
From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sat May  1 02:22:06 1993
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Date: Sat, 1 May 1993 02:17:34 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305010917.AA04901@well.sf.ca.us>
To: hart@ntmtv.com, jslee@well.sf.ca.us, ntmtv!hart@ntmtv.com, rslau@usc.edu
Subject: Re: cops & racism
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Status: OR

Chris,

I agree with everyhting you said.  I think that the cops/race/sex/etc.
issues are all in some way related to the rave scene.  I mean for the MOST
part raves are for everyone and for all races and sexual bents.  The cops
figure in as a MINOR irritant, which at times acts as the glue to keep us
all cohesive in our attempt to enjoy ourselves and our community.  I know
this sounds drippy, but I DO believe it.

Many people have pointed out how the discussions on the net of late have
been, "pointless", or "have degenerated".  I see it as just the opposite.
Underneath all the love and smarm some people like to push there are
questions.  And if you look at the subject matter that has been discussed of
late, flames not withstanding, there has been a fruitful dialog.  We have
talked about sex, age, race, public policy, sexuality,and humanity over the
course of these discussions.  How BORING it would be to JUST have party
announcments, and record reviews (both of which are important to many),
instead of a total expression of feelings that has occurred over the past
month.

There has been much chaos on the scene.  And this is reflected everyhwere,
from arguments here, to murders at parties, it has at times seemd like
everything was becoming unraveled.  In truth though things have become
better defined.  People are starting to take action (the benefit for Mal is
JUST one instance) in many forms.  Some have stopped going to parties that
are not open to more age groups, some have taken their cause up with lawyers
and the legislative process.  Overall a beautiful and pro-active thing, if
carried out fully.  So bag all of this apologetic shit, because in one way
or another it realtes to us.  If not as fellow party-goers (I have the term
"raver") then surely as human beings.

Peace.

(Oh yeah, it should read I HATE the term "ravers"---oops fingers slower
than the mind :).

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sat May  1 13:15:21 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com ((()))
Subject: Re: Wicked vs. Groove Kitchen (was Re: This week's RAVE guide )
Status: OR

> Who is DJing at Groove Kitchen?

Groove Kitchen is finally giving Moonpup a long-deserved whirl (11pm - 2am)
followed by Spun and Mark Farina.

> Oh, and I heard that "Unification" is offering a 50% discount if you bring a
> resolution or horn-clause. :-) (sorry couldn't resist)....

Is that a LISP joke?

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sat May  1 16:22:40 1993
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Date: Sat, 1 May 93 19:19:56 EDT
From: Monica Tauriello <monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: myfinal(?)wordonnudity
Message-Id: <CMM-RU.1.3.736298396.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
Status: OR

again, in response to john,
i agree that we as women relinquish our power when we look to jenny craig
(who is she, anyway?) however, i think we all have to remember that for many
of us, loving our bodies is a STRUGGLE, is RESISTANCE, against the
dominant/dominator culture that keeps us buying their diet products and their
other consumer goods to overcome what are perceived as, constructed as,
inadequacies.  sure it's great when a woman feels powerful enuf to take her
clothes off in public - i've done it in countless gay pride marches til the
sun started burning my titties.  but i'm getting off-track.. .. just remember
that while the confidence may come from within, it is a result of active
resistance to media messages, and it is a PROCESS. the fact that women may
want to look more like jenny craig than themselves is not a result of
individual neurosis, but is a SOCIAL issue.  

monicat

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sat May  1 17:00:23 1993
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Date: Sat, 1 May 93 16:56:33 PST  
From: "Steven Collins" <gobstop@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Sender: gobstop@uclink.berkeley.edu
Reply-To: gobstop@uclink.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <60994.gobstop@uclink.Berkeley.EDU>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Pull my Finger tonight, maybe?
Status: OR

Well, I heard from two different sources about a Pull My Finger "tonight,"
but as they were both recordings I really have no idea if it's really
tonight or last night.  If it is tonight it's at the Stone, doors at 12:30
NOT 21+, Mark Farina Moonpup Dutch.  They're also Having a Recycle Cinco
De Mayo party on Wednesday.  Call (415) 281-0586.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sat May  1 20:11:19 1993
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From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9305020309.AA05590@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: Pull my Finger tonight, maybe?
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Sat, 1 May 93 20:09:04 PDT
In-Reply-To: <60994.gobstop@uclink.Berkeley.EDU>; from "Steven Collins" at May 1, 93 4:56 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Status: OR

> Well, I heard from two different sources about a Pull My Finger "tonight,"
> but as they were both recordings I really have no idea if it's really
> tonight or last night.  If it is tonight it's at the Stone, doors at 12:30

Pull My Finger was last night.  You didn't really miss anything.  Left
it for Conception which was a cool map point -> warehouse scene, but
also sparsely attended.  

- leg of eel

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 00:01:11 1993
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Date: Sat, 1 May 93 23:58:27 -0700
From: ccat@netcom.com (Chris)
Message-Id: <9305020658.AA19410@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: NYC's FINEST -Dante at Tilt-a-Whirl noon Sun.
Status: OR

 Dante Maure will be DJ ing at Tilt a Whirl today (Sunday ) at noon.
Check him out..he's a very good DJ.
520 4th st (Bryant) 12:00 
He's also looking for other SF gigs these next two weeks.
He can be reached through me or Nick Phillip.
-Chris.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 10:20:20 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305021713.AA02634@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Cops, Montreal, H2O...
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 13:13:31 -0400 (EDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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Status: OR

This week we were talking about cops on sfraves and neraves. I said that we
didn't have any problems with them here. Until now.
Last night (saturday may 1st) was H2O LIFEJUICE in Montreal. A big event,
totally commercial, tickets sold in advance 15$. Got in with some help at 11pm
but if i had done the lineup i would have got in at 2am... At 3 am, the system
is shut down, lights turned on. On the mike: "the cops are here. please leave
the building, thank you.". Everybody sat on the floor (what happens in most
case when there are large crowds faced to the cops here) and waited. At first
i couldn't see any cops, then suddenly i see about 75 cops all geared up with
helmets, sticks etc... People were not leaving. Then the cops start running
in the crowd, then stop. Panic. people running everywhere, afraid of beeing
clubbed. When trying to find my way out, i saw a girl with blood on her head
but i couldn't get to her to see what was happening (turns out she is ok, but
it is not sure if its because of the cops or people running). Again they
start running in the crowd, then stop. Somebody picks up the mike: "yo, give
them a chance to get out, there is only 1 door left open!".

It turns out that the event didn't have a "special event license". Talk about
organisation! Still the cops showed up because clubs are putting a lot of
pressure on the city council to shut down the raves since Solstice. It seems
that the owner of Metropolis and Royal and some other places are really
pissed off. Well, people maybe would go more to these clubs if the crowd and
the music was interesting...

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 11:38:37 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 11:33:56 -0800
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
Subject: Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Status: OR



Groove Kitchen at Big Heart City was luring people in; only to find 
out no one else was there, (this at 1:30 am), and then after 5 seconds
inside, refused to refund. 


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 12:24:27 1993
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Date:         Sun, 02 May 93 15:03:04 EDT
From: SUSIE <SK2479A@american.edu>
Organization: The American University
Subject:      Re: NYC's FINEST -Dante at Tilt-a-Whirl noon Sun.
To: Chris <ccat@netcom.com>, sfravers <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
In-Reply-To:  Your message of Sat, 1 May 93 23:58:27 -0700
Status: OR

On Sat, 1 May 93 23:58:27 -0700 you said:
> Dante Maure will be DJ ing at Tilt a Whirl today (Sunday ) at noon.
>Check him out..he's a very good DJ.
>520 4th st (Bryant) 12:00

Wow he really is a tremendous dj...he was in dc last week at an event called
ultraworld 6...and boy did he kick...wowoowowowow....and what made him differen
t from joe smoe dj is that he smiled and bounced around...and looked like he
was ENJOYING the grooves he was spinning...not just trying to "achieve" that
perfect mix...it was truly beautiful...(and he even got on the mike and didn't
seem obnoxious...he was merely trying to get a tired bunch to dance...)
GO SEE DANTE!!!   (and a big darn for me...cuz i will miss his next appearance
in dc at mars on may 15...):)

but on another note...does anyone know of a good agist event in the city with g
ood tunez around may 18th? (yes its true i will finally be back home!!)

Can some one email me about the dna and dv8...i am wondering what they are all
about...and if they are worth it...

also while i was at the march on washington...i found a flyer for "product"
at 1015 folsom...what kinda tunes...what kinda event (i assume gay/lesbian/bi)
does it have a "rave vibe" or is it a club deal?? (it was so nice finding a
piece of home laying on the ground in the district...(:(:)

let me know...partyon...susie (:

>He's also looking for other SF gigs these next two weeks.
>He can be reached through me or Nick Phillip.
>-Chris.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 12:58:00 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 93 12:54:48 -0700
From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305021954.AA15562@jobe>
To: rth@netcom.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Status: OR

> Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 11:33:56 -0800
> From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
> 
> 
> 
> Groove Kitchen at Big Heart City was luring people in; only to find 
> out no one else was there, (this at 1:30 am), and then after 5 seconds
> inside, refused to refund. 

That's 'cause everyone went to Wicked!  It was packed;  the crowd 
peaceful and friendly;  music to die for;  not much fog used.  In other
words, a great experience until the cops showed up and closed it down
at 5:00 due to the overcrowding...


Apparently, a fire marshall should have been involved, but none around.
Hmmm.  They cuffed someone and took him away.  I think he was the 
promoter; maybe someone has more info.

Afterwards moved on over to AfterLife at DNA around 6am where Gavin, Doc M.,
and Simon did their usuall damage :-)  

All in all a worthwhile evening.  Time to rest...

- Steve

> 
> 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 15:13:43 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf (Vitamin B))
Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 15:03:38 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: whoa@leland.stanford.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Status: OR

>i just recently attended a panel on raves in san francisco... the likes
>of markie mark, 

An SFRaver!  Yay :) (oh, he's NOT the guy in the underwear - wholly 
different person)

>neesa (the earth girl), 

She generated some interesting discussion about feminism and the like - 
and as to why she was the only woman up there.  Hmm...  basically the
issue was sorta resolved when an audience member said we needed to
transcend the concepts of patriarchy and matriarchy and look at the
panel not at 8 men and 1 women but as 9 people.

>mark healey, 

Former ToonTown promoter, basically one of the guys who helped bring 
House music to SF (and also later on one of the cheif over-commercializers,
but he sounded like he'd stopped throwing parties because he didn't want
the monster he'd created) - quite eloquent and thoughtful in all his
responses.

>bruce eisner, 

Author of "Ecstasy: the MDMA story" - why he was on a "future of raves"
panel is a little beyond me.... h

>dante (? from new york... something like tribal evolution ?), 

He was REALLY GREAT - very positive in all his comments, definitely 
someone who "has got it".  Talked to him afterwards - he's still waiting
for his terminal, Chuck :)

>and well, i'll probably fuck
>up the rest of the names, so i won't try... 

There was Ernie Munson, SF DJ (and very high on the spiritual aspect
of raves), Alan (a promoter, does Wicked and the Full Moons), Tef 
(from LA - one of the main large-rave promoters down there - didn't
say much), and Nick Philips (the moderator for the panel)

>anyway, the panel was pretty cool
>and they talked about the future of raves, the rave mindset/consciousness, and
>such stuff... 

Yeah, it was great to finally see people throwing the parties start talking
about stuff like this - particularly the realization that we need to start
taking some responsibility for what we're doing, we need to start better
representing ourselves to the outside world.  Read like 2 hours worth of
good SFRaves or ne-raves mail :)

>what i wanted to know is, what is it like out on the east coast?

The same, I hope.  I got my tickets Friday - May 28th-June 8th!  Hello,
Boston & NY!

>some of the points made were:
>
>--rave is not just hedonism, but rather rave and house music serve as
>  a vehicle to self-realization, self-empowerment, self-consciousness

Definitely, but we shouldn't limit the parties to only those who see
raves as such a holistic viewpoint.  People should arrive at this 
conclusion naturally.

>--rave is a subcultural arena in which music and dancing unite the 
>  people (music and dancing created by the people for the people)...
>  the unifying factor is that the individual is free-form dancing but
>  together with the group in a sort of group trance effect
>--no one is a leader at a rave... the beauty is that everyone is equal

Definitely - it's easy to lose this focus (is this why I'm never 
impressed by live acts at raves?)

>--rave is at a crucial point in its existence; the commercial market
>  is taking hold of it fast BUT ravers have the power to transcend 
>  this commercialization if they will it; never underestimate the power
>  of dance and you can not put a price tag on the rave experience

Here here!

>there was a lot more raised in during this session, but all the while that 
>this was going on, i couldn't halp think that "wow, this sounds straight
>out of nietzsche or some other philosphical text" (you know, the one where 
>nietzschesays that art should be our religion... 

Ack... never thought of this as Nietzsche - maybe I should go do some
reading... 

>we should sombine the dionysiac and the apollonian, or 
>the hedonistic and the more structured, rational forms of art, in
>order to experience oneness, unity, etc... "the birth of tragedy)... that's
>really deep and all and as cool as shit... at the same time, however, i think
>there are certain realities to raves that impede this realization process...

Yes... another thing I noted was that people had lots of lofty ambitions but
came up short in trying to think of specific ways to implement them.

>basically, what i'm looking for is a response to this... some of the things 
>i've said are meant to simply provoke a reaction... 

aaa!  provocation!  aaa!

>what do you easterners think?

BTW, I'm cc:ing this to SFRaves for obvious reasons :)  

>is this techno shamanism unique to san fran/california? and again... coming
>back to the central question (which hopefully is not cliche) what is the future
>of raves?

	I certainly don't think it's unique to us, it might have a larger
pre-existing subculture out here to tap into, but I hope it's a message
with universal appeal....

>						*joie et paix*

	Brian


From geoffw@nexsys.net Sun May  2 16:05:13 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 93 15:28:06 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305022228.AA10133@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: whoa@leland.stanford.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Status: OR

> 
> >neesa (the earth girl), 
> 
> She generated some interesting discussion about feminism and the like - 
> and as to why she was the only woman up there.  Hmm...  basically the
> issue was sorta resolved when an audience member said we needed to
> transcend the concepts of patriarchy and matriarchy and look at the
> panel not at 8 men and 1 women but as 9 people.
> 

This issue was not solved! Yes we need to look at it as 9 people but
we also need to look at the fact that rave scene, at the level of organization,
and performance (the DJ's) are dominated by Men.  Might I also add that 
the person who said that we should look at it as 9 people was
a man and I did not feel that all of the women who spoke up felt
that the issue was solved, we just moved on thats all.
Let`s not sweep this one unde the rug guys, (and gals) we'll be making a
mistake if we do.








From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 16:22:10 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 16:18:54 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305022318.AA26886@well.sf.ca.us>
To: rth@netcom.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Status: OR

I was there around 5:30 (after King St shut down at 5, never got in
there).  About half full, pretty good spinning.  I left around 6:45.
Didn't really have that Groove Kitchen-y feeling though.  

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 16:34:49 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 16:31:53 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305022331.AA29072@well.sf.ca.us>
To: rth@netcom.com, saeedi@shell.portal.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Status: OR

This was my only night off during my current SF trip, so I decided to
be adventurous.  Caught the bus to Berkeley and went to Flower Garden
at the Berkeley Aquatic Park.  At the 'Thunder Bay' pavilion at the
north end of the park, which is that water you see on the right when
driving north on 880 toward the University Ave exit.  

What a cool place!  It has a medium-sized sort of old-style funhouse
main room in a sort of oblongish octagonal shape, and a big side room,
i.e. perfect for chillspace which is what they were using it for.
The DJing when I got  there was good (could have been Harry Who? but
I couldn't see for sure because he was mixing upstairs in the projection
room), interesting light show and various flashers.  The sound system
was undersized and overdriven, which meant that the bass had a really
muddy sound, and it needed to be better balanced, but what the hey.

The main thing was there was almost *nobody* there, maybe two dozen
people tops in a space that could easily fit 300.  In fact, when I
got  to the front  nobody was even taking money so they just waved me in.

I left after about an hour and made my way back to SF.  Showed up at
King St around 4:30 but by 5 it was clear nobody else was going in, 
and then it  got shut down.  Way disappointing -- I'm not completely
tired of King St yet and I miss the energy that generally develops
there.

So I walked up to Big Heart City and did the Groove thang between
about 5:30 and 6:45.  Not very crowded inside, but not bad, the
spinning  was decent and the visuals pretty good.  But it is obviously
a slice of clubland, and when the floor started getting populated with
beer drinkers after the bar reopened I figured it was time to split.

My schedule just isn't  working out these days -- have to go back to
Portland Tuezday night so y'all will just have to howl at the moon
without me . . .

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 17:08:00 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 93 20:05:01 EDT
From: Monica Tauriello <monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: re: cyberforum - rants & raves
Message-Id: <CMM-RU.1.3.736387501.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
Status: OR

Arthur Chandler wrote that in the cyberforum one of the themes that "seeped
out" was : "we have to transcend patriarchalism and embrace the feminine side
of aour natures."  he asked for opinions, so....

i am VERY uncomfortable with this statement, as it reeks of essentialism. 
IMHO there is NO such thing as a "feminine side" and a "masculine side" to
our "natures" - femininity and masculinity are culturally and socially
constructed categories, not natural at all.  i assume what the speaker meant
was that we need to get beyond a dominator/hierarchical mentality, and
embrace a mor(oops) ESSENTALLY FEMININE about cooperawhat one can say,
however, is that in our culture cooperation is THOUGHT OF as feminine/
competition - masculine --- but there is nothing natural about this.  

i am uncomfortable, also, with something stated on another post (brian's, i
think) about the cyberforum, which said that the issue of 1 woman, 7(?) men
on the panel wasn't a problem, because we need ot get beyond patriarchal and
matriarchal thinking - they're all people.  sure, we're all people - however,
we do live in a sexist culture, which organizes things along gendered lines,
whether we like it or not.  the lack of women on the panel could mean that
women are not as active in the rave scene, or it could mean that women are
active but in different (non-visible-leadership) roles, and thus are being
overlooked.  and if women aren't as active in the rave scene, why not? any
thoughts?  

monicat

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 18:20:31 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 18:15:03 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305030115.AA17117@well.sf.ca.us>
To: rth@netcom.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Status: OR

Uh, I hate to say this, but I RARELY remeber any policy of parties that say
"If you don't like the party there is a 100% refund".  Unfortunately parties
are NOT department stores and you should not expect them to act as such.
I would suggest buyer beware.

Groove Kitchen is NOT a ripoff.  It is one of the best parties put on by one
of the nicest promoters I have met.  It all depends on WHY you go to
parties.  If you determine that a good party is one that has a lot of
people, then you cut yourself out of alot of quality gugs in SF.  I would
suggest waiting for one of the massives if that is your taste. But calling
GK a ripoff is a bit extreme and unfair.


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 18:22:16 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 18:17:19 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305030117.AA17520@well.sf.ca.us>
To: rth@netcom.com, saeedi@shell.portal.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Status: OR

BS about shutdowns .... I have heard the the cops MUST have a warrant in
order to close a party.  They just can't close them willy nilly...uh, does
Due Process sound familiar....

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 18:25:43 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 18:22:30 -0700
From: Raul Gilbert MinaMora <tow@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305030122.AA18501@well.sf.ca.us>
To: SK2479A@american.edu, arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: Cyberforum: rants and raves
Status: OR

> naming female djs

In SF.. Dani, Jan Cooley, Smokin Jo.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 18:29:31 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 18:25:58 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305030125.AA19300@well.sf.ca.us>
To: arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Cyberforum: rants and raves
Status: OR

There has been one, as far as I see it, bad trend in the scene.  There is a
suburbanization as comapred to two years ago.  This scene was quite
different.  I am not making judgements here, but the crowds were a bit more
mixed, ethnically and sexual-orientation wise.  Now it is mostly a white
hetero thang.  If you went to ANY of the early toon towns then you know what
I'm talking about.

It makes me wonder whether people on this scene want to be segregated.  The
hets from the gays, white from black/asian/ etc.  To me this is NOT the way
to amke this scene thrive.  Things have got to be more inclusive, but it
escapes me as to how this is to be done.

I do know I select the parties I attend very carefully.  I usually know the
promoter and know the party that they throw, and will attend based upon past
performance as well as stated goals.

I mean the celbration of Beltane is truly wonderful, for those that
understand it and know what it means or want to try to gain understanding.
But how do you translate this event to African AMericans/Asian Americans,
etc. who are not of Celtic origin?  I guess it depends upon your
perspective, but it may ahve inadvertantly kept some people away who may
have seen such celebrations as exclusive to whites...I dunno...

From jslee@well.sf.ca.us Sun May  2 18:31:02 1993
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	id AA20752; Sun, 2 May 1993 18:33:48 -0700
Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 18:33:48 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305030133.AA20752@well.sf.ca.us>
To: fran@ravel.udel.edu, geoffw@nexsys.net
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
Cc: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, whoa@leland.stanford.edu
Status: OR

fran said:
> I'm glad raves are not meat markets....

It ALL depends on the party.  Because there are MANY that are.

AS for women being involved there is a party being put on by some of the
woemn on the scene called "Earth ..." something or other (oooh, I know
that's bad, but the name escapes me for the moment).  The Dj's will be
male, but at LEST the promoters are women.  As for female DJ's...need more
of 'em.  But with this competetive market it makes the boys club all the
more difficult to break into.

Personally i have heard ALL of the female DJ's in SF.  And for the most part
they do not spin the music that I want to hear.  They (I hate THEY so....),
I mean the ladies generally play to gay crowds, and that limits their
exposure.  Also the music a gay clubs tends to be more "soulful" (tons of
those screaming divaesque lyrics), and that is the last thing I want to hear
before the sun rises.

Smokin' Joe though is one woman who can spin with a vengeance!

Peace.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 18:39:44 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 93 18:36:18 -0700
From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
Message-Id: <9305030136.AA24829@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: jslee@well.sf.ca.us
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Status: OR

Point it there was no party at all inside. Last time I was there at 1:30 the place
was packed and it was a great event. This time when we got inside we were
the only people in the place. We turned right around, and they refused 
a refund. We paid for something that was not delivered. That's a rip off.
p.s. I never go to massives.

p.p.s. Who was the promoter?

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 19:00:41 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 18:55:16 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305030155.AA26469@well.sf.ca.us>
To: jslee@well.sf.ca.us, rth@netcom.com, saeedi@shell.portal.com,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Status: OR

Wicked was shut down by the *fire marshal*, from what I can tell.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 19:50:49 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305030235.AA00520@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: rth@netcom.com, saeedi@shell.portal.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu,
        jslee@well.sf.ca.us
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Status: OR


> From medisg.Stanford.EDU!sfraves-request@cdp.igc.org Sun May  2 19:17:25 1993
> Return-Path: <medisg.Stanford.EDU!sfraves-request@cdp.igc.org>
> Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 18:17:19 -0700
> From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
> To: rth@netcom.com, saeedi@shell.portal.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
> Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
> Content-Length: 179
> X-Lines: 3
> Status: RO
> 
> BS about shutdowns .... I have heard the the cops MUST have a warrant in
> order to close a party.  They just can't close them willy nilly...uh, does
> Due Process sound familiar....
> 
Oh yeah, well a promoter went to jail last night, they had something BETTER
than a warrent, they had THE FIRE MARSHALL.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 19:51:11 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 93 19:37:03 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305030237.AA00525@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: SK2479A@american.edu, arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu,
        tow@well.sf.ca.us
Subject: Re: Cyberforum: rants and raves
Status: OR


> From medisg.Stanford.EDU!sfraves-request@cdp.igc.org Sun May  2 19:17:29 1993
> Return-Path: <medisg.Stanford.EDU!sfraves-request@cdp.igc.org>
> Date: Sun, 2 May 1993 18:22:30 -0700
> From: Raul Gilbert MinaMora <tow@well.sf.ca.us>
> To: SK2479A@american.edu, arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
> Subject: Re: Cyberforum: rants and raves
> Content-Length: 58
> X-Lines: 3
> Status: RO
> 
> > naming female djs
> 
> In SF.. Dani, Jan Cooley, Smokin Jo.
> 
			     ^^^^^^^^^
			     She was visiting from London

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 20:02:54 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 93 20:00:29 -0700
From: ccat@netcom.com (Chris)
Message-Id: <9305030300.AA27323@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Female DJ's
Status: OR

How about DJ Mind Machine (the little Peorridge girl) Downtown Donna,
Lily Tran (Dig-it) who is quite good.. and Shioban (sp?)

Also,dont forget that one of SF's best early rave prompoters was Dianna
(Toon Town).
..
And what about Denise and Tornado (former "Mrs Floppy" and underground
mystr-ess)
......

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 20:06:13 1993
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Date:    Sun, 02 May 93 20:04 PDT
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: Tamara Palmer                        <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
Subject: female DJ's
Status: OR

Sandra Collins is a big staple in the afterhours
scene in LA (as well she should be :) ) and there's
"That Girl!" from San Diego...but I agree, we are
sorely lacking in this department...I guess it's
time for me to dust off my turntables! :)
                               Tamara

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 20:11:42 1993
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Date:    Sun, 02 May 93 20:08 PDT
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: Tamara Palmer                        <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
Subject: Female DJ's
Status: OR

The other thing I forgot to mention is -- I asked
a DJ here in LA (who shall remain nameless lest he
look like a chauvinist pig on both ends of this
coast!) why he thought there weren't more female
djs and he said that females are not into the music
as much and are not willing to make the necessary
sacrifices that being a dj entails...how can we
win with that sort of attitude?

                               Tamara
                        (who loves her music)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Sun May  2 20:19:06 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305030307.AA00554@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, jslee@well.sf.ca.us
Subject: Re:  Cyberforum: rants and raves
Status: OR

> 
> I mean the celbration of Beltane is truly wonderful, for those that
> understand it and know what it means or want to try to gain understanding.
> But how do you translate this event to African AMericans/Asian Americans,
> etc. who are not of Celtic origin?  I guess it depends upon your
> perspective, but it may ahve inadvertantly kept some people away who may
> have seen such celebrations as exclusive to whites...I dunno...
> 

Don't always judge a book by it's cover, I know more about this holiday
then your average "God Fearin'" celt (Irish,scottish, britton) does:)
When you start to study ancient and pre-history you begin to realize that
20 - 30, 00 years ago, all of these holidays that we "civilized folks"
have forgotton about were observed in one varient or another by every culture
on the planet (give or take a week or two).  Holidays like beltane are
linked to the seasons and astronomical year, the Celts called it Beltane
the egyptians called it something else, native americans have their "own
rites of spring" and I'm sure the aboriginals have an inverse or anti-holiday
equivilent, (There in the southern hemispher, and it autumn there). I've
studied Celtic "mysteries" and am currently studying african "mysteries" and
you know what? they have a LOT of the same stuff in them right down to the
drumming and other aspects of Trance,  I thought I had
really stumbled on something "the missing link between africans and celts
(so that's what they ment by `black irish')" but then I picked up a book
on feng shui (chinese geomancy) and started to see some of the same connections
and then you know what I realized? There was a time when all of us,
asian, africans, europeans knew this stuff, knew how to trance and heal, and
knew about rhythm. But we forgot! Or at least a bunch of us did.  And we sarted
to force other's to forget and to see the ways in which we were different
and make that more important then the ways we are the same. And while it may
be true that the "indiginous" culture of europe was the first to succumbe to
this Dominator mentality, It wasn't fully put down in europe until
"the burning times" when at lease 10 million people (mostly women) were
killed for being "witches" over a period of about 300 years.  These days,
we don't have to convert people to the Dominator culture by the blade
(that's form is still reserved for the smaller countries of the world)
we can just get a few people in that local to "sell out", set them up
with a lot of material wealth and put them in charge of the "area" it's
done in macro-cosm  (countries like S. Africa) and in micro-cosm
(selling drugs in S. Central) they will keep their neighbors down so long
as they get paid.  It's easy to use racial devisions to convinvce the
masses that blacks/whites are a violent race of people that must be contained
but in real life the people at the top of the econonomic pyramid only
care about one thing and that is MONEY.

Now when we go to a Rave, our spirit REMENMBERS how It USE TO BE! before
all this bullshit about my race is more-better-different-then your race.
We remember that were different but all connected to the earth so LET'S
PARTY!  That's what raving is about for me, learning to reconnect with each
other along co-operative bonds as oppose to competative bonds.  That doesn't
mean you have to want to associate with every body all the time but it
does mean that you are committed to tearing down barriers, cuz deep down
in side, we all come from the same source!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
 AT&T:Phones with Big Brother Inside, Just say "NO" to the Clipper wiretap chip!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  2 23:09:13 1993
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Date: Sun, 2 May 93 23:03:36 -0700
From: tgrant@netcom.com (Tony Grant)
Message-Id: <9305030603.AA03764@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

Hello, everybody.  I'm taking an intermission in my post weekend hibernation and
thought I'd try and share something that moved me.  I had a very exhausting
weekend, and as usual I was rejuvenated at 1015 on Sunday Morning at Boogie
Buffet.  For those of you who haven't been there since they opened the sun room,
I urge you you to check it out.  Unfortunately it's 21+  :(   :(   :(, but for
those who can, it's pretty amazing.  I've started to call it my church  =)
	The reason I felt so motivated to share is that around 1:00 in the afternoon,
Thomas took over for Gavan and spun *the most amzing set i've heard in months*,
maybe ever.  Totally slow, funky, soulful... all over the place from P-Funk to
Earth Wind & Fire to Eazy-E old school.  With every song he sucked more and more
people in, and I don't think I've ever felt that much energy... a room full of
people with the sunlight streaming in, everybody's bellies filled with blueberry
pancakes and fruit salad... absolutely slammin'... brilliant ... wicked ... cup
o' tea ...  =)

Usually I can't totally release on the dance floor unless I slip into the trance
mode and the DJ is able to erase the whole context of the club, but this morning
was different ... it was the most intense sense of sharing I've felt on the
floor with a group of people, and it wasn't 120-130 BPM which is very
invigorating, very refreshing ... sorry to keep rambling, but it triggered a few
things:

	"I'm not against playing fast.  It's just that now I understand
	fast as only an aspect."
		Wynton Marasalis

	"High energy does not necessarily mean fast.  High energy has
	to do with heart."
		Lou Reed

I think about this when I hear a DJ and it feels like the whole set is about
8-10 BPM too fast-- I understand that in the course of mixing, certain records
will need to have their tempo increased-- I'm talking about cats who knock
*everything* up a notch, and it just doesn't seem necessary.  It reminds up this
excercise club that I occasionly walk by and they'll be playing Top 40ish stuff
and they'll crank some 120 BPM song up to like 150, and it makes me shake my
head in sorrow.  You may gain some energy in sheer tempo, but you lose all the
original feeling, the soul of the song.

OK, OK, that's enough.

Thanks for listening.

Make my funk the P-Funk,

Tony


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 00:12:30 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 00:05:58 -0700
From: Jessie Jaeger <jjaeger@ocf.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199305030705.AA15571@tsunami.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  female DJ's


>From: Tamara Palmer                        <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
>Subject: Female DJ's

>The other thing I forgot to mention is -- I asked
>a DJ here in LA (who shall remain nameless lest he
>look like a chauvinist pig on both ends of this
>coast!) why he thought there weren't more female
>djs and he said that females are not into the music
>as much and are not willing to make the necessary
>sacrifices that being a dj entails...how can we
>win with that sort of attitude?

"So, who's girlfriend are you?"
"Are you a hoochie girl?"
"Oh, yeah, I've heard of you... you go out with X, right?"
"So, which promoter are you helping?"
"You're not a lesbian, then?"

I swear to god, all these things have been said to me at gigs that
I HAVE BEEN PROMOTING!  The level of ignorance is astounding!  I could
write a ten-page message here on my views, but I think it's more effective
to say simply how you (men and women) perpetuate the entrenchment of the
problem by how you treat others and how you expect others to treat you.
Women MUST work with other women, not against each other, to overcome
this problem... and I know men who recognize and sympathise with this
view as well (and are doing something to help).

Andrea

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 06:50:01 1993
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <9305031344.AA03732@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Pay To Play Loud in SJ
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 6:44:41 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


 Well, as I was reading my email this morning , the morning San Jose TV
show had a short story on a new fine that the SJPD will be levelling on 
people who , by being noisy , cause their neighbors to call the cops to
shut down the noise. The fine will be around $50+ dollars per call.

 The rational was that the fine would discourage habitual offenders of
the peace ( Many of the noise complaints in SJ are generated by the 
same repeat offenders ) . SJPD says they had 9000 (!) noise complaints
in 1992. The fine covers the cost to the police to answer the complaint.

 The chilling thing was , the newscaster said something like " if it 
works in San Jose , expect other municipalities to follow suit. ".

				Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


-- 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 07:31:26 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 10:06 EDT
From: laura@usl.com
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Women in the scene (was Re: the whole life expo...)
Received: from usl by usl.com; Mon,  3 May 1993 10:06 EDT
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Content-Length: 3219

Someone wrote:

>> >neesa (the earth girl), 
>> 
>> She generated some interesting discussion about feminism and the like - 
>> and as to why she was the only woman up there.  Hmm...  basically the
>> issue was sorta resolved when an audience member said we needed to
>> transcend the concepts of patriarchy and matriarchy and look at the
>> panel not at 8 men and 1 women but as 9 people.

Someone else replied:
>This issue was not solved! Yes we need to look at it as 9 people but
>we also need to look at the fact that rave scene, at the level of organization,
>and performance (the DJ's) are dominated by Men.  Might I also add that 
>the person who said that we should look at it as 9 people was
>a man and I did not feel that all of the women who spoke up felt
>that the issue was solved, we just moved on thats all.
>Let`s not sweep this one unde the rug guys, (and gals) we'll be making a
>mistake if we do.

Back in January I was sitting around with my friend Ed and we were talking
about the scene.  We got on the subject of "how many women are really involved"
and started couting.  We only knew of one female organizer -- Patty in Chicago.
We knew of six DJ's (Miss DJAX [Holland], Heart [aka Heather Heather of 
Brooklyn], Psycho Bitch [Chicago], Moneypenny [New York/Belgium], Sondra 
Collins [LA??]  and Jacqueline Christie [New York]).  This didn't sound so
great.  Ed looked at me and said "well, you know we can do something about
this."  "What" I asked.  "You've got records, I've got the equipment sitting
in my basement, come over any time you want and start learning."  So I did.

Since then, I see exactly WHY there are so few women DJs.

It ain't easy, kids.

I *PURPOSELY* picked a DJ name that did not indicate my sex just so people
wouldn't look at a flyer and go "Oh.  A girl DJ.  I wonder if she sucks,"
which is EXACTLY what people did to Heather Heather when she was starting out.
(Heather was not so great to begin with, but no one is.  In the months since
her debut at Quest 2, she's gotten a lot of practice in and she's a FINE 
hard trance DJ now.)  

When I go to buy records or show up at gigs, guys look at me and go "oh, so
you're the girl hardcore DJ.  I never expected a girl to spin hardcore."  Or,
when I ask to hear a record, a guy might say "you really want to hear that?
That's hardcore you know."  (Fortunately I have found a great place to shop
and a decent person to deal with in the store who accepted me from the start.)

Even my *friends* say to me "you don't look like what we'd usually expect
to see behind the tables."  Just because I'm a female?  Or because I'm not
17?  Or because I don't wear anything resembling rave gear?  Or what? 

When I spin guys crowd around the table.  I don't know whether they are there
just WAITING for me to fuck up or if they're trying to look down my dress, or
both.

I'm somehow preceived as a THREAT by some of the more egotistical/insecure
(funny how those two traits go hand-in-hand) male DJs out there.  They
crowd me while I'm spinning, or yell at me, trying to break my concentration.

So, this is a first-hand account of what it is like to be a female DJ in the
man's world of techno -- especially hardcore techno.

Laura

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 08:40:10 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 08:34:45 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305031534.AA21360@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Beltane, Malls & Wicked

Well most of the mall dwellers must have gone to Wicked cos they certainly
weren't at Beltane. Beltane turned out to be a rockin good time with
absolutely great visuals, nice staging incl: trees fountains and lots of
space to stretch out in. Great chill room although not far enough from the
main room to have  a distinctly different sound. And *NO SMOKING* YES!! What
a concept wonderful! Plus the aroma therapy was really nice. Music was
great; simon just shredded everything. Micjael from Island/univers started
off ans was great too. Mark Farina came on after Simon and was real good but
not great. Follwing him was Evil Eddie's replacement Julian who was also
great. Great people, Vibe in full effect!

All in all a nice job by Marc, Richard son and Co!

peace
nrg

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 08:45:51 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 07:24:39 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305031424.AA01112@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: Interesting mail (fwd)

This was on the cypherpunks list, I thought it was sorta funny 
and a little disturbing.
			geoffw



 I received this on the Leri list and thought a little amusement might be
appreciated here given the current conversations.


---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Sat, 01 May 1993 20:57:34
From: David L Racette <dlr@medical.win.net>
To: Leri <Leri@pyramid.com>
Subject: Interesting mail


 Opening Statement to the House Subcommittee on
 Telecommunications and Finance, Washington DC, April 29,
 1993

        Hello everyone and thanks for inviting me here.  My
 name is Bruce Sterling and I'm a science fiction writer and
 sometime science journalist.   Since writing my nonfiction book
 HACKER CRACKDOWN: LAW AND DISORDER ON THE ELECTRONIC
 FRONTIER, I have returned to writing science fiction.  And I've
 returned to that with some relief, frankly, since the world of
 science fiction is in most ways rather less strange and less
 bizarre than the contemporary world of telecommunications
 policy.

        I hope therefore that you will forgive me if I testify
 today as a science fiction writer.  It's one of the perks of my
 profesion to write about the future, or attempt to, and I
 thought you might like to meet someone from the
 telecommunications future that you are so busy creating.

        With your kind indulgence for my novelist's whimsy
 then, the rest of my brief presentation today will be given by a
 Mr. Bob Smith, with is an NREN network administrator from the
 year 2015.

        I present Mr. Smith.

        "Thank you, Mr. Sterling.  It's a remarkable privilege to
 talk to the legislators who historically created my working
 environment.  As a laborer in the fields of 21st Century
 cyberspace I of course would have no job without NREN and
 my wife and small son and I are all properly grateful for your
 foresight in establishing the Information Superhighway.

        "Your actions in this regard have affected American
 society every bit as strongly as did the telegraph, the railroads,
 the telephone, the highway system, and television.  In fact, it's
 impossible for me to imagine contemporary life in 2015
 without the Global Net; living without the Net would be like
 trying to live without electricity.

        "However, it's a truism in technological development that
 no silver lining comes without its cloud.  Today I'd like to
 mention two or three trifling problems that have come up that
 were not entirely obvious from the perspective of the early
 1990s.

        "First of all, this 'Research and Education' aspect.  Since
 communications *is* power in an Information Society, giving
 fantastically advanced communications to the Research and
 Education communities did in fact empower those communities
 quite drastically by comparison with interest-groups lacking
 that advantage.  Today, one of the most feared political
 organizations in the world is the multi-national anarchist
 libertarian group called the Students for an Utterly Free
 Society.

        "Of course, there have always been campus radicals, but
 thanks to their relative lack of financial clout, and lack of even
 a steady home address, these young fanatics once found it very
 difficult to organize politically.  Therefore, they were easy for
 the powers-that-be to ignore, except during occasional spasms
 of violent campus unrest.

        "Thanks to NREN, however, spasms of student unrest can
 now spread like lightning across entire continents.  Advanced
 AI translation programs installed on the Net only made matters
 worse, since in 2015 the global leaders of the student
 movements are not only extremely radical, but French.

        "Attempts by campus authorities to control this unrest
 have failed miserably.  In 2015, NREN sites are always the first
 buildings occupied during a campus strike.  Campus chancellors
 and faculty are themselves so utterly dependent on NREN that
 they become quite helpless off-line.

        "A second major problem has been the growth of
 unlicenced encryption, which has proved quite unstoppable.
 Today some seventy-five percent of NREN archives are
 material that no one in authority can read.  Countries that
 attempted to control and monitor network traffic have lost
 market share and service revenue as data processing simply
 moves offshore.

        "The United States has profited by this phenomenon to a
 great extent as people worldwide have flocked to the relative
 liberty of our networks.  Unfortunately many of these
 electronic virtual immigrants are not simply dissidents looking
 for free expression but in fact are organized criminals.

        "Take for instance a recent FBI raid on an enormous
 archive of encrypted Iranian files, illicitly stored in an obscure
 NREN node in North Dakota.  Luckily the FBI was able to
 decrypt these files thanks to an inside informant.  Deciphering
 these archives revealed the following contraband:

        "Eighty percent graphic image files of attractive young
 women without veils on, or, in fact, much clothing of any kind.

        "Fifteen percent digitally stored pirated copies of Western
 pop music and Western videos, still illegal to possess in
 Teheran.

        "And, five percent text files in the Farsi language
 describing how to guild, deliver and park truck-bombs in major
 urban areas.

        "I can't conclude my brief remarks today without a
 mention of a particularly odd development having to do with
 *wireless* computer telecommunications.  Since it is now
 possible to transact business entirely in cyberspace, including
 financial transactions, many information entrepreneurs in 2015
 have simply given up any physical home.  Basically, they have
 become stateless people, 21st Century gypsies.

        "A recent tragic example of this occurred in the small
 town of North Zulch, Texas.  There some rural law enforcement
 officers apprehended a scruffy vagabond on a motorcycle in a
 high-speed chase.  Unfortunately he was killed.  A search of his
 backpack revealed a device the size of a cigarette pack.  In
 searching the dead man's effects, the police officers, who were
 not computer literate, accidentally broke the device.  This tiny
 device was actually a privately owned computer bulletin board
 system with some 15,000 registered users.

        "Many of the users were wealthy celebrities, and the
 apparent outlaw biker was actually an extremely popular and
 nationally known system operator.  These 15,000 users were
 enraged by what they considered the wanton destruction of
 their electronic community.  They pooled their resources and
 took a terrible vengeance on the small town of North Zulch,
 which, by contrast, had only 2,000 residents, none of them
 wealthy or technologically sophisticated.  Through a
 combination of harassing lawsuits and sharp real-estate deals,
 the vengeful board users bankrupted the town.  Eventually the
 entire township was bulldozed flat and purchased for parkland
 by the Nature Conservancy.

        "Thanks in part to the advances that you yourselves set
 in motion, violent conflicts between virtual and actual
 communities have become a permanent feature of the cultural
 landscape in 2015."

        Thank you for your patience in entertaining my
 speculations.  I'll be happy to take any questions -- though
 only in my real-life persona.  Thank you very much.





----- End Included Message -----


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 08:50:26 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305031538.AA01215@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: jjaeger@ocf.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  female DJ's
Cc: sfraves@nexsys.net


What pretell is a Hoochie girl?

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 08:52:03 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305031532.AA01210@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: jslee@well.sf.ca.us, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Cyberforum: rants and raves



jslee writes :
 
> I agree with everything you stated.  But that still does not answer the
> question of why the scene has become more homogenous.  I understand the
> common bond issue and the commonality between all of us.  But the scene,
> whatever it's good intentions, does not reflect this ideal.  If what you
> said was truly happening, more and more people would be brought in by the
> sheer positive nature of the experince.  This has not happened.
> 
> Gays,Hets, and all others used to party together.  There was a
> multi-cultural feel to these events.  I can say, that after watching this
> scene over the past couple of years that the intergrative aspect has been
> lost.  Maybe because the message has been diluted perhaps?  I don't know.
> 
> Unless the scene is able to draw many different people in, in the spirit of
> commonality (striving to overcome the bullshit of artificial barriers like
> race and sexual orientation), then can it truly be called and instument of
> change, or much less a thriving and growing community?  Or does it become a
> thing exlcusively for use by one group of people or another?

Yes, I'm concerned about the trend toward LESS diversity that I'm
seeing in the Scene.  Many folks are afraid to flyer in minority
communities like Oakland and East Palo Alto because of the Gangs, but
NOT EVERYONE WHO LIVES IN THESE COMMUNITIES BELONG TO OR PARTICIPATE IN
GANG ACTIVITY.  If we fall into our fear on this then we will become
hypocrits.  You know and I know that the best parties and events get
there draw due to personal communication, one person telling other cool
people.  Look at parties like Wicked who didn't do a tremendous amount
of flyering, they can't keep the people away (even when it is in a
cheesey place like King street, which Wicked has definitely outgrown).
The problem that the 60's movement fell into was that eventually it was
"taken over" from a grassroots movement which included all races and
became (at least in the media's eye, a white thang) let's not fall into
the same trap.  As I've said before, I've seen "tuff" Black Homeboy
types totally trance out after a few hours at a rave.  For them they
have to let go of a lot of stuff before they can "take in" the scene.
I know cuz' I grew up in one of these areas.  They are use to white
people being a certain way and a rave doesn't fit their picture of
reality (they are literally having a reality crisis). First they have
to get over the stereotype that white folks don't know how to "let
loose" this is one of the most amazing things to some Brothers that
I've talked to at raves, that they see white people exhibit a lot of
rhythm and seem to be comfortable "shaking that booty".  The next thing
that they have to get use to is what we (AA people) sometimes refer to
as getting "vibed" this IS NOT the way that ravers use the term!  To a
black person comming to a rave, they are surprised that they are not
getting "vibed" by the white folks there, getting "vibed" is what
happens to many people of color and to most black men when they step
into a situation that is predominately caucasian, it is a subtle
feeling that you pick up comming from the people around you , mostly
fear, sometimes mixed with guilt, after years of this, you get sick of
it, some kids react by living up to the gangsta image and giving white
folks something to really be afraid of, some say fuck it and refuse to
socially associate with whites at all, some ignore  it and become
neurotic, some work for change on all fronts.  So anyway, at the best
raves, these brothers and sisters come and they have a reality check
because, for the first time in their lives, for some, they are being
treated as simply a human being by a white person and not a "race
object".  Next thing they have to get use to  are white DJs throwing
down some serious Phat beats, I saw homeboys at the New Years Gathering
running up to the turntables and finding Jeno ripping shit up, they
stared in disbelief/amazement/fear/joy.  One of them demanded of me
"Hey man!  who IS this guy!" I watched one guy grab his head like his
mind was on fire :) (yup they got it!) In African American culture,
dancing has always been an outlet, when things got real bad (as they
often did) you could always get some 45s a little record player and
dance.  Now some of the "upwardly mobile" blacks who feel like they
have to emulate "white" culture have a lot of hang-ups about dancing,
their reality check goes like this, "Wait, I thought white folks
thought dancing was an activity common blacks did, but these white
folks are out there shakin it, I spent my whole adult life surpressing
this part of my culture to "fit in" now I see the people I'm trying to
fit in with embracing it?  This does not compute!"

And it doesn't compute!  That's right! All of this bullshit, the fear,
the stereotypes, the assumtions, evaluations, etc, can be, needs to be
and at the best events ARE dropped by everyone involved, that's the tru
beauty of what's happening here.  So I encourage all of you out there
especially those who go to college and come in contact with people of
color on a daily basis to take flyers with you and invite them to the
parties that you would go to.  If you do it with sincerity, love and
awareness they will detect this about you and respond.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
 AT&T:Phones with Big Brother Inside, Just say "NO" to the Clipper wiretap chip!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 08:59:12 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 08:55:50 -0700
From: elizabet@cadence.com (Elizabeth Medel)
Message-Id: <9305031555.AA05612@cds8616>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Southbay SFR Lunch
Cc: elizabet@cadence.com

When: This Tuesday, 4 May
Time: 12.00 noon
Where: Greer Park, Palo Alto

Directions:

* From 101 (South or North) take the Oregon Expressway Exit

* Left at the first signal (West Bayshore - it's a frontage road 
  that takes you south again)

* Follow this road approx. 1/4 mile (pass appartment complex on right)
  
* You will see the park on your right hand side. Park in the first
  carpark to your right.

* We'll meet on the grassy knoll

Bring lunch, music, toys, yourselves!

Hope to see you there!!

Elizabeth.


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 09:07:00 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 08:58:49 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305031558.AA26054@well.sf.ca.us>
To: SK2479A@american.edu, arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu, diva@uclink.berkeley.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, tow@well.sf.ca.us
Subject: Re: Cyberforum: rants and raves

The woman dj at people's park was named Nadeah.

nrg

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 09:14:48 1993
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Date: 3 May 1993 09:10:22 -0800
From: "Scott Nozawa*" <scott_nozawa*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Unsubscribe
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

                       Subject:                               Time:9:08
  OFFICE MEMO          Unsubscribe                            Date:5/3/93
Please take me off the list.  Too much volume.  Thanx

T. Scot



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 09:20:38 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305031602.AA01290@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, laura@usl.com
Subject: Re: Women in the scene (was Re: the whole life expo...)
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

> 
> When I spin guys crowd around the table.  I don't know whether they are there
> just WAITING for me to fuck up or if they're trying to look down my dress, or
> both.
> 

Some guys will be turned on by a female DJ (i'm sure I would be under
certain circumstances) , power is sexy and a GOOD  DJ is channeling a
lot of power no mater what gender.  I'm sure guys crowd around you for
the same reason some girls would crowd around guy DJ's.

Although lately I've taken to dancing by the DJs (not because the DJs
are guys :) Traditionaly, I'm a speaker-tweeker and you can find me at
the bass bins but I've been moving away from that the last couple of
weeks, I like the energy by the DJ and I like to trance and feed my energy
back to them.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 10:20:43 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 10:13:47 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305031713.AA25495@ganymede.apple.com>
To: monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: re: cyberforum - rants & raves

monicat-

i must argue the point of men and women NOT having separate natures,
ie, 
"feminine" or "masculine".  these traits are affected by chemical
(im)balances in your body.  which is why you act different on drugs.
however, acting feminine or masculine can be a learned behavior, but
i don't think one would conciously "learn" either type of behavior
unless that one had the tendency to, as a result of having more of
that type of hormone.

this is not to be confused with domination/subservency.  i don't think
that anyone should have more power, or more luxuries, or more of anything
because of their sex, but men and women ARE NOT EQUAL.  THEY ARE DIFFERENT,m
and each has unique qualities and specialties.  i wish we could move a
way from androgeny a bit (the direction things seem to be going in...)
just long enough to appreciate the beautiful OPPOSITE qualities that 
both our sexes have.

(not a flame)

-mArK. 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 10:24:15 1993
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To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: Robert Hughes's message of Fri, 30 Apr 1993 20:41:16 -0800 <9305010341.AA23140@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Thursday nights
From: Desi the Three-Armed Wonder Comic <jondr@sco.com>
Sender: jondr@sco.com
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 10:16:41 PDT
Message-Id:  <9305031016.aa21597@scotty.sco.COM>

robert hughes asks:

>Well the Hardkisses event didn't appear at DNA last night; seemed to be
>the club DJ spinning, and I heard last week was their last thing there.
>Anybody have more info on this, or know of any regular Thursday happenings
>in SF that go after 2am?? 

deep faith is over and done with.  there won't be any more cos, in
mona's words, "we want it to go out on a good note."

i don't know about thursdays any more.  wait for someone else to pick
up the slack.  maybe casey (never neverland) will do it.  he's already
running splash at the oasis on saturday mornings...  (and btw, splash
was Really Cool this weekend - where were all you faithful SFravers?
i only saw P & M Normal and their Trusty Sidekick, Gil.)

Jon Drukman (in stereo where available)                         jondr@sco.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you want to touch the sky, just put a window in your eye.           - Coil

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 10:25:38 1993
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From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305031721.AA25569@ganymede.apple.com>
To: fran@ravel.udel.edu, geoffw@nexsys.net
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
Cc: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, whoa@leland.stanford.edu

i have a comment to anyone saying there are not enough women djs...or
that the color of their wallpaper is all wrong...or their shoes are too
tight...

do something.  instead of asking why there aren't more girl djs, ask
yourself why YOU ARE NOT A DJ.  that might be a good place to start.
or why you are not on the panel, etc.  not flaming, but i DO have a 
big pet peeve about these kinds of issues, especially when it becomes
a gender thing.

-mARK.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 10:35:15 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 10:29:12 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305031729.AA25641@ganymede.apple.com>
To: arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu, jslee@well.sf.ca.us, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Cyberforum: rants and raves

i think i'm in a rant mood today.  i hope i don't come accross
as just wanting to pick fights.  really.

but on the subject of Beltane making non-celtics feel excluded, i post
(that's POSE) this question:

"if a black-american had on a shirt with a picture of africa and the words
'black pride' (or similar) how would you look at that?"

probably without much judgement.  it seems fine to me.

but now turn that around and make it a white-american with a shirt on
that said "white pride".  all of a sudden that person becomes a racist.

the point i'm making may be moot...someone tell me.  sometimes i just
feel like a ton of crap gets thrown in the direction of young white
hetero males that haven't done anything to propagate this.  not all
black/white segregation is the idea of the white side, nor all het/homo
segregation the idea of the het side.

am i confused?  this is a real and serious inquiry, requesting a reply.

***also, if i'm pushing the boundaries of sfraves topics, just let
me know...it's monday, and i haven't had any coffee yet.

sincerely,

-mARK.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 10:36:34 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305031730.AA00353@slack>
Subject: Female DJ's
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 11:30:32 -0600 (MDT)
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Tamara:

> he said that females are not into the music as much

There are more women at our events than men, but maybe that's just me
(BAHHH!).  Seriously though, the ratio is roughly 10-20% higher.

There are also two female DJs in Salt Lake.  One spins disco and she's GREAT,
the other is just barely starting out.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 10:42:49 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 10:34:57 -0700
From: Jessie Jaeger <jjaeger@ocf.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199305031734.AA02925@tsunami.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  rants and raves


>From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
>To: monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
>Subject: re: cyberforum - rants & raves

>this is not to be confused with domination/subservency.  i don't think
>that anyone should have more power, or more luxuries, or more of anything
>because of their sex, but men and women ARE NOT EQUAL.  THEY ARE DIFFERENT,m
>and each has unique qualities and specialties.  i wish we could move a
>way from androgeny a bit (the direction things seem to be going in...)
>just long enough to appreciate the beautiful OPPOSITE qualities that 
>both our sexes have.

Hear, hear!  Differences DO NOt mean inequalities.  It is a shame that
a difference in nature is so often interpreted as an inferiority/superiority.
So, then... How can a feminine (sometimes seen as an inferior) quality
be more incorporated into rave scenes without the "masculine" feeling
threatened or "watered down?"  Why is this a threat?

Andrea

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 10:49:24 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 10:42:17 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305031742.AA25812@ganymede.apple.com>
To: IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  female DJ's

.. Sandra Collins is a big staple in the afterhours
.. scene in LA (as well she should be :) ) and there's
.. "That Girl!" from San Diego...but I agree, we are
.. sorely lacking in this department...I guess it's
.. time for me to dust off my turntables! :)
..                                Tamara

yes!!!  this is what is going to up the number of female
djs!!  personally, i would love to go off to a tripped 
out groove with a woman's touch.

-mARk.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 10:49:52 1993
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From: Jessie Jaeger <jjaeger@ocf.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199305031740.AA02988@tsunami.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Thursday nights


Just picked up a flyer a few days ago at Cafe Flore which is for

Primal
Tribal, Techno, and trance
Dj's Lewis and Bryan Hughes
Thursdays, 9th and Harrison

Looked kinda interesting so I was going to go.  Wait a minute... is
Bryan Hughes on this list????  But this isn't an after two event,
so I guess it doesn't count.  Ignore this.

Andrea

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:03:03 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 10:56:44 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305031756.AA26016@ganymede.apple.com>
To: elizabet@cadence.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Southbay SFR Lunch

as usual...if anyone
s (aaargh!) going to the sfr lunch, i could use a ride...

thx...

-mArk.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:02:46 1993
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From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305031753.AA25966@ganymede.apple.com>
To: laura@usl.com, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Subject: Re:  Women in the scene (was Re: the whole life expo...)
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

> Even my *friends* say to me "you don't look like what we'd usually expect
> to see behind the tables."  Just because I'm a female?  Or because I'm not
> 17?  Or because I don't wear anything resembling rave gear?  Or what? 
> 
exactly what does this remark about not being 17 mean?? that you're not
17 yet, or that you're no longer a spring chicken?

> When I spin guys crowd around the table.  I don't know whether they are there
> just WAITING for me to fuck up or if they're trying to look down my dress, or
> both.
> 

this just isn't a fair statement.  until i read that, i was thinking of
how cool it would be to stand around and watch you spin, too.  now i have
a different opinion.

> I'm somehow preceived as a THREAT by some of the more egotistical/insecure
> (funny how those two traits go hand-in-hand) male DJs out there.  They
> crowd me while I'm spinning, or yell at me, trying to break my concentration.
> 

read this last part over.  then read the previous part.  a threat ALMOST 
(<- note) sounds right.

> So, this is a first-hand account of what it is like to be a female DJ in the
> man's world of techno -- especially hardcore techno.
> 
> Laura

i'm sure it's not easy, but are there ACTUALLY people saying, don't hire
her, she's a girl, or are there just not a lot of girls that WANT to be
a dj, like you said the guy in the record store said in your last post?

-mARK.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:15:04 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 13:52 EDT
From: laura@usl.com
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Women in the scene (was Re: the whole life expo...)
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Mark asks:
>exactly what does this remark about not being 17 mean?? that you're not
>17 yet, or that you're no longer a spring chicken?

I'm 28, much older than the average raver.

>> When I spin guys crowd around the table.  I don't know whether they are there
>> just WAITING for me to fuck up or if they're trying to look down my dress, or
>> both.
>> 
>
>this just isn't a fair statement.  until i read that, i was thinking of
>how cool it would be to stand around and watch you spin, too.  now i have
>a different opinion.

See, I have no idea why these guys are standing there, and I have to wonder.
They don't stand around when male DJs spin, except for the very very good
ones like Lenny Dee, and I'm no where near that league.  So what am I to think?
Is it so freaky that a woman is spinning that they have to stand and watch?
Or what?  It's a bit DAUNTING to say the least.

>> I'm somehow preceived as a THREAT by some of the more egotistical/insecure
>> (funny how those two traits go hand-in-hand) male DJs out there.  They
>> crowd me while I'm spinning, or yell at me, trying to break my concentration.
>> 
>
>read this last part over.  then read the previous part.  a threat ALMOST 
>(<- note) sounds right.

Ahhh.  I never made the connection.

>i'm sure it's not easy, but are there ACTUALLY people saying, don't hire
>her, she's a girl, or are there just not a lot of girls that WANT to be
>a dj, like you said the guy in the record store said in your last post?

I think there are just not a lot of women who are willing to put themselves
out there to become DJs because of the stuff I described.  The *PROMOTERS*
and *ORGANIZERS* as a whole have been 100% supportive of me.  But when you
see the DJ old-boy network, getting involved is a bit nerve-wracking.  You
know how it is -- they all hang together in a corner behind the booth peering
out at the rave and talking amongst themselves, naming all the instruments
and producers involved in a track, and rating the current DJs mixing skills.
Most guys are socialized to be a bit more thick-skinned, and have little
problem dealing with this.

Laura

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:29:42 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 11:20:48 -0700
From: bill coderre <bc@apple.com>
Message-Id: <9305031820.AA12328@apple.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Ranting and Raving

	RANTING is the opposite of RAVING

If you have any questions, write to me, personally, not this list.
I can barely keep up as it is.

bill coderre
bc@apple.com


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:29:42 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 11:19:12 -0700
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
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To: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, geoffw@nexsys.net, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        whoa@leland.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Date: Sun, 2 May 93 15:28:06 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305022228.AA10133@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: whoa@leland.stanford.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Status: R


This issue was not solved! Yes we need to look at it as 9 people but
we also need to look at the fact that rave scene, at the level of organization,
and performance (the DJ's) are dominated by Men.  Might I also add that 
                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
the person who said that we should look at it as 9 people was
a man and I did not feel that all of the women who spoke up felt
that the issue was solved, we just moved on thats all.
Let`s not sweep this one unde the rug guys, (and gals) we'll be making a
mistake if we do.


***I don't see why which sex you are for a dj has to do with anything...
   So if there were more women dj's out there and less men dj's......
   You see it just doesn't make sense. Are you tring to say that all
   the men let them be organizers or dj's etc. that they don't allow
   women....hemmm? If that is the case then there is a problem.
   But I just don't see it that way. Are people supposed to go out and
   look for the opposite sex to join in on the organizing/performance
   side of things???? Just curious...






                     
         /\                       noah@cadence.com 
        <<>>      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  
    ((((noah))))  "if i can get higher than this, 
	<<>>       i don't want to know about it"---Terence McKenna   
	 \/       ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:32:35 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 11:26:13 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305031826.AA26298@ganymede.apple.com>
To: jjaeger@ocf.berkeley.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  rants and raves

> >From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
> >To: monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
> >Subject: re: cyberforum - rants & raves
> 
> >this is not to be confused with domination/subservency.  i don't think
> >that anyone should have more power, or more luxuries, or more of anything
> >because of their sex, but men and women ARE NOT EQUAL.  THEY ARE DIFFERENT,m
> >and each has unique qualities and specialties.  i wish we could move a
> >way from androgeny a bit (the direction things seem to be going in...)
> >just long enough to appreciate the beautiful OPPOSITE qualities that 
> >both our sexes have.
> 
> Hear, hear!  Differences DO NOt mean inequalities.  It is a shame that
> a difference in nature is so often interpreted as an inferiority/superiority.
> So, then... How can a feminine (sometimes seen as an inferior) quality
> be more incorporated into rave scenes without the "masculine" feeling
> threatened or "watered down?"  Why is this a threat?
> 
> Andrea

come on andrea, you know me better than that.  re-read what i said.

i wish that the opposite and unique qualities of each sex could be
appreciated more for what they are, instead of creeping closer and
closer to completely non-descript personalities where it's even a
crime to use "he" or "she" words.

the key, i think, is balance, and a form of "common" sense that 
includes a double (maybe triple) heaping of treating others the way
you wish to be treated. 

the rave scene SOMETIMES works to acheive that. not always. :(

all the race/sex-pref/gender stuff is trivial.  these are merely
manifestations of the same problem.  if we all just treated other
PEOPLE like we want to be treated, we would have no problems.  instead
we waste time on stuff like this.  actually, i don't consider it
a waste of time at all, i just don't believe it's where the true
problem lies.

$.02

-mArK.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:35:16 1993
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From: "Dana WATANABE" <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305031828.AA09016@mothra.nts.uci.edu>
Subject: grrrrr.. ruff bark bark
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 11:28:22 PDT
Cc: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

im going to bite on my lip REAL hard and be nice

im sorry, maybe im a different type of guy
maybe i hang around differnet guys
but i know that a lot of men including myself
think that a female dj is there to look good
more than to play good music

initial reaction female dj=babe behind the turntables

i know other guys react this way its not just me
so dont try to say it is

with this attitude comes two things
first - you think shes going to be bad so you
notice the mistakes she makes more
second - you objectify her and treat as something to be drooled on
not dealt with as a human being AND as a woman

i dont see that many girls crowding around the dj
to drool on him and when i do, its usually his friends
not strange people he doesnt know who are muhc larger than him

look the prevalent attitude in society is that woman cant
even figure out how to hook up a sound system much less
play the records, adn the funny thing is, women believe it too
so it becomes true

why arent there that many women dj's?
well shit, ive seen one
one
hmm.. im a girl looking for role models
i can try to be like christina applegate or maybe mother teresa
but i dont see any women to model myself after in the dj field
GEEEE.. i wonder why i wont think about being a dj

but fuck just dj'ing.. how bout production
sure.. rick james is god
call moby or liam or anyone you want god
WHERE ARE TEH GODDESSES???

being sampled
just objects in te song
not doing any of the creation

 ,
dana

im looking forward to the day when the army has to have bake sales
and the schools get all the money they need

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:37:12 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 11:24:47 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <rramstad@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: the garden thursday
Reply-To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com


Lots of different DJs, a great space, cheap cover, and one of the
organizers of this event, Jeff, seems like a cool guy too... what more
could you ask?  I'll definitely be there.

the f.a.b.r.i.c. presents
the Garden
Thursday, May 6th
fullmoon
dj's
jim huckin
superfuzz
tony
john casadidio
luciana
carlos
dj jd
$8 or $6 with canned food
18 & over w/id
510-869-glad

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:45:54 1993
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From: "Dana WATANABE" <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305031837.AA09217@mothra.nts.uci.edu>
Subject: This is about women, but not the same subject
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 11:37:46 PDT
Cc: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

just regarding this whole issue
i figure ill throw out a request for info

for my womens studies class i need to create a course
that will teach about women and technology

or more specifically,
why more women arent in technological fields
(why the ratio was like 10 to 1 in my engineering lectures
and i bet more women than men (%age wise) showed up)
why women feel less adapt at technology than men
(why are more women scared of computers than men)
and most importantly
what needs to change so that women will become more involved

i realy have a grasp on the answers to the first two
but i need articles, books, speakers, etc
to back it up

and then the last one i REALLY need help with

but overall, all i really need are sources
any type of medium
just lots of good sources

i ALSO need to tie all of this into ART, HISTORY and LITERATURE
which is the tricky part..
history is easy
art i think i can nail.. maybe.. who knows
and literature ?????
why there are no cyberpunk writers who are women?
just thoughts

any and all help is appreciated
and hell.. ill even mention you in the paper if you want

 ,
dana

dwatanab@uci.edu

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 11:47:17 1993
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From: "Dana WATANABE" <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305031841.AA09319@mothra.nts.uci.edu>
Subject: no really.. im not getting emotional on this
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 11:41:45 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

i just like posting lots when ive got 100 orders to enter in the
next 30 minutes

one thing i would like to point out about both race and gender and
sexual orientation and any type of differnce issues

NO, we should not all just accept each other as people
as human beings
im not JUST a human being
im me god dammit and im coming from my background
and until you deal with people as WHO THEY ARE
and NOT just as human beings
then you are REALLY dealing with THEM
not just someone who could be anyone
cuz they are all teh same

fuck showing respect
fuck tolerance
get to KNOW people
love people for who they REALLY are
dont love them just because theyre there

 ,
dana

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 12:37:21 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Bob Carasik's message of Mon, 3 May 93 10:34:03 PDT <9305031734.AA27944@zeus.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Splash
From: Desi the Three-Armed Wonder Comic <jondr@sco.com>
Sender: jondr@sco.com
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 12:32:32 PDT
Message-Id:  <9305031232.aa22148@scotty.sco.COM>

bob carasik asks me in email something that i should probably share
with the entire list:

>Is the pool *really* open yet, or is that just hype.
>Fri-Sat partiers want to know!!

the pool will be open after the 4th week.  this saturday was the 1st
week, so figure it out...

also, the party is going to become 18+!  i think that happens
simultaneously with the pool opening, but i could be wrong.  more info
as i get it.

they weren't carding this saturday...  and it was free, too!

Jon Drukman (in stereo where available)                         jondr@sco.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you want to touch the sky, just put a window in your eye.           - Coil

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 12:40:02 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 12:32:20 -0700
Message-Id: <9305031932.AA17800@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
X-Sender: mcg@netcom.com (Unverified)
Subject: Re: Cyberforum -- Women DJs/promoters

Gregg Helt:
> Also, during the discussion 'bout this at the Cyberforum, someone from the
> audience stood up to say that she and some other promoters were going to
> do an event with all women DJs.  Does anyone else remember more about this,
> who/what/where/when?

I know a few of the people doing this... they haven't picked a date yet,
they're still in the conceptual/metaorganizational stage.  I'll post more
info about it when things gel a bit.

On a broader level, tho, I think the problem with the gender imbalance at
the CyberForum had as much to do with the format of the presentation (i.e.
the presumption that the people on stage were somehow MORE IMPORTANT than
people in the audience or others in the rave scene) as with any inherent
sexism in the scene.  I'm not saying that women aren't underrepresented as
DJ's or promoters, but I think there is a problem with assigning too much
significance and power to DJ's and promoters.  As Ernie Munson says constantly,
"there are no stars in this scene, every man and woman is a star."  I think
that view is shared by nearly every DJ and promoter I've met.

I understand the frustration women have in a society in which the power
relations are dictated by institutions that are predominantly male.  One
nit I've always picked with "classical" feminism is the idea that simply
by placing women in positions of power (CEO's, Boards of Directors,
Governments, etc.) society will magically improve and become more humane.
The problem is that as long as the nature of these institutions rely on
hierarchical power dominator relationships, the women who achieve high
positions are likely to exhibit the same cut-throat, corrupt tendencies as
the men who precede and surround them.  Witness Thatcher or Feinstein.

I met someone on Saturday who went to the CyberForum and helps promote
events such as TAZ, and we got to talking about this women-run event.
She was sceptical of the whole idea, and didn't think that exclusion or
separatism was something that would benefit the scene.  She told me that
the reason there weren't that many women promoters is that you have to
be really aggressive and cut-throat to be successful at it, and those aren't
traits many women want to have.  (Her words, not mine).

I wouldn't go as far as that, and I support the idea of this party (after
all, we guys are at least invited!), but I would rather see women (and the
rest of us) work for a world where domination and power-tripping are
obsolete, rather than simply wanting to take the reins of such a system.
The house scene could potentially be a model for this kind of world, but
only if everyone's voice and contribution is heard and respected equally,
whether male, female, promoter, DJ, or just a member of the community.

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 13:09:20 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: about this female DJ stuff
From: Desi the Three-Armed Wonder Comic <jondr@sco.com>
Sender: jondr@sco.com
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 12:59:28 PDT
Message-Id:  <9305031259.aa22212@scotty.sco.COM>

check out DJ Emma, who is part of the DIY Sound System tribe.  i
haven't heard her but my housemate says she's incredible with the
1200s.  she has got a record out called The Duster which i have heard
- it is quite godlike (or goddesslike i suppose).

so, all you women who want to be DJs and/or musicians, get with the
program!

in our very own bay area we have a group called NRSHA (pronounced
Inertia) which is made up of two women.  unfortunately, their music
isn't that great, but at least they're trying...

Jon Drukman (in stereo where available)                         jondr@sco.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you want to touch the sky, just put a window in your eye.           - Coil

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 13:11:36 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 13:05:41 -0700
From: rox@netcom.com (Roxanna Stieber)
Message-Id: <9305032005.AA11924@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: rth@netcom.com
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: Robert Hughes's message of Sun, 2 May 1993 11:33:56 -0800 <9305021834.AA24534@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Groove Kitchen a rip off ...

Dan and I found out the same thing! We went there at 2:30 or so and paid
$10 a piece to go in and find NOBODY there. 5 people maybe? We turned
around and walked out and they wouldn't refund our money. Leaves a bad 
taste in my mouth.

Rox

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 13:27:05 1993
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From: Trevor Schulze <tschulze@cisco.com>
Message-Id: <199305032022.AA15817@stout.cisco.com>
Subject: DNA to be 18+?
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU (sanfranraves)
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 13:22:37 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Okay, this is just a rumor that I heard......

Is it true that DNA is going to be 18+ for now on with the Afterlife
parties?  Can it be?  The reasoning behind this (so I heard) is that
they got busted for selling to minors.  In order to keep it going they
are going to close the bar in the morning.  Hmmmm, this seems
interesting, can they do this? 

Just a raver openingly hopeing that this is true.....  :):):):):)
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------
  Trevor Schulze	tschulze@cisco.com	(415) 688-7739
----------------------------------------------------------------

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 13:33:24 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 13:23:46 -0700
From: rox@netcom.com (Roxanna Stieber)
Message-Id: <9305032023.AA12909@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: jslee@well.sf.ca.us
Cc: rth@netcom.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: John S. Lee's message of Sun, 2 May 1993 18:15:03 -0700 <199305030115.AA17117@well.sf.ca.us>
Subject:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...

It is a ripoff if there is NO people there. It is my opinion thathat in
order to have a party you HAVE to have people!
Rox

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 13:33:43 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 13:27:12 -0700
From: diva@uclink.berkeley.edu (The Devil Does Drugs)
Message-Id: <9305032027.AA09703@uclink.berkeley.edu>
To: mcg@netcom.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Cyberforum -- Women DJs/promoters

w'hell - I'll be cut-throat and aggressive! just point me in the
direction!  (I'm sure most of you figured that out =)  but
seriously, this is something I've thought about for a while now.
not only because I'm a woman and want to even things out a bit,
but also because I hate feeling "useless" when I go out.  I want
to put something into the scene, help out, get truly involved, 
not just wander around like the clueless wonder. =)  I also don't
want to be a token female... (what a coherent paragraph you're
writing leah! =)  so I guess my point is that there are those of
us who *definitely* want to be really involved, "up-and-coming"
or whatever... it's just that it's difficult to find a way in.

I'll see some of you tonight... and maybe I'll have a different
perspective then =)  

always, leah


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 13:33:53 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 13:27:53 -0700
From: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Message-Id: <9305032027.AA13191@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Keeping big brother out of our faces....

Greetings fellow ravers.... From Cap'n Crunch

  John Draper here,  with a mission to inform you folks about a scarey
trend by certain government and corporate forces to strip you of your
rights to privacy in electronic and voice mail.    If you don't have 
a personal computer or use Email,  then please ignore this.   But if
you're on this sfraves mailing list,  you probably have a computer,  or
access to one,  or at least are probably going to get one.

  Briefly,  last Apr 15th,  an announcement was made about our governments
support for an encryption chip officially called the Clipper chip,  which
is to be used to encrypt phone calls,  cellular phone calls and Email.
So what!!  you might ask...   If you have nothing to hide,   never do anything
illegal,  and are a law abiding citizen,   you have nothing to worry about.
If you desire complete privacy,  or expect privacy by purchasing phones
in the future with the expectation that you can keep your conversations
private,
then you should take heed.

  It is planned by large corporate manufacturers of these future phones,
AT&T to be precise,  to register their internal serial numbers or "keys"
with a government controlled escrow agency so that "Big brother" can extract
your secret decryption key with an authorized court ordered wiretap.   Now,
I say this is BOGUS,  WRONG,  and pure BULLSHIT,  and defeats the purpose
of encryption in the first place.    I'm not going to get into all the details
or politics of this insanity,  other then to inform you all of whats going on,
and how you can get more information,  and better yet,  how you can help our
cause to "THROW A WRENCH INTO THE GOVERNMENTS PLANS".

  Eventually,  the trends we are observing now,  indicate that the government
will eventually OUTLAW private encryption.   This is like the post office
forcing everyone to use postcards and eliminate mailing envelopes.  Now this
is not only BOGUS but scarey as well.

  So,  I say,  what can we do about this...   Well,  I have several ideas,
and a lot of them was discussed in the Cypherpunks forum.    One such Idea
I proposed was to make up information handouts to be passed out at raves,
informing those folks about what they can do to spread the word around,  and
to fight this dangerious trend.

  Another such idea,  although not completly accepted,  and hotly debated,
is to set up some tables with laptops or small portable computers,  and make
them available to those folks who want to obtain copies of PGP (An encryption
program),  sign each other's keys (To prevent spoofing),  and to network and
exchange information about this controversial subject.   

  In my opinion,  one way we can protect our rights to privacy is through
technology,  by using military strength encryption and even deception by
folling the snooper into thinking an encryped message is a program.

  So,  I make a plea to those rave organizers to contact us Cypherpunks,
and work with us to help inform fellow ravers owning,  or having access to
computers and Email,  on how we can fight "Big brother" and keep its
"ear" out of our faces.

  Encryption can be a powerful tool in setting up and planning future raves
in total privacy,   communicating and organizing other sub-events or for
any other communication requiring provacy.   So I urge you all to support
us Cypherpunks in helping get the word out and fight this Big Brother trend
the government and large corporations are pushing in our faces.

  For more information,  you can Email me here at address below,  as I plan
on staying on the sfraves mailing list for about another week.    Please
understand that my Email traffic is HUGE (About 400 - 500 messages a day),
and that this mailing list is also adding to the problem.   If you have any
questions,  feel free to send them,  but don't delay,  because I cannot
stay on this list forever.

  I've been raving since the "Toon Town" raves started up several years ago,
and really enjoy the togetherness of the crowds,  but with some severe allergy
problems,  I avoid the smokey raves or places that have little or no
ventilation.

  And now I want to complement the organizers of the Beltane rave last Saturday
night on how it was set up.    There was a lot of places where I can enjoy and
dance to the music without discomfort from heavy cigerette smoke.   The dance
floor was less crowded than most,  so had plenty of room to "romp and rave"
around,  and I really enjoyed the "schmooze room" or stretch room with the
matresses for stretching and doing yoga.   Having that available allowed me
to recover from the stresses of dancing and rest my lower back,  so I was able
to rave with the best of them without having to use drugs as a crutch to keep
dancing and raving all night.    All in all,  it was the most enjoyable rave
I've been to in a long time,  and I plea to those rave organizers to try and
set up similar non-smoking areas where we can grab a breath of fresh air once
in a while wihout having to try and talk the goons into letting us back in
after getting fresh air.    Also I want to thank the organizers for permitting
me to give a helping hand in the setting up,  because I couldn't afford the
$20 door fees.    WOW!!  the prices for getting into these raves has really
gone through the roof.    Anyway,   I helped tape up the dance floor panals
and was instrumental in getting it ready for opening on time.

  If any rave promoter wants me to attend and talk to the group of make myself
available to other ravers,  just make sure I can get on the guest list.  
HINT HINT!!  as I'm still unemployed,  and the entrance fees are what is 
keeping me away from most raves.    Just Email me if you want me to attend,
and provide a small,  well ventilated area where I can get a breath of fresh
air,  stretch and do yoga,  and I can attend and rave with the best of them.

  So I say to you folks **RAVE ON** but watch BIG BROTHER and do your part
in keeping him out of your face..    So support your local Cypherpunks
and if you're interested in helping out,  you can join the cypherpunks
mailing list,  by sending Email to "cypherpunks-request@toad.com".   Like
sfraves mailing list,  it has heavy traffic (About 30-70 messages/day),
but is an excellent forum and information resource for those interested
in cryptography,  although some messages are highly technical,  and political,
you might find it enlightening.

  The cypherpunks also meet on a monthly basis in Mt view,  so for more info,
please Email me or join the list.

RAVE ON DUDES...

Cap'n Crunch
John D.

crunch@netcom.com
crunch@well.sf.ca.us

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 13:38:57 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 13:30:20 -0700
From: diva@uclink.berkeley.edu (The Devil Does Drugs)
Message-Id: <9305032030.AA10111@uclink.berkeley.edu>
To: laura@usl.com, mark@ganymede.apple.com, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Subject: Re:  Women in the scene (was Re: the whole life expo...)
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

everyone sure loves to use us 17 year olds as examples and such...

=) =)  (humor for the smiley impared)

and whoever said that being 17 is all *that* great anyway? =) =) 

always, leah



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 14:16:59 1993
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From: Edward Potter <ejp@well.sf.ca.us>
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To: ccat@netcom.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  NYC's FINEST -Dante at Tilt-a-Whirl noon Sun.







From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 14:33:35 1993
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From: tgrant@netcom.com (Tony Grant)
Message-Id: <9305032129.AA00963@netcom3.netcom.com>
Subject: Groove Kitchen
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 14:29:06 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]



I'm afraid I don't follow...

A promoter's job is to rent the space, hire the Djs and create an atmosphere.
It's up to us to supply the people and the energy.  If everyone who posted that
Groove Kitchen sucked had stayed and danced there'd be nothing to complain
about.


Tony
-- 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 14:40:36 1993
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Date:         Mon, 03 May 93 17:30:20 EDT
From: susie <SK2479A@american.edu>
Organization: The American University
Subject:      Re: DNA to be 18+?
To: Trevor Schulze <tschulze@cisco.com>,
        sanfranraves <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
In-Reply-To:  Your message of Mon, 3 May 93 13:22:37 PDT

On Mon, 3 May 93 13:22:37 PDT you said:
>Okay, this is just a rumor that I heard......
>
>Is it true that DNA is going to be 18+ for now on with the Afterlife
>parties?  Can it be?  The reasoning behind this (so I heard) is that
>
>Just a raver openingly hopeing that this is true.....  :):):):):)
>----------------------------------------------------------------
ok...this is not fair...ahhhh i was a good little kid patiently waiting until t
he ageist age of 21 to go there...(i mean i never owned a fake id and what not)
and now once  i turn old enough to get in to the damm place it turns to 18+...
i now understand why people buy guns....not!*smile* partyon...susie (:
this is not fair...now this is proof that life is not fair...ahhhh
i think i will turn into a heartless old fart ageist...hehehehehhehe

>  Trevor Schulze	tschulze@cisco.com	(415) 688-7739
>----------------------------------------------------------------

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 14:44:33 1993
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Date: 3 May 1993 14:19:18 -0800
From: "Scott Nozawa*" <scott_nozawa*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Groove Kitchen
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

                       Subject:                               Time:14:13
  OFFICE MEMO          Groove Kitchen                         Date:5/3/93
Hi all,

     I would just like to clarify a few things.  Maybe I got confused from all
the different posts but... well anyways...   Groove Kitchen did not close down
on Saturday night it went all night long at 836 Mission ( Big Heart City ).  It
was Wicked that got closed at the King St. Garage.  

Keep it Alive and Thrive                               T. Scot 



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 14:44:19 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 14:35:46 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305032135.AA28028@ganymede.apple.com>
To: diva@uclink.berkeley.edu, laura@usl.com, mark@ganymede.apple.com,
        ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Subject: Re:  Women in the scene (was Re: the whole life expo...)
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

leah-

i know how you feel sometimes, but believe me, that feeling
of not being readily accepted into a scene or group or profession
or clique happens to everyone.  i think the reason women feel it
so strongly is that 1) there IS a certain fat group of men somewhere
that's making the rest of us guys look bad, and 2) it's been going
on for a while.

i would love to see more women involved with EVERYTHING.  i love
women.  i love the touch they (sorry bout using 'they'...) add to
creative, academic and social environments as well as ANY others,
that i might have left out.  AND i think they can do  the job just
as good (and better in many cases) than a man.

do be quite up front, i don't think (at least i hope) that there
are any kids like that on this list.   subsribing to the view that
women are inferior that is...

i wish sfraves ran this country.

VITAMIN B for president!!!

-mArK. (Always Take Your Vitamins)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 14:52:35 1993
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From: PLUI@iossvr.gm.hac.com
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Received: by DniMail (v1.0); Mon May  3 14:46:35 1993 PDT
To: HAC2GM..arpa.."sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu"@hac2arpa.hac.com
Subject: lee? anyone? help???

on the c2 tape with the backwards "E" (lee?) theres a song with a repeating vocal

"gonna ba gonna be gonna be alright" 

if i dont find this track, i may go insane (again) :)

can anyone help?               
                                __
Patrick Lui   aka cato         / '>  tweet! (luv bird)
plui@iossvr.gm.hac.com        /\ /\



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 15:23:19 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: PLUI@iossvr.gm.hac.com's message of Mon, 3 May 93 14:46:51 PDT <9305032146.AA25502@hac2arpa.hac.com>
Subject: lee? anyone? help???
From: Desi the Three-Armed Wonder Comic <jondr@sco.com>
Sender: jondr@sco.com
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 15:06:39 PDT
Message-Id:  <9305031506.aa05347@scotty.sco.COM>

patrick lui sez:

>on the c2 tape with the backwards "E" (lee?) theres a song with a repeating vocal
>"gonna ba gonna be gonna be alright" 
>if i dont find this track, i may go insane (again) :)

mukka - "buruchacha" on limbo/23rd precinct records.

Jon Drukman (in stereo where available)                         jondr@sco.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you want to touch the sky, just put a window in your eye.           - Coil

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 15:23:26 1993
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To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: FMR


     Does anybody know when the next Full Moon Rave is?  Is it going to be
at Bonny Doon?  Just wondering...

Thanks,
      calvin

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 15:36:57 1993
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Date:    Mon, 03 May 93 15:19 PDT
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: Tamara Palmer                        <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
Subject: Birthday Greetings

Happy 21st Birthday Susie!!!

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 15:41:54 1993
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From: Max Enrique Sequeira Garza <al160184@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Message-Id: <199305032223.AA30546@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Subject: SUSIE!!
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 16:23:49 +22335737 (CST)
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Yey!!!

'Rave on Susie'!!!!!!

Happy Birthday!!!!

        MAX

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 15:52:56 1993
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Date:    Mon, 03 May 93 15:33 PDT
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: Tamara Palmer                        <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
Subject: Song ID from CII

OK, this is a *LOUSY* description of the song, I know,
but I believe it's during Moonpup's set and it's very
Holly Johnson-esque and rambles on about the future...
Anyone on my wavelength? What the hell is it?
------------------------------------------------------
Q:(to Blur) "Hey, what's the name of that song that
             mentions the zulu nation?"
A: "Zulu Nation."
(just so you know just how DENSE I can be
 when it comes to identifying songs...:) )
------------------------------------------
                       Tamara Palmer
                       IZZYPK3@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 16:03:50 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 15:29:35 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305032229.AA01740@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu, jslee@well.sf.ca.us, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu,
        mark@ganymede.apple.com
Subject: Re:  Cyberforum: rants and raves



mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)  says and I quote:

> 
> i think i'm in a rant mood today.  i hope i don't come accross
> as just wanting to pick fights.  really.
> 
> but on the subject of Beltane making non-celtics feel excluded, i post
> (that's POSE) this question:
> 
> "if a black-american had on a shirt with a picture of africa and the words
> 'black pride' (or similar) how would you look at that?"
> 
> probably without much judgement.  it seems fine to me.
> 
> but now turn that around and make it a white-american with a shirt on
> that said "white pride".  all of a sudden that person becomes a racist.

Well I can tell you how I feel from the heart, The first feeling I get
is shock, surprise, followed by fear, I think, did I get off at the wrong 
exit or something :) Then I think well who the fuck is this person and if
it looks like I'm not in any immediate danger (or at least the odds are
somewhat in my favor ) I might  scan him to see what kind of person he is...

What I'm saying is that I'm having a conditioned reaction.  In this society
words have coded meanings.  I fully realize that Black Power and White Power
are syntatically equivilent but society has non-equivilent meanings.  We call
this whooping body of knowledge "political correctness" and it SUCKS!.

It sucks because a white person should be able to express their pleasure
at just being white without being labeled a racist.  You can be proud to be
white and still not feel that that makes you better than some other group on
the planet.  I think everybody (uh oh I feel a rant coming on...)
	

	1. That from a global perspective, white people are a minority.

	2.From a global perspective, every ethnic group is a minority.

	3.From a global perspective we are all in the majority as far as
	  humans are concerned, half in male bodies half in female bodies.

	4. Currently a european based technological civilization is in
	  control of most of the resources on the planet at this time.

	5. No individual group of people in the world are at the cause
	  of the problems that face the planet.  We all share in the
	  cause, we all moust share in the cure.

	6. The Dominator culture wants things to go on as usual,  they
	  believe in the doctrine of crisis management, balence of power
	  (their power), and large scale infomation memes like money,
	  nations,nationalities, etc.

	7. This culture is about control, they will resort to violence
	  in order to secure their control over the future of resources.

	8. Currently this culture is centered around the USA-Europe axis
	and includes the former soviet union as well as japan, austraila
	egypt, israel, saudi arabia the current south african government
	and the ruling elite of china.

	9. It is not about left or right wing politics, it's about economics

	10.  This culture cannot be overturned, no physical revolution
	could over turn it or prevent it from posioning the planet.

	11.  we need a REVOLUTION of CONSCIOUSNESS which needs to happen
	from the inside-out. every person, culture on the planet has a part
	of the puzzle.

	12.  Europeans like everyone else have an integral and important
	part in the whole.

	13.  It is NOT white people who are dominating the planet,
	its a Dominator Culture made up of every race on the planet
	although the controlers of this culture at the top of the 
	pyramid happen to be white.

	14.  We need to start to see our similarities with each other
	and use our diferences as tools to interoperate for the common
	good.
 



> 
> the point i'm making may be moot...someone tell me.  sometimes i just
> feel like a ton of crap gets thrown in the direction of young white
> hetero males that haven't done anything to propagate this.  not all
> black/white segregation is the idea of the white side, nor all het/homo
> segregation the idea of the het side.
> 
> am i confused?  this is a real and serious inquiry, requesting a reply.
> 
> ***also, if i'm pushing the boundaries of sfraves topics, just let
> me know...it's monday, and i haven't had any coffee yet.
> 
> sincerely,
> 
> -mARK.
> 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 16:08:49 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: lee? anyone? help???
From: kellyd@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (David Kelly)
Message-Id: <NNwZ3B1w165w@cybernet.cse.fau.edu>
Date: Mon, 03 May 93 18:36:34 EDT
In-Reply-To: <9305032146.AA25502@hac2arpa.hac.com>
Organization: Cybernet BBS, Boca Raton, Florida

PLUI@iossvr.gm.hac.com writes:

> on the c2 tape with the backwards "E" (lee?) theres a song with a repeating v
> 
> "gonna ba gonna be gonna be alright" 
> 
> if i dont find this track, i may go insane (again) :)

actually that was me (blur)..

and as jon said, it's 'buruchacca' by mukkaa on the limbo label out 
of glasgow, scotland..

if you like it, i would actually recommend anything else on that 
particular label also..  

(btw, excuse my mixing on the tape - the only rave so far i have been 
taped at and i get to mix with saturated slipmats..:)


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 16:25:21 1993
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From: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
Message-Id: <9305032308.AA19762@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com>
Subject: Re: the garden thursday
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 16:08:41 PDT
In-Reply-To: <9305031824.AA25450@groovy.us.oracle.com>; from "Bob Ramstad" at May 3, 93 11:24 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0]
Content-Length: 392

> Lots of different DJs, a great space, cheap cover, and one of the
> organizers of this event, Jeff, seems like a cool guy too... what more
> could you ask?  I'll definitely be there.
> 
> the f.a.b.r.i.c. presents
> the Garden
> Thursday, May 6th
> fullmoon
> dj's
> luciana
  ^^^^^^^
AND A WOMAN DJ TOO ! (sorry, couldn't resist.)

-- 
 dit@sybase.com        /         and shout out loud.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 16:30:59 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 19:13:21 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305032313.AA25208@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Metal Detectors?
In-Reply-To: <9304262318.AA22882@krupke.lurnix.com>
References: <9304261706.AA01727@nexsys.nexsys.net>
	<9304262318.AA22882@krupke.lurnix.com>

I wonder how much it costs to rent one of those airport type metal
detectors? It might weed out some of the weaponry people seem to be
bringing.

Extreme :-(

Sean

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 16:35:08 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 16:17:40 -0700
Message-Id: <9305032317.AA24048@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Sign of the Times (sigh...)

Just sighted on a MUNI shelter in my neighborhood, an eight-foot
ad for The Gap with an enormous portrait of Tim Leary.  Caption:
"Gap chambray shirt worn by TIMOTHY LEARY, Philosopher."

What's next?  Terence McKenna for Carnival Cruise Line?  Sasha Shulgin
for DuPont?  Hakim Bey for Allstate Insurance?  Ren and Stimpy for
Science Diet (has anyone else seen the Rocky and Bullwinkle ads for
for Taco Bell)???

=)

(now, over to Niels Mayer for commentary...)

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 16:40:15 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 19:07:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alan Michael Parry <brit@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: Re: Cyberforum: rants and raves
To: Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: <9305032229.AA01740@nexsys.nexsys.net>
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On Mon, 3 May 1993, Geoff White wrote:

> > but now turn that around and make it a white-american with a shirt on
> > that said "white pride".  all of a sudden that person becomes a racist.
> 
> What I'm saying is that I'm having a conditioned reaction.  In this society
> words have coded meanings.  I fully realize that Black Power and White Power
> are syntatically equivilent but society has non-equivilent meanings.  We call
> this whooping body of knowledge "political correctness" and it SUCKS!.
> 	1. That from a global perspective, white people are a minority.

 uh-oh. Looks as if someone is afraid of losing his white male priviledge.
 From a global perspective, white people ARE NOT a minority. Minority
 status is not derived by numbers but by political status and other
 similar factors. Based on this, there is no-one better off in this world
 than the white heterosexual male. Society should have different meanings
 - it is neccessary for such things to me said. People who talk about     
 starting a white students union or "straight campus" to oppose our       
 universities Queer Campus make me laugh. It is not always the people
 themselves that they fear, but loosing the priviledges that they were born
 with.
 
--Fluid




From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 16:42:42 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 19:23:35 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305032323.AA25490@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: Weekend Update
In-Reply-To: <199304262322.AA06074@well.sf.ca.us>
References: <199304262322.AA06074@well.sf.ca.us>

Perhaps it should be SOP to have at least one camcorder at a rave, to
document any abuses by the cops. Just make sure and cover up that red
light. Makes you less obvious.

Sean

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 17:01:19 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305032345.AA02092@slack>
Subject: Sign of the Times (sigh...)
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 17:45:07 -0600 (MDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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> Just sighted on a MUNI shelter in my neighborhood, an eight-foot
> ad for The Gap with an enormous portrait of Tim Leary.  Caption:
> "Gap chambray shirt worn by TIMOTHY LEARY, Philosopher."

Leary would appear nude in Better Homes & Gardens if you paid him enough
money.  The guy went on a speaking tour at clubs ferchrissake and will place
his "name" on anything that garners moola.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 17:04:38 1993
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From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305032315.AA00686@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Someone said:
>Does anyone have any comments or suggestions as to how we can begin
>to change this ?  

WE can't do anything unless you want to campaign to get more
girls interested in djing and promoting but if a person (girl
in this case) isn't interested enough to self-initiate a hobby
or profession, than how good are they gonna be at it and why
should they be given special attention?  I have absolutely no
interest in modern dance, a predominantly feminine art form
(doesn't have to be but it is) and if a group of woman tried to
recruit me because they needed more men on that scene, I would
still have absolutely no interist in it.  Or what if a bunch of
black people wanted me to join their step-dancing crew because
they needed more white people?  My point is, no matter what the
reason, if girls in general don't have the interest to persue these
matters than that's the way it is, I don't buy it that there's some
organized secret group of chauvinist, rave promoters keepin girls 
out.

Someone else said:
>The other thing I forgot to mention is -- I asked
>a DJ here in LA (who shall remain nameless lest he
>look like a chauvinist pig on both ends of this
>coast!) why he thought there weren't more female
>djs and he said that females are not into the music
>as much and are not willing to make the necessary
>sacrifices that being a dj entails...how can we
>win with that sort of attitude?

I think this person is right and shouldn't be called a chauvinist
for stating a (probably true) belief that absolutely does not imply
inferiority of woman to men, just a difference.  The biggest problem
with sexism and racism, besides their existence, is people who don't
know when they are and aren't occuring.  Like I stated before,
nobody's keeping girls out, they just don't tend to be interested
in these aspects of the scene.

So in essence, if your a girl on this list reading this, and you
have a strong interest in djing or rave promoting, get out there 
and do it.  But then, you didn't need me to reassure you because
if you were of the mind to do it you'd of done it anyway right?

-Mark

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 17:08:10 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305032355.AA29100@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Sign of the Times (sigh...)
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 16:55:15 PDT
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305032345.AA02092@slack>; from "Pete Ashdown" at May 3, 93 5:45 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

PEE-Raise Cheezus! and LO! on my crt Pete Ashdown spake thusly:
> 
> > Just sighted on a MUNI shelter in my neighborhood, an eight-foot
> > ad for The Gap with an enormous portrait of Tim Leary.  Caption:
> > "Gap chambray shirt worn by TIMOTHY LEARY, Philosopher."
> 
> Leary would appear nude in Better Homes & Gardens if you paid him enough
> money.  The guy went on a speaking tour at clubs ferchrissake and will place
> his "name" on anything that garners moola.
> 

Yup, like that VH-1 commercial he's in.

-H-


-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 						   howard@netcom.com
				 Help!
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 17:10:20 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 20:01:06 EDT
From: Monica Tauriello <monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: re: women djs
Message-Id: <CMM-RU.1.3.736473666.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>

mARK wrote that instead of asking ourselves why there aren't more girl(sic)
djs, we (women) should ask ourselves why we are not djs...

i would love to be a dj, and when i have the time and money i might start
learning...however, my point is that perhaps the rave community, particularly
in the promotions, dj arena, is male-dominated, not just in numbers but in
attitude.  laura wrote earlier of the difficulties she encounters with
many men in the hardcore community being uncomfortable with women.  another
woman, a promoter, wrote of the assumptions people make about her: that she
is just someone's girlfriend, etc.  historically rock music has been
male-dominated and sexist, and i don't see raves, etc. as being that much
diffeerent in that respect.  what we need to do is recognize the sexism women
face, and work against it.  it IS a political issue -it's not just about the
color of the wallpaper, whatever.  

monicat

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 17:30:53 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 17:27:26 -0700
From: ccat@netcom.com (Chris)
Message-Id: <9305040027.AA09102@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Women as Promoters/DJ's

  I think a lot of people are neglecting the fact that quite a few women are al-
ready on the scene,and promoting / DJing. And enlightened ones..especially
those

involved in the scene a year or two ago,were *remarkably* open to people
of diverse flavors attempting to express themselves in this exciting new
medium... And  to a large extent, it's still happening..
 I think the biggest drag on this process has been the creeping 
commercialism of the scene..resulting in a dilution..basically of it's
creative people in a sea of sheep-like-ones. Even so, some of the most
successful promoters have been women..(Ive always felt that in some
area,women were inherently more stable than men !)
 Just look at Dianna (of ToonTown) and Heather (of Storm)
  Both entered a mans world and succeeded.. 
There must be more..
I know the Equinox promoter is a very cool woman..and Preston's partner when
he  started Groove Kitchen was a woman also..
 So-next time you see a woman dj'ing or promoting..I think the biggest
favor you can do her is to simply judge her event on it's own merits and 
leave it at that.Celebrate diversity..and nobody needs anybody's pity.
..does that ring true..?
 Chris.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 17:41:15 1993
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From: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
Message-Id: <9305040033.AA22553@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com>
Subject: re: women djs
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 17:33:52 PDT
In-Reply-To: <CMM-RU.1.3.736473666.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>; from "Monica Tauriello" at May 3, 93 8:01 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0]
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> i would love to be a dj, and when i have the time and money i might start
> learning...however, my point is that perhaps the rave community, particularly
> in the promotions, dj arena, is male-dominated, not just in numbers but in
> attitude.  laura wrote earlier of the difficulties she encounters with
> many men in the hardcore community being uncomfortable with women.  another
> woman, a promoter, wrote of the assumptions people make about her: that she
> is just someone's girlfriend, etc.  historically rock music has been
> male-dominated and sexist, and i don't see raves, etc. as being that much
> diffeerent in that respect.  what we need to do is recognize the sexism women
> face, and work against it.  it IS a political issue -it's not just about the
> color of the wallpaper, whatever.  

