From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 00:04:22 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605010704.AAA27970@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: dj's with no cities...Last try
To: blkadder@value.net
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 00:04:07 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: ravedata@linux.kirbynet.lafayette.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960430193501.6524A-100000@value.net> from "blkadder@value.net" at Apr 30, 96 07:37:40 pm
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> 
> On Tue, 30 Apr 1996, Rave Info Compiler wrote:
> 
> > 
> > 
> > On Tue, 30 Apr 1996 blkadder@value.net wrote:
> > 
> > > Out of curiosity, where is all the compiled info available?
> > > 
> > >                                       Black Adder
> > > 
> > The ravedata information will be available about August on CD Rom and/or 
> > the web (to make it available for ravers both on the net and not!)
> > Love-
> > Nicole

Sorry, I apologize too.  Didn't understand the scope of your project.

-troy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 00:33:04 1996
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From: swoosh@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (John Elias Darrow)
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Wish: new weekly starting tonight
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I thought I'd pass on the info for a new wednesday night weekly
some of my friends are starting.

W I S H - wednesdays at the Bahia
1600 Market St., San Francisco
18 and over welcome
(415) 436-0663

Headliner DJs:
Tonight, May 1: DORAN
May 8: DUTCH
May 15: HENRIK
MAY 22: GROVER (Las Vegas)

Sound by JK Sound, Lighting by Eyetribe


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 02:03:42 1996
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To: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>                          !!!RIGHT ON NANCY!!!
>
> You GO girl! Damn that was good! I loved reading your post on porn and
>your response to what seems to be a common " I'll bury my head in the
>sand response when I hear something I don't like. " reply from John.  =)
>
>
> Just a couple of thoughts -- I did a research paper on pornography.
>Unfortunately it was not as in depth as I would have liked it to be. One
>thing I did learn, however, was that the word 'pornagraphy' originally meant
>stories told by prostitutes in order to incite men to lust (and
>supposedly encourage them to buy their services). We should keep in mind
>that the only surviving records of these events were supposed to have
>been written by men (who were absolutely unbiased ;) ). Eventually  porn
>became synonymus with violence and domination of women (by men). I
>believe this occured first in Europe and eventually moved to
>America via monograms and eventually photographs, during the Victorian
>era. If anyone is interested, e-mail me and I can dig out my old paper and
>more accurately remember the contents and refer to sources.
>
>
>Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
>                               (peace out)
>                                    /
>                              -=*=-/
>                                ~


Thank you. Your validation of my facts would be most intruiging.

I can only wonder, who's zoomin' who.

bcnu,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 07:02:19 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 10:00:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: Rave Info Compiler <ravedata@linux.kirbynet.lafayette.edu>
To: ne raves <ne-raves@world.std.com>, sf raves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Rave data reasoning
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.91.960501095424.30120A-100000@linux>
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Hi everyone-
Over the past few days ravedata has been receiving alot of slack and I 
just wanted to explain a few things to everyone although the problems 
were explained and resolved (thanks to those who did apologize!) Our 
project is aimed to bring the rave community closer together. We are not 
trying to make a profit but rather dedicating  hundreds of hours of our time 
to the scene we believe in...We really do appreciate the help that 
everyone does give us. The rave info will be available on both the web 
and on CD-Rom making this information availbale for ravers on the net and 
not.
Luv-
Nicole and Matt
"Rave Info Compilers"


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 07:51:05 1996
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From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: shakti <shakti@ahau.com>
cc: frisco groovers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, Fred Heutte <phred@teleport.com>,
        manoj@ahau.com
Subject: Re: Beltane
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          Well, you won't find it on the map;). It was a party yesterday 
that was being held 1 and 1/2 hours from the city. A really nice was 
passing out the flyers for it at Sunset. Did anyone go to this? How was it?
                                        -Reagan






On Tue, 30 Apr 1996, shakti wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> Because I think I've been takingnthings too seriously and in the spirit of
> lightening up I now invite you all to laugh really hard at/with me.
> 
> Abunch of my friends are having a small gathering in Washington this
> weekend and I hear something about Beltane.  So, I'm looking on the map
> for Beltane, WA.
> 
> WILL SOMEONE PLEASE ENLIGHTEN ME??
> 
> thank you,
> 
> shakti
> 
> i have a feeling it has something to do with spring or may...
> 
> geoff, i was gonna email you personally but i lost your email addy and i
> was in the mood for a public flogging
> 
> 		        http://www.ahau.com/~shakti
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 08:01:57 1996
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From: shakti <shakti@ahau.com>
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To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
cc: shakti <shakti@ahau.com>, frisco groovers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Beltane
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actually, what i was talking about, it's this weekend in Oceanview
Washington.  I got the whole scoop and a reality check :)

happy beltane!

love,

shakti :)


On Wed, 1 May 1996, Reagan Reid wrote:

>
>           Well, you won't find it on the map;). It was a party yesterday
> that was being held 1 and 1/2 hours from the city. A really nice was
> passing out the flyers for it at Sunset. Did anyone go to this? How was it?
>                                         -Reagan
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, 30 Apr 1996, shakti wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Because I think I've been takingnthings too seriously and in the spirit of
> > lightening up I now invite you all to laugh really hard at/with me.
> >
> > Abunch of my friends are having a small gathering in Washington this
> > weekend and I hear something about Beltane.  So, I'm looking on the map
> > for Beltane, WA.
> >
> > WILL SOMEONE PLEASE ENLIGHTEN ME??
> >
> > thank you,
> >
> > shakti
> >
> > i have a feeling it has something to do with spring or may...
> >
> > geoff, i was gonna email you personally but i lost your email addy and i
> > was in the mood for a public flogging
> >
> > 		        http://www.ahau.com/~shakti
> >
> >
>

		        http://www.ahau.com/~shakti


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 09:26:57 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605011626.JAA07518@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Reminder: RAW Tonight.
To: cc@cyborganic.net
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 09:26:00 -0700 (PDT)
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Just a reminder to everyone that Robert Anton Wilson is speaking tonight
at the Porter College Cafeteria on the UC Santa Cruz Campus, from 8:00pm
to 9:30pm.  Cost is 8 Dollars, which is a heck of a deal... He is speaking
in SF later this week for 29 dollars!

Robert Anton Wilson is a noted futurist, philosopher and Conspiracy Theory
Guru.  "Changing the world by changing the way we think about it"

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 10:00:05 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605011650.JAA18537@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Lighten Up Review
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 09:50:23 -0700 (PDT)
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Went to Lighten Up, Preston's party @ 111 Minna on Tuesdays.
(Man, there is plenty goin' on during Tuesdays, boy howdy...).

Anyway I do love that space, and the sound was really good.  Sound there 
in the past was either too loud, or the room seemed to "live" (lotsa 
reflecting sound off of empty bare walls).

I dunno how the dog does it, but he always manages to have some of the 
best sound around.  The room was just right, the sound was crisp, and clear.

DJ's for the evening were Preston and Loren.

the dog can really play some records, and I was impressed at how far he's 
come in such a short time.  Nice housey stuff, got people moving.  Really 
a smooth style.  Nice one!!!

As for Loren, he always impresses me with the variety of music he plays.  
I remeber when it was just "deep house" for Loren, and that is all he 
would play.  Now he seems much more vaired, going from hard trance, to a 
soulful techno, then into deep house.  Quite nice.

It was good to get out, and do some dancing.  Dunno if I'm gonna make 
Wicked, but will probably go and catch a groove.  Haven't heard the boyz 
(as they say), in quite a while.  Might be a good time to catch some 
tunes, and maybe do a crackerjack mini-weekend.

Peace out & catch a groove,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 10:00:11 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 09:59:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Wed, 1 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:

> >                          !!!RIGHT ON NANCY!!!
> >
> > You GO girl! Damn that was good! I loved reading your post on porn and
> >your response to what seems to be a common " I'll bury my head in the
> >sand response when I hear something I don't like. " reply from John.  =)
> >
> >
> > Just a couple of thoughts -- I did a research paper on pornography.
> >Unfortunately it was not as in depth as I would have liked it to be. One
> >thing I did learn, however, was that the word 'pornagraphy' originally meant
> >stories told by prostitutes in order to incite men to lust (and
> >supposedly encourage them to buy their services). We should keep in mind
> >that the only surviving records of these events were supposed to have
> >been written by men (who were absolutely unbiased ;) ). Eventually  porn
> >became synonymus with violence and domination of women (by men). I
> >believe this occured first in Europe and eventually moved to
> >America via monograms and eventually photographs, during the Victorian
> >era. If anyone is interested, e-mail me and I can dig out my old paper and
> >more accurately remember the contents and refer to sources.
> >
> >
> >Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
> >                               (peace out)
> >                                    /
> >                              -=*=-/
> >                                ~
> 
> 
> Thank you. Your validation of my facts would be most intruiging.
> 
> I can only wonder, who's zoomin' who.
> 
> bcnu,
> John
> 
> 
> 


They ain't your facts buddy-boy. They ain't even facts. Just some 
recorded ideas that may be facts.

Ran
                                          (flame on!)
                                              /
                                        -=*=-/
                                          ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 10:06:14 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605011706.KAA21698@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Disco Boy review in XLR8R.
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 10:06:06 -0700 (PDT)
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I don't know who this is ( I think I have a vague idea ), but thier shit 
was funny as all!

thoroughly amused at the old-time promoters, shit was spot on.

Yeah, behind the dex, that's where some of the real action is.  You can 
almost smell the sense of purpose, a preisthood almost. 

reminds me of a conversation I had with Tony Grant (Synergy) @ Lighten 
Up.  He referred to himself as a retired raver.  I knew where he was 
coming from!  We were both yapping about how we have put in our time and 
are ready for our retirement benefits.  Recounting all the money spent 
going out, we surmised that we would probably have a pretty hefty pension 
by now.

I think there should be some reward to those who have put in "the time".

I would really like to see:
- A membership card, that entitles you to certain benefits, like going to 
almost any party, gratis.  Why?  Well look, you've supported the "scene" 
for 5 years, and you deserve some respect.  Hell, you've paid the dues, 
now it's time to get some back.  Of course the card would not entitle you 
to free drinks.  Everyone pays for drinks.  But by flashing your "Raver 
Retirement Plan" card, you'll have the comfort of having instant respect, 
props and all that when you walk in the door.  People will say "There's a 
person who been at this at leasty 5 years!".d  You'll be the one to know.
- Free drugs. Now c'mon.  You've spent hours making sure you and your 
friends got hooked up, time after time.  You have added to the wealth of 
hundreds if not thousands or people.  You probably even helped some pay 
their rent during a time of need.  By flashing youyr card, all you need 
to is hold out your hand for a few party favors.  Get that lovin' feelin' 
all over again, just like you used to 5 years ago.  Gratis, of course.
- As part of the bonus plan, you get the luxury of, you guessed it, your 
own spot behind the dex, with the rest of the retirees.  Get a groove on 
*behind* the dex.  It is less crowded, and you will be part of a much 
more selective crew.  After all,m you've done your time on the crowded 
sweaty dance floor.  When you flash your card, your spot will be reserved 
so that you don't miss any of the action, where the action really is, 
behind the dex.  Your card grants you instant recognition as one fo the 
few, one of the proud, one of the old. Yeah!

I think this is an idea whose time as come. 

Peace out,
John


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 10:07:57 1996
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From: sequoia1@ix.netcom.com (Chris Chervin )
Subject: Berkeley e-mail question: indirectly RR
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello peoples,

I met this cool girl named Carla at sunset and she told me her e-mail.  
The problem is I can't remember how the last part goes.    

Something@uclink4.berkeley.edu   -  would that be correct for someone 
at berkeley?   Thanks and sorry for the nonrave post but I need to get 
a hold of her.


love chris 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 10:11:42 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605011711.KAA22653@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords
To: randream@cats.ucsc.edu (Randy C Cone)
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 10:11:35 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605010955.A3120-0100000@ese.UCSC.EDU> from "Randy C Cone" at May 1, 96 09:59:10 am
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> 
> On Wed, 1 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:
> 
> > >                          !!!RIGHT ON NANCY!!!
> > >
> > > You GO girl! Damn that was good! I loved reading your post on porn and
> > >your response to what seems to be a common " I'll bury my head in the
> > >sand response when I hear something I don't like. " reply from John.  =)
> > >
> > >
> > > Just a couple of thoughts -- I did a research paper on pornography.
> > >Unfortunately it was not as in depth as I would have liked it to be. One
> > >thing I did learn, however, was that the word 'pornagraphy' originally meant
> > >stories told by prostitutes in order to incite men to lust (and
> > >supposedly encourage them to buy their services). We should keep in mind
> > >that the only surviving records of these events were supposed to have
> > >been written by men (who were absolutely unbiased ;) ). Eventually  porn
> > >became synonymus with violence and domination of women (by men). I
> > >believe this occured first in Europe and eventually moved to
> > >America via monograms and eventually photographs, during the Victorian
> > >era. If anyone is interested, e-mail me and I can dig out my old paper and
> > >more accurately remember the contents and refer to sources.
> > >
> > >
> > >Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
> > >                               (peace out)
> > >                                    /
> > >                              -=*=-/
> > >                                ~
> > 
> > 
> > Thank you. Your validation of my facts would be most intruiging.
> > 
> > I can only wonder, who's zoomin' who.
> > 
> > bcnu,
> > John
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> They ain't your facts buddy-boy. They ain't even facts. Just some 
> recorded ideas that may be facts.
> 
> Ran
>                                           (flame on!)
>                                               /
>                                         -=*=-/
>                                           ~
> 
Huh?

And who is buddy-boy?

Who are you?

Why do you even want to start?

It is very interesting the types who are attracted to the list these 
days.  Whatever, zealots or not, I plan on staying.

Geez, there was a time when trolling was an art form.  Now it's just 
pornography to me.

Late,
John


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 10:34:22 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 10:33:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
cc: shakti <shakti@ahau.com>, frisco groovers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Beltane
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960501074841.706A-100000@value.net>
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Isn't Beltane a pagan holiday of fertility?
 (long before it was a rave, of course)

	--jon





On Wed, 1 May 1996, Reagan Reid wrote:

> 
>           Well, you won't find it on the map;). It was a party yesterday 
> that was being held 1 and 1/2 hours from the city. A really nice was 
> passing out the flyers for it at Sunset. Did anyone go to this? How was it?
>                                         -Reagan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Tue, 30 Apr 1996, shakti wrote:
> 
> > Hi all,
> > 
> > Because I think I've been takingnthings too seriously and in the spirit of
> > lightening up I now invite you all to laugh really hard at/with me.
> > 
> > Abunch of my friends are having a small gathering in Washington this
> > weekend and I hear something about Beltane.  So, I'm looking on the map
> > for Beltane, WA.
> > 
> > WILL SOMEONE PLEASE ENLIGHTEN ME??
> > 
> > thank you,
> > 
> > shakti
> > 
> > i have a feeling it has something to do with spring or may...
> > 
> > geoff, i was gonna email you personally but i lost your email addy and i
> > was in the mood for a public flogging
> > 
> > 		        http://www.ahau.com/~shakti
> > 
> > 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 11:32:41 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
In-Reply-To: <199605011711.KAA22653@netcom20.netcom.com>
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On Wed, 1 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:

> > 
> > On Wed, 1 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:
> > 
> > > >                          !!!RIGHT ON NANCY!!!
> > > >
> > > > You GO girl! Damn that was good! I loved reading your post on porn and
> > > >your response to what seems to be a common " I'll bury my head in the
> > > >sand response when I hear something I don't like. " reply from John.  =)
> > > >
> > > >
  > >  Just a couple of thoughts -- I did a research paper on pornography.
>> > >Unfortunately it was not as in deep or penetrating =) as I would have 
>>>>> liked it to be. One thing I did learn, however, was that the word
>>>>>'pornagraphy' originally meant
>> > >stories told by prostitutes in order to incite men to lust (and
>  > >supposedly encourage them to buy their services). We should keep in mind
> >> >that the only surviving records of these events were supposed to have
 > > >been written by men (who were absolutely unbiased ;) ). Eventually  porn
>> > >became synonymus with violence and domination of women (by men). I
>  > >believe this occured first in Europe and eventually moved to
> >> >America via monograms and eventually photographs, during the Victorian
> > >>era. If anyone is interested, e-mail me and I can dig out my old paper and
> >  >more accurately remember the contents and refer to sources.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
> > > >                               (peace out)
> > > >                                    /
> > > >                              -=*=-/
> > > >                                ~
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Thank you. Your validation of my facts would be most intruiging.
> > > 
> > > I can only wonder, who's zoomin' who.
> > > 
> > > bcnu,
> > > John
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > They ain't your facts buddy-boy. They ain't even facts. Just some 
> > recorded ideas that may be facts.
> > 
> > Ran
> >                                           (flame on!)
> >                                               /
> >                                         -=*=-/
> >                                           ~
> > 
> Huh?
> 
> And who is buddy-boy?


    Read the word 'your' in the sentance and have a cup of coffee.


> 
> Who are you?
>


    My name is plainly stated at the top. Have another cup.
 

> Why do you even want to start?
> 



    I'm responding to your posts so, logically, you started this. Not to 
    mention this is a forum of free exchange of ideas. Besides, you are 
    giving me some good motivation to hash out a few skills that need some 
    polishing.



> It is very interesting the types who are attracted to the list these 
> days.  Whatever, zealots or not, I plan on staying.


   The interesting types are why I came to sfraves. This is some 
   radically, cutting edge exchange of ideas going on here which would be 
   very difficult to achieve any where else. And do please stay. Not only 
   are you entertaining but occasionally insightful and enlightening.


> 
> Geez, there was a time when trolling was an art form.  Now it's just 
> pornography to me.
> 

   And from your earlier posts it would seem you would know best and 
   would appreciate it best (porngraphy that is).


> Late,
> John
> 
> 


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams

                *("In charege of who is there in charge of me. Do I look 
                   on  blindly and say I see, the way)
                                   /
                             -=*=-/
                               ~


Lyrics by Jon Anderson

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 11:50:40 1996
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From: "Rocky Mullin" <caliban@organic.com>
Message-Id: <9605011154.ZM10829@tempest.organic.com>
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 11:54:01 -0700
In-Reply-To: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
        "Reminder: RAW Tonight." (May  1,  9:26am)
References: <199605011626.JAA07518@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
MiscInfo: your chaotic-good formatting slave
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Subject: Re: Reminder: RAW Tonight.
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	this sucks, there's no way i am going to make it all
	the way down to porter tonight :( :( :( :( :(

	anyone going to tape it?

On May 1,  9:26am, Troy Sheets wrote:
> Subject: Reminder: RAW Tonight.
>
> Just a reminder to everyone that Robert Anton Wilson is speaking tonight
> at the Porter College Cafeteria on the UC Santa Cruz Campus, from 8:00pm
> to 9:30pm.  Cost is 8 Dollars, which is a heck of a deal... He is speaking
> in SF later this week for 29 dollars!
>
> Robert Anton Wilson is a noted futurist, philosopher and Conspiracy Theory
> Guru.  "Changing the world by changing the way we think about it"
>
> -troy
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me
> tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
> http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
> troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within
>-- End of excerpt from Troy Sheets



-- 
\  c   /\  a   /\  l   /\  i   /\  b   /\  a   /\  n   /\     rocky mullin
_\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\   san francisco
  \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /organic online, inc. 
   \/      \/      \/      \/      \/ http://www.organic.com/Staff/caliban
ninja250 -- analog synthesis -- chaotic good -- the internet is my ashtray

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 12:43:01 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 12:36:43 -0800
To: wisialob@elwha.evergreen.edu, cordovac@uclink4.berkeley.edu,
        snowdeal@elwha.evergreen.edu, kotanchj@elwha.evergreen.edu,
        jfhmsh@msn.com, kwilson@tcs.com, hawkins@seattleu.edu,
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From: David Ginsberg <ginsberg@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Friends
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A friend of mine sent this to me today.  I'd like to share it with my old
friends, my current friends, and my future friends.

peacelovejoy,

David

p.s. - Happy Birthday Steph and Tony!!!

                               Friends

   It all started so innocently.  We met as strangers, thrown
together by fate.  Some of you grow up with me, others I have only
known a short while.  Some of you I have hugged constantly over the
years, and others I met at a time when hugging was 'un-cool', and
it has stayed that way, though the times have changed around us.
Some of you I have not yet met in person.
   Every one of you has enriched my life.  You have helped to teach me, to
guide me on this often turning and forking road of life.  You have
been with me through the good times and the bad.  You have comforted
me when I cried,  held me when I was afraid, and laughed with me when
I was happy.
   And now we are in college.  And though the distance between us is
not great, it is great enough.  I am no longer afraid to reach out
and hug you, in fact I long to do it.
   You had walked with me for so long that I was afraid to venture on
alone. Yet even as I feared the dark of night, along came others to
help me on my journey, in hopes that I would walk with them so they
need not journey on alone.  They picked up where you left off, and
now they are no longer strangers.
   Who are you? You might be my brother, my sister, my cousin, an
old aquanitnce or a new one.  But first and foremost, I call you
friend.  And I miss you if you are away, and if you are here, then I
thank you for standing by my side.
   And so I send you this, so that you might know that someone,
somewhere, is thinking of you, praying for you, and loveing you.  And
that person is me.   May God grant you peace and happyness in your
times of trail, and watch over you, so that one day we will meet
again.

   Friendship is a strange thing....we find ourselves telling each other the
deepest details of our lives...things we don't even share with our families
who raised us...But what is a friend? A confidant? A lover? A fellow email
junkie? A shoulder to cry on? an ear to listen? a heart to feel?...A friend
is all these things...and more.
...Whether we met IRL, over The World, over Resort, or SE, or anywhere...I
call you friend. A word so small...yet so large in feeling...a word filled
with emotion. It is true great things come in small packages. Once the
package of friendship has been opened, it can never be closed...it is a
constant book always written...waiting to be read...and enjoyed.
We may have our disagreements...we may argue...we may concern one
another...friendship is a unique bond that lasts through it all....
........A part of me is put into my friends...some it is my humor...some it
is my listening ear...some it is real life experiences...some it is my
romanticism...but with all, it is friendship.
...................Friendships forged are a construct stronger than steel...
built as a foundation....necessary for life...and necessary for love.
Friends...you and me...
..you brought another friend...and then there were 3...
....we started our group....Our circle of friends...
.....and like that circle...there is no beginning or end....
............................................................................

                   ___                  ____                  ___
              ____(   \              .-'    `-.              /   )____
             (____     \_____       /  (O  O)  \       _____/     ____)
            (____            `-----(      )     )-----'            ____)
             (____     _____________\  -____-  /_____________     ____)
               (______/              `-.____.-'              \______)
                                       **HUG**
____________________________________________________________________________

          It is by chance we met, by choice we became friends...
____________________________________________________________________________

..Keep this going....Email all your friends this message....email all those
friends you never met....those you have...and those you've lost along the
way....


* * ** *** ***** ******** ************* *********************

David Ginsberg
Student of Neurophenomenology
        and the Human Condition
University of California, Berkeley
ginsberg@uclink4.berkeley.edu
<http://www.geopages.com/athens/2001>

"There is no such reality as something."
********************* ************* ******** ***** *** ** * * 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 12:57:48 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Flamefest-O-Rama (was Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords)
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>> > > Thank you. Your validation of my facts would be most intruiging.
>> > > I can only wonder, who's zoomin' who.
>> > 
>> > They ain't your facts buddy-boy. They ain't even facts. Just some 
>> > recorded ideas that may be facts.
>> > 
>> Huh?
>> And who is buddy-boy?
>
>    Read the word 'your' in the sentance and have a cup of coffee.

Here we go: an otherwise intelligent discussion degenerating into a 
flame-fest.  Everyone stand back, we is goan have a pissin' contest.

Anyone ever heard the story of the Wildwood Flower?  Anyone want to hear it?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 13:01:56 1996
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From: Matt Kodama <starchld@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <199605012001.NAA29731@elaine30.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Re: Rave data reasoning
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 13:01:28 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.3.91.960501095424.30120A-100000@linux> from "Rave Info Compiler" at May 1, 96 10:00:04 am
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> Over the past few days ravedata has been receiving alot of slack and I 
                                                             ^^^^^
since when is slack a bad thing???
slack off - quit your job!
give me slack, or give me food, or kill me!
matt.
> just wanted to explain a few things to everyone although the problems 
> were explained and resolved (thanks to those who did apologize!) Our 
> project is aimed to bring the rave community closer together. We are not 
> trying to make a profit but rather dedicating  hundreds of hours of our time 
> to the scene we believe in...We really do appreciate the help that 
> everyone does give us. The rave info will be available on both the web 
> and on CD-Rom making this information availbale for ravers on the net and 
> not.
> Luv-
> Nicole and Matt
> "Rave Info Compilers"
> 
> 


-- 
|=======================================================================|
|									|
| i have the world's largest collection of seashells.  i keep it on all	|
| the beaches of the world ... perhaps you've seen it.			|
|									|
| you know how it is when you're reading a book and falling asleep,	|
| you're reading, reading ... and all of a sudden you notice your eyes	|
| are closed?  i'm like that all the time.				|
|									|
| i put tape on the mirrors in my house so i don't accidentally walk	|
| through into another dimension.					|
|									|
|    - steven wright			      				|
|									|
|=======================================================================|
-starchld@leland.stanford.edu--the mothership can be reached at 493-4099-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 13:19:07 1996
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From: Matt Kodama <starchld@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <199605012018.NAA00299@elaine30.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: yo!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 13:18:51 -0700 (PDT)
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music question:
heard a song at fusion during one of the later sets which had a woman
singing "yo" over and over again - at least i think that's what she was
saying ... with not too much effort you could convince yourself that she
was saying dozens of different things.  sort of like an audio rorschach
blob (pardon horrid spelling, pleez)

anyway, does anybody know whose track that was?  (artist, although i'm
curious which dj that was too.)
thanks!
matt.

-- 
|=======================================================================|
|									|
| i have the world's largest collection of seashells.  i keep it on all	|
| the beaches of the world ... perhaps you've seen it.			|
|									|
| you know how it is when you're reading a book and falling asleep,	|
| you're reading, reading ... and all of a sudden you notice your eyes	|
| are closed?  i'm like that all the time.				|
|									|
| i put tape on the mirrors in my house so i don't accidentally walk	|
| through into another dimension.					|
|									|
|    - steven wright			      				|
|									|
|=======================================================================|
-starchld@leland.stanford.edu--the mothership can be reached at 493-4099-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 13:19:13 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Crackle 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Flamefest-O-Rama (was Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords)
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>Anyone ever heard the story of the Wildwood Flower?  Anyone want to hear it?

sure!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 13:59:55 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: non-rave, ride needed
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605011315.A3843-0100000@ese.UCSC.EDU>
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Hi!
 I need a ride from Santa Cruz to SJ at about 3:00am the Sat. morn of May 
4th. Failing that a ride to the Henry J. Kaiser (the Oakland Aud) in 
Oakland by 9-10:00 am the same morning would be great!

 Either way I'll help pay gas (a deal these days  :( ) and buy breakfast. 
This is for an on call job  and I really need the money or I wouldn't 
bother everyone with this.

You can e-mail me above if there are any angels out there.


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
                               (HELP)
                                 /       
                           -=*=-/
                             ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 14:09:22 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 14:12:19 -0700
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From: sequoia1@ix.netcom.com (Chris Chervin )
Subject: Berkeley E-mail question: sorta RR
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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hey all,

I met a girl named Carla at sunset last week and I'm trying to send her 
some mail.  The problem is I'm not sure what the Berkeley adress is.  
Is this correct?

   Something@uclink4.berkeley.edu

I'm pretty sure she said uclink4.  

Thanks in advance!

love chris

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 14:13:14 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605012113.OAA06701@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Flamefest-O-Rama (was Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords)
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 14:13:00 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605011956.MAA11926@shellx.best.com> from "SDream" at May 1, 96 12:56:23 pm
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> 
> >> > > Thank you. Your validation of my facts would be most intruiging.
> >> > > I can only wonder, who's zoomin' who.
> >> > 
> >> > They ain't your facts buddy-boy. They ain't even facts. Just some 
> >> > recorded ideas that may be facts.
> >> > 
> >> Huh?
> >> And who is buddy-boy?
> >
> >    Read the word 'your' in the sentance and have a cup of coffee.
> 
> Here we go: an otherwise intelligent discussion degenerating into a 
> flame-fest.  Everyone stand back, we is goan have a pissin' contest.
> 
> Anyone ever heard the story of the Wildwood Flower?  Anyone want to hear it?
> 
> S
> 
> 

Not this time Todd, not this time.

Out,
John


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 14:22:55 1996
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The following is much better with guitar accompaniment, but given the nature
of email and the desparate need for some positive vibes lately...  My 
apologies to the original author, whose name escapes me...

Now this here's the story of the Wildwood Flower.
It's an old country classic...

The Wildwood Flower grew wild on the farm.
We never know'd what it was called.
Some said it was a flower, some said it was a weed.
I never gave it much thought.

One day I was out on the farm talking to my brother Bill
and I reached down for a weed to chew on...
Things got fuzzy and things got blurry
and then everything was GONE!

(I didn't know what happened, but I knew it beat 
the hell outta sniffing burlap...)

When I came to my brother was there
and he said, "What's wrong with your eyes?"
I said I don't know, I was chewin' on a weed.
He said, "Let me give it a try!"

Spent the rest of that day and most of that night
tryin' to find my brother Bill.
Caught up with him, 'bout 6 o'clock the next morning,
naked, singing on the windmill.

(He said he flew up there.  I had to fly up and get him
down, he was about half crazy...)

Very next day we picked a bunch of them weeds
and we put'em in the sun to dry.
Then we mashed'em up, cleaned'em off,
put'em in the corn cob pipe.

Smoking that Wildwood Flower got to be a habit.
We'd never seen no harm.
Heck, we thought it was kinda handy:
take a trip and never leave the farm!

(Yeah, big ole puff o' that Wildwood Flower and, pretty soon, 
you're just wandering around behind the little animals...)

All good things got to come to an end,
and it's the same with the Wildwood Weed.
One day this fella from Washington come by
and spied 'em and turned white as a sheet!

Well, he burned and he dug and he dug and he burned
and he killed all our cute little weeds.
Then he drove away...
And we just smiled and waved...
Sitting there on that sack o' seeds...  8)

Y'all come back now, y'hear?

S





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 14:35:28 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 14:34:27 -0700
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From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: Re: HARMONY! (BSP)
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>
>Are there any tickets still available for Harmony's Beautiful People 
this 
>Friday?
>
>S
>
>
Beautiful People this Friday was NOT a presale ticket party. So all the 
tickets ARE still avialible, since we have not sold any yet. The doors 
will open @ nine, and tickets to get in will be purchased at the door. 

We DO however have a limited capacity of 800 people. This does not mean 
800 tickets will be sold! This means ALL of the guest list, ALL of the 
crew and ALL of the ticket sales = 800 people. We are very aware of 
problems that arise when promoters overcrowd a space, and want to make 
sure that we do not create a bad situation by doing just that. 

So, yes you can still get into Beautiful People, but try to get there 
early, because tickets will probably sell out fast! Once again the 
doors open at 9pm. The party is in San Francisco, so if you are coming 
from out of town get into the city and call the info #. (We will change 
the message at around 7pm. to give the directions) 

(408)486-9591+(408)450-3044 are the info #'s

Also, due to some last minute, unexpected budget increases (rrr!) we 
are going to charge $15 at the door, instead of $13. It is all going to 
be worth it!!!!! 

Peace and love to you,

Greg :)  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 14:56:43 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 14:52:42 -0700
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From: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Subject: My Friend...
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey You Guys,

A friend of mine left Vancouver almost a year ago on trip around the 
world.  When he left on his trip he was one of the corest Deadheads 
around.  After a year away he is now a very different man.  It seems he 
spent a month in Goa, India and another month in a beach town in Thailand. 
It was at these places that he saw the light. And oh boy, did he ever see 
the light.  Now I can't keep him away from my mix tapes.  And he is 
longing for a full moon party! I really want to show this guy a great time 
while he's in S.F. and complete the deadhead~to~raver transformation.  Can 
anyone suggest any extra special events for this weekend?  Man, just 
listening to the stories this guy has about Goa makes me want to chuck 
this keyboard out the window and jump on a plane.  

If anybody is planning a trip in that direction he'd love to pass along 
all of his recently gained information. And please forward any suggestions 
for this weekend immediately!!!!

Bye For Now!

-SUNNY
Solle Clothing Co.
solle@solle.com
http://www.solle.com/solle/ (under construction)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 15:12:42 1996
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Date: Wed, 01 May 1996 15:18:04 -0700
To: kcroy@best.com (kcroy), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Health Alert/Re: heroin is orally active
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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 Hiya Alllllll!

        First, and once again let me dispell this rumor that x is cut with
Heroin, not!!!!! An interview with the head of England's toxicology lab is
available via the net. The head of the lab was asked did they ever discover
h in any x they have ever tested in there long and industrious career, the
answer not!!!!!. Sorry to be a bubble buster, it's  tuft job but someone has
to do it. Better me, being a hologram, than a real human anyway.

>Im still confused about what across the country say is 'h' cut into their
>x. i mean, ive seen it back east, too. seems pretty common. am out of ideas
>for what that slow effect is. Dont buy that the symptoms are similar to
>taking too much. b/c people have taken half hits, and still ahd that dopey
>slow effect.

        Black tar Heroin is very strongly linked to the flesh eating
bacteria. The danger is extreme strong for people that shoot it, so DON'T DO
IT, YOU NOW HAVE THE BEST REASON IN THE WORLD TO REHAB, SO JUST DO IT.

Peace
THX1138




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 15:19:58 1996
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From: reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu (Jake Reichert)
Subject: Re: 
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>Well, he burned and he dug and he dug and he burned
>and he killed all our cute little weeds.
>Then he drove away...
>And we just smiled and waved...
>Sitting there on that sack o' seeds...  8)
>
>Y'all come back now, y'hear?

Available soon:

"SDream's greatest hits!"
Including the hit singles "The devil went down to Frisco" and "The story of
the wildwood flower"

Coming to all Tower outlets and other fine stores near you

;)

Jake 
(only 7 more days to go...)


Jake Reichert			|  I used to be indecisive/
reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu	|  But now I'm not so sure...		
				|                    -The The
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                     "LONELY IS AS LONELY DOES"
B.C. Gilbert/G. Lewis ------------------------    The Happy Family
A=====================================V  Bulgarian Voices | Pixies 
|          |              |   ____    |  Bauhaus |  Frazier Chorus
|     /|   |      /\      |  |    \   |  Michael Brook |  Spirea X
|    / |   |     /  \     |  |     \  |  The Breeders |  Colourbox
|   /  |   |    /    \    |  |      | |  Dead Can Dance |  Dif Juz
|  /___|   |   /______\   |  |      | |  Throwing Muses |  The The
|      |   |  /        \  |  |     /  |  Clan of Xymox | Rema-Rema
|      |   | /          \ |  |___ /   |  Cocteau Twins | Liquorice  
A=====================================M  Lisa Germano  | M|A|R|R|S
X Mal Deutschland | Dance Chapter | Insides |   The Birthday Party
A.R. Kane | Rowland S. Howard & Lydia Lunch  | C.V.O  |  Air Miami
Ultra Vivid Scene | Unrest | Pieter Nooten/Michael Brook | Swallow
That Dog. | Psychotic Tanks  |  Lisa Gerrard  | Last Dance |  Lush
Modern English |  Budd/Fraser/Guthrie/Raymonde |  This Mortal Coil   
The Wolfgang Press |  Richenel |  His Name Is Alive  | Pale Saints
The Glee Club    ---------------------------------    Colin Newman
                       "LONELY IS AN EYESORE"      


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 15:33:04 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 15:30:46 -0800
To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Re: Traci Lords Reply (long)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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John, I want to reply to each of your points because there are all
important and deserve discussion.  But unfortunately, finals week at
Berkeley has just descended and it's an impossibility for the next two
weeks.  (Computer lab hours are short and the lines are MASSIVE - I have to
reserve my computer time for papers).  (BTW, one of which you'll be
interested to know is the inadequacy of using Western feminism to evaluate
women's "oppression" in other societies, i.e. Muslim and Third World).

I'm sure either this conversation or another will continue at a later time.

Long live healthy debate!!

Take Care,
Nancy



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 15:39:06 1996
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Date: Wed, 01 May 1996 15:42:09 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: DJ Record Annoucement
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Hiya All;!!!!

        I plan in the next couple of weeks to do at least Germany, so if
every goes as planned I would be happy to do some record shopping for you's
guys over there. E-Mail me!!!!

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 16:14:35 1996
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Date: Wed, 01 May 1996 16:13:59 -0700
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Organization: ameba
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*THIS IS AN UPDATE TO THE INFORMATION REGARDING THE SCI FI CLUB FOUND IN 
THE WEEKLY RAVE GUIDE. PLEASE ADJUST INFO- THANKS:)*

SCI-FI action club-every Sunday after the Sunset party

resident action DJs THETA-BLIP DUTCH DRC MARS SOLAR

Free food and Funky vibes in The Juicy Milk Bar (Ameba DJ team + guests)

18 and up 21 to drink

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 16:25:24 1996
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The Sci Fi Action Club 

is located 683 Clementina @ 8th and Folsom (Cat's Grill)

ph# (415) 331-1500 ex 888

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 16:58:17 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 16:52:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Beltane
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
cc: Don Williams <don_williams@macmail.ucsc.edu>,
        "D. Steve White" <stevew@orion.oriontel.com>,
        Jamie Pauline Smith <spunk@cats.ucsc.edu>,
        Gregory Sandler <ascend@ix.netcom.com>,
        brooke pomerantz <bpomeran@ucla.edu>, Andrew Knudson <andrewk@sco.com>,
        James E Kaspar <James_E_Kaspar@notes.seagate.com>,
        Farouz Gipson <Farouz@cats.ucsc.edu>,
        Denise Gallant <deniseg@xaostools.com>,
        Paul Ferrise <tiny@master.village.it>,
        nick farwell <nick_farwell@macmail.ucsc.edu>,
        brandon estuesta <brandone@sco.com>, John Draper <crunch@netcom.com>,
        "michelle d'angelo" <dangelo@cats.ucsc.edu>,
        michael clay <meclay@netcom.com>,
        Stephanie Burnetts <burnetts@cleo.bc.edu>
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Hi everyone!



!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!HAPPY BELTANE TO YOU ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


You have all enriched my life in some way! I would like to offer you all 
this blessing;




May the holy mother earth, the sacred father sun, and the 
immortal-unknowable spirit of life help you and protect you all.


Ran
                           (We LIVE!!)
                                /
                          -=*=-/
                            ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 17:04:04 1996
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Subject: Re: Narcs and narcing
To: reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu (Jake Reichert)
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 17:03:38 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199604292200.PAA25746@jeeves.usfca.edu> from "Jake Reichert" at Apr 29, 96 03:00:59 pm
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> >>Nice thought, but generally false. I actually had opportunity to ask a cop
> >>about this once and he basically laughed at the suggestion. I've read that
> >>legally they may have to, but there are several exceptions, such as if they
> >>feel they'd be endangering themselves by admitting the truth.
> >>
> >>Joe
> 
> However, by law they cannot partake of any of the substances they are trying
> to bust someone for.  In the case of marijuana, this is easy enough.  If

	Sounds like another dangerous urban legend.

	"Feds have to say yes if you ask them if they're a fed. Really
they do."

-- 
Sameer Parekh					Voice:   510-601-9777x3
Community ConneXion, Inc.			FAX:     510-601-9734
The Internet Privacy Provider			Dialin:  510-658-6376
http://www.c2.net/ (or login as "guest")		sameer@c2.net

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 17:08:20 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 17:04:46 -0700
To: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: tigger@thestranger.com (Glenn)
Subject: Re: Beltane
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At 4:52 PM 5/1/96, Randy C Cone wrote:
>Hi everyone!
>
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!HAPPY BELTANE TO YOU ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>You have all enriched my life in some way! I would like to offer you all
>this blessing;
>
>May the holy mother earth, the sacred father sun, and the
>immortal-unknowable spirit of life help you and protect you all.


Blessed be!  And a fruitful and prosperous holiday to you and yours as well!

Tigger
(ATOI, Seattle)

0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0
**************************Go Tribal, Go Deep!!!****************************
0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0

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        .  =======              .  =======               .  =======
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       \ /  \v_'/              \ /  \v_'/               \ /  \v_'/
        #   _| |_               #   _| |_                #   _| |_
       (#) (     )             (#) (     )              (#) (     )
        #\//|* *|\\             #\//|* *|\\              #\//|* *|\\
        #\/(  *  )/             #\/(  *  )/              #\/(  *  )/
        #   =====               #   =====                #   =====
        #   (\ /)               #   (\ /)                #   (\ /)
        #   || ||               #   || ||                #   || ||
       .#---'| |----.          .#---'| |----.           .#---'| |----.
        #----' -----'           #----' -----'            #----' -----'



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 17:17:43 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 17:17:21 +0200
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Re: Fire-eaters at All Together Now
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>On Tue, 30 Apr 1996 Thnkblnd@aol.com wrote:
>
>> Did anyone else (aside from me) think that the fire-eaters at All Togethe=
r
>> Now were pretty cool?!  Has anyone seen them perform before?
>>
>> -rg
>>

Yeah I saw them at a few  All Together Now parties last year.  Usually
painted blue or green.  There is usually a mixed reaction to them.  Some
say they are satanic and have no place in a loving rave scene, some say
they are perverted being dressed in little or no clothing(of course this is
at an 18+ gathering where some people dance naked anyways), I think it
brings a circus element to the party that is kinda fun to watch and
interpret...

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 18:13:03 1996
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From: Waldura Renaud <waldura@essi.fr>
Message-Id: <199605020114.DAA25612@jessica.essi.fr>
Subject: Re: End of the world party
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 03:14:09 +0200 (MET DST)
Reply-to: waldura@essi.fr
Organization: ESSI, Sophia Antipolis (France)
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In a previous mail, Eric P. Peterson wrote:
> 
> throw and End of the World Party!  It could be a synchronized event
> occurring in every major raving city in the world. 
> [...]
> Anyone want to start a planning committee?

	Well, if you consider like some <religions> that the End of the
	World will occur on January 1st, 2000... you should definitely
	have a look at the _Gaia Rave_ project, Eric!

http://www2.e.kth.se/~e94_fhu/Public/GAIA/gaia_home.html  	

	Basically the idea is the same: a synchronized event taking place
	all over the planet for the first day of the 3rd millennium.
	(aka the End of the Old World ;-)
	_Gaia Rave_ tries to gather forces to setup this big event :-)

	I already mailed them, but it seems that it is still a bit too 
	early... Or that the guys were not so serious about it.

-- 
Renaud Waldura                                   <http://www.essi.fr/~waldura/>
Computer science student, "Systems & Networks"                <waldura@essi.fr>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 18:24:31 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 18:24:25 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: TKagnoff/Goa. was: Re: My Friend...
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...
>spent a month in Goa, India and another month in a beach town in Thailand.
>It was at these places that he saw the light. And oh boy, did he ever see
...
>listening to the stories this guy has about Goa makes me want to chuck
>this keyboard out the window and jump on a plane.

Speaking of goa, I just got T. Kagnoff's tape in da mail and it kicks arse
so far...

What was the track listing? it's not in the tape.

Why no pretty cover? I'll make you one for free if you're interested...

What other goa dj's are there in SFBA whose mix tapes I could acquire?

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
| ...sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't...|
|       -> but patience always helps. <-        |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 18:40:48 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 18:40:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: Glow sticks ???
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey, hey!

Another weekend is almost here :) and doesn't it sound wonderful...  

I was wondering if anybody knows where I could buy glow sticks.  I just 
love those things :).  I live in SF, but work in South Bay so anywhere in 
between would be cool (I could get them before Fri night).

Anybody going to see Doran spin tonight?  If you are come and say hi, I
would love to meet more people.  
I have long, straight brown hair (sometimes I have glitter in it :P, but 
not tonight, maybe at Beautiful PPl)...  Hmm...  don't know how to really 
describe myself - there is nothing that's too specific...  ah! - I have a  
little gap between my teeth and I smile a lot so it's not hard to 
notice.  Sometimes I walk around and offer Starburst :).  

Hugz,
Branka

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 18:41:25 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 18:41:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: TKagnoff/Goa. was: Re: My Friend...
To: michal migurski <lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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There's always Goa Gil from Marin... phat beats tho he's mainly a DATman...


On Wed, 1 May 1996, michal migurski wrote:

> What other goa dj's are there in SFBA whose mix tapes I could acquire?
> 
> -m.
> 
> 
> 0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
> |    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
> |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
> |                                               |
> |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
> |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
> | ...sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't...|
> |       -> but patience always helps. <-        |
> |                                               |
> |              Michal Migurski                  |
> |              (510) 664-1026                   |
> 0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 18:43:06 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 18:42:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: BSP free outdoor party saturday w/ a side order of trance:)
To: Happy Ravers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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On May 4th, we'd like to play in the sun and gather for a free outdoor 
daytime BBQ and Beats Picnic Party. We'll start things off at noon and go 
until 8:30 or so.
djs will be Jonathan, Joe Rice, BioJeff, LeLe, Tom, and Ethan
There will be a limited amount of both meat and veggie BBQ'd 
food that will be provided, so please bring food you'd like to have 
as well, salads, fruits, drinks..etc. 
This will be sort of like a pot luck, so bring your favorite foods
to share with others. Call 415.525.5o52 for directions.
We'll be at a familiar north bay locale.
 
enjoy the sun,
tom

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 18:55:41 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 18:55:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Glow sticks ???
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605011827.A17346-0100000@netcom6>
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  You can find them at a sporting goods store that sells fishing 
equipment or maybe a toy store. They are easy to find:).
                    Reagan






On Wed, 1 May 1996, Branka Cehic wrote:

> 
> Hey, hey!
> 
> Another weekend is almost here :) and doesn't it sound wonderful...  
> 
> I was wondering if anybody knows where I could buy glow sticks.  I just 
> love those things :).  I live in SF, but work in South Bay so anywhere in 
> between would be cool (I could get them before Fri night).
> 
> Anybody going to see Doran spin tonight?  If you are come and say hi, I
> would love to meet more people.  
> I have long, straight brown hair (sometimes I have glitter in it :P, but 
> not tonight, maybe at Beautiful PPl)...  Hmm...  don't know how to really 
> describe myself - there is nothing that's too specific...  ah! - I have a  
> little gap between my teeth and I smile a lot so it's not hard to 
> notice.  Sometimes I walk around and offer Starburst :).  
> 
> Hugz,
> Branka
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 20:14:06 1996
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Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 20:09:56 -0700
Message-Id: <199605020309.UAA07259@dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com>
From: shawna-@ix.netcom.com (Shawna McGourty)
Subject: Re: Glow sticks ???
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>  You can find them at a sporting goods store that sells fishing 
>equipment or maybe a toy store. They are easy to find:).


Also, I've seen 'em (go figure!) in army surplus stores.  In Montreal, 
they had every color imaginable!


shawna

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 20:36:43 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: How to finish a fight.
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We have plenty of conflict here, words only go so far.  Fuck this, I want
REAL face-to-face combat.

If you think that your shit is all that, then let's battle it out, fuck
this virtual shit.  That's right, it's time for a real fight, it's time for
a circle dance challenge.

So you think my words are agressive, you ain't seen my backflip scissor
kick (damn near killed a trancer).  When I'm really angry, with a twist.

You have yet to see the hyper agressive rooster strut, saved for those
really hardheaded ones (you know who you are).

Some of my more strategic moves involves the double fake.  Not a move for
the weak, besides rhythm is required.  That is where you motion forward
with your torso, let one foot slide backward, keeping the arms in an "L"
shape at the sides, pump them three times, turn, spin, and deliver a side
swipe from the left.  Devastating.

I won't give away my many tecniques here.  No I couldn't beat the devil,
but mere mortals?  No problem.

So bring the noise...if your shit is all that, buck up.  I guarantee a
dance hurting the likes that'll send you back home to momma.

C'mon wit' it,
John




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 20:39:25 1996
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Date: Wed, 01 May 1996 20:42:30 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: My Day
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Hiya,

        I spent the day sitting on Rodeo Beach in the Marin Headlands
listening to Trance. I highly recommend a good disc man, Panasonic seem to
make the ones the play the loudest, a good pair of  headphones which exclude
the ones they give you when you buy them. I prefer my Sony MVR-600 that
rock; real bass, and of course a good selection of Trance available from F-8.

        Their was a party that happened there a while ago, on a regular
basis, can anyone tell me who put it together and how I might go about
getting in contact with them, thanks.

PS Anyone recommend a new action computer game that's not to puzzle based,
and also not an exercise in how coordinated I am with the
Cyberman/Joystick/Mouse.
Peace
THX1138
510-599-2541


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 21:12:01 1996
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Date: Wed, 01 May 1996 09:16:32 -0700
From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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Organization: CT D-Zine
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Subject: Re: Glow sticks ???
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Branka Cehic wrote:
> 
> Hey, hey!
> 
> Another weekend is almost here :) and doesn't it sound wonderful...
> 
> I was wondering if anybody knows where I could buy glow sticks.  I just
> love those things :).
> Branka


Has anyone seen those alien head lolipops with a glow stick for
a handle????? I've seen them recently at a bunch of 7-11s and
liquor stores in the south bay. A little pricey but I think they're
pretty cool.

CT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 21:14:25 1996
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To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>, Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Glow sticks ???
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Try Scuba Diving Shops as well, We use them to identify each other
underwater during night dives. They have real cool colors like purple, red
and blue too!

Jon


At  6:55 PM 5/1/96 -0700, Reagan Reid wrote:
>
>  You can find them at a sporting goods store that sells fishing
>equipment or maybe a toy store. They are easy to find:).
>                    Reagan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Wed, 1 May 1996, Branka Cehic wrote:
>
>>
>> Hey, hey!
>>
>> Another weekend is almost here :) and doesn't it sound wonderful...
>>
>> I was wondering if anybody knows where I could buy glow sticks.  I just
>> love those things :).  I live in SF, but work in South Bay so anywhere in
>> between would be cool (I could get them before Fri night).
>>
>> Anybody going to see Doran spin tonight?  If you are come and say hi, I
>> would love to meet more people.
>> I have long, straight brown hair (sometimes I have glitter in it :P, but
>> not tonight, maybe at Beautiful PPl)...  Hmm...  don't know how to really
>> describe myself - there is nothing that's too specific...  ah! - I have a
>> little gap between my teeth and I smile a lot so it's not hard to
>> notice.  Sometimes I walk around and offer Starburst :).
>>
>> Hugz,
>> Branka
>>

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 21:14:56 1996
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From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Not rave related but interesting
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You GOT to check this out, crazy...


>From: Emily Robbins <erobbins@borland.com>
>Subject: Yikes !-FWD
>
>Oh my God.  You'll have to hear it for yourself.
>
>Em
>
>>  Want a laugh? Call the following number: (704) 377-4444. When the
>>recording  comes on, hit extension 1955. Then listen. The voice you'll
>>hear belongs to a  guy who reads the school lunch menu for kids in
>>Charlotte, North Carolina, and  he is EXCITED!!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 21:37:56 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: "Obvious" advice to Harmony
To: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler)
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 21:36:05 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: SDream@tgrigsby.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Some folks might think that the following advice might be unnecessary because
it's so obvious. But I thought I'd bring up these items , in reaction to
the lastest post with information about Harmony  , because there might be
a few folks who might hold events of their own that haven't thought of
these points yet.

1. Harmony, via Gregory Sandler, has put out the information that this Friday
   evening event will not have any tickets available pre-sale. All tickets
   at the door, with much encouragement to show up early. The time of 9PM was
   as the start of ticket sales.

   My advice - start selling those tickets AT 9PM SHARP! I think there will
   be a ton of folks who'll want to go to this, and you'll get a growing,
   restless crowd milling around and shoving on the sidewalk if you do the
   typical 1/2hour  or 1 hour delay. Don't matter if the sound system isn't 
   ready yet - get those folks off the sidewalk ! 

2. When the tickets run out - change the voicemail! No use having more folks
   showing up after that , causing a haves/have nots situation and loitering.
   Maybe the voicemail should be changed when the last 20 tickets are selling.

  ... and I'm not even going to this thing ....

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 21:47:50 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605020447.VAA29414@netcom22.netcom.com>
Subject: Bass Instinct ( for calendar )
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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[ to sfraves list ]

 I happened to be in the Solid Grooves music store and found this flyer:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 the b.a.s.s. kru presents the second chapta:

 BASS INSTINCT      May 10, 1996

 0 A DRUM AND BASS CELEBRATION 0   
 FEATURING DJS: *THAD *STAREYES *ABSTRACT *FLUX *NOEL *TOMAS

 Free mix tapes for the first eighty people

 For information call 415-332-5800 ext.24-7

 BIG UP ALL JUNGLE MASSIVE - THANKS FOR MAKING NEW DAWN A SUCCESS
----------------------------------------------------------------------------


 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 21:51:23 1996
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*

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 22:04:24 1996
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From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
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I couldn't resist, so I called as soon as I got the message.  Needless to 
say, I hooke dup the trusty multitrack tape recorder... hmmm, new sample 
fodder.... ;)  Be on the lookout for LunchMenuMan on a white lable 
somewhere soon... :D
(If I ever get enough titme to play with my musical toys! grumble grumble 
grumble)

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor
               I'M FINALLY ON THE WEB!!  CHECK OUT MY ARTWORK AT: 
                 http://think.ucdavis.edu/current/apodaca.html                


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 22:06:35 1996
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From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
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Just realized a most embarrassing typo in the last post... please read my 
little rant as "...enough TIME..."
:D

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor
               I'M FINALLY ON THE WEB!!  CHECK OUT MY ARTWORK AT: 
                 http://think.ucdavis.edu/current/apodaca.html                


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 23:14:41 1996
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Jon Zimmerman wrote:

>You GOT to check this out, crazy...

OH!  I just gotta have that HOT <gasp> POTATO!  DEEP SEA <gasp> HOAGIE, HOT 
<gasp> DIGGETY DOG, and

(ready for this?)

RAVE <gasp> FOR RAVIOLI!

Where did you *find* this?  That was too hilarious!!

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 23:18:12 1996
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Date: Wed, 01 May 1996 23:20:07 -0700
To: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Andrew Nourse" <andy@pythagoras.org>
Subject: Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords
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At 05:22 PM 4/29/96 PDT, Nancy wrote:
>Also, mainstream porn (made almost exclusively for men) is damaging in that
>it is NOT A REALISTIC PORTRAYAL OF FEMALE SEXUALITY.

It is rather unrealistic about male sexuality also.

>The women are portrayed as having the exact same sexual response as men.
i.e. there is
>no foreplay required, a woman is ready to go at a moment's notice, she is
>willing to have sex with anyone in the room without having to have any sort
>of relationship with them, and she has uncontrollable orgasms from intercourse.

They always tell us guys that that's what our sexual response is supposed to be,
but not all of us believe everything we are told.

The sort of thing you describe above certainly isn't what turns me on.
Perhaps that is why I find nearly all mainstream porn to be boring.
(Making sex boring, now that IS obscene).

>women who cannot communicate just what they really need from a lover.

Don't give up trying.

>Hopefully as a society we can move beyond our current model of sex as a) a
>display of dehumanized women for the man, and b) nasty and degrading to
>women.  This whole concept of what sex is evidences, to me, the sickness of
>our society.

They try to turn it into a commodity, and rather ineptly at that.
(kind of like what bad promoters do to raves).

>  Hopefully we can move toward a healthy, loving, equitable
>sexuality - and hopefully the mindset that will birth it is what we are
>creating in rave.

I hope so too.

>Change starts with the individual.  For myself, I have thrown away
>societal's pressure on my sexuality and proudly claim MY real desires - a
>loving relationship, my own pleasure (foreplay), respect and consensuality,
>and absolute enjoyment of sex.

It's possible that that's what everyone (of either sex) wants, once we get
past what
we are told we want.

>  I will support erotica and writings and
>photography from women - a sexuality that is beautiful, arousing, and
equitable.

I would hope that something like this could also be created by men, or even
by men
and women working together.  I'd love to see more of it in any case, whoever
does it.

>  I refuse to believe that being disturbed by current pornography
>means we cannot be sexually liberated.

Just don't assume that everyone *else* who opposes pornography will support the
sexual liberation of women.  The xtian right, in particular, has the
opposite agenda.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 23:18:20 1996
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Date: Wed, 01 May 1996 23:20:24 -0700
To: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Andrew Nourse" <andy@pythagoras.org>
Subject: Re: My Friend...
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At 02:52 PM 5/1/96 -0700, Sunny wrote:
>Hey You Guys,
>
>A friend of mine left Vancouver almost a year ago on trip around the 
>world.  When he left on his trip he was one of the corest Deadheads 
>around.  After a year away he is now a very different man.  It seems he 
>spent a month in Goa, India and another month in a beach town in Thailand. 
>It was at these places that he saw the light.

I'm sure he had seen it before, which is probably why he had followed the Dead.
They showed millions of us that music was for dancing to, and so much more.

A year ago, the Grateful Dead were still a going concern, that we all expected
to be going for quite a bit longer.   That changed very abruptly last August 9.

Raves give us another place to dance for hours and hours with wonderful people.
For that I am truely Grateful.  So, evidently, is your friend.

> And oh boy, did he ever see 
>the light.  Now I can't keep him away from my mix tapes.  And he is 
>longing for a full moon party! I really want to show this guy a great time 
>while he's in S.F. and complete the deadhead~to~raver transformation.

Is that really a transformation at all?

We are Everywhere.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  1 23:47:17 1996
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From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: attn: TKagnoff
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could you please e-mail me?

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
| ...sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't...|
|       -> but patience always helps. <-        |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 00:03:16 1996
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 02 May 1996 00:03:03 -0800 (PST)
Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 00:03:03 -0800 (PST)
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From: Jonas Hanning <hanning@SONOMA.EDU>
Subject: Kagnoff's tape!!!
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Just got this in the mail today, and it's the bomb! I know it's
been posted already, but I'd REALLY love to get a tracklisting
for it. And for those of you who like trance, and want a great
tape, talk to Mr Kagnoff! =)

reeeespect, jonas
...........................................................
..::DJ E(skimo!)::....:::Jonas Hanning:::....::dabalhed::..
.......:::http://www.sonoma.edu/students/hanning/:::.......
...........................................................


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 00:56:12 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 00:56:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Re: Not rave related but interesting
To: SDream <SDream@tgrigsby.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605020613.XAA18665@shellx.best.com>
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Definitely worth a dime....!  except I certainly hope this enthusiastic 
person isnt' the cook!!!!!!!!  Sounded like he was having a *ahem* little 
too much fun....I'll pass on the secret sauce... thank ya kindly...  ;-)
--Mau
 

On Wed, 1 May 1996, SDream wrote:

> Jon Zimmerman wrote:
> 
> >You GOT to check this out, crazy...
> 
> OH!  I just gotta have that HOT <gasp> POTATO!  DEEP SEA <gasp> HOAGIE, HOT 
> <gasp> DIGGETY DOG, and
> 
> (ready for this?)
> 
> RAVE <gasp> FOR RAVIOLI!
> 
> Where did you *find* this?  That was too hilarious!!
> 
> S
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 06:05:17 1996
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Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 06:06:50 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: BSP/SFR Calendar Event
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On May 4th, we'd like to play in the sun and gather for a free outdoor 
daytime BBQ and Beats Picnic Party. We'll start things off at noon and go 
until 8:30 or so.

djs will be Jonathan, Joe Rice, BioJeff, LeLe, Tom, and Ethan
There will be a limited amount of both meat and veggie BBQ'd 
food that will be provided, so please bring food you'd like to have 
as well, salads, fruits, drinks..etc. 
This will be sort of like a pot luck, so bring your favorite foods
to share with others. Call 415.525.5o52 for directions.
We'll be at a familiar north bay locale.
 


Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 07:09:22 1996
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Date: Thu, 02 May 96 07:02:56 PST
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: How to finish a fight.
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     what the fuck is this?????


______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: How to finish a fight.
Author:  jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee) at INTERNET
Date:    5/1/96 8:46 PM


We have plenty of conflict here, words only go so far.  Fuck this, I want 
REAL face-to-face combat.
     
If you think that your shit is all that, then let's battle it out, fuck 
this virtual shit.  That's right, it's time for a real fight, it's time for 
a circle dance challenge.
     
So you think my words are agressive, you ain't seen my backflip scissor 
kick (damn near killed a trancer).  When I'm really angry, with a twist.
     
You have yet to see the hyper agressive rooster strut, saved for those 
really hardheaded ones (you know who you are).
     
Some of my more strategic moves involves the double fake.  Not a move for 
the weak, besides rhythm is required.  That is where you motion forward 
with your torso, let one foot slide backward, keeping the arms in an "L" 
shape at the sides, pump them three times, turn, spin, and deliver a side 
swipe from the left.  Devastating.
     
I won't give away my many tecniques here.  No I couldn't beat the devil, 
but mere mortals?  No problem.
     
So bring the noise...if your shit is all that, buck up.  I guarantee a 
dance hurting the likes that'll send you back home to momma.
     
C'mon wit' it,
John
     
     
     


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 07:34:48 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 07:34:37 -0700
From: ccat@netcom.com (Chris Beaumont)
Message-Id: <199605021434.HAA06083@netcom17.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Pornography/Erotica
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  I, for one, would really like to hear what people think would be
non-sexist, women-friendly erotica.. I know it when I see it, but that's
fairly rare.. I tend to lean towards the slightly less-slick "amateur"
erotica.. but that might not be PC enough for some.. A very close (woman)
friend of mine has wanted for years to produce woman-friendly erotica, but
I suspect it would be hard to please everybody. In any case.. I hope
people don't stop trying....   :)
It's always been my feeling that sexual repression is used to control the 
masses...  Hows that for my Mayday statement?

-Chris. 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 08:12:16 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 08:06:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: My Friend...
To: Andrew Nourse <andy@pythagoras.org>
cc: Sunny <solle@ix.netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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This is a great point about the Dead--   I too am an upgraded
Deadhead-turned-raver.  The psychedelic Dionysean Light was introduced 
to so many people before Acid House began in the 80's... also, the whole 
"cyberhippie" phenom grew out of Deadhead Taper geeks and those of us who 
blathered on endlessly about Tapes and Tours via the pre-Web internet 
(geez, just look at the history of the WELL)!  Acid Test, indeed!  =)

But, with the exception of some true believer-Heads, the GD scene had 
become so chock full of posers and "theme park hippies in costume" (as 
pointed out in the book Generation X), it seems Rave allows for much 
more genuine cultural growth, with an appeal that ranges far beyond the 
patouli-wearin' masses that followed the Dead.  For instance, it's a lot 
easier for a Club Kid to accidently "see the light" at a rave, because a 
real rave is not so far a leap from the club scenes they are used to.  
But mention the Dead to some of these kids, and they may poo-poo it as so 
much hippy-dippy bullshit that their parents were into (ugh!).

Just another positive cultural effect of the digital revoIution, IMO.
Indeed, we ARE everywhere, and I too am Grateful.

=) 

"Wake now, discover that you are the sun that the morning brings."

-John


On Wed, 1 May 1996, Andrew Nourse wrote:

> I'm sure he had seen it before, which is probably why he had followed the Dead.
> They showed millions of us that music was for dancing to, and so much more.
> 
> Raves give us another place to dance for hours and hours with wonderful 
> people. For that I am truely Grateful.  So, evidently, is your friend.
> 
> We are Everywhere.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 09:40:06 1996
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To: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: F-8 beach party review
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Thank you so much for voicing your concerns, Maureen!  I, too, helped
collect some litter, and was amazed that only a small handful of
individuals were doing the same.  I wish I had met you that night, so if
nothing else we could have been a clean-up crew.
Whenever I visit a beautiful natural wonderland, such as that beach, I take
nothing but memories and leave nothing but footprints.  I even kept candy
wrappers and the like in my pockets till I got home!
I encourage everyone to help remove our presence from the areas we use to
celebrate life, because littering helps to destroy life.

Thanks again.  Much love to all,

- Eric P.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 10:12:49 1996
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To: Matt Kodama <starchld@leland.Stanford.EDU>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Rave data reasoning
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>> Over the past few days ravedata has been receiving alot of slack and I
>                                                             ^^^^^
>since when is slack a bad thing???
>slack off - quit your job!
>give me slack, or give me food, or kill me!
>matt.
I think flak was the intended term, not slack.

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 10:13:44 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 13:13:08 -0400
Message-ID: <960502131307_482774524@emout12.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: This wknd-CABIN TRIP 2!!  :)x<
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With a plethora of excellent options on where to put your body this weekend,
allow me to throw one more in the hat......

:)x<    : )x<  CABIN TRIP TOO!! - THIS FRI/SAT/SUN   :)x<    :)x<    
   Join us for a fun filled weekend in South Lake.  There are 3 or 4 spaces
left.  HERE'S THE SKINNY: This FRI, SAT, SUN. * 15-20 peoples in a 2BD/2ba
cabin W/HOT TUB, * not neccesarily an SFR event-a MIXED GROUP of good,
peacefull & fun, raver & non(yet) raver folks, *  TURNTABLES yes, but a small
sound system w/annonymous D.J.s, *  MIXED MUSIC: house, alt., gen x retro
goodies, ambi, and a taste of GOA compliments of J-Sun back home from
Savannah, * bring yer rekkids & discuses *  really cool LIGHTING, lil lasers,
and more by NUTRALIGHT  *  CHEAP!: $15-20/person, * communal din din
saturNIGHT * snowbarding optional saturDAY * new and improved-easy to
use-failsafe DIRECTIONS *  Last one went off like mad!!! (Sorry no naked
Moonpuppys this time : [ )

DETAILS: No need to send check, however NEED DEFINITE RESPONSES ASAP (first
replies get the goose, sorry I have not organized this very well and wish we
had more space), check with your mates, yer mom, yer psychic, whatever, but
make sure you'll be able to go FER SHER, then send me email WITH YOUR PHONE
#'S stating "Yes Steveo! I Wouldn't Miss It For The World!, Sign Me Up!" or
call me @800.388.8890 ext.777 before 4PM or after 10pm@916.443.8225.

Love, Love, Love,
Steve



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 10:15:49 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 10:15:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: Melissa Wong <inanna@best.com>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: A law students reply to "Narcs"
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 Hi everyone!  With all the confusion about narcs recently I e-mailed my
friend Erin, who some of you might know, and asked him what he knew on the
subject.  Here's his reply: 


Melissa,

I just read your message about Narcs.  As a lawyer-to-be, I think I 
should respond.  The entrapment defense very rarely works, and it is 
highly unlikely that just by asking whether someone is a narc would do 
it.  There are two ways to establish the entrapment defense:

1.  Show that the government's actions were so outrageous as to make a 
conviction unjust.  To my knowledge, this approach has only worked once.  
The defendant had shown some interest in kiddie porn in the past, but all 
indications were that he had reformed.  The government mailed him kiddie 
porn catalogs continuously over a five year period, until he finally gave 
in and ordered something.  This was considered so outrageous by the 
Supreme Court as to warrant an acquittal.

2.  Show that, prior to the government's actions, the defendant was not 
predisposed to commit the crime.  The danger of this defense is that, 
once it is raise, the defendant's character becomes an issue, and the 
prosecution can bring in evidence of prior convictions and other things 
that they otherwise could not.  For instance, one stay in rehab in the 
past may be enough to kill the defense.  Even with a clean record, 
though, this defense is hard.  In the average buying situation, the mere 
fact that a narc whispered "kind buds" as you walked by would not give 
you entrapment.  Only if you could show that the narc had to talk a 
reluctant buyer into buying could you establish the defense, and it would 
take a lot of cajoling by the narc to show this.  If you are a seller, 
the mere fact that you are carrying salable quantities would kill the 
entrapment defense. 

I just thought everyone should be clear on this.  Courts hate the 
entrapment defense, and it only works in outrageous situations.  The fact 
that a narc denies that he is a narc does not qualify.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 10:18:07 1996
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To: David Ginsberg <ginsberg@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Friends
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Remember, everyone, that the word "friend" ends in e-n-d, for true
friendships never end.

Corny but sincere,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 10:21:40 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 10:21:19 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: How to finish a fight.
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At 8:36 PM  -0700 5/1/96, John S. Lee wrote:

>So bring the noise...if your shit is all that, buck up.  I guarantee a
>dance hurting the likes that'll send you back home to momma.
>
>C'mon wit' it,
>John

Ah...John Lee makes me smile!  :^)

Maybe one day I'll meet the man...

TR



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 10:22:57 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 10:18:23 -0800
To: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Glow sticks ???
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Don't know where to find glow sticks but...

At 6:40 PM  -0700 5/1/96, Branka Cehic wrote:

>Anybody going to see Doran spin tonight?  If you are come and say hi, I
>would love to meet more people.
>I have long, straight brown hair (sometimes I have glitter in it :P, but
>not tonight, maybe at Beautiful PPl)...  Hmm...  don't know how to really
>describe myself - there is nothing that's too specific...  ah! - I have a
>little gap between my teeth and I smile a lot so it's not hard to
>notice.  Sometimes I walk around and offer Starburst :).

"...nothing that's too specific...?!"  Girl, you are beautiful! and there
are all kinds of things that make you specific, terrific, balistic,
dope-istic, maybe prolific?, and an all around cool woman!

Allow me to add that she will turn when called the "Croatian Sensation",
she's outgoing, friendly, has a funny accent, and is about 5'5".  Plus,
she's hella cool.

;^)

Tony



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 11:04:47 1996
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From: MIKE BOLGER <dislex@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: all together now => sunset
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man, there is just no way you can tell what's going on in someone else's 
head. you may guess and be right some of the time, or get a rough idea 
what ballpark they're playing in, but I don't care how clever you think 
you are, how keen your skills of perception have been tuned, whether 
you're a lover or a psychic, there is just no way you can be certain 
what's going on in someone else's head. 

I talked to this person this weekend. her name's Kristen.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 11:05:40 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 11:05:17 -0700 (PDT)
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: How to finish a fight.
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On Thu, 2 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:

> At 8:36 PM  -0700 5/1/96, John S. Lee wrote:
> 
> >So bring the noise...if your shit is all that, buck up.  I guarantee a
> >dance hurting the likes that'll send you back home to momma.
> >
> >C'mon wit' it,
> >John
> 
> Ah...John Lee makes me smile!  :^)
> 
> Maybe one day I'll meet the man...
> 

Didn't you know John S. Lee is an Artifical Intelligence?(now there's a 
twisted thought....) ;-)

                                             Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 12:10:33 1996
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Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 12:14:54 -0700
From: Diana Greer <inanna@ccnet.com>
Organization: The Lab
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To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
CC: Nancy <nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Traci Lords Reply (long)
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Hey you two.  Stop that!  Its a desert topping AND a floor wax=85=85

Pornography is objectification.  (That is the whole *idea*,)

Will-power, common sense, personal mores, self-control, a conscience; =

whatever you label that special part of a persons soul that helps us to =

decide what is right and what is wrong determines whether or not people =

commit acts of violence or kindness to others, NOT how much =

pornography/violence a person watches.  Conversely, you can listen to =

inspirational Pat Robertson speeches and go to church regularly and that =

is still no guarantee that you will be able to stifle the urge to insult =

the fast food clerk that gets your MacMeal order wrong=85..No, its all =

about making choices on how to act according to the societal rules you =

grew up with.  If we want a society of respect, we have to BEHAVE =

respectfully as an example of all.

" (There was a time when I couldn't look at no
woman, less massah either hang me or kill me.  Now that those days are
over, I intend to do some extra looking for all those brothers who
couldn't). "

John!  Get over it.  The past is the past.  There is no reason to ogle =

people just to prove a point.

John, you spend a bunch of time writing "He" and "She" when you could be =

saying "s/he" or something like that to indicate the inter-changability =

of gender.  (You frequently fall into the tired, old and so out-dated =

stereotypes about women and men.)

Peace, ((or maybe we don=92t need any right now?)  (Oh I know, I=92ll end =

this note with "regards."))

Regards,

Diana

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 12:49:42 1996
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 Just wanting to ask those of you that plan to goto the Big BBQ Party
Saturday if any of you have 1 or 2 folding tables that can be used to set
food on. Please let me know, thanks.

Tim (knucklehead) 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 13:10:35 1996
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Hey fellow spirits!

I've been in class all week for NT Server 3.51 .. Yeah, I know .. Big deal! 
BUT, like a doof, I haven't checked my mail in over a week .. Too many 
messages .. Close to 700 total.  If someone could be so kind and summarize 
where we are on doing a south bay event, I'd be so stoked .... In the 
meantime .. I've got a lotta catching up to do!!!!

Empathy to all!!!!
Dave
-- 
***********************************************
*   MM      MM EEEEEEE      A      NN    NN   *
*   MMM    MMM EE          A A     NNN   NN   *  
*   MMMM  MMMM EEEEE      A   A    NN N  NN   *
*   MM  MM  MM EEEEE     AAAAAAA   NN  N NN   *
*   MM  MM  MM EE       A       A  NN   NNN   *
*   MM  MM  MM EEEEEEE A         A NN    NN   *
*             P  E  O  P  L  E                *
*SUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCK *
*UCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKS *
*CKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSU *
*KSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUCKSUC *
***********************************************

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 14:43:04 1996
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From: reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu (Jake Reichert)
Subject: Re: How to finish a fight.
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>On Thu, 2 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:
>
>> At 8:36 PM  -0700 5/1/96, John S. Lee wrote:
>> 
>> >So bring the noise...if your shit is all that, buck up.  I guarantee a
>> >dance hurting the likes that'll send you back home to momma.
>> >
>> >C'mon wit' it,
>> >John
>> 
>> Ah...John Lee makes me smile!  :^)
>> 
>> Maybe one day I'll meet the man...
>> 
>
>Didn't you know John S. Lee is an Artifical Intelligence?(now there's a 
>twisted thought....) ;-)

Actually, Moonpup _and_ John are replicants.

Just a lil' note from the Blade Runner department,

Jake

Who's bullshit presentation will be OVER in 30 minutes. YYYYAAAYYY!!!!!


Jake Reichert			|  I used to be indecisive/
reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu	|  But now I'm not so sure...		
				|                    -The The
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                     "LONELY IS AS LONELY DOES"
B.C. Gilbert/G. Lewis ------------------------    The Happy Family
A=====================================V  Bulgarian Voices | Pixies 
|          |              |   ____    |  Bauhaus |  Frazier Chorus
|     /|   |      /\      |  |    \   |  Michael Brook |  Spirea X
|    / |   |     /  \     |  |     \  |  The Breeders |  Colourbox
|   /  |   |    /    \    |  |      | |  Dead Can Dance |  Dif Juz
|  /___|   |   /______\   |  |      | |  Throwing Muses |  The The
|      |   |  /        \  |  |     /  |  Clan of Xymox | Rema-Rema
|      |   | /          \ |  |___ /   |  Cocteau Twins | Liquorice  
A=====================================M  Lisa Germano  | M|A|R|R|S
X Mal Deutschland | Dance Chapter | Insides |   The Birthday Party
A.R. Kane | Rowland S. Howard & Lydia Lunch  | C.V.O  |  Air Miami
Ultra Vivid Scene | Unrest | Pieter Nooten/Michael Brook | Swallow
That Dog. | Psychotic Tanks  |  Lisa Gerrard  | Last Dance |  Lush
Modern English |  Budd/Fraser/Guthrie/Raymonde |  This Mortal Coil   
The Wolfgang Press |  Richenel |  His Name Is Alive  | Pale Saints
The Glee Club    ---------------------------------    Colin Newman
                       "LONELY IS AN EYESORE"      


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 14:51:38 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 14:49:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Glow sticks ???
To: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605011827.A17346-0100000@netcom6>
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On Wed, 1 May 1996, Branka Cehic wrote:

> 
> Hey, hey!
> 
> Another weekend is almost here :) and doesn't it sound wonderful...  
> 
> I was wondering if anybody knows where I could buy glow sticks.  I just 
> love those things :).  I live in SF, but work in South Bay so anywhere in 
> between would be cool (I could get them before Fri night).

I've found glow sticks at Toys-R-Us (plus lots of other cool things like 
play dough and flourescent markers!!).  Anywhere that sells kids toys 
will most likely have them!! :)

:)
kc

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 14:54:46 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: attn: Kristen, i lost your address for the Goa tape!
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i accidently cashed your check b4 writing down your address from it. please
email me your address so i can mail your Goa mix tape to you immeadiately.

-theron

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 15:11:17 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 15:07:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords
To: Andrew Nourse <andy@pythagoras.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <19960502061638.AAA23226@[204.119.89.82]>
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On Wed, 1 May 1996, Andrew Nourse wrote:

> 
> >  I will support erotica and writings and
> >photography from women - a sexuality that is beautiful, arousing, and
> equitable.
> 
> I would hope that something like this could also be created by men, or even
> by men
> and women working together.  I'd love to see more of it in any case, whoever
> does it.

Since this whole pornography issue is still going on, I thought I'd tell 
everyone where they can get a variety of pornography/erotica that is very 
sensitive to every *issue*.  The store is Good Vibrations (both in SF and 
Berkeley and by mail order).  It is a worker-owned and operated 
cooperative, founded by women.  There is a whole pornography (I am not 
distingishing between pornography and erotica because words are only 
words) section that has sub-categories such as "woman centered", gay, 
lesbian, bisexual, superstar, etc. etc.  There are reviews of every tape, 
and enough variey for all porn aficcionados.  I really don't want to jump 
into Good Vibe's views on porn, but they approach it in a sensitive, 
sex-positive view.  (if you want to talk to me about it, email me 
privately).  We are very lucky to have Good Vibe's in SF, and they are 
respectful of all sexualities and genders.  I'm sure many of you already 
know this, but those of you who don't, you should check it out sometime!

--kc

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 15:16:58 1996
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From: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
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hey kiddos-
does anybody have room for 1 or 2 extra sf people? we have gas money and 
whatever else. 
thanx
luv sarah

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 15:55:06 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 15:54:59 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: ride? was: Re: BSP/SFR Calendar Event
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Is anyone from Berkeley/Oakland going who might have rom for an extra in
their car? I'm thinking about checking this out...

call or e-mail me.

-m.

>On May 4th, we'd like to play in the sun and gather for a free outdoor
>daytime BBQ and Beats Picnic Party. We'll start things off at noon and go
>until 8:30 or so.
...
>This will be sort of like a pot luck, so bring your favorite foods
>to share with others. Call 415.525.5o52 for directions.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
| ...sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't...|
|       -> but patience always helps. <-        |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 16:10:30 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 16:09:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords
To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
cc: Andrew Nourse <andy@pythagoras.org>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Once again, on a different topic... I concur with Andy!  
Laura Miller of Good Vibrations is a fellow WELLbeing--  goodvibe@well.com

Their shop and catalog helps promote love and sensuality without 
judgement or exploitation.

Check it out!  And no sissor-kicks!   =)
-John


On Thu, 2 May 1996, KaySEE wrote:

> On Wed, 1 May 1996, Andrew Nourse wrote:
> 
> > 
> > >  I will support erotica and writings and
> > >photography from women - a sexuality that is beautiful, arousing, and
> > equitable.
> > 
> > I would hope that something like this could also be created by men, or even
> > by men
> > and women working together.  I'd love to see more of it in any case, whoever
> > does it.
> 
> Since this whole pornography issue is still going on, I thought I'd tell 
> everyone where they can get a variety of pornography/erotica that is very 
> sensitive to every *issue*.  The store is Good Vibrations (both in SF and 
> Berkeley and by mail order).  It is a worker-owned and operated 
> cooperative, founded by women.  There is a whole pornography (I am not 
> distingishing between pornography and erotica because words are only 
> words) section that has sub-categories such as "woman centered", gay, 
> lesbian, bisexual, superstar, etc. etc.  There are reviews of every tape, 
> and enough variey for all porn aficcionados.  I really don't want to jump 
> into Good Vibe's views on porn, but they approach it in a sensitive, 
> sex-positive view.  (if you want to talk to me about it, email me 
> privately).  We are very lucky to have Good Vibe's in SF, and they are 
> respectful of all sexualities and genders.  I'm sure many of you already 
> know this, but those of you who don't, you should check it out sometime!
> 
> --kc
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 16:24:56 1996
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From: Derek Chung <dhchung@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605022324.QAA23933@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: This Week's SFR Calendar!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (SF Raves)
Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 16:24:50 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves-calendar@hyperreal.com (SFR Calendar)
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This week I'm pleased to announce a new web site I've been working on with
a few other people.  The magazine, Late Train, is dedicated to the late 
night life.  Of special interest to SFR subscribers is the
search interface to the SFR calendar - you can retrieve party and
club info based on genre, age limit, price, location, DJ, etc; you can
also retrieve listings for just the current day or week, or for any particular
day in the past or future.

Also in the site is a database of 24-hour and other late night restaurants,
stores and services, so you can find out where to go before and after events. 
We have some photo work, reviews, and other articles in there, and we're 
working on more.

The URL for Late Train is http://www.hyperreal.com/zines/late/.  To get to the
search engine for the calendar, navigate to SF, then clubs.  To get to the
24-hour listings, navigate to SF, then 24-7, or the diner.  To get involved
with the magazine, check out the info section linked to the home page.


                                THE SFR CALENDAR
                                       
    http://www.hyperreal.com/raves/sf/calendar/gencal.cgi
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Upcoming Parties in the San Francisco Bay Area

   Friday, May 3rd - Bagok Tribe presents Xochipilli
   James Christian, That Kid Chris, John Howard, Sausee, Dreamer and Pat
   Allen (2x4), Soulstice (live).
   415.437.6905 510.674.8663
   
   Friday, May 3rd - Harmony presents _Beautiful People_
   Trent, Ethan, Greg, Deaks, Graeme, Shilo Maggi, special guest.
   limited capacity of 800 people.
   9pm-. SF. 408.486.9591 408.450.3044
   
   Friday, May 3rd - _kit kat_
   Jay-J, Eric Lacey, Jellybear.
   9pm-, 21+. Club 181, 181 Eddy St, SF.
   
   Saturday, May 4th - Wicked 
   Markie, Garth, Jeno, Thomas.
   11pm-8am, 21+, $15. SF. 415.512.5713
   
   Saturday, May 4th - _Down To Earth_
   Galen, John Howard, Solar.
   415.985.7109
   
   Saturday, May 4th - _Lettuce Dance 3_
   Astronaut Scott, Lucas, Mars, Jeff, Jesse (Delta 9).
   The Sea of Tranquility
   408.427.4501
   
   Saturday, May 4th - _Contribute_
   Simon, Tony, Josh, Billy, Astral Matrix.
   Visuals by Dimension Se7en.
   Proceeds donated to the Julie Fena Lavulo transplants fund.
   18+. 415.794.3134
   
   Saturday, May 4th - _BBQ & Beats Picnic Party_
   Jonathan, Joe Rice, BioJeff, LeLe, Tom, Ethan.
   limited amount of BBQ food provided, please bring some to share.
   12noon-8:30pm, All ages, Free. 415.525.5052
   
   Friday, May 10th - _Something Free_
   Ethan, Le Le, Tom, Dan Barnes.
   Free. 415.525.5052
   
   Friday, May 10th - Rain Dance Productions presents _Building Blocks_
   Garth, Carlos, Mark Farina, Tom, Spun, Woolove, Harry Who?.
   408.425.3316 415.965.5045 510.889.2922
   
   Friday, May 10th - _The Happening_
   Tomas Trouble, Donald Glaude, DRC, Pat (UK), Matthew Gadfathr.
   advance tix at Ameba & Primal Records
   415.267.3927 510.464.5985
   
   Friday, May 10th - _Funky Tekno Tribe vs Goldie & the Metalheadz_
   Goldie, Doc Scott, Graeme, DJ Dan, Markie, Raymond Roker , Professor
   Smith.
   10pm-, 21+. 525 Harrison, SF. 415.266.8215
   
   Friday, May 10th - the b.a.s.s. kru presents Bass Instinct
   A Drum and Bass Celebration
   Thad, Stareyes, Abstract, Flux, Noel, Tomas.
   Free mix tapes for the first eighty people
   415.332.5800x247
   
   Saturday, May 11st - _The Happening_
   outdoor party - 1/2 price to attendees of the 5.10.96 Happening
   415.267.3927 510.464.5985
   
   Saturday, May 11st - GK Productions/FunkyBeat presents _Experience_
   Dutch, Christophe, Mystr-E, Ivo, Max Factor, Jin, Nam, Spinner,
   Blesed, Essence, Paucus.
   510.980.8861 415.605.1915 408.488.1350
   
   Saturday, May 11st - _madness_
   Ethan, Alex Windsor, Jon Santos, Joe Rice, Peter Lazonby.
   
   Friday, May 17th - King St Garage
   Anita, Patrick, David Harness.
   10pm-, 21+, $4. King St Garage, 174 King St @ 3rd., SF. 415.522.6887
   
   Friday, May 17th - Ultra 5 presents _Smarties _
   Pierre (NYC), Eric Davenport, Barry Weaver, DJ Dan, Jeno, Kimo.
   9pm-7am, . 800.204.3986 415.437.5503 408.345.2399 916.484.4006
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Origin presents _Liquid Sky Music west coast tour_
   Teri Bristol (Miss Thing), Reese (NYC), Markie, Simon, Garth, Rob
   Doten.
   Virgin location, free water and organic food.
   415.675.5605 408.236.3398 415.541.5646 916.484.4213
   
   Saturday, May 18th - SqUAreOne presents _Fresh Start_
   Karizma, Rig-A-Tony, Lego, Pelican Boy, Dr. Jimmy Zimms, special
   guest.
   discount for May Babies w/i.d.
   $10. SF. 415.263.3987
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Spundae presents _Space Teddy_
   Keoki, DJ Dan, Mystr-E, Mars, Jon Santos, David Michael.
   415.764.2922
   
   Friday, May 24th - Space Children & In-Touch presents _Open Space_
   A1 (Texas), DJ Dan, Donald Glaude, Graeme, Cesar, Radley.
   415.267.3916 510.433.7216 408.327.9277 916.554.7177
   
   Saturday, May 25th - _Funky Tekno Tribe_
   Graeme, DJ Dan, Simon, Tony, Galen, Jon Williams, special guests.
   415.266.8215 415.266.9215
   
   Saturday, May 25th - _a higher state of freedom_
   andre lucero, taj, galen, sean murray, goura candra.
   Free. 415.303.5336
   
   Sunday, May 26th - _Spundae_
   John Aquaviva, Jon Williams, Simon, Henrik, Tony, Felix, David
   Michael, Kimball Collins, Mark Lewis, DJ Dan, Carlos, Miquel, Pete
   Avila, David Harness.
   Visuals by Dimension Se7en.
   9pm-8am, 21+. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.974.9389
   
   Friday, May 31st - _Needles_
   Barry Weaver, Donald Glaude, Chris Flores, Karizma, Dutch, Matthew,
   Miah, Stevie, Vibes, Flash, Dennis, Rockit, Filip, Scot, Carlos
   Campos.
   runs all weekend (thru 6/2)
   415.313.7107 916.440.2707
   
   Saturday, June 1st - _Tribal Future Big Mountain Boogie_
   Tony, Carlos, Josh, John Howard, Tracy, Galen, Solar, Alex Windsor,
   Alika, Abstract, Pollywog, Dan Barnes, Allen, Andrew, Nathan, DJ
   Crack.
   runs from noon Saturday until midnight or later Sunday.
   tix at Ameba and Primal.
   $20. Willits. 415.750.9368
   
   Wednesday, August 28th - Burning Man 1996
   includes Wicked Sound System.
   save $10 by registering by June 1st.
   runs entire weekend, through September 2nd.
   All ages, $35. Black Rock Desert, Nevada. 415.985.7471
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
W E E K L I E S

   House/techno/acid jazz/ambient/etc reg'lar happenins Some of them may
   have ended - let me know when that happens...
   
  Thursday
  
   Lift - House w/DJs David Harness, Aaron O, Jay-J, Black, guests.
   12mid-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma, SF. 415.267.5984
   
   Velvet Shop - House, Techno. call for location
   21+, $5. 4th St Bowl, , SJ. 408.235.1556
   
   _Azul_ - House, Soul w/DJs Alfie, James. 21+, Free. Casanova, 527
   Valencia, SF.
   
   Full House - Acid Jazz, House w/DJs Finn, Matt Bernsen, Andrew
   Rawnsley, Bruno Ybarra, guests, live musicians. 10pm-2am, 21+, $3.
   Miss Pearl's Jam House, Eddy & Larkin, SF.
   
   Pack-a-Bowl - "We'll be droppin the wax while you're droppin the
   balls" w/DJs Mars, Tracy, guests. 8:30pm-2am, $6. Park Bowl, Haight @
   Stanyan, SF. 415.541.5019
   
   _Diversity_ - jungle, trance. Every other Thursday
   18+, $5. , Sacramento 916.203.TRIP
   
   .blitz - foxyboysfancygirlsfreshmademixes begins April 4th
   21+. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   _Le Jazz Hot!_ - future sounds for jazz heads w/DJs Andrew Jervis,
   guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, $3. Nickies BBQ, 460 Haight, SF. 415.621.6508
   
   _Real_ - house, techno. every first Thursday of the month
   9pm-2am, 18+, $7. Pantages Theater, 1225 K St Mall, Sacramento.
   916.565.9588
   
   _Revolutionary Wax_ - coax your evolutionary ass w/DJs Consuelo Kevin,
   John John (Open Mind), James (Tweekin). 21+, Free. Dalva, 3121 16th
   St, SF. 415.252.7740
   
   _Green_ - house, techno w/DJs guests weekly. 10pm-2am, 18+. the top of
   the Wharf Cafe, the end of the Santa Cruz Wharf, Santa Cruz.
   
  Friday
  
   _ Sound Factory _- House w/DJs Pete Avila, David Harness, guets.
   9:30pm-7am, 21+, $10. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF.
   415.543.1300
   
   _Soul'd Out_ - House w/DJs Julius Papp, Rick Preston, guests. free
   before 10:30
   9pm-, 21+, $5. The Usual, 400 S.1st St., San Jose.
   
   _Nocturnal Transmission_ - House w/DJs David Harness, Tim Martinez,
   Saint John, guests. $5 before midnight.
   11pm-5am, 21+, $10. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Go Fast_ - Techno. Energy Music...for Women by Women (boys can come
   too).
   10pm-. 8th & Minna, SF.
   
   _Liquid Fridays_ - House w/DJs various DJs. 10pm-2am, 18+, Free. 2721
   Broadway, Sacramento., Sacramento. 916.484.4285
   
   _Viva_ - ...setting san francisco on fire! w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Jamie
   J, guest. free before 10:30 w/flyer
   9:30pm-4am, 21+, $7. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   the green door - "where circles meet squares" w/DJs andrew, thomas,
   caspar, paul, felix the dog, guests. 10pm-3am, 21+, $7. 880 Stevenson
   @ 10th, SF.
   
   _Nikita_ - house, techno w/DJs Jeno, Simon, Henrik. 10pm-7am, 21+,
   $10. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.267.0568
   [5.3 - Carl Craig]
   [5.10 - Deep Dish]
   [5.31 - Juan Atkins]
   [6.7 - DJ Duke]
   [6.14 - Westbam, Hardsequencer]
   [6.21 - CJ Mackintosh]
   [6.28 - Derrick May]
   
   _The Scene_ - 21+. the EndUp, 401 6th @ Harrison, SF. 415.393.9067
   
   _drum & bass trip hop_ - jungle, trip hop w/DJs Noel, Abstract,
   Andrew, Seth. begins March 29th
   10pm-2am, 21+, $3. 270 Brannan @ 2nd, SF. 415.905.8865
   
   _Beats_ - house, breakbeat, trance w/DJs Carlos Campos, Karizma,
   weekly guests. 7042 Folsom Blvd between Howe and 65th, Sacramento.
   415.273.1345 916.558.0850
   
   _This Side Up_ - house, techno w/DJs guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight,
   SF.
   
  Saturday
  
   _Other Whirled_ - House, Techno w/DJs Warren, Nobel, Jason Cassady,
   Nikki Rivera, guests. saturday morning
   6am-, 21+. 201 9th @ Howard, SF.
   
   _Sound Factory _- big club sounds
   9:30pm-4am, 21+. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF. 415.543.1300
   
   _Release _- Acid Jazz, Funk, Reggae, House w/DJs Jerry Ross, Josh, Mr.
   Sulu, Randy Wong. 21+. 1015 Folsom, , SF. 415.337.7457
   
   55 - House, Euro w/DJs Jorge Martinez, Tim Martinez, guests. 21+. 55
   Natoma St., SF. 415.267.1858
   
   _Vanilla Fudge _- House w/DJs Corey Black, Sunshine, Moonbeam, Jason,
   Big Lee, Darren. occasional saturday nights.
   10pm-2am, Free. Cafe Bastille, 55 Belden Alley, SF. 415.764.2903
   
   Vertigo - Psycho, Techno, Disco, Funk w/DJs Nikki Rivera, Ellen
   Ferrato, Dave Peterson, Lewis. 10pm-3am, 21+. the EndUp, 6th &
   Harrison, SF. 415.703.7172
   
   _Consciousness Lab Ambient Sound Research_ - ambient. live and
   pre-recorded ambient soundscapes
   7pm-11pm, . RAW Living Foods, 1224 9th @ Lincoln, SF. 415.789.8308
   
   _Liquid Vinyl_ - House w/DJs Jay-J, Suiki, John Howard, guests.
   2am-6am, 21+, $8. DV8, 540 Howard, SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Nuff Respect _- Jungle w/DJs StarEyes, Thad. 5pm-9pm, Free. Your
   Mama's Cafe, 5239 College Ave @ Broadway, Oakland, Oakland.
   510.601.YOUR
   
   phunkatech - Jungle w/DJs UFO, Noel, guests. 21+, $2. The Top, 424
   Haight, SF. 415.995.4699
   
   _Metro Jazz _- Acid Jazz w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Mauricio Avilas, Tom
   Thump, Franky, guests. 10pm-, 21+, $7. 111 Minna St, SF.
   [5.4 - Andrew Jervis (on the one)]
   
  Sunday
  
   the Sci-fi Club - hypersentientpsychedelictribalacidcybertrance w/DJs
   Dutch, DRC, Mars, Theta Blip, Solar, guests. Free food and Funky vibes
   in The Juicy Milk Bar (Ameba DJ team + guests)
   18+. 683 Clementina @ 8th & Folsom, SF. 415.331.1500x888
   
   _Spundae _- House, Techno w/DJs Henrik, Carlos, Miquel, weekly guests.
   free b4 10:30p
   10pm-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.974.9389
   
   _Leopard Lounge_ - Acid Jazz, Funk & Live Bands. w/DJs Suiki, Jay-J,
   Anthony, Julius Papp, Mark Farina, guests. 2125 Lombard @ Fillmore,
   SF. 415.771.2583
   
   _Pleasuredome_ - House w/DJs Neil Lewis, David Harness, Phil B,
   guests. 21+. 177 Townsend, SF. 415.985.5256
   
   Quench - House, Ambient w/DJs Rick Preston, Ryan Tapia, guests.
   Ambient-Space explorations by DJ Leath and guests in the front room.
   21+. The Usual, 400 South First St., San Jose. 408.535.0330
   
   _Techsture_ - deep layers of sound w/DJs tomas, markus, guests.
   8pm-12mid, All ages, Free. cafe abir, 1300 Fulton @ Divisadero, SF.
   415.974.4358
   
   subbass - jungle, drum'n'bass, trip hop w/DJs noel, abstract, jawbone.
   10pm-2am, 21+, $3. 270 Brannan @ 2nd, SF. 415.905.8865
   
  Monday
  
    Mushroom Jazz - acid jazz, trip hop w/DJs Mark Farina, Miquel, Julius
   Papp, guests. 9pm-3am, 21+, $5. 330 Ritch St, SF. 415.905.8811
   
   _Noc Noc_ - techno/ambient/jungle w/DJs Mohsen. 21+, Free. 557 Haight
   St., SF.
   
   MAD - Techno, Trance & Electro w/DJs Ethan, Alex, Jon Santos, Joe
   Rice, guests. $2 before 11pm.
   10pm-, 21+, $3. , SF 415.281.9432
   
   _Tongue n' Groove _- trip hop, jungle, acid jazz w/DJs tomas, seth,
   m.mark, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+, $5. Cat's Grill & Alley, 1190 Folsom @
   8th, SF. 415.431.3332
   
   _rotation_ - jazz, hiphop, soul, acid jazz, funk w/DJs racer x, yamu,
   stef, rasta cue-tip, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+. up & down club, 1151
   Folsom St, SF.
   
   _sensory_ - abstractbeatz-hiphop-dub-drum n'bass-electro w/DJs Tomas,
   Abstract, guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight, SF. 415.974.4358
   
   _Movement_ - trance, breakbeat, jungle w/DJs Ron, Kimo, Rich.
   10pm-2am, 18+, $3. Bahia Cabana, 1600 Market @ Franklin, SF.
   
  Tuesday
  
    Butterfly - Hip Hop, Acid Jazz, House, Funk w/DJs Charlotte, Dani,
   guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, $2. Casanova, 527 Valencia, SF.
   
   Breathe Deep - House w/DJs Jay-J, Ruben, Miquel, guests. 10pm-4am,
   21+, $5. 1015 Folsom., SF. 415.998.9515
   
   _Begin..._ - house, trip hop, trance w/DJs Darrel, Cisco, Radley,
   Ollie, Seanee, Xpress, Grey, Anna. 9pm-2am, All ages. The Inn of the
   Beginning, 8201 Old Redwood Highway, Cotati, Cotati. 707.524.4443
   
   _Kinetic_ - Phil Salter, guests. 21+, $5. 2325 clayton road, concord.
   510.946.5005
   
   _Shoam_ - Trip-Hop & Drum n Bass Your Mama's Cafe, 5239 College,
   Oakland.
   
   _Succotash!_ - tasty jazz - funk - beats - space w/DJs tom thump,
   rasta q-tip. 21+, Free. up & down club, 1151 folsom st., SF.
   
   _supper_ - funk, acid jazz w/DJs Caspar, guests. 21+, Free. Julie's
   Supper Club, 1123 Folsom @ 7th, SF. 415.861.0707
   
   _Light-n-Up Lounge_ - house w/DJs Preston, guests. 21+. 111 Minna St,
   SF.
   [5.7 - Big Lee]
   [5.14 - Mark Farina]
   
   _L-Tryptophan_ - ambient, techno w/DJs guest DJs weekly. 21+, Free.
   1624 California @ Van Ness, SF.
   