It is undeniable that there ARE greater obstacles for woman DJ's in this
arena. You will find it different elsewhere. In NYC there are plenty of 
woman DJ's, but then this is a place with ample nightlife for all various
types. In the after hours lesbian dance scene there are more than a few
all woman clubs with woman dj's, but then again quite a few are not
very interested in spinning outside of their own community (why should they,
having solved the problem for themselves on an acceptable level).
It also goes the other way, and gets worse. If you think acceptance and respect
dont come easily in the house community, try being a woman DJ in the hip-hop
community. Try being a gay male DJ in the hip-hop community and on and on.
It is a pretty large problem, eh (recognition).
And only WE can change it.
just adding on.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 17:44:25 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 20:37:05 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305040037.AA27382@pilot.njin.net>
To: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: more nekid bodies
In-Reply-To: <9304292040.AA29980@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
References: <9304292040.AA29980@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>

 > And yes, the outward expression of inner beuaty can also be a sexual turn 
 > on.  Personally, I find myself more attracted to someone who expresses a 
 > beautiful vibe that I can connect with over some model with an attitude. 
 > I think this is what is sometimes referred to as "love", something this
 > world could use a bit more of. 

Hear hear! That is exactly what I like most from a person, one who can
project a positive vibe. It makes the world a magic place.

Sean

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 17:50:56 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 17:34:13 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305040034.AA02044@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: geoffw%nexsys@apc.org, brit@ravel.udel.edu
Subject: Re: Cyberforum: rants and raves
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

>  uh-oh. Looks as if someone is afraid of losing his white male priviledge.

Um, what white male priviledge?
I lost that before I was born :)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 18:06:02 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305040052.AA06119@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Geoff White, closet Honky
To: brit@ravel.udel.edu (Alan Michael Parry)
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 17:51:59 PDT
Cc: geoffw@nexsys.net, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.03.9305031955.E1911-b100000@ravel.udel.edu>; from "Alan Michael Parry" at May 3, 93 7:07 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

> 
> 
> On Mon, 3 May 1993, Geoff White wrote:
> 
> > > but now turn that around and make it a white-american with a shirt on
> > > that said "white pride".  all of a sudden that person becomes a racist.
> 
>  uh-oh. Looks as if someone is afraid of losing his white male priviledge.

You have obviously never met Geoff.

-H-


-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 						   howard@netcom.com
				Don't Crash
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 18:13:29 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 21:00:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alan Michael Parry <brit@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: Re: Geoff White, closet Honky 
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
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On Mon, 3 May 1993, Howard Berkey wrote:

> You have obviously never met Geoff.

That is true, but I have been following this discussion and have noticed
that Geoff is African American. Sorry for the confusion but I was simply
restating something that I find myself saying with ever increasing
frequency. When the heterosexual white male realizes the situation and
stops thinking that he is under attack, then things may begin to change -
but not until.
 
--Fluid




From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 18:15:19 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 17:42:30 PDT
From: alves@bethe.ucdavis.edu (David Alves)
Message-Id: <9305040042.AA26158@bethe.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: metal detectors


>I wonder how much it costs to rent one of those airport type metal
>detectors? It might weed out some of the weaponry people seem to be
>bringing.
>Sean

well I think there should be a dark passage near the entrance where
people dressed in full white chemical protection suits (or whatever they are 
called) dance around you with those metal detectors made for the beach that
are specially wired up with lots of flashing lights and buzzers ...

Dave ;^)


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 18:21:21 1993
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From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305040050.AA00808@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Laura says:

>See, I have no idea why these guys are standing there, and I have
>to wonder.  They don't stand around when male DJs spin, except for
>the very very good ones like Lenny Dee, and I'm no where near that
>league.  So what am I to think? Is it so freaky that a woman is
>spinning that they have to stand and watch? Or what?  It's a bit
>DAUNTING to say the least.

It is "freaky", we've all aknowleded that. There aren't many girl
djs, people gawk at things that are different, you are different,
people gawk at you.  Don't take it so personal or sexual or negative.
Take advantage of it and prove yourself like everyone else has to do.

>I think there are just not a lot of women who are willing to put
>themselves out there to become DJs because of the stuff I described.

I doubt it.  There just aren't that many woman interested in it
for some reason or another, although that reason probably has
to do with societal gender programming but that's a different facet
of this issue.  If any one is intimidated out of doing something
they realy want to do than they need to work on certain aspects of
their charcter.

>The *PROMOTERS* and *ORGANIZERS* as a whole have been 100% 
>supportive of me.  But when you see the DJ old-boy network, getting
>involved is a bit nerve-wracking.  You know how it is -- they all
>hang together in a corner behind the booth peering out at the rave
>and talking amongst themselves, naming all the instruments and 
>producers involved in a track, and rating the current DJs mixing
>skills.  Most guys are socialized to be a bit more thick-skinned,
>and have little problem dealing with this.

That's called trade jargon and it sounds like you need to be
there with them if you're realy worth your wax & 1200's.  Have you
ever tried to participate or are you creating intimidation for
your self by assuming that they wouldn't want you there? 

Then Dana says:

>im going to bite on my lip REAL hard and be nice

>im sorry, maybe im a different type of guy
>maybe i hang around differnet guys
>but i know that a lot of men including myself
>think that a female dj is there to look good
>more than to play good music

>initial reaction female dj=babe behind the turntables

>i know other guys react this way its not just me
>so dont try to say it is

>with this attitude comes two things
>first - you think shes going to be bad so you
>notice the mistakes she makes more
>second - you objectify her and treat as something to be drooled on
>not dealt with as a human being AND as a woman

And at this point I'm wondering if there are two Dana's because
I'm not sure if this is the same person who posted about
being in a feminine studies class earlier and second I'm getting
pist off because of that objectify word/concept, which implies
that people are so simple-minded that we can't possibly see a human,
and a waman - to be druled on.  Why can't you still drule (a normal
human response) and aknowledge the skill or lack there of 
(another human response - whoa overload - two human responses
going on at the same time! - what's goin on)?

>i dont see that many girls crowding around the dj
>to drool on him and when i do, its usually his friends
>not strange people he doesnt know who are muhc larger than him

Oh?  I've seen intimidating strangers crowding Jeno all the time
and who is it that has the female groupies?  Ghost or someone?

-Mark

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 18:25:25 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 20:19:18 EDT
From: Monica Tauriello <monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
To: dwatanab@uci.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit
Subject: women and technology
Message-Id: <CMM-RU.1.3.736474758.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>

there is at least one cyberpunk woman writer i know of: marge piercy - *he,
she and it* and *woman on the edge of time* 

*he, she, and it* is fantastic

monicat

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 18:26:56 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 17:22:15 -0700
From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305040022.AA19410@jobe>
To: jondr@sco.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  lee? anyone? help???

> Date: Mon, 3 May 93 15:06:39 PDT
> From: Desi the Three-Armed Wonder Comic <jondr@sco.com>
> 
> patrick lui sez:
> 
> >on the c2 tape with the backwards "E" (lee?) theres a song with a repeating vocal
> >"gonna ba gonna be gonna be alright" 
> >if i dont find this track, i may go insane (again) :)
> 
> mukka - "buruchacha" on limbo/23rd precinct records.

Can someone post the titles and musicians on the C2 tapes in 
the order taped.  Thanks.

- Steve

> Jon Drukman (in stereo where available)                         jondr@sco.com
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> If you want to touch the sky, just put a window in your eye.           - Coil
> 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 18:41:01 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 21:28:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alan Michael Parry <brit@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: Minority status
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
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In answer to someone who stated that I was wrong in my definition of what
a minority is:

 "The term minority [is] highly misleading. In sociological use a minority
  refers not to the numercial size of a group but to their socioeconomic
  and poltical status. In sociological use a minority is "a group of
  people who, because of their physical or cultural characteristics, are  
  singled out from the others in the society in which they live for
  differential and unequal treatment, and who therefore regard themselves 
  as objects of collective discrimination.""

               -"SOCIAL PROBLEMS" Frank Scarpitti/Margaret Anderson 1992  
  _
 (_ )  ) (  ) _(            
 (  (_ (_) ( (_(




From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 18:56:14 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 18:47:41 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <rramstad@us.oracle.com>
To: saeedi@shell.portal.com
Cc: jondr@sco.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Steven J Saeedi's message of Mon, 3 May 93 17:22:15 -0700 <9305040022.AA19410@jobe>
Subject:  lee? anyone? help???
Reply-To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com


Steve sez:

> Can someone post the titles and musicians on the C2 tapes in 
> the order taped.  Thanks.

Well, I think this is a bit of wishful thinking, with 5 DJs and only 3
of them here on the net, not to mention tons of different records, but
if it happens, cool.  This is what I have (again for those who may
have missed it):

layout for C2 cassettes

tapes are in chronological order and are complete except for 10
minutes of Lee's set edited out from between the ddagger and forall
sides due to record skipping

circle		Scott Hardkiss			43 minutes
bullet		Scott Hardkiss			12 minutes
		Jon Drukman unmixed		31 minutes

sharp		Jon Drukman mixed		43 minutes
		Moonpup				 1 minute
flat		Moonpup				44 minutes

dagger		Moonpup				39 minutes
ddagger		Moonpup				17 minutes
		Lee				22 minutes

forall		Lee				45 minutes
exists		BLURrrr				45 minutes

C2 setlist for David Kelly aka BLURrrr

monumental - 'geera'
organs musical clocks and boxes - 'still'
transform - 'transformation'
house pimps - 'zulu nation'
dance 2 trance - 'power of american natives'
blood runs dry - 'all of your mind'
mukkaa - 'buruchacca'
dr. atomic - 'schudelfloss'
robin s - 'show me love'

Feel free to send me your additions if you want to contribute and you
know for sure what something is... or if you were the DJ :-)

Bob

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 19:08:22 1993
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Date:         Mon, 03 May 93 21:47:59 EDT
From: DZ5401A@american.edu
Organization: The American University
To: Mark Guthrie <winston@lurnix.com>, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To:  Message of Mon, 3 May 93 17:50:02 PDT from <winston@lurnix.COM>


On Mon, 3 May 93 17:50:02 PDT Mark said:
>Laura says:
>
>>See, I have no idea why these guys are standing there, and I have
>>to wonder.  They don't stand around when male DJs spin, except for
>>the very very good ones like Lenny Dee, and I'm no where near that
>>league.  So what am I to think? Is it so freaky that a woman is
>>spinning that they have to stand and watch? Or what?  It's a bit
>>DAUNTING to say the least.
>
>It is "freaky", we've all aknowleded that. There aren't many girl
>djs, people gawk at things that are different, you are different,
>people gawk at you.  Don't take it so personal or sexual or negative.
>Take advantage of it and prove yourself like everyone else has to do.
>
>>I think there are just not a lot of women who are willing to put
>>themselves out there to become DJs because of the stuff I described.
>
>I doubt it.  There just aren't that many woman interested in it
>for some reason or another, although that reason probably has
>to do with societal gender programming but that's a different facet
>of this issue.  If any one is intimidated out of doing something
>they realy want to do than they need to work on certain aspects of
>their charcter.
>
  gotta disagree with you mark. personally i know four women around who
want to and are trying to learn how to dj. To say that women
"arn't interested" in dj'ing isn't correct.
  women can and will be a greater force in the rave scene in the future.

>>The *PROMOTERS* and *ORGANIZERS* as a whole have been 100%
>>supportive of me.  But when you see the DJ old-boy network, getting
>>involved is a bit nerve-wracking.  You know how it is -- they all
>>hang together in a corner behind the booth peering out at the rave
>>and talking amongst themselves, naming all the instruments and
>>producers involved in a track, and rating the current DJs mixing
>>skills.  Most guys are socialized to be a bit more thick-skinned,
>>and have little problem dealing with this.
>
>That's called trade jargon and it sounds like you need to be
>there with them if you're realy worth your wax & 1200's.  Have you
>ever tried to participate or are you creating intimidation for
>your self by assuming that they wouldn't want you there?
>

   Mark, if a dj wants to really be part of the scene he should be out there
with the ravers, and not congregating in a dark corner trading 'dj'ing'
screects. last thing people need at raves is for the dj's to think they
arnt part of the scene.
   I can only HOPE that people like Laura will be a bigger part in the scene.
at the last rave i went to she was out there with everybody. i wish more
dj's were like that.


doug ))))) a b00mingg baSS for a l0ving race ((((( dz5401a@american.edu

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 19:21:29 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 19:17:06 -0700
From: Derek Yu <derek@ocf.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199305040217.AA06087@headcrash.berkeley.edu>
To: al160184@academ07.mty.itesm.mx, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  SUSIE!!


YOU GO GIRL!!!!!!

HAPPY BIRTHDAY SUSIE>>>>>
HOPE ALL YOUR WISHES COME TRUE!!!!



**********DEREK************



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 19:51:57 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 22:43:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Francis L Sibilla <fran@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: Re: Women in the scene (was Re: the whole life expo...)
To: laura@usl.com
Cc: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
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>  "You've got records, I've got the equipment
>sitting in my basement, come over any time you want and start learning."
>So I did. 

BRAVO Laura!





From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 20:21:21 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 23:03:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: Francis L Sibilla <fran@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
To: Mark Baldwin <mark@ganymede.apple.com>
Cc: geoffw@nexsys.net, bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, whoa@leland.stanford.edu
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On Mon, 3 May 1993, Mark Baldwin wrote:

> i have a comment to anyone saying there are not enough women djs...or
> that the color of their wallpaper is all wrong...or their shoes are too
> tight...
> 
> do something.  instead of asking why there aren't more girl djs, ask
> yourself why YOU ARE NOT A DJ.  that might be a good place to start.
> or why you are not on the panel, etc.  not flaming, but i DO have a 
> big pet peeve about these kinds of issues, especially when it becomes
> a gender thing.
> 
> -mARK.
First - I am not a DJ because I barely have the time to write this
response let alone invest the time in hunting through record stores and
all the other time consuming factors that go into djing - I am a Chemical
Engineering student, and a good one at that which unfortunately precludes
some hobbies - such as dj'ing - maybe someday.

Second - I am not a woman.  But I think it is everyone's responsibility to
help foster an environment that is supportive to everyone - not just those
who are already establishd in certain positions.  When I started this
series of posts it was to see if anyone had suggestions as to how we can
all work towards making raves or dj'ing more open to everyone - not just
men.  So that women like laura wouldn't have to deal with all the sexist
bullshit they currently have to to get exposure.  

I was looking for constructive ideas - not broad insulting generalizations
such as " women always blame men . . . "

etc. . . 

I thought maybe we could start commenting to promoters and asking them
about women DJ's getting their ideas and if they think that they won't
attract people - tell them they would - if enough people did maybe a
promoter (assumed male here since most are) who had such preconceptions
would get over them - I'm not promoting giving women preferential
treatment - I'm promoting equal opportunity

Fran
 



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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 23:43:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Joe LeSesne <raver909@telerama.pgh.pa.us>
Subject: Re: grrrrr.. ruff bark bark
To: Dana WATANABE <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
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[][][][][][[]<><><<><>><187-Mobile.Live.Techno.Vibes><<><><<><>][][][][][][][]


On Mon, 3 May 1993, Dana WATANABE wrote:

> look the prevalent attitude in society is that woman cant
> even figure out how to hook up a sound system much less
> play the records, adn the funny thing is, women believe it too
> so it becomes true
You hit the nail on the head. I have been following this thread since it
started and have been waiting for someone to say that. It's simple boys
and girls are still raised, socialized and conditioned differently so that
could explain the smaller number of women in technical fields. However there
would seem to be NO reason why there aren't more women involved in the
organization of events.
Some of the best organizers in the world were women.
> why arent there that many women dj's?
> well shit, ive seen one
> one
> hmm.. im a girl looking for role models
> i can try to be like christina applegate or maybe mother teresa
> but i dont see any women to model myself after in the dj field
> GEEEE.. i wonder why i wont think about being a dj
How about Saskia Stegers. The DJ and woman who started DJAX records?
Infact her DJ name was DJAX. 
 > but fuck just dj'ing.. how bout production
> sure.. rick james is god
> call moby or liam or anyone you want god
> WHERE ARE TEH GODDESSES???
Well there's Jade 4 U. She's a producer and a GOOD one. Of course there
should be more.
> being sampled
> just objects in te song
> not doing any of the creation
Good point, and one in which I had never thought about. 
				Joe



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 21:23:02 1993
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To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: Groove Kitchen a rip off ... 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 03 May 93 13:05:41 PDT."
             <9305032005.AA11924@netcom4.netcom.com> 
Date: Mon, 03 May 93 20:21:37 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


Hmm... GK wasn't that bad, except that I was feeling kinda ill (too
much food wine drink and song at the larch-ranchidian mountain retreat),
so I didn't dance much. But the music was decent, the crowds weren't
pushing me around, and there wasn't too much gangsta vibe. Course, it
helped to get there late. We got there at 3, it didn't really start
going till 4. Not necessarily a rave-outing to write home about, but
then again, at least it didn't get busted... 

(actually, we arrived at Wicked around 5AM to arrive just as wicked was
getting busted. the plan was to avoid the big gangsta bumrush from
1-3AM at wicked by going to GK.... then make a late appearance at
wicked when the vibe had been created.)

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 22:08:38 1993
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From: Satan <eaeu362@orion.oac.uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305040459.AA28303@orion.oac.uci.edu>
Subject: stuff
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 21:59:25 PDT
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

two words
tolerance
understanding

tolerating someone mean you deal with them as someone you have
to deal with
understanding means you deal with someone as who they are

stop talking
just listen
listen to what is being said, listen to why it is being said
listen to who is saying it
listen

think about it
think about where the speaker is coming from,
it doesnt matter that they are wrong
that they are not seeing what is obvious
just figure out why they are saying what they are saying
and
listen

understand why they think what they think
not from what you know from what they know
and in doing so lose yourself and gain their perspective
and see the world through different eyes

then explain why you think the way you do
not assuming you are right even though you are
not assuming that they are wrong even though they are

but do not talk
converse
communicate 
in both directions

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 22:26:51 1993
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From: "Dana WATANABE" <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305040525.AA21733@mothra.nts.uci.edu>
Subject: women
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 3 May 93 22:25:33 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

i dont think anyone on this list 
is someone who would concsiously say or think
that a woman is a bad dj just becuase they have ovaries

but someone said taht the only thing more we coudl do
is ENCOURAGE women to dj 

YES
EXACTLY

women need to be encouraged
they have more discouragements than men
(REALLY, they do...)
so they shoudl get more encouragements

if someone is bothered by the people glaring at them
then it is a problem
and it is not one that should have to be dealt with
does it happen to more women than men?
well im sure some male djs get droolers
but how many females do?
and does it bother the men?
and does it bother the women?

women shouldnt have to put up with shit just becuase
they are women 
or becauase they are differnt
and we should actively try to stop it
its not a reverse discrimination thing
its a promoting equality thing

lets see
a guy wants to be a dj
he goes out buys a system and some records
the guy selling him stuff says
'cool, you want to dj? what type of music? good luck!'
he sets up the equipment and practices
and practices and is okay so he gets a gig
and hes not great but people dont run out of the warehouse
so he gets another adn gets good

a girl wants to be a dj
she goes out and buys a system and some records
the guy says
'why do you want this? OHHHH Youre going to be a DJ?
thats cool.. you know how to set this stuff up??
dont you think that music is a little to hard?'
she does have trouble setting it up because
daddy didnt teach her anything  about stereos cars etc
cuz shes just a girl and mommy didnt know anything about it
she gets it set up and practices and practices and practices
and is okay so she gets a gig
and shes not that great but people dont run out of the warehouse
but a bunch of people say 'well shes pretty good for a girl'
so she gets another and the guys stare at her and crowd
her at the turntables and she goes home
and buys a sewing machine

and no, it doesnt always happen that way
but denying that it isnt likely  is denying a lot
or at least so i think
but im often wrong
and just too egotistical to admit it

 ,
dana

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 23:11:23 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 23:11 PST
From: YOUR FRIEND MIKE <MROMO@scuacc.scu.edu>
Subject: female djs 2sense
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
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I was going to stay silent cuz I didn't want to add too much more to
the chain, BUT I have to post one of those 2 liners once in a while,
so here it goes....
Emma was fantastic when I saw here at Tilt-a-Whirl.
I saw Dani once and she wasn't that good.
I remember seeing Jan Cooley, I think, but I don't remember.

I like having a woman dj up there just as much as I like seeing a new
male dj, provided they're good, of course.  I would think in a city 
actually, screw it.  I am done.

toomanylines

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 23:22:40 1993
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Date:         Tue, 04 May 93 02:07:00 EDT
From: susie <SK2479A@american.edu>
Organization: The American University
Subject:      Re: the whole life expo...
To: Mark Baldwin <mark@ganymede.apple.com>,
        FRAN "THE MAN" <fran@ravel.udel.edu>, geoffe <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Cc: brian <bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu>, neravers <ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu>,
        sfravers <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>, whoa <whoa@leland.stanford.edu>
In-Reply-To:  Message of Mon, 3 May 93 10:21:21 PDT from
 <mark@ganymede.apple.com>

On Mon, 3 May 93 10:21:21 PDT you said:
>i have a comment to anyone saying there are not enough women djs...or
>do something.  instead of asking why there aren't more girl djs, ask
>yourself why YOU ARE NOT A DJ.  that might be a good place to start.

this is a very simple answer...i have little musical talent...so i would not be
 a "good" dj...sure i can practice and become technically good...but
it is not the type of art i want to persue...now producing/helping...is another
issue etc...(yes i need a job and an apartment this summer, anyone?)

>or why you are not on the panel, etc.  not flaming, but i DO have a
>big pet peeve about these kinds of issues, especially when it becomes

i wasn't on the panel cuz i wasn't in sf...(: heheheh
and i am doing something productive...i will soon be putting out a list of all
known female dj's...there is also a certian amount of discussion that must
be done b4 social action is taken...because the progress should be thought out
in an intelligent manner...also part of social change is enlightening others
about the circumstances an oppressed group is in...so lets keep discussing the
issue...partyon...susie (:
>a gender thing.
>
>-mARK.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 23:25:14 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 23:24 PST
From: YOUR FRIEND MIKE <MROMO@scuacc.scu.edu>
Subject: jeez...forum?
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <929A320C20008587@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu"

about doom@leland.Stanford.EDU's post about splitting--

I am sorry if all these posts are too much...but isn't all the
""two
cents" on the subject of sexism, racism and world politics" and
such the POINT of this place? We are here to discuss ideas and
topics, and that's the whole thing!  If you just want announcements,
get the calendar or something.  

It just seems a bit odd to me that these posts are such a bother.
You don't have to read the whole thing..I just scan and delete if I 
am not interested in the thread or I am tired of it...rare, but it
happens..

my two cents on that.

mike

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May  3 23:54:45 1993
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Date: Mon, 3 May 93 23:47:47 PDT
From: "Tim Hyland" <thyland.US1.oramail@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: More female DJs
Original-To: MAILSEQ:sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu


There are a few other female DJs whose names I haven't seen fly by.  There's
Evil-E (or does she spell it Evol-E?) who spun a couple times in the chill room
at Care*Free.  She also spins at the Eagle Creek Saloon (gay bar on Market in
SF) on Fridays and Saturdays.  Lots of ambient/trancey house -- loved her mix.

Another club DJ who really hasn't gotten into the raves scene is Page Hodel. 
She's the DJ *and* Promoter for two clubs:  The Box at the Kennel Club
(Divisaderoin SF), which is a very mixed (gay/straight, boys/girls, ethnicity,
etc.) hip hop, funk, and house club on Thursdays.  (Fun, nice energy, but not
ravey.)  She also spins and promotes for the Dance Factory in Berkeley on
Saturday nights.  

One woman who DJs who I haven't heard is Stephanie Phillips who spins with
Nikki Rivera at Product, I'm told, and a couple other lesbian/gay clubs. 
Another in this class is Lily Tran, who spun at a couple sunday afternoon raves
in Golden Gate Park last summer and now spins at the G-Spot (End-Up, Saturday
nights, another women's dance club).

The last one I can think of is Monique, who is a friend of Neon Leon and the
crowd at BPM, who I haven't heard play in public much.

Share and enjoy,

Tim

P.S.  In Amsterdam, there is a woman DJ named Isis who I hear is fabulous (but
have not heard) and is 18, I think.  She spins at Mazzo (cool ravey club) and a
number of raves in Holland and Belgium.


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 00:04:27 1993
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Date:         Tue, 04 May 93 02:55:51 EDT
From: susie <SK2479A@american.edu>
Organization: The American University
Subject:      re: women djs
To: Cutlass Supreme <dit@sybase.com>, sfraves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
In-Reply-To:  Your message of Mon, 3 May 93 17:33:52 PDT

On Mon, 3 May 93 17:33:52 PDT you said:
>arena. You will find it different elsewhere. In NYC there are plenty of
>woman DJ's, but then this is a place with ample nightlife for all various

ok then...name them for me...thanx...then we we can talk about specifics and no
t generalizations...partyon...susie (: (also i guess you should separate the
 raver dj's from the other genre dj's...)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 00:33:04 1993
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From: Peter J Schenk <psiborg@well.sf.ca.us>
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To: brit@ravel.udel.edu, geoffw@nexsys.net
Subject: Re: Cyberforum: rants and raves
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu








quit

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Date:         Tue, 04 May 93 03:28:03 EDT
From: susie <SK2479A@american.edu>
Organization: The American University
Subject:      gender benderwax trax
To: sfravers <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>, dcravers <dcraves@american.edu>

gee do they make boy records and girl records...i thought not...partyon....
susie(:

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 00:43:03 1993
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Date:    Tue, 04 May 93 00:40 PDT
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: Tamara Palmer                        <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
Subject: test

test -- ignore -- sorry

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 00:57:54 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 00:51:46 -0800
From: Robert Jesse <rjesse@us.oracle.com>
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To: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: Sign of the Times (sigh...)
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Reply-To: rnj%lila@us.oracle.com

the huge Timothy Leary ads are apparently not regional to the bay area -
i saw them in Washington DC during March weekend too.   i'm kinda glad to
see him (and maybe in some measure all that he has stood for in his life)
getting another round of public exposure, even if is rather, um, commercial.

Begin forwarded message:

Date: Mon, 3 May 93 16:17:40 -0700
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Sign of the Times (sigh...)

Just sighted on a MUNI shelter in my neighborhood, an eight-foot
ad for The Gap with an enormous portrait of Tim Leary.  Caption:
"Gap chambray shirt worn by TIMOTHY LEARY, Philosopher."

What's next?  Terence McKenna for Carnival Cruise Line?  Sasha Shulgin
for DuPont?  Hakim Bey for Allstate Insurance?  Ren and Stimpy for
Science Diet (has anyone else seen the Rocky and Bullwinkle ads for
for Taco Bell)???

=)

(now, over to Niels Mayer for commentary...)

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 01:56:25 1993
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From: she@leland.stanford.edu
Message-Id: <9305040855.AA14664@cardinal.Stanford.EDU.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: Sign of the Times (WHO'S NEXT??)
To: rnj%lila@us.oracle.com
Date: Tue, 4 May 93 1:55:04 PDT
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305040851.AA01966@lila.us.oracle.com>; from "Robert Jesse" at May 4, 93 12:51 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

MykL G writes:

> Just sighted on a MUNI shelter in my neighborhood, an eight-foot
> ad for The Gap with an enormous portrait of Tim Leary.  Caption:
> "Gap chambray shirt worn by TIMOTHY LEARY, Philosopher."

Henry Rollins, Anthony Kiedis, Anna Daveare Smith, and Kim Gordon 
have also done Gap ads.  Is it just chic for celebrities to do Gap ads, 
or are all our counter-culture heroes selling out?

This is just another example of the way the Conspiracy (i.e., mainstream
culture of the United States of Generica) mines alternative culture for 
fresh food for its consumption machine.  We all know that this is happening 
to the rave scene!

Jessica W.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 03:15:57 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 03:14:19 -0700
Message-Id: <9305041014.AA23743@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
X-Sender: mcg@netcom.com (Unverified)
Subject: Sisters are doing it for themselves

As promised, here's more info on the women-run party Gregg and I mentioned
yesterday.

This will be a party organized and promoted by women with all-female DJ's
and production crew.  The working name is Our Sister's House.  It's going to
be a Thursday night event at a club, possibly on an ongoing weekly basis.
The starting date hasn't been decided yet.

The five or so women involved so far have lots of experience in the scene,
although not as primary organizers.  There's an organization meeting tonight
(Tuesday), and they told me any woman on SFRaves who's interested is
welcome, whatever your experience is.  Also, if you're worried about the
21+ problem, working at a party can be an effective loophole...

So if you're interested, show up at 7pm at 871 Page St. #3 (@ Scott),
home of Liz.  For questions, call Peace at (415) 431-2320.

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        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 03:39:28 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Quixotic endeavor #2547
Date: Tue, 04 May 93 03:38:18 -0700
From: doom@leland.stanford.edu


Has anyone out there noticed that with multiple discussions
of various topics involving sexism, racism and world
politics, the traffic on the list has gone up to around a
quarter megabyte a day?  And that a lot of the traffic is
looking dangerously close to the dreaded usenet
flame-exchanges?  It greatly pains me to delete things on
this list without reading them, but that's what I've had to
do lately.

I mean okay, so this is a community, so that means that
various topics of discussion are fair game... but that
also means you should really make an effort to exercise some
restraint and try and avoid jamming the communications
channel...  

Personally, I'd like to see a little more priority given to
news and a little less to editorials.  


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 06:33:33 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 06:30:25 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305041330.AA29512@well.sf.ca.us>
To: arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu, jslee@well.sf.ca.us, mark@ganymede.apple.com,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Cyberforum: rants and raves

Mark said:
"if a black-american had on a shirt with a picture of africa and the words
'black pride' (or similar) how would you look at that?"

Uh, are they throwing a party?  Are they throwing a 'RAVE'?  If not the
question is moot...To each his own.  If so then the issue of exclusivity
should be asked again...it's also different wearing a shirt that says
"whatever-pride" and throwing a party with that theme. IMHO.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 06:40:01 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 06:34:30 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305041334.AA00217@well.sf.ca.us>
To: rox@netcom.com, rth@netcom.com
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

I heard that after wicked got shut down Groove Kitchen filled up a bit.

I still see NO reason to call the Kitchen a rip-off.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 06:40:54 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 06:37:13 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305041337.AA00742@well.sf.ca.us>
To: jslee@well.sf.ca.us, rox@netcom.com
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Cc: rth@netcom.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Rox Said:
It is a ripoff if there is NO people there. It is my opinion thathat in
order to have a party you HAVE to have people!


I disagree.  In order to have a party you have to be in the right mindset.
The people are a PLUS, but NOT a necessity.  I mean if you go to parties
because there are lots of people then fine, but I don't think that's what it
is all about.

I would like to know, did you inquire about the number of people who were
inside?  Do you EVER inquire about numbers at a party?  I would find it a
rip-off if you asked and were lied to.  Otherwise, buyer beware.


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 06:44:30 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 06:43:45 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305041343.AA02011@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU, tgrant@netcom.com
Subject: Re:  Groove Kitchen

>A promoter's job is to rent the space, hire the Djs and create an
atmosphere.
>It's up to us to supply the people and the energy.  If everyone who posted
that
Groove Kitchen sucked had stayed and danced there'd be nothing to complain
about.

RIGHT ON!

Peace.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 06:51:32 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 06:50:18 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305041350.AA03294@well.sf.ca.us>
To: ccat@netcom.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Women as Promoters/DJ's

>.and Preston's partner when
he  started Groove Kitchen was a woman also..

It was DIanna of Toon Town.

The promoter for Equinox is Lacey.

One of the promoters for Vortex is Lisa.

The promoters of Earth Beat (Coming soon) are: Jo, Abbs, Marilyn.


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 07:26:34 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 4 May 93 15:25:19 BST
Message-Id: <8131.9305041425@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: Monica Tauriello's message of Sun, 2 May 93 15:47:22 EDT <CMM-RU.1.3.736372042.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
Subject: Re: costs of raving

>>>>> On Sun, 2 May 93 15:47:22 EDT, Monica Tauriello <monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu> said:

  Monica> guess that's cuz i started raving in brighton, england, tho,
  Monica> where most of the raves i attended were outdoors and FREE
  Monica> (donations for the generators)...clearly, this was because
  Monica> djs donated their time, and i don't expect them all to do
  Monica> that as they also have to make a living, and perhaps because
  Monica> the brighton police weren't as organized to crack down on
  Monica> raves as they may be here (nj, sf).  however, i guess i'd
  Monica> always seen it as a kind of countercultural, even
  Monica> anarchic/autonomous, thing.

Well, I'm just getting into raving, and at the moment here in
Cambridge, England, I mainly go to small parties, where 50 people on
the dance floor is too crowded to dance...  It does seem to me to be
very much a counter-culture thing.  It's all somewhat underground,
with locations generally not publicized in advance, and it's
completely non-commercial -- most of the parties are free.  Of course,
here in the UK, even the radio stations are underground (ie illegal
pirate stations).

That said, this weekend, I went to my first big commercial rave, the
Universe Tribal Gathering in Wiltshire.  Cost was 25 pounds, and they
were charging a pound for a small bottle of water, despite the fact
that flyer said free water... :-( But I was impressed at how friendly
the whole atmosphere was...  The place was BIG (25,0000 people) but
somehow the main tents had a really good vibe, and outside there was a
wonderful friendly festival atmostphere....  Cool.

I just got my C2 tapes from Bob (thanks, Bob!) and I've just started
listening to the first tape (circle).  My first reaction is that it's
very mellow and dreamy.  Excellent music, but have I got the tapes in
the wrong order?  For me, this is 4am music....  It's really cool to
hear tunes that I know and love -- I just wish I knew what they
were...

Peace,

	-roy

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 07:38:53 1993
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Message-Id: <9305041434.AA22717@soda.berkeley.edu>
Date: Tue, 4 May 93 10:20 EDT
From: laura@usl.com
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: djing and droolling
Received: from usl by usl.com; Tue,  4 May 1993 10:20 EDT
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 1904

I wrote:

>But when you see the DJ old-boy network, getting
>involved is a bit nerve-wracking.  You know how it is -- they all
>hang together in a corner behind the booth peering out at the rave
>and talking amongst themselves, naming all the instruments and 
>producers involved in a track, and rating the current DJs mixing
>skills.

>>That's called trade jargon and it sounds like you need to be
>>there with them if you're realy worth your wax & 1200's.  Have you
>>ever tried to participate or are you creating intimidation for
>>your self by assuming that they wouldn't want you there? 

Yes, I know my techno-trivia shit as well as the rest of them.  In fact, I 
learned it from some of the biggest instrument geeks on the net.  I just would 
rather hang out and have fun and groove at the party when I'm not working than 
be involved with the DJ rating panel / peanut gallery.  But the real fact is
that I don't like feeling like I'm being subjected to their comments.  I know
it's part of the game, but WHY does it have to be part of the game?  The guys
love to know all the facts, have all the answers, be able to play-by-play
analyze the mixes.  I don't HAVE to like what they do, and I sure as hell
don't have to assimmilate myself into their cliques.  Especially when raving 
as a whole is supposed to be so anti-clique.

I think another part of it is that there is a HUGE prejuidice against 
beginners, regardless of gender.  That's probably part of what I'm running up 
against, too.  Hell, my ex-boyfriend LAUGHED at me when I told him I was going
to learn to DJ.  A male A-list DJ verbally harassed me at my last gig.  If 
that's the kind of attitude people have toward beginners, especially female 
beginners, then can't you understand why maybe some people shy away?  The warm
fuzzy "come join our party" aspect of rave culture does not seem to extend 
into the realm of DJing.

Laura

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 08:07:18 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 08:02:27 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305041502.AA15750@well.sf.ca.us>
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Sign of the Times (sigh...)

Word is Leary was shitfaced drunk while speaking at the Cyberforum. The
people I spoke to thought he did our scene a rather large diservice by
appearing as a spokesman of sorts...

nrg

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 08:16:25 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 08:10:18 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305041510.AA17200@well.sf.ca.us>
To: monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: re: women djs

*Hardcore Community* seems a bit vague. Maybe I'm not familiar with it cos
the scene I'm familiar with seems populated by what appears to be a majority
of way cool fairly empowered women and a sprinlkling of women djs. I've
never encountered the *whos girlfriend are you* phenom. Most women I've met
in the scene were movers and shakers in it...keeping it alive day to day.
This includes women as promoters. Recycle and FeelX/Promised Land/Magic
Roundabout are some examples that jump to mind... But the more the better I
say...

peace, and let the good times rave!\nrg

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 08:16:49 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 08:11:29 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305041511.AA17423@well.sf.ca.us>
To: jondr@sco.com, saeedi@shell.portal.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  lee? anyone? help???

That's a hell of an idea, esp for us aspriring djs...

nrg

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 09:09:03 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 09:02:59 -0700
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
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To: doom@leland.stanford.edu, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Quixotic endeavor #2547

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU Tue May  4 03:41:45 1993
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Message-Id: <9305041038.AA14790@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Quixotic endeavor #2547
Date: Tue, 04 May 93 03:38:18 -0700
From: doom@leland.stanford.edu
Status: R

Doom says:   

It greatly pains me to delete things on
this list without reading them, but that's what I've had to
do lately.


***Your not the only one...
   and about the new thread about our heros selling out...
   hell, I'd do some stupid picture to if someone gave me
   a large amount of money! Why not! It isn't selling out.
   It's called making a living and if it takes doing almost
   anything for money then I'll do it. As long as I'm living
   a comfortable life!!! In these days you need $ to live and
   I personally like to have $ in my pocket!!!


   "The Empire has stood twelve thousand years. The dark ages to
   come will endure not twelve, but thirty thousand years. A Second
   Empire will rise, but between it and our civilization will be one
   thousand generations of suffering humanity. We must fight that."
	  
	  Hari Seldon--by: ISAAC ASIMOV

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 09:54:17 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305041651.AA03643@slack>
Subject: gender benderwax trax
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 10:51:52 -0600 (MDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 287       

> gee do they make boy records and girl records...i thought not...partyon....

Sometimes I wish my Orb stuff was of the female gender, then I could show them
just how much I love them.  I would really like my Black Dog "Bytes" CD to be
female, then I could attempt to make it reproduce.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 10:59:32 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 13:49:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Justin L. Abold" <aboldj@minerva.cis.yale.edu>
Sender: "Justin L. Abold" <aboldj@minerva.cis.yale.edu>
Reply-To: "Justin L. Abold" <aboldj@minerva.cis.yale.edu>
Subject: take me off list
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305041312.A12187-9100000@minerva.cis.yale.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII

Sorry to broadcast this to everyone but I have been trying for several
days to be taken off this list and noone at the addresses I was given is
responding.  
I am going home for the summer and do not want to continue on this list.

TAKE ME OFF THE LIST.   TAKE ME OFF THE LIST.   TAKE ME OFF THE LIST.

OFF>  OFF>  OFF>  OFF>  OFF>  OFF>  

Thanks.



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 11:37:30 1993
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Date: Tue, 04 May 93 09:01:54 pst
From: barryale@symantec.com (Barry Alexander)
Message-Id: <9304047365.AA736531314@symantec.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: raves a movement?



i attended the cyberforum at the whole earth expo last friday and one theme
that was brought up was rave as a movement/community thing. and that it has the
potential for incorporating the positive aspects of "the vibe" into every day 
"mainstream" life. but there where no real specifics presented by the panel, no 
real time too.

a few raves that i've attended have influenced me in very positive ways by 
reestablishing in me a spiritual connection of self/community/cosmos through 
rythmic, shared trance.  these were mainly word of mouth/no flyer/map point 
raves of the $7-$10 outdoor variety.  i haven't had the same experience though 
at all club/warehouse (big flyer) raves where most people are there just to 
party/front/be cool.

i believe that the insight that can be gained by individuals not tuned into the 
vibe getting the vibe would benefit the well-being of the planet at large.  if 
the integrity remains strictly at underground events, will it have any long 
term effect/momentum to change society in a positive way?  or does it matter.  
is it just another rites of youth culture thing, something we'll all tell our 
grand kiddies about?

  

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 12:38:21 1993
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From: "Dana WATANABE" <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305041929.AA06205@mothra.nts.uci.edu>
Subject: Raving SHoes
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Tue, 4 May 93 12:29:12 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

im sorry i get bitchy
but im at a realy bitchy point in my life
i listened to a tape i had of sandra collins spinning
on joachims show and i feel much better now

there are some things that i just cant tolerate and tahts my problem
and next time i wont yell at teh list
well i will, but ill try not to

BRIAN-if you form a ba.raves usenet thing i will shoot you in the head
the chances of me getting a ba listed thing is impossible

dont split the list
but dont expect people to calm down if you tell them to
i know i wouldnt
but thats just me

oh and brian, i tend to go barefoot
indoors its not always good, but i hateshoes
and outdoors i just have to feel the ground
i dont understand how people can wear shoes

but i dont understand why we shoudl wear clothes
:)
:)
:)
:)

 ,
dana

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 12:41:39 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 12:14:53 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305041914.AA08053@ganymede.apple.com>
To: monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: re: women djs
Cc: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Money's Not Our God, Really)

> 
> mARK wrote that instead of asking ourselves why there aren't more girl(sic)
> djs, we (women) should ask ourselves why we are not djs...
> 

pardon me...women. d=)


> i would love to be a dj, and when i have the time and money i might start
> learning...however, my point is that perhaps the rave community, particularly
> in the promotions, dj arena, is male-dominated, not just in numbers but in
> attitude.  laura wrote earlier of the difficulties she encounters with
> many men in the hardcore community being uncomfortable with women.  another
> woman, a promoter, wrote of the assumptions people make about her: that she
> is just someone's girlfriend, etc.  historically rock music has been

ok, this may be true.  but i think that if the majority of a certain type
of person (i hate using that terminology, but for the purpose of communica-
tion...) typically fits a certain role in a certain scene, you tend to 
think that others of that same "type" (forgive me...) fit into the same 
mold.

i know that people get very offended by this.  like if you said something
like, "oh, is s/he black?"  or "oh, is s/he mexican?" (examples only) in
response to a statement about [put in your favorite minority-type-stero-
type here] you might offended a whole bunch of people, white, black, 
blue, red.... but that's the way the human mind works.  and it's usually
a good thing.  it's how you figure out where the square goes, and where
the triangle and the circle go.  of course, people aren't shapes, they're
people, and that mindset only works so well.   *sigh*
 
> male-dominated and sexist, and i don't see raves, etc. as being that much
> diffeerent in that respect.  what we need to do is recognize the sexism women
> face, and work against it.  it IS a political issue -it's not just about the

you're right, monicat, and i'm not going to say that this isn't true, but 
the other point of interest here is that if women (in general<---) didn't
allow this to happen it wouldn't happen.  you have to realize that LOTS
of women like this type of attention and do their best to propagate the
male/female roles that you've described above.  and a large group of men
like it too, so they say more power to ya!   
 
> color of the wallpaper, whatever.  
> 
               ^^^^
all i meant by that was change things that bother you.  maybe i should
get more sleep before trying to draw parallels. :)

> monicat

-mArK. (Not Suitable For Children)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 12:52:15 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 12:45:38 -0700
From: diva@uclink.berkeley.edu (Insane Energy Woman)
Message-Id: <9305041945.AA25488@uclink.berkeley.edu>
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: one last comment...


on the whole women thing.  just a funny coincidence, really... I have
to write a composition in french this week... when I looked at the
topic choices, one was about a female writer, professional, etc whom
I admire and the other was about professions women have now that they
couldn't have had 100 yrs ago.  gee... I know where I can go for some
inspiration.  I guess I just have to learn ftp first. =)

the little things that make me wonder...

always, leah



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 12:59:32 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 12:40:22 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305041940.AA08316@ganymede.apple.com>
To: brit@ravel.udel.edu, howard@netcom.com
Subject: Re: Geoff White, closet Honky
Cc: geoffw@nexsys.net, mark@ganymede.apple.com (Money's Not Our God, Really),
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

> 
> On Mon, 3 May 1993, Geoff White wrote:
> 
> > > but now turn that around and make it a white-american with a shirt on
> > > that said "white pride".  all of a sudden that person becomes a racist.
> 
>  uh-oh. Looks as if someone is afraid of losing his white male priviledge.

                       ^^^^
i don't know who wrote this but:

um, first uv ahl, geoff didn't say that, i did.  and i don't know 
what you mean by my 'white male priveledge', and second ov all, this
kind of response is EXACTLY what i was reffering to!! 

i'm being prejudiced about possibly being prejudiced.  hmmmm.

*** s i g h ***

-mARK. (Not Suitable For Children)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:15:03 1993
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Message-Id: <9305042003.AA14014@soda.berkeley.edu>
From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 13:03:28 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: GUIDELINES FOR POSTING TO SFRAVES

Some guidelines for posting to SFRaves.   Print this out and tape it to
your computer for handy reference.  This list will be given to all new
members from now on.

1)  First realize that

	a) SFRaves is a large mailing list.

	b) The volume is already quite high.

	c) For every editorial or opinion there are hundreds of
	   possible replies.

	d) Topics of world import such as feminism and race relations
	   will *always* be with us, at least for the current generation,
	   and while discussion about them is important the issues *won't*
	   be resolved by just talking about them here on the list.  They
	   are appropriate here as long as they aren't more appropriate
	   in soc.feminism, etc.

	e) Ego has NO PLACE on the mailing list.

	f) Even with a high signal-to-noise ratio, a high volume means more
	   people skim articles than actually read them.  This is a bad thing.

2)  Now for the general rules:

	a) NO PERSONAL ATTACKS - even if someone is being a complete
	   jerk and everyone agrees, please refrain from flaming him/her
	   in public.  Send him/her all the private email you want.  If
	   they flame you first, be the wise one and take the argument
	   off the list.  If he/she is truely being a jerk everyone knows
	   it anyways.  The difference between a well-reasoned argument
	   and a personal flame should be quite clear.

	b) Try and set an upper limit to your number of posts to 2 a day.
	   Making more is fine, but as you're typing your third make *sure*
	   it's something that's worth the time of the 250 people you are
	   sending it to.

	c) BREVITY IS THE SOUL OF WIT.  Paragraphs prove you have a point.

	d) Ranting is the opposite of raving (thanks to rth@netcom.com for
	   reminding us)

	e) Don't reply to a post until you have read your entire mail
	   queue and made sure no one else has replied exactly what you
	   would say.

	f) Refrain from making "me too" posts, where you simply add "I agree"
	   to the bottom of a quoted message.

	g) If you reply to a post someone makes, READ EVERY WORD THEY SAY
	   CAREFULLY, and in the absence of facial and hand gestures interpret
	   their comments in the best possible light.  It's very hard for the
	   "TV" generation (which we are whther you own a TV or not) to know
	   how to communicate without visual cues.  Make sure you understand
	   what the other person is saying.  

	h) If a conversation turns into a particulary heated argument, wait
	   at least an hour before making your reply, to allow you to see 
	   what they are saying in the absence of a testosterone rush.

	i) Be SURE of what you are saying when you say it.  Proofread your
	   comments several times.  Make sure your use of certain words is
	   the generally accepted use by the community at large, not what
	   *you* think that usage should implicate.


We are at the brink of something BIG here, and SFRaves can be a part of
it.  But only if we keep ourselves as high quality as we've been in the
past, and these guidelines are a part of it.  Anyone who's spent a good
deal of time on the net knows these as part of an unwritten policy, but
they bear repeated for those who are new.  

The Conciousness Revolution has begun.

	Brian

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:16:24 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 13:09:13 -0700
From: diva@uclink.berkeley.edu (Insane Energy Woman)
Message-Id: <9305042009.AA28078@uclink.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: recycle



I talked to lori of recycle last night, and she asked me to remind
all y'all about the sooper dooper sfraves deal.  if you call shaun
ahead of time (I think - right?  and what is your number again? =)
and have him put you on the list, you can go to the door, give the
secret password to the doorperson and get in for a mere $2. =) =)
remember, this is for the sfraves crew... a little secret for us to
have fun.  and I say *definitely* go.  I've been there on good and
bad nights.  if we all were to go at once, we could have a *great*
vibe and a great time.  how can you go wrong for $2???  for those
who are fmring it this week... check out the cinco de mayo recycle
celebration pre-moon worship.  just to get you in da mood maybe.
the recycle people are really great... and can definitely use our
support.  I unfortunately will not be making it out (for what seems
the rest of my life =)  thanks to the end of semester/moving/trips/
job search/etc... meetings and dinners are about all I can handle
for the next week or two.  *sigh*  hope to see you all around
anyway.

always, leah



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:20:54 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305041752.AA14850@nmtvs313.mtvyp>
To: ames!usl.com!laura, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  djing and droolling

Hell, my ex-boyfriend LAUGHED at me when I told him I was going
to learn to DJ.  A male A-list DJ verbally harassed me at my last gig.  If 
that's the kind of attitude people have toward beginners, especially female 
beginners, then can't you understand why maybe some people shy away?  The warm
fuzzy "come join our party" aspect of rave culture does not seem to extend 
into the realm of DJing.

Laura
--------

fuckem' just throw down the solid jams and tell 'em to kiss your ass, 
you don't have to play their game, especially not if the crowd likes
the music.

*



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:32:15 1993
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	for 
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 13:22:22 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305042022.AA08733@ganymede.apple.com>
To: fran@ravel.udel.edu, mark@ganymede.apple.com
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
Cc: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, geoffw@nexsys.net,
        mark@ganymede.apple.com
    (Money's Not Our God, Really),
        ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu,
        whoa@leland.stanford.edu

it sounds to me, francis, like YOU want more women djs, without
knowing for sure how many women want to actually BE djs, or promoters
or whatever.

i have already said that i would love to see more female djs, but
i'm not suggesting that anyone be anyone but who THEY want to be,
just because i'd like to see the statistics raised for their group.

i'm sorry if you don't find my ideas constructive.  i do find your
comment insulting.

-mArK (Not Suitalbe For Children)

p.s.  laura-  i hereby extend an invitation to you and any other
      girls on this list that spin.  if you don't live in the 
      sf area, make a point of it to gig at a rave nearby.  i 
      will be the first person to dance up to your table with a
      big hug and a big welcome.  (and i promise i won't look 
      down your dress ;).

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:50:05 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 13:37:38 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305042037.AA03256@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: Your Sister's House


	Your Sister's House

	Is having an organizational meeting
	tonight to work on a collective party that they
	are organizing.  The address is 871 Page street #3 @ Scott
	time is 7 p.m. Organizational meetings every tuesday are
	open to all women.  The club will be open to EVERYONE!

	Call Peace @ 431-2320 for more info

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:50:28 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 11:56:20 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305041856.AA03083@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, winston@lurnix.com

> >i dont see that many girls crowding around the dj
> >to drool on him and when i do, its usually his friends
> >not strange people he doesnt know who are muhc larger than him
> 
> Oh?  I've seen intimidating strangers crowding Jeno all the time
> and who is it that has the female groupies?  Ghost or someone?
> 

I've seen girls crowd around Jeno, during New Years Eve, a bunch were
crowding him, trying to get him to look at them, (trying to pass him
phone numbers, the whole bit).  He almost ALWAYS has guys crowding him
hanging on EVERY cut he makes, scoping his style and trying to get
his label titles (he often puts tape over the titles :) I've seen
Jeno do what any good DJs do... ignore it all and keep spinning.  A good
DJ should be able to keep the vibe going even when the riot police are
busting through the door, that's their job.  Any guy DJ that will allow
his attention to be thrown cuz a woman (or man) with a killer body is 
dancing in front of him is not ready to playout yet.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:51:02 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 12:01:14 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305041901.AA03094@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, brit@ravel.udel.edu
Subject: Re: Minority status

> 
> In answer to someone who stated that I was wrong in my definition of what
> a minority is:
> 
>  "The term minority [is] highly misleading. In sociological use a minority
>   refers not to the numercial size of a group but to their socioeconomic
>   and poltical status. In sociological use a minority is "a group of
>   people who, because of their physical or cultural characteristics, are  
>   singled out from the others in the society in which they live for
>   differential and unequal treatment, and who therefore regard themselves 
>   as objects of collective discrimination.""
> 
>                -"SOCIAL PROBLEMS" Frank Scarpitti/Margaret Anderson 1992  
>   _
>  (_ )  ) (  ) _(            
>  (  (_ (_) ( (_(
> 
Not to flame you or anything but recently I saw this shirt worn by
an asian woman in San Franciso that said:

	Minority : A racist classification used to describe the
	majority of people in the world who are controlled by
	european culture"

"Cuz you know sometimes words have two meanings " - stairway to heaven

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:55:23 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 13:46:44 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305042046.AA03303@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: howard@netcom.com
Subject: Re: I'm thinking about splitting.
Cc: sfraves@nexsys.net



Um Howard, If you guys could wait a few monthes.
I and a few folks are in the process of starting up an ISDN service bureau.
We are pretty far along and are ordering lines, boxes and
negotiating with Pac Bell and the Internet backbone people 
even as we speak.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 13:56:23 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 16:45:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: Francis L Sibilla <fran@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
To: Mark Baldwin <mark@ganymede.apple.com>
Cc: mark@ganymede.apple.com, bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, geoffw@nexsys.net,
        mark@ganymede.apple.com, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, whoa@leland.stanford.edu
In-Reply-To: <9305042022.AA08733@ganymede.apple.com>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.03.9305041605.G20706-9100000@ravel.udel.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


I apologise for the comment about having better things to do with my time
than responding to your post - I was under a lot of other stress at the
time - but the rest stands - 
- I am not suggesting that people be who they are not, I am suggesting
that people   should have the opportunity to be who they want - and
repressive gender roles shouldn't stand in their way

Fran




From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 14:11:36 1993
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Message-Id: <199305042105.AA05908@stout.cisco.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Cc: tcollins@cisco.com
Subject: please remove me from alias
Date: Tue, 04 May 93 14:05:43 PDT
From: tcollins@cisco.com

but continue to send me the calender.

I don't have enough time to read all the email.

thanks,

tracy
-------
tracy collins          cisco systems
hardware engineer      1525 o'brien drive
tcollins@cisco.com     menlo park, ca 94025
voice: 415.688.8126    fax: 415.688.8282


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 15:02:10 1993
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From: whoa@leland.stanford.edu
Message-Id: <9305042156.AA17607@sunlight.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: ack!


wut up chris?

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 15:17:21 1993
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From: calvin@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 15:10:49 -0700
Message-Id: <9305042210.AA07320@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Full Moon Rave?


   Somebody told me that the Full Moon Rave at Bonny Doon is tonight (Tuesday)
Can anybody confirm that?  I have also heard it is on Thursday night.  Any help 
would be appreciated...  Thank you.

calvin@cats.ucsc.edu

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 15:23:15 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 14:26:08 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305042126.AA01609@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu


>  uh-oh. Looks as if someone is afraid of losing his white male
> priviledge.

>um, first uv ahl, geoff didn't say that, i did.  and i don't know 
>what you mean by my 'white male priveledge', and second ov all, this
>kind of response is EXACTLY what i was reffering to!! 

>frequency. When the heterosexual white male realizes the situation
>and stops thinking that he is under attack, then things may begin to
>change -

I think the problem here is that many of us heterosexual white males
have never experienced these percs or priveledges because we are
and LOOK countercoulture and even those who don't look it but are
more "superior minded beings" than the Dominators don't like to be
classed with them just because they and we happen to be white, het.,
males.  Being a heterosexual white male doesn't automaticly add you
to the club.  It has a lot to do with social and economic class and
other factors which nobody seems to recognize.  I'm the kind of
person that the kind of person that would descriminate would
descriminate against just because of the kind of person I am (did
ya get that?).  I also live a lower quality of life than many
minorities and get "vibed on" (per Geoffs definition) by some
minorities because I'm white and by store/resauraunt owners, etc.
because of the way I look, and by some woman because I'm male so I
in some ways I am more of an "outcast" than anyone else because I
am not recognized as a minority class and feel that I'm unfairly
categorized with the white, het., male label.  If any of these other
descriminated against classes could realy know me than they'd know
that I was "one of them".  Descrimination and bigotry take many
forms and I think people need to see it's not just a color thing.  
I always get sneers and weird looks by lesbians here in Berkeley
and I was recently flipped off by a black guy driving by whom I'd
never seen (Not a traffic thing, we had no interaction) just cause 
I'm male and white (I guess) and I feel like just saying "Shut the
fuck up, I'm on your side!"  The ironic thing is I'm the only male
(except for my dog, Juma) in a household of 5 woman, two of whom
are my daughters, I don't see how I could NOT be a feminist, and I 
live in a black neighborhood, where the local posse of 10 year olds
come and kick it at my house all the time.  It sounds rhetorical but
all oppressed people need come together and to realize who the enemy
realy is.

-Mark

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 15:23:36 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305042212.AA04809@slack>
Subject: XDZebra Review #29
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves),
        nm-list@reef.cis.ufl.edu (New Music List),
        ne-raves@silver.lcs.mit.edu (NE Raves),
        manchester@irss.njit.edu (Manchester),
        mw-raves@engin.umich.edu (Midwest Raves),
        socal-raves@ucsd.edu (So Cal Raves), dcraves@american.edu (DC Raves),
        seraves@american.edu (SE Raves), thomas@apple.com
Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 16:12:18 -0600 (MDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 9457      

I'm looking for someone who is interested in typesetting/editing the past
reviews I've done into a booklet.  Please contact me via email.

XDZebra Review #29

        Addiction
        266 Delmar Ct.
        Salt Lake City, UT 84101-1817

When in Utah call the T A S T E hotline 801-461-3375.

Trying to find these releases?  Try Ear/Rational Music:
FAX 805/893-8553, Phone 805/564-4949, email angst%cs@hub.ucsb.edu

Back issues are available from me by mail or by ftp'ing to soda.berkeley.edu.
They're in the pub/sfraves/music directory.

This is all my opinion.  Flames against a review are pretty pointless, so
don't bother.  Let me know if you have any other comments though.

BPMs provided courtesy of Eric Pederson's BPM calculator for the Sparc.

XDZebra Reviews may be reproduced without permission under one condition,
they remain intact and unchanged.  If you publish this in print, mail me a
copy via "Addiction".

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Review #29 Contents:
68000: Technocolor
Sandals: A Profound Gas
Black Dog Productions: (Bytes)
Deep Forest: Sweet Lullaby
Julian Cope: Dancing Heads
AFX in his third Analogue Bubblebath
Polygon Window: Quoth
Colours - A Compilation Album


68000: Technocolor
Pulse Soniq: SR9221
1  129  05:31 M21
2  130  04:26 Mind Machine
3  132  05:03 I/O
4  134  04:50 Technohead (Down in It)
5   96  04:19 Funky Twisted Sound
6  128  05:12 Vivid
7  126  04:52 Juno Echo
8  130  04:54 Data Cloud 9
9  134  04:31 Technocolor
10 132  05:21 Benzine
11 120  03:22 "Life"
12 134  04:44 Technohead (Life Mix)
13 134  06:17 Technohead (Smart Edit)
14 129  05:31 M21 (Galaxy Surprize)
15 120  02:28 Analogics (Pure Analog Edit)

Comments: An utter misery to sit through.  68000 has created an album that can
excite you with appearance: "15 tracks! Cool name! Cool art!"  Then trap you
in a litany of sameyness.  It isn't so much that they don't have a lot of
spice in their melodies or rhythms, but the fact that they use the same
instruments over and over.  It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to guess that
this entire thing was composed on one synthesizer, but unlike some artists,
68000 didn't have time to mess with presets or at change them from one state
to another.

Summary: 2/10.  Hard to listen to in one shot.  No shakeability present at
all.


Sandals: A Profound Gas
Acid Jazz/London Records: Jazid 47CD
1  104  08:44 Vocal Mix
2  104  07:58 Chetali Mix
3  104  08:45 Ardens Bud Phase 1
4  104  03:39 Ardens Bud Phase 2
5  104  04:39 Profound Dub

Comments: Groovalicious and thrownback, Sandals bring slinky jazz to a modern
form.  I would have liked to seen a heavier use of the flute, and the vocals
seem to serve no purpose with a "we've got a singer, we've got to use him" air
about them.  The mixes are decent, but unspectacular.  They get boring after
about five minutes, most of them are too long.

Summary: 6/10.  I'd like to see an album from these people, this is some
intriguing work.


Black Dog Productions: (Bytes)
Warp: WARPcd8
1  122  05:44 Object Orient by Plaid
2  128  06:15 Caz by Close Up Over
3   98  06:43 Carceres Ex Novum by Xeper
4       01:00 Phil(1)
   126  04:42 Focus Mel by Atypic.
    71  01:30 Phil(2)
5  129  04:08 Olivine by Close Up Over
        00:38 Phil(3)
6  133  06:24 Clan (Mongol Hordes) by I.A.O
7  126  02:12 Phil(4)
   112  04:02 Yamemm by Plaid
8  120  00:54 Phil(5)
   135  03:42 Fight The Hits by Discordian Popes
   131  01:45 Phil(6)
9  120  04:34 Merck by Balil
10 125  00:47 Phil(7)
   122  05:00 Jauqq by Close Up Over
11 124  07:35 Heart by Balil

Comments:  I'm almost certain that a member of Black Dog Productions has been
mapping my brain to see exactly what kind of music I'll go ape over.  This
album does it.  I had no idea that they were responsible for the way cool
I.A.O track on "Artificial Intelligence".  That was only a brief initiation
into what kind of abilities they have.  How to describe?  Melodic, trancey,
sometimes acidic.  The most distinguishing feature is the fact that these boys
know how to lay down a rhythm.  Sampled or constructed, they send vibrations
down my spine as I attempt to sit motionless in a chair.  On top of that, they
score with a cover design that manages to be computer-cool without being
Mondo-stupid.  Decoding the track listing somehow reminded me of cracking
code.

Summary: 10/10.  Warp scores again.  You don't deserve to have ears unless
you've heard this album first.


Deep Forest: Sweet Lullaby
Epic/Sony: 49K 74919
1   88  03:54 Original Mix
2   88  06:08 (Remix)
3  124  06:00 Q-Bass Mix
4  122  06:50 Round the World Mix
5  130  03:08 Bonus A La Efx

Comments: As the liner says, Deep Forest is not a group or artist, but a
"concept".  A damn good one at that.  Record the songs of African rain forest
Pygmies, then throw a synth line and drum beat behind it.  Things are slow
moving, but very luscious and deep.  The fact that this works so well at a
slow rate, is forgotten by the remixers as they pump it up on the last three
tracks and lose every bit of original integrity.  The last remix sounds
slightly better than the other two, but only as a stand-alone and not a
variation of the original.

Summary: 8/10.  The album should be interesting.  What I fear is this is going
to be on the airwaves ala "Sadeness" for the next year, making me thoroughly
sick of it.


Julian Cope: Dancing Heads
Island: 422-868 909-2
1   84  03:36 Head (Remix)
2   89  06:09 Head (Long Meg and Her Daughters Mix)
3  113  06:52 Love (L.U.V.) (Beautiful Love Remix)
4   98  08:18 Easty Risin' (East Easy Rider Remix)

Comments: I've always enjoyed Julian Cope, but never expected to find anything
of his that could possibly hit the dancefloor.  While rummaging through a
promo-CD shop, I ran over this.  "Dancing Heads" takes the rippingest parts of
the three Cope songs from "Peggy Suicide" and does the funky beat thing behind
them.  Sounds simple, but it works excellently.  Hugoth Nicolson did a
brilliant job with this work, it is too bad that it has been buried under a
ton of other commercial garbage.

Summary: 8/10.  I have no idea if this is still being pressed or not.  If you
like Julian Cope, you'll love this.  However, Cope doesn't appeal to everyone.


AFX in his third Analogue Bubblebath
Rephlex: CAT 008
1  133  03:54 .215061
2  136  08:03 .1993841
3   79  04:15 .0180871a
4  145  04:37 .942937
5  128  03:53 .0180871b
6  141  04:48 .0008908569
7  154  04:20 .5527803773258
8  125  04:06
9  125  05:07
10 144  00:36 AFX 6/b
11      04:41
12      00:54
13 147  05:14

Comments:  Richard James does it again with another slew of incredible
material.  More in line with the "Ambient Works" album than the Polygon Window
releases, Analog Bubblebath 3 is less harsh than either.  There are a few
harsh tracks, such as 4, 5, 7, 10, and 13, but even these have a weird
softness overlaid that only Richard James is able to do effectively.  9 is an
unsually funky work for AFX, as is the beatless 11 & 12. 3 shows he isn't
afraid to use samples, and distort them beyond recognition.  The prime tracks
are 1 and 8.  1 is logical extension to Analog Bubblebath 2, and 8 practically
had tears running down my face.

Summary: 9/10. Despite the wacky packaging (bubble wrap), and no printing on
the CD itself, this is Richard's best album yet.  It is also the hardest to
acquire.


Polygon Window: Quoth
Warp: WAP 33CD
1  139  05:36 Quoth (Original)
2  140  04:31 Iketa
3  142  07:58 Quoth (Wooden Thump Mix)
4   92  06:00 Bike Pump Meets Bucket

Comments: The first single from Warp and Richard James.  "Quoth" is one of the
harder tracks from the Polygon Window album, and the "Wooden Thump Mix"
certainly doesn't soften things at all.  "Iketa" is in Richard's patented
ambient style while "Bike Pump" is smooth, bouncy, and almost jazzy.  The Warp
packaging is stellar as usual.  I also purchased the 12" for the ultra-groovy
clear vinyl that it comes on.

Summary: 8/10.  The first three tracks are fairly standard for James, but the
final "Bike Pump" stands out.


Colours - A Compilation Album
Union City Recordings: cducr 1
1  124  06:24 UFI: Understand This Groove
2  124  05:44 Metropolis: Metropolis
3  123  05:34 Mombossa: Cry Freedom (Malawi Mix)
4  121  06:38 M.K. Featuring Alana: Burning (Mk Remix Extended)
5  128  06:48 M.A.N.I.C.: I'm Comin Hardcore (Original)
6  122  05:14 TC 1991: Berry
7  135  07:29 Urban Jungle: Bad Man
8  126  07:39 TC 1992: Funky Guitar (Lion Rock Inna Milanese Stylee)
9  129  04:59 Metropolis: Hyporeel
10 120  07:41 B.M.Ex: Appolonia: Quatmix
11 123  06:25 M.K. Featuring Alana: Always (12" Underground)
12 140  04:41 Unity: Unity (Piano City)

Comments: A very housey comp with some real classics.  The majority of the
compositions on here have a lot of familiar samples that are used effectively
without stealing from the original sources.  Metropolis is especially skilled
in accomplishing this, their tracks are like trips through all sorts of dance
music.  The two included TC tracks are prime, and if you don't have them yet,
you're missing out.  As with a lot of good house music, piano is prevalent.
M.A.N.I.C. and Unity feature some especially fine riffs.  "Cry Freedom" is
very uplifting tribal.  The only thing I really don't like are the Alana
tracks, her vocals are a bit too sweet for my tastes.

Summary: 7/10.  One of the better collections of house in a while, but
available only on import.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 15:24:39 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 14:05:37 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305042105.AA01589@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Mykl points out:

>With all due respect, I think you're a bit off-the-wall here, Mark.
>Being attracted to someone, even wanting to jump their bones, is
>a natural human response.  "Drooling" over them, or leering, is an
>entirely different thing, societally induced.  The behavior of many
>males is to treat a woman as if she were a piece of meat rather than

Ya, I guess your right.  I was thinking of a different definition of
druling (how I would harmlessly do it),  but after I read your post
I imagined how many or most guys would do it and... that's not very
nice.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 15:25:50 1993
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	for 
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 15:11:20 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305042211.AA09916@ganymede.apple.com>
To: fran@ravel.udel.edu, mark@ganymede.apple.com
Subject: Re: the whole life expo...
Cc: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, geoffw@nexsys.net, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, whoa@leland.stanford.edu

apopogy gladly accepted, fran...

but you are right.  this is a HOT issue.  i want it to be made
known to the world that i
(shit) --- that i would love to see an EQUAL or at least more
diverse mix of all genders/sex-prefs/and colors in all fields.
raves used to provide that, and i think they still can.

the important thing for all of us is to maintain the propuh mix
of not being naive, but also knowing who's on your (our) side,
so we don't bite any hands that are really trying to feed us.

qB)

-mArK. (Ready For A Nap)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 15:41:16 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 15:28:52 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: calvin@cats.ucsc.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: Full Moon Rave?

The full moon rave is on Wednesday night and will not be at Bonny Doon.

        Brian

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 15:54:19 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 15:42:46 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305042242.AA10244@ganymede.apple.com>
To: diva@uclink.berkeley.edu, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  recycle

hey!!  when's the fmr??  i missed that!  i know the full moon's
today or tomorrow, but somehow i didn't hear about the rave.
on a sad note, i have to do community (no, no...i wish!) service
work all the way through the summer for driving w/a suspended
license.  [[don't do it, kids, the judges don't like it :( ]]
but i'm gonna try to do a coupla all-niters and go straight 
there in the morning, or maybe leave early and get a coupla 
hours sleep.

and this time i want to meet every sfraver that goes!! =)

anyone leaving from the south bay?  

-mArK.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 16:19:25 1993
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From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305042259.AA10514@ganymede.apple.com>
To: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, calvin@cats.ucsc.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: Full Moon Rave?

where then!?!?!?!!?

-marK.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 16:19:38 1993
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From: netcom.com!howard@nexsys.net (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305042059.AA25328@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: I'm thinking about splitting.
To: geoffw%nexsys@apc.org (Geoff White)
Date: Tue, 4 May 93 13:59:15 PDT
Cc: howard@netcom.com, sfraves%nexsys@apc.org
In-Reply-To: <9305042046.AA03303@nexsys.nexsys.net>; from "Geoff White" at May 4, 93 1:46 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

PEE-Raise Cheezus! and LO! on my crt Geoff White spake thusly:
> 
> 
> 
> Um Howard, If you guys could wait a few monthes.
> I and a few folks are in the process of starting up an ISDN service bureau.
> We are pretty far along and are ordering lines, boxes and
> negotiating with Pac Bell and the Internet backbone people 
> even as we speak.
> 

Sounds good.  ISDN has definite advantages.

-H-

-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 						   howard@netcom.com
				Don't Crash
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 17:20:59 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305050002.AA03744@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: jonathan@casa.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: I'm thinking about splitting.
Cc: sfraves@nexsys.net

> > mentioned that there's an Internet co-op company starting up providing
> > internet services for $80/month or something... if we could find an ethernet
> > tap somewhere, or get an ISDN line somewhere, THEN we're in business.
> 
> A full-time 14.4 => 19.2kB (depending on modems) connection can be had from
> an internet coop called The Little Garden for about $70 a month, plus setup
> costs ($250) and 2 phone lines ($20/month).  
> 
> Giamma and I were planning to set up such a connection in the
> newly-expanded Ramona Towers when he returns from his month-long business
> trip (send him your condolences and other interesting tidbts, please!).  We
> have most of the necessary hardware lined up as well.

Hey You guys are gonna do that too!
I'm planning this as well! Let me know, I might be able to get you a deal
on two zyxel modems 16.8kbps! for $275 each!
 
If we both get hooked up we can sign up ravers in the soouth bay for
a lot less then netcom would charge.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 17:38:53 1993
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From: jon@lurnix.com (Jon Lebeck)
Message-Id: <9305042356.AA28072@verde.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: album.....

Does anyone know if the ablum "Holistic Defination" is out on CD?
I've been trying to find it but haven't had any luck.  Anyone else
know of this album?

                                thanx,

                                       Jon.

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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 18:25:20 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305050125.AA23541@well.sf.ca.us>
To: laura@usl.com, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  djing and droolling

>A male A-list DJ verbally harassed me at my last gig.

I would like to know WHO that was.  In any case, fuck 'em.  You just keep on
doing what YOU want to do, and listen to ONE person, YOURSELF.  That "dj
club" clique is a toughie...many of the people who are the A-list have been
spinning, at least here, for a while.  SO there's the "putting in your time
" thang.  Hang tough, and keep at it.  Play the music YOU like, and before
you know it people will be asking "hey, who is she?".

Peace.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 18:33:00 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 18:27:32 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305050127.AA24013@well.sf.ca.us>
To: nrg@well.sf.ca.us, pashdown@slack.sim.es.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Sign of the Times (sigh...)

Leary is either drunk or fucked up whenever he speaks.  At the last
Cyber-BE-In his old ass was stumbling and mumbling about some inane subject
matter.  Truly a profiteering has been for the moment.  But everyone has got
to pay bills.  He's made his contributino and if you can listen through his
BS you can still find not only a few grains of truth, but even some wisdom.
HE should lay off the shit when he's up there "representing" something other
than himself.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 19:05:37 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 18:53:57 PDT
Message-Id: <9305050153.AA20131@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
From: ez027924@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (Abdul Alhazred)
Subject: FMR

I know there have been posted a thousand queries. Hell, they overflowed my
disk (bummer). But when and where IS the FMR gonna be? I know that it is
Wednesday, NOT at Bonny Doon. SO where the hell is it?

And I hope you guys appreciate what happened to my poor network disk when I
uploaded from my mail some thirty odd messages and couldn't delete them
because they filled the disk too far to be copied to the Trash. Kinda like
stopping up a toilet, I suppose. HA HA HA

Gregor Mosheh can be reached at ez027924@hamlet.ucdavis.edu or
othello.ucdavis.edu most of the time on most days. Should you desire to
write to or call The Great One directly, the information follows.

623 Radcliffe Drive      Davis CA 95616-1011       (916) 758-5589


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 19:18:35 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 19:11:07 -0700
Message-Id: <9305050211.AA04935@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: GUIDELINES FOR POSTING TO SFRAVES

Thanks to Brian for some very good rules o' thumb.

I have two to add to the above:

a)  If a discussion gets particularly hot and high volume, especially
    involving broader issues than the SF scene, it should be taken to
    private e-mail.  It's easy to make a local mail alias or just send
    the next message to only the people who have been directly involved in
    the discussion.  One final post to SFRaves can be made to invite anyone
    who's interested to join the private group.

    This should have been done a couple of days ago with the gender and
    race discussions.  It should *certainly* be done for any future
    messages on these topics.  As moderator, I think Brian should
    jump in and recommend when a discussion should go private before
    it gets too unwieldy.  (Don't be shy, Brian  ;^)

b)  If someone sends you a private message, PLEASE don't quote them
    and respond in public without asking their permission (OK, Mark G.?)
    There's a reason they sent you the message privately, if only to
    keep the traffic down.  This is the second time this has happened
    to me in the last week, and if you think about it, it's really rude.



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 19:31:01 1993
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From: Mike J. Brown <mjbrown@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Message-Id: <9305050226.AA07631@bottom.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Subject: INFO: rave-related image sites reminder
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Tue, 4 May 93 22:26:02 EDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

There are rave-related images available via anonymous FTP at the following
locations:

archive for: alt.rave
site: cs.uwp.edu (Dave Datta's Music Archives)
directory: /pub/music/pictures/a/alt.rave

archive for: SFRaves
site: soda.berkeley.edu
directory: pub/sfraves/images

archive for: NE-Raves
media-lab.mit.edu (NE-Raves archives)
directory: pub/ne-raves/pictures

Also be sure to check the incoming directories at these sites.  If you upload
to the alt.rave site, please upload JPEG/JFIF compressed images if you can.
I got the space on the condition that it would be conserved!  There are
already some rather large GIFs there that may be deleted one day.  The
'readme' file there is getting kind of old; sorry, I'm *way* behind on
maintaining that filespace.
                                                            Mike Brown
_    _  __ ______________________________________Approach and Identify

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 19:45:54 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 17:21:52 -0700
From: uclink.berkeley.edu!diva@nexsys.net (Insane Energy Woman)
Message-Id: <9305050021.AA27835@uclink.berkeley.edu>
To: geoffw%nexsys@apc.org, sfraves%nexsys@apc.org
Subject: Re: Your Sister's House

if *ANYONE* is going to this from the east bay and can give me a ride,
I would be *eternally* grateful.  please please please.  =) =)  (and
a ride back, of course =)


always, leah


thanks!



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 20:15:10 1993
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From: Max Enrique Sequeira Garza <al160184@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Message-Id: <199305050308.AA51815@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Subject: Please some help!
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 21:08:49 +22335737 (CST)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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    Im sorry to post this in here, but you're my only help.
    Could anyone send me the e-mail adress for the electronic music list? I
need it to ask on a synth they are selling me way cheap (RT-09).
    Thanks a bunch!!!

        come together...
                    MAX

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 20:31:50 1993
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From: "Dana WATANABE" <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305050326.AA15527@mothra.nts.uci.edu>
Subject: Re:  djing and droolling
To: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Date: Tue, 4 May 93 20:26:14 PDT
Cc: laura@usl.com, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: <9305041752.AA14850@nmtvs313.mtvyp>; from "Chris Hart" at May 4, 93 10:52 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

>Laura talks about harrassment

>fuckem' just throw down the solid jams and tell 'em to kiss your ass, 
>you don't have to play their game, especially not if the crowd likes
>the music.

yes
support women dj's support good dj's
BUT you cant expect woman to deal with shit that
wouldnt happen if they werent

stop

never mind
drop the ego
love each other
kiss and make up


 ,
dana

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 21:33:56 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 93 21:27:13 -0700
From: rox@netcom.com (Roxanna Stieber)
Message-Id: <9305050427.AA16794@netcom2.netcom.com>
To: jslee@well.sf.ca.us
Cc: jslee@well.sf.ca.us, rth@netcom.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: John S. Lee's message of Tue, 4 May 1993 06:37:13 -0700 <199305041337.AA00742@well.sf.ca.us>
Subject: Weekend Report   
    was: Groove Kitchen a rip off ...

Look enough jumping on my case already. I do know the promotors of GK (or
use to). I support Preston's endeavors alot. I just don't think it's fair
to walk in for 5 seconds and walk right out and not get my money back.
They wouldn't let us peek inside. Next time one of us will go in and check
it out and that way if it isn't happening we'll only be out $10 split
between us and not $20. I use to go to GK way back when it was on Thurs.
nights at One Step Beyond. Besides we left Beltane cuz the vibe wasn't
there for us. To me a rave has to reach critical mass for the vibe to be
there. That's the way it is for me and my friends, it may be different for
you. So anyway we left GK and went to Wicked ANOTHER $30 for 2) and got
there between 2:30 and 3:00 to find at least 3 cop cars outside. We went
in anyway. Around 5:00 or so the cops came in with flashlights and were
shining them in people's eyes. Waking them up and shining the light right
in their eyes if they were sleeping. This was up on the balcony where we
were. Needless to say I have never seen this happen before. Alot of strange 
energy that night. 
Oh by the way on the way into Beltane at the Fashion Center the cops 
were there and were saying that everyone who was under 21 had to leave 
by 2:00 and that they were going to come back at 2:30 and if 
there were any under agers there they would shut the whole thing down.
The security was really heavy handed there. It was like BGP. Goons every
place, even in the chill-out room. That was one of the main reasons we
left. The overly thorough search we got on the way in really turned us
off. I mean we don't even look like the type that would carry weapons and
were very open to being searched, but they went overboard. 
Back to Wicked:        
Anyway we were enjoying Wicked even though we sensed that something was 
going to come down. Strange vibe. So after it got closed down we went 
over to the DNA and waited till it opened.  We finally found the vibe. 
Doc Martin and Simon really ripped up the dance floor. Doc Martin is a 
personal favorite of mine and it was really a nice surprise to see him 
there. So all in all the night/day turned out ok even if it was expensive.
Any way I'll probably go back to GK cuz I usually like the vibe there.
Although I did like the space better at King St. It was really dark at
Big Heart City. I mean I like it dark but it was so dark we couldn't find 
the bathrooms so we waited until we got to Wicked.

Rox

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May  4 21:59:09 1993
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Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 21:35:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Arthur Chandler <arthurc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu>
Subject: Heat, Light, Rules and Regulations
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305042157.A22270-b100000@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

 
   I have to (politely) disagree with the notion that the recent
discussions about race and gender issues in the rave scene are out of
place. These issues were raised at the Cyberforum panel on raves because
many people felt them to be real issues.  The fact that they generated a
good deal of light and heat on sfraves shows that the issues are genuine,
and cannot be wished away -- and should not be moderated away.  There are
some unresolved issues here -- issues that connect the rave scene to the
society at large.  It's all well and good to complain in chorus about the
intrigues of cops and unscrupulous promoters; but if there are internal
problems, shouldn't they be brought to light here and discussed?  If the
thread topic is listed in the subject, folks who don't want to listen in
on it can just hit the delete key.  If they do want in on it -- well, this
is the Internet: be prepared for heat along with the light.
  Having said this, I still fully subscribe to Brian's and Mykl's notion
that personal arguments should remove to email.  The essence of the
Internet [[ arthurc moves to the top of soapbox ]] is mutual aid.  If my
response to your views on patriarchy or racial exclusivity is, in spirit,
intended to foster ultimate harmony, then it ought to go out to sfraves,
IMHO. If the spirit behind my reply is to ding you for your opinion, I
should probably hold it in; but if send it I must, I should email you so
that we can duel it out by ourselves.
  sfraves should be large.  It can contain multitudes of emotions.
Discordant voices can make for profounder harmonies.




*********************************************************************
******************  The problem, and the solution, ******************
******************    Is bringing things to bear.  ******************
*********************************************************************



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 00:32:04 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 00:15:28 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305050715.AA04514@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: README!: COMMANDO CLIFF PARTY TONIGHT!



	This just across the wire.
	There will be a  renagade sound party TONIGHT in the
	PRESIDIO!  Don't show up before 4 AM.

	The party is at the bunkers at Langdon Court

	Directions as folllows: 25th ave turns into lincoln ave.
	follow it past baker beach, look for langdon on the lefthand
	side.  Tell them Mark Ameba sent you.

	That is all.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 08:15:54 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 08:10:51 -0700
From: jonl@netcom.com (Jonathan Lancaster)
Message-Id: <9305051510.AA24061@netcom2.netcom.com>
To: mcg@netcom.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: GUIDELINES FOR POSTING TO SFRAVES

I'd like to suggest another addition: Don't keep adding reply upon
reply in you message to the point where the whole mail message is
300 lines, with your one-liner at the end...this gets and instant
dp from yours truely.

-jonl

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 08:55:48 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 1993 11:40:17 +0501 (EDT)
From: Greg Beckham <gregbec@gibbs.oit.unc.edu>
Subject: im outta here!
To: AllRave Lists <dcraves@american.edu>, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        seraves@american.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305051117.A10976-b100000@gibbs.oit.unc.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

well- ive sent unsub requests to all the lists im on, but if for some
reason they didnt work, or i had a wrong address, please take me off the
list- but ill be back in late august.

id like to thank all the folks ive become friends with on the net and on
vrave, and am looking forward to coming back in the fall!

id like to thank the list administrators and all the folks who work for
the lists doing the rave guides and hookup guides- its adding a bit of
cohesiveness to a very disjointed scene and helps keep a lot of folks
informed!

if anyone wants to keep in touch, ill be at the summer address below... if
your interested in trading fliers or dj tapes- send me yours and ill send
you mine... i think im pretty good at doing that...

to everyone whos address i have- ill most likely be dropping you a line
this summer, but if i dont, that doesnt mean im not thinking about you!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-  greg beckham  [ origin ]           -     summer address:                  
- internet: gregbec@gibbs.oit.unc.edu -    2211 O'hara Dr.                   
- phone   : 919-914-4702              -    Charlotte, NC 28273               
- snail   : 7 teague hall             -    704-588-3541                       
-           unc-chapel hill           -                                   
-           chapel hill, nc 27514     -                                   
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Peace Out to:
Leah=)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cindy (Get well soon!!!!), Brian, Chris, Bryan, Susie, Sfraves, Dieselboy,
fluid, oz, randy,john, dave, laibach, inhuman, (damn- where's my      
memory? :) ) laura, doug, vic, Jetta!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!/b :),
damn- if i forgot anyone im SOOOOOOOO sorry, but im still in exam mode...


Peace Out!
greg....


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 09:41:10 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 12:35:54 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305051635.AA08732@pilot.njin.net>
To: Mike J. Brown <mjbrown@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: INFO: rave-related image sites reminder
In-Reply-To: <9305050226.AA07631@bottom.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
References: <9305050226.AA07631@bottom.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>

Want to see the space savings converting the GIF images to JPG?

-rw-r--r--  1 csc        160093 May  5 12:14 cindy.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc         35328 May  5 12:16 cindy.jpg
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        400712 May  5 12:14 danabry.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        194718 May  5 12:21 danabry.jpg
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        734146 May  5 12:13 garth.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        351355 May  5 12:18 garth.jpg
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        413671 May  5 12:14 group1.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        194746 May  5 12:19 group1.jpg
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        125845 May  5 12:13 heffa.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc         52770 May  5 12:20 heffa.jpg
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        311699 May  5 12:15 jeachim.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        149176 May  5 12:14 jessbeth.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc         68687 May  5 12:21 jessbeth.jpg
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        162593 May  5 12:20 joachim.jpg
-rw-r--r--  1 csc        112973 May  5 12:15 leah.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc         58556 May  5 12:21 leah.jpg
-rw-r--r--  1 csc         89601 May  5 12:15 xdzebra.gif
-rw-r--r--  1 csc         34094 May  5 12:22 xdzebra.jpg

This is with a Q of 75 and a smoothing factor of 30. This results in
JPEG images virtually indistinguishable from the original GIF.
Scanning in images in 24 bit color and converting directly to JPEG
results in even more space savings with 24 bit color preserved.

I wonder why there aren't more pics? I'm an amateur photographer;
maybe I should set up shop at one of the parties or something :).


Sean

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 09:54:38 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Bob Ramstad's message of Mon, 3 May 93 18:47:41 PDT <9305040147.AA25903@groovy.us.oracle.com>
Subject: lee? anyone? help???
From: Desi the Three-Armed Wonder Comic <jondr@sco.com>
Sender: jondr@sco.com
Date: Wed, 5 May 93 9:47:25 PDT
Message-Id:  <9305050947.aa29828@scotty.sco.COM>

fine, i was gonna keep it a big secret, but here's my set list...

Tape 1 Side 2 (unmixed)

Meat Beat Manifesto	I Got The Fear (Without Jack)
The Shamen		Boss Drum (Twitch)
Lemon Interupt		Minniapolis (Twitch)
JFK			Here They Come Again (Brutal Mix)
Sonic Solution		On The Move

Tape 2 Side 1 (mixed)

Eden Transmission		I'm So High
Up Above The World		Straight Up Caffeine
High Lonesome Sound System	Champion Sound
Metropolis			Metropolis (analog)
Outdance			Pump The Jumpin' (Deco Mix)
Coco Steel and Lovebomb		You Can't Stop The Groove (Twitch)
Shakedown Productions		Alhambra (Twitch)
The Grid			Crystal Clear (Trimar Mix)
Electrotete			I Love You (remix)
Intermix			Monument (Twitch)
Mental Cube			Q (Santa Monica Mix)
High Lonesome Sound System	Testimonial

----------
and here's what I got for moonpup's set:

?
Coco Steel & Lovebomb - Feel It
Jay Dee - Plastic Dreams
Liberty City - Some Lovin'
Jay Dee - Plastic Dreams
?
DHS - Holophonic Sound
?
TZ4
?
Paradise Organisation - Prayer Tower
?
280 West - Scattered Dreams
LNR - Work It To The Bone

(there's more but i ran out of identifying muscles)

Jon Drukman (in stereo where available)                         jondr@sco.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you want to touch the sky, just put a window in your eye.           - Coil

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 10:40:25 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 10:33:08 PDT
From: langston@isi.com (Richard Langston x247)
Message-Id: <9305051733.AA13415@chief>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Tim Leary's dead (no no no, he's drunk)


Sorry, I seem to have cut off the original FROM:line..... 
> 
> >Leary is either drunk or fucked up whenever he speaks.  At the last
 	The last time I heard Leary was about 5 years ago at the university
 of maryland, when he appeared with abbie hoffman and some anti drug folks at
 a legalization debate.  While his commercialism did sicken me, we didn't seem
 fucked up at all.  Just another data point.
 	IMHO, abbie hoffman was the best spokesman for the whole hippie->
 rave mind expansion thing.  He was honest, straightforward, and humble......
 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 10:44:57 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305051651.AA16473@nmtvs313.mtvyp>
To: ames!sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu!arthurc, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Heat, Light, Rules and Regulations

 but if there are internal
problems, shouldn't they be brought to light here and discussed?  If the
thread topic is listed in the subject, folks who don't want to listen in
on it can just hit the delete key.
--------------

I would prefer this ^ (above) but will defer to whatever the group prefers...

lat,

*


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 10:45:43 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 13:33:28 EDT
From: edward.levitch@sfwmd.gov (Ed Levitch)
Message-Id: <9305051733.AA06529@mailhost.sfwmd.gov>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  djing and droolling

Remember:

	If we make the chants, we CAN dance...
	Let your Mind, Body and Soul come alive, melt INTO the vibe...

Begin TranceMission

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 10:49:26 1993
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	for 
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 10:42:40 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305051742.AA07288@ganymede.apple.com>
To: csc@pilot.njin.net, mjbrown@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Subject: Re:  INFO: rave-related image sites reminder
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

in re: to all those gifs, could somebody mail those to me?
i am learning how to ftp by email, but haven't quite got it yet.

i already have :

leah
jessbeth (i think)
heffa
xdz
garth (but CAN'T open it :(  )

how does one send one?  scan a photo and then mail it?

-mARk. (100% Of Your Daily Vitamins)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 10:56:08 1993
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From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305051631.AA02362@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

>b)  If someone sends you a private message, PLEASE don't quote them
>    and respond in public without asking their permission (OK, Mark
>    G.?)  There's a reason they sent you the message privately, if
>    only to keep the traffic down.  This is the second time this
>    has happened to me in the last week, and if you think about it,
>    it's really rude.

O.K., apoligy to Mykl, he's right.  I didn't realize it was a
private message, a reminder to all to pay closer attention to the
headers (I will). BUT, I realize you might have been frustrated, even
thought it's not like I flamed you - I admited you were right about
something, but it's probably also not a good idea to use someones
name as a bad example on an addition to a list of rules that 200+
people were asked to print and hang on their terminals, you could
have left my name out of rule b and then told me privately.  Anyway,
no big deal.  Just more e-mail etiquette.

-Mark

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 10:58:18 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 13:52:59 EDT
From: Monica Tauriello <monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: sex/race on list
Message-Id: <CMM-RU.1.3.736624379.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>

i would definitely prefer to see these issues, especially as they relate to
the scene(s), aired on the list.  after all, one can just delete thru them. 
i also agree with the proposed rules, tho', about reading thru the day's mail
before posting so people aren't saying the same thing twice...

monicat

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 11:15:27 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 11:10:12 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305051810.AA07565@ganymede.apple.com>
To: monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  sex/race on list

i would like to think that sfraves is (much?) more than just a
virtual telephone post to nail fliers up to.  these issues
do relate, and as long as ettiquite (sp) is used there's no 
reason that we can't enjoy stimulating cross-fire of ideas
that pertain.  (IMO)

-mArk. (100% of Your Daily Vitamins)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 13:31:01 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 13:15:21 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305052015.AA05279@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: mw@sybase.com
Subject: Re:  README!: COMMANDO CLIFF PARTY TONIGHT!
Cc: sfraves@nexsys.net


> From sybase.com!mw@cdp.igc.org Wed May  5 13:12:00 1993
> Return-Path: <sybase.com!mw@cdp.igc.org>
> Date: Wed, 5 May 93 13:07:32 PDT
> From: mw@sybase.com (Michael Wertheim)
> To: geoffw@nexsys.net
> Subject: Re:  README!: COMMANDO CLIFF PARTY TONIGHT!
> Content-Length: 204
> X-Lines: 6
> Status: RO
> 
> > There will be a  renagade sound party TONIGHT in the
> > PRESIDIO!  Don't show up before 4 AM.
> 
> Is there any connection between this and the FMR?  Will there be an FMR?
> Is this a substitute for the FMR?
> 
> 


Mark Ameba called me last night at 12:30 and said that this was happening,
I don;t know if it indeed did happen.  It was LAST Night NOT tonight.


				geoffw

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 16:11:55 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 16:05:36 -0700
From: shrink@ucscb.ucsc.edu (Fabien Thad Santos)
Message-Id: <9305052305.AA24699@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
To: ccat@netcom.com, jslee@well.sf.ca.us, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  No place for arguements...

i agree, I think there is always time and place for everything.  But as for 
agruements, they don't belong one email cuz it just cause people like me to 
sit and read something that may not interest me. 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 16:15:43 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 93 16:09:20 -0700
From: shrink@ucscb.ucsc.edu (Fabien Thad Santos)
Message-Id: <9305052309.AA24813@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
To: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: checking ourselves

That's cool of you to say that.  That's my thoughts exactly...we must be on the
same wavelength.....um...nahhhhh!:)  Just go on want you believe in and you'll
be happy.....peace
---------------------------Fabien 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 18:12:44 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 1993 17:49:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Lee An <lee@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: c2 playlist
To: sfraves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305051703.B28187-a100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


here's my playlist for c2 if anyone's interested.

on the double dagger side after "it's gonna be a lovely day":

the good men		"give it up"
unomas			"escuchar"
zeony lee experience	"love energy"
soul sacrifice		"sacrifice dub"
paradise 3001		"beautification"

on the upside-down-A side:

sublime			"white label--released before "the theme"
double fm		"sound of amnesia"
la camorra		"te quiero"
aquastep		"carousel" remix
sound clash republic	"not for sale"
k&m			"funk and drive"
african juice		can't remember the title... on b-side of "congo bongo"
original rockers	"push push"
deja vu			"never knew the devil"

i've have this nagging feeling that i'm forgetting something--i'm doing
this at work and i don't have the tape with me--so you'll have to forgive
me if i have the order wrong. i'll take another listen soon and send the
corrections, if needed.

lee


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 18:16:08 1993
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From: paul.richard@glib.org
Message-Id: <9305052039.A9935wk@glib.org>
Date: Wed, 05 May 93 20:39:24 
Subject: HEY FROM CLINTON LAN
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu


Hey dudes and dudettes!  I've finally found a gateway to the Internet so's I
can get back in touch with you all.  I could have done it through the White
House system, but my address was so long that messages kept getting bounced
around.
Anyway, life in the West Wing is hectic, constant, long, and very exciting. 
Sorry, I haven't yet been able to schedule a rave for the East Room, but I'm
working on it.  Been to a couple of kewl events, but the work schedule doesn't
permit as much partying as I would like.  Needless to say, certain aspects of
raving no longer exist-interviews with the feds, interviews with counsel, a
great session of wee-wee for Willie, etc, etc.  Details on the pee test for
those who are interested.
So, I'm glad to be back in touch.  Let me know what's happening.  I'm looking
forward to being back in SF at the end of June for the parade and other
parties.  Until then, ravishingly yours,
Paul

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 18:48:15 1993
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Message-Id: <9305060141.AA19937@soda.berkeley.edu>
From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Wed, 5 May 1993 18:41:06 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Last Call for flyer info

These are the only listings I have for the calendar I'm putting out
tonight.  If you have flyers for any other non-weekly coming up in the next 
week or two, let me know...

        Brian



Thursday, May 6th - the Garden - dj's jim huckin, superfuzz, tony , john 
Friday, May 7th - Obsession - Taking up the top two floors of DV8
Friday, May 7th - Baked Raindrop
Saturday, May 8th (afternoon) - Straight-up Funk	FREE!
Saturday, May 8th - Groove Kitchen - Big Heart City 21+
Saturday, May 8th - Where the Wild Things Are
Saturday, May 8th - The World of Dr Splift
Friday, May 14th - Chapter One - DJ's rick preston, harry who, carlos, shon
Saturday, May 15th - Earth Beat
Saturday, May 22nd - Animation - (510) 247-2328

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 19:09:45 1993
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From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Message-Id: <9305060201.AA19667@netcom3.netcom.com>
Subject: FMR Weather Forecast
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Wed, 5 May 93 19:01:17 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

 NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE SAN FRANCISCO CA
 330 PM PDT WED MAY 5 1993 ...DO NOT USE AFTER 930 PM WEDNESDAY
 
  TONIGHT...INCREASING CLOUDINESS. LOWS 50 TO 55. NORTHWEST EVENING
 WIND TO 15 MPH.
  THURSDAY...MOSTLY CLOUDY WITH LOCAL DRIZZLE NORTH OF SAN
 JOSE IN THE MORNING. CLEARING IN THE AFTERNOON. HIGHS UPPER 60S TO
 MID 70S. NORTHWEST AFTERNOON WIND TO 20 MPH.

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
    MykL G      (Safety Sealed For Your Protection)      mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 21:58:53 1993
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Date: 06 May 93 00:46:37 EDT
From: Shaun Ralston <70007.3260@compuserve.com>
To: SFRaves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re-Subscribe Me PLEASE!
Message-Id: <930506044637_70007.3260_CHM53-1@CompuServe.COM>

Please re-subscribe me!  Sorry about the bounced back messages, but
my terminal was down for three days and Compuserve will only hold 100
messages.  I know, its time to get netcom!  In the meantime, please
resubscribe me at 70007,3260@CompuServe.com.  Peace, Love & Rave-ON!
- Shaun


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 22:49:41 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 1993 22:47:40 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305060547.AA04458@well.sf.ca.us>
To: mark@ganymede.apple.com, monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  sex/race on list

It funny...I ALWAYS dt thru the news & info.  But I ALWAYS read the "stuff"
that everyone else, of late, has had complaints with.  I'd rather read about
issues on peoples minds, as it realtes to the scene, than the "virtual"
flier.

Peace.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 23:07:42 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: odd-n-urgent FMR request
From: jp@darkstar.com (Julie Petersen)
Date: Wed, 05 May 93 22:38:48 -0600
Message-Id: <a80df275@darkstar.com>
X-Mailer: Fernmail 1.1 (unregistered, shareware fee not paid)


If anyone just happens to be swinging by FMR-AM on their way to ?work?
tomorrow and they just happen to be coming from the south bay
(on 17) could you bring me along for the ride? I will buy oranges.
Feel free to call me as early as 4AM. (408) 395-2220
---
We are setting out to create new worlds, new beings, new modes of consciousness.
--W.S. Burroughs
Julie Petersen  jp@darkstar.com

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May  5 23:32:05 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 1993 23:28:03 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305060628.AA12766@well.sf.ca.us>
To: jslee@well.sf.ca.us, rox@netcom.com
Subject: Re:  Weekend Report was: Groove Kitchen a rip off ...
Cc: rth@netcom.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

I found the bathrooms at Big Heart City!  (After wandering all over the place
to find them . . . :)  They were through the drop curtain to the left of the
DJ setup, around to the right . . .

Wish I hadn't work to do on Sunday, I was really hoping to see Dante and
Carlos at the good ole Troc but at 7 am I'd already been up 21 straight
hours and the thought of going 36 or 40 straight without sleep wasn't
in the Feasibility Quotient!

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 00:09:00 1993
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From: murt@leland.stanford.edu
Message-Id: <9305060704.AA19647@cardinal.Stanford.EDU.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: FMR
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Thu, 6 May 93 0:04:42 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

HEY!  Where is the FMR??!?  I've heard some rumors and I think I know where
it is more or less.  But I would greatly appreciate confirmation and more 
detailed directions.

Thank you profusely,

Scott

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 00:21:44 1993
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From: calvin@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Thu, 6 May 93 00:19:37 -0700
Message-Id: <9305060719.AA08161@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: FMR


    I know that everyone is saying that the FMR isn't at Bonny Doon, but 20 
people at my school (UCSC) are going to Bonny Doon tonight (Wed.) around
2:00 am.  They said it is definately going to be there.  Anybody know where
it is supposed to be?  Thanks...

calvin@cats.ucsc.edu

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 01:19:38 1993
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Date: Wed, 5 May 1993 23:37:54 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <well.sf.ca.us!phred@nexsys.net>
Message-Id: <199305060637.AA15002@well.sf.ca.us>
To: geoffw%nexsys@apc.org, sfraves%nexsys@apc.org
Subject: Re:  README!: COMMANDO CLIFF PARTY TONIGHT!

COOL!!!  I just rode by there the other night on my way back from Sausalito
(I'm back in cold, wet Portland now . . . sob!)  Have a great time all!!

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 02:21:41 1993
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Date: Thu, 6 May 1993 02:22 PST
From: YOUR FRIEND MIKE <MROMO@scuacc.scu.edu>
Subject: meowow?
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <3DB761BC8000136C@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu"


This is as rave related as most of the recents posts, so...

A cat wandered into my house today and proceeded to make herself cozy
and then started giving birth.

So, my roommates and I now have 3 (extremely cute) kittens.  They are
young, and we are going to take care of them for the rest of the month
or so, but if anyone is looking for that purrfect (I couldn't resist) present,
we got 'em...email me if you're interested...

now, rave related.

Went to T00n's tonight, and it was very....roomy.  What's up?  Also,
uuuhh...oh yeah, since nothing realy interesting seems up this weekend,
I will hopefully see you all at the park...(and Bob--bring those tapes,
I am ready to commit!! :) ) 

oh, have a nice thursday...

(p.s. anyone have any fresh kitten information for me, like feeding the
mom certain things?  I ran to Safeway and got some pickles and ice cream,
but it didn't fly...)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 07:32:57 1993
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Date: Thu, 6 May 93 07:30:36 PDT
From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9305061430.AA21114@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: meowow in  the park


OUR FRIEND MIKE purrs:
> uuuhh...oh yeah, since nothing realy interesting seems up this weekend,
> I will hopefully see you all at the park...(and Bob--bring those tapes,

Good chance I'll be there again with some friends & family.  Bob, if
you're *not* gonna be there, let us know so that I'll know to bring
along some kind of music...music...music...music...

- leg of eel

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 08:10:52 1993
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	id AA07438; Thu, 6 May 93 11:07:59 -0400
From: s i n e w a v e <tsines@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Message-Id: <9305061507.AA07438@photon.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Subject: still wanted: tr.909 drum computer
To: rave@alt.Stanford.EDU, music.makers.synth@rec.Stanford.EDU,
        music.marketplace@rec.Stanford.EDU, wanted@misc.Stanford.EDU,
        forsale@osu.Stanford.EDU, forsale@cmh.Stanford.EDU,
        analogue@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Analogue Heaven Synth list.),
        ne-raves@silver.lcs.mit.edu (ne-raves),
        mw-raves@engin.umich.edu (midwest rave list),
        sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU (sfraves (san fran rave list))
Date: Thu, 6 May 93 11:07:58 EDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

yes, i know this is annoying, but i am still looking to buy a roland tr.909 
drum computer. please help if you can.






sines
-- 
  /\    /\    _________________s i n e w a v e___________________    /\    /\
 /  \  /  \  /    todd sines: tsines@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu   \  /  \  /  \
/    \/    \/    384 e17th ave, columbus, oh 43201 614 299 9529   \/    \/    \
             analogue / analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 08:24:15 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 6 May 93 16:21:53 BST
Message-Id: <13656.9305061521@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: C2 playlist


I've formatted all the info that's been posted so far into a single
list.  I thought I'd post it here to help keep all the info in one
place, and to save everyone else having to do likewise...  (If I've
missed any info that's been posted, please let me know....)

	Cosmic Roy

-------------

1. Circle

Scott Hardkiss (43 min)


2. Bullet

Scott Hardkiss (12 min)

Jon Drukman (unmixed) (31 min)
  Meat Beat Manifesto		I Got The Fear (Without Jack)
  The Shamen			Boss Drum (Twitch)
  Lemon Interupt		Minniapolis (Twitch)
  JFK				Here They Come Again (Brutal Mix)
  Sonic Solution		On The Move


3. Sharp

Jon Drukman (43 min)
  Eden Transmission		I'm So High
  Up Above The World		Straight Up Caffeine
  High Lonesome Sound System	Champion Sound
  Metropolis			Metropolis (analog)
  Outdance			Pump The Jumpin' (Deco Mix)
  Coco Steel and Lovebomb	You Can't Stop The Groove (Twitch)
  Shakedown Productions		Alhambra (Twitch)
  The Grid			Crystal Clear (Trimar Mix)
  Electrotete			I Love You (remix)
  Intermix			Monument (Twitch)
  Mental Cube			Q (Santa Monica Mix)
  High Lonesome Sound System	Testimonial

Moonpup (1 min)


4. Flat

Moonpup	(44 min)
?
  Coco Steel & Lovebomb		Feel It
  Jay Dee			Plastic Dreams
  Liberty City			Some Lovin'
  Jay Dee			Plastic Dreams
?
  DHS				Holophonic Sound
?
  TZ4
?
  Paradise Organisation		Prayer Tower
?
  280 West			Scattered Dreams
  LNR				Work It To The Bone
...


5. Dagger

Moonpup	(39 min)


6. Ddagger

Moonpup (17 min)

Lee (22 min)
  The Good Men			Give It Up
  Unomas			Escuchar
  Zeony Lee Experience		Love Energy
  Soul Sacrifice		Sacrifice Dub
  Paradise 3001			Beautification


7. Forall

Lee (45 min)
  Sublime			<white label--released before The Theme>
  Double FM			Sound of Amnesia
  La Camorra			Te Quiero
  Aquastep			Carousel (remix)
  Sound Clash Republic		Not For Sale
  K&M				Funk and Drive
  African Juice			<b-side of Congo Bongo>
  Original Rockers		Push Push
  Deja Vu			Never Knew the Devil


8. Exists

BLURrrr	(45 min)
  Monumental			Geera
  Organs Musical Clocks
    and Boxes			Still
  Transform			Transformation
  House Pimps			Zulu Nation
  Dance 2 Trance		Power of American Natives
  Blood Runs Dry		All of Your Mind
  Mukkaa			Buruchacca
  Dr. Atomic			Schudelfloss
  Robin S			Show Me Love





From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 08:55:00 1993
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From: "Oz Lubling" <ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Message-Id: <9305061553.AA13289@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Subject: BLISSS!
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Thu, 6 May 93 11:53:45 EDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

______________________________________________________________________________

Friday, May 7                 Waltham, MA

BLISSS!       -  forcing the ink
                 
   At Brandeis University  Schwartz Auditorium... May 7th

Friday May 7 - 9 pm-2am   FREE!

DJ Lineup:

  ApplePie - Norway (Tech Squad/Pleasure Force)
  Thirteen - New York - (thiswillhurtyou)
  Mr. SparklE - Hartford (United Techno)
  donutZ - Worcester (House of Lordsvale)

A small mind-expanding VR setup
Video Projections
Holographic Smart Bar
Laser Effects by John Adams

crew: TechnoHead, Jeannie, Leslie, Brendan, Anna

special thanks to: NE-Raves, arnold, hata ha, ricardo retardo,
                   urbo, Pete Nimlock and Fax Records, Force Inc, 
                   Overdrive Records, and all you cybernetic 
                   organisms out there!


further info and/or directions:

 ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (TechnoHead)
 jfinks@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (Jeannie)
_______________________________________________________________________________


here is the BLISSS! flyer to all my sf friends,

take care and chill out,
ol

-- 
                            ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu                         
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
T	e	c	h	n	o	H	e	a	d
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 10:05:57 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Full Moon Rave
Date: Thu, 06 May 93 09:53:35 -0700
From: doom@leland.stanford.edu


(Great, now I suppose all the cat and dog lovers are going
to start arguing with each other...) 

The FMR worked amazingly well at the new surprise site,
within "1/2 hour" of San Francisco. Most everyone, me
included, expected it to be busted during Garth's set... but
we made it through Garth, Jeno, Markie Mark... then I
decided to leave at around 8:30.  And unfortunately, as I
was walking to my car, a lone police officer was driving in.
I also noticed a guy in a Park Service truck sitting in the
airport parking lot, talking to someone who looked like he
worked at the airport.  So maybe things were fine until the
airport employees showed up.  

And those little Cessna's trying to buzz in close without
getting too near the power lines were pretty funny.


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 10:13:40 1993
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From: *SAGE* <ulvbiskt@mcl.mcl.ucsb.edu>
Subject: WARP 9(jeno/garth in S.B.?!!)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Thu, 6 May 93 10:08:05 PDT
Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85]

	      Santa Barbara isn't exactly the raver's nirvana.
	      Moving here from SF last sept. to go to UCSB was
	      not the most well thought out move I've made. But
	      once in a while miracles do happen. Last I'm walking  
	      to class of all places and there's a flyer posted
	      for Warp 9 that say Jeno and Garth are spinnin'.
	      When I came to I didn't know where I was. 
		  Anyway, we'll see what happens. if any of you are
		  making the trip down there are a few things you 
		  might want to know.
		    1) Pretty much try not to spend any more time
		       in any of the local bars than is needed to make a
		       quick phone call or stop at the rest room.
		    2) There's a killer drum circle with all kinds of
		     tribal rythms for anyone who wants to participate
		     on sun. afternoons down by the beach on castillo
		     at salsipuedes (or something like that). there's
		     always a bunch of people down there.
		    3) If anyone needs a place to crash or any other
		    kinds of connections you can call CLYVE(me) at
		    (805) 963 5396. 
		       Peace. and have fun!
		       Al-

	     



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 11:17:42 1993
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Date: Thu, 6 May 93 11:10:58 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <rramstad@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: meowow in the park
Reply-To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com


I'll absolutely 100% be there this Sunday, in Marx Meadows at GGP.
Rave in a bag + tapes, so Lee, rest easy, and I'll bring C2 sets too.

(I generally get there at 1 or so and stay until sunset, FYI.)

Oh, and I'm DAT taping the Garden tonight, looks like a great DJ
lineup, so if everything goes well, we'll have some different tunes to
listen to on Sunday.  (If the DJs are willing, some of the tapes may
be made available through some sort of tape dubbing tree structure.
I'll announce it if it's available, so please don't send email asking
for copies, OK?  Thanks!)

I encourage everyone to come to the park Sunday, relaxing in the park
with some good tunes and the SFRaves posse is a great way to spend a
Sunday afternoon.

FMR mini-review: great!  I ** really ** liked the location, dancing on
sand is a total pain, and it's about as isolated as you can get and
still be 5 minutes from the freeway.  Very cool, kudos to Brian for
finding it!

Bob




From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 14:16:02 1993
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Date: Thu, 6 May 1993 17:05:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alan Michael Parry <brit@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: Warp
To: ne-raves <ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu>
Cc: sf-raves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.03.9305061730.A15312-9100000@ravel.udel.edu>
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Is there any lucky fellow out there who owns all of Warps Artifical
Intelligence albums??  If possible, I would like full titles and track
listings for all. greatly appreciated. I just managed to get B12 (Electro
Soma) today. beautiful orange vinyl. yum yum.
  _
 (_ )  ) (  ) _(            
 (  (_ (_) ( (_(




From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 15:27:20 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Thu, 6 May 1993 15:17:26 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: F M R

        Wow, this was the best time I've had at a party since the first
FMR at Berkeley Marina.  

        First off, Geoff was actually the one who thought of and first
scoped out the locale;  I came down a couple times after that to see what
the patrol situation was like at night, and discovered that turning left
at the end of Embarcadero resulted in a better place than turning right.

        I was SO NERVOUS about this location, what with a) PA cops having
a reputation for "being bored" and b) East Palo Alto not too far away.
In fact I was so nervous I could barely see straight while driving there.
But we got to the lot, parked the car, and Geoff and Stevie and I proceeded
to plan out where to park cars in the huge lot.  This was about 1am.  Within
maybe an hour 100 cars had shown up, and over the course of the night a 
total of 260 cars were there (probably more, this is a count I did at 5am)

Anyways, by 3am the sound system was JUST getting set up, and still no sign
of cops.  I was flabbergasted, as I had totally expected them to show up by 
then.  The music switched on, and the 400 or so already there turned off
their car stereos and started dancing.  Instant "critical mass".  We were
now unstoppable :)

High points through the night:

1) walking out to the edge of the marsh walkway extending from the building
there and listening to the music from 1/2 mile away.  Why does House music
sound so damn good in the outdoors?

2) seeing a big Public Works "reclaimed water" truck pull in - I feared the
worst, like uhoh, he needs to do something here and we're here and he's 
gonna call the fuzz and have us shut down.  He turned his truck around and
parked in a side parking lot, got out of his car, and joined the party!  He
said he could hear the music from the recycling plant about 3/4 mile away,
and wanted to see what was happening :)

3) talking to a Palo Alto high school student in the morning who said, 
"I have to leave - I have a calculus final in 10 minutes!"

4) Standing on top of those Stonehengian concrete blocks and looking out
over the crowd.  EEeen-sane.

5) The cops finally showed up around quarter to nine (!!!!), and actually 
they would have never known about it had the park rangers not called them.
Someone walked up, explained what was going on, said we're a responsible
group, we pick up after ourselves, etc., and gave the cop his name and
number.  The cop said, just be gone by 11 or so... I was completely blown
away :)

6) EVERYONE was smiling, dancing on top of vans, speaker stacks, everything
spelled P-O-S-I-T-I-V-I-T-Y.

The bad points:

1) Too much alcohol and nitrous.  Thanks, Wally!

2) Even though the dance floor and cars were on a packed dirt parking lot
and thus not harmful to the environment, unfortunately there were a lot of
people walking through the plant life next to the marsh, crushing sensitive
plants and such.  The site would have been perfect if it weren't for this.

3) SOO much trash!  But it got cleaned up, most of it at least (and WHY is
it standard to throw cigarrette butts on the ground?  Come'on, people! Those
are SOOO hard to pick up and throw away :(   )

But that's about it for the bad points.  Overall, I was deliriously happy.
Peace to the huge SFRaves posse in effect there, and everyone :)

	Brian



From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 17:54:43 1993
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Date: Thu, 6 May 1993 20:19:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alan Michael Parry <brit@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: UK article: Progressive House
To: ne-raves <ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu>
Cc: sf-raves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>, dc-raves <dcraves@american.edu>
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 Call it progressive house. Call it instrumental dub disco. Call it what
you like, but now the rave scene is all but dead, progressive house has
reanimated dance music - and the best of it is being produced in Britain.
Progressive house was developed by DJs influenced by early house and the
Balearic club scene, who took advantage of cheap technology and turned
record producers and remixers. Thanks to DJs like Leftfield, Andrew
Weatherall, Darren Emerson, Fabi Paras, the Boy's Own team and Justin
Robertson, people have flooded back to nightclubs all over the country.
Robertson is a good example of how DJing has evoloved. Having run one of
the country's most respected nightclubs, "Most Excellent", he has been
hired to remix a succesion of tracks. Not only dance acts like TC1992 and
React to Rhythm, but also high profile pop acts such as the Shamen and the
Sugarcubes. Other club nights which have paved the way for the new UK
house sound in the last 18 months or so are Slam (Glasgow), Love Ranch and
Drum Club (both in London), Back to Basics (Leeds), Venus (Nottingham),
and Renaissance (Mansfield). "There's a new sound in the clubs, pioneered
by DJs sick of the rave scene," says Dave Wesson, progressive house guru
and owner of Zoom Records. "It's very much influenced by what's been
happening in Europe, but, in the end, it's just British dance music
created by a universal dissatisfaction with the rave scene." According to
Jonathan Richardson from Dance promotions outfit POP, "progressive house"
is "essentially an uplifting, dubby, percussive workout."
  POP look after The Grid, an early purveyor of the new style. Back in
early 1990 The Grid's first single, Floatation, had a set of so-called
"progressive" mixes on the 12" release. Richardson points to the success
of last year's Felix track, Don't You Want Me, as a demonstration of how
huge the progressive house scene has become. Guerilla Records, known as
the label at the forefront of the new sound, hate the "progressive" label.
"It's unhealthy to label anything - all music should be progressive," says
Guerilla's press agent Marion Sparks. A&M marketing man Richard Marshall,
meanwhile, reckons that the labelling of the new movement is essential
because "name tags are a necessary evil: they articulate the style to the
masses".
 But, as usual, it all comes down to money, and selling loads and loads
of records. So British-dub-disco ("progressive house" if you must) is
about to hit the mainstream in a major way. The current "massive" tune is
David Bowie's latest single, Jump They Say, as remixed by DJs and
producers Leftfield. Now thats progress...

  _                                -SKY Magazine: May 1993.
 (_ )  ) (  ) _(            
 (  (_ (_) ( (_(




From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 19:19:53 1993
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From: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
Message-Id: <9305070215.AA25689@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com>
Subject: Good prices on sound system stuff (fwd)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Thu, 6 May 93 19:15:04 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0]
Content-Length: 2290

check this out:

From: martha@hpkslx.mayfield.HP.COM (Martha Lyons)
Newsgroups: ba.market.misc
Subject: Speakers/Amps/ Etc For Bands
Message-ID: <47560012@hpkslx.mayfield.HP.COM>
Date: 5 May 93 22:01:19 GMT
Organization: HP Response Center Lab
Lines: 41

******************************************************************************
		  Sound Reinforcement Equipment for Sale
  Suitable for filling a club, theater, or frat house with a
	  really big sound.  For use by a band, DJ or PA system.

Speakers

  [] Bear Bottoms (8) Bass Reflex cabinets each loaded with one JBL
	       E140 15 inch speaker $200 each.
  [] MH2's (4) Mid-High cabinets each loaded with two JBL E130 12 inch
	       speakers, and two JBL 2440 Horns $500 each.
  [] Community Light and Sound Front Loaded Bass Bins (2) Cabinets each
               loaded with one JBL E140 15 inch speaker $250 each.
  [] Altec Horns with 808B drivers in cabinets (2) $150 each.

Amplifiers & Electronics

  [] Crown PSA2's (3) $750 each.
  [] Custom 3-Way Crossover Limiter (1) Free as bonus with main speakers

Misc
  [] Amp Racks plywood with casters (2) $75 each.
  [] Gear Boxes (aproximately 2' x 2' x 2') with wheels (2) $75
  [] Speaker Cable (~600') $100
  [] AKG Tripod Mike stands (chrome) (1) $25 each.
  [] CV Lloyde 200' Splitter Snake (1) $400

  This is a current list of what we have on hand in terms of sound
  reinforcment equipment.  The mains speakers are all really nicely
  designed -- solid and have casters built into the cabinets for easy
  moving.  The equipment is located on the Peninsula if you want to
  come over some evening or weekend to look at it.  My home phone is
										 [415] 323-7171.   Nic/Martha

  
******************************************************************************
 Martha Lyons                     Hewlett Packard
 Tel:415-691-372                  Worldwide Response Center Lab
 Email:lyonsm@mayfield.hp.com     100 Mayfield Avenue, MS37MA
                                  Mountain View, Ca  94043
******************************************************************************


-- 
  Superhigh            \       bust a nut on a cloud 
 dit@sybase.com        /         and shout out loud.
  +vibes+             /	      We just feel happy - thats real     oh yeah....

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 21:10:21 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305070409.AA26254@netcom2.netcom.com>
Subject: robbie and scott (and jon and mike) on live 105
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Thu, 6 May 93 21:09:27 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

OK, color me amazed, but right now, on "the modern Mix", on local
artist night, Live 105 played a Very Cool (tm) song by "Hardkiss".

Is it true?

WHERE CAN I BUY IT?

it's awesome!

-H-


-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 						   howard@netcom.com
				Don't Crash
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

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From: zdross@ucdavis.edu
Date: Thu, 6 May 93 21:19:30 PDT
Message-Id: <9305070419.AA27372@dale.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

yes, I will try to be there this Sunday, so everyone come on down!

And Lee, if you bring the box and that music...music...music song, I will
declare you God for the day.  Right on!


Peace to the lot of you
Zak

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Thu May  6 22:15:05 1993
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To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: record pools
Date: Thu, 06 May 93 22:09:09 -0700
From: John William Gramata <easu252@orion.oac.uci.edu>


	Hello everyone.. I was wondering if anyone could help this
lowly DJ from the L.A. area.  I'm looking for two things.  First of
all I'm looking for the names of any good record pools (deep
house/trance pref.).  So far I have L.A. DJ (L.A.), and NET (N.Y.).
any additions to these would be greatly appreciated.  Second,  I'm
looking for the names and numbers of anywhere that has good deals on
mind machines (in the SF area), I haven't had much luck down here.

                            MUCH  THANKS !!!

                            ----->JOHN<-----
                         easu252@orion.oac.uci.edu

P.S.  Looking forward to the end of school and a nice TRIP up to the
      SF area ......

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 00:41:30 1993
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From: zephirus@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 00:38:15 -0700
Message-Id: <9305070738.AA09340@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: <<ATTORNEY WANTED>>

     Last night I was eagerly on my way to the FMR.
Unfortunately, do to an unfortuitous encounter with C.H.P. I
spent that night in detention for possession of MDMA. My
intentions were to have an evening of fun, spiritual
advancement, and love. Instead I was detained by people who
have no interest in any of those ideals or civil liberties
for that matter.
 
     The reason I mention my ordeal is that I am currently
searching for an attorney. If any of the SFRavers are
lawyers, and are interested in my case please contact me via
E-Mail (Zephirus@cats). I am not asking for donated legal
representation (Though it is quite welcome. As it stands I
will most likely be taking out loans to pay for my defense.
I am a student and not wealthy.) Above all, I am searching
for a good lawyer. In addition, if anyone can recommend a
lawyer, please do so.
 
     This incident took place on Highway 17 going from Santa
Cruz to Los Gatos. I was incarcerated at the Santa Clara
County Main Jail. I live in Santa Cruz. The trial will be in
Los Gatos on May 21st.
 
          Thank you so much for your support,
                                   Zephirus.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 08:07:12 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 08:04:53 -0700
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
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To: howard@netcom.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: robbie and scott (and jon and mike) on live 105

That was a killer song I must say so myself!!!!
Where can we obtain it if possible???

                     
         /\                       noah@cadence.com 
        <<>>      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  
    ((((noah))))  "if i can get higher than this, 
	<<>>       i don't want to know about it"---Terence McKenna   
	 \/       ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 09:44:32 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 1993 09:38:47 -0700
From: John M. Courte <jcourte@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305071638.AA04504@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: unsubscribe

Please unsubscribe me from the list.  It's been great lurking about and
finding out what the scene is like in SF and I'm going to be seeing quite a
few of you this summer, but my TELNET access is gone and until I get a new
setup, I'll be online for brief flashes at best. I'll still get a local
account and tell you all about Detroit happ'nins when I can.
peace
love
tech
-jcourte.

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 09:59:48 1993
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From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305071654.AA09360@jobe>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Question about dj's last Saturday at Wicked

the question is: Who played the set after Thomas last
Saturday at Wicked?  Was it Markie and Jeno after Markie,
or the other way round?

I was too busy dancing that I missed seeing both spinning :)

Thanks,

- Steve

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 10:02:05 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Fri, 7 May 1993 09:43:57 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-calendar@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: This week's RAVE guide

Hi gang!  Sorry in the delay, I was waiting for more flyers to come
in but none did... hope this gets to everyone on time.

Tonight is looking kinda dry, so I'd take it easy tonight and maybe
hit Splash! in the morning.  I wonder if the pool will be open - bring
your swimsuits just in case :)  Obsession could be cool tonight, but
caveats abound about DV8 so who knoz.  And there's never been a post
to the list about Mr. Baked Raindrop, so I can't tell ya what they're
like, other than they must have decent production for the promoters to
keep using that name for the past 6 months...

BTW I *think* Mission Rock is happening, it's worth checking out too.

That Straight-Up Funk deal looks QUITE good - and since the GG park
party is STILL being negotiated (next weekend is the target date for
getting it started - if you want to vent your anger about this call
your friendly neighborhood GG Park permit office), this may be your
only chance this weekend to hear music in the lovely spring weather...

Saturday night:  Groove Kitchen and Where the Wild Things Are are
both highly regarded events, with the younger crowd tending to go
to WTWTA and the older crowd to GK.  I usually prefer the music at
GK, but the lineup at WTWTA looks great too.

And even though there won't be a sunday-in-the-park party this weekend
(hell, I even got on the phone and started calling recreation departments
to see about getting a site w/ sound permits and all - no luck) there
will be a gathering of folx in Marx Meadows around 1 I guess, with 
boomboxes and sunshine who could ask for anything more?

Enjoy yourself :)

*****************************************************************************
UPCOMING RAVES IN THE SF/BAY AREA                     Last modified: 05/06/93
*****************************************************************************

Friday, May 7th - Obsession - Taking up the top two floors of DV8
	DJ's Harry Who, Ernie, Dante, Gavin, Markie, Mark Farina, Jan Cooley,
	Jon Williams, Alfie, Noel, Pete Avila, Neon Leon, and Simon
	Live House music by Dub Tribe - $15, 21+ - 415-266-9205

Friday, May 7th - Baked Raindrop
        Dutch  Ghost  Carlos
        $10 - call (415)995-2501

Saturday morning 4am-noon - Splash! - DJ's Scott Hardkiss, Tony, Felix,
	John Williams, James, and Aldo Bender - 278 11st Street, SF
	415-979-5880

Saturday, May 8th (afternoon) - Straight-up Funk	FREE!
	Carlos  Darwyn  James  Gavin  Ghost
	outdoor party, noon 'til whenever	415.371.9671	

Saturday, May 8th - Groove Kitchen - Big Heart City 21+
	415-267-3932 - dj's TBA

Saturday, May 8th - Where the Wild Things Are
	Buck  Josh  Mark Farina  Tony  Ernie  Noel
	415-979-8867    408-450-8537	916-558-4356

Saturday, May 8th - The World of Dr Splift
        Harry Who  Dutch  Carlos  Rick Preston
        408.236.3401   415.905.8885   510.464.5909

Thursday, May 13th - Lift - Jon Williams - Tony - Doran - Scott & Robbie
	basement of big heart city - 415-905-9629

Friday, May 14th - Chapter One - DJ's rick preston, harry who, carlos, shon
	408-450-3131	415-281-5914
	there will probably be an after party in some san jose park...

Saturday, May 15th - Earth Beat
        Buck  Tony  Doran  Markie Mark  Josh
        (415)995-2328

Saturday, May 22nd - Animation - (510) 247-2328

Saturday, May 29th - A Festival of Sound: Three tents to GET DOWN GET
	DOWN and one tent to get WICKED - indoors and outdoors - 
	All welcome to the re-unification of the scattered tribes

	DJ's (are you ready for this?)
	Harry Who	Spun		John Williams	Garth
	Pasta - Seattle	Josh		Carlos		Jeno
	Rick Preston	Dj Wool		Moonpup		Markie Mark
	Bam Bam		Ernie Munsen	Julius		Doc Marten
	Ghost		Eric Hill	Alfie		Barry Weaver
	Tony		James & Gavan (Tweakin')	James - sacramento
	Derek Carter & Mark Farina on 4 tables 		Live - DubTribe
	introducing: Mei-Lwun * Alonzo * Allan * Vicious V & Arturo
	
	408-496-1780 * 415-905-5917

Saturday, June 5th - Vortex - DJ's Josh, James, Markie, Buck, Ernie, & Tony

Friday, June 18th - Monday June 21st - Solstice - another Taste event, in the
	Utah desert.  If you're interested, send mail to solstice-request@
	slack.sim.es.com, with the word "SUB" in the body of the message.
	Buses from the Bay Area will be coordinated, with a most likely
	departure time of Thursday night and a return time of late Monday
	night.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

        People who want to send money, cards and other
        goodwill thoughts to Malachy can make checks payable to
        the:

                M. O'brian Healing Fund
                1388 Haight st #117
                San Francisco CA. 94112

        Also for the latest info on Mal you can dial

        (415) 241-1560.

        Every one's positive energy is DEFINITELY paying off.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Be-AT INFO LINE: 415-626-4087. This usually gives info 
about the raves coming up in the next couple of days.

More phone lines:
Feel the Trip: 415-905-9661
UP3 productions: 408-399-2611
408-296-1611 - 510-464-5999 - 916-558-3777

Also, Ameba Clothing can give info on raves.
415-750-9368, 1732 Haight St., San Fransisco
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here are some weeklies - whether or not they count as real "raves" is 
debatable, but they were advertised by fliers and the music could be
good. If anyone can provide reviews of them, i.e., their 
appropriateness in being on the list, let me know....

Fridays - Mission Rock - DJ's James and Gavin (from Tweekin Records)
	& others.  Outside dance floor. In China basin at 17th and Illinois.
	Phone  415-241-8862  	Visuals by Synergy (hi Tony!)

Fridays - ZANZIBAR - Deep house, acid jazz and garage.  DJ Josh.  (415)
        695-7887.  842 Valencia @ 19th St.

Fridays - Life @ the Sound Factory
        [4/2 - Doc Martin, London's Paul Oakenfold]
        525 Harrison @ 1st, SF    415.543.1300

Fridays - Berlin  10pm  55 Natom a (back of DV8)
        "Hard hitting bass sounds radiating rightious (sic) vibes
         for your brain"

Fridays at F/X - fresh with Rick Preston and friends
	400 south 1st street in San Jose - info: (408) 298-9796

Friday night/Saturday morning - Splash
     4am-12pm, Club O, 278 11th @ Folsom    FREE
     [may 1 - Mark Farina, Robbie Hardkiss, James, Gavan, Carlos]
     [may 8 - Scott Hardkiss, Tony, Jon Williams, Aldo Bender, James, Felix]

Saturday mornings - Family Dog - Info 415.266.8254
        Charter Oak warehouse - 3am-morning
	Ghost Tigger Ernie Nick
        (presented by Turtle Wax) 

Saturdays - Housing Project (after party) - 6am - 1pm 
	End Up 401 6th @ Harrison 21+ (Also Wednesdays 9pm-330am)

Saturdays - Deep House Sessions
	April 17 & 24 - Confluence: Eric Lacy  Jan Cooley  Garth  Jeno
	at the Groove Station  1141 Polk St  6-9 pm  FREE

Saturdays - Groove Kitchen - "Cookin' up some funky vittles"
	11pm - ? at 836 Mission - Info - 415-267-3932

Sunday mornings - Tilt-a-Whirl
        [april 18th - Robbie Hardkiss  Carlos  Bam Bam & others]
        6am - ?    18+     $5
        520 4th St @ Bryant (the Bridge/Trocadero)

Sundays - EndUp from 6am - 6th & Harrison

Sundays - AfterLIFE - six am till...  - 375 11th st * Dj Simon, Ernie *
	Bagels * Fruit Salad * Espresso * Smart Bar * Chill Room
	This week, Markie Mark 6-8:30am

Sundays - Boogie Buffet - Brought to you by Preston (groove kitchen et al.) 
	and Paul (afterLIFE) - Sunday Mornings at 1015 Folsom  
	6am until early afternoon. - Dancing downstirs, 
	Full breakfast cafe upstairs - Call 979-8845 for DJ lineup 

Sundays - Reunion (last Sunday of every month)
        Yahoo  Simon  Garth     10-6am  (707)323-4708

Sunday nights - Bulletproof boat party - 5-9pm pier 40 (boat embarks
        promply at 5) DJ's Scott & Robbie Hardkiss, Digs & Woosh, and others
        Tickets at both Bulletproof locations 629 Haight (255.7168)
        & upstairs at BPM  1141 Polk (567.8439)

Sundays - Team Green 
	3rd @ Harrison, 315 Harrison (City Nights), 21+ ID; Brought to 
	you by the people who promoted "Carefree", $8.00 admission.  
	Carefree alternative Style 

Sundays - flow at Nickie's (460 Haight)
        full house w/dj - 10pm-2am, 21+

Sundays - Zanzibar - 1pm-9pm - James, Gavin, and Felix playing a mix of House, 
	Funk and Rare Groove

Sundays, 3-7pm - Acid Jazz & Reggae Dancehall Connection - DJ's 
	Ivan, Rolo 1-3, Mind Motion, EFX, Ismael - Groove Station - 
	1141 Polk Street, SF

Sundays - Sunday Skool at Atlantis	5pm - 4am
	1st & Harrison 

Sunday night - Spundae (no relation to Spun, as far as I can tell)
        8pm - ?    Guest DJs + Henrick
        Natoma, between 1st and 2nd (probably 55 natoma, back of DV8)

Mondays - Pepper - Diff'rnt DJ's, notably Noel, Josh and Buck - 
	Don's Different Duck on lower Haight.

Mondays - House Coffee - DJ Stefan blends house grooves
        all ages, 115 4th St, Railroad Square. (Hot Spots)
        546-8665

Mondays - Pepper.Deep House with Buck, Josh, Chris Lum & Guests. 668
	Haight, 10-2AM, $3, 21+. "Tis a very merry, dancing, drinking, 
	laughing, quaffing, and untinking time" -- John Dryden. (the 
	oldest rave quote i've seen so far....)

Tuesdays - Together - Thomas  Simon  Garth  - Basement of Big Heart City
	415-979-8825

Tuesdays - ZANZIBAR - House.  DJ Andy.  (415) 695-7887.
        842 Valencia @ 19th St.

Wednesdays - Housing Project - 9-330am @ 401 6th st / harrison
	guest dj's ernie munson, jeno, josh, garth - 21+

Wednesdays - This Old House - Zanzibar - 842 Valencia, SF
	Jan Cooley  Neon Leon  Bam Bam 		10pm - 2am, $4

Wednesdays - Circus (was Rise) 
	Spun, Rick Preston  visuals by Donovan	(408)292-7464
	Toons - 52 E.Santa Clara at 2nd, SJ - 21+  free before 10

Thursdays - Deep Space - 200 N. 1st Street, SJ - 21+ - 408-345-2386
	Two dance floors - DJ's have included: Spun, Garth, Thomas,
	Risk Preston, Harry Who, and more.  Free before 9:30pm

Thursdays - ZANZIBAR - Acid jazz and house.  DJ Suki.  (415) 695-7887.
        842 Valencia @ 19th St. 21+

Thursdays - Primal - Tribal, Techno, and trance - Dj's Lewis and 
	Bryan Hughes - 9th and Harrison

Thursdays - Dog House (presented by Family Dog)
	"The Underground Comes to the Peninsula" (!)
	8-2am  261 California Ave, Burlingame	21+

Thursdays - VIRGIN MARY - bringing back the LOVE - with always holy & 
	consistent DJs garth, jan cooley, dutch, larry jr. - 2000 K street
	SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA - 21 & over, 10:00 pm

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONNECTION 2 TAPES are still available from Bob Ramstad,
boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com.  It's a 4-tape set, with music by
Moonpup, Scott Hardkiss, Jon Drukman, Lee, and Blurrrr - the tapes are
$20, plus $5 shipping (unless you pick it up in person) $5 of which
goes to the Malachy O'Brien trust fund.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

RADIO SHOWS: 

(Need info for: Friday and Saturday nights on 106.1, 107.7, and 105.3 -
	if you know the names and tiumes of the shows, give me a buzz...)

Tuesdays (early Wednesdays actually) - 12:45 - 3:30am, 90.7 KALX (Berkeley) - 
	fellow sfraver Mescalina "Tune in for acid indigestion and 
	other ailments"

Wednesdays, 10pm, KFJC, Foothill College (Santa Clara)

Thursdays, 7-9 on 91.3 FM KCPR San Luis Obispo - Beyond Techno, with
	DJ EZ Whip.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

If anyone has info on any other events, submit them! I can't possibly hope
to get all the info every week. 

Brian Behlendorf

bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-request@soda, owner-sfraves@soda, etc.


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 10:12:59 1993
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	id aa09941; Fri, 7 May 93 10:06:32 PDT
To: howard@netcom.com
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Howard Berkey's message of Thu, 6 May 93 21:09:27 PDT <9305070409.AA26254@netcom2.netcom.com>
Subject: robbie and scott (and jon and mike) on live 105
From: Desi the Three-Armed Wonder Comic <jondr@sco.com>
Sender: jondr@sco.com
Date: Fri, 7 May 93 10:04:47 PDT
Message-Id:  <9305071004.aa18616@scotty.sco.COM>

howard berkey sez:

>OK, color me amazed, but right now, on "the modern Mix", on local
>artist night, Live 105 played a Very Cool (tm) song by "Hardkiss".
>
>Is it true?

I can't vouch for the truth of the matter - you heard it; I didn't.

>WHERE CAN I BUY IT?

BPM Music Factory, of course!

>it's awesome!

what did you expect from a record that is co-written and -produced by
The UVC?

Noah Ruiz adds:

>That was a killer song I must say so myself!!!!
>Where can we obtain it if possible???

See above.

BTW, the subject line is erroneous.  Mike didn't do any work on the
12".  It was Jeff & myself.

Now, which version did they play, eh?

Jon Drukman (in stereo where available)                         jondr@sco.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you want to touch the sky, just put a window in your eye.           - Coil

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 10:16:09 1993
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	id aa09957; Fri, 7 May 93 10:07:33 PDT
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-calendar@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: Brian Behlendorf's message of Fri, 7 May 1993 09:43:57 -0700 <9305071643.AA03438@soda.berkeley.edu>
Subject: This week's RAVE guide
From: Desi the Three-Armed Wonder Comic <jondr@sco.com>
Sender: jondr@sco.com
Date: Fri, 7 May 93 10:05:38 PDT
Message-Id:  <9305071005.aa18621@scotty.sco.COM>

The incredible Vitamin B sez:

>Tonight is looking kinda dry, so I'd take it easy tonight and maybe
>hit Splash! in the morning.  I wonder if the pool will be open - bring
>your swimsuits just in case :)

The pool will *not* be open.

/j/

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 10:53:48 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 09:40:53 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305071641.AA04338@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, uunet!orion.oac.uci.edu!easu252@uunet.uu.net
Subject: Re: record pools

On mind machines, High Times magazine had a good review of most or all of
the good ones sometime in the last year/year-and-a-half.  It had locations,
addresses, etc.  I might even have that one if you can't fine it.

-Mark

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 10:54:25 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 10:03:55 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305071704.AA03520@jimi.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

     >Last night I was eagerly on my way to the FMR.
>Unfortunately, do to an unfortuitous encounter with C.H.P. I
>spent that night in detention for possession of MDMA. My

Bummer.  Would you mind telling the story?  I'm sure there is
a lesson to be learned and I think all would agree it's a relevent
topic.  If none of the 250+ people on the list refer you to a
lawyer firsthand, my friends' dad is a lawyer for the rights of
handicaped people and he gives out referels to her friends all the
time to his friends in criminal.  So much that she gets a little
embarrased but he's cool so he doesn't trip.

-Mark

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 10:55:19 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 10:53:07 -0700
Message-Id: <9305071753.AA19941@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Dante (NYC) at Mission Rock

If you missed Tilt-A-Whirl last Sunday (like I did) here's another
chance to hear N.Y.'s finest, along with Tweekin' Records stalwart
Gavin, tonight at the Mission Rock.

The location is 817 China Basin, just north of 17th and Illinois, east
of 3rd St.

See you there!

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 11:10:01 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 11:06:14 -0700
Message-Id: <9305071806.AA21495@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: This week's RAVE guide

The redoubtable Wonder Comic sez:

> The incredible Vitamin B sez:
> 
> >Tonight is looking kinda dry, so I'd take it easy tonight and maybe
> >hit Splash! in the morning.  I wonder if the pool will be open - bring
> >your swimsuits just in case :)
> 
> The pool will *not* be open.

I guess that would make tonight drier still -- if it weren't for
Mission Rock!

Don't take it easy tonight, get down outdoors under the full-ish moon
and the fresh bay breeze (no fog machine...)!

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 11:14:05 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 11:10:15 PDT
From: rpcaras@srv.pacbell.com (Bob Carasik)
Message-Id: <9305071810.AA17432@zeus.srv.PacBell.COM>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, winston@lurnix.com
Subject: Re: record pools


My mailtool alleges that Mark said:

> On mind machines, High Times magazine had a good review of most or all of
> the good ones sometime in the last year/year-and-a-half.  It had locations,
> addresses, etc.  I might even have that one if you can't fine it.
> 
> -Mark
> 
I got that article too and bought the IM-1 machine that they rate highly.
I've been pretty happy with it, both for relaxation/sleep induction and as
cheap passive entertainment.  Worth it, for a tech toy.

AstroBoy

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 11:28:29 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 13:37:51 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305071737.AA05997@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Sunday at the Park

I'll be there, assuming I survive Saturday night :). I think I'll
bring my camping pad so I can doze off ...


Sean

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 13:21:40 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 1993 13:18 PST
From: YOUR FRIEND MIKE <MROMO@scuacc.scu.edu>
Subject: park park park
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <62A16C20C000644A@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu"

Hey you all, even if you are not going out this weekend, get up and
go to the park this sunday.  I cannot make it to the lunches, and it would
be great to have a nice SFraves sort of sunday dealie...

music music music
(damn!)

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 14:26:38 1993
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Message-Id: <9305072120.AA21145@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: {GET DOWN} ^ 2 && *WICKED++ == ??
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 07 May 93 09:43:57 PDT."
             <9305071643.AA03438@soda.berkeley.edu> 
Date: Fri, 07 May 93 14:20:37 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>

|Saturday, May 29th - A Festival of Sound: Three tents to GET DOWN GET
|	DOWN and one tent to get WICKED - indoors and outdoors - 
|	All welcome to the re-unification of the scattered tribes
|
|	DJ's (are you ready for this?)
|	Harry Who	Spun		John Williams	Garth
|	Pasta - Seattle	Josh		Carlos		Jeno
|	Rick Preston	Dj Wool		Moonpup		Markie Mark
|	Bam Bam		Ernie Munsen	Julius		Doc Marten
|	Ghost		Eric Hill	Alfie		Barry Weaver
|	Tony		James & Gavan (Tweakin')	James - sacramento
|	Derek Carter & Mark Farina on 4 tables 		Live - DubTribe
|	introducing: Mei-Lwun * Alonzo * Allan * Vicious V & Arturo
|	
|	408-496-1780 * 415-905-5917


Hey! I won free tickets to this on KFJC 89.7 during "Belladonna"'s
show! (10-2 wed night). She'll be giving away another set of tickets on
her show next week so listen in.

I hope it's going to be good. If not, at least it'll be free. Anybody 
have any details? Location?

Also, Jon and Mike and Jeff will be pleased to know that "Belladonna"
played "the trip" on her show and said it was by "local band
ultraviolet catastrophe". 

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 16:10:18 1993
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Message-Id: <m0nrb6D-0009UPC@theporch.raider.net>
From: clee@theporch.raider.net (Chris Lee)
Subject: DJ Transformer effect
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Fri, 7 May 1993 17:41:00 -0600 (CDT)
Cc: nm-list@reef.cis.ufl.edu, ne-raves@silver.lcs.mit.edu,
        manchester@irss.njit.edu, so@theporch.raider.net
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Length: 922       

I'm looking for a way to create the "DJ Transformer" effect using a midi
trigger and some off-the shelf hardware for my techno music compositions.
This effect is similar to that DJs achieve by rapidly flipping their input
toggle switch from phono to line and back...sort of a "chopper" effect.
I'd like to be able to sync it thru midi... I though of using a drum machine
and a noise gate in some combination...
anyone have any ideas?
Thanks
Chris (aka anode)
-- 
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
  Chris Lee              Macintosh Consulting,      America Online: chris136
  PO Box 22621        Graphics,Interface Design,      Compu$erve: 73247,2402
  Nashville,TN 37202        Digital Audio        clee@theporch.raider.net
    "and the skies always had little fluffy clouds in them..." - THE ORB
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 16:28:35 1993
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Message-Id: <9305072313.AA12462@appseq>
Date: Fri, 7 May 93 23:13:10 GMT
From: Garry Payton-McDowall <gpaytonm@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: "Sylvie Leotin "'s message of Fri, 7 May 93 16:00:14 PDT <9305072300.AA14978@wrpyr.us.oracle.com>
Subject: Fwd: This week's RAVE guide


Hello there,

someone here at work forwarded this to me - is it possible to put me
on your mailing list?

My name's Garry.

This userid should do the trick,

gpaytonm@us.oracle.com

Have a great weekend - excellent newsletter by the way.

Cheers,

Garry

-------------------- Beginning of Forwarded Message --------------------
 Date: Fri, 7 May 93 16:00:14 PDT
 From: "Sylvie Leotin " <sleotin@us>
 Original-To: pamitche gpaytonm mgilmore



 just thought you might enjoy this .....		

	 Sylvie :)


 *******************************************************************************
 Sylvie Leotin * Oracle Applications Process and Release * (415) 506-2119



 ---- Included Message ----

 Received: 05-07-93 14:59                         Sent: 05-07-93 14:58 
 From: jcarrion.US1
 To: SLEOTIN
 Subject: Fwd: This week's RAVE guide
 Reply-To: jcarrion






 ---- Included Message ----

 Received: 05-07-93 13:27                         Sent: 05-07-93 13:26 
 From: WRPYR:bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu
 To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu sfraves-calendar@soda.berkeley.edu 
 Subject: This week's RAVE guide
 Reply-To: WRPYR:bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu
 X-Mailer:  Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)


 Hi gang!  Sorry in the delay, I was waiting for more flyers to come
 in but none did... hope this gets to everyone on time.

 Tonight is looking kinda dry, so I'd take it easy tonight and maybe
 hit Splash! in the morning.  I wonder if the pool will be open - bring
 your swimsuits just in case :)  Obsession could be cool tonight, but
 caveats abound about DV8 so who knoz.  And there's never been a post
 to the list about Mr. Baked Raindrop, so I can't tell ya what they're
 like, other than they must have decent production for the promoters to
 keep using that name for the past 6 months...

 BTW I *think* Mission Rock is happening, it's worth checking out too.

 That Straight-Up Funk deal looks QUITE good - and since the GG park
 party is STILL being negotiated (next weekend is the target date for
 getting it started - if you want to vent your anger about this call
 your friendly neighborhood GG Park permit office), this may be your
 only chance this weekend to hear music in the lovely spring weather...

 Saturday night:  Groove Kitchen and Where the Wild Things Are are
 both highly regarded events, with the younger crowd tending to go
 to WTWTA and the older crowd to GK.  I usually prefer the music at
 GK, but the lineup at WTWTA looks great too.

 And even though there won't be a sunday-in-the-park party this weekend
 (hell, I even got on the phone and started calling recreation departments
 to see about getting a site w/ sound permits and all - no luck) there
 will be a gathering of folx in Marx Meadows around 1 I guess, with 
 boomboxes and sunshine who could ask for anything more?

 Enjoy yourself :)

 *****************************************************************************
 UPCOMING RAVES IN THE SF/BAY AREA                     Last modified: 05/06/93
 *****************************************************************************

 Friday, May 7th - Obsession - Taking up the top two floors of DV8
	 DJ's Harry Who, Ernie, Dante, Gavin, Markie, Mark Farina, Jan Cooley,
	 Jon Williams, Alfie, Noel, Pete Avila, Neon Leon, and Simon
	 Live House music by Dub Tribe - $15, 21+ - 415-266-9205

 Friday, May 7th - Baked Raindrop
	 Dutch  Ghost  Carlos
	 $10 - call (415)995-2501

 Saturday morning 4am-noon - Splash! - DJ's Scott Hardkiss, Tony, Felix,
	 John Williams, James, and Aldo Bender - 278 11st Street, SF
	 415-979-5880

 Saturday, May 8th (afternoon) - Straight-up Funk	FREE!
	 Carlos  Darwyn  James  Gavin  Ghost
	 outdoor party, noon 'til whenever	415.371.9671	

 Saturday, May 8th - Groove Kitchen - Big Heart City 21+
	 415-267-3932 - dj's TBA

 Saturday, May 8th - Where the Wild Things Are
	 Buck  Josh  Mark Farina  Tony  Ernie  Noel
	 415-979-8867    408-450-8537	916-558-4356

 Saturday, May 8th - The World of Dr Splift
	 Harry Who  Dutch  Carlos  Rick Preston
	 408.236.3401   415.905.8885   510.464.5909

 Thursday, May 13th - Lift - Jon Williams - Tony - Doran - Scott & Robbie
	 basement of big heart city - 415-905-9629

 Friday, May 14th - Chapter One - DJ's rick preston, harry who, carlos, shon
	 408-450-3131	415-281-5914
	 there will probably be an after party in some san jose park...

 Saturday, May 15th - Earth Beat
	 Buck  Tony  Doran  Markie Mark  Josh
	 (415)995-2328

 Saturday, May 22nd - Animation - (510) 247-2328

 Saturday, May 29th - A Festival of Sound: Three tents to GET DOWN GET
	 DOWN and one tent to get WICKED - indoors and outdoors - 
	 All welcome to the re-unification of the scattered tribes

	 DJ's (are you ready for this?)
	 Harry Who	Spun		John Williams	Garth
	 Pasta - Seattle	Josh		Carlos		Jeno
	 Rick Preston	Dj Wool		Moonpup		Markie Mark
	 Bam Bam		Ernie Munsen	Julius		Doc Marten
	 Ghost		Eric Hill	Alfie		Barry Weaver
	 Tony		James & Gavan (Tweakin')	James - sacramento
	 Derek Carter & Mark Farina on 4 tables 		Live - DubTribe
	 introducing: Mei-Lwun * Alonzo * Allan * Vicious V & Arturo

	 408-496-1780 * 415-905-5917

 Saturday, June 5th - Vortex - DJ's Josh, James, Markie, Buck, Ernie, & Tony

 Friday, June 18th - Monday June 21st - Solstice - another Taste event, in the
	 Utah desert.  If you're interested, send mail to solstice-request@
	 slack.sim.es.com, with the word "SUB" in the body of the message.
	 Buses from the Bay Area will be coordinated, with a most likely
	 departure time of Thursday night and a return time of late Monday
	 night.

 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

	 People who want to send money, cards and other
	 goodwill thoughts to Malachy can make checks payable to
	 the:

		 M. O'brian Healing Fund
		 1388 Haight st #117
		 San Francisco CA. 94112

	 Also for the latest info on Mal you can dial

	 (415) 241-1560.

	 Every one's positive energy is DEFINITELY paying off.

 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Be-AT INFO LINE: 415-626-4087. This usually gives info 
 about the raves coming up in the next couple of days.

 More phone lines:
 Feel the Trip: 415-905-9661
 UP3 productions: 408-399-2611
 408-296-1611 - 510-464-5999 - 916-558-3777

 Also, Ameba Clothing can give info on raves.
 415-750-9368, 1732 Haight St., San Fransisco
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Here are some weeklies - whether or not they count as real "raves" is 
 debatable, but they were advertised by fliers and the music could be
 good. If anyone can provide reviews of them, i.e., their 
 appropriateness in being on the list, let me know....

 Fridays - Mission Rock - DJ's James and Gavin (from Tweekin Records)
	 & others.  Outside dance floor. In China basin at 17th and Illinois.
	 Phone  415-241-8862  	Visuals by Synergy (hi Tony!)

 Fridays - ZANZIBAR - Deep house, acid jazz and garage.  DJ Josh.  (415)
	 695-7887.  842 Valencia @ 19th St.

 Fridays - Life @ the Sound Factory
	 [4/2 - Doc Martin, London's Paul Oakenfold]
	 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF    415.543.1300

 Fridays - Berlin  10pm  55 Natom a (back of DV8)
	 "Hard hitting bass sounds radiating rightious (sic) vibes
	  for your brain"

 Fridays at F/X - fresh with Rick Preston and friends
	 400 south 1st street in San Jose - info: (408) 298-9796

 Friday night/Saturday morning - Splash
      4am-12pm, Club O, 278 11th @ Folsom    FREE
      [may 1 - Mark Farina, Robbie Hardkiss, James, Gavan, Carlos]
      [may 8 - Scott Hardkiss, Tony, Jon Williams, Aldo Bender, James, Felix]

 Saturday mornings - Family Dog - Info 415.266.8254
	 Charter Oak warehouse - 3am-morning
	 Ghost Tigger Ernie Nick
	 (presented by Turtle Wax) 

 Saturdays - Housing Project (after party) - 6am - 1pm 
	 End Up 401 6th @ Harrison 21+ (Also Wednesdays 9pm-330am)

 Saturdays - Deep House Sessions
	 April 17 & 24 - Confluence: Eric Lacy  Jan Cooley  Garth  Jeno
	 at the Groove Station  1141 Polk St  6-9 pm  FREE

 Saturdays - Groove Kitchen - "Cookin' up some funky vittles"
	 11pm - ? at 836 Mission - Info - 415-267-3932

 Sunday mornings - Tilt-a-Whirl
	 [april 18th - Robbie Hardkiss  Carlos  Bam Bam & others]
	 6am - ?    18+     $5
	 520 4th St @ Bryant (the Bridge/Trocadero)

 Sundays - EndUp from 6am - 6th & Harrison

 Sundays - AfterLIFE - six am till...  - 375 11th st * Dj Simon, Ernie *
	 Bagels * Fruit Salad * Espresso * Smart Bar * Chill Room
	 This week, Markie Mark 6-8:30am

 Sundays - Boogie Buffet - Brought to you by Preston (groove kitchen et al.) 
	 and Paul (afterLIFE) - Sunday Mornings at 1015 Folsom  
	 6am until early afternoon. - Dancing downstirs, 
	 Full breakfast cafe upstairs - Call 979-8845 for DJ lineup 

 Sundays - Reunion (last Sunday of every month)
	 Yahoo  Simon  Garth     10-6am  (707)323-4708

 Sunday nights - Bulletproof boat party - 5-9pm pier 40 (boat embarks
	 promply at 5) DJ's Scott & Robbie Hardkiss, Digs & Woosh, and others
	 Tickets at both Bulletproof locations 629 Haight (255.7168)
	 & upstairs at BPM  1141 Polk (567.8439)

 Sundays - Team Green 
	 3rd @ Harrison, 315 Harrison (City Nights), 21+ ID; Brought to 
	 you by the people who promoted "Carefree", $8.00 admission.  
	 Carefree alternative Style 

 Sundays - flow at Nickie's (460 Haight)
	 full house w/dj - 10pm-2am, 21+

 Sundays - Zanzibar - 1pm-9pm - James, Gavin, and Felix playing a mix of House, 
	 Funk and Rare Groove

 Sundays, 3-7pm - Acid Jazz & Reggae Dancehall Connection - DJ's 
	 Ivan, Rolo 1-3, Mind Motion, EFX, Ismael - Groove Station - 
	 1141 Polk Street, SF

 Sundays - Sunday Skool at Atlantis	5pm - 4am
	 1st & Harrison 

 Sunday night - Spundae (no relation to Spun, as far as I can tell)
	 8pm - ?    Guest DJs + Henrick
	 Natoma, between 1st and 2nd (probably 55 natoma, back of DV8)

 Mondays - Pepper - Diff'rnt DJ's, notably Noel, Josh and Buck - 
	 Don's Different Duck on lower Haight.

 Mondays - House Coffee - DJ Stefan blends house grooves
	 all ages, 115 4th St, Railroad Square. (Hot Spots)
	 546-8665

 Mondays - Pepper.Deep House with Buck, Josh, Chris Lum & Guests. 668
	 Haight, 10-2AM, $3, 21+. "Tis a very merry, dancing, drinking, 
	 laughing, quaffing, and untinking time" -- John Dryden. (the 
	 oldest rave quote i've seen so far....)

 Tuesdays - Together - Thomas  Simon  Garth  - Basement of Big Heart City
	 415-979-8825

 Tuesdays - ZANZIBAR - House.  DJ Andy.  (415) 695-7887.
	 842 Valencia @ 19th St.

 Wednesdays - Housing Project - 9-330am @ 401 6th st / harrison
	 guest dj's ernie munson, jeno, josh, garth - 21+

 Wednesdays - This Old House - Zanzibar - 842 Valencia, SF
	 Jan Cooley  Neon Leon  Bam Bam 		10pm - 2am, $4

 Wednesdays - Circus (was Rise) 
	 Spun, Rick Preston  visuals by Donovan	(408)292-7464
	 Toons - 52 E.Santa Clara at 2nd, SJ - 21+  free before 10

 Thursdays - Deep Space - 200 N. 1st Street, SJ - 21+ - 408-345-2386
	 Two dance floors - DJ's have included: Spun, Garth, Thomas,
	 Risk Preston, Harry Who, and more.  Free before 9:30pm

 Thursdays - ZANZIBAR - Acid jazz and house.  DJ Suki.  (415) 695-7887.
	 842 Valencia @ 19th St. 21+

 Thursdays - Primal - Tribal, Techno, and trance - Dj's Lewis and 
	 Bryan Hughes - 9th and Harrison

 Thursdays - Dog House (presented by Family Dog)
	 "The Underground Comes to the Peninsula" (!)
	 8-2am  261 California Ave, Burlingame	21+

 Thursdays - VIRGIN MARY - bringing back the LOVE - with always holy & 
	 consistent DJs garth, jan cooley, dutch, larry jr. - 2000 K street
	 SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA - 21 & over, 10:00 pm

 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 CONNECTION 2 TAPES are still available from Bob Ramstad,
 boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com.  It's a 4-tape set, with music by
 Moonpup, Scott Hardkiss, Jon Drukman, Lee, and Blurrrr - the tapes are
 $20, plus $5 shipping (unless you pick it up in person) $5 of which
 goes to the Malachy O'Brien trust fund.

 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 RADIO SHOWS: 

 (Need info for: Friday and Saturday nights on 106.1, 107.7, and 105.3 -
	 if you know the names and tiumes of the shows, give me a buzz...)

 Tuesdays (early Wednesdays actually) - 12:45 - 3:30am, 90.7 KALX (Berkeley) - 
	 fellow sfraver Mescalina "Tune in for acid indigestion and 
	 other ailments"

 Wednesdays, 10pm, KFJC, Foothill College (Santa Clara)

 Thursdays, 7-9 on 91.3 FM KCPR San Luis Obispo - Beyond Techno, with
	 DJ EZ Whip.

 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 If anyone has info on any other events, submit them! I can't possibly hope
 to get all the info every week. 

 Brian Behlendorf

 bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-request@soda, owner-sfraves@soda, etc.


-------------------- End of Forwarded Message ------------------------

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 17:40:22 1993
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From: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
Message-Id: <9305080036.AA10707@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com>
Subject: GK DJ lineup
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Fri, 7 May 93 17:36:16 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0]
Content-Length: 81

Sat May 8th:
Pete (is this Pete Avila?)
Adonis
Ernie Munson
Jeno

dit@sybase.com

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 18:09:03 1993
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From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9305080104.AA11534@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: DJ Transformer effect
To: clee@theporch.raider.net (Chris Lee)
Date: Fri, 7 May 93 18:04:56 PDT
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: <m0nrb6D-0009UPC@theporch.raider.net>; from "Chris Lee" at May 7, 93 5:41 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

> This effect is similar to that DJs achieve by rapidly flipping their input
> toggle switch from phono to line and back...sort of a "chopper" effect.
> I'd like to be able to sync it thru midi... I though of using a drum machine
> and a noise gate in some combination...

I've done this using a drum machine and noise gate, a Symetrix SG200.
It's easy.  The noise gate has trigger inputs that open up the gates.
I use a drum sound, like a tom or something as the trigger, and use
a sequencer to control the drum pattern.  Because it's a two-channel
noise gate, I can create this effect in stereo, completely controlled
via MIDI.  Hope this helps.

Happy triggering,
-leg of eel

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 18:57:12 1993
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Date: Fri, 7 May 93 18:53:47 PDT
From: nineball@remarque.berkeley.edu (9ball)
Message-Id: <9305080153.AA12109@remarque.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Addendum to Rave List


Here's one I didn't see on this weeks list.

The 5,000 Magic Fingers of Dr. J
Saturday May 8, 1992

Tickling your mind and tingling your spine
in a Central SF Location
With the magic fingers of
Carlos  Curb  Dutch
From NY's underground
Zagnut
Spinning 'till dawn
415.281.5641

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 19:05:26 1993
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To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
From: inhuman@mindvox.phantom.com (Inhuman)
Comments: Feed Your Head
Message-Id: <73k83B7w165w@mindvox.phantom.com>
Date: Fri, 07 May 93 22:07:29 EDT
In-Reply-To: <9305071704.AA03520@jimi.lurnix.com>
Organization: [Phantom Access] / the MindVox system

winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie) writes:

> Bummer.  Would you mind telling the story?  I'm sure there is
> a lesson to be learned and I think all would agree it's a relevent
> topic.  If none of the 250+ people on the list refer you to a

        Curious as I am to the circumstances, I would highly reccomend 
that you NOT share your story with us until your case has gone to trial.

Michael                         |  "I've begun to wonder if we wouldn't
(inhuman@mindvox.phantom.com)   |   also regard spelunkers as desperate
                                |   criminals if AT&T owned all the
...trance form...trance send... |   caves."   --John Perry Barlow

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May  7 19:36:14 1993
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From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305080233.AA23693@jobe>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Obsession number not in service?

I tried the number given for Obsession and got a recording saying
it was out of service.  Any idea when it starts???

- Steve

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May  8 09:21:11 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305081523.AA08692@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: C II tapes



	I can't stop listening to my C II tapes, they are really great
	I can see that I missed a lot of good music (I slept through much
	of the actual event :)  For those of you who have friends who need
	the fix and you can't get to bob, they have them at Tower Records
	in Mountain View for $24.95.  Mellissa say's that she has already
	sold 7 sets!, She plays it on the floor and people come in and 
	want to know "what kind of music is that?" (mostly los altos house-
	wives(husbands) and silicon vally engineer types)

	Does anybody have a playlist that they can send me? I missed the
	posts when/if it came through.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
 AT&T:Phones with Big Brother Inside, Just say "NO" to the Clipper wiretap chip!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From sfraves-request@medisg.stanford.edu  Sat May  8 13:13:42 1993
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From: Max Enrique Sequeira Garza <al160184@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Message-Id: <199305082008.AA37392@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Subject: Re: banana!!
To: derek@ocf.berkeley.edu (Derek Yu)
Date: Sat, 8 May 1993 14:08:16 +22335737 (CST)
In-Reply-To: <199305080836.AA03067@headcrash.berkeley.edu> from "Derek Yu" at May 8, 93 01:36:37 am
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Hy D!
>
> what's banana??
> you mean smoking banana peels..
     Yep!!

> i always thought that was a flase myth..  it works?????

    It shure does. Here goes the recipe!

    1.- Take 10-12 normal bananas and peel 'em.
    2.- Take a knife and for each peal slice shred off the inner white fiber
that the peal has.
    3.- After doing this you have a bunch of white fibers which you have to put
in a pot with a little water added and heat this. When it starts to boil, drain
the liquid and keep heating this. Repeat the draining a couple of times (this
is just to take the liquid off the fiber... not to cook it!).
    4.- Then you will have a mass of brownish fibers which you spread on a
cookie tray *or somethin' like that) and put it on a preheated 200F oven. Put
the tray as far from the flame as posible... the idea is to accelerate the
drying process. Leave it there for about 15-20 min. then turn of the oven, and
leave it there for about an hour or so, so it finishes drying off.
    5.- Scrape it all off the cookie tray and enjoy!!!

    It's kinda mild (take a lot), but i guess you're gonna like it!

            Share and enjoy...
              |     MAX
              |
              |
              -------------> Feel free to repost it to the sfraves, since it's
                             always good to kinow there's still legal natural
                             stuff you can do (and in your own kitchen!!!).

From sfraves-request@medisg.stanford.edu  Sat May  8 13:40:46 1993
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From: Max Enrique Sequeira Garza <al160184@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Message-Id: <199305082021.AA35340@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Subject: Re: banana!!
To: cspot@cats.ucsc.edu (Chris.Hilker)
Date: Sat, 8 May 1993 14:21:23 +22335737 (CST)
Cc: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu
In-Reply-To: <9305082017.AA04071@am.ucsc.edu> from "Chris.Hilker" at May 8, 93 01:17:21 pm
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>
> Testimony to the power of suggestion and the placebo effect. Don't waste
> your time.

    I hate placebo stuff (smart drinks)... when i tried this i thought it would
be too, but it's not quite a placebo... why not try it and then tell  me your
opinion???

> C.

        MAX

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May  8 13:59:20 1993
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Message-Id: <9305082054.AA12608@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: KQED raves?

Just saw a promo on KQED for what might be a really interesting
program, this Monday at 9 pm.  It's called "Dancing", and is an
in-depth look at the role of dancing in various societies around
the world (how society dictates how people dance, the function of
dance in everyday life, etc.)  They showed short clips of many
different types of dancing, (ballroom, African, Eastern European)
including about 1/2 second of some people at a rave!  Oddly, the
voice-over said "...to new-age rock'n'roll" over that shot... 

I hate to recommend people do anything to their TV aside from
killing it, but there's a chance this might be pretty good.
Sort of a "comparative religion" approach towards dancing.
Those with an eye for the "deeper meaning" of what we're doing
(Geoff, Robert J., etc.) should try to catch it.

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May  8 14:12:06 1993
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From: "Oz Lubling" <ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Message-Id: <9305082102.AA08929@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Subject: BLISSS! 
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu (San Francisco Raves)
Date: Sat, 8 May 93 17:02:21 EDT
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Forwarded message:
From ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu Sat May  8 15:45 EDT 1993
From: "Oz Lubling" <ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Message-Id: <9305081926.AA07532@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Subject: BLISSS!
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu (NorthEast Rave List)
Date: Sat, 8 May 93 15:26:28 EDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

BLISSS!

OK, guys, this was the best rave ever in the history of ravekind!!!!
:):):)
The vibe was amazing!
So many good smiles and happy dancers
All the people that were there were dancing.
The whole thing started with Michael Joly who performed
an amazing ambient live set
The videoprojector was the best ever in the history of videokind!!!!!
Showing ORb`s Textures and Patterns... Absolutely AWESOME!!!
Most people missed that...
I`m sorry for them
:)
Donutz Spun great house
Then Laura spun an intelligent hard set
Lasers came on
One red and one green
OHHHH shit!!!!
Hope everybody enjoyed themselves (Why am I saying this?
I KNOW everybody was spacing out!!!!

HAtata
Urbo is the way to go!!
See you all at Frosted Rave!!!
We are again destined to create ravehistory
The world is transforming
And I`m spacing out
My question is QUEST
Hello

Chill, 
APPLEPIE


-- 
                            ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu                         
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
T	e	c	h	n	o	H	e	a	d
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May  8 14:12:11 1993
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From: "Oz Lubling" <ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Message-Id: <9305082102.AA08937@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Subject: BLISSS! (Part II) 
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu (San Francisco Raves)
Date: Sat, 8 May 93 17:02:44 EDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Forwarded message:
From ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu Sat May  8 16:30 EDT 1993
From: "Oz Lubling" <ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Message-Id: <9305081939.AA07690@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Subject: BLISSS! (Part II)
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu (NorthEast Rave List)
Date: Sat, 8 May 93 15:39:18 EDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


Ok, since ApplePie did not want to write about himself, I have to!
Apple came on at 11:30 after laura..  He started the set with some
progressive house...  More people were flowing in by the minute..
By the stage, the ne-raves posse was flying high, dancing and grooving
to the sound...  The set progressed into some fucking awesome, chilled
out, urbo HARD TRANCE!!!  The best records known to man, were played
one after another in a progression leading all of us to heaven.  
I had an advantage over most people, because I recognized every 
track, and could not stop moving for 2 hours....  By 12:30, the
dance floor was packed with people... flying between the 
laser and enormous video screen... tranceformed by the fax sounzzz...
and then at 1:00 came my favorite part, the cybernetic BREAKCORE
EXPERIENCE....   All the way from Rabbit City to Frankfurt in 
30 minutes of intense breakbeats and extremely crazy, stoopid, PHAT,
fresh, and URBO mixing...(thanks arnold)....
For Christ sake, we even got the Brandeis people out of their fucking
chairs... They could not listen to this music while sitting down...

To sum up,  the vibe was awesome, the crowd was great, and thanx to
everyone who came: vanessa, tina, jesse, polida, mike, J P 3,
laura, darren, donato, john adams & sava, and the rest know
who you are....

hope to see you at QUEST,
oz
p.s. BLISSS! 2, coming soon....

-- 
                            ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu                         
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
T	e	c	h	n	o	H	e	a	d
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


-- 
                            ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu                         
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
T	e	c	h	n	o	H	e	a	d
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May  8 15:50:29 1993
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From: zephirus@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Sat, 8 May 93 15:45:40 -0700
Message-Id: <9305082245.AA07979@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: thanks


     I would like to thank you all for the sympathy and the
referrals. It is good to have support in a situation like
this. I have decided that it would be best if I did not talk
about the details of what happened or comment on them in any
way until after the trial. My charge is not terribly serious
and I will not go to jail. It is more of a hassle than
anything. Never the less it is really easy to get depressed
in these circumstances and it is really nice to turn on the
computer and find so many kind words and so much help. Thank
you!
                         God love you,
                              Zephirus.

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May  8 16:25:52 1993
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Date: Sat, 8 May 93 16:19:50 -0700
From: salsbury@netcom.com (The Butterfly)
Message-Id: <9305082319.AA22282@netcom.netcom.com>
To: al160184@academ07.mty.itesm.mx
Cc: derek@ocf.berkeley.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: Max Enrique Sequeira Garza's message of Sat, 8 May 1993 14:08:16 +22335737 (CST) <199305082008.AA37392@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
Subject: banana!!

		  Copied w/o permission from "Sex and Drugs"
			   by Robert Anton Wilson,
			      (c) 1973,1987,1988
				   (p.175)

BANANAS: The "electric banana" or "mellow yellow" fad of the late 1960s, in
which some people claimed to get high by smoking banana skins, is now
generally regarded as a hoax -- an attempt to make antidrug laws escalate into
total insanity by forcing the government to ban bananas. Actually, some banana
skins contain serotonin, a drug which is similar in structure to the
psychedelics, and might mutate while being burned. If so, this effect is
unpredictable and may depend on other factors (e.g., the ripeness of the
banana, or the temperature at burning, etc.) since the majority who tried this
experiment reported no result at all.

			      +++++++++++++++++
	...sorry to burst any bubbles. It seems to be a mainly placebo effect.
Supposed to taste really horrible, too, according to a former housemate of
mine who tried it years ago.

Pat
______________________________Think For Yourself_______________________________
		   Patrick G. Salsbury <salsbury@netcom.com>
		1800 Market Street #23, San Francisco, CA 94102
			   Voicemail: 415/703-7177
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   Thinking for yourself can be painful. It is easier to follow the lead of
 popular people than to think for oneself and make one's own decision; but the
	people one chooses to follow may not have accurate information.
                                                -Nadja Adolf <nadja@node.com>

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May  8 19:59:54 1993
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Date: Sat, 8 May 93 19:53:20 -0700
From: Michael Ginn <ginn@flamingo.stanford.edu>
Message-Id: <9305090253.AA15901@bittern.Stanford.EDU>
To: zephirus@cats.ucsc.edu
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: zephirus@cats.ucsc.edu's message of Fri, 7 May 93 00:38:15 -0700 <9305070738.AA09340@am.ucsc.edu>
Subject: <<ATTORNEY WANTED>>


I know a really good criminal lawyer: Tom Mueller (408) 292-2434.  I
think he primarily covers the county you were in, which is important.
A friend of mine got into trouble and this guy was much more competent than
the others he dealt with.

I'd be interested in hearing details of what happened (eg. what
precautions are in order) and how it goes.  I'd especially like to
know if this guy's number's changed...

Good luck with it,

---Michael

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May  8 22:04:45 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Sat, 8 May 1993 21:55:33 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Dante's Inferno

Dante took the crowd at Mission Rock to a screaming frenzy last night.  He
was really really impressive, bleding dub/acid stuffat the beginning to
airy house towards the end.  He may play at a couple more places before he
leaves on Thursday, so I DO suggest you check him out (I'll post if I find out 
where)

        Brian

From sfraves-request@medisg.stanford.edu  Sun May  9 02:15:05 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305090910.AA14706@netcom2.netcom.com>
Subject: Hardkiss song pt.2
To: jondr@sco.com, sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu
Date: Sun, 9 May 93 2:10:44 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Well, live 105 is playing the Hardkiss song again (but once again, no
mention of song name or mix).  I really like it.  Jon, you guys all did a
primo job on this one.  

Whats funny is that Live 105 is the first place I've heard it.
Granted, I haven't been getting out as much as I'd like, but I'm
hardly a hermit either.  Has anyone else heard the song I'm talking
about?  (that is, has anyone else heard the Hardkiss song _and_ heard
it played around town?)

I assume Robbie, Scott and Gavin play it.  	:-)

-H-

p.s.  Jon... did you DJ this (saturday) morning?  How was Splash?

See everyone in the park!


-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 			new .sig:		   howard@netcom.com
I see a great need.       alt.config yin/yang	   Nope, won't carry it here.
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  9 04:22:06 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305091116.AA19092@netcom2.netcom.com>
Subject: LIFE
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Sun, 9 May 93 4:16:38 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

(from the calendar)

Fridays - Life @ the Sound Factory
        [4/2 - Doc Martin, London's Paul Oakenfold]
        525 Harrison @ 1st, SF    415.543.1300


Last Friday Gunther and Debbie (his S.O./girlfriend/she-Gunther/better
half/whatever) went to this and his one-line review was
"Danger...Danger Will Robinson".  They spent most of the time people
watching. 

Bad vibe, bad music, funny drunken stories...

Two highlights they mentioned were:
First this buff dude had his girlfriend sit and hold his drink while
he flashed his washboard belly at drunk club-women.  An argument
started when she no longer wished to do this.  Debbie was more than
slightly amused by this dude.

So then club-girlfriend splits and club-dude proceeds to dance.  High
Volume club-woman (nice way to say 'rotund') proceeds to 'dirty dance'
with dude, leaning back and grinding, then leaning farther back and so
on.  Unfortunately she had too much to drink, or extended herself
beyond her center of gravity, or both, as she proceded to fall on her
dirty dancing booty.

Our hero and heroine decided to leave at this point.

So, what _worthwhile_ has happened there lately?  Gun said it was nice on the
inside... 

-H-

-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 			new .sig:		   howard@netcom.com
I see a great need.       alt.config yin/yang	   Nope, won't carry it here.
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  9 09:06:08 1993
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Date: Sun, 9 May 93 08:43:13 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305091543.AA00254@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, howard@netcom.com
Subject: Re: LIFE and WICKED


> Last Friday Gunther and Debbie (his S.O./girlfriend/she-Gunther/better
> half/whatever) went to this and his one-line review was
> "Danger...Danger Will Robinson".  They spent most of the time people
> watching. 
> 
> Bad vibe, bad music, funny drunken stories...


Well I think we will attempt an EXORCISM on May 22!

WICKED will indeed be at the sound factory that saturday so it will be
interesting.

If I know Jeno,Garth, Thomas and Markie, with the type of legendary sound system
that the sound factory has, they'll try to demolish the place.

I can't wait to see these club-kids' minds explode when Jeno gets a hold
of them :)

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  9 10:10:41 1993
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Date: Sun, 9 May 93 09:35:19 PDT
From: alves@bethe.ucdavis.edu (David Alves)
Message-Id: <9305091635.AA06216@bethe.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: radio shows


I would like to second the calendars request fro radio show info on 106.1, 
107.7, and 105.3 - I never hear anything except (I guess) their usual 
formats.

Dave

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  9 10:58:27 1993
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Message-Id: <9305091753.AA25624@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: Dante's Inferno

Brian sez:

> Dante took the crowd at Mission Rock to a screaming frenzy last night.  He
> was really really impressive, bleding dub/acid stuffat the beginning to
> airy house towards the end.  He may play at a couple more places before he
> leaves on Thursday, so I DO suggest you check him out (I'll post if I find
>out 
> where)

Not only that, but he just played a mind-melting ambient set in the
basement of Groove Kitchen last night (I'm still trying to get my brain
to resolidify).  Simply incredible.

Synergy Visuals were there in the basement too, those guys are
outdoing themselves every time out.  They really lived up to their
name last night.

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  9 12:20:29 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Sun, 9 May 1993 12:09:41 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White), sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu,
        howard@netcom.com
Subject: Re: LIFE and WICKED

Ack... I think this is a bad move, as I think it'll only increase the alcohol
element at Wicked which has been my biggest problem with it all along :(

        Brian

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Date: Sun, 9 May 1993 12:28:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Lee An <lee@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: C2 playlist (fwd)
To: sfraves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305091258.C1932-a100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


oops...  in my haste, i left out a song.  here's my set again, with the
correction. i hope nobody went and labeled their sets in indelible ink. :)

6. Ddagger

Moonpup (17 min)

Lee (22 min)
  The Good Men			Give It Up (remix)
  Unomas			Escuchar
  Zeony Lee Experience		Love Energy
  Soul Sacrifice		Sacrifice Dub
  Paradise 3001			Beautification


7. Forall

Lee (45 min)
  Sublime			<white label--released before The Theme>
  Double FM			Sound of Amnesia (remix)
  La Camorra			Te Quiero
  Aquastep			Carousel (remix)
  Sound Clash Republic		Not For Sale
  Lion Rock			Lion Rock
  K&M				Funk and Drive
  African Juice			Love Me (uk dub mix)
  Original Rockers		Push Push (remix)
  Deja Vu			Never Knew the Devil


btw, "remix" here means not only that the song is a different version of
the original, but that it's on a different record as well.

lee


From sfraves-request@medisg.stanford.edu  Sun May  9 17:14:06 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu
Subject: Test


Just testing.

C.

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  9 17:44:51 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: For the Seattle posse

Did anyone in the Northwest crew go to the Rave Called Sharon up
in Seatlle last night?  If so, can you post or drop me note on how it
went?  I have a friend who really wants to know how it came off.

Thanks,

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  9 17:44:58 1993
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Date: Sun, 9 May 93 17:22:01 -0700
Message-Id: <9305100022.AA19941@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Blast from the Past

You SFR old-timers will appreciate this -- at Boogie Buffet this
morning I ran into an old friend of ours, Eden (DJ El Dorado), who
spun at our first picnic and Connection I!

He asked how everyone was doing...  he's throwing a party in Santa
Cruz on Wednesday, June 9th.  The party doesn't have a name yet, but
it will be at 1121 Soquel Ave.  The info number is (408) 425-UJIV.

If anyone wants to say 'hi', Eden's number is (408) 438-6623.

p e a c e,

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May  9 19:00:44 1993
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Date: Sun, 9 May 93 18:52:51 -0700
From: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Message-Id: <9305100152.AA27307@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Raving on,  with the best of them...

Greetings fellow ravers...

  I survived yet another weekend of total rave mania.   Hit the Groove
kitchen first,   danced until it got shut down,   then moved over to
the Boogie Kitchen and raved some more.    I talked to a lot of people
to get an idea of how many have PC's and are on-line,   and I am
surprised at how many there are.    Most on Netcom,  lots from the
Universities,  and ALL are interested in keeping big brother out
of our faces.

  This was the first rave I have outlasted,  WITHOUT DRUGS!!   But
lots of coffee over at Boogie Kitchen.    GREAT PLACE!!  I recommend
it highly.

  Craig Larson is now back from the HUGE rave in the UK,  and was
showing the videos at Boogie Kitchen this morning.    I noticed the
Brits dance to faster music than we do,   is this a typical difference?

  Anyway,  (Yawn!!) I'm now in Zombie mode,   so gonna grab the last
batch of mail and shut down till next rave weekend.

  So,  how was the Wild Things rave up in Marin?   We were thinking of
making that one,   but since I already drove from Santa Cruz to groove
at the GK,   than I had to driva all the way back to drop Craig off,
then get back home to Fremont.   Returned by 6pm.    WOW!!  Whotta
All-nighter.....  I even skipped by health club workout,   after dancing
for more than 12 hours.... 

Rave on..

Crunch

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 00:23:37 1993
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From: cvoigt@flute.calpoly.edu
Message-Id: <9305100715.AA36222@flute.calpoly.edu>
Subject: party and law stuff
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 00:15:37 -0800 (PDT)
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Hey everybody!

I wanted to get some info from anyone out there who might know about
this.  I am thinking about having a little party in the future and in
talking to friends equipment that people want to bring could be fun
(lasers, stuff to spin with etc.) So my question is this: If the cops
came whats needs to be said to keep everything under control.  Revlevant
info: I wont be taking money from my friends and things s/b small (50 or
so humans).  After reading a post a couple of weeks ago where someone
was having what i think was a similar thing had there 1200's taken :(
which is massivly uncool and I would like to benifit from anyone's
experience to keep things going smoothly.  Either post on the net our
private which ever ya all feel is best.

C.H.E.

remenber: It's not how high you are its "Hi!! how are you?" :)

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 01:02:24 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 00:54:58 -0700
From: Derek Yu <derek@ocf.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199305100754.AA13680@lightning.berkeley.edu>
To: alves@bethe.ucdavis.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  radio shows

every Sat. night at midnight on 105.5 they play Modern Mix...  its from 12-3
and it has some good techno stuff on it..
they used to play some hot techno at around the same time on KMEL 106.1, but
they have stopped for the past 2 weeks..  don't know what's going on with that.


**********DEREK************



From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 01:04:28 1993
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Date: Sun, 9 May 1993 23:05:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott Everett Swiger <scottie@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Sender: Scott Everett Swiger <scottie@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Reply-To: Scott Everett Swiger <scottie@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: straight up funk and beyond?
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Cc: Whit Goodson <whitsitt@uclink.berkeley.edu>,
        Leah Reich <diva@uclink.berkeley.edu>,
        Brian Behlendorf <bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305092325.A21538-d100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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I went to "Straight Up Funk" last Sat. in Daly City, and what went on
there affected me enuf that I felt I had to post something about it
(although I've been on sfraves for a few weeks now, I've been content to
observe...until now).  If anyone else was there, I'd like to hear
your impressions of the party - here are mine (as briefly as I can :).

Although it was supposed to start at noon, lugging equipment by hand and
wheelbarrow down a cliff postponed things til about 3, and people starting
accumulating soon after.  From then until we left, around 7:30, I had a
great time (I'm basically convinced house music can be appreciated much
better out in the sun than some smoke-filled crowded "house" :).  But just
as we were getting ready to scale the cliff, we noticed a guy up on the
hillside with his pants around his ankles, grabbing his crotch and yelling
something like, "come and get it, bitch," to someone below.  This was
fairly disturbing, but we then noticed one of his friends (I think)
attacking another guy, punching him in the face and siccing his dog on him
until a woman stepped in and managed to stop him.  I don't remember seeing
any of these guys around until this happened, and it seemed pretty clear
to me they were starting something just for the sake of starting it.

Before I say anything about this incident, there's a 2nd part to add: we
came back around midnight, and to be blunt, someone accosted (I won't
presume his intentions) one of our female friends when she went to the
bathroom in the bushes.  She was able to run back to the party unharmed,
but how she will deal with what happened, and what this implies for the
well-being of the scene are hardly trivial matters.

I think I have some idea now what people mean about becoming _truly_ concerned
about an issue when it affects you directly - hearing about shootings and
fights and sexual harassment (or maybe this sounds more familiar: "He
was high, he wasn't thinking straight," or "He didn't _mean_ anything by it!"
or "What's the problem, the girl can always say no!") at raves is
worrisome and frightening, but you're can't really understand it til you
or someone close experiences it.

Both of the incidents I described were first-time occurrences for me, and
for them to happen at what had promised to be a trouble-free, enjoyable
event for all is pretty ironic, I guess.  I feel safe in assuming the guys
at fault here are more than just "outsiders" to the rave scene.  I hate to
make that insider/outsider distinction, but by outsiders I just mean people
whose motives for raving are, say, less than positive, caring,
respectful, etc., people who don't know why the scene began and what it
means to people that truly support it, people who cause stuff like this to
happen.  The question to me is then, do we try to "educate" such people,
maybe by setting some sort of positive example?  By the way those guys
acted, I would tend to say no, better to strengthen the existing "rave
population" before we try to draw in the masses (or "untuned," as the
Merry Pranksters would put it :). 

How to strengthen the scene, then?  (I hope I don't sound utterly
omniscient and dictatorial here, I don't mean to be, and if I'm missing
the point in any way, clue me in)  Once again, I don't believe the scene
should be based around exlusivity, but I feel that when promoting anything (50
people on a beach or 5,000 in a warehouse), _some_ distinction should be
made between people who will boost the party vibe and those who won't. 
Obviously, you can't do this club-style ("What's that, a flannel shirt? 
Sorry, don't think so."), but hopefully by how you promote your event and
what sort of party you throw.  This idea leads to a powerful argument for
smaller, "community"-type events - look what happened at Toon Town New
Years 1991: 7,000+ people, alcohol served, of course there'll be fights.  

I don't think I have any particular point here, and I'm sure this talk is
nothing new to a lot of you, but I do feel that as the "rave" scene
(buzzword alert!) as it is progressing (good argument for regressing too,
though :) right now is not going to do anything but bloat and be further
co-opted by mainstream culture (well on its way already).  I guess my
point is that to stop that from happening, or to provide an alternative to
that, we have to start thinking in new terms about what "raving" means,
what a "rave" can or cannot be, and what direction we want to take this
thing we've created (sounds like a _really_ bad sci-fi movie to me :).  To
do this means maybe we can't recreate the scene circa 1991/2, or that
we can't and shouldn't try to "clean up" the massive events to please us. 
Maybe it means our definition of "rave" should change.  The early SF
undergrounds provide a lot of good examples of how the scene can remain
pure and positive - why not use them as examples, but take the party
further, higher?

With that in mind, some friends and I formed the Mother Earth Sound System
around late February, and threw our first outdoor party at the Berkeley
Marina in early March.  We're trying to explore some of the possibilities
opened up by the FMRs, the DIY ethic, and the wonders of Mother Nature. 
What better way to keep spirituality and love in the scene than to put
people in a beautiful location with good music?  (Personally, I'll take
the rain, wind, mushy dancing, and sticky oranges of C2 over the usual $20
laser-fest any day :)  

Size isn't really the issue, though.  The last FMR w/ 400 (?) people
proves that (wish I'd been there).  We're small right now cuz we're
spreading our message the hard way: "we're having a party, tell a friend" 
At least this way we've got a pretty good idea of what kind of party we'll
have.  No voice-mail or 4-color flyers, thanks but no thanks.

Anyway, if you've been faithful enough (or maybe masochistic enuf) to get
this far, you'll might be interested to know that we've got gatherings
scheduled (hopefully) for late May and (definitely) for summer.  We'll
keep you all posted, but in the mean time, if you're interested in helping
us in ANY WAY, please get in touch with us.  We can use anything,
especially a generator at this point (we have sound system and DJs, but
people that can "do stuff" are welcome (I dislike the audience-performer
separation)).

Feel free to email me (or via sfraves to allow public discussion) or call
me at 510.549.6253.

OK, you've suffered enough.

peace,

			   s  c  o  t  t  i  e

			MOTHER EARTH SOUND SYSTEM   

 			>>>respect your mother<<<


From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 02:50:31 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 02:38:15 -0700
From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305100938.AA07562@jobe>
To: alves@bethe.ucdavis.edu, derek@ocf.berkeley.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  radio shows

> Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 00:54:58 -0700
> From: Derek Yu <derek@ocf.berkeley.edu>
> 
> every Sat. night at midnight on 105.5 they play Modern Mix...  its from 12-3
> and it has some good techno stuff on it..
> they used to play some hot techno at around the same time on KMEL 106.1, but
> they have stopped for the past 2 weeks..  don't know what's going on with that.
> 
I wish I also knew of more stations around here that will play good
techno.  106.5 used to play pretty fast techno from midnight til 1am
Sunday nights.  They stopped that.  105.3 plays techno from 9pm til
9:30~9:45 weeknights.  The only time I heard 106.1 Sat. nights I was 
really impressed, and that's unfortunate if they have stopped that as
well.  106.1 also played techno Friday nights past midnight, but they
interrupted the music a lot and that was pretty frustrating.

- Steve
> 
> **********DEREK************
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 04:53:17 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 12:46:34 BST
Message-Id: <24709.9305101146@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Geoff White's message of Sat, 8 May 93 08:23:45 PDT <9305081523.AA08692@nexsys.nexsys.net>
Subject: Re: C II tapes


  Geoff> 	Does anybody have a playlist that they can send me? I
  Geoff> missed the 	posts when/if it came through.

Here is the partial playlist I put together from the setlists that
some of the DJs posted (plus the partial setlist that Jon Drukman
started doing for Moonpup's set...)  Hope it helps, but it'd be real
nice if someone could get round to filling in the gaps...


	Cosmic Roy

-----------------------

1. Circle

Scott Hardkiss (43 min)


2. Bullet

Scott Hardkiss (12 min)

Jon Drukman (unmixed) (31 min)
  Meat Beat Manifesto		I Got The Fear (Without Jack)
  The Shamen			Boss Drum (Twitch)
  Lemon Interupt		Minniapolis (Twitch)
  JFK				Here They Come Again (Brutal Mix)
  Sonic Solution		On The Move


3. Sharp

Jon Drukman (43 min)
  Eden Transmission		I'm So High
  Up Above The World		Straight Up Caffeine
  High Lonesome Sound System	Champion Sound
  Metropolis			Metropolis (analog)
  Outdance			Pump The Jumpin' (Deco Mix)
  Coco Steel and Lovebomb	You Can't Stop The Groove (Twitch)
  Shakedown Productions		Alhambra (Twitch)
  The Grid			Crystal Clear (Trimar Mix)
  Electrotete			I Love You (remix)
  Intermix			Monument (Twitch)
  Mental Cube			Q (Santa Monica Mix)
  High Lonesome Sound System	Testimonial

Moonpup (1 min)


4. Flat

Moonpup	(44 min)
?
  Coco Steel & Lovebomb		Feel It
  Jay Dee			Plastic Dreams
  Liberty City			Some Lovin'
  Jay Dee			Plastic Dreams
?
  DHS				Holophonic Sound
?
  TZ4
?
  Paradise Organisation		Prayer Tower
?
  280 West			Scattered Dreams
  LNR				Work It To The Bone
...


5. Dagger

Moonpup	(39 min)


6. Ddagger

Moonpup (17 min)

Lee (22 min)
  The Good Men			Give It Up
  Unomas			Escuchar
  Zeony Lee Experience		Love Energy
  Soul Sacrifice		Sacrifice Dub
  Paradise 3001			Beautification


7. Forall

Lee (45 min)
  Sublime			<white label--released before The Theme>
  Double FM			Sound of Amnesia
  La Camorra			Te Quiero
  Aquastep			Carousel (remix)
  Sound Clash Republic		Not For Sale
  K&M				Funk and Drive
  African Juice			<b-side of Congo Bongo>
  Original Rockers		Push Push
  Deja Vu			Never Knew the Devil


8. Exists

BLURrrr	(45 min)
  Monumental			Geera
  Organs Musical Clocks
    and Boxes			Still
  Transform			Transformation
  House Pimps			Zulu Nation
  Dance 2 Trance		Power of American Natives
  Blood Runs Dry		All of Your Mind
  Mukkaa			Buruchacca
  Dr. Atomic			Schudelfloss
  Robin S			Show Me Love






From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 05:29:00 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 13:23:23 BST
Message-Id: <25399.9305101223@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Roy Badami's message of Mon, 10 May 93 12:46:34 BST <24709.9305101146@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
Subject: Re: C II tapes



  Geoff> 	Does anybody have a playlist that they can send me? I
  Geoff> missed the 	posts when/if it came through.

  Roy> Here is the partial playlist I put together from the setlists
  Roy> that some of the DJs posted (plus the partial setlist that Jon
  Roy> Drukman started doing for Moonpup's set...)  Hope it helps, but
  Roy> it'd be real nice if someone could get round to filling in the
  Roy> gaps...


Oops, that'll teach me to post before I finish reading my mail.  I've
broken one of the new sfraves rules already :-)

Ok, here it is again, with Lee's updates.  Sorry for the wasted
bandwidth...

	Cosmic Roy


------------------


1. Circle

Scott Hardkiss (43 min)


2. Bullet

Scott Hardkiss (12 min)

Jon Drukman (unmixed) (31 min)
  Meat Beat Manifesto		I Got The Fear (Without Jack)
  The Shamen			Boss Drum (Twitch)
  Lemon Interupt		Minniapolis (Twitch)
  JFK				Here They Come Again (Brutal Mix)
  Sonic Solution		On The Move


3. Sharp

Jon Drukman (43 min)
  Eden Transmission		I'm So High
  Up Above The World		Straight Up Caffeine
  High Lonesome Sound System	Champion Sound
  Metropolis			Metropolis (analog)
  Outdance			Pump The Jumpin' (Deco Mix)
  Coco Steel and Lovebomb	You Can't Stop The Groove (Twitch)
  Shakedown Productions		Alhambra (Twitch)
  The Grid			Crystal Clear (Trimar Mix)
  Electrotete			I Love You (remix)
  Intermix			Monument (Twitch)
  Mental Cube			Q (Santa Monica Mix)
  High Lonesome Sound System	Testimonial

Moonpup (1 min)


4. Flat

Moonpup	(44 min)
?
  Coco Steel & Lovebomb		Feel It
  Jay Dee			Plastic Dreams
  Liberty City			Some Lovin'
  Jay Dee			Plastic Dreams
?
  DHS				Holophonic Sound
?
  TZ4
?
  Paradise Organisation		Prayer Tower
?
  280 West			Scattered Dreams
  LNR				Work It To The Bone
...


5. Dagger

Moonpup	(39 min)


6. Ddagger

Moonpup (17 min)

Lee (22 min)
  The Good Men			Give It Up (remix)
  Unomas			Escuchar
  Zeony Lee Experience		Love Energy
  Soul Sacrifice		Sacrifice Dub
  Paradise 3001			Beautification


7. Forall

Lee (45 min)
  Sublime			<white label--released before The Theme>
  Double FM			Sound of Amnesia (remix)
  La Camorra			Te Quiero
  Aquastep			Carousel (remix)
  Sound Clash Republic		Not For Sale
  Lion Rock			Lion Rock
  K&M				Funk and Drive
  African Juice			Love Me (uk dub mix)
  Original Rockers		Push Push (remix)
  Deja Vu			Never Knew the Devil


8. Exists

BLURrrr	(45 min)
  Monumental			Geera
  Organs Musical Clocks
    and Boxes			Still
  Transform			Transformation
  House Pimps			Zulu Nation
  Dance 2 Trance		Power of American Natives
  Blood Runs Dry		All of Your Mind
  Mukkaa			Buruchacca
  Dr. Atomic			Schudelfloss
  Robin S			Show Me Love







From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 06:18:08 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 14:04:43 BST
Message-Id: <26166.9305101304@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu,
        ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
In-Reply-To: "Oz Lubling"'s message of Sat, 8 May 93 17:02:44 EDT <9305082102.AA08937@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
Subject: Re: BLISSS! (Part II) 


>>>>> On Sat, 8 May 93 17:02:44 EDT, "Oz Lubling" <ol@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu> said:

  Oz> The set progressed into some fucking awesome, chilled out, urbo
  Oz> HARD TRANCE!!!  The best records known to man, were played one
  Oz> after another in a progression leading all of us to heaven.  I
  Oz> had an advantage over most people, because I recognized every
  Oz> track, and could not stop moving for 2 hours....

So what _are_ the best records known to man....?  (IYHO, of course...:-)
Inquiring minds need to know...


Rave on,

	Cosmic Roy

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 07:03:40 1993
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <9305101356.AA06097@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: ClubRave(tm)
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 6:56:03 PDT
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.05.9305092325.A21538-d100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>; from "Scott Everett Swiger" at May 9, 93 11:05 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


Hello Scottie -

 My sympathies for your efforts! Also - I wouldn't mind attending one of
your "parties" in the near future ; it sounds like you have the right
attitude!


[ And, to SFRaves in general ] 

 Re: Negative antisocial/antipersonel behaviour at raves : I've been  
thinking recently that a "membership-only" setup with ID tags ( like a
convention ) might discourage random interloping troublemakers , empower
the promoter to enforce "membership behaviour guidelines" ( for 
example , 'members will refrain from harassing others ', 'members will 
refrain from fighting at club events' ), and concentrate the kind and 
sincere ravers together at special members/guests only raves.

 Tables could be set up at raves , and a potential ClubRave (tm) :-) 
member could get an application card . She gets the card stamped every
time she goes to a rave that has a ClubRave table - when she gets some
magic number of stamps ( 4, 5 ? ), she qualifies for a full membership.
To join full-up , and application with ID check would be completed ,
for the ClubRave files.