  Wednesday
  
   _ Come/Unity _- House, Techno, Ambient w/DJs Simon, Jeno, Garth. first
   Wednesday of the month.
   10pm-4am, 21+, $7. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.241.8815
   
   _Boost_ - old school uplifting house w/DJs Jamie J, Hector the
   ejector. 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison, SF. 415.703.7105
   
   _Roots_ - House, Trip Hop w/DJs Garth, Jeno, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+,
   $6. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.512.5713
   
   _cosmic lounge _- space jazz, galactic grooves, jungle w/DJs Caspar,
   Paul, Seth, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, Free. cafe mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th,
   SF.
   
   _Reunion_ - Danny, Naz Cafe, guests. 9pm-, 21+, Free. The Fulton Bar,
   1243 Fulton Mall, Fresno. 209.488.5332
   
   _Quantum_ - trance w/DJs Myster-e, Mars, guests. $3. tHE pOWERhOUSE,
   1347 fOLSOM. 415.861.1833
   
   _Thirsty_ - tasty house tunes and even better company w/DJs Jellybear,
   Jay-J, top notch guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, Free. The Top, 424 Haight St,
   SF.
   
   _The Lounge_ - 9pm-3am, 21+. 1401 Arden Way, Sacramento.
   916.922.8041x4240
   
   _Bubbles_ - deep funky techno house music w/DJs Don Crisp (Crisp
   Records), guests. starts May 1.
   9pm-2am, 21+. Babylon, 2260 Van Ness @ Vallejo, SF. 415.567.1222
   
   _Wish_ - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
   18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663
   [5.8 - Dutch]
   [5.15 - Henrik]
   [5.22 - Grover]
   
   _Belief_ - house w/DJs Julius Papp, Harry Who?, Rick Preston. begins
   5.22.
   10pm-, 21+. Agenda basement, 1st & San Salvador, San Jose.
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Info Lines

     * Be-At Info Line - 415-626-4087. Usually has 5-10 listings, updated
       daily.
     * Clubline - 415.979.8686
     * Fatline - 415.207.3668
     * Frequency 8 Trance/Techno infoline - 415.541.5019
     * the Global Party Network Buzzline - 415.568.1338
     * The Groove Line - (415) 331.1500 ext.4788
     * Housewares Rave Line - 415.281.0125
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Radio/TV Shows

     * Sunday night 11pm-2am - "The Dreaming/Innermind Show" w/DJ Miracle
       & Mr. Monchichi. House, Jungle, Trip-Hop, Ambient, Dub,
       Break-Beats & guest DJs. KSCU 103.3 (Santa Clara)
     * Sunday night 9pm-mid - "An Epiphany of Sound" hosted by J.C. KZSU
       90.1 (Stanford)
     * Monday afternoon 12:30-3:00 pm - DJ Jerecho presents the best of
       the urban polyrhythmic experience jungle, acid jazz, techno,
       electro, breakbeat KDVS, 90.3 FM (Davis)
     * Wednesday night/Thursday morning 3am-6am - "Aural Fixation"
       experimental sounds of ambient and trip hop with a splash of hi
       nrg, from trance to jungle. KZSC 88.1 fm (Santa Cruz)
     * Thursdays 9:30pm-midnight - "Aurora Borealis" Beats and
       atmospherics w/DJ Seth. KALX 90.7 (Berkeley)
     * Fridays 9pm-midnight - Andrew from Groove Merchant spins on KUSF
       90.3 (SF)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - midnight-noon. House/techno mix
       with Johnny K, Ozone & guests - KCSS 91.9 Central Valley (Turlock)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - "Just Desserts" w/Mr.Goodwrench -
       10pm-2am Ambient, Techno, Acid House, whacked-out Dub, Acid Jazz
       and noise KFJC 89.7 - Los Altos Hills
     * Saturday night 11pm - Flux Television, Viacom Channel 53 -
       Ambient, acid jazz and house music videos & interviews. (415)
       281-3377. flux@flux.net
     * Friday night - nocturnal transmissions - featuring house DJs from
       SF and around the world. mid-2am, 107.7 FM (SF)
     * Friday night - Your Mama's House w/Pete Avila - 3am-5am, 106.1
       KMEL.
     * Friday night - Moondance. Ambient; 3am-7:30am, KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday afternoon - "Bus Stop" - music and talk w/guest DJs from
       SF and beyond. 2pm-3pm. KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday night - "Saturday Night Spin Out" w/Ronnie Libido. Trip
       hop, Jungle, Ambient, Experimental Sounds. 10pm-2am. KFJC 89.7 -
       Los Altos Hills
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Administrative Notes

   If anyone has info on any other events, send it to me! I can't
   possibly hope to get all the info every week.
   
   This info gets sent via email every Thursday. To subscribe or
   unsubscribe to the calendar mailing list, send e-mail to
   majordomo@hyperreal.com with either the line
   
   subscribe sfraves-calendar or
   unsubscribe sfraves-calendar
   
   There is also an sfraves discussion mailing list for issues related to
   clubs, parties, house and techno music, etc. To subscribe, send e-mail
   to majordomo@hyperreal.com with the line
   
   subscribe sfraves
   
   in the body of the message.

   
 Derek Chung - dhchung@hyperreal.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 16:46:18 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 16:46:07 -0700 (PDT)
To: Jake Reichert <reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: How to finish a fight.
In-Reply-To: <199605022136.OAA13445@jeeves.usfca.edu>
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On Thu, 2 May 1996, Jake Reichert wrote:

> >On Thu, 2 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:
> >
> >> At 8:36 PM  -0700 5/1/96, John S. Lee wrote:
> >> 
> >> >So bring the noise...if your shit is all that, buck up.  I guarantee a
> >> >dance hurting the likes that'll send you back home to momma.
> >> >
> >> >C'mon wit' it,
> >> >John
> >> 
> >> Ah...John Lee makes me smile!  :^)
> >> 
> >> Maybe one day I'll meet the man...
> >> 
> >
> >Didn't you know John S. Lee is an Artifical Intelligence?(now there's a 
> >twisted thought....) ;-)
> 
> Actually, Moonpup _and_ John are replicants.
> 
> Just a lil' note from the Blade Runner department,
> 
Then who are the aliens, and where's Waldo?

                                      Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 16:46:37 1996
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To: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>, KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: (NRR) re: Traci Lords
Cc: Andrew Nourse <andy@pythagoras.org>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On the subject of Laura Miller, I had to interview her last year for an
interactive travel guide (to sf) that I was working on. I must say I've
never heard anyone discuss the merits of various vibrators as elegantly as
she can. :-)

Jon


At  4:09 PM 5/2/96 -0700, John Bagby wrote:
>Once again, on a different topic... I concur with Andy!
>Laura Miller of Good Vibrations is a fellow WELLbeing--  goodvibe@well.com
>
>Their shop and catalog helps promote love and sensuality without
>judgement or exploitation.
>
>Check it out!  And no sissor-kicks!   =)
>-John
>
>
>On Thu, 2 May 1996, KaySEE wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 1 May 1996, Andrew Nourse wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > >  I will support erotica and writings and
>> > >photography from women - a sexuality that is beautiful, arousing, and
>> > equitable.
>> >
>> > I would hope that something like this could also be created by men, or even
>> > by men
>> > and women working together.  I'd love to see more of it in any case,
>>whoever
>> > does it.
>>
>> Since this whole pornography issue is still going on, I thought I'd tell
>> everyone where they can get a variety of pornography/erotica that is very
>> sensitive to every *issue*.  The store is Good Vibrations (both in SF and
>> Berkeley and by mail order).  It is a worker-owned and operated
>> cooperative, founded by women.  There is a whole pornography (I am not
>> distingishing between pornography and erotica because words are only
>> words) section that has sub-categories such as "woman centered", gay,
>> lesbian, bisexual, superstar, etc. etc.  There are reviews of every tape,
>> and enough variey for all porn aficcionados.  I really don't want to jump
>> into Good Vibe's views on porn, but they approach it in a sensitive,
>> sex-positive view.  (if you want to talk to me about it, email me
>> privately).  We are very lucky to have Good Vibe's in SF, and they are
>> respectful of all sexualities and genders.  I'm sure many of you already
>> know this, but those of you who don't, you should check it out sometime!
>>
>> --kc
>>

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 16:54:43 1996
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Date: 2 May 1996 16:49:49 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Deep Dish Playing Live???
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Never Mind!  Just saw it on the calendar.

Yeah!!!  Deep Dish is Playing!!!!! Deep Dish is Playing!!!!!

-M


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 16:59:36 1996
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Date: 2 May 1996 16:48:26 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Deep Dish Playing Live???
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Hi!!

heard a rumor that Deep Dish is playing possibly at Nikita in 2 weeks or
so........  Can anyone confirm this???

Thanxs

-M


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 17:31:41 1996
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Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 17:31:11 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
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Subject: Full Moon
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Full moon party by Raindance of Santa Cruz this thurs nite/ fri morn
There is a party in a bar at the end of the Santa Cruz pier called Top 
of the Wharf you must go there before 1:30am tonight to find out what 
beach. Carlos , Jeno and more...
-- 
salutations, al@abema
_____________________________________
ameba  1732 haight street sf ca 94117
mailto:ameba@netcom.com
http://www.ameba.com        |      \
415.750.9368                |       \
=====================================
                            |       /
                            |      /

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 18:03:14 1996
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Message-Id: <199605030032.RAA04853@ns.mauswerks.com>
Subject: Newsweek-Herbal E
Date: Thu, 2 May 96 18:02:40 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
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Hi people-
There is a big hoopla on herbs in this week's Newsweek.

It contains the ubiquitous article on Herbal E. They interviewed some 
youngsters who have tried it, and asked others what they think of it. 
They also talk about the rave culture a little bit. 

The article also says: "Some dealers of real Ecstasy [though] are lacing 
their products with heroin; savvy users look out for telltale brown 
specks in the pills"...

They also discuss the dangers of ephedra (ma huang).  I have never found 
it to be in the slightest bit dangerous, but I suppose there are people 
who have adverse reactions to everything. The FDA has recorded only 400 
adverse reactions to it and 15 possible deaths. Not too bad when you 
consider that many more people have reactions to OTC and prescription 
drugs.

-Amy

PS- look for me at Harmony, I will wear my pink soccer shirt.
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 18:11:14 1996
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From: tim744@silicon.email.net
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 18:11:01 PDT
Subject: BBQ Fixins
Message-Id: <9605021811.S336632777@silicon.email.net>
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Can I get a volunteer to bring the fixins for burgers and hot
dog...(ie..mayo,mustard,ketchup..etc). Please email if you can help.
Just a short list of what I will be providing myself
Ribs.... for about 15
chicken...for about 15
Burgers meat and veggie about 20 or so
hot dog...about 20-40
 
all that should feed about 30-40 people possibly more depending on how much
you eat. I remember someone saying something about Tofu Dogs if the person
that mentioned that can bring a few, that would be great. Also if you want a
certain food to be cooked thats not listed, pleas feel free to bring it. It's
a big BBQ and one side will be meats and the other side will be Veggie. Also
a few people mentioned bring salads, fruit, drinks, and other picnic foods.
If everyone chips in and bring alittle of something for roughly 5-10 people I
think this will turn out great. If you have any questions on what to bring,
pls email me and let me know. I'll be bringing paper plates and things, but
if some others bring some to, that would be great. 
 
We have a killer lineup and good food, and great people. So let's make this
picnic party one for the books. And I just want to add a big thanks right now
for all the people helping out on this. It's great to see everyone pitching
in to make this possible.
 
Tim (knucklehead)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 18:35:02 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 20:44:01 -0500
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: tthomas@uoknor.edu (Love Toy)
Subject: Re: Newsweek-Herbal E
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>They also discuss the dangers of ephedra (ma huang).  I have never found
>it to be in the slightest bit dangerous, but I suppose there are people
>who have adverse reactions to everything. The FDA has recorded only 400
>adverse reactions to it and 15 possible deaths. Not too bad when you
>consider that many more people have reactions to OTC and prescription
>drugs.
>

*Delurk*

Well... awhile back I read that some people where dying from diet herbal
teas because they thought since the ingredients were all "natural" it meant
it was safe for you.  If this is the same herb I'm thinking of, this one
lady had a heartattack from the ephedra.  However she drank more than the
recommended dose, so watch out!  Just because it's natural doesn't mean
it's all safe.
                                                love Toy =)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 18:52:05 1996
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Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 18:55:10 -0700
To: tim744@silicon.email.net, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Re: BBQ Fixins
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Hiya Tim;

        Do you know how to BBQ Fish eg swordwish, if so I'll bring some of
that, just save a pound for me. So when is it anyway, god I'm so clueless
yet sooo happy, silly hologram aren't I.

Peace
THX1138


At 06:11 PM 5/2/96 PDT, tim744@silicon.email.net wrote:
>Can I get a volunteer to bring the fixins for burgers and hot
>dog...(ie..mayo,mustard,ketchup..etc). Please email if you can help.
>Just a short list of what I will be providing myself
>Ribs.... for about 15
>chicken...for about 15
>Burgers meat and veggie about 20 or so
>hot dog...about 20-40
> 
>all that should feed about 30-40 people possibly more depending on how much
>you eat. I remember someone saying something about Tofu Dogs if the person
>that mentioned that can bring a few, that would be great. Also if you want a
>certain food to be cooked thats not listed, pleas feel free to bring it. It's
>a big BBQ and one side will be meats and the other side will be Veggie. Also
>a few people mentioned bring salads, fruit, drinks, and other picnic foods.
>If everyone chips in and bring alittle of something for roughly 5-10 people I
>think this will turn out great. If you have any questions on what to bring,
>pls email me and let me know. I'll be bringing paper plates and things, but
>if some others bring some to, that would be great. 
> 
>We have a killer lineup and good food, and great people. So let's make this
>picnic party one for the books. And I just want to add a big thanks right now
>for all the people helping out on this. It's great to see everyone pitching
>in to make this possible.
> 
>Tim (knucklehead)
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 19:02:14 1996
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Message-Id: <199605030158.SAA26936@dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com>
From: shawna-@ix.netcom.com (Shawna McGourty)
Subject: Re: Glow sticks ???
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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One more thing about finding glo-sticks, you can definitely find them 
at places like Grand Auto Supply, however you can only get the green, 
orange & yellow ones there, the "safety" colors.  Green's a pretty cool 
color, but for blue purple & pink ones, you have to look elsewhere, in 
more obscure places.  


love,
shawna

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 19:12:35 1996
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From: "Fred Heutte" <phred@well.com>
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 19:12:16 -0700
In-Reply-To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
        "Re: Glow sticks ???" (May  2,  2:49pm)
References: <Pine.3.89.9605021457.A9139-0100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>, Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
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There is a party/toy store down around 9th and Harrison (if memory serves)
that has glow sticks in quantity, at least they had them when I went there
in about 1991.  I think it's still there, I just can't remember the name,
but you can't miss it, the storefront is painted a ghastly orange/yellow.

Hmm, might be on Brannan.  Anyway, it's in that neighborhood.

phred

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 20:25:10 1996
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From: davidmin@crl.com (David Minuk)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Upcoming live shows
Date: Fri, 03 May 1996 03:21:29 GMT
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P-Orridge fans:  Psychic TV is playing Friday nite at the Maritime
Hall.  Gen is leaning toward the industrial/noise side these days.
Also, Crash Worship will be playing the Trocadero this month.

David
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Minuk(davidmin@crl.com)
WWW:  My URL is http://www.crl.com/~davidmin/
This website is not yet rated.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 20:28:13 1996
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From: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
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Subject: BBQ Fixins (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 2 May 96 20:27:27 PDT
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> We have a killer lineup and good food, and great people. So let's make this
> picnic party one for the books. And I just want to add a big thanks right now
> for all the people helping out on this. It's great to see everyone pitching
> in to make this possible.

Yeah, thanks in advance everyone & especially Tim.  Janie & I will
be there in full force!

Lee

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 20:55:26 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 20:53:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Haunted by Waters May-July Schedule (fwd)non-rave
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605022036.A6048-0100000@si.UCSC.EDU>
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Hi!
 This is a band that a friend of mine really likes so I thought I would 
pass this on. A progressive celtic-rock apparently

Ran                            ("rock my soul")
                                     /
                               -=*=-/
                                 ~


>
>Haunted by Waters will be performing on the following dates:
>
>Sunday, May 9th
>Whole Earth Festival, Quad Stage, University of California, Davis.
> Performance time 4:30 pm.
>
>Friday, May 17th, 9pm
>Transmission Theatre, 314 11th St (@ Folsom),  San Francisco.
>With Thoth, Land of the Blind (from Portland), and dancers t.b.a.     Ph:
>415-621-1911 for more info.
>
>Fri June 7th
>Oakland Festival At The Lake, Oakland. 4:30 pm at the 10th street stage.
>
>Sun. June 9th
>Health & Harmony Festival, Santa Rosa.  1:45 pm.  Special appearance by
>trance dancer Magenta Crowe.
>
>Thurs July 18th
>Starry Plough, Berkeley.
>With Thoth.
>____________________________________
>Haunted by Waters debut CD, "LIKE THE DUST" was voted by Bay Area music
>critics in BAM magazine last month  as one of their  TOP TEN favorite CD's
> of '95, saying
>"This multi-cultural ensemble has produced an exotic record of tribal magic
>which succeeds musically, spiritually, aesthetically, and politically, and
>should be a must in everyone's CD collection.  Check it out!"
>-Bam Magazine, April 19th, 1996
>
>For more info see Haunted's web page at:
>http://members.aol.com/hauntedbw/
>____________________
>About LAND OF THE BLIND:
>THE BLIND is a band from Portland, Oregon bent on creating their own musical
>genre & category called "TRIBAL-HYPNO-TRIP",
>a fusion of dream pop, world, ecto & alternative.
>
>Phoenix Media/101.7 FM Boston
>   "The rich, lush music can almost be seen as well as heard. Lead vocalist
>Cyoakha wails with the intensity of Kate Bush..sparse and haunting...& notes
>of startling clarity...like Dead Can Dance they explore unconventional
>sounds...the Blind experiments with Middle-East-like scales and cryptically
>poetic lyrics for a bizarre but intriguing Laurie Anderson-meets-the-Women's-
>Choir-of-Bulgaria feel. Genuine and unpretentious.
>                              L. Anderson, WFNX
>________________________
>About THOTH:
>
>Thoth creates music that is both ancient and modern, classical and jazz and
>improvised. Their performance is choreographed with sensual movement. Their
>sound has been characterized as a blend of Slavic, Gypsy, Hebrew, Middle
>Eastern, North African, Celtic, Indian, and Native American Elements.
>


     She  ^`..'^
   




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 21:10:55 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 21:10:43 -0700 (PDT)
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Newsweek-Herbal E
In-Reply-To: <199605030032.RAA04853@ns.mauswerks.com>
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On Thu, 2 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> Hi people-
> There is a big hoopla on herbs in this week's Newsweek.
> 
> It contains the ubiquitous article on Herbal E. They interviewed some 
> youngsters who have tried it, and asked others what they think of it. 
> They also talk about the rave culture a little bit. 
> 
> The article also says: "Some dealers of real Ecstasy [though] are lacing 
> their products with heroin; savvy users look out for telltale brown 
> specks in the pills"...

More like uninformed users..... more poor reporting, like that's a first. 
<Andy Rooney voice on> Have you ever noticed the glaring deficiencies in 
factual data when the press reports on something you know about?<Andy 
Rooney voice off.>

I have noticed this on more than one occasion when I have seen media 
reports on certain computer related issues or technical phone-related 
issues. I find it very disturbing. If the media is spreading so much crap 
about things you or I know about, what are the chances that their 
reporting about issues you do not know about are in fact correct?


> They also discuss the dangers of ephedra (ma huang).  I have never found 
> it to be in the slightest bit dangerous, but I suppose there are people 
> who have adverse reactions to everything. The FDA has recorded only 400 
> adverse reactions to it and 15 possible deaths. Not too bad when you 
> consider that many more people have reactions to OTC and prescription 
> drugs.

Ephedra is a pretty powerful stimulant, and with any powerful substance 
there can be adverse reactions. 

                                            Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 22:14:52 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 22:14:39 -0700
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From: shawna-@ix.netcom.com (Shawna McGourty)
Subject: Re: Upcoming live shows
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>P-Orridge fans:  Psychic TV is playing Friday nite at the Maritime
>Hall.  Gen is leaning toward the industrial/noise side these days.
>Also, Crash Worship will be playing the Trocadero this month.


WOOHOO!  Anybody here ever been to a Crash Worship?  :)

Love,
Shawna

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:40:48 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 22:14:39 -0700
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From: shawna-@ix.netcom.com (Shawna McGourty)
Subject: Re: Upcoming live shows
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>P-Orridge fans:  Psychic TV is playing Friday nite at the Maritime
>Hall.  Gen is leaning toward the industrial/noise side these days.
>Also, Crash Worship will be playing the Trocadero this month.


WOOHOO!  Anybody here ever been to a Crash Worship?  :)

Love,
Shawna

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:41:12 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: Tonite
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Is there a party tonight in Aquatic Park in Berkeley?  If so, can you 
give us more details?

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:41:25 1996
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From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: BBQ Fixins
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>...Also
>a few people mentioned bring salads, fruit, drinks, and other picnic foods.

How about pumpkin pie for dessert?  I can cook up a couple of those, if 
folks think they'll want some.  Anyone?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:42:15 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 22:28:01 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: Narcs and narcing
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sameer@c2.org wrote:
>	Sounds like another dangerous urban legend.
>
>	"Feds have to say yes if you ask them if they're a fed. Really
>they do."

The message that I got from a lawyer about two and a half years ago (things
may have changed) was that an undercover law enforcement agent is required
to respond truthfully to any such request, *UNLESS* they may be physically
endangered by a truthful answer.  In practice, this amounts to carte
blanche for the agent except in extreme situations--an agent can almost
always make a reasonable case that a truthful answer would endanger him or
her.  In sum, don't count on any such entrapment defense.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:42:21 1996
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Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 22:19:39 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Sir Nod {Don Spence} <sirnod@redshift.com>
Subject: Ameba Party
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Hi All,
        I just finished my work for the semester and saw the post about the
Ameba party in Santa Cruz tonight. I'd love to go but I really done feel
like venturing alone. If anyone here in Monterey Land would like to cruise
up with me, that would be great. I have a car.

If anyone's interested, call at 408.375.8858 or page at 408.655.7496.

Thanks all....

Sir Nod
--

(><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<Sir Nod aka Don Spence>><<>>><<>><<>><<>><<>>><<) 
(sirnod@redshift.com-------(60's:Question Authority)--Voice/Fax:408.375.8858)
(dspence@student.miis.edu--((90's:Question Reality))------Pager:408.655.7496)
(<<<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>>**<<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>>)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:42:23 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 22:27:58 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: Health Alert/Re: heroin is orally active
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"THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com> wrote:
>        Black tar Heroin is very strongly linked to the flesh eating
>bacteria. The danger is extreme strong for people that shoot it, so DON'T DO
>IT, YOU NOW HAVE THE BEST REASON IN THE WORLD TO REHAB, SO JUST DO IT.

The first advice given in this note, that "X cut with heroin" is a
hysterical exaggeration, is good, but this additional info is slightly
hysterical as well.  There was about six weeks ago a spate of reports of
"flesh-eating" bacteria connected with tar heroin in the Bay area, but
there is no evidence of this occurring at present--apparently a particular
bad batch was the source.  There is no risk from smoked heroin--the
bacterium is destroyed by the heat--which is the most common route of
administration for tar.

Disclaimer: I am not a heroin user, so I have no personal experience with
these particular risks, but I do try to keep up with all the drug news that
is available, and I have spoken with both users and concerned nonusers
(needle exchange volunteers, abuse counselors, etc) about this particular
recent problem.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:44:09 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 21:43:55 +0200
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Review: enchantment and sunset (Sorry late)
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Well I ended up going to enchant ment early to help Josh set up.  It was at
a VERY clean space in Castro Valley(east bay) at a pool hall.  Because of
it's location and knowing the style of music that would be played(acid
trance to trip hop, break, with a gangsta element) I had doubts of the
party to begin with.

It's hard to be partial when it's your friends party and I guess the
statement - "At least I got in free." pretty much sums up my evening.
Don't get me wrong there were many good things about this party - The music
was good  Kwashi vs. Essence was great and Spun vs. Rick Preston was just
sic.  My friend Joey got to spin at his first party that night and did a
good job.  The space was CLEAN.  Main floor had all the pool tables and a
chill dj which was cool I love to play pool and never get to play while
trance music is flowin' through the halls, down stairs was a large
warehouse lookin' storage area which could probably house 500 - 800 ppl.
Great lasers and lighting - probably spent too much on this though... All
my god friends were there and the owners of the establishment were farlly
friendly.  The people was the main downer for me.  A whole mix of clubers,
gangsters and ravers (Could tell when "Set you free"by Planet Soul and
"Scandallus" by E-40 were played many hoots and hollars could be heard
however when spun and rick were playin some sick acid trance I hardly heard
a whistle)...  Many people were there to impress like at a club and I ust
felt out-a-place at times.  For Josh's first party it wasn't all that bad
but I know he will learn from the mistakes and create a better vibe next
time.

Sunset was just fabulus, I only stayed till the sun went down but I had a
wonderful time with everyone.  Right on Pacific!!

Austin

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:58:34 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 23:58:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
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Subject: (NRR) Turntable tweak question
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Okay, I was handed a free turntable today!  It is a Technics SL-QD33 
Direct Drive turntable :)  (What do you mean you've never heard of the 
SL-QD33?!?)
Anyway, the thing doesn't have a pitch control.  I am about to go ask my 
engineering major friends to help me figure out how to rig up some sort 
of potentiometer to the deck so that I can control the pitch... but I 
figure I might as well ask you folks if anyone else has attempted this 
sort of thing and if so if they have any pointers :)  thanks for your time!

OBEngineering:  Hey Marc, you wanna work on a turntable? :P

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor
               I'M FINALLY ON THE WEB!!  CHECK OUT MY ARTWORK AT: 
                 http://think.ucdavis.edu/current/apodaca.html                


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  2 23:58:41 1996
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Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 23:56:19 -0700
Message-Id: <199605030656.XAA21435@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Q Luong)
Subject: FULL MOON?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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There's a full moon going on tonight?!?!?!

I saw the full moon while I was working.
Damn, I thought it was going to be like, next week.


anyways, I'll be at Harmony's BP!!

Look for the asian guy who will be waving and smiling!! =)~


adam
                    R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 00:29:39 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 00:29:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: going to harmony?
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Howdy,

  Who's going to Harmony?  Would anyone like to head over there early with
Sarah and me or meet up later on? 

Think smiles!
) paul (


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 07:00:41 1996
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To: Diana Greer <inanna@ccnet.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Traci Lords Reply (long)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>" (There was a time when I couldn't look at no
>woman, less massah either hang me or kill me.  Now that those days are
>over, I intend to do some extra looking for all those brothers who
>couldn't). "
>
>John!  Get over it.  The past is the past.  There is no reason to ogle
>people just to prove a point.
>
>John, you spend a bunch of time writing "He" and "She" when you could be
>saying "s/he" or something like that to indicate the inter-changability
>of gender.  (You frequently fall into the tired, old and so out-dated
>stereotypes about women and men.)
>
>Peace, ((or maybe we don=92t need any right now?)  (Oh I know, I=92ll end
>this note with "regards."))
>
>Regards,
>
>Diana

I thought this conversation was over.  Besides, most of her reply coulda
been done private.

Oh well, nice try.  Next time try private e-mail.  That's where this type
of message belongs.

Out,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 07:55:27 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 07:55:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: tremor! (NRR)
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wow!  i feel so much closer to all of ya today :) we had a wee tremor 
last night, actually the epicenter was near Seattle but it was felt from 
Oregon to BC.  Ain't living on the fault line grand?

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 08:58:36 1996
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Subject: Newsweek-Herbal E 
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (sfraves@hyperreal.com)
Date: Fri, 3 May 96 8:58:28 PDT
From: DWATANAB@UCI.EDU (Dana Watanabe)
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> The article also says: "Some dealers of real Ecstasy [though] are lacing 
> their products with heroin; savvy users look out for telltale brown 
> specks in the pills"...

I think this is the biggest proof that this must be false.

 
 ,
dana

"... intriguing paper designs make LSD especially attractive to
junior high school and high school students." - DEA statement on LSD

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 09:09:29 1996
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From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: SDream <SDream@tgrigsby.com>
cc: tim744@silicon.email.net, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: BBQ Fixins
In-Reply-To: <199605030537.WAA22353@shellx.best.com>
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 Yes!! and whipped cream and cinnamon....I better go eat breakfast-but-yes!
              



On Thu, 2 May 1996, SDream wrote:

> 
> >...Also
> >a few people mentioned bring salads, fruit, drinks, and other picnic foods.
> 
> How about pumpkin pie for dessert?  I can cook up a couple of those, if 
> folks think they'll want some.  Anyone?
> 
> S
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 09:15:18 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605031613.JAA19251@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: BBQ Fixins (fwd)
To: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 09:13:46 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605030327.AA28622@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM> from "Lee Fogel" at May 2, 96 08:27:27 pm
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> 
> > We have a killer lineup and good food, and great people. So let's make this
> > picnic party one for the books. And I just want to add a big thanks right now
> > for all the people helping out on this. It's great to see everyone pitching
> > in to make this possible.
> 
> Yeah, thanks in advance everyone & especially Tim.  Janie & I will
> be there in full force!

This sounds like great fun and myself, Nicole and others are sure to be there.
Hope lots of other sfraves come too!!  

-troy

ps:  If you have yet to experience tim's (knucklehead's) cooking skills,
you are severely missing out!!!!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 09:16:53 1996
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To: tthomas@uoknor.edu (Love Toy)
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Newsweek-Herbal E
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Well... awhile back I read that some people where dying from diet herbal
>teas because they thought since the ingredients were all "natural" it meant
>it was safe for you.  If this is the same herb I'm thinking of, this one
>lady had a heartattack from the ephedra.  However she drank more than the
>recommended dose, so watch out!  Just because it's natural doesn't mean
>it's all safe.
>                                                love Toy =)

Yeah, witness hemlock and deadly nightshade, and also some varieties of
mushrooms, which are attributed to the deaths of a few people recently who
picked 'em out in the wild.  Venom is natural, too, but I don't know of
anyone willing to ingest it ;)

Organically yours,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 09:30:49 1996
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To: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Narcs and narcing
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>sameer@c2.org wrote:
>>       Sounds like another dangerous urban legend.
>>
>>       "Feds have to say yes if you ask them if they're a fed. Really
>>they do."
>
>The message that I got from a lawyer about two and a half years ago (things
>may have changed) was that an undercover law enforcement agent is required
>to respond truthfully to any such request, *UNLESS* they may be physically
>endangered by a truthful answer.  In practice, this amounts to carte
>blanche for the agent except in extreme situations--an agent can almost
>always make a reasonable case that a truthful answer would endanger him or
>her.  In sum, don't count on any such entrapment defense.
>
>anarch@scruznet.com

So, in a way, I was right.  I wouldn't rely on it in a real situation,
however...

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 09:40:47 1996
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Date: Fri, 03 May 96 09:42:21 PST
From: "Jacqui Kolarik" <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
Encoding: 6 Text
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: The British E Scene in The Face
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There's an article about the british scene and an interview with the parents of 
Leah Betts (died after taking E last November) in the March issue of "The Face".  
Article leaves something to be desired (facts and more depth), the magazine, as 
a whole, is cool.

Jacqui


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 09:46:03 1996
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Some Friday humor for y'all.  :)  - E
>
>One day, after a near eternity in the Garden of Eden, Adam calls out to
>God, "Lord, I have a problem."
>
>"What's the problem, Adam?", God replies.
>
>"Lord, I know you created me and have provided for me and
>surrounded me with this beautiful garden and all of these
>wonderful animals, but I'm just not happy"
>
>"Why is that, Adam?", comes the reply from the heavens.
>
>"Lord, I know you created this place for me, with all this lovely food
>and all of the beautiful animals, but I am lonely."
>
>"Well Adam, in that case I have the perfect solution.
>I shall create a 'woman' for you."
>
>"What's a 'woman', Lord?"
>
>"This 'woman' will be the most intelligent, sensitive, caring, and
>beautiful creature I have ever created. She will be so intelligent
>that she can figure out what you want before you want it.
>She will be so sensitive and caring that she will know your
>every mood and how to make you happy. Her beauty will rival that
>of the heavens and earth. She will unquestioningly care for your
>every need and desire. She will be the perfect companion for
>you.", replies the heavenly voice.
>
>"Sounds great."
>
>"She will be, but this is going to cost you, Adam."
>
>"How much will this 'woman' cost me Lord?", Adam replies.
>
>"She'll cost you your right arm, your right leg, an eye, an ear, and your
>left testicle."
>
>Adam ponders this for some time, with a look of deep thought and
>concern on his face. Finally Adam says to God, "Ehhh, what can
>I get for a rib?"
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 09:57:40 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 10:01:53 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: leftjab@well.com (leftjab)
Subject: Wonderful World . . .
Cc: aditya@mh1.well.com
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. . . Beautiful People!

In keeping with the flyer's theme, I will be wearing my Cookie Monster
t-shirt. See y'all tonight!

leftjab



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 10:17:01 1996
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To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: Adam and Eve
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Feminist flame bate, look out duck!  I don't want to admit that I actually
chuckled at this.

Rick

At 09:45 AM 5/3/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Some Friday humor for y'all.  :)  - E
>>
>>One day, after a near eternity in the Garden of Eden, Adam calls out to
>>God, "Lord, I have a problem."
>>
>>"What's the problem, Adam?", God replies.
>>
>>"Lord, I know you created me and have provided for me and
>>surrounded me with this beautiful garden and all of these
>>wonderful animals, but I'm just not happy"
>>
>>"Why is that, Adam?", comes the reply from the heavens.
>>
>>"Lord, I know you created this place for me, with all this lovely food
>>and all of the beautiful animals, but I am lonely."
>>
>>"Well Adam, in that case I have the perfect solution.
>>I shall create a 'woman' for you."
>>
>>"What's a 'woman', Lord?"
>>
>>"This 'woman' will be the most intelligent, sensitive, caring, and
>>beautiful creature I have ever created. She will be so intelligent
>>that she can figure out what you want before you want it.
>>She will be so sensitive and caring that she will know your
>>every mood and how to make you happy. Her beauty will rival that
>>of the heavens and earth. She will unquestioningly care for your
>>every need and desire. She will be the perfect companion for
>>you.", replies the heavenly voice.
>>
>>"Sounds great."
>>
>>"She will be, but this is going to cost you, Adam."
>>
>>"How much will this 'woman' cost me Lord?", Adam replies.
>>
>>"She'll cost you your right arm, your right leg, an eye, an ear, and your
>>left testicle."
>>
>>Adam ponders this for some time, with a look of deep thought and
>>concern on his face. Finally Adam says to God, "Ehhh, what can
>>I get for a rib?"
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 10:38:11 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 10:35:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: Thanks for glow sticks info
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Thanks to all of you who gave me good leads about the sources of glow 
sticks.  I got some at Toys-R-Us.  Little green once but for the first 
time they will do :).

I will have those at Beautiful People, so come say Hi, grab some 
Starbust and introduce yourself :).

Thank you Tony for being such a wonderful, beautiful person :).  See you 
tonight and tomorrow, ha?  Hey, I didn't realize my accent was funny, I 
knew my spelling sucks, but... :P

For those who missed Wish on Wed (and there were many of you)it was 
fun.  There were not many people there, but Doran was spinning, so music 
was great (he is the first DJ that I  started listening to 2 
months ago).  Also we had a change to chat with him for a while and 
what a 
wonderful guy :)...  I ended up going to Come Unity at 3am by myself and 
saw few familiar faces (Hey Stephan & Lydia) and few people that were at 
Wish earlier...  There is only one thing I can say about that - WOW.  I 
wish I didn't have to work on Thursdays :).

Anybody went to Full Moon?  How was it?

Hugz,
Branka

 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 10:46:05 1996
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Subject: Re: Traci Lords Reply (long)
Date: Fri, 3 May 96 10:45:13 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
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>I thought this conversation was over.  Besides, most of her reply coulda
>been done private.
>
>Oh well, nice try.  Next time try private e-mail.  That's where this type
>of message belongs.
>
>Out,
>John

Thank God someone has some sense around here. :-)

See ya'll on the dance floor.

-Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 10:51:58 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605031751.KAA06115@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Partay weekend, yeaaah!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 10:51:29 -0700 (PDT)
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Every once in a while I go out.  This weekend will be one of those once 
in a whiles.  Yeaa!, gonna catch a groove.  Much like I did earlier this 
week @ Lighten Up.  Yeaah!

Also heard about some underground going on.  Place holds about 300 
people.  Wil be interesting what the crowd is like.  I'll probably stop 
by this gig just to say hello, yeaah!  

Then it's off to Wicked.  Why?  Why not, I want to hear some music, and 
from what I hear, that is one of the many places some good music will be 
played this weekend.  Yeaah!

Interesting to see who'll find out about the UG, I do love suprises.  Yeaah!

Gotta get some new sneaks, gotta be ready for the challenge should the 
need arise.  Yeaah!

Peace & groove out,
John

P.S.  Yeaah!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 11:44:49 1996
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Date: Fri, 03 May 1996 11:44:57 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: VaVoom! 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: (NRR) more friday humour
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>>>>               Goldilocks and the Trio of Ursines
>>>>
>>>>     At one point on the space/time continuum existed an immature specimen
>>>>of the species Homo sapiens possessing the chromosomal pattern "XX".  This
>>>>juvenile recognized itself by the indicative code "Goldilocks".
>>>>     Goldilocks' female progenitor had imposed a strict injunction against
>>>>forays into the proximate arboreal terrain.  Due to the biological drive to
>>>>expand territorial limitations, the youthful female transgressed her
>>>>parentally-imposed sanctions, and thus found herself spatially displaced
>>>>without identifiable referent points.
>>>>     After locomotion through an incrementally expanding time period,
>>>>Goldilocks was
>>>>thermally deprived, in need of immediate nutrition, suffering a deficit of
>>>>energy, and in an extreme state of adrenal imbalance.  She perceived a
>>>>square of luminescence in the crepuscular shadows, and was motivated to
>>>>render herself adjacent to the source.
>>>>     The luminescence was generated from the interior of a solitary
>>>>residence.  Goldilocks applied digital pressure in tympanic mode to the
>>>>portal, without result.
>>>>The digestive acoustic signals emanating from the vicinity of her duodenum
>>>>motivated her further; she produced a vocalization intended to rouse any
>>>>residents of the habitation to action. No response being elicited,
>>>>Goldilocks contravened additional parental instructions by causing the
>>>>barrier apparatus to permit her intrusion.
>>>>     The domicile appeared vacant, but Goldilocks perceived a triple array
>>>>of nutrients fully prepared and displayed upon the gustatory board.
>>>>Prompted by her nutritional deficit, she approached the semi-solid
>>>>compounds.  Her biological response to the gaseous exudations of the
>>>>foodstuffs caused tremors in her manual appendages.  The trio of
>>>>presentation vessels were of graduated volume.  Goldilocks chose the
>>>>economy-size container, and seized a utensil to raise a measured quantity of
>>>>carbohydrate-laden substance to her nutrient-intake port.
>>>>     The kinetic energy potential of the sample communicated to her neural
>>>>synapses, causing her to precipitately release the utensil, which
>>>>demonstrated its specific gravity in an audible fashion.
>>>>     "Oh, this is excessively thermal!" emitted the protagonist.  She
>>>>adjusted her position so as to attempt intake from the family-size vessel.
>>>>Elevating an additional measured portion to her alimentary embouchement, she
>>>>plied the musculature of her upper facial area, and pronounced, "This is
>>>>kinetically deprived!"
>>>>     Having experienced subsequent negative reinforcement, the potential
>>>>woman approached the ultimate nutrient allotment.  In anticipation of
>>>>additional negative input, she cautiously hoisted the tertian utensil to her
>>>>lingual organ.
>>>>     "Oh," she caroled, "This sample of grain product is at optimum energy
>>>>calibration!"  She proceeded to ingest the maximum available caloric
>>>>material from the convenience-size container.
>>>>     Abdominal satiety being engendered, the pre-gestational being felt a
>>>>requirement to repose during the postprandial period.  She located a triad
>>>>of situational constructs, and considered their relative dimensional
>>>>qualities.  As her primary effort, she essayed the grandiose example.
>>>>     "Oh, this has extreme pressure resistance!" she declaimed.  She
>>>>attempted the
>>>>immediately sequential construct.  Her physical displacement resulted in her
>>>>lower extremities protruding at an acute elevation.  "Oh," she agonized,
>>>>"this has excessive receptivity!"
>>>>     She extracted her gluteal mass and relocated it to the tertiary
>>>>location.  "Oh!" she enthused, "This _chaise_ is precisely appurtenant to my
>>>>skeletal structure!"
>>>>     Unfortunately the mass displacement of the diminutive being was
>>>>disproportional to the stress-bearing capabilities of the fragile
>>>>construction, the resultant pressure creating a disruption in the junctions
>>>>of its fabrication.  As her fundament contacted that of the residence,
>>>>Goldilocks produced a loud vocalization attended by lachrymal flow.
>>>>     Still afflicted by digestive torpor, the forlorn infant sought the
>>>>somnolence-appropriate area of the premises.  Therein were situated three
>>>>divans of varying proportion.  _Primo_, Goldilocks evaluated the most
>>>>generously endowed.  "No, it is gargantuan!" she judged. Thereafter she
>>>>contemplated the more moderately enhanced version.  "No, it is of
>>>>insufficient breadth!" she determined.  _En suite_, she devolved upon the
>>>>final solution. "This horizontal surface for the purpose of reclining is
>>>>exactly suited to my requirements!"
>>>>     So she lay supine and permitted rapid eye movement to ensue.
>>>>     As the immature Homo sapiens passed through the four stages of its
>>>>sleep cycle, the ursine residents of the domicile achieved re-entry.
>>>>Arriving in the alimentary preparation area, the female of the party
>>>>exclaimed, "An unknown trespasser has consumed our nutrient preparations!".
>>>>     Surveying the parlor, the male of the party responded, "Another unknown
>>>>intruder has been utilizing our furnishings! And regard the wreckage
>>>>herein!"  The offspring of the two above-mentioned then scrutinized the rear
>>>>chamber, and cacophoned, "The perpetrator has availed itself of my sleeping
>>>>facility, and it continues to there abide!"
>>>>     The three enormous ursines surrounded the dormant human, exchanging
>>>>intemperately
>>>>expressed opinions upon her probable ancestry and social habits.
>>>>Goldilocks, roused by the auditory input, rendered herself vertical,
>>>>perceiving that she was in the vicinity of large predatory creatures.
>>>>Sympathetic response flooded her autonomic nervous system, and she effected
>>>>immediate egress from the domicile.
>>>>     The ursines, offended by the impropriety of Goldilocks' behavior,
>>>>invested in a home security system to prevent future incursions.
>>>>     As for Goldilocks...she developed a theory of archetypes based on
>>>>anthropomorphic
>>>>images which resulted in a multi-million dollar insomnia-prevention industry
>>>>and her own private line of whole-grain foods.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 12:40:52 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 12:38:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Adam and Eve
To: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
cc: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Fri, 3 May 1996, Rick Riffle wrote:

> Feminist flame bate, look out duck!  I don't want to admit that I actually
> chuckled at this.

If you can't laugh at yourself, who can you laugh at?

-kc

> 
> Rick
> 
> At 09:45 AM 5/3/96 -0700, you wrote:
> >Some Friday humor for y'all.  :)  - E
> >>
> >>One day, after a near eternity in the Garden of Eden, Adam calls out to
> >>God, "Lord, I have a problem."
> >>
> >>"What's the problem, Adam?", God replies.
> >>
> >>"Lord, I know you created me and have provided for me and
> >>surrounded me with this beautiful garden and all of these
> >>wonderful animals, but I'm just not happy"
> >>
> >>"Why is that, Adam?", comes the reply from the heavens.
> >>
> >>"Lord, I know you created this place for me, with all this lovely food
> >>and all of the beautiful animals, but I am lonely."
> >>
> >>"Well Adam, in that case I have the perfect solution.
> >>I shall create a 'woman' for you."
> >>
> >>"What's a 'woman', Lord?"
> >>
> >>"This 'woman' will be the most intelligent, sensitive, caring, and
> >>beautiful creature I have ever created. She will be so intelligent
> >>that she can figure out what you want before you want it.
> >>She will be so sensitive and caring that she will know your
> >>every mood and how to make you happy. Her beauty will rival that
> >>of the heavens and earth. She will unquestioningly care for your
> >>every need and desire. She will be the perfect companion for
> >>you.", replies the heavenly voice.
> >>
> >>"Sounds great."
> >>
> >>"She will be, but this is going to cost you, Adam."
> >>
> >>"How much will this 'woman' cost me Lord?", Adam replies.
> >>
> >>"She'll cost you your right arm, your right leg, an eye, an ear, and your
> >>left testicle."
> >>
> >>Adam ponders this for some time, with a look of deep thought and
> >>concern on his face. Finally Adam says to God, "Ehhh, what can
> >>I get for a rib?"
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 12:47:46 1996
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Date: 03 May 96 15:36:51 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Adam and Eve
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ERIC!  Ha Ha Ha! That is so funny!  I read it out loud to my whole office, and
we all laughed hard!  yep, a roomful of women! You can admit you laughed Rick,
how could someone not?  Yippee, it's Friday!

Leslie  ; )  



______________________________________________

Feminist flame bate, look out duck!  I don't want to admit that I actually
chuckled at this.

Rick

-----------------------

At 09:45 AM 5/3/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Some Friday humor for y'all.  :)  - E
>>
>>One day, after a near eternity in the Garden of Eden, Adam calls out to
>>God, "Lord, I have a problem."
>>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 13:02:36 1996
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Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 23:13:20 -0500
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: cduwe@wesleyan.edu (Colin Duwe)
Subject: Narc Tactics
ReSent-Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 13:02:27 -0700 (PDT)
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There was a very interesting article in the New York Times Sunday Magazine
a week or two ago written by an ex-DEA guy. He wrote of professional narcs
who are paid handsomely by the DEA to deliver up drug dealers. The article
was primarily concerned with a cocaine incident. In it, the DEA acted like
total buffoons believing a guy who served up a dummy and collected big
cash. When the scandal began to break the cops covered their asses and the
ass of the lying narc. The dummy got sent up the river.

So imagine how easy (and profitable) it might be for someone to come into
our scene and do roughly the same thing. If they could deliver up real
dealers, they might live large for quite a while. All they would need is
someone in law enforcement who would pay them and an ability to talk the
talk a little. Since they wouldn't be real police they aren't forced to
obey the laws. They could smoke lots of pot for instance. And they would
have lots of money to buy foreign cars and such.

I don't mean this to pinpoint anyone in our scene. Just as a further
warning to be very careful who you buy from, who you sell to, and who you
help by drugs. Also be careful what you say. The dummy that got sent up the
river in the article was not at all involved in drugs. He was a parking lot
attendant with a wife. It was never established that he ever even saw
cocaine in his entire life, much less use it, much less sell it. He was
convicted of "conspiracy to sell narcotics." And what would our
neighborhood narcs do if they ran out of dealers to sell to the feds in
order to pay for their fancy cars? This is not paranoia. This is simply
another plea to thuroughly get to know your friends. Keep it tight and keep
the family alive.

Keep Smiling
Colin





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 13:08:48 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 13:10:34 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: ecoman@darwin.ucsc.edu (Steve Dennis)
Subject: Hey where are the tickets for Harmony?
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 I keep calling the Harmony number but it dosen't tell me where they are selling tickets! :-(  I really want to go and there are a number of friends that want to go too, but I need more information.  If anyone knows who has them please let me know.

Steve



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 13:20:02 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 16:19:27 -0400
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: LOST JOURNAL @ last sunset
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a friend of mine lost his journal at the last sunset gathering. it's a spiral
binder that has i think has a silver cardboard cover? if anyone found it can
you please email me so i can get it back to him. a whole year's worth of his
memories are in there. i hope his good karma will bring it back to him.
please ask any of your friends if they found it as well. 

thank you very much everybody,
theron

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 13:34:31 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 13:34:02 -0800
To: ecoman@darwin.ucsc.edu (Steve Dennis), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Hey where are the tickets for Harmony?
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At 1:10 PM  -0800 5/3/96, Steve Dennis wrote:
> I keep calling the Harmony number but it dosen't tell me where they are
>selling tickets! :-(  I really want to go and there are a number of
>friends that want to go too, but I need more information.  If anyone knows
>who has them please let me know.

__________
Because they are probably busy setting up, I'll pass this on.  It outlines
the schedule of events for Harmony.


Per Harmony:

Beautiful People this Friday was NOT a presale ticket party. So all the
tickets ARE still avialible, since we have not sold any yet. The doors
will open @ nine, and tickets to get in will be purchased at the door.

We DO however have a limited capacity of 800 people. This does not mean
800 tickets will be sold! This means ALL of the guest list, ALL of the
crew and ALL of the ticket sales = 800 people. We are very aware of
problems that arise when promoters overcrowd a space, and want to make
sure that we do not create a bad situation by doing just that.

So, yes you can still get into Beautiful People, but try to get there
early, because tickets will probably sell out fast! Once again the
doors open at 9pm. The party is in San Francisco, so if you are coming
from out of town get into the city and call the info #. (We will change
the message at around 7pm. to give the directions)

(408)486-9591+(408)450-3044 are the info #'s

Also, due to some last minute, unexpected budget increases (rrr!) we
are going to charge $15 at the door, instead of $13. It is all going to
be worth it!!!!!

Peace and love to you,

Greg :)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 13:38:36 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 13:36:52 -0700
Message-Id: <199605032036.NAA07882@dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Q Luong)
Subject: Me at Harmony
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If you're going to Harmony's BP tonight, be on the lookout for a short 
asian dude with a white shirt with blue writing, (Mossimo in the front, 
sight for sore eyes in the back)

It will be me! =)~

come say hi, i'll have candy!!

adam
                    R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 13:44:45 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 13:44:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: going away for a week...
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I'm going to be gone for a week to the web conference in Paris, so I won't
be able to deal with mailing list problems or emergencies or bounces or
the like until after I get back on the 12th.  If something is urgent,
please send mail to root@hyperreal.com, and you'll get an answer in some
indeterminate amount of time. :)  I just put a new hefty disk in hyperreal
so hopefully we won't have hardware problems.  Take care.

	Brian



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 13:45:12 1996
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Date: Fri, 03 May 1996 13:47:46 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Wow, any more and I'll see china
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 I think we have beaten the Narc thing so far into the ground that I'll soon
be able to see China. Let's get off this crap. We all were born with common
sense, and we all know what's right and wrong. All we have to do is use them
when we decide to indulge at a party or get it from someone we don't know.
If read a few of these post and alot of fingers are still being pointed in a
round about way. 
And I'm getting sick of it. If you see some joe smoe selling, don't buy it
from them unless you know that person or your close friend know that person.
Use common sense people! We all have it. To keep this thread going any more
is just saying that YOU like seeing your post on the mailing list. This
doesn't just include the Narc thing, it include all these other silly,
stupid little threads on here. We can put all our energy to something better
then this. I know I'll probally get flamed for this, but the point I'm tring
to make is valid. Whether the law says that Narc have to or not say who they
are if asked is besides the point. You should always use Common sense when
indulging. I know I try to at least. 

If people are concerned about the law and Narc..goto a library and look it
up in a book. Common sense. Never rely on second hand info. If I don't here
something from the cows mouth, then I take that info as nothing more then a
rumor and deal with it in that manner. If it can not be proven by the person
you heard it from, then it very will could be a rumor. If you hear that so
and so did this to so and so, you don't go telling half the city. Go to the
people involved and personnaly ask them if it true or not. Get that facts
before spreading something all over town.

It just boils down to common sense, if we actually use it we don't have to
waste time talking about crap like this and we can put it to other things
like throwing a massive party and not worry about a damn thing because
everyone is indulging and using there Common sense.

Sorry for the post, I had to let off some stress. Planning a party can get
to you sometimes. See ya all tonight and Sat. I'm turning my party mode on
and work mode off. I need a drink and a bowl. Anyone gotta light.

Tim


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 13:48:10 1996
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From: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
Message-Id: <199605032047.NAA18626@alumnae.caltech.edu>
Subject: Going to BP tonite!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 13:47:15 -0700 (PDT)
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Hope to meet lots of you at Beautiful People tonite!

5'6" chinese guy with a crewcut, probably a green and purple
striped shirt and a fuzzy white glove

Say hi!

	Smiles,
		Chin


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 14:06:09 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Wow, any more and I'll see china
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Motion carried!  New business?

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 14:13:45 1996
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From: kcroy <kcroy@best.com>
Message-Id: <199605032109.OAA13203@shellx.best.com>
Subject: music q (harmony v.m)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 14:09:41 -0700 (PDT)
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anyone ID the music on the harmony voice mail for me? heard it so many times
and never know by whom..

take care
kcroy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 14:17:56 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 14:17:36 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: I'll be at BP tonight!
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Yes, I'm going as well, but please, don't come up and say hi, my friends
will think I'm a loser if they know I'm on SFR.

I'll be the Ukranian guy, about 6'2", black hair, and I'll be wearing a
shark-skin suit with big fuzzy dice from my neck.  I'll probably be walking
around saying something like:  "Look at all you little snivling freaks, get
a life!  Go  on...NO! I don't want a hug!!  And get that damn glow stick
out of my face!!"

I don't dance either!

;^)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 14:22:14 1996
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Subject: Re: Not rave related but interesting
Date: Fri, 3 May 96 14:20:20 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
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>>>>  Want a laugh? Call the following number: (704) 377-4444. When the
..

http://www.charlotte.com/ads/menuman

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 14:43:54 1996
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Date: 03 May 96 17:42:34 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: B.P. Fashion Post
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Yep, I'mm SOOOOOO happy it's Friday... and here's my almost-obligatory posting
for those of you who don't know me .... look for me and come say hello, please!

In honor of my spring fever and the beautiful weather, and the party theme, I
have an overwhelming urge to dress in a mother earth kind of way, so I'm
planning to wear a crown of silk flowers in my hair tonight -- and mmost likely
a green/white striped jumpsuit -- 

I better hurry up and start weaving that daisy chain!  so see you at Harmony,
everyone!

Leslie  ; )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 15:15:47 1996
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From: trance@netcom.com (Tamara Palmer)
Message-Id: <199605032215.PAA28658@netcom19.netcom.com>
Subject: Goldie
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 15:15:41 -0700 (PDT)
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Funky Tekno Tribe and URB Present:

Friday, May 10
Metalheadz vs. Funky Tekno Tribe

with guest DJs Professor Smith (XLR8R), Raymond Roker (URB),
Graeme (FTT), and Markie

at The Sound Factory
525 Harrison

for info and directions: 415.266.8215

____

Hug Your Waistline to the Bassline
 
Tamara Palmer 
trance@netcom.com
http://www.interverse.com/~tamara/righting.html

Women Respond to Bass 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 15:25:37 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 15:21:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Also going to BP
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I'm also going to BP tonight.  I'd love to meet ya'all.  The only 
distinguishing thing I can think of are my earrings that say Kirsten, but 
they are pretty hard to see!  I'll also have a ladybug puppet and a 
flourescent body marker for the black light which everyone loves when 
they play with it!!  If I can remember what everyone else posted about 
themselves, I'll say hi!  

see ya on the dance floor.......
kc

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 16:11:52 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 16:11:44 -0800
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From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: pik-nik
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I'll be seeing you all at the picnic...

there's more than a few of you I've been wanting to finally meet in person
so look out for me:

blue shorts. green striped polo shirt. brown airwalks. photo's on my website.

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 16:12:32 1996
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From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: pik-nik
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I'll be seeing you all at the picnic...

there's more than a few of you I've been wanting to finally meet in person
so look out for me:

blue shorts. green striped polo shirt. brown airwalks. maybe crutches, if
my foots still hurts tommorrow. =( photo's on my website.

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 16:50:50 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 19:50:17 -0400
Message-ID: <960503195016_483879913@emout07.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: DIRECTIONS to the cabin!  <=
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Well hell, I'll just put these here and if any of you poops can get out of
your rocking chairs and on the road, you should take them with you!  If you
would like to go, please call the cabin after 8:30 or page before heading
out.

Directions

>From Sacramento Take Hwy 50 (50! NOT 80!) through Placerville, etc towards
South lake Tahoe.   After you get over the sumit and into the Tahoe valley,
past meyers, there will be a big intersection where 50 wraps to the right.
 Just Stay on 50, it soon turns into the main "Strip" in Tahoe, (hotels, etc.
everywhere.)  A couple miles before the casinos will be a pretty big
intersection called "Ski Run Blvd", Take a right here.  Go up 6 or 7 blocks
to Birch Ave.  The Cabin is on Birch, I believe it's a right on Birch, but
it's a small street, so don't worry.  The address is 3670.  The phone # at
the cabin is 916 542 9353, my pager is 916 855 6762.  Keep this piece of
paper!!!

Don't forget:
* a couple of dishes
* sleeping bags/blankees
* sleeping pad
* music
* food for yourself
* a dish for sat night's dinner
  (be creative!)
* a log or two, or a duraflame
* bathing suit (yeah, right : )
* towels
* dorky board games, etc.
* bicycles?
* toys, fuzzies
* jizits
* korpals
* middlypoops

In case you missed it, here's the run-down:
:)x<    : )x<  CABIN TRIP TOO!! - THIS FRI/SAT/SUN   :)x<    :)x<    
   Join us for a fun filled weekend in South Lake.  HERE'S THE SKINNY: This
FRI, SAT, SUN. * 15-20 peoples in a 2BD/2ba cabin W/HOT TUB, * not
neccesarily an SFR event-a MIXED GROUP of good, peacefull & fun, raver &
non(yet) raver folks, *  TURNTABLES yes, but a small sound system
w/annonymous D.J.s, *  MIXED MUSIC: house, alt., gen x retro goodies, ambi,
and a taste of GOA compliments of J-Sun back home from Savannah, * bring yer
rekkids & discuses *  really cool LIGHTING, lil lasers, and more by
NUTRALIGHT  *  CHEAP!: $15-20/person, * communal din din saturNIGHT *
snowbarding optional saturDAY * new and improved-easy to use-failsafe
DIRECTIONS *  Last one went off like mad!!! (Sorry no naked Moonpuppys this
time : [ )

Love, Love, Love,
Steve





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 16:52:29 1996
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From: Waldura Renaud <waldura@essi.fr>
Message-Id: <199605032353.BAA04231@jessica.essi.fr>
Subject: Re: Also going to BP
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 01:53:29 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605031538.B28345-0100000@uclink.berkeley.edu> from "KaySEE" at May 3, 96 03:21:41 pm
Reply-to: waldura@essi.fr (Renaud Waldura)
Organization: ESSI, Sophia Antipolis (France)
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	Me too :-)

	And you _really_ can't miss me: orange trousers with "France
	Techno" black shirt aren't so common in the Bay!

	See ya all,

(by the way, Renaud is really my firstname, don't believe the mail 
headers; it pronounces like \ra-no\)

-- 
Renaud Waldura                                   <http://www.essi.fr/~waldura/>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 17:02:45 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 17:02:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Full Moon #
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       Hello all and Happy Friday:). I was just wondering if anyone has 
the # for Full Moon? I've heard that it is tonight and I wanted to get 
the # for a friend. Thanks! I hope to meet some of you at the SFR picnic 
tommorrow- oh and Wayne, can you bring my shark with ya!
                                   hugs-
                                 Reagan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 17:52:34 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 17:45:35 -0700
Message-Id: <199605040045.RAA17992@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com>
From: shawna-@ix.netcom.com (Shawna McGourty)
Subject: Me too, me too! :)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey all! :)

Come look for me at Harmony, hopefully I should be pretty distinctive!  
I'll be wearing my Nekkid Leddy shirt (you who've seen it know the one, 
it has a picture the shape of a woman's figure made entirely of black 
horizontal stripes), old comfy jeans, converse high-tops, 
glo-stick-style bracelets on both wrists, and most likely my bright 
green feather boa! I'll probably have my bag of trip toys with me, you 
can play with them if you want!  (also, if it gets too hot I'll 
probably have changed from my Nekkid Leddy shirt to my regular light 
grey tank top).  I'm 5'8" with shoulder length brown hair.  Come & say 
hi! :)  If you're good I may even give you one of my glow-sticks! :)

Everybody seems in pretty good spirits tonight (aside from a few of you 
cranky oldsters! ;)  Looks like it's gonna be a good party, hope 
everybody brings their smiles & energy, I look forward to seeing my 
family once again!


Shawna

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 18:22:28 1996
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Date: Fri, 03 May 1996 06:23:58 -0700
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
From: Freak Zone <freakz@ultima.org>
Subject: Re: Newsweek-Herbal E
Cc: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>The article also says: "Some dealers of real Ecstasy [though] are lacing 
>their products with heroin; savvy users look out for telltale brown 
>specks in the pills"...


Brown specks are usually caused by imcomplete synthesis of the safrole (it's
brown too!)




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 18:59:25 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 18:59:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: raves in 408
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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I could've sworn that there was a huge rave here in the 408 (Santa 
Cruz/San Jose) but I haven't seen anything about it.  Does anyone know if 
there is one here?  If so please reply immediately w/ the #.  Thank you 
soooooooooooo much.

RAVE ON!


      ___                ___           ___     
     /\__\              /\__\         /\  \    
    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
   /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
  /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
 /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
 \/__/~~/:/  /      \/__\:\/:/  / \:\  /\ \/__/
       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    











    







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 19:47:22 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 19:48:48 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Ride needed from SF to Harmony or FMR
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Hi...   If anyone is going to FMR or Harmony tonight,  and has a car,
or knows someone who does,   please call me at 1-800-381-5847
It's even a free call.

Of course I'll pay my share of gas...   Also,   it is common for me
to get NO responses.   Probably because the person with the car might think
"Someone else would offer a ride"....   Anyways,   I've had little or no
response to my pleas for rides...

I'll be home tonight,  so please call.   If you live in SF,   I can meet
you along Lombard or Van Ness,  or SOMA at a specific time.

Thanx



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 20:18:45 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 20:18:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: Re: BBQ Fixins/ pumpkin pie
To: SDream <SDream@tgrigsby.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Thu, 2 May 1996, SDream wrote:
> 
> How about pumpkin pie for dessert?  I can cook up a couple of those, if 
> folks think they'll want some.  Anyone?

yeah! i love pumpkin pie. that would really make my day.

love,
tom

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 21:07:57 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 21:07:48 -0700
From: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
Message-Id: <199605040407.VAA06893@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: beltane review
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Fellow SFRavers,

Well, someone asked if anyone on sfraves went to the Beltane event
that was advertised as "1 1/2 hours north of San Francisco" and since
I was there, I will. I have been too busy catching up on the work I 
missed by going to post until now, though.

The location was incredible. It was in the forest, about 10 miles from
Rio Vista (which is along the Russian River). We parked at the bottom
and had to hike up about 3/4 mile along a very steep mountain road.
There was a 4X4 taking people's gear up, so we at least didn't have
to pack our stuff in, but the hike was work. I ended up getting so
excited I did it three times that night/day, so it wasn't _that_ bad,
but I am getting a little ahead of myself here.

I got there about 12:30 AM and the party was jamming already by then.
There were probably 50 people at this point. The hosts had put tiki
torches in a circle and good music was spinning. After getting my tent
and such set up, I danced for a while to some very nice music, then
went down to help direct traffic for a while. People were still coming
when I got off shift at 5 AM. I think the directions on the voice line
were a little off, so some people got lost. It was kind of funny: by
dawn there was about an equal stream of people coming and going. We
maxed out at about 100.

Around dawn, a bunch of us decided To go Completely Ballistic and
ended up staying up all morning. As it got hot, we headed down
to a crystalin stream at the base of the hill, which had was very
nicely cold (it was really Hot!) and had a swimming hole and everything.

All in all, it was a very enjoyable and enlightening experience.
The best part for me was the fact that there was a very diverse
group of people: rich, poor, old, young, ravers, Beautiful People,
computer geeks (ahem), pagans, skeptics, etc. and while there was 
a certain amount of splitting into "camps" a lot of respectful
communication occured.

Who was subverting whose paradigm? I really couldn't have told you.

It was not especially a Beltanish sort of celebration, at least not
the way I understand Beltane, but it was pretty darn cool anyway.

One unpleasant thing did happen though:

Somehow Jason (from Pacific) got his records left out in the sun
and warped. This is really a big loss to all of us that love his
music. He is always doing free Djing at events like this and I think
we should start a collection going so he can afford to buy some new
records. It will not be the same, without some of his old greats,
but it will be interesting to see what a "new and improved" Jason
will sound like! If you would like to contribute, contact me. A few
of us who were there have already gotten it started.

Peace,
Jim

PS I know it is a little late, but if any of you see me at Harmony
come up and say hi! I will be wearing a nean green shirt with a map
of the moon all over it.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 23:48:29 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 23:49:56 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Probably won't make Harmony
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Well,  if you don't find me at Harmony, it's because nobody from Marin
responded to my posting asking for a ride.    I cannot believe out of
all those people who went to Harmony that nobody coming in from Marin
had room in their car.    Besides,  I'm not that excited patronizing
a venue that stations guards at the restroom doors to prevent people
from filling their water bottles so they can line their pockets.

I should be able to make the picnic tommorrow...  so look for me
there.

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May  3 23:48:36 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 23:50:03 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Harmony
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Say,  the next time any of you who live in Marin,  or SF happen to have
room in your car,   would it be possible to give me a call?

I'm usually home around 6 PM or so...

I would have liked to have been able to get there this evening.
I'm sure that there are more people in Marin than just me and
Black Sabbeth who usually never has room in his car.   There
just isn't enough people from Marin that has a car,  and is
willing to take a fellow raver.

Anyways,  if any of you happen to get this message in time,
please phone me....   1-800-381-5847

The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 00:29:32 1996
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Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 00:29:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Re: Newsweek-Herbal E
To: blkadder@value.net
cc: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960502210253.16269B-100000@value.net>
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I read the entire article(s) today in the waiting room of a tire and 
brake shop..  It was interesting and it could have been worse.  The 
closing comment was a statistic..something like there are still 1000 
deaths from prescription drugs vs. about 1 death from natural remedies.

Another interesting fact seemed to be that many deaths with herbal 
remedies involved the liver. Nearly all of the "herbal" deaths occured 
from massive doses (far exceeding the recommended dosage).

As far as Ephedra goes, I believe this wonderful plant is being abused by
many companies*..target pyramid diet product corporations..massive doses, 
I know.  In my previous attempts to loose weight with some wonder drug,
I have tried products containing ma huang, and known to me now many 
conflicting herbs.  Avoid Omnitrition, Equinox International, and Shaperight.
Everyone reacts differently of course,however all of these products made me
spaced out, nervous, irritable..big time.  I can't even imagine what 
might have happened should I have thought to take 12 pills at once..anyway...
As we all know, everything can be abused, even water.

*Believe it, these folks who have sold 150 million tablets for $3.00 a 
piece and their cost is .67 each, are IMHO abusing ancient Chinese 
Medicine and wisdom, their doses are way to huge and there was no real 
testing...  oh it's herbal, it must be ok...  The problem that I have 
with all of the make money quick with herbal high folks, is that in the 
long run, their greed will hurt us all and the return to sane ancient ways...
for healing...


> > 
> > The article also says: "Some dealers of real Ecstasy [though] are lacing 
> > their products with heroin; savvy users look out for telltale brown 
> > specks in the pills"...
> 

I found the above quote interesting when I read it because the very first 
E I ever had was a white dome-shaped tablet and it had brown specs...as I 
recall, I did get a bit sick to my stomach, however it passed in about 
1/2 hour to one hour...Don't know what the specs were butsomething made 
me ill.    This was in December of '92.

My two cents...  
--Maureen




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 08:26:46 1996
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Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 08:26:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Yeah!!!! 
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Whew, BP was amazing!!  What a great vibe!!  Thanks to all the wonderful
people I met last night and this morning...  especially Eric, who was very
supportive at all the right times! ;) 

(time to try to shut my eyes for a bit before going to the picnic....)  
I was (and will be) wearing a white shirt with a big smiley face on it.

:) :) :) :) :) :)

)paul(


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 09:28:18 1996
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Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 09:28:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Rave in Sacramento tonight...
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There's a small party in Sac tonight, does anyone know the number off hand?

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 10:31:26 1996
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Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 09:37:04 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Looking for event to webcast
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There's a techno club in Tokyo that'll be webcasting using CUSEEME, IRC &
email on 5/30.  We want to do a 2 way webcast between Tokyo & the Bay Area.
The problem is in order to match time with Tokyo our event will have to
start at 8 a.m. Thursday morning (5/30).  If anyone knows of anything at
all happening then please email me directly.

Some possibilities we've thought of are live computer graphics, performance
art, drag races and nature scenes.   I'm a little desperate so any idea is
appreciated.

Thanks,

Doran



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 12:29:20 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Q Luong)
Subject: HARMONY'S BP!!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Now, Harmony's Beautiful People....

That was I-N-C-R-E-D-I-B-L-E!!!!!!!!!

Everybody was oozing with vibe and it was sure bouncing off the 
walls!!!!

Troysheets!
Shawna!
CTD-Zine!
LowUfo!
Branka!
CHIN! (with the white glove!)
Amy!

We all gotta hook up and do that again.... =)~

adam
                            R.Lunatic

time to catch some more Z's


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 12:39:23 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: BBQ
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Uh oh...   Does anyone know where the BBQ is supposed to be?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 13:00:11 1996
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To: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
From: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Lack of South Bay Events
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 04:30 PM 4/26/96 -0700, you wrote:
>> 
>> EP>>I just dont think there is enough interested people in the area, but
>> EP>>then again i live in Palo Alto. I suggest moving to SF!!!
>> EP>>
>> EP>>The Finn
>> 
>> EP>There is a lot of interest in the San Jose area, Finn!
>> EP>moving to SF is a scary thought...
>> 
>> I might move to the city, cuz it is too sleepy here, but the commute
>> would be a brain drain.....
>> 
>> So what interest is there in SJ ? What sort of crowd, sound ..etc
>> 
>> Stephen
>> 
>
>
>
Check out Velvet shop on thursdays and Quench on Sundays.

I wouldnt say it's sleepy here, but just more laid back. Lotsa cool people. 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 13:02:05 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Lack of South Bay Events
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>Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 11:47:03
>To: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
>From: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
>Subject: Re: Lack of South Bay Events
>Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
>
>At 04:30 PM 4/26/96 -0700, you wrote:
>>> 
>>> EP>>I just dont think there is enough interested people in the area, but
>>> EP>>then again i live in Palo Alto. I suggest moving to SF!!!
>>> EP>>
>>> EP>>The Finn
>>> 
>>> EP>There is a lot of interest in the San Jose area, Finn!
>>> EP>moving to SF is a scary thought...
>>> 
>>> I might move to the city, cuz it is too sleepy here, but the commute
>>> would be a brain drain.....
>>> 
>>> So what interest is there in SJ ? What sort of crowd, sound ..etc
>>> 
>>> Stephen
>>> 
>>
>>
>>
>Check out Velvet shop on thursdays and Quench on Sundays.
>
>I wouldnt say it's sleepy here, but just more laid back. Lotsa cool people. 
>
PS: the sound is... whatever people feel like playing or listening to. 
        You can check out Spun (a San Jose native) who just got back from
Chicago. 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 13:19:39 1996
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From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Review: Beautiful People by Harmony
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Warning: kinda long...

The crew:  Michelle, Sabrina, and Marty, and myself.
The time: 9:45pm.
The mission: To infiltrate the Beautiful People rave with grins, hugs, 
lotion, fruit, and as many toys as we could lug in.  

We came well-equipped.  The night before, Michelle and I raided the local 
Toys-R-Us and came away with glo-sticks, Floam, Pez, bubbles, various 
stickers, a ladybug hand puppet.  I picked up grapes, oranges, and the 
Newsweek with the article on herbal drugs.  I also brought my lucky boxer 
shorts, but I won't get into that right now...  I felt like Santa Claus 
hefting my backpack into this place...

9:45pm found us hurtling from the South Bay to SF.  I didn't drive -- I flew 
very, very, close to the ground.  I warned my passengers ahead of time, I'm 
not so much a driver as an automotive stylist.  They looked at each other 
and immediately fastened every seat belt they could find.  Marty found a 
roll of duct tape and used it to further secure herself to the seat.

We had some unscheduled stops on the way up, so we didn't roll up until 
10:20pm.  After cutting Marty out of the back seat, we hurried in.

This rave went OFF!  It was at...<shudder>... the Jerrold street deli.  The 
space was incredibly well done!  I've decided that that was the best setup 
in that space I've seen so far.  I'm convinced that promoters learn from 
each other, so here's what they did right:

1. All kinds of props, stuff hanging from the walls and ceiling.  The last 
party I went to there, Fusion, had props strung across the space above the 
dance floor, and it's a *really* good effect.

2. Black plastic sheeting used to create a MUCH better chill space feeling 
upstairs.  That's one thing this space always seems to lack, but this time 
it was GREAT!  Need a little chill space for folks to sit and chat and be 
friendly!

3. Lot's of very good artwork (my favorite: "I am the Sun, you are the Moon, 
we are ...", can't remember the last...)  

4. Good lighting.  Lasers, lights, decent visuals.  Essential.

5. The promoter only allowed 800 people in.  That must be a magic number or 
something, because it was full but not crowded.  It was *just right*.

6. Free goodies!  Ok, they were cheap little plastic bears on string so you 
could wear them like a necklace, but they were cute!  The kind of nice 
little extra that starts things off right but doesn't cost the promoter an 
arm and a leg.

7. I don't know if this was planned or if it just happened, but at some 
point the Bathroom Nazi disappeared.  See, at this space, they have someone 
to control the flow of people going into the restrooms, but more than that, 
to make sure no one takes a bottle in to refill it.  With the no designated 
Bathroom Nazi, refills were a cinch!

The music was very good, and rather cutting edge -- including one break in 
the music that lasted 5 full minutes.  What pioneers of music!  Ok, just 
kidding, there were a couple of glitches, including one point where 
something weird happened and the music cut out a couple of times.  Not bad 
though.

THE VIBE:  Wow!  This is the first rave I've been to at that space since the 
Origins party way back when that had a really good vibe.  Everyone was 
happy, dancing, chatting, hugging.  And I met the coolest people from this 
list!!!  I saw a lot of old friends and met a bunch of new ones.  I'm not 
even going to try to name them all, but Jess really stood out -- folks, she 
is so cool to hang out with!  And this girl gets OFF!  She was moving and 
grooving the whole time!  Simply amazing...  And I got a chance to sit with 
Shawna for a bit!  Finally!  I got to be ... da da DAAAAAA!  Lotion Man!  I 
wandered around with my Cat-in-the-Hat hat doling out lotion to anyone that 
would take it.  I also got to be ... da da DAAAAAA!!!  Sticker Man, Orange 
Man, Grape Man, and Phat Hugz Man.  <hehe!>  I had so much stinkin' fun! 

Cool Moment:  Too many to list, but I did take LOTS of pictures!

Good karma:  I left my camera sitting out twice for as long as half an hour 
and no one bothered it.  After the second time and a frantic search before 
locating it on top of a speaker, I figured I'd used up all the good luck in 
my boxers for that evening...

Whew... Well, we all just got up.  The drive home as the sun came up was 
nice.  Gotta get the crew up and moving so we can make it to the BBQ...  Now 
if only I can figure out where it is...

S




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 13:52:27 1996
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Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 13:52:35 -0700
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From: VaVoom! 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: BBQ
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everyone have a good time at the picnic/BBQ!

i can't make it.. why do these outdoor events always happen on work days? :(

watch out for those teddy bears !

brendan


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 14:57:47 1996
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Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 15:01:22 -0700
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From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Ahhh!, I'm Sooo Clueless.....
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Hiya All;

        So, like, where's the BBQ; duh!!!!!

Happy
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 16:25:17 1996
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Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 04:31:25 -0700
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Save room for dessert!!!!

Freshly made Strawberry pies incoming!!!!!!!

CT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 16:26:40 1996
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Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 16:28:27 -0800
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From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: Also going to BP
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>I'm also going to BP tonight.  I'd love to meet ya'all.  The only 
>distinguishing thing I can think of are my earrings that say Kirsten, but 
>they are pretty hard to see!  I'll also have a ladybug puppet and a 
>flourescent body marker for the black light which everyone loves when 
>they play with it!!  


speaking of black light-fluorescent things, i'm bringing the paints! should
be a blast! i'll keep an eye out for like-minded peoples, but if you follow
the trail of painted bodies, you should find me eventually....:>

>see ya on the dance floor.......
>kc
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 18:12:17 1996
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Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 18:07:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: End of the world party
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I think I would be more interested in attending the after-party.

Much love,
				<<< Starchild >>>

My computer tells me that on Tue, 30 Apr 1996, Eric shared:

> If we get enough advance notice of the end of the world, someone should
> throw and End of the World Party!  It could be a synchronized event
> occurring in every major raving city in the world.  Would they be massives
> or undergrounds?  Would we want whistles?  Drums?  Clapping?  Live music of
> any kind?  How about the music?  Techno?  House?  Trance?  Trip-hop?  What
> would make the best end of the world party?  It would definitely have to
> last longer than any party has in history; maybe it could incorporate
> everything that everyone likes the most.  The spaces would have to be
> fairly large, cool, and unusual.  Anyone want to start a planning
> committee?
> 
> Peace in the end times,
> 
> - E

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 18:18:42 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: Dana Watanabe <DWATANAB@uci.edu>
cc: "Rusty H. Hodge" <rusty@hodge.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Legal Info, NRR
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Dear Friends & Family,
	
My computer tells me that on Thu, 25 Apr 1996, Dana shared (in part):

> And even if the jury isn't the type to just say "Drugs are Evil",
> they would have to be told and proven that the way the
> cops arrested you was illegal.  On a jury, you can't just say:
> "Hey that was entrapment!"  I mean, you can, but chances
> are teh otehr jurors won't beleive you unless the lawyer
> brought up proof of it.  (Not to mention that you aren't really
> supposed to make presumptions about the law yourself :)

	Dana's message has some great practical advice, but in her final 
sentence it would have been more accurate to say that judicial authorities 
generally do not *want* you to make presumptions about the law yourself, 
just as doctors don't want you to practice home remedies and record 
companies would rather you not tape songs off the radio -- they want to 
maintain their monopoly.  
	In fact however, you *are* legally entitled to do so.  When you sit 
on a jury, you are empowered to decide not only whether the law was broken, 
but more importantly, whether the defendant(s) should be found guilty of 
breaking the law.
	Historically, this has been a very important guarantor of 
people's freedom in the United States.
	An early case of "jury nullification" occurred in 1735, when 
the British governor of New York tried to have a newspaper publisher 
jailed for publishing material that made him look bad.  Criticising 
public officials was against the law, regardless of whether or not the 
criticism was valid, and the publisher, Peter Zenger, freely 
admitted he broke the law, but the jury in the case determined that the 
information he had published was in fact true, and acquitted him.
	During the period leading up to the Civil War, Northern juries 
sometimes refused to convict runaway slaves.  And the refusal of many 
jurors to convict defendants accused of breaking laws against selling and 
possessing alcohol during Prohibition contributed to the eventual repeal 
of that misguided law.  
	The reason jury nullification is so important is that it allows 
the people to vote directly against unjust laws, or laws that are 
unjustly applied by police or other authorities who may be corrupt, racist, 
etc. 
	Unfortunately, even though the right of jurors to try both the 
facts and the law in court has been upheld many times over the years, 
most judges today will not tell juries they have this right, and often 
lie and tell them exactly the opposite:  That they *must* find a defendant 
who has broken the law guilty.
	Members of the Fully Informed Jury Association (FIJA), a group 
formed to educate the public about their rights as jurors, have been 
disqualified as jurors for their beliefs, and in some cases arrested 
merely for handing out literature about jury rights outside courthouses.
	One more fine example of America's slide toward a police state.  
There is now talk of making it necessary only to have a majority of 
jurors vote to convict for a defendant to be found guilty, rather than by 
unanimous consent as has always been the case, or even of eliminating 
trial by jury altogether.
	In fact, for many people trial by jury in this country has 
already been eliminated.  Under "civil asset forfeiture," the government 
can legally prosecute your property (money, house, car, etc.) as having 
been used in a crime, and seize any or all of it.  Since you technically 
are not the defendant, they say, you are not entitled to be judged by a 
panel of your peers. 
	Many other people are intimidated into pleading guilty by being 
threatened with much stiffer sentences if they demand their day in 
court.  Something like 95% of criminal defendants plead guilty before 
they ever get a chance for a jury to hear their side of the story.
	What would you do, if given the chance to plead guilty and face 
maybe a year in prison and a $500 fine, or go to court and if found 
guilty, go to jail for ten or fifteen years?
	If you want to fight back against this kind of "justice," make 
sure you register to vote so that you will be eligible for jury duty.  If 
you are selected, pretend to agree with all the instructions given to you 
by the judge.  You may be required to swear an oath saying you will vote 
to convict if you find the law has been broken, but it is an illegal oath, 
and you are under no obligation to keep it.  
	When you get on the jury, vote your conscience.  If someone 
clearly "broke the law" by selling drugs, holding an "illegal" gathering, 
etc., if you do not believe these things should be crimes, vote "Not 
Guilty," and you'll have done your part to keep Big Brother at bay. 
	For more information on FIJA, call Marion McEwen at (510) 889-1544.

Yours in liberty,
				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 18:42:01 1996
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Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 18:46:15 -0700
Message-Id: <199605050146.SAA06496@dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com>
From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: Much thanks 2 you B.P.!!!!! 
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello everyone,

    Well, I am finally awake after what I think could have been the 
longest and toughest night of my life, (Beautiful People). Last night 
was a blast!!! We put every last bit of love and energy into that 
party, and oh man was it worth it!! You guys are so "beautiful!" We 
want to say thank you to all of you who came out and supported us. We 
hope everyone had a great time, and we'll see you in the future!!!

    Speaking of which, we have a free Harmony day party coming up! It 
will be on Sunday, May 12th. The party should begin around noonish and 
go into the night. Call the info lines for more information about this. 
We would love to see you there!!!

Peace, love and harmony to all beautiful people,

Greg :)

ps. to all of you that I met last night, it was good to finally meet 
you! Take care...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 19:12:53 1996
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Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 07:15:02 -0700
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From: Freak Zone <freakz@ultima.org>
Subject: Wicked!
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Wicked tonight!

Stop by the light show set up and say hi.
I'll be wearing a burgundy t-shirt


-Sean

_____________________________________
F R E A K   Z O N E !
"House music all night long..."
(415) 227-7421
_____________________________________


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 19:25:20 1996
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Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 19:25:00 -0700
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Freak Zone wrote:
> 
> Wicked tonight!
> 
> Stop by the light show set up and say hi.
> I'll be wearing a burgundy t-shirt
> 
> -Sean
> 
> _____________________________________
> F R E A K   Z O N E !
> "House music all night long..."
> (415) 227-7421
> _____________________________________The Line-up for Wicked according to Garth:  Thomas, Jeno, Markie, Garth
       in that order..Hope to see you there...dj Tracy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 19:57:06 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Boston
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Hey all!  next weekend I am going to see my parants (whom I have not seen 
for eight years) in Boston and I was wondering if anybody knew of any 
cool records shops or any good clubs to go to there.  I will be their for 
a Saturday and Sunday night so does anyone have any suggestions?  I would 
be very gratefull for any relivant info because the idea of me spending 
the whole weekend couped up in some hotel with my parants seems to me 
like taking loads of very strong acid and then standing in an all white 
room for the duration of the trip.
Yours nervious about BOston.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May  4 23:06:46 1996
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From: Jondabomb@aol.com
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Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 02:06:19 -0400
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Hey Matt please e-mail me privately so I can ask you something!
Jonathan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 00:56:14 1996
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Date: Sun, 05 May 1996 17:46:38 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Introduction
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Hi,

I've just subscribed to sfraves, so I thought I would write a quick intro.

I'm currently based in Brisbane, Australia, but am considering a move to SF
to take up a job offer at a groovy ISP based there - if that happens it will
probably be in the next month. So I thought I would subscribe and check out
the rave scene.

My tastes at the moment centre on goa-trance, particularly out-door goa
parties. There's a lot of them in this part of the world (especially a
couple of hours south in Byron Bay). I was supposed to be going to a goa
party on Friday night in Byron, but there's flooding here at the moment, and
the roads were cut... <sob>

If anyone wants to take 5 minutes to reply privately on the pros/cons of
living in SF, particularly ex-australians, I would appreciate that...

...jamie

--
dpp@peg.apc.org                       http://www.peg.apc.org/~dpp
D o m i n a n t      P i n e a p p l e      P r o d u c t i o n s
'Lead this life to the fullest, it may be the last life you have'


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 02:06:59 1996
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Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 02:06:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Haunted by Waters Schedule Correction (fwd)
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri, 3 May 96 07:24:19 -0700
From: Shevaun Gallant <she@xaostools.com>
To: Lana@cruzio.com, brandone@sco.com, randream@cats.ucsc.edu,
    James_E_Kaspar@notes.seagate.com, andrewk@sco.com, Mbeese@ea.com,
    booji@slip.net
Subject: Haunted by Waters Schedule Correction

Thanks to James for pointing out the mistake in the dates of the last E-mail....

She ^`..'^

>Subject: Haunted by Waters Schedule Correction
>
>Haunted by Waters will be performing on
>Sunday, May 5th at the
>Whole Earth Festival (UC Davis), not Sunday May 9th, since no such time
>exists!
>
>However, on Thursday, May 9th, Cheb i Saba, along with Axiom of Choice will
>be at the Sound Factory in San Francisco - 525 Harrison Street.
>Also appearing "Sukhawat and Rifatt Ali Khan & Party"
>with
>Odissi temple dancer "Jyoti Rout"
>plus
>visuals by "1008 Saddhus & Cara Devi",
>"Mehndi" henna hand painting,
>"Masala Chi" tea.
>
>Doors 8 PM, Show 9:30 PM 21+.
>
>Tickets $15.00 in advance at BASS.
>For more info call 415-789-8467 or X DOT 25 Productions at 800-710-8600.
>
>See you there!


     She  ^`..'^
   




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 09:01:58 1996
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Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 09:01:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: BBQ
In-Reply-To: <318B400D.5A71@ix.netcom.com>
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    Yeah I didn't get to try any of those pies, but the empty dish looked 
yummy:(.

    The picnic was purrfect!
                              love-
                          Reagan




On Sat, 4 May 1996, CT wrote:

> Save room for dessert!!!!
> 
> Freshly made Strawberry pies incoming!!!!!!!
> 
> CT
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 10:03:14 1996
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From: "Michael Lasmanis" <mikey@sfo.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 09:49:16 -8
Subject: test - please ignore
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hit 'd' now.

just testing my alias and subscription

mike

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 11:56:18 1996
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Subject: Harmony-BBQ
Date: Sun, 5 May 96 11:55:39 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
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Yes my friends!

Harmony kicked ass the other night. Ethan, DJ Dan and Graeme ripped up 
the turntables. The vibe was amazing, as many others have reported. At 
one point I was standing upstairs looking over the balcony and I could 
hardly believe how much energy was on the dance floor. I really couldn't 
sit down for more than 10 minutes. Thank you, Harmony crew for all your 
hard work and the groovy decorations.

I also met a lot of nice people last night, esp. Leslie, Eric P., SDream, 
Melissa and Branka. You guys are so cool! There were also many other nice 
folks who came up to say hello. Sorry if I wasn't more responsive, I was 
in 'a state of mind' to say the least.

Well, after Harmony was over we hung out at a friend's place and then it 
was off to the SFR bbq on no sleep. Woo hooo! It was a beautiful day, and 
I met some more fun people. We spent most of our afternoon dancing to 
BioJeff, LeLe and Ethan, fueled by ginseng and soda. Check me into a home 
for geriatric ravers, my feet will never be the same!! Today I feel like 
crap, but it was all worth it. Thanks also to Tim (and everyone else who 
helped) for pulling it off. 

What a great 24 hours! I hope to see you all again soon, maybe at 
Harmony's outdoor party.

-Amy

PS.- Paul says hello

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 12:09:14 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, idm@hyperreal.com, sf@xanadu.cyborganic.net
From: Jon Drukman <jsd@cyborganic.com>
Subject: interesting show tonight
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something that all fans of electronic music will want to check out:

Veggie Beat Manifesto (uh yeah sure... we know who this is, right?)
Single Cell Orchestra
Freaky Chakra

at the Edge in Palo Alto.  (from the city take 101 S to oregon expressway,
heading west... right at el camino, right on california)

single cell & freaky going head to head starting at 8 PM.


--
Name:  Jon
Email: jsd@cyborganic.com
Web:   http://www.cyborganic.com/bass-kittens/



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 13:13:05 1996
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From: Dimitri K Gortinsky <myself@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: harmony (BP)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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wanted to say hello to all the stanford and uscs folks that i met and saw. 
And i hope to see you all again........
dimitri


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 14:41:53 1996
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Date: Sun, 05 May 1996 14:42:44 -0700
From: Tex Manithep <tavin@slip.net>
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Subject: Vintage Videos from 1991-1992 Events
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Hello everyone,

Do you know of anyone with rare, raw footage from parties (1991-1992)?
If so, could you send email to me as to how to get a copy.
We would like to use this material for a photo/video montage for a 
work-in-progress on expanded consciousness.

Peace,
Tex & Heather

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 17:25:00 1996
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Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 20:55:09 +1000 (EST)
From: ed colmar <lmnt@nixon.ind.net>
To: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: sci-fi dj?
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.3.91.960505204855.13131A-100000@nixon.ind.net>
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> does anyone know the name of the dj that spun before and after mars last 
> night?
> sarah

	It was me  :)  

	I hope you liked it.  

	BTW I'm also playing monday (5/6/96) at the bahia cabana with 
DRC  for more info call:  415.263.5797 

	::hug::

	e

_______                                   _____________________________
       |  CDJ LMNT    ...     ed colmar  |                         
       |  Aural Pilot .. immersive Arts  |         /|   
_______|  http://www.immersivearts.org/  |_______|/ |__________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 18:44:19 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605060144.SAA17228@netcom9.netcom.com>
Subject: Thanks and $$ to Tim!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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[ to sfraves mailist ]

 Such a great little picnic yesterday! The music was somewhat late due
to generator problems , but Tim rented a replacement generator and the
music finally started cranking out at about 3PM. 

 These rare SFR events are nice for allowing us to meet folks who we
only know by email addresses. I finally got to talk face to face with 
Leslie , and a few more folks.

 I left early ( about 5:50 PM ), due to the effects of a springtime
cold. I just wasn't in dancing shape. But I did stay long enough to eat
some chicken and beef cooked by the picnic organizer , Tim (aka Knucklehead)
. There was also some good chicken and beef marinated and cooked by 
BlackAdder - delicious!

 One last thing - since the free donated genrator konked out, Tim had
to rent another generator with his own money. When you see him next time,
give him some $$$ !!!

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 19:10:19 1996
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Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 19:10:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Reply-To: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: somewhat related to Traci... (nrr)
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For those of us with nothing to do on Tues (or, on any night, for that
matter):


       TUE MAY 7

                            Good Vibrations Presents 

                            SALUTE TO
                            MASTURBATION

                        Good Vibrations, the legendary sex toy, book &
			video store, has proclaimed May, 1996 as National
                        Masturbation Month and kicks off a month
			devoted to self-love with
			highlights of the best masturbating
                        scenes from X-rated and educational videos by
                        mainstream and independent filmmakers! Hosted
			by sex educator Carol Queen, with a special
			surprise guest. Approx. 90 mins. TUE at 7:00, 9:15
			At the Roxie Cinema, SF






From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 21:25:52 1996
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Date: Sun, 05 May 1996 09:27:37 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Freak Zone <freakz@ultima.org>
Subject: MacDonald's Commercial
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Has anybody seen the MacDonnald's commercial with Ronald dancing at a rave?



-Sean

_____________________________________
F R E A K   Z O N E !
"House music all night long..."
(415) 227-7421
_____________________________________


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 22:25:47 1996
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From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: Freak Zone <freakz@ultima.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: MacDonald's Commercial
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yeah i saw it last night :) there's one with him golfing too!  boy can 
that guy boogie, eh? :)

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May  5 23:23:12 1996
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Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 23:23:38 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: sddpw@sirius.com (Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works)
Subject: searching for promoters
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I've put up a similar message before, but I am putting out the call one
more time before the end of the school year.

I am doing an independent study on the police permit process in San
Francisco.  Just what you have to do to get a permit, what the police are
looking for, what the building inspectors are looking for, what actual
policy is compared to the official line of crap that they give you, what a
promoter's constitutional rights are, etc.

I've done most of the research, but I was hoping to interview a couple of
people who have actually gone through the process (or have tried and
failed!).  So, if you or anyone you know has tried this most daunting task,
could you e-mail me or give me a call at (415) 773-6360?

When I am done with the project, I am hoping to have it printed up and
available through various organizations for free or at cost.  This
"personal angle" aspect will help make a worthwhile project all the better.

Thanks for your eye time and help.

Arkay



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 00:02:35 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 00:02:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: MIKE BOLGER <dislex@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: saving the world
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there use to be these kinds of people that I use to see *all* the time at 
these types of things.even though we've never had any real conversations 
& made eye contact only a handful of times, I've allways gotten a 
distinct impression that it was understood that things were cool between 
us, but that could just be in my head, I couldn't say. whay I do know is 
that are Raver Superheros and they have the ablity to inspire me & quite 
a few others to be something better than we were before.

If I was George Lucas I would have made an action figure of them already.

Lately, their presance has becoming rarer, which is too bad, but at the 
same time that's taught me to appreciate more the people who are able to 
make it out on their sundays. appreciate that moment as it exists while it 
lasts.

bunk drugs or not, I hang with cool people.

and for that, I'm grateful.

:)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 01:01:10 1996
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To: eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com
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Subject: Re: MacDonald's Commercial
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My friend is in the party one, haven't seen it though...I think it was filmed
at 1015...
Jonathan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 06:06:37 1996
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From: tim744@silicon.email.net
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 06:06:31 PDT
Subject: Big Thanks!!
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I just wanted to say thanks to all the people that lended a hand for this
picnic party. Thanks goes out to Ethan for brining the Sound system. John
Carol for hauling it to and from. All the DJ's that spun at the party. Sorry
your sets were not as long as I'd liked them to be. Thanks to all the people
that help in anyway, and last but not least, all the people that showed. I
hope everyone had a good time, I sure had a blast! Thanks for making it a
really good time.
 
Tim (knucklehead)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 07:24:25 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 07:24:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: MacDonald's Commercial
To: Freak Zone <freakz@ultima.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Ugh!  Yes, I saw it yesterday... part of "the Ronald grows up" ad 
campaign.  Never mind the fact that as one of the largest beef-industry 
powerhouses, McDonalds is responsible for the clearcutting of forests for 
cattle-grazing land, or the destruction of sustainable agriculture in this
and other countries.. etc, etc.   Monoculture embracing the "rave vibe" 
stinks of a "Reality Bites"-like cynicism, IMHO.


On Sun, 5 May 1996, Freak Zone wrote:

> Has anybody seen the MacDonnald's commercial with Ronald dancing at a rave?
> 
> 
> 
> -Sean
> 
> _____________________________________
> F R E A K   Z O N E !
> "House music all night long..."
> (415) 227-7421
> _____________________________________
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 07:57:06 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 07:55:25 -0700
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From: shawna-@ix.netcom.com (Shawna McGourty)
Subject: Fwd: possible raving roomie? (non-rave)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey all:

Well when I first posted this, I didn't get any real takers, so now 
that it's getting later in the year, I'll post it again & see if 
anybody's situations have changed at all.  Hope to hear from some of 
ya! :)

Love,
Shawna

________________________________________________________________________


Ok, it's getting to be about that time that I've GOT to get out of the 
Concord area!!

So, for anybody who's interested, this is what I'm looking for:

I am looking to move out of my current apartment and move into a house 
somewhere in the Berkeley/North Oakland area.  I will probably begin 
looking for places in May with the intention of doing the actual move 
in June.  I'm not in any situation where I'm required to move, so this 
time around I'm really going to take the time to find the perfect place 

& a nifty roommate to share the place with.  Last time I was in a 
desperte situation to find a roommate and ended up with a religious 
Catholic fresh out of rural Minnesota for the first time in his life!  
A nice guy of course, but is not someone who is "on my level" if you 
know what I mean.  So this time I will search for & find a roomie more 
on that level with me! :)  Hence my posting to sfraves about this, a 
raving roommate would be much more to my liking!  Anyway, to begin 
with, what I'm looking for is one roommate who can afford about the 
same as I can ($600-$650 a month) so we can get a fat house!  I am 
definitely looking for a house this time, not an apartment, preferably 
with a bathtub & fireplace! :) (don't know how feasible this is, but 
something cool might just pop up, I have the time to look!)  As far as 
the roommate is concerned, male or female, gay or straight, whatever, 
is fine.  I work a normal 8-5 monday thru friday job, so I guess I'd 
want somebody who's more quiet on the weekdays (someone who probably 
works similar hours as me I suppose & thus doesn't rage loudly into the 

weekday nights ;), but does whatever on the weekends!  I have a very 
sweet cat (has not yet once made a mistake in any other area other than 

her catbox, & always uses her scratching posts!).  I have an apartment 
full of furniture, so someone with less than a complete set of 
furniture is just fine.  I would probably (due to my cat) prefer 
someone who didn't have a dog, but another cat would be fine.  Also, of 

course, would like an area that's safe for us to live in & safe for my 
cat to go outside & play. 

If anybody is interested, please email me privately & we'll talk about 
it!  I think that's about it, if I can think of anything I left out, 
I'll post it as a P.S. 

thanks!

Love,
Shawna



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 07:57:35 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Steve Dennis <ecoman@darwin.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Anyone know about the SC Warf on Thursdays?
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I read on the SFR weekly happenings that there is techno, ambient (sp?), and
rave music at the end of Santa Cruz warf on thursdays nights.  Has anyone
gone to this?  Is it still happening?  I will check it out this thursday if
it is still going on, but if not I'm heading to the Blue Lagoon!  Thanks

Steve


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 08:16:00 1996
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From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
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Subject: Re: MacDonald's Commercial
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             I thought  he was dancing in a nightclub!?