 A ClubRave member would get ClubRave event info via phone tree or snailmail
or email. S/he would be allowed to bring guests. ClubRave members would 
pool their $$ together to hold events. I don't see why a member couldn't 
be younger than 18/21 . 

 The issue of selling "single event memberships" ( which would legally
be tickets by any other name , methinks ) would have to be resolved. It
may put ClubRave events into a different legal/permit zone than a purely
members/guests only event.

 What do you guys think??? It's already obvious to me that it's an 
abusable idea , but that would depend on the implementation and the
implementors.   

				Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com
 
-- 

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 07:23:56 1993
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Message-Id: <9305101416.AA28720@jumbo.apple.com>
Date: 10 May 1993 07:17:54 U
From: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
Subject: FW: Wicked Ruined?
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Well wicked is most likely ruined for me.  Hey this is great way to ruin the
scene, bringing raves to a popular club where pretensious people normally go. 
Pretensious clubbers still go to alcohol induced raves but at least they had to
make an effort.  

I dont think that ravers can change a high volume club scene, I think its the
other way around its already happening.  

I went to the "Attitude Factory" last Friday with some friends and saw alot of
familiar faces, too bad I didnt see Gunther.  My feelings were the same as his.
It is gross.  However it is a really cool place with the different rooms the
absolute best computer graphics I have ever seen!  and great lasers and lights.
 The people were gross.  

I personally feel very betrayed and dissapointed with Wicked on this move. 
Hell why not continue to have it at King St. and limit the people that can go
in.  I know the place is small and have always made an effort to get there
early.  Now that it is at "DEATH" ( a more appropriate name than Life).  


Whats the situation on the King Street garage anyways, maybe somebody else can
take over thowing raves at that space.  I really liked the space I think it has
alot to do with making the parties fun because it was such a small hot place.

NUT

"Terribly dissapointed with Wicked"


From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 07:29:33 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 15:20:37 BST
Message-Id: <27586.9305101420@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: larryc@netcom.com
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Larry Ching's message of Mon, 10 May 93 6:56:03 PDT <9305101356.AA06097@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: ClubRave(tm)



  Larry>  Re: Negative antisocial/antipersonel behaviour at raves :
  Larry> I've been thinking recently that a "membership-only" setup
  Larry> with ID tags ( like a convention ) might discourage random
  Larry> interloping troublemakers

There's a "members dance club" which I sometimes see adverts for here
which operates a membership policy, presumably precisely for the
purpose of discouraging random interloping troublemakers.  I've never
been there, so I don't know how effective it is.  The way they seem to
work it is that they won't admit anyone to any of their events unless
you show them your membership card at the door.  Membership is open to
anyone, is completely free, and I think lasts for life _but_ there's a
24 hour lag between applying for membership and being issued with a
card.  Seems like quite a neat idea...


[Just a bit of context: here in the UK, we have the problem of our
rather arcane alcohol licensing laws.  Pubs are only licensed till
11pm, so around 11.30pm you get hoards of pissheads streaming out of
the pubs, and potentially causing trouble.  In addition, because
nightclubs are generally licensed till 2am (or later), you get an
element who just go along to a nightclub to find somewhere to carry on
drinking -- despite the exhorbitant bar prices.  This is perhaps at
least part of the reason why nightclubs often have dress codes -- it
means you have to decide in advance that you're going to go out
clubbing, rather than just going in on a whim...]


Rave on,

   Cosmic Roy

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 07:55:45 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 15:44:38 BST
Message-Id: <28033.9305101444@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: larryc@netcom.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Roy Badami's message of Mon, 10 May 93 15:20:37 BST <27586.9305101420@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
Subject: Re: ClubRave(tm)



  Roy> around 11.30pm you get hoards of pissheads streaming out of
  Roy> the pubs

After writing that, I wondered whether it'd be understood outside the
UK...  I'm never sure about the diffences between our languages...

"pissed" is slang for drunk, hence "pisshead".  I would say that the
former is not pejoritive, and the latter may or may not be, depending
on context...

Does this usage exist in the US ?

Peace,

	Cosmic Roy

From sfraves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 08:13:19 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305101503.AA14042@slack>
Subject: Re: ClubRave(tm)
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 09:03:29 -0600 (MDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
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> After writing that, I wondered whether it'd be understood outside the
> UK...  I'm never sure about the diffences between our languages...
> "pissed" is slang for drunk, hence "pisshead".  I would say that the
> former is not pejoritive, and the latter may or may not be, depending
> on context...
> Does this usage exist in the US ?

Only when we talk about getting drunk in the UK.

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 08:50:35 1993
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From: don@vestek.com (Don Labutay)
Message-Id: <9305101445.AA02460@vestek.com>
Subject: Re:  radio shows
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 7:45:54 PDT
In-Reply-To: <199305100754.AA13680@lightning.berkeley.edu>; from "Derek Yu" at May 10, 93 12:54 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0]

-> 
-> every Sat. night at midnight on 105.5 they play Modern Mix...  its from 12-3
-> and it has some good techno stuff on it..
-> they used to play some hot techno at around the same time on KMEL 106.1, but
-> they have stopped for the past 2 weeks..  don't know what's going on with that.
-> 
-> 
107.7 has replaced their techno show (aftershock) for their old school weekend
show.  That's too bad, they played good music and had great guest djs 
(Jeno, Ghost, EFX, Doc Martin).


Da watcher.

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 08:55:46 1993
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From: don@vestek.com (Don Labutay)
Message-Id: <9305101508.AA02516@vestek.com>
Subject: Re: Wicked Ruined (Not!)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 8:08:42 PDT
In-Reply-To: <9305101416.AA28720@jumbo.apple.com>; from "Stewart, Scott*" at May 10, 93 7:17 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0]

-> 
-> Well wicked is most likely ruined for me.  Hey this is great way to ruin the
-> scene, bringing raves to a popular club where pretensious people normally go. 
-> Pretensious clubbers still go to alcohol induced raves but at least they had to
-> make an effort.  
-> 
-> I dont think that ravers can change a high volume club scene, I think its the
-> other way around its already happening.  

Don't worry everybody.  If Wicked starts after 2:00am it will be o.k.  I've
been to Sound Factory a couple of times when they had raves after 2am, and
when it hits around 1-2am most of the clubbers leave, since there's no more
alcohol, and more ravers coming in, and taking over.

da watcher


From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 09:31:36 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 09:20:38 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305101620.AA29919@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com
Subject: Re:  FW: Wicked Ruined?

Hmmm...interesting view.  What I have seen happen with this party is that
many of the "old school" don't go anymore.  Why?  I dunno, everything from
the "change" in the crowd, to too many people.

Now the change is a fact.  The last few Wickeds that were in Townsend have
been a bit on the drunken side with fights happening more and more often.
This last time there were just TOO many people.  WIcked ALWAYS packs them in
but at some point there is a thing called overcrowding which is VERY uncool
and unsafe.  The fire marshall called the last one off.  I think that WICKED
should try to find a space that can accomodate their crowd.  Unfortunately
there aren't that many spaces in SF that can do so without alienating some
of their supporters.  Between a rock and a hard place.


I can tell you THIS much, MANY promoters wish they had WICKED's problems :)


From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 10:05:09 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 09:51:39 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305101651.AA08918@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Sunday Night Tilt-a-Whirl

Howdy gang, well Tilt-a-Whirl not only had a Sunday morning gig yesterday,
but also a Sunday night gig; whether or not this will be regular thing
remains to be see. However, I hope it will be as it is showing a lot of
promise; what it needs right now is more people; and they would be wise to
come as thee is good time to be had there.

New to Tilt-a-Whirl is a much improved sound system run by a cool guy named
bob, who, I am told also provided the same system for the recent FMR. He's
got two Crown 1200 wpc amps that power the mid range and high end cabinets
and one Crown 2400 wpc amp that drives his bass cabinets. he said he's
rebulit the crossovers and gates...Anyway sounds friggin great. Loud as shit
too... first time I went home with my ears ringing in a while.

On the music side, very interesting: Surge started it off adn laid down a
solid set. Next a surprise appearance by Chicago's Mark Farina was a real
treat; he's a really nice guy. Dutch showed up and also another dj I was
unfamilar with. The three of them proceeded do spin a 2-hour tag team set
that ended up really covering a lot of ground. interesting dynamic having
one dj throw out a couple tunes, have the next repsond to these and so on,
great variety. Following this, Goa Gill comes on, unplugs the turntables and
proceeds to spin :) ??? a set of fast Real Hard Shit, heacy percussive,
trancy 150bpm+ stuff  on two Sony DATmans. No pitch control so he's matching
beats in his head; a few awkward transitions but all in all a heavy sound
that got people moving in a hurry; totally different sound than I'm used to
hearing in sf. For $5 Tilt-a-Whirl continues to be a great value as Mark
(the promoter) keeps pulling great djs out of the hat. Now if more people
would start going it could eally get great...

Too, God was doing some live Video Toaster stuff which at times was really
killer.

Enjoyed seeing MykL and Neils there Hi guys :)...

peace, and let the good times rave!
nrg

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 10:58:29 1993
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From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305101712.AA06301@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: alves@bethe.ucdavis.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu,
        uunet!ocf.berkeley.edu!derek@uunet.uu.net
Subject: Re:  radio shows

Oh ya, I think they play house/techno on 105 on Tue., Wed., Thu., or some
combo of the three around 8 or 9 p.m.  Sorry if this is too nebulous but it's
a pointer.
-Mark

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 10:59:07 1993
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From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305101706.AA06289@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, uunet!bethe.ucdavis.edu!alves@uunet.uu.net
Subject: Re: radio shows

I don't think 107.7 does it anymore and 106.1 is on Friday and I think 
Saturday nights from 12:00 - 3:00 a.m. (After the Kink Tec Wake Up Show - 
Best hip-hop show in the area, IMO).  106.1 isn't as good as it used to
be.  You used to be able to switch back and forth from 106.1 to 107.7 and
back again as the music got slow or repetetive and it was great.  106.1 is
(Oh, I just noticed I spelled King in King Tec wrong, that's king, not kink)
more house now and tends not to be as good as it used to be, not because of
that but it just isn't as good.  Dj EFX is on a lot (every time?) and so
is Pete Avila with occasional guest djs.

-Mark

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 11:10:48 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 10:56:00 PDT
From: randyb@kalpana.com (Randy Bias)
Message-Id: <9305101756.AA26789@kalpana.com>
To: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  F M R

Brian said:

> From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
> Date: Thu, 6 May 1993 15:17:26 -0700
> Subject: F M R
> Status: R
> 
> 3) SOO much trash!  But it got cleaned up, most of it at least (and WHY is
> it standard to throw cigarrette butts on the ground?  Come'on, people! Those
> are SOOO hard to pick up and throw away :(   )

As one of the "smoking" ravers I find that sticking the butt of the cigarette
back in the pack of cigarrettes is easy to do and helps to avoid this
situation, *but* even though I'm a smoker I think I can safely say that the
average smoker does consider the world their trash can.  I know that's
inflammatory, but it's JMHO.

Take Care,

--Randy

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 12:15:31 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305101144.ZM18359@nmtvs313>
Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 11:44:12 -0700
In-Reply-To: ames!sybase.com!dit (Cutlass Supreme)
        "GK DJ lineup" (May  7,  5:36pm)
References: <9305080036.AA10707@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: ames!sybase.com!dit (Cutlass Supreme)
Subject: Re: GK DJ lineup
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Does anybody know how to get ahold of ernie munson?
I want to find out about possibly hiring him...thanks

*

From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 12:21:50 1993
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From: "Dana WATANABE" <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305101914.AA24154@mothra.nts.uci.edu>
Subject: Cops
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 12:14:00 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

you know i was thinking the other day
and it was really obnoxious and tiresome

but i came up with a kind of neat idea
a friend of mine goes and hangs out with cops on campus a lot
he goes on ride alongs and talks to them
when we through a dance type thing on campus
he asked them if it was okay and they said sure
when they stop by he is there, they recognize him
and dont really hassle us
and he really helped out the time they did get a little miffed
and threatened to arrest me

soo... it occurs to me
why dont we start going on ride alongs with cops
get to know them, hang out with them, whatever

two things get accomplished
1) you understand them better
2) they understand you better

so you know most of the cops in a certain area
they come to bust a rave that youre at/helping put on
and you say 'hey bob, howsit goin?'
'pretty good.. whats going on here?'
'me and my friends are just throwing a party..
nothing much going on.. just playing some music
some dancing and what not.. just hanging out. you know'
'thats cool.. im just gonna look around and make sure its safe'
'okay'
<look look> 'seems okay.. have fun!   you gonna be by the station this week?'
'dunno.. its finals week.. maybe next week'
'okay see ya round'



From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 12:51:17 1993
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Message-Id: <9305101934.AA17182@netcom.netcom.com>
To: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: Sunday Night Tilt-a-Whirl
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU

> Too, God was doing some live Video Toaster stuff which at times was really
> killer.

I wish he wouldn't keep projecting his own image on the screen.  Does
he really go by the name "God"?  How egotistical...

(Is he still Jon Drukman's employer?)

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 12:56:41 1993
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From: PLUI@iossvr.gm.hac.com
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To: hac2gm..arpa.."sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU"@hac2arpa.hac.com
Subject: 808/MBM/SupremeLoveGods 

Sey, 808, MBM, and Supreme Love Gods played in Vancouver last night...

Supreme Love Gods started at 8:00. There was a crowd spanning the front of 
the stage about 5 bodies deep. People were mostly watchin' and the other 
9/10ths of the dance floor was empty. They played for 45 miniutes. It was early
and I 'spose people weren't into the heavy guitar sounds (?)

The floor had been filling up during the intermission, a dj in the balcony 
was playin some very good music. The crowd was a mix of ravers, motorcycle
jackets, and the usual club faces. By 9:15, the crowd at the Commodore Ballroom 
had grown to about 1600 (capacity, I think) and MBM started their set. 

It was very loud.

Since the dancefloor was packed, I moved off to the side of the stage, by the
bass bins :) There was more room to dance and the carpet was a little easier 
on my feet.   It was very loud :)  The floor was bouncing for the hour and 15 
that MBM played (no one was diving into the crowd, but I did notice a tall 
skinnyish guy being passed around over people's heads).

Again, another intermission. This time the dj played a more jazzy interlude
with Ramsey Lewis (?) samples, and a track that sounded a bit like the theme
from the Jetsons. The house lights came up for a bit and it was nice to see
the large crowd full of smiling faces.

808 came on at 11:00 with a kewl Alsa Spracht Zaratustra (sp?) and laser intro.
The lasers and intellibeams hadn't been used so far, so it most thoroughly
tripped me out.  20 minutes into the set, they played some older acid. There
were 2 people being passed around over people's heads now. 

It was very very very loud.

Close to the end of the show, I was dancing away, happy as a bird, a few feet
from the speakers, with my back to them, facing the crowd. My hair was standing.
Just as I turned to face the stage, I caught a glimpse of one of the big 2x15
bins vibrate itself forward and off the platform it (and the rest of the 
speakers) was placed on. As it came crashing down on me (still blaring), I 
caught it, and was suddenly reminded of a scene in The 10 Commandments.
The speakers were arranged in a 3 on top of 3 pattern. The one I was holding
was the bottom middle speaker. My attention shifted from the one blaring in 
my lap, to the others directly above me that were inching forward and downward.
I managed upright the speaker and reach over it (still blaring) to try and 
hold back the rest of the PA. By this time a bouncer or security guy noticed 
me messin with the PA and decided to find out what the hell I thought I was 
doing. He noticed my predicament and the day was saved. 

I continued dancing to the very very loud music until the show ended at 12:20

I picked up my kid sister (bar shift ending) and we went to the after party. 
My ears were ringing (still are) so we didnt stay. Fun night altogheter, but
I was bummed that the ticket price had gone from $18 to $25 the day of the show.
A smallish price to pay for such excitement, tho.
                                ____
                               |   /|            __
Patrick Lui   aka cato         |  { | BOOM      / '>  tweet!
plui@iossvr.gm.hac.com         |   \|   BOOM   /\ /\
      



From sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 12:59:49 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 12:40 PST
From: YOUR FRIEND MIKE <MROMO@scuacc.scu.edu>
Subject: c2 tapes ripp!
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <B8B4C16C4000C95D@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu"


I bought the set this weekend, and one is blasting away right now, filling
the mediocrity of my neighborhood with glorious house....fantastic!


Weekend was soooooooooo fantastic.  The beach party location couldn't be 
better.  I hope those folks throw one each week.  That's what it's all about,
isn't it?  Everyone hanging out together, reveling in the majesty that is nature and our home...

wow.  Good to see Lee & crew, M and Normals, Niels....what a time.  I am reminscent already!

where am I going to buy tapes if Ameba closes?  I hear mark's lease ends
wednesday so he isl ooking for a buyer quick-style....I really don't 
want to start buying them at HouseWarez...they're always grumpy...
have a fantastic week and go outside a lot...it's beautiful!!

mike

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 13:03:10 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305101857.AA01269@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU, larryc@netcom.com
Subject: Re: ClubRave(tm)

>  Tables could be set up at raves , and a potential ClubRave (tm) :-) 
> member could get an application card . She gets the card stamped every
> time she goes to a rave that has a ClubRave table - when she gets some
> magic number of stamps ( 4, 5 ? ), she qualifies for a full membership.
> To join full-up , and application with ID check would be completed ,
> for the ClubRave files.

>  The issue of selling "single event memberships" ( which would legally
> be tickets by any other name , methinks ) would have to be resolved. It
> may put ClubRave events into a different legal/permit zone than a purely
> members/guests only event.
> 
>  What do you guys think??? It's already obvious to me that it's an 
> abusable idea , but that would depend on the implementation and the
> implementors.   
> 
> 				Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

Well my first reaction was NO WAY, this is NOT what raving is about!
But then after I thought about it, there are zillions of parties out there,
I/we can still go to/throw free parties and the like and there is nothing
stopping the doorman from letting people in who are not full members.

This might be a good way to have members only parties where you know that jerks
CANT come in.  I for one am more interested in going to primarily outdoor
clandestine events these days and you can't really limit access to this type of
event.

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 13:34:27 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305102022.AA14734@slack>
Subject: Re: Sunday Night Tilt-a-Whirl
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 14:22:06 -0600 (MDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 312       

> > Too, God was doing some live Video Toaster stuff which at times was really
> > killer.
> 
> I wish he wouldn't keep projecting his own image on the screen.  Does
> he really go by the name "God"?  How egotistical...

God once did my lights.  Once he got the clouds out of the way, it was really
spectacular.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 13:37:29 1993
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From: brians@unislc.slc.unisys.com (Brian Sassone)
Message-Id: <9305102009.AA20589@unislc.slc.unisys.com>
Subject: Wickedly Wicked
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU (Bay Area Ravers)
Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 14:09:43 -0600 (MDT)
In-Reply-To: <9305101416.AA28720@jumbo.apple.com> from "Stewart, Scott*" at May 10, 93 07:17:54 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 1054      


Stewart, Scott* says:
> Hell why not continue to have it at King St. and limit the people that can go
> in.  I know the place is small and have always made an effort to get there
> early.  

Except for the people who get stuck in line bumming... Or the people who
walk out for a breath of fresh air and can't get back in because they've
already let too many people in... Or when the fire marshall shows up and
sends everybody home...

It seems like Wicked is becoming synonymous with this type of scene which
is (IMHO) counter-rave.  Why?  --  Why not just put Wicked to rest and start
up something else?  What's in a name?  Take it back underground.  The music 
is always brilliant.  The core community will find it and spread the word.
Or have we forgotten already?


-----------------------===<<O>>===------------------------------------------
-bS							"A happy face,
brians@ios.convergent.com				 a funkin' bass,
A lowly raver without a glowstick.			 for a loving race."
------------------------------------------===<<O>>===-----------------------

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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 13:23:24 PDT
From: mw@sybase.com (Michael Wertheim)
Message-Id: <9305102023.AA15427@orion.sybgate.sybase.com>
To: brians@unislc.slc.unisys.com
Subject: Re:  Wickedly Wicked
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Content-Length: 91

$$$

which isn't necessarily bad, I guess -- some of the $$$ helps fund the FMRs,
I think.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 14:04:43 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 13:40:41 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305102040.AA01433@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU, DWATANAB@uci.edu
Subject: Re: Cops

> 
> soo... it occurs to me
> why dont we start going on ride alongs with cops
> get to know them, hang out with them, whatever
> 
> two things get accomplished
> 1) you understand them better
> 2) they understand you better
> 

Well I'm not overly chummy but I do try to talk to them as much as possible,
answer their questions and basically provide a familiar face.
I know the Santa Cruz cops recognize me, which is a good thing.
I'm not sure if I want the SF police to know me by sight, but Dana
I think your right, I don't know about going on rides with then or offering
them water from your bottle or a hit off your balloon :) but It does pay
to stop and talk to them a little and make them feel as if they are humans
some cops NEED this type of reminder so that they don't go off.  Others
just find it plesant and become easier to deal with.  Some folks ask me
why I talk to cops at raves and I tell them that they can't bust anybody
while their busy talking to me!

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 14:30:52 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 13:49:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gioni Pasquinelli <gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: FMR
To: The Ravin' Peoples <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
Cc: "Brian \"VitB\" Behlendorf" <bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305101356.A17752-c100000@hamlet.ucdavis.edu>
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Sorry this is so late but I've been away from the computers for a bit.


The greatest ever!!!

	I must second Brian in his comments about the event...this was
the best event I have ever been to.  My mind has been reawakened to 
the incredible aspects of raving!!! The people were incredible, the vibe
was incredible.

	Truly it was "religious."  With the 400 or so people, a killer 
system with great dj's spinnin their hearts out, and the best location 
along with the marina. :)  It was incredibly beautiful watching the lights
across the bay dissapear as the sun came up...the whole sky turned red...

	Anyway I drove all the way from Davis by myself (since I wasn't
returning till today) to get there at around 2 am.  Many cars where comin
in still and I just roamed about listening to the car stereos blastin away.

	Thought I met Brian (was that you in the funky black and white hat) but
he was busy parkin cars...so I just hung out till about 3:45 when the 
system  fired to a screaming crowd...the vibe grew instantly even with
a few problems in the dj's department (a couple bad transitions etc.)
	
	I danced away till the morning broke when I had to take a rest...
everytime I moved away to the benches or the stone outcropping I 
couldn't keep my head from bobbing then my body writhing to the beat!!!
It was great!
	Though I kept to myself and didn't meet anyone else :( I had a 
killer time but I wish I had met all the sfravers present...I was the
ordinary looking guy with glasses and a white hat with the "G" on the
front.  I felt pretty out of place with all the nice but strange lookin
peoples...   
	
	I always thought those PG&E commercials were stupid till I 
saw a couple of ravers climbin the electrical towers over the marshes...

	I had to wonder what all the old fart joggers thought as they 
looked across the baylands to see several hundred people dancin away
to some kickin loud toons...   =)

	Overall it was the best I've been to and can't wait for the 
next!!!

By the way what was the dj linup???

Later all,

Gioni


						
G  
of the Pasquinelli Clan              What doesn't kill you makes you stronger
gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu 
Late...	


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 15:09:42 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 14:58:34 -0700
From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305102158.AA17862@jobe>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com
Subject: Re:  FW: Wicked Ruined?

> Date: 10 May 1993 07:17:54 U
> From: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
> 
> Well wicked is most likely ruined for me.  Hey this is great way to ruin the
> scene, bringing raves to a popular club where pretensious people normally go. 
> Pretensious clubbers still go to alcohol induced raves but at least they had to
> make an effort.  
> 
> I dont think that ravers can change a high volume club scene, I think its the
> other way around its already happening.  

It's really hard to say which way it's heading.  I was a clubber-type
until some friends brought me to a Wicked, a couple of Groove Kitchens,
and some tapes to listen to.  Finding alt.rave wasn't a problem, Brian
introduced me to sfraves, and every-now-and then I get on vrave and spend
a few minutes chatting with people I have never met.  One of these days
I'm going to hit an FMR, and so on and so forth.

I must admit, most people won't have net access, but I do try and bring
some friends into the scene to show them what I like to do and what I
don't like about the atmosphere around DV8, OZ, and other dumps like
that.  Sometimes it backfires;  hell, I tried, and I won't try it with
them again.
> 
> I went to the "Attitude Factory" last Friday with some friends and saw alot of
> familiar faces, too bad I didnt see Gunther.  My feelings were the same as his.
> It is gross.  However it is a really cool place with the different rooms the
> absolute best computer graphics I have ever seen!  and great lasers and lights.
>  The people were gross.  

Yes, but from 3am to 6~7am can you imagine what the ratio of ravers to 
'tuders will be?  Sound Factory has the best sound system and the
lighting is not bad either (I *really* wish they wouldn't shine those 
lasers at people; It's *dangerous*).  It does get a little warm and damp,
especially when the fogs roll through, imho prime location for a Wicked.
Let's show the clubbers what a party is really all about.  Hell, I'll 
even bring shitloads of lollypops and hand them out to the worst looking
of them all %)

> 
> I personally feel very betrayed and dissapointed with Wicked on this move. 
> Hell why not continue to have it at King St. and limit the people that can go
> in.  I know the place is small and have always made an effort to get there
> early.  Now that it is at "DEATH" ( a more appropriate name than Life).  
> 
> 
> Whats the situation on the King Street garage anyways, maybe somebody else can
> take over thowing raves at that space.  I really liked the space I think it has
> alot to do with making the parties fun because it was such a small hot place.
> 
> NUT
> 
> "Terribly dissapointed with Wicked"

- Steve

"Still willing to give it a chance"
> 
> 

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 15:59:12 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 18:51:49 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305102251.AA06943@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Ok, so I won't be at the park

Well I didn't survive Sat night ;), so I didn't get to meet whoever
showed up. Next time!


Sean

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 17:34:12 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 20:24:15 EDT
From: Monica Tauriello <monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: emergency broadcast?
Message-Id: <CMM-RU.1.3.737079855.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>

does anyone out there know anything about a group who i think is called the
emergency broadcast network (EBN)?  from what i understand, they're media
artists/activists and were at BLUE.... if anyone has any more info on who
they are/what they do, etc. PLEASE email me, tonite if possible... i have an
exam tommorrow in my cultural studies class and i'm trying to work in raving
and interactive, "radical" media....

much thanks, 
monicat

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 17:52:05 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 20:40:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alan Michael Parry <brit@ravel.udel.edu>
Subject: we're coming for your children..
To: sf-raves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
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> If you call until 12:00 tonight, you can purchase a round trip ticket
> from Boston to LAX for $48. That's right $48. It seems there was a
> typo in the Herald and the airline will honor the add until 12:00 tonight.

due to this, Fran and I will be in SF from July 24th-Aug3rd!!! 
I cant believe it. I think that covers an FMR too. wow. see you kids sooner
than i thought. :) :)

--Fluid







From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 19:30:39 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 17:36:29 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.berkeley.edu (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305110036.AA00282@ganymede.apple.com>
To: SanFran rAvErS <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>,
        mark@ganymede.apple.com
    (Money's Not Our God, Really)
Subject: test - help!


is this getting to the list?!?!

sorry. but i haven't got any new mail since friday morning!

could someone please mail me if this gets out?

thx.

-mArK.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 19:36:09 1993
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Message-Id: <9305102217.AA16443@jumbo.apple.com>
Date: 10 May 1993 15:17:24 U
From: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
Subject: LASER HAZARDS
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, "Steven J Saeedi" <saeedi@shell.portal.com>

Steve talking about the lasers at Attitude Factory
>(I *really* wish they wouldn't shine those lasers at people; It's
*dangerous*).  

I was thinking the same thing, but I thought I was being a little to paranoid. 
The laser light was going into the crowd and it didnt have a very high refresh
speed, I can see some people get their eyes hurt on this.  Anyone no of
somebody important to tell this at the Sound Factory.

Scott

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 20:00:22 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 93 19:55:34 PDT
From: langston@isi.com (Richard Langston x247)
Message-Id: <9305110255.AA15688@chief>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, saeedi@shell.portal.com,
        stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS


> From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU Mon May 10 19:35:14 1993
> Date: 10 May 1993 15:17:24 U
> From: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
> Subject: LASER HAZARDS
> Steve talking about the lasers at Attitude Factory
> >(I *really* wish they wouldn't shine those lasers at people; It's
> *dangerous*).  
> 
> I was thinking the same thing, but I thought I was being a little to paranoid. 
> The laser light was going into the crowd and it didnt have a very high refresh
> speed, I can see some people get their eyes hurt on this.  Anyone no of
> somebody important to tell this at the Sound Factory.
> 
> Scott
> 

	Actually, I believe (I'm almost sure) that it's against the law
to use lasers this way.  I've never been someplace that did this, but 
performance lasers are NOT supposed to touch anyone.  I learned about this
in the context of some story about how concert producers wanted to get
this rule changed because they don't think it's dangerous. 


	Basicly, I wouldn't worry about it as long as you're a few feet
away and don't stand there in a haze trying to see how intense the visuals
get.  Reminds me of all those stupid stories about staring into the sun
til you go blind 8*)



From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 20:18:51 1993
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1993 19:59:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gioni Pasquinelli <gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Normal
To: The Ravin' Peoples <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305101934.A13095-a100000@hamlet.ucdavis.edu>
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Yes the normal lookin one as in no rave gear wearin, grunge or punk havin
clothes...:)
	
ie.  I had on a paiur of blue jeans, a white t-shirt with a funky design
on the front (in the mornin) or a long sleeved blue shirt with some good
ol boots...to me that's normal for a rave the others there looked
extremely abnormal...but they were still very kewl blue, purple and white
hair and all...

:)

Have a good one...

						
G
  
of the Pasquinelli Clan              What doesn't kill you makes you stronger
gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu 
Late...	


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 10 20:24:35 1993
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From: Bryce Ryan <brycer@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305110317.AA18968@well.sf.ca.us>
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 10 May 93 20:17:34 PDT
In-Reply-To: <9305110255.AA15688@chief>; from "Richard Langston x247" at May 10, 93 7:55 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3test PL45]

Actually, lasers ARE/CAN BE quite hazardous to people's eyes.  I work for a
company that manufactures visible laser scanners to scan barcodes.  Federal
regulations require us to provide a "laser hazard" sticker on *everything*
that has a laser in it, even though the things are quite weak by most
standards.  We are also required to put a watchdog timer in each unit which
will guarantee that the laser can be on for no more than 2 seconds.  This is
to prevent any possible long term harm should someone accidentally activate
the laser while pointing it in the direction of their eyes.  (By the way, I
should say that we're happy to comply with the regulations because they do
represent good safety precautions.)

I have worked with the scanners, and had them come on in my face--i can tell
you all from personal experience that i don't recommend it for anyone.  i
had a temporary blind spot once for a couple of hours.  also, i have "felt"
the imprint of the scanner on my skin for quite some time after my skin was
exposed to it for bits of time (just had to try it on myself to see the
pretty colors (!)).

i'm quite concerned that an industrial power laser is flying around at
people level in a club--seems like an opportunity for unpleasantness
waiting in the wings.  I second the recommendation to the club--keep the
laser out of the crowd, please.

BryceR
TAZ mobile1
"You fill me full of X-stacy!"

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 03:17:43 1993
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From: Brian_Kelly@university-rel.ucsd.edu
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Date: 11 May 93 02:33:00 -0800
To: KANE@buast7.bu.edu, CRAMER@optilink.com,
        jpl.nasa.gov@kilimanjaro.Stanford.EDU,
        service.uci.edu@headwall.stanford.edu, berkeley.edu@soda.Stanford.EDU,
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Subject: Read on

[20] From: Timothy from the Water 5/11/93 1:37AM (168 bytes: 1ln)
To: The Universe
Subject: Attention Universal
--------------------------- Message Contents------------------------------
Sometimes when were at a
difficult time in our lives,
we don't reach out for help
Maybe its because we are proud,
Maybe we think we'd be bothering
someone with our troubles.
Perhaps were embarrassed,
or we might think that whats
troubling us has never
bothered anyone else before
and we are afraid to
show our tears, our feelings
If any of these thoughts are true
for you, You can reach out to me.
I don't know what I can do to help, but
I can listen, and understand,
and Love you know matter what.
I can remind you what a special
person/wiseman you are B
And how much you have to offer so many.  I'd
like to put my arms around you and
hug you and let you know how much
I do care and I'm here for you,
If you need me now and Forever.

-----------------------------------------------------

Always Remember, you cannot abandon what you do not know
To go beyond yourself, you must know yourself.
The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking
new landscapes but in having new eyes.
Please grant me weak eyes for things that our of
account and strong eyes for all thy truth:
We walk by faith and not by sight.
In all cases the respect you show yourself and other
Lifeforms determines how you the Planetary family.
If you allow others to be destructive in your Sacred
space, on some level you don't have the guts to be
disliked. It is not important to be liked by others,
but it is important to be able to live with yourself.
   HAPPINESS BEGINS WITHIN

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 05:54:14 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 11 May 93 13:42:52 BST
Message-Id: <27427.9305111242@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: "Stewart, Scott*"'s message of 10 May 1993 15:17:24 U <9305102217.AA16443@jumbo.apple.com>
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS

>>>>> On 10 May 1993 15:17:24 U, "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com> said:

  Stewart,> Steve talking about the lasers at Attitude Factory
>(I *really* wish they wouldn't shine those lasers at people; It's
  Stewart,> *dangerous*).  

  Stewart,> I was thinking the same thing, but I thought I was being a little to paranoid. 
  Stewart,> The laser light was going into the crowd and it didnt have a very high refresh
  Stewart,> speed, I can see some people get their eyes hurt on this.  Anyone no of
  Stewart,> somebody important to tell this at the Sound Factory.

As long as the laser is being scanned into a sheet or cone of light,
or is drawing a pattern or some sort, then it's perfectly safe.  If
it's a diverging beam, it's safe, too.

If, however, it produces one (or a few) small bright spots, say half a
centimeter across, then they shouldn't be shining it into the crowd.

	Cosmic Roy

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 06:07:17 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 11 May 93 13:52:52 BST
Message-Id: <27611.9305111252@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: langston@isi.com
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, saeedi@shell.portal.com,
        stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com
In-Reply-To: Richard Langston x247's message of Mon, 10 May 93 19:55:34 PDT <9305110255.AA15688@chief>
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS

> 

  Richard> 	Actually, I believe (I'm almost sure) that it's
  Richard> against the law to use lasers this way.  I've never been
  Richard> someplace that did this, but performance lasers are NOT
  Richard> supposed to touch anyone.  I learned about this in the
  Richard> context of some story about how concert producers wanted to
  Richard> get this rule changed because they don't think it's
  Richard> dangerous.

As long as the laser is scanning, it should be safe to point into a
crowd, and it's a cool effect to have a sheet of light or cone of
light sweeping across the dancefloor.  The reason there are
restrictions (in the UK) on doing this is that if the scanning
mechanism were to fail, then it _would_ be dangerous.  But did you
know that in the UK there are restrictions on using strobes for more
than two minutes at a time....?  

Actaully, I'd be interested in a description of exactly what these
lasers do when they're scanning the crowd.....

    Rave on,

	Cosmic Roy

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 08:13:37 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1993 08:02:05 -0700
From: Edward Potter <ejp@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305111502.AA06086@well.sf.ca.us>
To: paul.richard@glib.org, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  HEY FROM CLINTON LAN










From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 08:46:13 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 08:38:31 -0700
From: elizabet@cadence.com (Elizabeth Medel)
Message-Id: <9305111538.AA11336@cds8616>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Southbay SFR Lunch...Ooops!
Cc: elizabet@cadence.com

Sorry I didn't post this earlier, but I've been working in another
site, and far away from my terminal. I won't be able to make this
one today as I'm in the middle of getting my technical manuals out
for our software release. I hope it's not too late for some of you
to make it out there.

Again, my appologies for the late notice.

Elizabeth.

****************************************************************************

When: *TODAY* Tuesday, 11 May
Time: 12.00 noon
Where: Greer Park, Palo Alto

Directions:

* From 101 (South or North) take the Oregon Expressway Exit

* Left at the first signal (West Bayshore - it's a frontage road 
  that takes you south again)

* Follow this road approx. 1/4 mile (pass appartment complex on right)
  
* You will see the park on your right hand side. Park in the first
  carpark to your right.

* We'll meet on the grassy knoll

Bring lunch, music, toys, yourselves!





From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 09:06:53 1993
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From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
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To: mark@ganymede.apple.com, mark@ganymede.berkeley.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: test - help!

Well, I received it!!!
                     
         /\                       noah@cadence.com 
        <<>>      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  
    ((((noah))))  "if i can get higher than this, 
	<<>>       i don't want to know about it"---Terence McKenna   
	 \/       ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 09:28:20 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 12:20:42 -0400
From: brendan mcdougall <mcdougal@jensen.cc.brandeis.edu>
Subject: Planet X and dj Thirteen
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, mw-raves@engin.umich.edu, DCRAVES@american.edu,
        sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU, socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Message-Id: <9305111620.AA28078@jensen.cc.brandeis.edu>

Hi,

This last weekend after "The Brand X Juggler /  BLISSS" I asked dj  
Thirteen about her favorite record store.  She said "PLANET X IN NEW  
BRUNSWICK, NEW JERSEY".  If you read her review about Rave En Colour  
that Francois Dion hosted in Mntreal, she said that most people  
drooled over the records she and Ed were spinning--which came from  
*guess where*.

I had to try Planet X, so I looked up the number.  Called and asked  
for Spike.  He spent about 20 minutes with me chatting about records,  
scenes, and dj's.  He tried to guess what I would like given a few  
titles I gave him.  Now he's putting together a package for me that I  
should have by the end of the week!  Too, he said if I sent a tape  
with snatches of music I liked, he'd build from that.  Talk about  
service.  I'm learning about the scene, but I definitely get the  
feeling this guy is going to be a big asset in this part of my life.   
This guy is not running a shop to stroke his ego.

If you do end up calling him, be sure to mention the net.  He's not  
on the air yet, and he think its cool how the thread travels.

Thank you very much Laura, Ed and Eileen for making "Juggler /  
BLISSS" a cool event and for recommending Planet X.  


Brendan


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 10:26:47 1993
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	for 
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 09:59:35 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305111659.AA06604@ganymede.apple.com>
To: Crash Pad Foolonia <scottb@netcom.com>,
        Ivo's Dreaming <4ad-l@jhuvm.hcf.jhu.edu>,
        SanFran rAvErS <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>, nmlist@ganymede.apple.com,
        tooth@darkside.com
    (Much Nicer Since the Operation)
Subject: PLEASE ALIAS ME!!


sorry for the posting to any lists.....but for some f*$(ked up 
reason, my account at ganymede is not accepting incoming mail.
could anyone trying to send me mail, please 

alias me to markb@bronco.apple.com  ( <-- note the b)

thank you ...

-mARK.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 10:29:20 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 13:20:34 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305111720.AA03794@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS
In-Reply-To: <27611.9305111252@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
References: <27611.9305111252@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
	<9305110255.AA15688@chief>

At "Where the Wild Things Are" they had a 5 watt Co2 laser firing
directly into the crowd, sometimes as a straight line. I thought this
was *really* unsafe, so I took a closer look. I found that the
straight line wasn't really straight, that it diverged to about 5
inches in diameter by the time it reached the back of the (large)
room. The reason it diverged was that the apparent beam wasn't really
a beam at all. Even when the beam appeared stationary, it was actually
being scanned in a very small pattern. Perhaps this explained why
people weren't going blind.

I predict:

1. Something will go wrong. Either due to stupidity, equipment
   failure, or participant stupidity, someone's going to get a
   serious dose in the eye, perhaps damaging a significant part of
   their retina or optic nerve. I consider this quite likely given the
   wattage involved and the "homebrew" nature of the laser shows.

2. A lawsuit will ensue, probably from the parents of the now
   partially blind participant. This suit will hit the promoters of
   the event and any deep pockets possible, especially if it was a
   "legitimate" site. A criminal suit may follow as well, if there are
   regulations on laser use and those were broken.

3. The "fallout" phase. Expect extra media attention. The cops may
   make it a point to hassle us. Legitimate sites may refuse to let us
   run events there. Forget ever seeing a laser at a rave again.
   Perhaps expect more stiff enforcement of age limits.

Okay, even if there's no lawsuit or fallout, it would be awful to
have someone's sight damaged by a laser. That's not what we're about,
right?

So maybe we could speak to organizers and voice our concerns. 
Let them know that there's an unsafe situation, and that you want
everyone to have a good time. All it would take I think would be to
not allow lasers to fire directly into the crowd.

Sean

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 11:02:20 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Tue, 11 May 1993 10:47:21 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey), sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS

It was explained to me once that laser regulations fall under the same
headings as hazardous materials regulations, and that if one gets cited
for directing a laser beam towards people (even a _reflection_ of that
laser beam) the laser operator and/or the promoter of the event could be
responsible for up to $100,000 in fines (even more than if they had
dumped a couple gallons of toxic waste on the dance floor - now THAT would
be interesting!)

	Brian

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 12:03:27 1993
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To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 11 May 93 10:47:21 PDT."
             <9305111747.AA00102@soda.berkeley.edu> 
Date: Tue, 11 May 93 11:55:27 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


FYI -- in my review of the come/unity-malachy-benefit, I posted the
following:

>I do wish
>the operators would aim the laser AWAY FROM THE CROWD -- I got zapped
>straight in they eye by the laser when i was near the stage -- for a
>few minutes, I could see the afterglow of the laser-burn when I shut my
>eyes.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 12:33:16 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 12:26:23 -0700
From: Steve Klingsporn <moofie@apple.com>
Message-Id: <9305111926.AA07475@apple.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Apology


I sincerely apologize for my silly reply to the lady from AOL.
I didn't mean to be at all offensive, and didn't think before I
replied (and didn't see the calendar list mail address in
the headers).  Serves me right, I guess.

I goofed.

Steve

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 12:43:48 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 11:53:12 PDT
From: don@vestek.com (Don Labutay)
Message-Id: <9305111853.AA06825@vestek.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Speaking of hazardous lasers, here's a discussion I got from the
sci.electronics newsgroup:

----------- begin      
From: wellison@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Re: laser shows - legal ?
>A few years ago there was a standing debate regarding the legality of
>laser light shows because of their potential harm, as well as for
>the potential danger to airliner crew and passengers.  Are laser light
>shows legal ? Indoors ? Outdoors with 3 W argon lasers projected to
>the sky ?

All laser light shows in the U.S. are controlled by regulations set forth by
the FDA's Center for Devices and Radiological Health Department (CDRH) under
regulations 21 CFR 1040.10 and 1040.11 (legally of course ;-). Lasers with
power levels below 5 milliwatts (Class II and Class IIIa) do not require a
varience, which is a long and complicated form that must be submitted to the FDA
for approval on a yearly or bi-yearly basis. Any laser above 5 milliwatts
require a varience (Class IIIb and Class IV lasers). All laser light shows for
public viewing must has a shutter to block the beam should it stop scanning for
whatever reason. All laser light shows above Class II must have a key switch
interlock to prevent someone from turning it on.

The low power (<5 milliwatts) is what most night clubs use as they don't
require a varience, but I have seen argon lasers (much >5 milliwatts) in night
clubs. These are illegal in an enclosed space where the beam might strike a
person (yeah, I've seen them scan the audience with them as well, glad I'm not
thier insurance company ;-)

Outside laser shows use multi-watt lasers (Class IV) to get the effect. The FAA
must be notified as to the location of the laser and the direction in which the
laser beam will scan. If you hit a plane with a high powered laser, you are
responsible for the aftermath. These shows are run by trained laserist and
technicians and they are VERY careful as to where they point the laser. 

The laser shows that I build as a hobby are mainly in the <5 milliwatt range. I
have build some in the 2 watt range in which I had to go through the varience
paperwork with, but those I run and am responsible for. The little one's I sell
for permanent installation or for a D.J.'s use. Whoever buys one of my shows
signs an agreement that I am NOT responsible for their actions as I have no
control over it. I sell the larger ones only to experienced persons who have
used laser shows before and are aware of the dangers. Laser shows are neat, but
stricly controlled by the goverment. In Europe though, they don't have a CDRH
regulation to follow, so its pretty much open game.

-----------------------
From: jeh@cmkrnl.com
Subject: Re: laser shows - legal ?

In article <1993May4.100320.49786@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu>,
 wellison@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu writes:
>Lasers with
>power levels below 5 milliwatts (Class II and Class IIIa) do not require a
>varience,which is a long and complicated form that must be submitted to the FDA
>for approval on a yearly or bi-yearly basis. Any laser above 5 milliwatts
>require a varience (Class IIIb and Class IV lasers). 

I think it is pretty amusing that these folks came up with power limits that
completely ignore wavelength.  

If the primary concern is for eye damage (a real concern at high power levels
and close range), the shorter wave lengths are FAR more dangerous.  The retina
reflects a fair amount of red light but wavelengths of "argon green" and 
down are absorbed almost completely.  

This is not to say that the regs aren't necessary, but if they are going to
have regs at all they should have some grounding in fact.  

---------------------------
From: zlau@arrl.org (Zack Lau)
Subject: Re: laser shows - legal ?

Actually, the ANSI standards that cover lasers are wavelength dependent.
ANSI Z136.1 has a range of .4 to 200 microwatts for class 1 visible
and Near Infrared lasers, for example.

If you want to buy the a copy of the ANSI standard, 
you can call the American National Standards Institute
at 212-642-4900 in New York. 

If I recall correctly, a complete library of their standards
runs over $50,000. 

As I understand it, the FAA, the FCC, the Bureau of Radiation Health,
state and local governments can all regulate lasers, in the USA.  In
addition, the property owner may have a say.  The world record amateur
radio operator laser contact (248 km or 155 miles) had to deal with
the issue of bats (flying mammals) possibly being blinded.  Planes were
supposedly a non-problem--photomultiplier tubes used as receivers
no difficulty locating aircraft at night.

-------  end

da watcher

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 13:42:18 1993
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To: Roy Badami <uunet!harlequin.co.uk!roy@uunet.uu.net>
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, gwh@lurnix.com
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 11 May 93 13:52:52 BST."
             <27611.9305111252@wundt.harlqn.co.uk> 
Date: Tue, 11 May 93 12:15:21 -0700
From: gwh@lurnix.com


>As long as the laser is scanning, it should be safe to point into a
>crowd, [...]

It depends.  Laser pointers are low-enough power that you have to
stare at them for ten minutes to get any permanent damage.
Many industrial lasers will do permanent damage if you get
a good look into the beam even if it just scans past.

Lasers more powerful than a laser pointer should NEVER be pointed
at a crowd for any reason.  3 milliwatts is the absolute limit
for safe use like that.

-george



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 13:42:40 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 11:36:27 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305111836.AA07439@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU, uunet!well.sf.ca.us!brycer@uunet.uu.net
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS

Have you ever had the laser just briefly scan just right into your eye as it
was moving by?  I have and it does make your eye tweak out and see colour
splotch blind spot things (for lack of the proper terminology).  Probably
not a good idea to shine them into the crowd.

-Mark

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 13:52:10 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 13:45:05 -0700
From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305112045.AA05171@jobe>
To: langston@isi.com, roy@harlequin.co.uk
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS
Cc: saeedi@shell.portal.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu,
        stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com

> From roy@harlequin.co.uk Tue May 11 05:53:28 1993
> From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
> Date: Tue, 11 May 93 13:52:52 BST
> To: langston@isi.com
> Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, saeedi@shell.portal.com,
>         stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com
> In-Reply-To: Richard Langston x247's message of Mon, 10 May 93 19:55:34 PDT <9305110255.AA15688@chief>
> Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS
> 
> > 
> 
>   Richard> 	Actually, I believe (I'm almost sure) that it's
>   Richard> against the law to use lasers this way.  I've never been
>   Richard> someplace that did this, but performance lasers are NOT
>   Richard> supposed to touch anyone.  I learned about this in the
>   Richard> context of some story about how concert producers wanted to
>   Richard> get this rule changed because they don't think it's
>   Richard> dangerous.
> 
> As long as the laser is scanning, it should be safe to point into a
> crowd, and it's a cool effect to have a sheet of light or cone of
> light sweeping across the dancefloor.  The reason there are
> restrictions (in the UK) on doing this is that if the scanning
> mechanism were to fail, then it _would_ be dangerous.  But did you
> know that in the UK there are restrictions on using strobes for more
> than two minutes at a time....?  
> 
> Actaully, I'd be interested in a description of exactly what these
> lasers do when they're scanning the crowd.....

Well, in this particular case, the laser shot straight into the chest 
of someone standing there for 2~3 seconds.  Ths diameter was about an
inch or so, but still, even while scanning, it irritates my eyes. 

- Steve

> 
>     Rave on,
> 
> 	Cosmic Roy
> 

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 18:52:22 1993
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From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305112348.AA05963@jimi.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu


Just out of curiosity I called the Exploratorium to find out what the
rates were and availability, etc. and here's what I found out.

It's available any week night except wed.
We can bring a sound system, she mentioned bands playing there but
we'd have to make sure it's on a night that nothing is happening at
the theater next door.
There is a $1,000 deposit.
It would cost $4,200 for about 500 people.
It is only available from 6 p.m. - 12 a.m.

Great idea for a rave spot but the price and time slot barely don't
cut it IMO.  We could possibly hold one there on a Friday night so
that we could all go to other events from there but we'd have to
charge $12-$15 to be able to cover costs.  We'd probably have to sell
tickets in advance because I don't know how they feel about us renting
it and then charging an admission to the public.  We'd have to make it
like our "computer users group" has to "take up a collection" because
we can't afford the fee from our "budget".  Anyway, just an idea to
toss around.

-Mark


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 19:01:36 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305120155.AA08889@netcom2.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS
To: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Date: Tue, 11 May 93 18:55:42 PDT
Cc: langston@isi.com, roy@harlequin.co.uk, saeedi@shell.portal.com,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com
In-Reply-To: <9305112045.AA05171@jobe>; from "Steven J Saeedi" at May 11, 93 1:45 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Steven J Saeedi sez:
> 
> > From roy@harlequin.co.uk Tue May 11 05:53:28 1993
> > From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
> > Date: Tue, 11 May 93 13:52:52 BST
> > To: langston@isi.com
> > Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, saeedi@shell.portal.com,
> >         stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com
> > In-Reply-To: Richard Langston x247's message of Mon, 10 May 93 19:55:34 PDT <9305110255.AA15688@chief>
> > Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> >   Richard> 	Actually, I believe (I'm almost sure) that it's
> >   Richard> against the law to use lasers this way.  I've never been
> >   Richard> someplace that did this, but performance lasers are NOT
> >   Richard> supposed to touch anyone.  I learned about this in the
> >   Richard> context of some story about how concert producers wanted to
> >   Richard> get this rule changed because they don't think it's
> >   Richard> dangerous.
> > 
> > As long as the laser is scanning, it should be safe to point into a
> > crowd, and it's a cool effect to have a sheet of light or cone of
> > light sweeping across the dancefloor.  The reason there are
> > restrictions (in the UK) on doing this is that if the scanning
> > mechanism were to fail, then it _would_ be dangerous.  But did you
> > know that in the UK there are restrictions on using strobes for more
> > than two minutes at a time....?  
> > 
> > Actaully, I'd be interested in a description of exactly what these
> > lasers do when they're scanning the crowd.....
> 
> Well, in this particular case, the laser shot straight into the chest 
> of someone standing there for 2~3 seconds.  Ths diameter was about an
> inch or so, but still, even while scanning, it irritates my eyes. 
> 
> - Steve
> 
> > 
> >     Rave on,
> > 
> > 	Cosmic Roy
> > 
> 


-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 			new .sig:		   howard@netcom.com
I see a great need.       alt.config yin/yang	   Nope, won't carry it here.
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 19:45:46 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1993 19:34:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gioni Pasquinelli <gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Exploratorium
To: The Ravin' Peoples <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305111955.A18941-9100000@hamlet.ucdavis.edu>
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How the park right outside of the exploratorium...I can't remember the
name of it right now, but the one with the pond and the huge Roman columns
etc...that would be a killer location. With that huge dome and such...I
can see visuals on it now.  I have know idea about the permits etc...so
its just a thought.
						
G
  
of the Pasquinelli Clan              What doesn't kill you makes you stronger
gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu 
Late...	


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 20:08:09 1993
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From: Gioni Pasquinelli <gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Visuals
To: The Ravin' Peoples <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
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I posted this a while ago but got no response from you visual wizards out
there so here it goes again.

Playing around with an oscilloscope in lab I saw it makes some pretty
great patterns and waves. Can this be projected at all or magnified? Has
anyone else thought of this? Has it been done already?

Welp Later

						
G
  
of the Pasquinelli Clan              What doesn't kill you makes you stronger
gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu 
Late...	


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 20:22:19 1993
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From: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
Message-Id: <9305120312.AA16738@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com>
Subject: Word has it..
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Tue, 11 May 93 20:12:04 PDT
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that Together in the basement of Big Heart City is a great tuesday night
sound system for the ohsolo price of 5 shanks (and from reliable sources ..).
we shall see!
dit@sybase.com

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 20:51:12 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1993 20:44:31 -0800
To: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu


There's a Federal standard that sets a limit for wattage/cm and duration at
certain
wavelengths, so a Krypton beam at a certain spread and wattage can fall on
the eye for only so long, but a weaker beam can hit the eye longer, and
vise-versa. Last show I worked had about 6 tubes, mixed Krypton and Argon,
but the company running them would not let any beams strike the audience,
but the beams were hitting some of the crew and as long as it was a swiftly
moving beam, it was OK as they had calculated their safety limit and all
the crew knew to look away if they did get hit in the eye. There was a
video projector that used lasers as a light source, but as long as one was
20 feet away you could look directly into the source for as long as you
wanted, it was scanning so fast. 

Thing about hitting a crowd at a rave is some folks might be in a mood to
stare into the laser source instead of glancing away. That could prove
damaging.


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 20:56:27 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 93 20:52:30 -0700
From: pew@ucscb.ucsc.edu (Peter Simon Arthur Wayman)
Message-Id: <9305120352.AA24035@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, winston@lurnix.com
Subject: Mo' Radio


Hey, did I ever mention that KHDC, 90.9fm in Salinas has a underground
house show every tuesday night and wednesday night? (or technically
Wednesday morning and Thursday morning.)
It's called "Liquid Radio," and it's on from 1am to 5am.
I like it well enough, and you should too!
PS:
I went to the FMR, and it was my first FMR, and it was the best rave I've
ever been to. (But then, it was the only one where I've stayed till the end,
and I've only been to about 8-10 total) I liked it very very much.

aloha,
peter 
(this is being posted, right?) ((if not, could whoever gets it post it please?)).





From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 21:00:12 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1993 20:57:21 -0800
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: wicked@netcom.com
Subject: What is Wicked?

        Wicked is a state of group mind integrated physically through the
attendees bodies and grounded into the earth, using music as our medium in
the psychedelic dance forum.

        It is a precious magikal time/space that can be created anywhere
that the tribe congregates and communes. The music we take very seriously.
This is our focal tool. Our means and modes of expression. Expression of
freedom. Freedom to be, to live and love together.

        Essentially Wicked is a tribe of people, friends, lovers, allies -
FAMILY. We share common understanding through consensual appreciation of
modern dance music orchestrated by our Shamen - The D.J.'s  Garth, Jeno,
Markie, and Thomas and our Artefacts - The Records and The Sound System.

        Wicked can happen anywhere it is safe for us to practice / play. It
is an energy ritual. Ideally it should be in San Francisco. We regard
Wicked as essentially a San Francisco phenomenon but appreciate the
necessity of experimenting throughout the Bay Area. It is important to us
to maintain strong, consistent parties within the city.

        This of course has to be balanced with direct contact to the planet
and universe. By marking the lunar passage with free outdoor dance parties
(FMR) we are essentially synchronising and harmonising to the natural
rhythms and cycles.

        We have tremendous responsibility to look after each other, be it
the collective responibility of a FMR to the compliance of health, safety,
fire, and ordinance permits of an upscale commercial event.

        It's fun for us to use different venues as it keeps it fresh and
ever changing/mutating. Wicked dance parties are charged energetically and
have the ability to transform people and/or places - energy dynamics. We
always hope to leave our vibe wherever we party.

        The Sound Factory, regardless of what has been there before, is a
suitable space for a large, publically attended event. It is correctly
permitted and developed for safe gatherings. There has until recently, been
a boys gay dance club on saturday night - Cyclops. Now this is finished,
there is a space before the next regular club happens. We have a chance to
do a one-off Wicked at this venue. This prospect excites us greatly, as it
will give us an opportunity to dispel any past negative vibes and re-lay it
with safe positive vibes. 

        With this in mind, we invite all our positively orientated friends
and family to come and celebrate being alive Here & Now. We would also like
to extend the invitation to those who need healing. We hope to generate a
group shared experience capable of uplifting everyone's spirit.

                 
                 ********************************
                 ******** You Have Been  ********
                 ********  Listening To  ********
                 ******** A WICKED SOUND ********
                 ********   Communique   ********
                 ******************************** 
                                                  
                                                   


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 11 22:15:42 1993
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1993 22:11 PST
From: WLIANG@scuacc.scu.edu
Subject: Re: Visuals
To: gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <D1B85F79E0011B77@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
X-Vms-To: IN%"gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu"
X-Vms-Cc: IN%"sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU",WLIANG

Have you ever seen those moving laser type of images they project on the
walls at nightclubs?  Well, I'm not sure...but I think that projecting
those oscilloscope images would work in the same way.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 00:17:08 1993
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From: Simon Loewenthal <sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com>
Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS (fwd)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Wed, 12 May 93 8:13:48 BST
Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1]

> Forwarded message:
> >From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU Tue May 11 18:25 BST 1993
> Date: Tue, 11 May 93 13:20:34 EDT
> From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
> Message-Id: <9305111720.AA03794@pilot.njin.net>
> To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
> Subject: Re: LASER HAZARDS
> In-Reply-To: <27611.9305111252@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
> References: <27611.9305111252@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
> 	<9305110255.AA15688@chief>
> 
> At "Where the Wild Things Are" they had a 5 watt Co2 laser firing
> directly into the crowd, sometimes as a straight line. I thought this
> was *really* unsafe, so I took a closer look. I found that the
> straight line wasn't really straight, that it diverged to about 5
> inches in diameter by the time it reached the back of the (large)
> room. The reason it diverged was that the apparent beam wasn't really
> a beam at all. Even when the beam appeared stationary, it was actually
> being scanned in a very small pattern. Perhaps this explained why
> people weren't going blind.

People in the UK have been using lasers at raves and in clubs for years 
now. ( They have been used at other musiacal / theatrical events for
even longer ). So far there have been no accidents and from what I have
seen, and this has never been a point for the police force / council to stop
a rave. However, UK side, 99% of lasers are hired from legit companies that
specilise in rave lighting effects. No one I know of has of yet taken a 
laser printer and used that in a rave ! ( With a few modifications ;-) )
NB. Biggest laser I've scene used at a rave was: 25Watt twin head water
cooler argon laser. 
All lasers that mention a high wattage output tend not to be industrial 
lasers ( or they'd `burn' though the crowd, ) and the beam, as you meantioned,
is refracted and spiltt in smaller beams of less intensity.

Anyway multicolour lasers used in a rave with smoke machines and mirrors/
crystal balls positioned in the right place is a wicked effact.

I don't know what the police are like in the SF area, I'll find out in
August!
	
Can someone mail me back confirming this mail got to the sfraves group
as I don't subscribe ( Can't, too much mail and too much work here! )
Simon.


Suddenly it was all clear......		We got some serious problems here,
					and most of them yours!
Bye Bye		////
n-joi           o o               o	voice: +44 81 742 4093
./sjl            }              o	sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com
               \__/===========o

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-   Something thats hard to do, isn't worth doing at all - Homer Simpson     -
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 04:46:43 1993
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Date: Wed, 12 May 93 04:41:38 PDT
From: nineball@remarque.berkeley.edu (9ball)
Message-Id: <9305121141.AA05707@remarque.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Straight up funk at the beach
Cc: scottie@uclink.berkeley.edu


I was there too, with my contingent of four Canadian ravers who
flew down to spend two weeks with me doing the SF scene again
after they had been gone for almost exactly a year.  I'll post
more about the whole visit soon.

This is the kind of event that has really been puzzling me about
the scene here.  Remember the amazing three day Memorial (Labor?)
Day event at this site (end of John Daly Blvd near Ft. Funston) last
year?  This promised to be a followup, starting on a sunny Sat.
afternoon with the phone line promising to go as long as they could
until they got busted.  Thinking it could again be lots of cool people
dancing in the sun straight through the night to a Sunday morning
with acres o' vibe, idyllic setting and weather and a sunset to
boot, we went to find about 60 people sitting around apparently bored,
one person dancing, no real vibe, and what felt like (in the words of my
Canadian friends) an "after-grad" party (reeeeal young).

We left after about an hour and walked back
up to the parking lot where high school kids would come tearing
donuts through the lot glaring at us, and with each passing group
of teenage pseudo-gangsters (including one very loud in-your-face
drunk group with a rottweiler fetching sticks with the command
"sic it boy" -- I'd bet my last zorkmid they were the group that
Scott saw making lame-ass gestures at the top of the cliff) we
were more and more glad we were leaving and more sad the scene
at this place had seemed to deteriorate to this point.

What happened?  Man, this shoulda raged.  I dunno
anymore about the SF scene, and didn't know how to explain it
to my friends.  Oh well, rave on, I guess....

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 06:43:33 1993
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <9305121340.AA05765@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Spare MBM/808 "Pass"
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Date: Wed, 12 May 93 6:40:54 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


 Hello! 
 
  I asked a friend I know if he wanted to go to the 808/MBM show at the
 Edge in Palo Alto tonight , but he can't make it. Does anyone want to go? I
 bought two "guest passes" as soon as I could , so I now have an extra one
 for sale. The cost would be the same as it cost me - $14.00 . 
 
  A complication -  at the club , they didn't have actual tickets yet , so 
 I only have a receipt for two "guest passes". So, I would have to meet the 
 person who wants to go, in order for us to go in together.
 
  I live in San Jose, and so it would probably be easier for us to meet
 if you lived in the South Bay or the peninsula. Or ,we could meet at the 
 club. 
 
 
 				Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com
				WORK: (408) 756-1317
				HOME: (408) 295-5909  
 


-- 

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 08:11:47 1993
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From: SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU
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Apparently-To: sfraves-list1

>From noah@Cadence.COM  Wed May 12 08:06:53 1993
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>From: noah@Cadence.COM (Noah Ruiz)
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To: larryc@netcom.com
Subject: Re: Spare MBM/808 "Pass"
Cc: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu

Hi, larry this is noah@cadence.com!
I just want to say that I'll be there
tonight and hope to say hi to you and
anybody else on the list. As usual I'll
be wearing my cloBBer cap. Look for it
and say hello!!

                     
         /\                       noah@cadence.com 
        <<>>      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  
    ((((noah))))  "if i can get higher than this, 
	<<>>       i don't want to know about it"---Terence McKenna   
	 \/       ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 10:11:15 1993
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>From wicked@netcom.com  Wed May 12 10:07:57 1993
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Message-Id: <9305121708.AA27624@netcom.netcom.com>
Date: Wed, 12 May 1993 10:08:19 -0800
To: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu
>From: wicked@netcom.com
Subject: Re: DAT taping


>I can be hired outright, with the master DATs going to the promoter.
>(Though I'd love to keep a copy for myself, with the understanding
>that I would not make copies for anyone.)  


        Personally, I think the master DAT's should go to the DJ's (ie. the
artistes) and it is they that should be consulted if any taping of their
sets is to be done. If a promoter wants to tape their event they should
first get clearance from the DJ's concerned.

Markie  !)





                 
                 ********************************
                 ******** You Have Been  ********
                 ********  Listening To  ********
                 ******** A WICKED SOUND ********
                 ********   Communique   ********
                 ******************************** 
                                                  
                                                   


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 10:35:06 1993
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From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305121727.AA29157@jobe>
To: dit@sybase.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Word has it..

> Date: Tue, 11 May 93 20:12:04 PDT
> From: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
> 
> that Together in the basement of Big Heart City is a great tuesday night
> sound system for the ohsolo price of 5 shanks (and from reliable sources ..).
> we shall see!

Together has been raging for quite a while now.  I haven't been there
for a couple of weeks, so can't vouch for it now.

- Steve

> dit@sybase.com
> 

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 11:16:19 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Wed, 12 May 1993 11:06:35 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Administrativa

HI gang... remember when you mail, the preferred address is:

sfraves@sfraves.stanford.edu

John Reuling is updating the medisg machine and the aliases are taking
a moderate amount of wrangling to get to work.  Sendmail on the new
machine is acting quirky, so for now sfraves is aliased to medisg1.stanford,
the old machine.  When sendmail decides to work on the new machine he'll
move us over there.  Also, at some point the SFRaves archives will be
moved away from soda and to stanford.  (or at least, some portion of the
archives)  sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu still works of course, but I may
soon turn that off (or just alias it to me) to catch all the mondo 2K
people :)

	Brian


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 11:16:27 1993
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>From rg@CS.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 11:09:26 1993
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>From: Ravi Vinodrai Gadhia <rg@CS.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <9305121809.AA02554@Xenon.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: Spare MBM/808 "Pass"--Gone!!
To: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Date: Wed, 12 May 93 11:09:59 PDT
Cc: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu
In-Reply-To: <9305121340.AA05765@netcom.netcom.com>; from "Larry Ching" at May 12, 93 6:40 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]



Too slow...
Larry's spare ticket has been claimed.

How was the show in the city last night?


Ravi




From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 11:29:46 1993
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Date: Wed, 12 May 93 11:23:28 PDT
From: Derek Chung <dhchung@us.oracle.com>
To: dit@sybase.com, saeedi@shell.portal.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Word has it..

Together is still pretty hot and getting hotter... Last night
Gavin, Pete Avila, and Simon heated up the floor, all with 
strong sets (at least while I was there), Gavin especially.  
Synergy visuals look great in the chill room (which is very
well-furnished), and also from the dance floor - before it
gets crowded, you can look across the room through the doorway
between the rooms, and the way the screen is set up, it looks
like there is room full of color beyond...

The energy is great, but dress for the heat - it gets quite 
warm like a basement-of-1015 Wicked.  DJs change every week,
previous Togethers have featured Jeno, Garth, Thomas, Scott
Hardkiss and others.

People start filling it at around 12:30, enter through the
Jessie Street door (in the back), call 979-8825 for weekly
DJ lineup.

-Derek

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 o derek chung  o  oracle graphics  o  dhchung@us.oracle.com  o 415.506.6195 o
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 11:41:09 1993
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Date: Wed, 12 May 93 13:34:43 -0500
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To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Looking for music
Cc: mw-raves@engin.umich.edu

I need some cd's for my next party I have bought a few but they were  
not hard are fast enough. (one said that it had the greatest techno,  
I think one of the dj's name was Krom) Another had beats from 140 to  
180 bpm I find that slightly to fast.  What I am looking for is Nine  
inch Nails with less guitar and more synth.

Thanks for reading my babble.

Marc

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 11:53:12 1993
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Subject: I WANT TO BE A DJ !
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

Does anyone have any ideas on how I can start djing.  The music out  
there now I don't like so I want make my own.  Start up cost is a  
slight problem but I do have a 300 watt system that I used for my  
band.  But where do you find turntables and vinyl.  I would really  
like to get a working dj story on how he began.

Thanks 

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 12:11:18 1993
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Date: 12 May 1993 11:52:21 U
From: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
Subject: RE: Straight up funk at the beach
To: "9ball" <nineball@remarque.berkeley.edu>, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Cc: scottie@uclink.berkeley.edu

This a replyy to 9 Balls previous post I am refering to it all so I didnt want
to copy the whole thing.

I went there too, arriving at about 6:00 Saturday evening.  I took my
Wife(seperated for a year) to it.  This was here first Rave(which I didnt
consider a rave")  I am glad that other people had the same feeling I did, I
felt the same way as 9Ball.  I was pretty burnt out and I thought that was the
situation.  I didnt enjoy the scene either, no vibe at all.  

What bothered me was when they were gathering resources for a camp fire.  First
they grabbed anything lying on the ground. Hell I used to do that too, now I
have learned how detrimental that is too the ecosystem. One of it was a 20 foot
tree branch. Then a bunch of guys started Pulled a large tree branch that was
still attached to one of the treess.  I couldnt beleive this mentality it
immediately depressed me.

The music was really good so I stayed a little while after a killer sunset. 
while standing by the fire I saw several people put there cans and bottles in
the fire.  Yeah if the fire is hot enough they will melt completely but what
usually happens is someone has to pick up the burnt cans and broken glass.  I
went to one guy who just put his beer bottle in the fire and asked him nicely
that it would be better to put it in the trash pile 10 feet away.  The guy went
into so speal about how it will melt completely and the N02 tanks causing more
envioremental damage.  Being brought down further I soon left making excuses to
my wife how this is not a real rave and how I will take her to a good one next
time.

The only high point to this outing was the incredible sunset meeting a few
SFRAVERS and seeing Carlos play.  Carlos is one of the hottest DJ's.  He is the
only DJ I know that totally gets inot his music and dances, I love watching him
spin.  I also think he has the most unique funky sound.

NUT

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 14:18:06 1993
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From: SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU
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>From mayer@netcom.com  Wed May 12 14:12:13 1993
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To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu>,
        nineball@remarque.berkeley.edu (9ball)
Subject: Re: Straight up funk at the beach 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 12 May 93 04:41:38 PDT."
             <9305121141.AA05707@remarque.berkeley.edu> 
Date: Wed, 12 May 93 14:12:45 -0700
>From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


I went to straight up funk from 2:30-8PM sat and 2-7:30PM sun. I thought
saturday was pretty iffy, but i enjoyed myself anyways. sunday was
alot better, as the vibe was unmarred by rotweiler-toting gangstas and
the music was alot better too. More people were dancing on sunday...

i think the party also went off nicely around 8PM sat when carlos
showed up to spin. However, we were hungry and tired so we left and had
a delicious indian repast. The next day, I had heard that the party
lasted all night! (But then again, given the reports of the near-assuault
that occured sat night, perhaps it wasn't that cool of a place to be).

and yes, the gangsta-folks with the rottweiler were the idiots who
started the fight. There are times when a lysurgic acid mace-gun would
be a useful form of chemical warfare. Spray it in their face and watch
the ego melt. then again, why waste good acid on fucked-up crack-addled
scumbags?

PS: I too had hoped that the event would be similar to the 3-day
extravaganza put on by "Rave Called Sharon" last year. It wasn't, but
it was a nice way of spending two summery spring daze. I managed to
stear clear of some of the mishaps that occured on saturday day and
night, so perhaps i have a more positive view of this than most.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 14:35:14 1993
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>From mayer@netcom.com  Wed May 12 14:30:50 1993
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To: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
Cc: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu>
Subject: Re: Straight up funk at the beach 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "12 May 93 11:52:21 +0800."
             <9305121857.AA13305@jumbo.apple.com> 
Date: Wed, 12 May 93 14:31:16 -0700
>From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


forgot to mention the eco-damage aspect in my last post about
s.u.f.a.t.b. -- yes, the  macho shirtless-hunter-gatherers on saturday
were up there in the hierarchy of vibe-killers at the party.
fortunately, like the gangstas, they were gone on sunday.

To build a fire, the macho-shirtless hunter-gatherers (mshg's) decided
to not only grab every spec of dead wood in the canyon (which is sorta
ok)... they also decided that the 40-foot tall dead tree had to come
down.  They tried to draft me to help them  but i told them that it was
a stupid idea and that there are plenty of other pieces of wood
around... so the next thing you know, there's twenty mshg's grunting
and pushing and shoving and climbing and rocking the dead tree. it
looked like WW-II photo of the iwo-jima capture, or like a bunch of
guys jerking-off a oversized phallus.... once that tree was down, they
proceeded to try to break off the lower branches of living trees.
Grrrrr!

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 15:22:33 1993
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From: SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU
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>From scott_nozawa*@quickmail.apple.com  Wed May 12 15:17:06 1993
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Date: 12 May 1993 15:14:42 -0800
>From: "Scott Nozawa*" <scott_nozawa*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Circus Circus
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

                       Subject:                               Time:15:04
  OFFICE MEMO          Circus Circus                          Date:5/12/93
Hey all you Southbayers,

     Tonight is the last night for Circus Circus.  So if you're in the mood,
come on down to Toons at the corner of 2nd st. and Santa Clara in San Jose to
join the celebration.  It is free before 9:30 so come early 8)

The DJs will be:  Harry Who?   Rick Preston   Spun

Please bring your positive energy for one more dancefest because after this,
the Circus is leaving town!

Keep it Alive and Thrive                                      T. Scot




From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 16:22:47 1993
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Date: Wed, 12 May 93 19:16:39 -0400
From: Craig M. Kanarick <kanarick@media.mit.edu>
Message-Id: <9305122316.AA19495@media.mit.edu>
To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Rave Flyers article in Print Magazine




There is a *very* good article in this month's Print Magazine about
the graphic design of rave flyers and rave-club flyers.  The article
is quite well written but the visuals are incredible.

There are full-color reproductions of over 50 flyers from the
California rave scene.  Most of the are by Mel Marcelo, but there are
a lot of others, including Syd & Scooter, deeblur, Steve Levy, Richard
Duardo, David Horn, Mike Messex, Silas Hickey, David Orr, Rick Klotz,
and Stan Endo.

I'll try to scan in the images in my free time.... :-)

-- cmk

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 18:18:42 1993
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1993 18:18 PST
From: PGRASSI@scuacc.scu.edu
Subject: Jeno on kscu
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <7A48546A80017913@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu"

I'm real exited that Jeno's coming to spin on my show this Tuesday so 
listen up if ya can.  The show starts at seven, jeno will play for 1.5
hours and he'll be followed by rick preston then matt mau.
tuesday SOUL-DIGs, KSCU 103.3 FM 7-10PM
peace, pete gracious

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 18:57:28 1993
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>From mt1z+@andrew.cmu.edu  Wed May 12 18:54:18 1993
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1993 21:53:37 -0400 (EDT)
>From: Michael Bruce Tomblyn <mt1z+@andrew.cmu.edu>
To: sfraves-request@medisg.stanford.edu
Subject: 
Cc: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu, DCRAVES%AUVM.BITNET@psuvm.psu.edu,
        dcraves-request%auvm.bitnet@psuvm.psu.edu,
        FAMILY-L%MIZZOU1.BITNET@psuvm.psu.edu,
        GLB-NEWS%BROWNVM.BITNET@psuvm.psu.edu,
        HEALTHRE%UKCC.BITNET@psuvm.psu.edu, SERAVES%AUVM.BITNET@psuvm.psu.edu

UNSUBSCRIBE Michael Tomblyn

---------------------------------------------------------------
Please unsubscribe mt1z+@andrew.cmu.edu

I am losing my account at CMU due to graduation. Please unsubscribe me
so that you don't have a ton of mail being bounced around. Sorry for not
sending to the proper addresses, but I seem to have deleted those. Thanx.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 19:04:37 1993
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From: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
Message-Id: <9305130159.AA05753@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com>
Subject: Your Burning Love
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Wed, 12 May 93 18:59:48 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0]
Content-Length: 839

Well, since Pete couldn't ID this tune, I turn to the wisdom of the list:
Thanks anyway, Pete!
> Hey, Mr. Super name that tune...
> Do you recognize this song? It is pretty mellow, with some 'stop and go' break
> beats, and in the beginning there is a sample of a woman singing 'burning'
> on the 3... like this:
> 1 2 burning 4 1 2 burning 4 1 2 foryouuu 4 1 2 burning 4 1 2 foryouooooo
> I feel your body moving into the rhythm's beat
> move me
> your body's moving 
> you're wanting more
> only I can give you more
> waiting.. anticipating me bringing you down
> to realityyyyyyyyy
> (breaks)
> (mellow house chords played on bell sound)
> you give me burning love 
> (tape ends)
> 
> Thanks! (must have this song!!!!)
> -- 
-- 
  Superhigh            \       bust a nut on a cloud 
 dit@sybase.com        /         and shout out loud.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 20:18:23 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305130314.AA02050@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: Your Burning Love
To: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
Date: Wed, 12 May 1993 23:14:30 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305130159.AA05753@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com> from "Cutlass Supreme" at May 12, 93 06:59:48 pm
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Beyond the ultraworld of Cutlass Supreme:
> 
> Well, since Pete couldn't ID this tune, I turn to the wisdom of the list:
> > Do you recognize this song? It is pretty mellow, with some 'stop and go' break
> > beats, and in the beginning there is a sample of a woman singing 'burning'
> > on the 3... like this:

Burning by M.K. on Union City recordings.

> > Thanks! (must have this song!!!!)

Check out most UCR stuff... you'll like it. There is a compilation called
colors with UCR material. Sound factory have done some remix of ufi and m.k.
from UCR, but my advice: stay away. The least powerfull remix ever. This
company sucks.
BTW, for song identifications > 1 month old, i should be able to help...

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 20:53:10 1993
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1993 20:50:59 -0700
From: John S. Lee <jslee@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305130350.AA19379@well.sf.ca.us>
To: dit@sybase.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Your Burning Love

Man this song is SOOOO old, but it IS a good one...and quite trippy.  One of
the DJ's woldbe able to answer this one.  But I do remember it, and it is a
cool tune!

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 12 22:35:25 1993
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1993 22:22:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Lee An <lee@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Your Burning Love
To: Francois Dion <dionf@ere.umontreal.ca>
Cc: Cutlass Supreme <dit@sybase.com>, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305130314.AA02050@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305122225.A16313-a100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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On Wed, 12 May 1993, Francois Dion wrote:

> > Well, since Pete couldn't ID this tune, I turn to the wisdom of the list:
> > > Do you recognize this song? It is pretty mellow, with some 'stop and go' break
> > > beats, and in the beginning there is a sample of a woman singing 'burning'
> > > on the 3... like this:
> 
> Burning by M.K. on Union City recordings.
> 
> Check out most UCR stuff... you'll like it. There is a compilation called
> colors with UCR material. Sound factory have done some remix of ufi and m.k.
> from UCR, but my advice: stay away. The least powerfull remix ever. This
> company sucks.
> 
> Ciao,
> -- 
> Francois Dion

There are also domestic releases of M(arc) K(inchen)'s "Burning," original
mixes included, so you don't have to go out and spend $10 on the UCR import.

Just thought you might like to know...
Lee


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 06:18:49 1993
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Date: Thu, 13 May 1993 06:15:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: Arias Hung <mkim@reed.edu>
Subject: Re: For the Seattle posse
To: MykL G <mcg@netcom.com>
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305100021.AA19928@netcom.netcom.com>
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On Sun, 9 May 1993, MykL G wrote:

> Did anyone in the Northwest crew go to the Rave Called Sharon up
> in Seatlle last night?  If so, can you post or drop me note on how it
> went?  I have a friend who really wants to know how it came off.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> ----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
>         MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
> ____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____

I didn't go to the one on the 8th, but I did check out Sharon when they
came back in March.  Back then it wasn't that hot.  It was in the Omni, a
place not even in Seattle but half an hour away.  (Seattle cops and raves
seem to be a sickly mix)  Space was bad, Spun was good.


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 09:04:54 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305131601.AA08487@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: Your Burning Love
To: lee@uclink.berkeley.edu (Lee An)
Date: Thu, 13 May 1993 12:01:33 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.05.9305122225.A16313-a100000@uclink.berkeley.edu> from "Lee An" at May 12, 93 10:22:27 pm
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Beyond the ultraworld of Lee An:
> 
> On Wed, 12 May 1993, Francois Dion wrote:
> 
> > Burning by M.K. on Union City recordings.
> 
> There are also domestic releases of M(arc) K(inchen)'s "Burning," original
> mixes included, so you don't have to go out and spend $10 on the UCR import.

We get UCR at domestic prices here, which is 9.50-10$ CDN. Imports are 12.99-
13.99$ (REPHLEX cat008 was 18.99$ to give an idea on how prices are crazy).
(1$CDN=0.8$US)

Even at these prices people buy a lot of recordings in Montreal... In fact
Montreal is the city in Canada where they sell the most recordings.

To cut on expenses i buy in the states (mail order  or when visiting).

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 10:48:58 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: So what happened?

I didn't find out about last night's attempted party 'til this morning.
Brian's voice on the info line says "Oh well, nice try...".  Did it get
broken up?  Did anyone get to spin?  How many people showed up?

(I guess anyone who was there is probably still asleep... =)

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 13:13:28 1993
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Date: Thu, 13 May 93 13:03:46 -0700
From: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Message-Id: <9305132003.AA12860@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Raving in SJ last night

Well,  I'm here in San Jose this week at the Mac Developers Conf,
but I can still check Email here because of a nice setup that
allows me access to Internet.

I just want to report on two raves I attended in san Jose.   One
at the Club St John (Which I later learned as a gay bar),  but it
had totally awsome music sets,  but clientel was rather boring,
so we left for the Circus Cirsus rave on 2nd and Santa Clara st
in SJ,  and this one was truly dynamic.    It was free,  which 
really attracted me,  and the DJ's were reallyu creative.   

Great dymanic sets kept us hoppiing until 1:30 when things had to
shut down (Which was OK with me because I had to get up early).

Sound system was rather wimpey (Don't think it was anywhere near
the killowatt range,  but I managed to find a place near one
of th4e wimpey speakers that gave me SOME energy,  but to rave
while at the Computer conference was really great,  and I got my
body all loosened up,  and raved with some dudes from Wash DC
that I also met at the GK in SF last weekend.    All in all,  we
had a wecome break from all this computer conference humm drum
stuff (Land of the nerds).

Anyway,  thats a report on the rave,  should someone find it
useful..

Rave on..
JD

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 14:58:44 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Meat Beat and 808 State
Date: Thu, 13 May 93 14:55:07 -0700
From: doom@leland.stanford.edu


Well, courtesy of Pat Dote and KZSU I managed to get on the
guest list at the Edge last night, so I walked over there at
around 10 PM or so.  I expected I'd be early, but Meat Beat
Manifesto started soon after I got there.

Bunch of ravers were around... Ravi, Rox, a bunch of people
who aren't so active on the net (not to mention the folks
who's names I'm spacing on).  

Musically I thought 808 State's stuff sounded really good,
(particularly with the assist of what I gather were members
of UB40, though maybe I'm confused)... but I was bothered a
bit about the way they hide their instruments behind big
white ovals spelling out "808".  You could hardly see what
they were doing at all... I couldn't tell you if the whole
show wasn't on tape/sequencers. 

Meat Beat Manifesto was more interesting to watch, though it
took some work to figure out what instruments were supposed
to be doing what.  "Hm, you hear that pinging noise only
when the guy on the left hits the upper part of his drum
pad... and I guess he's shaping the electronic howling tones
by twisting those knobs up there."  At one point he says
"here's some *improvised* music" and walks across the stage
to press a button that turns on a complicated dub beat. 

So by and large, "live techno" is really silly.   But then
live performance is a pretty silly idea, in general. 

The crowd was interesting.  I was last at the Edge to see
Einsturzende Neubauten, and the contrast was pretty amazing.
Not as much black leather, fewer tattoos, elaborate
piercings, etc.  Brighter colors, and the Regular Guy look
were much in evidence.  None of which prevented the 7 foot
tall jocks (and a few of their shirtless male companions)
from forming a mosh pit.  There would be guys moshing at the
Edge during a chamber music recital.  I spent some time
playing energy absorber, essentially dancing in something
like a football blocking position for an hour.  

I tried to talk some people into checking out Dante at 2:30
over at Brian's party, but they weren't into it.  I went
home to kill some time, but the coffee wasn't working and I
wound up going to sleep myself.  Anything happen? 

(Oh, by the way, there's a room for rent over at my place,
for $365/month.  You too can know the joys of the Palo Alto
group housing communal living experience.  Within walking
distance of the Edge!  Inquire within.)


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 15:13:06 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Thu, 13 May 1993 15:06:43 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G), sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: So what happened?

>I didn't find out about last night's attempted party 'til this morning.
>Brian's voice on the info line says "Oh well, nice try...".  Did it get
>broken up?  Did anyone get to spin?  How many people showed up?

Unfortunately, He Who Was To Provide Sound (who shall remain nameless on
this list to avoid embarrasment) basically flaked on me, saying he'd 
meet me at a club in the city Wednesday night and we'd go down to the 
site around 2:00.  I gave up around 3:00 and went down to the site,
hoping he'd either gone down himself or is just "running late".  To make
a long story short, nope, nothing happened, and thankfully we didn't
make Dante drive to the site (I told him to wait up in the city, I'd call
him as soon as the sound arrived), and hopefully Lee got my message in
time (did you, Lee?).  Anyways, I am sorry to everyone who stayed up late
and made the trek out there.  This was something of a "dry run" - I was 
there from 3:30 until 5am, and saw maybe 2 cars use the road the whole
time... so it's a safe spot for future use :)  

>(I guess anyone who was there is probably still asleep... =)

Why.. yes!  I am!  Sleep-geeking! Oh my!

	Brian

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 19:01:15 1993
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Two announcements

First, Mission Rock is on for this Friday.  For info call 241-8862.

Second, Groove Kitchen is going the way of all things.  :(  !

The finale this Saturday will spotlight John Howard, Jon Williams,
Rick Preston and Doc Martin.

Dang!  It was nice to have a solid, dependable option on Saturdays
(except when it coincided with Wicked).

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 19:09:36 1993
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Date: Thu, 13 May 1993 19:08:32 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305140208.AA16107@well.sf.ca.us>
To: mcg@netcom.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Two announcements

Sorry to hear about the demise of Groove Kitchen.  Despite the disdain
the king st. garage gets from many these days, I had some very very fine
GK times there.  The heart wasn't in it, the other week when I was there
at Big Heart City.  

The wheel is turning, and I'm sure the GK posse will find a new project
soon . . .

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 13 23:46:53 1993
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From: uNiBrOw <unibrow@ecst.csuchico.edu>
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Subject: sfraves list
To: SFRaves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Thu, 13 May 93 23:47:04 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Just want to be included in the SF raves list.  I dont want to be left out
on any of the fun.....


 _ _     _ _   _ _     _ _   _ _ _ _ _ _    | "If you ever catch on fire try
_/_/    _/_/  _/_/    _/_/  _/_/_/_/_/_/    |  to avoid seeing yourself in a
_/_/    _/_/  _/_/_/  _/_/      _/_/        |  mirror, because I bet that's
_/_/    _/_/  _/_/ _/ _/_/      _/_/        |  what really throws you into a
_/_/_ _ _/_/  _/_/  _/_/_/   _ _ /_/ _ _    |  panic"  -Jack Handey
_/_/_/_/_/_/  _/_/    _/_/  _/_/_/_/_/_/    | 
                                            |  unibrow@cscihp.ecst.csuchico.edu


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 04:16:36 1993
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Date: Fri, 14 May 93 04:10:58 PDT
From: nineball@remarque.berkeley.edu (9ball)
Message-Id: <9305141110.AA17868@remarque.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Good and bad news about the FMR.
Cc: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, geoffw@nexsys.net


More about the parts of the scene that I and those friends from
Canada I've been referring to recently experienced in the last 2 weeks....

Man, we had a good time at this one.  This FMR was certainly the
high point of the whole 2 weeks; one of the high points of the
last year for me.  It reaffirmed the faith for my friends who
hadn't been around since about a year ago at the peak.
The one thing that stuck out for me was that it
seemed like all the old regulars showed up again, the ones that it
has been so damn hard to find out and around in the SF scene recently.
Saw Brian helping direct traffic & all, and Geoff firmly
emplanted in an otherworld-trance in front of the stacks.

Everyone still had the same story to tell of not going out much in
the scene anymore, but for this they were in the best of
spirits, all ready to go nuts.  The setting was great, what with
the baylands, the relatively remote feel to the location, the perfect
sized crowd for a FMR, the freshness of the space (thank god, finally
a new space), the cement blocks to look over the crowd, the powerline
towers to climb on, everything.  The music raged.  Bust free.  Very
little attitude to be found; dammit, everyone seemed to be happy.

When we got there, some doubt remained in my mind whether a sensitive
part of the Baylands was a good location for the FMR, but thinking
of how last summer everyone seemed over-eager to leave any location
cleaner than it began calmed my worries.  Unfortunately, as we were
the VERY last car to leave the site, we saw what was left behind.
As I was picking up trash around our car, the two rangers who
came in those green trucks in the AM had just about completed an
hour of picking up trash.  One ranger had just busted someone
for peeing in the bushes in plain sight of two portapotties.
His came up to talk to us, and hoping he would give one of those
surprisingly encouraging comments about the people or the idea, he
instead pointed out the damage to the marshland and
told us that there was "human excrement and trash
everywhere" and that "this is not a good place to hold a party.
Next time you hear of one of these things forming, tell them to
take it elsewhere.  We don't want it here."

Even as the scene seemed to show a bit of life and promise, it was
already proving itself changed and in danger of furthering its
persecution.  Oh well.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 10:36:41 1993
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Date: Fri, 14 May 1993 13:33:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Bruce Tomblyn <mt1z+@andrew.cmu.edu>
To: sfraves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: 
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU

UNSUBSCRIBE Michael Tomblyn

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 11:24:06 1993
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From: zdross@ucdavis.edu
Date: Fri, 14 May 93 11:02:30 -0700
Message-Id: <9305141802.AA24278@othello.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: sniff

I will miss Groove Kitchen alot.  It was a great alternative to the big 
parties on Saturdays, and Kenny is so totally cool about his gig.  Hopefully
he will 
get something new fired up in GKs place.


Bye bye GK.
Zak

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 11:45:19 1993
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Date: 14 May 93 14:34:47 EDT
From: Shaun Ralston <70007.3260@compuserve.com>
To: SFRaves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Subject: SUNDAY IN THE SUN PARTY!  
Message-Id: <930514183447_70007.3260_CHM115-1@CompuServe.COM>

YES! It's kinda back!?! This Sunday, May 16th, we are doing a
beach party with killer sound and incredible DJs in lieu of our
regular (not) Park party.  Until we clear up the park situation,
we are committed to doing a regular Sunday noon-sunset event.
The info line for this Sunday's event is 415-995-4731.  Be there!

Peace, Love, and RAVE-ON!   -Shaun
/


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 12:21:30 1993
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From: shrink@ucscb.ucsc.edu (Fabien Thad Santos)
Message-Id: <9305141917.AA21250@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
To: 70007.3260@compuserve.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: SUNDAY IN THE SUN PARTY!

cool...been waiting for one to happen....can you tell me where it is...
wait...forget it, I got the number down. Thanks anyways!

Peace, Love,...and Ectasy8)
Fabe


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 12:22:00 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Fri, 14 May 1993 12:11:43 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-calendar@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: This week's RAVE guide

	Hi gang!  This week has a few pretty solid possibilities.  Tonight
Mission Rock looks like a clear winner for the SF area, but if you're down
in the South Bay Chapter One looks like it has a great DJ lineup too.  And
going from Mission Rock to Splash (with a travelling-through-SF-at-night
interlude) is probably what I'll do.

	Saturday night my vote would be for the last Groove Kitchen, coz of all
the 21+ parties I've been to for the past 6 months I would say this one
has the overall best vibe and most consistantly surprising DJ selection 
(despite being empty one week).  Coming in a close second, though, would
be Earth Beat - I _believe_ this is being thrown by an all-female group
of promoters, and the 18+/no alcohol thing is BIG in my book.  Oh, and 
Saturday evening from 6 to 9pm is a cool shindig at BPM, with the Hardkisses
spinning (imagine - dancing at a party, hearing a song you love, walking up
to the turntables and looking at the record, and being able to run down and
buy it!  Ha!  genius!  :)

	And Sunday afternoon the same people who are trying to get GG Park
for us are gonna throw a party at Fort Funston - call the # for more exact
locations.

	As a final word, next time you go out to an outdoor party, PLEASE
be conscious of your impact on the ecosystem.  Both the FF party last Saturday
and the FMR the Wednesday before that have been marred by people who don't
realize the sanctity of the environment - I know I'm prolly preaching to the
converted, but if you see others doing this, don't be afraid to walk up and
say HEY! KNOCK IT OFF!.  End of sermon. :)

	Have fun this weekend!

	Brian

*****************************************************************************
UPCOMING RAVES IN THE SF/BAY AREA                     Last modified: 05/14/93
*****************************************************************************

Friday, May 14th - "Warehouse Jam" - 16th & Harrison
	Wool  Ernie Munson  Markie Mark  Jon Williams
	$5, 12:30 - dawn
	[warning: $5 + 16th & Harrison ->? large crowd - DC]

Friday, May 14th - Chapter One - DJ's rick preston, harry who, carlos, shon
	408-450-3131	415-281-5914  $13 advance tix avail. at Ameba on Haight
	there will probably be an after party in some san jose park...

Saturday morning 4am-noon - Splash! - DJ's Robbie Hardkiss, Dutch, Alfie,
	Simon, and Doran  (note - the Misson Rock hotline says Splash opens up
	at 2:30 as an afterparty for M.R.)  278 11st Street, SF - 415-979-5880
	Also, for the next few weeks this is FREE

Saturday 6pm-9pm - Deep House Session #3 - "Pureality" - the Hardkiss Posse
	1141 Polk St, (right above BPM)  (this sounds fun! and it's free!)

Saturday, May 15th - The last and final Groove Kitchen
	DJ's will be John Howard, Jon Williams, Rick Preston and Doc Martin.
	415-267-3932 - at 836 Mission, between 4th & 5th, SF.  21+

Saturday, May 15th - Earth Beat - DJ's Buck  Tony  Doran  Markie Mark  Josh
	No alcohol [right on!]  18+  [double-right-on!] (415)995-2328

Saturday May 15th - Wacky Citrus - DJ's Ernie Munson  Buck  La Paix  Sasha
	Scott Hardkiss  John Williams  Taylor - 21+ - 415-541-5617
	408-236-3747 916-484-5335

Sunday, May 16th - the GG Park Party moveth!  415-995-4731
	Location for this week: Fort Funston.  DJ's - ??? 

Sunday, May 16th (and every Sunday) 8pm -4am - Tilt-a-Whirl (the nighttime
	version) @ The Bridge; 4th & Bryant SF; 415.647.GRUV
	DJ's [5/16: Brad, Surge, and Goa Gil]   18+

Saturday, May 22nd - Wicked - DJ's Jeno, Garth, Markie, and Doc Martin
	Sound Factory, corner of 1st and Harrison, SF  21+
	$15 goes towards your first renegade sound system  
	[Come with your luv phasers set to STUN]  415-512-5713

Saturday, May 22nd - Foundation - DJ's Doran Tony Simon Jas DocMartin and Spun
	415-905-8831 - (previous Foundations have been 18+)

Saturday, May 22nd - Animating - (510) 247-2328

Saturday, May 29th - A Festival of Sound: Three tents to GET DOWN GET
	DOWN and one tent to get WICKED - indoors and outdoors - 
	All welcome to the re-unification of the scattered tribes

	DJ's (are you ready for this?)
	Harry Who	Spun		John Williams	Garth
	Pasta - Seattle	Josh		Carlos		Jeno
	Rick Preston	Dj Wool		Moonpup		Markie Mark
	Bam Bam		Ernie Munsen	Julius		Doc Marten
	Ghost		Eric Hill	Alfie		Barry Weaver
	Tony		James & Gavan (Tweakin')	James - sacramento
	Derek Carter & Mark Farina on 4 tables 		Live - DubTribe
	introducing: Mei-Lwun * Alonzo * Allan * Vicious V & Arturo
	
	408-496-1780 * 415-905-5917

Saturday, June 5th - Vortex - DJ's Josh, James, Markie, Buck, Ernie, & Tony

Saturday, June 12th - Spirit of the Tree - 415-266-8215 (Funky Techno Tribe)
	Tony Jeno Grahame DJ Dan and Thomas

Friday, June 18th - Sunday June 20st - Solstice - another Taste event, in the
	Utah desert.  If you're interested, send mail to solstice-request@
	slack.sim.es.com, with the word "SUB" in the body of the message.
	Buses from the Bay Area will be coordinated, if there's enough 
	interest, with a most likely departure time of Thursday night and a 
	return time of late Sunday night.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

        People who want to send money, cards and other
        goodwill thoughts to Malachy can make checks payable to
        the:

                M. O'brian Healing Fund
                1388 Haight st #117
                San Francisco CA. 94112

        Also for the latest info on Mal you can dial

        (415) 241-1560.

        Every one's positive energy is DEFINITELY paying off.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Be-AT INFO LINE: 415-626-4087. This usually gives info 
about the raves coming up in the next couple of days.

More phone lines:
Feel the Trip: 415-905-9661
UP3 productions: 408-399-2611
408-296-1611 - 510-464-5999 - 916-558-3777

Also, Ameba Clothing can give info on raves.
415-750-9368, 1732 Haight St., San Fransisco
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here are some weeklies - whether or not they count as real "raves" is 
debatable, but they were advertised by fliers and the music could be
good. If anyone can provide reviews of them, i.e., their 
appropriateness in being on the list, let me know....

Fridays - Mission Rock - DJ's James and Gavin (from Tweekin Records)
	& others.  Outside dance floor. In China basin at 17th and Illinois.
	Phone  415-241-8862  	Visuals by Synergy (hi Tony!)

Fridays - ZANZIBAR - Deep house, acid jazz and garage.  DJ Josh.  (415)
        695-7887.  842 Valencia @ 19th St.

Fridays - Life (updated DJ lists)
	[5/14 - Sasha]
	[5/21 - Marques Wyatt, Buck]
	[5/28 - Derrick Carter, Mark Farina]
	Sound Factory - 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF    415.543.1300

Fridays - Mr. Happy's Disco - garage, deeep house, disco
	Jan Cooley & Aaron O 
	174 King St, $8, 11pm->, info: 415.487.6237, 21+
	[from the Love Garage people]

Fridays - Berlin  10pm  55 Natoma (back of DV8)
        "Hard hitting bass sounds radiating rightious (sic) vibes
         for your brain"

Fridays at F/X - fresh with Rick Preston and friends
	400 south 1st street in San Jose - info: (408) 298-9796

Friday night/Saturday morning - Splash
     4am-12pm, Club O, 278 11th @ Folsom    FREE

Saturday mornings - Family Dog - Info 415.266.8254
        Charter Oak warehouse - 3am-morning
	Ghost Tigger Ernie Nick
        (presented by Turtle Wax) 

Saturdays - Housing Project (after party) - 6am - 1pm 
	End Up 401 6th @ Harrison 21+ (Also Wednesdays 9pm-330am)

Saturdays - Deep House Sessions
	April 17 & 24 - Confluence: Eric Lacy  Jan Cooley  Garth  Jeno
	at the Groove Station  1141 Polk St  6-9 pm  FREE

Sunday mornings - Tilt-a-Whirl
        [april 18th - Robbie Hardkiss  Carlos  Bam Bam & others]
        6am - ?    18+     $5
        520 4th St @ Bryant (the Bridge/Trocadero)

Sundays - EndUp from 6am - 6th & Harrison

Sundays - AfterLife - six am till...  - 375 11th st * Dj Simon, Ernie *
	Bagels * Fruit Salad * Espresso * Smart Bar * Chill Room
	This week, Markie Mark 6-8:30am

Sundays - Boogie Buffet - Brought to you by Preston (groove kitchen et al.) 
	and Paul (afterLIFE) - Sunday Mornings at 1015 Folsom  
	6am until early afternoon. - Dancing downstirs, 
	Full breakfast cafe upstairs - Call 979-8845 for DJ lineup 

Sundays - Reunion (last Sunday of every month)
        Yahoo  Simon  Garth     10-6am  (707)323-4708

Sunday nights - Bulletproof boat party - 5-9pm pier 40 (boat embarks
        promply at 5) DJ's Scott & Robbie Hardkiss, Digs & Woosh, and others
        Tickets at both Bulletproof locations 629 Haight (255.7168)
        & upstairs at BPM  1141 Polk (567.8439)

Sunday, May 16th (and every Sunday) 8pm -4am - Tilt-a-Whirl (the nighttime
	version) @ The Bridge; 4th & Bryant SF; 415.647.GRUV
	DJ's [5/16: Brad, Surge, and Goa Gil]   18+

Sundays - Team Green 
	3rd @ Harrison, 315 Harrison (City Nights), 21+ ID; Brought to 
	you by the people who promoted "Carefree", $8.00 admission.  
	Carefree alternative Style 

Sundays - flow at Nickie's (460 Haight)
        full house w/dj - 10pm-2am, 21+

Sundays - Zanzibar - 1pm-9pm - James, Gavin, and Felix playing a mix of House, 
	Funk and Rare Groove

Sundays, 3-7pm - Acid Jazz & Reggae Dancehall Connection - DJ's 
	Ivan, Rolo 1-3, Mind Motion, EFX, Ismael - Groove Station - 
	1141 Polk Street, SF

Sundays - Sunday Skool at Atlantis	5pm - 4am
	1st & Harrison 

Sunday night - Spundae (no relation to Spun, as far as I can tell)
        8pm - ?    Guest DJs + Henrick
        Natoma, between 1st and 2nd (probably 55 natoma, back of DV8)

Mondays - Depth Chamber - beginning 6/7
	[6/7 - jeno]
	[6/14 - bones/jan cooley]
	[6/21 - james/robbie hardkiss]
	[6/28 - greenwod/markie]
	at the refurbished 181 club, 181 eddy @ taylor
	9-2am, 21+, (415)241-1560

Mondays - Pepper - Diff'rnt DJ's, notably Noel, Josh and Buck - 
	Don's Different Duck on lower Haight.

Mondays - House Coffee - DJ Stefan blends house grooves
        all ages, 115 4th St, Railroad Square. (Hot Spots)
        546-8665

Mondays - Pepper.Deep House with Buck, Josh, Chris Lum & Guests. 668
	Haight, 10-2AM, $3, 21+. "Tis a very merry, dancing, drinking, 
	laughing, quaffing, and untinking time" -- John Dryden. (the 
	oldest rave quote i've seen so far....)

Tuesdays - Together - Thomas  Simon  Garth  - Basement of Big Heart City
	415-979-8825

Tuesdays - ZANZIBAR - House.  DJ Andy.  (415) 695-7887.
        842 Valencia @ 19th St.

Wednesdays - Housing Project - 9-330am @ 401 6th st / harrison
	guest dj's ernie munson, jeno, josh, garth - 21+

Wednesdays - This Old House - Zanzibar - 842 Valencia, SF
	Jan Cooley  Neon Leon  Bam Bam 		10pm - 2am, $4

Wednesdays - Circus (was Rise) 
	Spun, Rick Preston  visuals by Donovan	(408)292-7464
	Toons - 52 E.Santa Clara at 2nd, SJ - 21+  free before 10

Wednesdays - Chocolate City
	Bam Bam, Gerry V, Scott Hardkiss
	10pm - 4am, $5 ($2 b4 11), 21+
	Atlantis - 375 1st @ Harrison
	
Thursdays - Lush (beginning May 20th)
	Chris Lum & Ernie Munson
	715 Harrison @ 3rd	21+

Thursdays - Deep Space - 200 N. 1st Street, SJ - 21+ - 408-345-2386
	Two dance floors - DJ's have included: Spun, Garth, Thomas,
	Risk Preston, Harry Who, and more.  Free before 9:30pm

Thursdays - ZANZIBAR - Acid jazz and house.  DJ Suki.  (415) 695-7887.
        842 Valencia @ 19th St. 21+

Thursdays - Primal - Tribal, Techno, and trance - Dj's Lewis and 
	Bryan Hughes - 9th and Harrison

Thursdays - Dog House (presented by Family Dog)
	"The Underground Comes to the Peninsula" (!)
	8-2am  261 California Ave, Burlingame	21+

Thursdays - VIRGIN MARY - bringing back the LOVE - with always holy & 
	consistent DJs garth, jan cooley, dutch, larry jr. - 2000 K street
	SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA - 21 & over, 10:00 pm

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONNECTION 2 TAPES are still available from Bob Ramstad,
boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com.  It's a 4-tape set, with music by
Moonpup, Scott Hardkiss, Jon Drukman, Lee, and Blurrrr - the tapes are
$20, plus $5 shipping (unless you pick it up in person) $5 of which
goes to the Malachy O'Brien trust fund.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

RADIO SHOWS: 

(Need info for: Friday and Saturday nights on 106.1, 107.7, and 105.3 -
	if you know the names and tiumes of the shows, give me a buzz...)

Tuesdays, noon - 3pm - "London Jamaica" w/Francesca & Unknown
	House + some reggae	KZSU, 90.1 FM. - well-known guest DJs 

Tuesdays (early Wednesdays actually) - 12:45 - 3:30am, 90.7 KALX (Berkeley) - 
	fellow sfraver Mescalina "Tune in for acid indigestion and 
	other ailments"

Wednesdays, 10pm, KFJC, Foothill College (Santa Clara)

Thursdays, 7-9 on 91.3 FM KCPR San Luis Obispo - Beyond Techno, with
	DJ EZ Whip.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

If anyone has info on any other events, submit them! I can't possibly hope
to get all the info every week. 

Brian Behlendorf

bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-request@soda, owner-sfraves@soda, etc.


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 13:07:38 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305141214.ZM20709@nmtvs313>
Date: Fri, 14 May 1993 12:14:28 -0700
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: no listing?



I guess the listing is not out yet?

*

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 13:57:38 1993
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Date: Fri, 14 May 1993 13:51 PST
From: YOUR FRIEND MIKE <MROMO@scuacc.scu.edu>
Subject: tonight, tonight, ..lalalalala
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <E75A21412001E289@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU"


Hope to see people at Chapter One tongiht..it doesn't start until 2am
I mean 1 am or so, so it might be a good chance to nap then go out
(riiiiight)....the after party will be at FX with hopefully
Matt Mau, who is a damn good dj...

otherwise, anyone know if that group is going to have sound at the beach
this weekend?  The park people should check that beach out...it's sooooo
much cooler than the park, which is very cool, but the ocean....the 
ocean, now that is the shit...


see you alll...I will be at Chapt 1, th after party, DNA on Sunday, 
and then the park/beack whatever...

m

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 14:00:26 1993
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Date: Fri, 14 May 93 13:27:23 PDT
From: "Jonathan S. Drukman" <JDRUKMAN@us.oracle.com>
To: SFRaves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: This week's RAVE guide
Reply-To: jdrukman@us.oracle.com
Original-To: HQPYR1:SFRaves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU

In-Reply-To: HQPYR1:SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU's message of 05-14-93 12:11

a few notes: splash doesn't open til 4 - don't go there at 2.30!

not only can you buy the records that the DJs play if you hang around at BPM,
but they are also selling tapes of the DJs performances.  of course, you'll
have to wait a little while longer...  on the other hand, i know that scott
hardkiss at least doesn't buy any of his records at BPM, so if he plays a song
you want, you might have to look a little harder (or buy the tape when it comes
out)...

la dee da.

Jon Drukman                                           jdrukman@us.oracle.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Always note the sequencer - this will never let us down.


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 15:43:31 1993
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>From stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com  Fri May 14 14:51:03 1993
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>From: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
Subject: RE: This week's RAVE guide
To: jdrukman@us.oracle.com, sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

why not find a place for Splash that can start at 2:30, for people who get out
of Mission Rock or other places can go.  It would probably get a much better
turnout.

NUT

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 17:35:58 1993
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>From MROMO@SCUACC.SCU.EDU  Fri May 14 17:35:17 1993
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>From: YOUR FRIEND MIKE <MROMO@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
Subject: super duper!
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
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Just a quick addition about the after party for Chapter One--
one of our very own, Tomatsu (sorry about the spelling) will definitely
be there....very cool stuff...should be fun!

please come down, it should be a really good time, if I have anything
to say about it!  :)


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 18:10:36 1993
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From: brians@unislc.slc.unisys.com (Brian Sassone)
Message-Id: <9305150045.AA25775@unislc.slc.unisys.com>
Subject: Life is Music
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU (Bay Area Ravers)
Date: Fri, 14 May 1993 18:45:57 -0600 (MDT)
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    What is most intimate to life is the evolutionary process, the creative
    process.  When we hear music, we find that the background of sound is
    maintained and the foreground of sound comes up, maintaining the
    continuity of melody and binding together in harmony the single notes
    that come up as waves on the silent bed of the ocean.  This is precisely
    the creative process.  The wholeness of Being in its eternal silence
    warms up and produces the background of the music of life, and on the
    foreground of Being spring up the waves of relativity, waves of life.
    So music reminds us of what one is; it displays the story of life.  When
    one finds what one actually is, one is attracted to it.  Whether one is
    aware of it or not, reality of life is found in music and therfore it is
    natural that music should have a universal attraction.

						- Maharishi Mahesh Yogi


-----------------------===<<O>>===------------------------------------------
-bS							"A happy face,
brians@ios.convergent.com				 a funkin' bass,
A lowly raver without a glowstick.			 for a loving race."
------------------------------------------===<<O>>===-----------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 19:48:17 1993
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>From MROMO@SCUACC.SCU.EDU  Fri May 14 19:44:59 1993
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>From: YOUR FRIEND MIKE <MROMO@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
Subject: Chapter One not happening
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <190183062001C391@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU"

Argh! 

The Chapter One party is not going on tonight due to space problems...

oh well, I guess I will check you all out at something else tonight
or tomorrow...
>sigh<

mike

(but I am psyched about the beach!)

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 14 20:18:25 1993
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Date: Fri, 14 May 1993 20:13 PST
From: "KEN C. *((:-O" <AHCHANG@scuacc.scu.edu>
Subject: CHAPTER 1 ? ? ?
To: SFRAVES@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <1CA77376C001CB58@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
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X-Vms-Cc: AHCHANG

Does anyone know if Chapter ONe is happening tonite.......?
I heard that it has been cancelled !
Can anyone reconfirm that ?

ThanX
K.C.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May 15 11:01:48 1993
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From: uNiBrOw <unibrow@ecst.csuchico.edu>
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Subject: D.J. EFX & Juanito ?????
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Sat, 15 May 93 11:01:21 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Hello...

I have a question..  About 6 years ago I used to D.J. little house parties
in my town.  I had a few records from local bay area DJ's.  One was
Juanito (Oakland), and the other was DJ EFX (SF).  I had pulled out those old
records the other day and me and my friend got into a argument about what
type of music they were.  The songs were basically just mixes comprised of
10-20 second bites of the days latest hip-hop dance music.  Anyway.  My
question is this.  Would that type of music be considered Acid House???  My
friend seams to think so..  I totally disagree and think it is just a mix
of dance and hip hop music.  Nothing special..  I have always thought that
Acid house was the same thing as house.  BTW  Does anyone know if DJ EFX
is still around??  I think he is, and is still Dj'ing at the clubs.  Anyway
thats about it.

UnIbRoW


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Sat May 15 15:52:32 1993
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>From fung@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu  Sat May 15 15:51:43 1993
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From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Sat May 15 22:02:32 1993
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>From dougt@apple.com  Sat May 15 21:59:30 1993
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Date: Sat, 15 May 93 21:57:12 -0700
>From: Doug Terrebonne <dougt@apple.com>
Message-Id: <9305160457.AA13803@apple.com>
To: ETCXIAAF@karl.acc.iit.edu, alt.rave@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu,
        mw-raves@engin.umich.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  TECHNO MIX TAPE FOR SALE

Hi, I'm interested in your mix tapes... You still got some?

Doug

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 16 03:19:06 1993
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From: deltorto@aol.com
X-Mailer: America Online Mailer
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: End of the Universe Hacked
Date: Sun, 16 May 93 06:15:59 EDT
Message-Id: <9305160615.tn21937@aol.com>

Hi Everybody,

This is FYI.

Apologies for any overlaps if you get this twice. Note: I was in the
Netherlands last year and crashed/partied with these guys and gals and
they're ALL RIGHT kinds-a folks. This should be a real feth-ti-val for those
who can make it over there. The central Netherlands area is noted for the
lack of a "There" there, but what they lack in "There-ness," they more than
make up for with a wonderful sense of wackiness.

   Subliminal Hint:  l e t ' s   a l l   g o ...

Peace,
          ^ ^
  dave    '['                      ...Clip the Clipper Chip!
           u 
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------
H A C K I N G   A T   T H E   E N D   O F   T H E   U N I V E R S E
-------------------------------------------------------------------

                                     An 'in-tents' summer congress
H U H?
-------

Remember the Galactic Hacker Party back in 1989? Ever wondered what
happened to the people behind it? We sold out to big business, you
think. Think again, we're back!

That's right. On august 4th, 5th and 6th 1993, we're organising a
three-day summer congress for hackers, phone phreaks, programmers,
computer haters, data travellers, electro-wizards, networkers, hardware
freaks, techno-anarchists, communications junkies, cyberpunks, system
managers, stupid users, paranoid androids, Unix gurus, whizz kids, warez
dudes, law enforcement officers (appropriate undercover dress required),
guerilla heating engineers and other assorted bald, long-haired and/or
unshaven scum. And all this in the middle of nowhere (well, the middle
of Holland, actually, but that's the same thing) at the Larserbos
campground four metres below sea level.

The three days will be filled with lectures, discussions and workshops
on hacking, phreaking, people's networks, Unix security risks, virtual
reality, semafun, social engineering, magstrips, lockpicking,
virusses, paranoia, legal sanctions against hacking in Holland and
elsewhere and much, much more. English will be the lingua franca for
this event, although some workshops may take place in Dutch. There
will be an Internet connection, an intertent ethernet and social
interaction (both electronic and live). Included in the price are four
nights in your own tent. Also included are inspiration, transpiration,
a shortage of showers (but a lake to swim in), good weather
(guaranteed by god), campfires and plenty of wide open space and fresh
air. All of this for only 100 dutch guilders (currently around US$70).

We will also arrange for the availability of food, drink and smokes of
assorted types, but this is not included in the price. Our bar will be
open 24 hours a day, as well as a guarded depository for valuables
(like laptops, cameras etc.). You may even get your stuff back! For
people with no tent or air matress: you can buy a tent through us for
100 guilders, a matress costs 10 guilders. You can arrive from 17:00
(that's five p.m. for analogue types) on August 3rd. We don't have to
vacate the premises until 12:00 noon on Saturday, August 7 so you can
even try to sleep through the devastating Party at the End of Time
(PET) on the closing night (live music provided). We will arrange for
shuttle buses to and from train stations in the vicinity.


H O W ?
-------

Payment: In advance only. Even poor techno-freaks like us would like
to get to the Bahamas at least once, and if enough cash comes in we
may just decide to go. So pay today, or tomorrow, or yesterday, or in
any case before Friday, June 25th 1993. Since the banks still haven't
figured out why the Any key doesn't work for private international
money transfers, you should call, fax or e-mail us for the best way to
launder your currency into our account. We accept American Express,
even if they do not accept us. But we are more understanding than they
are. Foreign cheques go directly into the toilet paper recycling bin
for the summer camp, which is about all they're good for here.


H A !
-----

Very Important: Bring many guitars and laptops.


M E ?
-----

Yes, you! Busloads of alternative techno-freaks from all over the
planet will descend on this event. You wouldn't want to miss that,
now, would you?

Maybe you are part of that select group that has something special to
offer! Participating in 'Hacking at the End of the Universe' is
exciting, but organising your very own part of it is even more fun. We
already have a load of interesting workshops and lectures scheduled,
but we're always on the lookout for more. We're also still in the
market for people who want to help us organize this during the
congress.

In whatever way you wish to participate, call, write, e-mail or fax us
soon, and make sure your money gets here on time. Space is limited.


S O :
-----

> 4th, 5th and 6th of August

> Hacking at the End of the Universe
      (a hacker summer congress)

> ANWB groepsterrein Larserbos
      (Flevopolder, Netherlands)

> Cost: fl. 100,- (+/- 70 US$) per person
      (including 4 nights in your own tent)


M O R E   I N F O :
-------------------

Hack-Tic
Postbus 22953
1100 DL  Amsterdam
The Netherlands

tel     : +31 20 6001480
fax     : +31 20 6900968
E-mail  : heu@hacktic.nl

V I R U S :
-----------
If you know a forum or network that you feel this message belongs on,
by all means slip it in. Echo-areas, your favorite bbs, /etc/motd, IRC,
WP.BAT, you name it. Spread the worm, uh, word.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 16 16:23:49 1993
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Date: Sun, 16 May 93 16:12:54 -0800
From: Robert Jesse <rjesse@us.oracle.com>
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: house spirit in Aikido
Reply-To: rnj%lila@us.oracle.com

how is the japanese martial art of Aikido like House?  i was reading Aikido  
Primer by Eric Sotnak, and was struck by the closing of the document:

	The following are some of the founder's teachings concerning
	the essence of aikido:

	Aikido is a manifestation of a way to reorder the world of
	humanity as though everyone were of one family. Its purpose is to
	build a paradise right here on earth.

	Aikido is nothing but an expression of the spirit of Love for
	all living things.

	It is important not to be concerned with thoughts of victory
	and defeat. Rather, you should let the ki of your thoughts and
	feelings blend with the Universal.

	Aikido is not an art to fight with enemies and defeat them.
	It is a way to lead all human beings to live in harmony with each
	other as though everyone were one family. The secret of aikido is
	to make yourself become one with the universe and to go along with
	its natural movements. One who has attained this secret holds the
	universe in him/herself and can say, ``I am the universe.''

	If anyone tries to fight me, it means that s/he is going to
	break harmony with the universe, because I am the universe. At the
	instant when s/he conceives the desire to fight with me, s/he is
	defeated.

	Nonresistance is one of the principles of aikido. Because
	there is no resistance, you have won before even starting. People
	whose minds are evil or who enjoy fighting are defeated without a
	fight.

	The secret of aikido is to cultivate a spirit of loving
	protection for all things.

	I do not think badly of others when they treat me unkindly.
	Rather, I feel gratitude towards them for giving me the opportunity
	to train myself to handle adversity.

	You should realize what the universe is and what you are
	yourself. To know yourself is to know the universe.

the Primer is 25 pages.  if you'd like a copy, let me know and i'll send you  
back the LaTeX source.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 16 16:34:39 1993
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From: rave@leland.stanford.edu
Message-Id: <9305162330.AA24195@sunlight.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: EARTH BEAT-YEAH!!!
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Sun, 16 May 93 16:30:43 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Hmmm.....a brief word about Earth Beat for those who missed it. It was great, as most parties associated with Martin are, it was cool to see a team of female promoters pumping up the scene...anyhow, it was in some heavy-metal club on Gilman street, not the best location, but the music, vibe, people made up for it--just an indicator that the promoters were there for us, when they ran out of waater temporarily, they started giving away juices that they were previously selling...cool..a final word...MARKIE IS THE MAN!!!...incredible set, tweaked everyone over the top into la la land......peace....aaron

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 16 17:59:34 1993
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>From dms!curly!grigsby@netcom.com  Sun May 16 17:57:23 1993
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>From: dms!curly!grigsby@netcom.com (Spiral Death Trap)
Message-Id: <9305170053.AA19255@curly.agames.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu
Subject: Earth Beat location?


By "some heavy metal club on Gilman street" I hope you're not talking
about 924 Gilman street, the nucleus of the Bay Area punk scene for the
last 8 million years.  Cooperatively run, shows are never more than $5 +
$2/yr membership, no asshole security.  I've seen some of my favorite
shows ever in that space over the past several years.  If raves were 
run with as much attention to people before profits it would be viewed
as miraculous.  They're about as cool as you can get and still be legal.

Of course, I can't speak for the promoters that used the space, but it
sounds like everyone had a good time.  This could be a good bridge between
two groups that normally don't get along: punks and ravers.  Unless it
was someplace else, in which case I'll say that you should try going to
a show there sometime anyway.  Info line is 510-525-9926.

// g

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 09:03:46 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305171600.AA22184@slack>
Subject: A raver's view of the Grateful Dead
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 10:00:13 -0600 (MDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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I managed to get tickets for all three days of the Sting/Grateful Dead show in
Las Vegas.  Becky, the girlfriend of my best friend John, is a big Deadhead
and through her talents, we all managed to snag an entire weekend.

I'll be blunt.  I went to see Sting.  I had seen the Dead once before, in 1986
when they had come to Park West, Utah.  It was more out of curiosity than
appreciation for their music then.  There was a large amount of curiosity in
play this time as well, since I wanted to compare notes between the Deadhead
scene and the rave scenes that I had become so enamored of over the past year.

The first day, Friday, I only got to see the last song of Sting's set, "When
The World is Running Down".  I was surprised to see how energetic Sting was.
The last few tours he was musically strong, but visually limp.  This time he
was running around, jumping, and even stirring the audience on.  I was
surprised at the reception the Deadheads were giving Sting as well, warm and
appreciative.

Most of the Friday's Grateful Dead performance was lost in the muddle of my
mind.  John and I were both disinterested after a few songs.  Once the drum
solo of "Space" had occured, we returned to the floor to check things out.
Amazingly enough, we found that we were boogying quite nicely to this almost
tribal improvisation.  John wanted to see what the speaker stacks were like
close-up, so we walked right up to them.  I doubt you could that at any other
stadium concert.  Feeling the beat rushing through us, and the occasional
whooshes of bass from something he was hitting, we almost felt at home to the
thump thump thump of our own rave's bass bins.

After the show, we wandered the "mall".  I bought a tie dyed shirt with Winnie
The Pooh on it.  We met some friends, then took off for the motel where we
were staying.

Saturday, I made certain that we got there EARLY, so I could see what I came
for.  Sting put on another strong performance.  I was about fifty yards back
from the stage.  Again, I was amazed at the treatment given to him.  Someone
had even made a banner, "Welcome Sting" to go along with several other Dead
banners.

I'd started to notice the shirts.  It seemed that everyone had a unique
version.  The practice of stealing product logos by ravers for their T's had
long been in practice by Deadheads, and frankly they do it better.  Some
absolutely hilarious versions.  My favorites was definitely the dosed Calvin
& Hobbes.  I also got involved in a large marshmellow with a hundred other
people.  This, plus the tossing around of large balloons and beach balls made
it a concert event that was quite different from anything else I'd attended.
Yet still, their music failed to move me.  The prime example was the final
song, covering "Lucy in the Sky With Diamonds".  The audience would clap the
beat out before the chorus, then it would fall off a cliff into s mush of
netherland.  Why?

After the concert, we returned to the mall again.  This time stumbling upon
the "disco bus."  A large white bus where they had turned their internal sound
system external and were playing bits of 70's disco over the loud speakers.
There was an absolute MOB there and it was pumping hard when we arrived.  I
must have kicked myself a thousand times for not bringing down the sound
system and setting up the tables.  John and I had discussed doing it, but we
feared that nobody would accept the idea and we'd have wasted our time.  Now,
seeing 200 or so people jumping in a parking lot to "YMCA" made me ache to
have brought the rave culture together with the Dead culture.  I took a wild
chance and asked the people in the bus if they had any Orb.  They looked at me
like I was from a different planet, and I'm not even sure if they knew that I
was referring to music.  Oh well, maybe next year.

The last day, I caught all of Sting's set again, and it was completely
different from Saturday's set.  The highlight was hearing "Everything Little
Thing She Does is Magic" live for the first time.  The crowd absolutely
stormed over that.  The rest of the day was spent with a new found friend, who
unfortunately, had to leave early to catch her plane back to Seattle.  During
the first intermission between Dead sets, we spent some time in the drum
circle, then I walked her up to the phone booth where she had to phone a cab,
then leave.  She asked if I wouldn't rather be watching the show and I
guffawed over that comment.  Nothing about their music had ignited me to dance
yet.  As we were waiting in line for the phone, I could hear the Dead
returning to the stage again.  A half hour later and my friend was gone.

I walked back into the stadium and to my amazement, heard a funky 4/4 beat
coming off the stage.  Not only that, but Jerry was throwing off this lilting,
absolutely beautiful guitar line.  I looked at the audience itself and could
*see* the vibes flow over the entire arena as the beatwaves moved to the back.
So, THIS is "Morning Dew", the only song I'd seen a shirt for.  I couldn't
help myself, I ran down to the floor and danced like mad.  The energy was so
powerful at that time that the air was almost sparking.  I felt that the two
scenes weren't so different after all.  Each of them striving for that one
solitary moment where you just don't care about life's problems anymore.

As I was walking out, I saw a person's shirt which seemed to fit the moment
exactly.  "Were they ever here at all?" it read.  There was something
mystical, etherial and strange about the entire weekend.  It was like I was
visiting a different planet after all, but it was one that I could somehow
connect with anyway.  The square peg had fit in the round hole and I enjoyed
my stay.  This could become an additional addiction in the years to come.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 09:38:09 1993
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From: Andy Knight <AndyK@apricot.co.uk>
To: SFRaves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Subject: SFRaves...What are you?
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 16:23:00 BST
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To Whomever??

What exactley are you ? A bullitin board sys or something like that??!!!! If 
you are tell me if I can subscribe to more stuff from you??

I got your address from UK-Dance Info network. Sounding out the "End of the 
universe" hack event.

Hear from you soon!

Ta!!!!....

Andy

          Andyk@apricot.co.uk

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 09:45:16 1993
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Date: 14 May 1993 19:21:18 U
From: "Glenn Fajardo,USA" <glenn.fajardo@aldus.com>
Subject: RE: For the Seattle posse
To: "MykL G" <mcg@netcom.com>, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU

howdy howdy howdy from another seattle raver.  Sharon was good good good but
the after party was even better.  Every rave gets better than the last up here
because people are finally grasping the concept of a positive vibe.  It is wild
to be involved in this scene as it is growing--it has taken a couple years to
get here but I think this summer it will explode.  The crowd is becoming more
and more diverse and the smiles are getting bigger...and more extatic!!!

          bye bye baby bye bye.     ameeeeeee.  (borrowing tigger's account)   
_______________________________________________________________________________
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: MykL G on Sun, May 9, 1993 6:51 PM
Subject: For the Seattle posse
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: uunet!netcom.com!mcg (MykL G)
Subject: For the Seattle posse

Did anyone in the Northwest crew go to the Rave Called Sharon up
in Seatlle last night?  If so, can you post or drop me note on how it
went?  I have a friend who really wants to know how it came off.

Thanks,

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 09:47:42 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305171618.AA08935@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: Groove Kitchen


	Well, the last Groove Kitchen went out with a bang!
	By 4 a.m. the Vibe was so thick you needed a hack saw to cut it :)
	Jon ? started with some great tunes, including some break beat which
	I actually got into., Jon Williams worked OVERTIME and comeout as the
	hero of this Groove Kitchen laying down a serious set, followed by rick
	preston who pushed us all through the StarGate into the next dimension.
	I was great to see so many familiar faces around me and for the first 
	in a long time, amybe the first time this year, I felt completely safe
	to TOTALLY TRANCE and completely go off, I danced from midnight to
	7 a with about a 30 minute break in between When Doc Martin didn't
	show Jon Williams came back and throwed down an even more intense
	set than the first one!  I think the lot of us went past just trance
	to the level of "group mind" (for lack of a better word) that place
	where all ego is gone and you all just merge into one psychic ball
	of consciousness.  This was the kind of a party that makes you glad
	that you are a speaker-tweeker.

	After splitting at about 8, I got a ride from ark Ameba over to
	boogie buffet but it wasn't happening so we split, got some breakfast
	and then I crashed for about 3 hours got up and heaed to the beach
	on foot (bus actually, my car is not fixed yet).  I arrived at the 
	original site only to find it deserted.  I saw some ravers that told me
	it had been moved to sloat street.  So I started the 2 mile walk down
	great highway toward sloat. Got picked up by nrg and family along the
	way, we got conflicting reports that nothing was happening, that it was
	happening, etc. Eventually we rounded to corner and found about 100
	ravers lying out in the beach with a reasonably good sound system
	and Carlos spinning but no one dancing.  This group eventually
	grew to about 200 people and out of the blue up pops Jon Williams again
	(boy this guy is everwhere) who plays yet another killer set!  He got
	a lot of people off their collective butt and on the dancesand :)

	All in all a great weekend.  I did make some observations and some
	personal decisions this weekend which I will share in a separate post.


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 09:49:59 1993
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Date: 13 May 1993 12:03:17 U
From: "Glenn Fajardo,USA" <glenn.fajardo@aldus.com>
Subject: From the Seattle posse- A Rave Called Sharon:Prophecy
To: "MykL G" <mcg@netcom.com>, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU

Hi Mykle,

A Rave Called Sharon:Prophecy turned out to be pretty good despite some
organization setbacks.  The fliers weren't distributed until a few days before
the event and the location wasn't pinned down until late that night.  Rumors of
a cancellation were also being spread around by one of the promoters who was
throwing a party that night as well.  It was held at the Omni in Kent.  An OK
location, not the greatest.  The vibes were HIGH that night.  From my
experience, it was a really friendly event.  And the DJ's were fantastic. 
There was a woman spinning at one time, i forget her name, who was Excellent! 
She came up with some excellent excellent trance and tribal mixes that had
EVERYONE grooving.  Someone said that she was from England.  The grooves and
vibes really started kickin' around 3am.  Spun started his magic at about that
time.  Need I say more??? 

Everyone up here in Seattle is hoping that we get a bigger influx of promoters
from the Bay Area.  The one big promoter up here doesn't really have a clue as
to what vibe is about and tends to be hardcore LA style in the way he does his
parties.

Tigger


_______________________________________________________________________________
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: MykL G on Sun, May 9, 1993 6:51 PM
Subject: For the Seattle posse
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: uunet!netcom.com!mcg (MykL G)
Subject: For the Seattle posse

Did anyone in the Northwest crew go to the Rave Called Sharon up
in Seatlle last night?  If so, can you post or drop me note on how it
went?  I have a friend who really wants to know how it came off.

Thanks,

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 09:53:31 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 09:50:11 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305171650.AA01463@well.sf.ca.us>
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  A raver's view of the Grateful Dead

Hey Pete, Before local promoter Malachy was injured he would regularly do a
party called Atomic Rooster which ttok palce in the parking lot of the last
night of Dead runs at the Oakland coliseum. First one I whent to featured
Jeno, Garth and Markie. Killer groove, free, and ravers and deadheads seemed
to click real well...

peace, and let the good times rave!
nrg

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 09:57:13 1993
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From: EKSE <EKSE@corral.uwyo.edu>
Subject: I'm a traveling guy
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
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Scanning the last batch of sfrave mail, I noticed an entry from someone in Seattle.  Living in the high country of Wyoming I only ge
t to rave a few times a year and I will be in the Seattle Tacoma area between May 29 and June 13.  If anyone has dates of events in 
the area I would like to know and come check it out.  I also live within a few hours of Denver and if anyone at CU DU or CSU knows w
hats up, contact me at

EKSE@outlaw.uwyo.edu  (university of wyoming, Laramie)

Thanks in advance EKSE.


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 09:57:57 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 09:54:05 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305171654.AA02261@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: TRANCE MISSION ALERT!

Last night at Tilt-a-Whirl Goa Gil went **FULLY NUTS** Hours of endless,
hard, hardcore trance. Loud and clean... Serious groove. had a great time
with Gray, Leg of Eel, Derik and Ovid (sp?)... Real change of pace...check
it out next time...

peace, and let the good times rave!
nrg

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 10:33:11 1993
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From: Simon Loewenthal <sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com>
Subject: Mdma intake control structured design system. v 1.0.0 - beta release.
To: uk-dance mailing list <uk-dance@orbital.demon.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 18:25:09 BST
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1]


Dear all,

cc: sfraves

more idle burbble from Simon.

Rcv'ed this from a friend of mine who is at Loughbourgh Uni up north.
Wonder if I could find some sort of IT based tie in with this project :-)
( Ps. Nicky, this is the Marc in the van to Donnington with dreaded hair! )

Anyway, message continues...

fwd'ed from humbm@lut.ac.uk:

Had an intersting lecture on Friday on models of heat control and
thermoregulatory enviromental models....And there I had a great idea for
my project, it would go something like this:

	o Calculate the body's metabolic rate and sweat rate whilst raving.

	o correalte this with different in takes of MDMA

	o Assess the isulatory values of typical ravers clothes/hats/gloves
	  (measured in clo.)
	
	o Assess the thermal enviroment in different clubs at different times.
	  This would include: -Air temp
			      -Relative humidity
			      -Air velocity
			      -Radient Air temp.

	o Using a mathematical model of the Human (already on our human 
	  sciences lan) it would be possible to produce a database of how
	  many pills/time actually dancing you need to pass before suffering
	  heat stroke and death. Now this sound morbid, but just imagine
	  being able to say as you enter a club, for example AWOL, that you
	  can:
		-allow half an hour to "come up"
		-after x amount of time you will enter the model's warning
		 level. But because you have calculated that your heat balance
		 is being disrupted by the thermal storage value of your white
		 gloves and hat, you can take them off, your body will be 
		 thermally balanced and you can continue with coplete exertion
		-After y amount of time the club is beginning to seriously
		 heat up. There is no air movement and your sweat rate is
		 insufficient to allow normal evaporation. Carry on like this
		 and you'll be exhusted before your time. Hence the model
		 tells you to take a break. The body can also handle another
		 Heart, but NOT a China White.
		-After a short rest, you can continue, following the guidance
		 of the model.

And hence you will have a database of optimum drug intake within different
clubs at different times wearing different clothes. The possibilities are
endless....You could calculate your dress at a do on the North pole, working
out how many layers to wear to commence, and how long you'd need to be 
dancing/how many pills you'd need before you could be raving butt naked.
Obviosly in such a condition a psychological dimension on the model would
also reveal how raving mad you are as well.

The possibilities are endless. With the coming of Cyber Tribe, the 
technologisation and miniturisation of our society, imagine the ulimate
E-Heads application. The database inside your wrist watch work station, with
MDMA carefully delivered into the bloodstream via a form of osmosis from the
watch, at the precise intervals to keep you going, warm you up or, by
withholding doses, cool you down. Various settings would be availible:
experimenter, weekend raver, nutter, seriously caned, mashed beyond belief,
suicidal, and a variety of user programmable options. Just tell the watch
which club your in, fill it's tank with your choice of MDMA and away you
go.........


Fwd,ed message ends.

So this is what students do! Wonder if I can get a paying job
as a student. ( Does not include grant ).


--


Suddenly it was all clear......		We got some serious problems here,
					and most of them yours!
Bye Bye		////
n-joi           o o               o	voice: +44 81 742 4093
./sjl            }              o	sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com
               \__/===========o		Simon's lack of email address's

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-  If something is too hard to do,  then its not worth doing - Homer Simpson -
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 10:46:02 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305170952.ZM21435@nmtvs313>
Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 09:52:32 -0700
In-Reply-To: uNiBrOw <ames!ecst.csuchico.edu!unibrow>
        "D.J. EFX & Juanito ?????" (May 15, 11:01am)
References: <9305151801.AA15112@cscihp.ecst.csuchico.edu>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: uNiBrOw <ames!ecst.csuchico.edu!unibrow>, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: & Juanito ?????



D.J. EFX is still around, I believe he is a member of Bobby G's
Soul Disco record pool, call Bobby at 431-1758 if you want to
 find him.

Lat,

*

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 11:49:09 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305171846.AA22699@slack>
Subject: Re: A raver's view of the Grateful Dead
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 12:46:24 -0600 (MDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 622       

> What is a "large marshmellow"? Inquiring minds, well, you know the rest...
> 
> >I also got involved in a large marshmellow with a hundred other
> >people.

I noticed this unfortunate typo after it was too late.

"large marshmellow fight"

It is where someone brings a couple bags of marshmellows and then starts
hucking them at random targets below them in the grandstand.  There was one
point where it was like living in a hot cross-fire area, and there were
zillions of marshmellows in the air.  It was light activity the first day,
moderate the second day, then the third day, it seemed like everyone brought a
bag.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 12:24:25 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 93 12:04:51 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305171904.AA09054@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: SFRaves...What are you?


> From medisg1.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org Mon May 17 09:43:14 1993
> Return-Path: <medisg1.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org>
> From: Andy Knight <AndyK@apricot.co.uk>
> To: SFRaves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
> Subject: SFRaves...What are you?
> Date: Mon, 17 May 93 16:23:00 BST
> Encoding: 16 TEXT
> X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0
> Content-Length: 325
> X-Lines: 17
> Status: RO
> 
> 
> 
> To Whomever??
> 
> What exactley are you ? A bullitin board sys or something like that??!!!! If 
> you are tell me if I can subscribe to more stuff from you??
> 
> I got your address from UK-Dance Info network. Sounding out the "End of the 
> universe" hack event.
> 
> Hear from you soon!
> 
> Ta!!!!....
> 
> Andy
> 
>           Andyk@apricot.co.uk
> 
	Well Folks... do we all write at once or do we let brian
	Respond first. I vote for Brina responding and then we can all
	post/comment afterwards.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
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From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 12:45:09 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 93 12:32:32 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <rramstad@us.oracle.com>
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Pete Ashdown's message of Mon, 17 May 1993 10:00:13 -0600 (MDT) <9305171600.AA22184@slack>
Subject: A raver's view of the Grateful Dead
Reply-To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com


maybe I should have retitled this "a raver's/deadhead's view of a
raver's view of the Grateful Dead" :-)

If you aren't interested in hearing some comments on what Pete said
about the Vegas shows, plus a brief tie-in with raving, delete this
sucker NOW!  You have been warned.

Sting's set on Saturday was virtually identical to the one on Friday,
which bothered a lot of people, me included.  "He's got a great
repertoire, why the hell is he playing exactly the same songs?"
Sunday was completely unique, including a ripping "Purple Haze" of all
things, except for "Every Little Thing She Does Is Magic" which was a
repeat from Friday.  

Why all the wonderment at how Sting was received by the 'heads?  A lot
of people I know were skeptical, but by Sunday, they were all pretty
happy with having Sting along for the rest of the (major venue shows
on the) summer tour.  Sting has EXCELLENT professional musicians
backing him up, and frankly, they wail, a kick ass band.  'Nuff said.

> As we were waiting in line for the phone, I could hear the Dead
> returning to the stage again.  A half hour later and my friend was
> gone.

> I walked back into the stadium and to my amazement, heard a funky 4/4
> beat coming off the stage.  Not only that, but Jerry was throwing off
> this lilting, absolutely beautiful guitar line.  I looked at the
> audience itself and could *see* the vibes flow over the entire arena
> as the beatwaves moved to the back.  So, THIS is "Morning Dew", the
> only song I'd seen a shirt for.  I couldn't help myself, I ran down to

Actually, this was almost certainly "Terrapin Station", my all time
favorite Dead tune.  And a lot of other 'heads feel the same way...
plus it got a strong strong reaction, because no one was expecting it
(it was too late in the set to go into a long song, most people were
expecting the start of Drumz, me included, even though I told friends
that I was hoping for a Terrapin and an Other One before the show.)

Setlist for Sunday for the record:

 I: Touch of Grey, Walking Blues, Althea, Masterpiece, Row Jimmy,
    Cassidy.

II: Samson and Delilah, Help on the Way > Slipknot! > 
    Franklin's Tower > Looks Like Rain > Terrapin Station >> 
    Drumz > Space > The Other One > Wharf Rat > Throwing Stones > 
    Lovelight.

 E: Brokedown Palace.

and yeah, Terrapin started about 30 - 35 minutes into the second set.
Oh, and there are a LOT of shirts for Terrapin, too :-)

> the floor and danced like mad.  The energy was so powerful at that
> time that the air was almost sparking.  I felt that the two scenes
> weren't so different after all.  Each of them striving for that one
> solitary moment where you just don't care about life's problems
> anymore.

Precisely.  The goal is the grand "ego dissolve", which occurs when
the feeling that life's problems don't matter anymore is strengthened
and generalized.  This happens at raves and at Dead shows, people on
drugs and people sober.  Another symptom is an increasing feeling of
unity with everything and everyone.

Enough of my blithering, but yes, there is a strong strong connection
between the peak moments of the rave experience and the peak moments
of the deadhead experience, the routes are different, but the result
is the same.  I absolutely see this, and have had equally intense
moments at both events.  Call me a dual-citizen, if you will.

And boy, if you think Vegas is a marginally weird place, try visiting
when 60,000 deadheads are in town :-)

Bob




From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 12:54:34 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 93 12:15:08 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305171915.AA09069@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, nrg@well.sf.ca.us
Subject: Re: TRANCE MISSION ALERT!


> From medisg1.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org Mon May 17 10:13:31 1993
> Return-Path: <medisg1.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org>
> Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 09:54:05 -0700
> From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
> To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
> Subject: TRANCE MISSION ALERT!
> Content-Length: 283
> X-Lines: 7
> Status: RO
> 
> Last night at Tilt-a-Whirl Goa Gil went **FULLY NUTS** Hours of endless,
> hard, hardcore trance. Loud and clean... Serious groove. had a great time
> with Gray, Leg of Eel, Derik and Ovid (sp?)... Real change of pace...check
> it out next time...
> 
> peace, and let the good times rave!
> nrg
> 

	I'M READY! 

	I don't have a car right now but I want to know when he'll be
	playing, I really wanna hear him.
	So if anybody is going and needs a friend to tak along (hint :)

	I'M THERE!

				G
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
        If I can't Trance, I don't want to be part of your revolution
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 13:07:20 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 20:57:27 BST
Message-Id: <10201.9305171957@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: Geoff White's message of Mon, 17 May 93 12:04:51 PDT <9305171904.AA09054@nexsys.nexsys.net>
Subject: Re: SFRaves...What are you?

>>>>> On Mon, 17 May 93 12:04:51 PDT, geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White) said:



> To Whomever??
> 
> What exactley are you ? A bullitin board sys or something like that??!!!! If 
> you are tell me if I can subscribe to more stuff from you??
> 
> 
  Geoff> 	Well Folks... do we all write at once or do we let brian
  Geoff> 	Respond first. I vote for Brina responding and then we can all
  Geoff> 	post/comment afterwards.


I've already replied -- and I copied it to uk-dance in case anyone
else on that list has the list address and admin address confused...


	Cosmic Roy

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 13:28:07 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 93 12:59:03 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305171959.AA09147@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: Some Thoughts on the Scene


	I did a lot of thinking this weekend about the Scene, its potential
	and it's fate.  These are my observations and decisions.  They are
	based on my observations of not only the Scene as it is today but
	the things that "went before" (Since I'm a little older then some,
	I do remember the summer of love although I was a mere 10 years old
	at the time). I'd like to get comments from some of the "elders"
	on the list like will who has seen and done much more than I have...

	1. Eventhough their are retro elements to this Scene with regard to
	   the "hippy" Scene they are not the same.

	2. Human Nature has progressed some since the 1960`s but not as much
	   as some of us would like to belive.

	3. Even if the Scene dies as did the "hippie" movement, it will still
	   make an impact.  Remember, it is part of the natural order of an
	   ecosystem to experience birth, life, reproduction and death.

	4. Much as many of you younger folks resist it, the rave Scene is
	   the child of the hippie movement, many of the people in the 
	   Scene were born around 67 - 70, at the hight of the vibe of this
	   movement, many of your parents had high hopes for what you would 
	   do and, in many ways, the Scene is a continuation of many of those
	   principles.

	5. As with any form of energy, as you get further away from the source
	   in time and space, there is a diminishing and coagulation.  As the
	   Scene gets bigger and more exposed and available, it will change,
	   some for the better, but largely for the worst.  Out of the wake-up
	   of the 60's we had a major push in civil rights, the ending of an
	   unjust war (many of the flower children went away to vietnam and 
	   came back in a box, this mobilized many of them to action, how 
	   would you feel if Brian got drafted and then 6 months later, he was
	   dead, followed by leah, or dana... it would have an impact, I tell
	   you.) some people decided that the only way to fight fire was with
	   fire, they formed groups like the Black Panthers, the Weathermen,
	   SLA, etc. While I may agree with the causes that a lot of these
	   groups fought for, I can clearly see the result of meeting violence
	   with direct violence (at least in these cases). Eventualy a lot of
	   people got "lost" in the 60's, but not all, some "went back to the
	   land" and are still there, raising kids and silently trying to seed
	   a new generation.   Some used the rock group that they already had
	   as a vehicle for social change, some started Ice Cream stores and
	   some ran for public office.  Some were murdered, imprisoned or
	   exiled by the government (yes this DOES happen in america).
	   The question we must ask is how do we learn from what happened before
	   and use this knowledge to our best advantage.  Maybe it can be 
	   different this time, maybe not.  My guess is that we will have so
	   incremental progress like before that we will bequith to OUR
	   children, who will carry on.  In evolution, things take time.

	6. I think the major contribution that the House Movement can make is
	   the KNOWING that we are all ONE.  Anybody who has been on the dance-
	   floor of a good rave at 4 am feels this, for some it is a religious
	   feeling, for some it is a physiological biological one but when we
	   experence relentless  drumming, it puts us in contact with something
	   that we all did a long long time ago, whether you are a soul sista
	   or a white boy, your ancestors all did this one primeval thing...
	   when we rave, we remeber.  In the 60's this was different, there
	   was ego loss but no awareness of group consciousness, accepting
	   someone of a different race, sexual preference, etc. was a concept
	   that was considered ideal but not practiced on an everyday sort of
	   way as it is in the rave scene, we as a group have gone beyond that
	   one, (we still need to work on sexism though!)

	7. What's next? I don't know.  I personaly think we have to learn new
	   models of government, based on consensus,.  Since we now have 
	   appropriate electronic communications mediums available, this is 
	   possible.  It was not possible in the 60's or even 80's.  It can
	   work but we have to unlearn some conditioning first, we are already
	   good ast this and have created a technology of de/reprogramming that
	   seems to work quite well :)

	8. Well for me, I will be throwing most of my energy into outdoor
	   alcohol free, all ages events.  I love clubs like Wicked and 
	   Groove Kitchen, but the smoke and the bad air are too much even
	   for a healthy person's immune system to fight off on a weekly
	   basis.  Also something special happens when we perfrom the rave
	   ritual out of doors,  Mother Earth talks to us (well she talks to
	   me :) shee communicates with here children in a deep way.  I think
	   Malachy knew this to be true, which is why he wanted to have small
	   outdoor intimate events.  I'm going to focus my energy on creating
	   real outdoor rave rituals of sound.  If they can be legal, fine.
	   If not well, I hope we don't have to resort to the tactics of the
	   Spiral Tribe here but if that has to happen then so be it.

	9. I don't know exactly what turn this will take with me.  I keep
	   telling myself that I don't want to be a promoter, it's to hard
	   to do the job with integrity all of the time, and I would try
	   to hard.  But maybe the way to do it is to just buy a sound
	   system and DIY do it yourself.  I think it will work better if
	   each person or at least no more that two people at a time buy
	   things jointly, this way we have more diversity of schedualing
	   (no committees to ask and no profits/losses to have to deal with
	   on a large scale, It's easy to get an oK schedual confirmation
	   from 2 as oppose to 20. But if we, as a group have a FEW people
	   around with sound systems, it increases our odds of making sure
	   that a lot of good parties will get thrown.  We already have an
	   ample pool of DJs some old and many new rising stars that need a 
	   chance to be heard. We have the Net for communication and
	   infrastructure, what we need are people with the fillowings
	   skills/resources:

		1. Sound Systems, or parts of sound systems, including
		   turntables and mixers.

		2. Access to Energy (Generators or easy access to rented 
		   generators, (we should start buying our own))

		3. People willing to work security for free. Outdoor events
		   need security.  Security is mostly looking around you 
		   for things in destress or things out of place, often the
		   problem is corrected by just standing in the vacinity.
		   There  already is an unofficial security network of sorts,
		   just people like me and a few others that look out for 
		   people in distress, we've began to recognize each other
		   but it needs to be a little more formal, like cpr and
		   first aid training.

		4. People who have cellular phones.  and/or portable laptops
		   with modems. I've even thought about this as a
		   safety device.  The cheap phones that are light and
		   reasonable are around $350, you can get deals on air
		   time including "unlimited weekend access" for about
		   $60. The light phones that support conventional modems
		   seem to be around $700 but if anyone has any better info
		   let me know. (Who says you can't bring vrave to bonny dune?
		   :)

		5. People willing to invest/loose :) money throwing events.
		   Some folks can afford to invest various amounts of
		   money without it seriously impacting their life
		   style, we can think of a way that they can feel good
		   about doing this.  They should go in knowing that
		   the primary purpose of the event is to generate the
		   Vibe in the best way possible and that they will
		   every effort will be made so that at least they
		   don't loose money and hopefully gain.  If money is
		   made they should feel as if they could take their
		   profits with out feeling guilty and also know that
		   they will be invited to donate their profit to the
		   group or to some other endevor.

		6. People who have various forms of transportation, from 
		   Trucks, 4-wheel drives, bikes, mobile homes, sports cars,
		   boats and planes.

		7. Ravers who are Hams. Are there any out there?

		8. People who love to volunteer, who can take orders as well
		   as give orders. (Anybody out there remember logistics teams?)

		9. People who love to take risk, we need these people to do the
		   thinks we're afraid to. :)

	       10. Law Hackers or Lawyers to help with those sticky situations
		   that we hope don't have to happen.

	       11. Media assasins, people who want to talk to the media and
		   are good at it.

	If anybody out there is interested in exploring this with me, write
	to me and maybe we can have some conversation off line or on another
	list.  I think if we want to have the Scene be good then we need to
	set an example for others to follow.


					G

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew            : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

                --PGP Public key available upon request--
      If I can Trance, I don't want to be part of your revolution
                                (stolen from monicat :)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 13:28:54 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 93 13:09:36 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305172009.AA09157@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: uk-dance@orbital.demon.co.uk, sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com
Subject: Re: Mdma intake control structured design system. v 1.0.0 - beta release.
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu



It's funny that you mention this.  The variables that you mentioned
is one reason I don't partake of e in big hot warehouse parties.  It is
also why I feel that you really need to stay healthy to be a hardcore raver.
I've found that when I want to really do a good underground on the edge rave,
I go sober cuz I'm more awake and my body can take more abuse, with out having
to worry about how much more my blood pressure is elivated by the drug.
But then, I've even cut out most of my coffee so just call me a health nut.

I for one believe in a.

It doesn't alter your body temperature much and has a much lower effect on
your heart rate, and blood pressure.


FOR THE NSA LINE REAPER:
I in no way shape or form condone or advocate  the use of illegal
or controlled substances.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 14:16:35 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 93 14:08:23 -0700
From: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Message-Id: <9305172108.AA01562@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Some suggestions to the organizers

Geoff White writes:

>        8. Well for me, I will be throwing most of my energy into outdoor
>           alcohol free, all ages events.  I love clubs like Wicked and 
>           Groove Kitchen, but the smoke and the bad air are too much even
>           for a healthy person's immune system to fight off on a weekly
>           basis.  Also something special happens when we perfrom the rave
>           ritual out of doors,  Mother Earth talks to us (well she talks to
>           me :) shee communicates with here children in a deep way.  I think
>           Malachy knew this to be true, which is why he wanted to have small
>           outdoor intimate events.  I'm going to focus my energy on creating
>           real outdoor rave rituals of sound.  If they can be legal, fine.
>           If not well, I hope we don't have to resort to the tactics of the
>          Spiral Tribe here but if that has to happen then so be it.

I totally agree...   I go to raves not only to schmooze and enlighten folks
on how they can protect their privacy,    but I also go for the totally 
awsome vibes,  exercize and refreshing mind enhancement that happens at
a rave.

Unfortuately,  raves DO take a lot out of my 50 yr old body.   The 12 hours
of continious dancing hardly phases me as long as I recognize my limitations
and deal with it in my own way,  by making good use of the chill out rooms
to do my yoga and stretching every so often.   I can proudly say that I can
do this WITHOUT DRUGS,  but I don't abhore the use of them by others,  as
I have always adopted a "Live and let live" attitude.

My biggest complaint is the heavy smoking going on EVERYWHERE... with no place
to go except outside (And THAT don't work if the establishment don't allow
"in's and out's").    I suffer immensely but it's a relativly small price I
have to pay to enjoy the rave scene.

I make a plea to the rave organizors to establish a smoke free chill out room
where allergic people like me can have a refuge and a break from the stale
smokey air.    This will not only increase the amount of ravers,  but will
get and encourage others to enjoy raving that normally cannot do it.

My recovery times take about 2 to 3 weeks,  depending on
the amount of smoke exposure I'm subjected to,  thus severly limits my raving,
unless I can catch an "outdoor event" which I haven't yet done.

I think that raves are a very healthy thing,  in fact,  it's the most heathy
trend thats come down the pipes in a long time.

Someone else has asked for some comments on the 60's era for those that have
been around that long.   I think the 90's are lots more healthey than the
60's were,  because of the rave music energy and lots of dancing that goes
on.    But remember,  that all it takes is for some dude that cannot handle
his drugs to ever-exert and die.    This will give raving a bad name,  so
lets do this with SOME moderation....  So far,  the scene is really great
and I promote it whole heartedly...  With that,  I got nothing else to say
other than "Rave on dudes!!..." and "Fight the clipper chip!".

Cheers
Cap'n Crunch
(An old hacker from another era)

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 14:40:38 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 93 14:24:52 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <rramstad@us.oracle.com>
To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com
Cc: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Bob Ramstad's message of Mon, 17 May 93 12:32:32 PDT <9305171932.AA09432@groovy.us.oracle.com>
Subject: A raver's view of the Grateful Dead
Reply-To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com


Correction: after hashing it out in email, the song that Pete really
dug at the Sunday Grateful Dead show in Las Vegas was "Franklin's
Tower", with the lyric "You better roll away, roll away the dew".
This is not even remotely similar to "Morning Dew" which is a
beautiful ballad, and it also not remotely similar to "Terrapin
Station" which is an epic poem... I just took the +30 minute figure
and the 4/4 with incredible Jerry guitar, and decided that he must
have meant Terrapin.  Sorry.  I'll spank myself now.

Yeah, you say now "who cares?" but remember this, and you'll be able
to bond more fully with your deadhead brothers at the next post-show
atomic rooster type gathering :-)

Bob

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 14:50:06 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 14:39:06 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White), sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: SFRaves...What are you?

I sent him a copy of the welcome message and said if he wanted to join
to just let me know.

I'm soon going to turn off the "sfraves@soda" alias and have it just
point to me, so that we capture a lot of people who hear about this
through Mondo 2K and other sources but aren't aware of the -request
part of the alias.  So please, remember to send your mail to
sfraves@sfraves.stanford.edu....

        Brian

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 15:24:11 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305172212.AA28267@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: A raver's view of the Grateful Dead
To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 15:12:13 PDT
Cc: pashdown%slack.sim.es.com%groovy@us.oracle.com,
        sfraves%medisg1.Stanford.EDU%groovy@us.oracle.com
In-Reply-To: <9305172124.AA09579@groovy.us.oracle.com>; from "Bob Ramstad" at May 17, 93 2:24 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Bob Ramstad sez:
> 
> 
> This is not even remotely similar to "Morning Dew" which is a
> beautiful ballad, and it also not remotely similar to "Terrapin
> Station" which is an epic poem... I just took the +30 minute figure


"Morning Dew" also was covered by Devo... killer version, IMHO.

-H-



-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 						   howard@netcom.com
		    Underground like a wild potato
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 15:59:27 1993
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From: SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU
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Apparently-To: sfraves-list1

>From elizabet@Cadence.COM  Mon May 17 15:56:24 1993
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>From: elizabet@Cadence.COM (Elizabeth Medel)
Message-Id: <9305172256.AA13315@cds8616>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Southbay SFR Lunch
Cc: elizabet@Cadence.COM


When: Tuesday, 18 May
Time: 12.00 noon
Where: Greer Park, Palo Alto

Directions:

* From 101 (South or North) take the Oregon Expressway Exit

* Left at the first signal (West Bayshore - it's a frontage road 
  that takes you south again)

* Follow this road approx. 1/4 mile (pass appartment complex on right)
  
* You will see the park on your right hand side. Park in the first
  carpark to your right.

* We'll meet on the grassy knoll

Bring lunch, music, toys, yourselves!

Hope to see you there!!

Elizabeth.


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 16:16:39 1993
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From: SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU
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>From stanbrid@student.msu.edu  Mon May 17 16:13:14 1993
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>From: Nicole E Stanbridge <stanbrid@student.msu.edu>
Message-Id: <9305172313.AA16333@student3.cl.msu.edu>
Subject: Please read!! (
To: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu (sfraves)
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 19:13:13 EDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

> >
> > > Anyone who is planning on going to his show PLEASE let me know.  I have a
> > friend who does sound for them and would like to get in touch with him again
. 
> I
> > > would like to get some people who are planning on attending the show to re
la
> y
> > > a message to him for me.  I know it will surprise the hell out of him.
> > >
> >   Here is the scope.  You will find him in facing the stage (but set away fr
om
>
> > > it) with all the sound and lighting shit.  He is tall with a gotee and
> > > basically shaved hair.  His name is Josh.  If the show is anything like ou
rs
>
> > > you should be able to walk right up to the area where he is mixing.
> > > I would like to send out an E-Mial to you and then if possible you could p
ri
> nt
> >
> > > it up and give it to him.   It would be great if this could really work ou
t.
>
> >
> > > Please let me know about this.  I hope to hear from a bunch of people at
> > > different locations so he could get a few messages from different shows at

> > > individual cities.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > THANK YOU  THANK YOU  THANK YOU  THANK YOU  THANK YOU   THANK YOU
> > > > >
> > > > > Pandora  (nicole)  (stanbrid@students.msu.edu)
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 16:20:05 1993
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From: SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU
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>From mayer@netcom.com  Mon May 17 16:15:47 1993
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To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu>
Subject: Me wants "atomic rooster" at shoreline shows! (was Re: A raver's view of the Grateful Dead )
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 17 May 93 09:50:11 PDT."
             <199305171650.AA01463@well.sf.ca.us> 
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 16:16:20 -0700
>From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


I haven't been to a dead show since '89ish (got bored with their
music), but the confluence of a number of events has lead me to
seek/find a ticket for Saturday's shoreline show.

It sure would be nice if there was some kind of DJ-in-the-lot deal
after the show, wouldn't it? (For those of use that need the 130 BPM fix).

Pretty please? I'll be happy to help with heavy lifting and tek-stuff!

Goddamn -- I've superglued myself to this here computer-chair until I
finish writing this &(*%^&$%^ program, so I'm ready to bust loose, come
next weekend. Dead show, rave, I don't care -- just gimme some vibe,
gimme some beat!

00000000011111111112222222222333333333344444444445555555555666666666677777777778
???            Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ???
12345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 16:28:06 1993
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From: zdross@ucdavis.edu
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 16:11:17 -0700
Message-Id: <9305172311.AA17447@othello.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Earth Beat

Earth Beat was a great time out there in Berkeley.  The party was nice and 
small in an appropriately sized place with lots of good vibes and dancing
energy.  Had a map point too, which I think is a good thing these days.

Mike was talking to Martin and he said that a Basics was coming up sometime
this summer.  Is this cool or what?  I can't wait to see all those familiar
faces again....

Went to DNA (afterlife) and had abig bummer:  those booths upstairs by the 
windows (my favorite spots there) have been moved out and replaced with
pool tables, and the windows covered with black shades.  Oh well, no more
afterlife for me, unless they move somewhere better.

The beach was happening nicely, basically a chill spot with a big stereo
to listen to.  I love these things.  I wish they had decided to locate at
the end of John Daly blvd. as the other party last week.  Maybe next time.
At one point a guy got on the mike and said that the party would be there
every weekend from now on, so hope to see you all there in the future.

Peace
Zak

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 16:53:31 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 16:43:07 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Weekend Update

        Groove Kitchen was definitely the place to be.  No attitude, lots
of smiling people, lots of familiar faces and at the same time lots of new
faces of people who seemed eager to mesh with the crowd.  The sound system
was nice and superclean (those Community speakers are great!).  The visuals
were great, especially downstairs in the wondeful ambient lounge (the best
ambient lounge I've been in inawhile, perhaps EVER - very little sound
bleeding from the main floor upstairs, tons of visuals, two Van Der Graff
generators (those balls of glass filled with plasma and an single electrode
shooting sparks to the surface, especially to where you touch it).  However,
my knee and back have been hurting me, and I couldn't dance for more than
about 15 minutes at a time :(  So I spent most of my time doing my Rip Van
Wrinkle imitation downstairs.... I didn't sleep Friday night (project at
work) so I couldn't help but catch some Z's there.

        So anyways, the next morning I hook up with Graham (one of the
guys responsible for trying to get the permits for GG Park).  The GGNRA
people are really dragging their feet on the whole issue and basically 
treating us like dirt as far as getting the permits and such.  The next
target date, bvtw, is May 30th to get the ball rolling, but if these 
parties at the beach can continue Graham might just stop trying to get
GG Park going.  

        Anyways we made a couple of trips playing "rave taxi", went and
picked up a generator, and planned on getting something together at the end of
Noriega street, about 6 blocks south of Lincoln in the sunset district,
where Noriega meets the ocean.  To make a long story short, the sound system
never arrived, and Graham and I told the approx 150 people who showed up
there to head down to Sloat where the other party was.  We left to return
the generator and go home, rather angry at the sound not showing but happy
that there was at least another party going on.

        Anyways, this is the second time a party I've been involved with
has had sound system problems.  This is not a good trend :(.

        Glad people had fun at the beach, I was just too exhausted by
all this to try and make it (plus I had an exam this morning to study for).
Hopefully the people throwing those parties will allow a wide variety of
DJ's to spin there.....

        Take care.

        Brian

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 17:41:49 1993
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From: Ravi Vinodrai Gadhia <rg@cs.stanford.edu>
Message-Id: <9305180035.AA09344@Xenon.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Groove Kickin'
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 17:34:58 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Hi all!

Hope everyone had a good weekend.  I sure did!

Decided to try something new this week--got massive
sleep on Friday night hoping to be fully charged
for Saturday.  It made a BIG difference.  Try it.

Groove Kitchen was incredible.  After completely
surrendering my soul to the music, I don't think
that I will ever dance the same way I used to.
This feeling always leaves me satisfied.  :)

Afterwards, we headed over to DNA for a bit.  Markie
was spinning some good stuff, but it wasn't really
there.  Boogie Buffet, however, was a really nice 
surprise.   

Anyways, just wanted to say hi.  The volume on SFraves 
has been pretty low recently--what's going on with 
everyone?  Off enjoying the sun...I hope!

Bye, friends.

Ravi







From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 17 21:25:10 1993
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Date: Mon, 17 May 1993 21:08:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: Magnalena Kita <magskita@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu>
Subject: nanananan/i'm back!!
To: cc@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
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nanannaanaan i got to see dante outdoors...he played evolution here in
nyc...,he didn't seem to hurt that he missed the outdoor thing brian was
planning...actually he was really chill...he said he had fallen asl**p to
take a nap...and just never got a wake up call...but wowowowo he was
great... 

second i will be back on thurday...(i don' t know what time or anything
yet...) does anyone have any crash space for a few daze...cuz i am having
parental unit problems...but amazingly enough...you can contact me through
them...at 415 334 8421...oh and does anyone know about any good
apartments??? near muni??

now back to raving...anyone going to the wicked...and what is doing this
weekend????  please reply to my email (and/or the list) cuz i am
temporarily off the list cuz of my traveling...and brians feelings towards
1000000000000 bounces...i am very exicted to party this summer in the
city...cuz i have raved all over now...and have some stories to
tell...just ask...partyon...susie(:



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 04:24:43 1993
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Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 04:03:21 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305181103.AA05536@well.sf.ca.us>
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  A raver's view of the Grateful Dead

I'm glad to see pashdown had a good time at the Vegas Dead shows!
I wasn't able to make it thanks to an overloaded work schedule,
but  I will be down in California for the Shoreline (Mountain View)
and Cal Expo (Sacramento) shows next week.  Definitely will catch
some ravetime too, I had a fairly disappointing stint on my last
swing at the end of last month with only the moderate enjoyable
GK at Big Heart City to show for it.

I think the rave and GD scenes are perfectly well compatible as long
as one accedes to the fact they are basically in parallel universes
with little awareness of each other (although that's changing a little).
Some of the Dead's drums-n-space time has been pretty ravey itself
over the last year (I'm waiting for someone to go back through the
tapes and grab some of the better GD samples to throw down with the
usual platters ;).

As for microraves at the Dead 'mall,' it's already been done at least
twice -- Atomic Rooster (Chinese New Years) and Shrove Tuesday (Mardi
Gras) at the Oakland Coliseum parking lot.  I missed the first but
had a fine time at the second after the Dead show -- a pretty decent
crowd going on at least two hours past the end of the show.  Took
a Deadhead friend of mine through, someone with totally no rave
experience, and he thought it was great!

I find the Dead and rave scenes each to be curative of what I perceive
to be some of the shortcomings in the other.  But just as jazz and
bluegrass are two quinessential forms of American music that have very
little crossover points culturally, I think rave and the Dead scene
are destined to go their separate ways.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 09:44:16 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305180900.ZM21945@nmtvs313>
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 09:00:16 -0700
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: A Gratefully Spun view of the Universal Dead


>> I felt that the two scenes
>> weren't so different after all.  Each of them striving for that one
>> solitary moment where you just don't care about life's problems
>> anymore.

>Precisely.  The goal is the grand "ego dissolve", which occurs when
>the feeling that life's problems don't matter anymore is strengthened
>and generalized.  ...

>Enough of my blithering, but yes, there is a strong strong connection
>between the peak moments of the rave experience and the peak moments
>of the deadhead experience, the routes are different, but the result
>is the same.  I absolutely see this, and have had equally intense
>moments at both events.  Call me a dual-citizen, if you will.

--- End of included mail from ames!us.oracle.com!groovy!boccibob

yes, i agree, the 2 scenes *are* remarkably similar in intent, i got
that impression at 2 dead shows I attended last December.  There were
lots of ravers at those (Oak Coli.) shows too, which added to the feeling
that there was a connection.  Now *some* ravers CAN'T STAND the dead
(yo lowone) and I'm sure there are dheads that hate raves but still,
the common points greatly outweigh the differences.  so......on that note...

<<<<<<<<LOOKY HERE, YEAH, RIGHT HERE, JUST BELOW, YEAH, THAT'S IT>>>>>>>>>>>

i'd like to announce that i'm trying to promote a rave, which may be
an outside thang in one of our neighboring states...i'm being intentionally
vague here as we don't know who's on this net and I/we don't need any
more hassles when all we're trying to do is dance, so don't ask me on this
public medium *where* it'll be etc. tho I'll happily tell ya if you catch
me offline.  i'm looking for an outside thang and i believe i have a site....

now...if this all comes off (& i really hope it will), it'll be a .... yeah,

	a
		bonafide

			* * * M I R A C L E * * * *


yes peoples, i need a miracle, i got me finger in da air, and i'm ravin
like i just don't care... the name actually started as a joke between me &
the friend i went to the dead shows with, as when we walked through "troll
alley" (where everybody sells shit) we were besieged by the rainbow
children with their fingers up sayin' "I need a miracle..."  Being periferal
deadheads (if so at all, tho i like *some* of the music) we were amused...
then i realized how much work it was going to be to promote this rave and all
the shit that could go wrong and i realized that...

(spoken in beetlejuice's screaming voice, as in "Lydz..."):

 		I NEED A MIRACLE TOO!!!!!!

on a last note, i'd like to inquire of you wicked people (as in the messages
coming from "ames!netcom.com!wicked").  i've noticed that trying to throw
a party on the same night as y'all is the KISS OF DEATH, which i attribute
to the fact that you have been throwing these parties for a long time and
have aquired a large following by doing good shit.  which is cool.  what
i'd like to know is how can i NOT be on the same date as stuff you are doing?
would you be so kind as to let me in on your calendar so that we might *avoid*
competing?  i'm going to be doing this a long way from SF, but would like
to get some bay people to go, so i want to time it right.  if you'd rather
reply privately or by phone, please do ((415) 940-2263 days / (415) 771-7017
eves.)

Pete Ashdown:
Pete, i'd like to coordinate some with you also, and while the date will be
quite a while after the SLC/Utah gig you're doing, it will be close enough
distance-wise that some Utah folks might be able to go.  i have also been
pining for an outside southwest event, so maybe we can organize in such a way
everybody who would want to go can, without creating competition with some
other event.

i am also thinking of renting a bus to gofrom SF to the site.  this might
be expensive so i'm curious as to how many of you would be into doing a 
"road rave" to the site, do the party there, and road rave back.  i've
talked to a few people here and there with the response being pretty
positive, but since this will require a number of people to make it "cost
effective" (aagghh, marketing slang...helllllllpppppp!), i'd like to know
how many of you folks would be down for this bus idea.  then i can get an
idea of how feasible this is (the bus).

in general i realize that hoping for NO conflicts is probably unrealistic,
but i would at least like to set it up so the sfraves posse isn't having
conflicts with events that are/would be/will be very popular for this group.
since i would count pete's utah gig and wicked gigs as being popular
with folks on this list, i thought i'd mention it.  i am also planning
to involve people from the "remote site" so to speak, so maybe we can build
some interstate contacts, etc.  i'll be trying to determine if this is 
do-able in the next couple of weeks, so don't get too excited, but if it
can be done with the resources i have available and all, then damnit!
i'm gonna do it....

--------------in reply to geoff-----------------

yeah, i agree that hippies begot ravers, and so on, the amount of 
shared culture is a *dead* give away (sorry, couldn't prevent that
from slippin out...).

on the People Who Got This & That:

i got auto transportation, will have turnatables (of my own) soon, am
definitely willing to do free security, especially for outdoor events
and am more of a ham than is reasonably acceptable...



an i'm out like a scout lookin' fer a new route... 

*

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 11:11:07 1993
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Date: Tue, 18 May 93 10:04:02 -0700
From: ccat@netcom.com (ccat)
Message-Id: <9305181704.AA10288@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Sound system

   One alternative as far as the speakers are concerned
is to build our own.The markup on speakers is astronomical.I have a friend
who used to build professional speakers who could give us advice..
Good drivers don't come cheap..but they are far cheaper than buying
manufactured speakers of low quality..
 I'm not a professional sound person,but I do know that the quality
of sound depends largely on the speakers and cabinets...and a good
speaker of high efficiency,can make even a low powered amp sound much
more powerful than it would sound on a speaker of lower efficiency.
Ported, "bass reflex" designs are the easiest high efficiency speakers to
manage...   A+S speakers (23rd and Shotwell in SF) sell lots of drivers and are
a great local resource..We should get several opinions..

Just a data-point.
-Chris.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 11:40:20 1993
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To: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Cc: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU,
        cspot@cats.ucsc.edu
Subject: Re: A raver's view of the Grateful Dead 
In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 18 May 93 04:03:21 -0700.
             <199305181103.AA05536@well.sf.ca.us> 
Date: Tue, 18 May 93 10:26:48 +45722824
From: "Chris.Hilker" <cspot@cats.ucsc.edu>

Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us> writes:
>Some of the Dead's drums-n-space time has been pretty ravey itself
>over the last year (I'm waiting for someone to go back through the
>tapes and grab some of the better GD samples to throw down with the
>usual platters ;).

Fred Lieberman, my American Popular Music professor from last spring,
mentioned at the time that Mickey Hart was very curious about this new
rave music stuff. Hm. Now that I think about it, I lent Fred L. a couple
of compilation CD's...maybe tapes of them made their way to the Dead?

C.

--
hilker!chris (cspot@cats.ucsc.edu)

"My home is Vulcan and everybody likes me there and they don't call me freak."
Life is fair. There, I said it. If anyone asks, you can tell them I did.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 11:48:51 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305181739.AA24018@slack>
Subject: Re: A raver's view of the Grateful Dead
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 11:39:32 -0600 (MDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 691       

> Fred Lieberman, my American Popular Music professor from last spring,
> mentioned at the time that Mickey Hart was very curious about this new
> rave music stuff. Hm. Now that I think about it, I lent Fred L. a couple
> of compilation CD's...maybe tapes of them made their way to the Dead?

Greg turned me onto Mickey Hart's solo stuff when I was staying with him and
Brian last time I was out.  "Tribal" is an understatement when it comes to
describing it, and it certainly wouldn't be out of place at any rave.

On one day, during the "drum set" Hart banged the hell out of some miked piece
of metal.  Made me wonder if we'd be seeing Einstuerzende Neubauten opening
for them next year.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 12:18:11 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305181043.ZM22053@nmtvs313>
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 10:43:21 -0700
In-Reply-To: ames!netcom.com!ccat (ccat)
        "Sound system" (May 18, 10:04am)
References: <9305181704.AA10288@netcom3.netcom.com>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: ames!netcom.com!ccat (ccat), sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Sound system/Miracle

speaking of sound systems, i have a couple of questions:

1.  anybody got the phone number for shredder?

2.  anybody got the phone number for other sound systems rental people?

3.  anybody got any solid info about what sound companies are good to work
    with and which ones to avoid?  in particular, who are the sound company
    or companies that have been flaking and not showing up?  that i *do not*
    need to deal with if i can avoid it...

4.  if i wanted to rent stuff in another city, can anyone tell me what 
    power/capacity/quality requirements and/or brand names to look for
    and/or avoid?

you may reply any way you see fit, privately might spare the list unnecessary
bandwidth....or if ya want to phone, Here it IS...(415) 940-2263 (till 4:30)
(415) 771-7017 after that or weekends....

lat,

*

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 12:24:06 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305181813.AA23695@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: Sound system
To: ccat@netcom.com (ccat)
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 14:13:17 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305181704.AA10288@netcom3.netcom.com> from "ccat" at May 18, 93 10:04:02 am
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Beyond the ultraworld of ccat:
> 
>    One alternative as far as the speakers are concerned
> is to build our own.

It is a good way to go, but do not cut corners. Use flimsy wood and you will
have to start again. You also have to think in terms of size. What size can
you move? If you only have a car, you will find it problematic.

>The markup on speakers is astronomical.

It's very true, but if you count the numerous hours of work you'll have to put,
then maybe it is not as attractive to build your own. If i had the money, i
would buy a stack of Community speakers and monitors. They are small, efficient
and they sound incredible. But i didn't have the $ so i built mine. They are
very efficient but they are HUGE. I will probably do the same design in
hybrid for road use.

>  I'm not a professional sound person,but I do know that the quality
> of sound depends largely on the speakers and cabinets...

And the xover is also very important. A passive crossover is the cheapest
solution while an active xover with dual amping sounds much better, is more
efficient and saves you lots of work but cost a lot because of the bi-amps.

> and a good
> speaker of high efficiency,can make even a low powered amp sound much
> more powerful than it would sound on a speaker of lower efficiency.

And not to forget that you have to double the wattage to add 3db of SPL.

> Ported, "bass reflex" designs are the easiest high efficiency speakers to
> manage...

Hybrids can achieve the SPLs of bassreflex designs while taking 1/4 of cubage.
They are more stable in terms of impedance and you can design 2ohm or 4ohm
systems easily (of course the amp must be designed for these loads so that the
power transfer is maximized). The disadvantage of hybrids is the cost: you
need two bass drivers (connected together with the rim and electrically
connected in a push-pull way: the + of the first connected to the - of the
other and vice-versa). I have a lot of experience in cabinet designs, so if
help is needed, i'm here. In the case of drivers, i have no idea which to use.

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 12:53:09 1993
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Date: Tue, 18 May 93 11:27:44 PDT
From: randyb@kalpana.com (Randy Bias)
Message-Id: <9305181827.AA28705@kalpana.com>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net, sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com,
        uk-dance@orbital.demon.co.uk
Subject: Re: Mdma intake control structured design system. v 1.0.0 - beta release.
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu

>It's funny that you mention this.  The variables that you mentioned
It's funny that you mention this...

>is one reason I don't partake of e in big hot warehouse parties.  It is
>also why I feel that you really need to stay healthy to be a hardcore raver.
I agree.  The interesting thing (for me) is that I have a hard time dancing
while on E.  It affects my motor coordination too much.  In fact, I don't find
it enjoyable while dancing at all.  It makes me too lethargic.

>I for one believe in a.
Ditto.

>It doesn't alter your body temperature much and has a much lower effect on
>your heart rate, and blood pressure.
It's impact on the body is rather minimal in my opinion.


--Randy

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 13:42:13 1993
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Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 12:07:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gioni Pasquinelli <gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Dead Show
To: The Ravin' Peoples <sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305181214.D29916-a100000@hamlet.ucdavis.edu>
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Hey all,
	Just finished reading the mail and with all the stuff on the dead
my interest has been piqued.  Since somebody said there will be a show up
here in Sac I am wondering who else might be going.  I have never been to
a show or even listened to the music but it sounds interesting and I'd
like to here some.
	So this is a call to anyone interested or who is already goin to
the show up here.  By the way when is it and how much...I guess I could
call but I'm here now so I might as well ask.

See ya all,

Late
Gioni Pasquinelli
gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu      What doesn't kill you makes you stronger



From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 13:48:52 1993
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From: SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU
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Apparently-To: sfraves-list1

>From ccat@netcom.com  Tue May 18 12:43:01 1993
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>From: ccat@netcom.com (ccat)
Message-Id: <9305181943.AA21847@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu
Subject: Sound system idea.. Holophonic/cybersonic

  Has anyone ever seen a mixer that varies *reverberance(delay _time_) and
level control via a joystick control..perhaps with switchable parameters
such as filters eq,etc..all parameters trackable by delay,relative sp[ectral
strength as registered by RTA,etc... Seems like this would be eas
y to do with widely available DSP chips.off the shelf MIDI gunk,etc.
. (this is all implemented in sw,so the most critical
part is the user interface,which could be controlled,better yet, via a v/r
bodysuit..) Whoa..getting carried away there..Wonder what the VR wizards
would have to say.
Anyone familiar with programming audio dsp ..particularly simulating different
binaural environments..? Lets make the future SFRaves sound system _truly_
a force to be reckoned with and _truly_ representative of our computer based
background! ;)


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 14:11:18 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305182007.AA24401@slack>
Subject: Effects
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 14:07:26 -0600 (MDT)
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>   Has anyone ever seen a mixer that varies *reverberance(delay _time_) and
> level control via a joystick control....

Think "modular".  Don't go for the mixer just because it has a built in
sampler, effects unit, or ice maker.  It is much better to have things like
this external.  One thing you should look for is the ability for the mixer to
cue effects or treat them as a separate line.

As for effects boxes, the Boss SE-50 (and now SE-70) is probably the most
robust and powerful.  The Ensonique DP4 is also really hot because it can do
spatial processing which I haven't found from any other company.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 14:43:05 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305182019.AA01296@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: Effects
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 16:19:36 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305182007.AA24401@slack> from "Pete Ashdown" at May 18, 93 02:07:26 pm
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Beyond the ultraworld of Pete Ashdown:
> 
> >   Has anyone ever seen a mixer that varies *reverberance(delay _time_) and
> > level control via a joystick control....
> 
> Think "modular".  Don't go for the mixer just because it has a built in
> sampler, effects unit, or ice maker.  It is much better to have things like
> this external.  One thing you should look for is the ability for the mixer to
> cue effects or treat them as a separate line.

There is a yamaha which is pretty nice and midi controllable. Add an ibm, an
MPU-401 and a powerglove connected to the parallel port... voila VC for the
masses...

Another thing: the Gravis Ultrasound 3D. Same thing, it could be controlled
with the powerglove (or whatever). Starting tomorrow there is something on
VR in San Jose and they will have a demo booth of their 3D system. Pretty
impressive... Presently i dont have the 3D library so i use it as a sampler
only.

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 14:57:55 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305182046.AA02072@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Effects
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Date: Tue, 18 May 93 13:46:55 PDT
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305182007.AA24401@slack>; from "Pete Ashdown" at May 18, 93 2:07 pm
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Pete Ashdown sez:
> 
> As for effects boxes, the Boss SE-50 (and now SE-70) is probably the most
> robust and powerful.  The Ensonique DP4 is also really hot because it can do
> spatial processing which I haven't found from any other company.
> 


ART makes some pretty good guitar effects processors which work well
with keybds. and voice... We had an ART SGE which was pretty clean.  

I've heard good stuff about the Ensoniq effects box, and if it's the
same level of quality as their synths and samplers it's prolly well
worth the money.

-H-


-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 						   howard@netcom.com
		    Underground like a wild potato
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 15:06:07 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305182127.AA24611@slack>
Subject: Push & Twist
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 15:27:42 -0600 (MDT)
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Definitely go for the push and twist.  I wish all the speakers I rented used
them, but usually it is only on the bass bins.  I've had 1/4" die or need to
be propped up in the middle of a rave to make a good connection.  Not a fun
situation.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 16:04:11 1993
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To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: Sound system idea.. Holophonic/cybersonic
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 18 May 93 12:43:03 PDT."
             <9305181943.AA03494@medisg.Stanford.EDU> 
Date: Tue, 18 May 93 15:17:43 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


From: ccat@netcom.com (ccat)
>Anyone familiar with programming audio dsp ..particularly simulating different
>binaural environments..? Lets make the future SFRaves sound system _truly_
>a force to be reckoned with and _truly_ representative of our computer based
>background! ;)

Well, you can get a roland sound space (RSS) unit from Roland Pro
Audio, the only problem is that (a) you have to pick the appropriate
sound sources (e.g. a voice or lead instrument) that can be distinctly
localized in 3-space; (b) the units cost approx $21,500 for 4 channels
(i.e. place 4 distinct sound sources somewhere in <x,y,z> 3-space). The
unit does come with a controller that allows you to dial-in sounds in
3-space, and is  MIDI controllable as well.

Unlike many of the VR-ish 3d sound environments, the RSS claims to 
work over loudspeakers. In actuality, i think you have to pick your
sound sources and overall soundscape quite carefully in order for the
3-D sound effect to work. Various albums have been recorded w/ this
technology, including some techno stuff whose name escapes me  right
now -- you can tell whether RSS was used because the cover or track
listings contain a box with the letters RSS....

More affordable systems are available to plug into your computer.
The following are oft used in creating 3-D sound for virtual reality
environments -- as far as know, these only work over headphones:

	(1) Bo Gehring, In Focus Systems of Toronto sells  a 3-D sound card 
	    that plugs in to your macintosh.... (toronto-area-code)963-9188
	(2) Crystal River Engineering Convolvotron -- plug it into
	    yer IBM PC -- ask the company for software to do the 3-D synthesis.

Alternately, you can put the 3-D effect into your source material. Bob
Clearmountain audio sample CD roms have some sounds that have been 3-D
enhanced by RSS. I've also sampled sound effects off of roland's RSS
demo CD and that can be fun too....

There are other systems available as well, but they're all in the 
astronomical price ranges suitable only to pros and studios, e.g.
Archer Communication Q-Sound (rental only, $300.00/day includes
technician), Audio+Design "Ambisonics" ($12,000). There are a bunch of
me-too products out there on the market to capitalize on this exciting
field, however, at least one of them that I saw/heard was pure
unadulterated snake oil. So be careful.

Or wait. I expect this stuff will come down in price in the next 5
years, and hopefully all the sleazy snake oil vendors will be out of
business. Furthermore, for an SFR sound system, we should probably
stick to the basics -- you can buy a significant amount of PA and 
amplification for the cost of any of the above 3-D audio processors.

I was actually trying to CON-vince my previous employer (Hewlett-
Packard Laboratories) to purchase one of the above 3-D systems for some
computer controlled 3-D audio experiments I was doing in Human-Computer
Interaction and Multimedia. Unfortunately, instead of doing that, they
nuked our lab and offered us all generous voluntary severance payments
if we promised to quit... well, I'm 3.5 months into my 11 month paid
vacation, and I'm loving it...

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

PS: want more info -- here's an old article I posted to netnews:

Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
From: mayer@hplnpm1.hpl.hp.com (Niels P. Mayer)
Subject: Re: Roland Sound Space
In-Reply-To: mir@chorus.chorus.fr's message of 14 Oct 92 14:02:27 GMT
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 1992 03:42:28 GMT
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Labs, Media Technology Lab, Palo Alto, CA.


From mir@chorus.chorus.fr (Adam Mirowski):
> Has anyone heard the new Roland Sound Space system?
> Does it work in your opinion?

Yes. I picked up the Roland demo disk at AES -- the effect works, IMHO. The
music on it is pretty sucky, some bad rap, bad pop, bad soul, bad heavy
metal, and bad film music. I guess demomusique is not much of an art form...

From: smithj@hpsad.sad.hp.com (Jim Smith)
> Suzanne Cianni used it on (I think) "Hotel Luna."  On her piece "Rain,"
> for example, she said she used it to put each note in just the right
> place.  Well, maybe I heard it and maybe not.  I'm still not sure.  It's
> certainly a subtle effect for the money!

This piece is on the RSS sampler disk that I got from Roland. It is one of
the poorest demos of the 3-D effect. (and the music is kinda lame too; then
again, i'm not into effete new age/classical crap).

Fortunately, the demo disk is an excellent source for 3-D'd samples :-)
(speaking of 3-D samples, i noticed that some of the bob clearmountain drum
sample cd-roms claim they use RSS...).


--------------------

The papers I've read on the RSS indicate it uses a combination of
techniques. The RSS's "binaural processor" uses HRTFs (head related
transfer functions) to calculate the spectral shaping caused by the
interaction of the pinna (earlobes) with the sound source location.  The
RSS "transaural processor" uses some means of crosstalk-cancellation in
order to make the output of the binaural processor work on speakers.
The HRTF'd output from the "binaural processor" goes to the headphone jacks.

HRTFs are the psychoacoustic basis of alot of work in "3-D virtual acoustic
displays" used in VR (virtual reality) applications. For example, VPL's
high-end VR systems use a Convolvotron from Crystal River Engineering to
synthesize HRTFs thereby allowing you to not only see a synthesized
3-dimensional world, but also hear a 3-dimensional world.

There's been a lot of work in this subject by Elizabeth Wenzel and Durand
Begault (NASA Ames Rsch Ctr), Fred Wightman and Doris Kistler (U
Wisconsin), and Scott Foster (Crystal River Engineering). What Roland has
done is take alot of American university and research lab technologies and
commercialize it.... I guess that's cool, except that we (Universities,
NASA, companies w/ research labs like HP, Bell, IBM, DEC, Xerox) should
attempt to do a slightly better job of hanging on to revolutionary
technologies that may make big bucks in the future (when pricing drops
enough to allow VR to go fully commercial). Hell, like I should talk... the
Convolvotron groundwork was done at HP Labs... <censored>.

FYI, the best introductory material on 3-D sound can be found in "Cyberarts
-- exploring art & technology" edited by Linda Jacobsen (Miller Freeman
Inc, ISBN 0-87930-253-4). Included there is an article by C.Chan from
Roland on the RSS system, as well as articles by Wenzel & Begault on HRTFs,
and Foster on the Convolvotron.

There's also a more in-depth article (with full references) by Wenzel,
Wightman and Kistler in the proceedings of ACM CHI '91 conference. I just
happen to have a review of the article from my trip report to that
conference:

| * "Localization by Inexperienced Listeners Using Non-Individualized
|    3-D auditory display cues"
|    Elizabeth M. Wenzel, NASA-Ames Research Center
|    Frederic L. Wightman, University of Wisconsin
|    Doris J. Kistler, University of Wisconsin
| 
| In contrast with the <censored> paper/talk reviewed above, this talk was real
| "science." People localize the direction a sound is coming from through the
| perception of interaural differences in time of low-frequency
| sound-arrival, as well as interaural differences in intensity at high
| frequencies.  Further localization occurs when sound waves interact with
| the pinnae (outer ears). Pinnae shape the spectrum of the sound, changing
| the spectrum with different locations. The effects of such spectral shaping
| needs to be simulated (via digital filters, convolvotron) if the sound is
| to be simulated for use with headphones. Unfortunately, each person's
| pinnae are slightly different, and would result in different spacially
| induced spectral shaping. The experiment tests whether it is feasible to
| create a "three dimensional auditory display" that does not need to be
| calibrated to individual subjects. The simulated spacial effects are
| derived from one subject whose pinnae-induced spectral shaping is derived
| from the "head related transfer function" (HRTF). HRTF is measured by
| putting microphones in a model of the head and pinnae of a "good
| localizer". The reference subject has been "behaviorally calibrated" for
| correlation with measured sound direction.
| 
| The experiments determined that "In general, the data suggest that most
| listeners can obtain useful directional information from an auditory
| display without requiring the use of individually-tailored HRTFs,
| particularly for the direction of azimuth."  The main problem noted is that
| people tend to have "mirror image" perception problems in localizing sound,
| e.g. back<-->front and up<-->down confusions. The discussion section
| mentions that these could be artifacts of their experimental method of
| determining real (non-headphone) location by a blindfolded person in an
| anechoic chamber listening to one of 6 speakers placed in a moveable
| semi-circle. Reflections of room acoustics may play a big role in
| disambiguating up from down and front from back.
| 
| This is a very interesting, detailed paper and the presentation almost felt
| like a science version of Shelock Holmes sleuthing.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
	    Niels Mayer -- hplabs!mayer -- mayer@hplabs.hp.com
                     Collaborative Multimedia Project
		       Hewlett-Packard Laboratories
			      Palo Alto, CA.
				   *


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 16:06:09 1993
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From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9305182226.AA04146@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: vacation week rpt
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Tue, 18 May 93 15:26:49 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


Ah, vacation.  We did our annual back-to-nature thing; 4 days
of hiking in the Toiyabe National Forest (Mt. Charleston, 35
miles outside Las Vegas).  A total get-away-from-it-all trip;
no house music, not even Intermix, opting for Tangerine Dream
for the car ride.  Janie even left the walkman-for-hiking
at home this time.  Mountains, pine trees, sun, clouds, hail -
the only kind of scene that rivals or surpasses raving in the
bliss department.  

On the other end of the reality spectrum, we stopped at Vegas where
my parents live.  Spent an afternoon doing some people watching
at Ceasar's Palace.  Yes, the Dead were coming to town, and we
were amused to see the occasional deadhead wander through the
gaudy, tacky glitz of the Palace Mall, mouths agape, eyes wide open,
bumping into the Roman Statues and marble fountains.  Talk about
fish out of water.  Another more modest Hotel/Casino we visited was
overrun with deadheads.  While not all deadheads are poor and
smell bad, they sure could use a few pointers on how to play
blackjack.

As a mecca for those who wish to rub knees with the illusion of
wealth/riches/fortune and class, Vegas attracts a pretty diverse
sample of humanity.  But there wasn't a raver in sight, no rave
wear, not even the grunge look.  No surprise, for although the
casino establishment has done a lot in the sensory stimulation
department the VIBE just ain't here.  Even under the most optimum
of neurological conditions, Vegas is best experienced as a total
goof.

Plane landed in SF on Saturday, but I was just too drained to attend
the last Groove Kitchen.  Opted for the beach thing on Sunday.  The
laid back house music on the beach scene was the perfect way to ease
back into ravedom.  Did Tilt-a-Whirl Sunday night, and yes Goa Gil
assaulted us with a relentless 3 hours of hardcore trance.  He 
doesn't seem to bother much with beat matching, but I really wish
more DJs would play this kind of stuff instead of the retro 70's
disco/funk that keeps popping up.  Anyway, I'm sure looking forward
to Wicked this Sat., and for all those who keep whining about the
Sound Factory, do like me; nap until 2:00, show up at 3:00 and
turn the space into the center of the Universe where only 12-
dimensional superconscious cosmic energy patterns are capable of 
existing.

- leg of eel

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 16:38:09 1993
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Date: Tue, 18 May 93 15:58:47 -0700
From: ccat@netcom.com (ccat)
Message-Id: <9305182258.AA04241@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Soundspaces..

  When I was at the beach-rave on Sunday I was struck by a unique quality of
the beach/outdoor (but especially the beach) environment.Essentially,it
is an environment with no reverberation.. Exreriments in audio field
manipulation *work* in outdoor environments like this.. (unlike halls which
essentially strongarm the soundfield..)  I know some of the early Tonka
soundsystems incorporated soundfield manipulation..(help us on this,Markie..)
How much would it cost for bare bones soundfield manipulation.. ?
Ideally,the system would need 4 channels or more to manipulatethe rearchannel
ambiance..
-Chris.

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 17:35:07 1993
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Date: Tue, 18 May 93 17:09:19 -0700
From: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Message-Id: <9305190009.AA26497@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: A question about "Wicked" rave coming up...


  I was wondering who the promoters of the Wicked rave are?    I want to try
and contact them as soon as possible.    Need either Email or at least a phone
number to a machine where I can get called back BEFORE it starts.

Thanx
JD

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 17:45:34 1993
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Date: Tue, 18 May 93 20:18:26 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305190018.AA12533@pilot.njin.net>
To: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Weekend Update
In-Reply-To: <9305172343.AA08822@soda.berkeley.edu>
References: <9305172343.AA08822@soda.berkeley.edu>

I went down to the beach at Noriega. No ravers there, and no clue
where everyone had gone. I figured you got busted or something.

Anyway, I spent the afternoon strolling the beach, and later spent a
couple of hours watching the hawks from the summit of Mt. Tamalpais.
Not a bad day at all. Only thing I could have wished for was a snuggly
to share it with. All things in time :).

I'll be free Saturday night, so tell me there's something kickin'
cause I'm in the mood!

Peace,

Sean

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 18:39:35 1993
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From: dms!curly!grigsby@netcom.com (Spiral Death Trap)
Message-Id: <9305190005.AA20952@curly.agames.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Spatial Sound


I helped the Convolvotron people demonstrate their stuff at Siggraph a few
years ago ('91) -- worked better for some people than for others.  Generally
front-to-back comes out better than up-and-down localization.  It also
required you to have headphones on or your head localized between speakers
with tolerances ~1".  Head-related transofrms are neat, but necessarily
headphone-bound.

Localization in a PA is much different -- you really have to know where the
speakers are exactly in order to do anything more impressive than quad
panning (which _is_ cool but not what we're talking about).  This means
you pre-process a piece for one specific environment or you have lots of
expensive processing.

Then again, DSP prices have dropped like rocks in the past year or so.  The
possibilities broaden continuously -- note the proliferation of cheap effects
boxes that do more and more amazing stuff.

The problem is always writing software for a custom system -- you tend to
need expensive things like in-circuit emulators or at least logic analyzers
and downloader boards.  It's not much harder to do 10,000 magic boxes than
1, which is why you don't see much homebrew stuff -- everything changes so
fast that ROland will probably sell your mega-zowie processor for $299 byy
the time you're done constructing it.

// g

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 20:56:28 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 20:27:35 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: "Building Online Community" - tomorrow night

        This looks tres interesting - if anyone can make it I'd recommend
it (tho I won't be able to)

>From cypherpunks-request@toad.com Mon May 17 13:52:33 1993
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From: Eric S Theise <estheise@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305172021.AA03202@well.sf.ca.us>
Subject: May Modern Times event
To: nobody@well.sf.ca.us (Jeremy Hillary Boob)
Date: Mon, 17 May 93 13:20:59 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3test PL45]
Status: OR

Thought some of you might be interested in Wednesday's Jacking
In/Cyberspace Literacy event ...

Jacking In: A Series on Cyberspace Literacy presents
ONLINE COMMUNITIES AROUND THE BAY: THE INNS AND THEIR KEEPERS

Every computer-based conferencing system lets its subscribers access 
relevant community information and discuss topics ranging from Apple 
Computers to zymurgy.  While these systems are all based on the same 
conceptual model, each one evolves its own personality and community 
standards based on underlying software, management policies, and, 
ultimately, the subscribers it attracts.

This installment of Jacking In will feature a talk about building and 
nourishment of online community, followed by community-conscious 
demonstrations of several San Francisco-based conferencing systems.

In cyberspace, community is not geography.

John Coate, "Building Online Community"
Wayne Gregori, SF Net
Alex Liberman, 101 Online
Gail Ann Williams, The WELL


Wednesday, May 19, 7:30 p.m.
$3-$5 sliding scale
Modern Times Bookstore
888 Valencia (19th/20th)
San Francisco, CA 94110
(415) 282-9246


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 18 23:00:16 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Tue, 18 May 1993 22:33:56 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: The SFRaves Sound System

        A group of us have been talking about this and we thought we could/
should bring it to the list as a whole.  We're thinking about forming together
a sound system to do renegade parties this summer.  Realizing that the key
weak link in pulling a party together has been relying on sound people, we
think D.I.O (Doing It OUrseves :) is the way to go.

        Basically the way this would work is, those interested in working on
it woulfd meet and decide on exactly what needs to be bought - and then each
person would go out and buy a piece of equipment, and assemble it all together
in some central location.  Each person would still own the piece of equipment
they paid for, but the collection would rotate around this group of people
say once a week.  If a particular piece of equipment is too expensive maybe
one or two people could chip in on it. 

        The goal would be to assemble a system made out of small, easily
carryable pieces rather than two giant 6' stacks or something.  That makes
it easier to buy too ($1000 huge cabinet vs. $300 component).  In some cases
perhaps the components could be built inexpensively.