On Sun, 5 May 1996, Freak Zone wrote:

> Has anybody seen the MacDonnald's commercial with Ronald dancing at a rave?
> 
> 
> 
> -Sean
> 
> _____________________________________
> F R E A K   Z O N E !
> "House music all night long..."
> (415) 227-7421
> _____________________________________
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 08:45:18 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Beautiful People was just that!
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        I am still in awe over Friday Night's Beautiful People!  As I said
throughout the night, the Harmony Crew delivers :)  This was one of the
best parties, and best personal party experiences, that I've ever had.
Right when I got there and met Jess, Renaud, and other new and older
friends outside, I had a good feeling about the party.  The only negative
aspect that I can think of was the water situation (big surprise, eh?).
People who put on parties need to be more aware, and take more control, of
the way water is handled.  It's the only thing that I heard others complain
about.
        The music was great throughout the night; only at the beginning,
and somewhere in the middle, were there times when there was either
uninspired-sounding or too-hard-sounding (for this boy) stuff played; the
rest of the time I got more dancing in than I usually do.  There was plenty
of trance to be enjoyed.  Everyone on the floor was having a blast, and it
was pretty packed as the night went on, but it was never too crowded down
there, and never got too hot and stuffy, so I was comfortable the whole
time.
        As it was a Harmony party, almost all my friends from The Crew were
there, and (like everyone else there) they were all in very positive,
upbeat spirits.  Everyone I saw was quick to smile; even Jenny seemed
happier than usual!  I was so surprised to see many newer friends, some
whom I haven't seen in a while.  It was a joy to introduce some newer
friends, like Leslie, to some of my older friends in the Crew.  It was like
Crysalis, in that I was either seeing friends or making new friends the
entire time, but much more so.
        Highlights of my experience: giving Greg a donation to the Harmony
fund, which I've been wanting to do for some time now (made me feel so good
to contribute something); meeting a beautiful, friendly gal named Melanie,
and (since she had no money and no EnhancEmEnts) giving her her first-ever
ExpEriEncE; being kissed by not one, but TWO gals (and I wish I could
recall who they were, as we'd just met; one of them had a tongue piercing,
and asked if I'd like to kiss someone who had one.  Of course I said
"Sure!" and it was a delightful first for me :)); having people recognize
me from my description and introduce themselves, and recognizing others who
described themselves (didn't meet everyone, though...next time!); loving
everyone, and receiving so much love and friendliness from everyone.
        I even enjoyed staying and helping to take down the decorations; I
found a Beautiful People laminate, and Greg said I could have it (BONUS!).
I said good-bye to everyone, and made the acquaintance of a guy named
Thomas, who had some sort of British accent (I think) and rides a white
motorcycle.  Then I made my way back to the South Bay to get some breakfast
and to call my friend Sara to say I was on my way to see her (in the
Modesto area; I put hundreds of miles on my truck over the weekend!).
        High praise and lots of love to the Harmony crew for giving us an
incredible space, it was beautiful and comfortable in classic Harmony
style; thanks to everyone there for all the love, smiles, hugs, kisses,
candy, and other diversions ;).  I am very happy to have also been a part
of everyone else's good time, and I know we will share many more wonderful
experiences in the future.  The scene thrives!!!

Love and Harmony to all,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 08:48:15 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Veggie Beat Manifesto
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Went to Sunset yesterday and experienced my first Berkley Marina event.
I've heard so much about that place, it was nice to get to finally
experience it.  Just happened to be wearing a Meat Beat Manifesto shirt, and
while talking with a friend about them, he informed me they were playing at
the Edge in Palo Alto with Single Cell Orchestra and freaky Chakra.  So we
took off and headed on down there.  I was told that they played under the
name Veggie Beat Manifest because it was to be a practice show for thier up
coming tour.  

Less than 100 people showed up, give or take some of course.

We caught about 45 minutes of Freaky and Single Cell, and they rocked.  I
couldn't stop buggin, boppin and generally flailing the whole time.  I was a
little bummed when they stopped, cuz I was really into it.    

Meat Beat was great.  There were atleast four people on stage.  Jack, a
drummer,  a saxaphon/guitar/bass player,  another guy on keyboards and a
Therimen (sp?).  They played new stuff, as well as some old favorites like
Helter Skelter, which I was just ranting and raving about hearing it at
Sunset last weekend.  Coincidence?  I don't think so.  They were great, as
usual, but I'm biased because I've liked them for so long.  Glad I was
included in the loop.  They will be in Sacramento on Tuesday, playing 5
minutes from my house.  :)

Rick



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 08:50:05 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Lets change the subject
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Crunchman writes:
>My idea is to form "Pick up points" located in convenient spots
>in the Bay Area.    People who have room in their cars,  show up
>at the pickup point,  and take as many people as they can.
>
>The SFRaves mailing list is perfect for announcing those rides
>that are available at the pickup points.   Specific pickup points
>can be proposed and made "Official".    Those who have cars and
>want company,  can meet at pickup points,   privately arranged
>through SFRaves.
>
<snip>
>If needed,  I can make my 800 number available for putting those
>with cars in touch with those without cars,  in case they can't read
>their mail on sat night prior to going out.
>
>The Crunchman

So, what do y'all think of this idea?  I know it would help many people who
are sometimes/always in need of a ride, and we should try to get as many of
our friends and family to as many events as possible, to strengthen our
scene and spread the love.  I hope to become involved if some sort of
coordinated transportation effort sees fruition.

Thanx,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 09:35:06 1996
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To: tim744@silicon.email.net
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Big Thanks!!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I had fun for the hour I was there.  It was great seeing so many friends
again, especially new friends I met the night before!
Let's do this again; maybe it could become a somewhat regular (monthly or
bi-monthly?) event, and maybe Eric P. could show up while there's still
plenty of flesh on the grill!

Lollipop licks to all :)

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 09:55:33 1996
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From: Michael <Michael.Minnich@bankamerica.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: harmony, down to earth, sunset
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Let's see, my weekend recap for all you anxious subscribers:  This weekend was
one of self-sufficiency, of navigating this city by bus and foot, for the most
part anyway.

Friday night the pick was Beautiful People.  After a veritable adventure on
the
Muni trying to get myself and my two friends down to the location, I was a
little bummed to discover that it was at The Deli.  I'd been there once before
and nightmare memories flooded back of thousands of people packed in like
sardines and water being an extremely rare commodity as opposed to sweat which
was in great abundance due to the intolerable temperature.  The Harmony party
turned out quite different however.  I don't know what force defined its
attendance, or if it achieved its 800 person capacity, but as far as I was
concerned, there was a perfect number of people.  Pleasantly full, yet plenty
of room to dance and move around.  The vibe was 100% Playskool, which is perf
ectly okay; everyone was having a good time.  The music was on and off.  The
first guy I heard, the one before Ethan, was pretty horrible.  But Ethan
brought things back together with some minimal wacked out techno.  The guy
after Ethan (I think his name was Trent...?) was REALLY good.  Hard hard weird
acid bordering on hardcore.   Then came Dan; you either love him or roll your
eyes at him.  At that point I lost track of the music and kind of drifted off
in a corner.  I did get a ride home from some Stanford kids, so big ups to the
Palo Alto massive!

Saturday night led me solo to Down to Earth.  I wasn't really psyched on this
party, but as it turned out, I had a LOT of fun at it.  The space was really
REALLY cool.  Another one of these ubiquitous live-art-work spaces, but this
one was classy.  Upstairs (the first place you enter) was very colorful and
arty, pictures and sculptures everywhere.  There was no smoking inside, but
they had a cool little patio that the smokers hung out in.  Going downstairs
led you first to an intimate tripped out chill room.  Very cool looking space
area, but I always find those things a little hard to infiltrate when I'm all
alone.  Everyone is packed into every available floorspace looking happy as a
clam, with their best friend to their right and their second best friend to
their left.  Beyond that was the "main" dance area, which was equally
intimate,
but still very cool.  The music started off the jam.  The first dj (name of
Aleka or something) was slammin'.  I always like to be pleasantly surprised by
dj's I've never heard of before who are very good.  Makes up for all the dj's
I've heard of 10,000 times who still suck.  I liked the vibe at this party; it
wasn't a I'm-on-E-are-you-too????? vibe like BP, but people were still soberly
friendly and open and down with it all.  Plus the assorted upstairs/downstairs
chill areas were good for conversation.

Sunday was a beautiful Sunset at the Marina.  For some lame reason, I've lived
in this city six months now and this was the first sunset I'd been to.  I
certainly will try not to miss one again.  Totally beautiful, kickin',
dj-jazzy-jeff-and-the-fresh-prince-'sum-sum-sum-sum-summertime' vibe.  Can I
just add that I love seeing young kids (under 10 or whatever) at outdoor
parties like this.  Truly K-rAd, d00d.

For future reference, if any of you guys or gals ever find yourselves itching
for the weekend not to end on a Sunday (or a Saturday or whatever), give me or
Doug Zimmerman a call because we always chill Sunday evenings at our house
spinning wax with superstar DJ James Dee of Chrysalis / Disco 2000 / NASA /
Djax fame (winner last three years of DMC int'l DJ competition).  ;)  We live
at Divis & Fulton, if you're in the neighborhood.

inhuman@ghetto.of.the.mind

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 09:59:39 1996
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Date: 06 May 96 12:55:29 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Wow, What a Weekend!
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I hardly know how to begin to describe how wonderful this weekend was ... and in
a very great part to all of the amazing people on SFR!  

We learn from everything -- someties with baby steps, sometimes with giant steps
-- this weekend was a huge leap for me!   I had some personal insights about who
I am and why I am part of this scene --- R

Raving has changed me in so many ways, and I am in a wonderful transitional
period in my life, and it could not happen without every one of you. 

Harmony had one of the best vibes I ever have experienced at a party -- I got
there really early, thinking I'd buy my ticket and come back, but there were
already about 10 SFRavers waiting outside, so I decided to start my night right
there, and it was all good, better and best from then on in....

To the people who put that party together, THANK YOU for all of your hard work,
you made a beautiful environment for us, filled with positive messages.  I met
SOOOOO many people I couldn't possibly name them all, but between my old friends
Todd (SDream), Marty, Eric, Shawna, and my new friends Jess (send me your phone
# pls, woman), Amy, Paul, Renaud, Katrina (waiting for that first post, you
promised), Sarah, Terry, Kristen, Melissa, Stacey (I am so happy to have
personally met you, I can't wait to come to your next party) --  and ....  uh-oh
I think I lost a few braincells, sorry! -- It was an amazing night for me... 

I drove home over the Bay Bridge at sunrise, listening to groovy acid jazz and
smiling like a maniac....  fell asleep with the same smile on my face...

And then, I pulled myself out of a deep sleep early Saturday (ok, it was 2pm) to
finish making my potato salad and cruise over to the BBQ -- 
Let's all take a moment to say THANK YOU TIM (KNUCKLEHEAD) for putting this
together!  If you missed it, he brought a huge barbeque and cooked food all day
long for everyone!  Lots of food and wonderful music, and a chance to see my old
and new friends again, plus meet even MORE SFRavers -- like Larry,  Phred,
BioJeff (do not miss this guy spinning!), Ethan, Matt P.K. L, the amazing Moshe,
Michael M, (sorry braincells drained, there were millions more) plus lots of
other friends -- and hi B.A., maybe you can marinate me some veggies next time?
-- It was like being at a huge family picnic, except these are the people you
WISH were in your actual family!   

And then....  Yes, I am a diehard -- it was a short nap and on to Wicked,
because it was my opportunity to meet both Geoff White AND John S. Lee -- you
guys are great, I am so happy to have had the chance to meet you face to face!
(For those who are curious, picture John with a big friendly smile on his face!)
And then Chris from Solle Clothing was there too!  And Dianna T -- plus some
other friends came who had never experienced the harder, darker, funkier Wicked
Vibe -- and they were not disappointed!

And Sunday, yes, it is the day of rest, thank god!  My gratitude and love to
everyone who I saw, spoke with, exchanged ideas with, hugged, this weekend ----
You have all made me a better person!

Love to everyone!     Leslie  : )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 10:05:17 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 10:05:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jess Fogler <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: BP - 8 miles high
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WHOAH - someone pull me off the ceiling....BP just bust my heart right
open...I think I'm in love with y'all.

jess


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 10:18:33 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 96 09:58:40 PST
From: "Waterstreet, Andrea" <awaters@mfi.com>
Encoding: 870 Text
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: blue lagoon in santa cruz?
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     All youse Santa Cruz folk...can anyone give me an update of what's 
     been happening at the Blue Lagoon?  Waaay back in 1989, when I was a 
     student at UCSC, it was the only place in Santa Cruz that had house 
     music--and the only place to actually *dance* without having some slob 
     try and "dirty dance" you.
     
     The DJ's name was Eric Berg--and he eventually became my significant 
     other.  He played house, and for an aberrent while <grin>, techno, up 
     until 1993, when we moved to SF.  I remember that the owner, this guy 
     named Freddy, was, shall we say, not entirely hip to Eric's house 
     scene, and was always wanting him to play the Cure or Depeche mode.  
     
     So...what's it like now??
     
     Andrea
     
     >>>>sometimes i feel
     like puttin my hands 
     up in the air<<<<<<<

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 10:25:31 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 10:24:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Newsweek-Herbal E
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605040049.A21877-0100000@well>
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FYI--

Herbal E products have been outlawed in Florida.  (Read in the Chronicle)


--kaysee

kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu
.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*

"Talk is cheap..."


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 10:41:18 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 10:39:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Review: Beautiful People by Harmony
To: SDream <SDream@tgrigsby.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605042019.NAA10578@shellx.best.com>
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On Sat, 4 May 1996, SDream wrote:

> 
> We came well-equipped.  The night before, Michelle and I raided the local 
> Toys-R-Us and came away with glo-sticks, Floam, Pez, bubbles, various 
> stickers, a ladybug hand puppet.  I picked up grapes, oranges, and the 
              ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
	      Said hand puppet didn't really count 'cuz it only had 5 
legs.  *I* had the real one with six legs :P  tee hee hee  But, SDream's 
ladybug and my ladybug bonded, and even danced together, mine putting his 
mutant one to shame!! :P  hee hee  And everyone will be glad to know that 
SDream helped her earn her name!!  She will now be joining me at all future
events. :)    


> 3. Lot's of very good artwork (my favorite: "I am the Sun, you are the Moon, 
> we are ...  
---radiant 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 11:31:04 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 11:31:21 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Electric 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Lets change the subject
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>>My idea is to form "Pick up points" located in convenient spots
>>in the Bay Area.    People who have room in their cars,  show up
>>at the pickup point,  and take as many people as they can.
>So, what do y'all think of this idea?  I know it would help many people who
>are sometimes/always in need of a ride, and we should try to get as many of
>our friends and family to as many events as possible, to strengthen our
>scene and spread the love.  I hope to become involved if some sort of
>coordinated transportation effort sees fruition.

sounds like a good idea. i live on the peninsula and i always drive into the
city, so i've always got room for a couple people..

should anyone need a ride, feel free to call me up (415.341.1897) and leave
a message on my answering machine. if it's busy, i'm online. email might be
a better bet than vox, even.
brendan


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 11:55:08 1996
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To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Wow, What a Weekend!
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At 12:55 PM  -0400 5/6/96, Leslie Ayres wrote:

>finish making my potato salad and cruise over to the BBQ --


Damn!  That was sum gooooood potato salad girl!  Thank YOU!  And that's
from a very discerning PS palate.

:^)

Tone



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 12:13:21 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 12:13:01 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Review: Beautiful People by Harmony
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At 10:39 AM  -0700 5/6/96, KaySEE wrote:

>> 3. Lot's of very good artwork (my favorite: "I am the Sun, you are the
>>Moon,
>> we are ...
>---radiant

"I am the sun, you are the moon, together we are radiant."

Also, Eric wrote:

>I had a good feeling about the party.  The only negative
aspect that I can think of was the water situation (big surprise, eh?).
People who put on parties need to be more aware, and take more control, of
the way water is handled.  It's the only thing that I heard others complain
about.<

They had no control over the water situation.  There are some things that
promoters can't control, i.e., the rules of the house.  You see the whole
situation around the water stem from the guys that run the deli.  NOT (I
repeat, NOT) Harmony.  In fact, Harmony risked being punished by sneaking
in boxes of water and passing them out secretly throughout the night.  It
was the best they could do, besides maybe duct taping the "water guard" guy
near the bathrooms.

Before the party, I spoke with the guy that was just finishing the mural on
the side of the building.  (Word is, he mixed in some flourescent paints
and they will be lighting it up with black lights.  The outside at least is
going to look very "rave" related.  It's a cool mural.)  I asked him what
he thought of the management.  He said they were very cool.  I immediately
brought up the water issue (I heard last party they were selling bottles
for $3), saying that it's bullshit to not let water in the party, deny
people water from the bathrooms (read: refills), and charge $3 for bottles
that we all know cost $.50 at most.  He said that a large group (not a mob
though) should approach them with this concern.  I don't know if it would
work, but might be worth a try.

See ya!

Tone



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 12:25:53 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 12:22:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Reply-To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: BEAUTIFUL People (LONG)
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I am actually kind of surprised to not find more about BP today.  (I hope 
everyone keeps posting about it, it was wonderful!!)  Well, here I am 
poised to give my synopsis (actually bordering on novella!) of a truly 
remarkable event!!

On Friday I started getting more and more excited as the day went on.  I 
knew this was going to be a wonderful party and that I was finally going 
to meet a lot of people on sfraves.  As soon as I got off work around 
5ish, I took off for the city to meet my friend.  Not having a lot of 
time because the party started early, we jammed over to the Haight to 
indulge in some funky clothes to get ourselves in the spirit.  As we got 
there, we missed the Olympic torch run by nanoseconds. We ran down the 
Haight in pursuit only to see the caravan disappear over the hill.  We 
must have looked pretty silly!!  We both bought obnoxious shirts, but at 
least I now have a piece of clothing that will make me more noticeable!! :P

We got to the party a bit before 10 pm, stressing out that it was going to 
sell out which I heard never happened.  I was told that about half of the 
total amount came (~500) which was the *perfect* amount.  At its peak it 
was just crowded enough to be engulfed in a pervasive glow, but at the 
same time, you could always find a bit of dancing room if you wanted it.  
Plus, there was air conditioning on the dance floor, which helped me keep my 
energy the whole night.

Getting there early was great because we heard every dj, got to dance 
with an open dance floor, and got to experience the party from beginning 
to end.  As soon as my friend and I arrived, we hooked up with Jess and 
erase99.  The four of us stayed together most of the night, and it really 
seemed like a natural combination.  Jess and erase99 went a bit ballistic 
in the beginning and wore themselves out later on, but somehow they 
managed to get their feets moving again, especially Jess.  I met tons of 
sfravers and their friends, and I tried really hard to commit everyone's 
name to memory which I think I did pretty well.  I can't wait to see 
everyone again.  Let's see if I can work my brain here: hi to Ivana, 
Sarah, Renaud, Paul, Jess, erase99 (Brendan), Leslie, Chin (w/ 
water bottle), SDream (and Michelle), Marty, Shawna, Tim (Giggle 
Rock-please email me!), Matthew (who we painted an eye on forehead), 
Nancy (of course!!), Eric (who has forgotten he met me!!), and other 
non-sfravers.  (If I have forgotten anyone, please email me and chew me 
out!!)

The space was beautiful.  There was a main dance floor with a balcony 
overhead where you could look out on all sides.  I enjoyed watching from 
above.  The space itself has these green lights which, when added with 
the black lights, made a funky glow.  It was the perfect brightness for 
me.  YOu could see everyone clearly, but it wasn't too bright.  I love 
being able to see people because I can connect with them better that way.

We danced off and on, wandering around, chatting with people.  Waiting 
for hours for the women's restroom.  (Women take so dang long! :)  I had 
no problem with the water situation because we managed to sneak in water 
bottles, and had no run-ins with the Bathroom Nazi's.  At one point, 
someone placed a whole case of Calistogas in the back corner.  Everyone 
grabbed them.  I don't know if they were heisted from the establishment, 
or if some Harmony pixies were behind it!!  But, at least some people got 
free water.  

Around 1 am we even had a little sfraves corner going.  A bunch of us 
were settled  around the corner with the animation dancing and chatting

BEST EXPERIENCES OF THE EVENING:

Around 3 am I discovered this key airconditioned spot on the dance 
floor.  I then proceeded to spend the next 3 hours dancing my ass off.  
This was the first time I had truly discovered the DANCE FLOOR.  My most 
amazing experiences come from the time I spent there.  First, I must say 
that air conditioning is key for sustainable energy.  Also, once I 
started, I didn't stop because I knew I'd never start again.

Amazing experience #1

When I first started dancing, I found my "spot", that perfect place 
where you know your body *belongs*.  As I started warming up and 
absorbing the music, I began to feel the vibe around me.  There was this 
guy behind me that was already in his "space" and had this enormous grin 
on his face.  He was 100% in tune with the music and you could tell he 
was having a fantastic time.  I totally knew how he felt because that's 
how I feel when I get absorbed by the music.  The corners of my mouth 
begin to turn upward, and I become ecstatic.  I feel completely one with 
the world and feel endlessly happy.  Anyway, I was enjoying dancing and 
soaking up the vibe, especially what was emanating from the guy behind 
me.  Then, at one point I turned around and he was gone :(  I could 
immediately feel his absence, and had to go find him to tell him so.  I 
didn't get to talk to him much, but his name was Nathaniel (if he is on 
this list or anyone knows him, can you let me know?) I really hope I get 
to share some dance space with him sometime in the future.  His energy 
really affected me!

Amazing experience #2

As I was dancing, I noticed that the people right in front of the dj's 
were NOT dancing.  I thought that I'd share my energy, and ran up to two of 
the people not dancing, and started encouraging them to dance.  I 
wouldn't take NO as an answer and I succeeded in getting them to move.  
It was really cool, and one of the guys came up and thanked me later.  
That was fun.  I wanted to get everyone on the dance floor moving!!  I am 
contemplating next time I go out to wear a flourescent sign that says 
"DANCE"!!!

Amazing experience #3

Towards the end of the party, I was in one of the corners completely 
absorbed in watching three women dance.  They were feeding off of one 
another, and were very graceful dancers.  I joined in for a bit as the 
sun was coming up!!

Amazing experience #4

Also towards the end, seeing this guy dancing, look at his friend who 
then began to dance, and then the two of them hugging and then proceeding 
to dance together.  Lovely!

Amazing experience #5

I brought my flourescent marker (water soluble, so no worries about 
tagging!) and shared it with a bunch of people.  Jess drew something on 
my eyes, I still have no idea what!  It was cool to pass it around and 
have everyone draw on themselves and then to see them glowing!!


So that is my VERY long review.  THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, 
Harmony.  I truly appreciated your efforts and was glad to be a part of 
everything that occurred!!

--Kaysee (aka Kirsten)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 12:27:25 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 12:27:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Reply-To: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: What a weekend (long) ...
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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I have to quote a friend of mine who says that almost every weekend is 
like a vacation.  It's true :), I feel like I haven't been at work for 
quite some time (not that I want to be here, but...).

Fri - Harmony/BP
WOW...  Beautiful setting, beautiful people, wonderful music...  Even the 
Nazi water guy was nice to me (which I didn't understand).  He took water 
bottles from so many people in front of me, but when I was walking in the 
bathroom (with my water bottle sticking out of my front pocket), he 
purposely turn his head away.  Maybe all the positive energy overwhelmed 
him for a sec :P.  I noticed he was gone later :).

I met so many people that night and hang out with old friends - Tony - 
you know the big Ukranina guy, Sy, Melissa, Terry, Adam, Ian, Amy & Paul, 
Eric, Leslie, Tim, Paul, Sarah, Paul, Jonathan, Sarah, Chin (way too many 
Pauls and Sarahs - I don't remember last names).  Great meeting you all 
and hanging out :).  I even met another person from Croatia there (born 
in the same city) - hey Zoran :).

The party was just so wonderful and thanks to the organizers for putting 
so much love and energy into it.

Sat day
BBQ - it was so nice.  The weather was great, the party was small and it 
felt very relaxing.  There was plenty of food, music was great and I 
loved it.  Thanks Tim :).  I felt like I knew almost everybody there, 
either from Harmony the night before or from before.  It was great.

Sunday
Sunset :). I called at 1:30 and there was no VM, so I was a little 
bummed, but at 4pm, great surprise...  there was Sunset after all.  
Sunset was happening - many, many happy people dancing around.  It was 
fun, although a little cold.  There were people at Sunset I saw three 
days in a row.  Amazing :).  No better way to finish the weekend. 

What a life!!!!!

Hope to see you guys soon, and have a great week.
Hugz,
Branka

P.S.  Sorry for the lenght of this, I just can't get my mind of it....

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 12:35:41 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 12:32:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: SFR BBQ
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I got there about 4:30 with cookies and Pepsi in hand.  I then proceeded 
to meet tons of people (you know who you are!!!).  I didn't dance too 
much because I was too exhausted from BP.  I managed a few 15 minute 
spurts of energy, but mainly I concentrated on hangin out!!

The food was terrific, my favorite being Leslie's potato salad (can I 
have that recipe?) and CTD's strawberry pies!

Everyone was terrific and I have now inherited this spongy ball from Matt 
that is to be passed on at some future event!  

I took the rest of the weekend easy, and somehow managed to miss sunset 
again.  Damn, I have yet to make it out there :(

--kaysee

kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu
.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*

"Talk is cheap..."


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 12:47:58 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 12:48:14 -0700
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From: Electric 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: harmony
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just a short post. i'm completely swamped with work and school right now. :(

had an amazing time, it's too bad i had to leave early. greets to everyone
who was there, a special thanks to kirsten for the flourescent marker, todd
for the grapes, and jess for the cookies and being a becon of happyness.

my own experience with the water situation: i trashed my water bottle
outside the party, but jess and paul managed to sneak theirs in. when i was
upstairs in the bathroom, the "water nazi" caught someone filling up their
bottle and just told them that he didn't want to see it, and to stick it in
their pocket when they came out. he was certainly cool about it, and i think
the nazi comparison might be a bit much. they _were_ just doing their job,
and it was cool that that let people sneak some water, while maintaining the
image that noone was getting any.

i did see one of the security guy pissed though. he came into the washroom
and demanded that someone tell him who the asshole dealing acid was, because
"someone is in a padded room now because of that fuck-up". luckily, that was
the only negative aspect of my whole night.

oh yah.. todd has the coolest toys too!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 12:49:13 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 12:48:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: MacDonald's Commercial
To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
cc: Freak Zone <freakz@ultima.org>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960506081528.21958A-100000@value.net>
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Yes I have and thought it quite odd.  I didn't know what to think of it.  
I can't wait for it to continue so we get to see what the hell is going 
on with this.


On Mon, 6 May 1996, Reagan Reid wrote:

> 
> 
>              I thought  he was dancing in a nightclub!?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sun, 5 May 1996, Freak Zone wrote:
> 
> > Has anybody seen the MacDonnald's commercial with Ronald dancing at a rave?
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -Sean
> > 
> > _____________________________________
> > F R E A K   Z O N E !
> > "House music all night long..."
> > (415) 227-7421
> > _____________________________________
> > 
> > 
> 


      ___                ___           ___     
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    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
   /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
  /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
 /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
 \/__/~~/:/  /      \/__\:\/:/  / \:\  /\ \/__/
       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    











    







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 12:58:10 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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Hey gang!  Is this something we can work on?
- E

>What we need right now is a list and location from those that have cars.
>So if you have a car,  and want to take a fellow raver please send me
>Email right away with the following information.
>
>Your location:
>How many people can take:
>
>Also include any other partenent information.
>
>The next thing we need to do,  is establish "pickup points",    for instance
>I'll name a few....
>
>SOMA - 5th and Harrison Donut shop
>Haight - Ameba or Freq-8
>Marin - Marin city,  San Rafael,  Sausalito
>San Jose - (I'll leave that up to those that live down there)
>Penninsula - Mt View, Palo Alto,  etc.
>East Bay
>  Fremont
>  Hayward
>  Oakland
>  Concord
>
><ANY OTHERS I LEFT OUT - PLEASE ADD HERE>
>
>Ideally,  I will want to use my 800 number for coordinating these rides
>but within a week,  I'll have no permenent home (I have to move due to lack
>of a job)
>
>So,  lets use this list to work out a workable system.
>
>The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 13:08:36 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 13:07:37 +0100
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: MAD and MADNESS
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Greetings Friends!

Well, after two weeks at V, none of us liked it, nor did we like the 21+
aspect, so, we've bailed =)

MAD is therefore on hiatus for an as now unknown amount of time. Once again
thanks for the support, we all really appreciate it.

In the meantime however, MAD, Gateway Systems, and some other Friends, get
together for an evening of "Madness," this coming saturday, May 11th.

Lineup is: John Carel, Jon Santos, Ethan, Alex, Joe Rice, and, from London,
Pete Lazonby =)

More info at:

415.281.9432    or    415.985.7187

hope you can join us!
ethan


-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 13:15:24 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 13:14:36 -0700
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From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
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Hey all!

I *really* enjoyed hearing Trent at beautiful People, does anybody know if
he has tapes out or where I could get them?  Amebas, have you got 'em?

Thanks!

Love,
Shawna



"blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah"


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 13:18:58 1996
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Eric P. wrote:

>I had fun for the hour I was there.  It was great seeing so many friends
>again, especially new friends I met the night before!
>Let's do this again; maybe it could become a somewhat regular (monthly or
>bi-monthly?) event, and maybe Eric P. could show up while there's still
>plenty of flesh on the grill!

It sounds like, to do that, we'd have to make some contributions of some 
kind to make it worthwhile.  I would gladly ante up for this!  Anyone else?  
Seriously, folx, it was a really nice event, and would be well worth a few 
bucks.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 13:21:00 1996
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Subject: Harmony, BBQ, Wicked
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Oooooohhh....I'm so tired...

This past weekend ->
Friday: Beautiful People by Harmony
Saturday day: SFR BBQ
Saturday night: Wicked
Sunday: TV.  Flopped on the couch.  All day.

I'll say it again, Harmony kicked down some serious energy Friday night.  Wow!
New friends:  Jess, Paul, Ms Phink, Renaud, Sarah, Kirsten, Melissa, 
Michael, Adam (what a huge grin!), oh geez I can't possibly think of them 
all...  Marty, Sabrina, Michelle and I will never forget that one!

But I'm voting Tim (Knucklehead) for "Raver of the Month".  What a guy!  A 
simple, yet really nice BBQ -- *tasty* food, *great* music, *warm* vibe!  
Black Adder's marinade was pretty weak though -- just kidding!  It was 
killing me it was so good!  Got to see almost everyone from the night before 
-- even the ladybug puppet -- and I got a chance to chat with Wayne.  Great 
guy!  I was going to bring pies, but I got up way too late.  So I ran my 
crew over to the BBQ, then took off in search of a deli to pick up a veggie 
dish.  I ended up in a SERIOUSLY rough neighborhood in Richmond.  They were 
filming an episode of "Cops" in front of the first grocery store I stopped 
at...(j/k)...  I never found anything remotely resembling a deli, so my 
veggie dish was: Texan Mesquite flavored Frittos.  And beer.  Sorry...  I 
just read the message from Larry about the generator.  Tim, we owe ya BIG 
one, bud...

Wicked was a helluva a lot of fun, if you just wanted to dance.  This is not 
the place to find a huge family vibe, but the music was *really* good.  Bass 
is your friend.  EXCELLENT acid visuals.  Up by the DJ were the ravers, and 
I found some big smiles there, including one on a face belonging to a high 
voltage young lady named Heather.  That girl was MOVING!  But closer to the 
bar were the beefy boys ("pardon me sir, but is that a tire pump sticking 
out of your ...") and the look-but-don't-even-think-about-talking-to-me 
girls.  The ladies are certainly nice visually if entirely unfriendly, but 
the beefy boys are standing around with no shirt on and not one drop of 
sweat to account for it.  There was one short, beefy guy who I began 
thinking of as "Stubby".  His arms and legs belonged on someone with a much 
shorter torso.  But this guy I liked: he was really dancing his butt off and 
seemed to be having a really good time, not just posing.  Leslie, Marty, and 
I danced our booties off, although Leslie flaked out early -- wimp! (hehe)  
Marty and I were there until 6am.

And folks, we got to meet: JOHN S. LEE.

So what's he like?  He's a PUNK!  (just kidding!)  No, John's a really nice 
guy with a great smile.  Hey John, sorry I didn't chat more, but I have 
given up trying to have conversations at these events.  I'll call you in the 
next couple of days instead, ok?  As it is, I lost my voice over the 
weekend.  If anyone finds it, please drop me a line, ok?  Hope you didn't 
detect any 10,000 year old funk while standing next to me...  ;)

Anyway, just wanted to drop everyone a line and thank you all for making 
this weekend one of the best I've had in a long time.  You people are so 
wonderful and so friendly, and this whole scene has really filled a huge 
space within me.  I yearned for a place and a people where I could be a 
little kid, where I could be friendly and outgoing, and where I could be 
just as crazy as I wanted.  I'm expressing myself as I've never been able 
to, with the community I find myself in responding with warmth and 
friendship, and I love you all for that.

Huge Grinz and Phat Hugz,

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 13:39:10 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 13:38:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: What makes a rave? (long reply to JSL)
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Dear Friends & Family,

	I apologize for digging up this old message to respond to, but I 
had set John's post aside because he said a couple of things about the 
nature of raves that I found somewhat enlightening, although presumeably 
not in the way he intended.
	Because I knew I wanted to take some time and devote some quality 
thought to this reply, I put off responding for perhaps longer than is 
proper.  

My computer tells me that on Sun, 21 Apr 1996, John S. Lee shared (in part):

> A lame threat?  Naw, reality.  I am not going to go because it is far to
> religious for me.  I mean, all these people have gotten into my little
> scene, something I really loved, and turned it into a free form public art
> forum. It distresees me that things aren't the way they were.  Before there
> were chill rooms, there was music and a dance floor.  No Zamfir pan flute
> music and a bunch of gropers on bean bags giving massages and reading tarot
> cards by blacklight.  Before rave became a free form public art forum, it
> was just there for the dance.  I guess I was limited in my thinking that
> this would last.  The only constant is change, and you can expect certain
> change with a free form public art forum.  No, I guess you're right, rave
> is dead, long live rave.  Now we truly have a direction, a vector in which
> our free form public art forum can go.  To flourish and blossom into a new
> type of free form public art forum, where dance is no longer the purpose.
> Where sex is an abstraction to be enshrined inside the wrappings of
> psychobabble altar paper, to be used whenever the subject is broached so it
> can be neatly presented, logical and clean.  And I can see now how these
> very ideas can exist within the context of a free form public art forum,
> can not only free us from the confines of limited thinking but free us from
> the problems and intricasies of humanity, where everything has an
> explanation, where there are a million answers to everything, where there
> are no answers at all.  I am saddened at my loss of parties, rave or
> whatever, but I do have some reassurance that the old ways have paved the
> way to a new vista, a new adventure, a new free form public art forum.
> 
> cmon...
> 
> People go to parties to hear some good music, see some friends, dance and
> have a good time.  Everything else is bonus.

I don't know how long John has been raving -- probably longer than I have 
-- but my perception of how it "used to be" is quite different than John's.
When I first started going to raves at the beginning of 1992, the scene 
was not infused with the "back to basics" approach that seems to be so 
popular now.  Now many people seem to want just a dark warehouse with a 
good DJ and sound system playing to a couple hundred people.  

When I began raving, I don't remember hearing anybody saying they wanted 
that.  People liked the bells and whistles.  Toon Town was the big party 
then -- they put on one-off events in big venues, for thousands of people 
like Cool World and Funky Tekno Tribe do now, only the vibe was more like 
a Friends & Family or a Harmony.  Toon Town went all out with stuff like 
virtual reality, bouncy castles, carnival rides, vendors, brain wave 
machines, etc.  I loved it, and others seemed to as well.  It was new, it 
was exciting, it was fun!

Going clubbing with friends back in the eighties, during and immediately 
following high school, what we got was a club with a DJ, alcohol, and a 
dance floor that stayed open till 2 a.m.  People wore high heels and 
cologne and sparkling gold necklaces, but mostly they wore black.  There 
were no whistles, no smiles, no stuffed animals, no waterguns, and few 
smiles.  

It was the addition of these missing factors, along with a creativity and 
a willingness to try things at parties that people weren't used to, like 
the vendors and the rides and stuff, (along with the arrival of techno 
and the evolution of house, of course) that made raves special and 
different for me, in a word, fun!

When I started raving, I used to say to people all the time, "I had no 
idea going out dancing could be so much FUN!"  It didn't matter that we 
went to big parties with thousands of people we didn't know, because 
everyone was cool and you could meet new people so easily, you didn't 
need a bunch of people you already knew to be there in order to enjoy 
yourself and feel accepted.  I went to many parties alone and was 
welcomed into groups and made new friends.  I'm sad that I didn't stay in 
touch with or try to establish lasting friendships with many of the 
ravers I met, but I still run into people on a regular basis who say, 
"Hey, I met you back at ______! Wow!"

Before raves, if I told someone I felt going dancing at clubs was a 
spiritual experience, I don't think anyone would have related.  In fact I 
never would have said that, because I never had reason to feel it.  If 
someone had told me that, I probably would have looked at them as if 
they'd said going grocery shopping was a spiritual experience.

Raving has changed that for me.  At raves, I've had great conversations 
about meaning-of-life type stuff, and experienced transcendant bliss, as 
well as seeing others experience it.  I've come to understand the 
importance of dance to the human condition, and to feel part of a sacred 
tribe.  To me, clubbing was about music, dancing, and looking good in 
order to meet good-looking people.  Raves can be about these things too, 
but they are about so much more, including the spiritual aspect.

In short, I don't think rave was *ever* about "just dance."  If it was 
about "just dance," I wouldn't call it a rave.  Too much missing.  Since 
I began raving, the scene has moved in that direction -- unfortunately, 
in my opinion.  

I miss the bells and whistles of an all-out massive.  The Gathering is a 
large, good-vibe event, but it's not Toon Town.  The creativity and diversity 
of fun experiences to be had aren't there.  Now the focus is on DJs and 
music, and often little else.  

John implies that there were DJs spinning house music for groups of ravers 
(and by that I assume he means people with smiles and a good vibe) before the 
advent of fun, glossy flyers, and black lights, beanbags, and tarot readings.  
If so, I stand corrected; this wasn't my experience.  

Perhaps it goes to the issue of when raves began.  In Britain, they were 
having warehouse parties with DJs spinning back-to-back tracks in the 
eighties, but until the arrival of Exstasy on the scene I would hesitate 
to call those events raves.  Not having been there, I can't testify as to 
the vibe, but having seen groups of drunk English youths at parties, I'm 
skeptical as to whether alcohol-driven events could have really had the 
friendliness, openness, and lack of meat-market atmosphere that says rave to me.

> This is all IMO of course.  I'm still looking for clubs with house music.
> Forget underground, I can't stand to get dirty, I need a club that sells
> booze and stays open till 2 a.m.  Where there are high heels and stockinged
> legs.  Where sage & wood necklaces have given way to sparkling gold
> apparel, and capped teeth.  Where I smell Gendarme cologne, instead of
> stinky old arm & body hair sweat.  I need a night on the town, where I can
> wear some good clothes, and meet some top drawer people.  Now this is REAL
> house.  And that's what I want!  Dj of the evening?  DJ P.Como, slammin the
> cold rock stuff from 12-2 (who listens to music before 12).  Martini's are
> half price before 11!

	Some of this I can dig.  I like getting "dolled up" to go out -- 
although I find wood necklaces and sage perfectly suitable -- and like 
John I generally prefer not to be stinky and dirty.
	But 2 a.m.?  Fuck that!  I want a place that stays open all 
night!  The only reason we have clubs closing at 2 a.m. is because of 
fucked up drinking laws that treat responsible adults like children, 
imposed by a government that wants to control us "for our own good."
	Personally, I think alcohol tends to attract the wrong elements 
(and please note, "wrong elements" is not a code word for anything other 
than people who are unfriendly and do not have the vibe!) to raves, but 
some people have more fun at parties drunk, indeed some people *are* more 
fun drunk, and I respect that.  If a drug makes you a friendlier, happier 
person, by all means indulge.  Do it responsibly.

> 
> People should respect everyones right to have a good time and catch a groove.

Yes to that!  I agree with John about not building an altar where people 
are trying to dance... just don't say not to build one at all.  It's the 
tolerance for doing "uncool" stuff like that at a party that makes raves 
what they are.

Much love,
				<<< Starchild >>>

> 
> 
> Out,
> John
> 
> P.S.  One of the reasons I don't go out is that I am surrounded, even
> harassed by trancers and trance energies.  I mean the brightness of the
> auras, and all that vibe they send out is rather unnerving.  I can't
> concentrate on BBB's while they are around, filling the air with their
> energies, essence, reaching higher plateaus of hummus.  I just find it way
> too distracting.  Once, when I almost kicked one, a while back before I was
> in the know about these things, I would learn a lesson I would not soon
> forget.  While trying to circledance, my foot was heading toward the back
> of a trancers skull, my foot bounced off of some invisibile force.  I can't
> explain it, it just bounced off like it hit hard rubber.  I got up from the
> floor after losing my balance with that flying scissor kick rebound.  The
> trancer then looked up to me, calm, serene, and said, "Did you knock?".  It
> was like they were talking out of an echo chamber, "Hello, hello, hello!!!"
> It was!, they were talking out of an echo chamber, but I didn't see one.
> I knew then that I was dealing with something greater than myself.  Humbled
> , I slinked away, into the dark confines of a corner, trying to put myself
> together.  As I looked toward the dance floor, I couldn't see the trancer,
> just a big blue ball hovering over the dancelfoor.  I knew then that I
> witnessed the birth, at that very moment, so crystalline, so clear, it was
> the start of a free form public art forum.  I knew then as I know now, that
> I really was limited.  I start my juggling classes and General Ed.
> requirements for Urban Attention Getting.
> 
> I knew then, to respect one and all trancers.  They do good stuff.  They
> helped me get into juggling.
> 
> ...
> 
> 
> no more altars!, no more altars!, no more altars!, no more altars!,...
> 
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 13:54:17 1996
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To: Electric 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Lets change the subject
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>should anyone need a ride, feel free to call me up (415.341.1897) and leave
>a message on my answering machine. if it's busy, i'm online. email might be
>a better bet than vox, even.
>brendan

I've got you added to my list.    Do you know of a good "pickup point"
like an "easy to get to" restaurant near you?    Also,   is this number
you gave me the one that would reach you "Prior to the party",  and
would you make an effort to keep the line free a few hours before the
party?

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 14:01:29 1996
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From: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
Message-Id: <199605062100.OAA13258@alumnae.caltech.edu>
Subject: more Beautiful People stuff
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 14:00:25 -0700 (PDT)
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Okay, just in case everyone isn't tired of BP reviews yet... :)

Great location, great setup, GREAT VIBE!  I didn't think that I would
like the balcony thing at first, this was my first party without a
separate chill space, but it ended up working out great.  It's a lot
easier to get your energy level back up when you can look down on a
floor filled with people dancing out of their minds ;)

For awhile I alternated between dancing, chilling with the people I
came with, and wandering around meeting people,
including lotsa sfravers and friends!  Then I was like, hey, its
still early in the night, maybe I'll run around and do the spray
bottle thing for half an hour and then chill and chat with everybody...

Next thing I know someones complaining to me that the party's going
to be OVER in 40 minutes.  Stunned, I Iook out the door and see that
it's *light* outside.

Whoops.

Where did the night go?  :)

Anyways, it was cool to meet all of you, maybe next time I'll actually
get to TALK to some of you ;)  and get introduced to those of you I haven't
met yet.

Thanks for all the energy and love, I haven't been that wired
for a loooong time!


                Smiles,

                        Chin

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 14:42:48 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 14:42:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: hooray for Tim!
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	big up and thanks to Tim for the *wonderful* afternoon he showed
us all on Sat.  Tim, you rule.  I'm glad everything worked out so well.  
	It was a great day, great party, great crowd, great bbq.  I stayed
to watch the sunset, but then had to go home and crash.

	I hope this happens again real soon.  I'm fully committed to
helping out on the next one...

		-burger king von jon


p.s. for those of you who haven't met knucklehead, you gotta!  He's one
rad, lovable, kewl dude.  I've shared more laughs with this guy than any
other sfraver.  <phvvvrrrrrrrrrrrrrmmmmmmmbbt!>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 14:42:58 1996
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From: darrele@netcom.com (Darrel Etter)
Message-Id: <199605062142.OAA29430@netcom21.netcom.com>
Subject: Veggie Beat Manifesto(RE:)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (sfraves)
Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 14:42:46 -0700 (PDT)
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Rick says:
> Meat Beat was great.  There were atleast four people on stage.  Jack, a
> drummer,  a saxaphon/guitar/bass player,  another guy on keyboards and a
> Therimen (sp?).  They played new stuff, as well as some old favorites like
> Helter Skelter, which I was just ranting and raving about hearing it at
> Sunset last weekend.  Coincidence?  I don't think so.  They were great, as
> usual, but I'm biased because I've liked them for so long.  Glad I was
> included in the loop.  They will be in Sacramento on Tuesday, playing 5
> minutes from my house.  :)
> Rick

There was a time not too long ago when Meat Beat Manifesto were the
only words I could get out of my mouth when someone asked me what kind
of music I liked. After seeing them last night, I relized that time is
completly gone. It could be that I was upset to see them so heavily
dependant on DAT. It could be that it was their first show and they
just havn't gotten it together yet. It could be that they were too
loud. But, I think I've just grown away from that sound, and I'm happy
about that.

They sounded so tired and out of it. The therimin intro was fine, and
the processed sax was good, but that's about it. I left after four
songs. I guess I expected them to change their sound. They were moving
that direction with that last CD ( with "That Shirt", "25 seconds of
silence", etc).  Has anyone heard their new release (I assume there is
one since they're touring)?

I'll still buy their new CD, and I love what they did for me in years
past in the same way Sonic Youth and the Slits have a special place in
my heart, but for now, give me PRANA or Juno-Reactor over MBM anyday!

In mourning, 
=Darrel
darrele@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 15:10:08 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 18:09:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: DJ Hardware <hardware@gate.net>
To: massive@mixcom.com
cc: Buzzdc@aol.com, NE-Raves@World.std.com,
        South East Rave List <SERAVES@AMERICAN.EDU>, mtn-raves@hyperreal.com,
        MW-raves@hyperreal.com, SFRAVES@hyperreal.com,
        pb-cle-raves@hyperreal.com, txraves@io.com, DCraves@AMERICAN.EDU,
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Subject: Re: |NER| Re: Looking for bookings in June / July / August
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> > > > Hello all Rave Promoter Subscribers. 
	My name is DJ Hardware and I'm the 
> > > > director of A&R at Adrenalin Records in New York. i currently live in 
> > > > South Florida where I base the A& R office for Adrenalin Records. I'm 
> > > > looking for DJ Gigs north of Florida in the USA or in North Florida where 
> > > > I have not played yet. Currently I have 5 mixed CD's out on Adrenalin 
> > > > Records in stores throught the world. They are:
> > > > 		- Trip - Hop Acid Phunk vol 1
> > > > 		- Trip - Hop Acid Phunk vol 2  
> > > > 		- Acid warfare vol 1
> > > > 		- House Stompin'
> > > > 		- Adrenalin Hardcore Rush
> > > > 	        - Trip-Hop Acid Phunk vol 3 : The Hard Edition
> > > > 		- Electro Phunk 
> > > > 	        - Beat Generator
> > > > 
> > > > 	and a 12" single BY :THE TWEAKER called "All Tweaked Out"
> > > > 		With remixes by DJ Voodoo & The liquid Method
> > > > 				          	and Stryke
> > > If anyone is intrested in booking me at a club or event please contact me 
> > > at the Adrenalin Records Offices in Florida for more information at (407) 
> > > > 495 - 9954 or the Fax number at (407) 495 - 3919 or Email me at 
> > > > hardware@gate.net. 
> > > > 
> > > > 					Thanks for your time......
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 							DJ HARDWARE
> > > > 						      ADRENALIN RECORDS
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 15:37:32 1996
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From: Dimitri K Gortinsky <myself@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Anyone know about the SC Warf on Thursdays?
To: Steve Dennis <ecoman@darwin.UCSC.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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i went last week and it was pretty good....carlos and (i cant remember) 
who else spun...the crowd is alot smaller than on tues nights which makes 
it easier to dance ....cover of 4 is the same but they only have two dj's 
instead of three (on tue night)
as far as i know its going on every week...
dimitri

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 15:46:30 1996
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How do I take myself off of this list??  Help!

Thanks,

Stephanie

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 15:55:28 1996
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From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Subject: Re: Vibe in Vegas (long)
To: Vince <vince@vmar.com>
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I was in Vegas this weekend, and decided to also check out Utopia for 
some dancing.  Got there about 12am and the dance floor was packed by 
1am.  I found the vibe to be a little scattered, with a mostly clubby 
crowd.  There was some good energy and some pretty "ravey looking 
people" as well.  There was some good animation visuals, and the sound 
system would have been great if all the speakers were working.
I couldn't stay long and had to leave about 1:30.  I'd like to go back 
and see what its like at 5am.
On the 24th Doc Martin and Spun will be there.

:)
peter

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 16:01:11 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu (Jake Reichert)
Subject: That whole barbeque thingee
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Well, this was the first time since OCTOBER that I actually made it out
anywhere (yes, you read that right.  No, I don't have monthlexia).
Originally I was going to exile myself to my room and study all day, but I
thought, "what the hell.  How often does this happen?"  So I went.

Let's just say I think my day was spent a wee bit better than studying.
Make that quite a bit.  I met lots of new SFRavers that I'd never seen in
person before, ate a variety of roasted animal products (although not quite
as varied as Black Adder's famous Roast Chicken Skin a la Carte :)), danced
to some cool music (after about *a year* I finally got to hear my buddy
BioJeff spin), and relaaaaaxed.  Thanks to everyone who helped put this
together, especially Mr. Knucklehead himself, without whom this lovely event
would have never transpired (killer BBQ sauce, Tim).  And it was soooo good
to see some of you that I hadn't seen forever (you know who you are).

Thanks for the great day, ya'll, and hopefully I'll see you again soon.

Now back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Jake

P.S.  My offer to pay a billion dollars for anyone to finish my presentation
is now expired.  Why?  Because my presentation is DONE!!!!! DONE I TELL
YOU!!!! HAHAHAHAHHAHA....
Jake Reichert			|  I used to be indecisive/
reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu	|  But now I'm not so sure...		
				|                    -The The
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                     "LONELY IS AS LONELY DOES"
B.C. Gilbert/G. Lewis ------------------------    The Happy Family
A=====================================V  Bulgarian Voices | Pixies 
|          |              |   ____    |  Bauhaus |  Frazier Chorus
|     /|   |      /\      |  |    \   |  Michael Brook |  Spirea X
|    / |   |     /  \     |  |     \  |  The Breeders |  Colourbox
|   /  |   |    /    \    |  |      | |  Dead Can Dance |  Dif Juz
|  /___|   |   /______\   |  |      | |  Throwing Muses |  The The
|      |   |  /        \  |  |     /  |  Clan of Xymox | Rema-Rema
|      |   | /          \ |  |___ /   |  Cocteau Twins | Liquorice  
A=====================================M  Lisa Germano  | M|A|R|R|S
X Mal Deutschland | Dance Chapter | Insides |   The Birthday Party
A.R. Kane | Rowland S. Howard & Lydia Lunch  | C.V.O  |  Air Miami
Ultra Vivid Scene | Unrest | Pieter Nooten/Michael Brook | Swallow
That Dog. | Psychotic Tanks  |  Lisa Gerrard  | Last Dance |  Lush
Modern English |  Budd/Fraser/Guthrie/Raymonde |  This Mortal Coil   
The Wolfgang Press |  Richenel |  His Name Is Alive  | Pale Saints
The Glee Club    ---------------------------------    Colin Newman
                       "LONELY IS AN EYESORE"      


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 16:07:45 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 16:00:59 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu (Jake Reichert)
Subject: See ya in a while...
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To all you friendly SFRaver-types,

Although my bullshit Tech. in Ed. project is done, I still have a few
obligations to meet.  "Few" being the understatement of the century next to
"No, really, I think John Ritter was actually a pretty mediocre actor."  I
will be spending today through Thursday in Hell.  If you need to reach me,
you can reach mi via surface mail at the following address:

Jake Reichert
Hell, The Underworld
66666

Or you can send me cheery email to make me happy at reicja00@usfca.edu

Gotta go pack my bags.  And do some quantum physics.  And some real
analysis. Und so weiter.

I'll stop now.

Jake

going slightly insane


Jake Reichert			|  I used to be indecisive/
reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu	|  But now I'm not so sure...		
				|                    -The The
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                     "LONELY IS AS LONELY DOES"
B.C. Gilbert/G. Lewis ------------------------    The Happy Family
A=====================================V  Bulgarian Voices | Pixies 
|          |              |   ____    |  Bauhaus |  Frazier Chorus
|     /|   |      /\      |  |    \   |  Michael Brook |  Spirea X
|    / |   |     /  \     |  |     \  |  The Breeders |  Colourbox
|   /  |   |    /    \    |  |      | |  Dead Can Dance |  Dif Juz
|  /___|   |   /______\   |  |      | |  Throwing Muses |  The The
|      |   |  /        \  |  |     /  |  Clan of Xymox | Rema-Rema
|      |   | /          \ |  |___ /   |  Cocteau Twins | Liquorice  
A=====================================M  Lisa Germano  | M|A|R|R|S
X Mal Deutschland | Dance Chapter | Insides |   The Birthday Party
A.R. Kane | Rowland S. Howard & Lydia Lunch  | C.V.O  |  Air Miami
Ultra Vivid Scene | Unrest | Pieter Nooten/Michael Brook | Swallow
That Dog. | Psychotic Tanks  |  Lisa Gerrard  | Last Dance |  Lush
Modern English |  Budd/Fraser/Guthrie/Raymonde |  This Mortal Coil   
The Wolfgang Press |  Richenel |  His Name Is Alive  | Pale Saints
The Glee Club    ---------------------------------    Colin Newman
                       "LONELY IS AN EYESORE"      


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 16:28:20 1996
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Date: 06 May 96 19:26:36 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: In  Defense of Myself...
Message-ID: <960506232635_71165.755_GHL62-1@CompuServe.COM>
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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SDream/Todd said about me at Wicked...

Leslie, Marty, and I danced our booties off, although Leslie flaked out early --
wimp! (hehe)  Marty and I were there until 6am.


///////////////

I, I, I, I have been called a wimp?   NEVER!!

Hello, I beg your pardon, Mr. I-Wish-There-Were-a-Chill-Space-for-a-Handrub ....
you know I danced hard hard hard at Wicked, and left at 5am in case of bad Bay
Bridge traffic...  which luckily wasn't goin' on at all in my homeward-bound
direction....  Besides, I had a date.

So considering I beat you to Harmony by at least an hour, and to the picnic by
more than that AND I still had time to make my promised potato salad ... I'm way
ahead of you in the "wow-are-my-feet-beat" category, my friend!  

Your apologies will be happily accepted!!

I've never been so happily tired after a weekend, I swear!

Leslie    ; )




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 16:36:52 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 16:33:59 -0700
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From: Low UFO <lowufo@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: HARMONY'S BP!!
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Well it looks like R.Lunatic beat me to it.  We both went to BP together and
met alot of people.  I told R.Lunatic I was going to make a make shout-out
to all the people we met from sfraves, but he beat me to the punch.  Anyway,
I just wanted to say "HI" to all the people we met, and sorry if I seemed a
little upset or quiet.  BUNK SUX.  Oh Well.  I was at least able to point
out all of you to my friends.  Well at least I now have my first post out of
the way.  I hope to post more later.

Ian 

P.S. I'm glad CTD-zine went with us.  He wasn't going to go, but we dragged
him kickin' and screamin'.  Hahaha.  I know he was glad he went too. 

At 12:27 PM 5/4/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Now, Harmony's Beautiful People....
>
>That was I-N-C-R-E-D-I-B-L-E!!!!!!!!!
>
>Everybody was oozing with vibe and it was sure bouncing off the 
>walls!!!!
>
>Troysheets!
>Shawna!
>CTD-Zine!
>LowUfo!
>Branka!
>CHIN! (with the white glove!)
>Amy!
>
>We all gotta hook up and do that again.... =)~
>
>adam
>                            R.Lunatic
>
>time to catch some more Z's
>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 16:42:39 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 16:42:10 +0200
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Weekend recap: Wicked, Contribute, & Sunset Yeah!!
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello friends,

I'm kinda bumbed cuz I didn't make it out to BP, I went last year and had
soooo much fun and I expected this one to be just as good (As I have heard)
but for some reason I didn't have that excitment to go out - I guess it was
a long hecktic week for me.  I also missed out on the BBQ because I had to
work till 6 but hopfully another will be planned and I will schedule the
day off just to go.

Well, I went to a small housE party on saturday for awhile and I talked
some friends into going out to the city, that night.  On the bridge we
decided to stop by King street for Wicked - I've only been to one
Wicked(the anniversery last year), hence I am still only 20 yrs. old but we
decided to go anyways and in we did...  It was different to say the least.
I've been to king street once as well but only of a few minutes.  This time
I thought it was warm, good acid visuals and great BASS - I LUV BASS Thomas
was on playing some great house and moved into some break/jungle beats
which I haven't gruved to in a while.  There wasn't a family friendly vibe
that I am use to but I didn't really expect one from such an older crowd.
I totally agree with SDream's post about Wicked. Did a lot a dancing up
front, not much socialization but smiless a lot and we left right after
Markie came on to go to Contribute

Contribute was at the deli and I instantly loved the mural on the side, I'm
sure it will look even better with black lighting.  It was about 3 or 3.30
when we got there and Tony was on the decks goin off.  I saw many people I
knew and socilized with some new friends.  I danced most of the night and
left early (6am) so I could rest my tried feet.  24,000 watts of sound was
quite loud for the deli but it was bearable with ear plugs and I didn't
hear much about Astril Matrix PA..Did anyone hear?

Sunday I went to the Marina and it was my first time back since last years
final sunset.  OOOHHHH  MAANN it was great.  I had the best time.  It
brought back memories of all the past sunsets last summer I went to there.
The music was great.  I got there when Kevin started and he played some
funk shit I enjoyed and Alex was spinning some cool afternoon trance.  But
Solar made my sunday with a many rcognizable old skool and new music
favorits.  I brought fruit drinks to share which were passed out upon 5
minutes of my arival and stayed almost to the end.  Yes I picked up many
articals of trash before I left.  I hope the trash situation was not as bad
this time.  This was the best Sunset for me this year, great vibe, great
choons, great people, great dancers, and great fun.  Thank you Pacific
Yeah!!!!

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 16:58:39 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 16:58:20 +0200
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Old skool mixed tapes (89 - 94')
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Does anyone know where I could get copies of older mixed tapes.  I was
listing to my old Carlos, Ghost, and Jeno mixes (The only ones I own prior
to 94')and was wondering if there is anyway I could get a hold of some of
these.  Maybe some one would be so kind as to let me make a copy of there
tapes.  I would provide blank tapes and mailing postage if neccesary.  The
first dj's I heard and remembered were Carlos, Jeno, Doc Martin, and Dan.
If anyone knows where i can pick up tapes of them or, Garth, Simon, Darwin
Chamber, Josh, Joe Harp, Harry Who?, Spun, Jon Bishop, Rick Preston,
Thomas, the Hardkiss brothers etc it would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 17:11:10 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 17:10:53 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, syntonic-request@orb.org
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: w'end (the long version)
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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greetings folks

been reading all your mails and smiling :>:> and then trying to think how
to put into words what happened this past w'end....NOT an easy task given
all the truly amazing things that went on.

sigh. enuf to say that i am still in this amazing state of euphoria, but
way tired (and i didn't go anywhere near a club saturday or sunday night.
pathetic!). i suppose i should have paced myself more, but i had *no idea*
how wonderful it was all going to be. 

harmony just about blew the top of my head off - the location (forGET the
water boyz. if that's all we had to complain about we are WAY ahead), the
decorations, and the ambience were so fun and playful! i *think* i r'member
seeing a twister mat somewhere in the early part of the evening...? :> and
then all the fluorescent fun - i waz so glad i was able to paint so many
bodies...
whomever it was with the yellow pen...woman, you are an arTISTE! you can
draw on my arm ANYtime. i'm am but your humble canvas :> 

oh, the music.....i did 'na wanna stop! you've already heard the rave
reviews, so i'll just say "right on!"

special moments - finally meeting the faces behind the names, especially,
but not including (mostly because i caNOT remember everything and
everyone...humble apologies :< ) eric (you give bee-YOOO-tiful hugs my
friend. can't believe it didn't see you saturday...?), the beautiful leslie
(La Primavera incarnate!), matthew (your buddies' names are lost in the
ether...) , sdr, oMAN...and of course some special others - tim(othy - tell
me more about this coming w'end?), pete (hi!), paul, amy...who'm i
forgetting??? AH! jonjon the burger king!!!! LURved your fishnets!!! 

funnest moments - getting filmed (yes - i'm a tv-tart), painting, and
realizing that the funky new lighting set-up near the front door was
actually the *sun* coming up (talk about losing track of reality).

saturday (BP after-party??) was great, i could *sense* that, but i was
sooooo out of it from the night b4 that i wasn't really able to talk to all
of you gorgeous people. someone may have slept between BP and the picnic;
NOT me. the best part was FINally hearing B'jeff....all i can say here is
that all of you who have been telling me he is the next best thing since
sliced bread are WRONG. he's better than chocolate. WORST part - finding a
gopher hole with my ankle. ouch! :<

sorry to have missed sunset, but i did find my corner in the sun with some
friends (thankx to loulou and vitta :>). 

hope you all had as good a time. see you all at the next.....

peace
melis

ps - extended invitation to one and all for my b'day! just remember to get
your BM tix, and we'll all have a...?
cheers!




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 17:18:35 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 17:17:36 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: SFR logo
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Didn't someone once post the location of the graphic file for the SFR logo?  
I'd really like to get a hold of that.  Does anyone here know where it's at?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 17:47:53 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 17:46:25 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: What makes a rave? (long reply to JSL)
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>When I began raving, I don't remember hearing anybody saying they wanted 
>that.  People liked the bells and whistles.  Toon Town was the big party 
>then -- they put on one-off events in big venues, for thousands of people 
>like Cool World and Funky Tekno Tribe do now, only the vibe was more like 
>a Friends & Family or a Harmony.  Toon Town went all out with stuff like 
>virtual reality, bouncy castles, carnival rides, vendors, brain wave 
>machines, etc.  I loved it, and others seemed to as well.  It was new, it 
>was exciting, it was fun!



I'm curious about something folks, not having been around long enough to
have experienced the famed Toon Town parties.  Seems like every time I hear
one of the old timers talk about the old days, they go on about the old Toon
Town parties.  "Oh yeah, I've been raving since '91, like at Toon Town!"
Everybody still talks about them, more than any other party I've ever heard
about from back then.  From what everybody's been saying, this sounds like a
total blast! Why is it no one does them any more?  What happened to them?  &
what would it take to bring one back?  Is this a true physical impossibility
or is it just that no one gets around to putting in the effort to do
something like that any more?  Seems like you could really set up something
spectacular at the Homebase warehouse or something.  


Love,
Shawna



"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 18:17:21 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 18:17:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Jon Zimmerman <bigz@bigz.com>
cc: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Chat?
In-Reply-To: <199604300635.XAA12293@cyberE.creative.net>
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Dear Jon and Randy:

I am looking for some help on a multi-media theatre production I am
working on.  I t would entail basically going off on some distorting
some video stills with some rendering.  One of our animators had to drop 
out; if you have any time to help on an image we could ftp them back and 
forth.  Thanks 

Cassandra

On Mon, 29 Apr 1996, Jon Zimmerman wrote:

> Hey Randy, I'm not sure your there now, but I'm up rendering at home for my
> senior project. What platform are you working on? What is your animation
> about (I'm assuming its an animation). The following are picts from my
> senior animation. They're B-17s I've been modeling that fit into one of the
> four scenes I'm creating. I'm interested to see what your up to...
> 
> Jon Zimmerman
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At  3:54 PM 4/29/96 -0700, Randy C Cone wrote:
> >Hi!
> > Is anyone up! I'm working in the computer lab on some 3d modeling and
> >e-mailing during rendering -- anybody care to communicate?
> > E-mail me privately please. Thanx!  :)
> >
> >
> >Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
> >
> >                          *("come talk to me")
> >                                  /
> >                            -=*=-/
> >                              ~
> >
> >
> >* Peter Gabriel lyrics
> 
> Jon Zimmerman
> (415)664-6645
> bigz@bigz.com
> http://www.bigz.com
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 18:18:45 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 18:21:55 -0700
To: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Re: Weekend recap: Wicked, Contribute, & Sunset Yeah!!
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NOTE: Tone of this post is total utter sarcasm designed for your twisted
amusement, do not take seriously!!!!!!!!!

Hiya All;       

        Sorry, but I'm a little annoyed. Where's all the list people who
usually jump all over people's shit for someone admitting they broke the
law, and/or admitting they committed a VERY(sarcasm present) serious crime,
or better yet where are all those MAD mothers, and why aren't they calling
for the demise of 174 King Street for allowing minors in.

        So come on we want to see this persons body parts virtually ripped
apart on SFRAVE's for having the nerve, and the ordasity to admit they
committed a crime. So come on all you list vultures out there in a miserable
mood it's time to feed.

>Well, I went to a small housE party on saturday for awhile and I talked
>some friends into going out to the city, that night.  On the bridge we
>decided to stop by King street for Wicked - I've only been to one
>Wicked(the anniversery last year), hence I am still only 20 yrs. old but we
>decided to go anyways and in we did...  It was different to say the least.
>I've been to king street once as well but only of a few minutes. 

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 18:26:16 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 18:26:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
Subject: Burnout phase (was weekend recap)
To: Austin <exodus@earthlink.net>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Mon, 6 May 1996, Austin wrote:

> but for some reason I didn't have that excitment to go out - I guess it was
> a long hecktic week for me.  

I've been going through this lately.   Seems like every 9 months or so - 
sometimes longer - I go through a real burn out phase.  I'm not excited 
by going out and I just get generally very very bored with life in 
general.  I can't get into the music, so I listen to talk radio in the 
car instead. (Don't worry, no Rush).  I always come around, though, and 
so I am not worried.  

Who else goes through this? I'm sure everyone does to a certain extent.

Most of all, what about the dj's - especially ones who are in heavy 
demand to put so much of themselves into the music ALL THE TIME?  What do 
you do when you need a break?  Or is it so much in your blood that you 
never do get burned out?

Consequently, I will be attending Madness next weekend.  But if Sunset is 
going on, I'm passing it up for some quiet time with my someone special.;)

I'd love everyone's iput and thoughts on this.  Especially dj's and 
promoters.

love,
Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 18:28:58 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 18:32:13 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, vince@vmar.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Re: SFR logo
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Dear Vince & All;

        Though I'm very grateful for Vince's awsome effort  in designing the
present SFR Logo. Also, I would like to state that I wear mine with pride
every time I go out.

        But I was just wondering does the logo have to be so 60's. Rave &
Techno & late 80's & 90's thang. I expected something a lot more Cyber, and
a lot more up to date rather than something that reminds me of the old and
moldy sixites. Just wondering if we could do something to change this.

        I suggest a virtual contest, where people submit their vision of the
sfr logo, and we vote via a web site wheree they are displayed, how bout it
people, speak your minds.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 18:50:07 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 18:45:31 -0700
Message-Id: <199605070145.SAA06260@dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: HARMONY'S BP!!
To: Low UFO <lowufo@ix.netcom.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 

>
>P.S. I'm glad CTD-zine went with us.  He wasn't going to go, but we 
dragged
>him kickin' and screamin'.  Hahaha.  I know he was glad he went too. 
>


Yep, He was Kickin' and screamin' on the way out too!!


Adam

                R.Lunatic

=)~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 18:53:54 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 18:55:18 +1000
To: Electric 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Lets change the subject to RavePool
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>I've got you added to my list.    Do you know of a good "pickup point"
>>like an "easy to get to" restaurant near you?    Also,   is this number
>>you gave me the one that would reach you "Prior to the party",  and
>>would you make an effort to keep the line free a few hours before the
>>party?
>it's my home phone number. it's also my modem number, so if it's busy, i'll
>get email within 5 minutes. i love getting new mail so i read it the instant
>it comes in..
>as to a meeting point... uhh.. i dunno. the san bruno caltrain station is
>kinda on my way to the city.. (i live by the junction of 92 and 280)

Ok,  caltrain station it is...   How many people can you take?   I need to
know that...

Ok,  so far we got just two people with cars.  One in San Jose (Mike)
and another one in San Bruno.    Do we have anymore people with cars to
help out with my RavePool project....  Surely we should more than just
two people.   How about Marin,  don't we have ANYONE in Marin that has
a spare seat in their car?   Come on you guyz,   we can do better than
this... Can't we?

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 18:54:02 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 18:55:24 +1000
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Ravepool
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Hey gang!  Is this something we can work on?
>- E
>
>>What we need right now is a list and location from those that have cars.
>>So if you have a car,  and want to take a fellow raver please send me
>>Email right away with the following information.
>>

Yea you guys,  now we got something ELSE to talk about rather then
DRUGS DRUGS DRUGS and more drugs...   :-)

And it's constructive and helpful to all....  It helps those people
who have cars who want company to go to parties,  and those without
cars to get there safely...  So far,  we only got 2 people,  but
what the heck,  it's just Monday anyways,  I'm sure the response
will pick up,  because I'm putting in my energy to make RavePool
work.

Cheers
The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 19:15:41 1996
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From: "'Dave Bayer'" <dlb@typhoon-ether.Berkeley.EDU>
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To: "\\SFRaves\\" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Beltane and Full Moon
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There was a nice little thingy put on that was reviewed already. The spot 
was quite nice, but the vibe never really allowed it to become a Beltane 
festival (so I guess it was ok that I forgot my body paint because I am 
not sure if me dancing naked with that stick I found, painted with oil 
based black body paints in those tribal markings out of RE/Search 
#something or other would have made people uncomfortable or not). The 
next day people headed down to the river for a dip... Overall it was 
quite enjoy to just come and lie around with friends in the Groovy Grove 
as it was called... and play/hear some Lurker music as it was called in 
the morning....

	So then there was the full moon on Thrusday night up at the Marina
(it got busted at the Aquatic Park as it was being set up, but we were
told to if they moved it to the marina and kept the car out of sight -
basicly in the parking lots - it could go on, and it did. The night
started off with a really nice trance set by ed, and was followed by some
hard techno by Minor minor, but he had trouble due to a stylus kind of
giving out which made people sit down... Then an experiment, 15 minutes of
gabber while trying to sort the stylus out... Spun played an acidic set
while I went to get a little sleep, but I woke up to Jon Carol playing
some morning techno. Overall, things fell into place once we got to the
Aquatic park. 

	How many people are putting together some type of full moon 
parties these days? See all of you (I guess who know me) with my whistle
when I get back in a month from that far away Scotland place...

dave

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 19:25:13 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 19:24:37 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Reekend Wecap
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Brevity goes a long way...someone once told, me but that's another story...

Split from work a bit early (having to sneak by our troll-like
receptionist.  What Gargamel was to the Smurfs, our receptionist is to
Xinutians.  I think he used to rave, but after Toon Towns ended he's been a
recluse.  Rumor has it he and John Carel used to party, but that ways WAY
back when they were kids.  Like 21, and shit.  "Hey Ti-Fred!" :^) to help
Harmony set up that space so beautifully.  These guys work so hard to turn
even the most stubborn space into a positive vibe frenzy.  Kudos to the
crew for putting all their energy into the space; the decorations were
funky, the lighting ethereal, the music crisp and clear (same system, BTW
as the one in Portland with Gateway).  The party was a blast.  It was nice
meeting those that I met, and certainly fun dissing those that weren't
around.  ;^)  J/J

Leslie suprised me by telling me that I was up for contention to marry her,
and while I went home a little baffled by that, once I eat her potato salad
at the BBQ I was prepared to have a dance off with John Lee for said
coveted position by her side.

I think I may have been one of the first persons to witness the beginning
of the end for the poor kid that flipped out.  He was barreling through the
crowd for no reason, and he ran right into the big beafy head bouncer
upstairs.  I told the bouncer I would get him, and so I followed him into
the main room, where again he was barging through people, and I started
trying to calm him.  He was way gone, and with me in tow, he ran back into
the hall and right into the big beefy bouncer again and then out the door.
To be quite honest, the bouncer was pretty cool considering he'd been run
into twice.  The kid went outside (after fumbling with the door) and
plopped himself down on the side walk.  I thought the fresh air might be
good for him, and came back inside.  About a half hour later I went outisde
to check on him and the first thing out of the bouncer's mouth was, "Did
you give him that acid?!"  "No!" I replied, "why?  What happened to him?"
"He just got taken away by the cops. He was resisting."  "Shit!"

Home, vitamins, sleep...good.  BBQ...good.  The music rocked, the people --
you people -- :^*  Mwah!  Huge hugs and kisses.  Met a woman from very
close to my home town, and that was kewl.  (Shhhh...She's a doll.  :^)
Danced hard for a long time, the music was good, the sound excellent, the
tea yummy ;^), the food delicious, the sun shining, the smiles wide and
toothy, the conversation inane and senseless, er, I mean intriguing and
captivating, the breeze breezy, the vibe wonderful, the sunset beautiful,
the ...

Stayed until the BBQ pit was loaded on the truck and the equipment in the
van.  Was told I should go to Sacramento for the party going on there (For
the Love?) and said that if I wasn't there by 3AM I wasn't coming [or is
that, I was com...nevermind. :^]  But I had to hit a friend's roof party in
The City.  Made that and completely freaked my friends out by saying I was
going to Sacramento at Midnight.  Opted to drive instead of ride my
motorcycle, and that was a good thing.  Got to the map point by 1:50am, in
the party exactly at 2am.  Gave a nice welcoming hoot to all the Sac kids,
and jammed around the place looking for my friends.  ANY friends.  BIOJeff
had spun and gone already, but low and behold Amy Starkey and Melanie (and
Mike) were there and that was nice.  They made me feel good by saying they
were happy to see me.  I guess I had to believe them.

The cops came into the party, a nice party, in a small warehouse, with a
closed off hot chill area and a DJ booth WAY up above everyone's head, and
asked them to turn the volume half way down.  Very cool of them and people
cheered that it wasn't a full bust.  Well, of course, the volume went right
back up to it's original level and by 4am the party was busted.  Kind of
foolish not to keep the music low for a good long time.  Maybe they should
have timed it so that when the nearby trains cruised by, making a hell of a
racket, they could crank it, and then turn it back down when the train was
gone.  You could have a volume man, sort of like a throttle man in off
shore power boat racing (they need to throttle back when the prop goes out
of the water).  Anyway, the people that put this party together are cool,
and Charisma was good while I was there.

Of course then you have the usual mob scene with crazy kids outside with
wild eyes and "no place else to go!"  Crashed and smoked cigs for a while
and then slept.  Left Sac around 4PM Sunday to go to a BBQ and totally
spaced on calling the Pacific number to see if there was a Sunset.  Fuck!
Oh well, at least I was home an hour after Simpsons and then went to sleep.

See you at Madness...
Love
Tone

P.S.  So, some crazy dude took control of my email account late last week
and posted that I was, get this...6'2" and Ukranian?!  And I wear a
shark-skin suit and fuzzy dice!?  Shit man, I am not Ukranian to start
with, I'm half Italian/half random European, and my roommate has the shark
skin suit, not me.  Also, *I* wear a freaked out wig and a half-cut, red,
cordory smoking jacket.  I have never owned fuzzy dice, but I did once own
some scuzzy mice.  Buzzy lice?  Wazzy Nice?  [Sorry.  :^]

5'2" in case anyone was wondering.  ;^)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 19:28:01 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 19:26:17 -0700
Message-Id: <199605070226.TAA28604@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Me and my new life!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Well.. 

My life has been a bore for quite a while. I went to school, worked, 
studied and slept. Until I met these two individuals, Terry <CTD-Zine> 
and Ian <LOWUFO>. They were the ones that actually changed my life 
around. They got me into ravin' about 2 months ago? I think i'm 
addicted.. but you know what.. I LOVE IT!!!!!!!!

Thanks alot you two! This Summer iz going to be a goooood ONE!


Your Ravin' Lunatic,

                Adam.

p.s. btw everybody, CTD-Zine gave me my handle at Gaia. He sorta 
spurted it out, and I like it. hehe    =)~




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 19:36:29 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 19:36:25 -0700 (PDT)
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: What makes a rave? (long reply to JSL)
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.16.19960506025702.360f5726@popd.ix.netcom.com>
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On Mon, 6 May 1996, hey, where am I? wrote:

> I'm curious about something folks, not having been around long enough to
> have experienced the famed Toon Town parties.  Seems like every time I hear
> one of the old timers talk about the old days, they go on about the old Toon
> Town parties.  "Oh yeah, I've been raving since '91, like at Toon Town!"
> Everybody still talks about them, more than any other party I've ever heard
> about from back then.  From what everybody's been saying, this sounds like a
> total blast! Why is it no one does them any more?  What happened to them?  &
> what would it take to bring one back?  Is this a true physical impossibility
> or is it just that no one gets around to putting in the effort to do
> something like that any more?  Seems like you could really set up something
> spectacular at the Homebase warehouse or something.  

I think it may be more of a matter of "That was then, this is now." Toon 
Town was great, but I think that much of the energy was "newer"(awaiting 
the flames on this one....) I would like to know what some of the 
original promoters are up to now....

                                                Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 19:37:31 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Reekend Wecap
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> The cops came into the party, a nice party, in a small warehouse, with a
> closed off hot chill area and a DJ booth WAY up above everyone's head, and
> asked them to turn the volume half way down.  Very cool of them and people
> cheered that it wasn't a full bust.  Well, of course, the volume went right
> back up to it's original level and by 4am the party was busted.  Kind of
> foolish not to keep the music low for a good long time.  Maybe they should
> have timed it so that when the nearby trains cruised by, making a hell of a
> racket, they could crank it, and then turn it back down when the train was
> gone.  You could have a volume man, sort of like a throttle man in off
> shore power boat racing (they need to throttle back when the prop goes out
> of the water).  Anyway, the people that put this party together are cool,
> and Charisma was good while I was there.

I was there too! (met you and Amy)... yeah, it was a pretty cool party.  
I know from experience that anything that happens in downtown Sac is 
busted, but I figured it would be cool while it lasted.  Karizma's set 
was definitely the bomb!  Last summer there were tons of parties here, 
but this summer looks bleak.  If anyone wants to throw a party at Cal 
Expo, I can help them w/that.  You supposedly can't get it anymore, but I 
know I can....  I know it's a big, commercial space, but there's almost 
nowhere else you can throw a party here legally...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 19:55:40 1996
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To: blkadder@value.net
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: What makes a rave? (long reply to JSL)
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In a message dated 96-05-06 22:39:55 EDT, you write:

> think it may be more of a matter of "That was then, this is now." Toon 
>Town was great, but I think that much of the energy was "newer"(awaiting 
>the flames on this one....) I would like to know what some of the 
>original promoters are up to now....

They are throwing the Gathering basics vision, freedom, wicked.....
Jonathan


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 20:26:47 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 21:25:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: A little more gratitude
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hi all -
 BP was rave #4 for me, and the BEST for cool folx and good vibe.  Todd's   
grapes were delicious (or does that sound funny?)!  I brought along a   
first-timEr, a cool guy named Armando, and he had a blast as well.   
 Thanks to the Harmony folks for the great decor and the A.C., and thanks   
to Tone for being Tone!  Dr. Melissa, it was great to meet you, but I   
missed your email address; send me a message so we can get in touch!  'n'   
thanks for the paint... Hugs out to Branka, Sarah, Sy, and Joel!

 Ladybug fans: check   
http://schoolnet2.carleton.ca/english/sci/env/ladybug/ladybugs.html

 I'd love to hear from other Santa Cruz area people to find out more   
about what's happening in our neck of the woods.  If there's nothing   
happening, we can fix that.
 -Roy  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 21:10:23 1996
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Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 21:10:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
cc: Austin <exodus@earthlink.net>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Burnout phase (was weekend recap)
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 Amy- I know exactly what you mean since I'm going throught it know 
myself: I'm burnt on going to parties. All I've been able to handle 
latelt has been daytime parties like the SFR B-B-Q:):):):).
I guess a bit of it has to do with having 3 weeks of school left and 
projects to do, quizzes, test and exams to take:(. I find when I am going 
through these phases to just take some time out, no matter how long. The 
last thing I want to do is "force" myself to go out when the desire isn't 
there. The few times when I've done this I've been a grotch(sp?) and I 
don't want to take parties for granted. So for next few weeks I'll be 
taking a break from night parties that is unless I get a big power surge 
of energy and decide to go out. Take care!
                  love-
                    Reagan





On Mon, 6 May 1996, Amy R Starkey wrote:

> 
> On Mon, 6 May 1996, Austin wrote:
> 
> > but for some reason I didn't have that excitment to go out - I guess it was
> > a long hecktic week for me.  
> 
> I've been going through this lately.   Seems like every 9 months or so - 
> sometimes longer - I go through a real burn out phase.  I'm not excited 
> by going out and I just get generally very very bored with life in 
> general.  I can't get into the music, so I listen to talk radio in the 
> car instead. (Don't worry, no Rush).  I always come around, though, and 
> so I am not worried.  
> 
> Who else goes through this? I'm sure everyone does to a certain extent.
> 
> Most of all, what about the dj's - especially ones who are in heavy 
> demand to put so much of themselves into the music ALL THE TIME?  What do 
> you do when you need a break?  Or is it so much in your blood that you 
> never do get burned out?
> 
> Consequently, I will be attending Madness next weekend.  But if Sunset is 
> going on, I'm passing it up for some quiet time with my someone special.;)
> 
> I'd love everyone's iput and thoughts on this.  Especially dj's and 
> promoters.
> 
> love,
> Amy
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 21:58:36 1996
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From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Burnout phase (was weekend recap)
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> Amy- I know exactly what you mean since I'm going throught it know 
>myself: I'm burnt on going to parties. All I've been able to handle 
>latelt has been daytime parties like the SFR B-B-Q:):):):).
>I guess a bit of it has to do with having 3 weeks of school left and 
>projects to do, quizzes, test and exams to take:(. I find when I am going 
>through these phases to just take some time out, no matter how long. The 
>last thing I want to do is "force" myself to go out when the desire isn't 
>there. The few times when I've done this I've been a grotch(sp?) and I 
>don't want to take parties for granted. So for next few weeks I'll be 
>taking a break from night parties that is unless I get a big power surge 
>of energy and decide to go out. Take care!



Yeah, I know whatcha mean too!  I've only been raving for about six months
(six month anniversary Memorial Day weekend!  I've got the holiday theme
going here, I started on Thanksgiving! :) and even now I sometimes do get
tired, esp these two weekends!  Between this past weekend & next weekend
there are six different things going on that I was interested in!  Wears a
person out.  & I agree with you guys that I really don't want to take the
scene for granted, to not appreciate something like that would be a major
tragedy to me.  Doesn't make it easy to take a break tho with so many good
parties to attend!


Love,
Shawna




"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 22:27:35 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 22:27:53 -0700
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From: Electric 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: w'end (the long version)
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>decorations, and the ambience were so fun and playful! i *think* i r'member
>seeing a twister mat somewhere in the early part of the evening...? :> and
wooo! twister!! jess and i taught renaud how to play twister! the group that
brought the twister mat unfortunately forgot to bring the spinner (their
backpack was _packed_) so jess made up some cards and we pulled cards
instead of spinning. i lost everytime i played. i think paul won all the
time. grrrrr..

>whomever it was with the yellow pen...woman, you are an arTISTE! you can
>draw on my arm ANYtime. i'm am but your humble canvas :> 
that was the fabulous kirsten (aka kaycee) with the marker. the yellow
crayola marker got passed around a lot.. it could have been anyone who did
the fabulous artwork though.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 22:31:48 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 22:32:06 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Electric 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Burnout Phase
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>I've been going through this lately.   Seems like every 9 months or so - 
>sometimes longer - I go through a real burn out phase.  I'm not excited 
>by going out and I just get generally very very bored with life in 
>general.  I can't get into the music, so I listen to talk radio in the 
>car instead. (Don't worry, no Rush).  I always come around, though, and 
>so I am not worried.  
>
>Who else goes through this? I'm sure everyone does to a certain extent.

i have the perfect solution to your woes. go out with jess to a party. she's
the ultimate party enjoyment aid. if you go out with jess, you will have
fun. guarenteed.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 22:33:32 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 22:33:50 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: SFR logo
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>        I suggest a virtual contest, where people submit their vision of the
>sfr logo, and we vote via a web site wheree they are displayed, how bout it
>people, speak your minds.

why go with a standard at all?
why not everyone make their own version and print up their own laminates?
diversity is best, after all..


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May  6 23:38:08 1996
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Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 11:44:21 -0700
From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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Organization: CT D-Zine
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Here's my $.02 on the whole SFraves logo thing.

I have been very interested in laminates, and have
found that there are many of you (especially the
sfr newbies, like me) don't have one. Laminates are
an excellent way for us to create unity, and find
each other in darkened warehouses. ;^)

The so-calraves list is going crazy right now with the
idea of laminates. For those of you that don't know,
they have a section dedicated on their home-page just
to display laminate ideas submitted by fellow so-cal
ravers. If you get the chance, check 'em out, some 
of them are pretty cool.

One idea, (given to me by Troy Sheets) was to create 
a black and white logo that could be easily downloaded
by everyone.

As for me, I'm stoked on the idea of a new logo and
am hopping onto Illustrator right now!

Well, Whadaya think???

Hugs,

CT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 00:57:28 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 00:57:22 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Crusty old raver <wayne@club.net>
Subject: Re: MacDonald's Commercial
Cc: john@ati.com
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At 7:24 AM 5/6/96, John Bagby wrote:
>Ugh!  Yes, I saw it yesterday... part of "the Ronald grows up" ad
>campaign.  Never mind the fact that as one of the largest beef-industry
>powerhouses, McDonalds is responsible for the clearcutting of forests for
>cattle-grazing land, or the destruction of sustainable agriculture in this
>and other countries.. etc, etc.   Monoculture embracing the "rave vibe"
>stinks of a "Reality Bites"-like cynicism, IMHO.

blah blah blah. I am *so* tired of political correctness...

I don't go to MacDonalds because of PC inspired idealism. I don't go
because I don't like the quality of their products.

Can we just talk about music and dancing?

Signed,

One step closer to unsubscribing.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 02:22:33 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 02:22:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: Matt Kodama <starchld@leland.Stanford.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: yo! (musical nonsense)
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I have no idea what the song is called, but it sounds like they should 
have called it "Yo-yo".  It could be played along with the track "Slinky" 
by Into The Third Power.  8)

My computer tells me that on Wed, 1 May 1996, Matt Kodama shared:

> music question:
> heard a song at fusion during one of the later sets which had a woman
> singing "yo" over and over again - at least i think that's what she was
> saying ... with not too much effort you could convince yourself that she
> was saying dozens of different things.  sort of like an audio rorschach
> blob (pardon horrid spelling, pleez)
> 
> anyway, does anybody know whose track that was?  (artist, although i'm
> curious which dj that was too.)
> thanks!
> matt.
> 
> -- 
> |=======================================================================|
> |									|
> | i have the world's largest collection of seashells.  i keep it on all	|
> | the beaches of the world ... perhaps you've seen it.			|
> |									|
> | you know how it is when you're reading a book and falling asleep,	|
> | you're reading, reading ... and all of a sudden you notice your eyes	|
> | are closed?  i'm like that all the time.				|
> |									|
> | i put tape on the mirrors in my house so i don't accidentally walk	|
> | through into another dimension.					|
> |									|
> |    - steven wright			      				|
> |									|
> |=======================================================================|
> -starchld@leland.stanford.edu--the mothership can be reached at 493-4099-
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 03:26:07 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: Have car, will rave!
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Dear Friends & Family,

	I am overjoyed to now have an operational gas-guzzling locomotive 
device, i.e. a car.  Having long been without one, I know what a pain it 
can be to get to events you want to go to in many cases.  It's a pain to 
own one too, if you live in the city, however, and I'm thinking of 
selling it to buy a bike. (Much thanks to the Department of Parking and 
Traffic for raising revenue on the backs of the working/student poor who 
cannot afford garages, via parking tickets!)  But as long as I have the 
car, I'll share it.  8)
	Of course I will still be scooting around on Rollerblades as 
often as possible.  I'm hoping by the time the laws get modified to 
prohibit inline skating downtown, require us to wear helmets, and 
enforcement of no sidewalk riding is beefed up, there will be some 
exciting new form of transportation available.
	Cap'n Crunch & Eric Petersen were talking about setting up 
pick-up points, which sounds like a great idea, if it can really be 
organized and if there's enough demand to make it happen.
	Anyway, I live in the upper Market area in San Francisco near 
Market & Noe, if anybody in S.F. needs a ride to something, give me a 
call!  I don't promise I'll want to go, but I'll at least consider it.  
8) I have voicemail, so you may leave a message there anytime without fear of unduly 
disturbing my sleep... (415) 270-7887.
	Would love the opportunity to meet new smiling raver faces.  
Also, if anyone's ever desperate for a place to sleep before BART starts 
running in the morning or something...

Much love,
				<<< Starchild >>> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 04:56:53 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: What makes a rave? (long reply to JSL)
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Dear Friends & Family,

On Sunday (?), I shared:

> >When I began raving, I don't remember hearing anybody saying they wanted 
> >that.  People liked the bells and whistles.  Toon Town was the big party 
> >then -- they put on one-off events in big venues, for thousands of people 
> >like Cool World and Funky Tekno Tribe do now, only the vibe was more like 
> >a Friends & Family or a Harmony.  Toon Town went all out with stuff like 
> >virtual reality, bouncy castles, carnival rides, vendors, brain wave 
> >machines, etc.  I loved it, and others seemed to as well.  It was new, it 
> >was exciting, it was fun!
> 
> And on Mon. May 6, 1996, hey where am I? (Shawna!) shared:
> 
> I'm curious about something folks, not having been around long enough to
> have experienced the famed Toon Town parties.  Seems like every time I hear
> one of the old timers talk about the old days, they go on about the old Toon
> Town parties.  "Oh yeah, I've been raving since '91, like at Toon Town!"
> Everybody still talks about them, more than any other party I've ever heard
> about from back then.  From what everybody's been saying, this sounds like a
> total blast! Why is it no one does them any more?  What happened to them?  &
> what would it take to bring one back?  Is this a true physical impossibility
> or is it just that no one gets around to putting in the effort to do
> something like that any more?  Seems like you could really set up something
> spectacular at the Homebase warehouse or something.  

	All it would take is enough of us wanting it to happen, and a few 
promoters with the know-how to take the idea and run with it, with the 
help of lots of volunteers.
	I don't know where all the people you refer to who say they loved 
Toon Town have been hiding though, because lately what I seem to be 
hearing is that massives are lame, that underground is better; big is too 
commercial, and just lacks the vibe of a small, intimate event, it is 
said.  I would be encouraged to hear that I am not the only one who feels 
an ideal rave is a smorgasbord of sights, sounds, sensations, and people.
	Small parties are lots of fun, and a good part of the scene, but 
I'm sorry that massives have apparantly developed such a bad rep.
	How would we think of the sixties if the promoters of Woodstock 
had decided to hold a small, underground event for a few people?  Small 
parties may draw the community together, but big events hold the 
possibility of changing the world.  Think about that.
	I have yet to go to a Burning Man, but from everything I've seen 
and heard, it seems like a good model for a rave massive, and indeed many 
ravers are to be found there, in separate "rave" camps.  Big doesn't have 
to mean commercial, un-spiritual, overpriced (I won't comment here on 
Burning Man promoters charging $30 for an outdoor event), and bad vibe.
	I know that Rick Preston, formerly of Toon Town is still around.  
Mark Heley, another Toon Town promoter was involved with Club Life 
magazine recently... may be in L.A. now?  Anyone?  Diana Jacobs, I don't 
know.  They are the main three I remember... any historians to comment?
	As far as why they stopped, that's probably hard to trace 
reliably at this point.  I think it was bickering among people involved, 
and some people doing independent conflicting events, but don't quote me 
on that.
	Not that we need to bring back the name, or the promoters, to have 
an event with a vibe like Toon Town.  In fact, so much of what made it 
special was the newness that you couldn't recreate the vibe by trying to 
reproduce what was there.  We have to start fresh, with new ideas.
	Personally, I was inspired by some of the things Rick Riffle 
mentioned in his post about the Rennaissance Faire at Reed College, like 
the 200 foot long naked slippery-slide...  
	What do the rest of you think?

PLURally yours,
				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 08:42:19 1996
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	id AA831484127; Tue, 07 May 96 08:47:30 PST
Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 09:47:30 PDT
From: Diane_Tabellija@adoc.xerox.com
Message-Id: <9604078314.AA831484127@beluga.adoc.xerox.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: APB for Chin
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   Say, a few of you were speaking about meeting Chin at Wicked.  I think I 
   was freaking w/him and wanted to id the man.   So anyone out there who 
   can link me up w/his e-mail address, please do so.  Better yet, Chin, if 
   you get this msg, give me a shout.  (And yeah I know, folks, I'm gonna 
   check the bios too...but I'm impatient!)
   
   Pointing fingers and more,
   Diane ;)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 08:51:59 1996
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        I can sometimes give rides to anyone who can use a meeting point in
the Santa Clara/Sunnyvale/Campbell/Saratoga areas.  We should pick
well-known locations.
        Anyone who is to provide transportation should post their
availability and number of passengers they can pick up in advance of a
given party, so no one is left high and dry.  I mentioned to someone that I
can take one passenger and a bunch of stuff (I drive a half-ton pickup),
but anyone who rides with Eric P. has to agree on my payment terms: hugs,
payable on demand :)
        Who all can volunteer as a semi-regular driver?  I think everyone
will agree that setting up rides will add to our scene, in a small way
strengthening and unifying us...okay, so maybe it ain't as noble as all
that, but a nice idea, eh?

Peace & petrol,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 08:54:03 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 08:53:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Jungle anyone?
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	Seriously now...what's WRONG with you guys...Why hasn't jungle
taken off in SF the way it should....don't you guys know how amazingly
ultra-hip this stuff is.  OK so it's not trance but it's got a whole wacky
vibe of its own.....and I love it...

	Can't dance to jungle?  just close your eyes, listen to the bass
or the snare and do a modified version of your regular thang.  It
definitely took me a few tries but I'm hooked now...

	Not sure what jungle is?  Get Stareyes' mix tape - it really rocks
and it's a bargain at $7.00 including postage.

	AND THIS WEEKEND there are at least two major jungle events that I
know of:

	1.  Bass Instinct on Friday with local favorite DJ's (incl.
		Stareyes)
	2.  Goldie at some club on Friday.  This guy does what they call
	intelligent jungle (or dolphin jungle).  Almost ambient-like 
	overtones with a kicking classic drum and bass backbone.  I'm not
	sure what he's going to do here but the guy is probably the most
	famous mainstream jungle DJ in the UK and definitely worth
	checking out.


SO whadday say guys?  Ready to break out of the trance mold for one night
and give jungle a try..... It's a great antidote to the rave burn-out
blues.

	who's coming with me?

		** jess **


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 09:07:21 1996
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To: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Burnout phase (was weekend recap)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Burnout?  Me?  Never!  I wish I could attend MORE events!  The only thing
that keeps me from being more prominent in the scene is lack of funds :)
Actually, I purposely put some time in between parties sometimes, even if I
can afford to go to more.  Being selective helps, too; I don't go to a
party unless I know and like at least two djs in the lineup.  All this
helps me to enjoy the experiences more, and to stay healthy (a major
concern).
Amy, I hope you never burn out on love, because there's a lot directed at you!

Finally recovering from the weekend,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 09:38:26 1996
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Date: 07 May 96 12:35:46 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Burnout phase (was weekend recap)
Message-ID: <960507163546_71165.755_GHL74-4@CompuServe.COM>
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	Amy Starkey said....

	I've been going through this lately.   Seems like every 9 months or so - 
	 longer - I go through a real burn out phase.  I'm not excited 
	general.  I can't get into the music, so I listen to talk radio in the 
	car instead. (Don't worry, no Rush).  I always come around, though, and 
	so I am not worried.  

	Who else goes through this? I'm sure everyone does to a certain extent.

_________________________________________

One thing I've noticed as I've gotten older, and more experienced noticing how
my life moves in cycles, is that we need to respect those cycles.  

I had a "burnout awareness" weekend a few weeks ago, the weekend of the Sunset
boat party -- when I realized that I'd been doing things all weekend that should
have made me happy - but they didn't.  I felt really depressed and isolated.

So I stayed in the house mostly for the next 2 weeks, except for work, I stayed
to myself, read books, withdrew and hibernated for a while.... and then came
back into the real world again.  (I did call my friends and tell them I was ok,
that I was just making some private space for a while.)

And during that time, I made some important personal decisions -- which might
not have happened without the break from my usual dancing and social whirlwind.

I'm a studier of astrology and believe that planetary transits have huge effects
on how we feel and perceive what goes on around us ... and so I have a resource
to refer to to understand what's going on with me ... and believe me, I've gone
through lots of major changes over the last years....  

We are creatures who are affected by the cycles of the universe, and not
respecting those cycles can create a lot of confusion, and self-criticism.
Where I used to wonder "what's the matter with me," now I realize it's just a
human cycle of ups and downs.  

The hard part is knowing that, even if I don't feel like going out, THERE'S A
PARTY GOIN' ON!  I hate to miss anything good, and I always wish I could be
everywhere all the time, seeing my friends, soaking it all in.  But sometimes...
you just gotta stay home.

Leslie   : )

p.s.  Re DJs and burnout -- Sure it happens, and for those of us who follow
certain djs', we know when they're there and they're spinning, but their heart's
not in it.  Hey, we all have jobs to do, even when we wish we had the day or the
night off.  That's life!




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 09:45:51 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 09:43:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: w'end (the long version)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960507052753.00833f20@140.174.229.14>
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> 
> >whomever it was with the yellow pen...woman, you are an arTISTE! you can
> >draw on my arm ANYtime. i'm am but your humble canvas :> 
> that was the fabulous kirsten (aka kaycee) with the marker. the yellow
> crayola marker got passed around a lot.. it could have been anyone who did
> the fabulous artwork though.


That pen has been the greatest; it's seen 4 raves so far and is still 
going strong.  The artist was definitely NOT me.  I can't draw worth 
beans!!!  Jess on the other hand...

kaySEE

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:04:41 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Burnout phase (was weekend recap)
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>We are creatures who are affected by the cycles of the universe, and not
>respecting those cycles can create a lot of confusion, and self-criticism.
>Where I used to wonder "what's the matter with me," now I realize it's just a
>human cycle of ups and downs.
>
This is very true: ecological, biological, and stellar cycles have their
influence on us; hence, we are cyclic as well.  This may be more obvious in
females than in males, since they have biological rhythms and cycles that
men don't have, but we are all influenced internally by a great number of
internal and external forces.