        The philosophy behind the system would be that it would be used for
outdoor, free/donation-only parties, and a small fund would be set up as a
maintanence fund in case equipment breaks or new pieces need to be bought or
something.  Having all the equipment at one place is essential in being able
to pull it together on short notice.

        Those of us who are interested should meet in person sometime soon.
Sometime next week would be perfect for me.  (I'll be gone this weekend).
If you're interested (and haven't already made your voice heard) drop me a 
line about meeting.  I'll be home next Tuesday-Friday...

        Brian

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 01:34:58 1993
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From: Magnalena Kita <magskita@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu>
Subject: scratch that
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Cc: dcraves@american.edu
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305190106.A4824-a100000@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu>
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i guess i am not comming back until july (cool i get to party with the
sfravers comming east)...i will be staying at laura la gassa's apartment
in hoboken at 201 217 9192 ...i knew i would get lost here...this is
really sudden...i think i am crazy...hey anyone have any cool friends i
could hang out with in nyc/?? i guess now i am kinda sad that i will be
missing raving with you guys for a while...ahhh the trials and
tribulations of a bicoastal raver..see you all in july (an cool events
going on??) ...partyon...susie(: p.s. i will have lots of broolyn rave
stories to tell...hehehe 



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 06:46:29 1993
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From: Shaun Ralston <70007.3260@compuserve.com>
To: SFRaves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Brian, thanks! RECYCLE
Message-Id: <930519131104_70007.3260_CHM71-1@CompuServe.COM>

Sorry, Brian about the back-wash (yuk) of messages
returned from CompuServe.  Problem has been soled. 
Are you interested in going to RECYCLE tonight, I'll
gladly put you and a few friends on guest list!
Peace, Love, and RAVE-ON!Shaun    


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 06:46:19 1993
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From: Miles Pearce <Miles.Pearce@bristol.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <13058.9305191403@irix.bristol.ac.uk>
Subject: UNIVERSE INFO
Sender: Miles.Pearce@bristol.ac.uk
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Wed, 19 May 93 14:03:31 GMT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

From Miles.Pearce@uk.ac.bristol Wed May 19 12:40:41 1993
From: "Miles Pearce" <Miles.Pearce@uk.ac.bristol>
Message-Id: <9356.9305191240@irix.bristol.ac.uk>
Subject: UNIVERSE INFO
Sender: Miles.Pearce@uk.ac.bristol
To: sf-raves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Wed, 19 May 93 12:40:15 GMT
Cc: miles.pearce@uk.ac.bristol
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

For your information............

Many requests from the States about the availability of the UNIVERSE

WORLD TECHNO TRIBE  LP/MC/CD

So, here ya go 

Available from good record shoppes on British Import, if you can't find it
you can mailorder it from

UNIVERSE (E-MAIL)
P O Box 1569
Bath, BA2 5EH
Avon
United Kingdom

Specifying what you want:

Universe World Techno Tribe Album

Verse LP		WTT1	9.99  pounds sterling
Verse CD		WTT2	13.49 pounds sterling
Verse MC		WTT3   	9.99  pounds sterling
Ltd. Ed. Pic. Disk	WTT4	11.99 pounds sterling

Please make Cheques, Postal orders etc payable to:

Universe Cosmic Clobber

Please also include enough to cover return postage to your address.

Here's the full track listing

FOR ANYONE INTERESTED......................................................


UNIVERSE in association with RISING HIGH RECORDS present:

		WORLD TECHNO TRIBE - LP\MC\CD

PIONEERS OF THE					THE HYPNOTIST
UNIVERSE

Written & produced by Caspar Pound and Peter Smith, forth coming release.

SPINGYARD					C J BOLLAND

Written & produced by C J Bolland, Taken from 4th sign EP. R & S Records.

.215061						A.F.X.

Composed & produced by A.F.X. for Rephex, taken from Analogue Bubblebath 3.

VIRTUAL BREAKDOWN				LAURENT GARNIER
(Mind Your Head)

COSMIC LOVE					RESISTANCE D
(Approach & Identify)

Written & produced by Resistance D, Taken from The Emphasis EP.

FLYING DEEPER					SKYFLYER

Written & produced by Arndt Pecher & Rolf Maier-Bode, Taken from Saph II.

VIRTUAL REALITY					TWO THUMBS

Composed & produced by Sauwe and Van De Pas, Taken from Two Thumbs Vol. 4.

TREMORA DEL TERRA				ILLUMINATAE

Composed & produced by G MAITTHEWMAN & D Osbourne, Taken from XVX-1.

LIST 2						SUBURBAN HELL

Composed by D Hermelun & G Schonewille, Taken from DJAX-UP 159.

SEQUENTIAL					SEQUENTIAL
(The Dune Mix)

Composed by Craig Peck & Pete Namlook, Taken from RSN 45.

1ST SYMPHONY					DAVE ANGEL

Composed & produced by Dvae Angel, Taken from Orchestrations.

BARBARELLA					SVEN VATH
(The Irresistible Force Remix)

Composed & Produced by Sven Vath & R Hildenbeutel, Remix by Mixmaster Morris


If you have any further enquires mail me at:

miles.pearce@bristol.ac.uk

END OF INFORMATION


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 08:11:32 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 07:26:51 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305191426.AA11052@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: ComeUniverse@nexsys.net
Subject: The Progression of House Culture

I found this under a stack of papers that I got while attending the CyberForum
a few weekends ago...



	           THE PROGRESSION OF HOUSE CULTURE
		   ________________________________


	"As mankind moves into the new millennium, we will progressively
	leave behind the inflated value of the form level, and look more
	towards expressions of the heart" (Celtic Renaissance by 
						Alice Rigan, 1980)

	This we must do, and especially people involved with house culture.
Since evolution is the very nature of the house movement, the people involved
with it must take more responsibility.  We must demonstrate with our lives the
type of caring, sharing community attitude that is now needed so much if this
planet has any chance of getting back together as a communal family organism.
House people should be among the most highly evolved, sensitive groups in the
modern world today.  Through use of certain sacred medicines, ancient or modern,
people are beginning to see the way things really are.  Whether Rave promoters
know it or not, they provide a forum for mass personal and planetary change.
Raves can be treated as shamanic workshops.  However, this forum can so easily
be destroyed by commercialists, capitalists, and sharpsters who were robbing
banks before the raves.  Our sacred time is often someones else's fast buck.
If the people throwing events and playing the music are living old world 
lifestyles and laughing all the way to the bank, what does the new generation
have to go on?  It is up to us to teach by example.  Treating raves as just
another way to gain financial security or success will crush the movement from
within.  Here are two quotations from two articles out of the current 
nationwide Mixmag Magazine, concerning the much older house movement in Britain:

	"Raves are not always run by music lovers.  All too easily they
	become risk free, high return, black market operations.  as the
	scene exploded, the money men moved in."

	"No matter their loyalty to the scene, there aren't many ravers
	who are going to carry on getting abused by promoters and scam 
	merchants."

It is obvious that with too many years of commercial raving, the ravers will
start to become disillusioned.   There is still a healthy underground house
movement in Britain- it has nothing to do with paying 20 pounds to get in.
Here in San Francisco we have the chance to start turning things around and
giving some positive direction to the countless loyal ravers who come to these
functions to dance and expand their minds.  Our family depends on us.  Our
planet needs us.  Rave culture must be continued by people who truly care
and understand what is going on with regards to house culture and the evolution
of mankind.  We are dealing with people's minds and consciousness, not just
their cash flow.  we must maintain integrity and always always remember we have a responsibility to guide the next generation into the new millennium.


Mission Earth, 1993

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 08:50:24 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 1993 08:20:02 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305191520.AA22152@well.sf.ca.us>
To: ccat@netcom.com, hart@ntmtv.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Sound system/Miracle

One of the best sound systems I evr heard was based around a Meyersound
Quadraphonic PA that was provided and run by Ultrasound of SF. In general,
Ultrasound comes very highly recommended...

nrg

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 09:22:22 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 08:26:51 -0800
From: Robert Jesse <rjesse@us.oracle.com>
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU, socal-raves@ucsd.edu,
        ne-raves@silver.lcs.mit.edu, dcraves@american.edu,
        uk-raves@orbital.demon.co.uk
Subject: hooligans turn from agression to togetherness
Reply-To: rnj%lila@us.oracle.com

Quote from "MDMA - The View from England", by Nicholas Saunders,
in the MAPS Newsletter (Multidisciplinary Association for
Psychedelic Studies), Spring 1993, Vol IV, No. 1.

   It may well be that MDMA has actually had a beneficial effect in Britain.   
Last season saw a large reduction in football violence.  Mark Gilman from  
Lifeline in Manchester is conducting a two year study of a sample of young  
men in the north west including 'football hooligans'.  He says "in their  
transition from hooligan to raver these young men spurned excessive use of  
alcohol in favor of ecstasy.  Conversations were no longer about which team's  
'lads' could be ambushed where and when. Rave culture and ecstasy use have  
become more attractive than using large amounts of alcohol and running around  
the streets looking for fights with opposing football fans.  MDMA use  
encourages a desire for friendship and togetherness, not aggression."  It is  
not that MDMA is cheaper, the cost of a good night out is about the same.   
However, he tells me that the shortage of good 'E' this season has caused a  
return to alcohol along with other drugs, and he fears a return to the  
previous levels of violence.

   There is no reason to believe that this change of behaviour is restricted  
to football fans.  Just as LSD in the sixties caused lasting cultural  
changes, I believe that the widespread use of MDMA now is laying down the  
foundations of new, as yet undefined, social values.  And i believe it will  
be a largely positive change.
  [...]
  There are those who think that MDMA can be stamped out by a scare campaign  
or heavy use of the law, and others who believe that it is a passing fad.   
MDMA is here to stay for a simple reason"  it provides access to an  
experience that human beings value.

---------------------------

MAPS is a non-profit, membership-based organization working to assist  
psychedelic researchers around the world design, obtain governmental  
approval, fund, conduct and report on psychedelic research in humans. [...]   
If you can even faintly imagine a cultural re-integration of the use of  
psychedelics and the states of mind they engender, please consider joining  
MAPS in supporting the expansion of scientific knowledge in this area.

	MAPS / 1801 Tippah Avenue / Charlotte, NC  28205
	704 358-9830 voice 704 358-1650 fax

---------------------------

Nicholas Saunders recently (April 1993) published a sparkling, 320 page book,  
E for Ecstasy.  It covers MDMA's therapeutic use, the British rave scene,  
scientific research concerning MDMA, the political situation...  The book  
contains a 79 page bibliography by Alexander Shulgin, a 73 page reference  
section with synopses, and several other appendices.  It's available from

	N. Saunders / 14 Neal's Yard / London WC2H 9DP England

Write (or call +44 071 836 9404) for info - a 37% discount is available for  
orders in multiples of five copies.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 10:12:59 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305191640.AA11123@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: The Ultimate(tm) Renegade Sound System



	OK folks,
	I have a friend in Baltimore who builds sound systems.

	He is REAL good at it and builds them out of the joy that he
	gets from the technical challenge and the joy others get from
	listening to the Systems that he builds.

	I've been talking to him about building me a portable fairly light
	ass kickin sound system.  He is not a raver and only has a few "techno"
	compilations in his collection but he knows how to build a system
	taylored to the type of music that will be played on it.


	What I need to know from the group is what are the key variables.

	So far I think I need:  

	2- way operation (bass on one amp mid and highs on the other)
	Portability (i.e. light and not to bulky)
	Rugged casing.


	What I need to know is stuff like 
	how much bass power at what frequencies (he says he can build technology
	that can go down around 20 Hz but it would cost in money/power)

	Remember this system is being designed for OUTDOOR PARTIES.

	So all you audio dudes and dudettes please give me feedback.


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 10:53:05 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 10:25:56 -0700
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: "Building Online Community" - tonight

We should have been ON that panel, don't you think?

Is anyone else thinking of going and presenting ourselves?

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 11:00:13 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 19 May 93 18:26:38 BST
Message-Id: <12059.9305191726@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Cc: uk-dance@orbital.demon.co.uk
In-Reply-To: Geoff White's message of Wed, 19 May 93 07:26:51 PDT <9305191426.AA11052@nexsys.nexsys.net>
Subject: Re: The Progression of House Culture


>>>>> On Wed, 19 May 93 07:26:51 PDT, geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White) said:

  Geoff> I found this under a stack of papers that I got while
  Geoff> attending the CyberForum a few weekends ago...

[...]

  Geoff> There is still a healthy underground house movement in
  Geoff> Britain- it has nothing to do with paying 20 pounds to get
  Geoff> in.

Liked the post.  Dunno to what extent this is the norm, but most of
the events I go to at the moment are small free parties put on by a
local soundsystem.  They do it because they have fun doing it.  The
locations don't cost them anything -- usually a squat or someones
house, maybe outdoors when the weather gets better.  The DJ's spin for
free.  Sometimes there's a colection to help pay for the hire of the
amps and speakers.  These parties happen most weeks, and if people
don't know where the next one is, they know that if they turn up to
the right pub they'll probably find someone who knows...

From what I hear, the scene's much the same elsewhere, though I'm
fairly new to the scene, so I couldn't really say...

    Rave on,

	Cosmic Roy

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 11:41:48 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 11:05:24 PDT
From: PLUI@iossvr.gm.hac.com
Message-Id: <9305191805.AA17243@hac2arpa.hac.com>
Received: by DniMail (v1.0); Wed May 19 11:05:08 1993 PDT
To: hac2gm..arpa.."sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU"@hac2arpa.hac.com
Subject: nw-raves list here!

Hullooo.....

NWraves (Northwest raves) is now a reality! Here's some addresses:

nw-raves-request@wimsey.bc.ca  -for [un]subcriptions and admin stuff

nw-raves@wimsey.bc.ca          -the list itself...

plui@iossvr.gm.hac.com         -I'll compile a weekly rave guide. 
                                NRG (Northwest Rave Guide) 
                                Send me info.

I'm still putting a welcome to nw-raves msg together, it will follow.
See you on the list!

                                __
Patrick Lui   aka cato         / '>  tweet!
plui@iossvr.gm.hac.com        /\ /\

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 13:30:45 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 1993 12:34 PST
From: PGRASSI@scuacc.scu.edu
Subject: sorry about Jeno
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <CA76458BE002A393@SCUACC.SCU.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@medisg1.stanford.edu
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@medisg1.stanford.edu"

There were some complications and Jeno was not able to make it to the show
last evening, howevah, he'll be coming down next tuesday (again 7-8:30PM,
103.3fm Tuesday).  thanks-
pete g.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 13:46:15 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 13:08:41 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305192008.AA11464@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: groovy!us.oracle.com!boccibob@apc.org
Subject: Re: The Ultimate(tm) Renegade Sound System
Cc: sfraves@nexsys.net

> 
> 
> >	2- way operation (bass on one amp mid and highs on the other)
> 
> This is usually called "bi-amping".  Given the use outdoors, ideally
> you should have a summed mono bass / stereo mids/highs crossover.
> This would improve overall bass response in the space, and keep the
> important parts stereo.
>
Yeah! Thanks.


 
> >	What I need to know is stuff like how much bass power at what
> >	frequencies (he says he can build technology that can go down
> >	around 20 Hz but it would cost in money/power)
> 
> You definitely want to go down to 20 Hz.  At a minimum, you want to go
> down to 40 Hz.  This shouldn't be too hard with a bi-amp scheme, so
> that you have subwoofers which go from 20 Hz - 200 Hz or so, and then
> mids and highs.  However, this doesn't really square with:
> 
> >	Portability (i.e. light and not too bulky)

I would think that with HOUSE music I should be going for as much bass
as possible or a more balanced toward mid range? Any body know?

Well I don`t think about cars when I talk about moving it.
A Two car or small pickup solution is fine, I basiclly want to be able
to "rapidly deploy it. And maybe "scoop it up" quick too.
But definitely would like to be able to set up in 5 - 15 minutes MAX.


> 
> as a good subwoofer will need to be at least 1 foot x 1 foot x 1 foot
> and weigh around 20-30 pounds.  This is pretty much minimum, and you'd
> want four of these most likely to generate enough bass.
>

My friend claims he has some sort of "circular" tube bass technology I'll
talk this over with him.

 
> In general, I think that it's definitely possible to put together a
> sound system which can be moved around in a really big car, but you're
> going to need a generator anyway, so you might as well shoot for
> something which fits in a small pickup.
> 
> Bob
> 
>
Koowel.  What kind of amps should I get? 

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 14:23:31 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 11:39:54 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305191840.AA14450@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Sound

I have a friend who builds speakers for Meyer Sound.  Possible assistance
or discounts available.

-Mark

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 14:39:43 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305192030.AA11603@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: hart@ntmtv.com
Subject: Re: The Progression of House Culture
Cc: sfraves@nexsys.net


> From ntmtv.com!hart@ntmtv.portal.com Wed May 19 12:12:43 1993
> Return-Path: <ntmtv.com!hart@ntmtv.portal.com>
> From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
> Date: Wed, 19 May 1993 11:35:34 -0700
> References: <9305191654.AA11226@nexsys.nexsys.net>
> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
> To: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
> Subject: Re: The Progression of House Culture
> Content-Length: 299
> X-Lines: 8
> Status: RO
> 
>  I think that those are pretty cool ideas, i wonder how they might be
> spread.  it seems that some folks are tuned in immediately and easily,
> but to make this fan out would be really cool, the question is how to
> get such a message to the *average raver*, and to the public at large...
> 
> any ideas?
> 
> *

Yeah! I got an idea! 

		We should make an animated movie!
		(a small one)
		a bunch of us could write a sfew treatments
		or maybe some pieces of a screenplay.

		It could sorta be aligorical or a cover of an existing
		story like Alice in Wonderland
		(with Alice being the quintessential Rave Goddess(tm) )
		I like this theme but I would rather have some theme that
		would call for a group (there's the wizard of oZ!)
		Any of the Fairly Tales could most likely do, anything
		involving a journey or trip.  Then we could reinterpret
		the various scenes in different artistic ways that would
		expound on some concept close to rave culture (sorta
		trying to give the emotional experience without taking
		the substances) but not be overly preachy. It should be
		funny and entertaining (and of course the ravers triumph
		and the planet is saved in the end! (oh, brother :) :) :)

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 16:00:27 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 14:01:33 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <us.oracle.com!rramstad@nexsys.net>
To: geoffw%nexsys@apc.org
Cc: sfraves%nexsys@apc.org, groovy!us.oracle.com!boccibob@apc.org
In-Reply-To: Geoff White's message of Wed, 19 May 93 13:08:41 PDT <9305192008.AA11464@nexsys.nexsys.net>
Subject: The Ultimate(tm) Renegade Sound System
Reply-To: us.oracle.com!boccibob%groovy@nexsys.net


>> This is usually called "bi-amping".  Given the use outdoors, ideally
>> you should have a summed mono bass / stereo mids/highs crossover.
>> This would improve overall bass response in the space, and keep the
>> important parts stereo.

I neglected to mention there's a kit for this in the Old Colony Sound
Labs catalog, if you can't find another source, the kit is $69 and
you'd need a power supply kit at $99 too.  No cases, but otherwise
everything required.

> I would think that with HOUSE music I should be going for as much bass
> as possible or a more balanced toward mid range? Any body know?

I'd say you want roughly double the number of woofers/subwoofers as
you do midranges/tweeters.  My best guess as what would make sense:

4 15" woofers in cabinets for bass
	powered by a good PA amp, like a Crown or Peavy
	may need two amps, but if the first amp is selected well,
	you could start out with one amp powering all 4
	and then buy a second later to get extra oomph if needed
	I'd recommend something rated at 400-600w/ch in stereo operation
	another option would be 6-8 12" woofers, but then you'd
	definitely need 2 amps and you'd spend more overall
2 midrange/horn tweeter cabinets
	my guess here is that you should go for a passive crossover
	between the mids and highs, and I'd also recommend that you
	use two - four midrange drivers, and a single superloaded horn tweeter
	power these with a quality amp, it's OK if the bass amp is
	a little muddy (but very powerful) but this amp needs to be
	cleaner, and doesn't need to be nearly as powerful, 100 w/ch
	should be fine (brand recommendations, anyone?)
active summed mono bass / stereo mid/high crossover

> My friend claims he has some sort of "circular" tube bass technology
> I'll talk this over with him.

These can work well if designed properly, but can be boomy if not.
Well designed enclosures for the speakers are a must, regardless of
the shape.  

> A two car or small pickup solution is fine, I basiclly want to be able
> to "rapidly" deploy it. And maybe "scoop it up" quick too.  But
> definitely would like to be able to set up in 5 - 15 minutes MAX.

Most of the time setting up a system isn't in moving the gear, it's
putting the connections together.  If you have all of the gear in your
possession and it's stable, you can optimize the connections and make
it REALLY SIMPLE to hookup.  A good trick here is to color code / tag
/ tape everything so that completely non-technical people can hook up
the speakers without any more direction than "match the colors".

Budget?  My guess is that you'll spend around $600 for the bass amp,
roughly the same for the mid/high amp, around $1000 for
woofers/mids/tweeters (4 woofers at about $60, 8 mids at about $40, 2
horns at about $100, plus slack), who knows? on the cabinets, depends
on your friend, but maybe as much as $600-$1000, and then good strong
cables and connectors could run you another $500 or so.  Total cost in
the $3000+ range.  This system should be comparable to the standard
FMR setup but with more bass, and my guess is that it would be a lot
cheaper.

Of course, there are a lot of advantages to buying off-the-shelf PA
cabinets, primary being that you can listen to the results before
investing a bunch of money in cabinet materials which are wasted if
the resulting cabinet doesn't work well.

Just a bunch of conjecture, but I've worked in clubs and ran my own DJ
outfit where I hauled gear all over eastern WA for 4 years... but I'm
sure there are people out there on the list who know more than I about
this.

We should coordinate this, I'd like to see the SFR sound system
happen, and I could see myself buying into it if there was the
possibility of seeing some of the $$ returned at some point through
donations collected at events.

Bob


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 16:25:39 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 15:46:07 PDT
From: alves@bethe.ucdavis.edu (David Alves)
Message-Id: <9305192246.AA04936@bethe.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: talk show


hello

did anyone see the Lifetime talk show Jane Pratt?
they had "Ecstacy and Raves" as the topic last night.

the show had 3 ravers (2 guys and 1 girl), 1 promoter (Scotto), 
1 NY dj (don't remember the name), one young lady doctor who goes
to raves with her doctor friends, and some filmaker named Duane who
is a big fan of the current war on drugs.

the show was ok as far as talk shows go.  it definitely focused on the
use of E at raves and the pros and cons of E and generally anything to
do with E.

the Dj complained about this as did others.

the 3 ravers were sometimes too enthusiastic and excited to
be taken real seriously by the studio audience, especially one
guy who was wearing shorts.
 
the doctor seemed to come from a psychiatric background and was not
as clear and authoritative as you would hope.  she did explain the
MPTP/Parkinsons confusion but was vague about the spinal fluid rumor.

both of these were put forward by Duane the well informed drug warrior.

i thought the funniest part of the show was when some lady in the
audience started yelling at the girl raver asking if "she ever planned
on having kids?"  and telling her that "her babies were going to be
mutated by all the drugs she used to take."

makes me wonder if a lot of bored New Yorkers go on this show
just to say ridiculous stuff.  maybe she was a plant - hired by
the show to spice things up?  or maybe it was a fairly typical
antidrug rant.

dave

P.S.  the doc did try to explain that E doesn't cause mutated babies.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 16:46:22 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 93 14:42:11 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305192142.AA11856@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: groovy!us.oracle.com!boccibob@igc.apc.org
Subject: Re: The Ultimate(tm) Renegade Sound System
Cc: sfraves%nexsys@apc.org, renegade%nexsys@apc.org


Maybe we should take this discussion off line... I've set up
a list for it called 

	renegade@nexsys.net

To auto subscribe send to renegade-request@nexsys.net

SUBSCRIBE RENEGADE Your name

and  the friendly listserver droid will service your request
to get off send 
UNSUBSCRIBE RENEGADE

easy.
See you there.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 16:49:39 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 1993 16:12 MST
From: "Devin J. Hanson" <DHANSON@cc.utah.edu>
Subject: Opinion of DJ?
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Message-Id: <E8DACB49E200821E@CC.UTAH.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
X-Vms-To: IN%"sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu"


I'm considering bringing James to Salt Lake City for a June 12 rave.  Can anyone tell me their opinion of his music and what kind of music he plays?

Thanks!

Devin

Peace

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 19 19:08:17 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 1993 18:44:24 -0800
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
X-Sender: rth@netcom.com (Unverified)
Subject: More Stuff coming up ...


Couple flyers I picked up at Together, (which was nice and warm last night).

Live & Direct  -  Friday May 21
Warehouse Jamdown  -  Spun * Shon  -  Mark Farina  -  Jon Williams
16th and Harrison
$5 12:30 - Dawn

wednesdays opening night june 2nd dj's: mark farina - harry who? - james & gavan
free before 12, $2 after @ sound factory

FLO May 22
Carlos - Binnie - Dutch - Smiles - Moonpup - Frank E - Giga Beat
Featuring Savage Tribal Drumming
visual sensations - Plasma Sculpture by the "FOSSIL"
Visual Creation by 8th Day - Visual Lush by JOSH - Lazers by GLOWORM
Mind Pumping Sound by DIRECT SOUND SYSTEMS
Massage Lounge*Smart Bar*Fresh Fruit*Paint Room*Solar Shaman
415-281-0669 408-450-3532 510-247-2328 (last number is the same as
Animating May 22)

 


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 02:47:23 1993
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Date: Wed, 19 May 1993 22:00:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Magnalena Kita <magskita@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu>
Subject: 90210
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Cc: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
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CONGRATDULATIONS TO THE GRADUATING CLASS OF WEST BEVERYLY HIGH 1993

...because we know what "cool" ravers are...heheheheeh

partyon...susie (: (in the big apple)



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 02:47:29 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305200505.AA28286@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: Next VRAVE , When ?
To: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Date: Thu, 20 May 1993 01:05:14 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305200418.AA13361@netcom.netcom.com> from "Larry Ching" at May 19, 93 09:18:20 pm
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Beyond the ultraworld of Larry Ching:
> 
>  When is the next occasion that VRAVE is going to be set up?

June 19th, Montreal, Canada... a bit far i suppose :)

3 terminals to a console running unix with slip... if simpler solutions exists,
i'd like to hear about them... only 1 phone line... which is still a good
beginning, particularly if you have to climb telephone poles :)

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 02:47:41 1993
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <9305200418.AA13361@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Next VRAVE , When ?
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Wed, 19 May 93 21:18:20 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


 I know about someone who has an idea for something she calls the Virtual
Rave. I'd like to take her to a local rave that has VRAVE running , to see
if it matches her idea in any respects.

 When is the next occasion that VRAVE is going to be set up?

				Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

-- 

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 09:37:07 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305200811.ZM23632@nmtvs313>
Date: Thu, 20 May 1993 08:11:43 -0700
In-Reply-To: ames!netcom.com!rth (Robert Hughes)
        "More Stuff coming up ..." (May 19,  6:44pm)
References: <9305200144.AA27406@netcom.netcom.com>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: ames!netcom.com!rth (Robert Hughes), sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: DIRECT SOUND SYSTEMS

DIRECT SOUND SYSTEMS
----------------------

anyone have an opinion on these guys as sound system suppliers?

thx,

*

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 11:04:11 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305201003.ZM23754@nmtvs313>
Date: Thu, 20 May 1993 10:03:07 -0700
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Tryin' to call me? (415) 940-2263
Cc: ntmtv!hart

hey,

i keep getting several "click" messages daily on my (415) 940-2263 phone
number, and since i just invited everyone and their cousin from sfraves
to call, i though i'd just say go ahead and leave a message, i don't 
bite...also, if you thot you got a wrong #, jack=chris..., i have
friends who know me by both...so don't worry dahling, just spit it
out and i'll get back to ya real quick, i'm just out of my office
alot, so it's hard to catch me "live"...if it ain't any of you, well
just ignore this then...

PS: anybody going to pfunk friday?  that shit is going to be ON!!!!
if ya want to hang b4 tha show, and live in the city, drop a line...
in other funky bizniss, there's a virtual rap-a-thon going down on
the "green" (concord?), anybody else out here a rap addict?


"oak-land, ya know i go way back
 to cool nuts, phat 'stangs and cadillacs..."

*

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 11:21:07 1993
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Message-Id: <9305201752.AA10540@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: Next VRAVE , When ?

(oops, forgot to Cc: this to the list...)

Larry sez:

>  When is the next occasion that VRAVE is going to be set up?

I was just thinking that someone ought to set up vrave at Wicked
this Saturday (with consent of Markie, etc. of course).  Anyone
out there with a PC + Modem interested?  There are several nooks
and crannies at Sound Factory that could be good spots to set up
if someone has long-enough phone extensions (and if there's any
elbow room left at all  =)

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 11:21:51 1993
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From: mw@sybase.com (Michael Wertheim)
Message-Id: <9305201753.AA01646@orion.sybgate.sybase.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: house in SF
Content-Length: 342


House music?  Nope, I can't stand the stuff.

Jon, Jeff and I are looking for a 4-bedroom house in San Francisco.  If you
know of one that's for rent, please let us know about it.

Requirements:
    - street parking
    - reasonably safe neighborhood
    - rent under $1600 per month

Finder's Reward: We'll sample you on the next UVC 12".


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Date: Thu, 20 May 93 11:11:40 -0800
From: Robert Jesse <rjesse@us.oracle.com>
Message-Id: <9305201911.AA02289@lila.us.oracle.com>
To: mw@sybase.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: subscription

hey mike,  i was talking with jon yesterday and he thought that
i should have received the new Twitch CD by now.  i haven't.

i wonder if, when i sent in my subscription, i was actually added
to your paid subscriber mailing list.  wondering if you could check
it out.  thanks.  - bob

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 11:54:55 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Thu, 20 May 1993 11:09:29 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-calendar@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: This week's RAVE guide

	Hi gang!  I'm calling in from LA long-distance so this'll
have to be short... I was gonna do this last night but soda decided
to veto that idea, as it was down right up to the time I had to leave.
Anyways, I don't have much to recommend for Friday night, but it might
be a good chance to see what the inside of 16th and Harrison looks like 
for $5 :)  Saturday night I'd recommend you set your luv phasers to STUN
and make a Wicked vibe, tho Foundation could be cool, and FLO definitely
looks intriguing (I for one will always champion the cause of the unheard
DJ and/or party, so I would go even to just see what's up on your way
to wherever else).  Last Sunday there was a beach party where Sloat meets
the great highway, and they *say* they're gonna try and have it there each
week, tho I don't have a phone # for them yet.  Graham & co. may try
a party this Sunday as well, so call the phone # listed....

	Have fun!


*****************************************************************************
UPCOMING RAVES IN THE SF/BAY AREA                     Last modified: 05/14/93
*****************************************************************************

Friday, May 21st - Funky [something]
        Carlos  Dutch  Darwin
        415.979.4544

Friday May 21 - Live & Direct - Spun * Shon - Mark Farina - Jon Williams 
	16th and Harrison - $5 12:30 - Dawn

Saturday morning 4am-noon - Splash! - DJ's Robbie Hardkiss, Dutch, Alfie,
	Simon, and Doran  - 278 11st Street, SF - 415-979-5880
	Also, for the next few weeks this is FREE

Saturday, May 22nd - Wicked - DJ's Jeno, Garth, Markie, and Doc Martin
	Sound Factory, corner of 1st and Harrison, SF  21+
	$15 goes towards your first renegade sound system  
	[Come with your luv phasers set to STUN]  415-512-5713

Saturday, May 22nd - Foundation - DJ's Doran Tony Simon Jas DocMartin and Spun
	415-905-8831 - (previous Foundations have been 18+)

Saturday, May 22nd - Flo
        Carlos  Binnie  Dutch  Smiles  Moonpup  Frank E  Giga Beat
        featuring savage tribal drumming
        visuals by The "Fossil", 8th Day, Josh, Gloworm
        Massage Lounge/Smart Bar/Fresh Fruit/Paint Room/Solar Shaman
        (415)281-0669   (408)450-3532   (510)247-2328

Sunday, May 23th - the GG Park Party moveth!  415-995-4731

Sunday May 23 (and every Sunday) @ The Bridge (4th & Bryant) - Tilt-a-Whirl
	*Steve Mitchell*   *Simon (UK)*   *Goa Gil*
	Visuals by GO'D (Gandolph O'Dougherty) & Paradise
	8pm - 4am;  21+ w/ID   415.647.GRUV

Saturday, May 29th - A Festival of Sound: Three tents to GET DOWN GET
	DOWN and one tent to get WICKED - indoors and outdoors - 
	All welcome to the re-unification of the scattered tribes

	DJ's (are you ready for this?)
	Harry Who	Spun		John Williams	Garth
	Pasta - Seattle	Josh		Carlos		Jeno
	Rick Preston	Dj Wool		Moonpup		Markie Mark
	Bam Bam		Ernie Munsen	Julius		Doc Marten
	Ghost		Eric Hill	Alfie		Barry Weaver
	Tony		James & Gavan (Tweakin')	James - sacramento
	Derek Carter & Mark Farina on 4 tables 		Live - DubTribe
	introducing: Mei-Lwun * Alonzo * Allan * Vicious V & Arturo
	
	408-496-1780 * 415-905-5917

Saturday, June 5th - Vortex - DJ's Josh, James, Markie, Buck, Ernie, & Tony
	415-337-4988

Wednesday, June 9th - (a party down in Santa Cruz, thus far with no name)
	(408) 425-UJIV

Saturday, June 12th - Spirit of the Tree - 415-266-8215 (Funky Techno Tribe)
	Tony Jeno Grahame DJ Dan and Thomas

Friday, June 18th - Sunday June 20st - Solstice - another Taste event, in the
	Utah desert.  If you're interested, send mail to solstice-request@
	slack.sim.es.com, with the word "SUB" in the body of the message.
	Buses from the Bay Area will be coordinated, if there's enough 
	interest, with a most likely departure time of Thursday night and a 
	return time of late Sunday night.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

        People who want to send money, cards and other
        goodwill thoughts to Malachy can make checks payable to
        the:

                M. O'brian Healing Fund
                1388 Haight st #117
                San Francisco CA. 94112

        Also for the latest info on Mal you can dial

        (415) 241-1560.

        Every one's positive energy is DEFINITELY paying off.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Be-AT INFO LINE: 415-626-4087. This usually gives info 
about the raves coming up in the next couple of days.

More phone lines:
Feel the Trip: 415-905-9661
UP3 productions: 408-399-2611
408-296-1611 - 510-464-5999 - 916-558-3777

Also, Ameba Clothing can give info on raves.
415-750-9368, 1732 Haight St., San Fransisco
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here are some weeklies - whether or not they count as real "raves" is 
debatable, but they were advertised by fliers and the music could be
good. If anyone can provide reviews of them, i.e., their 
appropriateness in being on the list, let me know....

Fridays - Mission Rock - DJ's James and Gavin (from Tweekin Records)
	& others.  Outside dance floor. In China basin at 17th and Illinois.
	Phone  415-241-8862  	Visuals by Synergy (hi Tony!)

Fridays - ZANZIBAR - Deep house, acid jazz and garage.  DJ Josh.  (415)
        695-7887.  842 Valencia @ 19th St.

Fridays - Life (updated DJ lists)
	[5/14 - Sasha]
	[5/21 - Marques Wyatt, Buck]
	[5/28 - Derrick Carter, Mark Farina]
	Sound Factory - 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF    415.543.1300

Fridays - Mr. Happy's Disco - garage, deeep house, disco
	Jan Cooley & Aaron O 
	174 King St, $8, 11pm->, info: 415.487.6237, 21+
	[from the Love Garage people]

Fridays - Berlin  10pm  55 Natoma (back of DV8)
        "Hard hitting bass sounds radiating rightious (sic) vibes
         for your brain"

Fridays at F/X - fresh with Rick Preston and friends
	400 south 1st street in San Jose - info: (408) 298-9796

Friday night/Saturday morning - Splash
     4am-12pm, Club O, 278 11th @ Folsom    FREE

Saturday mornings - Family Dog - Info 415.266.8254
        Charter Oak warehouse - 3am-morning
	Ghost Tigger Ernie Nick
        (presented by Turtle Wax) 

Saturdays - Housing Project (after party) - 6am - 1pm 
	End Up 401 6th @ Harrison 21+ (Also Wednesdays 9pm-330am)

Saturdays - Deep House Sessions
	April 17 & 24 - Confluence: Eric Lacy  Jan Cooley  Garth  Jeno
	at the Groove Station  1141 Polk St  6-9 pm  FREE

Sunday mornings - Tilt-a-Whirl
        [april 18th - Robbie Hardkiss  Carlos  Bam Bam & others]
        6am - ?    18+     $5
        520 4th St @ Bryant (the Bridge/Trocadero)

Sundays - EndUp from 6am - 6th & Harrison

Sundays - AfterLife - six am till...  - 375 11th st * Dj Simon, Ernie *
	Bagels * Fruit Salad * Espresso * Smart Bar * Chill Room
	This week, Markie Mark 6-8:30am

Sundays - Boogie Buffet - Brought to you by Preston (groove kitchen et al.) 
	and Paul (afterLIFE) - Sunday Mornings at 1015 Folsom  
	6am until early afternoon. - Dancing downstirs, 
	Full breakfast cafe upstairs - Call 979-8845 for DJ lineup 

Sundays - Reunion (last Sunday of every month)
        Yahoo  Simon  Garth     10-6am  (707)323-4708

Sunday nights - Bulletproof boat party - 5-9pm pier 40 (boat embarks
        promply at 5) DJ's Scott & Robbie Hardkiss, Digs & Woosh, and others
        Tickets at both Bulletproof locations 629 Haight (255.7168)
        & upstairs at BPM  1141 Polk (567.8439)

Sunday, May 16th (and every Sunday) 8pm -4am - Tilt-a-Whirl (the nighttime
	version) @ The Bridge; 4th & Bryant SF; 415.647.GRUV
	DJ's [5/16: Brad, Surge, and Goa Gil]   18+

Sundays - Team Green 
	3rd @ Harrison, 315 Harrison (City Nights), 21+ ID; Brought to 
	you by the people who promoted "Carefree", $8.00 admission.  
	Carefree alternative Style 

Sundays - flow at Nickie's (460 Haight)
        full house w/dj - 10pm-2am, 21+

Sundays - Zanzibar - 1pm-9pm - James, Gavin, and Felix playing a mix of House, 
	Funk and Rare Groove

Sundays, 3-7pm - Acid Jazz & Reggae Dancehall Connection - DJ's 
	Ivan, Rolo 1-3, Mind Motion, EFX, Ismael - Groove Station - 
	1141 Polk Street, SF

Sundays - Sunday Skool at Atlantis	5pm - 4am
	1st & Harrison 

Sunday night - Spundae (no relation to Spun, as far as I can tell)
        8pm - ?    Guest DJs + Henrick
        Natoma, between 1st and 2nd (probably 55 natoma, back of DV8)

Mondays - Depth Chamber - beginning 6/7
	[6/7 - jeno]
	[6/14 - bones/jan cooley]
	[6/21 - james/robbie hardkiss]
	[6/28 - greenwod/markie]
	at the refurbished 181 club, 181 eddy @ taylor
	9-2am, 21+, (415)241-1560

Mondays - Pepper - Diff'rnt DJ's, notably Noel, Josh and Buck - 
	Don's Different Duck on lower Haight.

Mondays - House Coffee - DJ Stefan blends house grooves
        all ages, 115 4th St, Railroad Square. (Hot Spots)
        546-8665

Mondays - Pepper.Deep House with Buck, Josh, Chris Lum & Guests. 668
	Haight, 10-2AM, $3, 21+. "Tis a very merry, dancing, drinking, 
	laughing, quaffing, and untinking time" -- John Dryden. (the 
	oldest rave quote i've seen so far....)

Tuesdays - Together - Thomas  Simon  Garth  - Basement of Big Heart City
	415-979-8825

Tuesdays - ZANZIBAR - House.  DJ Andy.  (415) 695-7887.
        842 Valencia @ 19th St.

Wednesdays - Housing Project - 9-330am @ 401 6th st / harrison
	guest dj's ernie munson, jeno, josh, garth - 21+

Wednesdays - This Old House - Zanzibar - 842 Valencia, SF
	Jan Cooley  Neon Leon  Bam Bam 		10pm - 2am, $4

Wednesdays starting june 2nd dj's: mark farina - harry who? - james & gavan
	free before 12, $2 after @ sound factory

Wednesdays - Chocolate City - Bam Bam, Gerry V, Scott Hardkiss
	10pm - 4am, $5 ($2 b4 11), 21+
	Atlantis - 375 1st @ Harrison
	
Thursdays - Lush (beginning May 20th)
	Chris Lum & Ernie Munson
	715 Harrison @ 3rd	21+

Thursdays - Deep Space - 200 N. 1st Street, SJ - 21+ - 408-345-2386
	Two dance floors - DJ's have included: Spun, Garth, Thomas,
	Risk Preston, Harry Who, and more.  Free before 9:30pm

Thursdays - ZANZIBAR - Acid jazz and house.  DJ Suki.  (415) 695-7887.
        842 Valencia @ 19th St. 21+

Thursdays - Primal - Tribal, Techno, and trance - Dj's Lewis and 
	Bryan Hughes - 9th and Harrison

Thursdays - Dog House (presented by Family Dog)
	"The Underground Comes to the Peninsula" (!)
	8-2am  261 California Ave, Burlingame	21+

Thursdays - VIRGIN MARY - bringing back the LOVE - with always holy & 
	consistent DJs garth, jan cooley, dutch, larry jr. - 2000 K street
	SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA - 21 & over, 10:00 pm

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONNECTION 2 TAPES are still available from Bob Ramstad,
boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com.  It's a 4-tape set, with music by
Moonpup, Scott Hardkiss, Jon Drukman, Lee, and Blurrrr - the tapes are
$20, plus $5 shipping (unless you pick it up in person) $5 of which
goes to the Malachy O'Brien trust fund.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

RADIO SHOWS: 

(Need info for: Friday and Saturday nights on 106.1, 107.7, and 105.3 -
	if you know the names and tiumes of the shows, give me a buzz...)

Tuesdays, noon - 3pm - "London Jamaica" w/Francesca & Unknown
	House + some reggae	KZSU, 90.1 FM. - well-known guest DJs 

Tuesdays (early Wednesdays actually) - 12:45 - 3:30am, 90.7 KALX (Berkeley) - 
	fellow sfraver Mescalina "Tune in for acid indigestion and 
	other ailments"

Wednesdays, 10pm, KFJC, Foothill College (Santa Clara)

Thursdays, 7-9 on 91.3 FM KCPR San Luis Obispo - Beyond Techno, with
	DJ EZ Whip.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

If anyone has info on any other events, submit them! I can't possibly hope
to get all the info every week. 

Brian Behlendorf

bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-request@soda, owner-sfraves@soda, etc.


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 12:01:24 1993
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	for 
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Date: Thu, 20 May 93 11:17:48 PDT
From: mark@ganymede.apple.com (Mark Baldwin)
Message-Id: <9305201817.AA07579@ganymede.apple.com>
To: SanFran rAvErS <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>,
        mark@ganymede.apple.com
    (Money's Not Our God, Really)
Subject: goodbye (for now...)


goodbye to everyone at sfraves...i'm moving to another job, and
i won't have net access until i get all set up.  so long apple,
hello radius.

i will miss all of my net.friends and hope to see you again soon.

rave killer and take care...

-mArK. (Usually Works In One Dose)

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 13:28:07 1993
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From: kawakami@noc.usfca.edu (Sea of Sin)
Message-Id: <9305202001.AA07608@noc.usfca.edu>
Subject: addendum to the calendar
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU (Discoravers)
Date: Thu, 20 May 1993 13:01:52 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves-calendar@soda.berkeley.edu
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL8]
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Content-Length: 476       

Friday, May 21st- Sunday, May 23rd- Goddess Is Awake. Artists and Speakers
	include The Gorilla Choir, Timothy Leary, R.U. Serious of Mondo 2000, & more.
	& more. Donation $1-$13. All shows 8 pm. UCSC Upper Quarry in Santa
        Cruz.

Saturday, May 22nd - deep-routed house
	DJs frankie  cyril  patrick  billy  tony
	9:00pm, 21+, $3		houseline: 875-1227

Sunday, May 23rd - Tilt-a-Whirl
	Steve Mitchel   Simon   Goa Gil
	8pm - 4am, 520 4th St @ Bryant, 21+, 415.647.GRUV



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 14:12:59 1993
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From: calvin@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Thu, 20 May 93 13:42:17 -0700
Message-Id: <9305202042.AA29511@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: info?


      I noticed the following in the addendum to the calendar:

Friday, May 21st- Sunday, May 23rd- Goddess Is Awake. Artists and Speakers
        include The Gorilla Choir, Timothy Leary, R.U. Serious of Mondo 2000,
        & more. Donation $1-$13. All shows 8 pm. UCSC Upper Quarry in Santa
        Cruz.

     What is going on there?  I go to ucsc and I haven't heard anything about
it.  Thanks...

calvin@cats.ucsc.edu

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 16:29:32 1993
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Date: Thu, 20 May 1993 16:03:51 -0700
From: Derek Yu <derek@ocf.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199305202303.AA15302@lightning.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: unsubscribe...


I am heading out to NY from 5/23-6/23...
please unsubscribe me for that time..
i'll be back...


**********DEREK************



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 23:02:59 1993
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Date: Thu, 20 May 1993 22:20:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott Everett Swiger <scottie@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: MOTHER EARTH SOUND SYSTEM #2
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305202227.B20690-a100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


MOTHER EARTH SOUND SYSTEM 
will gather 
Saturday, May 22 
to perform an outdoor sunset ritual of music and dance
from 3 pm to a (late) night end

No alcohol - your liquid needs met by FOOD NOT BOMBS

Bring picnic stuff - food, fun tingz (drums, toys, etc), blankets....

DJs -->
	Brad	
	Andy
	Stonie	
	Scottie
	and special guest Ben
	from Brighton, England

All welcome - free as always

Watch for directions Friday (5/21) night!


			MOTHER EARTH SOUND SYSTEM
			>>>respect your mother<<<

			UNITE  CELEBRATE  SURVIVE


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 20 23:15:12 1993
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From: jas@netcom.com
Message-Id: <9305210553.AA09329@netcom3.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Next VRAVE , When ?
To: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Date: Thu, 20 May 93 22:53:02 PDT
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Reply-To: jas@netcom.com
In-Reply-To: <9305201752.AA10540@netcom.netcom.com>; from "MykL G" at May 20, 93 10:52 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

> 
> (oops, forgot to Cc: this to the list...)
> 
> Larry sez:
> 
> >  When is the next occasion that VRAVE is going to be set up?
> 
> I was just thinking that someone ought to set up vrave at Wicked
> this Saturday (with consent of Markie, etc. of course).  Anyone
> out there with a PC + Modem interested?  There are several nooks
> and crannies at Sound Factory that could be good spots to set up
> if someone has long-enough phone extensions (and if there's any
> elbow room left at all  =)
> 
> ----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
>         MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
> ____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____
> 
> 
	I have a notebook 386pc with a 14.4k modem. I'm free this Saturday
so why not! Send me some mail!

	-jas 
 

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 01:02:05 1993
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From: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Message-Id: <9305210732.AA01166@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Trying to reaach the Wicked rave promoters

Hi,
  As suggested by some other ravers,   I tried to Email to wicked@netcom.com
but nobody there has responded to my Email and was wondering if anyone here
is in contact with them and can ask them to respond to my Email.   So if anyone
out there knows other means of contacting them,   please have them either call
me or Email me.   I sent them my phone number,  so they should have it.

Thanx
JD

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 01:22:00 1993
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Date: Fri, 21 May 1993 00:43:11 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305210743.AA19686@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: re: next online VRAVE

I
I'll be in the SF area from Friday through Memorial Day (yay).  So I could
possibly also bring my laptop and 14.4K modem to Wicked on Saturday night,
although I'll be at the Grateful Dead show at Shoreline earlier so I might
not arrive until 2 or 3 am . . .

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 08:13:44 1993
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Date: Fri, 21 May 93 07:28:35 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305211428.AA15122@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU, phred@well.sf.ca.us
Subject: re: next online VRAVE


> From medisg.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org Fri May 21 06:12:57 1993
> Return-Path: <medisg.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org>
> Date: Fri, 21 May 1993 00:43:11 -0700
> From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
> To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
> Subject: re: next online VRAVE
> Content-Length: 260
> X-Lines: 5
> Status: RO
> 
> I
> I'll be in the SF area from Friday through Memorial Day (yay).  So I could
> possibly also bring my laptop and 14.4K modem to Wicked on Saturday night,
> although I'll be at the Grateful Dead show at Shoreline earlier so I might
> not arrive until 2 or 3 am . . .
> 
Thanks everbody but VRAVE really needs a CRT to be effective in a crowd.
Especially in a place like the sound factory.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 11:15:30 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305211719.AA15266@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: Clipart



	Anybody know where there is a cache of clip art on the Net?

	I need it for the rave zine.
	e-mail me privately.

				G

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 11:17:36 1993
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Date: Fri, 21 May 93 10:40:24 pst
From: barryale@symantec.com (Barry Alexander)
Message-Id: <9304217380.AA738006024@symantec.com>
To: Scott Everett Swiger <scottie@uclink.berkeley.edu>,
        sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Return-Receipt-To: barryale@symantec.com (Barry Alexander)
Subject: Re: MOTHER EARTH SOUND SYSTEM #2



    Is there a tel. # to call for this? i won't have access to email friday nite
    and really want to check this event out!

    barry

MOTHER EARTH SOUND SYSTEM 
will gather 
Saturday, May 22 
to perform an outdoor sunset ritual of music and dance
from 3 pm to a (late) night end

No alcohol - your liquid needs met by FOOD NOT BOMBS

Bring picnic stuff - food, fun tingz (drums, toys, etc), blankets....

DJs -->
 Brad 
 Andy
 Stonie 
 Scottie
 and special guest Ben
 from Brighton, England

All welcome - free as always

Watch for directions Friday (5/21) night!


   MOTHER EARTH SOUND SYSTEM
   >>>respect your mother<<<

   UNITE  CELEBRATE  SURVIVE



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 11:47:34 1993
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From: Ravi Vinodrai Gadhia <rg@cs.stanford.edu>
Message-Id: <9305211817.AA00550@Xenon.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: LUSH
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Fri, 21 May 1993 11:17:20 -0700 (PDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 399       

Hi All,

Don't know where they got the name, but decided
to check Lush out anyways.  3rd & Harrison is
a pretty good spot--good lighting, ok sound, &
safe.  We missed Ernie Munson; Chris Lum
played a set that got about 20 people on the 
dance floor groovin'.  Definitely a FUN time.

Next week is Derrick Carter & Mark Farina.
Let's see what else...$5 :| , 21+ :( 

see you there next week!
Ravi




From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 12:01:34 1993
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----------------------------Original message----------------------------
I saw the following posted on another mailing list.  I was wondering if
there is anyone else out there who has heard about this, or can verify
it?

***********************************************************************

Original message: "ACTION ALERT"


Time for Social Work Advocacy:

The Internet as we know it may be at risk by our Congress.
A bill written by Rep. Rick Boucher (D, Virginia), chair of the House
Science Subcommittee will remove government subsidies and place control
with the telephone companies.  A likely consequence will be a substantial
increase of cost to universities with the likelihood that some will
drop out or charge for use by individuals.

This not only threatens CUSSnet, but all other academic uses of the nets.
Perhaps it is time to notify our representatives of the value of the
internet for educational, scientific, and other scholarly uses.

Additional information can be found in "Colleges and Telephone
Companies Battle over the Future of the Internet", page A25,
The Chronicle of Higher Education, vol. 39 #37, May 19, 1993.



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 14:21:39 1993
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Date: Fri, 21 May 1993 13:51:33 -0800
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
Subject: YAF ...

 Yes, it yet another flyer:

DO Friday May 28th 10 PM/$7/6AM
Mr Curb Blackstone Noel Buck
415-267-3964 
 It'll be in SF -- North Beach somewhere, but not the Stone ...


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 15:24:03 1993
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Date: Fri, 21 May 93 14:17:42 PDT
From: Marcell.Gabriel@ebay.sun.com (Marcell Gabriel)
Message-Id: <9305212117.AA08828@livinlarge.EBay.Sun.COM>
To: ames!ebay.sun.com!Marcell.Gabriel@ebay.sun.com, funky-music@athena.mit.edu,
        alvinl@u023.ca.vp.com, hart@ntmtv.com
Subject: Re: INQUIRING MINDS
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU


> 
> you gonna be there G?
> 
> of course, i *don't have that 12" with me....damn!
> 
> who else is going?  anyone want to meet at the theatre b4 da show?
> 
> inside?  near the bar?  any better ideas?  (i had a long lunch.....zzzzzz)
> 
> peace, love and hair grease (izzat wot they say?  are *you* my mother?)
> 

Yes, I'm going tonight.  I was kickin' myself when I missed the 
mothership in Berkeley, several months ago.   

I leaving the office around 3:30pm and headed straight to Circle Star
to get my ticket.  Then I'll break for a little din-din.  

I'm down fo' meeting before the show.  Or even afterward.


'Cell

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 15:27:08 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
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Date: Fri, 21 May 1993 13:34:03 -0700
In-Reply-To: Marcell Gabriel <ames!ebay.sun.com!Marcell.Gabriel>
        "Re: INQUIRING MINDS" (May 21, 12:48pm)
References: <9305211948.AA08672@livinlarge.EBay.Sun.COM>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: Marcell Gabriel <ames!ebay.sun.com!Marcell.Gabriel>,
        funky-music@athena.mit.edu, alvinl@u023.ca.vp.com
Subject: Re: INQUIRING MINDS
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU

you gonna be there G?

of course, i *don't have that 12" with me....damn!

who else is going?  anyone want to meet at the theatre b4 da show?

inside?  near the bar?  any better ideas?  (i had a long lunch.....zzzzzz)

peace, love and hair grease (izzat wot they say?  are *you* my mother?)



"gotta break 'em off somethin'
 and it's *gotta* be bumpin'"

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 15:34:59 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
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Date: Fri, 21 May 1993 14:28:09 -0700
In-Reply-To: ames!ebay.sun.com!Marcell.Gabriel (Marcell Gabriel)
        "Re: INQUIRING MINDS" (May 21,  2:17pm)
References: <9305212117.AA08828@livinlarge.EBay.Sun.COM>
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To: ames!ebay.sun.com!Marcell.Gabriel (Marcell Gabriel),
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        alvinl@u023.ca.vp.com, ntmtv!hart
Subject: Re: INQUIRING MINDS
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU



Let's meet at the bar nearest the front door just before the show.
  I'll be wearing a maroon cap that says "PNB"... I'm 5'6-7"...

lat,

*

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 21 23:19:23 1993
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Date: Fri, 21 May 1993 22:20:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott Everett Swiger <scottie@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: M.E.S.S. Location
To: sfraves <sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305212219.B25175-b100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


The MOTHER EARTH SHOUND SYSTEM outdoor sunset gathering
Saturday, May 22, 3 pm-very late
will be at Berkeley's Aquatic Park

* from SF/South Bay...
	Take 880 to the University Ave. exit
	Take University to 6th St. and turn RIGHT
	Take 6th to Dwight and turn RIGHT
	Follow Dwight til it deads ends at the railroad tracks
	Park, walk across the tracks, down the hill, veer right, and listen

* from Berkeley/East Bay...
	Take University west to 6th St. and turn LEFT
	see above

Public transportation...
	Take the AC Transit #51 down University to 6th, get off, etc etc

If driving, please try to park a little way from the end of Dwight and walk

If you need to hear the directions, call this number -

Whit (510) 549-6222 (his machine has directions on it, and IF THE LOCATION
CHANGES, we will post new location and directions on this machine)

or if you want to hear a human -
Scott (510) 549-6253

We hope to meet you out in the sun!!! :)

Peace,

			MOTHER EARTH SOUND SYSTEM
			>>>respect your mother<<<
			UNITE  CELEBRATE  SURVIVE


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May 22 21:02:35 1993
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From: drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu
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To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: subscribe me

please subscribe me
drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sat May 22 23:04:13 1993
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: Dead Tomorrow 
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Sat, 22 May 93 22:43:26 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


 With the lack of traffic here , I'm assuming that everyone's studying
hard and/or raving hard! So, a small post from me.

 I'll be at Shoreline tomorrow ( Sunday ) for the Grateful Dead show. I'll
be bringing my girlfriend to her first Dead show - we'll be camped out on 
the lawn. If anyone else is going ( besides Fred Huette ) , I'll be wearing
an SFR badge , and maybe my SFR hat. Since there's few places that I 
feel comfortable about wearing my 50th Anniversary of LSd t-shirt, I'll
probably be wearing that too.

				Rave On!

					Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

-- 

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 23 00:08:31 1993
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Date: Sun, 23 May 93 02:23:32 EDT
From: <sk2479a@american.edu>
To: <@auvm.american.edu:SK2479A@AMERICAN.EDU>
Subject: spinning at fmr's???


hiya all...i have a friend christian (who goes by the dj name applepie) and he
is wondering who to contact about spinning at the june fmr...he is from norway.
..and went to school on the east coast...and would love to spin at an fmr...
(also he is an excellent dj..and spins awesome tunes...) since he will be in c
alifornia...could someone enlighten me...thanx...partyon...susie(: btw what
is the date of the next fmr...?(even thogh i won't be there....)and what is the
 date of the july fmr...(cuz i can maybe arrange to be there...)

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 23 01:11:20 1993
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Date: Sun, 23 May 93 00:38:23 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305230738.AA00925@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: Renegade Sound System (status)


	We just got another Sound System Designer/Builder
	signed on to the renegade list and he is outlining some
	good stuff. Once again if anybody out there wants to
	join in the discussion , sign on by doing a 
	
	subscribe renegade <your name>

	in the body of a message to renegade-request@nexsys.net

	We'll keep the list going for the duration of this project
	(which will most likely result in the construction and
	delivery of a sound system)  This IS NOT the same thing as the
	sfraves sound system (although it could be) but we need sfraves
	expertise as far as making a portable, high quality system
	that Kicks (B)ASS!! We're shooting for the $3- $5 K range so all
	you techno musicians and people who know what House music should
	sound like in the great outdoors Give us a hand!


				G
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
      If I can Trance, I don't want to be part of your revolution
				(stolen from monicat :)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 23 05:54:15 1993
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Date: Sun, 23 May 93 04:12:00 PDT
From: gregg@coreys.berkeley.edu (Gregg Helt)
Message-Id: <9305231112.AA10648@coreys.maggot>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: beach party?


	Anyone know if the beach party is happening again today?
Or know an info line to call?

				visualizing beach,
				gregg


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 23 20:04:13 1993
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From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305240059.AA24570@jobe>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Wickewickewickewicked & Wild!

Need I say more?  

Thanks to all who shared the vibe, making it a most incredible
experience for me.  Great music, great site, great spirit, great
friends;  Great family!

night night...

- Steve


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 23 22:15:00 1993
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From: cvoigt@flute.calpoly.edu
Message-Id: <9305240336.AA93244@flute.calpoly.edu>
Subject: Planet X
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Date: Sun, 23 May 1993 20:36:29 -0800 (PDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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Hey everybody!,

i wont go in to my mind numb weekend activites while im down here in SLO
town.  my girlfriend went to wicked and had a great time, music was
outstanding.  got a question about music awhile ago someone posted that
they went to Planet X for music and had a great overall experiance and
was just plain happy with the whole place.  how do i get in touch with
them and all the other things.  looking for more tribal/jungle techno
type stuff on vinyl.

thanx
CHE





From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 00:20:45 1993
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Date: Sun, 23 May 93 22:12:24 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305240512.AA01774@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net, renegade@nexsys.net, mis@nexsys.net
Subject: nexsys now has 14.4


	I have upgraded nexsys.net to talk to igc.org via a new ZyXel
14.4 kbps modem.  When it can connect to the ZyXel at cdp, it is capable of
16.8kbps! so I am going to relax the request to not download
the archive files.  Please don't go hog wild though!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
      If I can Trance, I don't want to be part of your revolution
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 03:53:57 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 01:58:33 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305240858.AA27206@well.sf.ca.us>
To: saeedi@shell.portal.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Wickewickewickewicked & Wild!

I had a great time too, although it was hotter than the second circle
of Hell in there.  Nonstop solid vibe all the way through.  Saw M and
P-ter Normals and Geoff White.  Good to see some familiar faces in
clubland.  It really wasn't all that bad -- my first time at the 
Sound Factory.  Very little offtrack attitude from the crowd or the
operation.  Very LOUD ontrack attitude from the DJ booth!!

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 04:33:34 1993
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From: Simon Loewenthal <sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com>
Subject: pretty t-shirts
To: sfraves - Berkeley University <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Date: Mon, 24 May 93 10:33:56 BST
Cc: marc mcneill <m.b.mcneill1@lut.ac.uk>
Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1]

Dear all,

This discussion is going on at uk-dance as well, but...

Is anyone in San Fran area making t-shirts with the sfraves logo
on it? I've got the gif file and I'm impressed. Its a wicked logo.

I'm interested in getting 2/3 of them/ long sleeved t-shirts, cotton.
Good quality print on front and back. 

Cheers in adv for any responce.
Mail me direct please.

Simon.
--


Suddenly it was all clear......		We got some serious problems here,
					and most of them yours!
Bye Bye		////
n-joi           o o               o	voice: +44 81 742 4093
./sjl            }              o	sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com
               \__/===========o		simon@silly.nohope.lost-it.mdma.chem.gov

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-	     (A wise man doesn't play leap-frog with a Unicorn)		     -
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 04:34:21 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 02:43:37 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305240943.AA00546@well.sf.ca.us>
To: larryc@netcom.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Dead Tomorrow

Larry got a rendition of 'Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds' as a 
reward for wearing his shirt :-)

The Dead show today was pretty good, but frankly I had a more rewarding
(and KICKIN') time at Wicked last night :)

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 09:08:45 1993
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From: gibson@email.ncsc.navy.mil (Gibson)
Message-Id: <9305241453.AA25731@email.ncsc.navy.mil>
Subject: Re: INQUIRING MINDS
To: Marcell.Gabriel@ebay.sun.com (Marcell Gabriel)
Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 09:53:25 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: ames!ebay.sun.com!Marcell.Gabriel@ebay.sun.com, funky-music@athena.mit.edu,
        alvinl@u023.ca.vp.com, hart@ntmtv.com, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305212117.AA08828@livinlarge.EBay.Sun.COM> from "Marcell Gabriel" at May 21, 93 02:17:42 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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Does the Mothership go anyplace besides CALIFORNIA???????

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 09:24:47 1993
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From: Robert Jesse <rjesse@us.oracle.com>
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To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: community, mutual caring, and responsibility
Reply-To: rnj%lila@us.oracle.com

a friend sent the following email this morning.  sounds to me like there's a  
highly placed raver in the white house - she may just not know it yet!

Begin forwarded message:

Date: Mon, 24 May 93 00:43:51 -0700
From: <cortex!paul>

I have set aside this Sunday's New York Times Magazine for you.  The cover  
story is on Hillary Rodham Clinton and her political agenda.  She is quoted  
as saying "What do your lives in today's world mean?  What does it mean in  
today's world to pursue not only vocations, but to be human?  Who will lead  
us out of this spiritual vacuum?  The answer is all of us are required to  
play our part in redefining what our lives are and what they should be."  She  
talks about "defining what it means to be human going into the 21st century"  
... "how to build a society based on love and connection, a society in which  
the bottom line would not be profit and power, but ethical and spiritual  
sensitivity and a sense of community, mutual caring, and responsibility."   
She describes herself as having "a burning desire to make the world better  
for everybody" ...  They also mention someone named Michael Learner who  
discusses "developing a new spirit of cooperation, mutual caring, and  
dedication to work."

Anyway, I thought you might find some of the parallels intriguing...

Paul



From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 10:36:45 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 09:59:58 -0700
From: ccat@netcom.com (ccat)
Message-Id: <9305241659.AA29490@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: From UK-raves..


  Hi everyone.. I culled this from UK raves..thougt everyone would get a kick
out of it! (No,I don't agree with the premise)

Date: Mon, 24 May 93 8:59:19 BST
From: Simon Loewenthal <sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com>
Subject: Verbal Diahorrea

Thoughs for today.


Verbal Diahorrea.
I had this once in Nepal for 3 days! No, that was just plain.... STOP STOP!

I'm pleased someone said it. Yes, stateside dicussion lists do seem
to be full of the above stuff.

I can only speak on the sfraves list but, most of it is deep psychlogoy
on raving. All very well but most of its a load of crap. I think most of
the people on the list are college students who've found raving and pills,
and think its the best thing since sliced bread, and the `be all and end all'
of life!
But, they seem to be on the right track with CyberTribe and friends. Maybe
they know something we don't?

However some of the stuff they write about does have a comical value :-)

However the scene in San Fran looks very good and very positive. So I
won't cut it up, too much.

Simon the cynical, Simon the comical, Simon the _____.
--


Suddenly it was all clear......         We got some serious problems here,
                                        and most of them yours!
Bye Bye         ////
n-joi           o o               o     voice: +44 81 742 4093
./sjl            }              o       sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com
               \__/===========o         Simon's lack of email address's

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-            (A wise man doesn't play leap-frog with a Unicorn)              -
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
.....
_chris.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 10:42:29 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 10:14:13 PDT
From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9305241714.AA03205@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Free party Wed., 1015 Folsom


NEXT Computer Co. is throwing a "wild techno party" at 1015 Folsom
for anyone who knows about it, according to some guy I ran into who
has something to do with setting it up.  It's on Wednesday, starting
at 9:00pm.  I didn't recognize the 1 DJ mentioned.  Anyway, since
there is some evidence in the universe that white-collar computer 
geeks can rave, this could be fun.

- leg of eel

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 11:05:47 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305240950.ZM25516@nmtvs313>
Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 09:50:42 -0700
In-Reply-To: ames!shell.portal.com!saeedi (Steven J Saeedi)
        "Wickewickewickewicked & Wild!" (May 23,  5:59pm)
References: <9305240059.AA24570@jobe>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: ames!shell.portal.com!saeedi (Steven J Saeedi),
        sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Wickewickewickewicked & Wild!

yeah, i "dropped" in to this after the dead show, it *was*  fun.  some guy
kept prancing around making monkey noizes, very entertaining, danced alot,
nearly fell asleep in the chill room....good times...these are the ...

good 

	times

leaves
	your
		cares
			be - hind!

					*

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 11:10:58 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 09:59:05 -0700
In-Reply-To: gibson@email.ncsc.navy.mil (Gibson)
        "Re: INQUIRING MINDS" (May 24,  9:53am)
References: <9305241453.AA25731@email.ncsc.navy.mil>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: gibson@email.ncsc.navy.mil (Gibson),
        Marcell.Gabriel@ebay.sun.com (Marcell Gabriel)
Subject: Re: INQUIRING MINDS
Cc: ames!ebay.sun.com!Marcell.Gabriel@ebay.sun.com, funky-music@athena.mit.edu,
        alvinl@u023.ca.vp.com, ntmtv!hart, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU


Does the Mothership go anyplace besides CALIFORNIA???????

----------
da mothership goes everywhere!!!!!!!!!

jus kiddin', but iheaard it was a full tour...

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 11:13:33 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305240955.ZM25521@nmtvs313>
Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 09:55:33 -0700
In-Reply-To: Fred Heutte <ames!well.sf.ca.us!phred>
        "Re:  Dead Tomorrow" (May 24,  2:43am)
References: <199305240943.AA00546@well.sf.ca.us>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: Fred Heutte <ames!well.sf.ca.us!phred>, larryc@netcom.com,
        sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Dead Tomorrow


The Dead show today was pretty good, but frankly I had a more rewarding
(and KICKIN') time at Wicked last night :)

--------
i agree (and was stupid enuff to say so in front of a bunch of deadheads
at hte shrlne prking lot....zzzzzz)

nice day all weekend long tho, it was great!

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 11:19:05 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 10:36:04 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305241736.AA02473@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU, lila!us.oracle.com!rnj@apc.org
Subject: Re: community, mutual caring, and responsibility


Well, maybe Paul is getting his job done :)

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 12:13:32 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305241746.AA02530@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU, lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com
Subject: Re: Free party Wed., 1015 Folsom
Cc: rberger@cerf.net, ramsey@netcom.com


> From medisg1.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org Mon May 24 10:42:15 1993
> Return-Path: <medisg1.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org>
> Date: Mon, 24 May 93 10:14:13 PDT
> From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
> To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
> Subject: Free party Wed., 1015 Folsom
> Content-Length: 387
> X-Lines: 9
> Status: RO
> 
> 
> NEXT Computer Co. is throwing a "wild techno party" at 1015 Folsom
> for anyone who knows about it, according to some guy I ran into who
> has something to do with setting it up.  It's on Wednesday, starting
> at 9:00pm.  I didn't recognize the 1 DJ mentioned.  Anyway, since
> there is some evidence in the universe that white-collar computer 
> geeks can rave, this could be fun.
> 
> - leg of eel
> 
HEY LETS ALL GO AND CRASH THIS PARTY!
WE CAN DEFINITELY SPREAD THE VIBE!
and show them how its done :)

			G

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 12:14:07 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 10:43:57 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305241743.AA02525@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU, ccat@netcom.com
Subject: Re: From UK-raves..

>   Hi everyone.. I culled this from UK raves..thougt everyone would get a kick
> out of it! (No,I don't agree with the premise)
> 

> Date: Mon, 24 May 93 8:59:19 BST
> From: Simon Loewenthal <sloewent@lhr-sys.bru-ro.dhl.com>
> Subject: Verbal Diahorrea
> 
> Thoughs for today.
> 
> 
> Verbal Diahorrea.
> I had this once in Nepal for 3 days! No, that was just plain.... STOP STOP!
> 
> I'm pleased someone said it. Yes, stateside dicussion lists do seem
> to be full of the above stuff.
> 
> I can only speak on the sfraves list but, most of it is deep psychlogoy
> on raving. All very well but most of its a load of crap. I think most of
> the people on the list are college students who've found raving and pills,
> and think its the best thing since sliced bread, and the `be all and end all'
> of life!


Yeah, I already replied to this.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 12:33:48 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 11:45:38 -0800
From: Robert Jesse <rjesse@us.oracle.com>
Message-Id: <9305241945.AA04482@lila.us.oracle.com>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net, lila!us.oracle.com!rnj@apc.org,
        sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: community, mutual caring, and responsibility

i sent him a copy of the note, too!

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 12:57:22 1993
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Message-Id: <9305241913.AA12252@jumbo.apple.com>
Date: 24 May 1993 12:15:52 U
From: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
Subject: Eating Crow at Wicked
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU, wicked@netcom.com

Hi all:

Just wanted to say that even though Wicked was at Attitude Factory, I decided
to give at Try, partly because of the Wicked Communication note and also I
thought at first wicked was going to be combined with life on Fridays.

Well I had one of the best times Ive ever had at a Rave,  The Vibe there was
incredible.  The music was incredible and everybody was extremely happy.  We
got there at 1:30 and there was this long line outside and thought we would
never get in.  The line went relatively quick and we were in by 2:00. The music
was intense.  Jeno was doing this very trippy stuff with the speakers cause
incredible resonance throughout does anybody know what he was doing to cause
this? 

I left about 8:00 with a great feeling and decided to leave it that way and go
home and get some sleep.  After some sleep I went to the Dead concert to wander
around the Parking lot for awhile (is this whats called the Mall?).  First time
of ever being at one, very fun and trippy. 

The only drawback to the weekend was when somebody stole my sunglasses out of
my backpack that was in the Coat Check at Wicked.  I thought about this when I
checked the bag in but didnt think much of it because of all the times I have
checked expensive coats in.  Oh well I learned a lesson the hard way.

I take back what I said about wicked before.  It was great to see everyone on
the net.  

Later
 
NUT

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 13:10:57 1993
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From: mw@sybase.com (Michael Wertheim)
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To: ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: what I did this weekend
Content-Length: 2971


Jon, Jeff and I did our first Ultraviolet Catastrophe live performance this
weekend at a rave called Recess in Oklahoma City.  The rave was to feature a
live UVC performance, plus two guest DJs from New York: Joey Beltram and Keoki.

We arrived in Oklahoma City in the afternoon and formed a quick impression of
Oklahoma City -- small town in the middle of nowhere.  We got comfortable in 
our hotel room.  We tried to find Joey Beltram and Keoki but were unable to 
meet either of them.  We left for the rave at 7pm.

It was an all ages rave, average age being 17 or 18.  The rave flyers said 
that the rave would go from 6pm to 6am, and the doors did indeed open at 6pm.
There were a few people on the dancefloor from 7pm to 10pm, but it didn't 
really reach critical mass until 11pm or so.  People in general seemed to be
having a good time, but there wasn't much of a rave-y vibe going.  It reminded
me of a very hip high school dance, actually.  There were quite a few people
sitting around just watching, and the people on the dancefloor didn't dance 
with a lot of energy.  But the music wasn't too terrible, and the crowd seemed
pretty nice.

The music was varied.  Between 6pm and midnight there was a progressive house
set, a hardcore set, a breakbeat set, etc.  None of the DJs were incredibly 
impressive.  There was also an incredibly annoying MC who kept on talking over
the music.  He would say the usual MC cliches like "everybody scream", and 
everybody would scream.  And he would said "can you feel the E?", which seemed
pretty strange to me because I didn't see a single person who looked like they 
were on E.  The whole thing seemed odd to the four of us because we're used
to raves where microphones are *never* used, except maybe at the end of the
rave to thank everyone for coming and to tell them where the after party will
be.

We went on at 12:30.  Our set was about 45 minutes long and consisted of nine
songs, including "The Trip" and "Trip Harder".  The crowd seemed to enjoy it.
They continued dancing, occasionally looking up at the stage.  The oddest part
of the show was that there were bubble machines and fog machines going on all
around us, and bubbles kept on popping on the keyboards, so we kept on having
to wipe the bubble soap off the keyboards.

After our set, Joey Beltram went on to DJ.  He played a very hard hardcore set.
We were incredibly tired because we had been up since 6am traveling, and the
performance was pretty taxing as well, so after half an hour or so we went
back to our hotel room and crashed.  We heard later that the rave lasted until
7am.

We woke up at noon and knocked on the door of the hotel room that Joey Beltram
was staying in.  He answered the door, and we chatted for a while.  Then we met
Julie Jewels from Project X magazine.  Then we all then went across the street
and ate lunch in an Italian restaurant.  We finished lunch at 3, at which time
we headed to the airport to catch our planes.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 13:12:53 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305241203.ZM25637@nmtvs313>
Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 12:03:55 -0700
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: funky-music@athena.mit.edu, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: RE: PFunkin' MINDS/dates


--- Forwarded mail from "PATRICK PADUA" <PADUA@MAIL.LOC.GOV>

Date: 24 May 1993 14:44:14 GMT
From: "PATRICK PADUA" <PADUA@MAIL.LOC.GOV>
Subject: RE: INQUIRING MINDS
To: funky-music-request@APOLLO.LAP.UPENN.EDU, ntmtv.com!hart@ntmtv
Comment: RE: INQUIRING MINDS

-------------------------------------------------------------          
BELOW ARE THE DISTRIBUTION LIST ENTRIES THAT THIS MESSAGE              
WAS SENT TO BUT CANNOT BE REPLIED TO:                                  
                                                                       
sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU                                 
funky-music@Athena.MIT.EDU                                   
ames!ebay.sun.com!Marcell.Gabriel@EBay.Sun.COM               
-------------------------------------------------------------          
                                                                       
  
Does the Mothership go anyplace besides CALIFORNIA??????? 
  
---------- 
da mothership goes everywhere!!!!!!!!! 
  
jus kiddin', but iheaard it was a full tour... 
  
------------------------------------------
THIS IS A REPLY TO THE ABOVE MESSAGE
SUBJECT OF THE REPLY: FONK ON TOUR                  
------------------------------------------
          They're comin' back  to Chocolate City  this Friday:  at  the  DC 
          Convention Center (which is  why  I'm  not going) with, get this, 
          the Last Poets AND the Ohio Players.   
           
          Pat 
           
          Still kicking  my  ass  that  I  didn't  see  Eddie  Hazel's  New 
          Funkadelic's  in   DC,   one   whole   week   before   he   died. 


--- End of forwarded mail from "PATRICK PADUA" <PADUA@MAIL.LOC.GOV>


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 14:09:35 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 13:18:23 PDT
From: Jon Drukman <jdrukman@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: fear & raving in oklahoma
Reply-To: spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com

RAVE & LOATHING IN OKLAHOMA CITY

so, got back from oklahoma last night.  it was very weird.  for one
thing, everybody talks with a southern accent which is disconcerting.
i felt like i had been transplanted into a TV show set in the south,
rather than actually *being* in the south, if that makes sense.  it
was very big, open, flat and cheap looking.  you can buy a really nice
house there for $30-45K.  ("lot of land" chris said.  "it's still
oklahoma" i said.  "nice view" he said.  "nice view of oklahoma" i
said, hoping that that would explain it.)

so, we get in, and one of the rave promoter's assistants picks us up
at the airport, only he doesn't really know the flight number so he
just wanders around the airline looking for people who look out of
place.  i guess he homed in on us pretty quickly, all things
considered, but it was just a symptom of how disorganized the promoter
was...

he drives us to the club, which is a converted church - nice high
ceilings.  cool.  it looks like a mess in there, and people are
erecting all sorts of paraphernalia.  the basement had flooded (i
guess they had been having lots of rainstorms there lately) and it
smelled very mildewey.  dusty cement floor.  of course since it had
been raining a lot, it was more like mud than dust...

we are pretty burned out from the flight so we ask if they've thought
about where we're staying.  nobody seems to know but the promoter asks
if we'd like a hotel.  we of course say "YES" and chris drives us to
an OK looking place that wants way too much money.  fortunately, we're
not paying, so it doesn't matter.  we hang out in our (air
conditioned!) rooms for a while and watch TV.

eventually, we get bored, and nobody calls to see what time we want to
be at the party or anything like that, so we take matters into our own
hands.  after a quick fast food dinner, we call a cab and go to the
club.  they're still setting up, even though the party was supposed to
start 30 mins prior to this, according to the flyer.  the sound guys
are testing the system using some hideous bon jovi-esque material.  we
tell them to put our tape in, and it sounds pretty good but given the
way they are driving the system, we suspect that it will only last for
about 1 hr before it craps out.

so, we're supposed to go on at 11, and it's around 7 now.  we hang
out, meet the promoters/DJs/etc.  the DJs all love us to bits and we
are actually asked to *autograph records*.  we said, "you don't really
mean that, do you?"  but they insist and are thrilled to bits when we
sign.  weird juju, bwana.

the music throughout the night is a weird melange.  some DJs play
nosebleed techno, some play breakbeat.  a really nice guy named Mike
Lombard from houston plays a mix of progressive house and old
favorites - very cool.  there was a DJ from San Francisco (Mike
Manahan) out there and he plays all the typical current SF hits -
needless to say, this was my favorite part of the evening!
  
eventually, we have to perform.  so the lights go out and the fog &
bubble machines kick into high gear.  Mike Lombard insists on
introducing us, so we come on and launch into jeff's slow/ambient
intro piece.  considering that midwesterners are still really into 160
BPM breakbeat it was pretty weird, but once the beat finally kicked
in, they started swaying appreciatively.  next track was The Trip
(original) which was the big hit for those guys - unlike here where
Trip Harder was the one.  but they whooped it up when the dead can
dance samples came in like it was michael jackson singing thriller or
something and i thought "this fame stuff ain't so bad actually."  it
was really interesting reading the crowd.  the slower, trippier stuff
didn't work too well - i guess oklahoma isn't much of a drug town.  we
certainly didn't see too many high people.  and of course it was a
no-alcohol event.

since drugs were pretty much non-existant, the only way for people to
keep going all night was for the music to be really high energy, fast
and pounding.  so, our more straightforward pounding tracks really got
people moving.  at least when the energy flagged, nobody left the
floor - they just sort of shuffled around until the beat picked up
again.

anyway, we came, we played, we conquered.  the DJs and promoters were
all over us: "you guys were great!  you kicked ass!  come play my
party in houston next month!"

after our set, we were dead tired, so we went back to the hotel and
fell asleep.  james, the promoter, said he'd be by the next day to
pick us up for a barbeque that was being held with all the DJs,
organizers & talent.  we woke up the next day and wandered out of our
room, where we bumped into Julie Jewels (NY club scene queen & editor
of Project X magazine).  she said she didn't know what was going on
with the promoters and we doubted we'd be able to find them or get to
this BBQ before we had to be at the airport.  so we knocked on Joey
Beltram's door and talked to him for a while.  we went out to lunch
with Julie & Joey and then by the time we got back to the hotel, it
was time to get to the airport.  still no sign of chris or james or
any of the organizers (and they weren't answering their phones or
pagers) so we called a cab.  while waiting we met Keoki (another NY
DJ) who was pretty cool.  eventually, the cab showed up and we bailed
on oklahoma.

pretty cool trip all in all but those promoters were really out of it.

still, it's nice to be famous and worshipped and adored and all
that... AND get paid for it!

Jon Drukman         spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com        jdrukman@us.oracle.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Always note the sequencer - this will never let us down.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 14:33:37 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 13:55:58 -0800
From: Mark Baldwin <Mark_Baldwin@qmgate.radius.com>
Subject: hello all....
To: sfraves <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>

just checking to see if i can get out.  i don't expect this to hit the list,
but if it does, don't hate me.  just say hi.  

peace...

-mArK. (Usually Works In One Dose)

p.s.  oh yeah....my address is Mark_Baldwin@qmgate.radius.com ... don't add me 
back to 
the list just yet.  but could someone re: to me so i know if anyone gets this? 
 thx.



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 15:19:54 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 14:15:42 PDT
From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9305242115.AA07910@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Sweat & pancakes


Got into Wicked around 4 and we chilled a bit waiting for things to
settle down a little.  The dance floor was incredibly hot, even later
when the crowd thinned.  The chill rooms were very comfortable,
comparatively chilly in fact, so I can only conclude that they were
having some kind of ventilation problem.  By around 6, I finally
started to feel like I was at a rave, and started to have fun.
The music and sound system was superb.  The general ambience of the
Sound Factory left me cold however, and I never really felt comfortable
there.  I caught some Michel Jean Jarre, Kraftwerk and Laurie Anderson
in one of the chillout rooms, stuff I was into 10 years ago. 
Another room housed a pool table, and another offered a dirty carpet
under a steady drip of ceiling condensation.  There were a couple of 
screen with some standard computer animation stuff, far less mesmerizing 
than Synergy's (Tony & Co.) stuff.  There were some upstairs spaces
that were basically saunas, except that everyone kept their clothes on.

I think I'm getting too used to outdoor raving, cause I found the
heat and lack of air to be more of a distraction than usual.  I was
never able to really let go on the dance floor and I sensed that
many others were also struggling with this.  But since everyone who
has already posted had such a great time I am forced to conclude that
I am a just a wimp.  Oh well.  My better half made the mistake of not 
drinking enough fluids and she suffered greatly for it the next day.
Double oh well.

Booger Buffet was great fun, warm/friendly/happy vibe with good 
ventilation, visuals (Synergy) and free food.  The fruit salad was fine
but I broke my fork on the pancakes.  If I ever blow a flat on a Sunday
morning South of Market, I know where to get a cheap tire patch.  
Now that DNA is closed and Tilt-A-Whirl has time shifted, 
Boogie Buffet has no trouble reaching critical mass.  As another
Termiraver once said, "I'll be back."  

I was too pooped to get to the beach thing, but heard that it was
fun, except for an incident where a disgruntled surfer turned off
the generator and tried to end the party.  I'll others give a first
hand report.  Next week: Maybe the Gathering Friday nite followed
by the Malachy benefit at the End-Up Sat. morning... Oh, and let's
not forget the grand birth of My Sister's House this Thursday, or
is it next Thursday?  

- leg of eel


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 17:31:24 1993
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Message-Id: <9305242348.AA19561@groovy.us.oracle.com>
Date: Mon, 24 May 93 16:48:35 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <rramstad@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: connection 2 tape update
Reply-To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com


Howdy, all... just a quick update on the C2 tape situation and a
general financial summary.

I had 500 sets of 4 tapes made at a cost of roughly $4,000.  The sales
of each set includes a minimum of $5 for Malachy.  At $15 towards my
expenses per set ($5 for Malachy, with an extra $5 for mail order
mailers and postage) I will break even after selling 265 sets.  So
far, I have sold roughly 130 sets.

What does this mean?  I am currently holding $650+ for Malachy and I
am planning on turning this over to the fund either a) in mid June or
hopefully b) when it hits the magic figure of $1,000 as I'd like to
have the donation be a "significant amount" and not have it roll in in
dribs and drabs (whichever comes earlier).

In addition, I'm starting to feel some financial pressure to work
harder on selling the sets, as I'm currently still almost $2,000 in
the hole.  My current plan is to take some samples with me to Boston
this weekend, and I'm also planning on taking some sets to Bay area
stores (suggestions, anyone?) to have them either buy them outright
and sell them or, if they are honest and reliable, have them do
consignment with me.

If you are out of the Bay area and have a store you frequent which
might be interested in carrying the tapes, email me a phone number and
I'll contact them.  I'll gladly send non-local stores a sample set and
an address to order the tapes wholesale.

Hopefully I can continue to sell the sets and break even without
having to lower the price significantly, as this would reduce the
overall donation to the healing fund.

So... that's the current situation.  I'll post more detailed financial
information when things wind down more.

Naturally, I'm still selling C2 sets mail order ($25, $29 non-US) and
in person ($20).  I haven't been available at events much recently,
but I'm planning on being very available the first weekend in June.

Also, the Mountain View Tower Records, at the corner of San Antonio Rd
and El Camino Real is carrying the C2 sets in the cassette techno
section for $24.99 + tax.  Many people have found this option very
convenient.  

If the sets end up for sale at any other stores in the Bay area, I'll
let people know through this list.

Thanks for all of your support, the sales so far have been quite
strong, and I'm really happy with all the positive comments and
everything!

Bob








From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 17:39:16 1993
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Message-Id: <9305250005.AA20691@groovy.us.oracle.com>
Date: Mon, 24 May 93 17:05:53 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <rramstad@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: C2 tape identification
Reply-To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com


> Also, the Mountain View Tower Records, at the corner of San Antonio Rd
> and El Camino Real is carrying the C2 sets in the cassette techno
> section for $24.99 + tax.  Many people have found this option very
> convenient.  

> If the sets end up for sale at any other stores in the Bay area, I'll
> let people know through this list.

This just occurred to me... in case you're looking for the tapes in a
store and have never seen the them in person before, it's a 4 tape
set, and the Dali print on the front has a couple of big tigers and an
elephant with stilt-like legs.

Salvador Dali: Dream Caused by the Flight of a Bee around a
Pomegranate, a Second before Waking Up.

Just FYI, and apologies for cluttering the list,
Bob


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 18:23:24 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 17:33:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: RE: WICKED
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Cc: RoxaneG@othello.ucdavis.edu
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305241712.A13333-9100000@othello.ucdavis.edu>
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And Wicked it was. Wicked was great. I never thought that I would have
such a great time at the Sound Factory. The music quality and sound was so
live i felt elevated before my time. If anyone stepped foot in the chill
room they must have felt the intensity of the positive energy flowing
through there. Let's just say there was a lot of love being generated.
Great music and Great times.
RG


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 18:58:03 1993
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From: geoffw@carlyle.com (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305242257.AA21720@ carlyle.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU, srv.pacbell.com!lxfogel@uu.psi.com
Subject: Wicked


	Well I didn't have a great time at Wicked, I had an OK time but not
	a great time.  The dance floor was too hot, and coupled with the
	"fire" in my body (first time in 70 days) I was sorta uncomfortable.
	The music was OK but didn't really get me going,  I just didn't feel
	that incredible Vibe that I'm used to feeling at a Wicked.  Maybe
	It was too big butI've been to larger wickeds, maybe it was too hot
	but I've enjoyed myself at hotter more styfling wickeds, maybe it
	was the drugs but I've been more blasted at Wickeds.  I donno, but
	eventhough the music was OK , I had few moments of real enjoyment.
	I think for me I might gauge a party by the intensity of my Trance
	and I didn't trance out that much.  But I did like seeing a lot of
	my friends and seeing folks like Jessica, Ann the Normals, and others
	did make me feel wanted.

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 19:05:19 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Mon, 24 May 1993 18:28:27 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: About Wednesday night

From: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Subject: more info for wednesday
Date: Mon, 24 May 93 17:50:26 PDT

Here's the flyer info for the free party Wed. at 1015 Folsom:

STONE design & John Perry Barlow cordially invite you to...

The Temple of the New Edge

Transcendental Technovibrations
D-Man
Video Alchemy by Pyromania Arts

A night of pleasure, spiritual technology, dance in the Four
Elements, interactive playground.
Random Mutations:Osseus Labyrinth

9pm Wednesday May 26th 1993
1015 Folsom at 6th


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 19:25:39 1993
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	id AA19478; Mon, 24 May 93 21:57:27 EDT
Date: Mon, 24 May 93 21:57:26 EDT
From: WILL-E <perez@andromeda.rutgers.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU, socal-raves@ucsd.edu,
        ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu, dcraves@american.edu,
        uk-raves@orbital.demon.co.uk
Subject: 50 Years CD
Message-Id: <CMM-RU.1.3.738295046.perez@andromeda.rutgers.edu>

While speaking to my British friend recently, he mentioned a double CD
coming from the 50 year anniversary celebration that took place in
San Francisco.  Among the things he mentioned are Genesis P'Orridge and
Timothy Leary being on it.  Does anyone have this or know where to find it?

Please reply to me and not to the list (as I've posted to several lists).
If there is enough interest, I will post the info thus saving bandwith.

Thanks!

WILL-E <perez@andromeda.rutgers.edu>
"How can a counterCULTURE be COUNTERculture?"

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 22:28:32 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 22:05:49 -0700
From: trocha@netcom.com (Dan Trocha)
Message-Id: <9305250505.AA04440@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Foundation

Did anyone attend Foundation last weekend?  I understand it was at the
San Carlos Airport?

=Dan
----

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 24 23:15:01 1993
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Date: Mon, 24 May 93 22:52:41 -0700
Message-Id: <9305250552.AA26329@netcom.netcom.com>
To: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: Sweat & pancakes
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU

> Oh, and let's
> not forget the grand birth of My Sister's House this Thursday, or
> is it next Thursday?  

Hang on... the opening date hasn't been selected, and it doesn't look 
to be that imminent.

This weekend is shaping up to be mighty interesting, though.  Although
I'll probably still be on the sidelines taking a much needed (um) breather,
I predict that events in store will be extremely (er) memorable.

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                                       mcg@netcom.com
                      Oxygen, si!  Fog machines, no!
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 08:05:24 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 07:37:42 -0700
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
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	id AA02074; Tue, 25 May 93 07:37:42 -0700
To: Mark_Baldwin@qmgate.radius.com, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: hello all....

I got it....
HELLO!!!

from:




         /\                       noah@cadence.com 
        <<>>      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  
    ((((noah))))  "if i can get higher than this, 
	<<>>       i don't want to know about it"---Terence McKenna   
	 \/       ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 09:55:28 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305251617.AA01934@slack>
Subject: XDZebra Review #30
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu (SF Raves),
        nm-list@reef.cis.ufl.edu (New Music List),
        ne-raves@silver.lcs.mit.edu (NE Raves),
        manchester@irss.njit.edu (Manchester),
        mw-raves@engin.umich.edu (Midwest Raves),
        socal-raves@ucsd.edu (So Cal Raves), dcraves@american.edu (DC Raves),
        thomas@apple.com
Date: Tue, 25 May 93 10:16:59 MDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Still looking for a typesetter/design artist... Anyone?  Anyone?

XDZebra Review #30

        Addiction
        266 Delmar Ct.
        Salt Lake City, UT 84101-1817

When in Utah call the T A S T E hotline 801-461-3375.

Trying to find these releases?  Try Ear/Rational Music:
FAX 805/893-8553, Phone 805/564-4949, email angst%cs@hub.ucsb.edu

Back issues are available from me by mail or by ftp'ing to soda.berkeley.edu.
They're in the pub/sfraves/music directory.

This is all my opinion.  Flames against a review are pretty pointless, so
don't bother.  Let me know if you have any other comments though.

BPMs provided courtesy of Eric Pederson's BPM calculator for the Sparc.

XDZebra Reviews may be reproduced without permission under one condition,
they remain intact and unchanged.  If you publish this in print, mail me a
copy via "Addiction".

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Review #30 Contents:
50 Years of Sunshine
Tox Uthat - A Techno Compilation
Nu-tro-gen
Twitch CD 7
System 7: 777
Fortran 5: Persian Blues
SonnenSystem: Virtual Ambience EP


50 Years of Sunshine
Silent Records: SR9333
100 Micrograms:
1       04:15 Dr. Timothy Leary: The Incredible Lightness Ov Being Molecular
2       07:03 Pelican Daughters: The Bicycle Ride
3       05:34 Closedown: Bliss
4       04:51 Love Spirals Downwards: Kykeon
5       06:20 Nurse With Wound: Beetle Crawls Across My Back
6       05:06 White Stains: Let It Be Thus
7  126  06:16 XKP & Mr. L: Thee Spirit Ov Thee Molecule
8  122  07:28 The Ultraviolet Catastrophe: Full Moon (Crescent Mix)
9  125  09:01 Nonplace Urban Field: Pseudogarten
10 129  06:45 Psychic TV: Acidosis
11 102  08:42 Earth Leakage Trip: The Awakening
250 Micrograms:
1       03:59 Phauss: Radiator (For Amanita Muscaria & Mark McCloud)
2       03:34 Belt: Under the Sunset
3       03:45 Elliot Sharp: inSERGEncy
4       15:37 Harvey Bainbridge: The Voyage - In the Wake of Passing Clouds
5       04:15 Controlled Bleeding: After the Rain
6       05:24 Hawkwind: Space Dust
7   96  05:35 68000: Disillusion
8  115  05:07 Satellite IV: In A Sugarcube
9  139  07:12 Hyperdelic: Dosed
10 168  05:47 Drome: Biopolar Trip
11 123  06:07 Steel Porn Rhino: On LSD

Comments: A wildly varied two disc compilation put out by Silent Records
celebrating Albert Hofmann's first LSD trip.  The theme is obvious, but is
presented in such different manners, that listening to this compilation
becomes a trip of its own.  With an introductory reading by Timothy Leary,
things move into a stark ambient industrial tone then gradually builds into a
dark dance ending.  Ultravoilet Catastrophe does their second release with a
transitional piece from rythmic ambience into a tribal explosion.  This is
placed perfectly on the disc as things swing into an up tempo to close off
"100 Micrograms".  PTV seems to be the odd track out, since it is more noise
based than dance, Earth Leakage Trip closes things off nicely with more of
their weirdness.  "200 Micrograms" begins in the same way with brooding
distorted lyrics over beatless noise by Phauss, then takes a different
direction into bright tones and psychedelic trance.  Harvey Bainbridge
presents a stunning Enoesque piece which puts Eno himself to shame.  As the
beat kicks in, 68000 does an incredible slow piece which is
uncharactaristically good over their miserable album.  The final four tracks
are fantastic dance with good samples.  I especially enjoy the closing by
Steel Porn Rhino.

Summary: 9/10.  An excellent tribute and a fine compilation as well.  Drop it
if you're into exploration, but if you're looking for solid dance, it probably
isn't a good idea.


Tox Uthat - A Techno Compilation
Pulse Soniq: PS9329
1  146  06:15 Orange Sky: Aeronautic Trip
2  140  07:02 Cirrus Minor: Solar Sperm
3  125  06:37 Cirrus Minor: Whales
4   98  04:02 Nonplace Urban Field: Unireverse
5  143  04:33 Nonplace Urban Field: Holding Hands
6  130  04:56 Cosmic Breeze: Carrying Galaxies
7  128  09:44 Mindope: Subsonic Soul
8  130  06:58 Brain Unltd: Atlantic Ocean
9  121  14:58 Horizon 222: Spirit Level

Comments: Very similar in form to the FAX release "Compilation 1".  Fast
trance with a touch of funk provided by Nonplace Urban Field.  NUF is unusual
in the use of vocals that sound like a radio announcer delivering Timothy
Leary lines.  Several of the tracks take advantage of my weakness for
unintelligible Cocteau Twins like female singing over distinct beats.  Mindope
attempts to cross diva and trance, and barely makes it, but slides more into
the deep house area.  Brain Unltd, Cirrus Minor, and Orange Sky are most like
the FAX trance, with sweeping melodies and steady rhythms.  Finally, Horizon
222, with members from Zoviet France, makes a gradual collage of sound that
compares favorably with Psychic Warriors ov Gaia.  This is the only group on
the compilation who is not on the Toxikktrakks label.

Summary: 8/10.  At a domestic price, this is an eclectic collection of trance
that is well worth the tag.


Nu-tro-gen
Thunderpussy: THP 2002-2
1  136  05:13 Rollin' Reptiles
2  136  04:41 Breakin' n' Bazzin'
3  136  05:02 Freakin' n' Humpin'

Comments: Bouncy techno with a bit of chipmunk thrown in.  The best part of
this short release is the two remixes.  True to its name, "Breakin' n'
Bazzin'" has some finely placed and picked breaks that make it interesting to
listen and move to.  "Freakin'" is the same but to a lesser extent, it
concentrates more on melody manipulation than rhythm.

Summary: 5/10. Too short, but moderately cool.


Twitch CD 7
Twitch: TW-CD-07
1  120  06:58 The Shamen: Boss Drum
2  125  07:04 Gipsy: I Trance You
3  128  05:13 Rupaul: Supermodel
4  128  06:39 Paradise Organisation: Prayer Tower
5  131  05:58 Slave to External: Disintegrate
6  130  06:10 Fargetta: Music is Movin'
7  130  07:10 Outer Mind: I Still Want Ya
8  130  06:51 Daisy Glow: Give it All
9  133  05:23 Tasti Box: Asid
10 135  05:16 Lemon Interupt: Minniapolis
11 136  06:11 Intermix: Monument
12 143  05:09 Illuminator: Your Eyes Will Be Open

Comments: A more housier release than usual for Twitch.  Firing things off,
The Shamen's "Boss Drum" has been completely reworked into a groovin'
instrumental.  Other highlights are Lemon Interupt's "Minniapolis" and
Intermix's "Monument".  I was mildly disappointed in "Monument" though, it
doesn't differ drastically from the original.  "Asid" by Tasti Box puts analog
to extensive and almost obnoxious use.  "Prayer Tower" is another standout on
the progressive side with decent classic samples thrown in.  Taylor808 makes
his CD debut with Illuminator and Slave to External, which are musically solid
but tend to punch your jaw with sound bites that don't add much to the
original workings.  Gipsy, Rupaul, Outer Mind, Fargetta, and Daiy Glow are a
bit over the line on house for my tastes, but are well done nonetheless.

Summary: 7/10.  Didn't grab me as much as past Twitch releases.  Twitch did
throw in a couple of hilarious opener samples though.


System 7: 777
Big Life/Weird and Unconventional: BF LCD 1
1  124  09:31 7:7 Expansion
2  125  08:19 A cool dry place
3  138  07:47 Desir (Ghost Mix)
4  120  07:33 On the seventh night
5  130  08:02 Sinbad
6  127  09:46 Ship of the desert
7       07:23 Faydeaudeau

Comments: God help me, I love this album more than Orb's "U.F.Orb".  I tried
and tried, but the fact just keeps coming back, this definitely sounds better.
Even though Alex and Thrash threw their hands into "A cool dry place" the real
stunners are what follows with fabulous rhythms, Arabic themes, and real
innovation.  "Desir" is an energetic fast piece, "Seventh night" takes trance
through the sands of the Sahara, and "Sinbad" and "Ship" follow up well with
melodic mutating tracks.  The ambience of "Faydeaudeau" is sweeter than
anything I've heard in months.  Hillage and Giraudy have taken Orb's
inspiration to another level.

Summary: 10/10.  A masterpiece in green.  This will probably be domestic soon,
if you can wait that long.


Fortran 5: Persian Blues
Mute: CD MUTE 157
1  128  03:59 Original Mix
2  134  08:59 Full On Orchestral Philharmonical Mix
3  127  11:59 The 11.56 Sound Clash System Remix
4  128  07:15 3YE1270 Mix
5  128  06:16 Pulsation Mix

Comments: Fortran 5 return on the Arabian ship with their new single "Persian
Blues".  Although the orchestration of this piece is really swell, the vocals
are really poopy.  This is unusual since I enjoyed all the vocals on their
previous album, "Blues".  However, this time, they've got a male vocals
singing about petroleum in an overpowering manner.  Yes, it doesn't work, but
thankfully, there are two instrumental mixes, "Philarmonical" and "Pulsation"
as well as a mostly instrumental mix, "Sound Clash".  So things may look grim
in the F5 camp, but lets hope for a return to greatness on their album, "Bad
Head Park".

Summary: 5/10.  Fantastic music awash with an emotional political-ecologist
wailing about the Middle East.  Too bad I can't dance on oil wells.


SonnenSystem: Virtual Ambience EP
Paul E. Tan (03) 3476674 (Tape)
1  118  03:59 Subsonic Dreams (Organic Bliss)
2  109  01:55 Tropical Braindance (Abbreviated)
3  118  04:17 Master and Servant (SS "Brutality" Mix)
4  115  03:33 Heaven (I-Dom Factor One)
5  131  05:01 Deep Structure (Spatial Vibration Mix)
6  131  04:41 Deep Structure (Virtual Assault Mix)
7  106  05:21 Even If I Wanted To (I-Dom Factor Two)

Comments: A nicely produced EP tape from Paul E. Tan.  The opener tracks are
my favorites.  "Subsonic Dreams" samples a Meat Beat Manifesto rhythm and
makes it all its own, "Tropical Braindance" is short, but quirky and fun.
The "Master and Servant" remix, although capable, seems really out of place
after the first two original pieces, but not as bad as "Heaven".  The I-Dom
Factor tracks are very poppy, and although well produced, are on the wrong
side of the radio dial for my sensitive stomach.  "Deep Structure" takes
things in an Oldfield direction, yet in a darker sense.  The "Virtual Assault"
mix would be at home on any industrial comp.

Summary: 5/10.  I would really like to see Paul put the first two tracks on a
single and head in that direction.  They are really the best thing about this
EP.

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 11:39:22 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 13:13:04 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305251713.AA28847@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: From UK-raves..
In-Reply-To: <9305241743.AA02525@nexsys.nexsys.net>
References: <9305241743.AA02525@nexsys.nexsys.net>

I had to deal with that for several years when I ran a telconferencing
system. Seems like there'd always be someone who dropped into a group,
contribute nothing, and sneer at the content of the conversation.

Getting online must be a truly hollow experience for them.

Sean

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 12:05:04 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 13:17:00 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305251717.AA28980@pilot.njin.net>
To: "Stewart, Scott*" <stewart#m#_scott*@msgate.corp.apple.com>
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU, wicked@netcom.com
Subject: Eating Crow at Wicked
In-Reply-To: <9305241913.AA12252@jumbo.apple.com>
References: <9305241913.AA12252@jumbo.apple.com>

Bring along a tiny padlock and use it to lock the zippers together. It
wouldnt stop someone determined, but it stops casual browsing.

Sean

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 13:31:10 1993
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From: drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 12:21:35 -0700
Message-Id: <9305251921.AA10666@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Festival of Sound

What's up guys?

I'm faily new to this board, although I've been in the scene for awhile now.
Sad to see that the last rave I went to looked more like a Brian Adams concert.
It seems that the atmosphere feeling I've been getting lately has been more
of a (gulp) club scene.  I miss the 'openess' feeling that were in early
earlier raves.
 
Anyhow, I was wondering if anyone knew more about the Festival of Sound going
off this weekend.
 
Thanks!
 
drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 14:04:45 1993
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From: drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 13:31:25 -0700
Message-Id: <9305252031.AA17732@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Festival of Sound

(I apologize if this posts twice, wasn't sure of correct address.)

What's up guys?

I'm fairly new to this board, although I've been in the scene for awhile now.
Sad to see that the last rave I went to looked more like a Brian Adams concert.
It seems that the atmosphere feeling I've been getting lately has been more
of a (gulp) club scene.  I miss the 'openess' feeling that were in early
earlier raves.
 
Anyhow, I was wondering if anyone knew more about the Festival of Sound going
off this weekend.
 
Thanks!
 
drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 15:33:24 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 1993 14:16:58 -0800
To: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
Subject: Re: Eating Crow at Wicked
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

>Bring along a tiny padlock and use it to lock the zippers together. It
>wouldnt stop someone determined, but it stops casual browsing.
>
>Sean

Hummmmm, seems this Wicked was a bit more torrid than last one I went to ...


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 15:54:07 1993
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From: Robert.Fanfelle@eng.sun.com (Rob Fanfelle)
Message-Id: <9305252201.AA15489@stripmine.Eng.Sun.COM>
To: trocha@netcom.com
Subject: Re: Foundation
Cc: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU




Yeah,  I went to Foundation.

I called the number and found out that it was less than 10 miles from my
house!  I was extremely enthused.  I decided to give the location a drive by
to see how secluded it was.  The rave was in an abandoned auto wrecking
garage on a dead-end street.  The building was between 101 and the San Carlos
airport/lagoons.  I figured that this was a pretty good location that should go
unnoticed.   (WRONG)

We got there around 11pm+ and was greated by your generic "Lyon security" dweeb.
After a $20 deposit we go in.  Standard faire with a few day-glow posters,
a tired looking juice bar, and four Port-a-Pods.  Still, I didn't expect TOO
much (hell it was close to my house).  There were about 50 people there,
some hanging, some dancing.  I was settling in to the music and the rave
Xperience when lo; the cops.  ACK.  Complete shutdown.

Some promoter stopped me on the way out and said that the rave was moving
to some backup location less than 10 minutes away.  It was midnight and my 
group and I were not in the mood to wait around.  We ate the cash loss and 
headed to Wicked. (an interesting drive)



-Rob "da Morph"

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 16:29:12 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 15:26:17 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305252226.AA04461@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: First Aid/CPR training( update)

I posted this to planner but got no response so I'm posting to the
full list.  This workshop is set for Friday afternoon, but we still
need a space to do it in.
			G

----- Begin Included Message -----

From nexsys.net!geoffw@cdp.igc.org Tue May 25 12:29:38 1993
Return-Path: <nexsys.net!geoffw@cdp.igc.org>
Date: Tue, 25 May 93 12:08:01 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
To: sfraves-planners@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: First Aid/CPR training
Content-Length: 1361
X-Lines: 26
Status: RO

Sean O'Quin who is a Medical Consultant has offered to train people in
Basic First Aid and CPR for personnel involved in doing "Security" for
the Unity Benefit.  This first Training session is only for people who
are working/going to the Unity event who are interested in knowing how
to take care of people and be available in the event of a medical
emergency.  If this goes well, future workshops will be planned for the
entire community.  This training will be free (but a small donation to
cover the cost of the training equipment may be requested.) An
organizational meeting is scheduled for this Friday, please call Sean's
pager at 560-6068 code 60 i.e. <your_number>*60.

We also need a location to stage the training workshop (large room to
set up CPR dummies, etc.) if you have any ideas call Sean or e-mail
me.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
      If I can't Trance, I don't want to be part of your revolution
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


----- End Included Message -----


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 16:32:14 1993
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From: Lee An <lee@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Baltimore/DC trip
To: sfraves <sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305251432.A27118-a100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hi gang,

I'm going to be in the Baltimore/Washington D.C. area in a week or so and
I thought it would be swell if I could make part of the trip a working
vacation. The problem is, I don't know anyone that's involved the scene
over there (if there is one), and none of my friends do either. It's been
a looong time since I'd last been in that part of the country. If anyone
knows of the scene there, and hopefully some of the people involved, I'd
be eternally grateful if you could send any info this way regarding the
promoters/organizers/events and such.

Many Thanks in advance,
Lee



From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 17:01:56 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 19:19:00 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305252319.AA11603@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Location of the BIG Wicked?

Do they have a locale yet? Know how they plan to lay it out?

If they get all the DJs they say they are, it's going to be one hell
of an event!

Sean

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 17:26:57 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Tue, 25 May 1993 16:16:33 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: a question or two

    1)  I currently am looking at a private beach about 25 minutes south
of San Francisco for use for a party.  There are, however, two
caveats, though if one or two parties are held there after awhile
those conditions may be repealed.  It's a beautiful beach, plenty of
parking, and this would be 100% legal, but the music couldn't go past
1am or so (at least, not officially, but people can drum afterwards,
and/or if the vibe is right and the owner knows it, maybe it could last
til dawn) and also the owner would want $5 per person, since that's
what he asks for normal users of the beach.  I may be able to talk him
down to $4, but as it stands I'd probably ask $8 or maybe $9 per person
to have some good production and pay the DJ's what they deserve.

So I'd envision this as a "sunset serenade" party - maybe that's the
name I'd use, I dunno - starting around 6pm, ending at midnight or 1,
with free food and drinks and bonfires and a large soundsystem.  I'd
be aiming for 500 people, which the site could easily hold, and the
party would end just in time for people to make it to the next party.
On the advice of some people this would be on a Saturday.  Arranging
a bus would be expensive, but renting a couple of vans to drive people
from the Haight is definitely a possibility.  I'm not sure I'd want to
make it a Connection 3, but if this goes off well and the owner does
let us do an all-nighter I would definitely make that C3.  Also, I'd
use those vans to make sure people who Shouldn't Be On The Road make
it home safely.

I wouldn't do it as a money-raiser, I'd make sure everyone gets paid
and then give the rest to Malachy or a charity.  

Now, given those conditions, do you all think I could get a large enough
group of people to make it worth it?  I figure I'd need at least 250 to 
break even.  



   2)  Anyone know the current state of the challenge to the cabaret
laws in the city of San Francisco?  I have another site, outdoor, private
property, very close to downtown, I'm looking at which we could definitely 
throw something at but we'd have to make it 21+ :(  

Right now it is illegal, officially, to have an event with under-21 folk
in the city of SF that goes past 2:30 thanks to the curfew.  I intend to
spend time this summer CHALLENGING that, and I don't care if it's a
brick wall I'm going up against I want to at least try and stop this
sillyness.  Anyone interested in joining?

	Brian

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 18:58:38 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305251747.ZM26855@nmtvs313>
Date: Tue, 25 May 1993 17:47:00 -0700
In-Reply-To: ames!soda.berkeley.edu!bbehlen (Brian Behlendorf)
        "a question or two" (May 25,  4:16pm)
References: <9305252316.AA14410@soda.berkeley.edu>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: ames!soda.berkeley.edu!bbehlen (Brian Behlendorf),
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: a question or two

and I don't care if it's a
brick wall I'm going up against I want to at least try and stop this
sillyness.  Anyone interested in joining?
------------
count me in.  should i take that CPR thang and do security?
geoff?  where/when will that be, if so?  (sorry, deleted that
note - i've been through cpr b4, but can't remember shit, so...
better do it again...)

*

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 19:19:35 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 1993 18:04:49 -0800
To: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
From: wicked@netcom.com
Subject: Re: Location of the BIG Wicked?
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

        May I remind everyone that saturday coming is NOT a 'big' Wicked.
We are providing the entertainment in one of the tents. There happen to be
three other tents featuring a whole host of Bay Area DJ talent that should
not be overlooked. In so much as we can take our vibe and convert the Sound
Factory, we will do the same with the tent made available to us. No more
than 400 -500 people in the tent. I hope everyone takes the time to do the
rounds. You'll be missing a lot otherwise.

Markie   !)

                 
                 ********************************
                 ******** You Have Been  ********
                 ********  Listening To  ********
                 ******** A WICKED SOUND ********
                 ********   Communique   ********
                 ******************************** 
                                                  
                                                   


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 19:39:45 1993
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To: Robert.Fanfelle@eng.sun.com (Rob Fanfelle)
From: jslee@well.sf.ca.us (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Foundation
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

>Yeah,  I went to Foundation.
>
>I called the number and found out that it was less than 10 miles from my
>house!  I was extremely enthused.  I decided to give the location a drive by
>to see how secluded it was.  The rave was in an abandoned auto wrecking
>garage on a dead-end street.  The building was between 101 and the San Carlos
>airport/lagoons.  I figured that this was a pretty good location that should go
>unnoticed.   (WRONG)
>
>We got there around 11pm+ and was greated by your generic "Lyon security"
>dweeb.
>After a $20 deposit we go in.  Standard faire with a few day-glow posters,
>a tired looking juice bar, and four Port-a-Pods.  Still, I didn't expect TOO
>much (hell it was close to my house).  There were about 50 people there,
>some hanging, some dancing.  I was settling in to the music and the rave
>Xperience when lo; the cops.  ACK.  Complete shutdown.
>
>Some promoter stopped me on the way out and said that the rave was moving
>to some backup location less than 10 minutes away.  It was midnight and my 
>group and I were not in the mood to wait around.  We ate the cash loss and 
>headed to Wicked. (an interesting drive)
>
>
>
>-Rob "da Morph"

Uh...the $20 BS pissed me off!  I talked to the guys who threw it and have
NOT stopped giving them hell for what they did.  I will be seeing them this
weekend at a friends house and I will route their asses some more.

LOOK, $20 for a RAVE in a warehouse is UNCALLED for.  I expect to pay
$20-$25 on new years, with a GREAT DJ lineup, in a GREAT space.  Those guys
shoulda charged  $10 the MAX.  If the production was pumped, $15, but their
porduction lacked even the basics most people have come to expect.

It is productions like these that are making people stay home
unfortunately.  This only makes the scne more and more like LA and degrades
the experience for first timers.  I hope they stop this trend, and soon.

I did see the crowd at wicked.  Looked as if everyone had a GREAT time
there...and uh, they charged $13-$15.  Now that's WICKED!  At least it is
good to know that there are some promoters who remain ethical despite the
fact others choose different routes!

I say NEVER pay $20 for a party unless it is MASSIVE and PUMPED.  $20 for a
warehouse?...gimme a break!

Peace :)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+"The community can rest assured that their interests are very much my own,+
+ and that anything I can do to maintain the security of the citizens, will+
+ be my primary objective.  Be seeing you.  b-|" - Number Six->The Prisoner+
+                                                                          +
+ from the village of jslee@well.sf.ca.us - a still tongue spills no beans +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 20:04:47 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 19:30:36 PDT
From: Derek Chung <dhchung@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Seattle update


Hi all!

I went to Seattle this weekend, and although I didn't get
a chance to go out (I was with my father), I managed to
figure out where I could have gone, had I been able to.
I suppose any of you SFR-people from Seattle would be
more enlightened, but here's a tourist's perspective.

One dance-music record store is Underground Dance Music
(they have house, techno, and hiphop), 422 E Denny Way
in the Capitol Hill area.  There I picked up some 
flyers for some parties called Kaleidoscope, Belgian
House Party II, Euro-Rave '93, and the (3 * GetDown + Wicked)
party in SF (!). Some Bay Area DJs featured were
Scott & Robbie Hardkiss, Bones, and Pasta.  I also picked
up a 12-page newspaper called XLR8R, which has interviews,
reviews, and a calendar; one of the issues I picked up 
also reprinted the info-E flyer that was done here.
The cover story this month was about the conflicts between
rave promoters and the cops (imagine that).
XLR8R listed a few more events, which include Garth,
Christophe, Carlos, Dutch, Markie Mark, and Dub Tribe.  
It also has a list of weeklies.  

An ad for Underground Dance Music listed an info line,
206.322.RAVE, which I assume is free, which is supposed
to list the weekend's events.  

The May issue also featured "top ten" lists from Moonpup
and Jon Williams, if you're looking to spend a little money:

Moonpup (a baker's top ten):
1. TC93 "Harmony" (white label)
2. Keekotronics and NLTJ - "Gimme the Funk" (Burma)
3. 290 North - "Spirit of 93" (Tomahawk)
4. Sounds of Silence - Lounge Lizards EP (Inner City)
5. Matter - "Don't You Want Some More" (Guerrilla)
6. The Look - "Glamour Girl" (Sexy)
7. Sounds of Silence - "DJ Equalizer" (Inner City)
8. Unreal - "Nairobi" (CT)
9. Gayle Lynne - "Rain Come Down On Me" - (Tomato)
10. Double Dee - "The More I Get, The More I Want" (Irma)
11. Phuture - "Inside Out" (Strictly Rhythm)
12. Cheeky Chunks - "Disco Yahoo"
13. "Bass The Night Away" (Spot On Records)

Jon Williams:
1. Acid Rain - "Twista" (UR)
2. Hawke - "3 Nudes in a Purple Garden" (Hardkiss)
3. Too Critical - "Coca-Cola"
4. Sven Vath - "Ritual of Life" (Eye Q)
5. Sonic Solution - "Arab Girl" (R & S)
6. Genesi - "White Dance" (Ishtar)
7. Megalon - "Semblance" (Plink-Plonk)
8. Choice - "Acid Eiffel" (Fragile)
9. Sequential - "Saturn Cruises" (Rising High)
10. UVC - "The Trip (Hydroponic Dub)" (Acetate)


and June's Tweekin' Records top 10:

1. Master Freez - "Listen to the Bass" (Irma)
2. Hawke - "3 Nudes in a Purple Garden" (Hardkiss)
3. D.I.Y. - "Mobile Music" EP (Strictly 4 Groovers)
4. Man Power - "Ring the Wave" (Global Cuts)
5. Hustlers Convention - The Dance EP (Stress)
6. Ready for Dead - "Ready for Dead" (Limbo)
7. Jump - "Luv It Up" (Dark Records)
8. Nation of Noise - "Feel the Joy" (Lock Groove)
9. Corduroy - "Something In My Eye" (Acid Jazz)
10. Stereo MCs - "Creation" (4th & Broadway)



-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 o derek chung  o  oracle graphics  o  dhchung@us.oracle.com  o 415.506.6195 o
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 20:21:14 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 19:24:55 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305260224.AA04783@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: a question or two

>    2)  Anyone know the current state of the challenge to the cabaret
> laws in the city of San Francisco?  I have another site, outdoor, private
> property, very close to downtown, I'm looking at which we could definitely 
> throw something at but we'd have to make it 21+ :(  
> 
> Right now it is illegal, officially, to have an event with under-21 folk
> in the city of SF that goes past 2:30 thanks to the curfew.  I intend to
> spend time this summer CHALLENGING that, and I don't care if it's a
> brick wall I'm going up against I want to at least try and stop this
> sillyness.  Anyone interested in joining?
> 


As I've said to you in person, politicians understand two things...
Money and votes.
18-21 may not have a lot of money, but you do have the vote.  If you made
it known that you were going to have 18+ parties where people would have
the oppertunity to sign a petition to repeal the law and REGISTER TO VOTE
so that ypur voice would be heard.  I bet you would see some action REAL
QUICK!  Be sure to call the media so that they can see that these 18 year
olds are intelligent and are willing to follow the democratic process.
In fact if you had a 18+ rave JUST FOR THIS PURPOSE the resultant
publicity will definitely get the city's attention.


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 21:24:35 1993
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Date: 	Tue, 25 May 1993 20:38:52 -0700
Message-Id: <199305260338.AA13718@well.sf.ca.us>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
From: jslee@well.sf.ca.us (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: a question or two
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU

>>    2)  Anyone know the current state of the challenge to the cabaret
>> laws in the city of San Francisco?  I have another site, outdoor, private
>> property, very close to downtown, I'm looking at which we could definitely 
>> throw something at but we'd have to make it 21+ :(  
>> 
>> Right now it is illegal, officially, to have an event with under-21 folk
>> in the city of SF that goes past 2:30 thanks to the curfew.  I intend to
>> spend time this summer CHALLENGING that, and I don't care if it's a
>> brick wall I'm going up against I want to at least try and stop this
>> sillyness.  Anyone interested in joining?
>> 
>
>
>As I've said to you in person, politicians understand two things...
>Money and votes.
>18-21 may not have a lot of money, but you do have the vote.  If you made
>it known that you were going to have 18+ parties where people would have
>the oppertunity to sign a petition to repeal the law and REGISTER TO VOTE
>so that ypur voice would be heard.  I bet you would see some action REAL
>QUICK!  Be sure to call the media so that they can see that these 18 year
>olds are intelligent and are willing to follow the democratic process.
>In fact if you had a 18+ rave JUST FOR THIS PURPOSE the resultant
>publicity will definitely get the city's attention.

I for one would be MORE than happy to start some type of petition drive to
change these ridiculous laws!  FIgure this, for the first time in a long
time 18+ have a reason to vote...to party!  If this cannot rally people our
age to the booths nothing will (so far wars have been ineffectual at
illicitng any response).  But really,  I would definetly be into this!  FOr
instance...if things were times right, get down-getdown-- would be an
excellent start!  And every party thereafter.  Figure on a good weekend
THOUSANDS litlerally go out in droves here in the bay area.  And many are
21-- trying to get into venues. 

Well, what does everyone think?
SHould THIS be taken to the STATE level? (Locally for SURE!).

Peace...maybe this one WILL be televised :)

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+"The community can rest assured that their interests are very much my own,+
+ and that anything I can do to maintain the security of the citizens, will+
+ be my primary objective.  Be seeing you.  b-|" - Number Six->The Prisoner+
+                                                                          +
+ from the village of jslee@well.sf.ca.us - a still tongue spills no beans +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Tue May 25 22:22:25 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Tue, 25 May 1993 21:45:53 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: Derek Chung <dhchung@us.oracle.com>, sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Seattle update

>10. UVC - "The Trip (Hydroponic Dub)" (Acetate)

Yeah, I bet he gets a lot of use outta that acetate!  :)

        Brian

From SFRaves-request@medisg1.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 00:07:39 1993
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Date: Tue, 25 May 93 23:26:33 -0700
From: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Message-Id: <9305260626.AA09144@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Techno party on Wed.

>HEY LETS ALL GO AND CRASH THIS PARTY!
>WE CAN DEFINITELY SPREAD THE VIBE!
>and show them how its done :)

Ahem!!   I am working at the NextWorld Expo,  and as far as I know,
the wild techno party is INVITE ONLY!!.    I DO have invitations
for a few of my friends...


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 00:38:23 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Tue, 25 May 1993 23:28:32 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: jslee@well.sf.ca.us (John S. Lee), geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Subject: Getting a petition started (was Re: a question or two)
Cc: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU


Hmmm... a petition would be a great place to start.  I'm leaving for Boston
for 10 days this Saturday so I won't make it to Get Wicked, but if someone
could go and maybe have a booth or a station collecting signatures that
would be great.  I know a "Hemp for Victory" stand will be there too. 

We need to do some research first:

1)  Find out if there's currently an appeal in the works, and if so, 
synchronize with whoever's running that so we don't duplicate efforts.

I have asked around a lot, and though I remember hearing someone had 
started something I'm getting nothing but blank stares (not just from the
list).  I will call Hallinan's office tomorrow and find out what's up.

2)  Find out the exact code ID in the Penal code/whatever the curfew laws
fall under.  I'm pretty sure it's a county or maybe even city of San Francisco
law, not a state law.  Again, a call to Hallinan may clear this up - but if
it doesn't would someone be able to go down to city hall and look it up?

3)  Decide if we want the petition statement to be a general statement or a
call for a vote on the subject - if the latter we have to limit the signators
of the petition to registered voters in San Francisco....  anyone have
experience with petition law?  I *know* some of you out there were around in
the 60's :)

Maybe just a general this-is-who-we-are-and-this-is-how-we-feel petition to
throw in their face at a supervisor's board meeting would be sufficient.
We could get a lot more signatures for this.

Let me know what you think about #3 - meanwhile I'll do some digging, and
maybe talk to the petitioners who always cruise around the Berkeley campus...

	Brian



From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 01:20:32 1993
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	id AA08895; Wed, 26 May 93 00:13:04 -0700
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 00:13:04 -0700
From: murphy@ucscb.ucsc.edu (eris)
Message-Id: <9305260713.AA08895@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: socal trip sooooon

hellooooo!!!  i know i never write anything  (still drowning  in mail EVEN with
the cutback) but i am going to go to the santa barbara area on the   2nd of
June and then off to the riverside/palm springs area for a week or more after.
i was just wondering if there was anything i should check out while i was in
those areas.  i'll have access to transportation (hopefully!) to LA at all
times, so if there is ANYTHING absolutely wonderful or interesting in those
areas from june 2nd to like the 21st, mail me contact numbers. please oh
puhleeeezz!! :)  i am bringing lotsa books to read in case i end up hiding in
my parents house with nowhere to go. :)  thanks a lot and HI EVERYONE!!:)
-marlo  [murphy@ucscb.ucsc.edu   , tofuspam :]   :)

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 10:26:53 1993
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	id AA00822; Wed, 26 May 93 09:24:17 -0700
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 09:24:17 -0700
From: elizabet@cadence.com (Elizabeth Medel)
Message-Id: <9305261624.AA00822@cds8616>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Southbay SFR Lunch 
Cc: elizabet@cadence.com

Sorry this is so late, but I've been snowed under these past few weeks!
Had a quick chat with Doom and he said that only two people showed up to
last week's lunch. There were also a few time conflicts with the techno
radio show so we thought why not just move the lunch back to Thursdays
(and any other days if people suggest!).

Once again, I won't be able to make it (I'll be out of town), but I do
hope a good number of you turn out. It's such a nice way to break up the
day, and what better way for new people to meet one another?!

I'll be there next week for certain.

Thanks!


********************************************************************************
When: This *Thursday* (weather permitting), 27 May
Time: 12.00 noon
Where: Greer Park, Palo Alto

Directions:

* From 101 (South or North) take the Oregon Expressway Exit

* Left at the first signal (West Bayshore - it's a frontage road 
  that takes you south again)

* Follow this road approx. 1/4 mile (pass appartment complex on right)
  
* You will see the park on your right hand side. Park in the first
  carpark to your right.

* We'll meet on the grassy knoll

Bring lunch, music, toys, yourselves!

Hope to see you there!!

Elizabeth.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 11:54:11 1993
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Date: 	Wed, 26 May 1993 08:50:42 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305261550.AA13952@well.sf.ca.us>
To: csc@pilot.njin.net, sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Location of the BIG Wicked?

It's in Livermore, fleemarket I think....
nrg

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 12:15:39 1993
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Date: Wed, 26 May 93 09:43:05 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305261643.AA05580@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: "The House Party is in full effect"


Looks like the "Sistas" have worked it out!


----- Begin Included Message -----

From EBay.Sun.COM!Becky.Simmons@cdp.igc.org Wed May 26 08:42:46 1993
Return-Path: <EBay.Sun.COM!Becky.Simmons@cdp.igc.org>
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 08:17:20 PDT
From: Becky.Simmons@EBay.Sun.COM (Rebecca Simmons [Technical Support Specialist])
To: fyi@tehilliah.Corp.Sun.COM, bay_drum@yoltar.Eng.Sun.COM
Subject: "The House Party is in full effect"
Cc: Becky.Simmons@EBay.Sun.COM, together@doctor.Eng.Sun.COM,
        kas@ladyhawk.csd.sgi.com
Content-Length: 490
X-Lines: 22
Status: RO


KHAFRE presents.....

THE HOUSE PARTY
featuring all Women's DJS'

     playin' everythang
     finger-poppin'- foot-stompin'- soul music,
     in an atmosphere filled with sculptures, trees, incense and
     spiritual people....

     JUS' THE RIGHT PLACE TO BE...

every FRIDAY & SATURDAY 10PM TILL 2AM

at KHAFRE'S
811 Washington Street
(between 8th & 9th Street)
Downtown "OLD" Oakland

African & Caribbean cuisine prepared nightly * admission $5.00
                      (510)832-5669


----- End Included Message -----


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 12:17:06 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9305261555.AA18422@netcom2.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Techno party on Wed.
To: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 8:55:22 PDT
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305260626.AA09144@netcom4.netcom.com>; from "John Draper" at May 25, 93 11:26 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

John Draper sez:
> 
> >HEY LETS ALL GO AND CRASH THIS PARTY!
> >WE CAN DEFINITELY SPREAD THE VIBE!
> >and show them how its done :)
> 
> Ahem!!   I am working at the NextWorld Expo,  and as far as I know,
> the wild techno party is INVITE ONLY!!.    I DO have invitations
> for a few of my friends...
> 
> 


Hmm...  Stone Design threw one last year which (I believe) was invite
only... I think Chris was there doin the smart bar thing, he can
probably elaborate... 

Anyway I hope it's free for anyone, I plan on swinging by... Maybe we
could get in w/ NeXTWorld Expo passes :-)



-H-

-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 						   howard@netcom.com
		     This is why events unnerve me
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 12:31:30 1993
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From: PLUI@iossvr.gm.hac.com
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Received: by DniMail (v1.0); Wed May 26 09:12:35 1993 PDT
To: hac2gm..arpa.."sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU"@hac2arpa.hac.com
Subject: new Doc Martin/record tape stores in LA

huuuulllllloooo....

a friend of mine is in LA right now, and I asked her if she'd get some
new dj tapes for me.  I heard a semi-new Doc Martin tape where he's slowed 
right down (I dont remember the name tho). If anyone is knows of any recent
Doc tapes, please send me titles. -i really liked that slo style!

Also, where in LA should my friend go to find dj tapes?                          


thanks                                  __
-cato                                  / '>  tweet!
(plui@iossvr.gm.hac.com)              /\ /\         (luvbird)
      



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 12:47:14 1993
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Date: Wed, 26 May 93 09:19:12 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305261619.AA19940@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, uunet!soda.berkeley.edu!bbehlen@uunet.uu.net
Subject: Re: a question or two

I'm sure we could meet the human quota of 250+.

-Mark

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 12:48:33 1993
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From: raff@oas.olivetti.com (Raffaele Sena)
Message-Id: <9305261848.AA00842@foggia.oas.olivetti.com>
Subject: UVC review
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Wed, 26 May 1993 11:48:32 -0700 (PDT)
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From "Street sound" N. 64 / Apr 93
global dj directory / reviews

	THE ULTRAVIOLET-CATASTROPHE
	The Trip

	Prod. n/a; Hardkiss (US).

	Real interesting piece of funky tribal trance 
	and progressive house. *** R.d.G.


	[rating system: * to *****,  *** -> interesting-solid]


Ciao,
	Raffaele

------------------------------------------------------------
Raffaele Sena - Ing. C. Olivetti & C. S.p.a. - Ivrea - ITALY
		Phone: +1-408-366-3542
		Fax:   +1-408-366-3606
		E-Mail: raff@oas.olivetti.com

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 13:13:41 1993
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Date: Wed, 26 May 93 11:54:59 pst
From: barryale@symantec.com (Barry Alexander)
Message-Id: <9304267384.AA738442499@symantec.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Techno party on Wed.


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From: crunch@netcom.com (John Draper)
Message-Id: <9305260626.AA09144@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Techno party on Wed.

>HEY LETS ALL GO AND CRASH THIS PARTY!
>WE CAN DEFINITELY SPREAD THE VIBE!
>and show them how its done :)

Ahem!!   I am working at the NextWorld Expo,  and as far as I know,
the wild techno party is INVITE ONLY!!.    I DO have invitations
for a few of my friends...

    ANY BODY GOTTA AN INVITATION AND A REAL GOOD COLOR COPIER?
    MAKE COPIES - DISTRIBUTE THEM TO THE MASSES
    BA


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 13:14:47 1993
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <9305261905.AA19493@netcom.netcom.com>
Subject: Thursday lunch better for me 
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 12:05:19 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


RE: Southbay Lunch

 Due to a recent work-related scheduling problem, Tuesdays were
bad for me , so the switch from Tuesday back to Thursday is fine 
with me!

 Unfortunetly - I may not be able to make it tomorrow , due to prior
lunch commitments. See you folks next week Thursday!

					Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

-- 

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 13:29:32 1993
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Date: Wed, 26 May 93 15:26:13 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9305261926.AA10708@pilot.njin.net>
To: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Cc: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: a question or two
In-Reply-To: <9305252316.AA14410@soda.berkeley.edu>
References: <9305252316.AA14410@soda.berkeley.edu>

I don't live in the bay area (I live in Davis), but I do believe that
18+ people shouldn't have a curfew. If there's anything I can do to
help, just let me know.

Sean

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 14:00:49 1993
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Message-Id: <9305262016.AA26030@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: the ever expanding mail filter at the center of the universe
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 13:16:24 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>

is giving me a swelling itching brain. (as devo would say).

what with the incredible proliferation of aliases for sfraves,
my mail filter for this one little list has expanded to ridiculous
proportions. (note I can't match on "sfraves" since there's another
mailing list with the sfraves substring).

can we please settle on one mail address?

#
# SF Ravers Mailing List
# To: sfraves@medisg.stanford.edu
# sfraves-request@medisg.stanford.edu
#
Return-Path sfraves-request@soda.berkeley.edu ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Return-Path sfraves-request@medisg.stanford.edu ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Return-Path sfraves-request@medisg1.stanford.edu ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Return-Path sfraves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Return-Path sfraves-request@nexsys.net ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
To sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
To sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
To sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
To sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
To sfraves@nexsys.net ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Cc sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Cc sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Cc sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Cc sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Cc sfraves@nexsys.net ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Apparently-To sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Apparently-To sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Apparently-To sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Apparently-To sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Apparently-To sfraves@nexsys.net ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Resent-To sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Resent-To sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Resent-To sfraves@medisg1.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Resent-To sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"
Resent-To sfraves@nexsys.net ^ ? "/usr/local/lib/mh6.7/rcvstore +sfraves"

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 14:32:43 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA27207; Wed, 26 May 93 14:32:43 -0700
Received: by techno.Stanford.EDU (4.1/1.34)
	id AA01634; Wed, 26 May 93 13:29:54 PDT
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	id AA01630; Wed, 26 May 93 13:29:50 PDT
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	id AA11951; Wed, 26 May 93 13:29:28 -0700
Date: Wed, 26 May 1993 13:13:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: Lee An <lee@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: new Doc Martin/record tape stores in LA
To: PLUI@iossvr.gm.hac.com
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305261612.AA24634@hac2arpa.hac.com>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305261351.D9152-b100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII



> a friend of mine is in LA right now, and I asked her if she'd get some
> new dj tapes for me.  I heard a semi-new Doc Martin tape where he's slowed 
> right down (I dont remember the name tho). If anyone is knows of any recent
> Doc tapes, please send me titles. -i really liked that slo style!
> 
> Also, where in LA should my friend go to find dj tapes?                          

> thanks                                  __
> -cato                                  / '>  tweet!
> (plui@iossvr.gm.hac.com)              /\ /\         (luvbird)

there are tons of record stores in la where you can find mix tapes. i
highly recommend that your friend go to melrose blvd in hollywood. there
are three excellent stores on that one street alone--including street
sounds, dmc, and beat non stop. and if she can't find what she wants in
those stores (highly unlikely), she can head east a coupla blocks to santa
monica blvd, where prime cuts, one of the first rave music oriented record
store in la, is located. if you can't get what you need at any of those
places, it doesn't exist...

happy hunting,
lee


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 16:41:19 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA06166; Wed, 26 May 93 16:41:19 -0700
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	id AA02074; Wed, 26 May 93 16:02:38 PDT
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	id AA02069; Wed, 26 May 93 16:02:36 PDT
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	id AA25677; Wed, 26 May 93 16:02:57 -0700
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 16:02:57 -0700
Message-Id: <9305262302.AA25677@netcom.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Gardening help needed

Hi, all!  I've been asked to spread the word that Malachy will be leaving
the hospital in a few weeks and moving into a cottage in the East Bay with
his brother.  They're starting to fix the place up now, and there is a garden
which "needs lots of work".

If anyone has any leads on:

1.  spare or inexpensive gardening supplies or tools,

2.  books on gardening,

3.  if you have spare time and want to help out,

please send me e-mail or call Peace at (415) 431-2320.

Thanx,

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 17:00:43 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA07440; Wed, 26 May 93 17:00:43 -0700
Received: by techno.Stanford.EDU (4.1/1.34)
	id AA02093; Wed, 26 May 93 16:06:15 PDT
Received: from einstein.oac.uci.edu by techno.Stanford.EDU (4.1/1.34)
	id AA02089; Wed, 26 May 93 16:06:13 PDT
Received: from leakey.oac.uci.edu by einstein.oac.uci.edu with SMTP id AA08919
  (5.65c/IDA-1.4.3 for sfraves@techno.stanford.edu); Wed, 26 May 1993 16:06:13 -0700
Received: from localhost by leakey.oac.uci.edu (5.65c/Ultrix3.0-C)
	id AA05347; Wed, 26 May 1993 16:06:12 -0700
Message-Id: <199305262306.AA05347@leakey.oac.uci.edu>
Cc: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: the ever expanding mail filter at the center of the universe 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 26 May 93 13:16:24 PDT."
             <9305262016.AA26030@netcom3.netcom.com> 
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 16:06:11 -0700
From: Joachim Vance (The Underdog) <jvance@einstein.oac.uci.edu>

> 
> can we please settle on one mail address?
> 
  I agree.  I do get sick of constantly adding to my .maildelivery
file.  but there are a few things you can to to shorten that list.
The main thing is to match on "sfraves@".  This covers almost all of
em.  Here's my few lines...  Hope this helps anyone with long filter
lists:

To            sfraves@   pipe A   "/usr/lib/mh/rcvstore +sfraves"
cc            sfraves@   pipe A   "/usr/lib/mh/rcvstore +sfraves"
Apparently-To sfraves@   pipe A   "/usr/lib/mh/rcvstore +sfraves"
Apparently-To sfraves-list1@ | A  "/usr/lib/mh/rcvstore +sfraves"
Resent-To     sfraves@   pipe A   "/usr/lib/mh/rcvstore +sfraves"
To       sfraves%nexsys  pipe A   "/usr/lib/mh/rcvstore +sfraves"
cc       sfraves%nexsys  pipe A   "/usr/lib/mh/rcvstore +sfraves"


BTW, aren't we all supposed to be using sfraves@techno.stanford.edu?

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 17:03:02 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA07627; Wed, 26 May 93 17:03:02 -0700
Received: by techno.Stanford.EDU (4.1/1.34)
	id AA02078; Wed, 26 May 93 16:02:38 PDT
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	id AA02068; Wed, 26 May 93 16:02:35 PDT
Received: from netcom3.netcom.com by netcom.netcom.com (5.65/SMI-4.1/Netcom)
	id AA25648; Wed, 26 May 93 16:02:50 -0700
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 16:02:50 -0700
Message-Id: <9305262302.AA25648@netcom.netcom.com>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
From: mcg@netcom.com (MykL G)
Subject: Re: "The House Party is in full effect"
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

> Looks like the "Sistas" have worked it out!

[ flyer deleted ]

This sounds really kewl (esp. the African/Carib food) but it has nothing
to do with "Your Sister's House"...

YSH have announced their opening, June 3rd (next Thursday) at Clio's,
a restaurant at Haight and Pierce.  This opening will be more a food
and chill party with DJ's, than a dance party, running from 10 'til 2.

They expect to get the club thing going the following week.

The info line is (415) 765-7670.

----____----____--__--__--__--__-_-_-_-_-_-__--__--__--__--____----____----
        MykL G                Use your wings.        mcg@netcom.com
____----____----__--__--__--__--_-_-_-_-_-_--__--__--__--__----____----____


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 18:05:34 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA12276; Wed, 26 May 93 18:05:34 -0700
Received: by techno.Stanford.EDU (4.1/1.34)
	id AA02297; Wed, 26 May 93 17:02:19 PDT
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	id AA02293; Wed, 26 May 93 17:02:17 PDT
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	id AA23851; Wed, 26 May 93 17:02:10 PDT
Received:  by dlsun87.us.oracle.com (5.59.10/37.3)
	id AA13401; Wed, 26 May 93 17:03:26 PDT
Message-Id: <9305270003.AA13401@dlsun87.us.oracle.com>
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 17:03:26 PDT
From: Jon Drukman <jdrukman@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Mark Guthrie's message of Wed, 26 May 93 13:57:33 PDT <9305262057.AA20215@cassy.lurnix.com>
Subject: UVC only ***?
Reply-To: spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com

[street sounds gives UVC 3 stars.]

mark guthrie sez:
>A *** !  Why not a ***** ?!  Well, O.K., maybe a ****, to
>leave room for Trip Harder - a definite *****.

Trip Harder *is* on that EP.  Strange as it may seem, some people do
not think that this is the greatest record ever made.  Well, what can
you do about that...

Could be worse - DJ magazine gave it a really bad review.

Ahhhhhhh whaddya gonna do?

/j/s/d/

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 18:12:56 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA12840; Wed, 26 May 93 18:12:56 -0700
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	id AA02301; Wed, 26 May 93 17:02:22 PDT
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	id AA02292; Wed, 26 May 93 17:02:14 PDT
Received: from carlyle.UUCP by uu.psi.com (5.65b/4.1.031792-PSI/PSINet) via UUCP;
        id AA25023 for ; Wed, 26 May 93 19:46:52 -0400
Received: by  carlyle.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
	id AA00742; Wed, 26 May 93 15:55:59 PDT
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 15:55:59 PDT
From: geoffw@carlyle.com (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305262255.AA00742@ carlyle.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU, netcom.com!mayer@uu.psi.com
Subject: Re: the ever expanding mail filter at the center of the universe


> From uupsi!techno.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request Wed May 26 13:54:50 1993
> To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>
> Subject: the ever expanding mail filter at the center of the universe
> Date: Wed, 26 May 93 13:16:24 -0700
> From: "Niels P. Mayer" <uupsi!netcom.com!mayer>
> Content-Length: 2706
> 
> is giving me a swelling itching brain. (as devo would say).
> 
> what with the incredible proliferation of aliases for sfraves,
> my mail filter for this one little list has expanded to ridiculous
> proportions. (note I can't match on "sfraves" since there's another
> mailing list with the sfraves substring).
> 
> can we please settle on one mail address?


Most installations take great liberties rewriting mail addresses
sory but you will have to start hacking some heuristics into your
filter.  Like everything in evolution... move forward or die.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 18:22:06 1993
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	id AA13597; Wed, 26 May 93 18:22:06 -0700
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	id AB02206; Wed, 26 May 93 16:48:02 PDT
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	id AA02200; Wed, 26 May 93 16:48:00 PDT
Received: from spool.uu.net (via LOCALHOST) by relay2.UU.NET with SMTP 
	(5.61/UUNET-internet-primary) id AA08080; Wed, 26 May 93 19:48:02 -0400
Received: from lurnix.UUCP by spool.uu.net with UUCP/RMAIL
	(queueing-rmail) id 194619.26023; Wed, 26 May 1993 19:46:19 EDT
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	id AA27426; Wed, 26 May 93 13:58:34 PDT
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	id AA20215; Wed, 26 May 93 13:57:33 PDT
Date: Wed, 26 May 93 13:57:33 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305262057.AA20215@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

>From "Street sound" N. 64 / Apr 93
>global dj directory / reviews

>	THE ULTRAVIOLET-CATASTROPHE
>	The Trip

>	Prod. n/a; Hardkiss (US).

>	Real interesting piece of funky tribal trance 
>	and progressive house. *** R.d.G.


>	[rating system: * to *****,  *** -> interesting-solid]

A *** !  Why not a ***** ?!  Well, O.K., maybe a ****, to
leave room for Trip Harder - a definite *****.

-Mark

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed May 26 18:32:06 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA14328; Wed, 26 May 93 18:32:06 -0700
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	id AA02385; Wed, 26 May 93 17:34:23 PDT
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	id AA02381; Wed, 26 May 93 17:34:17 PDT
Received: by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA08317; Wed, 26 May 93 17:14:57 -0700
Message-Id: <9305270014.AA08317@soda.berkeley.edu>
From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Wed, 26 May 1993 17:14:56 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: Joachim Vance (The Underdog) <jvance@einstein.oac.uci.edu>
Subject: Re: the ever expanding mail filter at the center of the universe
Cc: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>

        The problems with the seemingly random mail headers has
been caused by the cluster of machines we use getting shifted around
as newer machines come in... sendmail on the newer machine was
acting funny, but a newer vrsion of sendmail was brought in and it
should be working now.  Anyways, the machines have been renamed too,
so no more medisg1, it's now, officially, techno.stanford.edu.  However,
sfraves.stanford.edu is the same machine, a simple alias for it, so 
even if you send mail to sfraves@sfraves.stanford.edu it'll show up
as "sfraves@techno.stanford.edu" in the mail header.  All the bs with
"sfraves-list1" and stuff should be gone now that sendmail is working
fine.

        So remember, the correct address, the one that will always work,
is:  (drumroll, please)

        sfraves@sfraves.stanford.edu

        which is the same (currently) as:

        sfraves@techno.stanford.edu.

*phew*  :)  Sorry about all the confusion earlier.

        Brian

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 07:05:00 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA21114; Thu, 27 May 93 07:05:00 -0700
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	id AA04898; Thu, 27 May 93 06:29:02 PDT
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	id AA04892; Thu, 27 May 93 06:29:00 PDT
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	id AA15646; Thu, 27 May 93 06:29:27 -0700
From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <9305271329.AA15646@netcom4.netcom.com>
Subject: Damp Lunch / SJ Oasis
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 6:29:27 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


 Well , all the weather reports say it's going to rain today , so I 
guess I won't feel bad about missing the SFR lunch !

------

 This weekend looks like a good time to come back to raving - is the 
thing at the San Jose Oasis club still happening on Thursday evenings?
For someone who lives in San Jose, I've never had the occasion to 
go to it, since I had to go to work early on Friday. But - tonight
for sure!

				Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

-- 

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 09:08:41 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA26336; Thu, 27 May 93 09:08:41 -0700
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	id AA05195; Thu, 27 May 93 08:22:01 PDT
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	id AA05191; Thu, 27 May 93 08:21:59 PDT
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	id AA24466; Thu, 27 May 93 08:18:33 -0700
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	id AA26613; Thu, 27 May 93 09:21:54 MDT
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	id AA04825; Thu, 27 May 93 09:21:43 MDT
From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305271521.AA04825@slack>
Subject: Street Sound
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu (SF Raves)
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 9:21:41 MDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

> >From "Street sound" N. 64 / Apr 93
> >global dj directory / reviews
> 
> >	THE ULTRAVIOLET-CATASTROPHE
> >	The Trip

> A *** !  Why not a ***** ?!  Well, O.K., maybe a ****, to
> leave room for Trip Harder - a definite *****.

Personally, I think Street Sound is a waste of paper.  Their reviews are
confusing and usually three months late.  I got a copy of Mixmag Update
yesterday and even though it was a month old (it is a weekly), I was blown
away at how much new stuff they had in it.  DJs who depend on Street Sound as
their soul source of information are people I laugh at.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 09:21:04 1993
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	id AA26866; Thu, 27 May 93 09:21:04 -0700
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	id AA05181; Thu, 27 May 93 08:17:47 PDT
Received: from hpd.lut.ac.uk by techno.Stanford.EDU (4.1/1.34)
	id AA05177; Thu, 27 May 93 08:17:40 PDT
Received: from hpb.lut.ac.uk by hpd.lut.ac.uk; Thu, 27 May 93 16:16:52 bst
Received: by hpb.lut.ac.uk (15.11/SMI-4.1)
	id AA25327; Thu, 27 May 93 16:16:20 bst
Message-Id: <9305271516.AA25327@hpb.lut.ac.uk>
From: Marc McNeill <M.B.Mcneill1@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 16:16:13 BST
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0 (LUT)]


> Right now it is illegal, officially, to have an event with under-21 folk
> in the city of SF that goes past 2:30 thanks to the curfew.  I intend to
> spend time this summer CHALLENGING that, and I don't care if it's a
> brick wall I'm going up against I want to at least try and stop this
> sillyness.  Anyone interested in joining?
 
 
 This is terrible. I can't belive a country could have such stupid laws.
 Can you imagine being 15-20 years old and not being alowed out, by law,
 to anywhere past 0230 hrs. F*ck that. They'd be a f*cking riot here.

 Its a deinal of peoples rights. I thought the American law you can't drink
 till your 21 was a bit steep, but denying peoples freedom at whatever age
 is disgusting. What right does the state have to impose these laws on
 these people?
 
 I'm sorry but that is wrong. Full support to this bloke who's challenging
 the state.
 
<marc>


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    -------------------------------
    <o    Seeing is believing,   o>
     |>  But Experience is the  <|                  humbm@lut.ac.uk
    //      Original Truth       \\                 +44 509 265987
    -------------------------------
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 12:36:57 1993
Received: from techno.Stanford.EDU by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1)
	id AA08095; Thu, 27 May 93 12:36:57 -0700
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	id AA05852; Thu, 27 May 93 11:33:52 PDT
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	id AA05848; Thu, 27 May 93 11:33:51 PDT
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	id AA22422; Thu, 27 May 93 11:34:26 -0700
Date: Thu, 27 May 1993 11:29:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tony Grant <tgrant@netcom.com>
Subject: Mission Rock
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305271149.A22155-9100000@netcom3>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Hey Kids!

Mission Rock will be happening again this week.  Every week the
vibe grows.  There will be 2-for-1 admission before 11:00 and
a *special* guest DJ this week.  Call 241-8862 for all your
Mission Rock needs.


	Tony


/--------------------------------------------------------------\
|  Tony Grant          tgrant@netcom.com       s y n e r g y   |
\--------------------------------------------------------------/



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 12:55:39 1993
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	id AA09365; Thu, 27 May 93 12:55:39 -0700
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	id AA05914; Thu, 27 May 93 11:44:06 PDT
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	id AA05910; Thu, 27 May 93 11:44:05 PDT
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	id AA00777; Thu, 27 May 93 11:29:23 PDT
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 11:29:23 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305271829.AA00777@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: Free phone listing



	If you have a rave related business or service and you want it
to appear on the "Family Phone List"  in the Comming Issue of CyberTribe-5
please send it TODAY, the format is as follows:



415.666.6666<tab>The Beast (Visuals)

I specifically want Visual companies, sound systems, smart bars, etc.

(ccat I already have you :)

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 14:07:41 1993
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Date: Thu, 27 May 93 11:41:02 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305271841.AA00792@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: GIFs needed



	The Solstice Issue of CyberTribe-5 in all it glory
is just about ready to go to press.  All I need are a few
cool graphics.  So if anybody has any Know of any totally
cool GIFs PLEASE let me know.  Don't tell me to look in such and such
directory because I don't have tome to do that. What I need is a pointer
(pathname) to the actual gif i.e. soda.berkeley.edu:/pug/gif/rave.gif

This is a black andf white production so it needs to look good in gray.

I need about 3 images which will go into a space about 4" x 5"
(I have xv so I can scale it to the size I want)

Also If anybody knows someone who can make 1000 tiny "books" for a good
rate, let me know.


Thanks.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
Paranoia - Your state of mind when you finally realize what's really going on.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 14:50:59 1993
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Date: Thu, 27 May 93 11:39:51 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305271840.AA13706@jimi.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

>This is terrible. I can't belive a country could have such
>stupid laws.  Can you imagine being 15-20 years old and not
>being alowed out, by law, to anywhere past 0230 hrs. F*ck 
>that. They'd be a f*cking riot here.  Its a deinal of peoples
>rights. I thought the American law you can't drink till your 21
>was a bit steep, but denying peoples freedom at whatever age is
>disgusting. What right does the state have to impose these laws
>on these people?

>I'm sorry but that is wrong. Full support to this bloke who's
>challenging the state.

I'm often embarrased to be associated with (by living on the surface
of the same planet) the kind of humans that make, support, and
enforce these kinds of laws.

-Mark

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 15:09:38 1993
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From: zdross@ucdavis.edu
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 14:16:12 -0700
Message-Id: <9305272116.AA20594@othello.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Foundation

so did anyone go to this party?

My friends and I left for the party down in Palo Alto at around 2 am.
Got there at 2:30 or so and there was nothing there, called the line
which said to call the gathering line.  Called the gathering line and 
the party had moved to Berkeley.  We said screw it, and got home at 3:15am.
Way too tired to party.  Sounds like it would've been really fun if we
had made it, was wondering if anyone here could comment.

See all you faithful on friday night./

Zak

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 16:04:25 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Thu, 27 May 1993 14:27:28 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, sfraves-calendar@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: This week's RAVE guide

	I'm going on vacation for 10 days starting Saturday morning, so
if I go out Friday night it'll be my last for awhile (damn, and just as it 
looks like it's getting GOOD).  I'll have net.access of course, so I'll
still be maintaining the list and putting the calendar out... 

	Anyways, Friday night looks decent, DO could be quite good, and any
rave that advertises the price of admission on the flyer is definitely good
in my book.  The phone messages says it'll be somewhere in North Beach (not
the Stone), so Joe Bob says check it out.  I believe Alladin's Lamp will
be in the Sacramento area, so for those of you up there that'd be worth your
time definitely.

	Saturday night the choice is obvious: Get Wicked.  Looks like this
is the first in what promises to be a summer full of, er, large parties.  
Let's make sure the large parties maintain that vibe we all experience at the
small ones by supporting them 100%...


*****************************************************************************
UPCOMING RAVES IN THE SF/BAY AREA                     Last modified: 05/24/93
*****************************************************************************

Thursday, May 27th - Freedom (Sacramento) - ? till 3am.
        Markie Mark, Robbie Hardkiss, James, Dave E
        Groove Garden (I think that's the name of the place)
        18+  916-484-5035   1890 Arden Way, Sacramento

Friday, May 28th - DO - DJ's Mr. Curb, Blackstone, Noel, & Buck
	10pm-6am, $7 - 415-267-3964

Friday, May 28th - Baked Raindrop - DJ's Dutch  Ghost  Carlos
        $10 - call (415)995-2501

Friday, May 28th - Straight Up Funk - DJ's Darwin Rob Ted Noel Smiles Lee
        510.505.8841

Friday, May 28th - Sunday, May 30th - Club 181 Opening weekend
        Endless Dancing/Delectable Chow/Billiards/Live Jazz/Late-Night Beats
        Broun Fellinis  Buttermilk  Alphabet Soup  Black Swans  Kenny Brooks
        DJs  Josh  George  Gerry V & Kirk
        181 Eddy at Taylor, 5pm - 2am, phone 415.673.8181, supervised parking

Friday, May 28th - Alladin's Lamp - 9pm-?
        Alfie, Spun, Ernie Munson, Dutch, Carlos, Timothy, Cristophe,
        Sargon, Kenneth Paul. Live performance by NYC's Sen-Sei.
        Lasers by Hollywood Dog. $3 off to first 200 people with
        canned fruit donation.
        510-466-0510  415-241-1573  916-449-3141  209-244-8852

Saturday morning 4am-noon - Splash! 
	the swimming pool opens - be prepared to get wet with...
        Scott Hardkiss  Mark Farina  Derrick Carter  Carlos  Bam Bam
                Pete Avila  Gavan
        4am till...     415-979-5880    278 11th @ Folsom       FREE!

Saturday morning, May 29th - Sound Source
        Jeno  Markie Mark  Dani  Simon
        "A Day Dedicated to Malachy"
        6am - 4pm       The EndUp  401 6th @ Harrison   21+

Saturday, May 29th - A Festival of Sound: Three tents to GET DOWN GET
	DOWN and one tent to get WICKED - indoors and outdoors - 
	All welcome to the re-unification of the scattered tribes

	DJ's (are you ready for this?)
	Harry Who	Spun		John Williams	Garth
	Pasta - Seattle	Josh		Carlos		Jeno
	Rick Preston	Dj Wool		Moonpup		Markie Mark
	Bam Bam		Ernie Munsen	Julius		Doc Marten
	Ghost		Eric Hill	Alfie		Barry Weaver
	Tony		James & Gavan (Tweakin')	James - sacramento
	Derek Carter & Mark Farina on 4 tables 		Live - DubTribe
	introducing: Mei-Lwun * Alonzo * Allan * Vicious V & Arturo
	
	408-496-1780 * 415-905-5917

Sunday, May 30th - the GG Park Party moveth!  415-995-4731

Friday June 4th - Sunday June 6th - Purple Rain
	Party with us under the stars for 3 days straight - $5 donation
	DJ's (so far) Al, Alex, Bam Bam, Ben, Binnie, Buck, Carlos,
	 Darwyn, Dave Alga, Doran, Expand, Franko, Ghost, Harry Who,
	 Jack De La Rosa, James & Gavan, La Paix, Liquid, Moonpup,
	 Rick Preston, Rob, Ryan, Sargon, Shon, Simon, Smile, Ted
	Info & Directions: 510-729-7631, 415-469-6771

Saturday, June 5th - Vortex - DJ's Josh, James, Markie, Buck, Ernie, & Tony
	415-337-4988

Wednesday, June 9th - (a party down in Santa Cruz, thus far with no name)
	(408) 425-UJIV

Friday, June 11th - Channeling
        Jeno  Doran  Josh  Anton  Tony
        Bring Blankets/Share the Morning With Us - In memory of Will Higgs
        415.267.7660    415.599.3360

Saturday, June 12th - Spirit of the Tree - 415-266-8215 (Funky Tekno Tribe)
	Tony Jeno Grahame DJ Dan and Thomas

Friday, June 18th - Sunday June 20st - Solstice - another Taste event, in the
	Utah desert.  Stay tuned for details, or mail 
	pashdown@javelin.sim.es.com

Friday, June 25th - Romper Room - 9pm-? - $5 - 510-633-7482
        (not much info yet)

Saturday July 17th - UNITY  - more details to follow.

Saturday July 31st - Universe - more details as they become available.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

        People who want to send money, cards and other
        goodwill thoughts to Malachy can make checks payable to
        the:
                M. O'Brien Healing Fund
                1388 Haight st #117
                San Francisco CA. 94112

        Also for the latest info on Mal you can dial (415) 241-1560.
        Every one's positive energy is DEFINITELY paying off.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Be-AT INFO LINE: 415-626-4087. This usually gives info 
about the raves coming up in the next couple of days.

More phone lines:
Feel the Trip: 415-905-9661
UP3 productions: 408-399-2611
408-296-1611 - 510-464-5999 - 916-558-3777

Also, Ameba Clothing can give info on raves.
415-750-9368, 1732 Haight St., San Fransisco
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here are some weeklies - whether or not they count as real "raves" is 
debatable, but they were advertised by fliers and the music could be
good. If anyone can provide reviews of them, i.e., their 
appropriateness in being on the list, let me know....

Fridays - Mission Rock - DJ's James and Gavin (from Tweekin Records)
	& others.  Outside dance floor. In China basin at 17th and Illinois.
	Phone  415-241-8862  	Visuals by Synergy 

Fridays - ZANZIBAR - Deep house, acid jazz and garage.  DJ Josh.
        415-695-7887.  842 Valencia @ 19th St.

Fridays - Life (updated DJ lists)
	[5/28 - Derrick Carter, Mark Farina]
	Sound Factory - 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF    415.543.1300

Fridays - Mr. Happy's Disco - garage, deeep house, disco
	Jan Cooley & Aaron O 
	174 King St, $8, 11pm->, info: 415.487.6237, 21+
	[from the Love Garage people]

Fridays - Berlin  10pm  55 Natoma (back of DV8)
        "Hard hitting bass sounds radiating rightious (sic) vibes
         for your brain"

Fridays at F/X - fresh with Rick Preston and friends
	400 south 1st street in San Jose - info: (408) 298-9796

Friday night/Saturday morning - Splash
     4am-12pm, Club O, 278 11th @ Folsom    FREE

Saturdays - Housing Project (after party) - 6am - 1pm 
	End Up 401 6th @ Harrison 21+ (Also Wednesdays 9pm-330am)

Saturdays - Deep House Sessions
	April 17 & 24 - Confluence: Eric Lacy  Jan Cooley  Garth  Jeno
	at the Groove Station  1141 Polk St  6-9 pm  FREE

Sundays - EndUp from 6am - 6th & Harrison

Sundays - AfterLife - six am till...  - 375 11th st * Dj Simon, Ernie *
	Bagels * Fruit Salad * Espresso * Smart Bar * Chill Room
	This week, Markie Mark 6-8:30am

Sundays - Boogie Buffet - Brought to you by Preston (groove kitchen et al.) 
	and Paul (afterLIFE) - Sunday Mornings at 1015 Folsom  
	6am until early afternoon. - Dancing downstirs, 
	Full breakfast cafe upstairs - Call 979-8845 for DJ lineup 

Sundays - Reunion (last Sunday of every month)
        Yahoo  Simon  Garth     10-6am  (707)323-4708

Sunday nights - Bulletproof boat party - 5-9pm pier 40 (boat embarks
        promply at 5) DJ's Scott & Robbie Hardkiss, Digs & Woosh, and others
        Tickets at both Bulletproof locations 629 Haight (255.7168)
        & upstairs at BPM  1141 Polk (567.8439)

Sunday, May 16th (and every Sunday) 8pm -4am - Tilt-a-Whirl (the nighttime
	version) @ The Bridge; 4th & Bryant SF; 415.647.GRUV
	DJ's [5/16: Brad, Surge, and Goa Gil]   18+

Sundays - Team Green 
	3rd @ Harrison, 315 Harrison (City Nights), 21+ ID; Brought to 
	you by the people who promoted "Carefree", $8.00 admission.  
	Carefree alternative Style 

Sundays - flow at Nickie's (460 Haight)
        full house w/dj - 10pm-2am, 21+

Sundays - Zanzibar - 1pm-9pm - James, Gavin, and Felix playing a mix of House, 
	Funk and Rare Groove

Sundays, 3-7pm - Acid Jazz & Reggae Dancehall Connection - DJ's 
	Ivan, Rolo 1-3, Mind Motion, EFX, Ismael - Groove Station - 
	1141 Polk Street, SF

Sunday night - Spundae (no relation to Spun, as far as I can tell)
        8pm - ?    Guest DJs + Henrick
        Natoma, between 1st and 2nd (probably 55 natoma, back of DV8)

Mondays - Depth Chamber - beginning 6/7
	[6/7 - jeno]
	[6/14 - bones/jan cooley]
	[6/21 - james/robbie hardkiss]
	[6/28 - greenwod/markie]
	at the refurbished 181 club, 181 eddy @ taylor
	9-2am, 21+, (415)241-1560

Mondays - House Coffee - DJ Stefan blends house grooves
        all ages, 115 4th St, Railroad Square. (Hot Spots)
        546-8665

Mondays - Pepper.Deep House with Buck, Josh, Chris Lum & Guests. 668
	Haight, 10-2AM, $3, 21+. 

Tuesdays - Together - Thomas  Simon  Garth  - Basement of Big Heart City
	415-979-8825

Wednesdays - Housing Project - 9-330am @ 401 6th st / harrison
	guest dj's ernie munson, jeno, josh, garth - 21+

Wednesdays - Recycle - The Stone, SF - 18+ - 415-599-3750.

Wednesdays - Pure Sugar [starts June 2nd]
        mark farina  harry who?  james  gavan
        free before 12, $2 after  @ the Sound Factory

Wednesdays - Chocolate City - Bam Bam, Gerry V, Scott Hardkiss
	10pm - 4am, $5 ($2 b4 11), 21+
	Atlantis - 375 1st @ Harrison
	
Thursdays - YOUR SISTERS' HOUSE - 415-765-7670
	(June 2nd at Clio's, corner of Haight and Pierce, 10pm-2am)

Thursdays - Lush - Chris Lum & Ernie Munson
	715 Harrison @ 3rd	21+

Thursdays - Deep Space - 200 N. 1st Street, SJ - 21+ - 408-345-2386
	Two dance floors - DJ's have included: Spun, Garth, Thomas,
	Risk Preston, Harry Who, and more.  Free before 9:30pm

Thursdays - Shine - Djs Jelly & Jay-J + guests
        683 Clementia (off 8th between Howard and Folsom)

Thursdays - ZANZIBAR - Acid jazz and house.  DJ Suki.  (415) 695-7887.
        842 Valencia @ 19th St. 21+

Thursdays - Primal - Tribal, Techno, and trance - Dj's Lewis and 
	Bryan Hughes - 9th and Harrison

Thursdays - Dog House (presented by Family Dog)
	"The Underground Comes to the Peninsula" (!)
	8-2am  261 California Ave, Burlingame	21+

Thursdays - VIRGIN MARY - bringing back the LOVE - with always holy & 
	consistent DJs garth, jan cooley, dutch, larry jr. - 2000 K street
	SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA - 21 & over, 10:00 pm

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONNECTION 2 TAPES >> 4 cassettes >> 6 hours >> complete live house
DJs: Moonpup, Scott Hardkiss, Jon Drukman, Lee and Blurrr >>
contact Bob Ramstad boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com >>
$20 + $5 shipping, $5 of which goes to the Malachy O'Brien healing fund >>
also at Tower Records Mountain View with the techno tapes
corner of San Antonio and El Camino Real
they have a Dali print with tigers on the front - $24.99 + tax

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

RADIO SHOWS: 

(Need info for: Friday and Saturday nights on 106.1, 107.7, and 105.3 -
	if you know the names and times of the shows, give me a buzz...)

Tuesdays, noon - 3pm - "London Jamaica" w/Francesca & Unknown
	House + some reggae	KZSU, 90.1 FM. - well-known guest DJs 

Tuesdays (early Wednesdays actually) - 12:45 - 3:30am, 90.7 KALX (Berkeley) - 
	fellow sfraver Mescalina "Tune in for acid indigestion and 
	other ailments"

Wednesdays, 10pm, KFJC, Foothill College (Santa Clara)

Thursdays, 7-9 on 91.3 FM KCPR San Luis Obispo - Beyond Techno, with
	DJ EZ Whip.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

If anyone has info on any other events, submit them! I can't possibly hope
to get all the info every week. 

Brian Behlendorf

bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, 510-649-0351

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 16:12:20 1993
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	id AA15268; Thu, 27 May 93 15:26:38 PDT
Message-Id: <9305272226.AA15268@dlsun87.us.oracle.com>
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 15:26:38 PDT
From: Jon Drukman <jdrukman@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
In-Reply-To: Brian Behlendorf's message of Thu, 27 May 1993 14:27:28 -0700 <9305272127.AA14507@soda.berkeley.edu>
Subject: This week's RAVE guide
Reply-To: spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com

there's a party happening in fresno on sunday night with dj's: kenneth
paul, mark farina, tony & myself...

if anybody happens to be in that area (i don't even know where fresno
is but what the hell, could be fun) go for it!

/jon

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 17:38:19 1993
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Date: 	Thu, 27 May 1993 17:03:43 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305280003.AA28640@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Tilt-a-Whirl DJ Update

Howdy gang

missed the early calendar, so I thought I'd let everyone know that this week
at Tilt-a-Whirl DJs are:

  *Galen*   *Tony*   *Goa Gil*

Sunday, may 30th (and every sunday)
4th & Bryant in SF
8pm - 4am
21+ w/ID  Smart Bar, Bar, Good Food!

Visuals by GO'D and Paradise!

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 19:49:39 1993
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	id AA738551614 Thu, 27 May 93 18:13:34 pst
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 18:13:34 pst
From: barryale@symantec.com (Barry Alexander)
Message-Id: <9304277385.AA738551614@symantec.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: lower california



    hi all, i will be in so. cal./LA july 4th weekend.  is there anything like  
    the sfraves list serving the LA area which i could post/request to see      
    what's up down there?  *OR* does anyone on this list know of anything       
    kewl happening down there jul4we?  i've heard of some stores on melrose     
    blvd (street sounds, dmc, beat non stop) in hollywood and santa monica      
    blvd (prime cuts) that will have flyers...*BUT* i'm looking for something
    not so commercial/massive - something like the fmr/mess/beach thangz up
    here.  i will be renting a car to make the trip with two others, so if you
    need a ride to la and back from sf, lemme know too.  thanx.

    barry

	

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 20:15:03 1993
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From: srfrrosa@leland.stanford.edu
Message-Id: <9305280116.AA22841@cardinal.Stanford.EDU.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: addendum to the calendar
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 18:16:32 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


At Splash! last week, I got a flyer for:

                        FLOWeR GARDeN

                 euphoric power rave for peace

                        Sunday May 30
             3-day weekend * all welcome * all night

             Mark * Chris * Carlos * Liquid * John
              Plastech * Ducky * Tai * Francesco
                    Unknown * Pete * James

                   1 Bolivar Drive, Berkeley
       80 to University Ave, Right on 6th, 1 Block to Addison,
       Right on Addison, To dead end at Berkeley Aquatic Park

                  415*266*8232   408*236*2032



So jus' letting y'all know.

love,

maiko


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 20:39:33 1993
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From: dit@sybase.com (Cutlass Supreme)
Message-Id: <9305280125.AA01351@frenzy.sybgate.sybase.com>
Subject: Goodbye!
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 18:25:57 PDT
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In a few weeks I will be leaving the east bay, my home of 24 years. In the
last few years a mysterious energy has been manifesting itself here in the
form of all night parties unlike any other, and it feels good to have been
in these houses:

Recess (the immediate predecessor to rave here? got your hall pass?)
E is for Everybody
E is for Everybody 2
Little Shellys Seafood Salad
Toon Town 2
Osmosis
Candyflip (the first house weekly?)
The Outlaws BART party
Mr Floppy's flophouse (the original multiday party!)
Mr Floppy's longest day
The Gathering
Woopy Ball (perhaps the most successful 2 night party!)
The Gathering: Vision (5 stars!!)
Community
Love in the Bassment
Wicked
Full Moon at candlestick park&Baker Beach
The Sound Factory (just a joke..relax)
Groove Kitchen
Mission Rock
Smartie Party (even though I fell asleep on the dance floor)
after hours at 187 Shipley
Sunny Side Up
Utopia Project
and so many more....

(ren voice) memories......

I wish luck to all of the sound systems who are taking the music 
giving it back to the people. Keep fighting. and keep dancing.

Please send some positive vibes my way and wish me luck in NYC! 

Love, peace, 120 beats
and fuck the hair grease...
Superhigh
and see you at mission rock!
dit@sybase.com 

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 21:13:04 1993
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Date: 	Thu, 27 May 1993 18:49:26 -0700
From: Maureen Garrett <metalmau@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305280149.AA22470@well.sf.ca.us>
To: M.B.Mcneill1@lut.ac.uk, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)

Curfews, forfeiture, busting MDMA Labs while Speed ones thrive, are aoll
ways of controlling the scene, the movement.  I believe it is a conspiracy,
there are many powerful people who want the masses divided and at war with
each other...I have been thinking of how I can help fight and put and end to
the 1984 tactics of forfeiture...maybe it is time for another political
party so to speak...."Something's happening here, what it is ain't exactly
clear."   --Rave, rave against the dying of the light.    Mau

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 21:24:06 1993
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From: cvoigt@flute.calpoly.edu
Message-Id: <9305280219.AA69556@flute.calpoly.edu>
Subject: sat. night
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Thu, 27 May 1993 19:19:45 -0800 (PDT)
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Hey !! 

Check it out im heading north this weekend SF area.  I just checked the
list out and i was woundering if there is anything else going on on sat.
night?  I want a good back-up if it rains r
r (opps)
or if i get there and things are not what is cool, though it looks to be
mind thumping.  please drop the word.  GK would have been cool but .....
Also i didn't get any response as to getting in touch with planet X
records, am iconfused about this place?

Thanks

CHE
peace



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 21:34:38 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Thu, 27 May 1993 20:27:47 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: zdross@ucdavis.edu, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Foundation

Yes, it turns out the second location after the warehouse got busted was
going to be the same place as the Full Moon last month, however for some
reason when they arrived they found a police blockade (!!)... so they moved
it to Berkeley.  Hmmmmmmmmmm

        Brian

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 21:42:32 1993
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From: drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Thu, 27 May 93 20:24:26 -0700
Message-Id: <9305280324.AA29255@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: SONG ID?!?!

What's up, y'all?

I was at a rave in S.F. awhile ago and I heard this song with the sample--
"We are family...I got all my sisters and me..."--- It's probably an old
track but no one around here knows who it's by.  I'm headed to Haight this
weekend and hope to find it there.  Any info. on who this is is much
obliged! (or where I can find it)
                             ---Thanks
                    
-Jeff-

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 22:22:45 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Thu, 27 May 1993 20:40:00 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Tilt-a-Whirl DJ Update

>  *Galen*

Galen gave me a tape a few weeks ago, and it's *really* good, trancey,
dubby house.  I've just about worn the tape thin... time to ask for 
another one I guess :):)

        Brian

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 22:24:20 1993
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Date: Thu, 27 May 93 20:39:47 -0800
From: Robert Jesse <rjesse@us.oracle.com>
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To: Maureen Garrett <metalmau@well.sf.ca.us>
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Reply-To: rnj%lila@us.oracle.com

Political Party - what a great name for a future sfraves event!

Begin forwarded message:

Date: 	Thu, 27 May 1993 18:49:26 -0700
From: Maureen Garrett <metalmau@well.sf.ca.us>
To: M.B.Mcneill1@lut.ac.uk, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)

Curfews, forfeiture, busting MDMA Labs while Speed ones thrive, are aoll
ways of controlling the scene, the movement.  I believe it is a conspiracy,
there are many powerful people who want the masses divided and at war with
each other...I have been thinking of how I can help fight and put and end to
the 1984 tactics of forfeiture...maybe it is time for another political
party so to speak...."Something's happening here, what it is ain't exactly
clear."   --Rave, rave against the dying of the light.    Mau


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Thu May 27 23:06:46 1993
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To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Garth
Date: Thu, 27 May 93 22:16:53 -0700
From: Joachim Vance (The Underdog) <jvance@einstein.oac.uci.edu>


  I just found out that Garth will be down here in LA on Friday night.
I was wondering if anybody had contact with him or had his phone
number to find out if he might be down here through Sat night.
   If he is, I'd like to have him on my Sat. night radio show.  

This is also an open invite to all SF (and other non LA-area DJs if
you don't live in SF) to spin on my show.  If you know of a DJ who
will be in or near LA on a Sat night, let me know or have them get in
touch with me.  714.SUN.JUDO.

thanks!

Joachim
The Bubble Boy

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 01:27:36 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305280734.AA22199@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: SONG ID?!?!
To: drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu
Date: Fri, 28 May 1993 03:34:21 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305280324.AA29255@am.ucsc.edu> from "drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu" at May 27, 93 08:24:26 pm
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Beyond the ultraworld of drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu:
> 
> I was at a rave in S.F. awhile ago and I heard this song with the sample--
> "We are family...I got all my sisters and me..."--- It's probably an old
> track but no one around here knows who it's by.

How old you want? 70s disco? 80s bubblegum remake? 90s dance?

It's probably "We are family/we all into love" by Unit3 UK. Some ragga on it.
I think it was out in 91, maybe 92. Popular in big dance clubs...
The 80s remake, i dont remember who made it, and the original song is:
"we are family" - (shit, a blank...hmmmm....) was it sister sledge? geez... i
wuz about 7 years old, so dont lapidate me if i'm wrong on this one... It was
around 1977 i would say...(good luck finding it) 

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 03:05:55 1993
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To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: SONG ID?!?! 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 28 May 93 03:34:21 EDT."
             <9305280734.AA22199@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA> 
Date: Fri, 28 May 93 01:43:14 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


yes, original people who did "we are family" is sister sledge.

sampling this song is, at least theoretically, cheezy. i haven't heard
any songs with this sample, so perhaps they did good.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 08:48:38 1993
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Via: uk.ac.bristol; Fri, 28 May 1993 15:27:45 +0100
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From: Miles Pearce <Miles.Pearce@bristol.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <3509.9305281527@irix.bristol.ac.uk>
Subject: UNIVERSAL INFO
Sender: Miles.Pearce@bristol.ac.uk
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Fri, 28 May 93 15:27:51 GMT
Cc: miles.pearce@bristol.ac.uk
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]


> 
> For your information............
> 
> Many requests from the States about the availability of the UNIVERSE
> 
> WORLD TECHNO TRIBE  LP/MC/CD
> 
> So, here ya go 
> 
> Available from good record shoppes on British Import, if you can't find it
> you can mailorder it from
> 
> UNIVERSE (E-MAIL)
> P O Box 1569
> Bath, BA2 5EH
> Avon
> United Kingdom
> 
> Specifying what you want:
> 
> Universe World Techno Tribe Album
> 
> Verse LP		WTT1	9.99  pounds sterling
> Verse CD		WTT2	13.49 pounds sterling
> Verse MC		WTT3   	9.99  pounds sterling
> Ltd. Ed. Pic. Disk	WTT4	11.99 pounds sterling
> 
> Please make Cheques, Postal orders etc payable to:
> 
> Universe Cosmic Clobber
> 
> Please also include enough to cover return postage to your address.
> 
> Here's the full track listing
> 
> FOR ANYONE INTERESTED......................................................
> 
> 
> UNIVERSE in association with RISING HIGH RECORDS present:
> 
> 		WORLD TECHNO TRIBE - LP\MC\CD
> 
> PIONEERS OF THE					THE HYPNOTIST
> UNIVERSE
> 
> Written & produced by Caspar Pound and Peter Smith, forth coming release.
> 
> SPINGYARD					C J BOLLAND
> 
> Written & produced by C J Bolland, Taken from 4th sign EP. R & S Records.
> 
> .215061						A.F.X.
> 
> Composed & produced by A.F.X. for Rephex, taken from Analogue Bubblebath 3.
> 
> VIRTUAL BREAKDOWN				LAURENT GARNIER
> (Mind Your Head)
> 
> COSMIC LOVE					RESISTANCE D
> (Approach & Identify)
> 
> Written & produced by Resistance D, Taken from The Emphasis EP.
> 
> FLYING DEEPER					SKYFLYER
> 
> Written & produced by Arndt Pecher & Rolf Maier-Bode, Taken from Saph II.
> 
> VIRTUAL REALITY					TWO THUMBS
> 
> Composed & produced by Sauwe and Van De Pas, Taken from Two Thumbs Vol. 4.
> 
> TREMORA DEL TERRA				ILLUMINATAE
> 
> Composed & produced by G MAITTHEWMAN & D Osbourne, Taken from XVX-1.
> 
> LIST 2						SUBURBAN HELL
> 
> Composed by D Hermelun & G Schonewille, Taken from DJAX-UP 159.
> 
> SEQUENTIAL					SEQUENTIAL
> (The Dune Mix)
> 
> Composed by Craig Peck & Pete Namlook, Taken from RSN 45.
> 
> 1ST SYMPHONY					DAVE ANGEL
> 
> Composed & produced by Dvae Angel, Taken from Orchestrations.
> 
> BARBARELLA					SVEN VATH
> (The Irresistible Force Remix)
> 
> Composed & Produced by Sven Vath & R Hildenbeutel, Remix by Mixmaster Morris
> 
> 
> If you have any further enquires mail me at:
> 
> miles.pearce@bristol.ac.uk
> 
> END OF INFORMATION, AN' THAT'S ALL IT IS, FOLKS......
> 

*** UNIVERSE GOES SFO - JULY 31st 1993 ***

watch the net for futher details on this one

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 09:32:34 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
Message-Id: <9305280757.ZM28986@nmtvs313>
Date: Fri, 28 May 1993 07:57:36 -0700
In-Reply-To: ames!cats.ucsc.edu!drseuss
        "SONG ID?!?!" (May 27,  8:24pm)
References: <9305280324.AA29255@am.ucsc.edu>
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.4 02apr93)
To: ames!cats.ucsc.edu!drseuss
Subject: Re: SONG ID?!?!
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

 the original is sister sledge, "we are family", which has been looped...

-=Jack=-

  "now you're lookin' back..."

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 10:21:04 1993
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From: "Dana WATANABE" <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
Message-Id: <199305281628.AA29149@mothra.nts.uci.edu>
Subject: Are you coming down for the weekend ... o/~
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Fri, 28 May 93 9:28:23 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

since a couple of people have asked and since a lot of tripping
err umm.. i mean people going on trips or vacation or coming home
or whatever will be going on

IF YOU ARE COMING TO Southern California -
there is the SOCAL-RAVES mailing list

weekly calendar just like Bri's
and minimal other chat

to get on, send a message to

SOCAL-RAVES-REQUEST@UCSD.EDU

Saying:

SUBSCRIBE SOCAL-RAVES


on another note... what would be a good week to come up to SF 
this summer.. i want to buy plane tickets now, so i was
wondering if there was a particular week that was better

 ,
dana

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 10:46:30 1993
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Date: Fri, 28 May 93 13:05:58 EDT
From: Monica Tauriello <monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: coming to sf!
Message-Id: <CMM-RU.1.3.738608758.monicat@gandalf.rutgers.edu>

hello everyone! i'll be moving to sf in late july, so if anyone knows of any
apartments/rooms open, please let me know... i'll be riding with a friend
from nj, and we'd prefer something in the city, 2 bedroom or 2 rooms in a
house, and relatively cheap (based on whatever going sf rates are), near
public trans., and hopefully where a cat will be allowed tho this is not
necessary.... let's see: i'm neat in common space, and messy in my room, not
TOO loud, and i don't need to smoke (cigs) in the house...

thanks!!!!!!!

monicat

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 11:10:06 1993
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Date: Fri, 28 May 93 09:14:06 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9305281614.AA21647@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU, uunet!cats.ucsc.edu!drseuss@uunet.uu.net
Subject: Re: SONG ID?!?!

The sample is Sister Sledge (sp?), I think but I don't know what track uses
it.

-Mark

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 11:34:24 1993
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Date: Fri, 28 May 93 10:28:55 PDT
From: megatest!kermit!preiter@uu2.psi.com (Pete Reiter)
Message-Id: <9305281728.AA00608@kermit.megaeng>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: A few that missed the list
X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII
Content-Length: 742


Sun, May 30
The Zone - A Memorial night of funk
Visuals by Danny Boy
DJs Liquid, Spun, Michael
(408) 631-1082

Mon May 31st
The Family Cordially Invites You To:
A Day In the Park (in a San Jose park)
Julius, Carlos, Harry Who, Rick Preston
(408) 929-1300

Monday May 31st
Free Life
9 pm @ the FX (in San Jose) FREE!
DJs Rick Preston and Harry Who

Monday in the park is definitely worth checking out....

Deep Space was rocking tonight. DJs were Mark Farina, Rick Preston, Garth and
Spun. This weekly event typically has better music than most all-night raves
I go to these days. It's not big on Vibe, but there's no attitude either.
Definitely check it out if you get the chance. What do you know, there is life
in San Jose...

						Pete


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 11:47:45 1993
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Date: Fri, 28 May 93 10:53:41 PDT
From: mw@sybase.com (Michael Wertheim)
Message-Id: <9305281753.AA23004@orion.sybgate.sybase.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: SONG ID?!?!
Content-Length: 127


It's Sister Sledge's "We Are Family" ('93 remix).  You can get the 12" or CD5
at BPM (but try finding it at Tweekin' first).


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 12:10:38 1993
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Date: Fri, 28 May 93 10:34:43 PDT
From: megatest!kermit!preiter@uu2.psi.com (Pete Reiter)
Message-Id: <9305281734.AA00613@kermit.megaeng>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: One more item of interest...
X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII
Content-Length: 337

I thought some of you might be interested in this show...




may 30 sun Crash Worship, Unzub, Mental Pigmies at Gilman a/a $5 5pm

Gilman, 924 Gilman Street, Berkeley, CA  94710
  All ages - No alcohol - Volunteer run.  1 mile from N. Berkeley BART.
  Membership cards $3/year, shows $5.   (510)525-9926 book (510)524-8180


						Pete

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 12:30:11 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305281821.AA21898@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: SONG ID?!?!
To: mw@sybase.com (Michael Wertheim)
Date: Fri, 28 May 1993 14:21:16 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305281753.AA23004@orion.sybgate.sybase.com> from "Michael Wertheim" at May 28, 93 10:53:41 am
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Beyond the ultraworld of Michael Wertheim:
> 
> 
> It's Sister Sledge's "We Are Family" ('93 remix).  You can get the 12" or CD5
> at BPM (but try finding it at Tweekin' first).

No kid'! Another remix... So:
original, '8? remix and '93 remix.

I must correct what i said yesterday:
Unit3 UK did not sample Sister sledge, they used the refrain only. Sorry about
the confusion. It's actually Keselle from Unit3 who sings it... (just listened
to it...)

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 15:13:59 1993
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From: aavilan@leland.stanford.edu
Message-Id: <9305282140.AA02679@cardinal.Stanford.EDU.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Unsubscribe
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Date: Fri, 28 May 93 14:40:52 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]



Please unsubscribe me...leaving for the summer.


Alle:)


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 16:17:40 1993
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From: drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Fri, 28 May 93 15:37:49 -0700
Message-Id: <9305282237.AA13639@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Get Wicked


Hello, Hello!

First of all I want to thank y'all for the info 'bout the "We are family..."
song.

Anyways, about the Festival of Sound this Sat., does anyone know if the
location's still in the Livermore area, is it another $20 tic or will
it be more due to the 30 dj line-up?

Thanks all!
=Jeff=
drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 17:22:34 1993
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Message-Id: <9305282332.AA16387@netcom.netcom.com>
Date: Fri, 28 May 1993 16:32:15 -0800
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
Subject: Gathering Tonight/No DO



Mr. Curb's putting DO off for a couple of weeks due to the Gathering 
tonight. Call 267-4800 for Gathering info.-> Markie Mark, the Hardkisses, plus
others are spinning. No Alcohol. 


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 18:12:57 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9305290016.AA07730@slack>
Subject: XDZebra Review #31
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves),
        nm-list@reef.cis.ufl.edu (New Music List),
        ne-raves@silver.lcs.mit.edu (NE Raves),
        manchester@irss.njit.edu (Manchester),
        mw-raves@engin.umich.edu (Midwest Raves),
        socal-raves@ucsd.edu (So Cal Raves), dcraves@american.edu (DC Raves),
        seraves@american.edu (SE Raves), thomas@apple.com,
        cyfetish@weird.ml.us
Date: Fri, 28 May 93 18:16:54 MDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

XDZebra Review #31

        Addiction
        266 Delmar Ct.
        Salt Lake City, UT 84101-1817

When in Utah call the T A S T E hotline 801-461-3375.

Trying to find these releases?  Try Ear/Rational Music:
FAX 805/893-8553, Phone 805/564-4949, email angst%cs@hub.ucsb.edu

Back issues are available from me by mail or by ftp'ing to soda.berkeley.edu.
They're in the pub/sfraves/music directory.

This is all my opinion.  Flames against a review are pretty pointless, so
don't bother.  Let me know if you have any other comments though.

BPMs provided courtesy of Eric Pederson's BPM calculator for the Sparc.

XDZebra Reviews may be reproduced without permission under one condition,
they remain intact and unchanged.  If you publish this in print, mail me a
copy via "Addiction".

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Review #31 Contents:
Post Acid Crash Vol. 2
Falconer
<< Tequila Slammers and the Jump Jump Groove Generation >>
Bass Cube
Compilation 2
David Bowie: Jump They Say
Front 242: Religion


Post Acid Crash Vol. 2
Force Inc.: FIM - 1 - 007
1  148  05:36 Vinyl Countdown: Paroles
2  150  04:46 Force Mass Motion: Sub Sonix
3  141  06:08 Madonna 303: I Love You More Than Sex Can Say
4  153  05:29 Twin Drive: In - Sync
5  175  04:13 Car & Driver: Help Germany
6  144  06:39 Age: Underground
7  155  05:54 Biochip C.: Strange Invader Remix
8  149  07:33 Space Cube: Mental Terror (S.F. Acid Mix)
9  155  04:55 Car & Driver: Drive
10 165  04:07 The Modulor: Noon
11 149  06:31 Age: Strange Insight
12 156  06:18 Jammin Unit / Walker: Egglayer Queen
13 148  05:39 Walker: 303 Interface

Comments:  Force Inc. finally puts out a followup to the excellent Post Acid
Crash.  Once again, the acid on this disc is like sucking lemons, and there is
plenty of it.  The one complaint I have is the usual substitution of blatant
speed over texture in an attempt for the hardcore sound.  Car & Driver are the
fastest tracks on the disc, but thankfully they manage to pull it off well.
Other excellent tracks are by Vinyl Countdown, Age, and Force Mass Motion.  On
the underside, Madonna 303 is acidically strong, but uses a really insipid
sample, Biochip C. is a bit too on the Industrial-Belgian mode for my tastes.

Summary: 6/10.  Not as good as the original, but still the best collection of
acid around.


Falconer
Clockwork Records/CMV: CMV 08-5510
1  110  06:02 Earth Rise
2       02:25 Dream Scape No. 1
3  110  01:23 Studio (A Day in the Life)
4   90  06:32 Eve of Buddha
5       03:47 The Aurora Shrine
6  108  04:05 Dream Scape No. 2
7       06:08 Voyager
8  128  06:20 Last Moment (First Breath)
9   96  04:40 Primary
10  86  07:55 Final Transmission
11 110  03:43 Provincial Perspective

Comments: I was extremely skeptical when I saw this disc and its booklet
imprinted with a yellow sticker-like oval reading "Andy Falconer ex The Orb".
Usually a dependence upon old associations indicates a poor ability to stand
on your own.  Andy worked on two Orb tracks, "Into the 4th Dimension" and the
Apollo IX release, "Peace in the Middle East".  Word is that he also
contributed heavily to Hypnotone projects.  There are a few references to the
Orb sound, but there are more extreme departures away from it.  Funk with
"Final Transmission", jazz with "Provincial Perspective", shining "Ai" style
ambience with the two "Dream Scape" tracks, plus a healthy dose of
experimentation.  Most tracks are off the floor, but "Earth Rise" and
"Voyager" contain healthy beats that would work well.  Everything from baby
sounds to videogame music to Hillage style guitars have been mixed in by Andy
for an album that is quite distinctly his own.

Summary: 9/10.  Don't trust the label's dependent marketing.  This is a real
treat to listen to.


<< Tequila Slammers and the Jump Jump Groove Generation >>
Warp: WARP CD10
1  125  05:46 Jaco: Show Some Love
2  129  05:26 THK: France (Saturn Mix)
3  125  05:54 Solitaire Gee: Slumberland
4  120  05:10 DIY: Hothead (Original DIY Dub)
5  125  05:41 Coco Steel & Lovebomb: You Can't Stop The Groove
6  126  05:58 Nightmares on Wax: Happiness
7  125  05:33 Rhythm Invention: Ad Infinitum
8  124  04:46 Eternal: Mind Odyssey
9  118  09:35 DIY: Hothead D (W Insifignificance Mix)

Comments: The latest compilation from Warp is a bit of a disappointment in the
innovation area.  Usually Warp is plowing the way for the rest to follow, but
on this one, very few tracks stand out as something unusual.  Coco Steel &
Lovebomb and Nightmares on Wax present a pair of above-the-rest tracks.  The
only other entry that really grabbed me was "France" by THK.  DIY's work is
deeply cool bleepiness.  The "D" version of "Hothead" is more significant for
its high mixability than its listenability.  "Slumberland" by Solitaire Gee is
a decent builder.  Rhythm Invention comes very close to being boring, and the
inclusion of widely available "Eternal" is puzzling.  "Eternal" is a decent
track, but I would have rather seen Black Dog, Polygon Window, or even (gasp)
LFO.

Summary: 7/10.  Less than par compilation this time around.  Still leaps and
bounds above most other non-label comps.


Bass Cube
PANDiSC: PDD-8831
1  136  03:50 Bass Bass Music
2  115  04:18 Sicilian Brown
3  128  05:16 Planet Bass 93
4  102  04:47 Faraway Bass
5  137  04:10 Hittin' Bottom
6  128  04:25 Bass So Strong
7  144  04:25 Bass Feels Good
8  128  03:46 Ode To Billy Jive
9   79  04:49 Slo Jam
10 132  05:14 Basswerk
11 124  04:18 Arabian Bass
12  99  04:23 Dance While The Record Spins

Comments:  Whilst investigating monster-bass hip-hop, I ran across this disc.
What piqued my curiosity was the "Basswerk" track.  I was surprised to find
that there wasn't any bass present while I was first playing this disc, then I
realized that my tiny home stereo couldn't handle it.  If played through
headphones, you can almost hear it, like a subliminal wind in the background.
In other words, the bass is huge on here, and unless you have a system that
can handle it, it isn't worth purchase.  As for the tracks themselves, they
are mostly hip-hop with a bit of techno cross-over.  No rapping is present at
all, just a lot of insipid samples about bass.  "Basswerk" uses a lot of
Kraftwerk samples, and "Arabian Bass" uses the same "Wah ah wah wah" sample
that Orb's "Blue Room" uses.  However, there are some really boring snoozers
on here too.

Summary: 5/10.  Cool for investigation, but structurally weak.  Biggest bass
I've ever haven't heard, can't wait to try it on a PA.


Compilation 2
FAX +49-69/450464
1  148  05:43 Deltraxx: The Real Secret
2  140  06:04 Limelight: Mens, Mentis (Lex Durus Mix)
3  150  06:03 Subsequence: Healthy
4  150  05:36 Hearts of Space: Drawn to the Thrill
5  140  07:22 SynSyl: AngeLIcKES the dEVIL
6  150  06:54 4Voice: Catching the Scent of Mystery
7  154  05:41 Escape: Escape to Mars
8  136  07:05 Sequential: 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea
9  145  06:01 Sextant: It's Gonna Be Alright
10 140  05:22 SYN: Angel Kicks the Devil

Comments: Another compilation release from the excellent FAX records.
Compilation 2 did not impress me as much as Compilation 1 did.  Things are a
bit harder and a bit faster here.  Whereas Compilation 1's strength lay in its
hard trance, this is just plain hard and tends to fall through in that area.
Seqential stayed with the program and turned in a whispery, but uptempo
ambient piece.  4Voice is great once again with a sweeping pounder.  Another
chiller is "Drawn to the Thrill" by Hearts of Space, which brings to mind
Resistance D's "Cosmic Love".

Summary: 6/10.  Not near as good as Compilation 1.  A few gems, but mostly
harder crud.


David Bowie: Jump They Say
BMG/Savage: 74785-50034-2
1  126  04:23 Jump They Say (Album Version)
2  125  04:04 Jump They Say (Radio Edit)
3  125  05:02 Jump They Say (Club Hart Remix)
4  126  07:42 Jump They Say (Leftfield Remix)
5  115  04:42 Pallas Athena (Album Version)
6  115  05:36 Pallas Athena (Don't Stop Praying Remix)

Comments:  After hearing the raging ballyhoo over the Leftfield remix of David
Bowie's "Jump They Say", I finally broke down and bought the single.  OK stuff
but not terrific in my eyes.  Probably the worst thing I've heard yet from
Leftfield.  The real delight on this disc is the Meat Beat Manifesto remix of
"Pallas Athena" (Don't Stop Praying).  Usual funkadelic Jack Danger's
trademark, it makes commercial Bowie fun to listen to and move to.  As for the
rest of the single, there are two remixes by JAE-E which don't do much for me
and standard Bowie.  If he turns you on, I'd imagine you'll like it.
Unfortunately, I don't.

Summary: 4/10.  An especially good MBM remix, a mediocre Leftfield remix, and
trademarked Bowie.


Front 242: Religion
Sony/Epic: 49K 74928
1  130  03:34 Religion (7" Mix by Andy Wallace)
2  130  06:06 Religion (Pussy Whipped Mix by J.G. Thirlwell)
3  148  04:43 Religion (The Prodigy Bass Under Siege Mix)
4  130  03:40 Religion (Bitch Slapper Mix by J.G. Thirlwell)
5  140  04:56 Religion (The Prodigy Trance U Down Mix)
6  133  05:30 Crapage (Never Hurry a Murray Mix by The Orb)
7  133  05:58 Crapage (The Turd Mix by The Orb)
8  130  05:24 Religion (Lovelace A Go-Go Mix by J.G. Thirlwell)

Comments: It must be a difficult task for talented artists to remix something
that is complete garbage.  This is the case with Front 242's new single, the
completely pathetic "Religion".  In this case, they got some of the best
people for the money, and in the long run, only one person came out on top.
J.G. Thirlwell's remixes completely kick, except for when Jean-Luc De Meyer's
vocals are used.  Thankfully in the best mix, "Pussy Whipped" these are kept
to a minimum.  The Deep Throat samples he uses in the "Lovelace" mix are
hilarious.  Prodigy manages to do OK in instrumentation, especially in the
"Trance U Down" mix, but fails under vocals.  Last, The Orb floats to the
occasion and does a pair of crap remixes for a crap song named "Crappage".