The impulse is pure
Sometimes our circuits get shorted
By external interference

Signals get crossed
And the balance distorted
By internal incoherence

OK, so maybe that wasn't relevant, but it popped into my head, and I love
the song (quiz: who can name that tune?).

A rhythm master,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:06:32 1996
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On Tue, 7 May 1996, Starchild wrote:

> 	I have yet to go to a Burning Man, but from everything I've seen 
> and heard, it seems like a good model for a rave massive, and indeed many 
> ravers are to be found there, in separate "rave" camps.  Big doesn't have 
> to mean commercial, un-spiritual, overpriced (I won't comment here on 
> Burning Man promoters charging $30 for an outdoor event), and bad vibe.

	Too late, you already commented on it, so once again, let us 
reiterate why Burning Man costs anywhere from $25 to $40 depending on 
when you order tickets. First, Larry Harvey has to pay for an organized 
land usage permit from BLM, they have to pay for the portipotties cause 
your average folk don't know how to squat, let the shit dry and then pack 
it which each and everyone one of the people who attend would have to do 
to not harm the ecosystem when the playa becomes a lake again, then there 
is some type of insurance fee..... So, if you go and plan on not harming 
the natural ecosystem that has developed with our constant urge to move 
resources from one ecosystem to another, $30 is not expensive for 5 days, 
it's just going to pay for the necessities which we as city folk need.
	Now, to address you comment of burning man being a "massive". 
Well, here is what you might want to look at. Burning Man is this big 
festi where peoples are not suppose to be spectators; everyone is a 
participate which means YOU have to get over the 
I-paid-for-this-shit-event attitude because if one is thinking that, he 
or she is still working on the consumer level and not on a participatory 
level. That is why massives have gone down hill over time - that is why 
people complain and it is where "commericalism" works its way in. When 
the crowd is reduced to people paying a fee to attend this really cool 
production instead of some people coming out and paying to cover costs 
and maybe a little more, the attitude of 
I-am-not-getting-my-money's-worth worms its way in and somehow that ends 
up killing the whole party (at least from my perspective, your insights may 
vary). So things like Toon Town will not repeat themselves unless people 
start dropping their consumer attitudes, but this won't happen til the 
massives feel more like parties and less like massive productions put 
together to "give" people something for their money - but often they 
often end up charging for the important stuff like water (with which they 
didn't let you into their party). Anyway enough dribble... To scotland, 
bye bye

dave

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:14:22 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: SFR t-shirts
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Everybody:

Some of us have been kicking the idea around of creating some t-shirts for 
the folks on this list with the some kind of SFR design on it.  Our first 
idea was to put the SFR laminate design on it, but what I'd like to do is 
create a page with that design and any others that you folks come up with, 
and let you vote on which one you prefer via email.

To this end, I'd like to invite all the artists among us to whip out their 
favorite paint program and start letting the creative juices flow.  You can 
send me images in GIF or JPG format as email attachments.  Let's set a 
cut-off date, say the end of the month?  If that's not long enough, I'll 
always be glad to extend it -- this is very informal.  As I get images, I'll 
post them on a page and put the URL out on the list.

Cool?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:19:20 1996
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Hey, count your blessings, Jess.  I think jungle has taken off in SF more so
than in almost any other city in the US.  Sure I guess there aren't any big
name jungle dj's from SF, but it's still a very rare occasion in any US city
to
see all-jungle parties on an even semi-regular basis.  Jungle is still UK fare.

I think jungle underwent a renaissance about a year ago, but in my extremely
valuable opinion, it's all starting to sound the same again.  I don't
completely understand it, because there's so much more that can be done with
it, but it's almost like there's a stylistic mandate that all jungle must have
those same spacey chords, those same rude synth stabs, the same whitey pop
divas.  Certainly there are plenty of exceptions, but the upside is that I
think the best jungle is yet to come.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:20:38 1996
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Date: 07 May 96 10:12:05 -0800
From: Michael <Michael.Minnich@bankamerica.com>
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Subject: ride hookups
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Something that we used to do on ne-raves back in the day was called the
Hook-Up-O-Matic.  One person (Jetta) used to compile this weekly, and
basically, as Friday approached, anyone who could offer a ride to a party or
who was looking for a ride to a party would email her with the details.  At
the
end of the week, the result was a big long list that looked something like
this:

-------
OFFERING RIDES
-------
SoooperRave:
-John Doe (jdoe@dough.com) 212-xxx-xxxx, has space for 2-3 people from
downtown
area

Club Rub-A-Dub:
-Casper Dodd (crack@space.net) 617-xxx-xxxx, has room for 1 person, wants to
leave early around 9

-----
NEEDING RIDES
-----
Jim Jones (jj@temple.org) 212-xxx-xxxx, wants ride to rub-a-dub, will pay for
gas, tolls, dinner, breakfast

------

You get the idea...  This might work better than some sort of permanent
meeting
spot, because people's availability and schedules change on a weekly basis
anyway.  The only problem is, it requires some responsible person with time on
their hands to compile and maintain it.  I'd offer, but I'm none of those
things.

inhuman@east.coast.flava



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:21:59 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 10:21:58 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: w'end (the long version)
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>wooo! twister!! jess and i taught renaud how to play twister! the group that
>brought the twister mat unfortunately forgot to bring the spinner (their
>backpack was _packed_) so jess made up some cards and we pulled cards
>instead of spinning. i lost everytime i played. i think paul won all the
>time. grrrrr..

you've gotta explain to me how you *lose* at twister, esPEcially in THAT
kind of a setting.... tee hee :>

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:23:32 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 10:23:25 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: w'end (the long version)
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>> >whomever it was with the yellow pen...woman, you are an arTISTE! you can
>> >draw on my arm ANYtime. i'm am but your humble canvas :> 
>> that was the fabulous kirsten (aka kaycee) with the marker. the yellow
>> crayola marker got passed around a lot.. it could have been anyone who did
>> the fabulous artwork though.
>
>
>That pen has been the greatest; it's seen 4 raves so far and is still 
>going strong.  The artist was definitely NOT me.  I can't draw worth 
>beans!!!  Jess on the other hand...
>
>kaySEE

!!jess! was it you? i got a gorgeous swirling pattern down my arm with a
long line of dots next to it.....very celtic i thought.

melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:26:08 1996
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From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Lets change the subject to RavePool
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140b24adb4bda78904@[146.225.72.168]>
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Before I go out, I will gladly post if I have spaces left in my car.  I 
am all for ride sharing, and am an advocate of public transpo.  However, 
one giant problem with automobiles, and IMO the reason we can't get 
people out of their cars is independence.  When you go to a rave you are 
at the mercy of the driver.  If everyone is on the same wavelength, then 
it works, but if someone wants to go home at a different time, then it 
sucks for everyone involved.  This happened to me at FnF in October.  I 
had to go home with my ride at ~5 am, missing the last 1 1/2 to 2 hours 
of the party, which were amazing from what I heard later on!

If I have room in my car and am driving, I will gladly give folks from 
North Oakland/Berkeley area a ride!

kaysee

kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu
.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*

"Talk is cheap..."


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:41:16 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Wicked!
Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 10:41:31 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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With such a rich scene this weekend, it was really hard to turn down
such cool events as the BBQ and Beautiful People, due to previous
engagements I had scheduled. However, I did make it to Wicked for my
four month anniversary with my girlfriend and guardian angel, Jamie.

My roommies and I threw a housewarming earlier that evening, and that
party really hit it off. Our intention was to shuttle as many partiers
as possible to Wicked to continue the festivities, and we had a really
hard time getting everyone out the door! Once we congregated in front
of the King St. Garage, everyone was excited to enter, especially
several virgin ravers who were with us. As we waited, Marty comes
driving up from the BBQ to share a preliminary hug before changing and
returning.

Needless to say, the sound crew didn't disappoint. Markie, Garth and
Jeno laid down an especially happenin' beat, and we were all getting
off! Later on in the evening, after 4am (was it Thomas spinning
then?), some sick beats were being laid down, providing a challenge to
everyone dancing.

It was cool meeting SDream among others, and hope to meet many more of
you at Spundae Memorial Day weekend, if not earlier. If only my
weekends weren't so packed with things to do already...

P&L,
-G-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:54:35 1996
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Date: 7 May 1996 10:41:50 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Jungle anyone?
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, "jess" <jess@quickmail.apple.com>
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         Reply to:   RE>Jungle anyone?

Hey Jess.

Nothing is wrong with jungle!!  I love jungle, but I must admit I dont like to
dance to it.  Its not that I cant dance to it, I just prefer grooving to
deeeeeeep house.  I'd rather smoke a bowl, lay down, slap on a pair of
headphones and close my eyes when I listen to jungle. 

Would love to see Goldie this weekend but Friday I'm going to 1015 to check
out Deep Dish and Saturday I'm going to Sacramento to see Flock of Seaguls and
Missing Persons.  Aaah!  80's flashback.  Should be funny.

-M

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/7/96 8:57 AM
To: Mark Camp*
From: jess

	Seriously now...what's WRONG with you guys...Why hasn't jungle
taken off in SF the way it should....don't you guys know how amazingly
ultra-hip this stuff is.  OK so it's not trance but it's got a whole wacky
vibe of its own.....and I love it...

	Can't dance to jungle?  just close your eyes, listen to the bass
or the snare and do a modified version of your regular thang.  It
definitely took me a few tries but I'm hooked now...

	Not sure what jungle is?  Get Stareyes' mix tape - it really rocks
and it's a bargain at $7.00 including postage.

	AND THIS WEEKEND there are at least two major jungle events that I
know of:

	1.  Bass Instinct on Friday with local favorite DJ's (incl.
		Stareyes)
	2.  Goldie at some club on Friday.  This guy does what they call
	intelligent jungle (or dolphin jungle).  Almost ambient-like 
	overtones with a kicking classic drum and bass backbone.  I'm not
	sure what he's going to do here but the guy is probably the most
	famous mainstream jungle DJ in the UK and definitely worth
	checking out.


SO whadday say guys?  Ready to break out of the trance mold for one night
and give jungle a try..... It's a great antidote to the rave burn-out
blues.

	who's coming with me?

		** jess **


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Subject: Jungle anyone?
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 10:58:20 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Lets change the subject to RavePool
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>When you go to a rave you are at the mercy of the driver.  If everyone is
>on the same wavelength, >then it works, but if someone wants to go home at
>a different time, then it sucks for everyone >involved.
>kaysee
>
Good point!  So when someone volunteers a ride, that person needs to make
clear what time he/she wants to leave (I always stay till the end of a
party, for example), as well as what time he/she wants to arrive (I always
try to arrive as close to the start of a party as possible, for example).
That way, no one is stuck in a remote location without a ride (which almost
happened to me in Vallejo, at whatever party was there several months ago,
and was scary till I found other friends than those who had brought me up
to drive me back down).  Then also, those ride-seekers will know who is
staying for how long at a given event, and can choose a ride appropriate to
their needs.

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 11:00:09 1996
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From: swoosh@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (John Elias Darrow)
Message-Id: <9605071756.AA00644@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
Subject: Re: MacDonald's Commercial
To: mhg@cats.ucsc.edu (-=]madame mercury[=-)
Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 10:55:59 -0700 (MDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605061250.A27524-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU> from "-=]madame mercury[=-" at May 6, 96 12:48:58 pm
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> 
> Yes I have and thought it quite odd.  I didn't know what to think of it.  
> I can't wait for it to continue so we get to see what the hell is going 
> on with this.
> 
unfortunately, not so much.  I read in the paper that the growing up is just 
introducing a new sandwich with lettuce and tomatoes and dijon mustard,
to please adult's taste in lunch as well as kids.  I think this commercial
just reflects an attempt to reach a certain commercial market that is
getting more and more attention in the mainstream lately.  nothing more.
> 
> On Mon, 6 May 1996, Reagan Reid wrote:
> 
> > 
> > 
> >              I thought  he was dancing in a nightclub!?
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On Sun, 5 May 1996, Freak Zone wrote:
> > 
> > > Has anybody seen the MacDonnald's commercial with Ronald dancing at a rave?
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > -Sean
> > > 
> > > _____________________________________
> > > F R E A K   Z O N E !
> > > "House music all night long..."
> > > (415) 227-7421
> > > _____________________________________
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> 
> 
>       ___                ___           ___     
>      /\__\              /\__\         /\  \    
>     /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
>    /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
>   /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
>  /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
>  \/__/~~/:/  /      \/__\:\/:/  / \:\  /\ \/__/
>        /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
>       /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
>      /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
>      \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>     
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 11:11:11 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 11:10:57 -0700
From: tony@xinet.COM (Tony Rotundo)
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References: <Pine.SOL.3.91.960507043136.20062A-100000@orion>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 11:10:50 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.com>
Subject: Re: outdoor prices

He hit it on the head.  You gotta go to understand, and even then go with
the intention of getting out of it what you put into it.

Did you know they spend upwards of a WEEK picking up everyone's garbage off
the playa?!  I heard that they might offer partial or full refunds if
people stay Monday (or longer) to help clean-up.

There are a multitude of other expenses that Dave didn't mention, the least
of which is a 40' tall wooden and neon "man-like" structure (you've
probably seen the pictures) that everyone dances around as it burns on
Sunday night.  The energy surrounding that one event, in the midst of so
much going on that weekend, is worth the $25 alone.

As for it being a rave massive, I don't think there were over maybe (guess
here) 500 ravers collected at any one time at any one set-up.

It's a "social massive," but breaks traditional social paradigms.  In fact,
it puts them on their ear.  :^)

Tone



At 10:06 AM  -0700 5/7/96, 'Dave Bayer' wrote:
>On Tue, 7 May 1996, Starchild wrote:
>
>> 	I have yet to go to a Burning Man, but from everything I've seen
>> and heard, it seems like a good model for a rave massive, and indeed many
>> ravers are to be found there, in separate "rave" camps.  Big doesn't have
>> to mean commercial, un-spiritual, overpriced (I won't comment here on
>> Burning Man promoters charging $30 for an outdoor event), and bad vibe.
>
>	Too late, you already commented on it, so once again, let us
>reiterate why Burning Man costs anywhere from $25 to $40 depending on
>when you order tickets. First, Larry Harvey has to pay for an organized
>land usage permit from BLM, they have to pay for the portipotties cause
>your average folk don't know how to squat, let the shit dry and then pack
>it which each and everyone one of the people who attend would have to do
>to not harm the ecosystem when the playa becomes a lake again, then there
>is some type of insurance fee..... So, if you go and plan on not harming
>the natural ecosystem that has developed with our constant urge to move
>resources from one ecosystem to another, $30 is not expensive for 5 days,
>it's just going to pay for the necessities which we as city folk need.
>	Now, to address you comment of burning man being a "massive".
>Well, here is what you might want to look at. Burning Man is this big
>festi where peoples are not suppose to be spectators; everyone is a
>participate which means YOU have to get over the
>I-paid-for-this-shit-event attitude because if one is thinking that, he
>or she is still working on the consumer level and not on a participatory
>level. That is why massives have gone down hill over time - that is why
>people complain and it is where "commericalism" works its way in. When
>the crowd is reduced to people paying a fee to attend this really cool
>production instead of some people coming out and paying to cover costs
>and maybe a little more, the attitude of
>I-am-not-getting-my-money's-worth worms its way in and somehow that ends
>up killing the whole party (at least from my perspective, your insights may
>vary). So things like Toon Town will not repeat themselves unless people
>start dropping their consumer attitudes, but this won't happen til the
>massives feel more like parties and less like massive productions put
>together to "give" people something for their money - but often they
>often end up charging for the important stuff like water (with which they
>didn't let you into their party). Anyway enough dribble... To scotland,
>bye bye
>
>dave




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 11:33:33 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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>You GOT to check this out, crazy...
>
>
>>From: Emily Robbins <erobbins@borland.com>
>>Subject: Yikes !-FWD
>>
>>Oh my God.  You'll have to hear it for yourself.
>>
>>Em
>>
>>>  Want a laugh? Call the following number: (704) 377-4444. When the
>>>recording  comes on, hit extension 1955. Then listen. The voice you'll
>>>hear belongs to a  guy who reads the school lunch menu for kids in
>>>Charlotte, North Carolina, and  he is EXCITED!!
>>>
The man is ON FIRE!  Hahaha!!!  He's having entirely too good a time ;)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 11:36:35 1996
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From: dhchung@us.oracle.com (Derek Chung)
Message-Id: <199605071836.LAA02225@slamdance.us.oracle.com>
Subject: Re: ride hookups
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (SFRaves)
Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 11:36:39 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <05079610153801260000.bankamerica.com> from "Michael" at May 7, 96 10:12:05 am
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I think I can set up a no-frills version of this on the SFRaves web site.
It would just be a short form with a date, name/contact info, and space
for a brief description of what ride is needed/offered.  Another page
would have all of the postings for all upcoming dates.

Do most SFRavers have some sort of web access now?  If not, do most people
at least know someone who does, who can post and get info from this page?

Um, I don't want everyone on the list sending me mail telling me they do or
don't have web access, so maybe just send me mail if you don't have
web access and you'd want to use this ride thing.

-Derek


Michael wrote...
>
>
>Something that we used to do on ne-raves back in the day was called the
>Hook-Up-O-Matic.  One person (Jetta) used to compile this weekly, and
>basically, as Friday approached, anyone who could offer a ride to a party or
>who was looking for a ride to a party would email her with the details.  At
>the
>end of the week, the result was a big long list that looked something like
>this:
>
>-------
>OFFERING RIDES
>-------
>SoooperRave:
>-John Doe (jdoe@dough.com) 212-xxx-xxxx, has space for 2-3 people from
>downtown
>area
>
>Club Rub-A-Dub:
>-Casper Dodd (crack@space.net) 617-xxx-xxxx, has room for 1 person, wants to
>leave early around 9
>
>-----
>NEEDING RIDES
>-----
>Jim Jones (jj@temple.org) 212-xxx-xxxx, wants ride to rub-a-dub, will pay for
>gas, tolls, dinner, breakfast
>
>------
>
>You get the idea...  This might work better than some sort of permanent
>meeting
>spot, because people's availability and schedules change on a weekly basis
>anyway.  The only problem is, it requires some responsible person with time on
>their hands to compile and maintain it.  I'd offer, but I'm none of those
>things.
>
>inhuman@east.coast.flava
>
>
>

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 o derek chung  o  oracle graphics  o  dhchung@us.oracle.com  o 415.506.6195 o
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 11:48:00 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 11:47:31 -0700 (PDT)
To: Michael <Michael.Minnich@bankamerica.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: ride hookups
In-Reply-To: <05079610153801260000.bankamerica.com>
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On 7 May 1996, Michael wrote:

> 
> Something that we used to do on ne-raves back in the day was called the
> Hook-Up-O-Matic.  One person (Jetta) used to compile this weekly, and
> basically, as Friday approached, anyone who could offer a ride to a party or
> who was looking for a ride to a party would email her with the details.  At
> the
> end of the week, the result was a big long list that looked something like
> this:
> 
> -------
> OFFERING RIDES
> -------
> SoooperRave:
> -John Doe (jdoe@dough.com) 212-xxx-xxxx, has space for 2-3 people from
> downtown
> area
> 
> Club Rub-A-Dub:
> -Casper Dodd (crack@space.net) 617-xxx-xxxx, has room for 1 person, wants to
> leave early around 9
> 
> -----
> NEEDING RIDES
> -----
> Jim Jones (jj@temple.org) 212-xxx-xxxx, wants ride to rub-a-dub, will pay for
> gas, tolls, dinner, breakfast
> 
> ------
> 
> You get the idea...  This might work better than some sort of permanent
> meeting
> spot, because people's availability and schedules change on a weekly basis
> anyway.  The only problem is, it requires some responsible person with time on
> their hands to compile and maintain it.  I'd offer, but I'm none of those
> things.
> 
> inhuman@east.coast.flava

Hmm... I could write a cgi script that would allow people to enter and 
retreive info via a web page. Any interest in this?

                                              Black Adder 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 11:57:13 1996
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Date: 7 May 1996 11:50:59 -0800
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Not rave related but in
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>, "Jon Zimmerman" <bigz@bigz.com>
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         Reply to:   RE>>Not rave related but interesting

FYI - Tuesday is "Take A Bath Day", according to the Lunch Menu Man.

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/7/96 11:44 AM
To: Mark Camp*
From: Eric P. Peterson
>You GOT to check this out, crazy...
>
>
>>From: Emily Robbins <erobbins@borland.com>
>>Subject: Yikes !-FWD
>>
>>Oh my God.  You'll have to hear it for yourself.
>>
>>Em
>>
>>>  Want a laugh? Call the following number: (704) 377-4444. When the
>>>recording  comes on, hit extension 1955. Then listen. The voice you'll
>>>hear belongs to a  guy who reads the school lunch menu for kids in
>>>Charlotte, North Carolina, and  he is EXCITED!!
>>>
The man is ON FIRE!  Hahaha!!!  He's having entirely too good a time ;)



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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 11:59:40 1996
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Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 11:59:07 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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Hey kids, Sat. May 11 the River is celebrating Gaia.  We're cleaning, 
clearing and purifying Juaquin Miller park in Oakland.  The music will 
go on around 3pm and ritual will start around 5:30.  Dance & celebration 
until dark.  Call 510-986-9150 for directions and info.
Peace(<:love, Michi   P.S.  Ann & Gregg are graduating this month from 
UCB (YES!!) so look to the new moon this month for a ripping flipping 
trypping good time...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 12:11:12 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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If anyone has any Mac sound files with samples of any kind of "rave music,"
I'd love to get copies!  Please let me know.

Mac Daddy (ouch!),

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 12:49:42 1996
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Don't forget that we'll need some large garbage bags, too, just in case the
trash containers won't hold our refuse!

Environmentally friendly,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 12:50:17 1996
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From: "'Dave Bayer'" <dlb@typhoon-ether.Berkeley.EDU>
X-Sender: dlb@volcano.berkeley.edu
To: Michael Douglas Lick <mlick@ix.netcom.com>
cc: "\\SFRaves\\" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
In-Reply-To: <199605071916.MAA21105@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
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Ok, I just sent you the reg info. Send it in by June 1st and its a bit 
cheaper. So far, it looking like my bus will be full as we are bringing 
up a sound system (as is just about every other person I have talked to 
that is going), but I can give this advice...

	you are going to a barren desert. There is nothing there, no 
water, no food, no shade, no emergency medical services... So, bring 
shade, bring shade that you can stake down (go get some 12" rebar lengths 
and as many 1 liter soda bottles to put over them, rebar pounded into the 
playa is the only thing that works as stakes). It will be hot during the 
day! Bring 1 gallon of water per person per day just to be safe; 
dehydration will be the quickiest killer of your weekend... Bring 
extra water for cooking and cleaning and general washing of dust off things 
that you don't want dust on though if you don't mind dust you will be 
better off... Learn first aid if you are clumsy (hell, learn first aid 
anyway to help out other people who are clumsy or become clumsy). 
Basicly, you are going to a place where everyone has to take care of 
themselves, and no one will tell you how best to do that (well, maybe 
Earthbound Medical people will, but they are pretty cool about things and 
do offer something like EMS out there, only thing you have to walk 1 mile 
to main camp and then find them first unless I learn enough to set up 
some type of med station in rave camp this year). Some people bring the 
city with them, others come up to find out/remember what living without 
our constructs/conviences is like.

	The only thing out there is what you and other people bring... 
Make sure to take it all back as well....

dave

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 13:00:29 1996
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To: "'Dave Bayer'" <dlb@typhoon-ether.Berkeley.EDU>
cc: Michael Douglas Lick <mlick@ix.netcom.com>,
        "\\SFRaves\\" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
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On Tue, 7 May 1996, 'Dave Bayer' wrote:

> Basicly, you are going to a place where everyone has to take care of 
> themselves, and no one will tell you how best to do that (well, maybe 
> Earthbound Medical people will, but they are pretty cool about things and 
> do offer something like EMS out there, only thing you have to walk 1 mile 
> to main camp and then find them first unless I learn enough to set up 
> some type of med station in rave camp this year). Some people bring the 
> city with them, others come up to find out/remember what living without 
> our constructs/conviences is like.
> 

I would add one more thing: Don't drive like you are on the freeway. 
 
                                                  Black Adder
                                             

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 13:09:29 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 13:08:32 -0800
To: Michael Douglas Lick <mlick@ix.netcom.com>
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
Cc: "\\SFRaves\\" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Also...

All of a sudden some of those little things that ravers bring for fun to
parties take on a significant role.  For example.  Because there are very
few land marks to guide you (driving in vectors is rad, albeit dangerous
around the camp), you need a beacon of some sort to identify your camp.
Glow sticks work well for this purpose.   I am not kidding when I say that
a lot of people get lost looking for their camp, and have to wait until the
morning to find it.  No joke, it happend to me for three hours one night.
Even with a beacon!  ;^)  Glow sticks (or a flash light) are also a good
idea when walking anywhere away from the camps.  Yes, it's trippy when the
helicopter have to airlift people out, but it ain't worth the show.  At
least one person got hit by a car near the rave camp last year.

I'm sure as the time comes more and more info will be shared.  Sorry if I
got carried away, as I tell my friends, Burning Man is the only thing in
this world that makes me feel like a kid on Christmas Eve when I think
about it.  (Except maybe for a Friends and Family party.  ;^)

Peace y'all!

Tone

At 12:49 PM  -0700 5/7/96, 'Dave Bayer' wrote:
>Ok, I just sent you the reg info. Send it in by June 1st and its a bit
>cheaper. So far, it looking like my bus will be full as we are bringing
>up a sound system (as is just about every other person I have talked to
>that is going), but I can give this advice...
>
>	you are going to a barren desert. There is nothing there, no
>water, no food, no shade, no emergency medical services... So, bring
>shade, bring shade that you can stake down (go get some 12" rebar lengths
>and as many 1 liter soda bottles to put over them, rebar pounded into the
>playa is the only thing that works as stakes). It will be hot during the
>day! Bring 1 gallon of water per person per day just to be safe;
>dehydration will be the quickiest killer of your weekend... Bring
>extra water for cooking and cleaning and general washing of dust off things
>that you don't want dust on though if you don't mind dust you will be
>better off... Learn first aid if you are clumsy (hell, learn first aid
>anyway to help out other people who are clumsy or become clumsy).
>Basicly, you are going to a place where everyone has to take care of
>themselves, and no one will tell you how best to do that (well, maybe
>Earthbound Medical people will, but they are pretty cool about things and
>do offer something like EMS out there, only thing you have to walk 1 mile
>to main camp and then find them first unless I learn enough to set up
>some type of med station in rave camp this year). Some people bring the
>city with them, others come up to find out/remember what living without
>our constructs/conviences is like.
>
>	The only thing out there is what you and other people bring...
>Make sure to take it all back as well....
>
>dave




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 13:10:33 1996
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From: Marc Pfister <mjpfister@ucdavis.edu>
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To: Michael <Michael.Minnich@bankamerica.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
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On 7 May 1996, Michael wrote:

> 
> Hey, count your blessings, Jess.  I think jungle has taken off in SF more so
> than in almost any other city in the US.  Sure I guess there aren't any big
> name jungle dj's from SF, but it's still a very rare occasion in any US city
> to
> see all-jungle parties on an even semi-regular basis.  Jungle is still UK fare.

Actually, considering how big San Francisco is as a techno/house city, it 
has a small jungle scene. Of course, the west coast has been very slow to 
adopt drum n' bass, both up here and in LA, but cities like Baltimore and 
Philadelphia have larger jungle parties, flying in DJs and MCs from 
England. Boston and New York have had jungle scenes from the beginning of 
hardcore breakbeat.
I'm not trying to say that SF has a weak scene, its just still at its 
infancy. Through the hard work of the jungle djs to get their sound out 
it definately has been growing.

> 
> I think jungle underwent a renaissance about a year ago, but in my extremely
> valuable opinion, it's all starting to sound the same again.  I don't
> completely understand it, because there's so much more that can be done with
> it, but it's almost like there's a stylistic mandate that all jungle must have
> those same spacey chords, those same rude synth stabs, the same whitey pop
> divas.  Certainly there are plenty of exceptions, but the upside is that I
> think the best jungle is yet to come.

It's coming, believe me.... some of it is here already. The "intelligent 
style", with all the ambient synth washs is two styles old already. After 
intelligent the big thing was/still is 'jump up', a ruff, minimalist 
style that seems to borrow a lot from hip hop, especially vocal samples. 
Wu Tang Clan seems to be the most popular for some reason, but even the 
new Busta Rhymes 12" has a jungle remix on it. Now the newest style to 
emerge, dubbed 'tech-step', its very dark and minimal and a bit more synthey.
Jungle is also branching out - check the 4hero remixes of DJ Krush's 
Meiso for a hiphop/drumnbass hybrid or the Fila Brazillia remix of Lamb's 
Cotton wool for drum 'n bass at a(comparatively) slow 135 bpm.

This is a good weekend for drum 'n bass in SF, with both the Metaheadz 
vs. FTT and the BASS cru's Bass Instinct party. I would bet that knowing 
that Goldie doesn't like house music, as soon as he finishes up at the 
FTT party he'll head over to Bass Instinct, so don't miss out on the 
smaller party just because they don't have the big names.... 

vibin'
hannibal selecta

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 13:17:04 1996
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From: "'Dave Bayer'" <dlb@typhoon-ether.Berkeley.EDU>
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Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
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Ok, for those of you who wish to register and don't have the form, just 
print this out (or write it the part that follows the:
*************************************************

BURNING MAN 1996 ADVANCE REGISTRATION/ORDER FORM
<Copy and distribute freely>

on a piece of paper and send it to the address specified...  so here it is:

Whats follows is another advance release from the Spring 96 "Building Burning
Man" newsletter. '96 Registration form included at end'o'file; get a $10
discount if you send it in before June 1st!

*************************************************

SURVIVAL

Visitors to the playa should not come as spectators to a show. Instead, they
will encounter an interactive experience; a spontaneous outpouring of energy
that is created by our community itself. Burning Man is a phenomenon which
springs from your immediate involvement. We are not funded by grants or
product endorsements. We depend upon direct contributions. Hundreds of people
are now engaged in creating this year's event. Here is how you can help:

CONTRIBUTE
Send in your registration fee today!  By purchasing your ticket now for $25
you can save $10. Beginning in June tickets to the event will cost $35. 
Buy a
t-shirt or a video. If you can, make an extra contribution (see the check box
on order form). Many new projects- Mudhenge, the Inferno, a new public
transit project, and an elaborated Man-are being readied for 1996. None of
this will happen without your early support. If you are among those people
who already know they are coming to Burning Man, help us now. 

VOLUNTEER
There is only one way to become a member of the Project.  You must do
something. Burning Man is a society of activists. Later this year we will
solicit volunteers to help us run the infrastructure of our camp. We are now
recruiting experienced builders, people to do data entry and distribute
flyers, help with clerical tasks, and individuals who can assist with
transport of materials to Nevada throughout the year. If you have any skill
or resource which you think might help us in our preparations, please call
our Hotline.        

ARTISTS
In addition to the "Inferno," Burning Man is planning many new art
initiatives in 1996.  Our burning pageant in the desert on Sunday, September
1, will feature large-scale portable effigies that can be raised overhead.
 Puppeteers, model makers, stilt walkers, fire performers, etc.-please
contact us.  We also need folks to assist us in casting a large number of
plaster brains (yes, brains ) that will be featured at our premier show on
March 23 at the Minna Street Gallery in San Francisco.      

MUDHENGE
In 1995 our camp was inundated by a rainstorm and mudpeople sprang from the
playa (you know who you are). In 1996 we will construct a temple and public
shower in which to house these rites. We invite all persons of mud to
worship, wallow, and bathe between the legs of "Water Woman" (Showers are
restricted to initiates. You must first get down in the mud). If you would
like to help construct and tend the temple, or wish to organize and schedule
an event here (i.e. mud wrestling, a mud procession, etc.) please contact our
Hotline.

PUBLIC TRANSIT
The playa of the Black Rock Desert is a fundamentally safe environment.
 Apart from the very real, dire, and life-threatening hazard of becoming lost
[please read the Survival Guide that is mailed to all registered
participants] the playa is as flat and as forgiving as the mattress of a
playpen. The greatest hazard that we face is self-created. Nearly every one
of the few serious accidents and injuries that we have witnessed during
Burning Man has involved automobiles. This year we encourage everyone to
bring bicycles. They are perfectly adapted to the hard-packed surface of the
playa.  We plan also to organize a pool of specially marked bicycles for
public use. If you can help us with this effort please call our Hotline.

FILM FEST
We are now accepting entries for the 2nd Annual Burning Man Film and Video
Festival. The deadline for submissions is July 4th. Please contact Coffee
Achievers at 415.826-3277. Ask for Hernan. 

SETTLEMENT
This year, the city of Black Rock will sport a newly renovated downtown area
and a number of exurban hubs, or "meta-theme camps." If you want to create
your own city within a city, call the Hotline. 
 
*************************************************

1996 REGISTRATION/ORDER FORM

Burning Man Festival
Wednesday, August 28 through Monday, September 2, 1996

The annual celebration of BURNING MAN will take place over Labor Day weekend
in the Black Rock Desert of Northern Nevada. All attendees need to register
for the event, and must bring their own shelter, food and water. 

This form can be used to register and/or order Burning Man merchandise. Feel
free to make copies. If you are purchasing tickets you will receive your
registration packet (including 1996 map, survival guide, and schedule of
events) approximately one month before the festival.

Tickets: Purchase advance tickets now for Burning Man, August 28 - September
2, 1996.  We will mail you a ticket, your survival guide, map, and a detailed
schedule of events approximately one month before the event. Order now and
save! After June 1st, the price goes up to $35 per person.

Burning Man Video: Only the finest photons, hand-selected and lovingly
preserved on durable magnetic tape for your viewing pleasure. Relive past
glories or see what you missed in this 48-minute documentary by WeirdTV's
Chuck Cirino. A substantial portion of the proceeds benefit Burning Man.
 $19.95

T-shirts: Buy a Burning Man t-shirt, lovingly crafted from 100% cloth for
cool desert comfort. Screen printed on black in sizes L and XL. Always
fashionable; makes a great gift! Proceeds benefit the Burning Man Project.
 $15.00 


*************************************************

BURNING MAN 1996 ADVANCE REGISTRATION/ORDER FORM
<Copy and distribute freely>


Name: __________________________________ Phone: (______)_______________

Address: ____________________________________________________________

City: _____________________________ State: _______ Zip: _______________


-Registration tickets 
 number in party: ________  x $35.00* = $______

  *For a limited time only, you can register for Burning Man 96 for just $25
per person. This special advance price is valid ONLY through June 1, 1996.
 Orders postmarked after June 1, 1996 must register at the $35.00 rate.


-Burning man videos
 QTY: ________  x $19.95 = $______


-Burning man t-shirts 
  QTY: ____ LARGE ____ EXTRA LARGE ____
 total shirts - QTY: ________  x $15.00 = $______


-Optional extra contribution  = $______


-Total amount enclosed:     = $______

Please make checks payable to BURNING MAN. 
Mail this form with payment to:

The Burning Man Project
P.O. Box 420572
San Francisco, CA  94142-0572

Burning Man is a 100% participant-funded event, entirely dependent on your
support. Thanks!!

###          


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 13:22:23 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 13:22:02 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: satur.DAYritual/party
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Hey kids, Sat. May 11 the River is celebrating Gaia.  We're cleaning, 
>clearing and purifying Juaquin Miller park in Oakland.  The music will 
>go on around 3pm and ritual will start around 5:30.  Dance & celebration 
>until dark.  Call 510-986-9150 for directions and info.
>Peace(<:love, Michi   

hey amebas

d'you want us to bring supplies for clean-up, or will everything become
clear on the info line?

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 13:24:39 1996
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Date: Tue, 07 May 96 13:18:56 PST
Message-Id: <9604078315.AA831500699@ccmail.rsco.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re[2]: MacDonald's Commercial
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     If you must know, here's the beef on the McD comerical:
     McDonalds is introducing a new burger this week, the "Arch Duluxe", a 
     "luxry burger" priced high, better quality ingredients etc ($3.99 w 
     fried & coke) aimed at adults who wouldn't normally go to McDonalds.  
     Its a $100 million advertising and marketing campaign. You will see 
     Ronald taking up "adult" pastimes such as dancing at a club, playing 
     golf, and shooting pool. He will also change clothes eventually also. 
     
     And NO i do NOT work for McDonalds or an ad agency. 
     
     And BTW can we stop the blathering regarding half-baked and ilinformed 
     economic theory please.


______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: MacDonald's Commercial
Author:  Crusty old raver <wayne@club.net> at INTERNET
Date:    5/7/96 1:01 PM


At 7:24 AM 5/6/96, John Bagby wrote:
>Ugh!  Yes, I saw it yesterday... part of "the Ronald grows up" ad 
>campaign.  Never mind the fact that as one of the largest beef-industry 
>powerhouses, McDonalds is responsible for the clearcutting of forests for 
>cattle-grazing land, or the destruction of sustainable agriculture in this 
>and other countries.. etc, etc.   Monoculture embracing the "rave vibe" 
>stinks of a "Reality Bites"-like cynicism, IMHO.
     
blah blah blah. I am *so* tired of political correctness...
     
I don't go to MacDonalds because of PC inspired idealism. I don't go 
because I don't like the quality of their products.
     
Can we just talk about music and dancing?
     
Signed,
     
One step closer to unsubscribing.
     
     


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 13:34:44 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 13:34:13 -0700
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From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Vote on Logo
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Ok, since I *immediately* got a response, I *immediately* set up a page for 
the proposed t-shirts logos.  Please check out:

        www.tgrigsby.com/sfraves/index.html

It's only got one image on it...  so far...

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 14:14:31 1996
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Date: 07 May 96 14:09:22 -0800
From: Michael <Michael.Minnich@bankamerica.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
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> Actually, considering how big San Francisco is as a techno/house city, it
> has a small jungle scene. Of course, the west coast has been very slow to
> adopt drum n' bass, both up here and in LA, but cities like Baltimore and
> Philadelphia have larger jungle parties, flying in DJs and MCs from
> England. Boston and New York have had jungle scenes from the beginning of
> hardcore breakbeat.
> I'm not trying to say that SF has a weak scene, its just still at its
> infancy. Through the hard work of the jungle djs to get their sound out
> it definately has been growing.

I still disagree that NY, Baltimore, or anywhere in the US short of
Toronto (which isn't in the US) has had much of a jungle scene.  There
has however always been a fundamental difference between SF and other
scenes, especially the east coast.  On the east coast, big parties almost
always have big name out-of-town dj's, which sometimes are jungle dj's.
But they always play side by side house and techno dj's anyway.  Jungle's
still too hard and fast for a major major party to be all jungle.

The thing about the east coast versus San Francisco is that on the east
coast, promoters are always flying in huge names from the UK, from up and
down the coast, from the midwest, from the rest of Europe.  At the same
time, east coast kids are willing to drive 8-12 hours for a party
regularly, from DC to Boston, from North Carolina to New York, etc.  In
San Francisco, most parties, even big ones, seem to rely on SF dj's,
sometimes LA or other CA locales.  It's cool to see clubs like Nikita
booking out-of-town dj's week after week.  At the same time, SF ravers
do not like to travel.  If a party is an hour outside of the city,
probably at least 75% of people who would have otherwise gone to the
party won't go.


But on the east coast I never saw much in the way of regular jungle events
like
I've seen much of out
here.  There were the occaisional Jungle Fever, Jungle Sky, 2 Tuff parties,
but
I never saw any
weeklies.  SF could certainly do more in the way of bringing in out-of-town
dj's though.  I miss my
east coast sounds!

inhuman@ruff.in.the.jungle

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 15:00:35 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
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I have to admit first that I havn't been following this thread cuz I'm not
really into jungle all that much.  I like alot of what I've heard, but at
this point I'm not an enthusiest.  Anyway:

What is going on with so many promotors having ambient/jungle rooms?  Is
there something I'm missing?  Jungle rooms I can see. Ambient rooms I can
see.  But who got the idea that these two things make a good combination.
One of the great things about ambient rooms IMHO is the chill atmosphere.
If you are into dancing, it gives you a good place to rest and relax a bit
before you go back to the dance room.  For me, I like to chill all night,
and rarely head into the dance space.  A jungle space seems to me like a
high energy kinda place.  I think mixing the two just really defeats the
whole concept of Chill and Jungle.  Uh....IMHO of course :)

Any comments on this subject.  I know some of you have opinions on it
because I've read more than one review on parties that said "the ambient
room didn't have much ambient music....".

Rick



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 15:17:32 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 96 15:17 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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> I have to admit first that I havn't been following this thread cuz I'm not
> really into jungle all that much.  I like alot of what I've heard, but at
> this point I'm not an enthusiest.  Anyway:

ditto :)
 
> What is going on with so many promotors having ambient/jungle rooms?  Is
> there something I'm missing?  Jungle rooms I can see. Ambient rooms I can
> see.  But who got the idea that these two things make a good combination.
> One of the great things about ambient rooms IMHO is the chill atmosphere.
> If you are into dancing, it gives you a good place to rest and relax a bit
> before you go back to the dance room.  For me, I like to chill all night,
> and rarely head into the dance space.  A jungle space seems to me like a
> high energy kinda place.  I think mixing the two just really defeats the
> whole concept of Chill and Jungle.  Uh....IMHO of course :)
> 
> Any comments on this subject.  I know some of you have opinions on it
> because I've read more than one review on parties that said "the ambient
> room didn't have much ambient music....".

I dont know if its the promoters...
but...a lot of ambient artists have often delved into 'beats' and quite
recently ive even been given a lot of trax from amb artists who are
experimenting in...you guessed it Jungle.
Personally id prefer ambient in a room all night with no jungle.
But i guess cause the dj's who are playing ambient are thinking they
should be carrying on the progression..and playing their jungle  at
parties. Next time you're at a party...in an ambient room..what you should
do is go and ask the dj.
we're always happy to talk :)
(jus not while we're playing tho ;)
peace 
bill.e





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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 15:24:47 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
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>What is going on with so many promotors having ambient/jungle rooms?  Is
>there something I'm missing?  Jungle rooms I can see. Ambient rooms I can
>see.  But who got the idea that these two things make a good combination.
>One of the great things about ambient rooms IMHO is the chill atmosphere.
>If you are into dancing, it gives you a good place to rest and relax a bit
>before you go back to the dance room.  For me, I like to chill all night,
>and rarely head into the dance space.  A jungle space seems to me like a
>high energy kinda place.  I think mixing the two just really defeats the
>whole concept of Chill and Jungle.  Uh....IMHO of course :)
>
I agree with Rick here: ambient music lends itself well to chillin', but
jungle sounds too energetic to me to be a suitable companion to ambient.
The only place I've heard jungle in the "chill" area was the Gathering, and
I ended up abandoning the space in favor of chilling outside (very chilly!)
with my friend Sara (very warm!).  A chill space needs soundscapes that
help you to relax, take a breather, relate to those close to you, etc.  I
figure jungle has no more appropriate place than on the main dance floor,
where people can go off, geek out, dance like maniacs, or just stand there
wishing someone would turn up the bass :)

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 15:35:54 1996
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There are many different styles and sounds of jungle/drum and bass. I 
personally am into the more ambient style (yes, there is an ambient 
jungle style). Basically in this type of jungle you'll find much more 
lush pads and sound effects. The beats are also mixed differently so 
that they act more as a textural element instead as in-you-face breaks. 
In these type of tracks, it's really easy to follow the half time 
signiture thus making it feel slow and flowing (around 70-80bpms 
usually). Sometimes in my "chill out" set i'll play maybe 2 or 3 jungle 
traks that loosly fall into this category spaced between a bunch of more 
mellow records.

the effect is still quite chill i think.

andrew

Rick Riffle wrote:
> 
> I have to admit first that I havn't been following this thread cuz I'm not
> really into jungle all that much.  I like alot of what I've heard, but at
> this point I'm not an enthusiest.  Anyway:
> 
> What is going on with so many promotors having ambient/jungle rooms?  Is
> there something I'm missing?  Jungle rooms I can see. Ambient rooms I can
> see.  But who got the idea that these two things make a good combination.
> One of the great things about ambient rooms IMHO is the chill atmosphere.
> If you are into dancing, it gives you a good place to rest and relax a bit
> before you go back to the dance room.  For me, I like to chill all night,
> and rarely head into the dance space.  A jungle space seems to me like a
> high energy kinda place.  I think mixing the two just really defeats the
> whole concept of Chill and Jungle.  Uh....IMHO of course :)
> 
> Any comments on this subject.  I know some of you have opinions on it
> because I've read more than one review on parties that said "the ambient
> room didn't have much ambient music....".
> 
> Rick

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 15:52:46 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Jungle anyone?
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>There are many different styles and sounds of jungle/drum and bass. I
>personally am into the more ambient style (yes, there is an ambient
>jungle style). Basically in this type of jungle you'll find much more
>lush pads and sound effects. The beats are also mixed differently so
>that they act more as a textural element instead as in-you-face breaks.
>In these type of tracks, it's really easy to follow the half time
>signiture thus making it feel slow and flowing (around 70-80bpms
>usually). Sometimes in my "chill out" set i'll play maybe 2 or 3 jungle
>traks that loosly fall into this category spaced between a bunch of more
>mellow records.
>
>the effect is still quite chill i think.
>
>andrew
>
Now that would be good in a chill space!  The only stuff I've heard so far
that I can identify as jungle has snare action that sounds like a machine
gun.  I was unaware that there are more flavas within jungle.

Let's hear it!

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 15:57:15 1996
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From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
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I am an ambient dj/artist myself, and I devuldge into beats sometimes
myself.  Light IDM or ambient dub stuff.  And I can see even an ambient dj
moving the energy around and even guiding it up to some ambient jungle kinda
stuff, then back down to chill.  But that's a movement kind of thing.  

What I'm talking about is when ambient dj's and jungle dj's are scheduled
for the same space.  In my opinion it kills the whole ambient vibe.  I don't
know what the jungle vibe is so whether ambient kills it or not I'm not
sure.  But.....ambient music involves alot of *trust*...IMO, or in from a
different view, a greater experience can happen when a person trusts the
music that is happening than if they don't.  I think in mixing the two, the
trust is lost.  I've seen this happen in a room where we (C-lab) started out
playing ambient, then halfway through the night were asked to pick up the
tempo a little so people could dance in that space.  We played trip hop for
a couple of hours, then went back to ambient.  Being in the space the whole
night, I saw a totally chill atmosphere where most everyone was lying or
sitting down, turn into a dance space with quite a bit of energy, then back
to ambient.  It never really did get chill again.  The music was totally
chill, but I think the trust in the music was gone.  This observation was
mirrored by others that I know as well.

Once again, jungle and ambient are both fine, and I know there some great
ambient/jungle tracks incorporating both styles of music.  But I don't
really think that's what I'm talking about.



>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 15:58:14 1996
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Date: 07 May 96 18:53:04 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Mixing Ambient & Jungle...
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First allow me to say I am NOT an authority on the many categories and types of
music that we all listen to ... sometimes when I read these posts that discuss
the merits and differences between eight or ten types of music that I would
never recognize by name in a million years ... I feel like I'm on another planet
...  (jump-up, tech-step, I'm feeling dizzy!)...

However, I do know that Polywog is one dj who will create the most amazing mixes
of types of music, and her "Into the Jungle" tape, which is not all jungle at
all, mixes jungle beats with hip=hop, house, Jim Morrison, gregorian chants,
other odd musical sources, and would be great to hear in any ambient space ....

One of Polywog's strengths, from what I've heard, is that she defies musical
categorization, resulting in really unique sounds and atmospheres... 

Leslie


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:00:56 1996
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To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
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Yes Yes Yes.

Rick

>I agree with Rick here: ambient music lends itself well to chillin', but
>jungle sounds too energetic to me to be a suitable companion to ambient.
>The only place I've heard jungle in the "chill" area was the Gathering, and
>I ended up abandoning the space in favor of chilling outside (very chilly!)
>with my friend Sara (very warm!).  A chill space needs soundscapes that
>help you to relax, take a breather, relate to those close to you, etc.  I
>figure jungle has no more appropriate place than on the main dance floor,
>where people can go off, geek out, dance like maniacs, or just stand there
>wishing someone would turn up the bass :)
>
>- E
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:01:14 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 19:00:42 -0400
Message-ID: <960507190041_486312347@emout15.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Room/Roommate Needed (Berk/Oak)
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Hey all,
My really good friend Bren really needs either a room, or a roommate(s) in
the Berkely/Oakland area starting June 1st.  She's an art student (CCAC),
extremely nice, extremely easy going, extremely unique, (in a very positive
way).  I lived with this girl for months and was very bummed when she moved
to Berkely.  Shes limited in $$, UP to 350 I think, but she is reliable and
needs someone who is also.  She is an awesome cook, and very neat.  (Wait a
minute, why was it that we broke up?!)  She has very little stuff and likes
all kinds of music.  If you think you might want to meet her, give here a
call @ 510-547-4028, ask for Bren, it's best to call back if you dont get a
hold of her.  Or just look for the really beautifull, zany girl in the
overalls dancing in the water at any given sunset.
Thanks,
Steveo
P.s. or call me 916 443 8225

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:01:19 1996
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Overheard while dancing at the Tahoe cabin trip this weekend.  (This one
ended up being mostly non(until now)-ravers.)

>(Reluctantly to fellow non raver friend) "Uh, I dont know..  this music
seems to be getting a lot better or something."

>(Friend, reluctantly back) "Uh, yeah, yeah it does doesn't it?"

; ]

Big thanks to MarKs for coming through, also to Melissa and Krishna for
putting up with the Cabin switch hassles.  This weekend had several
underlying purposes, and all those involved helped do some amazing things
that will change some peoples lives forever.

The Yosemite excursion is still in the works....








From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:01:24 1996
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To: ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: SFR logo/laminates (YES YES YES YES
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I can't control myself,  yes I love my laminate and wear it proudly, but I
can't tell ya'll how many nightsI've sat up dreaming about a new sfr laminate
design!!  I am all for the idea, who do we talk to??  As far as diversity of
designs, well, yes, but, the idea is to assist in recognition, in turn, to
encourage communication among us.  Maybe a couple designs, but they would
need some obviously recognizable element.  Let's gather more input.  I know
some people might think we're nuts here, but dont' loose faith "VIVA LA NEW
LOGO!"
Steveo
Independent Graphics

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:01:38 1996
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Does anyone know where this phrase came from, I saw it on T's at ameba.
 Speak now before I plagerize you with my design o matic  plager phaser.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:04:03 1996
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To: epaul@synopsys.com (Eric P. Peterson), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Jungle anyone?
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At 3:52 PM  -0700 5/7/96, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

>Now that would be good in a chill space!  The only stuff I've heard so far
>that I can identify as jungle has snare action that sounds like a machine
>gun.  I was unaware that there are more flavas within jungle.
>
>Let's hear it!


I've only heard this once at a BBQ Saturday night, and I really don't know
if jungle afficionados would call this "jungle" (it sounded like what
Andrew was describing, and like what I've heard in chill areas with at
least a "rain forest" sound), but it was hella cool and keeping a
distinctly non-ravey crowd entertained:

Spring Heel Jack  "These are Strings"

Anyone in the know, know?



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:04:13 1996
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Absolutely and totally acceptable in this context.  Like I said in my other
post.  If the dj can move the energy in an appropriate way up to jungle for
a shout time then back down, I can see that as a good thing.  I'm not trying
to ban jungle from ambient rooms....cuz all music has crossover with the
sounds.  I think they both really just need thier own spaces.

Rick

At 03:26 PM 5/7/96 -0700, you wrote:
>There are many different styles and sounds of jungle/drum and bass. I 
>personally am into the more ambient style (yes, there is an ambient 
>jungle style). Basically in this type of jungle you'll find much more 
>lush pads and sound effects. The beats are also mixed differently so 
>that they act more as a textural element instead as in-you-face breaks. 
>In these type of tracks, it's really easy to follow the half time 
>signiture thus making it feel slow and flowing (around 70-80bpms 
>usually). Sometimes in my "chill out" set i'll play maybe 2 or 3 jungle 
>traks that loosly fall into this category spaced between a bunch of more 
>mellow records.
>
>the effect is still quite chill i think.
>
>andrew
>
>Rick Riffle wrote:
>> 
>> I have to admit first that I havn't been following this thread cuz I'm not
>> really into jungle all that much.  I like alot of what I've heard, but at
>> this point I'm not an enthusiest.  Anyway:
>> 
>> What is going on with so many promotors having ambient/jungle rooms?  Is
>> there something I'm missing?  Jungle rooms I can see. Ambient rooms I can
>> see.  But who got the idea that these two things make a good combination.
>> One of the great things about ambient rooms IMHO is the chill atmosphere.
>> If you are into dancing, it gives you a good place to rest and relax a bit
>> before you go back to the dance room.  For me, I like to chill all night,
>> and rarely head into the dance space.  A jungle space seems to me like a
>> high energy kinda place.  I think mixing the two just really defeats the
>> whole concept of Chill and Jungle.  Uh....IMHO of course :)
>> 
>> Any comments on this subject.  I know some of you have opinions on it
>> because I've read more than one review on parties that said "the ambient
>> room didn't have much ambient music....".
>> 
>> Rick
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:10:17 1996
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I'd be into that.  There is a guy in Sacramento named Jonny that is crazy
all over the place, but it flows perfectly.

Rick

At 06:53 PM 5/7/96 EDT, you wrote:
>First allow me to say I am NOT an authority on the many categories and types of
>music that we all listen to ... sometimes when I read these posts that discuss
>the merits and differences between eight or ten types of music that I would
>never recognize by name in a million years ... I feel like I'm on another
planet
>...  (jump-up, tech-step, I'm feeling dizzy!)...
>
>However, I do know that Polywog is one dj who will create the most amazing
mixes
>of types of music, and her "Into the Jungle" tape, which is not all jungle at
>all, mixes jungle beats with hip=hop, house, Jim Morrison, gregorian chants,
>other odd musical sources, and would be great to hear in any ambient space ....
>
>One of Polywog's strengths, from what I've heard, is that she defies musical
>categorization, resulting in really unique sounds and atmospheres... 
>
>Leslie
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:16:30 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Future cabin trips
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Hey all!

        Steveo suggested I bring up the idea of a Yosemite cabin trip to
take place sometime in June!  Would anyone be interested?  That might be a
better time for people to get away, even though it'll already be into
tourist season, but heck, we'll be tourists, too, of a sort ;)  Will this
one fly?  Does anyone know how to coordinate such an endeavor?

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:18:02 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: That Yosemite thang
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Yes, Steveo says that if there's enough interest, he'll get it.  What a guy :)

Peace,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:25:20 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 16:25:14 -0800
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: SFR logo/laminates (YES YES YES YES
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Well, Steve, you're a graphics guy... =)

...hey, so am I! I'm definitely going to contribute to SDream's logo idea
page ASAP. While I don't like the idea of an SFR t-shirt (I like my own
t-shirts thank you =) I am totally open to the idea of redesigning the SFR
laminate... it's pretty plain.

>I can't control myself,  yes I love my laminate and wear it proudly, but I
>can't tell ya'll how many nightsI've sat up dreaming about a new sfr laminate
>design!!  I am all for the idea, who do we talk to??  As far as diversity of
>designs, well, yes, but, the idea is to assist in recognition, in turn, to
>encourage communication among us.  Maybe a couple designs, but they would
>need some obviously recognizable element.  Let's gather more input.  I know
>some people might think we're nuts here, but dont' loose faith "VIVA LA NEW
>LOGO!"
>Steveo
>Independent Graphics


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:28:22 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 16:28:19 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Jungle anyone?
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

I think it's called "intelligent jungle." Of course I don't know much about
all these pigeonholes but I've heard it referred to by that name (also
called "wussy jungle," in the same sentence, according to stareyes; tho' I
kinda like it).

-m.

>I've only heard this once at a BBQ Saturday night, and I really don't know
>if jungle afficionados would call this "jungle" (it sounded like what
>Andrew was describing, and like what I've heard in chill areas with at
>least a "rain forest" sound), but it was hella cool and keeping a
>distinctly non-ravey crowd entertained:
>
>Spring Heel Jack  "These are Strings"
>
>Anyone in the know, know?


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 16:53:45 1996
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To: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: Jungle anyone?
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I like "intellijungle".  Even wrote some myself.  Jungle, with cooler sounds
IMO :O

Rick

At 04:28 PM 5/7/96 -0800, you wrote:
>I think it's called "intelligent jungle." Of course I don't know much about
>all these pigeonholes but I've heard it referred to by that name (also
>called "wussy jungle," in the same sentence, according to stareyes; tho' I
>kinda like it).
>
>-m.
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 17:04:18 1996
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Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 17:04:38 -0700
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From: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Jungle anyone?
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i heard it called "ambient hardcore" a couple years ago...
it was described as having breaks speeded up super super fast so that the
beat almost dissapeared, with ambient sounds mixed in. sounded pretty cool,
but i never got my hands on any. :(

>I like "intellijungle".  Even wrote some myself.  Jungle, with cooler sounds
>>I think it's called "intelligent jungle." Of course I don't know much about
>>all these pigeonholes but I've heard it referred to by that name (also
>>called "wussy jungle," in the same sentence, according to stareyes; tho' I
>>kinda like it).


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 17:32:52 1996
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From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
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Hi I'm looking for a DXF of a human figure to use in an animation for
school. I've got one now, but it's pretty ugly. I need one with seperated
ligaments so I can animate it.

Thanx,

Jon

p.s. I'll send you a copy of my animation when it's done if you send me a
good human figure dxf.

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:03:19 1996
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Subject: Re: Future cabin trips
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On Tue, 7 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> Hey all!
> 
>         Steveo suggested I bring up the idea of a Yosemite cabin trip to
> take place sometime in June!  Would anyone be interested?  

i am! i am! i am!! a yosemite cabin trip. YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!! i was just 
there a few weeks ago and am already missing it. if you need any help in 
planning this just let me know. 

  Does anyone know how to coordinate such an endeavor?

well- not really but i could definately look in to it.
luv
sarah

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:14:22 1996
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Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 18:14:42 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: today
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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HAPPY NATIONAL MASTERBATION DAY!!

(be good to yourself)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:14:37 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 18:14:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Future cabin trips
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I would love to go and to help.
Let us talk further about it if you are serious.


Cassandra


On Tue, 7 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> Hey all!
> 
>         Steveo suggested I bring up the idea of a Yosemite cabin trip to
> take place sometime in June!  Would anyone be interested?  That might be a
> better time for people to get away, even though it'll already be into
> tourist season, but heck, we'll be tourists, too, of a sort ;)  Will this
> one fly?  Does anyone know how to coordinate such an endeavor?
> 
> - E
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:16:33 1996
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Date: 07 May 96 21:14:56 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Yosemite, did you say?
Message-ID: <960508011456_71165.755_GHL156-1@CompuServe.COM>
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Here's one person who'd be interested in a Yosemite trip ... for one thing (I'm
ducking and hiding my blushing face as I say this...) I've never been to
Yosemite, even though I've lived in the Bay Area since I was 17 years old -- and
we know that's a long, long time!

For another thing, I love hangin' out with all youz guys...

I'd be happy to help  in coordinating in some way, though I am clueless about
how to go about it -- so I'd be better in some sort of record-keeping role,
maybe, or I could be in charge of hats.....

Eric?  SteveO?  Do we have a volunteer coordinator?

Leslie  :')


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:26:31 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: today
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> HAPPY NATIONAL MASTERBATION DAY!!
> 
> (be good to yourself)


...speaking of beating meat.......


Meat Beat Manifesto is playing at Melarkey's tonight in downtown 
Sacramento!  Go if you live within a 150 mile radius!  Should be cool... 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:32:24 1996
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 07 May 1996 18:32:05 -0800 (PST)
Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 18:32:05 -0800 (PST)
Date-warning: Date header was inserted by SONOMA.EDU
From: Jonas Hanning <hanning@SONOMA.EDU>
Subject: It's still for sale!
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Yes folks, all my equipment is still up for grabs. In case you 
missed it the last time, it's...

* 2 Technics SL1200Mk2 turntables. They are about 2.5-3 yrs old,
according to the guy who sold them to me less than 3 months ago.
Their condition is great (they ARE Technics, remember?), but they
could use some Kleenex. =) The carts...one is a Technics w/ a 
Stanton styli. The other one is some kind of broadcast quality
cart. There is a logo on it, I just don't remember what logo it
is. *smile* And oh, they ARE original US versions. I paid $700 for
the pair, and I'm asking something like that, although it is very
negotiable. (I'm leaving REALLY soon...)
* Harman Kardon 3250 Stereo Receiver. This baby rocks! =) Paid
$320(+tax)+60 (5 yr warranty that covers just about EVERYTHING) for
it when I bought it in February 1996. 
* a pair of DCM KX10 speakers. They have a 10" bass woofer, a 6"
midrange and a 3/4" tweeter. If I had anything to say in the matter,
I would _NOT_ sell these! But I have to. I paid $340(+tax) for the 
pair, and I'm asking about $300.
* Packard Bell 14" monitor. This was bought 4-5 months ago for 
$280(+tax) and it's going for $200.

Once again, I need to get rid of them ASAP. =) And oh, I might be
able to do some trading, since I need record cases at the moment. =)

reeeeespect, jonas
...........................................................
..::DJ E(skimo!)::....:::Jonas Hanning:::....::dabalhed::..
.......:::http://www.sonoma.edu/students/hanning/:::.......
...........................................................


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:38:52 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Bumpin' weekend!
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Fuck yeah!  When I can have a weekend like the one I had this past weekend,
it makes the rest of the week much more bearable.

On Friday, a birthday party for my main sister Kari, drank and ate like
Romans.  Went out to 333 Ritch to hear some old-skool (not "old-timer")
grooves.  Loved it...the brown was definitely in town and gettin' down.
Nice friendly place, with lotsa friendly faces.  Shit was on, catchin'
tunes from my lost youth.

Saturday, geared up for Wicked, went alone, was all good!  I hardly go out,
but when I do I can usually be found at any of Preston's parties (when I'm
up to it), OR Wicked (when I'm down for it). And the occasional UG I might
hear about, if it's thrown by people I trust.  Why?  Simply put, all sets
tend to have some of the best music in the area.  The Dj's and the mood of
these parties is one of festivity.  The quality of music is a cut above,
and both groups really know how to throw a party.  I also like to hear
excellent skills.  I have become very, very picky about what I like and
dislike about music.  Probalby because I buy a whole shitload of it
(although not as much as DJ Loren) , and because I can hear a bad mix no
matter how fucked up I am.

Wicked was all good.  Jeno, although not in top form when I heard him @
first, put on some really great funky fat-ass tunes, and had the crowd
pumped and moving.  Then T (Thomas) came on and really stomped the crowd
with some serious funked up house.  I haven't heard T  mix like that in
ages.  That mutha rocked it!  Love that jungle mix near the end of your set
(fucking flawless, money).  Markie tore open so many heads, he left people
trying to buy vowels!  His shit was locked up and spot on.  The music was
waaay deep, nasty, tripped out, tranced out, house.  These guys are some of
the few who can get me to go out, and their music says it all.

Saw plenty of smiling faces from the list at this Wicked.  Met Leslie,
SDream, Marty, and the ever so funky Diane T.  Definitely some happy jack
MF's if I do say so myself :).  Had a good conversation with Leslie (@
Wicked?, beleive it or not, we were able to converse), didn't get to talk
much with anyone else, since it seemed everyone wanted to dance.  Very cool
party, and met some really cool people!

Well I've waxed on enough.  Looks like there was enough of a good weekend
for everyone!

I'm out,
John




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:40:51 1996
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Subject: Re: Future cabin trips
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>        Steveo suggested I bring up the idea of a Yosemite cabin trip to
>take place sometime in June!  Would anyone be interested?  That might be a
>better time for people to get away, even though it'll already be into
>tourist season, but heck, we'll be tourists, too, of a sort ;)  Will this
>one fly?  Does anyone know how to coordinate such an endeavor?



I would definitely be into something like this!  I missed out on the last
two Tahoe cabin trips :( so it would be nice to go to Yosemite! 


Shawna




"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:45:19 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 18:23:41 -0600
To: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Burnout phase (was weekend recap)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 7:26 PM  -0600 5/6/96, Amy R Starkey wrote:

>Most of all, what about the dj's - especially ones who are in heavy
>demand to put so much of themselves into the music ALL THE TIME?  What do
>you do when you need a break?  Or is it so much in your blood that you
>never do get burned out?
>

It can be a problem. I've never been completely burnt out or been as jaded
as some old-timers (I've only been in it 4 years, though) but I certainly
go through phases where I'd rather sit at home and read a good book and
listen to music than go out. When that happens I won't go to many parties
where I'm not spinning.

After seeing the inner workings and mechanics of throwing parties from
djing and promoting I don't get quite as excited about as many parties as
when I was only a raver. I definitely appreciate the scene more now,
though. Back before I djed and promoted as much, all it took was a cool
flyer to get me utterly hyped on an event, while now I'm much more
discerning and tend to put my energy into parties that I know are being
done for the right reasons like F&F, Chrysalis, etc., although I'm more
likely to brave a nightclub crowd in order to hear a top dj than I used to
be.

Being able to actually put something back into the scene by doing parties
and spinning keeps it worthwhile - I'd like to think I can help others get
as much out of it as I have, and I'll never lose my love for the music.

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 18:46:04 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 18:40:50 -0600
To: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 4:00 PM  -0600 5/7/96, Rick Riffle wrote:
>I have to admit first that I havn't been following this thread cuz I'm not
>really into jungle all that much.  I like alot of what I've heard, but at
>this point I'm not an enthusiest.  Anyway:
>
>What is going on with so many promotors having ambient/jungle rooms?  Is
>there something I'm missing?  Jungle rooms I can see. Ambient rooms I can
>see.  But who got the idea that these two things make a good combination.
>One of the great things about ambient rooms IMHO is the chill atmosphere.
>If you are into dancing, it gives you a good place to rest and relax a bit
>before you go back to the dance room.  For me, I like to chill all night,
>and rarely head into the dance space.  A jungle space seems to me like a
>high energy kinda place.  I think mixing the two just really defeats the
>whole concept of Chill and Jungle.  Uh....IMHO of course :)
>
>Any comments on this subject.  I know some of you have opinions on it
>because I've read more than one review on parties that said "the ambient
>room didn't have much ambient music....".
>
>Rick

One one hand, as a sometime "ambient" dj, I like the absolute anarchy and
eclecticism of the ambient room, but I also think that the privilege can be
abused. Frankly, I don't want to hear 2 hours of jungle in a chill room
unless it's intelligent enough to hold a seriously philosophical
discussion. I have a few ambient/electronic jungle tracks that I'd play in
a chill room, but sparsely. Alex Paterson played straight up techno at the
Gathering mixed with a little ambient/dub/jungle. Cool stuff, but not the
greatest to sit around and chill out to. I prefer stuff that's interesting
and mellow enough to relax to, but has enough of a beat to keep you from
nodding off completely. Having said that, if I'm playing and I see people
falling asleep I figure I'm doing something right...

contradictarily,

Joe




(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 19:07:43 1996
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To: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: Re: Me and my new life!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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today adam wrote:
>Well.. 
>
>My life has been a bore for quite a while. I went to school, worked, 
>studied and slept. Until I met these two individuals, Terry <CTD-Zine> 
>and Ian <LOWUFO>. They were the ones that actually changed my life 
>around. They got me into ravin' about 2 months ago? I think i'm 
>addicted.. but you know what.. I LOVE IT!!!!!!!!
>
>Thanks alot you two! This Summer iz going to be a goooood ONE!
>
>
>Your Ravin' Lunatic,
>
>                Adam.


awwwwwwwwwww!  aren't ravers cute?

peace, love, and raving-

matt l.

matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 19:07:43 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: a suggestion about new laminate designs
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey all!

When designing your potential laminate designs, I was thinking that I'd make
a suggestion about that.  I think that whatever the design is, it should be
all in day-glo colors! :)  (those of you who know me, know I'm always
looking for nifty day-glo toys & whatnot for the fun of it!)  This, in
addition to just looking really cool under the blacklights, also makes it
*far* more easy to spot at a distance in those darkened rave rooms.  I have
so much trouble detecting an actual sfrave badge these days cuz I can't see
it well enough unless I simply walk up to the person & grab whatever's
hanging around their neck!  So for practicality's sake & for the sake of us
all being as fun & colorful as possible, that's my suggestion! :)


Love,
Shawna




"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 20:01:23 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: Yosemite Cabin Trip!
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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hello all-

i would love to go on another trip with cool sfravers!  i'm going to
suggest, arbitrarily, the third weekend in june.  that's the 21'st thru 23'rd.

i, matthew d. p. k. lanier, am about to do something really stupid.  here goes-

i'll volunteer to help coordinate this thing if people are interested.  i
just hope i could follow in steveo's footsteps!  so, why don't people either
post if they have an interest?


hope this works!

peace, love, and yosemite-

matt l
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 20:01:31 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: Yosemite Cabin Trip!
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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hello all-

i would love to go on another trip with cool sfravers!  i'm going to
suggest, arbitrarily, the third weekend in june.  that's the 21'st thru 23'rd.

i, matthew d. p. k. lanier, am about to do something really stupid.  here goes-

i'll volunteer to help coordinate this thing if people are interested.  i
just hope i could follow in steveo's footsteps!  so, why don't people either
post if they have an interest?


hope this works!

peace, love, and yosemite-

matt l
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 20:09:43 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 20:09:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Yosemite Cabin Trip!
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Definitely interested... this time I'll know in advance so I can take 
work off...  If there's anything I can do to help (foot in mouth 
already), let me know :)


> hello all-
> 
> i would love to go on another trip with cool sfravers!  i'm going to
> suggest, arbitrarily, the third weekend in june.  that's the 21'st thru 23'rd.
> 
> i, matthew d. p. k. lanier, am about to do something really stupid.  here goes-
> 
> i'll volunteer to help coordinate this thing if people are interested.  i
> just hope i could follow in steveo's footsteps!  so, why don't people either
> post if they have an interest?
> 
> 
> hope this works!
> 
> peace, love, and yosemite-
> 
> matt l
> matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
> lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
>                                   /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
> home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
>                                 /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
>                                /   ++++   \
> "i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
> window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
> unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
> saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
> reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
> the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
> the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
> the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
> for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
> and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
> would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."
> 
>      -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 20:17:22 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 20:18:44 +1000
To: dhchung@us.oracle.com (Derek Chung)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: ride hookups
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>I think I can set up a no-frills version of this on the SFRaves web site.
>It would just be a short form with a date, name/contact info, and space
>for a brief description of what ride is needed/offered.  Another page
>would have all of the postings for all upcoming dates.

Sounds good,   but will you always be available to shuffle this info
to me before this Friday?    I only got 3 people with cars so far that
are willing to share a ride....  Ain't much but I can Email them to you
so you can test out the CGI...    Will you program the CGI to mail me the
form?     That way,  there would be no work on your part to shuffle the
data to me.    Then,  on Friday,  I can consolidate the information and
post it to the list,    say by about 7 or 8 pm.   Usually nobody even
thinks about leaving much before then.    Remember,  for those that may
leave early,  they can always call my 800 number and get the info.

>
>Do most SFRavers have some sort of web access now?  If not, do most people
>at least know someone who does, who can post and get info from this page?

I think we can do it both ways,   just Email me the rides offerred and I'll
compile up a list of drivers,  arrangement phone numbers,  and pickup points
in a neat little list each friday.    It might look like this...


Driver          Email           Phone           Pickup point
------          -----           -----           -------------
eric         Eric@whatever   408-269-1999       Camden and Bascom South San Jose


Something like that....   But sure,   putting this on a Hyperreal web site would
be a worthey cause,  thats for sure.    If I wasn't spending so much time
looking
for work,  I would have it up on MY web site right now,   but my main focus is
finding employment.

>
>Um, I don't want everyone on the list sending me mail telling me they do or
>don't have web access, so maybe just send me mail if you don't have
>web access and you'd want to use this ride thing.


I wouldn't really worry about it Derek,   but if you would like to hack around
some CGI code just for phun,   I certainly wouldn't get in your way...   :-)

If you don't do it,  I will,   hopefully sooner,  rather than later....   Hmm,
In fact,   I think I'll add that to my web page tonight.   I alreday wrote this
CGI that Emails a form to me.    I'll compile it on "vcomm.net".    It's written
in "C"....   I might even have time to do it tonight.....  :-)   I'll post
the URL as soon as I finish and test it.
>
>-Derek
>
But I don't want to cut out those who can't get on the net,  or on the WEB,
so thats why my 800 number will be available.    On Friday,  I usually stay home
until about 9 pm.

If someone wants to donate a voice mail line,   I can put it up there,   but
we would need an 800 number (Not everyone has change at that payphone).

But even a normal voice number will do....  I would be willing to record the
message every friday.  So, now you have TWO number to call...  That rave info
line number,  and that Ride info number.   Now,  if we all can somehow get word
to those people who record those info lines,  and include ride information
(like they do in Australia - but ya gotta call those 0055 numbers,  and they
aren't cheap) that would be better for all of us.   Things would be a lot
simpler of the promoters read the SFRaves list.   I know Martin sometimes reads
them (if he has time).

Later...
Da Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 20:17:24 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 20:21:36 -0800
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glad to see so many of you this weekend, i could go on forever.  you all
know by now harmony went off, the bbq was sweet, and sunset took care of
anyone with energy left over.  just want to add a couple of personal
observations.

So many beautiful people!  Extra-special thanx to Eric for his gift to
Melanie, an eighteen-year-old self-proclaimed witch who shone like a
supernova all night at her first rave.  She's now under the weather a bit,
and wants to keep her experiences infrequent and special, but we'll be
seeing her again after school ends.  I hope none of us judge people by
their age, but seeing how unbelievably together Melanie is at 18 reminded
my 28-year-old self of the Tom Lehrer line, "When Mozart was my age, he'd
been dead for two years."

Whoever's been posting about the playfulness back in the day w/Toon Town
would feel right at home at Harmony -- my inner child was out on Friday
night!

Another reminder of how good we have it here in SF . . . just after
midnight I met this quiet young woman sitting alone (her name escapes me),
dressed a little more clubby than most of us.  She said she was from Rhode
Island, out here visiting friends, and commented about the "Salvation Army"
style we seemed to have out here.  I said that there were definitely large
pockets of thrift shop/hippie dress in the scene, and lotsa retro stuff and
black light clothes, but not always.  she then talked about how cliquey it
was back east, that people did lotsa coke & speed, and that the music was
harder.  It was before Ethan came on, the dance floor hadn't exploded yet,
and she seemed a bit disappointed.

Cut to about 3:30, and I bump into her somewhere.  She's grinning
ear-to-ear, looking a little overwhelmed.

"So, how do you like it now?"

"<huge grin> I don't know what I'm going to tell my friends back home . . .
is it always like this?"

"Not always, but more than enough . . . THIS is a San Francisco underground." :)

It was my first time to the Deli, and although it wasn't perfect, it didn't
get in the way of my vibe.  If the space wasn't so expensive for Harmony
anyway -- I know they didn't want to charge $15 and then have people pay
for water -- maybe there could be a deal ahead of time with the owner
regarding water.  Something like adding $2 to everyone's admission, giving
everyone a coupon for one free bottled water, and allowing bathroom
refills, if the owner insists on monopoly water rent.  But I'm glad that so
many people did refill.  I didn't like having to be sneaky about water, so
I didn't try, but I enjoyed the icy cold spring water I did buy & of course
everyone shared.

I did get the distinct impression, however, that one of the owner-security
people did not like the uninhibitedness of the chill room upstairs . . .
like he'd notice three people were together, and his face looked liked he'd
slowly realized that this meant that at least two must be of the same
gender (in the vague recesses of my brain, I swear someone once posted a
similar observation before . . . sorry for any plagiarism).  Tough on him
-- if he can accept our money, he can accept our scene, in all of its
wonderful openness and diversity.

The BBQ was extremely pleasant, really meeting people, some day-after body
hugs, great food, Ethan playing while the sun beautifully set over Marin .
. . ahhh!  Thank you, Tim -- I'll keep on paying you back in my own way.

The only thing was, to paraphrase the Sunset message the next day --
CIGARETTE BUTTS SUCK!!  I had my flashlight for my kaleidoscopes, and after
the party picked up 50+ butts in the areas where people had been sitting.
I gave a hug to Holly at Sunset when I saw her grind out her cigarette,
pick it up and put it in her knapsack . . . I plan on similar positive
reinforcement at outdoor raves in the future; dunno what I'll do when I see
someone toss one aside.  Crashed early that night.

Woke up early to get BASS tickets for the June 15 Concert for a Free Tibet,
hung out with friends in the afternoon, and then made my way across town to
the Marina at about 6 . . . I was pretty tired, but the few minutes of
dancing did me good.  SFR moment -- I was wandering around, looking for
familiar faces, when one appeared and said "Hi -- I've seen you the last 3
days!" in a nice accent.  :-)  I hadn't yet met her, but was thinking from
Tony's post that she must be Branka, and she was!  I was too tired for much
conversation (really), but it was nice to be noticed . . . a fun weekend!

I thought that I'd finally take this coming weekend off, but I now know
that won't happen =-)  I think I'll at least take Friday off, tho -- sorry
Something Free, I hope you go off and I regret it . . .

you guys are great, thanks for another terrific weekend!

leftjab



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 20:17:35 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 20:18:51 +1000
To: blkadder@value.net
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: ride hookups
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>On 7 May 1996, Michael wrote:
>
>>
>> Something that we used to do on ne-raves back in the day was called the
>> Hook-Up-O-Matic.  One person (Jetta) used to compile this weekly, and
>> basically, as Friday approached, anyone who could offer a ride to a party or
>> who was looking for a ride to a party would email her with the details.  At
>> the
>> end of the week, the result was a big long list that looked something like
>> this:
>>
>> -------
>> OFFERING RIDES
>> -------
>> SoooperRave:
>> -John Doe (jdoe@dough.com) 212-xxx-xxxx, has space for 2-3 people from
>> downtown
>> area
>>
>> Club Rub-A-Dub:
>> -Casper Dodd (crack@space.net) 617-xxx-xxxx, has room for 1 person, wants to
>> leave early around 9
>>
>> -----
>> NEEDING RIDES
>> -----
>> Jim Jones (jj@temple.org) 212-xxx-xxxx, wants ride to rub-a-dub, will pay for
>> gas, tolls, dinner, breakfast
>>
>> ------
>>
>> You get the idea...  This might work better than some sort of permanent
>> meeting
>> spot, because people's availability and schedules change on a weekly basis
>> anyway.  The only problem is, it requires some responsible person with time
>>on
>> their hands to compile and maintain it.  I'd offer, but I'm none of those
>> things.
>>
>> inhuman@east.coast.flava
>
>Hmm... I could write a cgi script that would allow people to enter and
>retreive info via a web page. Any interest in this?
>
I'm going to do that tonight...   Should take just a few minutes.   I got
a CGI that delivers the form to my mailbox....

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 20:17:42 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 20:19:01 +1000
To: blkadder@value.net
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>On Tue, 7 May 1996, 'Dave Bayer' wrote:
>
>> Basicly, you are going to a place where everyone has to take care of
>> themselves, and no one will tell you how best to do that (well, maybe
>> Earthbound Medical people will, but they are pretty cool about things and
>> do offer something like EMS out there, only thing you have to walk 1 mile
>> to main camp and then find them first unless I learn enough to set up
>> some type of med station in rave camp this year). Some people bring the
>> city with them, others come up to find out/remember what living without
>> our constructs/conviences is like.
>>
>
>I would add one more thing: Don't drive like you are on the freeway.
>
Because it is possible to drive fast on the Playa,  people get tempted to
just point their car in an arbitrary direction and go full throttle.
After all,  it's what the pro speed drivers drive on.    Also,  if you
do intend to "strike it off" on your own,  in some arbitrary direction,
please be advised that not ALL of the playa is dry...  After all,  it
is a lake a certain time of the year,   and not all of it is dry.

On places that are wet,  is mud that is at least 3- 4 ft deep.   If you
get stuck out there,   there is no way to call for help.    So,  a simple,
cheap CB radio might be in order.    Heck,  you can get them for less
than $100.    Imagine if you got stuck out there....   nobody will
know you're out there...

Da crunchman - Who's been out on the playa twice now...



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 20:34:26 1996
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Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 20:34:46 -0700
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From: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: a suggestion about new laminate designs
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>When designing your potential laminate designs, I was thinking that I'd make
>a suggestion about that.  I think that whatever the design is, it should be
>all in day-glo colors! :)  (those of you who know me, know I'm always
anyone have neon ink in their printer?? anyone?? i didn't think so.
it could always be a black and white design with a colour-your-own theme...


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 21:17:46 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 21:17:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: BBQ Fixins
In-Reply-To: <v0213050eadaf7dda8130@[146.225.72.168]>
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>> Uh Oh! here we again with old posts making another appearance:(.
  I had 54 messages in my inbox.
                            Reagan





On Fri, 3 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> Don't forget that we'll need some large garbage bags, too, just in case the
> trash containers won't hold our refuse!
> 
> Environmentally friendly,
> 
> - E
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 21:40:29 1996
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From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: argh!
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hello everybody-

as i sit here and listen to freaky chakra, writing the paper that will never
end, i need to ask for 1 moment of the e-tention.


        AA            RRR              GG          HHH       HHH      !!!
       AAAA           R RR            GGGG         HHH       HHH      !!!
      AA  AA          R  RR          GG  GG        HHH       HHH      !!!
      AA  AA          R RR          GG             HHHHHHHHHHHHH      !!!
      AAAAAA          RRR            GG GGGG       HHHHHHHHHHHHH      
      AA  AA          R  R            GG GG        HHH       HHH      !!!
      AA  AA          R   R            GGG         HHH       HHH      !!!


Thank you for letting me get that out.  it's been a long day, and i need
sleep.  but, in the grand raver tradition, i won't be getting it.

if you're bored and need a break, give me a buzz or an e-mail.  i'll love
you for it!


peace, love, and work-

matt l.
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 22:40:59 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 22:36:59 -0700
Message-Id: <199605080536.WAA16324@dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: Me and my new life!
To: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 

>>Thanks alot you two! This Summer iz going to be a goooood ONE!
>>
>>
>>Your Ravin' Lunatic,
>>
>>                Adam.
>
>
>awwwwwwwwwww!  aren't ravers cute?
>
>peace, love, and raving-
>
>matt l.
>



Cute?!? Haha... nobody has ever called me cute... uugghh...

ADam
                    R.Lunatic.. =)~


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 22:44:26 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: Yosemite Cabin Trip!
To: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>
>hello all-
>
>i would love to go on another trip with cool sfravers!  i'm going to
>suggest, arbitrarily, the third weekend in june.  that's the 21'st 
thru 23'rd.
>


That'd be a good weekend for me.. =)~


Adam
                    R.Lunatic

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 22:58:50 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 23:00:47 -0800
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From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
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crunch@well.com (John Draper) wrote:
>Because it is possible to drive fast on the Playa,  people get tempted to
>just point their car in an arbitrary direction and go full throttle.
>After all,  it's what the pro speed drivers drive on.

While serious speed drivers do drive on desert flats in general, the Black
Rock Desert in particular is not that well-suited because the soil makeup
is too slippery.  So if you feel like trying for the land speed record for
89 Toyota Celicas, or whatever, head east to Bonneville or south to other
salt flats.  Every serious Burning Man injury I know of has been
auto-related, and that is one thing that BM can do without.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 22:58:56 1996
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Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 23:00:50 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
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Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu> wrote:
>What is going on with so many promotors having ambient/jungle rooms?  Is
>there something I'm missing?  Jungle rooms I can see. Ambient rooms I can
>see.  But who got the idea that these two things make a good combination.

At a guess: jungle and ambient are both relatively marginal genres within a
larger scene that is house-oriented (here in the Bay area), so an organizer
who has limited time/space available but wishes to incorporate a variety of
styles chooses to share the smaller styles in a single presentation, while
the more well-known reside in a unified main area.  Also, I've heard
several people say that while jungle is generally too fast/hard/crazy for
them to dance in their usual way to, they enjoy kicking back and letting it
mess with their heads for a while...this might be a factor.

As an aside, I just picked up a jungle CD, "Jungle Zone EP" from Energy
Zone, for $3.50 (!) that I like a lot.  Might be on the fast side for
some--150 bpm range I'd say--but I can definitely get down to it.  A
bargain.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May  7 23:09:28 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605080609.XAA04012@netcom4.netcom.com>
Subject: (unrave) Bill Nelson @ Tower Records
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 23:09:25 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Some of you who are into semi-obscure , unique , and gifted musicians 
may be familiar with the British musician Bill Nelson. Former lead 
guitarists of 70's avant-garde rock band BeBop Deluxe , he has been 
doing a mostly solo career , with some soundtrack work and some recordings
with other musicians . Some ambient room DJs seem to be familiar with his 
work - kind of like Brian Eno's "Music For Films", but with more of
an edge and a characteristic sound. Definitely mental movie soundtrack
stuff. 

 Anyway , he's going to be appearing in San Francisco
this week! It's an in-store appearance at the Tower Records at Columbus
and Bay , this Thursday May 9th at 6PM.

 I don't know if he's going to be playing any music or not! But since it's 
been over ten years since I saw him play in Palo Alto , I may make the
commute from Sunnyvale just to see how he's doing.

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 00:14:50 1996
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Subject: Re: Jungle anyone?
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I think Flux is my local fave- drum n' bass w/ funk guitar sampled in.
Too much.

Count me in for Bass Instinct.

happy thumpin'
-berT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 01:33:26 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 01:34:55 +1000
To: Michael <Michael.Minnich@bankamerica.com>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
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>I never saw any weeklies.  SF could certainly do more in the way of bringing
>in
>out-of-town dj's though.  I miss my east coast sounds!
>
>inhuman@ruff.in.the.jungle

Yea,  that could also be because our SF promoters don't know how to contact the
"Out of town" DJ's.    Or the venue rental/insureance/security costs are so
high that they cannot afford to fly in out of towners.   OF course,  I'm only
speculating.    I sure wish they would bring in more German DJ's.   Also I hear
Russian DJ's are getting really hot,  so my German friend I know has told me.

The Crunchman






From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 01:33:31 1996
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To: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: re: Jungle anyone?
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>For me, I like to chill all night,
>and rarely head into the dance space.  A jungle space seems to me like a
>high energy kinda place.  I think mixing the two just really defeats the
>whole concept of Chill and Jungle.  Uh....IMHO of course :)

I've noticed that a lot of Jungle gets played in Ambient rooms,  and even
the Gardening club has featured Jungle.    I think that this might be
because Jungle has a lot of Ambient like passages in it.    It's really
different,  where there are fast beats,  then no beats,   then half beats,
with little or no pattern to them.  Probably why they call it jungle.
I like it because it's fast....   It's great to "Warm up to dancing" to.

The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 01:33:39 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 01:35:06 +1000
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Future cabin trips
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>Hey all!
>
>        Steveo suggested I bring up the idea of a Yosemite cabin trip to
>take place sometime in June!  Would anyone be interested?  That might be a
>better time for people to get away, even though it'll already be into
>tourist season, but heck, we'll be tourists, too, of a sort ;)  Will this
>one fly?  Does anyone know how to coordinate such an endeavor?
>
I thought that you had to book a Yosemite visit several years in advance.
Well,  if you can pull it off,  I certainly would like to go...   Of course
I'll need a ride...

The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 01:33:47 1996
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To: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Yosemite Cabin Trip!
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>
>i'll volunteer to help coordinate this thing if people are interested.  i
>just hope i could follow in steveo's footsteps!  so, why don't people either
>post if they have an interest?
>
  I could bring my laptop so we can have Net access and have live rave
reports...   :-)

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 01:33:54 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 01:35:17 +1000
To: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>crunch@well.com (John Draper) wrote:
>>Because it is possible to drive fast on the Playa,  people get tempted to
>>just point their car in an arbitrary direction and go full throttle.
>>After all,  it's what the pro speed drivers drive on.
>
>While serious speed drivers do drive on desert flats in general, the Black
>Rock Desert in particular is not that well-suited because the soil makeup
>is too slippery.  So if you feel like trying for the land speed record for
>89 Toyota Celicas, or whatever, head east to Bonneville or south to other
>salt flats.  Every serious Burning Man injury I know of has been
>auto-related, and that is one thing that BM can do without.
>
Yup!!!



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 01:42:29 1996
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Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 13:48:46 -0700
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Eric P. Peterson wrote:
> 
> Hey all!
> 
>         Steveo suggested I bring up the idea of a Yosemite cabin trip to
> take place sometime in June!  Would anyone be interested?  That might be a
> better time for people to get away, even though it'll already be into
> tourist season, but heck, we'll be tourists, too, of a sort ;)  Will this
> one fly?  Does anyone know how to coordinate such an endeavor?
> 
> - E

Well, time and $$$$$ permitting....I'm sure myself, the
crazy-ass Raving Lunatic, and Low UFO are down. I have 
some camping equip. available (stove, sleeping bags, 3 tents,
lanterns, etc.) Anyone else interested????

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 02:27:18 1996
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From: "Fred Heutte" <phred@well.com>
Message-Id: <9605080227.ZM16310@well>
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 02:27:12 -0700
In-Reply-To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
        "Re: Jungle anyone?" (May  7,  4:03pm)
References: <v03006650adb59436f235@DialupEudora>
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For those who know:

Anyone who heard Jonah's amazing set at our F&F Nag Champa ambient night
a year ago, or Polliwog's Tribal Future set, or Goldie or LTJ Bukem's
CDs and tapes, or has stopped by Ameba, may well have heard jungle witho8ut
even knowing it.  

Jungle isn't just that booyaka-bad-bwoi-with-a-rat-a-tat stuff, it's a
legitimate part of the music the way that "rude boy" anthems were a
part of reggae's foundation, but just as with reggae it's not the
dominant sound.  Jungle started about five years as an offshoot of
hardcore/breakbeat techno, but always had its roots in dub and dancehall
with the distinctive half speed bassline.  In the last couple of years,
there has been an increasing influence from straight-ahead jazz, as heard
most clearly in the work of LTJ Bukem, Goldie and PLUG (among others).

The less vocal-oriented side of jungle is often referred to as "drum and
bass," although the terms are loose as usual.  And then there's hardstep,
dark and lots of other variants.  Drum programming is the key to jungle,
and the distinctive skittering sound is present but with a very wide
variety of specific approaches.  Basslines tend to be drawn-out, rather
than four-on-the-floor, following the dub or jazz b-line approach.  
Jungle tends to be in the 135 to 170 bpm range (half that for the bassline),
and the rhythmic structure makes it difficult to dance to in the conventional
four-kicks-to-the-bar style that characterizes dance music from trip hop
up to gabber speed.  But people DO dance to jungle, you just have to find
the right approach for yourself.  I tend to sort of sway with it . . .

Right now, we're in the Golden Age of jungle/d&b, as far as I'm concerned.
New records with exciting new sonic ideas come out all the time, just lke
they did in house and techno years ago.  It can't last forever, and some
jungle sounds have already become old-hat, but there's a lot of innovation
yet to come.  Like anything new, it takes some getting-used-to, but I've
found it very rewarding as both a DJ and listener.

The Ameba crew has championed jungle for the last two years, and I've
made it a point to play at least a track or two in all my public sets
since the end of 1994.  There is so much good stuff coming out now that
it's taking more and more of my set time: I played about half dub and
half jungle at the F&F Point Molate picnic a couple months ago, and
a good half-hour at the beginning of my Insight set in Eugene last
month.  It's good for starting or ending a set, as a break in the middle,
and in longer doses for listening and -- if you have an attentive crowd --
as a dance set as well.

Andrew Ameba told me the other night he thinks jungle is probably a
transitional genre, but that the half-speed bass idea is a very intriguing
and workable one and that we have only begun to see where all this is
evolving.  I tend to agree . . . house and techno have worked through
just about every variation of the four-on-the-floor approach, and perhaps
the example of jungle/d&b will encourage house and techno producers to
start experimenting with loosened-up rhythm patterns.  I keep waiting for
the more complex Caribbean, African and Asian rhythmic patterns to show
up in all of these forms.  We may not see much of that kind of new
synthesis occurring yet, but it almost seems inevitable to me.

Jungle, which uses the rapidly advancing desktop computer-based technology
the way that house and techno used studio analogue and digital equipment,
as a doorway to new sonic and rhythmic ideas, is just the beginning of a
new era of electronic dance music.  

That, and the fact it presses all of my ON buttons musically, is what
interests me and keeps me looking for all the cool new tracks.

Listening to the really great jungle/d&b tracks, once again I've learned
the wisdom of the ascended master of funk, George Clinton:  

Free your mind, and your ass will follow!


phred

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 03:47:02 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 03:46:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: GULFSTREAM V <madox@netcom.com>
Subject: Music (nrr)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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ok, i need some help and advise about music. im about to record my music 
onto DAT, but from there, how do i go about mailing it out to record 
labels and the such in order to have my music released to the public in 
stores?

or, would i have to go to a producer and let the producer take care of 
setting up a deal with a label? 

i dont want to spend my money and have 1000 CD pressed for whatever cost 
and have tons of CDs sitting around my house and collecting dust. also, 
no money to spend on such a novel idea.

please give me ideas on what to do and if you want to help me on my trek, 
it would be greatly appreciated (sp).

thank you :)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 04:17:31 1996
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From: Sami Khoury <khoury@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605081117.EAA00946@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Music (nrr)
To: madox@netcom.com (GULFSTREAM V)
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 04:17:28 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605080315.A17529-0100000@netcom19> from "GULFSTREAM V" at May 8, 96 03:46:58 am
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> ok, i need some help and advise about music. im about to record my music 
> onto DAT, but from there, how do i go about mailing it out to record 
> labels and the such in order to have my music released to the public in 
> stores?

Once you get your stuff to DAT, make cassette tape copies and mail these
to record labels.  Never send DAT copies out, as this provides anyone
the means to make a cd-quality master and completely rip you off.

Getting your material to labels is pretty easy as well (having them
actually listen is another story entirely...).  You can find contact
information for most labels on the web.  This information generally
includes a snail-mail address, fax, phone, contact person, etc.  Of
course, email addresses and URLs are becoming more and more common,
as well.

So just get in touch with the labels you feel will have a niche for
your material and ask them how to go about submitting a demo.  That's
about it.

> or, would i have to go to a producer and let the producer take care of 
> setting up a deal with a label? 

No, this is not strictly necessary.  As far as electronic/computer
music, the notion of a 'producer' breaks down somewhat.  They still
exist, of course, but note how many times you've seen in the liner
notes "All tracks written, produced, and engineered by Whomever".

hope this helps,

	Sami

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 08:08:42 1996
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yo...

i went to a jungle pawty saturday night and although it was kinda small
and in portland traditon not many people were creating a happy vibe, i
saw enormous potential.  the music was smooth and groovy and i learned how
to salsa dance :)

me...

  Tribe of the Solar Mind                           http://www.ahau.com/~shakti
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
   Ahau  *  333 SW Park. Ave # 304  *  Portland, OR 97205  *  (503) 274-8009




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 08:48:05 1996
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Date: 8 May 1996 08:42:01 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Future cabin trips
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        "Eric P. Peterson" <Eric_P#d#_Peterson@quickmail.apple.com>
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         Reply to:   RE>Future cabin trips

This sounds Great!!!  But, isnt there something like a 3 year waiting list to
get a cabin or even a camp site at Yosemite??  I might be wrong about that,
but I seem to remember that when I went with my family a long time ago, we had
reservations a few years in advance.

-M

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/7/96 7:31 PM
To: Mark Camp*
From: Eric P. Peterson
Hey all!

        Steveo suggested I bring up the idea of a Yosemite cabin trip to
take place sometime in June!  Would anyone be interested?  That might be a
better time for people to get away, even though it'll already be into
tourist season, but heck, we'll be tourists, too, of a sort ;)  Will this
one fly?  Does anyone know how to coordinate such an endeavor?

- E



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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Future cabin trips
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 08:59:07 1996
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From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
In-Reply-To: <v01530503adb5eee198b9@[165.227.109.23]>
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On Tue, 7 May 1996, Anarch wrote:

> While serious speed drivers do drive on desert flats in general, the Black
> Rock Desert in particular is not that well-suited because the soil makeup
> is too slippery.  So if you feel like trying for the land speed record for
> 89 Toyota Celicas, or whatever, head east to Bonneville or south to other
> salt flats.  Every serious Burning Man injury I know of has been
> auto-related, and that is one thing that BM can do without.

Incorrect. This years world land speed record attempt will happen at the
Black Rock Desert.

> anarch@scruznet.com
> 
> 

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 09:07:22 1996
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To: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <mdpkl@best.com>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Yosemite Cabin Trip!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>hello all-
>
>i would love to go on another trip with cool sfravers!  i'm going to
>suggest, arbitrarily, the third weekend in june.  that's the 21'st thru 23'rd.
>
>i, matthew d. p. k. lanier, am about to do something really stupid.  here goes-
>
>i'll volunteer to help coordinate this thing if people are interested.  i
>just hope i could follow in steveo's footsteps!  so, why don't people either
>post if they have an interest?
>
>
>hope this works!
>
>peace, love, and yosemite-
>
>matt l

Yeah, Matt, take a leadership role, and you'll be a hero!  :)  I know
Steveo will appreciate everyone's support and participation in helping to
make this go off!  Right, Steveo?

Beats & Blessings,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 09:19:39 1996
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From: "Jacqui Kolarik" <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
Encoding: 6 Text
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Free Tibet-not rave related
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I recently bought tickets for Saturday and Sunday shows.  I must admit, mainly 
because of the music.  This may sound like an ignorant question, especially 
being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  Also, 
does anybody know how much of my hard earned $56 dollars will actually be used 
to help and what kind of help is needed?  I thought it was a valid question to 
this group because there are so many enlightened people on this list.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 09:32:47 1996
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From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Meat Beat Cancelled
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They cancelled :(

>...speaking of beating meat.......
>
>
>Meat Beat Manifesto is playing at Melarkey's tonight in downtown 
>Sacramento!  Go if you live within a 150 mile radius!  Should be cool... 
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 09:45:31 1996
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From: TKagnoff@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 12:44:58 -0400
Message-ID: <960508124458_109294166@emout14.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Bass Instinct or Funky Techno Tribe w/Goldie and Doc Scott???
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I was just wondering where all the junglists are going this friday night. Are
you going to Bass Instinct or Funky Techno Tribe w/Goldie and Doc Scott or
BOTH??? I think i may just have to check out both. On the one hand it's not
every day that the two biggest drum n' bass producers come to play in SF. On
the other, the BASS Kru definately mash it up. BI is $8 and has free mix
tapes for the first 80 people. FTT is probably gonna be $15-20 (if not more,
uhh!), it's 21 and over, and i think its at the sound factory :-P. it's
rumored that stareyes is going to be plaing a mix of happy hardcore w/jungle
at BI. that girl rox! Tomas also is playing at BI. He plays some of the
stoniest beats ever. Flux, abstract,noel, and thad are spinnin the
polyrhythmic chaos as well. i review their tapes in the recent xlr8r. pick it
up! SO, where R U going?



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 09:49:30 1996
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To: "Jacqui Kolarik" <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Tibet was taken over by China in 1959, and much of the culture and
civilation has been destroyed.  To the point that the His Holiness The Dali
Lama and many of the monks from the monistaries had to flee to india where
they live now and attempt to maintain thier culture and lifestyles.  Many of
the monistaries have been destroyed, and I believe (but don't actually know)
that many Tibetans have lost thier lives because of this.  There is much
much more to the story that I do not know about, but I believe Free Tibet is
an organization that provides aid to the Tibetans in India, and brings about
awareness of thier situation to the world.

>This may sound like an ignorant question, especially 
>being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  Also, 
>does anybody know how much of my hard earned $56 dollars will actually be used 
>to help and what kind of help is needed?  

I don't know, but I would think probably most of it. 

Rick



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 09:54:03 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: Bass Instinct or ???
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[ to sfraves list ]

 A recent post to SFRaves -
> From: TKagnoff@aol.com
> Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 12:44:58 -0400
> Subject: Bass Instinct or Funky Techno Tribe w/Goldie and Doc Scott???
> 
> I was just wondering where all the junglists are going this friday night. Are
> you going to Bass Instinct or Funky Techno Tribe w/Goldie and Doc Scott or
> BOTH??? 

 My heart and my wallet says go to Bass Instinct -

> ... the BASS Kru definately mash it up. BI is $8 and has free mix
> tapes for the first 80 people. FTT is probably gonna be $15-20 (if not more,
> uhh!), it's 21 and over, and i think its at the sound factory :-P. it's
> rumored that stareyes is going to be plaing a mix of happy hardcore w/jungle
> at BI. that girl rox! Tomas also is playing at BI. He plays some of the
> stoniest beats ever. Flux, abstract,noel, and thad are spinnin the
> polyrhythmic chaos as well. i review their tapes in the recent xlr8r. pick it
> up! SO, where R U going?
 
 Haven't heard Stareyes or Thad live in awhile - and I'm an early bird, so
one of those free mix tapes may come my way! Bass Instinct it is ...

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 10:07:38 1996
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From: sequoia1@ix.netcom.com (Chris Chervin )
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
To: "Jacqui Kolarik" <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
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You wrote: 
>
>I recently bought tickets for Saturday and Sunday shows.  I must 
admit, mainly 
>because of the music.  This may sound like an ignorant question, 
especially 
>being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  
Also, 

This is as I know it.  Please correct me if I'm wrong or misled:

Tibet, sometime in the past century (I believe) was forcefully taken 
over by China.  Tibet previously was a very peaceful Buddhist country 
and really had no way to stop China's invasion.  Since than hundreds of 
thousands of Buddhists, including the Dali Lama (sp?) have been living 
in exhile in India.  

Meanwhile in Tibet the chinese have been moving in.  They are literaly 
wiping out the Tibetian culture by bringing in there own culture and 
pushing out the old ways.  The whole thing is a pretty Fucked up deal.  
I believe that is why you may see signs to boycott China.

love chris

"Free Tibet"

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 10:29:56 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
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>Meanwhile in Tibet the chinese have been moving in.  They are literaly
>wiping out the Tibetian culture by bringing in there own culture and
>pushing out the old ways.  The whole thing is a pretty Fucked up deal.
>I believe that is why you may see signs to boycott China.
>
>love chris
>
Isn't it great that China, #1 human rights violator in the world, gets
most-favored-nation trade status with the US?  Makes me feel ashamed to be
a citizen...

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 10:48:48 1996
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From: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
Subject: buttercups
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god, i am soo envious, you guys have it so sweet over there in your lil 
hippy pit!!!!!  picnics and sunsets and cabintrips and probably sun all day 
long...
*HI* thx (i'll be emailing you tomorrow because i been 
super busy and now my dog is whining she wants to leave); hi tim, thats great
your bbq worked out so well; where is michael mccusty?; hi everybody, here's a 
post from  ..germany. 
love, ulrike


****************************************************************************
we can forgive a man for making a useful thing as long as he doesn't admire 
it.
the only excuse for making a useless thing is that one admires it intensely.
****************************************************************************


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 10:49:00 1996
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Date: 8 May 1996 10:44:17 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: VERY NRR-SmashMouth!-BSP
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Please dont flame me for this *Very* non rave related post, but its for a good
cause!

My brothers band, SmashMouth, is playing tonight at the Edge in Palo Alto.
They are your typical KOME/Live105-ish alternative band.  But a million times
better than most of the stuff thats played on those stations.  They are
getting alot of airplay on KOME and KROQ down in LA.  And, they are on the
verge of being signed.  I predict these guys will be the next Pearl Jam!  

So if your bored tonight and want to see a good "alternative rock" band, head
on out to the Edge.

Flame away,

-M 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:17:37 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 11:21:00 -0600
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: SCO record release party
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Single Cell Orchestra record release party tonight @ Cafe Du Nord. Live
performance by SCO v Freaky Chakra, downtempo like.

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:30:57 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 11:25:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Question:  Has anyone ever seen or participated in a slam/mosh pit at a 
rave?  I'm curious because a friend from LA says that he's seen them 
break out on at least a couple of occasions with hardcore dj Ron D. Core 
at the helms.  I must say that i'd be a little surprised to find out about 
this happening in the Bay Area -- though I have, on a couple of occasions, 
seen a fella who didn't know what was up attempting to do this.

I know that this is FAR from the norm down there, but still, it's a curious 
phenomenon that has mostly to do, I think, with a certain cross-over 
element not really knowing exactly how to respond to the hectic beats.  
Personally, I would love to see mosh pits in the Bay Area.  I dream of 
getting a little physical down there near the dj booth, tightening the 
muscles and turning the machismo on overdrive as I watch mini-packbacks 
and lollipops fly up into the laser-lit air (just kidding ;).  -Rok.

(Acutally, to be fair, moshing needn't be overly physical -- just tends 
to get that way when certain people feel like upping the ante, thereby 
diminishing the collective experience and the amount of people willing 
and/or able to participate.)      




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:31:00 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 11:26:55 -0700
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From: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Subject: Roots???
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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My roommates are trying to convince me to check out "Roots" in the 
basement of 1015 tonight.  Has anyone been?  Is it worth the trip? 

-SUNNY


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:45:09 1996
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Date: 08 May 96 14:40:12 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Stupid questions?
Message-ID: <960508184012_71165.755_GHL6-2@CompuServe.COM>
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Jacqui Kolarik asked a question about Tibet saying ... "This may sound like an
ignorant question,...."


I'd just like to say there is no such thing as an ignorant question, when
sincerely asked ....   (and I was enlightened with the answers to your question,
so I'm glad you asked it!)


....and I hope you all agree, 'cause I'm sure I'm saving up some of the
stupidest, most obvious questions, and one day I'll spring them on everyone, and
hope they bear with me!   (hint: they'll probably be about some obscure
description of music...)

L  ; )


p.s.  We're still waiting to hear from some of the lurkers who I met this
weekend, who PROMISED to make their first posts this week!  You know who you
are... and so do I .....


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:47:14 1996
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Date: Wed, 08 May 1996 11:49:41 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
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At 11:25 AM 5/8/96 -0700, you wrote:
>
>Question:  Has anyone ever seen or participated in a slam/mosh pit at a 
>rave?  

Wow! I had to sit and think on that. I personally wouldn't want anyone
slamming into me. I do think that having hundreds of hands and fingers
moving your whole body everywhere might feel kinda cool if you were
indulging that night. But If I was really into the music I don't think I'd
like to have someone over my head and holding them. I personaly don't think
a slam/mosh pit has a place at a rave. 

Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:51:59 1996
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From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: well, yosemite might work! (please read me!)
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hello all-

over the past day, i've gotten many responses from people who say they would
come to a yosemite trip.  so, i ask the following favors of the sfraves
community:

1)could anyone else who is interested mail me asap?

2)could anyone who has experience making reservation with yosemite also
contact me?


i think it would be great to get this off the ground!!!


hope to hear from you all soon!

peace, love, and yosemite-

matt l.
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:52:27 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
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>(Acutally, to be fair, moshing needn't be overly physical -- just tends
>to get that way when certain people feel like upping the ante, thereby
>diminishing the collective experience and the amount of people willing
>and/or able to participate.)

Which, to me, contradicts the spirit of the (sf)rave scene.  I'd rather hug
a body than slam into it any day!

Easily bruised,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:54:21 1996
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Date: 8 May 1996 11:48:34 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno M
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, "Kyung Rok" <Kyung_Rok@quickmail.apple.com>
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         Reply to:   RE>Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?

hmmm, I would not be into the moshing thing.  Imagine being off in your own
world grooving with your eyes closed and suddenly being slammed in the face by
someone doing a stage dive off the 1200's.  Would not be cool.  Plus, this
would take up way too much dance floor space, especially right infront of the
DJ.  

-M

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/8/96 11:37 AM
To: Mark Camp*
From: Kyung Rok

Question:  Has anyone ever seen or participated in a slam/mosh pit at a 
rave?  I'm curious because a friend from LA says that he's seen them 
break out on at least a couple of occasions with hardcore dj Ron D. Core 
at the helms.  I must say that i'd be a little surprised to find out about 
this happening in the Bay Area -- though I have, on a couple of occasions, 
seen a fella who didn't know what was up attempting to do this.

I know that this is FAR from the norm down there, but still, it's a curious 
phenomenon that has mostly to do, I think, with a certain cross-over 
element not really knowing exactly how to respond to the hectic beats.  
Personally, I would love to see mosh pits in the Bay Area.  I dream of 
getting a little physical down there near the dj booth, tightening the 
muscles and turning the machismo on overdrive as I watch mini-packbacks 
and lollipops fly up into the laser-lit air (just kidding ;).  -Rok.

(Acutally, to be fair, moshing needn't be overly physical -- just tends 
to get that way when certain people feel like upping the ante, thereby 
diminishing the collective experience and the amount of people willing 
and/or able to participate.)      




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From: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 11:59:03 1996
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Date: Wed, 08 May 1996 11:59:18 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
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don't you hate it when you accidently reply to a person when you meant to
reply to the list?? grr.. here it is, anyway.

>>>Question:  Has anyone ever seen or participated in a slam/mosh pit at a 
>>>rave?  
>>Wow! I had to sit and think on that. I personally wouldn't want anyone
>>slamming into me. I do think that having hundreds of hands and fingers
>
>well, mosh pits don't neccesarily have to be those kill-fests that you see
at concerts and such. back in the old days before grunge had become popular,
all the locals and i used to have mosh pits where everyone was just swaying,
moving around, and gently bumping into each other. kind of like a
transferral of the energy or vibe...
>it was only when grunge got cool and all the frat boys jumped in that the
mosh pits started getting violent. not surprisingly, this is when i got
turned off grunge and discovered rave.
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 12:06:21 1996
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Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
Date: Wed, 8 May 96 12:04:32 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Aleph One, aleph1@dfw.net wrote:
>Incorrect. This years world land speed record attempt will happen at the
>Black Rock Desert.

I'm sure that a genuine speed record attempt will be undertaken by people 
who know what they're doing and can organize themselves to make their 
effort without endangering the other attendees.  The land speed record 
remark was really directed at those who come out to the desert and find 
the wide-open spaces an irresistible temptation to get wasted and race 
around in the dark without knowing where the hell they're going.  Don't 
do it!

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 12:20:40 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 12:20:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: well, yosemite might work! (please read me!)
To: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605081851.LAA11507@taz.hyperreal.com>
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Hey guys!

I would love to go, although I am not sure if I will be able to make it 
in June.  I am planning to go to Croatia 6/6 - 6/24, so if it is in that 
time frame :(...  Oh, well.  Just let me know what the exact date is.

Hugz,
Branka

On Wed, 8 May 1996, matthew d. p. k. lanier wrote:

> hello all-
> 
> over the past day, i've gotten many responses from people who say they would
> come to a yosemite trip.  so, i ask the following favors of the sfraves
> community:
> 
> 1)could anyone else who is interested mail me asap?
> 
> 2)could anyone who has experience making reservation with yosemite also
> contact me?
> 
> 
> i think it would be great to get this off the ground!!!
> 
> 
> hope to hear from you all soon!
> 
> peace, love, and yosemite-
> 
> matt l.
> matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
> lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
>                                   /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
> home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
>                                 /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
>                                /   ++++   \
> "i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
> window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
> unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
> saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
> reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
> the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
> the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
> the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
> for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
> and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
> would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."
> 
>      -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 12:31:22 1996
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To: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>well, mosh pits don't neccesarily have to be those kill-fests that you see
>at concerts and such. back in the old days before grunge had become popular,
>all the locals and i used to have mosh pits where everyone was just swaying,
>moving around, and gently bumping into each other. kind of like a
>transferral of the energy or vibe...
>>it was only when grunge got cool and all the frat boys jumped in that the
>mosh pits started getting violent. not surprisingly, this is when i got
>turned off grunge and discovered rave.
>>
No, moshing started with metal, dude.  Especially speed metal.  And that
was WAY before the weak genre of grunge started.  Grunge mosh pits were
pale imitations of true mosh pits, at such concerts as Exodus, Anthrax, and
Slayer.  Spikes, chains, and leather abounded, and people got HURT!
It was at a Testament opener to an Iron Maiden show a few years ago, when
lead singer Chuck Billy, seeing the action in the crowd, said (yelling):
"Push somebody!  [voice down an octave] HURT 'EM!!!"  That is what moshing
is all about.

Here endeth the lesson.

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 12:36:11 1996
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From: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Burning Man!!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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> >Incorrect. This years world land speed record attempt will happen at the
> >Black Rock Desert.

For those who decide this year to put the pedal to the metal at BM, 
please pay attention to which way the wind is blowing, and how close 
you are to other people.   Excess dust in the nostrils, eyes, and ears 
can get tedious for the otherwise happy-go-lucky disposition.  

Thanks, Rok. 
  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 12:44:08 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 12:44:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Dimitri K Gortinsky <myself@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
To: Jacqui Kolarik <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9604088315.AA831572342@ccgate.ssi.sony.com>
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On Wed, 8 May 1996, Jacqui Kolarik wrote:

> I recently bought tickets for Saturday and Sunday shows.  I must admit, mainly 
> because of the music.  This may sound like an ignorant question, especially 
> being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  Also, 
> does anybody know how much of my hard earned $56 dollars will actually be used 
> to help and what kind of help is needed?  I thought it was a valid question to 
> this group because there are so many enlightened people on this list.
> 
> 
as far as i know tibet is 'part' of china and under chinas laws...tibet 
is currently trying to become autonomous from china. the money will 
probably go to milrepea (sp?) an organization started or helped by adam 
youch aka mca ....at the end of the b-boys video, sabatoge, their is a 
small piece on milrepea (sp?)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 12:50:52 1996
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From: Dimitri K Gortinsky <myself@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: bassinstinct
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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does anyone know in what general area of the bay area this party will be 
in?..im in santa cruz and would like to know how far i might have to drive
thanks much
dimitri

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 12:55:33 1996
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From: Corey_Johnson@krinfo.com (Corey Johnson)
Subject: Burning Man vs. commerical media incursion.
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     --Informed people--
     
     I'm just wondering if anyone close to the Burning Man organization can 
     confirm that MTV will be attending this year, and if so, what measures 
     will be taken to ensure that their presence does not contaminate the 
     event.  I was happily preparing to send in my early registration form 
     when word of this unfortunate development reached me.  The fellow 
     responsible for this assertion claimed to be in close contact with BM 
     planners.  He also added that contingencies are being drawn up to 
     accomodate as many as 10,000 attendees.  
     
     Aside from my concerns about maintaining the integrity of Burning Man 
     and fighting attempts to commodify its impact on the mediascape, I am 
     even more troubled by what effect all of this might have on the 
     character of the playa.  For instance, will there be a constant police 
     presence on site, or will they stick to occasional patrols as they did 
     last year?  Will it be necessary to impose more structure on the 
     layout of the camp and control parking/traffic conditions?  Will the 
     rave camps have to be more subdued than previous years?  The more I 
     think about it, the more it begins to sound like the suburbs.  Yuck.  
     If anyone can dispel (or confirm) these reports, please share your 
     valuable knowledge with the rest of us.  Thanks,
     
     Corey
     
     ps- My apologies if this has been discussed already.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 13:20:31 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605082020.NAA02685@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: hard copy tonite (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I got this off socal-raves.  I assume the same episode is on tonight in SF.
See what the sensationalistic mass media's latest take on the rave scene
is.  Have a tissue handy.

-troy

> 
> checked the listing:
> 
> 7:00 on kcbs channel 2:  Hard Copy: "teen party fad"
> 
> so THATS what a rave is ;)
> 
> Dave Scruton
> 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 13:24:17 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 13:24:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
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Yes! I am - I love slamming into masses of bodies, risking bloody noses
and the like to have a macho group grope of sorts.  I actually particpated
in a mosh pit at a grateful dead concert once and it was one of the
funnest things ever.  As long as everyone is lighthearted and laughing it
can be great.


But then again, I a reformed college rugby player so there you go..

	** jess **

 On Wed, 8 May 1996, Kyung Rok wrote:

> 
> Question:  Has anyone ever seen or participated in a slam/mosh pit at a 
> rave?  I'm curious because a friend from LA says that he's seen them 
> break out on at least a couple of occasions with hardcore dj Ron D. Core 
> at the helms.  I must say that i'd be a little surprised to find out about 
> this happening in the Bay Area -- though I have, on a couple of occasions, 
> seen a fella who didn't know what was up attempting to do this.
> 
> I know that this is FAR from the norm down there, but still, it's a curious 
> phenomenon that has mostly to do, I think, with a certain cross-over 
> element not really knowing exactly how to respond to the hectic beats.  
> Personally, I would love to see mosh pits in the Bay Area.  I dream of 
> getting a little physical down there near the dj booth, tightening the 
> muscles and turning the machismo on overdrive as I watch mini-packbacks 
> and lollipops fly up into the laser-lit air (just kidding ;).  -Rok.
> 
> (Acutally, to be fair, moshing needn't be overly physical -- just tends 
> to get that way when certain people feel like upping the ante, thereby 
> diminishing the collective experience and the amount of people willing 
> and/or able to participate.)      
> 
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 13:28:02 1996
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From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: Mark Camp* <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
cc: sfr <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, Kyung Rok <Kyung_Rok@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno M
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> 
> hmmm, I would not be into the moshing thing.  Imagine being off in your own
> world grooving with your eyes closed and suddenly being slammed in the face by
> someone doing a stage dive off the 1200's.  Would not be cool.  Plus, this
 
	OK I see your point.  I'll just have to slam into my friends when
I see them before the rave.  :)

	** jess **



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 13:42:05 1996
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From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Mosh pit
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> 
> hmmm, I would not be into the moshing thing.  Imagine being off in your own
> world grooving with your eyes closed and suddenly being slammed in the face by
> someone doing a stage dive off the 1200's.  Would not be cool.  Plus, this
 
	OK I see your point.  I'll just have to slam into my friends when
I see them before the rave.  :)

	** jess **




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 13:50:00 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 13:49:42 -0800
To: Corey_Johnson@krinfo.com (Corey Johnson), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: tony@xinet.COM (Tony Rotundo)
Subject: Re: Burning Man vs. commerical media incursion. PRR
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[PRR = Partly Rave Related]

Your questions and comments would be better directed to the Burning Man
newsgroup:

burnman-list@well.com

However, my take on it is this:   Last year, before I got convinced
otherwise, I was not going to attend, and part of that decision was due to
the fact that I heard that MTV was going to be there.  Boy am I glad I was
talked into going!  Not only didn't I see MTV, I didn't see much in the way
of mass media.  I know the organizers are strict about the level of media
production going on there.

As for MTV actually having a large scale presence there, I am alight with
the thought of people climbing over each other to set any stage they may
erect on fire.  No lie!

Tony

P.S.  Your questions about structure of the camps and layout and all
that...If you've been there you know you could easily, and without
question, move "out of the suburbs and into the country."  I heard this
year there are going to be some condos going up around the hot springs.
;^)


At 12:34 PM 5/8/96, Corey Johnson wrote:
>
>     --Informed people--
>
>     I'm just wondering if anyone close to the Burning Man organization can
>     confirm that MTV will be attending this year, and if so, what measures
>     will be taken to ensure that their presence does not contaminate the
>     event.  I was happily preparing to send in my early registration form
>     when word of this unfortunate development reached me.  The fellow
>     responsible for this assertion claimed to be in close contact with BM
>     planners.  He also added that contingencies are being drawn up to
>     accomodate as many as 10,000 attendees.
>
>     Aside from my concerns about maintaining the integrity of Burning Man
>     and fighting attempts to commodify its impact on the mediascape, I am
>     even more troubled by what effect all of this might have on the
>     character of the playa.  For instance, will there be a constant police
>     presence on site, or will they stick to occasional patrols as they did
>     last year?  Will it be necessary to impose more structure on the
>     layout of the camp and control parking/traffic conditions?  Will the
>     rave camps have to be more subdued than previous years?  The more I
>     think about it, the more it begins to sound like the suburbs.  Yuck.
>     If anyone can dispel (or confirm) these reports, please share your
>     valuable knowledge with the rest of us.  Thanks,
>
>     Corey
>
>     ps- My apologies if this has been discussed already.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 14:08:07 1996
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From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: Re: Burning Man vs. commerical media incursion.
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I hope and pray this  aint so!! maybe a rumor, anyone in the know, know?
MTV is the lowest and most insulting  form of entertainment I have ever seen.

Mark
>     
>     --Informed people--
>     
>     I'm just wondering if anyone close to the Burning Man organization can 
>     confirm that MTV will be attending this year, and if so, what measures 
>     will be taken to ensure that their presence does not contaminate the 
>     event.  I was happily preparing to send in my early registration form 
>     when word of this unfortunate development reached me.  The fellow 
>     responsible for this assertion claimed to be in close contact with BM 
>     planners.  He also added that contingencies are being drawn up to 
>     accomodate as many as 10,000 attendees.  
>     
>     Aside from my concerns about maintaining the integrity of Burning Man 
>     and fighting attempts to commodify its impact on the mediascape, I am 
>     even more troubled by what effect all of this might have on the 
>     character of the playa.  For instance, will there be a constant police 
>     presence on site, or will they stick to occasional patrols as they did 
>     last year?  Will it be necessary to impose more structure on the 
>     layout of the camp and control parking/traffic conditions?  Will the 
>     rave camps have to be more subdued than previous years?  The more I 
>     think about it, the more it begins to sound like the suburbs.  Yuck.  
>     If anyone can dispel (or confirm) these reports, please share your 
>     valuable knowledge with the rest of us.  Thanks,
>     
>     Corey
>     
>     ps- My apologies if this has been discussed already.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 14:12:37 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 17:12:05 -0400
Message-ID: <960508171203_487007685@emout16.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Trips & Treats-SFR Help Needed
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Calling All Sfravers,
I was just thinking.. (uh...),  I suppose I've managed to find some cool
cabins & party spots, but with the combined resources of sfraves, who know
what we could come up with!!  SO, keep your peepers posted, ear in on
conversations, whatever, but whenever you hear about a cool spot or some see
some prime vacation property for rent in the paper, write it down, and throw
yourself a party or at least put it out on the list, for someone else like
myself to snatch up and expolit for communal benefit.  ; ] 
Love,
Steveo
P.S. Looks like Matt (lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu) [Thank you Matt!!]  will be
doing the address collection for Yosemite, be sure to send him any dates that
will or wont work for you.  Also be sure that you have a serious interest,
having things come up is totally understandable, but it's frustrating when
people sign up then you never hear from them again.  Keep us informed of your
situation.
P.S.S.  Yes, yosemite is a total madhouse and a bitch to get into in the
summer, but there are tricks, we may have to look for a place outside the
park. No Worries, yah.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 15:54:25 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 15:54:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Jacqui Kolarik <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
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Also another question- who will be performing there?
                Reagan




On Wed, 8 May 1996, Jacqui Kolarik wrote:

> I recently bought tickets for Saturday and Sunday shows.  I must admit, mainly 
> because of the music.  This may sound like an ignorant question, especially 
> being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  Also, 
> does anybody know how much of my hard earned $56 dollars will actually be used 
> to help and what kind of help is needed?  I thought it was a valid question to 
> this group because there are so many enlightened people on this list.
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 15:55:49 1996
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From: Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress <mswietzke@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy and Desert Raves
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I just watched the show Hard Copy and the segment on raves.  Wow!  What a
laugh.  I think it will be on again at 7pm tonight on CBS.  

This 5 minute segment talked about how raves are all about "boozing and
doing nitrous".  This segment seemed to show all the negative parts of a
rave and talked about all these people who died from going to raves.  

The funniest thing was that the reporter said that raves moved from the
cities to deserts because of the gang warfare and the driveby shootings.

oh well...
{:~D   Matt

 _____     ____    _____   _____             ____  ____  ____   ____
|     \   /    \  |       |          |   /  |     |     |    | |
|_____/  |______| |_____  |_____     |_ /   |____ |____ |____| |____
|     \  |      |       |       |    |  \   |     |     |           |
|_____/  |      |  _____|  _____|    |   \  |____ |____ |       ____|     
   _______                            _____   _____
      |    |     |  |     | |\    /| |     |    |     |\   |  /
      |    |_____|  |     | | \  / | |_____|    |     | \  |    
      |    |     |  |     | |  \/  | |          |     |  \ | 
      |    |     |  |_____| |      | |        __|__   |   \|  


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 16:09:32 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: Dimitri K Gortinsky <myself@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: Jacqui Kolarik <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605081246.A8923-0100000@si.UCSC.EDU>
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Dear Friends & Family,

My computer tells me that on Wed, 8 May 1996, Jacqui Kolarik asked:
> 
> > I recently bought tickets for Saturday and Sunday shows.  I must admit, mainly 
> > because of the music.  This may sound like an ignorant question, especially 
> > being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  Also, 
> > does anybody know how much of my hard earned $56 dollars will actually be used 
> > to help and what kind of help is needed?  I thought it was a valid question to 
> > this group because there are so many enlightened people on this list.

...and Dmitri K. Gortinsky responded:

> as far as i know tibet is 'part' of china and under chinas laws...tibet 
> is currently trying to become autonomous from china. the money will 
> probably go to milrepea (sp?) an organization started or helped by adam 
> youch aka mca ....at the end of the b-boys video, sabatoge, their is a 
> small piece on milrepea (sp?)

	Tibet was an independent country during the first half of this 
century.  Following the communist takeover of China in 1949, China 
invaded Tibet the next year in 1950, and has controlled the country ever 
since, claiming it is part of China.
	Amnesty International and other human rights groups have 
condemned Chinese human rights abuses against the people of Tibet.
	An Associated Press article in the Chronicle (5/30/95) states:

"China has imprisoned and often tortured hundreds of Tibetan 
independence supporters during the past two years, including children, 
Amnesty International said in a report to be released today."

	The article also relates:

"In violation of both Chinese and international law, children have been 
reportedly held incommunicado, denied trials, beaten, made to do heavy 
labor with adults, and subjected to electric shocks," Amnesty 
International reported.

It cited the case of a 12-year-old girl from the Tibetan capital of Lhasa 
who lost the use of an arm and a leg after being beaten with electric 
batons and forced to work digging excrement and loading it onto trucks."

	I don't know anything about the "Free Tibet" event, or where the 
money would go, but I think the situation in Tibet pretty much speaks for 
itself as far as the legitimacy of Tibetans' desires for independence are 
concerned.

				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 16:31:05 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 16:30:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19960508184941.006771c8@email.org>
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On Wed, 8 May 1996, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:

> At 11:25 AM 5/8/96 -0700, you wrote:
> >
> >Question:  Has anyone ever seen or participated in a slam/mosh pit at a 
> >rave?  
> 
> Wow! I had to sit and think on that. I personally wouldn't want anyone
> slamming into me. I do think that having hundreds of hands and fingers
> moving your whole body everywhere might feel kinda cool if you were
> indulging that night. But If I was really into the music I don't think I'd
> like to have someone over my head and holding them. I personaly don't think
> a slam/mosh pit has a place at a rave. 
> 
> Tim (knucklehead)
> 
> At a small rave that I was at, there formed a mosh pit. The slamming
becuase people were indulging that nhight turned more into a hard touch
fest and it was intense.  i enjoyed it except that after a while a couple
of people started getting very agressive as the night worn on becuse they
were getting to wound up in a vibe that was based on agression. the
movements people were making to each other were by nature of the pit 
intrusive and that built up a very weird vibe that was not very loving but
instead almost led to a couple of fights (i must qualify that there were
two groups of people there that knew each other a long time and did not
normally get along). 

I personally did not like a pit at a rave; i'd rather go to another type
of concert where agressionwas expected to be the vibe and the pit the
environment to let it out.  A rave to me is not about that vibe.

Cassandra   


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 16:49:35 1996
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Date: Wed, 08 May 96 16:48:07 PST
From: "Jacqui Kolarik" <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
Encoding: 35 Text
Message-Id: <9604088315.AA831599342@ccgate.ssi.sony.com>
To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re[2]: Free Tibet-not rave related
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Saturday, June 15th:  Beastie Boys, The Smashing Pumpkins, A Tribe Called Quest, 
John Lee Hooker, Hugh Masekela, Foo Fighters, Biz Markie, Pavement, Cibo Matto, 
Richie Havens, Chaksam-Pa

Sunday, June 16th (my b-day!) :  Red Hot Chili Peppers, Fugees, Bjork, 
Skatalites, Rage Against The Machine, De La Soul, Beck (solo), Sonic Youth, Yoko 
Ono/IMA, Buddy Guy, Chaksam-Pa.

I also see that there is an info line 1-888-MILAREPA and a web site at http://
www.milarepa.org.
_______________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
From:    Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net> at Internet
Date:    5/8/96  3:54 PM

 
Also another question- who will be performing there?
                Reagan




On Wed, 8 May 1996, Jacqui Kolarik wrote:

> I recently bought tickets for Saturday and Sunday shows.  I must admit, mainly

> because of the music.  This may sound like an ignorant question, especially 
> being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  Also, 
> does anybody know how much of my hard earned $56 dollars will actually be used

> to help and what kind of help is needed?  I thought it was a valid question to

> this group because there are so many enlightened people on this list.
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 16:52:44 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 16:52:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFR laminates/Cabin Trips
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Dear StevO,

	If you want a new SFR laminate, go for it!  I think some new ones 
would be neat too.  I don't see any reason we need a standard design, I 
think it would be fun if there were many different designs.  I've thought 
of the idea before myself.
	I doubt that Vince consulted a bunch of people before making up 
the current one, he probably just felt creative and decided it would be a 
cool thing to do.  But that's just my guess.
	A laminate incorporating a smile might be neat, since one rarely sees a 
plastic smile on a raver.  ;)

P.S. - I'm bummed there was another cabin trip I couldn't make... I want 
to go!  Yosemite sounds fun too... if you're organizing anything else Steve, 
count me interested!

Groovily yours,
				<<< Starchild >>> 


On Tue, 7 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:

> I can't control myself,  yes I love my laminate and wear it proudly, but I
> can't tell ya'll how many nightsI've sat up dreaming about a new sfr laminate
> design!!  I am all for the idea, who do we talk to??  As far as diversity of
> designs, well, yes, but, the idea is to assist in recognition, in turn, to
> encourage communication among us.  Maybe a couple designs, but they would
> need some obviously recognizable element.  Let's gather more input.  I know
> some people might think we're nuts here, but dont' loose faith "VIVA LA NEW
> LOGO!"
> Steveo
> Independent Graphics
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 16:54:46 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 16:48:04 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: fritz@hooked.net (Greg-n-Cindy)
Subject: Pulp Fiction
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>>From carter@tab.com Mon May  6 23:25:13 1996
>Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 00:20:45 -0500
>X-Sender: carter@tab.com (Unverified)
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>To: (Recipient list suppressed)
>From: carter@tab.com (J. Carter Vincent, III)
>Subject: Pulp Fiction
>
>Hi Folks,
>
>Just a quick request. A friend here in Austin is a remarkable artist, and
>he is getting ready to enter a painting contest, the theme being, quite
>simply, Pulp Fiction. We are working on figuring out what people's
>perceptions of "Pulp Fiction" are, and what visual images this phrase
>brings to mind. If you feel like humoring me and helping an artist, please
>give me your impressions/ideas ASAP.
>
>Muchas Gracias...
>
>
>J. Carter Vincent, III
>Hacienda La Minita
>2901 Barton Skyway #2807
>Austin, TX 78746
>Work: 512-347-0232
>Home: 512-347-0242
>

Peace & positivity,
GnC



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 17:05:22 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 17:03:45 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Harmony Review #1001  :)
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Anyone have the patience for another Harmony review?  ;)

I'm flooded with finals and papers right now, this is my first time
checking mail since ** LAST WEEK! ** (tough to break a daily habit!), and
last week I had told myself, no way, you have to be responsible, no Harmony
for you!

But 3 am Friday rolled around, and instead of sleeping soundly with my head
on an open textbook, where did I find myself?  On a dancefloor in the
middle of a crowd of happy people, jumping up and down, waving glow sticks
in the air!  Now, how did that happen?

First time at the Deli.  The limitations of the space are obvious, but
props to Harmony for transforming a deli/bar with attitude into a big
cuddly lovepit!   Funny moment: the security guard at the door telling me,
"I have to check your backpack!", looking for, oh, guns, knives, drugs (ha,
he shoulda looked in my shoe), opening it and exclaiming in utter surprise,
"oranges?!"  :) :)   The owners looked a little perplexed at the whole
scene as well.  They were probably wondering, how come no-one's buying
alcohol??!   The decorations were BEAUTIFUL, the sound was awesome, the
size of the crowd was perfect (hope Harmony didn't lose money on this one).
THANK YOU HARMONY!

I brought a newbie - a sweet, open, friendly Deadhead - and spent the night
leading him by the hand, showing him what I see.  We danced with happy
people, we drew with markers, we ate oranges, we thrust our hands into the
best head of hair at the party (the guy with huge, bleached, teased-out
afro - no, it wasn't a wig!!), we banged on drums, we hugged people, we got
adorned with stickers.  Someone placed one on him that read
"non-returnable," and he turned to me and said, "Non-returnable!  There's
no going back now!!"  And I smiled and told him that at a first rave
someone either gets it or they don't, and you can tell when someone gets it
because they will turn to you and say something that makes it obvious, and
that his statement definitely qualified!

My one regret, which is my usual regret, is that I didn't spend more time
with people, especially all of you!  Somehow, at parties, my capacity for
speech leaves me, my memory deserts me, and I unconsciously absorb hours
and hours by mainly dancing.   I haven't been much of a chill-room person.
The night always whizzes by in a haze, I meet people whose names dissolve
into a blur, and others I mean to spend time with somehow doesn't happen.
I see by the reviews that I missed many toys and people!  :(

But the reviews teach me, again, how a rave is all WHAT YOU MAKE IT.  It is
what you bring to it - a lesson for life.  Everyone who posted a review
created their own amazing experience through their positive energy, their
contribution, their creativity, toys, fruit, presents, their friendliness.
The rave is merely a unique atmosphere where the effect of your energy will
be immediately apparent.  In the "real world" it is difficult to see the
connection between your attitude and your experience, but the rave provides
a testing ground where what you put out will be returned instantaneously, a
thousand-fold.  Immediate Karma.   Proof that consciousness becomes
reality, that love and joy and happiness are manifested first from  our own
hearts, if we choose to create it.  :)   All of you proved that to me
again!  I love all of you happy ravers!!

In answer to some of you, yes, my raverboy was there.   He is easy to spot.
Look for a tall guy with a big silly grin and a jester hat, bouncing up
and down.  :)

Am disappearing now for a week...will re-emerge to seriously get down this
summer!!   Good-bye for now.  Love, Nancy






From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 19:14:38 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 19:14:17 PDT
Subject: Hard Copy story on Raves
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Anyone have any opinions on this one?
 
Tim (knucklehead)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 19:16:09 1996
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Date: Wed, 08 May 1996 19:15:59 -0800 (PST)
From: JONAS THE ESKIMO BOY <HANNING@SONOMA.EDU>
Subject: Hard Copy report on raves!!!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Whoa people. Just saw the worst report on the "drugfilled" and "new" teen
attraction...outdoor raves. First of all, hearing someone talking about outdoor
raves as something new pissed me off, since that's how it all started. At least
in Europe. And since when is teens taking drugs and getting drunk something
that's specific to raves? That happens every day in the dorms at my lovely
educational facility. ;) But then again, this was Hard Copy, what was I to
expect. It's just sad.

reeeespect, jonas

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 19:18:38 1996
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From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: nw-raves@hyperreal.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: (NRR) how about that tim leary??
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just found out that Timothy Leary is termially ill ... and so he has 
planned to commit suicide LIVE on the internet.  I don't care how big an 
icon he is, this to me seems to be in somewhat poor taste, to say the 
least.  It's all fine and good to want to take control of your own demise 
if you'd otherwise end up a bed-and-painridden vegetable, but to broadcast 
it???

sorry, just had to rant a little.  and i'm interested in other folks 
comments.  believe me, if i had his email address handy i'd rant to him 
too :)

k


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 19:24:53 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 19:24:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Ha!!!!
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  Dear all,

  When someone earlier today had said that there was going
to be a segmet about raves on 'Hard Copy' tonight, I just had to tune in.
They focused on the desert raves of SoCal. A home movie camera showed 
some well! you guessed it ravers. They went on to describe these parties 
in words like out of control, booze orgies; asking where are the parents.
They basically compaired this "new" thing to Woodstock, where the drug of 
choice is nitrous.
 Oh my God, I was ROTFL. Did anyone else cath this report? When I see 
these sad reports it makes me appreciate the rave scene even more because 
I know what the real story is and what truly goes on at "those kind of 
parties".
  Just my $0.02
 Reagan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 19:27:13 1996
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From: ephedra@netcom.com (ephedrina)
Message-Id: <199605090225.TAA23268@netcom13.netcom.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (sfravers)
Subject: NON RAVE-RELATED: Economist Ecstasy Article (fwd)
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BETTER THAN WELL
The Economist, April 6th 1996

Society's moral confusion over drugs is neatly illustrated by its differing 
reactions to Prozac and ecstasy

Every week, according to the most conservative estimates, half a million 
Britons take a pill to make them happy.  This pill was originally developed as 
an appetite suppressor.  Now it is an adjunct to partying.  In America, some 5m 
people regularly take a different sort of pill.  This one was developed as an 
anti-depressant.  Now it is widely used as a chemical accessory by those who 
think it is unfair that they should ever feel low.

The British users are breaking their country's law.  The Americans are not.  
Which raises an important question.  If it is not acceptable to take a drug 
with the awkward name of 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (better known as 
MDMA, and even better known as ecstasy) to make you feel happy when you just 
want to have fun, why is it acceptable to take the anti-depressant fluoxetine 
(better known as Prozac) to make you feel happy if you are not actually 
clinically depressed?

When Prozac -- made by Eli Lilly, an American pharmaceutical firm -- came on 
the market in 1987, it was halied as a "wonder-drug."  Unlike previous 
anti-depressants, it appears to have no serious (and few trivial) side 
effects.  Its sales have soared.  They are expected to hit $4 billion a year by 
2000, according to analysts at Lehman Brothers, an American investment bank.

Ecstasy is older.  It was developed in 1914 and became popular in the 1970s as 
an adjunct to psychotherapy because of its ability to reduce anxiety and 
facilitate communication.  German marriage-guidance counsellors regularly 
recommended it.  It, too, is good business.  A tablet can cost as little as 
3.50 pounds ($5) to make and sells on the streets for around 15 pounds.  This 
suggests that the British market alone is worth well over 300m pounds a year.

Both drugs affect the level of serotonin, a neurotransmitter in the brain that 
is thought to influence sleep, appetite, aggression and mood.  
Neurotransmitters are chemicals that carry messages between nerve cells.  They 
are secreted by one cell and picked up by receptor proteins on the surface of a 
neighbor.  Once the message has been delivered, a neurotransmitter is either 
destroyed or sucked back into the cell the made it -- a process known as 
re-uptake.

Both Prozac and ecstasy work by inhibiting the re-uptake of serotonin.  This 
means that the messenger molecules hang around in the gap between the cells and 
the message gets amplified.  Ecstasy, in addition to blocking re-uptake, causes 
a surge of serotonin to be released into the gap -- so that not only is it not 
removed, but there is more of it there in the first place.  Since clinical 
depression seems to be associated with a lack of serotonin at certain receptor 
sites (extremely low levels of serotonin have been found, for instance, in some 
suicides), the idea of using serotonin re-uptake inhibitors as anti-depressants 
has been popular for some time.

So there are some parallels.  But there is also an important difference between 
the drugs -- one which might be thought to justify banning one but not the 
other.  Though it has been accused of causing violence in rare cases (the 
"Prozac defense" was once fashionable among lawyers, but 65 consecutive 
convictions have dampened their enthusiasm) Prozac does not seem to harm its 
users.  Very occasionally, ecstasy (or, more particularly, dehydration 
associated with its use) kills.

This does not, however, seem to have been the reason why MDMA was actually 
proscribed.  In 1971, when the drug was banned in Britain, this problem was 
almost unknown.  Things had not changed much by 1985, when the drug was first 
scheduled in America.  This is hardly surprising.  Death is rare -- it occurs 
in only one per 3 1/2m uses.  Fatal dehydration generally happens in a hot 
environment.  And it is preventable by drinking a judicious, though not 
excessive, amount of water (too much can kill you, too).

The formal reason for the drug's proscription was fear of neurotoxicity -- that 
it might cause a persistent drop in serotonin levels in the brain.  But 
America's Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA), instead of placing it in schedule 
three, which would have allowed continued medical use, put it in schedule one 
-- denying it even to doctors.

Better living through chemistry

The neurotoxic effects of MDMA are real.  Regular users may suffer a drop of a 
third in the level of serotonin-derived chemicals in the fluid of their spinal 
cords, according to research by George Ricaurte, a neurologist at Johns Hopkins 
University in Baltimore.  But such effects do not appear to be very troubling 
-- at least not in the doses that people actually use.  Slightly reduced sleep, 
less impulsive behaviour and less hostility are the main symptoms.  And other 
drugs which are neurotoxic in laboratory experiments do not seem to cause 
difficulties in the outside world.  Fenfluramine, another appetite surppressor, 
has been in use for 25 years and been taken by around 50m people without any 
sign of a problem.

The decision to put MDMA into schedule one, therefore, seems odd.  It came 
despite the opinion of Francis Young, a federal judge who was asked to review 
the evidence, that it should have gone in schedule three.  The explanation 
seems tobe that the mid-1980s also saw MDMA's recreational use change from 
small groups of people taking it in private, to large groups of people taking 
it in public.  Ecstasy was being born and the DEA wished to strangle it.

The history of Prozac casts the propriety of the ban in sharp relief.  
Strictly, America's Food and Drug Administration recognises Prozac as suitable 
for the treatment only of depression and obsessive-compulsive disorder.  In 
practice it is being prescribed (quite legally, if warnings are given) for 
panic disorders, premenstrual tension, premature ejaculation and chronic 
back-pain.  But, increasingly, people are being prescribed it simply because 
they want it.  And those who are unable to find a friendly doctor to fill in a 
prescription are turning to the black market.

Peter Kramer, a psychiatrist at Brown University, in Provdence, Rhode Island, 
says Prozac users feel "better than well" -- a sentiment no doubt echoed by 
many a user of ecstasy.  As Dr. Kramer puts it in his book "Listening to 
Prozac," "until the advent of Prozac most ethical questions involving 
psychotherapeutic drugs turned on clinical trade-offs."  But because Prozac has 
proved so safe, it is much more widely prescribed than previous 
anti-depressants.  The question is whether a line can be drawn between 
therapeutic and non-therapeutic use of the drug.  And if it can be, should it 
be?

There are two ways of dealing with this question.  One is to duck it.  Some 
doctors argue (with a certain circular logic) that if something is treatable 
with an anti-depressant then it must, by definition, be depression.  The drug 
is then restoring a state which would "naturally" exist if the person were 
well.  So, the argument goes, unlike ecstasy (where the act of taking the drug 
provides immediate pleasure) Prozac does not actually create pleasure.  In the 
words of a spokesman for Eli Lilly, the drug does not make people into 
super-people.

The other way of answering the question is to admit that Prozac, like ecstasy, 
is often used recreationally, to enhance pleasure, rather than to treat 
depression -- and, if this is not approved of, to ban its use in these cases.  
But why ban the recreational use of drugs?

The motive often seems to be what Dr. Kramer refers to as "pharmacological 
Calvinism."  The use of drugs for fun rather than therapy is widely disapproved 
of.  There is, too, a feeling that doctors -- who, it is to be hoped, know what 
they are doing -- should be in charge of the process of giving drugs out.  But, 
in that case, why not let doctors give out MDMA as well?  There is also a 
belief that, at least with mental problems, behavioural therapy is morally 
superior to chemotherapy.  But the two are intimately linked.  Eric Hollander, 
of the Mount Sinai School of Medicine, in New York, for example, recently 
showed that treating obsessive-compulsive disorder with drugs produced the same 
changes in the activity of patients' brains -- uncoupling the action of four 
groups of nerves that are unhealthily locked together -- as threating them with 
psychotherapy.  It hardly seems that one method is morally inferior just 
because it is easier.

Nor does it seem reasonable to stop people taking drugs to achieve easily an 
effect which might be won in other ways with difficulty.  Good information 
about the risks and benefits, and proper supervision of manufacture, are always 
important (and are a good argument for legalising what people clearly want).  
But given these, it is not clear that pills should always be popped under a 
doctor's supervision.  So, when Calvinists ask if people taking Prozac to 
eliminate elements of their personalities, such as shyness, is so very far 
removed from the recreational use of ecstasy, the answer appears to be "no."  
But what is wrong with that?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 19:30:11 1996
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	id WAA09330; Wed, 8 May 1996 22:30:08 -0400
Message-Id: <199605090230.WAA09330@cc02du.unity.ncsu.edu>
Subject: Summer sublets in SF
To: sfraves@squishy.com
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 22:30:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: john rainbow <humphrey@unity.ncsu.edu>
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Hiya folks! 

I and my SO are in SF for the summer. We are looking for a summer sublet. 
ASAP!!!!!!!

It would be super cool if you could help us out...please tell me about 
all the cool places you know of...

later

-john ______
            \
      ....  -|-   ---   Squishy: Intelligent Fun(k) ---  ---  ---\ ....
     ////   \|/                          *raleigh*  boston   sf     \\\\
    ////    john  john_humphrey@ncsu.edu    919      617     415     \\\\
   ////  rainbow                            859      499     566      \\\\
  ////  humphrey  john supports pgp        2604     1925    0863       \\\\
  \|/                                                      ext 4        \|/
   *   http://www4.ncsu.edu/unity/users/h/humphrey/squishy/rainbow.html  *


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 19:36:55 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 19:37:17 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: sddpw@sirius.com (Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works)
Subject: Reply to Hardcopy
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Would anyone think it a good idea to respond to that HardCopy segment
formally?  I'm sure they have an e-mail address.  But then again, is it
worth it?  It's not like they're going to turn around and go, "By the way,
we we're all wrong on our rave report.  It's all the fault of asshole cops
that these parties must go to great lengths to stay underground.  Oh yeah,
and also, we blew the whole thing completely out of proportion and were
totally irresponsible in not presenting anything positive.""

I'll hold my breath on that one.  Isn't it amazing how they NEVER can seem
to find anyone articulate!  I mean, from the postings, it seems that people
here are quite an intelligent bunch.  Hardcopy musta saw the laminates and
STEERED CLEAR.  "Watch out, THEY look intelligent.  We can't have them on
our show."

P.S. - you'll forever be my friend if you can tell me what that song was
that they kept on catching in the background.  I LURV IT!!!

peace....arkay



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:00:32 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605090300.UAA03259@netcom15.netcom.com>
Subject: Mail Order Glow Sticks
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 20:00:02 -0700 (PDT)
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[sfraves @hyperreal.com]

 Since glowsticks are a reoccuring topic here on SFRaves , I thought 
folks would be interested in an item in a catalog I got in the mail today.

6" Cyalume Lightsticks , glows at max intensity for 1/2 hour , dims 
   after 1/2 hour. Colors Red, Yellow, and White for $1.49 each,
   10 for $10.00 , and 100 for $80.00 .
   Stock #G7820 : Red
   Stock #G7821 : Yellow
   Stock #G7822 : White

6" Blue Lightsticks last 8 hours (!) , prices are $2.00 each, 10 for
   $15.00 , and 100 for $120.00.
   Stock #G7823 : Blue

or, 4 Reds, 4 Yellows, 1 White, and 1 Blue for $12.00. 
   Stock #G7824 : 10 pack mixed colors

 This was in the 1996 Summer Catalog (#228) of 

 The Electronic Goldmine
 P.O. Box 5408
 Scottsdale, AZ 85261       1-800-445-0697 : Toll Free Order Line

 $5 minimum for shipping , minimum order $10.00 plus shipping

 I've bought stuff from these guys before, they've been OK to me. They 
specialize in used , overstock, surplus, and discontinued electronic
components ( like Maverick missile gyros , all kinds of LEDs, electronic
drumsticks, novelty sound modules ) and electronic kits ( color organs,
strobes, light sensitive sound generators, etc. ). Those of you who are
gadget minded might want to order their catalog ( $1 each ).

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:08:39 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 20:07:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
To: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
cc: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.93.960508162006.2116B-100000@elaine19.Stanford.EDU>
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> On Wed, 8 May 1996, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:
> 
> > At 11:25 AM 5/8/96 -0700, you wrote:
> > >
> > >Question:  Has anyone ever seen or participated in a slam/mosh pit at a 
> > >rave?  
> 
Hi!
 I was involved with some underground parties in Santa Cruz, (at the ol' 
train station) from Jan. '95 to Sept. '95. The one time I saw anything 
remotely like moshing was a circle of men (5-6) around this women on the 
dance floor (ages in the late 20's). She was kinda twirling with her eyes 
half closed and hands up and just sorta bouncing off the men surronding 
her. It was a very gentle dance yet highly charged with eroticism.


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
        
   *(" I like the rush hour, 'cause I like the rush. The pushing 
       of the people. I like it all so much. Such a mass of motion. Do not 
       know where it goes. I move with the movement and... I have the touch.)
                                 /
                           -=*=-/
                             ~

* Peter Gabriel- "I Have The Touch."

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:13:11 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 20:08:41 -0700
Message-Id: <199605090308.UAA20127@dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Smarties 1 year
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey, I just wanted to know if any of ya'll are going to Smarties?! 
Lemme know.. I'm going!

                Add your name to the list!!!!



Adam                            R.Lunatic


a list o' people..

1)R.Lunatic

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:13:46 1996
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From: brianlyo@wolfe.net (Brian Lyons)
Subject: any typographers out there?
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      If anyone knows the listserve adress of graphic design/typography
bulletin board,
please mail me with it. Thank you, brian.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:20:15 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605090319.UAA10463@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy story on Raves
To: tim744@silicon.email.net
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 20:19:59 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605081914.S345489059@silicon.email.net> from "tim744@silicon.email.net" at May 8, 96 07:14:17 pm
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> 
> Anyone have any opinions on this one?

Well, of course this was all filmed at Dune, a socal-raves sponsored event,
so of course socal raves is going crazy over it.  If you want, I can forward
these messages to sfraves.  Anyone object?

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:25:40 1996
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From: davidmin@crl.com (David Minuk)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Ha!!!!
Date: Thu, 09 May 1996 03:20:48 GMT
Message-Id: <319163cb.165884419@mail.crl.com>
References: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960508191026.29981A-100000@value.net>
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Hmmm, I seem to remember reading somewhere a while back that the
promoter actually INVITED Hard Copy to the party?!?  Anyone else
remember this?  I didn't see it, I would like to see more open-minded
reporting like the excellent report on Ch. 7 last Sunday about the
Cannabis Buyers Club.

David

On Wed, 8 May 1996 19:24:47 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

>
> 
>
>  Dear all,
>
>  When someone earlier today had said that there was going
>to be a segmet about raves on 'Hard Copy' tonight, I just had to tune in.
>They focused on the desert raves of SoCal. A home movie camera showed 
>some well! you guessed it ravers. They went on to describe these parties 
>in words like out of control, booze orgies; asking where are the parents.
>They basically compaired this "new" thing to Woodstock, where the drug of 
>choice is nitrous.
> Oh my God, I was ROTFL. Did anyone else cath this report? When I see 
>these sad reports it makes me appreciate the rave scene even more because 
>I know what the real story is and what truly goes on at "those kind of 
>parties".
>  Just my $0.02
> Reagan
>

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Minuk(davidmin@crl.com)
WWW:  My URL is http://www.crl.com/~davidmin/
This website is not yet rated.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:35:09 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 20:35:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: (NRR) how about that tim leary??
To: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
cc: nw-raves@hyperreal.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SCO.3.91.960508191452.17259C-100000@vanbc.wimsey.com>
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On Wed, 8 May 1996, Karen Hardie wrote:

> just found out that Timothy Leary is termially ill ... and so he has 
> planned to commit suicide LIVE on the internet.  I don't care how big an 
> icon he is, this to me seems to be in somewhat poor taste, to say the 
> least.  It's all fine and good to want to take control of your own demise 
> if you'd otherwise end up a bed-and-painridden vegetable, but to broadcast 
> it???
> 
> sorry, just had to rant a little.  and i'm interested in other folks 
> comments.  believe me, if i had his email address handy i'd rant to him 
> too :)
> 
> k
> 
> 


Hi!
 I think this event of Leary's is important and rightous. There has 
always been an issue of who controls our lives. Ourselves, our 
government, our peers and socity. I think that we our moving, as a world 
society, towards self control rather than externally imposed control. 
There are those who resist this and those who support this movement 
(albeit this support/nonsupport is usually unconcious).
 I believe (in Peter Pan ;) ) that a society of self controlled people is 
desirable. I also feel that this personal control should include the 
choosing of ones time and method of death. Granted that many people in 
our world can not make this decision responsibly. This only points out 
the need to educate people in taking responsibility for their lives IN 
TOTALITY. In other words, looking at not only our lives but how our lives 
affect the enviroment we share with others.
 I feel that by broadcasting his death, Tim Leary is highlighting this 
struggle from imposed control to self-control. In this light I feel his 
efforts are righteous. No one is being forced to tune into his death and 
I doubt that it will not be "showey". We shall see.

Awaiting the flames

Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
                            (peace)
                              /
                        -=*=-/
                          ~



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:35:34 1996
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From: b e n   c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
To: "'Karen Hardie'" <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
Cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: (NRR) how about that tim leary??
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 20:32:51 -0700
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On Wednesday, May 08, 1996 12:18 PM, Karen Hardie wrote:
>just found out that Timothy Leary is termially ill ... and so he has=20
>planned to commit suicide LIVE on the internet.  I don't care how big =
an=20
>icon he is, this to me seems to be in somewhat poor taste, to say the=20
>least.  It's all fine and good to want to take control of your own =
demise=20
>if you'd otherwise end up a bed-and-painridden vegetable, but to =
broadcast=20
>it???

this is not dissimilar to what Leary has been doing all of his adult =
life: taking an issue that the public would like to avoid (in this case =
it's assisted suicide, before it was psychadelics) and presenting it in =
an unavoidable way. I think our society needs a few troublemakers like =
this to keep us from avoiding complex issues.

B E N   C H U N
-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
--
H O M E:                              W O R K:
ben_chun@community.net                webmaster@platform-horizons.com
http://community.net/~ben_chun/       http://www.platform-horizons.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:40:16 1996
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From: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
To: eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com, nw-raves@hyperreal.com
Subject: (NRR) how about that tim leary??
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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> sorry, just had to rant a little.  and i'm interested in other folks 
> comments.  believe me, if i had his email address handy i'd rant to him 
> too :)

	According to his home page at http://www.leary.com, its either 
tim@leary.com or timleary@earthlink.net.

	Its an interesting page...  he includes a diary of drug intake.  You can 
see how his health deteriorated when he used the fast stuff...  and check out 
the recipe for Leary Biscuits.

Andrew
-----------------------------------------
Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:53:44 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 20:53:38 -0700 (PDT)
To: David Minuk <davidmin@crl.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Ha!!!!
In-Reply-To: <319163cb.165884419@mail.crl.com>
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, David Minuk wrote:

> Hmmm, I seem to remember reading somewhere a while back that the
> promoter actually INVITED Hard Copy to the party?!?  Anyone else
> remember this?  I didn't see it, I would like to see more open-minded
> reporting like the excellent report on Ch. 7 last Sunday about the
> Cannabis Buyers Club.

Dr. Dean Edell(sp?) probably has a lot to do with the good medical 
reporting you see on channel 7. He has a weekly show that is great. 

                                                     Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:55:30 1996
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To: "Jacqui Kolarik" <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>I recently bought tickets for Saturday and Sunday shows.  I must admit, mainly
>because of the music.  This may sound like an ignorant question, especially
>being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  Also,

Feel free to correct me someone, because I feel like I'm talking directly
out of my ass right now.

Free Tibet means get China out of Tibet. There is a chinese occupation of
Tibet that's been going on for a while, and the problem is that The Chinese
government is not trying to coexist with Tibetans, they are slowly trying
to push them out. The government of China encourages its citizens to move
to Tibet and settle there. They get special treatment from the government,
while Tibetan culture ad especially religion are being driven out. The
Dalai Lama tours the world asking fo help because he is in exile... I think
the Chinese tried to influence the choice of Lama and the real one was
forced to leave because he isn't enough of a puppet for the Chinese.

I have no idea where the ticket money is going. The most I've heard on that
subject is that it's being donated to "several Bay Area Tibetan support
organizations" or something like that.

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 20:59:03 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 20:59:01 -0800
To: TKagnoff@aol.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Bass Instinct or Funky Techno Tribe w/Goldie and Doc Scott???
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>I was just wondering where all the junglists are going this friday night. Are
>you going to Bass Instinct or Funky Techno Tribe w/Goldie and Doc Scott or
>BOTH??? I think i may just have to check out both. On the one hand it's not

If you can't make both, go for BASS. I admit Goldie doesn't come around too
often, but the BASS crew is local and they're trying to get some kind of
jungle scene started in the Bay Area, so they really deserve some support.
I think they're also handing out free tapes to the first ??? people who
show up.

-m.

PS.. I mailed your tape today, TK. expect it *soon*.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 21:01:29 1996
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To: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
cc: nw-raves@hyperreal.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: (NRR) how about that tim leary??
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On Wed, 8 May 1996, Karen Hardie wrote:

> just found out that Timothy Leary is termially ill ... and so he has 
> planned to commit suicide LIVE on the internet.  I don't care how big an 
> icon he is, this to me seems to be in somewhat poor taste, to say the 
> least.  It's all fine and good to want to take control of your own demise 
> if you'd otherwise end up a bed-and-painridden vegetable, but to broadcast 
> it???

While it may be distasteful to you, no one is forcing anyone to watch it.


> sorry, just had to rant a little.  and i'm interested in other folks 
> comments.  believe me, if i had his email address handy i'd rant to him 
> too :)

I imagine that he has already received his share of rants. My guess this 
is all for shock value anyways. 

                                              Black Adder 

 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 21:02:31 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 21:02:28 -0800
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Free Tibet-not rave related
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Isn't it great that China, #1 human rights violator in the world, gets
#1? I disagree... They're up there somewhere though...

>most-favored-nation trade status with the US?  Makes me feel ashamed to be
>a citizen...

I think there's a shitload of countries with that status... It's more of a
statement to NOT get MFN status when yer dealing with the US... If we took
that away, there'd be an economic cold war.

politics are ridiculous, huh?

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 21:08:39 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 21:08:36 -0800
To: tim744@silicon.email.net
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Hard Copy story on Raves
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Anyone have any opinions on this one?

missed it.. what did they say?

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 21:10:50 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 21:10:47 -0700 (PDT)
To: Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works <sddpw@sirius.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
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On Wed, 8 May 1996, Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works wrote:

> Would anyone think it a good idea to respond to that HardCopy segment
> formally?  I'm sure they have an e-mail address.  But then again, is it
> worth it?  It's not like they're going to turn around and go, "By the way,
> we we're all wrong on our rave report.  It's all the fault of asshole cops
> that these parties must go to great lengths to stay underground.  Oh yeah,
> and also, we blew the whole thing completely out of proportion and were
> totally irresponsible in not presenting anything positive.""

It would be worth it if you were dealing with persons interested in 
objectivity. The staff of Hard Copy is not composed of such individuals. 
I am sure that these yellow "journalists"(my apologies to any real 
journalists for using this word to refer to such people) heard many of 
the real reasons for the parties and why they are held where they are. It 
is all irrelevant.

Sensationalism sells ad spots. People watch this kind of crap just like 
they slow down to get a good look at the scene of an auto accident. 

                                                Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 21:38:03 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 21:38:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: BSP "something free"
To: Happy Ravers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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hello all ya wonderful people!

its about that time again, were planning to gather under the stars this 
friday nite for a free outdoor party! our djs for the evening will be dan 
barnes, ethan, LeLe, and tom. hope to see ya if i know ya, and hope to 
meet ya if i dont!
the vmail is 415.525.5o52. 

lots and lots o good energy to ya!
phil, carl, & tom

ps. if anyone has questions or comments, youre welcome to call me at home: 
4o8.275.1546 or email here.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 22:11:34 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 00:09:28 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Ha!!!!
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On Wed, 8 May 1996, Reagan Reid wrote:

>   Dear all,
> 
>   When someone earlier today had said that there was going
> to be a segmet about raves on 'Hard Copy' tonight, I just had to tune in.
> They focused on the desert raves of SoCal. A home movie camera showed 
> some well! you guessed it ravers. They went on to describe these parties 
> in words like out of control, booze orgies; asking where are the parents.
> They basically compaired this "new" thing to Woodstock, where the drug of 
> choice is nitrous.

The sad part is that they filmed it at Dune. The promoters of Dune
busted their asses to stop any nitrous from being sold. They emptied
themselves several thanks and even took a dealers keys and told him
he would not get them back unless they helped clean up any baloons
the morning faster. *sight*

>  Oh my God, I was ROTFL. Did anyone else cath this report? When I see 
> these sad reports it makes me appreciate the rave scene even more because 
> I know what the real story is and what truly goes on at "those kind of 
> parties".
>   Just my $0.02
>  Reagan
> 

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 22:35:09 1996
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Date: Wed, 08 May 1996 22:35:32 -0700
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From: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: (NRR) how about that tim leary??
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>just found out that Timothy Leary is termially ill ... and so he has 
>planned to commit suicide LIVE on the internet.  I don't care how big an 
>icon he is, this to me seems to be in somewhat poor taste, to say the 
>least.  It's all fine and good to want to take control of your own demise 
>if you'd otherwise end up a bed-and-painridden vegetable, but to broadcast 
>it???

it's intended to cause a controversy. that's the point.
we need someone to open up the issue of death to discussion, since it's
totally repressed in our society. you said it above, it's about taking
control of your own destiny. tim wants everyone to realize that they should
take control of their lives (and deaths) instead of being passive about it.
the most dramatic statement he can make is to broadcast his death.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 22:54:29 1996
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From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
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When I was in Detroit this last summer, I went to see Lords of Acid in 
Pontiac...  During their show the crowd "moshed" quite furvently.  
Someone even threw a shoe at the stage!
This was not your typical SF raves crowd, though...

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor
               I'M FINALLY ON THE WEB!!  CHECK OUT MY ARTWORK AT: 
                 http://think.ucdavis.edu/current/apodaca.html                


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 23:00:24 1996
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Date: Wed, 08 May 1996 23:04:03 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: PARTIES
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Hiya;

        Don't ya hate when you try and throw a party and most of the people
you invite blow you off, in others cancell or or not show up. If you never
had this experience, it hurts.

THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 23:06:57 1996
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Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 23:08:54 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Hard Copy
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Did anyone tape this?

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 23:16:59 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
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>Would anyone think it a good idea to respond to that HardCopy segment
>formally?

Well, I didn't find a URL for Hard Copy, but I did find the following, which 
lists URLs for just about any TV station that has a web page of any kind.  
Just FYI...

http://www.tvnet.com/

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 23:44:46 1996
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Subject: Re: Bass Instinct or Funky Techno Tribe w/Goldie and Doc Scott???
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free mix tapes to the first 80 people at BI

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May  8 23:48:06 1996
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The preliminary polls as to the junglists' destinations for friday night are:

Bass Instinct: 6
Funky Tekno Tribe: 0
Both: 1



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 00:11:56 1996
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Date: Thu, 09 May 1996 00:12:18 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
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>>Would anyone think it a good idea to respond to that HardCopy segment
>>formally?
well, before anyone goes off half-baked, i think we should compose a letter
as a whole.

points to be included could be:

-refution (is that a word?) of the alcohol and nitrous issue.
-an explaination of the principals behind raving.
-an explaination of the effects of 'common' rave drugs and why they are used
-how raving has positive effects on life outside raving, and why would they
want to    destroy something positive with negative press?
-responsibility of the media
-lots more. ideas?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 00:23:21 1996
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Date: Thu, 09 May 1996 00:23:42 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "I, 99" <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: NON RAVE-RELATED: Economist Ecstasy Article (fwd)
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>an appetite suppressor.  Now it is an adjunct to partying.  In America,
some 5m 
>people regularly take a different sort of pill.  This one was developed as an 
>anti-depressant.  Now it is widely used as a chemical accessory by those who 
>think it is unfair that they should ever feel low.
but prozac doesn't help those who aren't "low". it only acts as a placebo in
these cases. granted, many people are depressed and don't know it - possibly
epidemic numbers, possibly not - but this doesn't change the fact that for
many people it doesn't do anything.

>When Prozac -- made by Eli Lilly, an American pharmaceutical firm -- came on 
>the market in 1987, it was halied as a "wonder-drug."  Unlike previous 
>anti-depressants, it appears to have no serious (and few trivial) side 
>effects.  Its sales have soared.  They are expected to hit $4 billion a
year by 
well, i can personally attest to unpublished (and not so trivial) side
effects of prozac and other SRIs.

however, a very interesting article and very thoughtfully written. thanks
for posting it!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 00:26:58 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 01:24:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: RE: Hard Copy story on Raves
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, tim744 <tim744@silicon.email.net>
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Listening to all the comments on Hard Copy, I get the impression they   
were really ill-informed.  And I further get the impression that there's   
no group better-qualified to inform on this topic than present company.   
 Any one else have the urge to try to contact the editors and give them   
the real poop?  Maybe sign them on the list?  Forward archived messages   
so they can get the real feel of what this is all about?  If nobody here   
sets it straight, no one else on the planet is going to do it...
 -Roy

 ----------
From:  tim744[SMTP:tim744@silicon.email.net]
Sent:  Wednesday, May 08, 1996 7:45 PM
To:  sfraves
Subject:  Hard Copy story on Raves

Anyone have any opinions on this one?
   

Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 00:58:46 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 00:58:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Adam Luong <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
cc: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.EDU>,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Yosemite Cabin Trip!
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yes, this is also a good weekend for me

Cassandra

On Tue, 7 May 1996, Adam Luong
wrote:

> You wrote: 
> >
> >hello all-
> >
> >i would love to go on another trip with cool sfravers!  i'm going to
> >suggest, arbitrarily, the third weekend in june.  that's the 21'st 
> thru 23'rd.
> >
> 
> 
> That'd be a good weekend for me.. =)~
> 
> 
> Adam
>                     R.Lunatic
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 01:23:13 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 01:23:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: THX1138 <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: PARTIES
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Dear THX1138:

I have had that experiance with meetings and other types of things I
have organized and it sucks.  But know that it wasn't you.:) Just life
and they probably had good reasons not to show.

Love,
Cassandra

On Wed, 8 May 1996, THX1138
wrote:

> Hiya;
> 
>         Don't ya hate when you try and throw a party and most of the people
> you invite blow you off, in others cancell or or not show up. If you never
> had this experience, it hurts.
> 
> THX1138
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 01:36:08 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 02:34:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: Yosemite Dates
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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ooh, 6/21 to 6/23 is BAD for me, and a coupla other folks I know who   
might otherwise go... Count that as one NO vote for that date.
 -Roy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 02:14:18 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 02:15:44 +1000
To: lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Put me on the Yosemite list
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Also,  put me on the list of those people who need rides.   So it's late
Wednesday evening and we ONLY GOT 3 people signed up as rave pool drivers.
This is pathetic at best....   ONLY 3 people having cars and able to take
additional riders to the parties this weekend?    Out of how many on
SFRaves?   Someone said 900 people?   Is that right?    Something is
very wrong here....

The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 07:09:00 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 16:11:02 +0200 (MESZ)
From: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
Reply-To: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy/T.Leary
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On Wed, 8 May 1996 blkadder wrote (about that hardcopy article on
the rave scene) :
> 
> Sensationalism sells ad spots. People watch this kind of crap just like 
> they slow down to get a good look at the scene of an auto accident. 
> 

....or check out timothy leary comitting suicide on the internet.
damn, can anybody enlighten me about the difference?

don't get me wrong, i don't mind everybody doing what they are doing,
only i think exposing your own death to an audience of millions, thus
impliing everybody was *interested* in it, is, well, em, not really humble...
...not really *grand*... i dunno. i think it shows you're a *really* troubled
person...anyway not the way i would want to do it...anyway it's certainly 
kinda interesting ...but again imagine how would you explain anybody or even 
yourself why you are watching it, or whatever you are supposed to do with 
it, maybe its some kind of interactive conference thingy... you know it's kinda 
dirty if you ask me.
especially all you really clean and nice and pc people over there... you 
should hate that!!

anyway i don't really understand why somebody has that urge to make 
themselves public. i stopped feeling that way since i was class speaker 
in 11th grade... believe me then i really got a kick out of it...
i wouldn't respond a word to that article. i would just shut up and grin.
god, i literally push myself to post on that list.....

small little rabbits and daisy chains - 
ulrike
 
ps. i must be doing something wrong, my posts don't show my address on the
     index like all the others but some line that says : To: sfraves@...  
     instead. i don't really like that. i want to see my address there...
     boohoohooo...
pps. thanks for your replies guys.

****************************************************************************
we can forgive a man for making a useful thing as long as he does not admire 
it.  
the only excuse for making a useless thing is that one admires it intensely.
o.wilde
****************************************************************************


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 07:35:29 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 07:33:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
To: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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 Before wasting time in a reply to Hardcopy you might consider Do they
even care ?  I suspect that a show like that would only care that you
watched at all - NOT whether you agree/disagree.... merely that they are
getting through . Their goal is not to inform with TRUTH as much as it is
to inform with entertainment ( truth is not really their objective )...

All this IMHO of course ;-)

HARDCOPY the show that cares about THE TRUTH and shows it...
Now there's a slogan for the masses....

Mike

 
 meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic 
 Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 08:08:06 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605091506.IAA01907@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy story on Raves
To: tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net (Troy Sheets)
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 08:06:12 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: tim744@silicon.email.net, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605090319.UAA10463@xanadu.cyborganic.net> from "Troy Sheets" at May 8, 96 08:19:59 pm
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Recently , Troy offered to forward some socal posts about the HardCopy
Dune smear/story:
> 
> Well, of course this was all filmed at Dune, a socal-raves sponsored event,
> so of course socal raves is going crazy over it.  If you want, I can forward
> these messages to sfraves.  Anyone object?
> 
> -troy
> 
 Maybe if you could just give us a taste of the main threads in the 
socal discussion - there's so much SFRaves mail already! But I would be
interested in the opinions and reactions going around.

 Favorite quote from HardCopy: "And then the sun rises like a bloodshot
 eye! ... (ravers) climb dangerous steep rocks!"
 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 08:09:57 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 08:08:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, tim744 <tim744@silicon.email.net>
Subject: RE: Hard Copy story on Raves
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 Roy- I don't see bringing Hard Copy onto this list doing any good! Sorry 
if I sound too negative, but it would just create more negative 
stereotypes:(. I wouldn't consider these people compassionate or caring. 
If they got on this list they would probaly distort all the positive 
things that are said just to get another false story.
                        Reagan



On Thu, 9 May 1996, Roy Feague wrote:

> 
> Listening to all the comments on Hard Copy, I get the impression they   
> were really ill-informed.  And I further get the impression that there's   
> no group better-qualified to inform on this topic than present company.   
>  Any one else have the urge to try to contact the editors and give them   
> the real poop?  Maybe sign them on the list?  Forward archived messages   
> so they can get the real feel of what this is all about?  If nobody here   
> sets it straight, no one else on the planet is going to do it...
>  -Roy
> 
>  ----------
> From:  tim744[SMTP:tim744@silicon.email.net]
> Sent:  Wednesday, May 08, 1996 7:45 PM
> To:  sfraves
> Subject:  Hard Copy story on Raves
> 
> Anyone have any opinions on this one?
>    
> 
> Tim (knucklehead)
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 08:40:51 1996
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From: blkadder@value.net
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 08:40:46 -0700 (PDT)
To: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960509071218.00822300@140.174.229.14>
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, Be 99 wrote:

> >>Would anyone think it a good idea to respond to that HardCopy segment
> >>formally?
> well, before anyone goes off half-baked, i think we should compose a letter
> as a whole.
> 
> points to be included could be:
> 
> -refution (is that a word?) of the alcohol and nitrous issue.
> -an explaination of the principals behind raving.
> -an explaination of the effects of 'common' rave drugs and why they are used
> -how raving has positive effects on life outside raving, and why would they
> want to    destroy something positive with negative press?
> -responsibility of the media
> -lots more. ideas?

Yes, don't waste your energy on a futile effort. Again, I am sure they 
had plenty of people telling them the postive aspects of raving, etc. 
etc. Have you ever been to a party that looks as fun as that, and not 
have had people comment on it, or explain to anyone asking what it is all 
about? THEY DON'T CARE.

                                          Black Adder 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 08:46:02 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 08:43:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Harmony Review #1001 :)
To: Nancy <nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Wed, 8 May 1996, Nancy wrote:

> Anyone have the patience for another Harmony review?  ;)
> 
> I'm flooded with finals and papers right now, this is my first time
> checking mail since ** LAST WEEK! ** (tough to break a daily habit!), and
> last week I had told myself, no way, you have to be responsible, no Harmony
> for you!
> 
> But 3 am Friday rolled around, and instead of sleeping soundly with my head
> on an open textbook, where did I find myself?  On a dancefloor in the
> middle of a crowd of happy people, jumping up and down, waving glow sticks
> in the air!  Now, how did that happen?
> 

I knew I would see this silly girl's face at Harmony.  Erase99 commented 
that Nancy wouldn't be coming and was kind of upset about it, but I 
*knew* she would be there.  Keeping her away would be like keeping a 
magnet away from a paper clip--impossible.  And the place to look for her 
is near the speaker....  Sure enough, both rang true.  Talk about a tried 
and true raver....  

I luv ya', Nancy!!!

kaysee

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 08:50:45 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 08:47:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: (NRR) how about that tim leary??
To: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SCO.3.91.960508191452.17259C-100000@vanbc.wimsey.com>
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You can find him at leary.com on the web.  There is a front page article 
in the SF Chronicle today about him having terminal cancer.  It just 
talks about what he is doing with his last days.  His new search for 
higher consciousness is Dying.  He's calling it Hi-Tech Designer Dying.

kaysee

kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu
.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*


On Wed, 8 May 1996, Karen Hardie wrote:

> just found out that Timothy Leary is termially ill ... and so he has 
> planned to commit suicide LIVE on the internet.  I don't care how big an 
> icon he is, this to me seems to be in somewhat poor taste, to say the 
> least.  It's all fine and good to want to take control of your own demise 
> if you'd otherwise end up a bed-and-painridden vegetable, but to broadcast 
> it???
> 
> sorry, just had to rant a little.  and i'm interested in other folks 
> comments.  believe me, if i had his email address handy i'd rant to him 
> too :)
> 
> k
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:08:04 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:07:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Hard Copy  - packabowl anyone?
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I taped the Hard Copy segment and if anyone wants to see it just lemme
know.  I live really close to F8 so if you're on Haight street c'mon by.

Does anybody want to go to Packabowl tonight???

	** jess **


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:09:14 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:08:16 -0700 (PDT)
To: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy/T.Leary
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, Ulrike Laitko wrote:

> 
> 
> On Wed, 8 May 1996 blkadder wrote (about that hardcopy article on
> the rave scene) :
> > 
> > Sensationalism sells ad spots. People watch this kind of crap just like 
> > they slow down to get a good look at the scene of an auto accident. 
> > 
> 
> ....or check out timothy leary comitting suicide on the internet.
> damn, can anybody enlighten me about the difference?

I imagine this is Tim's last chance to shake things up, so he is taking the 
opportunity. 

The difference here, however small, is that this is being done as a 
statement. The family of 4 in the mangled station wagon aren't their of 
their own volition, nor are they attempting to somehow enlighten society by 
their actions. As to the reason somone would chose to watch it, well, that 
really depends on the individual. Ritualistic suicide has been part of 
many cultures, and it certainly wouldn't be fair to say that all those 
observing are there due solely to a macabre interest. 


> don't get me wrong, i don't mind everybody doing what they are doing,
> only i think exposing your own death to an audience of millions, thus
> impliing everybody was *interested* in it, is, well, em, not really humble...
> ...not really *grand*... i dunno. i think it shows you're a *really* troubled
> person...anyway not the way i would want to do it...anyway it's certainly 
> kinda interesting ...but again imagine how would you explain anybody or even 
> yourself why you are watching it, or whatever you are supposed to do with 
> it, maybe its some kind of interactive conference thingy... you know it's kinda 
> dirty if you ask me.
> especially all you really clean and nice and pc people over there... you 
> should hate that!!

I get a D- in pc.   

The one thing this will do is shove the issue of the right to choose the time 
and place of your own demise in a lot of people's faces which I believe is 
his point. Whether or not you choose to watch it becomes irrelevant as 
you have been motivated enough to speak about it, which means you are 
*thinking* about the issue.   

                                            Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:11:15 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:11:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: TKagnoff@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: BI or FTT or Both
In-Reply-To: <960509024733_290342230@emout07.mail.aol.com>
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	Count me in for BI this Friday.....


		see ya there    ** jess **


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:26:00 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:22:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Yosemite Dates
To: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
In-Reply-To: <9605090836.AA13400@mail.ico.net>
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PLEASE, PLEASE, *NOT* on the weekend of JUNE 15th.  My best friend from 
high school is getting married (ack!) and I have to put on this green 
formal dress that I will *never* wear again and be a bride's maid.  I 
want to go on this Yosemite shindig very much and that weekend would be 
awful.  

Just happy it's not me who's tying the knot :)

kaysee

On Thu, 9 May 1996, Roy Feague wrote:

> 
> ooh, 6/21 to 6/23 is BAD for me, and a coupla other folks I know who   
> might otherwise go... Count that as one NO vote for that date.
>  -Roy
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:27:12 1996
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To: sddpw@sirius.com (Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works)
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
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I'd say let them remain clueless.  We can be messengers of truth by word
and example to the world at large...

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:44:58 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:39:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Minuk <davidmin@crl.com>
To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
Cc: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        tim744 <tim744@silicon.email.net>
Subject: RE: Hard Copy story on Raves
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Sounds to me that they found out about the event because they WERE on the 
So-cal list. 

David

On Thu, 9 May 1996, Reagan Reid wrote:

> 
>  Roy- I don't see bringing Hard Copy onto this list doing any good! Sorry 
> if I sound too negative, but it would just create more negative 
> stereotypes:(. I wouldn't consider these people compassionate or caring. 
> If they got on this list they would probaly distort all the positive 
> things that are said just to get another false story.
>                         Reagan
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu, 9 May 1996, Roy Feague wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Listening to all the comments on Hard Copy, I get the impression they   
> > were really ill-informed.  And I further get the impression that there's   
> > no group better-qualified to inform on this topic than present company.   
> >  Any one else have the urge to try to contact the editors and give them   
> > the real poop?  Maybe sign them on the list?  Forward archived messages   
> > so they can get the real feel of what this is all about?  If nobody here   
> > sets it straight, no one else on the planet is going to do it...
> >  -Roy
> > 
> >  ----------
> > From:  tim744[SMTP:tim744@silicon.email.net]
> > Sent:  Wednesday, May 08, 1996 7:45 PM
> > To:  sfraves
> > Subject:  Hard Copy story on Raves
> > 
> > Anyone have any opinions on this one?
> >    
> > 
> > Tim (knucklehead)
> > 
> > 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:51:08 1996
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From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Hard Copy (A Suggestion)
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	As peple have pointed out calling, sending email, or taking to 
court Hard Copy wont do any good. For them its just another day at work.
If you really whish to do something fight fire with fire. Get some film 
major from one of the raves lists to do a small documentary on raves and 
show it on public access tv and some film festivals, etc. I'am sure 
enough money can be collected for such thing from all the rave lists. 
Hey, Iam down for 50 bucks. Anyone up to the task?

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:51:16 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:48:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: NRR: The Godfather of Sou or do you want some real funk?
To: Fred Heutte <phred@well.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605080227.ZM16310@well>
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> 
> Listening to the really great jungle/d&b tracks, once again I've learned
> the wisdom of the ascended master of funk, George Clinton:  
> Free your mind, and your ass will follow!
> phred
> 

do you wanna hear the original funkman himself?  JAMES BROWN?  JB will be 
in SF at the Maritime Music Hall on May 16th and 17th.  Sorry to waste 
bandwith with non-rave related music, but seeing JB in concert is the 
ultimate (and you can't tell me his music hasn't had some influence on 
house/techno)!!!  The last time I saw him was the best concert I've ever 
seen.  And can that man generate vibe!!!  Can you say sex machine?  This 
man can move it and shake it like no other.  As a resident JB fanatic, I 
highly reccomend seeing him live!  I already have my tickets and you'll 
see me funkin' to the groove in the aisles!!

"We got the funk, give up the funk..."

"YOu can have Watergate, but give me some bucks and I'll be straight.."

"Who in the funk do you think you are?"

"Down D, funky D.."



(can you name the tunes above?  not all are JB licks.  Come on' you 
funksters, you!!)

terminally funky,
kaysee

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 09:51:31 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:51:07 -0800
To: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Put me on the Yosemite list
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I don't know, but in my book, it's pretty damn rude to insult people who
*you're* looking at for a favor!

Don't get me wrong, I'm wholeheartedly in favor of car pooling, but this
isn't about car pooling, it's about people without transportation getting
rides, and while it's a great thing to help each other out, your sales
pitch might be better if it's skewed slightly more toward the positive.  ;^)

You have three more people than were signed up last week, right?!

Tony


At 2:15 AM  +1000 5/9/96, John Draper wrote:
>Also,  put me on the list of those people who need rides.   So it's late
>Wednesday evening and we ONLY GOT 3 people signed up as rave pool drivers.
>This is pathetic at best....   ONLY 3 people having cars and able to take
>additional riders to the parties this weekend?    Out of how many on
>SFRaves?   Someone said 900 people?   Is that right?    Something is
>very wrong here....
>
>The Crunchman




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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:53:03 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
Subject: B2B
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Hey do any of you wacky ravers want to get all dressed up and run
(walk/crawl) in the Bay to Breakers with me ???

Vince

Sunday May 19th

info: http://www.sfo.com/~hulaman/bay2b.html



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 10:08:11 1996
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From: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
Message-Id: <199605091705.KAA21455@alumnae.caltech.edu>
Subject: Hardcopy Impressions
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 10:05:02 -0700 (PDT)
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So as I was watching this thing I was wondering what
I would have thought had I not known anything about
the rave scene and what it was about...

I think thought number one would have been:
	"Wow, what a CRAZYFUN thing to do!"

Thought number two would have been:
	"Man, what's up with the damn PACIFIERS?!?"


		Kids these days, I tell ya :)

			-Chin
	

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 10:12:00 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
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>Sensationalism sells ad spots. People watch this kind of crap just like
>they slow down to get a good look at the scene of an auto accident.
>
>                                                Black Adder

And this is what we need to remember.  TV exists to advertize (push)
products and services; the stuff that fits in between the ads exists to
hold the audience's attention so that it sees the ads.
In my family, TV existed solely for entertainment and education; commercial
breaks were always kitchen/bathroom/get-Dad-another-beer breaks, and none
of us cared much what was on the commercials (except for a few cool
toy/game ads that appealed to us as kids...).  Now, when I see TV (which is
rare), I feel insulted by the commercials.  I wonder if the advertisers
care that they turn off a large portion of the viewing audience they're
supposed to be enticing to buy their stuff...

Socialism!  We need some socialism around here!

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 10:34:02 1996
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To: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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>points to be included could be:
>
>-refution (is that a word?) of the alcohol and nitrous issue.
>-an explaination of the principals behind raving.
>-an explaination of the effects of 'common' rave drugs and why they are used
>-how raving has positive effects on life outside raving, and why would they
>want to    destroy something positive with negative press?
>-responsibility of the media
>-lots more. ideas?

I doubt Hard Copy would take any of it seriously, or consider it worth
adding into the commentary of their shows.  That would smack of compassion,
which apparently has little or no place on such a program.

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 10:34:50 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Ride share
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Crunchman wrote:

>Also,  put me on the list of those people who need rides.   So it's late
>Wednesday evening and we ONLY GOT 3 people signed up as rave pool drivers.
>This is pathetic at best....   ONLY 3 people having cars and able to take
>additional riders to the parties this weekend?    Out of how many on
>SFRaves?   Someone said 900 people?   Is that right?    Something is
>very wrong here....

As someone who has been recently guilt-tripped about not giving a ride to 
someone I didn't really know and who lived 1.5 hours away from me, let me be 
the first to respond to this.

I think the ride pool is a neat idea, but not one suited to me for the 
following reasons:

1. I'm not in the habit of giving people rides unless they're friends of 
mine.  I occasionally make exceptions to this, but they are rare indeed.

2. I'm a rather private person.  I don't like the idea of giving out my 
number to -- what was the number you quoted, 900? -- 900 people, about 870 
of which I've never even met just so they can call me up out of the blue and 
beg a ride.

3. I usually go with a few friends and I simply don't have room in my car.

I'm not saying the ride pool is a bad idea.  For myself, though, if I want 
to give someone a ride, I'll write them a note or call them and invite them 
to go along with me somewhere.  Usually, because I invite people I know and 
have had a chance to ok, the invitation is a standing one.

My point is, there are many of us who already contribute to giving people 
rides to raves.  Calling the low turn-out "pathetic" is out of line.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 10:39:14 1996
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From: Justin Cooper <datura@best.com>
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Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy/T.Leary
To: blkadder@value.net
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 10:12:09 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960509084221.1338C-100000@value.net> from "blkadder@value.net" at May 9, 96 09:08:16 am
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blkadder@value.net once said
> 
> Ritualistic suicide has been part of 
> many cultures, and it certainly wouldn't be fair to say that all those 
> observing are there due solely to a macabre interest. 
>

not only is ritual suicide virtually unknown in our modern culture, but i'd
say that it is also lacking any sort of dying/death ritual/rite as well..

sure there's the funeral with prayer etc, but that's all done after the 
fact.  our society tends to just not deal with the reality that people die,
but rather it groups the dying together in nursing homes and such, out of
sight, out of mind.  death and dying in america today is very taboo.

which is, imo, why tim is choosing to broadcast his death.  he always did
like to shake up people's preconcieved notions of what XXX is.


 
> I get a D- in pc.   
> 
> The one thing this will do is shove the issue of the right to choose the time 
> and place of your own demise in a lot of people's faces which I believe is 
> his point. Whether or not you choose to watch it becomes irrelevant as 
> you have been motivated enough to speak about it, which means you are 
> *thinking* about the issue.   
> 
>                                             Black Adder
> 
> 

that too :)

 justin

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 10:41:47 1996
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Subject: packabowl age?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 10:40:42 -0700 (PDT)
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Hi all,
does anyone know what the agelimit is for pack-a-bowl tonite ?
And if someone does, would that someone please let me know what
it is ?:) 
thanks much,
-harsh
hdeshma@scdt.intel.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 10:42:29 1996
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Subject: Re: Hard Copy story on Raves
Date: Thu, 9 May 96 10:09:02 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: "Troy Sheets" <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
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>Well, of course this was all filmed at Dune, a socal-raves sponsored event,
>so of course socal raves is going crazy over it.  If you want, I can forward
>these messages to sfraves.  Anyone object?
>
>-troy

Please, no!
I get enough mail as it is, 60 messages this morning just from SFR.
I don't have the time to read all the socal messages too. It's
pretty crazy in here between the Hard Copy, Timothy Leary and Free
Tibet stuff. But maybe you could make a list of those who want it 
and forward to them?

I'm sure I know what their reaction is, they must be totally pissed.
Let's just leave it at that...

thanks,
Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 10:52:32 1996
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From: "Jacqui Kolarik" <jkolarik@ssi.sony.com>
Encoding: 26 Text
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To: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>, socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Hard Copy (A Suggestion)
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What a great idea,  Raves from a raver's point of view.  There are so many 
articulate, intelligent, educated, people in this scene, let's interview them 
instead of the person who's been doing speed/ex/pot/alchohol/roofies/heroin (not 
necessarily in that order) for three days in a disco, then goes to an outdoor 
rave after cutting school, murdering their parents, and can barely talk much 
less express the intimacies of the scene, but wears the "rave-garb" that is 
stereotypically linked with party-goers.  Why collect money?  Perhaps there are 
those on the list that can donate time and energies?
_______________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Hard Copy (A Suggestion)
From:    Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net> at Internet
Date:    5/9/96  9:51 AM

 As peple have pointed out calling, sending email, or taking to 
court Hard Copy wont do any good. For them its just another day at work.
If you really whish to do something fight fire with fire. Get some film 
major from one of the raves lists to do a small documentary on raves and 
show it on public access tv and some film festivals, etc. I'am sure 
enough money can be collected for such thing from all the rave lists. 
Hey, Iam down for 50 bucks. Anyone up to the task?

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 11:01:52 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605091801.LAA22883@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: AH Gear Poll
To: analogue@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 11:01:30 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: socal-raves@ucsd.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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[To the raving list people... this is a project I did for the Analogue Heaven
Mailing list.  I thought you might be interested to see the tools people
use to make your favorite dance music!]

Whew!! What a job.  But, I think my efforts were worth it as
we now have some good info and insite into the tools of
AH members.  The number one synth is.... a drum machine!!

There are 2 lists here of the same data... one is sorted by
number of AH members reporting to use the synth and the other
is sorted by synth manufacture/model.  A DM: prefix indicates
the unit is a drum machine.

A note on errors: YES there are many items on here that are
not analogue.  I just put in the info that people sent me.
If there are incorrect DM: prefixes, please let me know.

I have spent a lot of time on this project and for this
reason I will not record any more gear lists for the time
being.  I got well over 50 responses including over 200 units,
so I think this is a good statistical cross-section.

Enjoy. -troy

 
    Sorted by AH Popularity:

    DM: Roland TR-606                                 18
    Roland Juno 106                                   15
    Oberheim Matrix 6(r)                              14
    Sequential Pro 1                                  14
    Korg MS-20                                        12
    Roland Juno 60                                    12
    DM: Roland TR-808                                 11
    Korg Mono/Poly                                    11
    Roland SH-101                                     11
    Roland TB303                                      11
    DM: Roland TR-909                                  9
    Roland Jupiter 8                                   9
    Sequential Prophet 5                               9
    Arp Odyssey                                        8
    Roland Juno 6                                      8
    Arp 2600                                           7
    Roland Jupiter 6                                   7
    DM: Roland TR-707                                  6
    Ensonic ESQ                                        6
    Moog Memorymoog                                    6
    Oberheim Matrix 1000                               6      
    Realistic Moog MG1                                 6
    Roland MC-202                                      6
    Roland SH-09                                       6
    Moog Minimoog                                      5
    Moog Prodigy                                       5
    OSC Oscar                                          5
    PAiA Fatman                                        5
    Roland Jupiter 4                                   5
    Roland System 100(m) (104)                         5
    Seqeuential 600                                    5
    Sequential Six Track                               5
    DM: Linn LinnDrum                                  4
    DM: Roland TR727                                   4
    Korg EX8000                                        4
    Korg MS-50                                         4
    Korg Polysix ("Best Organ and great bass")         4
    Moog Micro Moog                                    4
    Moog Source                                        4
    Novation Bass Station                              4
    Oberheim Xpander                                   4
    Roland SH-1000                                     4
    DM: Boss DR-55                                     3
    DM: Roland CR8000                                  3
    DM: Roland R8 (w/ Dance Card)                      3
    Korg EX-800                                        3
    Korg MS-10                                         3
    Korg Poly-800 (mk II)                              3
    Moog Sonic Six                                     3
    Oberheim OB-1                                      3
    Oberheim OB-8                                      3
    Oberheim OBMx                                      3
    Roland JX-8P                                       3
    Roland JX3P                                        3
    Roland MKS-50                                      3
    Roland SH-02                                       3
    RSF Kobol Expander                                 3
    Theremin (any)                                     3
    Yamaha CS-40m                                      3
    Arp Axxe                                           2
    Casio CZ-101                                       2
    Crumar Bit One                                     2      
    DM: Sequential Drumtraks (with prommed 909 c       2
    DM: Simmons SDS                                    2
    DM: Simmons SDS 9 drum brain                       2
    Elka Synthex                                       2
    EMS Synthi A                                       2
    Gleeman Pentaphonic                                2
    Korg DW-8000                                       2
    Korg Poly 61m                                      2
    Korg SQ-10                                         2
    Mellotron 400s                                     2
    Moog Multi-Moog                                    2
    Oberheim 4 Voice                                   2
    Octave Cat                                         2
    PowerTran Transcendent 2000                        2
    PPG 2.2                                            2
    Rhodes Chroma Polaris                              2
    Roland Alpha Juno-2                                2
    Roland D-550                                       2
    Roland Juno 2                                      2
    Roland MKS-30                                      2
    Roland MKS-7                                       2
    Roland MKS-80                                      2
    Roland SH-3A                                       2
    Roland SH-5                                        2
    Sequential Prophet VS                              2
    Serge Modular                                      2
    Synton Syrinx                                      2
    Yamaha CS-20m                                      2
    Yamaha CS-5                                        2
    Yamaha DX-7(2)                                     2
    Akai AX-60                                         1
    Analogue Systems TH48                              1
    ARF Bernie                                         1
    Arp Avatar                                         1
    Arp Little Brother                                 1
    Arp Omni                                           1
    Arp Pro Soloist                                    1
    ARP Quadra                                         1
    Arp String Enseble                                 1
    Boss HC-2                                          1
    Boss PC-2                                          1      
    Buchla 200 Serial Electric Music Box               1
    Casio 202                                          1
    Casio CZ-1                                         1
    Casio FZ-1                                         1
    Control Synthesis Deep Bass Nine                   1
    Crumar Spirit                                      1
    Curtis CEM Homemade Modular                        1
    Delta Music Modular                                1
    Digisound Modular-80                               1
    DK Synergy II                                      1
    DM: Aleisis SR-16                                  1
    DM: Boss DR-660                                    1
    DM: Casio DH-100                                   1
    DM: Emu Drumulator                                 1
    DM: Gretsch Synsonic Drums                         1
    DM: Kawai XD5                                      1
    DM: Korg KPR 77                                    1
    DM: Roland 626                                     1
    DM: Roland PB 300                                  1
    DM: Roland R-5                                     1
    DM: Roland TR-505                                  1
    DM: Simmons SDS-1000                               1
    DM: Simmons SDS-200                                1
    DM: Sound Master SR 88                             1
    DM: Star Synare 3                                  1
    DM: Tama Techstar TAM500                           1
    DM: Yamaha DD-5                                    1
    DM: Yamaha RX-21                                   1
    DM: Yamaha RX11                                    1
    DM: Yamaha RY30                                    1
    Doepfer MS-404                                     1
    Doepfer System A-100                               1
    EDP Wasp                                           1
    EML 400                                            1
    EML 401                                            1
    EML EML-101                                        1
    EML prototype                                      1
    Ensonic Mirage                                     1
    Ensonic SQ-1+/32                                   1
    Evolution EVS-1                                    1
    Exclusively Analogue Aviator                       1
    Fender Rhodes                                      1
    Freeman String Symphonizer                         1         
    Hammond BCV                                        1
    HUGE modular homebuilt                             1
    Kawai 100f                                         1
    Kawai K1                                           1
    Kawai K3                                           1
    Korg Delta                                         1
    Korg KPR-77                                        1
    Korg MaxiKorg                                      1
    Korg Micropreset                                   1
    Korg PS-3200                                       1
    Korg Wavestation EX                                1
    Moog MG-1                                          1
    Moog Modular                                       1
    Moog Rogue                                         1
    Oberheim 2-voice                                   1
    Oberheim 8-voice                                   1
    Oberheim DMX                                       1
    Oberheim DPX-1                                     1
    Oberheim Matrix 12                                 1
    Oberheim XA                                        1
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    Opus III                                           1
    PAiA Vocoder                                       1
    PPG 2.3                                            1
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    Roland GR-700                                      1
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    Roland MKS-20                                      1
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    Roland SH-2000                                     1
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    Yamaha CS-15                                       1
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    Yamaha DX-100                                      1
    Yamaha FB-01                                       1
    Yamaha TX-802                                      1
    Yamaha TX-816                                      1 

    Sorted by Manufacture/Model

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    Korg Polysix ("Best Organ and great bass")         4
    Korg PS-3200                                       1
    Korg SQ-10                                         2
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    Mellotron 400s                                     2
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    Roland GR-700                                      1
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    Roland JX-8P                                       3
    Roland JX3P                                        3
    Roland MC-202                                      6
    Roland MKS-10                                      1
    Roland MKS-20                                      1
    Roland MKS-30                                      2
    Roland MKS-50                                      3
    Roland MKS-7                                       2
    Roland MKS-70                                      1
    Roland MKS-80                                      2
    Roland MSQ 700                                     1
    Roland Promars                                     1
    Roland R-8m                                        1
    Roland SH-02                                       3
    Roland SH-09                                       6
    Roland SH-1                                        1
    Roland SH-1000                                     4
    Roland SH-101                                     11
    Roland SH-2000                                     1
    Roland SH-3A                                       2
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    Roland SH-5                                        2
    Roland SH-7                                        1
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    Roland TB303                                      11
    RSF Kobol Expander                                 3
    Seqeuential 600                                    5
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    Serge Modular                                      2
    Siel DK6000                                        1
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    Simmons ClapTrap                                   1
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    Voyetra 8                                          1
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    Yamaha CS-01                                       1
    Yamaha CS-15                                       1
    Yamaha CS-20m                                      2
    Yamaha CS-40m                                      3
    Yamaha CS-5                                        2
    Yamaha CS-80                                       1
    Yamaha DX-1                                        1
    Yamaha DX-100                                      1
    Yamaha DX-7(2)                                     2
    Yamaha FB-01                                       1
    Yamaha TX-802                                      1
    Yamaha TX-816                                      1



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 11:20:49 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 11:20:32 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: B2B
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

you bet.

i've been told "it isn't really a race". phew. :>

not sure whether we'll actually be able to meet b4 the race, but it would
be very fun if some people could arrange something like an end-of-race sfr
area (???)...maybe this is too ambitious for 9-10am on a saturday?

whadd'ya think people?