Summary: 3/10.  Thirlwell manages to make the gold-plating stick, but more
often than not, the smelly dung underneath pokes through.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 21:56:25 1993
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Date: Fri, 28 May 93 21:01:45 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305290401.AA10307@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: 16 hour London?jamaca KZSU




	Will start 11pm on Monday June 7th and
	run till 3 pm the following tuesday.

	Confirmed DJs
	TONY DURAN SPUN ANTON UNKNOWN

	Maybe
	JENO THOMAS LA PAIX


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Fri May 28 22:19:14 1993
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To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: LA's benefit for Malachy
Date: Fri, 28 May 93 21:29:48 -0700
From: Joachim Vance (The Underdog) <jvance@einstein.oac.uci.edu>


   Today I got told by two people that a bunch of LA promotors are
getting together to throw a benefit for SF promotor Malachy.  

(for SoCal-Ravers who don't know of Malachy, he was very instrumental
in throwing small intimite gatherings in SF like the Full Moon Raves.
He was seriously injured in a car accident a short time ago.)

   Well, I just got off the phone with someone and have a bit more info.
The event will be called "Unification of a House Nation: LA to-gather"
(or something similar.  it was suggested by Doc.) and it will be on
July 10th.   
   A lot of major promotors are helping out with this thing and have
cancelled all events for the 10th so that all energy can be focused on
this event.  Shredder is donating a sound system.  I'm sure the DJs
are donating their time.  50% of the money would go to the Malachy
fund.  The other 50% would go to an LA charity or there was apparently
talk of founding a Drug Education organization that would educate
ravers and help people with addictions and the like.  They already
have Jeno and Thomas from SF lined up (and they're trying to get
Garth), and I'm sure every major DJ from LA will spin.

   It sounds like they're trying to make this a pretty big event.  I'm
going to see if I can attend the promotor meetings to find out a bit
more.   This sounds like the perfect direction for LA to move and
shows a lot of hope for the scene here.

Joachim

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Sat May 29 01:04:02 1993
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From: Robert Jesse <rjesse@us.oracle.com>
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To: Joachim Vance (The Underdog) <jvance@einstein.oac.uci.edu>
Subject: Re: LA's benefit
Cc: socal-raves@ucsd.edu, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Reply-To: rnj%lila@us.oracle.com

>From: Joachim Vance (The Underdog) 28 May 93 21:29:48 -0700

>50% of the money would go to the Malachy
>fund.  The other 50% would go to an LA charity or there was apparently
>talk of founding a Drug Education organization that would educate
>ravers and help people with addictions and the like.

i strongly support the idea of making a drug policy or research organization  
one of the beneficiaries of raves.  MAPS - Multidisciplinary Association for  
Psychedelic Research - seems to me especially worthy of consideration.  MAPS  
wants to improve the quality and survivability of the rave scene, and has  
contributed to the dissemination of benefit enhancement and harm reduction  
information about MDMA.  i feel sure the scene would benefit in many ways  
from contributing back to MAPS.

from their quarterly newsletter:

MAPS is a non-profit, membership-based organization working to assist  
psychedelic researchers around the world design, obtain governmental  
approval, fund, conduct and report on psychedelic research in humans. [...]   
If you can even faintly imagine a cultural re-integration of the use of  
psychedelics and the states of mind they engender, please consider joining  
MAPS in supporting the expansion of scientific knowledge in this area.

	MAPS / 1801 Tippah Avenue / Charlotte, NC  28205
	704 358-9830 voice 704 358-1650 fax

individual membership is $30/year, and gets you the quarterly newsletter  
(current issue is 48 pages) of research info, social & policy news, etc.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Sat May 29 10:20:44 1993
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From: calvin@cats.ucsc.edu
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Date: Sat, 29 May 93 09:38:47 -0700
Message-Id: <9305291638.AA07521@am.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Get Wicked


      Hello.  I was wondering if it would be possible to meet some more people
from sfraves tonight at Get Wicked.  I've only met a couple of you, and I think
tonight could be a good time to put some more faces to the names on the net...
Anyways, I'll have blue hair, so I shouldn't be too hard to find.  I'm
looking forward to meeting a lot of you...

calvin@cats.ucsc.edu

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Sat May 29 15:35:46 1993
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Date: 	Sat, 29 May 1993 15:05:28 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199305292205.AA26488@well.sf.ca.us>
To: calvin@cats.ucsc.edu, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Get Wicked

I think the plan is to try and meet near the DJ setup in the Wicked
tent between 3 and 4 am.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 30 14:15:53 1993
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From: saeedi@shell.portal.com (Steven J Saeedi)
Message-Id: <9305302047.AA17212@jobe.shell.portal.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: What happened at 1st & harrison last night?

I just heard on the radio about some girl shot and killed last night
at the Unocal station in front of Sound Factory and Atlantis.  Does
anyone know of any details?  The radio report mentioned she was on 
her way to Club Circle.

Last week this time I reported of the truly incredible experience had
at wicked, and now am saddened to hear about last night/this morning's
event at the same location.  Hmmm.  Folx, live life, 'cause you don't 
know when you're on your way out.

- Steve


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 30 14:55:30 1993
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Date: Sun, 30 May 93 14:05:57 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305302105.AA13624@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: URSS status


	We are progressing with the design of the Ultimate(tm) Renegade
	Sound System.  So far we think the system will cost around $3 - $4K
	not including amps, or turntables/mixers.  (does include, drivers,
	cabinets, active crossovers connectors, amp rack.  I would like
	people on the list to have an oppertunity to help us allong,
	we need a small amount of cash to do build prototypes, the total
	needed is $300, I'm willing to put in $200 of my own.  I'm asking
	for SMALL donations of around $5 - $10, no more than that, we will
	figure out something juicy that you get for your contribution,
	make suggestions.  Your money will go to building prototype
	enclosures so that we can have a portable system optimized
	for HOUSE music. As more autonomous, renegade sound systems become
	operational, it is your bet gurantee of having quality, low cost
	or free OUTSIDE parties, and events!

	Please see me if you want to donate or send your contribution
	to:
	    Geoff White
	   316 Escuela Ave. #62
	   Mt. View california, 94040
	   Att: URSS

	I will post a total of amounts received and what was done with the
	money in the next status message.  If you want to remain
	anonymous please say so.

			- G

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEXUS SYSTEMS/CYBERTRIBE-5 : Voice:(415)965-2384   Fax: (415)327-6416
Editor/Instigator/Catalyst : Geoff White <geoffw@nexsys.net>
Production Crew		   : Universal Movement Trinity <umt@nexsys.net>

        "They might stop the party, but they can't stop the future"

		--PGP Public key available upon request--
Paranoia - Your state of mind when you finally realize what's really going on.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 30 19:36:09 1993
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Date: Sun, 30 May 1993 18:51:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Magnalena Kita <magskita@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu>
Subject: vacations
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305301826.A16368-8100000@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII


well i was raving last night in brooklyn when i met sfr (wearing a
homemade tag) derek from ucb...he was way cool...(:(:

keep sending them out here...(:(:(:

partyon...susie (:

p.s. what is the deal with universe...does it look like fun...?



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Sun May 30 19:59:36 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9305310150.AA13821@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: SPL meter



	Can anyone loan me an SPL meter to take to the FMR this thursday?

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 31 01:01:20 1993
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Date:    Mon, 31 May 93 00:20 PDT
To: SFRAVES@techno.Stanford.EDU, SOCAL-RAVES@ucsd.edu,
        Tamara Palmer                     <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
From: Tamara Palmer                        <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
Subject: test - ignore and delete

Please ignore this...this is only a test. It is a test of the Emergency
Broadcast System and it is only a test. Had this been an actual emergency
the broadcasters in your area would have official news...

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 31 09:06:27 1993
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Date: Mon, 31 May 1993 11:15:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: cmkoski@thunder.berkeley.edu
Subject: How do I get on to your bbs?
To: Raves Bulletin Board <sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9305311117.A17270-9100000@thunder>
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Hello,

	I am a student in Lakehead University in Thunder Bay, Ontario
Canada and I would like to know (after reading Mondo 2000) how to get onto
your bbs?  Please send me mail, because I am interested in finding out more...

Thanks.

			cmkoski@thunder.lakeheadu.ca

			Cory Koski a.k.a. Rockman



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 31 11:24:25 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9305311732.AA27445@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: How do I get on to your bbs?
To: cmkoski@thunder.lakeheadu.edu
Date: Mon, 31 May 1993 13:32:22 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.05.9305311117.A17270-9100000@thunder> from "cmkoski@thunder.berkeley.edu" at May 31, 93 11:15:17 am
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Beyond the ultraworld of cmkoski@thunder.berkeley.edu:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> 	I am a student in Lakehead University in Thunder Bay, Ontario
> Canada

That's far to go to raves in SF! ( hmmm... i'm even farther... :P )

> and I would like to know (after reading Mondo 2000) how to get onto
> your bbs?

Cory, all well behaved email lists work with a request address and a reflector
address. The convention is to add -request to the handle.

Ex:  sfraves@sfraves.stanford.edu for the reflector (your msg was sent to all)
     sfraves-request@sfraves.stanford.edu for the request addy. When you email
     to a request address, you must put in the subject line: subscribe

Brian, i was going to email sirius with a list of all rave reflectors and the
*proper* way to use a reflector (including the conventions) but i dont know if
it's a good idea. Maybe just tell him the conventions but not the addresses?
I was also going to send it to wired and boardwatch. Should I?
[Brian Behlendorf - Vitamin B is the list maintainer, cory]

> Please send me mail, because I am interested in finding out more...

SFraves covers the bay area raves (that's the San Francisco bay). This is a
pretty good list, but if you want to go to raves and not just read about them,
i would also suggest to join:

Raving Up North (digest on the Montreal and surrounding cities like Ottawa/Hull,
                 Quebec, Burlington, Plattsburg etc... on the local rave scene.
                 Drop me a note if you want to subscribe as this is not a
                 reflector, so there is no request addy)
ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu (reflector for the north east rave scene. dont forget
                         the -request when subscribing)

There is also a rave list for the midwest, the northwest, south california,
southeast, florida, and washington D.C. The first was sfraves (almost 2 years?)
then ne-raves 1 year ago, then Raving Up North etc... just so you know who
started it all (this list).

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Mon May 31 18:43:40 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Mon, 31 May 1993 17:56:22 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion), cmkoski@thunder.lakeheadu.edu
Subject: Re: How do I get on to your bbs?
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

Francois - thanks for the reply to Cory's post.  About 6 months ago I mailed
stjude@well about changing the address in any future publications of the 
User's Guide, and she said they probably wouldn't have another pressing so
there wasn't any need to change it :|. 

        Brian

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 01:58:42 1993
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From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199306010815.AA24710@well.sf.ca.us>
To: dhchung@us.oracle.com, mkim@reed.edu
Subject: Re: Seattle/Portland update (Seattle Scene is DEAD!)
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

Good to see another NW update.  As you may know, there IS a nw-raves
list now . . .

I've just returned from another incredible SFrave trip which I'll write
about elsewhere.  But I'm hoping for better things from the Northwest
this summer.  In recent months I've been to one excellent event at
La Luna in Portland, a semi-OK UHF one at the old Euphoria (featuring
a killer set by Markie), turned away from another UHF one, and a
couple of small things at Park Ave and one truly underground party
at 8th and Everett in a really cool space that just didn't attract
many people.  Haven't seen anything in Seattle yet, though I hope to.
But I have hopes for Portland and will try to make some local connections
soon.  

The news from SF is -- let the commercial crowd do what they want, it
is time to go tribal and spread it around.  Come/Unity and FMR have
shown the way -- with no more effort and a lot less hassle than the
pure-profit approach, the stealth rave is the way to go, in small
rooms, clubs or outdoors.  Surely Portland, Seattle and other Northwest
areas can be more than mildly receptive to this approach!

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 02:00:14 1993
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Date: Mon, 31 May 1993 22:45:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Arias Hung <mkim@reed.edu>
Subject: Re: From the Seattle posse- A Rave Called Sharon:Prophecy
To: "Glenn Fajardo,USA" <glenn.fajardo@aldus.com>
Cc: MykL G <mcg@netcom.com>, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199305171642.AA05084@igate.aldus.com>
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On 13 May 1993, Glenn Fajardo,USA wrote:

> 
> Everyone up here in Seattle is hoping that we get a bigger influx of promoters
> from the Bay Area.  The one big promoter up here doesn't really have a clue as
> to what vibe is about and tends to be hardcore LA style in the way he does his
> parties.
> 
> Tigger

I'm not sure I agree with you at all.  I didn't go to the Sharon rave you
went to , but I went to the previous one in the Omni in March and thought
it was WEAK!  That one big promoter you're talking about (aka Chris, Mr.X,
see my previous post on the Seattle/Portland scene) seems to be the only
one left throwing good parties.  Sure, and you can tell from his style
that he is a harcore LA man (no games, rides, sponsers...past parties have
come with dancers and cages), but at the same time he seems to be the one
that attracts the best crowds. 

-Arias 


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Date: Mon, 31 May 1993 21:33:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Arias Hung <mkim@reed.edu>
Subject: Re: Seattle/Portland update (Seattle Scene is DEAD!)
To: Derek Chung <dhchung@us.oracle.com>
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9305260230.AA00288@slamdance.us.oracle.com>
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On Tue, 25 May 1993, Derek Chung wrote:

> 
> Hi all!
> 
> I went to Seattle this weekend, and although I didn't get
> a chance to go out (I was with my father), I managed to
> figure out where I could have gone, had I been able to.
> I suppose any of you SFR-people from Seattle would be
> more enlightened, but here's a tourist's perspective.
> 

As a native of the Seattle scene, I'd just like to verify and update this
information.  The scene here is pretty pathetic right now.  The topper
came just last Saturday when just about all the main promoters (Chris
Rosemonde (Mr. X) Dee-lyte (Tom) , The Clockwork people, Foundation 451,
Cat in the Hat prod, just about the only one's not involved were Mark and
Rich (Mark was previously Prophets of Psyche-AudioVisions)) got together to
do the Eclipse rave on memorial day weekend and only about 500 people
showed up.  What a change from a year ago's fourth of July rave nation rave
at Union station in which about 2200 showed, or even Halloween's Union
Station rave that attracted 2500.  This fourth, we'll be lucky to bring in
1000.  
	The situation between the cops and promoters has caused a lot of
problems that have defintely detracted from the scene.  The Seattle PD
has spread the malicious word around to space owners not to rent out to
promoters due to drugs and violence.  Promoters are constantly being
harassed during their parties to provide permit after permit.  Chris is
no longer allowed to have dancers at his parties since (in the cops
words) they see BUTTOCKS!  VIP rooms are also no longer allowed since the
cops must be able to see the full party upon entry.  Some promoters are
being forced to find spaces outside the city limits because of their bad
publicity.  Raves are strictly monitored by uniformed and UC police.  Not
the kindof environment to have lots of fun at.  When interviewed and
asked by The Rocket why there was such a control freak emphasis upon the
scene, the PD responded by likening the amount of people at raves with
those at concerts and cited some rowdy incidences at some recent Mudhoney
concerts.  Gimme a fuckin' break!  
	Anyway, it seems like the scene is just about dead.  Another reason
for the downfall seems to be due to the insurgence of yuppiedom.  Some
promoters, in hopes to make more money, began advertising heavily along
UW's frat row.  With this, went most of the UG which makes for worse
parties and atmospheres.  
	The club scene isn't too hot anymore either.  For anyone coming
here, Flowers on Wednesday's nights is still a good fun crowd and
atmosphere.  The Vogue on Saturday's can be good.  Fetish nights for the
hardcore are Sunday's at the Vogue, however if you show up, make sure you
look like you belong.  The Doormen have been cracking down as of late
because too many spectators have been coming to gawk at everyone.

	As for Portland, the main promoters there seem to be Blonde Indian
Productions (Minage and Brian) and UFO productions (Mark Meyers).  The
crowds there do seem to be a bit better.  The cops are extraordinarily
relaxed compared to the Seattle scene.  The average draw is around 500
people, not really a UG there though.  

If anyone wants any more info on the Seattle/Portland scene and/or
upcoming events please E-mail me.  If there are enough requests I would be
happy to post the weekly events and/or start up a NW raves
mailing list.  Funny how it's the only part of the country left that is
NOT represented.

BTW:  For you out of towners, I will be throwing a private invite-only
rave at my school...Reed College, Portland...with full bar and all the fun
extra's in July (tentative date, 24th) so if any of you will be in the
area, feel free to drop me a note.

-Arias  





From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 02:00:25 1993
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Date:    Mon, 31 May 93 22:28 PDT
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
From: Tamara Palmer                        <IZZYPK3@mvs.oac.ucla.edu>
Subject: Twitch Deception!

Beware of deceiving record store clerks!
After being cooped up for weeks due to
illness, I finally got some fresh air today
and hit the only record store open on Melrose
Avenue here in LA on Memorial Day, the very
inferior Beat Non Stop. After perusing the
meagre CD selection and finding a copy of
Twitch CD3, I asked the seemingly honest clerk
if he had a copy of the new Twitch release.
"This one, " (indicating CD3) "is their latest
release". Yeah right. And monkeys might fly
outta my butt.
--Tamara
       (bounding back to the Bay Area for
        the summer in two weeks!!!!!!!!!)

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 02:00:50 1993
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Date: Mon, 31 May 93 21:43:28 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9306010443.AA14822@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: FMR


> From techno.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org Mon May 31 20:11:54 1993
> Return-Path: <techno.Stanford.EDU!SFRaves-request@cdp.igc.org>
> From: gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu
> Date: Mon, 31 May 93 18:47:39 -0700
> To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
> Subject: FMR
> Content-Length: 233
> X-Lines: 7
> Status: RO
> 
> 	I have seen that the Full Moon will be on Friday, so I assumed
> the FMR would be on Friday as well.  But I have seen a couple people say 
> it will be on Thursday night...
> 	So does anybody out there know for sure?
> Thanks,
> Later,
> Gioni
> 

The Full Moon will occur on Friday June 4 at 1302 h Universal (GMT) time.
The Full Moon happens at the same instant all around the world, it does not
travel through the time zones. So PDT is 9 time zones (9 hours west of
Greenwich, England - 1 hr. for Daylight savings time =m 8 EARLIER, which makes
the exact Full Moon at 502 am Friday Morning, the FMR is always on the night
of the rising energy unless the Full Moon occurs on or before the evening of
the current day. In other words even though the full moon takes place on friday,
it happens friday MORNING, the rising energy is the night before!

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 02:00:55 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
Message-Id: <9306010525.AA09108@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Candies!
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1993 01:25:31 -0400 (EDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Content-Length: 1412      

Hey, you tought candies were not dangerous, well guess again:

[Taken from the FDA archives]
PRODUCT         Artificially flavored Strawberry Magic Fizz Popping Candy.
                Recall #F-344-3.
CODE            Uncoded.

MANUFACTURER    Coca-Cola Foods, a division of the Coca-Cola Company,
                Houston, Texas.
RECALLED BY     Manufacturer, by Fax April 7, 1993.  Firm-initiated recall
                ongoing.

DISTRIBUTION    Nationwide.
QUANTITY        1,300,000 packages were distributed.
REASON          Product is contaminated with metal fragments.

You wouldn't want to give that to ravers :). I wonder how much stuff like that
we never hear of... At least in this case it was Coca-cola who recalled it...

Were wondering what i was searching on the FDA archives? It seems like there is
a new law in the US regarding the nootropics. The private importation for test
purpose has been revised, but i cant find the info... I'm doing a thing on the
nootropics imported in the states then canada and want to know if it's all ok.

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 02:01:11 1993
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From: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu (Brian Behlendorf)
Date: Mon, 31 May 1993 19:20:39 -0700
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.3 5/22/91)
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Subject: Full Moon Parties, Renegade arties, and Site Finding

       Hi guys, it's Brian, posting from Laura's terminal in New Jersey.
Why am I spending my vacation time making a post to everyone?  Because the
Full Moon Party in SF is this Thursday night, and the one in Boston is
supposed to be Friday night.  Both parties, though, are currently without
a set site for their location.  

        The reason I'm posting is because I want to see both parties HAPPEN,
particulary the one out here because many people are travelling a long way
in anticipation of this.  I'm not as worried bout SF, because there are always
a few safe fallback spaces available. 

        So I'm going to present here the guidelines that I've been following
in deciding if sites mke a particularly good site for an outdoor unpermitted
party. Why am I telling you this?  Becausethis should motivate you to go out
and look for sites around where you live, maybe spark a memory of a location
you hung out at in high school, etc.  

	Now, if you're in SF, and you find a location which matches the
guidelines set below, send mail to geoffw@nexsys.net, as he's gonna be the
coordinator for the FMR there.  If you find a location within an hour of
Boston, send mail to Shannon (sscoen@gnu.ai.mit.edu) as he seems to be pretty
close to the Full Moon people (they say they can't find a location due to
"being really busy with Yellow", their for-profit party the next night).
If you don't live around these (or even if you do), look at this as a guide
to finding renegade sites.  This summer is set to be the summer of renegade
parties ALL OVER North America, and see this if you will as a primer, a guide
to finding a good location.

	The info presented here is the result of 10 months of location-
hunting, for both SFRaves events and the Full Moon parties in SF, and for
the most part the locations have worked fantastically -the FMR last month
in Palo Alto had 285 cars ~= 800-1000 people, and the cops didn't show up 
until 9am, and even then said to just be gone by 11am.  But more on that later.



THE DANCE SPACE - anticipate how many people you are gonna have, nd make sure
there's enough room where you're setting u the speakers and such for these
people - also make sure there's room for people to rest and relax without
harming the environment or others.  Grass is the best surface, as it bounces
back and doesn't make you tired as quickly as sand does.  Sand, especially
rocky sand, is hard to dance in, but if you find a space where it's hard,
and try and clear away any large rocks from the center, you should be okay.
Aim to provide a surface on which people can dance barefoot.  Try and avoid
dancing on concrete whenever possible, but also avoid having the dancefloor
be a bed of plants, because 10 hours of pounding Doc Martens are gonna kill
anything but the hardiest grass.  For this reason, avoid using the same
grassy space more than onces every two months or so, to give the grass a 
chance to grow back.  Also, dry grass can be VERY dangerous, particularly
for people who smoke and unconciously drop cigarrette ashes on the ground.

THE SOUND SYSTEM - Geoff White is coming up with some specs on what outdoor
sound systems should sound like, but in general terms, two speaker stacks
and about 1.5kw of amp power should be enough for any gathering of less than
1000 people.  Aim the system towards the waterif you're on a beach, or in
general away from civilization as best as possible.  Remember that cold air
can carry sound well, and so can water surfaces and canyons.  As for the 
generator, take your total wattage needed and multiply by two - most renegades
get 5kw generators which cost maybe $50 per night to rent - make sure you get
enough gasolin.  If the location is far away from civilization, you may want
to consider bringing extra needles (we found this out the hard way at C2) and
other small but vital parts, maybe so much as extra turntables or mixer.

ACCESS TO THE SITE - You want to have your system somewhat removed from the
road, as you want to be INVISIBLE to the casual driver passing by if possible.
But, you also don't want to make the sound crew carry their heavy equipment
a mile and a half, so try and find a reasonable spot.  The flip side, of
course, is that the farther away from the road, the less likely cops are going
to confiscate equipment (more on that later).  

PARKING - This is usually the weakest link in any site.  There are HUNDREDS of
gorgeous sites around the Bay Area, I kid you not, which are hampered by the
fact that they couldn't support more than maybe 5 cars :)  Anyways, you want to
get the cars as far off the main road as possible, parking them down a side
street, or in a big parking lot.  Parking attendents are mandatory if you 
expect more than say 30 cars.  If you have to park on the side of the road, try
your best to obey traffic laws, park outside the lines, and make sure there 
is enough room for emergency vehicles to access the dance floor if the need
ever arose.  You want to be as invisible as possible.  Also, have the parking
attendents hand out flyers to arriving cars saying, "Welcome to *blah*.  Please
leave your alcohol in the car.  Please be careful and aware of your environment
and each other.  Thank you, and a donation of $*blah* would be appreciated."

LEGALITIES - The ideal site is unincorporated land, or Bureau of Land
Management land, or simply property which has a history of being used by
the public at large for parties (high school hangouts in the woods are
good sources believe it or not).  Failing this, city parks, then county,
then on up the list - the higher the authorities whose toes you step on,
the more likely they are to be mean.  When they show up, as you should fully
expect them to, there is only one option - be completely upfront, honest,
call a spade a spade and say it's simply a group of kids who want to get
together and dance under the stars, and you didn't want to do it in a place
where you'd be bothering anyone.  Pledge to clean up after yourselves and
DO LEAVE your name and address.  In every case I've dealt with, being upfront
with the cops shows them you're not trying to be sneaky, and they will 
appreciate that.  If they give you a line about drug use, tell them they can
go around and confiscate any drug use they see: for the most part this'll
prolly mean dumping out people's beers, but people shouldn't be bringing beer
to an outdoor party anyways.  Anyways, do your best to work WITH the cops - 
don't see this as an US vs. THEM situation, because that'll land you in
trouble faster than you can say "lawyer".  If the cops insist on not letting
the party continue, then politley comply, tear down the system, and move the
party either by having pre-printed directions to the next site or a phone #
to call for further directions.  

DRUGS - as noted above, avoiding the obvios drugs is a definite plus. The
worst offender is alcohol, as not only will it piss the cops off, it's also
likely to harm the vibe and create potential "flash points" of violence.  
Nitrous is alo far too obvious, and it should be discouraged, particularly
if someone tries to sell it.

THE MORNING - as the sun is rising, you should anticipate stopping it if the
location is used by the public during the day.  You should also DEFINITELY,
DEFINITELY clean up after yourselves - bring trash bags and LEAVE THE PLACE
CLEANER THAN YOU FOUND IT.  Make sure others are in a state to drive home,
especially if "home" is more than 20 minutes drive away.  Carry Epheadra or
Vivarin orcoffee if you can to help people make it home.

Other assorted info: if the area is sensetive ecologically, try and maintain
a vigil around the sensetive areas to prevent too much damage;  keep in mind
in every gatheing there are Stupid peope who do Stupid Things, so be prepared
to educate them as to what's really going on... try and maintain a database,
if just in your head, of which cops are usually meaner than hich others; and
if you have a relative or friend or other sympathetic ear in the police force,
perhaps letting them know ahead of time, or gettingtacit permission, would be
 a very GOOD thing.

Okay, my machine's about to shut down, so I better go for now.  If I think of
more I'll post.  But print this out and keep it around all summer and beyond.
And I hope we can get it together this week.  Good luck all :)

	Brian

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From: gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu
Date: Mon, 31 May 93 18:47:39 -0700
Message-Id: <9306010147.AA07857@hamlet.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: FMR

	I have seen that the Full Moon will be on Friday, so I assumed
the FMR would be on Friday as well.  But I have seen a couple people say 
it will be on Thursday night...
	So does anybody out there know for sure?
Thanks,
Later,
Gioni

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 02:35:25 1993
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Date: 	Tue, 1 Jun 1993 01:08:15 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199306010808.AA23776@well.sf.ca.us>
To: bbehlen@soda.berkeley.edu, ne-raves@gnu.ai.mit.edu,
        sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re:  Full Moon Parties, Renegade arties, and Site Finding

Good for you, bri.  If someone can hold a rave in the woods by Queens
Blvd., then no reasonably isolated place in the world is off-limits
to the good vibrations!
,

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 02:53:05 1993
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Date: Mon, 31 May 93 21:13:14 PDT
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To: SFRaves@soda.berkeley.edu
From: gmosheh@nyx.cs.du.edu (Gregor Mosheh)
X-Sender: gmosheh@nyx.cs.du.edu (Unverified)
Subject: FMR

Geez, any info at all on the Full Moon Rave at SF?
Dates, times, etc? I missed the last one and I don't wanna miss this one.
                                                gmosheh@nyx.cs.du.edu.

He can be also reached in real life:
                                                623 Radcliffe Drive
                                                Davis, CA 95616-1011
                                                (916) 758-5589

"No, officer. I don't know why that grape juice stayed there so long. I
thought it tasted kinda fermented. Dunno where that brewer's yeast came
from..."


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 06:22:40 1993
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From: Oozing Sincerity...  01-Jun-1993 1341 <gary@ayrmis.enet.dec.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Apparently-To: sfraves@techno.stanford.edu
Subject: A would-be member.


	I'd like to subscribe to the list, my apologies if this turns
	out to be one of those 'subscribe me' mails that everyone ends
	up getting, but I'm sure your a tolerant bunch.

	Gary, Ayr, Scotland

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 07:11:09 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 14:21:40 BST
Message-Id: <1154.9306011321@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: M.B.Mcneill1@lut.ac.uk
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Marc McNeill's message of Thu, 27 May 93 16:16:13 BST <9305271516.AA25327@hpb.lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)


  Marc>  
  Marc>  This is terrible. I can't belive a country could have such stupid laws.
  Marc>  Can you imagine being 15-20 years old and not being alowed out, by law,
  Marc>  to anywhere past 0230 hrs. F*ck that. They'd be a f*cking riot here.

  Marc>  Its a deinal of peoples rights. I thought the American law you can't drink
  Marc>  till your 21 was a bit steep, but denying peoples freedom at whatever age
  Marc>  is disgusting. What right does the state have to impose these laws on
  Marc>  these people?
  Marc>  
  Marc>  I'm sorry but that is wrong. Full support to this bloke who's challenging
  Marc>  the state.
  Marc>  
  Marc> <marc>


Yeah, I was going to reply to this thread asking what the hell was
going on...  

You're not *really* trying to tell me that it's illegal for people
under the age of 21 to go out at night.... ARE YOU ?  God, what kind
of a police state are you living in...?

I had enough difficulty comprehending the idea of a minor curfew when
someone on the net tried to explain it to me a while back.  But are
you really saying that this kind of thing is used against people over
18 too...?  Or is this just something to do with permits for clubs to
open late... (god, we have enough of that kind of stupidity here....)

I'm continually amazed by the opressive powers that the state seems to
have in the US...  I have this theory that the reason you Americans
take civil rights issues so seriously is because you have (virtually)
no rights...

Mind you, I'm also continually surprized by the way our government
manages to chip away at our rights without any objections from the
populace...  the powers that came about during the minors strike to
prevent people assembling, and to set up exclusion zones... the new
crack down on travellers....

Well, I guess I'm rambling here.... why can't we live in a world
governed by sane people...

	Cosmic Roy



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 07:43:10 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 14:57:52 BST
Message-Id: <1674.9306011357@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca
Cc: drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Francois Dion's message of Fri, 28 May 1993 03:34:21 -0400 (EDT) <9305280734.AA22199@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA>
Subject: Re: SONG ID?!?!


> 
> I was at a rave in S.F. awhile ago and I heard this song with the sample--
> "We are family...I got all my sisters and me..."--- It's probably an old
> track but no one around here knows who it's by.

  Francois> How old you want? 70s disco? 80s bubblegum remake? 90s dance?

  Francois> It's probably "We are family/we all into love" by Unit3
  Francois> UK. Some ragga on it.  I think it was out in 91, maybe 92.
  Francois> Popular in big dance clubs...  The 80s remake, i dont
  Francois> remember who made it, and the original song is: "we are
  Francois> family" - (shit, a blank...hmmmm....) was it sister
  Francois> sledge? geez... i wuz about 7 years old, so dont lapidate
  Francois> me if i'm wrong on this one... It was around 1977 i would
  Francois> say...(good luck finding it)

Yeah, it was Sister Sledge.  Wasn't a remixed version rereleased quite
recently...?

	Cosmic Roy

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 10:48:26 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 09:54:54 PDT
From: Jon Drukman <jdrukman@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Tamara Palmer's message of Mon, 31 May 93 22:28 PDT <9306010528.AA25160@techno.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Twitch Deception!
Reply-To: spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com

Tamara Palmer sez:

>Beware of deceiving record store clerks!
[...]
>if he had a copy of the new Twitch release.
>"This one, " (indicating CD3) "is their latest
>release". Yeah right. And monkeys might fly
>outta my butt.

probably not intentional deception, just plain ignorance.  of course,
the latest CD is #7 and the latest vinyl is #11.  get 'em all.  many
times.

Jon Drukman         spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com        jdrukman@us.oracle.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Always note the sequencer - this will never let us down.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 11:31:40 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 13:44:16 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9306011744.AA24791@pilot.njin.net>
To: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Cc: M.B.Mcneill1@lut.ac.uk, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <1154.9306011321@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
References: <1154.9306011321@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
	<9305271516.AA25327@hpb.lut.ac.uk>

Roy Badami writes:
 > You're not *really* trying to tell me that it's illegal for people
 > under the age of 21 to go out at night.... ARE YOU ?  God, what kind
 > of a police state are you living in...?
 > 
 > I had enough difficulty comprehending the idea of a minor curfew when
 > someone on the net tried to explain it to me a while back.  But are
 > you really saying that this kind of thing is used against people over
 > 18 too...?  Or is this just something to do with permits for clubs to
 > open late... (god, we have enough of that kind of stupidity here....)

Rather than teaching our children to deal with life's challenges, we
Americans try to protect them. Regardless of maturity level, we don't
let people drink until they're 21. We protect them from nudity and sex
because they may be SCARRED(tm) for life. Rather than teaching them
how to deal with things, we teach them that these things are Evil, and
that associating with them should bring great guilt. We take away
everything for them to do, and then are indignant when they spend time
"cruising" in their cars.

The Japanese said it right. Americans are basically lazy. They want to
do it the easy way. They're taught that they want kids, so they make
them. Then they don't want to spend time with them to find out who
they are, and how to help them be ready to make decisions. These kids
grow up and the cycle continues.

I'll start calling our society advanced when we start solving problems
and not symptoms.

Sean

(I return you now to your regular programming. DISCOnnected!)

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 12:05:52 1993
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Message-Id: <9306011818.AA27281@am.ucsc.edu>
To: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Candies!

        Let us know when you find out. :)
        On the subject of nootropics. I have an order form from Interlab
in England but I have been afraid to send them any money for fear of
my purchase being confiscated at the border. Has anyone ever dealt with
Interlab successfully? Did you need a doctor's prescription or any such
nonsense?
                                        -z
                                      

From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 12:39:59 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 11:33:41 -0700
From: elizabet@cadence.com (Elizabeth Medel)
Message-Id: <9306011833.AA02764@cds8616>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Southbay SFR Lunch...Anybody?
Cc: elizabet@cadence.com

This week looks promising weatherwise!

When: This Thursday, 3 June
Time: 12.00 noon
Where: Greer Park, Palo Alto

Directions:

* From 101 (South or North) take the Oregon Expressway Exit

* Left at the first signal (West Bayshore - it's a frontage road 
  that takes you south again)

* Follow this road approx. 1/4 mile (pass appartment complex on right)
  
* You will see the park on your right hand side. Park in the first
  carpark to your right.

* We'll meet on the grassy knoll

Bring lunch, music, toys, yourselves!

Hope to see you there!!

Elizabeth .

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 12:48:28 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 12:04:16 PDT
From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9306011904.AA13733@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
To: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Candies!


>         On the subject of nootropics. [...] Has anyone ever dealt with
> Interlab successfully? Did you need a doctor's prescription or any such
> nonsense?

I dealt with them over a year ago.  I remember hearing that you can no
longer get stuff from them.  Anyway, I had to provide a signed
statement  saying that what I was ordering is a one month supply for my
own personal use.  

- leg of eel

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 14:00:22 1993
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To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: nootropics? // quick review of (get down)^ 3 && wicked
Date: Tue, 01 Jun 93 13:29:29 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


previous discussions mentioned the word "nootropic" -- whazzat?

--------------------

I went to the (get down)^3 && wicked party at the sonoma county
fairgrounds in santa rosa -- i mighta blown it off cuz of the distance
involved, but the fact that I had two "comps" for this rave (courtesy
of KFJC) and didn't have to stand in a big huge line made me go. I'm
glad I did. For a "big" rave, I found it most excellent, perhaps one of
the better ones I've been to this year. 3hree different rooms to dance
in, the big beautiful outdoors to chill in, a positive vibe throughout.
Didn't see as many sfravers as I expected, but i did run into Geoff,
Zak, M and P-ter, Ethan, Ovid, and Shaun (in order of appearance).
Other than that, I saw a few familiar faces, and lots of unfamiliar
faces.

Believe it or not, I liked the music best at the small hall near the
entrance. Carlos played a tasty crowd-hyping set there around 3:30AM,
and immediately afterwards some DJ that I didn't reconize played some
music that motorvated the booty to dance dance hard n' trippy. Who was
that anyways?

Best visuals happened in the big hallway at the rear w/ the arched
ceiling. The things seen were hard to describe, so I won't try, other
than to say that they made nice use of a laser, fog, and these
"searchlights" that scanned through the expanse of the room, briefly
illuminating gossamer filaments of swirly fog.  Due to the expansive
nature of the room, the sound was a bit too reverberant when we first
arrived there around 2:00AM, but got better later in the evening
(perhaps because as it got more crowded people's bodies damped out the
reflections).

I was enjoying myself just fine in the wicked room until someone blew
chunks on my eyes-of-buddha jacket, which was otherwise minding it's
own business on the back of a chair. After spending some time in the
bathroom cleaning it off (which seemed like an awesome feat at the time
given the way the bathroom fixtures were breathing), I decided to try
to forget about it by not returning to the wicked room... 

There was supposed to be an after party under the metal bridge in
Guerneville, but, come morning, I was too tired and decided to use the
last of my remaining energy to drive back to SF.... Did anyone go to
the afterparty?

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 14:22:57 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1993 13:18:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gioni Pasquinelli <gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu>
Sender: Gioni Pasquinelli <gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu>
Reply-To: Gioni Pasquinelli <gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Nootropics
To: The Ravin' Peoples <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <Pine.3.05.9306011321.A4069-b100000@hamlet.ucdavis.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII


	Welp there are many articles and a couple FAQs on this subject
matter, mostly at either stein.u.washington.edu or at fenris.claremont.edu
under pub/drugs or alt.drugs or something like that, I do have a lot of
these but not handy so it you don't have ftp access I might possibly be
able to send it to you or something but this won't be easy so try a
different way please.
	From what I have read the FDA currently allows anyone to buy "1
months supply for your own personal use" of whatever from any foreign
company.  Though this might take many months to finally arrive at your
doorstep and you might be subjected to research and lited on their files
or whatever. 
	I know people who have placed orders, sent the money and never
received their supplies because the FDA is holding the order.  
	So basically do it at your own risk for you might get screwed.  I
have never ordered anything from Interlab or anybody else so this is all
2nd-hand knowledge.
	
Hope that is of help,

Later

Gioni Pasquinelli
gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu      What doesn't kill you makes you stronger





From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 15:00:40 1993
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To: dhchung@us.oracle.com, SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Tue,  1 Jun 93 13:36:27 PDT
Subject: Re: Seattle/Portland update (Seattle Scene is DEAD!)
Cc: nw-raves@wimsey.bc.ca, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU


Polyphemus, o staring CRT tells me that on 3/31, Arias Hung wrote:

>>If there are enough requests I would be
>>happy to post the weekly events and/or start up a NW raves
>>mailing list.  Funny how it's the only part of the country left that is
>>NOT represented.

Um, there IS a mailing list already, and it is

	nw-raves@wimsey.bc.ca
		which is the general, higher traffic list, or

	nw-raves-request@wimsey.bc.ca
		for sub and unsub requests.

>>"The scene here is pretty pathetic right now. The topper came just last
>>Saturday when just about all the main promoters...got together to do the
>>Eclipse rave on memorial day weekend and only about 500 people
>>showed up."

Sounds like you didn't have such a good time; too bad, because I 
thought Eclipse was actually one of the better parties to be thrown in 
quite some while:

NOT 	overcrowded
	overfogged
	overstuffed with Shirtless Male Hunter-Gatherers
	overwhelmingly saturated with hairspray and _faaaaashion_
	overloud--good clean sound, I mean imagine _that_...
	overblown into this huge attitude feeding-frenzy

Merely o'erbrimming with two rooms of _killah_ free-your-spine 
grooving, an amazingly friendly crowd, fairly sharp eye-candy, enough 
room for everyone to really get out of their heads and NJOI, no hassles 
by the police, even friendly and courteous door/bouncer staff.  And 
everyone there seemed to be having a great time; high smile-wattage.  
For example, while I was admiring this woman's flawless styley 
bone-crunching grooving, I saw someone walk up to her, exchange a 
couple of words, and for her to start showing him what her steps were.  
I mean, how often do you see that?!?  Seems to me to be more of a 
return to what good raving fun used to be than a departure from it.

As another Seattle raver, I'd like to offer a slightly different 
clarification; true, there has become a rave "scene" as opposed to a 
rave community, somewhat aided by the "L.A. style" of the majority of 
the parties here (which IMHO produces nothing but high-profile 
exhibitionism and separation as opposed to creating a friendly 
atmosphere) but that's to be expected when profit motive overtakes the 
original purpose of sheer, unadulterated fun I suppose.   So now it 
takes a little more effort to push through the gloss and get down to 
the free-fusing core, which can usually be found somewhere near the 
front or beside the bins.  There are a small group of regulars that 
show and show and show and set off sparks.  As far as the cops and the 
bureaucracy goes, that's how the right-wing membrane recoils; if raves 
have to go further underground, I'm all up for it!


>>Anyway, it seems like the scene is just about dead.

Well, if Eclipse is an example of scene, post-mortem, then

			SCENE

			   RIP

		         ...good riddance...

Make way for something a lot better this summer!!

	<0>  Dread-Eye	"There's only one way out...and that's _up_"


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 15:20:48 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 14:09:39 PDT
From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9306012109.AA15677@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: sfraves@nexsys.net
Subject: SAVE AMEBA



	Ameba Clothes on Haight is in desperate need of some
	limited partner investors.  This is not an advertisement
	but just thought you all might not want to see a center
	of rave activity go away.  Mark needs $5,000. to keep it open
	if you can help him in any way, call

	415.750.9368 TODAY! (tomorrow might be too late)

			-G

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 15:24:58 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 14:26:27 PDT
From: rpcaras@srv.pacbell.com (Bob Carasik)
Message-Id: <9306012126.AA00701@zeus.srv.PacBell.COM>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU, gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu
Subject: Re: Nootropics

Yep, I don't think Euro-mailorder of nootropics has worked since
early '92 or thereabouts.  Customs &/or the FDA decided that simple
mail ordering didn't fit their concept of "it's OK is a doctor told you
that you gotta get this rare foreign treatment or you'll die.  Refer to
the alt.psychoactives group for info nootropics, nutrition, brain machines,
and other cool stuff. Botton line on Interlab: Save your $$, drink samrt drinks, and stand real close to the bass cabinet.

AstroBoy

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 15:28:41 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 13:59:16 PDT
From: Jon Drukman <jdrukman@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: my weekend
Reply-To: spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com

i apologize to anyone who went to SPLASH this weekend and wanted to
take a swim in the pool.  it wasn't opened because the Oasis staff has
yet to install a ladder, or something equally stupid.  casey sez next
week for sure!  (but then again he also said last week for sure, so
take it with as much NaCl as you need.)

-----

so, i was invited to DJ at a party called MASS which was happening
down in Fresno.  ordinarily, nothing could persuade me to drive that
far but it was being put on by two friends of mine and i managed to
con a ride in a much comfier car than my own.

the space was some abandoned office space (or something).  the
promoters invited the fire marshal to come inspect the space ahead of
time in order to avoid hassle at 3 AM.  this made things tidy and
legal but it meant that a lot of the planned spaces had to be
abandoned when the marshal said that (for instance) the basement was
off limits, no more than 3 people on the upper level at a time, etc
etc.  it did have one positive effect - as the turnout was pretty
small (just a few hundred people), it concentrated the partiers in one
space and made for some nice bonding opportunities.  and it wasn't
crowded or anything, so that was cool.

we got there while they were setting up and i was instantly whisked
away to Cal State Fresno where the weekend techno radio show demanded
a party DJ in exchange for promotion, so i got to practice my set live
on the air.  pretty cool.  immediately after finishing, i was zipped
back to the party where i tried out my hiphop/funk/nasty house set on
the unsuspecting crowd.  i managed to immediately alienate a few
people, so i knew i was doing something right.  fortunately, most of
the people i met said that they really liked the change of pace.

anyway, the party really went off nicely.  i had a great time, met
lots of new people, and left with that happy feeling that you get
after a truly great rave.  it also led me to a few observations about
the scene...

1) Ecstasy is an important catalyst.

I understand that we don't want to play up the scene as being one
continuous drug-fueled orgy, but having seen ecstasy use drop off in
SF and a corresponding increase in attitude & cliqueishness, I have to
say that the two are inescapably linked.  Obviously you don't *need*
to have everyone zonked on E to have That Vibe, but it certainly
helps.  Maybe we're all just too uptight to create a communal feeling
without having our inhibitions chemically dissolved.  Think about it:
how many people have just walked up to you and struck up a
conversation lately?  How many of them were on E?

2) SF no longer has a "rave" scene.

Maybe I'm an old fuddy-duddy purist, but to me there is a concrete
quantitative difference between "big party with visuals and techno
music and chill spaces and smart bars" and "rave".  For the latter,
there is always some kind of "vibe" - a feeling that is indescribable
but quite perceptible.  You know you've been to a rave when you leave
the party with a warm mushy happy feeling.  When you think back to it,
you get another warm little thrill.  When I started out on this whole
scene a year ago March, I felt this way quite often after leaving
events.  Now, I'm lucky if I leave with only a headache.  Experiencing
the energy and unbridled enthusiasm of the Fresno kids reminded me of
why I waited in incredible lines to pay $20 to get in all that time
ago.

I'm sure I'm going to draw a million flames for both of these
observations, but I stand by them.  My traveling companion absolutely
agreed with me on both points, btw, and she's been to even more
parties than I have...

Jon Drukman         spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com        jdrukman@us.oracle.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Always note the sequencer - this will never let us down.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 15:43:36 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 14:01:04 PDT
From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9306012101.AA24762@cassy.lurnix.com>
To: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU,
        uunet!cats.ucsc.edu!zephirus@uunet.uu.net
Subject: Re: Candies!

I ordered from them once with no problems but since that order they sent me
some literature describing new laws and procedures and I can't remember what
it said.  Hmmm - maybe I do need to order more vasopresin. |-)

-Mark

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 15:46:18 1993
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From: gregrich@microsoft.com
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To: glenn.fajardo@aldus.com, SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Tue,  1 Jun 93 14:22:01 PDT
Subject: Re: From the Seattle posse- A Rave Called Sharon:Prophecy
Cc: mcg@netcom.com, nw-raves@wimsey.bc.ca, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU


The CRysTall ball says again that Arias Hung, 3/31, enscribed

"That one big promoter you're talking about (aka Chris, Mr.X,
see my previous post on the Seattle/Portland scene) seems to be the only
one left throwing good parties.  Sure, and you can tell from his style
that he is a harcore LA man (no games, rides, sponsers...past parties have
come with dancers and cages), but at the same time he seems to be the one
that attracts the best crowds."

Hmm.  Well he's more or less the only one left throwing parties because 
from what I hear he's rather territorial, and not above being _not_ 
nice about it.  But being the only game in town and throwing GOOD 
parties are two different things entirely (IMHO).  Lots of fog, flashy 
lightshow, knobs up to 11, glam crowd with _lots_ of attitude, same old 
same old same old <yawn> thang...

For the benefit of promoters/DJs who are thinking of coming up here, 
that highly touted LA style (IMHO) strays dangerously close to being 
old, tired, proverbial-broken-whip-and-dead-horse-ish.  New ideas?  New 
toys?  Innovation?  _fresh_?  New attitude?  I don't think Seattle is a 
one-horse town and I'd be WAY up for seeing new promoters making forays 
into this area.

Just my $0.02.

	<0>  Dread-Eye	

----------
From: Arias Hung  <netmail!mkim@reed.edu>
To: "Glenn Fajardo,USA"  <glenn.fajardo@aldus.com>
Cc: MykL G  <mcg@netcom.com>;  <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: From the Seattle posse- A Rave Called Sharon:Prophecy
Date: Monday, May 31, 1993 10:45PM


On 13 May 1993, Glenn Fajardo,USA wrote:

>
> Everyone up here in Seattle is hoping that we get a bigger influx of 
promoters
> from the Bay Area.  The one big promoter up here doesn't really have 
a clue as
> to what vibe is about and tends to be hardcore LA style in the way he 
does his
> parties.
>
> Tigger

I'm not sure I agree with you at all.  I didn't go to the Sharon rave you
went to , but I went to the previous one in the Omni in March and thought
it was WEAK!  That one big promoter you're talking about (aka Chris, Mr.X,
see my previous post on the Seattle/Portland scene) seems to be the only
one left throwing good parties.  Sure, and you can tell from his style
that he is a harcore LA man (no games, rides, sponsers...past parties have
come with dancers and cages), but at the same time he seems to be the one
that attracts the best crowds.

-Arias


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 15:54:45 1993
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Date: 1 Jun 1993 14:27:21 U
From: "Glenn Fajardo,USA" <glenn.fajardo@aldus.com>
Subject: RE: From the Seattle posse
To: "Arias Hung" <mkim@reed.edu>,
        "Glenn Fajardo,USA" <glenn.fajardo@aldus.com>,
        "NW Raves" <nw-raves@wimsey.bc.ca>
Cc: "MykL G" <mcg@netcom.com>, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

>.......Sure, and you can tell from his style
>that he is a harcore LA man (no games, rides, sponsers...past parties have
>come with dancers and cages), but at the same time he seems to be the one
>that attracts the best crowds. 

I guess I will start my response with my usual disclaimer.   First, whatever my
criticism may be, they are not intended to denegrate or condemn anyone. 
Second, my intentions are to attempt challenge anyone reading my missives to
think about perceptions (both theirs and mine) and how to best bridge varying
perspectives so that we can mutually gain an understanding of where we are both
coming from and where we would ideally like to go.  With that said, I shall
move ahead.

I guess what I look for when I go raving is for fertile ground to plant seeds. 
I look for an environment that is hospitable for the cultivation of ideas,
understanding and ultimately, a unity betweeen myself, those that I come in
contact with and with the environment that I inhabit.  In any given situation
I've experienced,  there will always be something that I will not like or agree
with.  From my perspective, that is a given for every single thing in my life. 


I agree with you, Arias, that Chris does draw a big crowd.  But does a big
crowd necessarily make a good rave?  Is it the prescence of those frills
(rides, games and leather go-go slaves...) OR even the lack of the
aforementioned make a good rave? For myself, I look for diversity.  My call for
other promoters to the Northwest area was not a condemnation of Chris but
rather a call for diversity in an area that sorely needs it.  My point is that
the Northwest is fertile ground for a good rave community.  Yet, it also has
the potential for stagnation.  I personally would like to see this "garden"
bloom.

Peace!

Glenn  

==============================================

On 13 May 1993, Glenn Fajardo,USA wrote:

> 
> Everyone up here in Seattle is hoping that we get a bigger influx of
promoters
> from the Bay Area.  The one big promoter up here doesn't really have a clue
as
> to what vibe is about and tends to be hardcore LA style in the way he does
his
> parties.
> 
> Tigger

I'm not sure I agree with you at all.  I didn't go to the Sharon rave you
went to , but I went to the previous one in the Omni in March and thought
it was WEAK!  That one big promoter you're talking about (aka Chris, Mr.X,
see my previous post on the Seattle/Portland scene) seems to be the only
one left throwing good parties.  Sure, and you can tell from his style
that he is a harcore LA man (no games, rides, sponsers...past parties have
come with dancers and cages), but at the same time he seems to be the one
that attracts the best crowds. 

-Arias 



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 16:07:33 1993
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Date: 	Tue, 1 Jun 1993 15:06:14 -0700
From: Ethan Isaac Miller <nrg@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199306012206.AA21848@well.sf.ca.us>
To: mayer@netcom.com, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  nootropics? // quick review of (get down)^ 3 && wicked

Yeah.....
Get Wicked was Killer!

Great Vibe for such a large gathering. And the music was great everywhere
all night long. Choo-choo trained into the small hall at 8:00 am to fing
Mark Farina and Derek Carter ripping it up on 4 tables. 20 minutes later Jon
Wiliams was shredding the big room

Ahhhhhh..... If this summer is full of parties like this...I can hardly
wait.

see ya
nrg

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 16:29:54 1993
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From: winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie)
Message-Id: <9306012208.AA16143@jimi.lurnix.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

	>overstuffed with Shirtless Male Hunter-Gatherers
			  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Hilarious.  Who first coined this?  I seem to remember this as
a clasic Niels-ism but maybe he was just using it too.  Anyone
know the source?

-Mark

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 16:45:53 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9306012224.AA00962@slack>
Subject: Devin's "Vibes"
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 16:24:12 MDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Things have been cracked down upon here in Slick City.  Devin came up with the
great idea to bus people from a location a few blocks away to his event on
Saturday, called "Vibes".  He asked if I would DJ and I readily agreed, since
it seems I'm having trouble finding warehouses for my own events and the new
promoters here aren't as friendly with "Taste" as Devin's "Deep" is (silly
politics).  Geoff White mentioned that he might come out for it, but didn't.
Too bad...   Had the best time I've had in a long time and probably did my best
set ever.

The night started off with the police arriving.  There wasn't even anyone
there and the sound system was barely audible!  It was apparent that someone
was calling it in.  This happened all night long, with the police showing up a
total of four times.  However, with no alcohol, nobody charging admission at
the door, and people telling them it was a "free" event (they charged $5 for
the bus ride), they were powerless!  Devin put "back to basics" on the flyer
and that is definitely what it was.  Nobody selling anything, free water in
dispensers (we had to run back to my house in the middle of the night to get
more) and a "vibe" like you couldn't believe.

I had to do two sets, a half-hour at 12:30 and close it off at 4:00.  The
12:30 was fairly standard.  Beat matched for half an hour, about ten songs.
Nothing spectacular.  By 4:00 people were coming up to me and saying, "PLEASE
PLAY SOMETHING HARD" because none of the other DJs were doing it.  When I came
on, I played a bit off of "Sesame Street Fever" then dropped into a 175 bpm
track by Car & Driver.  People were screaming.  I kept the bpms high for about
twenty minutes, until finally in the middle of Speed Freak screaming "SUCK ME,
SUCK ME HARD" I cut the power to the turntable, threw on the De La Soul sample
where he says, "NOW WAIT A MINUTE" then dropped into this sweeping airy
beatless thing from B12.  God it felt GREAT.  Lots of Orbital that night with
the new album just hitting my hands that morning.  Devin called it the
"Orbital" rave ;-).  Also dropped the dance remix of Julian Cope that I found
a month or so ago and people luv'd it.  I listened to the tape later, and my
technique wasn't too great (of course, I never think it is), but that probably
had something to do with the fact that I couldn't resist leaving the table to
dance on the floor with everyone else.  I kept things going until 6:00 after
the sun had come up.  It was in a roofless old club and it just looked
spectacular.  First time I've made it to sunrise and been able to see it
happen.  Birds flying over in blue sky.  I can't wait until Solstice.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 17:19:59 1993
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To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: new address (temporary)
From: tamara@cyberden.sf.ca.us
Reply-To: tamara@cyberden.sf.ca.us
Comments: CyberMember
Message-Id: <y7eH5B6w165w@cyberden.sf.ca.us>
Date: 	Tue, 1 Jun 1993 13:09:45 -0700
Organization: Indescribable Creations

My UCLA account ran out of juice and they closed it off on me...
My new temporary address is: tamara@cyberden.sf.ca.us
                      Tamara Palmer

__________________________________________________________________________
   |       /         |\
   | H E   \ Y B E R |/ E N            [ tamara@cyberden.sf.ca.us ]

   The CyberDen - Public Access Waffle Usenet System - 415/472-5527

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 17:43:13 1993
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To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU, uk-dance-errors@orbital.demon.co.uk,
        suster@ucscb.u
Subject: never mind! yet another new address
From: charly@cyberden.sf.ca.us
Reply-To: charly@cyberden.sf.ca.us
Comments: CyberMember
Message-Id: <JViH5B5w165w@cyberden.sf.ca.us>
Date: 	Tue, 1 Jun 1993 14:29:18 -0700
Organization: Indescribable Creations

disregard my other message, my new temporary address is:

             izzyzi5@mvs.oac.ucla.edu

the other address will work but i won't check it often, as
it is long distance....thanks!
{                              --Tamara Palmer


__________________________________________________________________________
   |       /         |\
   | H E   \ Y B E R |/ E N            [ charly@cyberden.sf.ca.us ]

   The CyberDen - Public Access Waffle Usenet System - 415/472-5527

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 17:47:59 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 15:15:18 PDT
From: Bob Ramstad <rramstad@us.oracle.com>
To: geoffw@nexsys.net
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Geoff White's message of Tue, 1 Jun 93 14:09:39 PDT <9306012109.AA15677@nexsys.nexsys.net>
Subject: SAVE AMEBA
Reply-To: boccibob%groovy@us.oracle.com


I would strongly encourage anyone considering becoming a "limited
partner investor" in Ameba to undertake a full review of the books.
This is a prudent and intelligent thing to do whenever considering
this sort of investment.  Review of the books will make it clear if
the business has seasonal cycles and this is just a temporary slump,
or if the business needs rethinking / reworking.  It will also make it
obvious as to the magnitude of the cash flow problem.

I would also encourage anyone involved to have legal notarized
contracts executed which clearly delineate what you are getting for
your investment -- in particular, should Ameba become bankrupt, any
agreements should be spelled out in black and white and witnessed by a
notary, especially if you expect to be able to hold Mark personally
liable for the funds.  Obviously, any sort of profit sharing agreement
should also be properly handled.  (Any lawyer will tell you that
proper agreements in the beginning will save lawsuits and hassle in
the end.)  An important question to have answered in the contract: if
you are a limited partner, are you liable to cover your percentage of
any losses?

Finally, I would encourage potential investors to visit the shop,
examine the inventory, layout, etc, meet the employees, talk to people
here on SFRaves, and so on to get a feel for the type of business
Ameba is in and its particulars -- before assuming partial financial
responsibility for the business.

Note that I have nothing against Mark, these are all just intelligent,
prudent, possibly obvious suggestions before making any investment.

I realize that action is needed, and that there may not be time to go
through all of this, but...  hell, now that I've said this, at least
I'll be able to sleep at night if things get ugly for an ill-informed
investor...

Blah blah blah,
Bob

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 18:00:30 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1993 15:54:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Lee An <lee@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: SONG ID?!?!
To: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Cc: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca, drseuss@cats.ucsc.edu, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <1674.9306011357@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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> > I was at a rave in S.F. awhile ago and I heard this song with the sample--
> > "We are family...I got all my sisters and me..."--- It's probably an old
> > track but no one around here knows who it's by.
> 
>   Francois> How old you want? 70s disco? 80s bubblegum remake? 90s dance?
>   Francois> It's probably "We are family/we all into love" by Unit3
>   Francois> UK. Some ragga on it.  I think it was out in 91, maybe 92.
>   Francois> Popular in big dance clubs...  The 80s remake, i dont
>   Francois> remember who made it, and the original song is: "we are
>   Francois> family" - (shit, a blank...hmmmm....) was it sister
>   Francois> sledge? geez... i wuz about 7 years old, so dont lapidate
>   Francois> me if i'm wrong on this one... It was around 1977 i would
>   Francois> say...(good luck finding it)
> 
> Yeah, it was Sister Sledge.  Wasn't a remixed version rereleased quite
> recently...?
> 
> 	Cosmic Roy

Yup, a bunch of old Sister Sledge tunes have been rereleased and remixed
by Sure is Pure and others. "We are Family" is the most well known of the
bunch, but you might want to check out "Lost in Music" as well. The new
remixes are very good in that they incorporate new acid and progressive
house sounds into the songs without destroying the original grooves that
made the songs hits. 

Lee


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 18:39:41 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 21:07:11 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9306020107.AA08998@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Who *is* that guy with the flashing lights? :)


The one with the scrolling sign... I think he's been at every rave
I've been to.

You on here? 

Sean

PS - I loved the strobe with the diffraction glases. Who needs drugs?
Wow.


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 18:59:03 1993
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Date: 	Tue, 1 Jun 1993 18:09:41 -0700
From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199306020109.AA10674@well.sf.ca.us>
To: spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com
Subject: Re:  my weekend
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

"Rave" is hardly over in SF, Jon.  At least that's what I
would conclude after Get Down x 3 + Wicked, which rose way beyond its
expected potential (in my view anyway) precisely because of the one-off
vibe there.  

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 19:14:12 1993
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From: pew@ucscb.ucsc.edu (Peter Simon Arthur Wayman)
Message-Id: <9306020116.AA04939@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Excuse me...

Excuse me, but I was wondering: What IS this Mondo 2000?
thank you,
peter w:)

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 19:24:24 1993
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Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 18:09:23 PDT
Message-Id: <9306020109.AB21965@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
From: gmosheh@nyx.cs.du.edu (Gregor Mosheh)
X-Sender: gmosheh@nyx.cs.du.edu (Unverified)
Subject: Nootropix

Someone asked: Nootropic? Whazzat?

Nootropics are "smart drugs". Still experimental and "quasi-legal" in the
USA, they are very popular among the new drug scene.

Re: European Labs
Under no circumstances should anybody order from Inhome Health Products,
Switzerland or Interlab, England. Both of these places have been targeted
by the DEA. They'll send your goods all right, but chances are great that
you'll never get the package through customs. As far as I know, there are
two labs that still ship to the USA and get through reliaby. I'll post them
tomorrow or so, when I get the addresses from home.

I have shitloads of text files on drugs of all sorts. Write me if you want
more info. Most of it is from FTP and stuff, but I'll save you the trouble
of FTPing it all. Nice of me, eh? ;)

Rave on, d00dz.
 The Great One has a new Internet address:
                                               gmosheh@nyx.cs.du.edu.
He can be also reached in real life:
                                                623 Radcliffe Drive
                                                Davis, CA 95616-1011
                                                (916) 758-5589

Gregor Mosheh: The Twisted Anarchist With A Heart
                                                        -Jess J. Tapper

"No, officer. I don't know why that grape juice stayed there so long. I
thought it tasted kinda fermented. Dunno where that wine yeast came from..."


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 19:38:16 1993
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Message-Id: <9306020127.AA08752@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: Shirtless Male Hunter Gatherers // Our Sisters House
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 01 Jun 93 15:08:25 PDT."
             <9306012208.AA16143@jimi.lurnix.com> 
Date: Tue, 01 Jun 93 18:27:57 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>


From winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie):
>> overstuffed with Shirtless Male Hunter-Gatherers
>                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> Hilarious.  Who first coined this?  I seem to remember this as
> a clasic Niels-ism but maybe he was just using it too.  Anyone
> know the source?

A Niels-ism, eh? Thanks, I've always wanted to own an ism!

I did use that term in describing the overzealous wood-gathering 
actions of certain party-goers during the recent Daly City beach rave
described in a previous posting. As to whether that term is originally
mine ... who knows -- it's just four words.

--------------------
Ob-Rave:

Make sure to give your support to the women of the scene by checking
out "Our Sister's House" this thursday night at Cleo's Haight St.  I
seem to have lost the flyer, but it starts pretty early (8ish) with a
low-cost vegetarian dinner, and then gets more partylike later on,
finally closing at 2AM (just in time for the FMR)!

Also, yesterday my S.O., others from "our sister's house", and yours
truly scoped out an indoor/outdoor warehouse site for a potential
upcoming party in Palo Alto. Looks interesting!

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==           Niels Mayer -- netcom!mayer -- mayer@netcom.com               ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 19:56:25 1993
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From: murt@leland.stanford.edu
Message-Id: <9306020206.AA16242@cardinal.Stanford.EDU.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: FMR
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 19:06:44 PDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Hi everyone!

I've been trying to get hold of Geoff so that I can maybe go with him to look
at possible sites.  I've been putting some thought into this and I think I've
come up with some promising possibilities.  However, I'm not SUPER familiar
with the Bay Area so I'd appreciate any suggestions people might have. Just
remember Brian's guidelines...  Please send mail directly.

Thanks,

    Scott

(murt@leland.stanford.edu)

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 21:07:22 1993
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From: howard@netcom.com (Howard Berkey)
Message-Id: <9306020324.AA10506@netcom2.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Shirtless Male Hunter Gatherers // Our Sisters House
To: mayer@netcom.com (Niels P. Mayer)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 93 20:24:12 PDT
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9306020127.AA08752@netcom3.netcom.com>; from "Niels P. Mayer" at Jun 1, 93 6:27 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

Niels P. Mayer sez:
> 
> 
> >From winston@lurnix.com (Mark Guthrie):
> >> overstuffed with Shirtless Male Hunter-Gatherers
> >                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> > Hilarious.  Who first coined this?  I seem to remember this as
> > a clasic Niels-ism but maybe he was just using it too.  Anyone
> > know the source?
> 
> A Niels-ism, eh? Thanks, I've always wanted to own an ism!
> 

Of course the best Niels-ism is the term "Love Phaser", which he came
up with after I commented on "projecting the vibe" by having phaser
beams of pure love shoot out of your forehead.  Niels should slap a
(tm) on that one before Wired and Mondo-2K pick it up.  ;-)

-H-


-- 
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Howard Berkey 						   howard@netcom.com
			  "oogabooga" - Anon.
... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...    ... .. ...   ... .. ...   ... .. ...

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Tue Jun  1 23:59:18 1993
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From: cvoigt@flute.calpoly.edu
Message-Id: <9306020611.AA90254@flute.calpoly.edu>
Subject: MY weekend
To: spudboy%dlsun87@us.oracle.com
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1993 23:11:28 -0800 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9306012059.AA17539@dlsun87.us.oracle.com> from "Jon Drukman" at Jun 1, 93 01:59:16 pm
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Hi every-dang-body!!!!

I had a grrrrrreeeaaaat time this weekend.  Found vibe and some just
nice fucking people who were cooler than i ever would have expected.
Where did i find this? TILT-A-WIRL!!  Jon in reponse to your post i
totally agree with you and most of your insights so this isnt a flame
but rather just a report that there are things that are dang "ravey"
(for all those that know me you know how much i dislike that rave word)
But back to the subject: My girlfriend and i decided that since our
friends are tending to be anti party ("its just a bunch of stupid
want-a-be markie marks (as in underwear) and false E induced niceness")
we were going to go out by our selves.  went to check out tilt-a-wirl
(heard good stuff about it).  Went there early 10pm, there was maybe 30
people there and about 3-10 dancing at any given time.  Music was
slamming!  but few people, the people that were there and dancing were
mostly doing the eyes closed-i'm-trancing-out-and-i'm-not-here-to-"be
seen" thang (right on! none of that "look at me" shit)

Tony's set started and he just was great, totally impressed.  Big, deep
and housey.  CHEbob saz check him out!  I saw a guy i havent seen in a
while and talked to him for a while (.5 hr) came back and there was
about 50 people on the floor.  Things went OFF from there. 

Next up was Goa Gil.  i hadn't even heard of this guy, why?  he was
in-fucking-creditable.  The heavyest tribal i have ever heard of.  I was
destroyed it was great.  I meet this guy jeff who independently meet my
girlfriend also he new some things about Goa Gil so learned some things.
as we were about to leave and saying our good-byes and all, already
feeling great, he said "you really like Goa Gil?, i'll be back" gave me
a DJ tape (his own i'm pretty sure).  This is the finest example of
selfless niceness i have experiance in a while, call it vibe if you want

this is way longer than i wanted so im gonna get da hell out.  by the
way tilt-a-wril was $7 Good deal.  also Mr. Happys disco was lame,
clickish, and full of club attitude, waste.

Peace,
the only legit rave gear is a Smile, the guy i was refering to was
wearing a surfer tank top and a pair of levis that fit.

CHE (gotta go to my radio shift, wish me luck for a good show)


From SFRaves-request@medisg.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 00:21:27 1993
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Date: 	Tue, 1 Jun 1993 22:47:45 -0700
Message-Id: <199306020547.AA18174@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@medisg.Stanford.EDU
From: jslee@well.sf.ca.us (John S. Lee)
X-Sender: jslee@well.sf.ca.us (Unverified)
Subject: VORTEX

On Saturday June 5, 1993 Hallucination Generation returns to assault you
sonically, visually, and mentally in the VORTEX.  Spinning you into
psychedelic submission will be DJ's Josh-Tony-Buck-Markie Mark-James-Ernie.
 Visual overload will be provided by Eye-Con Enhancements,Synergy,  and CL
of Groove Kitchen to name a few.  When your senses can no longer take it,
chill out in our ambient room provided by Arthur Kent.

Admission will be $10 before 11:00 pm, $15 thereafter.  ALL are invited to
join us in the VORTEX, the final trip!

Location is Santa Clara.  Directions will be given on Friday June 4, 1993.

If you would like to be on the mailing or phone list call: 415-337-4988

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ "A psychedelic experience with the use of lights, color, and sound..."   +
+ Timothy O. Leary                                                         +
+                                                                          +
+                 from the village of jslee@well.sf.ca.us                  +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 00:54:25 1993
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Date: 	Wed, 2 Jun 1993 00:21:48 -0700
From: Maureen Garrett <metalmau@well.sf.ca.us>
Message-Id: <199306020721.AA10585@well.sf.ca.us>
To: calvin@cats.ucsc.edu, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re:  Get Wicked

Hi.  Wish I had logged on sooner.  I saw you and commented to whoever I was
with at the time, "Beautiful Hair!"   Wicked was smokin....the only lack was
a really dark and quiet chill ambient room, which I would have gone nice
with shrooms.  (delete I in above line)  anyway, it's late and I need to go
into the dreamtime.  ///Keep the weekend of July 31 open for Universe, a
dance theme park in Sonoma County.    --Mau

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 01:39:32 1993
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Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 00:52:40 -0700
From: ftc@netcom.com (Entropy Tech.)
Message-Id: <9306020752.AA01608@netcom4.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU


Hi all!
New to the scene, and to the area..... Mr Baked Raindrop ( Dave )
Turned me on to this list... and Ive been told alot of good things 
aobut the FMR, but alas alack, Im without any mode of transportation, 
and woondered if there4 was anyone else out ther in a similar situation
that I could lend my brain cell(s) to and hopefully find a solution.

All this, and reality too :) 

		- ftc@netcom.com

" And Its all real.. form your first broken heart to the last breath you 
	take .. the inbetween times you do what you need to , cause noone
	is going to spank you afterwards for saying that four letter word,
	kissing that girl, or quaffing that drink. If nothing else, I want
	to look at it all and say.. it was fun, I enjoyed Myself, Whats next ? "

			- Me

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 02:02:34 1993
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Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 04:03:18 EDT
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To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Justice goes to pot... (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <37@medical.win.net>
Organization: somewhere ...

Forwarded from LERI ...

|
|FORWARDED MAIL -------
|From: CIVL097@cantva.canterbury.ac.nz ("Brandon Hutchison,Civil Eng Dept")
|Date: 26 May 93
|Originally To: Multiple recipients of list ADDICT-L <ADDICT-L@KENTVM.BITNET>
|
|X-News: cantva alt.drugs:14827
|From: slp9k@cc.usu.edu
|Subject:[alt.society.civil-liberty] Justice goes to pot...
|Date: 25 May 93 21:18:52 MDT
|Message-ID:<1993May25.211853.68476@cc.usu.edu>
|
|--------------Begin Forwarded Article--------------
|
|Given the source of this article, I figured a lot of
|interested people might have missed it.
|
|Justice Goes To Pot
|by B. J. Oppenheimer
|
|As you read this, I'll probably be behind bars,
|serving a possible five to 40 years in federal prison
|with no hope of parole.  My house will have been
|confiscated by the government, and a fine of $340,000
|will have been levied against me.
|
|I'm a nonviolent offender with no prior record.
|Married for 20 years with two small children, I'm a
|college graduate and published writer.  I have a good
|reputation in the community and have been involved in
|many charitable organizations.
|
|My only crime was planting a handful of marijuana
|seeds....
|
|When I was first arrested for growing pot last
|August, I freely admitted my guilt, fully expecting to
|receive the relatively minor sentence usually meted out
|in marijuana cases.  Until recently, marijuana use and
|cultivation was decriminalized in many places, and even
|now it's only a misdemeanor in most states (including my
|own).  It usually warrants nothing more than a suspended
|sentence and a small fine when prosecuted at the state
|level.  Last year a man in Upstate New York was
|convicted of growing 154 plants - many more than I am
|charged with - and his only punishment was a $100 fine -
|less than a dollar a plant.
|
|My penalty probably would have been similar - if
|I'd been tried in state court.  But more and more, these
|cases are being turned over to the federal government
|for prosecution, where penalties are much stiffer.  What
|would've earned me, at most, a fine and probation in
|state court carries a mandatory minimum sentence of five
|years (and a maximum of 40) when prosecuted at the
|federal level.
|
|It's all because of recently enacted mandatory
|minimum-sentencing laws.  They impose statutory minimums
|for all drug crimes and prohibit the judge from any
|exercise of judicial discretion in arriving at a
|sentence.  The judge is enjoined against taking into
|account things like my reputation in the community,
|charitable works, or lack of prior record.  Since
|there's no such thing as parole in federal prison
|anymore, if I'm sentenced to five years (assuming I lose
|my case), that's how many I'll serve.
|
|Chalk it up to the government's "get tough on
|crime" policy: So what if a few undeserving people serve
|inflated sentences? It's worth it to keep the streets
|free from crime.  The problem is, rather on being tough
|on crime, the net effect of mandatory minimums is to be
|soft on crime - violent crime.  Since the are no
|mandatory minimum sentences for offenses like rape,
|child molestation, murder, aggravated assault, et
|cetera, violent criminals are often released early to
|make room for nonviolent first offenders like me.  The
|average murderer now serves only six and a half years in
|jail (versus the five years minimum I'll serve).
|But if our jail terms are similar, there's one
|important difference between the murderer and me: He
|doesn't lose his house.
|
|Even though my house was bought with legitimate
|earnings, and there was no marijuana grown on my
|property, it was confiscated by the police shortly after
|I was arrested.  The primary reason given was that
|fertilizer was found in my basement.  My house was thus
|considered a "facilitator" of the crime, which justifies
|its forfeiture.  When I learned that the government had
|seized my property on such flimsy pretenses, it
|infuriated me, but what bothered me even more was that
|they did it without even trying me first.
|
|Since passage of the Comprehensive Crime Control
|Act of 1984, property can be seized if one is merely
|suspected of using it in a crime.  It's not even
|necessary to be charged, much less convicted.  It's up
|to the individual to prove that he didn't use it
|illegally.  And since this is a civil forfeiture, and
|public defenders are only provided in criminal cases,
|he's forced to foot the bill for a lawyer.  Often he
|also must put up a bond, sometimes as much as $10,000,
|which usually makes fighting the forfeiture cost-
|prohibitive.
|
|In the majority of cases, the government simply
|steps in and takes the property without even bothering
|to charge anyone with a crime, and there's not a thing
|to be done about it.  Since 1984 almost two and a half
|billion dollars in property has been seized this way.
|There's another difference between the murderer and
|me.  He isn't subject to penalties for tax-stamp
|violation.  Even though marijuana is illegal, in many
|states you're required by law to buy tax stamps for its
|cultivation - at a cost of $1,000 per plant - something
|that's virtually impossible to do without incriminating
|yourself.  Yet even if you are somehow able to purchase
|the stamps without getting arrested but don't actually
|affix the stamps to the plants - in the wind and rain -
|you're still liable for a heavy fine.  And they don't
|just count the living, growing plants.  They count the
|dead ones and even the cutoff stems from plants that
|were thinned from the garden and thrown away earlier.
|Even though the total weight of marijuana in my case was
|under five pounds, with all these other factors added
|in, the fine was $340,000.
|
|When I asked my lawyer how the government expected
|me to pay such an astronomical fine, he said, "They
|don't.  They want to wipe out your assets.  Then when -
|and if - you get out of jail, they intend to garnish
|your wages for the remainder.  Of course, by that time
|there'll be all that interest...."
|
|But the fine is just part of my penalty for tax-
|stamp violation.  It also carries criminal (versus
|civil) penalties of up to five years in state prison.
|That's on top of the five to 40 years I'll already be
|serving in federal prison.  All for the crime of putting
|a handful of marijuana seeds in the ground.
|If this seems like a violation of the Eighth
|Amendment ("Let the punishment fit the crime"), it's not
|the only time the Constitution's been ignored when it
|comes to drug law.  Confiscation of property without due
|process is a violation of the Fifth Amendment.  Police
|can now obtain search warrants based on anonymous tips,
|which is a violation of the Fourth Amendment.  And a
|defense attorney's legal fees can be seized in drug
|cases, a violation of the Sixth Amendment.
|
|But if drug laws are chipping away at the
|Constitution, they're wreaking havoc on our prison
|system.  Federal prisons are currently at 146 percent of
|capacity, and drug offenders serving mandatory minimum
|sentences make up 57 percent of the population (more
|than half had no prior arrests).  At the current rate of
|incarceration, nearly 70 percent of all federal inmates
|will be drug offenders serving mandatory minimums by
|1995.
|
|The United States now imprisons more of its
|citizens per capita than any other country in the world
|(455 per 100,000 people).  That's compared to the No. 2
|country, South Africa, with 311 per 100,000.
|
|As stated earlier, violent offenders often must be
|granted early release to make room for this influx.  In
|a recent four-year period in Florida more than 130,000
|inmates (including muggers, armed robbers, et cetera)
|were released, and one out of three went on to commit
|new crimes.  The F.B.I. reports that the rate of violent
|crimes in America increased by 24 percent from 1987  to
|1991, and many people feel that mandatory minimums have
|a lot to do with it.
|
|But apart from the hypothetical increase in violent
|crime due to mandatory minimums, there's the undeniable
|increase in taxpayer costs.  The National Institute of
|Corrections estimates that in 1992, the United States
|built facilities for 2,000 cells (at a cost of $100
|million) per week to accommodate the exploding prison
|population - and construction costs were only a part of
|the total.  It's been estimated that in five years, the
|financial obligations incurred by U.S. corrections could
|be double the current national deficit.  On top of that,
|it costs on average over $20,000 a year to house, feed,
|clothe, and guard each of the 81,426 federal prisoners.
|And this is to say nothing of the increased cost of
|social services of inmates' families, which were
|previously being provided for by the inmates themselves.
|Over 30 million Americans regularly smoke
|marijuana, so it's not surprising that a lot of people
|in this country feel that it should be decriminalized.
|I'm sure that many people would disagree, but I doubt
|they'd dispute the fact that the penalties for marijuana
|use are not only unjust and illogical, but make an
|unconscionable waste of taxpayer dollars.  With violent
|crime making us all live like prisoners, it's time to
|stop freeing murders to make room for marijuana users.
|
|
|reproduced without permission from a recent issue of Penthouse
|
|-----------------End Forwarded Article--------------------------
|--
|Forwarded-By:
|
|Brandon Hutchison,University of Canterbury,Christchurch
|                  New Zealand
|



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 05:38:06 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 12:56:16 BST
Message-Id: <7212.9306021156@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: csc@pilot.njin.net
Cc: M.B.Mcneill1@lut.ac.uk, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Sean Casey's message of Tue, 1 Jun 93 13:44:16 EDT <9306011744.AA24791@pilot.njin.net>
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)


  Sean> Rather than teaching our children to deal with life's
  Sean> challenges, we Americans try to protect them. Regardless of
  Sean> maturity level, we don't let people drink until they're 21.

I guess what I'm having difficulty here is that these _children_
you're talking about may be 20 years old....  (I have similar
difficulty coping with your alcohol laws, for the same reason).  At
what age do you become an adult in the US....?  I certainly accept
that whatever age you choose, its arbitrary, and will always be too
low for some people, and too high for others...

It's just that I'd always assumed it was 18 like in the UK -- maybe
it's just my ignorance showing here.  Can 18-year-olds vote in the US?

	roy

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 06:02:22 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 13:13:28 BST
Message-Id: <7252.9306021213@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Cc: uk-dance@orbital.demon.co.uk
Subject: Film samples


I always like film sound-bites which seem to have druggie
connotations, despite being perfectly innocent in their orignal
context...

I just heard a piece of techno which samples Arnie in Total Recall
saying `This is the best mind-fuck yet'

Which reminds me, there are quite a few samples in Eat Static's
Prepare your Spirit....  they all _sound_ like they come from old
sci-fi movies, but I don't recognize any of them....

Anyone know where they come from....  ?

Anyone else out there into Eat Static...?  Anyone have a discography...?

"Let them eat static...."

	Cosmic Roy

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 06:25:05 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 13:38:30 BST
Message-Id: <7273.9306021238@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: rpcaras@srv.pacbell.com
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU, gdpasquinelli@ucdavis.edu
In-Reply-To: Bob Carasik's message of Tue, 1 Jun 93 14:26:27 PDT <9306012126.AA00701@zeus.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: Nootropics


  Bob> Yep, I don't think Euro-mailorder of nootropics has worked
  Bob> since early '92 or thereabouts.  Customs &/or the FDA decided
  Bob> that simple mail ordering didn't fit their concept of "it's OK
  Bob> is a doctor told you that you gotta get this rare foreign
  Bob> treatment or you'll die.  Refer to the alt.psychoactives group
  Bob> for info nootropics, nutrition, brain machines, and other cool
  Bob> stuff. Botton line on Interlab: Save your $$, drink samrt
  Bob> drinks, and stand real close to the bass cabinet.

Out of interest, what exactly do interlab sell?  Are these different
nootropics from those in your common-or-gargen smart drink...?

Not that I'm particularly interested in nootropics, but are these
substances legal in the UK...?

	Cosmic Roy

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 06:37:02 1993
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Date: 	Wed, 2 Jun 1993 05:59:56 -0700
Message-Id: <199306021259.AA15763@well.sf.ca.us>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
From: jslee@well.sf.ca.us (John S. Lee)
X-Sender: jslee@well.sf.ca.us (Unverified)
Subject: VORTEX

On Saturday June 5, 1993 Hallucination Generation returns to assault you
sonically, visually, and mentally in the VORTEX.  Spinning you into
psychedelic submission will be DJ's Josh-Tony-Buck-Markie Mark-James-Ernie.
 Visual overload will be provided by Eye-Con Enhancements,Synergy,  and CL
of Groove Kitchen to name a few.  When your senses can no longer take it,
chill out in our ambient room provided by Arthur Kent.

Admission will be $10 before 11:00 pm, $15 thereafter.  ALL are invited to
join us in the VORTEX, the final trip!

Location is Santa Clara.  Directions will be given on Friday June 4, 1993.

If you would like to be on the mailing or phone list call: 415-337-4988

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ "A psychedelic experience with the use of lights, color, and sound..."   +
+ Timothy O. Leary                                                         +
+                                                                          +
+                 from the village of jslee@well.sf.ca.us                  +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 07:02:11 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 14:11:25 BST
Message-Id: <7573.9306021311@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: howard@netcom.com
Cc: mayer@netcom.com, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Howard Berkey's message of Tue, 1 Jun 93 20:24:12 PDT <9306020324.AA10506@netcom2.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Shirtless Male Hunter Gatherers // Our Sisters House


  Howard> Of course the best Niels-ism is the term "Love Phaser", which he came
  Howard> up with after I commented on "projecting the vibe" by having phaser
  Howard> beams of pure love shoot out of your forehead.  Niels should slap a
  Howard> (tm) on that one before Wired and Mondo-2K pick it up.  ;-)

Yeah, this one used to confuse me.  Especially when people made posts
about security confiscating their love phasers.  For a while, I though
that a love phaser must be some kind of rave toy that was popular over
in SF.... :)

	Cosmic Roy

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 08:04:16 1993
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To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
From: jslee@well.sf.ca.us (John S. Lee)
Subject: VORTEX

On Saturday June 5, 1993 Hallucination Generation returns to assault you
sonically, visually, and mentally in the VORTEX.  Spinning you deep into
psychedelic submission will be DJ's Josh, Buck, Tony, James, Markie Mark,
and Ernie Munsen.  Visual overload will be provided by Eye-Con
Enhancements, Synergy, CL and others.  When you senses can no longer take
it, chill out in the ambient room by Arthur Kent.

As with all HG-Vortex events, ALL are invited to join us in this journey!

Admission will be $10 before 11:00 p.m, $15 thereafter.  The location will
be in  Santa Clara.

Explicit directions will be given Friday June 4.  Please call the
information line if you'd like to be put on the mailing/voice list:
415-337-4988.

(All you need to bring are a positive vibe, stomping shoes, and of course a
little stamina :)

See you in the Vortex!

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ "A psychedelic experience with the use of lights, color, and sound..."   +
+ Timothy O. Leary                                                         +
+                                                                          +
+                 from the village of jslee@well.sf.ca.us                  +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 08:20:05 1993
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From: lxfogel@srv.pacbell.com (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9306021428.AA21754@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
To: cvoigt@flute.calpoly.edu
Subject: Re: MY weekend
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

CHE:
> Next up was Goa Gil.  i hadn't even heard of this guy, why?  he was
> in-fucking-creditable.  The heavyest tribal i have ever heard of.  I was
> destroyed it was great. 

Goa will sell you his own DJ tape fir $15 from a box under the table while
he's spinning.  Good Stuff.

> this is way longer than i wanted so im gonna get da hell out.  by the
> way tilt-a-wril was $7 Good deal. 

I saw a flyer there that said that the next Tilt-a-Whirl will be outdoors.
Anyone know what the deal is about this?

- leg of eel

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 09:26:47 1993
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From: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com (Pete Ashdown)
Message-Id: <9306021541.AA01718@slack>
Subject: Film samples
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU (SF Raves)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 9:41:28 MDT
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> Which reminds me, there are quite a few samples in Eat Static's
> Prepare your Spirit....  they all _sound_ like they come from old
> sci-fi movies, but I don't recognize any of them....
> Anyone else out there into Eat Static...?  Anyone have a discography...?

I'm still trying to get my hands on some.  I was under the impression that
they were Ozric Tenticles under the dance influence.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 10:03:07 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
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To: ames!cats.ucsc.edu!zephirus, dionf@ere.umontreal.ca,
        sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Re: Candies!

On the subject of nootropics
------------------^^^^^^^^^^

what are these?

thx,

*

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 11:07:41 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 18:18:48 BST
Message-Id: <8674.9306021718@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Eat Static


These are the two eat static albums that I know of....

	Cosmic Roy

----------------

My copy of Prepare Your Spirit is on cassette :-(

Eat Static:  Prepare Your Spirit
MC:  Alien Records  ARC 1
  Hallucinate
  Fudge
  Worm-lips
  Instinct
  Eat-static
  Destiny
  Raga
  Almost human
  OM machine
  Cyber-funk
  The watcher
  Higher state
  Woman is life
  Medicine wheel
  The fourth dimension


I've just got a (borrowed) CD of the new album in front if me, too:

Eat Static:  Abduction
CD:  Planet Dog Records / Ultimate Records  BARK CD 001
  Prana
  Gulf Breeze
  Kalika
  Splitting World
  Kinetic Flow
  Forgotten Rites
  Abduction
  Intruder
  Xenomorph
  Inner Peace


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 11:25:55 1993
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From: Roy Badami <roy@harlequin.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 18:12:54 BST
Message-Id: <8658.9306021712@wundt.harlqn.co.uk>
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: Pete Ashdown's message of Wed, 2 Jun 93 9:41:28 MDT <9306021541.AA01718@slack>
Subject: Re: Film samples


> Which reminds me, there are quite a few samples in Eat Static's
> Prepare your Spirit....  they all _sound_ like they come from old
> sci-fi movies, but I don't recognize any of them....
> Anyone else out there into Eat Static...?  Anyone have a discography...?

  Pete> I'm still trying to get my hands on some.  I was under the impression that
  Pete> they were Ozric Tenticles under the dance influence.

Yeah, they're an Ozrics offshoot, though I don't think it's exactly
the same lineup.

I picked up the album `Prepare Your Spirit' on casette at an Ozrics
gig, and I think it's excellent.  Their new album, Abduction, seems to
be reasonably easy to get hold of over here... released about a month
ago, I think...


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 11:48:05 1993
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From: ccat@netcom.com (ccat)
Message-Id: <9306021733.AA23572@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Vortex posting

  Is the system malfunctioning? I received about 4 copies of the Vortex
posting.
-Chris.

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 11:50:42 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9306021725.AA16662@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: csc@pilot.njin.net, roy@harlequin.co.uk
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)
Cc: M.B.Mcneill1@lut.ac.uk, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

>   Sean> Rather than teaching our children to deal with life's
>   Sean> challenges, we Americans try to protect them. Regardless of
>   Sean> maturity level, we don't let people drink until they're 21.
> 
> I guess what I'm having difficulty here is that these _children_
> you're talking about may be 20 years old....  (I have similar
> difficulty coping with your alcohol laws, for the same reason).  At
> what age do you become an adult in the US....?  I certainly accept
> that whatever age you choose, its arbitrary, and will always be too
> low for some people, and too high for others...
> 
> It's just that I'd always assumed it was 18 like in the UK -- maybe
> it's just my ignorance showing here.  Can 18-year-olds vote in the US?

You can vote at 18, you can join the army and get shot at, but you can't
drink. You gotta be 21 to do that.


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 12:01:26 1993
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From: rpcaras@srv.pacbell.com (Bob Carasik)
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To: sfraves@soda.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: dit@sybase.com


Belated farewell to the guy whose sig once said:

" Bust a nut on a cloud
	Shout out loud "

Did he write that one or is it some kinda sex-positve slogan that
world needs more of?

So happy trials to dit.  Oh well, time to pray to the ginseng god.

AstroBoy

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 12:28:45 1993
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From: geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Message-Id: <9306021750.AA16812@nexsys.nexsys.net>
To: howard@netcom.com, roy@harlequin.co.uk
Subject: Re: Shirtless Male Hunter Gatherers // Our Sisters House
Cc: mayer@netcom.com, sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU


>   Howard> Of course the best Niels-ism is the term "Love Phaser", which he came
>   Howard> up with after I commented on "projecting the vibe" by having phaser
>   Howard> beams of pure love shoot out of your forehead.  Niels should slap a
>   Howard> (tm) on that one before Wired and Mondo-2K pick it up.  ;-)
> 
> Yeah, this one used to confuse me.  Especially when people made posts
> about security confiscating their love phasers.  For a while, I though
> that a love phaser must be some kind of rave toy that was popular over
> in SF.... :)
> 
> 	Cosmic Roy
> 
I thought it was John Druckman who came up with it but I think your right
it was Niels, something to the effect of "next you`ll be telling me that
you are zapping people with pahser beams of pure love comming out of your
forehead" To which I replied "How did you know!"  This was back during
the "raving is" discussion as to whether there was mystical mumbo jumbo
involved in the rave experience or just plain physiology.  I agree,
Niels should (tm) it.  It started as a personal joke but we SF ravers have
come to use it to mean any party where the vibe is strong, on a party where
we anticipate that the vibe will be strong as in I'm going home and charge
up my luv phaser.  When some-one says their luv-phaser was confiscated at
the door they are refering to the fact that the harsh security and venue
basically killed any vibe that could have happened, but sometimes
a few are smuggled in ....

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 12:47:00 1993
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From: cvoigt@flute.calpoly.edu
Message-Id: <9306021909.AA69435@flute.calpoly.edu>
Subject: test
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1993 12:09:49 -0800 (PDT)
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Hi 

sorry im having mail problems and i need to see if this gets thru.
i posted last night and even that didnt come back? if any one gets this
please zap it back to me so i can see where the prob is.

thanks and sorry for the prob.

CHE



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 13:46:09 1993
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Date: Wed, 2 Jun 93 16:06:20 EDT
From: csc@pilot.njin.net (Sean Casey)
Message-Id: <9306022006.AA08892@pilot.njin.net>
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: Any really good movie theatres in the Bay or Sacramento area>


I'm looking for a really awesome place to watch the summer movies. THX
or the new Digital Dolby or even the Douglass Trumbull spec that a few
theatres do. Big screens comfy seats good projection equipment.

I really don't care where because I often visit the Bay area and Santa
Cruz, and I live in Davis, so if you know anything, I want a good
movie experience.

Can anyone make any recommendations?

Sean

PS. Davis has great projection equipment, but it's MONO sound!!! I
really haven't scoped out Sacramento yet.The UA theater at Arden Way
is okay, but the floor isn't properly sloped so if you sit near the
front you look at the back of people's heads (yech).

PPS. Any IMAX or OMNIMAX theaters around?

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 14:42:25 1993
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Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1993 13:53:21 -0800
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
From: rth@netcom.com (Robert Hughes)
Subject: Re: MY weekend

>in-fucking-creditable.  The heavyest tribal i have ever heard of.  I was
>destroyed it was great.  I meet this guy jeff who independently meet my
>girlfriend also he new some things about Goa Gil so learned some things.
>as we were about to leave and saying our good-byes and all, already
>feeling great, he said "you really like Goa Gil?, i'll be back" gave me
>a DJ tape (his own i'm pretty sure).  This is the finest example of
>selfless niceness i have experiance in a while, call it vibe if you want
>
>CHE (gotta go to my radio shift, wish me luck for a good show)

Goa Gil got the name 'cause he spins in Goa, India where there are suppose
to be some wild international house things happening, and he might also be
from there but I'm not sure about that. He and Axel from Germany
use small portable DAT machines to spin, partly because a bag full of tapes are
easier to transport than boxes of records. You might have noticed that night 
that there was some crackling noise during his set, and it sounds like he was
getting some digital drop-outs off his DAT's. 


From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 16:24:00 1993
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From: jimt@sunfse.ese.lmsc.lockheed.com (Jim S. Thompson)
Message-Id: <9306022243.AA06330@sunfse.ese.lmsc.lockheed.com>
To: pashdown@slack.sim.es.com, roy@harlequin.co.uk
Subject: Re: Film samples
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU

	Could someone describe this groups sound as well as Ozric Tentacles'?
	
	Thanks!						Jim Thompson (CYBERIA)

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From: brians@unislc.slc.unisys.com (Brian Sassone)
Message-Id: <9306022322.AA09496@unislc.slc.unisys.com>
Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)
To: ios!geoffw@nexsys.net (Geoff White)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1993 17:22:50 -0600 (MDT)
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU (Bay Area Ravers)
In-Reply-To: <9306021725.AA16662@nexsys.nexsys.net> from "Geoff White" at Jun 2, 93 10:25:33 am
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When I was growing up in Ohio (with the corn and the cows), the drinking
age for beer was 18 while everything else was 21.  I don't know what it is
anymore -- that was a long time ago...

P.S.  Does anybody remember 3.2 beer?  :P


-----------------------===<<O>>===------------------------------------------
-bS							"A happy face,
brians@ios.convergent.com				 a funkin' bass,
A lowly raver without a glowstick.			 for a loving race."
------------------------------------------===<<O>>===-----------------------



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 18:20:11 1993
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To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: nootropics
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 93 17:43:15 -0700
From: John William Gramata <easu252@orion.oac.uci.edu>


	Hey everyone, I've never tried to order Nootropics through the
mail, but (since I live in So. Cal.) I've bought quite a bit from our
good friends in Mexico.  The quality is just as good( from what I am
told), and it is relatively cheap.  Last time I went down, I bought
four bottles of Nootropil (800mg/30ea), and four packs of Hydergine 
1.5mg/24ea.).  The boarder patrol checked my bag SAW IT AND SAID.....
"go through."  No hassles!  They were relatively cheap, Nootropil was
$6.30 a bottle, and hydergine was ? ($35.09 Mex.).  So my advice is,
If you know anyone down in So. Cal. have them get it for you.  If you
don't have friends down here--MAKE SOME!!! If you have any questions
just drop me a line (easu252@orion.oac.uci.edu) my name is John.

P.S.  I'm no expert, but then again, who is!
P.S.S. Looking forward to a SF trip in late June.....

                            SMILE,
                     ------>John G<------
                     easu252@orion.oac.uci.edu
                     

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 20:05:37 1993
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From: hart@ntmtv.com (Chris Hart)
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To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
Subject: re: Pix
Cc: ntmtv!hart

oops, fergot th' filenames, zzzzz ....

here dey are:

Xochi_Stack_1.0.hqx
Color_Orb_PICS.sea.hqx

thx,

**********************> .  

From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 22:47:36 1993
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From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion)
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Subject: Re: a question or two (fwd)
To: brians@unislc.slc.unisys.com (Brian Sassone)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1993 23:54:50 -0400 (EDT)
Cc: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU
In-Reply-To: <9306022322.AA09496@unislc.slc.unisys.com> from "Brian Sassone" at Jun 2, 93 05:22:50 pm
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Beyond the ultraworld of Brian Sassone:
> 
> When I was growing up in Ohio (with the corn and the cows), the drinking
> age for beer was 18 while everything else was 21.  I don't know what it is
> anymore -- that was a long time ago...

Most provinces in Canada, it is 18. Xcept for ontario which is 19 and several
places are 21 in toronto ontario. This (combined with the restrictive 1 am
closing time in Ontario) is particularly ridiculous in Ottawa and Hull. Hull
is in Quebec and the other side of rideau channel is Ottawa, so you see a lot
of people driving from Ottawa to Hull at midnight cause in Hull it's 18 and
the clubs/pubs/bars close at 3 am..

> P.S.  Does anybody remember 3.2 beer?  :P

Yuk, light beer

Ciao,
-- 
Francois Dion
    '  _   _   _ 
 CISM (_) (_)  _) FM       Montreal , Canada       Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA
      (_)  / . _)             10000 Watts          Telephone no: (514) 343-7511
_______________________________________________________________________________
Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-...



From SFRaves-request@techno.Stanford.EDU  Wed Jun  2 23:01:58 1993
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From: kawakami@noc.usfca.edu (Sea of Sin)
Message-Id: <9306030519.AA10818@noc.usfca.edu>
Subject: exploritorium
To: sfraves@techno.Stanford.EDU (Discoravers)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1993 22:19:43 -0700 (PDT)
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Today Apple Pie, Chris, and I went to the Explortorium. On the first
Wednesdays of each month the admission is free. I suggest you you have any
out of town vistors or have  some time to kill by looking at some cool
exhibits. BTW, in some of the exhibits they have they do have soem ariel
pictures of the Bay Area. This could help in finding sites. :) 


Sea of Sin