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 11:21:22 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 11:17:52 -0800
To: hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: packabowl age?
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 10:40 AM  -0700 5/9/96, hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com wrote:
>Hi all,
>does anyone know what the agelimit is for pack-a-bowl tonite ?
>And if someone does, would that someone please let me know what
>it is ?:)
>thanks much,
>-harsh
>hdeshma@scdt.intel.com



Though their (Rock-a-Bowl) voice mail said otherwise when I called a while
back, the age limit is 18+, or at least it was three weeks ago.

Call F8 for further details.

Tony



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 11:42:37 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 11:42:36 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: julie@catapent.com (Julie Mills)
Subject: Re: B2B
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I'm doing Bay 2 Breakers, too!  I'd love to meet up after.  We could bring
laminates and meet by the letter 'R' at the end of the race.

Julie



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 11:48:09 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 11:47:53 -0700
Message-Id: <199605091847.LAA09647@dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com>
From: mlick@ix.netcom.com (Michael Douglas Lick)
Subject: Re: Hard Copy (A Suggestion)
To: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

You wrote: 
>
>	As peple have pointed out calling, sending email, or taking to 
>court Hard Copy wont do any good. For them its just another day at 
work.
>If you really whish to do something fight fire with fire. Get some 
film 
>major from one of the raves lists to do a small documentary on raves 
and 
>show it on public access tv and some film festivals, etc. I'am sure 
>enough money can be collected for such thing from all the rave lists. 
>Hey, Iam down for 50 bucks. Anyone up to the task?
>
>Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
>http://underground.org/
>KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
>Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 
>
>
TO ALL INTERESTED IN A DOCUMENTARY ON RAVES to fight "fire with fire":

My friend Clench is currently involved in such a project. You may have 
seen him filming at Harmony's Family Reunion at ACME, at MERIDIAN 
(Mosch's cool little party!), and at Beautiful People.

I'm sure that his product would be Public Access TV and Film Festival 
material with a little help from his friends (ie: YOU!)

If you would like to be interviewed, donate money, donate equipment or 
have footage of raves/parties you would like to donate to his movie, OR 
ANYTHING ELSE YOU THINK WOULD HELP e-mail him at:
 
                   clench13@aol.com

HE IS TOTALLY EXCITED AS IT IS ABOUT HIS DOCUMENTARY, AND WITH SOME 
SUPPORT FROM THE SCENE, HE WOULD BE IN extacy!!!!!!

thanks for listenting,
peace,love,unity::::::::::::::::::::::fathertime
      puckin.drooly.horks!!!!!!
          P.D.H.!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 12:06:02 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 12:03:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: The annoying spelling patrol is out 
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605091847.LAA09647@dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com>
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, Michael Douglas Lick wrote:

> 
> SUPPORT FROM THE SCENE, HE WOULD BE IN extacy!!!!!!
					 ^^^^^^
					This word is spelled ecstasy.

(Understandable mistake, hard word to figure out)
(Much apologies, I have a hard time re-reading spelling errors.  Must 
have something to do with the long  line of English teachers in my 
family:)  No offense to anyone, I make the same mistakes!!)  Actually my 
biggest pet peeve is when "you're" is spelled "your."  

Shutting her mouth now and waiting for the heat:)

kaysee

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 12:11:06 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605091911.MAA24041@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: VERY IMPORTANT- COMMENTS TO HARD COPY (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 12:11:01 -0700 (PDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24]
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Okay kids, this is it.  Kc is the socal-raves promoter of Dune, and
he has some connections in the Hollywood TV industry.  Send your comments
to kc at sarahtonen@earthlink.net

-troy

> If you have specific comments to make regarding the segment on Hard Copy
> please e-mail them to me ASAP as I am having a meeting with the producer of
> the segment later today!
> 
> Your comments MUST only regard the following areas:
> 
> 1) Producer/Editor Irresponsibilty
> 2) Errors/Inaccuracies in the report
> 3) Ommissions in the report
> 4) Irresponsibility in legalities (i.e. playing copywrited music and video
> images, minors without consent, etc.)
> 
> 
> No emotional responses please.
> 
> 
> 
> Please get these to me immediately.  Please don't call me or Hard Copy... yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Kc
> 
> 
> Memories of DUNE at
> http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen
> 
> 

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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 12:16:43 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 12:16:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: BTB:  how about....
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How about our own "float" with a generator and a DJ being pulled along by
lots of happy ravers?

:)

(it's not that far-fetched... there's a full-on tiki bar being pulled
along every year with blenders, bartenders and TVs!) 

smiley



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 12:21:06 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 96 12:21 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: The annoying spelling patrol is out
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

> On Thu, 9 May 1996, Michael Douglas Lick wrote:
> 
> > 
> > SUPPORT FROM THE SCENE, HE WOULD BE IN extacy!!!!!!
> 					 ^^^^^^
> 					This word is spelled ecstasy.
> 
> (Understandable mistake, hard word to figure out)
> (Much apologies, I have a hard time re-reading spelling errors.  Must 
> have something to do with the long  line of English teachers in my 
> family:)  No offense to anyone, I make the same mistakes!!)  Actually my 
> biggest pet peeve is when "you're" is spelled "your."  
> 
> Shutting her mouth now and waiting for the heat:)
> 
> kaysee
>
Sheeesh...feel better now? 
peace 
bill.e





   ****** .com online v2.02 is now up and fully v2.0 Netscapified ******
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 12:56:54 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 12:56:44 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Crusty old raver <wayne@club.net>
Subject: rides
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

Some people on this list think that it's their god-given right to get a
ride, whenever they want, to wherever they want, at their convenience.

Nobody here on SF Raves nor anywhere else owes anybody a ride, and when one
is offered or given, it should be appreciated, not expected. Those of you
that constantly want rides ought to be a little more inwardly focused to
figure out why rides aren't being offered to you. Attitude, respect for
others and personal grooming habits should be topics of thought.

With that in mind, can we bring the whining to a stop?



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:11:02 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:07:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: packabowl age?
In-Reply-To: <9605091740.AA25532@cad614.sc.intel.com>
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 I'm pretty sure that it's *all ages*.




On Thu, 9 May 1996 hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com wrote:

> Hi all,
> does anyone know what the agelimit is for pack-a-bowl tonite ?
> And if someone does, would that someone please let me know what
> it is ?:) 
> thanks much,
> -harsh
> hdeshma@scdt.intel.com
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:13:11 1996
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Priority: urgent
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 14:11:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: RE: Hard Copy (A Suggestion)
To: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>, socal-raves <socal-raves@ucsd.edu>
Cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Now THIS is a great idea.  I'd pitch in 50 bucks, if we can get someone   
who would really DO it.  Anyone know any good fimmakers?
 -Roy

 ----------
From:  Aleph One[SMTP:aleph1@dfw.net]
Sent:  Thursday, May 09, 1996 11:15 AM
To:  socal-raves
Cc:  sfraves
Subject:  Hard Copy (A Suggestion)

 As peple have pointed out calling, sending email, or taking to
court Hard Copy wont do any good. For them its just another day at work.
If you really whish to do something fight fire with fire. Get some film
major from one of the raves lists to do a small documentary on raves and
show it on public access tv and some film festivals, etc. I'am sure
enough money can be collected for such thing from all the rave lists.
Hey, Iam down for 50 bucks. Anyone up to the task?

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:22:19 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:23:17 -0700 (PDT)
Message-Id: <199605092023.NAA25272@worm.hooked.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Just arrived in SF...don't know shit
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Wow!  I just arrived in SF this week and I'm completely clueless.  
 
You may remember me... my name is Erik and I posted about a month ago
saying that I was packing my shit up and driving cross country from DC to
San Fran. 
 
Oh, Yeah... I must explain why I'm using moonpup's address... well, I'm
living in moonpup's place while he's in the UK.  And he left before I got
here.  So, back to my original story... 
 
Yes, I'm a new San Franciscan (is that right?).  So who'd like to show me
what the west coast is all about?  Any friendly gatherings this weekend? 
(I lost the sfraves calender.  Actually I think I need to resubscribe) I'm
fumbling through this Mac.  I assumed when moonpup said had a computer for
me to use that it would be a PC... 
Wrong! 
 
Another questions: 
Wheres a Mall or a bunch of shops to buy stuff? 
And anyone know a cool place to get a hair cut?  I'm goin' long to short so
I don't want any Joe cuttin' me too bald.  
 
--erik  
 
 
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:29:38 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:28:54 +0200
To: crunch@well.com (John Draper), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Ride pool was: Re:Put me on the Yo list
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Also,  put me on the list of those people who need rides.   So it's late
>Wednesday evening and we ONLY GOT 3 people signed up as rave pool drivers.
>This is pathetic at best....   ONLY 3 people having cars and able to take
>additional riders to the parties this weekend?    Out of how many on
>SFRaves?   Someone said 900 people?   Is that right?    Something is
>very wrong here....
>
>The Crunchman

Hey, I'd help out if I could but I live in Pleasanton about an hour east of
the city and I also drive a 2 seat car...This leaves me with little options
for ride sharing.  If I could get a ride sometimes too I wouldn't have to
pay up to 10 dollars a weekend for gas to a party.

Savin' those pennies till the next party...
Austin

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:30:19 1996
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Date: Thu, 09 May 1996 13:30:40 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "I, 99" <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: rides
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Some people on this list think that it's their god-given right to get a
>ride, whenever they want, to wherever they want, at their convenience.

i think the original idea of the ride pool was to give people rides should
you be driving an empty car past their house or neighborhood. not driving
out of your way to pick someone up and take them home, that is obviously a
little ridiculous. i, for one, have no problem stopping somewhere along the
way to the city to pick up a couple people if it's not out of my way. and if
i got a buck or two in gas money, or just managed to help someone else have
a good time that would be worth it to me.

besides, we owe it to the environment to fill up our cars with people when
we go somewhere. what's an extra 10 minutes if it saves someone from driving
an additional car, or if it makes a couple people happy?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:37:51 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:37:23 +0200
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Re: packabowl age?
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

hdeshma@scdt.intel.com wrote on 5/9/96:
>Hi all,
>does anyone know what the agelimit is for pack-a-bowl tonite ?
>And if someone does, would that someone please let me know what
>it is ?:)
>thanks much,
>-harsh
>hdeshma@scdt.intel.com

Well the flyer I got at Sunset says 21+ but a couple of weeks ago it was 18+=
???/

I think I am going and I will bring my "60's/70's" sfr laminamte (as some
one mentioned)
Special Guest : GARTH and residents  TRACY and MARS
Here's the ## 415.541.5019

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:44:22 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:43:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
cc: socal-raves@ucsd.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Hard Copy (A Suggestion)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960509114544.26885C-100000@dfw.dfw.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.93.960509134148.9366A-100000@amy28.Stanford.EDU>
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This actually was going to be one of my suggestions for in the end it is 
that kind of work which endures once the people who were involved are
gone.  If you qant to make a statement, you need to do it yourselves.  I 
have some ideas on how it could be done.  Would anyone want to work on
such a project?

Cassandra

On Thu, 9 May 1996, Aleph One wrote:

> 	As peple have pointed out calling, sending email, or taking to 
> court Hard Copy wont do any good. For them its just another day at work.
> If you really whish to do something fight fire with fire. Get some film 
> major from one of the raves lists to do a small documentary on raves and 
> show it on public access tv and some film festivals, etc. I'am sure 
> enough money can be collected for such thing from all the rave lists. 
> Hey, Iam down for 50 bucks. Anyone up to the task?
> 
> Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
> http://underground.org/
> KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
> Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:44:58 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:44:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Melissa Wong <inanna@best.com>
To: blkadder@value.net
cc: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960509083540.1338B-100000@value.net>
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You know, about four years ago Newsweek showed up to A Rave Called Sharon
and....... there were plenty of us who gave them positive interviews and
perspectives.  What showed up in the article?  People on drugs and "Do you
know where your children are when you're asleep?"  That was four years ago.
Same shit different day.  It seems futile to attempt to enlighten these
entertainers and babysitters.  That's all these Hard Copy people are.  They
are not journalist and they are not interested in "reporting".  They are
concerned with NUMBERS.  That is, numbers of viewers.  If you watched their
show.... you watched their advertisers adds.  That's it.  Keep it real and
loving HERE.  That's where we make a difference.  In our lives together as
a community.  There will always be the charlatans out there looking for a
buck and I don't want to cater to them anymore than we already have.  Do
any of you remember the 60 minutes show about 3-4 years ago?

Melissa

	

	**************************************************************	
	Go to the mountains and the oceans and the forest, go naked in 
	the summertime that you may regain the old joy and love gladly 
	and freely under the stars.

						-John Whiteside Parson
	**************************************************************




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 13:49:29 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:49:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Melissa Wong <inanna@best.com>
To: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: B2B
In-Reply-To: <v02130503adb7d2eb8cd2@[157.22.240.192]>
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Oooohhhhh, that would be fun.  An SFRaves funky crew all dressed up and
shaking our rumps down the street!


On Thu, 9 May 1996, Vince wrote:

> Hey do any of you wacky ravers want to get all dressed up and run
> (walk/crawl) in the Bay to Breakers with me ???
> 
> Vince
> 
> Sunday May 19th
> 
> info: http://www.sfo.com/~hulaman/bay2b.html
> 
> 

	

	**************************************************************	
	Go to the mountains and the oceans and the forest, go naked in 
	the summertime that you may regain the old joy and love gladly 
	and freely under the stars.

						-John Whiteside Parson
	**************************************************************




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 14:04:53 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 14:03:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy (A Suggestion)
To: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
cc: socal-raves@ucsd.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960509114544.26885C-100000@dfw.dfw.net>
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, Aleph One wrote:

> 	As peple have pointed out calling, sending email, or taking to 
> court Hard Copy wont do any good. For them its just another day at work.
> If you really whish to do something fight fire with fire. Get some film 
> major from one of the raves lists to do a small documentary on raves and 
> show it on public access tv and some film festivals, etc. I'am sure 
> enough money can be collected for such thing from all the rave lists. 
> Hey, Iam down for 50 bucks. Anyone up to the task?
> 
> Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
> http://underground.org/
> KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
> Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 
> 
> 


Hi all!
 I actually have a production okay at Santa Cruz Community TV (my local 
public access station) and can work with others to produce a tape. I'm 
REALLY poor so I would need financil assitance (getting tape[s], going to 
raves, trasportation). I could help pay for some but not all. Most 
important is that I do have access to video equipment and an editing system 
and a station to broadcast from.
 Interested replies can be addressed privately. I'm also a film/video 
student.

Ran @ Dionysus dreams

                             (broadcasting live)
                                  /
                            -=*=-/
                              ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 14:14:01 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 16:05:09 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: VERY IMPORTANT- COMMENTS TO HARD COPY (fwd)
Message-Id: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960509160448.16218C-100000@dfw.dfw.net>
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Some of you might want to add something to this.

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 11:35:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kc <sarahtonen@earthlink.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: VERY IMPORTANT- COMMENTS TO HARD COPY

If you have specific comments to make regarding the segment on Hard Copy
please e-mail them to me ASAP as I am having a meeting with the producer of
the segment later today!

Your comments MUST only regard the following areas:

1) Producer/Editor Irresponsibilty
2) Errors/Inaccuracies in the report
3) Ommissions in the report
4) Irresponsibility in legalities (i.e. playing copywrited music and video
images, minors without consent, etc.)


No emotional responses please.



Please get these to me immediately.  Please don't call me or Hard Copy... yet.




-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 14:16:34 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 14:15:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Crusty old raver <wayne@club.net>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: rides
In-Reply-To: <v02140b02adb7fc84b047@[157.22.222.111]>
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> With that in mind, can we bring the whining to a stop?

My car has 263,000 miles on it, mostly from taking ungrateful little 
bastards to raves :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 14:17:59 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 14:16:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
cc: hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: packabowl age?
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960509130719.16388A-100000@value.net>
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I think it said 21+ on the flyer...

> 
>  I'm pretty sure that it's *all ages*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu, 9 May 1996 hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com wrote:
> 
> > Hi all,
> > does anyone know what the agelimit is for pack-a-bowl tonite ?
> > And if someone does, would that someone please let me know what
> > it is ?:) 
> > thanks much,
> > -harsh
> > hdeshma@scdt.intel.com
> > 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 14:57:30 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 14:54:15 -0700
Message-Id: <199605092154.OAA24389@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: Harmony resp./info (Bsp)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello everyone,

    I just wanted to say thanks for all of the overwelming responce to 
our last party (Beautiful People)! All of us really apprieciate the 
positive feedback that all of you have given us! It really does mean 
alot!! We thrive on it. For me personally, all of the energy that was 
created that night is what is forcing me to do it again! You guys, are 
the driving force behind Harmony! You are responcible for creating the 
vibe, the energy and the love! We try our hardest to give you the 
atmosphere, which lets you be open, positive, sharing, caring and 
loving. But always remember, it is because of you!

    And with that, here is the next party! On this Sunday May 12th, 
Harmony is going to the beach! The party will start at 12 noon, and go 
past sunset sometime. Of coarse it is FREE, and will be located on a 
friendly beach in Santa Cruz. The weather report looks sunny, so come 
out and show your support!! Please, bring water and food, plus cold and 
warm clothes!! Most of all bring your positive energy!!!!! The info 
numbers are (408) 486-9591 and (408)450-3044


Peace, 

Greg :)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 15:20:43 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 15:19:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tinsau <amdice@puc.edu>
To: Julie Mills <julie@catapent.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: B2B
In-Reply-To: <199605091842.LAA22545@catapent.com>
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, Julie Mills wrote:

> I'm doing Bay 2 Breakers, too!  I'd love to meet up after.  We could bring
> laminates and meet by the letter 'R' at the end of the race.
> 
> Julie
> 
> 
That sounds like a good place to meet. I will have to remember to bring 
my laminate just for this. Are there others running this as well? 

  Austin                             
  Tinsau                    

            S.F. Born and Raved!                          










From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 15:30:06 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605092218.PAA27990@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: packabowl age?
To: dwarzau@ns.net (John Deatherage)
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 15:18:55 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: raygun@value.net, hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960509141643.26687A-100000@hornet.ns.net> from "John Deatherage" at May 9, 96 02:16:59 pm
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Nope!  It is all ages, but there is a bar there that you must be +21 to
get in to.

-troy

> 
> 
> I think it said 21+ on the flyer...
> 
> > 
> >  I'm pretty sure that it's *all ages*.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On Thu, 9 May 1996 hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com wrote:
> > 
> > > Hi all,
> > > does anyone know what the agelimit is for pack-a-bowl tonite ?
> > > And if someone does, would that someone please let me know what
> > > it is ?:) 
> > > thanks much,
> > > -harsh
> > > hdeshma@scdt.intel.com
> > > 
> > 
> 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 15:37:49 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 15:37:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tinsau <amdice@puc.edu>
To: Melissa Wong <inanna@best.com>
cc: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: B2B
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, Melissa Wong wrote:

> 
> Oooohhhhh, that would be fun.  An SFRaves funky crew all dressed up and
> shaking our rumps down the street!
> 
> 
> On Thu, 9 May 1996, Vince wrote:
> 
> > Hey do any of you wacky ravers want to get all dressed up and run
> > (walk/crawl) in the Bay to Breakers with me ???
> > 
> > Vince

Actually, since I will be coming straight from Space Teddy I will be 
dressed up. I don't know about the feasability of meeting at the start of 
the race but having a meeting at the end by the R as was suggested is 
surely workable. 

  Austin                             
  Tinsau                    

            S.F. Born and Raved!                          










From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 15:44:06 1996
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>    And with that, here is the next party! On this Sunday May 12th,
>Harmony is going to the beach! The party will start at 12 noon, and go
>past sunset sometime. Of coarse it is FREE, and will be located on a
>friendly beach in Santa Cruz. The weather report looks sunny, so come
>out and show your support!!
>
>Peace,
>Greg :)

Yes!  I am soooo there!!!  Hope to see as many of y'all as possible.  If
anyone near the 17/85 interchange needs a ride over the hill, let me know,
and I'll see if I can give you one.  But only if you have good grooming
habits ;) (j/k)

Pass the sunscreen,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 15:49:20 1996
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Subject: Re: VERY IMPORTANT- COMMENTS TO HARD COPY (fwd)
Date: Thu, 9 May 96 16:49:22 -0600
From: Andy Hawks <andy@cmac20.colorado.edu>
To: "Sanfrandisco Raves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>If you have specific comments to make regarding the segment on Hard Copy
>please e-mail them to me ASAP as I am having a meeting with the producer of
>the segment later today!
>
>Your comments MUST only regard the following areas:
>
>1) Producer/Editor Irresponsibilty
>2) Errors/Inaccuracies in the report
>3) Ommissions in the report
>4) Irresponsibility in legalities (i.e. playing copywrited music and video
>images, minors without consent, etc.)
>
>
>No emotional responses please.

This is pretty fruitless, IMHO.  =)  I fully understand the feelings 
behind your desire to correct the wrongs you feel were committed, but....

Melissa Wong's comments hit it on the mark, it's the most intelligent 
response I've ever heard to this tired, decade old subject, and takes a 
wize, mature focus:  

>From:        Melissa Wong, inanna@best.com
>
>Keep it real and
>loving HERE.  That's where we make a difference.  In our lives together as
>a community.  There will always be the charlatans out there looking for a
>buck and I don't want to cater to them anymore than we already have. 

As she said, these people are always going to get away with as much as 
they can to draw attention to themselves for whatever reason (money, 
psychological need, whatever).  And there are always going to be people 
in your life who feed off your energy like that for their own selfish 
gain, whether it's a friend, lover, family, or Hard Copy.  

The best solution is generally not to engage in the energy struggle when 
someone feeds off you like this, because it just ends up promoting 
negativity on either or both ends, and it wastes your own time and 
energy.  

Rather, focus more strongly on what's close to you that's positive and 
mutually beneficial, because positivity breeds positivity.  Like Melissa 
said, "Keep it real and loving HERE. That's where we make a difference."  
It can't be said better or more accurately.   

And try to realize that the Hard Copy type of exploitation goes on 
weekend after weekend on a smaller/individual scale all around you.  If 
you do feel the need to do something about it, work from the grassroots 
to ensure that everyone understands what rave culture is really all about 
-- that's how you kill the whale, when it's a little itty-bitty fishy.  
Take away people's fear of what they don't understand and they start to 
embrace what was once mysterious, what they once might've sought to 
exploit or punish or put an end to.  

break down barriers and spread love in your own ways every day and the 
world will be a better place.  =)

peace and lur




       __                                              __
   ___/  )           andy@andy.colorado.edu           (  \___
  (___) (_____   peace<->love<->unity<->respect   _____) (___)
  (___)> _____    believe in the power of love    _____ <(___)
  (___)_/                                              \_(___)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 16:16:43 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605092316.QAA29622@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: VERY IMPORTANT- COMMENTS TO HARD COPY (fwd)
To: andy@cmac20.colorado.edu (Andy Hawks)
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 16:16:27 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <1380461931-249077@cmac20.Colorado.EDU> from "Andy Hawks" at May 9, 96 04:49:22 pm
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> 
> As she said, these people are always going to get away with as much as 
> they can to draw attention to themselves for whatever reason (money, 
> psychological need, whatever).  And there are always going to be people 
> in your life who feed off your energy like that for their own selfish 
> gain, whether it's a friend, lover, family, or Hard Copy.  
> 
> The best solution is generally not to engage in the energy struggle when 
> someone feeds off you like this, because it just ends up promoting 
> negativity on either or both ends, and it wastes your own time and 
> energy.  
> 
> Rather, focus more strongly on what's close to you that's positive and 
> mutually beneficial, because positivity breeds positivity.  Like Melissa 
> said, "Keep it real and loving HERE. That's where we make a difference."  
> It can't be said better or more accurately.   

I agree with your energy strugle ideas, but the fact is, is that this
negative publicity may make it very hard to throw parties.  Dune
was thrown in complete compliance with the Fedral desert Land Management
rangers... and they were there supervising the whole event.  If the 
common notion of raves becomes "they are drugged-out orgies", then it
may be impossible to have these parties.  Remember, they are trying to
get ratings, TV wants to be your friend.  If people don't let the networks
know that TV is pissing them off, then they won't change.  Kc has an
incredible opportunity to let the Media know what the growing rave culture
thinks about them bashing our scene.  Let's give him support, okay?

-troy

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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 16:40:56 1996
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To: Vince@vmar.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: BayToBreakers Raveathon
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 .....any of you wacky ravers want to get all dressed up and run
(walk/crawl) in the Bay to Breakers with me ???-Vince

Hmm, DING, idea (lightbulb over head) this sounds interesting, perhaps we can
grab a boom box, a few whistles, throw on our floppy hats and overalls, and
rave on down the road.  Damn we need those SFR shirts!  -When is B2B Vince?-
 
Love,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 16:55:13 1996
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From: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
To: andy@cmac20.colorado.edu
Subject: Re: VERY IMPORTANT- COMMENTS TO HARD COPY (fwd)
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> 
> >If you have specific comments to make regarding the segment on Hard Copy
> >please e-mail them to me ASAP as I am having a meeting with the producer of
> >the segment later today!
> >
> 
> This is pretty fruitless, IMHO.  =)  I fully understand the feelings 
> behind your desire to correct the wrongs you feel were committed, but....
> 

	Small-time complaints might be fruitless, but in this case someone was 
exploited (perhaps even slandered), as a promoter/individual, by a media 
company.  Like it or not, the media carries a lot of weight, and dealing with 
them on their level can avoid a lot of negativity being broadcast...  The reason 
the media works at all is that there is a certain degree of responsibility, 
based on "whining" by the slandered.

Andrew

-----------------------------------------
Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 17:00:44 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: VERY IMPORTANT- COMMENTS TO HARD COPY (fwd)
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>        Small-time complaints might be fruitless, but in this case someone was
>exploited (perhaps even slandered), as a promoter/individual, by a media
>company.  Like it or not, the media carries a lot of weight, and dealing with
>them on their level can avoid a lot of negativity being broadcast...  The
>reason
>the media works at all is that there is a certain degree of responsibility,
>based on "whining" by the slandered.
>
>Andrew
>
The argument in favor of addressing HC is gaining strength, IMO.  Maybe we
should support this cause after all.  Crew?

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 17:21:04 1996
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 Hey Everyone!
 
 We're going to be helping out the BASS crew on Friday. F-8 will be 
 the map point for the party. These guys are doing great job with 
 getting jungle out and about in town, so give 'em some support!
 
 Stop by between 10pm-2am and get the skinny.
 
 "The shit you just can't fuck with!"
  
 Dig it!
 
 Jonas
 
 F-8
 1816 Haight St.  @ Stanyan
 SF
 
 415-221-4142
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 17:33:37 1996
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From: Dimitri K Gortinsky <myself@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re[2]: Free Tibet-not rave related (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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this is the organization i was talking about.......

>I also see that there is an info line 1-888-MILAREPA and a web site at 
>http:// www.milarepa.org.


> I recently bought tickets for Saturday and Sunday shows.  I must admit, mainly

> because of the music.  This may sound like an ignorant question, especially 
> being from a Buddhist family, but what does "Free Tibet" really mean?  Also, 
> does anybody know how much of my hard earned $56 dollars will actually be used

> to help and what kind of help is needed?  I thought it was a valid question to

> this group because there are so many enlightened people on this list.
> 
> 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 17:48:11 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 17:46:33 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Hard Copy and the Nature of Mass Media
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Michael wrote:

> Before wasting time in a reply to Hardcopy you might consider Do they
>even care ?  I suspect that a show like that would only care that you
>watched at all - NOT whether you agree/disagree.... merely that they are
>getting through . Their goal is not to inform with TRUTH as much as it is
>to inform with entertainment ( truth is not really their objective )...


I agree, but I think that their goal is not to inform at all, but to ensure
an audience FOR THE COMMERCIALS.  Size of audience share sets the price the
show can charge for commercial time - the PROFIT behind this show.
Therefore, they sensationalize and "entertain" and distort and vulgarize as
much as possible to appeal to the widest amount of people (oops, I mean
"consumers").

Most television shows are merely the padding around the true purpose of
commercial television - agressive advertisement for you to buy, buy, buy.
Their mind-numbing stupidity (i.e. sit-coms) and their ridiculous
sensationalizing (i.e. tabloid "news" shows) create a state of mind in the
viewer that ensure absolute receptivity, NOT conducive to analytical
thought -- the perfect mind-set to unthinkingly absorb the subliminal/overt
messages of the commercials.  Therefore, it would be counter-productive for
a medium intent on creating mindless consuming automatons to encourage
open-mindedness and thinking for our selves.

The job of the Hard Copy crew is to scour real life for any situation that
could possible be exploited.  And illegal, all-night parties with
teen-agers and drugs is PUUURRFECT for that.  It's "sexy!" (in advertising
lingo).

A public  retraction is totally impossible.  Any information would just be
for the benefit of the Hard Copy crew, who may or may not care - either
way, it doesn't change the nature of their job, which is to sensationalize,
which brings in the viewers, who are primed for a barrage of advertising.

The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media, and making
sure those in our own lives hear from us the real story.

But, it was good for a laugh.  :P

Back to studying!
Love, Nancy


>
>All this IMHO of course ;-)
>
>HARDCOPY the show that cares about THE TRUTH and shows it...
>Now there's a slogan for the masses....
>
>Mike
>
>
> meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic
> Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 17:50:07 1996
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From: Derek Chung <dhchung@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605100049.RAA07444@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: This Week's SFR Calendar!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (SF Raves)
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 17:49:55 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves-calendar@hyperreal.com (SFR Calendar)
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Friday is a big Jungle night with Bass Instinct featuring SF's finest
junglists and also Funky Tekno Tribe welcomes Goldie and Doc Scott.
There's a free party as well that night; on Saturday, Madness ought
to be crazy, and maybe there'll be a Sunset on Sunday.

I have a feeling some of the weeklies are dead and buried by now, but
I need some help figuring out exactly which ones are no more.


                                THE SFR CALENDAR
                                       
    http://www.hyperreal.com/raves/sf/calendar/gencal.cgi

     _________________________________________________________________
   
Upcoming Parties in the San Francisco Bay Area

   Friday, May 10th - _Something Free_
   Ethan, Le Le, Tom, Dan Barnes.
   Free. 415.525.5052
   
   Friday, May 10th - Rain Dance Productions presents _Building Blocks_
   Garth, Carlos, Mark Farina, Tom, Spun, Woolove, Harry Who?.
   408.425.3316 415.965.5045 510.889.2922
   
   Friday, May 10th - _The Happening_
   Tomas Trouble, Donald Glaude, DRC, Pat (UK), Matthew Gadfathr.
   advance tix at Ameba & Primal Records
   415.267.3927 510.464.5985
   
   Friday, May 10th - Funky Tekno Tribe vs Goldie & the Metalheadz
   Goldie, Doc Scott, Graeme, DJ Dan, Markie, Raymond Roker , Professor
   Smith.  10pm-, 21+. 525 Harrison, SF. 415.266.8215
   
   Friday, May 10th - the b.a.s.s. kru presents Bass Instinct
   A Drum and Bass Celebration
   Thad, Stareyes, Abstract, Flux, Noel, Tomas.
   Free mix tapes for the first eighty people
   415.332.5800x247
   
   Saturday, May 11st - _The Happening_
   outdoor party - 1/2 price to attendees of the 5.10.96 Happening
   415.267.3927 510.464.5985
   
   Saturday, May 11st - GK Productions/FunkyBeat presents _Experience_
   Dutch, Christophe, Mystr-E, Ivo, Max Factor, Jin, Nam, Spinner,
   Blesed, Essence, Paucus.
   510.980.8861 415.605.1915 408.488.1350
   
   Saturday, May 11st - _madness _
   Peter Lazonby, Ethan, Alex Windsor, Jon Santos, Joe Rice, John Carel.
   415.281.9432
   
   Saturday, May 11st - "The River" presents _ritual and rave_
   a tribute to Gaia, our mother.
   Sanna, Cyr, Ronan.
   Pot luck at 6ish - bring exotic cuisine and spirit
   3:30pm-dark, All ages, Free. Joaquin Miller Park, Oakland.
   510.986.9150
   
   Wednesday, May 15th - Game Technologies presents _Sprockets_
   Freaky Chakra vs. Single Cell Orchestra, guests.
   8p-2a, $5. San Jose. 408.345.1415
   
   Friday, May 17th - King St Garage
   Anita, Patrick, David Harness.
   10pm-, 21+, $4. King St Garage, 174 King St @ 3rd., SF. 415.522.6887
   
   Friday, May 17th - Ultra 5 presents _Smarties _
   Pierre (NYC), Eric Davenport, Barry Weaver, DJ Dan, Jeno, Kimo.
   9pm-7am, . 800.204.3986 415.437.5503 408.345.2399 916.484.4006
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Origin presents _Liquid Sky Music west coast tour_
   Teri Bristol (Miss Thing), Reese (NYC), Markie, Simon, Garth, Rob
   Doten.
   Virgin location, free water and organic food.
   415.675.5605 408.236.3398 415.541.5646 916.484.4213
   
   Saturday, May 18th - SqUAreOne presents _Fresh Start_
   Karizma, Rig-A-Tony, Lego, Pelican Boy, Dr. Jimmy Zimms, special
   guest.   discount for May Babies w/i.d.
   $10. SF. 415.263.3987
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Spundae presents _Space Teddy_
   Keoki, DJ Dan, Mystr-E, Mars, Jon Santos, David Michael.
   415.764.2922
   
   Friday, May 24th - Space Children & In-Touch presents _Open Space_
   A1 (Texas), DJ Dan, Donald Glaude, Graeme, Cesar, Radley.
   415.267.3916 510.433.7216 408.327.9277 916.554.7177
   
   Saturday, May 25th - Funky Tekno Tribe 
   Graeme, DJ Dan, Simon, Tony, Galen, Jon Williams, Chris Flores,
   Darkhorse, Jonah Sharp, Professor Smith.
   limited pre-sale tix $20 at Housewares & In Tha Mix.
   415.266.8215 415.266.9215 408.236.2205 916.484.3727
   
   Saturday, May 25th - _a higher state of freedom_
   andre lucero, taj, galen, sean murray, goura candra.
   Free. 415.303.5336
   
   Sunday, May 26th - _Spundae_
   John Aquaviva, Jon Williams, Simon, Henrik, Tony, Felix, David
   Michael, Kimball Collins, Mark Lewis, DJ Dan, Carlos, Miquel, Pete
   Avila, David Harness.
   Visuals by Dimension Se7en.
   9pm-8am, 21+. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.974.9389
   
   Friday, May 31st - _Needles_
   Barry Weaver, Donald Glaude, Chris Flores, Karizma, Dutch, Matthew,
   Miah, Stevie, Vibes, Flash, Dennis, Rockit, Filip, Scot, Carlos
   Campos.
   runs all weekend (thru 6/2)
   415.313.7107 916.440.2707
   
   Friday, May 31st - Out-A-Sight
   Graeme, Jeno, Simon, Sotero (SD).
   Visuals by Hyperdelic, Donovan.
   SF. 415.437.4462
   
   Friday, May 31st - Beyond Space-Time/Kundalini presents _100%
   Spiritual Rays of Love_
   Michael Manahan, Dervish, DJ Daeman, Ernie Munson, Phil Salter, Jon
   Williams.
   415.337.4928
   
   Saturday, June 1st - _Tribal Future Big Mountain Boogie_
   Tony, Carlos, Josh, John Howard, Tracy, Galen, Solar, Alex Windsor,
   Alika, Abstract, Pollywog, Dan Barnes, Allen, Andrew, Nathan, DJ
   Crack.
   runs from noon Saturday until midnight or later Sunday.
   tix at Ameba and Primal.
   $20. Willits. 415.750.9368
   
   Wednesday, August 28th - Burning Man 1996
   includes Wicked Sound System.
   save $10 by registering by June 1st.
   runs entire weekend, through September 2nd.
   All ages, $35. Black Rock Desert, Nevada. 415.985.7471
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
W E E K L I E S

   House/techno/acid jazz/ambient/etc reg'lar happenins Some of them may
   have ended - let me know when that happens...
   
  Thursday
  
   Lift - House, Funk w/DJs David Harness, Ruben Mancias, Jay-J, Black,
   guests. 12mid-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma, SF. 415.267.5984
   
   Velvet Shop - House, Techno. call for location
   21+, $5. 4th St Bowl, , SJ. 408.235.1556
   
   _Azul_ - House, Soul w/DJs Alfie, James. 21+, Free. Casanova, 527
   Valencia, SF.
   
   Full House - Acid Jazz, House w/DJs Finn, Matt Bernsen, Andrew
   Rawnsley, Bruno Ybarra, guests, live musicians. 10pm-2am, 21+, $3.
   Miss Pearl's Jam House, Eddy & Larkin, SF.
   
   Pack-a-Bowl - "We'll be droppin the wax while you're droppin the
   balls" w/DJs Mars, Tracy, guests. 8:30pm-2am, $6. Park Bowl, Haight @
   Stanyan, SF. 415.541.5019
   
   _Diversity_ - jungle, trance. Every other Thursday
   18+, $5. , Sacramento 916.203.TRIP
   
   .blitz - foxyboysfancygirlsfreshmademixes begins April 4th
   21+. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   _Le Jazz Hot!_ - future sounds for jazz heads w/DJs Andrew Jervis,
   guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, $3. Nickies BBQ, 460 Haight, SF. 415.621.6508
   
   _Real_ - house, techno. every first Thursday of the month
   9pm-2am, 18+, $7. Pantages Theater, 1225 K St Mall, Sacramento.
   916.565.9588
   
   _Revolutionary Wax_ - coax your evolutionary ass w/DJs Consuelo Kevin,
   John John (Open Mind), James (Tweekin). 21+, Free. Dalva, 3121 16th
   St, SF. 415.252.7740
   
   _Green_ - house, techno w/DJs guests weekly. 10pm-2am, 18+. the top of
   the Wharf Cafe, the end of the Santa Cruz Wharf, Santa Cruz.
   
  Friday
  
   _ Sound Factory _- House w/DJs Pete Avila, David Harness, guets.
   9:30pm-7am, 21+, $10. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF.
   415.543.1300
   
   _Soul'd Out_ - House w/DJs Julius Papp, Rick Preston, guests. free
   before 10:30
   9pm-, 21+, $5. The Usual, 400 S.1st St., San Jose.
   
   _Nocturnal Transmission_ - House w/DJs David Harness, Tim Martinez,
   Saint John, guests. $5 before midnight.
   11pm-5am, 21+, $10. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Go Fast_ - Techno. Energy Music...for Women by Women (boys can come
   too).
   10pm-. 8th & Minna, SF.
   
   _Liquid Fridays_ - House w/DJs various DJs. 10pm-2am, 18+, Free. 2721
   Broadway, Sacramento., Sacramento. 916.484.4285
   
   _Viva_ - ...setting san francisco on fire! w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Jamie
   J, guest. free before 10:30 w/flyer
   9:30pm-4am, 21+, $7. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   the green door - "where circles meet squares" w/DJs andrew, thomas,
   caspar, paul, felix the dog, guests. 10pm-3am, 21+, $7. 880 Stevenson
   @ 10th, SF.
   
   _Nikita_ - house, techno w/DJs Jeno, Simon, Henrik. 10pm-7am, 21+,
   $10. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.267.0568
   [5.10 - Deep Dish]
   [5.31 - Juan Atkins]
   [6.7 - DJ Duke]
   [6.14 - Westbam, Hardsequencer]
   [6.21 - CJ Mackintosh]
   [6.28 - Derrick May]
   
   _The Scene_ - 21+. the EndUp, 401 6th @ Harrison, SF. 415.393.9067
   
   _Beats_ - house, breakbeat, trance w/DJs Carlos Campos, Karizma,
   weekly guests. 7042 Folsom Blvd between Howe and 65th, Sacramento.
   415.273.1345 916.558.0850
   
   _This Side Up_ - house, techno w/DJs guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight,
   SF.
   
  Saturday
  
   _Other Whirled_ - House, Techno w/DJs Warren, Nobel, Jason Cassady,
   Nikki Rivera, guests. saturday morning
   6am-, 21+. 201 9th @ Howard, SF.
   
   _Sound Factory _- big club sounds
   9:30pm-4am, 21+. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF. 415.543.1300
   
   _Release _- Acid Jazz, Funk, Reggae, House w/DJs Jerry Ross, Josh, Mr.
   Sulu, Randy Wong. 21+. 1015 Folsom, , SF. 415.337.7457
   
   55 - House, Euro w/DJs Jorge Martinez, Tim Martinez, guests. 21+. 55
   Natoma St., SF. 415.267.1858
   
   _Vanilla Fudge _- House w/DJs Corey Black, Sunshine, Moonbeam, Jason,
   Big Lee, Darren. occasional saturday nights.
   10pm-2am, Free. Cafe Bastille, 55 Belden Alley, SF. 415.764.2903
   
   Vertigo - Psycho, Techno, Disco, Funk w/DJs Nikki Rivera, Ellen
   Ferrato, Dave Peterson, Lewis. 10pm-, 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison,
   SF. 415.703.7172
   
   _Liquid Vinyl_ - House w/DJs Jay-J, Suiki, John Howard, guests.
   2am-6am, 21+, $8. DV8, 540 Howard, SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Nuff Respect _- Jungle w/DJs StarEyes, Thad. 5pm-9pm, Free. Your
   Mama's Cafe, 5239 College Ave @ Broadway, Oakland, Oakland.
   510.601.YOUR
   
   phunkatech - Jungle w/DJs UFO, Noel, guests. 21+, $2. The Top, 424
   Haight, SF. 415.995.4699
   
   _Metro Jazz _- Acid Jazz w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Mauricio Avilas, Tom
   Thump, Franky, guests. 10pm-, 21+, $7. 111 Minna St, SF.
   [5.11 - Roman]
   [5.18 - Kevin]
   [5.25 - Harry Who?]
   [6.1 - Markie]
   [6.8 - Two Year Anniversary]
   
  Sunday
  
   the Sci-fi Club - hypersentientpsychedelictribalacidcybertrance w/DJs
   Dutch, DRC, Mars, Theta Blip, Solar, guests. Free food and Funky vibes
   in The Juicy Milk Bar (Ameba DJ team + guests)
   18+. 683 Clementina @ 8th & Folsom, SF. 415.331.1500x888
   
   _Spundae _- House, Techno w/DJs Henrik, Carlos, Miquel, weekly guests.
   free b4 10:30p
   For Technotica, call 415.764.2922
   10pm-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.974.9389
   [5.12 - Julius Papp, Henrik, Garth, Carlos]
   
   _Leopard Lounge_ - Acid Jazz, Funk & Live Bands. w/DJs Suiki, Jay-J,
   Anthony, Julius Papp, Mark Farina, guests. 2125 Lombard @ Fillmore,
   SF. 415.771.2583
   
   _Pleasuredome_ - House w/DJs Neil Lewis, David Harness, Phil B,
   guests. 21+. 177 Townsend, SF. 415.985.5256
   
   Quench - House, Ambient w/DJs Rick Preston, Ryan Tapia, guests.
   Ambient-Space explorations by DJ Leath and guests in the front room.
   21+. The Usual, 400 South First St., San Jose. 408.535.0330
   
   _Techsture_ - deep layers of sound w/DJs tomas, markus, guests.
   8pm-12mid, All ages, Free. cafe abir, 1300 Fulton @ Divisadero, SF.
   415.974.4358
   
   subbass - jungle, drum'n'bass, trip hop w/DJs noel, abstract, jawbone.
   10pm-2am, 21+, $3. 270 Brannan @ 2nd, SF. 415.905.8865
   
  Monday
  
    Mushroom Jazz - acid jazz, trip hop w/DJs Mark Farina, Miquel, Julius
   Papp, guests. 9pm-3am, 21+, $5. 330 Ritch St, SF. 415.905.8811
   
   _Noc Noc_ - techno/ambient/jungle w/DJs Mohsen. 21+, Free. 557 Haight
   St., SF.
   
   _Tongue n' Groove _- trip hop, jungle, acid jazz w/DJs tomas, seth,
   m.mark, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+, $5. Cat's Grill & Alley, 1190 Folsom @
   8th, SF. 415.431.3332
   
   _rotation_ - jazz, hiphop, soul, acid jazz, funk w/DJs racer x, yamu,
   stef, rasta cue-tip, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+. up & down club, 1151
   Folsom St, SF.
   
   _21st sensory _- abstractbeatz-hiphop-dub-drum n'bass-electro w/DJs
   Tomas, Abstract, guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight, SF. 415.974.4358
   
   _Movement_ - trance, breakbeat, jungle w/DJs Ron, Kimo, Rich, guests.
   10pm-2am, 18+, $3. Bahia Cabana, 1600 Market @ Franklin, SF.
   
  Tuesday
  
    Butterfly - Hip Hop, Acid Jazz, House, Funk w/DJs Charlotte, Dani,
   guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, $2. Casanova, 527 Valencia, SF.
   
   Breathe Deep - House w/DJs Jay-J, Ruben, Miquel, guests. 10pm-4am,
   21+, $5. 1015 Folsom., SF. 415.998.9515
   
   _Begin..._ - house, trip hop, trance w/DJs Darrel, Cisco, Radley,
   Ollie, Seanee, Xpress, Grey, Anna. 9pm-2am, All ages. The Inn of the
   Beginning, 8201 Old Redwood Highway, Cotati, Cotati. 707.524.4443
   
   _Kinetic_ - Phil Salter, guests. 21+, $5. 2325 clayton road, concord.
   510.946.5005
   
   _Shoam_ - Trip-Hop & Drum n Bass Your Mama's Cafe, 5239 College,
   Oakland.
   
   _Succotash!_ - tasty jazz - funk - beats - space w/DJs tom thump,
   rasta q-tip. 21+, Free. up & down club, 1151 folsom st., SF.
   
   _supper_ - funk, acid jazz w/DJs Caspar, guests. 21+, Free. Julie's
   Supper Club, 1123 Folsom @ 7th, SF. 415.861.0707
   
   _Light-n-Up Lounge_ - house w/DJs Preston, guests. 21+. 111 Minna St, SF.
   [5.14 - Mark Farina]
   
   _L-Tryptophan_ - ambient, techno w/DJs guest DJs weekly. 21+, Free.
   1624 California @ Van Ness, SF.
   
   _Lost in Space_ - house, hip-hop w/DJs Pause, Dark Money, Winnie B,
   Eric Lacy. 21+, Free. Cafe Mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th, SF.
   
  Wednesday
  
   _ Come/Unity _- House, Techno, Ambient w/DJs Simon, Jeno, Garth. first
   Wednesday of the month.
   10pm-4am, 21+, $7. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.241.8815
   
   _Boost_ - old school uplifting house w/DJs Jamie J, Hector the
   ejector. 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison, SF. 415.703.7105
   
   _Roots_ - House, Trip Hop w/DJs Garth, Jeno, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+,
   $6. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.512.5713
   
   _cosmic lounge _- space jazz, galactic grooves, jungle w/DJs Caspar,
   Paul, Seth, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, Free. cafe mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th,
   SF.
   
   _Reunion_ - Danny, Naz Cafe, guests. 9pm-, 21+, Free. The Fulton Bar,
   1243 Fulton Mall, Fresno. 209.488.5332
   
   _Quantum_ - trance w/DJs Myster-e, Mars, guests. $3. tHE pOWERhOUSE,
   1347 fOLSOM. 415.861.1833
   
   _Thirsty_ - tasty house tunes and even better company w/DJs Jellybear,
   Jay-J, top notch guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, Free. The Top, 424 Haight St,
   SF.
   
   _The Lounge_ - 9pm-3am, 21+. 1401 Arden Way, Sacramento.
   916.922.8041x4240
   
   _Bubbles_ - deep funky techno house music w/DJs Don Crisp (Crisp
   Records), guests. starts May 1.
   9pm-2am, 21+. Babylon, 2260 Van Ness @ Vallejo, SF. 415.567.1222
   
   _Wish_ - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
   18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663
   [5.15 - Henrik]
   [5.22 - Grover]
   
   _Belief_ - house w/DJs Julius Papp, Harry Who?, Rick Preston. begins
   5.22.
   10pm-, 21+. Agenda basement, 1st & San Salvador, San Jose.
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Info Lines

     * Be-At Info Line - 415-626-4087. Usually has 5-10 listings, updated
       daily.
     * Clubline - 415.979.8686
     * Fatline - 415.207.3668
     * Frequency 8 Trance/Techno infoline - 415.541.5019
     * the Global Party Network Buzzline - 415.568.1338
     * The Groove Line - (415) 331.1500 ext.4788
     * Housewares Rave Line - 415.281.0125
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Radio/TV Shows

     * Sunday night 11pm-2am - "The Dreaming/Innermind Show" w/DJ Miracle
       & Mr. Monchichi. House, Jungle, Trip-Hop, Ambient, Dub,
       Break-Beats & guest DJs. KSCU 103.3 (Santa Clara)
     * Monday afternoon 12:30-3:00 pm - DJ Jerecho presents the best of
       the urban polyrhythmic experience jungle, acid jazz, techno,
       electro, breakbeat KDVS, 90.3 FM (Davis)
     * Wednesday night/Thursday morning 3am-6am - "Aural Fixation"
       experimental sounds of ambient and trip hop with a splash of hi
       nrg, from trance to jungle. KZSC 88.1 fm (Santa Cruz)
     * Thursdays 9:30pm-midnight - "Aurora Borealis" Beats and
       atmospherics w/DJ Seth. KALX 90.7 (Berkeley)
     * Fridays 9pm-midnight - Andrew from Groove Merchant spins on KUSF
       90.3 (SF)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - midnight-noon. House/techno mix
       with Johnny K, Ozone & guests - KCSS 91.9 Central Valley (Turlock)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - "Just Desserts" w/Mr.Goodwrench -
       10pm-2am Ambient, Techno, Acid House, whacked-out Dub, Acid Jazz
       and noise KFJC 89.7 - Los Altos Hills
     * Friday night - nocturnal transmissions - featuring house DJs from
       SF and around the world. mid-2am, 107.7 FM (SF)
     * Friday night - Your Mama's House w/Pete Avila - 3am-5am, 106.1
       KMEL.
     * Friday night - Moondance. Ambient; 3am-7:30am, KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday afternoon - "Bus Stop" - music and talk w/guest DJs from
       SF and beyond. 2pm-3pm. KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday night 11pm - Flux Television, Viacom Channel 53 -
       Ambient, acid jazz and house music videos & interviews. (415)
       281-3377. flux@flux.net
     * Saturday night - "Saturday Night Spin Out" w/Ronnie Libido. Trip
       hop, Jungle, Ambient, Experimental Sounds. 10pm-2am. KFJC 89.7 -
       Los Altos Hills
     * Saturday night 9pm-mid - "An Epiphany of Sound" hosted by J.C. and
       Monkeywrench KZSU 90.1 (Stanford)
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Administrative Notes

   If anyone has info on any other events, send it to me! I can't
   possibly hope to get all the info every week.
   
   This info gets sent via email every Thursday. To subscribe or
   unsubscribe to the calendar mailing list, send e-mail to
   majordomo@hyperreal.com with either the line
   
   subscribe sfraves-calendar or
   unsubscribe sfraves-calendar
   
   There is also an sfraves discussion mailing list for issues related to
   clubs, parties, house and techno music, etc. To subscribe, send e-mail
   to majordomo@hyperreal.com with the line
   
   subscribe sfraves
   
   in the body of the message.
   
   
   
   
    Derek Chung - dhchung@hyperreal.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 17:54:54 1996
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Message-Id: <199605100023.RAA17451@ns.mauswerks.com>
Subject: Wha's up with DAT?
Date: Thu, 9 May 96 17:54:19 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hello kiddies-
Did anyone DAT the sfr picnic? If so, I'd like to obtain a copy of LeLe's 
set.
Can someone help me out with this, please!

I hope to see everyone at the Harmony beach thing on Sunday, I hope I can 
wait 
that long. It's only Thursday and I'm dancing around in my living room...

Love ya-
Ms Phink

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 18:30:59 1996
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From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: packabowl age?
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>I think it said 21+ on the flyer...
>
>> 
>>  I'm pretty sure that it's *all ages*.



The times I've been there, I think it was all ages just to bowl, like any
bowling alley would be, and it is 21+ to actually get into the separate bar
area.  They always card me once I try to get into the bar, but not usually
before, at least so far.


Love,
Shawna




"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 18:47:16 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 18:48:36 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Need ride to "Something Free" Please help
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As usual,  my ride to Something Free fell through,  so if anyone's going
tommorrow night,  please let me know....  Call me at 415-381-5847 or
1-800-381-5847.

The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 19:23:12 1996
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Date: Thu, 09 May 1996 19:27:02 -0700
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From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: RE: Hardcopy Report
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Hiya All;

        It's this type of thinkg that makes me glad I don't have a TV,
cable, or a VCR. If you ever thought that throwing your TV set out your
window would be fun, nows the time peoples. Come'on and join the few who
just say no to TV.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 19:58:02 1996
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From: davidmin@crl.com (David Minuk)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Sunset
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 02:53:09 GMT
Message-Id: <3192af36.250739837@mail.crl.com>
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According to the voice mail this week's Sunset will be in Southern
Cal, at the beach.  Wish I could go, but maybe I'll make it to
Harmony.

David
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Minuk(davidmin@crl.com)
WWW:  My URL is http://www.crl.com/~davidmin/
This website is not yet rated.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 20:38:08 1996
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To: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: dpsrosa@ax.ibase.org.br (Dirceu Pereira)
Subject: Re: Hard Copy Capitalism & Mass Media
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 05:46 PM 5/9/96 -0800, Nancy wrote:
>
>The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
>resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media, and making
>sure those in our own lives hear from us the real story.
>
It's simple. America is the land of consumism, You guys are so very used with consuming, consuming, consuming... an american can turn any good idea into profits and capitalism, even a Rave ( just take a look at most promoters..definitely into $$$ first )

I did not see this HARD COPy show, but when I used to live in the U.S., I used to watch it often, just to LOL about how your country can get stuck with such a thing as the O.J. Simpson trial... at least, most of it.

Now, that this story is over, popular TV needs new villians, new heroes, new real-life soap operas.. Maybe they will just turn to Raves ( I hope they don't), and as you can't really argue with TV... you can just tell people YOUR truth and hope they believe in it ( I am sure 90% will believe in what they "saw" in Hard Copy than in your words )

Dirceu


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 20:40:38 1996
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To: Melissa Wong <inanna@best.com>, blkadder@value.net
From: dpsrosa@ax.ibase.org.br (Dirceu Pereira)
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy
Cc: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 01:44 PM 5/9/96 -0700, Melissa Wong wrote:
>
>
>You know, about four years ago Newsweek showed up to A Rave Called Sharon
>and....... there were plenty of us who gave them positive interviews and
>perspectives.  What showed up in the article?  People on drugs and "Do you
>know where your children are when you're asleep?"  That was four years ago.
>Same shit different day.  It seems futile to attempt to enlighten these
>entertainers and babysitters.  

The main lesson in:

NEVER TRUST JOURNALISTS ( unless you know the person or trust the vehicle this person is in)

And, believe me, guys, I was a real victim of journalists by the time I used to DJ professionally ( they had this show about raves, drugs... they showed me DJing and said " Even teh music is made and spun to the enjoyment of drug users" ) I got fired from a good steady job at a law firm the next day :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 21:04:04 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 21:00:57 -0800
To: dpsrosa@ax.ibase.org.br (Dirceu Pereira)
From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Re: Hard Copy Capitalism & Mass Media
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>At 05:46 PM 5/9/96 -0800, Nancy wrote:
>>
>>The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
>>resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media, and making
>>sure those in our own lives hear from us the real story.
>>
>It's simple. America is the land of consumism, You guys are so very used
>with consuming, consuming, consuming... an american can turn any good idea
>into profits and capitalism, even a Rave ( just take a look at most
>promoters..definitely into $$$ first )
>
>I did not see this HARD COPy show, but when I used to live in the U.S., I
>used to watch it often, just to LOL about how your country can get stuck
>with such a thing as the O.J. Simpson trial... at least, most of it.
>
>Now, that this story is over, popular TV needs new villians, new heroes,
>new real-life soap operas.. Maybe they will just turn to Raves ( I hope
>they don't), and as you can't really argue with TV... you can just tell
>people YOUR truth and hope they believe in it ( I am sure 90% will believe
>in what they "saw" in Hard Copy than in your words )
>
>Dirceu


Hmm, how intriguing!  Where ARE you?

Yes, the thought of what the rest of the world must think of Americans
frightens me.  If they look at the mass media of any indication...it's
totally repulsive, that's why I and everyone I know detests television.  We
only export the worst of pop culture.  Yeah, Baywatch,  HardCopy and the
Enquirer - that's what it means to be American!

And America's and the First World's unchecked consumerism is causing mass
problems for the rest of the world (environment, poverty, resources).  It
can't go on for much longer.  Advertising is just a symptom of a
consumerist mind-set (and the tyranny of capitalism) -- a mind-set that I
hope is changing before we kill the earth and most of her inhabitants.

Love, Nancy

P.S. a lot of us support underground parties that are not profit-oriented.









From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 21:57:44 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 21:57:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Darrin Fossella <darrin@cea.edu>
Subject: Psychosis - SPAZ+Pirate Audio Party Sat. 5/11/96
To: SFraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
cc: terbo ted <shag@sirius.com>, Nathan Montesa <natmon@aol.com>,
        Darrel Etter <darrele@netcom.com>, Brenda Stine <bstine@process39.com>,
        STAFF <staff@cea.edu>, INTERNS <interns@cea.edu>
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                      Psychosis 

                  Sat. 5/11/96 9pm - 6am
               in Oakland at Compund I 
        cost = $5 (help support our gas fund for phree summer party  tour)
        infoline = (415)522-2398

Main Room DJ's
  Synthesis
  Jack Acid
  Flux
  
Live Electronic Music by Super Purple Ape Zombies

Chill Room DJ's
  Liquid Acrobat
  Ritchie the Menace
  Live ambience by Noisegate
  Sunflowerfish
  Jesus

Early Drum Circle Happening - bring your drum...

peace out 
keep smiling:)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 21:59:06 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 21:59:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: RE: Hardcopy Report
To: THX1138 <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960510022702.009c2898@sanfrancisco01.pop.internex.net>
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, THX1138 wrote:

> Hiya All;
> 
>         It's this type of thinkg that makes me glad I don't have a TV,
> cable, or a VCR. If you ever thought that throwing your TV set out your
> window would be fun, nows the time peoples. Come'on and join the few who
> just say no to TV.
> 
> Peace
> THX1138
> 
> 


TV? What's a TV? oh... you mean that ugly piece of flickering furniture. 
Gods, I threw that out years ago. Took too much time from dancing!


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams


          (Theatre is life, film is art, TV is furniture.)
                                 /
                           -=*=-/
                             ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 22:25:09 1996
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Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 22:23:30 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Fwd: Re: packabowl age?
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Well folks, here's the answer to the Big Question on packabowl's age limit!
I think tracy meant to send this to sfraves, but inadvertently sent it to me
instead:
-shawna

____________________________________________________________________________
________

Pac a bowl has always been All Ages unless you are drinking alcohol then
you must show your id.  I hope to see you all there....dj Tracy



>hey, where am I? wrote:
>> 
>> >I think it said 21+ on the flyer...
>> >
>> >>
>> >>  I'm pretty sure that it's *all ages*.
>> 
>> The times I've been there, I think it was all ages just to bowl, like any
>> bowling alley would be, and it is 21+ to actually get into the separate bar
>> area.  They always card me once I try to get into the bar, but not usually
>> before, at least so far.
>> 
>> Love,
>> Shawna
>> 
>> "Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."
>> 
>> 
>> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
>> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%\|/%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
>> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%      %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
>> %%%%%%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%
>> %%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%
>> %%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%
>> %%%%%%  %%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%
>> %%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%%  %%%%%%
>> %%%%  %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%  %%%%%
>> %%%%  %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%  %%%%%
>> %%%%  %%%%%%%%%%%%%  %%%%%%%%%%%%%  %%%%%
>> %%%%%  %%%%  %%%%%%%%%%%%%%  %%%%  %%%%%%
>> %%%%%%  %%%%%   %%%%%%%%%  %%%%%  %%%%%%%
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>> %%%%%%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%%%%
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>> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 22:31:15 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: leg stretchin' time =)
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hi all!
 Looks like I'm goin' to the Harmony Beach Party Babylon ;)!  It is going 
to be soooooooooooo good to get out and DANCE! I'm going early to help 
out Greg and crew and will probably stay late to help clean up, so it 
will be really easy to find me. Remember, long brown pony tail with short 
hair on sides and front (can you say mudflap?), blond imperial, blu eyes, 
6 foot tall, and SKINNY (at least I feel that way). Green khaki shorts 
for daytime and baggy blu jeans at night. 
 I may also be videotaping for a student project and airing the piece on 
Santa Cruz public access TV if it turns out well. So wear your best folks! ;)


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams

                           (boogie, boogie, boogie!)
                                 /
                           -=*=-/
                            \_/ 
                             " 
                             

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 22:36:16 1996
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From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: nw-raves@hyperreal.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: re* my tim leary post :) (NRR)
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thanx for everyone's varied and interesting responses :) now that i've 
heard from your different points of view i i feel better about the whole 
thing ... there's a part of me that just feels kinda weird about it, but 
i'm not so flabbergasted as i was before.

i wonder what William Burroughs will do?

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 23:17:23 1996
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From: Kristofer Ananda Carrison <mohack@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Who?
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Who was it that recently wrote a paper on raving?
Is it posted somewhere on the web?  Anybody know the address?
Seisure Lather,
Krishna


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May  9 23:24:28 1996
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Has anyone seen this commercial?  Kind of Bummed me out. Though I love
Chemical Bros., it kind of upset me that they would license their music to
Microsoft. Would'nt it have been more interesting if Microsoft had written
their own music for their own commercial! I know they're trying to play off
my emotions but...

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 00:17:30 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 00:18:35 +1000
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From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: B2B
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>That sounds like a good place to meet. I will have to remember to bring
>my laminate just for this. Are there others running this as well?

I was thinking of doing it also,   after a Sat Night rave...

Da Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 00:41:56 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 00:45:46 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: FYI
Cc: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
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Hiya All;

        The attachment is sample of what can be found on a very interesting site
(http://www.damicon.fi/drugs/pihkal/pihkal/pihkal.html). Being a
technologist I was very impressed by the amount of technical detail that was
available there.

        I hope you find the sample I've provided you as technically
interesting as I did, thanks.

Peace
THX1138

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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>PiHKAL #114 MDOH</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<H3>Phenethylamines i Have Known and Loved</H3>
[<A HREF="pihkal113.html">Backwards</A>][<A HREF="pihkal115.html">Forwards</A>]<BR>
[<A HREF="index.html#INDEX">Main Index</a>]<BR>
<H2>#114 MDOH; N-HYDROXY-MDA; 3,4-METHYLENEDIOXY-N-HYDROXYAMPHETAMINE
</H2>
<STRONG>SYNTHESIS:</STRONG> To a well stirred solution of 14.8 g hydroxylamine
hydrochloride in 120 mL MeOH there was added 3.6 g of
3,4-methylenedioxyphenylacetone (see under MDMA for its preparation)
followed by 1.0 g sodium cyanoborohydride.  The oxime, prepared from
the ketone and hydroxylamine in MeOH with pyridine, may be substituted
for these two components.  Concentrated HCl was added over the course
of a couple of days, to keep the pH near neutrality.  When the
reaction was complete, it was added to H2O, made strongly acidic with
HCl, and washed with 3x100 mL CH2Cl2.  The aqueous phase was made
basic with 25% NaOH, and reextracted with 3x100 mL of CH2Cl2.  The
extracts were pooled, and the solvent removed under vacuum to give 1.7
g of an oily residue which, with pumping under a hard vacuum for a few
minutes, changed to a white solid.  This can be Kugelrohred if the
vacuum is sufficiently good to keep the temperature during the
distillation below 100 &#176;C.  The extremely viscous distillate formed
crystals immediately upon wetting with IPA.  It was dissolved in 20 mL
of warm IPA and neutralized with concentrated HCl, with the titration
end-point being red rather than orange on universal pH paper.  Modest
addition of Et2O allowed the formation of
3,4-methylenedioxy-N-hydroxyamphetamine hydrochloride (MDOH) as white
crystals, which weighed 1.4 g when air dried.  If the temperature of
distillation exceeded 100 &#176;C, there was extensive decomposition during
distillation, with the formation of 3,4-methylenedioxyamphetamine
(MDA) and the oxime of the ketone.  Under these circumstances, the
only base isolated was MDA.  The surest isolation procedure was to
obtain MDOH as the free base, as a crystalline solid which could be
recrystallized from 5 volumes of boiling IPA.  The free base had a mp
of 94-95 &#176;C (and should not be confused with the oxime of
3,4-methylenedioxyphenylacetone which has a mp of 86-88 &#176;C since the
mixed mp is depressed, mp 56-62 &#176;C, or with the free base of MDA which
is an oil).  Anal. (C10H13NO3) N.  The hydrochloride salt had a mp of
149-150 &#176;C (and should not be confused with the hydrochloride of MDA
which has a mp of 185-186 &#176;C since the mixed mp is depressed, mp
128-138 &#176;C).  Anal. (C10H14ClNO3) N.  Acetic anhydride can serve as a
useful tool for distinguishing these materials.  MDA gives an N-acetyl
derivative with an mp of 92-93 &#176;C.  MDOH gives an N,O-diacetyl
derivative with a mp of 72-74 &#176;C.  Methylenedioxyphenylacetone oxime
gives an O-acetyl derivative that is an oil.
<P>
<STRONG>DOSAGE:</STRONG> 100 - 160 mg.
<P>
<STRONG>DURATION:</STRONG> 3 - 6 h.
<P>
<STRONG>QUALITATIVE COMMENTS:</STRONG> (with 100 mg) I felt hampered the first hour by
some internal barrier, which prevented total enjoyment.  However, this
began to break through in a wonderful way just before the supplement
was offered.  Since I felt I was beginning to move through the
barrier, I declined the supplement, particularly since I was anxious
to compare the after-effects with my first experience.  I had found
the first time very remarkable, but felt unusually tired for several
days following.  I feel it is important to know whether this is a
specific drug-induced effect, or the result of psychological
phenomena.  The experience continued in a rich, meaningful way.  There
was a marvelous inner glow, the warmth from all the other participants
was wonderful to feel, nature was most beautiful.  There were no
dramatic breakthroughs, or rushes of insight or energy, but just a
wonderful contemplative space where things gently unfolded as you put
your attention on them.
<P>
(with 100 mg) The material came on fairly rapidly.  In about 30
minutes, I was intensely intoxicated, and more deeply than with MDMA.
It was a glorious feeling, and beauty was everywhere enhanced.  With
eyes closed it felt marvelous, and it was appealing to pursue the
inner experience.  I did notice an internal dryness which was
characteristic of MDMA, and I had similar difficulty in urinating, but
not as intense as with MDMA.
<P>
(with 120 mg) The colors of the market-place, of all the fresh foods,
constituted a beautiful mosaic.  Nothing practical, simply a real
treasure to be used with individual intention and enjoyment.
Everything was seen with new eyes, new meanings, faces, figures, the
colors of the rainbow subconsciously individually applied.  A
'soul-scape'.  The following day very exhausted, tired, back-pain.
<P>
<STRONG>EXTENSIONS AND COMMENTARY:</STRONG> The first time that MDOH was synthesized,
it had inadvertently and unknowingly been converted to MDA.  And the
search for proper dosage and characterization of effects of this
product was, of course, the rediscovery of the dosage and the effects
of MDA.  It is one of the world's most remarkable coincidences that
after the second synthesis of MDOH, when MDOH had really and truly
been actually prepared, the brand new search for proper dosage and
characterization of effects revealed that they were almost identical
to the earlier observations for (the inadvertently produced) MDA.
<P>
This reminds me of my speculations in the discussion of both FLEA and
the HOT compound where they also showed paired molecular structures
with their prototypes that differ only by a single oxygen atom.
Again, might there be some metabolic interconversion within the body?
The immediate thought would be that the oxygen atom (the hydroxy
group) might be metabolically removed, and the effects of either drug
are due to the action of MDA.  But the opposite direction is in many
ways more appealing, the in vivo conversion of MDA to MDOH.  Why more
appealing?  For one thing, oxidative changes are much more common in
the body than reductive changes.  For another, the conversion of
amphetamine to N-hydroxyamphetamine is an intermediate in the
conversion of amphetamine to phenylacetone, a known metabolic process
in several animal species.  And that intermediate,
N-hydroxyamphetamine, is a material that gives the famous cytochrome
P-450 complex that has fascinated biochemists studying the so-called
NADPH-dependent metabolism.
<P>
I would put my money on the likelihood of MDA going to MDOH if it
should turn out that the two drugs interconvert in the body.  And in
that case, it would be MDOH, or another metabolite on down the line
that is common to both MDA and MDOH, that is the factor intrinsic to
the intoxication that is produced.  Human metabolic studies are
needed, and they have not yet been done.
<P>
<HR>
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[<A HREF="index.html#INDEX">Main Index</a>]<BR>
<HR>
<AUTHOR><I>HTMLized by <A HREF="http://www.hyperreal.com/~lamont/">Lamont Granquist</A><I></AUTHOR>

--=====================_831739546==_--


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 03:09:08 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 03:09:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Re: Anyone Up for a Techno Moshpit?
To: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Oh boy.  Why don't I find that hard to believe?  That a most pit might 
develop under the spinning eye of Mr. Hardcore.. ( I have a bunch of his 
tapes)

However, PLURKKK troubles me..  peace, love, unity, respect, kill, kill, 
kill...  argh..  --Mau


On Wed, 8 May 1996, Kyung Rok wrote:

> 
> Question:  Has anyone ever seen or participated in a slam/mosh pit at a 
> rave?  I'm curious because a friend from LA says that he's seen them 
> break out on at least a couple of occasions with hardcore dj Ron D. Core 
> at the helms.  I must say that i'd be a little surprised to find out about 
> this happening in the Bay Area -- though I have, on a couple of occasions, 
> seen a fella who didn't know what was up attempting to do this.
> 
> I know that this is FAR from the norm down there, but still, it's a curious 
> phenomenon that has mostly to do, I think, with a certain cross-over 
> element not really knowing exactly how to respond to the hectic beats.  
> Personally, I would love to see mosh pits in the Bay Area.  I dream of 
> getting a little physical down there near the dj booth, tightening the 
> muscles and turning the machismo on overdrive as I watch mini-packbacks 
> and lollipops fly up into the laser-lit air (just kidding ;).  -Rok.
> 
> (Acutally, to be fair, moshing needn't be overly physical -- just tends 
> to get that way when certain people feel like upping the ante, thereby 
> diminishing the collective experience and the amount of people willing 
> and/or able to participate.)      
> 
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 06:45:45 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 15:44:32 +0200 (MESZ)
From: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy/T.Leary
To: blkadder@value.net
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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> The one thing this will do is shove the issue of the right to choose the time 
> and place of your own demise in a lot of people's faces which I believe is 
> his point. Whether or not you choose to watch it becomes irrelevant as 
> you have been motivated enough to speak about it, which means you are 
> *thinking* about the issue.   
> 
>                                             Black Adder

last comment on this, and very short, cause i must remember i gotta 
do some work from time to time: 

this is the one right you ever have : 
to jump from your balcony (in case you have one, i believe, you guys over 
there have only fire ladders and your houses are not high enough. but 
anyway you get me) whenever you want to. 
***nobody is ever trying to take that from you***. at least, i've never 
heard about a case where somebody was trying to do that. to be precise, 
this is one of these good ol' things nobody will ever be able to take 
from you even if they tried. i mean, ok, there can be some trouble after 
you're dead like insurance stuff, or, last century, you were, like, not 
buried on a cemetery or in some ugly corner of it, but i mean, hey, 
what do *you* care...you're dead anyway. 

[ of course there's that euthanasia thing still. i see that point. 
 *BUT* :  somebody who is physically able to jump from his
 balcony but is afraid to do it **doesn't really wanna die**. i think it's
 perfectly ok they make it a crime to sell poison or something to such a 
 person.  my opinion. ]

so, finally, i don't really see what the usefulness in that 
public-diing issue is, apart from and except some abstract taboo-breaking
quality that might be quite neat. maybe.
there's a german saying: break through doors that are already open. i 
dunno if that makes any sense in the translation. that's what leary is 
doing, to my eyes.
well, i guess i just don't like people that make a lot of fuss...
....well, timothy leary is quite ok i guess... don't know him that 
well anyway...

very short, indeed...

love and flying saucers, ulrike

ps: like it or not, but you guys are *quite* pc, at least the overall 
    impression of your list. wamnt me to go into more detail? 
    pc in some *nice* way however.

**************************************************************************
it is the spectator, not life, that art really mirrors.
o.wilde
**************************************************************************

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 07:28:29 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 07:27:55 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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Hello All!

Please forgive me if this topic is inappropriate for this mailing 
list but has anyone ever read the Celestine Prophecy by James Redfield?
His ideas from the book seem to parallel the reasons of why we gather
at incredible events like last weeks Beautiful People. I receive his
monthly newsletter and I would like to quote from his opening thoughts,

"...The world is quickly polarizing into those stuck in Fear, control,
and selfishness, (and who want not just to share their version of the 
truth, but to legislate it and force others to comply whether or not
there is a democratic consensus) and those of us who hold the vision
of a democratic spiritual renaissance on the planet. Ideology and
dogma and religion is less important at this moment than whether we
are visualizing faith, love and spiritual awakening for the world, or
hate, envy, and collapse.
	The love within the visualization is what really matters. We 
must hold our truth and communicate it with others without even sending
hate energy. If we do, then we become part of the problem. The Tenth
Insight is about dicovering our truth and the truth of humanity's 
future, and then remembering how much spiritual power we have, and 
holding the Vision that this transformed human world will emerge."

I can't wait to see all you beautful people again I met last weekend at
BP on Friday and Wicked on Saturday and to make new friends this 
weekend! I'm probably going to go to Madness Saturday night and I would 
LOVE to share everything that I'm bringing with me (candy, vit C drops,
water, and my love for you!)...I'll also try and find those of you who
have posted previous descriptions of yourselves but here's what I look
like: asian, 5'8", super short hair (buzzzzz cut), usually just wear a
plain white t and comfy khakis or jeans.

Love to you all!

Take care,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 07:44:59 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 07:44:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Off yer Butts you little Wussies
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	OK - THAT'S IT - I've had just enough of your whimpering -

		"But, but, but (sob, sniffle) I can't _DANCE_ to jungle
		(drool, salivate, slobber)"  etc...etc...

Here's the deal:

	Get off yer sorry asses and I'll personally TEACH you little
chicken shits how to DANCE to jungle...

NO EXCUSES NOW - SEE YOU ALL AT BASS INSTINCT!


	I'll be wearing a tight, white soccer material shirt with adidas
stripes down the sleeves and baggy black pants - and YES, I'll be
dancing..

	fun guaranteed 
		
		jess


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 08:30:45 1996
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From: ccat@netcom.com (Chris Beaumont)
Message-Id: <199605101530.IAA28367@netcom15.netcom.com>
Subject: looking for apartment (NON RAVE)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 08:30:42 -0700 (PDT)
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Hi List members..
  This isn't rave related, but I thought I'd give it a shot...
My girlfriend and I am looking for a cool apartment situation (1 or 2 br.)in
SF, preferably in a mellow, neighborly kind of neighborhood/building.
(fun raver neighbors?) Our primary target neighborhoods are the 
Castro, Upper Market, lower Haight, and inner Mission  neighborhoods..
If any of you have interesting apartments opening up in your buildings, etc.
drop us a line at "chris@ncafe.com". We are both stable tenants with good
references and we don't play music very loud at home.. 

Hugs to all...
-Chris B.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 08:41:38 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: BSP Free Live Ambient/Idm by "RE:"
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RE: will be playing live ambient/idm electronic listening music for your
listening pleasure at RAW Live Foods tonight.  We will start around 7:30 pm
and play till about 10:00.  It's free, and the food at RAW is incredible.
(All organic, all vegan)  RAW is located at 1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln.  
Hope to see you there.

Rick


ps. for those of you who made it to the first cabin trip, RE: is Rick and Eric.




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 08:51:58 1996
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From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Subject: socializing at raves
To: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
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You wrote: 
>My one regret, which is my usual regret, is that I didn't spend more 
time
>with people, especially all of you!  Somehow, at parties, my capacity 
for
>speech leaves me, my memory deserts me, and I unconsciously absorb 
hours
>and hours by mainly dancing.   I haven't been much of a chill-room 
person.
>The night always whizzes by in a haze, I meet people whose names 
dissolve
>into a blur, and others I mean to spend time with somehow doesn't 
happen.

I know just how you feel.  Once I start trancing, I find the best way 
to connect to others is through the joy of the music.  And the best way 
I feel I can express that is to share it through dancing.  

I find that sometimes its a struggle to narrow my focus to have a 
conversation when I'm being swept up into the beauty of all the energy 
around.  At this time dancing is the best way to relate.  

I'm most able to feel a oneness with the flow of the vibe, when I'm 
dancing

:)
peter





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 09:03:42 1996
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Date: 10 May 1996 08:57:18 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy and the Nature
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, "Nancy" <Nancy@quickmail.apple.com>
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         Reply to:   RE>Hard Copy and the Nature of Mass Media

Rather than complaining to Hard Copy, maybe complaining directly to the
advertisers would be a better idea.  If the advertisers become aware of the
publics outrage over the programs that they buy time on, maybe the next time a
story like this comes around, they wont want to advertise.

just a thought......

-M

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/9/96 5:54 PM
To: Mark Camp*
From: Nancy

Michael wrote:

> Before wasting time in a reply to Hardcopy you might consider Do they
>even care ?  I suspect that a show like that would only care that you
>watched at all - NOT whether you agree/disagree.... merely that they are
>getting through . Their goal is not to inform with TRUTH as much as it is
>to inform with entertainment ( truth is not really their objective )...


I agree, but I think that their goal is not to inform at all, but to ensure
an audience FOR THE COMMERCIALS.  Size of audience share sets the price the
show can charge for commercial time - the PROFIT behind this show.
Therefore, they sensationalize and "entertain" and distort and vulgarize as
much as possible to appeal to the widest amount of people (oops, I mean
"consumers").

Most television shows are merely the padding around the true purpose of
commercial television - agressive advertisement for you to buy, buy, buy.
Their mind-numbing stupidity (i.e. sit-coms) and their ridiculous
sensationalizing (i.e. tabloid "news" shows) create a state of mind in the
viewer that ensure absolute receptivity, NOT conducive to analytical
thought -- the perfect mind-set to unthinkingly absorb the subliminal/overt
messages of the commercials.  Therefore, it would be counter-productive for
a medium intent on creating mindless consuming automatons to encourage
open-mindedness and thinking for our selves.

The job of the Hard Copy crew is to scour real life for any situation that
could possible be exploited.  And illegal, all-night parties with
teen-agers and drugs is PUUURRFECT for that.  It's "sexy!" (in advertising
lingo).

A public  retraction is totally impossible.  Any information would just be
for the benefit of the Hard Copy crew, who may or may not care - either
way, it doesn't change the nature of their job, which is to sensationalize,
which brings in the viewers, who are primed for a barrage of advertising.

The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media, and making
sure those in our own lives hear from us the real story.

But, it was good for a laugh.  :P

Back to studying!
Love, Nancy


>
>All this IMHO of course ;-)
>
>HARDCOPY the show that cares about THE TRUTH and shows it...
>Now there's a slogan for the masses....
>
>Mike
>
>
> meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic
> Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.



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From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Hard Copy and the Nature of Mass Media
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 09:19:02 1996
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To: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: socializing at raves
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>I find that sometimes its a struggle to narrow my focus to have a
>conversation when I'm being swept up into the beauty of all the energy
>around.  At this time dancing is the best way to relate.
>
>I'm most able to feel a oneness with the flow of the vibe, when I'm
>dancing
>
>:)
>peter

But there are those of us who feel that, when you do that, you don't WANT
to relate to us, and we feel ostricized (that's my experience).  It's so
confusing to find friends, get all excited that we're all sharing in a
wonderful experience, then see those friends (with whom we were
anticipating to spend some time socializing) ignore all but the dance floor
and their own thang.  This happens to me at every party; the most recent
example would be Nancy at BP: I saw her for all of ten seconds, and that
was it :(
OK, enough whining for now...see youse at BI and on da beach!

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 09:28:38 1996
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Date: 10 May 1996 09:23:44 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Deep Dish at 1015 Tonight
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Is anyone going to see Deep Dish tonight??

Anyone know if they are actually playing live or just spinning?



-M


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 09:44:57 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 09:44:23 -0700 (PDT)
To: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy/T.Leary
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On Fri, 10 May 1996, Ulrike Laitko wrote:

>  
> 
> > The one thing this will do is shove the issue of the right to choose the time 
> > and place of your own demise in a lot of people's faces which I believe is 
> > his point. Whether or not you choose to watch it becomes irrelevant as 
> > you have been motivated enough to speak about it, which means you are 
> > *thinking* about the issue.   
> > 
> >                                             Black Adder
> 
> last comment on this, and very short, cause i must remember i gotta 
> do some work from time to time: 
> 
> this is the one right you ever have : 
> to jump from your balcony (in case you have one, i believe, you guys over 
> there have only fire ladders and your houses are not high enough. but 
> anyway you get me) whenever you want to. 
> ***nobody is ever trying to take that from you***. at least, i've never 
> heard about a case where somebody was trying to do that. to be precise, 
> this is one of these good ol' things nobody will ever be able to take 
> from you even if they tried. i mean, ok, there can be some trouble after 
> you're dead like insurance stuff, or, last century, you were, like, not 
> buried on a cemetery or in some ugly corner of it, but i mean, hey, 
> what do *you* care...you're dead anyway. 

Actually, you are very, very wrong about that. There is a whole section 
of society that believes that anyone wanting to kill themselves for 
*ANY* reason including terminal illness should not be allowed to. They 
would rather keep you on life support until you waste away into 
nothingness, regardless of the quality of your "life." This has 
happened time and time again. There are people across the U.S. right now 
hooked up to life-support with 0.00001% chance of recovery, but 
people won't allow the plug to be pulled. 

Assisted sucide was outlawed in Michigan after Jack Kevorkian assisted in 
helping several terminally ill people put an end to their suffering. He 
was tried under these laws, although unsucessfully. 

> [ of course there's that euthanasia thing still. i see that point. 
>  *BUT* :  somebody who is physically able to jump from his
>  balcony but is afraid to do it **doesn't really wanna die**. i think it's
>  perfectly ok they make it a crime to sell poison or something to such a 
>  person.  my opinion. ]

Most terminally ill people don't want to die. They want to end their 
suffering. Why should it be a crime to end their suffering in the least 
painful manner? 

> so, finally, i don't really see what the usefulness in that 
> public-diing issue is, apart from and except some abstract taboo-breaking
> quality that might be quite neat. maybe.
> there's a german saying: break through doors that are already open. i 
> dunno if that makes any sense in the translation. that's what leary is 
> doing, to my eyes.

The translation makes absolute sense and to some extent I agree. However 
this is the man's last chance to do something towards something he believes 
in. While the issue may be open, perhaps he feels it isn't being 
discussed enough. Just a guess.

> well, i guess i just don't like people that make a lot of fuss...
> ....well, timothy leary is quite ok i guess... don't know him that 
> well anyway...

I saw Timothy Leary speak a few years back at the anniversary of Albert 
Hoffmans discovery of LSD. This event was something like $100 to get in(I 
found an "alternate" way in.) His speech consisted of"Everyone needs to get 
the message, blah blah blah..." I kind of tuned out after that. I assumed 
"everyone" were those people that could afford the $100 to hear his 
message. I am no great fan of the man, but he has does some positive 
things.  

> very short, indeed...
> 
> love and flying saucers, ulrike
> 
> ps: like it or not, but you guys are *quite* pc, at least the overall 
>     impression of your list. wamnt me to go into more detail? 
>     pc in some *nice* way however.

I am an individual. I am not the group. If you wish to call the tone of 
S.F. Raves pc, I would agree to some extent. However, don't label me pc. 
You don't know me. 

                                              Black Adder 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 09:47:31 1996
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To: "Renee Baker" <Nanette.R.Baker@jpl.nasa.gov>
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: (idm) BSP Free Live Ambient/Idm by "RE:"
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Oh sorry,  San Fancisco, California, USA.

I forget sometimes that this stuff goes all over the world.

Rick

At 09:23 AM 5/10/96 -0700, you wrote:
>
>Where?  Pasadena, CA?  Davis, CA?  Somewhere in the UK???
>_______________________________________________________________________________
>Subject: (idm) BSP Free Live Ambient/Idm by "RE:"
>From:    rdriffle@ucdavis.edu at Internet
>Date:    10-05-1996  08:44
>
>RE: will be playing live ambient/idm electronic listening music for your
>listening pleasure at RAW Live Foods tonight.  We will start around 7:30 pm
>and play till about 10:00.  It's free, and the food at RAW is incredible.
>(All organic, all vegan)  RAW is located at 1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln.
>Hope to see you there.
>
>Rick
>
>
>ps. for those of you who made it to the first cabin trip, RE: is Rick and Eric.
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 10:02:13 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 09:55:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: peter fogel <peterbf@ix.netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Fri, 10 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> >I find that sometimes its a struggle to narrow my focus to have a
> >conversation when I'm being swept up into the beauty of all the energy
> >around.  At this time dancing is the best way to relate.
> >
> >I'm most able to feel a oneness with the flow of the vibe, when I'm
> >dancing
> >
> >:)
> >peter
> 
> But there are those of us who feel that, when you do that, you don't WANT
> to relate to us, and we feel ostricized (that's my experience).  It's so
> confusing to find friends, get all excited that we're all sharing in a
> wonderful experience, then see those friends (with whom we were
> anticipating to spend some time socializing) ignore all but the dance floor
> and their own thang.  This happens to me at every party; the most recent
> example would be Nancy at BP: I saw her for all of ten seconds, and that
> was it :(

Eric, I think you have misunderstood Peter's comment.  The dance floor is 
an amazing experience.  Not all communication is found through voice, and 
if you have ever shared space with someone dancing, you will know that 
it is truly an intimiate form of communication.  I have connected in an 
inexplicable way with people while dancing next to them in a state of 
bliss.  When we then mention it to each other, it quickly dissolves 
because it is not something you can explain nor analyze.  It is a 
transcendant communal feeling that just exists.  I don't think you can 
explain this form of communcation, rather you have to experience it.  It 
can take your mind to a new level because it challenges your assumptions 
about how to relate with another human being.  

I spent three straight hours on the dance floor at BP, and I connected 
with people in an amazing way.  It is different than one-on-one 
interactions, but no less legitimate.  I am a firm believer in a 
collective consciousness, where we generate an amazing power as a group, 
but at the same time maintaining the individuality that generates the 
collective experience.  Generating a collective consciousness requires a 
lot of giving from everyone involved, and, IMO, is why it is not 
generated to its fullest potential in most situations.  Most people don't 
know that the more you give, the more you receive.  The amount of giving 
required is very difficult, especially when most people want others to 
make them happy.  

I have been discovering, more and more, the relationship we can share as a 
group. It is my opinion that it is that relationship that keeps people coming 
back.  Some people experience it directly, some are still on the fringes 
and are intrigued enough to eventually find it, and some never find it.  
The ones who don't end up leaving or thinking that the whole experience 
is about drugs and clothes and whatever else.  I would say that I have 
just left the fringes and am starting to step into the center.  However, 
there are many different levels and I can only see the ones behind me and 
not in front of me!

cheers,
kaySEE

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 10:20:06 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 10:10:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy Capitalism & Mass Media
To: Nancy <nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: Dirceu Pereira <dpsrosa@ax.ibase.org.br>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02130501adb87c2d1fa0@[128.32.91.92]>
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, Nancy wrote:

> >At 05:46 PM 5/9/96 -0800, Nancy wrote:
> >>
> >>The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
> >>resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media, and making
> >>sure those in our own lives hear from us the real story.
> >>
> >It's simple. America is the land of consumism, You guys are so very used
> >with consuming, consuming, consuming... an american can turn any good idea
> >into profits and capitalism, even a Rave ( just take a look at most
> >promoters..definitely into $$$ first )
> >
> >I did not see this HARD COPy show, but when I used to live in the U.S., I
> >used to watch it often, just to LOL about how your country can get stuck
> >with such a thing as the O.J. Simpson trial... at least, most of it.
> >
> >Now, that this story is over, popular TV needs new villians, new heroes,
> >new real-life soap operas.. Maybe they will just turn to Raves ( I hope
> >they don't), and as you can't really argue with TV... you can just tell
> >people YOUR truth and hope they believe in it ( I am sure 90% will believe
> >in what they "saw" in Hard Copy than in your words )
> >
> >Dirceu
> 
> 
> Hmm, how intriguing!  Where ARE you?
> 
> Yes, the thought of what the rest of the world must think of Americans
> frightens me.  If they look at the mass media of any indication...it's
> totally repulsive, that's why I and everyone I know detests television.  We
> only export the worst of pop culture.  Yeah, Baywatch,  HardCopy and the
> Enquirer - that's what it means to be American!
> 
> And America's and the First World's unchecked consumerism is causing mass
> problems for the rest of the world (environment, poverty, resources).  It
> can't go on for much longer.  Advertising is just a symptom of a
> consumerist mind-set (and the tyranny of capitalism) -- a mind-set that I
> hope is changing before we kill the earth and most of her inhabitants.
> 

I want to make a quick comment here.  Whereas I might be one of the first 
people to start criticizing the good ole' US of A, we must remember that 
at least we live in a country where you can criticize all that you want.  
This doesn't happen in much of the rest of the world.  There are many 
things that I hate about the U.S., but one of the things I love the most 
is that I *can* hate it.  And, when it comes down to it, I would NEVER 
live in any other country.  Having done so, I like it here quite a bit.  
There is no single place that is perfect.  And nothing is either black 
nor white...

kaySEE

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 11:00:29 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:58:41 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: DUNE rebuttal to Hard Copy (fwd)
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Lets see what they reply.

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 10:13:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kc <sarahtonen@earthlink.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: DUNE rebuttal to Hard Copy

The following is a letter we sent to Hard Copy regarding the story.  They
ended up cancelling the meeting for now and made me put my thoughts onto
paper.

They have not responded yet, but have ensured me that they would.  Later
today I will post the "producer" (who was NOT present at the events) name
and fax # so you can send in your own response.

Here's the letter....






                                                                      9 May 1996

XXXXXXXXXXX
Hard Copy
Via Fax  XXXXXXXXXX


RE: Hard Copy report "The Ultimate Bash" 5/8/96



As a producer of DUNE, the "desert-rave" most covered in yesterday's
(5/8/96) Hard Copy "investigation", I am greatly disturbed at the approach
and manner in which you covered the movement.  I understand that not all of
the footage was from DUNE and that the story represented the entire desert
rave movement.  However, the Hard Copy report was presented as a "special
investigation into the ultimate bash" and that "our undercover cameras were
there to capture it all for the first time."  Statements such as these
would indicate that you are reporting on one single event and that all of
the footage in the segment is from that particular event.  The footage is
misrepresentative in this regard.

Here are some brief thoughts, questions and comments regarding this
misrepresentation, misconduct and irresponsibility in your report.  I'm
sure that more issues and clearer thoughts will come around as we in the
DUNE organization have time to discuss this problem in depth.



Questions:
Why did no one from Hard Copy make any attempt to find a DUNE
representative and ask for their thoughts... or even ask for their
permission to cover the event.  We were all (about 30 of us) wearing
prominent laminate tags for easy identification.

Why were we lied to by the "Hard Copy undercover camera" team when we asked
about their use for the footage?  We were insured that the videotape would
be for personal usage only.  Does "personal use" include personal gain at
the expense and defamation of ourselves and our guests at the gathering?

Did the minors who were photographed give waivers to Hard Copy?  Did Hard
Copy ask permission to use our copyrighted graphics on the video screens?
(I'm relatively certain that you would consider matter such as these to
fall under the "fair usage" clause.)

Did Hard Copy make any attempt to cover the story in a different light or
was the "out-of-control-teen-orgy" angle premeditated before the event?  Is
this approach ethical?  Responsible?

Was this material purchased from an independent videographer?

Was the producer (or a staff representative of Hard Copy) even present at
the event?  If so, how could they possibly have overlooked the above
issues.  More importantly, how could they have possibly rendered the
following misinformation about this event.  If not, how could they
substantiate such claims?

Totally inaccurate claims include that the events (implying the one being
pictured) are

        "Deadly teenage orgies of sex and booze <where> there's no way for
        police and parents to help."
AND
        "...far from parents and police and are also far away from medical
        attention for the inevitable casualties from too much booze, too many
        drugs and not enough sleep"

Not only did we invite the police to come, DUNE made extensive (and
expensive) arrangements to have local and federal police officials and an
EMT staffed ambulance present and PAID for the ENTIRE DURATION OF THE
EVENT. We also had port-o-pots and dumpsters brought in so that we wouldn't
repeat the same mistakes made at past events like Woodstock.  We went to
through these exhaustive efforts to combat the very specific (and obvious)
reasons above.  Doesn't that imply something about a level of
responsibility being present at events such as these?  Wasn't this fact
blatantly omitted and misrepresented in your report.

Yes, we had a problem with the current fad of inhaling nitrous oxide.  We
knew it, the police knew it.  And TOGETHER the police and DUNE took action
to keep the problem down to a minimum.  We emptied several tanks and issued
MANY warning citations.


The word "orgy," as in "orgy of sex and booze," infers that sexual
misconduct was the center or even present at this event.  I don't recall
there being ANY out-of-bounds sexual activity.  Furthermore, your report
did not even back-up such an allegation.  So why was such a careless word
used to describe this gathering?  Did the Hard Copy representative see
something that no one else saw?  Why didn't they tape something that
backed-up such a description? The only thing I saw that even remotely
looked orgiastic were people dancing and having the time of their lives.




Misrepresentations:
Having the voice over mention "death" and synchronously showing someone
lying on the ground while pixelating his face implies that the guy pictured
is in fact dead. No one has EVER died at a "rave" in the desert or in Los
Angeles.  (We have been very lucky perhaps.)

It is equally misrepresentative to report that someone at a desert rave
under the influence of psychedelics wandered away from the party who's
"body was found 2 days later."  Where did you get this report?  It wasn't
documented on the local news and none of the 300 people who report details
about LA raves on the internet have ever heard such a story. Nor could
anyone find information to that effect archived anywhere.  Perhaps his body
was found 2 days later at a bar and perhaps he was clean, rested and
shaven?

Hard Copy also states that the rave movement has

        "moved from the city to the desert to escape the violence of the
urban
        raves that have been plagued with gang shootings and deadly fires."

Who did you get this information from?  We only know of 1 instance in the 6
year history of the LA rave culture where there was a gun fired in a gang
related fight.  And there has NEVER been a "deadly fire" at a rave in LA.
(There may not have EVER been a fire at a rave period.... I'm looking into
this).  The only thing that we are escaping are the frustrations of city
dwelling.  We go to the desert to celebrate unbridled life and to be
astonished by the magnificence of nature that is around us.





Irresponsible reports such as yours are killing a very important movement
in the U.S.  Gathering and dancing is not illegal in any way.  I assure you
that it is every ravers dream to be able to cooperate and work with
authorities and the public to make raves safer and more secure and,
therefore, more enjoyable.  This was the effort and purpose of DUNE.  We
cannot begin to make progress in these efforts when "deadly, orgiastic,
out-of-control" misrepresentations are painted by the media in an obvious
attempt at sensationalism, defamation and discredit.  Our efforts have
certainly been set back by your selfishly irresponsible and unethical
report.



We are proud of DUNE.  Apart from there being no fights, no fires, no
medical disasters, no trace of trash or presence/destruction in the desert
(you can look at the Bureau of Land Management report on DUNE to validate
these claims), we blessed many peoples' lives.  My e-mail box and WWW site
are still being bombarded with comments about how DUNE changed their
outlooks on life...  gave them a sense of personal revival.  It surprises
me how 2000 people can walk away from a celebration like DUNE and consider
it to be a highlight of their life while a handful come with ulterior
motives and walk away finding everything BUT beauty and unity.

There is no way to keep the media from profiteering off of our efforts.
Even in your efforts to defame, you made desert raving look like a lot of
fun... Our only hope is that we may be able to better educate ourselves and
bring true understanding to those who (without offering solutions to
problems they see) insist on scrutinizing and discrediting everything
around them.

I hope that you will make an effort to "investigate" your errors.  If you
do, you may uncover a very valuable, beautiful and peaceful spirit on which
rave culture thrives.  Perhaps it may even be something worth reporting!

If you are interested in discovering the true value of rave celebrations, I
would LOVE to escort you through some of the LA underground dance scene and
show you what makes us put so much of our lives into this vital cultural
movement.

Please visit the DUNE WWW site for more information, pictures and reviews
of this event.

http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen






Kirk R. Cameron
DUNE
sarahtonen@earthlink.net






-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 11:31:40 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 11:29:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Reply-To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: NRR: The Godfather of Soul or do you want some real funk? (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
cc: starchld@leland.stanford.edu
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Hi everyone, here's the answers to my funk songs.  Matt, I made one 
mistake, but I double checked and got it right this time.


"We got the funk, give up the funk..."

Parliment-Give up the Funk


"YOu can have Watergate, but give me some bucks and I'll be straight.."

Fred Wesley and the JB's-the line is the name of the song


"Who in the funk do you think you are?"

Sly and the Family Stone-line is the name of the song


"Down D, funky D.."

James Brown-Doin' it to Death



I know you knew all of them!!!

I hope everyone has a beautiful weekend.  I will be hiking in Yosemite 
(the only thing that can drag me away from going to Madness!), so I won't 
see any of your lovely faces :(  I'll just have to start dancing on the 
top of Half Dome, eh?  :)   Have a wonderful weekend, I'm sure I'll read 
about it on Monday!!!  I'm sad to miss an event that will bring us all 
together, but think about me, will ya?  

Smiles,

KaySEE


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 11:34:40 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 11:36:07 +1000
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From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Rave pool
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Ok folks,

This is TGIF day,  so those with cars that have room,  please check in
sometime today or tonight and let me know which party you're going to
tonight.    I'll be home after 8 pm so if anyone needs a ride,  I can
hook you up with those who contact me.    I'll either take phone calls
on 1-800-381-5847 or Email.    Lets see if we can make this work...

The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 11:53:40 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605101853.LAA16062@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: DUNE rebuttal to Hard Copy (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 11:53:31 -0700 (PDT)
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Here is Kc's reply to Hard Copy.  Apparently his meeting fell through, 
but he composed this letter instead.  Enjoy.

-troy

------------------



The following is a letter we sent to Hard Copy regarding the story.  They
ended up cancelling the meeting for now and made me put my thoughts onto
paper.

They have not responded yet, but have ensured me that they would.  Later
today I will post the "producer" (who was NOT present at the events) name
and fax # so you can send in your own response.

Here's the letter....






                                                                      9 May 1996

XXXXXXXXXXX
Hard Copy
Via Fax  XXXXXXXXXX


RE: Hard Copy report "The Ultimate Bash" 5/8/96



As a producer of DUNE, the "desert-rave" most covered in yesterday's
(5/8/96) Hard Copy "investigation", I am greatly disturbed at the approach
and manner in which you covered the movement.  I understand that not all of
the footage was from DUNE and that the story represented the entire desert
rave movement.  However, the Hard Copy report was presented as a "special
investigation into the ultimate bash" and that "our undercover cameras were
there to capture it all for the first time."  Statements such as these
would indicate that you are reporting on one single event and that all of
the footage in the segment is from that particular event.  The footage is
misrepresentative in this regard.

Here are some brief thoughts, questions and comments regarding this
misrepresentation, misconduct and irresponsibility in your report.  I'm
sure that more issues and clearer thoughts will come around as we in the
DUNE organization have time to discuss this problem in depth.



Questions:
Why did no one from Hard Copy make any attempt to find a DUNE
representative and ask for their thoughts... or even ask for their
permission to cover the event.  We were all (about 30 of us) wearing
prominent laminate tags for easy identification.

Why were we lied to by the "Hard Copy undercover camera" team when we asked
about their use for the footage?  We were insured that the videotape would
be for personal usage only.  Does "personal use" include personal gain at
the expense and defamation of ourselves and our guests at the gathering?

Did the minors who were photographed give waivers to Hard Copy?  Did Hard
Copy ask permission to use our copyrighted graphics on the video screens?
(I'm relatively certain that you would consider matter such as these to
fall under the "fair usage" clause.)

Did Hard Copy make any attempt to cover the story in a different light or
was the "out-of-control-teen-orgy" angle premeditated before the event?  Is
this approach ethical?  Responsible?

Was this material purchased from an independent videographer?

Was the producer (or a staff representative of Hard Copy) even present at
the event?  If so, how could they possibly have overlooked the above
issues.  More importantly, how could they have possibly rendered the
following misinformation about this event.  If not, how could they
substantiate such claims?

Totally inaccurate claims include that the events (implying the one being
pictured) are

        "Deadly teenage orgies of sex and booze <where> there's no way for
        police and parents to help."
AND
        "...far from parents and police and are also far away from medical
        attention for the inevitable casualties from too much booze, too many
        drugs and not enough sleep"

Not only did we invite the police to come, DUNE made extensive (and
expensive) arrangements to have local and federal police officials and an
EMT staffed ambulance present and PAID for the ENTIRE DURATION OF THE
EVENT. We also had port-o-pots and dumpsters brought in so that we wouldn't
repeat the same mistakes made at past events like Woodstock.  We went to
through these exhaustive efforts to combat the very specific (and obvious)
reasons above.  Doesn't that imply something about a level of
responsibility being present at events such as these?  Wasn't this fact
blatantly omitted and misrepresented in your report.

Yes, we had a problem with the current fad of inhaling nitrous oxide.  We
knew it, the police knew it.  And TOGETHER the police and DUNE took action
to keep the problem down to a minimum.  We emptied several tanks and issued
MANY warning citations.


The word "orgy," as in "orgy of sex and booze," infers that sexual
misconduct was the center or even present at this event.  I don't recall
there being ANY out-of-bounds sexual activity.  Furthermore, your report
did not even back-up such an allegation.  So why was such a careless word
used to describe this gathering?  Did the Hard Copy representative see
something that no one else saw?  Why didn't they tape something that
backed-up such a description? The only thing I saw that even remotely
looked orgiastic were people dancing and having the time of their lives.




Misrepresentations:
Having the voice over mention "death" and synchronously showing someone
lying on the ground while pixelating his face implies that the guy pictured
is in fact dead. No one has EVER died at a "rave" in the desert or in Los
Angeles.  (We have been very lucky perhaps.)

It is equally misrepresentative to report that someone at a desert rave
under the influence of psychedelics wandered away from the party who's
"body was found 2 days later."  Where did you get this report?  It wasn't
documented on the local news and none of the 300 people who report details
about LA raves on the internet have ever heard such a story. Nor could
anyone find information to that effect archived anywhere.  Perhaps his body
was found 2 days later at a bar and perhaps he was clean, rested and
shaven?

Hard Copy also states that the rave movement has

        "moved from the city to the desert to escape the violence of the
urban
        raves that have been plagued with gang shootings and deadly fires."

Who did you get this information from?  We only know of 1 instance in the 6
year history of the LA rave culture where there was a gun fired in a gang
related fight.  And there has NEVER been a "deadly fire" at a rave in LA.
(There may not have EVER been a fire at a rave period.... I'm looking into
this).  The only thing that we are escaping are the frustrations of city
dwelling.  We go to the desert to celebrate unbridled life and to be
astonished by the magnificence of nature that is around us.





Irresponsible reports such as yours are killing a very important movement
in the U.S.  Gathering and dancing is not illegal in any way.  I assure you
that it is every ravers dream to be able to cooperate and work with
authorities and the public to make raves safer and more secure and,
therefore, more enjoyable.  This was the effort and purpose of DUNE.  We
cannot begin to make progress in these efforts when "deadly, orgiastic,
out-of-control" misrepresentations are painted by the media in an obvious
attempt at sensationalism, defamation and discredit.  Our efforts have
certainly been set back by your selfishly irresponsible and unethical
report.



We are proud of DUNE.  Apart from there being no fights, no fires, no
medical disasters, no trace of trash or presence/destruction in the desert
(you can look at the Bureau of Land Management report on DUNE to validate
these claims), we blessed many peoples' lives.  My e-mail box and WWW site
are still being bombarded with comments about how DUNE changed their
outlooks on life...  gave them a sense of personal revival.  It surprises
me how 2000 people can walk away from a celebration like DUNE and consider
it to be a highlight of their life while a handful come with ulterior
motives and walk away finding everything BUT beauty and unity.

There is no way to keep the media from profiteering off of our efforts.
Even in your efforts to defame, you made desert raving look like a lot of
fun... Our only hope is that we may be able to better educate ourselves and
bring true understanding to those who (without offering solutions to
problems they see) insist on scrutinizing and discrediting everything
around them.

I hope that you will make an effort to "investigate" your errors.  If you
do, you may uncover a very valuable, beautiful and peaceful spirit on which
rave culture thrives.  Perhaps it may even be something worth reporting!

If you are interested in discovering the true value of rave celebrations, I
would LOVE to escort you through some of the LA underground dance scene and
show you what makes us put so much of our lives into this vital cultural
movement.

Please visit the DUNE WWW site for more information, pictures and reviews
of this event.

http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen






Kirk R. Cameron
DUNE
sarahtonen@earthlink.net






-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:09:43 1996
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X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95
To: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Microsoft Commercial/Chemical Bros. 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 09 May 1996 23:19:52 PDT."
             <199605100619.XAA22140@cyberE.creative.net> 
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> Has anyone seen this commercial?  Kind of Bummed me out. Though I love
> Chemical Bros., it kind of upset me that they would license their music to
> Microsoft. Would'nt it have been more interesting if Microsoft had written
> their own music for their own commercial! I know they're trying to play off
> my emotions but...

That was definitely a surreal experience.  Kind of along the lines of hearing
the Toyota (?) commercial that used "Light My Fire".


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:18:53 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:19:18 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Garbled 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Off yer Butts you little Wussies
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>	OK - THAT'S IT - I've had just enough of your whimpering -
>		"But, but, but (sob, sniffle) I can't _DANCE_ to jungle
>		(drool, salivate, slobber)"  etc...etc...
>Here's the deal:
>	Get off yer sorry asses and I'll personally TEACH you little
>chicken shits how to DANCE to jungle...
>NO EXCUSES NOW - SEE YOU ALL AT BASS INSTINCT!

hahahahah.

yes, i'll be there too, freaking out to the breaks. =)
no description, just look for jess and ask her where i am.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:20:18 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: Matthew Boshko Abrams <marbs@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: rides
To: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
cc: Crusty old raver <wayne@club.net>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Thu, 9 May 1996, John Deatherage wrote:

> > With that in mind, can we bring the whining to a stop?
> 
> My car has 263,000 miles on it, mostly from taking ungrateful little 
> bastards to raves :)
> 
> 						 \/
 Well my car has 288,000 miles on it, SO THERE! : )
                                                 /\
Matt 
   Da 
    Loaf

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:22:45 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: Celestine Prophecy?
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WARNING: spiritual & political theory...

>"...The world is quickly polarizing into those stuck in Fear, control,
>and selfishness, (and who want not just to share their version of the 
>truth, but to legislate it and force others to comply whether or not
>there is a democratic consensus) and those of us who hold the vision
>of a democratic spiritual renaissance on the planet.

The world is as it has always been.  There is no polarization that was not 
already there.  Humanity has always lived with fear, control, selfishness 
and tyranny.  It has always also held hope of a better life, a vision of 
what could be if only everyone would respect and care for each other.  This 
is nothing new.  We can address the here and now, but remember that the here 
and now are the only things you can affect unless you do something very 
large scale with the potential for very long lasting impact.

>Ideology and
>dogma and religion is less important at this moment than whether we
>are visualizing faith, love and spiritual awakening for the world, or
>hate, envy, and collapse.

To tie two threads together, I'm sure the folks in Tibet were visualizing 
faith, love and spiritual awakening when the ideology and dogma of the 
Chinese army rolled right over them.  Thinking happy thoughts is not enough. 
 Action is required at some level that's large enough to be seen by many, if 
not all, something that creates an energy in others and serves as an 
example.  Sitting in the lotus position sending out vibes is useless.  
Identifying those things that we wish to change for the better and making a 
potent effort to change them is what makes a real difference.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:29:20 1996
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Subject: Re: Hard Copy and the Nature
Date: Fri, 10 May 96 12:27:23 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
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nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy) wrote:
>The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
>resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media...

The television will not be revolutionized.

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:30:27 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:25:00 +0100
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: madness tix
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Greetings friends =)

Just some data points on madness....

The map point will be open from 9pm until 1am OR until 600 tickets
are gone, they'll probably all go, so please show up early...

This party is a benefit for maintaining and expanding the various equipment
we've been putting to use over the years (my soundsystem for example) which
is why we're asking for a slightly larger donation ($10) than you might be
used to from us.

It is also a birthday party for at least a few of us, myself included, so
please come help us celebrate!

More info at:  415.281.9432  or 415.985.7187

take it easy
ethan

-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:35:01 1996
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Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy/T.Leary
Date: Fri, 10 May 96 12:33:09 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
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Ulrike Laitko, laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de wrote:
>this is the one right you ever have : 
>to jump from your balcony (in case you have one, i believe, you guys over 
>there have only fire ladders and your houses are not high enough. but 
>anyway you get me) whenever you want to. 
>***nobody is ever trying to take that from you***. at least, i've never 
>heard about a case where somebody was trying to do that

Suicide is a felony crime in California.  A failed attempt can result in 
prosecution.

> to be precise, 
>this is one of these good ol' things nobody will ever be able to take 
>from you even if they tried.

This is true enough--just be sure you succeed.

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:41:54 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:42:16 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: sddpw@sirius.com (Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works)
Subject: Big Yeaaah for DUNE
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I think Kirk's response was EXCELLENT.  I, for one, cannot wait for the
producers' e-mail and/or snail mail address to put in my own $0.02.  I
think that a well thought out, detailed response like Kirk's, followed by
HUNDREDS (hint, hint) of short reponses, is an excellent way to combat
"yellow journalism", as it was called earlier.

Not that I am ignoring everyone's great discussions about shock media and
schizophrenic capitalism, but for me personally, sometimes I just cannot
sit by and let these things go unchallenged.

Everyone have a fun, safe, happy weekend!!



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:42:54 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:42:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: rides
To: Matthew Boshko Abrams <marbs@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>, Crusty old raver <wayne@club.net>,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Fri, 10 May 1996, Matthew Boshko Abrams wrote:

> On Thu, 9 May 1996, John Deatherage wrote:
> 
> > > With that in mind, can we bring the whining to a stop?
> > 
> > My car has 263,000 miles on it, mostly from taking ungrateful little 
> > bastards to raves :)
> > 
> > 						 \/
>  Well my car has 288,000 miles on it, SO THERE! : )
>                                                  /\
> Matt 
>    Da 
>     Loaf
> 


Thats funny, Matt rides a motercycle. =)


Ran
                     (tee hee)
                        /
                  -=*=-/
                    ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:45:01 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: BSP Free Live Ambient/Idm by "RE:"
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>RE: will be playing live ambient/idm electronic listening music for your
>listening pleasure at RAW Live Foods tonight.  We will start around 7:30 pm
>and play till about 10:00.  It's free, and the food at RAW is incredible.
>(All organic, all vegan)  RAW is located at 1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln.  
>Hope to see you there.

For those of you that haven't heard Rick and Eric play, they are GOOD.  Hope 
to see you folx there!

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:46:57 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:47:19 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Pepper 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: rides
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>> My car has 263,000 miles on it, mostly from taking ungrateful little 
>> bastards to raves :)
> Well my car has 288,000 miles on it, SO THERE! : )
amatures.
mine's been around the clock _twice_. so there. 
nyaa nyaa nyaa! *thumbing nose*

brendan


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 12:50:32 1996
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From: Joerg Grosse <joerg@sapling.rose.hp.com>
Subject: Santa Cruz Rave
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:50:10 PDT
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Hi everybody,

  me and a friend are from Germany and just moved here to California.
Looking desperately for techno since we are here we finally found the sfraves
home page yesterday. Didn't know that there is also a techno scene over here.
GREAT!

Subscribing only yesterday to sfraves we read those messages about that
beach rave in Santa Cruz on Sunday. However we did not get the whole story.

So can somebody please tell me again...
WHERE EXACTLY IN SANTA CRUZ IS THAT RAVE?

See you there
Joerg
joerg@sapling.rose.hp.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 13:00:20 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 13:00:04 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: madness tix
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At 12:25 PM  +0100 5/10/96, Ethan Miller wrote:

>It is also a birthday party for at least a few of us, myself included, so
>please come help us celebrate!

Let's not forget Bono, who's birthday is today!  And we all know how much
he's impacted the SF rave scene as of late.

"Salami!"  ;^)

See ya there kiddies!
Tone




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 13:05:48 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 13:02:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I sent this to Eric and Peter and cc'ed the list, but it never showed 
up.  Soooo, here goes again.

kc

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 09:55:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
Cc: peter fogel <peterbf@ix.netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: socializing at raves


On Fri, 10 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> >I find that sometimes its a struggle to narrow my focus to have a
> >conversation when I'm being swept up into the beauty of all the energy
> >around.  At this time dancing is the best way to relate.
> >
> >I'm most able to feel a oneness with the flow of the vibe, when I'm
> >dancing
> >
> >:)
> >peter
> 
> But there are those of us who feel that, when you do that, you don't WANT
> to relate to us, and we feel ostricized (that's my experience).  It's so
> confusing to find friends, get all excited that we're all sharing in a
> wonderful experience, then see those friends (with whom we were
> anticipating to spend some time socializing) ignore all but the dance floor
> and their own thang.  This happens to me at every party; the most recent
> example would be Nancy at BP: I saw her for all of ten seconds, and that
> was it :(

Eric, I think you have misunderstood Peter's comment.  The dance floor is 
an amazing experience.  Not all communication is found through voice, and 
if you have ever shared space with someone dancing, you will know that 
it is truly an intimiate form of communication.  I have connected in an 
inexplicable way with people while dancing next to them in a state of 
bliss.  When we then mention it to each other, it quickly dissolves 
because it is not something you can explain nor analyze.  It is a 
transcendant communal feeling that just exists.  I don't think you can 
explain this form of communcation, rather you have to experience it.  It 
can take your mind to a new level because it challenges your assumptions 
about how to relate with another human being.  

I spent three straight hours on the dance floor at BP, and I connected 
with people in an amazing way.  It is different than one-on-one 
interactions, but no less legitimate.  I am a firm believer in a 
collective consciousness, where we generate an amazing power as a group, 
but at the same time maintaining the individuality that generates the 
collective experience.  Generating a collective consciousness requires a 
lot of giving from everyone involved, and, IMO, is why it is not 
generated to its fullest potential in most situations.  Most people don't 
know that the more you give, the more you receive.  The amount of giving 
required is very difficult, especially when most people want others to 
make them happy.  

I have been discovering, more and more, the relationship we can share as a 
group. It is my opinion that it is that relationship that keeps people coming 
back.  Some people experience it directly, some are still on the fringes 
and are intrigued enough to eventually find it, and some never find it.  
The ones who don't end up leaving or thinking that the whole experience 
is about drugs and clothes and whatever else.  I would say that I have 
just left the fringes and am starting to step into the center.  However, 
there are many different levels and I can only see the ones behind me and 
not in front of me!

cheers,
kaySEE


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 13:14:04 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 13:13:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Matthew Boshko Abrams <marbs@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: rides
To: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>, Crusty old raver <wayne@club.net>,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Fri, 10 May 1996, Randy C Cone wrote:

> On Fri, 10 May 1996, Matthew Boshko Abrams wrote:
> 
> > On Thu, 9 May 1996, John Deatherage wrote:
> > 
> > > > With that in mind, can we bring the whining to a stop?
> > > 
> > > My car has 263,000 miles on it, mostly from taking ungrateful little 
> > > bastards to raves :)
> > > 
> > > 						 \/
> >  Well my car has 288,000 miles on it, SO THERE! : )
> >                                                  /\
> > Matt 
> >    Da 
> >     Loaf
> > 
> 
> 
> Thats funny, Matt rides a motercycle. =)
> 
> 
> Ran
>                      (tee hee)
>                         /
>                   -=*=-/
>                     ~
> 
And a I have a car, it a little red 1969 BMW 2002  
			       
Silly Randy, tricks are kids  :<> and fish???

Matt
   Da 
    Loaf

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 13:19:56 1996
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To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: Celestine Prophecy?
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>Sitting in the lotus position sending out vibes is useless.

I have to say you are wrong here.  You must not do it much yourself, or you
wouldn't be saying that.  I meditate daily, and I can attest to the fact
that it is quite useful in all aspects of my existance.
  
>Identifying those things that we wish to change for the better and making a 
>potent effort to change them is what makes a real difference.

This can work as well, but I believe they hold equal weight.

Rick



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 13:21:24 1996
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Subject: Re: Hard Copy and the Nature
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>Rather than complaining to Hard Copy, maybe complaining directly to the
>advertisers would be a better idea.

Simple, yet to the point.  Anyone recall who the advertisers were?  I 
haven't seen it yet myself.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 13:45:31 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 13:51:21 -0700
To: epaul@synopsys.com (Eric P. Peterson)
From: rhea@xinet.COM (Rhea Gossett)
Subject: Re: socializing at raves [WARNING: LONG RESPONSE ahead]
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My name is Rhea & I haven't posted for a _ very long _ time,
but Eric P.'s comments about "socializing at raves" are making
me want to break my silence.

I go to raves for the beautiful balancing point between
the specific/general, individual/group, me/not me....

As Peter Fogel said, it's the "beauty of all the energy around"
that grabs me and holds me - it takes me a while to collect
my thoughts enough to let them go, and surrender them to
dance.  When I'm feeling truly myself, and the music sounds
like the most intense, unbelievably mighty & glorious thing
imaginable, THEN I can't stop smiling, can't stop looking around
me with joy and appreciation.

Some nights the feeling I speak of above happens; some nights
it doesn't happen.  But - above all - when that dance-floor
feeling happens is when I can most feel myself able to reach out,
and share, and take sincere and caring interest in others.

Rave, for me, then, is the moment when I find myself within that
crazy glowing smile, then raise my head up & look around, and
meet the eyes of someone dancing, smiling, crazy next to me !

Eric P. writes:
>But there are those of us who feel that, when you do that, you don't WANT
>to relate to us, and we feel ostricized (that's my experience).  It's so
>confusing to find friends, get all excited that we're all sharing in a
>wonderful experience, then see those friends (with whom we were
>anticipating to spend some time socializing) ignore all but the dance floor
>and their own thang.  This happens to me at every party .....

To sum the experiences I'm speaking of up with the criticism that I
am "ignoring all but the dance floor and my own thang" is really reductive,
I think.

>From your own comments, I could tag socializing, and meeting & greeting
friends as "your thang" and then decide whether or not, as someone who
labels herself a relatively _ un-social _ person, I should feel ostracized
or hurt by your behavior.  I don't want to do that.  It's true, I don't know
you - so in a sense I guess I'm not your friend, but I would hate to be
thinking "this person's my friend, this person's not my friend," as I
looked with joy
over a crowd of people raving.

If you "feel ostracized," that's YOUR feeling; it doesn't "happen
to you" - you choose that interpretation for the confusion you may be
feeling.  Don't put that on people who may be relating to the rave-energy
by dancing.

In a sense, (as Peter said again) dancing _ can _ be the best way to relate -
you're putting your energy into the place, the moment, the music,
the crowd, the building, including everyone & excluding none.

This list itself, right now, is verging away a bit from this
aspect of raving, I think - recent posts about events that happened
over the last two weeks were full of messages from people saying "hi"
to specific friends, posting long lists mentioning people by name who
the writers felt made the event go off for them...though I think it is
incredibly important and exciting when people find each other & become
friends within a shared love of raving, I would still hate to see this
list become exclusively a social circle.

As an interesting aside to the "social" aspect of raves that you
mention, there have been many, many, MANY times that I've been
_roughly_ jostled out of my trance/dance/rhythm by someone
hustling through the dance floor to embrace one of their [official]
friends. What quality of "friendship" is occuring then?

Eric - I really don't want you to feel attacked.  You've just touched
on elements within the whole concept of friendship that I turn over
in my thoughts often. What I really want to express here is the value I see
in remembering to consider as many "perspectives" as I can before I anchor
myself to a specific feeling - the perspectives of others, as well as my own.
Raves have been such a big learning experience for me, showing me
that perspective seems to be what lets us get outside confining social
structures in the first place.

Hopefully smiling at YOU from a dance floor sometime this weekend,

Rhea - who likes to be anonymous, but still likes to have folks
around to talk with when the music ends !




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 14:05:40 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 14:05:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: rides
To: Matthew Boshko Abrams <marbs@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Fri, 10 May 1996, Matthew Boshko Abrams wrote:

> > >  Well my car has 288,000 miles on it, SO THERE! : )
> > >                                                  /\
> > > Matt 
> > >    Da 
> > >     Loaf
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > Thats funny, Matt rides a motercycle. =)
> > 
> > 
> > Ran
> >                      (tee hee)
> >                         /
> >                   -=*=-/
> >                     ~
> > 
> And a I have a car, it a little red 1969 BMW 2002  
> 			       
> Silly Randy, tricks are kids  :<> and fish???
> 
> Matt
>    Da 
>     Loaf
> 

You have TWO vehicles AND you're whining. Spoiled brat! ;)


Ran
                      
    (well my saucer has 20 trillion miles on it, nyeanh!)
                       /
                 -=*=-/
                   ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 14:13:42 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 14:13:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves (fwd)
To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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On Fri, 10 May 1996, KaySEE wrote:

> 
> Eric, I think you have misunderstood Peter's comment.  The dance floor is 
> an amazing experience.  Not all communication is found through voice, and 
> if you have ever shared space with someone dancing, you will know that 
> it is truly an intimiate form of communication.  I have connected in an 
> inexplicable way with people while dancing next to them in a state of 
> bliss.  When we then mention it to each other, it quickly dissolves 
> because it is not something you can explain nor analyze.  It is a 
> transcendant communal feeling that just exists.  I don't think you can 
> explain this form of communcation, rather you have to experience it.  It 
> can take your mind to a new level because it challenges your assumptions 
> about how to relate with another human being.  
> 
> I spent three straight hours on the dance floor at BP, and I connected 
> with people in an amazing way.  It is different than one-on-one 
> interactions, but no less legitimate.  I am a firm believer in a 
> collective consciousness, where we generate an amazing power as a group, 
> but at the same time maintaining the individuality that generates the 
> collective experience.  Generating a collective consciousness requires a 
> lot of giving from everyone involved, and, IMO, is why it is not 
> generated to its fullest potential in most situations.  Most people don't 
> know that the more you give, the more you receive.  The amount of giving 
> required is very difficult, especially when most people want others to 
> make them happy.  
> 
> I have been discovering, more and more, the relationship we can share as a 
> group. It is my opinion that it is that relationship that keeps people coming 
> back.  Some people experience it directly, some are still on the fringes 
> and are intrigued enough to eventually find it, and some never find it.  
> The ones who don't end up leaving or thinking that the whole experience 
> is about drugs and clothes and whatever else.  I would say that I have 
> just left the fringes and am starting to step into the center.  However, 
> there are many different levels and I can only see the ones behind me and 
> not in front of me!
> 
> cheers,
> kaySEE
> 
> 


Hi all!
 kaySEE, the collective conciousness you are refering to has been 
experienced in many different enviroments and is a area of (part time) 
study for me. I first came across it at Grateful Dead concerts (before 
they were REALLY big colisium affairs). Bob Weir refered to this 
phenomenon as "Gestalt Linkage".


Ran
                 ( all together now )
                     /
               -=*=-/
                 ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 14:15:20 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: Celestine Prophecy?
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Ok, Ok, I was a bit reactive.  Sorry Todd.  I really do understand what you
are trying to say.  I just hold the belief that meditation is just as
powerfull as anything else, and can accomplish as much.  

Now sitting around watching TV shows like Hardcopy....now that's "inaction".
There are worlds of difference between meditation and just sitting around.
We don't need to argue about this.  I'm sure Todd had no intention of
offending any of us Buddhists out here, and once again I appologise for
being so reactionary.  Maybe I should go meditate on it :)

Rick

At 01:40 PM 5/10/96 -0700, you wrote:
>>>Sitting in the lotus position sending out vibes is useless.
>>I have to say you are wrong here.  You must not do it much yourself, or you
>>wouldn't be saying that.  I meditate daily, and I can attest to the fact
>>that it is quite useful in all aspects of my existance.
>i think the point was more that action is better than inaction. instead of
>spending all your time thinking about something, do something.
>IMO, todd was not trying to say that meditation was bad or useless, but that
>spending all your time meditating as a means to change something might be a
>bit futile.
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 14:22:59 1996
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From: Sarah Jane Slaymaker <sjslay@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <199605102122.OAA10869@cardinal2.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: read only if ur aussie john
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Sorry to post to the list but...

Aussie John! the one I met at 1015 when DJ Dimitri was spinning and then again
at BP email me back. Please.

Sarah

-- 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 14:37:22 1996
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To: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Celestine Prophecy?
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>Now sitting around watching TV shows like Hardcopy....now that's "inaction".
>There are worlds of difference between meditation and just sitting around.
>We don't need to argue about this.  I'm sure Todd had no intention of
>offending any of us Buddhists out here, and once again I appologise for
>being so reactionary.  Maybe I should go meditate on it :)
>
>Rick
>
Not to mention those of us non-Buddhists who also meditate ;)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 14:38:23 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 14:36:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy Capitalism & Mass Media
To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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        Dirceu Pereira <dpsrosa@ax.ibase.org.br>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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And what must other countries think of us ?  Baywatch & American Gladiators
are two of the MOST popular shows in the world....

And most other people are just bursting to get their chance to spend $$$
like we Americans get to....

Makes me wonder what the world will come to in the next 50 years or so...
Hang on we're in for a wild ride and those of us who already live in
"DIsneyland" will have to meet the people at the gates who have been waiting
for their turn - especially since we are showing them what our theme park
looks like via satellite TV and movies...

Hummmm,

Mike


 meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic 
 Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 14:51:23 1996
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Subject: Re: Celestine Prophecy?
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Rick,

Y'know, I kinda had a feeling I'd hear from you on this...

>>Sitting in the lotus position sending out vibes is useless.
>
>I have to say you are wrong here.  You must not do it much yourself, or you
>wouldn't be saying that.  I meditate daily, and I can attest to the fact
>that it is quite useful in all aspects of my existance.

Ok, "useless" was too strong a word.  My focus was on doing something that 
affects the many, not just the one.  And yes, I've meditated.  It gave me 
time to hash out many problems, to center and stabilize myself.  But it did 
little or nothing to solve the problems around me.  It only made me better 
able to handle them.  The initial post implied that spirituality of the self 
was the sole answer to making the world a better place, and I feel that's 
entirely incorrect.

>>Identifying those things that we wish to change for the better and making a 
>>potent effort to change them is what makes a real difference.
>
>This can work as well, but I believe they hold equal weight.

Nothing to add here.  The old saying, "you have to love yourself before you 
can love another" is pretty dead on.  What I was attempting to express -- 
not very well apparently -- was that self-improvement is only one step.  
Becoming actively involved is the next.

Hugging a tree is fine.  Hugging the logger is better.  But if you really 
want change, you have to push the logging company to alter it's business, to 
find other sources of fiber and building materials, to diversify and then 
stop the logging.  And all the spirituality in the world isn't going to 
matter to the top execs who get rich off lumber, or the people whose 
livelihoods rest on the cutting of timber.

Just one example.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 14:55:49 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 14:56:14 -0700
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From: Remember? 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: bass instinct
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i changed my mind. i will post a description, because i just got new stuff
in the mail!!!

i will be wearing my brand new "Save the Planet, Kill Yourself" T-shirt.
it's black, with the words on the front and on the back there is a globe
with a red circle around it and a person with a crossed out circle over them.

i also got my new bumperstickers: "Save the planet, kill yourself" (again)
and "Eat People, not Animals"

yay!!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 15:00:53 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: BI:Red,Black,and White In d'Jungle
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[ to sfraves list ]

 If I make it to Bass Instinct tonight, I intend to dress pretty "basic" -
black Ben Davis ( ape logo ) canvas pants , white t-shirt and red corduroy
long sleeve shirt. Once I warm up on the dance floor, the red shirt will
probably end up around my waist! In any case , don't hug me 'cause I have
germs - a rather nagging spring cold virus that won't take a hint and leave
my body. Say "hi!" to me anyway! I promise not to cough on you.

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 15:03:00 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 15:02:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: madness tix
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  Ethan- my dear friend, unfortuanelty I won't be able to make it to the 
party- a BIG:(! I've been ill all week and even though I'm almost over 
it, I don't think it would be too wise to pull an all-nighter:(.
But, I just want to wish you a * VERY HAPPY BIRTHDAY* and to say that I 
wish I could be there with all you * mad* fools......
                             hugs-
                            Reagan







On Fri, 10 May 1996, Ethan Miller wrote:

> Greetings friends =)
> 
> Just some data points on madness....
> 
> The map point will be open from 9pm until 1am OR until 600 tickets
> are gone, they'll probably all go, so please show up early...
> 
> This party is a benefit for maintaining and expanding the various equipment
> we've been putting to use over the years (my soundsystem for example) which
> is why we're asking for a slightly larger donation ($10) than you might be
> used to from us.
> 
> It is also a birthday party for at least a few of us, myself included, so
> please come help us celebrate!
> 
> More info at:  415.281.9432  or 415.985.7187
> 
> take it easy
> ethan
> 
> -----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
> -------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
> -------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 15:15:12 1996
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Subject: Re: socializing at raves (fwd)
Date: Fri, 10 May 96 15:14:38 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
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>Hi all!
> kaySEE, the collective conciousness you are refering to has been 
>experienced in many different enviroments and is a area of (part time) 
>study for me. I first came across it at Grateful Dead concerts (before 
>they were REALLY big colisium affairs). Bob Weir refered to this 
>phenomenon as "Gestalt Linkage".
>
Here is my whole take on this dancefloor/socializing thing. 

Unless you are out dancing, you are being a total lame ass.
Yes, meeting new people is great fun and I try to spend some
time talking to people too.

But I feel that if the DJ is doing a really good job, you
almost owe it to that person to be out dancing! If I was a 
DJ, nothing would be worse than playing to a room full of
boring people. Conversely, if someone really sucks the first
thing I do is go sit down. (yes, I do sit down when I'm tired too!)

I feel like unless i am moving, I'm just sitting there being
entertained. But if I am dancing, I am helping to create the 
energy that ultimately makes the party happen or not. It is 
so great to feel that your energy is helping the party to go off!!
It makes the whole experience really worth it to me. 

Luv-
Ms Phunk


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 15:23:19 1996
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From: darrele@netcom.com (Darrel Etter)
Message-Id: <199605102223.PAA29590@netcom21.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (sfraves)
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 15:23:15 -0700 (PDT)
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> On Fri, 10 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:
> > >I find that sometimes its a struggle to narrow my focus to have a
> > >conversation when I'm being swept up into the beauty of all the energy
> > >around.  At this time dancing is the best way to relate.
> > >
> > >I'm most able to feel a oneness with the flow of the vibe, when I'm
> > >dancing
> > >
> > >:)
> > >peter
> > 
> > But there are those of us who feel that, when you do that, you don't WANT
> > to relate to us, and we feel ostricized (that's my experience).  It's so
> > ...
> Eric, I think you have misunderstood Peter's comment.  The dance floor is 
> an amazing experience.  Not all communication is found through voice, and 
> if you have ever shared space with someone dancing, you will know that 
> it is truly an intimiate form of communication.  I have connected in an 
> inexplicable way with people while dancing next to them in a state of 
> bliss.  When we then mention it to each other, it quickly dissolves 
> because it is not something you can explain nor analyze.  It is a 
> transcendant communal feeling that just exists.  I don't think you can 
> explain this form of communcation, rather you have to experience it.  It 
> can take your mind to a new level because it challenges your assumptions 
> about how to relate with another human being.  
> ...
> I have been discovering, more and more, the relationship we can share as a 
> cheers,
> kaySEE

I like your explaination kaySEE! 

Another perspective that I was reminded of by this discussion, related
to trance in groups, is the experiences I've had in zen
meditation. I've only been to zen-do's (a zen-do is a zen church, or a
place where you do zen meditation) a few times, but a simular question
came to mind when I first tried it; why do all these people need to
get together in a room together just to be peaceful and ignore each
other?

After trying it, I understood. The energy of being in a room full of
others meditating is enriching, satisfying, secure, and
transforming. It is actually easier to meditate with others around
you. Or, perhaps with nature around you. After all, we are human, and
humans are very close animals ( dictated by a dependancy of our young
that exceeds most any other animal). I would compare dancing/trancing
alone to a plant trying to grow out of it's soil. Humans are as
conected to other humans as plants are to their soil.

In Zen, true spiritual thought can not be expressed in words (I know
I've read that somewhere). In meditation you empty your mind. Your
only concern is your breathing. Your eyes are closed.

At raves, my only concern is the beat (the breath of the room), my
eyes are so over stiulated by lasers and fast movement (I hope) that I
am effectivly blinded. Words are unimportant and meaningless at this
time. What is there to say? The music says it all for me. 

=Darrel
darrele@netcom.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 15:36:10 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605102232.PAA15342@netcom15.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: S.F. Bay Area Techno
To: joerg@sapling.rose.hp.com (Joerg Grosse)
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 15:32:58 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605101950.AA152487826@paloalto.access.hp.com> from "Joerg Grosse" at May 10, 96 12:50:10 pm
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[ to sfraves list ]
> 
> Hi everybody,
> 
>   me and a friend are from Germany and just moved here to California.
> Looking desperately for techno since we are here we finally found the sfraves
> home page yesterday. Didn't know that there is also a techno scene over here.
> GREAT!
> 
 Besides the events put on by Friends and Family, another group I associate 
with techno here in the SF Bay area is the S.P.A.Z. crew. Try and check out
one of their events - I don't think you'll be disappointed. In fact, I think 
they just posted something to SFRaves yesterday or today about an event they
are doing this weekend.

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

 ===> DISCLAIMER: Your definition and preferences in "techno" may not 
                  agree with mine! <===



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 15:54:33 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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>Unless you are out dancing, you are being a total lame ass.

Anybody got a bullet-proof vest for me?  :(



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 15:56:19 1996
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Subject: Re: Hard Copy Capitalism & Mass Media
Date: Fri, 10 May 96 15:54:29 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
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Michael E. Clay, meclay@netcom.com wrote:
>And what must other countries think of us ?  Baywatch & American Gladiators
>are two of the MOST popular shows in the world....

Just goes to show that enthusiasm for the tawdry, the sensational, the 
exploitive, all the cheesy and brain-numbing stuff that teevee is so good 
at producing is a *human* character, not an American one.  We're just the 
best at *making* the stuff.

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 16:28:36 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 16:25:11 -0700
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: tigger@thestranger.com (Glenn)
Subject: Re: Celestine Prophecy?
Cc: z2013@speakeasy.org
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At 1:58 PM 5/10/96, SDream wrote:
>Rick,
>
>Y'know, I kinda had a feeling I'd hear from you on this...
>
>>>Sitting in the lotus position sending out vibes is useless.
>>
>>I have to say you are wrong here.  You must not do it much yourself, or you
>>wouldn't be saying that.  I meditate daily, and I can attest to the fact
>>that it is quite useful in all aspects of my existance.
>
>Ok, "useless" was too strong a word.  My focus was on doing something that
>affects the many, not just the one.  And yes, I've meditated.  It gave me
>time to hash out many problems, to center and stabilize myself.  But it did
>little or nothing to solve the problems around me.  It only made me better
>able to handle them.  The initial post implied that spirituality of the self
>was the sole answer to making the world a better place, and I feel that's
>entirely incorrect.

As the ripple from a pebble thrown into a pond reverberates and spreads out
so does the energy one taps into when one meditates.  Sometimes we are the
pebble, other times the water.

If one's desire is to change the world around them and to have an impact on
nature of the reality that we chose to exist in, one must initiate that change
within themselves.

There is never just a sole answer to most situations.  Variables and
permutations
in energies and one's actions, whether immediately tangible or not also
have an impact,
at times immediately tangible, at times not.

Peace!

Tigger


0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0
**************************Go Tribal, Go Deep!!!****************************
0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0

          \\\|||///               \\\|||///                \\\|||///
        .  =======              .  =======               .  =======
       / \| O   O |            / \| O   O |             / \| O   O |
       \ /  \v_'/              \ /  \v_'/               \ /  \v_'/
        #   _| |_               #   _| |_                #   _| |_
       (#) (     )             (#) (     )              (#) (     )
        #\//|* *|\\             #\//|* *|\\              #\//|* *|\\
        #\/(  *  )/             #\/(  *  )/              #\/(  *  )/
        #   =====               #   =====                #   =====
        #   (\ /)               #   (\ /)                #   (\ /)
        #   || ||               #   || ||                #   || ||
       .#---'| |----.          .#---'| |----.           .#---'| |----.
        #----' -----'           #----' -----'            #----' -----'



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 16:30:44 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 16:25:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Rave/Media Essay (Super Long)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Though perhaps better sent on a Tuesday instead of a Friday afternoon, 
this is about 1/4 of a cultural studies piece titled "Moral Panic, the 
Media and British Rave Culture."  Written by Sarah Thornton, the rest of 
this essay can be found in "Microphone fiends : Youth Music & Youth 
Culture / edited by Andrew Ross & Tricia Rose. Routledge, 1994.

I had some free time a while back and thought i'd scan this article in 
and then disseminate it, but I didn't because it would have taken way too 
long, and because of the slight ethical dilemma I had about sending the 
entire essay out without the permission of the writer, especially since 
this list is archived (mixed blessing if you ask me).  Though several 
words and characters were mistranslated, most of it is accurate and 
intelligible.  

Read it and make up your own mind.  -Rok.
___
The idea that authentic culture is somehow outside media and commerce is a 
resilient one. In its full-blown romantic form, the belief imagines that 
grass-roots cultures resist and struggle with a colonizing mass-mediated 
corporate world. At other times. the perspec- tive lurks between the 
lines, inconspicuously informing parameters of research. definitions of 
culture and judgments of value. Either way, scholars of youth and music 
culture are among the most tenacious holders of the idea. One explanation 
for this is undoubtedly that their studies reproduce the anti-mass-media 
discourses of the youth formations they study. While youth celebrate the 
"underground," academics venerate subcultures where one group denounces 
the "commercial," the other criticizes "hegemony": where one laments 
"selling out," the other theorizes "incorporation."
Every music scene has its own specific set of media relations. "Acid 
house. ' a dance club culture which, after sensational media coverage 
about drug use, mutated into ' rave a movement said to be bigger than 
punk and akin to the hippie revolution. offers a particularly revealing 
case. In exploring this case, this article finds no opposition between 
subcultures and the media, except for a dogged ideological one. It 
uncovers no pure origins or organic homologies of sound, style and 
ritual, nor does it vilify a vague monolith called "The media." Instead, 
it examines how various media are integral to youth's social and 
ideological formations. Micromedia like flyers and listings are means by 
which club organizers bring the crowd together; niche media like the 
music press construct as much as they document subcultures; while mass 
media like the tabloids develop as much as do youth movements. Contrary 
to youth discourses, then, subcultures do not germinate from
seed and grow by force of their own energy into mysterious movements to 
be belatedly ingested by the media. Rather, media are there and effective 
right from the start.  They are integral to the processes by which, in 
Bourdieu's terms, we "create groups
To understand the relations between youth subcultures and the media, one 
needs to pose and differentiate two questions. On the one hand, how do 
youth's subcultural dis-courses position the media? On the other hand are 
the media instrumental in the congregation of youth and the formation of 
subcultures? The two questions are entwined but distinct. Youth's 
"underground" ideologies infer a lot but understand little about cultural 
production. Their views of the media have other agendas to fill. They are 
a means by which youth imagine their own and other social groups, assert 
their distinctive character, and affirm that they are not just " 
attention spans " to be bought and sold by advertisers, nor faceless 
members of an undifferentiated mass.
Even the most political subcultures are also taste cultures. Given that 
the vast majority of British youth subcultures, past and present, do not 
espouse overt political projects, nor even constitute "subcultures" in 
more stable sociological senses of the term issues of taste and 
distinction deserve attention. Rather than depoliticizing youth 
subcultures, this move actually gives fuller representation to the 
complex and not always progressive politics of popular culture. While 
difference is not necessarily resistant, it is always caught up in 
systems of distinction.
Similarly, the second question about how the media do not just represent, 
but mediate within, subculture can only be fully understood in relation 
to subcultural ideologies. For !he positioning of various media 
outletsQprime-time chart shows versus late-night narrowcasts, BBC versus 
pirate radio, the music press versus the fanzines, flyers versus 
magazinesQas well as discourses about "hipness," "selling out" and "moral 
panic," are crucial to the ways young people receive these media and, 
consequently, to the ways that media shape subcultures.

The "Subcultural Capitals" of the "Underground"

The term "underground" is the expression by which clubbers refer to 
things subcultural. ,lore than fashionable or trendy, underground sounds 
and styles are "authentic," and pitted against the mass-produced and 
mass-consumed. Underqrounds denote exclusive worlds whose main point is 
not elitism. but whose parameters often relate to particular crowds. They 
delight in parental incomprehension, negative newspaper coverage and that 
best blessing in disguise, the BBC ban. More than anything else, then, 
undergrounds define themselves against the mass media.
Undergrounds are nebulous constructions;4 their crowds shun definitive 
social categorization. Mostly they are said to be " mixed " and, although 
the subcultural discourses cross lines of class, race and sexuality, the 
people who hold these ideas are less likely to
physically traverse the relevant thresholds.5 Generally, underground 
crowds are attached to sounds. As one label manager put it: "There are 
records out there that are more radical and, at this moment, have a more 
radical audienceQa smaller, more selective audienceQ but the sounds in 
that area will be the next generation of sounds we're all used to.... 
That's what I mean by underground."6Undergrounds define themselves most 
clearly by what they're notQthat is "main stream." Although there is 
variation, the oft-repeated expression by which they refer to mainstream 
clubs is that these are places where "Sharon and Tracy dance around their 
handbags." This mainstream is decried as passive, indiscriminate and 
uncommitted to dance culture; it is ridiculed for its " herd instinct" 
and " bandwagon mentality. " Undoubtedly
a residual version of the mass, this mainstream points to the relevance 
of Andreas Huyssen's "mass culture as woman" thesis. but here the 
traditional divide between virile high art and feminized low 
entertainment is replayed within popular culture itself.7
Though the discourses of the underground are anti-mass culture, one 
should not confuse them with those of the art world. Certainly. both 
criticize mass culture for being derivative, \/e commercial, shallow and 
femme. But they differ insofar as subcultures romanticize "the street" 
and the crowd, not artists' studios and individual genius. Moreover, 
rather than the dreaded "trickle down," the problem for underground 
subculture is popularization by a gushing up to the mainstream. These 
metaphors are not arbitrary, for they betray a sense of social place. 
Subcultural discourses implicitly give alternative interpretations and 
values to young people's, particularly young men's, subordinate status; 
they reread the social world.
The main currency of the underground might be called "subcultural 
capital." Pierre Bourdieu's distinction model, from which the term is 
borrowed and amended, describes a total system which concentrates on the 
tastes of the middle-aged.8 Perhaps more than gender, race or ethnicity, 
age differences and aging in time throw a spanner into the workings of 
class-based distinctions.9 This may be because youth. whatever their 
class enjoy a momentary reprieve from "necessity."'! In other words, 
youth are exempt from adult commitments to the accumulation of economic 
capital. They temporarily enjoy what Bourdieu argues is normally reserved 
for the bourgeoisie; that is, a "taste of liberty or luxury. "
Subcultural capital can be accumulated, but not over a lifetime. It is a 
capital with built in obsolescence, which either gets converted into 
cultural capital proper (for example jazz was turned into " Ph.D. music 
)l ~ or depreciates in subcultural value (sometimes not without a fight; 
for example, Bob Dylan). Of course, "adult" cultural capital is also 
subject to obsolescence, but it isn't built in, so to speak. Bourdieu 
characterizes the avant-garde as the young bourgeois producing knowledges 
that eventually become ' classic.  But subcultural capital is different 
from this nascent cultural capital, insofar as its main antagonist is not 
established art culture but mass culture, and graduating up is not its 
standard route Subcultural capital deteriorates with age and in this way, 
maintains its position as prerogative of the young.                    
	As a result, clubber subcultural capital is not as class-bound as 
cultural capltal After age, the social difference along which it aligns 
most systematically is, in fact, gender.  Girls and women often opt out 
of the game of "hipness," refusing to compete. and conceding

___

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 16:55:21 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 16:55:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: free party tonite BSP
To: Happy Ravers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.3.88.9605101646.A12639-0100000@svpal>
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heyya everyone!

the sun is shining, the weather is beautiful!
just in case ya haven't run into previous messages...
tonite we gather under the stars with djs ethan, dan barnes, Le Le, and 
tom. for directions call 415.525.5o52. bring that good energy, and lets 
party! 
we'll be at a north bay location, BTW

energy to ya'll
tom


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 17:21:33 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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To: THX1138@planet-jubip.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
cc: laitko@hpbio1.biologie.hu-berlin.de
Subject: Re: FYI (Recent E Info)
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First off, I hope there aren't any Beavises out there that are going to try
to make e from these directions, they seem vague and incomplete.  I'm not
opposed to home chemistry, just be smart.
Secondly, Thanks for this info THX, it seems very interesting especially the
second half regarding MDOH. I however, have very poor comprehension quality
when the reading gets that technical.  Is there anyone out there can that can
interpret the general gist of that document.  If I am understanding correctly
MDOH is a new sythesetic similar to MDA, also I dont even know if I can tell
much difference between MDMA and MDA.  Any input appreciated,
Love,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 17:44:59 1996
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Message-Id: <199605110044.RAA20859@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
To: epaul@synopsys.com (Eric P. Peterson)
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: socializing at raves 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 10 May 1996 09:18:48 PDT."
             <v02140b18adb8b9317e4f@[146.225.72.168]> 
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 17:44:34 -0700
From: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
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>
>But there are those of us who feel that, when you do that, you don't WANT
>to relate to us, and we feel ostricized (that's my experience).  It's so
>confusing to find friends, get all excited that we're all sharing in a
>wonderful experience, then see those friends (with whom we were
>anticipating to spend some time socializing) ignore all but the dance floor
>and their own thang.  This happens to me at every party; the most recent
>example would be Nancy at BP: I saw her for all of ten seconds, and that
>was it :(
>
Anyone who knows me knows that I can talk a mile a minute and I am just about
as outgoing and gregarous as it gets, but there are times when even I
have to jump out there and start dancing.

Seriously, if not for the dance floor, a "rave" would just be one big
gab and hugfest. These are good things, to be sure, but they aren't raves.

Others have said it better so I will be brief: it is on the dance floor
that we all come together in unity, it is on the dance floor where the
vibe get created, it is on the dance floor where the really important
stuff happens. So SHUT UP AND DANCE! ;-)

Peace,
Jim

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 17:54:56 1996
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To: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: socializing at raves
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Others have said it better so I will be brief: it is on the dance floor
>that we all come together in unity, it is on the dance floor where the
>vibe get created, it is on the dance floor where the really important
>stuff happens. So SHUT UP AND DANCE! ;-)
>
>Peace,
>Jim

Well, yeah, talk is cheap...anyway, I like a balance between dancing (and
all that includes, which I'm still discovering) and socializing, with old
friends and new.  If I spent all my time dancing, I wouldn't meet anyone,
but if I didn't dance at all, I'd be denying myself the experience.  Do ya
see where I'm coming from?  Everyone has a slightly different approach to
raves; that's mine, for now.  Thanks, Jim, and thanks to everyone who
shared their insights!

Dancin' shoes on,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 18:00:13 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 17:56:24 -0700 (PDT)
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To: Jesus Chrysler <jchryslr@Catch22.COM>
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Microsoft Commercial/Chemical Bros.
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 12:10 PM 5/10/96 -0700, Jesus Chrysler wrote:
>> Has anyone seen this commercial?  Kind of Bummed me out. Though I love
>> Chemical Bros., it kind of upset me that they would license their music to
>> Microsoft. Would'nt it have been more interesting if Microsoft had written
>> their own music for their own commercial! I know they're trying to play off
>> my emotions but...
>
>That was definitely a surreal experience.  Kind of along the lines of hearing
>the Toyota (?) commercial that used "Light My Fire".

Actually Chrysler tried to use "Light My Fire" in the late 60's, but when
Jim Morrison heard what was going on, put a stop to it. Is the day of Rock
legends over?

Jon

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 18:11:52 1996
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From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Microsoft Commercial/Chemical Bros.
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 12:10 PM 5/10/96 -0700, Jesus Chrysler wrote:
>> Has anyone seen this commercial?  Kind of Bummed me out. Though I love
>> Chemical Bros., it kind of upset me that they would license their music to
>> Microsoft. Would'nt it have been more interesting if Microsoft had written
>> their own music for their own commercial! I know they're trying to play off
>> my emotions but...
>
>That was definitely a surreal experience.  Kind of along the lines of hearing
>the Toyota (?) commercial that used "Light My Fire".

Actually Chrysler tried to use "Light My Fire" in the late 60's, but when
Jim Morrison heard what was going on, put a stop to it. Is the day of Rock
legends over?

Jon

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 18:35:35 1996
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Subject: Re: socializing at raves
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>Well, yeah, talk is cheap...anyway, I like a balance between dancing (and
>all that includes, which I'm still discovering) and socializing, with old
>friends and new.  If I spent all my time dancing, I wouldn't meet anyone,
>but if I didn't dance at all, I'd be denying myself the experience.  Do ya
>see where I'm coming from?  Everyone has a slightly different approach to
>raves; that's mine, for now.  Thanks, Jim, and thanks to everyone who
>shared their insights!



Yeah, I tend to agree on that one.  I like my raves to be a good mix of
dancing *and* socializing with my friends.  If I spend the whole time
hanging in the chill room talking with people, I really feel like I missed
out on an important aspect of the party, & the evening feels incomplete.
However, the only parties that I dance 100% of the time are the ones that
are totally lacking in friendly people & vibe.  The individuals that attend
a party are also very important to me, I love all you guys & I wanna talk to
ya upon occasion! :)  So, like in almost every other aspect of my life I can
think of, it is never 100% one way or the other, the very best raves really
consist of a good healthy mix of dancing my ass off *and* socializing in the
chill room.  The only time you'll see me doing just one is if the party
entirely lacks the other, i.e. the music's great but no vibe- I'll be on the
dance floor the whole time; the music sucks but the vibe rages- I'll be in
the chill area the whole time.  I love that feeling of being on the dance
floor & making eye contact with some other raging dancer & neither of you
needs to talk, you both just *know*! :)  But I just love those nifty chill
room encounters too.

See y'alls on the dance floor/chill room!


Love,
Shawna




"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 18:40:53 1996
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To: sddpw@sirius.com (Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works)
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, george@unrrts.com
Subject: Re: Reply to Hardcopy 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 08 May 1996 19:37:17 PDT."
             <v01520d00adb709c1349d@[205.134.228.51]> 
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:06:37 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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> Would anyone think it a good idea to respond to that HardCopy segment
> formally?  I'm sure they have an e-mail address.  But then again, is it
> worth it?  It's not like they're going to turn around and go, "By the way,
> we we're all wrong on our rave report.  It's all the fault of asshole cops
> that these parties must go to great lengths to stay underground.  Oh yeah,
> and also, we blew the whole thing completely out of proportion and were
> totally irresponsible in not presenting anything positive.""
> 
> I'll hold my breath on that one.  Isn't it amazing how they NEVER can seem
> to find anyone articulate!  I mean, from the postings, it seems that people
> here are quite an intelligent bunch.  Hardcopy musta saw the laminates and
> STEERED CLEAR.  "Watch out, THEY look intelligent.  We can't have them on
> our show."

Sorry (and pleased to say) that I missed the segment.

I ignore HC and all those other tabloid TV shows. Their target
audience is right-wing, undercultured, undereducated, and god fearing
folks, who are easily snookered by such cheap propoganda as told by
twinkie journalists. These are folks who may never understand the rave
scene, because it so contradicts all they have come to know throughout
their lives. It's really sad, when you think about it.

You made a wise call by ignoring them. Their only purpose in life is
to invoke controversy; by simply answering to it, they feel validated
by a letter from another "loyal" viewer, and will become encouraged to
do more tall tales of our precious scene.

Sorry I feel so cynical about this folks. I've given up on news
magazines ever since 60 Minutes did that slanderous story on Werner
Erhard back in '91. What little TV news watching I do these days is on
CNN. (Remember when Linda Ellerbee was on the air. Now THAT was TV
journalism...)

Now, back to more rave related stuff,

-G-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 19:03:10 1996
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Subject: Re: FYI (Recent E Info)
Date: Fri, 10 May 96 19:01:22 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:
>First off, I hope there aren't any Beavises out there that are going to try
>to make e from these directions, they seem vague and incomplete.  I'm not
>opposed to home chemistry, just be smart.

Did we get the same message?  I didn't do more than glance at it, because 
I have the book it was taken from, but I think the instructions were 
quite clear.  But I didn't get X info (though it's in the book), just the 
MDOH that you mention from the "second half".  In any case, it's still a 
very good idea for anyone not experienced in organic synthesis to just 
forget about it.  Just because the instructions are clear and detailed 
doesn't mean that they're simple, and you probably can't get the 
ingredients anyway.

>Secondly, Thanks for this info THX, it seems very interesting especially the
>second half regarding MDOH. I however, have very poor comprehension quality
>when the reading gets that technical.  Is there anyone out there can that can
>interpret the general gist of that document.  If I am understanding correctly
>MDOH is a new sythesetic similar to MDA...

The info is excerpted from a book called PIKHAL, a pseudo-autobiography 
of Alexander Shulgin.  Shulgin is a chemist who has spent the past twenty 
or thirty years researching the chemistry underlying human 
psychopharmacology, with emphasis on the phenethylamine family of 
compounds to which X, mescaline, and the other psychedelic amphetamines 
belong.  The first part of the book is the story, describing his life and 
how he came to pursue these studies, while the second gives a synopsis of 
his results in exploring the phenethylamine family.  He presents several 
hundred compounds, including X, mescaline, 2CB (bromomescaline), and STP, 
in the format given here for MDOH, with syntheses and results of human 
experimentation.  Most of these compounds are variations on a theme 
created by systematic structural modification of natural or already-known 
phenethylamines.  Most are not, based on his experimentation, 
psychopharmacologically interesting.

I gather the book is available in a WWW version.

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 19:05:34 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 19:05:56 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Remember? 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves (fwd)
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>Unless you are out dancing, you are being a total lame ass.
>
>Anybody got a bullet-proof vest for me?  :(

i've got some armor-all i can spray on you, eric. :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 19:36:26 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 19:36:36 -0700
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From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Maaaaaaadnessss!!
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Hey all!

Well hope to see all of ya at Madness tomorrow night!  I won't be back home
again before i go tomorrow, so I'll post my description now.  I'll be
wearing my usual Nekked Leddy shirt this time around & jeans, & black shoes.
*If* I remember to take it out, I'll probably have my neon green feather boa
on too!  So come on up & say howdeedo, all those of you I've met & those of
you I haven't yet met!


Love,
Shawna




"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 19:57:05 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 19:58:25 +1000
To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Hard Copy Capitalism & Mass Media
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>> >>The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
>> >>resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media, and making
>> >>sure those in our own lives hear from us the real story.

The MUTE switch is a wonderful way to resists consumerism...   Thats
what it's there for....   :-)

The Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 21:06:06 1996
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From: davidmin@crl.com (David Minuk)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: The exploitation continues
Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 04:00:56 GMT
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Look at http://melroseplace.com/sydney.html and follow the link at the
bottom of the page.  Then have a look at my page as below!

David
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Minuk(davidmin@crl.com)
WWW:  My URL is http://www.crl.com/~davidmin/
This website is not yet rated.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 10 22:33:39 1996
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Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 22:34:47 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Madnessähelpäride?= (from map point)?
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Well, um, here I am begging for a ride again. =(

I feel bad doing this twice in two weeks (don't want to just take, take,
take =) but I really want to go to madness. I live in Berkeley, but I can
make it to SF on Bart (probably to the map point at F-8 if I have to).

Can someone be a kind soul and hook me up with a ride to Madness from
Berkeley if possible, Bart station preferred, F-8 if necessary? I can fork
over gas money and stimulating conversation. =)

call me if you can help out:
Mike@510.664.1026

I'll be around after my big history final ends at noon.

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 00:50:26 1996
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Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 00:50:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140b0cadb932a4b0c9@[146.225.72.168]>
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On Fri, 10 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> >Others have said it better so I will be brief: it is on the dance floor
> >that we all come together in unity, it is on the dance floor where the
> >vibe get created, it is on the dance floor where the really important
> >stuff happens. So SHUT UP AND DANCE! ;-)
> >
> >Peace,
> >Jim
> 
> Well, yeah, talk is cheap...anyway, I like a balance between dancing (and
> all that includes, which I'm still discovering) and socializing, with old
> friends and new.  If I spent all my time dancing, I wouldn't meet anyone,
> but if I didn't dance at all, I'd be denying myself the experience.  Do ya
> see where I'm coming from?  Everyone has a slightly different approach to
> raves; that's mine, for now.  Thanks, Jim, and thanks to everyone who
> shared their insights!
> 
> Dancin' shoes on,
> 
> - E

And if that ain't enough,
 Hi! As some of you may recall I do live ambience of the atmosphere 
variety. That is with very few, if any, beats. My goal is to create the 
complimentry opposite to the kinetic energy of the dance floor(s). This 
is done in an effort to create foward motion through balance of 
energy(s). Not many people can dance for 8- 12 hours straight ;) through 
and rest and refreshments are a good thing. Also it is nice to say hi to 
those you wish to. A calm chill room provides this kind of a space and 
ideally tries to help support the vibe from the other side.
 In some ways this is an easier job than the dance DJ's as you are not 
locked into a beat groove. But in some ways it is harder to maintain an 
interesting sound without beats and one must really stretch that creative 
muscle in order to keep up with those beats. Not to mention that the 
space should be cozy, safe and nice for folks to relax and catch their 
breath (or a snooze).
 Just some change.


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams


                       ( what was that masked sound? )
                             /
                       -=*=-/
                         ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 00:54:41 1996
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To: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
From: dpsrosa@ax.ibase.org.br (Dirceu Pereira)
Subject: Re: Hard Copy Capitalism & Mass Media
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 09:00 PM 5/9/96 -0800, Nancy wrote:
>>At 05:46 PM 5/9/96 -0800, Nancy wrote:
>>>

>
>Hmm, how intriguing!  Where ARE you?

Rio de janeiro, Brazil
>
>Yes, the thought of what the rest of the world must think of Americans
>frightens me.  If they look at the mass media of any indication...it's
>totally repulsive, that's why I and everyone I know detests television.  We
>only export the worst of pop culture.  Yeah, Baywatch,  HardCopy and the
>Enquirer - that's what it means to be American!

The TV and american cinema kinda brings to the third world countries this idea of "american way of life", which i do not consider very valid. There are many good things about America, like more freedom of speech, but there are also many bad things such as commercialism, rascism towards latins, asians, blacks, indians ( sorry, I am not P.C.), foreigners in general, when they come from the 3rd. world... i experienced it even in the EAst Coast rave scene.

But the communism failed, and we are now in the rise of an even fiercer capitalism, with corporations running the countries' minds, decisions and funds. The whole world is now seen as markets, not countries...who cares if China has no human rights, when they have $$$ to buy our goods???"

>
>And America's and the First World's unchecked consumerism is causing mass
>problems for the rest of the world (environment, poverty, resources).  It
>can't go on for much longer.  Advertising is just a symptom of a
>consumerist mind-set (and the tyranny of capitalism) -- a mind-set that I
>hope is changing before we kill the earth and most of her inhabitants.

You are right. Although we are surely a minimal voice in the middle of this sea of "capitalism slaves", in my case I can only hope to have a few hours of fun, dancing and interacting ith people, without even bothering with the way media talks about raves.   ( in here, it is considered a place for crackheads and crusties )

>
>Love, Nancy
>
>P.S. a lot of us support underground parties that are not profit-oriented.
>
>
I do support them to, and i am sure they exist everywhere... but i guess most promoters turn into being profit-oreintated when promoting events become their way of living.

Love
DIRCEU>
>
>
>
>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 01:04:32 1996
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Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 01:02:00 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
Subject: Re: FYI (Recent E Info)
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>The info is excerpted from a book called PIKHAL,

{snip}
>
>I gather the book is available in a WWW version.
>

Yep. It's right here on our very own Hyperreal:

http://hyperreal.com/drugs/pihkal/

Enjoy,

Vince



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 01:51:12 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Saturday night
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Hey you don't watch that watch this!

This Saturday night S.P.A.Z. doing a party at compounf Eye in Berkeley.So 
check it out......!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 06:55:20 1996
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From: Matt Kodama <starchld@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <199605111355.GAA23062@elaine36.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: harmony sunday
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 06:55:07 -0700 (PDT)
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help!  i printed the info line #'s for harmony's sunday beach party,
deleted the mail, and left 'em on my desk at work - can somebody please
mail them to me again ... thanks!
matt.
-- 
|=======================================================================|
|									|
| i have the world's largest collection of seashells.  i keep it on all	|
| the beaches of the world ... perhaps you've seen it.			|
|									|
| you know how it is when you're reading a book and falling asleep,	|
| you're reading, reading ... and all of a sudden you notice your eyes	|
| are closed?  i'm like that all the time.				|
|									|
| i put tape on the mirrors in my house so i don't accidentally walk	|
| through into another dimension.					|
|									|
|    - steven wright			      				|
|									|
|=======================================================================|
-starchld@leland.stanford.edu--the mothership can be reached at 493-4099-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 10:50:02 1996
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Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 10:49:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Bay To Breakers: a rolling rave?
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Since there are a *lot* of people interested in bay to breakers, why don't
we rent a cart and generator and pull a sound system along?  That way we
could have excellent beats to dance to!  (an SFR banner would be nice,
too)

I'm serious...  is anyone interested in helping out? 

) paul (


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 16:01:32 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: SDream <SDream@tgrigsby.com>
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Subject: URGENT: Call Hard Copy!/Tape Available
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Dear Friends & Family,

My computer tells me that on Wed, 8 May 1996, SDream shared:

> >Would anyone think it a good idea to respond to that HardCopy segment
> >formally?
> 
> Well, I didn't find a URL for Hard Copy, but I did find the following, which 
> lists URLs for just about any TV station that has a web page of any kind.  
> Just FYI...
> 
> http://www.tvnet.com/

	Anybody who would like to tape (or see) Hard Copy's piece on 
raves may call me at (415) 626-3036.
	After watching (and taping) this complete piece of trash, I 
called KRON TV Channel 4, which aired the segment.  KRON did not produce 
the Hard Copy segment, but they share responsibility for misinforming the 
public and prejudicing them against raves and ravers.
	After a couple tries, I got the number for Al Holzer, their Vice 
President of news and programming.  You'll probably just get his 
secretary, but I hope she gets lots of messages to deliver for him.
	His number is 561-8768.  Use it!  
	I also taked to Pat Law, Channel 4's Viewer Liaison.  She told me 
that the night previous to the Hard Copy broadcast, a mere "6 or 7" 
complaints to the station resulted in them *pulling from the air* a Jack 
In The Box commercial.  
	This shows that if we can generate a significant number of 
critical calls on Hard Copy, it will have a real impact on decisions at KRON.

	But don't stop at calling Channel 4.  Pat told me that Hard Copy 
is produced by Paramount.  Paramount also produces Entertainment Tonight, 
which has a toll-free number, (800) 421-0476.  You can call this number 
and ask to be transfered to the producers of Hard Copy, and save yourself 
the charges of calling them direct at (213) 956-5808.
	I was told by the folks at Hard Copy that the "Desert Rave" segment 
of Wednesday's Hard Copy was produced by a Frank Feldinger.  His answering 
machine says to leave him a message and he'll return your call.  So far 
he has not returned mine, but I plan to be persistant.  8)
	
	I think it is important that we mobilize effectively against this 
type of anti-rave slander.  We are *not* powerless to affect media 
coverage of our scene.  Speaking up loudly and sharply gets the message 
across.
	I want them to understand that a pack of lies, stereotypes, and 
dangerously wrong images like Hard Copy broadcast about us is the 
equivalent of them doing a segment on black welfare mothers eating 
watermelons and fried chicken, shooting crack, and getting pregnant; i.e. 
being prejudiced against our scene is as wrong as being racist.
	This understanding on the part of the media will only evolve to 
the extent that we get involved and make ourselves heard.
	
Let's make some noise!

				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 16:44:22 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: Be 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Ammo for Hard Copy Responses!
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>>>>> COULD SOMEONE WHO HAS THE ADDRESSES OF THE OTHER REGIONAL RAVE 
LISTS FORWARD THIS AND MY PREVIOUS MESSAGE ABOUT HOW TO GET IN TOUCH WITH 
HARD COPY TO THOSE LISTS?  THANKS! <<<<<<
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Friends & Family,

My computer tells me that on Thu, 9 May 1996, Be 99 shared:

> >>Would anyone think it a good idea to respond to that HardCopy segment
> >>formally?
> well, before anyone goes off half-baked, i think we should compose a letter
> as a whole.
> 
> points to be included could be:
> 
> -refution (is that a word?) of the alcohol and nitrous issue.
> -an explaination of the principals behind raving.
> -an explaination of the effects of 'common' rave drugs and why they are used
> -how raving has positive effects on life outside raving, and why would they
> want to    destroy something positive with negative press?
> -responsibility of the media
> -lots more. ideas?

	The following are a few of the things about the segment that 
might be mentioned.  The quoted material is from the narrator, the 
material in brackets are my comments on what's wrong with what they said:

"the ultimate zoo for serious party animals"
[The "party animals" wording is slanderous and not in the spirit of raves 
at all.]

(we crashed the desert rave and got) "all the madness on tape"
[A nice way of saying they deceived their subjects about their purpose in 
filming.  Also, the word "madness" is highly judgmental.]

"besides dancing, they do lots and lots of alcohol (pause) and drugs"
[Alcohol *is* a drug. Also, undue focus on drugs, again.  And most raves 
do not feature much alcohol use.  No comparison is given to other scenes, 
such as clubs, bars, and concerts.]

"taken improperly it (nitrous oxide) can cause siezures, brain damage, 
and even death"
[Focuses on the negative effects of a drug without any balance or 
comparison to the risks of using legal substances.  No statistics are 
given of these occurences, compared to the overall number of users, which 
would probably show risks to be smaller than the TV spot would lead 
viewers to believe.]

(nitrous oxide seemed to be) "the drug of choice"
[Wrong.  Nitrous oxide is just more visible because of the balloons, and 
thus presents a more effective visual image for TV]

(the main attraction of desert raves is that they are) "far, far away 
from parents and police"
[this is just false.  In all my years raving, I've never heard anyone 
mention this as the main reason they were at a rave.  And many raves, 
sadly, have lots of police present.]

(mention of people passing out from nitrous)
[undue focus on drug use and its dangers]

(mention of person taking a halucinogenic drug and wandering away from 
the party) "They found his body two days later."
[again, focusing on drug use and its dangers]

"temperatures can drop to near freezing"
[contributes to making our parties seem dangerous]

"drug-addled crowds"
[more negative imagery of drugs]

"right back to the dancing, the drugs"
[another mention of drugs in a negative context]

"...last party animals staggering away"
[another offensive use of the term "party animals" in reference to ravers]

"they, and the desert, have a little time to heal before it starts all 
over again"
[implies that raves are damaging the desert environment.  If true, this 
needs to be put in context, i.e. compared to other human activity.  Also, 
the statement implies that people's bodies are being harmed, and need 
"healing" after a party.  The dancing *is* healing!]

(raves moved to the desert) "to escape the violence of urban raves, which 
have been plagued by gang shootings and deadly fires."
[This is false.  I've never heard those concerns cited as a reason for 
having an outdoor party.  Another negative assumption on the part of the 
producers.  And again, no context comparing "urban raves" to other 
late-night activities]

(dawn struggles over the horizon) "like a bloodshot eye"
[this distasteful metaphor reinforces the focus on drugs 
and their negative effects]

"dangerous fallout" (of rave parties) 
[this statement went along with the visual of someone climbing on some 
steep rocks, the word "fall" creating the image of danger from falling.  
Coincidental?  Maybe, but I doubt it.]

"the police say their biggest obstacle in shutting (rave parties) down is 
trying to find them."
[the premise of this statement is that they *should* be shut down.  No 
opposing view is given.]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Other general critical points:

	In the whole segment, which lasted maybe five minutes, the only 
statement included that promoted a positive, responsible view of our 
scene was when a girl directing traffic (probably one of the promoters of 
the party they filmed) was asked why people couldn't park just anywhere 
and she said it was because of the need to protect the desert environment.
	There was the gratuitous sex element, with shots of attractive 
young women in bare midriffs dancing, which would be fine if presented in 
a positive way, but in the context of Hard Copy's coverage, it was 
obviously designed to say "raves are about drugs, underage sex, people 
getting hurt, destruction, and lack of control."
	No mention was made of adults being at the parties also, which is 
almost always the case.  I can't remember being at a party without people 
over 21, and in many cases a good number of people in their 30's and above.
	The one person in the segment who mentioned age was talking about 
just turning 18.  The narrator's references were to young people, 
partying without parental control, not responsible drivers, voters, and 
adults having fun in a positive, spiritual atmosphere.
	The word "spiritual" aired once, in a quote from a young female 
participant, but it was given no context or explanation -- the girl's 
quote was not made to seem credible to the audience.
	The word "celebration" also aired once, also with no supporting 
information.
	Generally, participants who were interviewed were either 
obviously high, or were talking about getting "loaded," "passing out," 
etc.  
	From my experience, this is not at all typical of a rave.  But I 
don't need to tell any of you that...

Peace, Love & Grooviness,
				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 17:22:52 1996
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Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 17:19:28 -0700
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Madness Tonight!
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Hi Everybody!! Whoever's going to MADNESS tonight, look for a short 
asian guy with an SCHWA ALIEN HEAD necklace! That would be I! Come say 
Hi! And again, I'll have CANDY!!!! =)~


Adam
                    R.Lunatic



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 19:27:56 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: Bass Instinct: Good 4 What Ails Ya!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 19:27:53 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Some Thoughts On Bass Instinct -

 Great! Friendly! Roomy! No annoying eye-level strobe lights - heck, no
strobes! They did have a black light fixture. Little smoke , warm without 
being stifling. Free water and oranges , smart drinks for $3/2 drinks for $5.
If the "b.a.s.s. kru" do another event , I would recommend checking them out.

 I arrived at the site at around 11:30PM , after a ticketing delay at the
map point. Thad was spinning some excellent music , but the gathering crowd 
was shy about dancing. Some kind of threshold was broken sometime just after
Stareyes took over , and more folks moved into the dance area and started
twiching and stepping.

 For awhile , DJ Abstract joined Stareyes at another ( third? ) turntable
for some pairs mixing. Sounded good to me.

 My footwear experiment had mixed results. Many years ago I had bought a
pair of cowboy boots from a thrift store for a Halloween costume, and I
decided to try 'em on for the night! My toes were aching, but the smooth
leather soles gave me different move options on the smooth concrete floor
that the gripping type of soles athletic shoes have. Also , the hard high
heels were fun to balance on. 

 I don't know the trends in jungle/drum n' bass , but I haven't heard the
4/4 plus jungle mixes I heard last night. How common is this?  Techno/jungle
hybrid .

 It was nice to meet and re-meet some "new" SFRavers - Jess , Garbled 99 and
his friend Alec from Wash. DC, "Shroom" Alec, Leslie Ayers, a-French-guy-whose-
name-excapes-me-at-this-time, an-Asian-American-guy-whose-name-I-couldn't-hear-
over-the-music. I had to leave at around 2AM , so I didn't get to see if the
rumored appearence by Goldie happened or not - one of the other folks I listed
here will have to report!

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com

 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 19:30:06 1996
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Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 19:35:57 -0700
From: Diana Greer <inanna@ccnet.com>
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To: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
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Subject: Re: Bay To Breakers: a rolling rave?
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Paul Abramson wrote:
> 
> Since there are a *lot* of people interested in bay to breakers, why don't
> we rent a cart and generator and pull a sound system along?  That way we
> could have excellent beats to dance to!  (an SFR banner would be nice,
> too)
> 
> I'm serious...  is anyone interested in helping out?
> 
> ) paul (


Paul,

Count me in.

Diana Greer

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 19:48:52 1996
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From: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
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On Sat, 11 May 1996, Adam Luong wrote:

> Hi Everybody!! Whoever's going to MADNESS tonight, look for a short 
> asian guy with an SCHWA ALIEN HEAD necklace! That would be I! Come say 
> Hi! And again, I'll have CANDY!!!! =)~
> 

he'll also be wearing a big and crazy striped hat. 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 20:11:09 1996
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I'll be there with my Nawty Boy t-shirt, say HIGH!
JOnathan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 21:55:34 1996
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From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Reply-To: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: the something free story - long
To: Happy Ravers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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dear family and friends,
off with a slow start, we made our way to the location of our party, 
skaggs island, in marin. we were in three seperate cars, each 
anticipating on arriving at different times. after my friend isac and i 
picked up a generator, we headed up to marin to meet up with Le Le, carl 
with some sound,water, and other stuff, jon carel w/ sound, and ethan. 
when i arrived, carl was at the spot already. but there was something 
more. apparently, some of the local kids decided to gather there and have 
a little drinking party. we think, hmm, alcohol a negative, but we'll see 
what we can do. with some acceptions, the kids were generally friendly or 
oblivious to what we wanted to do, ie. have a rave. some were even 
excited, and wanted to see what this "rave" stuff was about. so carl and 
i proceded to set up teh monitors, tables, and some torches for light. as 
some of the kids said, go ahead, set up, since everyones drinking they'll 
be out of your hair soon and leave in an hour or two. as were setting up, 
tho, the "attitude" factor was on a large upswing, and some began 
expressing their dilike of what we were doing, while most of the kids at 
this time still said dont worry theyre just drunk, keep setting up. so 
half of our stuff out of carls truck, one of the kids expressing their
dislike of us took one of our torches and broke it. from this point the 
situation turned real nasty. 	
	we decided it best to leave, and started loading everything 
back. some of them where now throwing rocks at carls truck, and a torch 
or two more got wrecked, as well as dents and scratches from said rocks, 
and a busted tail lite. so we sped out of there, carl took off to change 
something on teh vmail, while isac and i followed, then noticed jons van 
going to the site, turning around, we flagged him down, stopping some 
ways down teh road past the site. we explained what happened and went 
back for carl, flagging down another car going to the site, and luckily 
that was ethan. the three of us went back to where jon was. during all 
this Le Le had arrived, and carl came back as well. we thought about what 
to do, during which time the kids causing teh trouble walked over to 
cause more. with a unanomous decision to try the marina as another 
locale, we took of, but not before they had a chance to swing at our cars 
with something. they took out a back lite on isacs car. it was really sad 
that most of them were quite receptive to what we wanted to do, there wes 
just a handfull who wanted trouble.
	down to the marina everything went, and isac and i stayed behind 
at a cross roads to flag down ravers going to the site. after about an 
hour we left for teh marina as well, getting stuck in unbelivable back up 
on bay bridge, we got to marina at about 4.3o am. no one in sight. we 
called our vmail and found out the party was busted early on. we went to 
carls house to crash.
	basically, we want to express our appreciation for those who did 
want to come, and sincerely appologize if we got your hopes up for a 
party. we appreciate all of you who have come in teh past, and would like 
to say that we want to continue to do what weve been doing. hopefully 
things will go more smoothly in the future, and we look forward to seeing 
many of you! were planning a little something, and we'll keep ya posted. 
thankyou for listening. 
	
love,
the something crew

ps. i hope madness fucking rocks!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 11 23:22:57 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: F2T vs. Goldie
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Anyone go to this?  I know the F2T crew won 'cause they have DJ Dan :P


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 01:23:42 1996
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>his friend Alec from Wash. DC, "Shroom" Alec, Leslie Ayers, a-French-guy-whose-
oops! better substitute into that line Erik and Eric for both occurences of
Alec, in that order.   ;)   larry was still sick, i think we can give him a
break on that one. :)

i thought the party was great. good music, loved the older hardcore stuff i
heard (it's so much fun when you hear a song you know the lyrics to), and
loved the newer stuff too. unfortunately, i had to leave early so i could
work the next day (ugh) so i didn't get to hang around and see if goldie
showed up. =(

i met a brand new sfraver too! Dan- who just joined the list a couple days
ago. of course, now that i know who he is, i'll expect a post out of him. :)

i wanted to go to madness tonight, but i managed to get a minor case of
heatstroke at work today and don't feel up to going out. (i'm looking for
sympathy here. anyone? please?? =) ) please, tell me how madness went!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 04:14:50 1996
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Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 16:21:11 -0700
From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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Hey everyone!!

Did anyone at Building Blocks last night pay attention
to Carlos's set? I heard it was completely new and very
phat! Just curious...thanx!

Hugs, 

CT

I'll see you all at Harmony!!!!!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 04:33:43 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: Mark Camp* <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
cc: sfr <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, Nancy <Nancy@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy and the Nature
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Dear Friends & Family,

	What Mark says about complaining to the advertisers being most 
effective is probably true.  I taped the segment on raves, but turned my TV 
off immediately thereafter.  Did anybody watch the whole program, or has 
watched previous or subsequent episodes of Hard Copy, to know who these 
advertisers may be?
	My girlfriend Chikako also said there was a phone number 
displayed at the end of the show that you could call to reach Hard Copy, 
but she didn't get a chance to write it down.  I'm wondering if this is 
a better way to reach the people responsible than by calling 
Entertainment Tonight's 800 number... if ET gets a bunch of calls from 
people wanting Hard Copy (which I hope they do!), they may get fed up and 
stop transferring people.
	If anyone got the number from the show, could you post it?  Thanks...

Much love,
				<<< Starchild >>>


On 10 May 1996, Mark Camp* wrote:

>          Reply to:   RE>Hard Copy and the Nature of Mass Media
> 
> Rather than complaining to Hard Copy, maybe complaining directly to the
> advertisers would be a better idea.  If the advertisers become aware of the
> publics outrage over the programs that they buy time on, maybe the next time a
> story like this comes around, they wont want to advertise.
> 
> just a thought......
> 
> -M
> 
> --------------------------------------
> Date: 5/9/96 5:54 PM
> To: Mark Camp*
> From: Nancy
> 
> Michael wrote:
> 
> > Before wasting time in a reply to Hardcopy you might consider Do they
> >even care ?  I suspect that a show like that would only care that you
> >watched at all - NOT whether you agree/disagree.... merely that they are
> >getting through . Their goal is not to inform with TRUTH as much as it is
> >to inform with entertainment ( truth is not really their objective )...
> 
> 
> I agree, but I think that their goal is not to inform at all, but to ensure
> an audience FOR THE COMMERCIALS.  Size of audience share sets the price the
> show can charge for commercial time - the PROFIT behind this show.
> Therefore, they sensationalize and "entertain" and distort and vulgarize as
> much as possible to appeal to the widest amount of people (oops, I mean
> "consumers").
> 
> Most television shows are merely the padding around the true purpose of
> commercial television - agressive advertisement for you to buy, buy, buy.
> Their mind-numbing stupidity (i.e. sit-coms) and their ridiculous
> sensationalizing (i.e. tabloid "news" shows) create a state of mind in the
> viewer that ensure absolute receptivity, NOT conducive to analytical
> thought -- the perfect mind-set to unthinkingly absorb the subliminal/overt
> messages of the commercials.  Therefore, it would be counter-productive for
> a medium intent on creating mindless consuming automatons to encourage
> open-mindedness and thinking for our selves.
> 
> The job of the Hard Copy crew is to scour real life for any situation that
> could possible be exploited.  And illegal, all-night parties with
> teen-agers and drugs is PUUURRFECT for that.  It's "sexy!" (in advertising
> lingo).
> 
> A public  retraction is totally impossible.  Any information would just be
> for the benefit of the Hard Copy crew, who may or may not care - either
> way, it doesn't change the nature of their job, which is to sensationalize,
> which brings in the viewers, who are primed for a barrage of advertising.
> 
> The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
> resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media, and making
> sure those in our own lives hear from us the real story.
> 
> But, it was good for a laugh.  :P
> 
> Back to studying!
> Love, Nancy
> 
> 
> >
> >All this IMHO of course ;-)
> >
> >HARDCOPY the show that cares about THE TRUTH and shows it...
> >Now there's a slogan for the masses....
> >
> >Mike
> >
> >
> > meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic
> > Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.
> 
> 
> 
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> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 06:06:27 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Carlos @ Building Blocks?
In-Reply-To: <319520E7.712@ix.netcom.com>
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> Did anyone at Building Blocks last night pay attention
> to Carlos's set? I heard it was completely new and very
> phat! Just curious...thanx!

I doubt it...  Carlos probably played song #5 in the #6 slot just to 
throw everyone off (ooohh ahhhhhh!) while he was scratching off beat.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 09:33:29 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 09:34:12 -0700
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From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: Today's Harmony info (Bsp)
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Good morning!,

    Well, we are off to start setting up the party for today! For your 
info...

    The party will start @ 12 noon (if we are not there, we just got 
held up so don't worry :) It will be at Boony Dunes state beach 5-10 
miles north of Santa Cruz on Highway 1. (I don't know the exact miles, 
but there are signs.) The info #'s are (408)486-9591 and (408)450-3044

    The dj line up is: Matt - Cloud - Trent - Greg - Graeme La Paix

    Bring all your energy and beach toys!! It is absolutely beautiful 
out today!!! We hope to see you there!!!!


Peace,

Greg :)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 11:43:48 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 11:43:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: Need A Ride To Harmony?
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Hi! 
	
	It looks beautiful, and hot out, the best weather for a beach 
party!  8)
	Chikako and I are going to be leaving S.F. around 1pm or 
thereabouts, and I have room for two more people in my car.
	The one drawback is we will be leaving early (unfortunately), to 
be back here by about 630pm.  That means leaving maybe at 4, depending 
how long it takes to get there, I can't really remember.
	If anyone wants a ride one or both directions, give me a page 
(415) 270-7887.  We'll try to figure out where in S.F., or between S.F. 
and Bonny Doon, we can meet up.
	First come first serve!  (But you don't necessarily need shoes or 
shirt...)

Much love & sunshine,
				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 12:05:59 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 12:02:31 -0700
Message-Id: <199605121902.MAA13585@dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Madness last night =)~
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Well, once again there was a VIBE party!! Lots o' people, lots o' 
music! The location was GREAT!!!! Good open dance floor and good open 
chill spaces! 

I made some new friends and met some old friends, <old?, i think i just 
met them once or twice> 

Todd (You and I are the Suess Brothers!!)
Sarah Dancin' Machinette!
Paul (with a big smily face for SFR logo)
Leslie 
Shawna- (with nekked leddy shirt)
Troy Sheets
Rebecca (HOSTESS WOMAN!!)

If I forgot anybody's name, e-mail me and chew me out... My memory has 
faded.. heheh....

If anybody saw a short asian dude with a Black and White Dr. Suess hat 
with a Swcha Alien Head necklace on, THAT WAS ME! =)~

Can't wait for another good party to come along.... now, it's time to 
go back and study for my midterms... uugggh..

Adam
                        R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 13:00:23 1996
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From: b e n   c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
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Subject: experience?
Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 13:00:04 -0700
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did anyone make it to experience last night? how did it go?

B E N   C H U N
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
H O M E:                              W O R K:
ben_chun@community.net                webmaster@platform-horizons.com
http://community.net/~ben_chun/       http://www.platform-horizons.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 13:11:20 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: Ride To Harmony -2pm
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Okay... now looks more like 2pm we'll be leaving the city! 8(
Anyway, if you'd like a ride, page me... (415) 270-7887.  We'll see what 
we can do.

Much love,
			<<< Starchild >>>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 13:59:01 1996
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From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
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Hiya;

        Rides to Harmony available e-mail me with your number, fast fast fast.

Peace


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 16:40:13 1996
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From: Superstah 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: everyone died?
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wow. the list certainly has gone from high volume to low volume rather
abruptly (sp?).
c'mon! someone tell me about madness! and if goldie showed up at Bass instinct!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 16:49:06 1996
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From: Superstah 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: sony
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something is up with sony's server.
i keep getting bounced mail from mail1.bc.in.sel.sony.com.
does anyone know the admin's mail address?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 16:51:49 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 16:51:46 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: madness (opinion? review? you decide!)
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All I can say is,

   -> madness went off <-

This was undoubtedly one of the best parties I've ever attended... nice
location, handy outside table n' chair area (could talk to people without
having to holler), beautiful decorations, incredible visuals, good chill
space, cheap ticket, short porto-pottie line and

FREE WATER.

=)

Got there around 11:30, Jon Santos was in the middle of spinning a great
set. Hung out, danced, looked around for people I know. Met some new folks.
etc, etc.

Don't remember what time Ethan came on, but everyone started cheering and
he just *ripped shit up.* I went fucking crazy dancing right from the
beginning, but soon fatigue reduced me to standing in one spot and just
sorta bumping along to the tunes... Around the middle of his set there wa
this extended 20 minute block with areally simple, almost unchanging beat.
Incredible. I've never heard so much in such simple music... people (myself
included) were screaming and cheering and everyone was totally into it. Did
I hear some JUNGLE making its way into and Ethan set? wow.

Later, at about 2 or 3am, Pete Lazonby (sp?) started his set... At first I
wasn't too impressed because the beats were really irregular and hard to
dance to. Like Aphex Twin doing trance or something. I was having problems
even listening to it, it was so "foreign" to me. But later, it got more and
more abstract and "unmusical," and I found myself enjoying it more. Somehow
this rolling, hardcore ambient found its way into my mind and I got totally
into it. Oh yeah... this guy was spinning from CDs! I've never seen a setup
like his. I didn't even know it was possible to beatmatch CDs, but he had
some sort of special CD decks that had pitch control and stuff.

I left around 4-ish, feeling great. Altogether a *perfect* party... thanks
to all the FnF folks and
     HAPPY BIRTHDAY Ethan and Wayne.
(who else had birthdays? weren't there 4 people who had birthdays this week?)

Hello to all the SFR people I ran into there...
Wayne, Ethan, Mike, the other Mike (new guy), Brian, Shawna, Leslie (thanks
again for the ride!), Adam (and friends), Sarah, Todd, Jon, Jonathan, Black
Adder, Claire, and anyone whose name I might have forgotten.

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 17:10:24 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 17:10:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: michal migurski <lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: madness (opinion? review? you decide!)
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On Sun, 12 May 1996, michal migurski wrote:
> 
> I left around 4-ish, feeling great. Altogether a *perfect* party... thanks
> to all the FnF folks and
>      HAPPY BIRTHDAY Ethan and Wayne.
> (who else had birthdays? weren't there 4 people who had birthdays this week?)
 
>>>> John Carel and still another?



> 
> Hello to all the SFR people I ran into there...
> Wayne, Ethan, Mike, the other Mike (new guy), Brian, Shawna, Leslie (thanks
> again for the ride!), Adam (and friends), Sarah, Todd, Jon, Jonathan, Black
> Adder, Claire, and anyone whose name I might have forgotten.
> 
> -m.
> 
> 
> 0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
> |    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
> |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
> |                                               |
> |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
> |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
> |                                               |
> |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
> |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
> |                                               |
> |              Michal Migurski                  |
> |              (510) 664-1026                   |
> 0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 17:13:12 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 17:12:59 -0800
To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: madness (opinion? review? you decide!)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>On Sun, 12 May 1996, michal migurski wrote:
>>
>> I left around 4-ish, feeling great. Altogether a *perfect* party... thanks
>> to all the FnF folks and
>>      HAPPY BIRTHDAY Ethan and Wayne.
>> (who else had birthdays? weren't there 4 people who had birthdays this week?)
>
>>>>> John Carel and still another?
oh. I don't know John Carel, but happy birthday!

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 18:11:12 1996
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> >
> > I'm serious...  is anyone interested in helping out?
> >
> > ) paul (
> 
> Paul,
> 
> Count me in.
> 
> Diana Greer

Make that two

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 18:23:49 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 18:23:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
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To: michal migurski <lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: madness (opinion? review? you decide!)
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On Sun, 12 May 1996, michal migurski wrote:

> All I can say is,
> 
>    -> madness went off <-
> 

fuck yeah!!!!!!!

> This was undoubtedly one of the best parties I've ever attended... nice
> location, handy outside table n' chair area (could talk to people without
> having to holler), beautiful decorations, incredible visuals, good chill
> space, cheap ticket, short porto-pottie line 

and what a beautiful night. the weather was incredible!!!

wow- i dont remember the last time i had such insane amounts of 
fun (oh yeah- i guess that would have been at bp last week).

hoooray for all the others that danced like MAD till the very end =) !!!
*hugs*
sarah

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 19:20:39 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 19:20:36 -0800
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From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: madness (opinion? review? you decide!)
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>and what a beautiful night. the weather was incredible!!!

yeah... warm enough to just hang out and cool enough for a nice rest from
the dancin' heat. =)

>hoooray for all the others that danced like MAD till the very end =) !!!
>*hugs*
>sarah

What time did the party wrap up? Who spun after Pete? Was it good to the
last drop? I left when Pete was in his wierd ambient phase. Anyone have any
input on the end of the party? I left around 4am.

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 20:03:22 1996
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From: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: Re: madness (opinion? review? you decide!)
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On Sun, 12 May 1996, michal migurski wrote:

> What time did the party wrap up? Who spun after Pete? Was it good to the
> last drop? I left when Pete was in his wierd ambient phase. Anyone have any
> input on the end of the party? I left around 4am.
> 
> -m.
alex spun after pete and he tore the place up!!!! yes- the party was PHAT 
to the very last little drop. there weren't too many of us left by the 
end, but we sure were having fun. i'm not sure exactly what time it ended...
pretty late.

*hugs again*

sarah
saberant@sfsu.edu



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 22:27:39 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 22:27:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
Reply-To: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: madness (opinion? review? you decide!)
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On Sun, 12 May 1996, JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT (i.e. Sarah) wrote:
> alex spun after pete and he tore the place up!!!! yes- the party was PHAT 
> to the very last little drop. there weren't too many of us left by the 
> end, but we sure were having fun. i'm not sure exactly what time it ended...
> pretty late.

I think it was Joe Rice who finally finished the night (until 7:30am!)... 
The music just seemed to get better and better, although at the end it
really seemed like a marathon!  ;)  It was pretty surreal when they
started passing out danishes and orange juice to the folks still dancing
around 6:30!  People munching, dancing, smiling, .... :)  Many kudos for
the abundant free water and friendly management. The owner even came out
and danced with us in the wee hours! 

I was a little confused by Peter Lazonby's beats, since for a while it
seemed (to me) to be a pretty slow, grating, and un-danceable, although
pretty interesting to just listen to. Someone told me that this is the
only thing people dance to in England, which I found implausible. 
Unfortunately, I think I lot of people left instead of waiting it out,
since the dance-factor improved a lot afterwards.. 

Madness was just one big happy wacky smile-fest for me.  Hopefully we'll
see more events in this space soon... it was perfect!  The only thing I
could've asked for were more black lights, since I brought some
fluorescent markers.  

:)
paul
(smiley)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 22:59:04 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 22:56:31 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
Subject: Re: Bay To Breakers: a rolling rave?
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>Since there are a *lot* of people interested in bay to breakers, why don't
>we rent a cart and generator and pull a sound system along?  That way we
>could have excellent beats to dance to!  (an SFR banner would be nice,
>too)


This might be more appropriate for the Gay Freedom Day Parade, where we
could drive it in the back of a truck and wouldn't be in such a mob scene.

It's also much shorter, like a couple miles instead of 7.5 miles.

just  a thought,

Vince




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 12 23:07:17 1996
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Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 23:07:10 -0700
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From: Tim (knucklehead) <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Madness
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Well I really never have given a review before, I don't plan on to. because
usually most of the events I've gone to have been great and words wouldn't
do it justice. Well Madness went beyond that. I have hit a new level. I can
not believe how much love and energy I felt at Madness. Thank you to
everyone involved putting this event on. This one I will remember forever.

DAMN! I LOVE this family we have here!

Tim (knucklehead)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 01:53:57 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Harmony at the Beach (long)
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Hi all!

 Well, Harmony did it again! This phatness went down at good ol' Bonny 
Doone Beach (man, how many parties HAS that beach seen?!?). This was my 
first party out since I started posting at sfraves. I like to thank each 
and every one of you who have shared a bit of themselves with us here at 
sfraves. I was able to see so many more things than I have ever 
seen before at a rave, in part due to everyone's input right here!
 
 Things started a little late (3:30pm) but it was well worth the wait. 
The sound system was absolutely incredible and was placed in a natural 
accoustic bowl (of the beach) for a perfect symbosis of technology and 
enviroment. I walked to the other side of the beach and could still hear 
everything cleary and feel the bass :) Yet right in front of the DJ 
coffin and on the main dance circle you could still talk to people. NICE!
 I'm sorry for being lousy with DJ names but there were four with # 3 
being Trent and closing out our very own Gregory Sandler. I believe DJ 
Dan was first? And I didn't catch the name of the # 2 DJ.
 All the music was first rate, although I was wondering for moments ;) 
The biggest problem was the wind which absolutely howled (especially on 
the train tracks) but was tolerable on the dance floor. Just before 
sunset the wind died and the tempature was just right. We eventually 
stopped about 8:30 - 9:00 pm (?).

 I managed to get some videotape of the event on s-vhs which I may use 
for a class soon or to work on that anti-H.Copy documentary. I may base 
that upon my Raves as a Rite of Passage essay I wrote. Lots of amazing 
shots of people dancing and smilin' and playin'. :) Some nice sunset 
shots too.

 Recieved a wide variety of response to my videotaping. From worshipful 
to directly threatening (!?!) Intersting to say the least.

 Pleasure to meet so many smiling folks! I met Starchild, Stacey, Tracey 
Dmitry(?), Clinch, remet with Lee (from Harmony) and Jen and some really 
tall cool smiley honcho whose name escapes me. And of course seeing Greg 
made me smile =) Also big hugs to DJ Ceasor!!!!!! (hope i spelt that right)

 I danced, got a little sunburn and had a great time  :) I felt so good 
when I got home  ( especially after the shower ;) ).


 Thank you Harmony!!


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams


                             ( peace on earth )
                                    /
                              -=*=-/
                                *

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 03:45:08 1996
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From: Fred Heutte <phred@well.com>
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To: nw-raves@hyperreal.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: a couple of weekends worth . . .
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Sorta dropped the ball on saying anything about last weekend.

First I should mention Susie's most excellent birthday party, where
the apple and pear cider were definitely better than my mixing :)
I missed Harmony as a result but had a real good time anyway,
especially my periodic geekfest with Laura, one of the chief geeks
at Infogeek, I mean Infoseek :)

Last Saturday was the sfraves picnic, about which nuff said except
the weather was awesome and so was the music and the company.  

I went to Down to Earth, the Pacific/Sunset party, on Saturday night,
in a very interesting gallery/performance art place at 21st and Mission.
There is another party there next week, I think (different organizers).
I didn't have a chance to talk with Polliwog about it since she was
spinning at the time :)  but I gather she is involved with this space
on an ongoing basis.  John Howard was down in the basement playing
really cool jazzy stuff, a real treat for me at 3 am instead of the
usual bang-yer-noggin stuff.  I stuck around for some of Galen's set
and then went to Wicked, but it just didn't do anything for me so
I went home a bit early.

Sunday afternoon was my first Sunset of the year, and fine one, if a
bit on the chilly side.  Alex really impressed me and managed to keep
everything going despite the fact he was playing (techno) at sunset!

Sunday night was like a flashback to my raving past, circa 1992.  Three
places, two and a half misses.  I got to 1190 Folsom (ok, 683 Clementina
since you have to go in the back door) after midnight, after the Ameba
crew had already cleared out.  This was for the Sci Fi Club, where
Brenda and I had a memorable evening a few weeks back.  But this time,
it was Not Happening -- about 20 people in the dance room listlessly
shuffling to the usual hard trance stuff, and five people in the bar --
two DJs, a bartender, another customer and me.  I drank a beer and split.
I missed the Sub Base party down at 290 Howard by a short bit, by the
time I got there it was already closed down.  They had a nice flyer,
has anyone been since?  Finally, since I was nearby, I dropped into Spundae.
I really don't care for the space or the crowd, but James Christian from
NYC, whose records I like quite a bit, was playing so I had a chance to
check him out.  Standard NY club/hard house, nothing spectacular.  I did
have a chance to meet Peter, one of the co-promoters of Spundae.  They're
quite busy now -- doing Nikita on Friday at 1015, Spundae on you-know-when,
and out of town events on Saturday, the first of which was here in Portland
last night.

Monday I shopped for records and found excellent jungle/drum + bass at
Zebra in the lower Haight.  Definitely check them out.  Tweekin continues
to please me with their broad and deep house selection, and they're adding
more techno and jungle as well.  I heard (and passed) on both new albums
by Underworld and Orbital.  Finally checked back in at Ameba and spun a
bit before heading out of town.  Got my cool-as-you-like Tribal Future
tickets, get yers soon!

This past weekend was a bit more restricted as I have a big work project
I'm wrapping up.  But we did our first Portland outdoor event this year,
organized by Jeremy.  This was at a beautiful spot right on the Columbia
River, across from about NE 15th in Portland.  It drizzled but never got
too wet.  Toonz by Cory West, Jeff (who brought out a fine speaker system),
yrs trly and Jeremy, whose was unfortunately shut down due to the generator
running out of gas :-)  I played both LTJ Bukem's "Rain Fall" and Hardkiss'
"River and Rain" in honor of the humidity :)  About 40 people showed up,
many from Seattle, and despite the weather it was a nice way to start up.
Jeremy's got one a month scheduled at various Vancouver area locations
through the summer.  

Last night, Spundae brought their road show to Portland.  Lots of
production,
lasers, big sound, two full rooms of stuff, at Roseland.  I mostly stayed
in the main room where Carlos kicked off a big charge and led into a nearly
three-hour set by the Deep Dish guys, Dubfire and Sharam, who traded off
three-and-three for the entire set.  They spun very well though not like
DJs do, more like record producers do (which they are).  Lots of test
pressings, not much continuity from track to track but lots of excellent
ones.  Vocals, hard house, tracky stuff all mixed together.  Carlos and
Brenda and I had a good time funking out bigtime to some of the tunes
early in the set.  

Very little vibe of any note, but the crowd was relatively relaxed.  I saw
one of the local promoters breaking up a big circle early in the Deep Dish
set.  A half a dozen guys with satin jacket emblazoned with their Breaks
Crew name showed up, one even had a crash helmet on his head.  I guess
they were determined to be the show.  The promoter had other ideas.  He
told them off, they grumbled a bunch and then melted.  This thing about
ravers and circle dancers is like the mods and rockers.  It's a culture
clash that won't go away.  It'll be interesting to see how this progresses.

The Spundae party here is the wave (rave) of the future, I think.  Say
goodbye to warehouse parties.  I haven't been to a one in Portland in
years that really has had much going for it.  Occasional sets -- DRC
a couple of weeks ago, Emma last fall, Derrick Carter's awesome three-deck
mix, Garth a way long time ago -- stand out for me, but I've never had a
*good* time at one of these.  Spundae had a bit more of an age mix and
clearly these big-production affairs in club spaces are where things are
going.  We are about to witness the Americanization of the UK club scene,
and this is the precursor.  Spundae is starting down the path of the
superclub model, where they build up a name, a local crowd, bring in
the big name DJs, and then starting planting their operation all around
the country.  I wish Spundae well but their concept and their crowd are
not what I got into all this for, although I certainly enjoyed the music
last night.  

For $16, everyone got a good deal at Spundae, but I still prefer to haul
equipment across the sand and play outside . . .

phred

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 08:30:53 1996
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From: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
Reply-To: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
Subject: surpising madness review
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Hmm, I should have listnened to my intuition from my burnout phase that I 
had mentioned last week.  I feel like the black sheep on this one.

I didn't have that good a time at Madness as I do at most of the other 
raves I've attended.  The crowd was just too weird for me.  Don't ask me 
what I mean by that - for I can't put my finger on it, it's just how I 
felt (and others, too from whom I talked to.) Don't get me wrong, it was 
a good vibe, just a really freaky weird vibe.  There was a point 
when I was actually thinking to myself "people in here are cheering too 
loud - I can't even hear the music!"  I guess I wasn't in the right 
mindframe all night long, cause that has never happeded to me before - 
then again, I've always been able to hear the music ove rthe cheering - 
and that place was almost hurtful it was so loud.

Sorry I didn't geta chance to meet and talk to new sfravers.  I just 
wasn't into it that night - I wasn't feeling very social and would not 
want to have brought any of you down.  I did love the space and the 
decorations - especially the big tent on that ledge and the colorful 
poster nearest the bathroom.

I probably won't go out again til Tribal Future - I think Madness was a 
loud and clear message that I need some time off from raving. 

love,
Amy
---------------
|   _  ,/|    |
|  '\`o O'    |
|   =(_^_)=   |         Amy Starkey
|     |U|     |         sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu
|     | |     |      
---------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 09:32:21 1996
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To: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Bay To Breakers: a rolling rave?
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>This might be more appropriate for the Gay Freedom Day Parade, where we
>could drive it in the back of a truck and wouldn't be in such a mob scene.
>
>It's also much shorter, like a couple miles instead of 7.5 miles.
>
>just  a thought,
>
>Vince

I'm hoping that such an activity will take place at an event I can support
in good concience, instead of the above example, which represents something
I'm very torn on...

Non-judgmental but feelin' funny,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 09:45:11 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605131645.JAA12218@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: mad.
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 09:45:09 -0700 (PDT)
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Mad was extremely energetic.  When Ethan was spinning people were practically
climbing the walls.  Big industrial/goth turnout for a rave.  Around
4am the music got very, um, "experimental".... dramtically changing the
vibe on the dance floor.  It is very difficult to beat-match CDs at 
+160bpms... as was evident from that mix.  Detroit sound sweeping
sf?  boom boom boom boom boom boom.  I miss sound with some funk and house 
influence.  

Saw lots of silly stuff there, making it a particularly entertaining evening.

-troy

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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 09:56:54 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 09:56:47 -0800
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: Bay To Breakers: a rolling rave?
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eric

does that mean you're coming with us? ;>

how about the people who've said they're interested in 'doing' the race? do
we wanna coordinate? is there a likelihood that this 'float' thing is going
to happen, or should we just all collapse in a heap at the 'R' section at
the end (i like this idea anyway....:> ), where all our SFR buddies will be
waiting with hugs etc., etc. for us smelly road warriors?

???

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 10:17:01 1996
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From: melvinm@iii.com (Melvin Monterrosa)
Message-Id: <9605131711.AA10131@molly>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Bay To Breakers: a rolling rave?
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Couldn't you have this rolling rave at both events?
just a thought...
Mello

************************** Original Message *************************

From: epaul@synopsys.com (Eric P. Peterson)
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 09:31:44 -0700
To: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Bay To Breakers: a rolling rave?

>This might be more appropriate for the Gay Freedom Day Parade, where we
>could drive it in the back of a truck and wouldn't be in such a mob scene.
>
>It's also much shorter, like a couple miles instead of 7.5 miles.
>
>just  a thought,
>
>Vince

I'm hoping that such an activity will take place at an event I can support
in good concience, instead of the above example, which represents something
I'm very torn on...

Non-judgmental but feelin' funny,

- E

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 10:41:46 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 96 10:45:09 -0800
Subject: Bass Instinct, Harmony Beach Party
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	Wiissshhh... Another not-so-bad week-end! :-)

	It all began on Friday night; once spotted the location for _Bass
	Instinct_ (a little confusion gave me the location before everyone
	else), I go there to listen to that Drum & Bass stuff, and meet
	friendly SFRavers, by order of appearance: Larry, Jess, E, Brendan,
	Erik, Albert, Leslie, Kirsten's very nice friend, and many others...

	Some comments about BI: place ok but not really tremendous, friendly
	people, sound system correct and lights... well... only one black
	light, some people like that but I usually prefer something more
	elaborate (e.g. last BP was perfect: lazer, shining stuff, etc.
	-- but everything was perfect at _Beautiful People_, so...)
	Overall, the music at BI was good but sometimes a little, mmh,
	choppy. Even Jess, awarded Jungle Dance Queen of the Year, and in spite
	of her provoking statements ;-), seemed to have problems getting
	into the music,	so we decided to take off, direction _Something Free_.
	Oops. This was definitely an error, as you might have guessed from
	previous posts; we spent one hour and a half on the Bay Bridge,
	stuck into the traffic, to finally land to the Berkeley Marina,
	in the middle of nowhere: no sound, no people, no party :-(
	*Urgh*.	After minor adventures, we went back home a little
	disappointed.

	But full of energy for the Harmony beach party on Sunday!
	The location was really great: a kind of natural cirque,
	with the waves crashing far away, plenty of room for as many 
	people as possible, beautiful weather, *perfect* sound...
	Of course, as any beach party, it was better than anything else:
	people were dancing friendly everywhere, you could have a walk near
	the sea or climb the rocks... So cool!
	I love that, jumping in the sand, feeling the beat in your feet,
	lay down in the sun, chewing the sand friendly people throw at
	you (just joking, it was quite windy). I also met John who is a real
	cool dude!
	Much respect to the Harmony crew! I tried to give as much help as
	possible, but they deserve my deepest congratulations!
	Encore ! ;-)

						Renaud


Very soon: a comparison between the Techno scene in SF and on the
French Riviera.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 10:54:31 1996
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Subject: Harmony Beach party
Date: Mon, 13 May 96 10:53:56 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
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Hi everyone-
Well I missed Madness and everything else this weekend because I have 
been busy 
pretending to be a responsible adult... therefore I was glad for the 
opportunity 
to go to the beach for a while and blow off some steam!

We arrived around 4 pm and the weather was really nice, just a bit windy. 
I found
that if I was sitting down the sand would blow into my eyes, so... 
perfect excuse
to dance. I danced pretty solidly for 3 hours, but dancing on the sand is 
like being
on some kind of a hellish Stairmaster, boy are my legs tired today! The 
music was
great, I don't know who was spinning when because I am just krazy & mixed 
up.
There were lots of smiles and happy faces from everyone.

I didn't meet too many sfravers, just a few. I guess I was pretty 
absorbed in 
what I was doing. :-) For those of you who don't know me, I was wearing a 
black
bikini top, shorts and (sometimes) a Fukengruven t-shirt. There, now you 
can say
a post dated hi!

We left around 7 pm, ran amok on the beach picking up trash, including 
lots of
balloons... my public service announcement for today: Give a hoot, don't 
pollute!
Balloons are not biodegradable. Sorry if this is too PC for you 
litterbugs...

It looks like I may not see anyone until Tribal Future, so take care and 
be good.
And thank U Harmony for coming through again for us. Can't wait 'till 
your next party.

Luv, 
Woodsy Owl

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 11:06:05 1996
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From: Sarah Jane Slaymaker <sjslay@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Message-Id: <199605131806.LAA18311@cardinal1.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: madmadmad
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 11:05:59 -0700 (PDT)
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I'm not a usual reviewer but the party that was Madness needs to be exulted!

There was not a thing to complain about and everything to rave about! The space
the music, the people, the candies...all perfect! I have never felt quite so
fulfilled. This is a strange feeling for me because I always want more tunes 
and, body permitting, more dancing. This was THE best rave I have checked out
in the Bay Area so far...

Most memorable image: At around 7am orange juice and danishes were brought out!The few of us still dancing stopped very briefly to take a drink and then pick
up some food to have while dancing. I looked around and people were tapping outthe beat with their danishes. For some reason I found this incredibly cute. No
time to stop moving so we'll make our food dance too!

Thanks Paul, Sarah, Jeff, John, Adam and Philip for the energy and near 8hrs of
groovin'. plus Big O and James for the Ben Gay.

Huge thanks and Happy Birthdays to the crew from Madness. I think you guys made
my month! Let's see it happen again!

luv Sarah

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 11:19:14 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Bass Instinct, Harmony Beach Party
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I'll second everything Renaud said about the weekend.  We certainly did go
through a miserable bridge commute, and in Berkeley found Nothing Free.  I
was glad that we rescued Moshe and his friend there, though, as they had
even worse luck that night.
The vibe at Bass Instinct was harder than what I'm used to, but was
interesting.  It also took a while to find the groove in jungle, but it was
fun when I did.  Great to see some friends there; it was amusing/mildly
annoying to have many people come up to me asking if I had this or that,
but not bad...
The beach party was "all that," as JSL might say.  Friendly, playful people
(TONS of friends at this one; thanks to the beautiful gal who came over and
tweaked my toes as stretched out on the sand to watch the dancers for a
while!), outstanding music (I haven't heard Greg spin in ages, and
thoroughly enjoyed his set), and *aw, shucks* another kiss from Laurie
(sp?), the tongue-pierced gal who kissed me at BP (my head's still in the
clouds) :)
Everyone there made the party what it was.  It was so cool to see some
mothers out there with their children for Mother's Day, some of whom even
danced!
Well, now my back is very sore, and my neck and calves are burned, but I
had a wonderful time, and thought the party went off like a mutha!!!  See
y'all next time...

Love,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 11:49:50 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (sfraves@hyperreal.com)
Date: Mon, 13 May 96 11:49:41 PDT
From: DWATANAB@UCI.EDU (Dana Watanabe)
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I think poepl talking about aiming at the advertisers is the right
line of thought, going along that line iw ould say
that people should just call/write/fax paramoutn and their local
tv stations,

there are MANY things about the report to complain about than
giving ravinga  bad name

If you do complain, i woudl reccommend focusing on thing brought
up in the response letter by the promtoers of the party

You can write in and just say that you feel it is horrendous
that Paramount supports a program that lies about the deaths of people
(the kid shown in the clip with the pixelated face wasn't dead,
and we're still trying to track down info on the "boy who wandered into the
desert" becuase no one knows anything about this)

Also complain about the program video taping people wihtout their 
permission under the pretense that the film was for personal use
ESPECIALLY minors that were taped and shown on TV

And also about the fact that they repeatedly blatently lied
during the report, (like saying police/medical help was inaccessible
but in fact an ambulance was there along with several rangers/sheriffs)

I think complaints will be more readily received and acted upon
if they are about the quality of the program or the ethics they
use as a news (type) program in their research/reporting




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 11:52:40 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 11:55:06 -0700
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From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: Thanks from Harmony!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello everyone!!!

    Well, that was great! Just what we all needed, (a relaxing day on 
the sand)! Thank you to everyone who came out and supported us! And an 
even bigger thanks to everyone who cleaned up for/with us!!! (You guys 
were a BBBIIIIGGG help!) Rob, Jon and the rest of Gateway, thanks for 
the bad ass sound! Matt, Cloud and Trent, thanks for the tunes! (And no 
Randy, Dj Dan didn't spin first.) 

    We had lots of fun, and hope that you all did too! We will see you 
soon!!! Love.

Peace,

Greg :)  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 12:03:13 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 12:03:26 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Superstah 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Harmony Beach party
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sheesh. set this back to Ms Phink instead of the list. oops.

>>We left around 7 pm, ran amok on the beach picking up trash, including 
>>lots of
>>balloons... my public service announcement for today: Give a hoot, don't 
>>pollute!
>>Balloons are not biodegradable. Sorry if this is too PC for you 
>>litterbugs...
>
>i don't think being responsible with our environment is PC. it's just
right. PC has negative connotations, our planet does not.
>c'mon everyone, i know it's probably not the people on the list, let's get
our act together and stop chucking trash around. i've especially noticed
that californians in general have a real tendancy to throw cigarette butts
on the ground (and not even extinguish them half the time!). yuck.
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 12:05:49 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 12:08:53 -0600
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: mad.
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At 10:45 AM  -0600 5/13/96, Troy Sheets wrote:
>Mad was extremely energetic.  When Ethan was spinning people were practically
>climbing the walls.  Big industrial/goth turnout for a rave.  Around
>4am the music got very, um, "experimental".... dramtically changing the
>vibe on the dance floor.  It is very difficult to beat-match CDs at
>+160bpms... as was evident from that mix.  Detroit sound sweeping
>sf?  boom boom boom boom boom boom.  I miss sound with some funk and house
>influence.

Ummm, more experimental english trance sound. That ain't Detroit. Detroit
is deep soulful techno.

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 12:15:11 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: NRR Mac e-mail question
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Would someone please help me with this?  A friend wants to send me a ZIP
archive, but I can't use the file because it appears on my Mac (after I
receive it via e-mail) as a "document" and, when I try to open it, an error
message tells me that the application that created it couldn't be found.
What kind of software is needed to access such a file?  I know StuffIt
Expand won't help, so there must be some application/utility out there that
can.  Please help!

Thanks,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 12:28:57 1996
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Date: 13 May 96 15:26:24 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Gay  Freedom Parade Story
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Vince said:
>This might be more appropriate for the Gay Freedom Day Parade, where we
>could drive it in the back of a truck and wouldn't be in such a mob scene.
>
>It's also much shorter, like a couple miles instead of 7.5 miles.
>
>just  a thought,
>
>Vince

And Eric replied:

I'm hoping that such an activity will take place at an event I can support
in good concience, instead of the above example, which represents something
I'm very torn on...

Non-judgmental but feelin' funny,

- E
_______________________________________________

Here's my short story.  Preface:  I'm straight, but all three of my best male
friends are gay.  

Three years ago, I was invited by a friend to dance on the Sisters of Perpetual
Indulgence float at the Parade -- If you don't know them, this is a wild and
wonderful group of gay men who dress in outrageous campy nun-drag and party a
lot -- they also support a wide range of gay community causes and issues, and
they're a cool and playful (obviously) group.  

I had never even BEEN to the parade, but I dressed in my craziest costume (which
was a lot less crazy than it would be now!), and had the TIME OF MY LIFE!  We
had loud speakers, awesome music, and as we travelled down the road, people
yelled and smiled and danced with us, I LOVED IT!  The energy at this even is
amazing, total happiness and freedom being felt by people, many of whom live
their lives with caution and criticism, out partying with abandonment and joy.  

The past two years, I've gone and volunteered for a while, then partied, danced
in the street, and I have to say met amazing people -- I met my best friend Sara
at the parade two years ago (you may have met her yesterday at Harmony or at the
SFR picnic with me) on a day that was a life-changing experience for me  -- 

To know about the parade:  1. Not everyone is gay -- it's not about being gay to
be there, it's about supporting people's freedom to be who they are, and 2. The
vibe is happy and upbeat, like a big smilin' community ....

Plus, as I hope we all know, there are a lot of gay ravers out there, and we're
all part of the same family! If we had a float or a marching/dancing group on
foot (and honestly I don't know if there's a huge bureaurcratic process in order
to even get in), we could make a sign that shows support of freedom in general,
not specifically for sexual orientation -- something that represents all of us,
straight/gay/bi/abstinent whatever!

Whichever we do, Bay to Breakers or Gay Pride, I'm happy to partipate!

Leslie  : )     Dance on!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 12:43:37 1996
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To: Superstah 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Harmony Beach party
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>c'mon everyone, i know it's probably not the people on the list, let's get
>our act together and stop chucking trash around. i've especially noticed
>that californians in general have a real tendancy to throw cigarette butts
>on the ground (and not even extinguish them half the time!). yuck.
>>
The only thing I left behind, besides residual love & positive nrg, was a
pair of black, plastic, super-dark shades, because they fell out of my
shirt pocket as I was helping to lug amps down to the beach.  So I guess
now someone out there has a free pair of cheap sunglasses (oh yeah!).
(Wow!  A ZZ Top moment...hehehe!).

Peace,  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 13:05:15 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 13:05:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
Reply-To: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: BAY TO BREAKERS: Umm, oops!
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Update on my (seemingly aborted) ambitions to drag a sound system along
for BTB... 

I have laryngitis, can't speak, and feel pretty crappy.  So it's going to
be very hard for me to make the 'trance float' happen for Bay to Breakers. 
I got several nice messages of support, though, so if you are very
motivated and would like to take the reins on this one, please send me
some more mail and I'd be glad to see what we can do! 

In any case, we should definitely have a meeting place at the end (the 'R'
section), and probably at the beginning too for those who want to hang out
during and after the 'race'. 

For all of those who asked:  Bay to Breakers is a 7+ mile event (more like
a parade than a race) in San Francisco on Sunday morning, May 19.  It
starts south of Market and ends in Golden Gate Park.  Lots of the 100,000
people dress up in crazy costumes and it's really fun. 

Sarah (sjslay) and I are planning to dance all night and then hit BTB --
if anyone would like to join us please speak up!  :) 

Take care, and please send some positive energy to my vocal cords!! 

) paul (

(mr. frog)
 "croak"


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 13:10:36 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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Problem worked-around!  Thanks, all.  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 13:11:21 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605132009.NAA20624@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: NRR Mac e-mail question
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 13:09:05 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140b01adbcd76fd58a@[146.225.72.168]> from "Eric P. Peterson" at May 13, 96 12:15:00 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
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> 
> Would someone please help me with this?  A friend wants to send me a ZIP
> archive, but I can't use the file because it appears on my Mac (after I
> receive it via e-mail) as a "document" and, when I try to open it, an error
> message tells me that the application that created it couldn't be found.
> What kind of software is needed to access such a file?  I know StuffIt
> Expand won't help, so there must be some application/utility out there that
> can.  Please help!
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> - E
> 
> 
> 

There is a shareware program called unZip, now in version 5.2.1.  I can 
send it to you if you'd like, OR you could do a search (web that is) 
using unzip AND mac as the search string.

Later,
John


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 13:34:51 1996
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Hey all,

        I have a business proposition for the promoters of Harmony,
Chrysalis, and Friends & Family, but my only contact is Greg of Harmony.
Can someone please send me the e-mail address of anyone I may contact in
the Gateway and FnF crews?  It will potentially benefit the Bay Area rave
scene, and I'd surely appreciate the opportunity.

Thanks,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 14:09:36 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 16:07:46 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Hard Copy retaliation #1 (fwd)
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FYI

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 13:10:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kc <sarahtonen@earthlink.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: Hard Copy retaliation #1

Please copy the following text "Society for Professional Journalism Code of
Ethics" and fax it to the following name/number with the information
provided.  If you can, you may want to send it several times over the next
couple of weeks and you should cross post this to other mailing lists
encouraging them to voice their concern as well.

-----------------------------Start Copy Here----------------------------


TO: Frank Feldinger/Hard Copy
Via fax: 213/862-1068
From:(YOUR NAME) A disgusted desert raver

RE: A reminder for your commitement to ethics in journalism

As a reminder of your responsibilities in professional journalism, please
review the items starred below





               The Society of Professional Journalists
                           Code of Ethics

Code of Ethics

The Society of Professional Journalists, Sigma Delta Chi, believes the duty
of journalists is to serve the truth.

We BELIEVE the agencies of mass communication are carriers of public
discussion and information, acting on their Constitutional mandate and
freedom to learn and report the facts.

We BELIEVE in public enlightenment as the forerunner of justice, and in our
Constitutional role to seek the truth as part of the public's right to know
the truth.

We BELIEVE those responsibilities carry obligations that require journalists
to perform with intelligence, objectivity, accuracy and fairness.

To these ends, we declare acceptance of the standards of practice set forth:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I. Responsibility

The public's right to know of events of public importance and interest is
the overriding mission of the mass media. The purpose of distributing news
and enlightened opinion is to serve the general welfare.

***Journalists who use their professional status as representatives of the
public for selfish or other unworthy motives violate a high trust.***
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

II. Freedom of the Press

Freedom of the press is to be guarded as an inalienable right of people in a
free society. It carries with it the freedom and the responsibility to
discuss, question, and challenge actions and utterances of our government
and of our public and private institutions. Journalists uphold the right to
speak unpopular opinions and the privilege to agree with the majority.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

III. Ethics

Journalists must be free of obligation to any interest other than the
public's right to know the truth.

  1. Gifts, favors, free travel, special treatment or privileges can
     compromise the integrity of journalists and their employers. Nothing of
     value should be accepted.
  2. Secondary employment, political involvement, holding public office, and
     service in community organizations should be avoided if it compromises
     the integrity of journalists and their employers. Journalists and their
     employers should conduct their personal lives in a manner that protects
     them from conflict of interest, real or apparent. Their
     responsibilities to the public are paramount. That is the nature of
     their profession.
**********************************************************************
**3. SO-CALLED NEWS COMMUNICATIONS FROM PRIVATE SOURCES SHOULD NOT BE
PUBLISHED
     OR BROADCAST WITHOUT SUBSTANTIATION OF THEIR CLAIMS TO NEWS VALUES.
**********************************************************************
 *4. Journalists will seek news that serves the public interest, despite the
     obstacles. They will make constant efforts to assure that the public's
     business is conducted in public and that public records are open to
     public inspection.
  5. Journalists acknowledge the newsman's ethic of protecting confidential
     sources of information.
  6. Plagiarism is dishonest and unacceptable.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

IV. Accuracy and Objectivity

Good faith with the public is the foundation of all worthy journalism.

 *1. Truth is our ultimate goal.
 *2. Objectivity in reporting the news is another goal that serves as the
     mark of an experienced professional. It is a standard of performance
     toward which we strive. We honor those who achieve it.
 *3. There is no excuse for inaccuracies or lack of thoroughness.
 *4. Newspaper headlines should be fully warranted by the contents of the
     articles they accompany. Photographs and telecasts should give an
     accurate picture of an event and not highlight an incident out of
     context.
  5. Sound practice makes clear distinction between news reports and
     expressions of opinion. News reports should be free of opinion or bias
     and represent all sides of an issue.
  6. Partisanship in editorial comment that knowingly departs from the truth
     violates the spirit of American journalism.
  7. Journalists recognize their responsibility for offering informed
     analysis, comment, and editorial opinion on public events and issues.
     They accept the obligation to represent such material by individuals
     whose competence, experience, and judgment qualify them for it.
  8. Special articles or presentation devoted to advocacy or the writer's
     own conclusions and interpretations should be labeled as such.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

V. Fair Play

*Journalists at all times will show respect for the dignity, privacy, rights,
and well-being of people encountered in the course of gathering and
presenting the news.

 *1. The news media should not communicate unofficial charges affecting
     reputation or moral character without giving the accused a chance to
     reply.
 *2. The news media must guard against invading a person's right to privacy.
  3. The media should not pander to morbid curiosity about details of vice
     and crime.
 *4. It is the duty of news media to make prompt and complete correction of
     their errors.
 *5. Journalists should be accountable to the public for their reports and
     the public should be encouraged to voice its grievances against the
     media. Open dialogue with our readers, viewers, and listeners should be
     fostered.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

VI. Pledge

Adherence to this code is intended to preserve and strengthen the bond of
mutual trust and respect between American journalists and the American
people.

The Society shall -- by programs of education and other means -- encourage
individual journalists to adhere to these tenets, and shall encourage
journalistic publications and broadcasters to recognize their responsibility
to frame codes of ethics in concert with their employees to serve as
guidelines in furthering these goals.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Code of Ethics adopted 1926; revised 1973, 1984, 1987
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Society of Professional Journalists also has published an ethics guide
called "Doing Ethics in Journalism, A Handbook with Case Studies" by Jay
Black, Bob Steele and Ralph Barney (1993). For information on how to get the
book, contact the Society at P.O. Box 77, 16 South Jackson St., Greencastle,
IN 46135-0077. The Telephone number is (317) 653-3333.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Related Links

Northern California Pro Chapter's Ethics Page
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

                          Return to San Diego SPJ

----------------------------------------------------------------------------



-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 14:13:06 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Harmony/Gateway/FnF proposition
Cc: John_W._Stuart@livewire.com
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Dear Promoters of the Harmony, Gateway Systems, and Friends & Family parties,

        This message concerns a recent thread of discussion on sfraves
about coffee.  My roommate (and friend of over ten years), John Stuart, has
a relative who's an executive of a large coffee company based in southern
California.  Thus, John is able to acquire coffee beans at very low cost.
He and I are interested in setting up and running a coffee station at
parties for whoever is interested.  The promoters of the events where the
coffee station would be set up would be paid a percentage of coffee sales,
to be agreed upon by both parties.  Due to positive comments about the idea
of having a coffee station at parties, we feel that, by maintaining a
coffee station, we would be providing a service that would be appreciated,
and we would want to sell the coffee at a reasonable, easily affordable
price.  It would be a very simple operation, and wouldn't take up much
floorspace (the best place for such a coffee station would be in the chill
area).  We would provide all the necessary materials, and would take as
much responsibility as possible for the waste (cups, stirring sticks, etc).
        I apologize for making this public via the list, but I don't have
the e-mail addresses of the proper people to contact, and hopefully posting
this way will generate more support (anyone?).  Please e-mail me, privately
if you wish, if you have an interest in discussing this further.  On behalf
of John Stuart and myself, I thank you for your attention.

Very truly yours,

- Eric P.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 14:25:13 1996
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From: The.Finn@bbs.urbanite.com
Message-Id: <199605132125.OAA26756@taz.hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: 13 May 1996 14:26:34 PST
Subject: Re: madness -Lazoby set
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PA>I was a little confused by Peter Lazonby's beats, since for a while it
PA>seemed (to me) to be a pretty slow, grating, and un-danceable, although
PA>pretty interesting to just listen to.

Pete is a really talented guy, I think the main think that was wrong
was that he turned up at 2am and spun at 2:30 (he was supposed to be on
at 4am) so he didn't get a chance to catch the vibe. He said after that
he was surpised that people wanted a real constant dance vibe, but
anyone who stayed through his set would have found that he picked up on
this.

PA> Someone told me that this is the
PA> only thing people dance to in England, which I found implausible. 
PA> Unfortunately, I think I lot of people left instead of waiting it out,
PA> since the dance-factor improved a lot afterwards.. 

Naw, Pete is pretty unique in style, playing alot of his own personal
toons. (he has  a CD called your humble servant, cant remeber the
label, and is looking to produce more stuff while he is here)

But I have to admit, it was Alex who really blew me away.

Asta
Stephen

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 14:41:05 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 14:37:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves [WARNING: LONG RESPONSE ahead]
To: Rhea Gossett <rhea@xinet.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02120d14adb931c0c612@DialupEudora>
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On Fri, 10 May 1996, Rhea Gossett wrote:

> 
> In a sense, (as Peter said again) dancing _ can _ be the best way to relate -
> you're putting your energy into the place, the moment, the music,
> the crowd, the building, including everyone & excluding none.
> 
> This list itself, right now, is verging away a bit from this
> aspect of raving, I think - recent posts about events that happened
> over the last two weeks were full of messages from people saying "hi"
> to specific friends, posting long lists mentioning people by name who
> the writers felt made the event go off for them...though I think it is
> incredibly important and exciting when people find each other & become
> friends within a shared love of raving, I would still hate to see this
> list become exclusively a social circle.

I read Rhea's post and have been pondering this aspect of it all 
weekend.  As someone who posted a short list of sfravers of whom I had 
met at BP, what she is saying above struck me.  After being here for any 
amount of time (for me it's been about 10 months), you begin to want to 
meet the people with whom you converse.  Raves are a communal experience, 
and the "rave" experience is arguably best shared with others rather than 
doing it alone or in a small, limited group of friends.  Conversing with 
"strangers" and sharing something with them, be it as simple as a smile, 
adds to the communal spirit.  So, it is in this context that I want to 
discuss Rhea's comments.

Speaking from my own feelings, I would post the names of people I had met 
*not* to exclude anyone, but rather to include more people into the 
family.  Although some may disagree, I feel it is hard to be a part of a 
group if you are anonymous.  How can your individuality be enjoyed if no 
one knows who you are?  Of course, this can be carried to the extreme.  In 
which case you would get a small exclusive clique; something akin to a 
high school hierarchy.  I imagine this is what Rhea was alluding to.  

If I could meet all 400 people on this list and then be able to give each 
one written acknowledgment, I would be overjoyed.  It is nice 
when someone appreciates you.  And, I think, appreciation and acknowledgment 
of each human's individuality is the highest form of compliment.  This 
only adds to the communal experience, and this is where I disagree with 
Rhea when she talks about "hating to see this become a social circle."   
Because, I don't think that's what this list is nor what it will ever 
become.  If we can meet one another, it adds faces to print and, thereby, 
enhances many people's experiences because it makes everything more 
personal.

What makes this list "look" like a social circle is that you get people 
who are less "shy" (for lack of a better word) or busy, or whatever, that 
post frequently.  So, you start to read stuff from the people who post 
all of the time.  The remedy for this is that more people should post.  
If someone doesn't post, they won't be known and they aren't necessarily 
adding to the communal vibe of this "raving" list.  Rhea, herself, added 
a perspective that made me stop and think from a different angle.  How 
does that happen if people don't post?  I think I am more specifically 
speaking about people who might be intimidated to post something rather 
than those who are too busy.  Isn't this a Do-It-Yourself culture where 
you need to make it what you want it instead of sitting around talking 
about how it could be better?  I'll be the first to admit that I have fun 
being on this list.  It is like a rave away from a rave, and isn't raving 
what we are all here about?  

I'd like to see more people come forward and speak up (hopefully with 
tolerance and understanding in mind!), epecially those among us who are 
shy.  A rave is a great place to lose your shyness because we all seek a 
common goal of creating a marvelous vibe, and in order to do that we must 
respect and acknowledge every single one of us.   

Rhea says, 
> Raves have been such a big learning experience for me,showing me 
> that perspective seems to be what lets us get outside confining social 
> structures in the first place.

Words to live by!! :)


-kaysee

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 14:43:22 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: Re: coffee station
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 14:41:32 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Just my opinion, but I hope the coffee station idea is a go! There are folks
at raves who aren't in danger of hyperthermia who would like a warm ,
flavorful cuppa coffee. ( Mocha too ? ) 

 And - maybe iced coffee for the un-cola crowd ?

 Decaf for those who just like the flavor? ( Probably not very many )

 Biscotti (sic) ? Shortbread cookies? Other Pastry?

 He folks - what stuff should Eric & John coffee stations offer?

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 14:46:44 1996
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Friday - - - >

Bass Instinct was a fun little underground party at the same space as
Chrysalis' 420.  It looked to me like they had a great sound system, but it
was
woefully underamplified.  No bass, ironically enough.  No big deal, I can kick
it without pristine sound.  There were a number of people thoroughly getting
into the music.  I really enjoyed Tomas' set especially; he should have gone
on
earlier when there were more people there.
Saturday - - - >

Madness.  This was a great party in a number of ways and yet it never really
hit critical mass for me.  The space was the biggest plus.  Nice sized
warehouse bordered by a thoughtfully decorated indoor chill area with a couch
and mattresses and a big outdoor patio area with chairs and tables.  The one
downside to the huge chill area was that I think it drew a lot of people away
from the dance floor.  I will attest to the earlier reports of the crowd being
"weird".  I couldn't quite put my finger on it either.  Maybe it came from the
fact that everyone seemed really out of their heads and yet not terribly
social
or open to unfamiliar people (namely ME!).  The music, during primetime
anyway,
seemed pretty undancey.  I wasn't really too aware of who was spinning after
Jon Santos finished his set.  Was Peter Lazonby the only one who played CDs?
If so, he was the main culprit for me.  Most of his mixes broke down into long
ambient transitions, questionably beatmatched.  Not that it was his fault, but
the CDs kept skipping also, something that tends to kill any trance set.  Then
there was the gabber-jungle segment which sent me on another journey into the
chill areas.  Certainly I think everyone can appreciate the niche that Mad has
carved out for itself with its techno-only foundation, but I had several
people
express their reluctance to go to Madness simply to hear the same regulars at
Mad all in a row.  Surely there are more techno dj's in San Francisco to build
a lineup from.  Sho and James Dee come to mind as two overtalented underbooked
SF techno dj's.  Overall it was a nice party though, no question about it.

inhuman

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 14:48:26 1996
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Wait a minute!  We don't wanna get too elaborate (and pass the added
expense on to anyone).  We just want to provide coffee, in a choice of
regular or unleaded, hot or decaf.  I think it would be a nice addition to
the breakfast items that are served at some parties.  We'll see...

Powered by caffeine,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 15:14:57 1996
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>
>[ to sfraves list ]
>
> Just my opinion, but I hope the coffee station idea is a go! There are folks
>at raves who aren't in danger of hyperthermia who would like a warm ,
>flavorful cuppa coffee. ( Mocha too ? ) 

I like it.  Especially the iced coffee idea.  And mochas (Jake _loooves mochas).

Mr. Javaholic


Jake Reichert			|  I used to be indecisive/
reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu	|  But now I'm not so sure...		
				|                    -The The
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                     "LONELY IS AS LONELY DOES"
B.C. Gilbert/G. Lewis ------------------------    The Happy Family
A=====================================V  Bulgarian Voices | Pixies 
|          |              |   ____    |  Bauhaus |  Frazier Chorus
|     /|   |      /\      |  |    \   |  Michael Brook |  Spirea X
|    / |   |     /  \     |  |     \  |  The Breeders |  Colourbox
|   /  |   |    /    \    |  |      | |  Dead Can Dance |  Dif Juz
|  /___|   |   /______\   |  |      | |  Throwing Muses |  The The
|      |   |  /        \  |  |     /  |  Clan of Xymox | Rema-Rema
|      |   | /          \ |  |___ /   |  Cocteau Twins | Liquorice  
A=====================================M  Lisa Germano  | M|A|R|R|S
X Mal Deutschland | Dance Chapter | Insides |   The Birthday Party
A.R. Kane | Rowland S. Howard & Lydia Lunch  | C.V.O  |  Air Miami
Ultra Vivid Scene | Unrest | Pieter Nooten/Michael Brook | Swallow
That Dog. | Psychotic Tanks  |  Lisa Gerrard  | Last Dance |  Lush
Modern English |  Budd/Fraser/Guthrie/Raymonde |  This Mortal Coil   
The Wolfgang Press |  Richenel |  His Name Is Alive  | Pale Saints
The Glee Club    ---------------------------------    Colin Newman
                       "LONELY IS AN EYESORE"      


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 15:20:13 1996
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On Mon, 13 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> Wait a minute!  We don't wanna get too elaborate (and pass the added
> expense on to anyone).  We just want to provide coffee, in a choice of
> regular or unleaded, hot or decaf.  I think it would be a nice addition to
> the breakfast items that are served at some parties.  We'll see...
> 
> Powered by caffeine,
> 
> - E
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 15:22:22 1996
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I just did something random on here and I think I resent a message from 
Eric. Please ignore it. Apologies:)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 15:43:53 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, John_W._Stuart@livewire.com
Subject: Re: Harmony/Gateway/FnF proposition
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> and we would want to sell the coffee at a reasonable, easily affordable
> price.

Little bottles of water are sold for $2.00 at parties...  it's a rip off 
when you can get it at the Kwikie-Mart for 69 cents on the way there.  
Just as long as it's *really* reasonable.  Most coffee places are waaaaay 
too expensive...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 16:14:09 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 18:01:24 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: DUNE: The real story (fwd)
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Brad Burlingham wanted to set the record right so here is the real story.
Sorry to waste the bandwidth for all of those in the know.

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Mon, 13 May 96 15:48:42 PST
From: BRAD BURLINGHAM <brad_burlingham@studio.disney.com>
To: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
Subject: DUNE: The real story 

Hi Aleph,

Did you ever see a post from me w/ the header: DUNE the real story?

If not, would you mind forwarding it to sfraves.  for some reason i don't think
its gone through.

Thanks,

Brad

Hello friends to the north,

As you know by now, the slime show that is Hard Copy did a piece on a
desert rave last night.  A VERY negative piece.

The rave that they showed (with the exception of a few clips) was DUNE, a rave
put on by several socal ravers including myself.  We are deeply saddened that
the media (if you can call Hard Copy media) has once again choosen to
misrepresent our scene.

We are very, very proud of DUNE and feel you should hear the real story.

DUNE happened on March 23rd and was the brainchild of several people from the
socal raves list.  All involved in DUNE felt like they had gotten so much out of
the scene that we wanted to give something back. We were also fed up with greedy
promoters and an increase in the number of parties being busted.  

So, instead of bitching about it, we decided to take action. We accomplished
this by putting on an legal (not for profit) party in the desert with an amazing
atmosphere, spirituality and vibe.   Los Angeles' top DJ's (Christopher
Lawrence, Lee, Doran and Thee-O) understood what DUNE was about and volunteered
their substantial services.  We also hired one of LA's top sound companies to
provide 4 speaker stacks of the most amazing sound i've ever heard.

The party was 100% legal.  We worked closely with the Bureau of Land Management
to ensure that this party would not be busted.  We paid the overtime salaries
(not cheap) of 4 Sherriffs so that they could be at the party all night.  We
paid to have an ambulence at the party the entire time.  We wanted to show
ravers that not all authority figures are against us, while at the same time
proving to the Rangers that raves are not the evil parties that the media paints
them to be.  They were impressed with the party and days later, commented that
the site we used was cleaner than before we got there.

The location about 2.5 hours out of L.A. in the middle of the desert.  The site
was surrounded by an enormous U-shaped grouping of rocks that created a
spectacular natural rock ampatheather. We had two huge projection screens with
incredible visuals as well as lighting projected directly on the rocks and
ground.  

The party officially went from 11pm-noon (from 9-11 we let some djs from the
socal list spin) and we charged only $5 with the hope of possibly breaking even. 
Over 2,000 happy people showed up to help make it an incredible experience for
all.  To top it off, the comet was overhead and was mind-blowingly beautiful to
say the least (it was the size of the moon and the tail went 1/3 of the way
across the sky).

We encourage you to check out our website which now includes pictures and
reviews of the event. Http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen

Also, we hope to do another DUNE sometime in Sept., so if you'd like to be a
part of this positive event, send me an email and i'll put you on our mailing
list. We'd love to include our brothers and sisters from other cities in this
plurry event. 

Peace and don't believe the hype,

Brad 

ps thanks to the sf ravers that attended our event.  It was great having you
down in L.A.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 16:15:03 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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Yeah, Moshe and his buddy told us what happened.  It totally sucks!  Jess,
Renaud, Erik, and I passed through the trials of the bridge from SF to get
to the Marina (over an hour to cross the bridge!).  They must have gotten
there just after you left, and we got there after they'd looked all around
the Marina, and were sitting on a curb, not knowing what to do.  We all
kicked it there till the sun came up, Jess driving them home to Oakland and
then returning for the rest of us.
Hopes for much success with future parties in friendlier locales to you and
yours.  Keep your energy up!  We love that you did what you could, and hope
your losses were minimal.

Peace,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 16:38:38 1996
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From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Bad Rave PR coming to a theater near you! (fwd)
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More sad news. :(

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 16:12:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kc <sarahtonen@earthlink.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: Bad Rave PR coming to a theater near you!

This is in today's Hollywood Reporter....

ZIELINSKI, BOBER FIND 'ECSTASY'

by Rick Hanson

CANNES- Director Rafal Zielinski, whose "Fun" picked up two awards at the
Sundance Film Festival two years ago, is set to direct the techno-themed
'Ecstasy.'

Philippe Bober, a producer and sales agent with the Berlin based
Co-Production Office, described it as a tragic love story set in Berlin's
techno-music scene. Bober says he has begun putting together the financing
on the $2.5 million project.

'Ecstasy' concerns an aging classical musician who becomes tragically
obsessed with a 20-year-old woman. He lets her drag him into the dangerous
drug scene that surrounds techno music.






Sounds like we're gonna be misrepresented yet again.



-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 16:43:18 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 16:42:52 -0800
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Gay  Freedom Parade Story
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

I second all Leslie has to say about the Gay pride parade.  It's an amazing
event and you want to talk about vibe?!?!  Even without black lights and
posters, lasers or drugs, the rally is one of the most powerful events I've
every been to.  It's truly about life, liberty and the pursute of happiness
and non-prosecution.  For all people.

Imagine a sea of people all dancing to loud house music.  You can handle
that right, now double, triple, quadruple the largest rave you've ever been
to and that's what the end of the rally is like.  I climbed on a bus stop
to take a picture and as far as I could see there were people the entire
street wide in both directions dancing to the music (also did the hand wave
and had the most intense rush as all these people started waving their
hands in the air.).  It was an ocean of brothers and sister, all creeds,
colors, and orientations.  Freaks?!  Fuck yeah!  Nudity?  Some of that too.
Leather, piercings, tatoos, gratuitous displays of wild abandon?  Yup, and
then some!

I can understand if you're uncomfortable, Eric, but let me assure you this
wouldn't be like walking into a gay bar for the first time.  It's much more
profound than that.

I will help organize a SFR meeting place, but would be far more into
supporting/helping organize Vince's idea of putting together a float (It's
late to start that now).  Maybe we could even try and get one of our
favotrite DJs to spin (the street party), but I'd be suprised if they
didn't have DJs already lined up.  In fact, it might be super hard to get
into the parade.  Anyone involved with the rally in here?

Peace!

Tone

P.S.  In terms of numbers, I think about 300,000 people might go to the
rally (probably more), and I'd say that about (guessing here) 50,000 are
dancing in the street after the parade.  Little ole you Eric, will not
stand out as a lone hetrosexual male in the group, I promise.  Hell, I'll
be there and I'm straight, but if you want, I'll hold your hand to make you
feel more comfortable.  ;^)  (J/J)

At 3:26 PM  -0400 5/13/96, Leslie Ayres wrote:
>Vince said:
>>This might be more appropriate for the Gay Freedom Day Parade, where we
>>could drive it in the back of a truck and wouldn't be in such a mob scene.
>>
>>It's also much shorter, like a couple miles instead of 7.5 miles.
>>
>>just  a thought,
>>
>>Vince
>
>And Eric replied:
>
>I'm hoping that such an activity will take place at an event I can support
>in good concience, instead of the above example, which represents something
>I'm very torn on...
>
>Non-judgmental but feelin' funny,
>
>- E
>_______________________________________________
>
>Here's my short story.  Preface:  I'm straight, but all three of my best male
>friends are gay.
>
>Three years ago, I was invited by a friend to dance on the Sisters of
>Perpetual
>Indulgence float at the Parade -- If you don't know them, this is a wild and
>wonderful group of gay men who dress in outrageous campy nun-drag and party a
>lot -- they also support a wide range of gay community causes and issues, and
>they're a cool and playful (obviously) group.
>
>I had never even BEEN to the parade, but I dressed in my craziest costume
>(which
>was a lot less crazy than it would be now!), and had the TIME OF MY LIFE!  We
>had loud speakers, awesome music, and as we travelled down the road, people
>yelled and smiled and danced with us, I LOVED IT!  The energy at this even is
>amazing, total happiness and freedom being felt by people, many of whom live
>their lives with caution and criticism, out partying with abandonment and
>joy.
>
>The past two years, I've gone and volunteered for a while, then partied,
>danced
>in the street, and I have to say met amazing people -- I met my best
>friend Sara
>at the parade two years ago (you may have met her yesterday at Harmony or
>at the
>SFR picnic with me) on a day that was a life-changing experience for me  --
>
>To know about the parade:  1. Not everyone is gay -- it's not about being
>gay to
>be there, it's about supporting people's freedom to be who they are, and
>2. The
>vibe is happy and upbeat, like a big smilin' community ....
>
>Plus, as I hope we all know, there are a lot of gay ravers out there, and
>we're
>all part of the same family! If we had a float or a marching/dancing group on
>foot (and honestly I don't know if there's a huge bureaurcratic process in
>order
>to even get in), we could make a sign that shows support of freedom in
>general,
>not specifically for sexual orientation -- something that represents all
>of us,
>straight/gay/bi/abstinent whatever!
>
>Whichever we do, Bay to Breakers or Gay Pride, I'm happy to partipate!
>
>Leslie  : )     Dance on!




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 17:08:16 1996
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Message-ID: <3197CF34.29ADB4E4@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 17:09:24 -0700
From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Organization: r e g e n e r a t i o n  X
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (X11; I; Linux 1.99.2 i586)
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Subject: *madness* review
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hey everybody! after reading the reviews of madness, i felt obliged to
add my comments on it too. i agree with most people that the vibe was
good. i was glad that there were no circle dancers. i wish that my ride
had decided to stay until the end so that i could heave enjoyed the
finale. i was too pumped up to leave but had to. the ambient(ish) set in
the middle at around 3 a.m. was excellent chill out kind of music but
hard to dance to. the wait for more danceable music paid off as soon as
the jungle like beats kicked in. i hope that i will attend more raves
with a crowd of this sort. this was the best indoor party that i have
ever been to. was glad to meet crunch again after f-8. hope to see some
of you at Sprockets on wednesday in san jose. 


love 
dhiren & ionX

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 17:13:25 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 17:12:47 -0700 (PDT)
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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>Date: 13 May 96 17:52:35 EDT
>From: "Norman L. Goody, MD" <71623.3404@CompuServe.COM>
>To: "\"FIONA.J.CORBETT\"" <9055674@iona.sms.ed.ac.uk>
>Cc: Lorraine Adler <AdlerL@otsp.psb.bls.gov>,
>        Cathy Cooper <clc2e@virginia.edu>, Robin Curhan <curhan@travcorps.com>,
>        mike dangerfield/CIS <102043.3411@CompuServe.COM>,
>        "David Vener, MD" <73354.3372@CompuServe.COM>,
>        Michael Levin- digdc <michael@digitaldc.com>,
>        Brian Shafer- digdc <brian@digitaldc.com>,
>        Maya Draisin <maya@radiomail.net>, Erin Foley <lucifer@his.com>,
>        jeremy goody <jnice@slip.net>, Willi Hart <willih@as.ucsb.edu>,
>        "INTERNET:LocoCycles@aol." <LocoCycles@aol.com>,
>        Chase Langford <langford@geog.sscnet.ucla.edu>,
>        Sherilyn Smith <ssmit1@u.washington.edu>,
>        Jon Zimmerman <Bigz@bigz.com>
>Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
>
>
>---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
>From:   Nelson Spruston, INTERNET:spruston@nwu.edu
>TO:     Norman L. Goody, MD, 71623,3404
>        (unknown), INTERNET:JSMITH@DENVER.LIB.CO.US
>        (unknown), INTERNET:JOHNSOND@MERLE.ACNS.NWU.EDU
>        (unknown), INTERNET:FERSTER@NWU.EDU
>        (unknown), INTERNET:BMENSH@SUPERLINK.NET
>        (unknown), INTERNET:SPRUSTON@UCLINK.BERKELEY.EDU
>DATE:   5/13/96 10:15 AM
>
>RE:     Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
>
>Sender: spruston@nwu.edu
>Received: from lulu.acns.nwu.edu (lulu.acns.nwu.edu [129.105.16.54]) by
>dub-img-7.compuserve.com (8.6.10/5.950515)
>        id JAA18854; Mon, 13 May 1996 09:59:59 -0400
>Received: from [129.105.41.23] (dendrite.nbp.nwu.edu) by lulu.acns.nwu.edu
>with SMTP
>        (1.37.109.18/20.4) id AA121185991; Mon, 13 May 1996 08:59:51 -0500
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>Message-Id: <v01530502adbcf0274b76@[129.105.41.23]>
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 08:59:53 -0500
>To: jsmith@denver.lib.co.us, johnsond@merle.acns.nwu.edu, ferster@nwu.edu,
>        "Norman L. Goody, MD" <71623.3404@compuserve.com>,
>        bmensh@superlink.net, spruston@uclink.berkeley.edu
>From: spruston@nwu.edu (Nelson Spruston)
>Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
>
>>I am sorry to bother you with this, but I think it's important.
>>
>>Please vote.
>>
>>Nelson
>>
>>>  ------- Forwarded Message Follows -------
>>>
>>> "Just yesterday B'nai B'rith's annual report (Canada) on
>>> hate and racism located the net as the one source of
>>> exploding and uncontrollable dissemination of hate mail.
>>> I feel strongly that every NO vote on the formation of a
>>> neo-Nazi newsgroup is a public and civilized blow
>>> against a pernicious, evil movement. Please vote to
>>> affirm society's rejection of neo-Nazis.  Please
>>> distribute the following message as you deem
>>> appropriate.
>>>
>>> A group of neo-nazis are trying to form a newsgroup on
>>> Usenet called rec.music.white-power, so that they can
>>> get their message of hate out to young people using the
>>> Internet.  Newsgroups are public discussion areas on the
>>> Internet and their formation requires enough support
>>> from the Internet community.
>>>
>>> EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU HAS ONE VOTE when it comes to
>>> creating a new Usenet group. I hope you will vote NO and
>>> thereby tell these Nazis you don't want their stuff on
>>> the net. Below is the procedure, please repost my plea
>>> and get the NO vote out.   This is my personal opinion.
>>> If you want to see the official call for votes, you can
>>> read in news.group or ask me for a copy of the notice
>>> calling for votes.
>>>
>>> Do not vote twice - that would constitute voting fraud.
>>>
>>> HOW TO VOTE:
>>>
>>> Send E-MAIL (posts to a newsgroup are invalid) to:
>>>
>>>         music-vote@sub-rosa.com
>>>
>>> This is an impartial, third-party vote taker.
>>>
>>> Do not REPLY to THIS message, if you are trying to vote.
>>>  Please do not assume that just replying to this message
>>> will work. Check the address before you mail your vote.
>>> Your mail message should contain only one statement:
>>>
>>>         I vote NO on rec.music.white-power
>>>
>>> I REALLY HOPE YOU VOTE NO!
>>>
>>> Vote counting is automated.  Failure to follow these
>>> directions may mean that your vote does not get counted.
>>>  If you do not receive an acknowledgment of your vote
>>> within three days contact the votetaker about the
>>> problem.  It's your responsibility to make sure your
>>> vote is registered correctly.
>>>
>>> Here's what Canada's George Burdi, of the neo-Nazi
>>> Heritage Front, had to say about this vote, on February
>>> 21, on his RESISTANCE mailing list:
>>>
>>>         "There is a call for votes         coming on
>>>         rec.music.white-power in the next         week
>>>         or so, and you will be notified in a
>>>         special issue of RREN exactly what to do.
>>>           FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS TO THE LETTER.  Let me
>>>                 be perfectly blunt and state that we
>>>         have more         than enough "net-nazis" to win
>>>         this thing         hands-down. But every one of
>>>         you must vote YES!
>>>          And just voting yes means nothing unless you
>>>               do it properly.
>>>         So you have been forewarned.          The
>>>         instructions are coming to your email box
>>>          soon, and they are not complicated.  Just
>>>            follow them as told, and we will have a WP
>>>                 music newsgroup
>>>         finally!"
>>>
>>> If Mr. Burdi's confidence disturbs you, please give this
>>> letter the _widest_ possible distribution, and help us
>>> deliver the largest NO vote in the history of UseNet. If
>>> you would like more detailed information on why you
>>> should vote no, check out http://nizkor.almanac.bc.ca -
>>> although it should be noted that the Nizkor Project has
>>> no connection to this personal plea."
>>>
>>> Gary Romalis
>>>
>>>
>>>                 /::::::::|  MK2ENG@BOLTON.AC.UK
>>>                 |:::::::::::\ |: "always look on the
>>>                 bright side of life" :| \::::::::|
>>>                 MK2ENG@BOLTON.AC.UK  |:::::::::::/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---End of forwarded mail from heinrich@up4u0a.gwdg.de
>>>
>
>
>
>

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 17:26:16 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605140018.RAA15389@netcom7.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: coffee station
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 17:18:34 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140b19adbcfba657cf@[146.225.72.168]> from "Eric P. Peterson" at May 13, 96 02:48:19 pm
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In reaction to my enthusiactic post , Eric said:
> 
> Wait a minute!  We don't wanna get too elaborate (and pass the added
> expense on to anyone).  We just want to provide coffee, in a choice of
> regular or unleaded, hot or decaf.  

 Those basic items sound good enough for me! My apologies for getting
carried away ....

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 17:27:01 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Bjork on the beach
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Bjork is Bjeautiful!  That was awesome hearing snips of "Human Behaviour",
and I hope to hear more of this kind of thing in the future.  Whoever mixed
that, you rule!!!

Peace,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 17:36:07 1996
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Message-Id: <199605140035.RAA23500@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
To: Michael <Michael.Minnich@bankamerica.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, ausman@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU
Subject: Re: madness 
In-reply-to: Your message of "13 May 1996 14:41:31 -0800."
             <05139614413801125100.bankamerica.com> 
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 17:35:39 -0700
From: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

>
>Madness.  This was a great party in a number of ways and yet it never really
>hit critical mass for me.

Ditto. I actually would have liked a few more people there. I really liked
the crowd, even though it was a bit "freaky". To tell you the truth, I prefer
a crowd with a bit of an "edge" like that. I loved BP, but sometimes all
the sweetness makes me feel sticky.

>I will attest to the earlier reports of the crowd being
>"weird".  I couldn't quite put my finger on it either.

Well, as one of my friends reminded me there (was it you Troy?):
"The name of the party _is_ Madness."

I stayed until 5:30 AM when some guy in the chill room told me to look
into his eyes and he would "read me". He sung some freaky songs into my 
ears and looked into my eyes and told me far more about me than any stranger
should be able to tell. Or so I thought at the time. It freaked me out
enough that I left. But it was time anyway.

This party was kind of a breakthrough for me in that I really wanted to go,
but couldn't contact any friends beforehand. So I decided to go not knowing
if anyone I knew would be there for sure. Of course, I knew something like
20 people there and had a great time. That was cool. Thanks to all of you
that went for helping make it happen!

Peace,
Jim

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 17:40:11 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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Here we go again!  If you must vote, the only good vote is a yes.  But only
if you believe in freedom of speech...  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 17:47:11 1996
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Message-Id: <199605140047.RAA24621@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
To: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, ausman@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU
Subject: Re: surpising madness review 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 13 May 1996 08:30:28 PDT."
             <Pine.3.89.9605130827.A9134-0100000@saclink1.csus.edu> 
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 17:46:43 -0700
From: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
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>
>Sorry I didn't geta chance to meet and talk to new sfravers.  I just 
>wasn't into it that night - I wasn't feeling very social and would not 
>want to have brought any of you down.  I did love the space and the 
>decorations - especially the big tent on that ledge and the colorful 
>poster nearest the bathroom.
>
I am glad I got a chance to talk to you. And you definitely didn't bring
me down. But that is like trying to bring down a cloud, anyway.

Hugs,
Jim A.

PS I will miss having you around, but I certainly understand the need to
"take a break." I only really started raving in January, but I am already
doing it less and less. It is hard to go out and expend that much energy
every weekend.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 17:56:32 1996
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From: "Fred Heutte" <phred@well.com>
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 17:42:21 -0700
In-Reply-To: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
        "mad." (May 13,  9:45am)
References: <199605131645.JAA12218@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
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I think there's a misunderstanding about the "Detroit sound."  Detroit 
producers put plenty of funk and house in their tracks because it's part
of what they come from.  I certainly hear those influences in tracks by
Jeff Mills, Red Planet, Aux 88, Octave One and the other Detroit material
coming out now, not to mention Richie Hawtin who is closely allied with
the Detroit sound but has his own unique direction.

If anything, Chicago seems to have lost a lot of the funky feel, although
it seems to be coming back now with a resurgence led by Glenn Underground
and Cajmere.  But for a while, it seemed like every Chicago track with
the word "funk" in it had nothing of the sort.  At least not to these
ears, trained in the art of the funk by Professor James Brown and Doctor
George Clinton.

phred

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 18:15:53 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 18:13:54 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: For anybody who's interested:
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Hey all!

I remember noting a while back that people were curious as to the number of
subscribers on this list.  For those of you who might be interested (& also
don't know how), I just found out that you can actually obtain a complete
list of everybody who is currently subscribed by sending an email to
majordomo@hyperreal.com with
WHO SFRAVES typed in the body of the message.  It popped right back with a
complete list within minutes of me sending it off!  


Love,
Shawna




"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 18:21:08 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 18:20:55 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Richie Hawtin, was Re: mad.
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Spake Phred:
>of what they come from.  I certainly hear those influences in tracks by
>Jeff Mills, Red Planet, Aux 88, Octave One and the other Detroit material
>coming out now, not to mention Richie Hawtin who is closely allied with
>the Detroit sound but has his own unique direction.



Speaking of Richie Hawtin, when I was in Montreal I missed hearing Richie
Hawtin spin by 1-2 weeks, which kinda bummed me out.  Does anybody know if
this fella *ever* does anything in the Bay Area?  Would *love* to check that
out! :)


Love,
Shawna




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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 19:00:05 1996
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From: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199605140156.SAA04392@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: just a little random thing
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 18:56:01 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.16.19960512235521.2707073c@popd.ix.netcom.com> from "hey, where am I?" at May 13, 96 06:20:55 pm
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Hey everybody,

today I gave my phd dissertation to my committee, and in two weeks i'll 
get it back and then...I'll be done with graduate school forever!!!!

Then you can call me:

Dr. Ann Loraine


Love and kisses,

anthrax


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 19:13:29 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 19:13:25 -0700
Message-Id: <199605140213.TAA05313@moon.sirius.com>
Subject: Valence / Movement tonight
From: Jim Grady <jim@aeonmedia.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Monday May 13, 10pm-2am
Valence is throwing Movement at Bahia Cabana,
1600 Market @ Franklin
$3 cover, 18+

DJs:

Graeme
Mars
Julio

Sound:

EAW 4x15 subs
EAW 880 tops

See you there,
Jim


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 19:20:22 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 19:19:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Richie Hawtin, was Re: mad.
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I believe he is still banned entry into the U.S....  something to do with
a work permit or somesuch.  He'll see his day in court soon, tho, and get 
back into the fray.


		-jon




On Mon, 13 May 1996, hey, where am I? wrote:

> Spake Phred:
> >of what they come from.  I certainly hear those influences in tracks by
> >Jeff Mills, Red Planet, Aux 88, Octave One and the other Detroit material
> >coming out now, not to mention Richie Hawtin who is closely allied with
> >the Detroit sound but has his own unique direction.
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking of Richie Hawtin, when I was in Montreal I missed hearing Richie
> Hawtin spin by 1-2 weeks, which kinda bummed me out.  Does anybody know if
> this fella *ever* does anything in the Bay Area?  Would *love* to check that
> out! :)
> 
> 
> Love,
> Shawna
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."
>   
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> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 19:22:47 1996
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Message-Id: <199605140222.TAA03364@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
To: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: URGENT: Call Hard Copy!/Tape Available 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 11 May 1996 16:01:19 PDT."
             <Pine.SOL.3.91.960511153726.4815A-100000@orion> 
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 19:22:22 -0700
From: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
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Thank you for all the effort and time you put into researching those 
phone numbers and all. I will call and let them know what I think!

>	I want them to understand that a pack of lies, stereotypes, and 
>dangerously wrong images like Hard Copy broadcast about us is the 
>equivalent of them doing a segment on black welfare mothers eating 
>watermelons and fried chicken, shooting crack, and getting pregnant; i.e. 
>being prejudiced against our scene is as wrong as being racist.

Um, no. A raver can change his spots.

Peace,
Jim A.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 19:45:30 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 19:45:54 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Superstah 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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>>>> I REALLY HOPE YOU VOTE NO!
it's a freedom of speech thing. if you hated the cda, then you have no
choice but to vote yes. better to not vote at all.
have you ever seen how someone posting large binaries uuencoded into
millions of parts can disrupt a newsgroup? i seriously doubt that the group
will ever have any impact. it will either A) escalate into a huge flame war
on every issue
B) get censored by everyone
C) get spammed so badly that I) sysadmins have no choice but to drop the
group due to bandwidth concerns  II) it renders the group unreadable  III)
it gets flooded so badly that messages are lost, destroying the threads.
so, there really isn't anything to worry about.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 20:05:30 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Limiting the number of tickets sold
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PROMOTERS:  The last two really good raves I went to, the promoters set a 
predetermined limit on the number of tickets to be sold and advertised this 
number.  Then both times less people showed up than anticipated.  In the 
case of Mad, this seemed to result in a rather thin turn-out.  I have a 
theory about the reason, and it goes like this:

Limiting the number of tickets is a GREAT idea -- there's nothing worse than 
going to a rave that's overcrowded -- but you might specify a number that's 
about 200 more than you really want.  See, when there's a limit, I think 
people assume that after a certain hour the party will be sold out, so they 
don't bother to go.  If the promoter had based the price on that number so 
as to come out even, s/he may end up losing money due to the poor turnout.

Just a thought.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 20:05:37 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 20:04:54 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Review: Mad
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Another Mad review (long):

The situation: 
        Saturday night
        My entire crew missing in action (read "flaked")
        Three hamsters missing in action (read "liberated by a friend's 
children")
       
Psychological condition:
        Less than favorable (read "crappy mood")

The disguise:
        Black baggies
        white t-shirt
        Fimo medallion with a smiley on one side and "SFR" on the other
        A red and white Dr. Seuss hat

Additional equipment:
        Grapes
        Lotion
        Tums
        Water
        Stickers
        Camera and several rolls of film
        etc.

The mission, should I choose to accept it:
        To locate a large group of indigenous rabble and assist them in
        releasing as much energy as possible via ritualistic rhythmic
        undulation of bodies, hugs, massages, and large grins.

The phone burst into flames five seconds after the voice message completed.  
I removed my wetsuit and got into my disguise.  Don't ask what I was doing 
in a wetsuit.  I chose to accept the mission.  It was either that or 
continue watching the Nick at Night "Mission Impossible" marathon...

I snuck off into the night, alone, late.  I was pretty sure I'd miss out 
since it was 12:30 by the time I found the map point.  I was in luck -- 
tickets were still available.  I was actually giggling to myself as I drove 
off to find the space.

I showed up and was immediately greeted by SFR friends with big grins.  It 
was GREAT!  I saw so many people I knew and met so many more from this list, 
all so friendly, all feeling good and having a good time.

Folks, I have to take a moment and make special mention: My vote for "Raver 
'O The Week" goes to the ever wonderful Shawna McGourty.  In spite of all 
the friendly faces, when I first got there, I was having a bit of trouble 
shaking the horrible week I'd had.  She took care of me and made sure I had 
a *superb* evening, for which I definitely owe her big time. 

As the evening wore on, I danced...and danced...and danced...  geez, I was 
there until after they closed everything down -- a first for me -- and even 
helped pull down some of the decorations in the chill space.  I was a 
bouncing ball of energy, turning all the negative energy from a seriously 
bad week into positive party energy.  YES!!!

COOL MOMENT: Watching the screen in the chill space and seeing, among the 
acid visuals, the silhouettes of two women doing a rather exotic dance.  
Went back inside and saw that it was actually two women dancing in the beam 
of light from the camera.  WOW!  They were good.  I joined them a couple of 
times, but geez, my body just don't move like that...

COOL MOMENT: I don't know who the DJ was, but someone was putting together 
such good jams, the crowd starting getting *noisy*.  I was all over the place...

COOL MOMENT: Wayne: "Can you give me a ride?"

COOL MOMENT: Watching Rikki dancing with glo-sticks.  *Very* cool!

COOL MOMENT: Passing out grapes the next morning.  I put smiles on a lot of 
faces!

COOL MOMENT: Just about every hug I got was a cool moment unto itself, and I 
got a bunch!

COOL MOMENT: Adam (aka R.Lunatic) and I running around with our Dr. Seuss 
hats.  Hey, it was just plain fun being such a goof.  I was skipping and 
jumping and running and being a total kid.

COOL MOMENT: The owner got out and danced with us a couple of times.  This 
guy was doing a kind of James Brown shuffle thing that was cool!  Ya gotta 
like someone that jumps out and parties with the kiddies, flashing just as 
big a smile as any raver.

COOL MOMENT: Smiling and getting instant smiles back!

COOL MOMENT: Aw heck, there's too many to name...  I'll add this though: 
cramps in my legs.  What's that you say?  Cramps don't sound like a cool 
moment?  Well, by that time it was 7:30am and it was my body telling me it 
was getting close to spent.  I have never danced quite that much.  WOW!

FUNNY MOMENT: Sneaking up on Tim (Knucklehead) as he slept in a large, 
comfortable looking chair, removing all his clothes, posing him in lurid 
positions with a couple of squirrels and a glo-stick, and taking pictures!  
Got his clothes back on and he didn't even wake up!  Soon as I get those 
developed I'll post them on a new Web page...

WELL DONE:  Free water and juice.  Danishes too, which looked *yummy*, but I 
wasn't up for any...  There was also fruit cocktail available, equally yummy 
looking.  Plenty of toilets, plenty of indoor chill space, *wonderful* 
outdoor space with tables, chairs, and even a couple of love seats!  Art 
work from Beautiful People, including that fantastic sun & moon painting, 
hung inside and outside.  I hope we get to use that space again!!!

WEIRD CHARACTERS:  Yeah, there were a few people there that I suspect had 
access to far better chemicals than most.  But then, most parties have a few 
of those.  I just leave them to explore the modified world they've created 
and wander back into the dance space.

If there was a downside to this party, it was the weird ambient stuff that 
came on late in the party.  For me at least, it just wasn't danceable.  So I 
hung outside and waited for it to change, which of course gave me time to 
meet more people.  I'm not saying it was bad, in fact it was good music, 
just not very danceable in my case.

I had a damn good time and I've got the pictures to prove it...  And I'll 
give up the negatives for the right price...

I did have a good time, and I feel bad for those that didn't.  If I'd found 
you, I'd have done all I could to bring you up to my level, promise.  

NEXT TIME: The next time you're at a rave and you're having trouble getting 
with the groove, come find me.  If I have energy and a smile to spare, 
you've got it.

I would name off all the people I met and saw, but dang, there were so many! 
 I love you all!  Hasta, kiddies...

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 20:17:26 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 19:12:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: Monty <audiotek@priscilla.ultima.org>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: JL Transmission V.3/Beach party in SB
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.91.960513190251.9216F-100000@priscilla.ultima.org>
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begin transmission.....
	the Justice League Sound System will be doing another beach 
party, known as Horizon, this weekend, May 18th.  the weather is destined 
to be gorgeous down there this weekend and we intend on celebrating that 
fact to the fullest, as Justice League DJ's Kamahele, Joe Rice, Ray 
Shomon, Monty, and Paula bring you a broad, finely mixed collection of 
some of the best in House, Techno, Trance and beyond.  for more info, and 
directions, please call 805.899.7336, or feel free to email myself or Joe 
Rice.  
end transmission....... 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 20:58:21 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 20:58:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jessica Robin Berkson <berky@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Harmony at the beach...
To: Monty <audiotek@priscilla.ultima.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.3.91.960513190251.9216F-100000@priscilla.ultima.org>
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hello there all- I'm a sort of new subscriber to the list- I just didn't 
want to mail until I'd been to another party and remembered how wonderful 
it all was...Harmony was beautiful- and watching the sunset go down with 
all of the happy people that were there- it was incredible!!  Yay to Harmony!
I love you guys- you've done it again!

-jess (the bubble girl )
;)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 21:19:54 1996
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From: GITANE <Gitane@cris.com>
To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>
Cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Gay  Freedom Parade Story
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unfortunately for the purposes of putting a float in the parade the
application date just passed (was May 10), though I'm planning to 
park my motorhome as close to the staging/celebration area the night
before and have a super vantage point to party all day! 







                                                


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 21:39:03 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 21:38:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140b2dadbd2444e2c4@[146.225.72.168]>
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I second that!


On Mon, 13 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> Here we go again!  If you must vote, the only good vote is a yes.  But only
> if you believe in freedom of speech...  - E
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 21:44:17 1996
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From: jonas@hunab-ku.com
To: SFRaves@hyperreal.com
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 21:40:16 +0000
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CC: resonant@hunab-ku.com
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 jus' checkin!    :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 22:42:48 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:45:52 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Raves in SF, The NEGATIVE "Experience"
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Hiya All;

        I was hanging outside Experience where some of my fav DJ's were
spinning, Mars, & Eric. So why was I out side; because it was so hot inside.
I eventually got tired of the negative tweekee children/staff causing chaos
inside & out ruining it for everyone. Also, the fact that one of our other
promoters called the police on the party; which in my book unless there's a
risk of loss of life, limb, or property that this should never happen.

        I'm personally fed up with all ages events, and am never ever going
to another one again, with the exception of  these few
people/groups/promoters C^3, Frequency 8, Compound I, Full Moon, New Moon,
SPAZ and Harmony.

        Between the gangs, the children, the poor venues and the sociopathic
greedy promoters that over crowd these venues, that I'm more than happy to
be over charged by the clubs. At least they have  HVAC(heating, ventilation,
and air conditioning system).

        Ya now what does it take to purchase a few industrial grade
fans/blowers?    I'll tell ya, a promoters who's more concerned about the
people attending the event, than their pocket books. I'm sorry SF, because
we just don't have that kind of promoter here.

        You can get multiple such devices from any building supply house for
a couple of hundred dollars, and/or rent them from equipment rental places.
Ya now the same places you get your generators from. I'll be happy to
purchase them myself and make them available to our promoters for a deposit
and a very small fee if I have a written commitment from our promoters
saying they will use them. But it will never ever happen, because most of
our promoters would rather purchase a stupid flashing light that no one will
notice because they can rent that to another promoter.

Totally Disgusted With The Greed & Lack of Concern
THX1138



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 22:43:53 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:43:47 -0700
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
From: Tim (knucklehead) <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: Review: Mad
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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SDream wrote :

>FUNNY MOMENT: Sneaking up on Tim (Knucklehead) as he slept in a large,
>comfortable looking chair, removing all his clothes, posing him in lurid
>positions with a couple of squirrels and a glo-stick, and taking pictures!
>Got his clothes back on and he didn't even wake up!  Soon as I get those
>developed I'll post them on a new Web page...
>

Boy I'd like to see them too :)

Tim (knucklehead)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 22:53:55 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:50:26 -0700
Message-Id: <199605140550.WAA09058@dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: surpising madness review 
To: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>
>PS I will miss having you around, but I certainly understand the need 
to
>"take a break." I only really started raving in January, but I am 
already
>doing it less and less. It is hard to go out and expend that much 
energy
>every weekend.
>

I'm taking a break now.. Uggh.. I've been going at it for FOUR weeks in 
a row now... I think I'm going to calm down.. =)~ make next week.. hehe

Adam
                    R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 22:55:11 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:55:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: UCSC FREE RAVE = for all
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605102143.OAA22727@ns.mauswerks.com>
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All right...

Join us for "Oracle" @ the UCSC campus May 31st.
dance area and ambient chill zone
for more info. write to mhg@cats.ucsc.edu

don't forget...it's FREE

      ___                ___           ___     
     /\__\              /\__\         /\  \    
    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
   /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
  /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
 /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
 \/__/~~/:/  /      \/__\:\/:/  / \:\  /\ \/__/
       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    











    







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 23:29:29 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 23:32:47 -0700
Message-Id: <199605140632.XAA19363@dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Harmony's Beach Party
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey everybody, by the way. There was this guy who was taking ALOT of 
pictures at the beach party on Sunday. Make sure it doesn't get on HARD 
COPY. Hehe.

         Adam
                        

                        R.Lunatic

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 23:45:21 1996
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From: moonpup@hooked.net (DJ Moonpup)
Subject: testing 1,2,3
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mary had a little lamb as smelly as her ass, and everywhere that mary went
she smoked up lots of grass....



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 23:50:22 1996
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 23:51:26 -0700
From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Organization: r e g e n e r a t i o n  X
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To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
CC: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: socializing at raves 
References: <Pine.3.89.9605131304.B14921-0100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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> Rhea says,
> > Raves have been such a big learning experience for me,showing me
> > that perspective seems to be what lets us get outside confining social
> > structures in the first place.
> 
> Words to live by!! :)
> 
> -kaysee

After reading the post , I can say that it best describes my feelings
of the beauty of raving and am glad someone has the ability to express
them in words.

Great post-> Rhea and KaySEE

Hugs,
ionX

PS. A rave is the celebration of the continuity of incredible change.
-- my 2 cents for today

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 23:57:59 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 23:56:09 -0700 (PDT)
Message-Id: <199605140656.XAA04433@worm.hooked.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: San Francisco people are Great!
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    I just wanted to say that the vibe I get from this city is awesome!  I
love to be able to smile at random people on the street and not get a "What
the fuck are you looking at" return look... but an even bigger smile back! 
 
  And during my first week here I met some truely beautiful people...  
 
Renaud "The Frenchman" is even cooler than I first thought (considering he
ditched me on our apartment agreement).   And he's actually as funny as he
thinks he is. 
 
Then I met Brendan... Only a minute after I posted my "don't know shit in
San Fran", he called me up and wanted to show me around Haight street. 
Holy shit was I surprised!  And I had a hell of a time.  Thanks Brendan. 
 
  And thanks for introducing me to the energy goddess herself, Jess.  When
she's partying she holds the key to ecstasy.  An awesome woman.  She's
definately one of a kind! (Partying while attending Med school?  Didn't
know it was possible) 
 
Then there's Eric Peterson.  I always wanted to meet the "10 posts a day
makes my work day go faster" man.   A beautiful person--Ask him for a
hug... you won't be disappointed. 
 
Later on at Bass Instinct I met Leslie (who I will definately be partying
with in the future.  She just eminated beautiful vibes!) and Albert and
others who I can't remember their names, sorry.  I RARELY forget faces,
though. 
 
The SFravers are beautiful people.  I can only imagine what the Beautiful
People party was like (I hadn't arrived yet.  I've only heard the
testimony).  And I look forward to meeting you all.   Don't hesitate to
call me up.  
 
**IMPORTANT!  READ DISCLAIMER** 
These words were NOT written by moonpup 
He's in London until late August 
 
...and I'm ERIK.  I'll be using his address until then 
415-337-6666  Address all comments, rebuttals, love or hate letters to me,
ERIK 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 13 23:58:33 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: moonpup@hooked.net (DJ Moonpup)
Subject: I think I have contact !!!
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Hi folks,

 I finally found my old friend Rick Webb, and he has helped me out by
letting me use his labtop, so I can communicate with the world, (finally)

I have felt so cut off from my comfort zone, since arriving, as I don't
have daily access to a computer, but now I should be able to check in about
once every week or so.

To any one who complains that there's not enuff trance and techno in S.F.
you should come to London........techno and trance are in major abundance
here.....

here's a basic rundown of some of the shit I've done and heard so far.

Day one.....arrived at noon...no hassles with customs....(to bad I didn't
bring massive amounts of head wear......)    first shock.....prices and
cost to travel.   unfucking believable......I have spent 1/2 my $$ in the
first 10 days of my trip.....bummer....but needed.

day two.....went to my first club....MEGATRIPOLIS thurs nites in Charring Cross.
loads of shit happenin there.........interactive computer area, drum room,
triphop room, main room- (Derrick May played), some guys bring two crates
of records, and a turntable and you can check out and buy records, right
there in the club......cool idea.....

lots of interesting things to do. a massage area, lots of toys to play
with, and most of all loads of people going off......many happy ravers
here.

I have noticed several major differences here, one is how much smoking goes
on here.....to much for my poor little eyes and lungs, and major drinking
going on.

heavy alcahol vibe......loads of smoke machines, it's like walking in a
constant fog.......but I gotta say, a bigger % of people are appearing to
have a great time, lots of smiley happy people.  however when you leave a
club atmosphere, you find the people on the streets to be very sad and make
very little eye contact and smiles are rarely exchanged. I miss that about
S.F

lots of drunken ass holes who abuse womens energy with typical male ego and
neanderthal attitudes.....

however in the clubs, It's completely different. happy smiles and good
vibes all around.

Day three......mostly rested and found some soccer shirts and just kicked
it around the city.

Day four......I woke up at 5am and went out to visit my old haunting
grounds. for those that don't know, I was born and grew up in London, and
moved to America when I was 12 years old, so I went to visit my old
neighborhood and schools etc......very spiritual......I must have walked 15
or more miles that day......I totally exausted my poor old feet, they hurt
for over a week after that (all that walking on concrete).......The Days
are long as hell here......it begins to get light out at 4:45 in the
morning, and if your walking home through a park or something you can
really relate to the orb samples of birds singing and chirping away,(like
on fluffy clouds etc...) thats something I take for granted in S.F.there
are so many different kinds of song birds here.....it's beautiful.....it
stays light out till 9:30 at night, hella long ass days....I didn't realize
how much further north I am, in fact the sun comes up in my bedroom window,
does a horseshoe manuver over my house to the front, and then back to set
in my bedroom window again. It's alost like living in the north pole.

I went to a brilliant underground club called DELIVERANCE, it was a full on
wharehouse party with 3 rooms of total trance and techno.....and people
were goin bonkers.....I personally found it to be to much, I mean if you
are tired of 160 bpm all nite and you want to chill out and find mellower
music (house, ambient,triphop etc....) forget it......all three rooms were
playing 160+ all nite long...........even at 5:30am.........no rest for the
wicked, but again I emphasize......tons of happy people enjoying the
vibe........It is so energizing and fresh to see locals enjoying local DJ's
play the music, it is an infectious feeling, and I find myself to be very
happy, and content. I am so glad I came........It's awsome to get a
different perspective, in fact it's life saving. I recomend everyone come
check it out.......you will learn so much about what is right and wrong
about the S.F scene.....as well as learn how lucky you are to live in a
relatively friendly atmosphere (on the streets).

Day five........I left deliverance at about 8:30am and went to chelsea, I
bought a ticket to a soccer match, and later in the day I saw chelsea play
Blackburn rovers.....cool game, (except Chelsea lost 3-2). I eventually
passed out and finally got some sleep......

Day six........slept all day.....well needed rest


Day seven......went out and started to look for a job, (yes I'll be broke
in 2-3 weeks if I'm not careful)......

Day eight.......I found an old family friend who runs a recording studio,
and he ordered me some cassetes at bulk rate prices (tapes cost an arm and
a leg, not to mention your first born).......and I have been dubbing off
tapes as fast as I can give them out......I got my first booking for june
7th at Mr C's club.."THE END" I am totally stoked.......TripHop is just
beginning to take off here, I could'nt have picked a better time to come
.........

day nine.......interviewed for a job as a bartender and I think I got
hired....only bummer is I have to shave my beard off......I love my stoopid
beard, it's so full now, but I guess I'd rather be hairless than pennyless.

Day ten.......off to Megatripolis again and finally by chance found my
friend Rick Webb hanging out......thus I now have a semi computer contact
and can check in about once a week or so.

Day 11.......I went to "THE END" to see the wierd beats collective, and saw
DEPTH CHARGE perform, fucking brillient........for the first time since
being in London, I was at home.......awsome triphop and west coast
breakbeat all night long......I havn't danced like that for a long
time......fully inspirational and what a great response from the
crowd....WOW!!!    I really am beginning to see the different vibes, and
directions of the music now, not as trance and techno oriented as I had
first thought, many kinds of music are being played here, (albeit trance
and techno are the biggest)......Triphop is making a mark and I predict
soon it will be massive too......I hope so.

I ran into a DJ named MATT B who about four years ago was in L.A and was
dicked around by some promoters, and he needed to get to San Fran to make
some $$, so I rented a van and gave him a ride to S.F. he was grateful and
when he left we said if I ever come to the UK, he would take care of
me.....yeah I know BLAH BLAH BLAH.....
well quite by suprize, he was DJ'ing at "THE END" that nite and we had a
wicked time hanging out, he introduced me to tons of cool people, and told
them all I was the only one in California to treat him well.......I have to
say good karma goes a long way, and I am so glad he remembered me and my
good deed......I felt very special and was welcomed even more by many of
his friends.......I am so happy, some day I will look back on these days as
"the good old days"

I'm am totally meeting the most incredible people here........most say good
things about S.F. and they know we go off in San Fran, and many say they
want to come over....... so if you meet a brit who's visiting, be really
nice to them, it will come back to you someday, when you least expect it.

Day 12.......went to another wild underground party in BRIXTON of all
places. now imagine yourself at a wild undergroud party in a totally black
neighbohood, like hunters point. well 20 years ago you would never see a
bunch of white people dancing the night away in Brixton, but wow what a
difference 20 years makes, not only that....the bouncers (totally tuff
looking brothers) were the nicest and friendliest bouncers I have ever had
the pleasure to meet, absolute respect and total harmony. After 11 years of
DJ'ing I have never been treated so nicely as I was by thee fine
boys.......left an indelible impression on my mind.

well lets see its now the 13th day and I am completely exhausted, yet energized.
I have been given some insane promo triphop and can't wait to come home and
play it.

I guess thats all for now......I miss some of you, but I am loving the vibe
here. I wish I could book more work in San Fran, because the way things are
going here, I am in demand here, and I may never come home........sad but
true..

I wan't to thank publicly Eric D. who has been looking after my pad and my
kitties for me, that has allowed me to be here, and I hope to hear from
some of you soon......just e-mail me at

                                        moonpup@hooked.net

and I will eventually recieve it through the labtop, etc.....Eric will save
all impotant e-mails for me........

I love you all and I miss you, I especially miss those of you who have been
so kind to me over the last year....you know who you are......I will see
you all soon......

                         absolutely dileriously happy ..... moonpup

                                (have beats ....will travel)

p.s. personal note to becca kramer......I don't have your e-mail address
with me, can you send me an e-mail with the address so I can send you a
personal e-mail.......thanks hope to hear from you soon........



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 00:12:51 1996
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Message-Id: <199605140712.AAA21985@taz.hyperreal.com>
Date: Tue, 14 May 96 00:09:00 PDT
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: well, yosemite is coming along slowly
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

hello all-

just a report from the yosemite correspondent.

i think we have enough people to make the trip worthwile!  now, i pose the
following questions:

1) are we looking for cabin life or tent life?

2) i got several requests to change the date, so i will run a poll:

could everybody remotely interested in this trip e-mail me with their
prefered dates?  in about 3 days, i will tabulate the results and return
them with the optimal dates.  make the subject "dates" and send it privately.


till next time a decide to download my 500+ messages / day...

peace, love, and yosemite-

matt l.
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 00:31:23 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 00:29:32 -0700 (PDT)
Message-Id: <199605140729.AAA08687@worm.hooked.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: hello and hope all is well (fwd)...moonpup in London
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

 
BEGINNING OF E-MAIL TO SFRAVES 
 
 
Hi folks, 
 
 I finally found my old friend Rick Webb, and he has helped me out by 
letting me use his labtop, so I can communicate with the world, (finally) 
 
I have felt so cut off from my comfort zone, since arriving, as I don't 
have daily access to a computer, but now I should be able to check in about

once every week or so. 
 
To any one who complains that there's not enuff trance and techno in S.F. 
you should come to London........techno and trance are in major abundance 
here..... 
 
here's a basic rundown of some of the shit I've done and heard so far. 
 
Day one.....arrived at noon...no hassles with customs....(to bad I didn't 
bring massive amounts of head wear......)    first shock.....prices and 
cost to travel.   unfucking believable......I have spent 1/2 my $$ in the 
first 10 days of my trip.....bummer....but needed. 
 
day two.....went to my first club....MEGATRIPOLIS thurs nites in Charring
Cross. 
loads of shit happenin there.........interactive computer area, drum room, 
triphop room, main room- (Derrick May played), some guys bring two crates 
of records, and a turntable and you can check out and buy records, right 
there in the club......cool idea..... 
 
lots of interesting things to do. a massage area, lots of toys to play 
with, and most of all loads of people going off......many happy ravers 
here. 
 
I have noticed several major differences here, one is how much smoking goes

on here.....to much for my poor little eyes and lungs, and major drinking 
going on. 
 
heavy alcahol vibe......loads of smoke machines, it's like walking in a 
constant fog.......but I gotta say, a bigger % of people are appearing to 
have a great time, lots of smiley happy people.  however when you leave a 
club atmosphere, you find the people on the streets to be very sad and make

very little eye contact and smiles are rarely exchanged. I miss that about 
S.F 
 
lots of drunken ass holes who abuse womens energy with typical male ego and

neanderthal attitudes..... 
 
however in the clubs, It's completely different. happy smiles and good 
vibes all around. 
 
Day three......mostly rested and found some soccer shirts and just kicked 
it around the city. 
 
Day four......I woke up at 5am and went out to visit my old haunting 
grounds. for those that don't know, I was born and grew up in London, and 
moved to America when I was 12 years old, so I went to visit my old 
neighborhood and schools etc......very spiritual......I must have walked 15

or more miles that day......I totally exausted my poor old feet, they hurt 
for over a week after that (all that walking on concrete).......The Days 
are long as hell here......it begins to get light out at 4:45 in the 
morning, and if your walking home through a park or something you can 
really relate to the orb samples of birds singing and chirping away,(like 
on fluffy clouds etc...) thats something I take for granted in S.F.there 
are so many different kinds of song birds here.....it's beautiful.....it 
stays light out till 9:30 at night, hella long ass days....I didn't realize

how much further north I am, in fact the sun comes up in my bedroom window,

does a horseshoe manuver over my house to the front, and then back to set 
in my bedroom window again. It's alost like living in the north pole. 
 
I went to a brilliant underground club called DELIVERANCE, it was a full on

wharehouse party with 3 rooms of total trance and techno.....and people 
were goin bonkers.....I personally found it to be to much, I mean if you 
are tired of 160 bpm all nite and you want to chill out and find mellower 
music (house, ambient,triphop etc....) forget it......all three rooms were 
playing 160+ all nite long...........even at 5:30am.........no rest for the

wicked, but again I emphasize......tons of happy people enjoying the 
vibe........It is so energizing and fresh to see locals enjoying local DJ's

play the music, it is an infectious feeling, and I find myself to be very 
happy, and content. I am so glad I came........It's awsome to get a 
different perspective, in fact it's life saving. I recomend everyone come 
check it out.......you will learn so much about what is right and wrong 
about the S.F scene.....as well as learn how lucky you are to live in a 
relatively friendly atmosphere (on the streets). 
 
Day five........I left deliverance at about 8:30am and went to chelsea, I 
bought a ticket to a soccer match, and later in the day I saw chelsea play 
Blackburn rovers.....cool game, (except Chelsea lost 3-2). I eventually 
passed out and finally got some sleep...... 
 
Day six........slept all day.....well needed rest 
 
 
Day seven......went out and started to look for a job, (yes I'll be broke 
in 2-3 weeks if I'm not careful)...... 
 
Day eight.......I found an old family friend who runs a recording studio, 
and he ordered me some cassetes at bulk rate prices (tapes cost an arm and 
a leg, not to mention your first born).......and I have been dubbing off 
tapes as fast as I can give them out......I got my first booking for june 
7th at Mr C's club.."THE END" I am totally stoked.......TripHop is just 
beginning to take off here, I could'nt have picked a better time to come 
......... 
 
day nine.......interviewed for a job as a bartender and I think I got 
hired....only bummer is I have to shave my beard off......I love my stoopid

beard, it's so full now, but I guess I'd rather be hairless than pennyless.

 
Day ten.......off to Megatripolis again and finally by chance found my 
friend Rick Webb hanging out......thus I now have a semi computer contact 
and can check in about once a week or so. 
 
Day 11.......I went to "THE END" to see the wierd beats collective, and saw

DEPTH CHARGE perform, fucking brillient........for the first time since 
being in London, I was at home.......awsome triphop and west coast 
breakbeat all night long......I havn't danced like that for a long 
time......fully inspirational and what a great response from the 
crowd....WOW!!!    I really am beginning to see the different vibes, and 
directions of the music now, not as trance and techno oriented as I had 
first thought, many kinds of music are being played here, (albeit trance 
and techno are the biggest)......Triphop is making a mark and I predict 
soon it will be massive too......I hope so. 
 
I ran into a DJ named MATT B who about four years ago was in L.A and was 
dicked around by some promoters, and he needed to get to San Fran to make 
some $$, so I rented a van and gave him a ride to S.F. he was grateful and 
when he left we said if I ever come to the UK, he would take care of 
me.....yeah I know BLAH BLAH BLAH..... 
well quite by suprize, he was DJ'ing at "THE END" that nite and we had a 
wicked time hanging out, he introduced me to tons of cool people, and told 
them all I was the only one in California to treat him well.......I have to

say good karma goes a long way, and I am so glad he remembered me and my 
good deed......I felt very special and was welcomed even more by many of 
his friends.......I am so happy, some day I will look back on these days as

"the good old days" 
 
I'm am totally meeting the most incredible people here........most say good

things about S.F. and they know we go off in San Fran, and many say they 
want to come over....... so if you meet a brit who's visiting, be really 
nice to them, it will come back to you someday, when you least expect it. 
 
Day 12.......went to another wild underground party in BRIXTON of all 
places. now imagine yourself at a wild undergroud party in a totally black 
neighbohood, like hunters point. well 20 years ago you would never see a 
bunch of white people dancing the night away in Brixton, but wow what a 
difference 20 years makes, not only that....the bouncers (totally tuff 
looking brothers) were the nicest and friendliest bouncers I have ever had 
the pleasure to meet, absolute respect and total harmony. After 11 years of

DJ'ing I have never been treated so nicely as I was by thee fine 
boys.......left an indelible impression on my mind. 
 
well lets see its now the 13th day and I am completely exhausted, yet
energized. 
I have been given some insane promo triphop and can't wait to come home and

play it. 
 
I guess thats all for now......I miss some of you, but I am loving the vibe

here. I wish I could book more work in San Fran, because the way things are

going here, I am in demand here, and I may never come home........sad but 
true.. 
 
I wan't to thank publicly Eric D. who has been looking after my pad and my 
kitties for me, that has allowed me to be here, and I hope to hear from 
some of you soon......just e-mail me at 
 
                                        moonpup@hooked.net 
 
and I will eventually recieve it through the labtop, etc.....Eric will save

all impotant e-mails for me........ 
 
I love you all and I miss you, I especially miss those of you who have been

so kind to me over the last year....you know who you are......I will see 
you all soon...... 
 
                         absolutely dileriously happy ..... moonpup 
 
                                (have beats ....will travel) 
 
 
p.s. personal note to becca kramer......I don't have your e-mail address 
with me, can you send me an e-mail with the address so I can send you a 
personal e-mail.......thanks hope to hear from you soon........ 
 
END OF MESSAGE TO SFR 
 
 
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 06:58:29 1996
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To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Here we go again!  If you must vote, the only good vote is a yes.  But only
>if you believe in freedom of speech...  - E

To do the above requires a total suspension of reality.  As if there are
not enough outlets for hate already.

Late,
John

"god made me phunky, but I guess he blessed me that way!"

..they have eyes, but they do not see...





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 07:04:45 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 07:04:11 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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Subject: Fantastic Weekend!
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Hello to all you crazy SFRavers!

This past weekend was absolutely amazing! I had so much fun meeting
most of you from this list at Madness on Saturday and Harmony on Sunday.
I don't have my magic memory names notebook with me so I don't think
I can name the 20+ new brothers and sisters that I met this past 
weekend but all of your happy smiles and faces were permanently etched 
in my memory for eternity. 

Thanks again to all the beautiful people who make these incredible
events possible! You probably know this already but you have changed
my life for the better...I now realize that every single person on
this planet is a beautiful person. Even deep down in the hearts of what
used to be my worst enemies there is a seed of pure goodness and it is
my goal in life to help them see and nurture that both inside and out-
side of the rave scene.

I can't wait to see you all again and to meet new family members...
take care of yourselves!

Peace and Love,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 07:15:38 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 07:15:05 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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To: pabrams@itsa.ucsf.edu
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Hi Paul,

I'm hoping on being able to do Bay to Breaker with everyone from SFRaves
but I'm supposed to also run/walk it with the company that I work for...
is it cool to bring them along too, approx. 10 or so? Also, is there
still gonna be a meeting at the letter "R"? 

Peace and Love,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 07:37:42 1996
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To: Superstah 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>>>> I REALLY HOPE YOU VOTE NO!
>it's a freedom of speech thing.

No it is not.  It is a democratic process.  You do not have to consider
freedom of speech issues in this regard if one doesn't want to.  Besides,
they can put up a nice big nasty web page.  FOS is the red herring people
love to use.  Sometimes, against all logic.

>if you hated the cda, then you have no
>choice but to vote yes.

Wrong IMO.  They are two seperate issues.  One was decided by congress, the
other BY THE PEOPLE.  This vote, is BY THE PEOPLE (at least those with
computers).  Since there are other avenues for these nitwits to publish
their hate, they need not be on the Usenet.  You want a race free society,
then always vote no on hate.  You want to discuss race well into the 22nd
century?  Provide as many avanues pas possible for racist thought.  They
can put up a web page, keep the bastards off the Usenet.

>better to not vote at all.

People have died so that I can vote.  Even though this is a less democratic
means (I mean the entire population isn't voting, just tech weenies), I see
it as synonymous with voting rights in general.  If you're a person of
color or a woman, you should ALWAYS vote.  People DIED to ensure that you
have that right.

Just the persepective of a person whose father and mother couldn't vote
when he was born.

>have you ever seen how someone posting large binaries uuencoded into
>millions of parts can disrupt a newsgroup?

Happens every day.  Spam is a way of life.  Especially since the internet
flood gates have opened.  Spams becuase of limited speech?  What is this
extortion...either vote yes or the whole USenet goes down?  Whatever, let
it sink.  It damn near rock bottom anyway.

>i seriously doubt that the group
>will ever have any impact.

Funny, people said the exact same thing about Hitler, Mussolini, and
countless other fascist despots.

>it will either A) escalate into a huge flame war
>on every issue

Very few newsgroups are civilized and without flamage.  I always thought
Usenet == flame war.  Try asking a simple question and watch your ass catch
on fire.

>B) get censored by everyone

Censorship CAN be a good thing.  I do not beleive in a free for all where
EVERYTHING goes.  We have to have some standard by which to set a course.
Just because there are pedophiles, does not mean there should be a group
devoted to their eortic binaries.  Just as there are rapists and other
miscreants, does not mean we need to provide a vehicle for their pursuits.
What Americans have yet to understand or grapple with is the RESPONSIBILITY
of free speech.  And responsibility often requires management.  And
management often requires that some things NOT be done.

>C) get spammed so badly that I) sysadmins have no choice but to drop the
>group due to bandwidth concerns  II) it renders the group unreadable  III)
>it gets flooded so badly that messages are lost, destroying the threads.

The s/n ration on usenet is very, very low.  All the items you talked about
are realites now.  Usenet willl not be any worse off by NOT having a bunch
of spuremacists talking about thier music.  Let them put iup very expensive
web pages.  Internet is NOT a democracy, there are millions of people who
are not on the net, as a matter of fact, the majority of the population.
There are plenty of other avenues for racists, and supremacists, to spout
their garabe.  Keep the Usenet in it's presednt state of decay.  Vote NO
for neo-nazi punk bitch mutherfuckers with a 4th grade education, trying to
have thier ideas validated by society.  Skinheads and Nazis, the real
reasons pepper spray was invented.

>so, there really isn't anything to worry about.

I think the survivors of the holocaust would tend to differ.  And I *do*
agree with them in this regard.  Enough is enough.  Stop the hate.  Destroy
it before it ever comes to the surface.  The Usenet will just not be a
media they can exploit.  Vote no for a sane tomorrow.

Peace,
John

P.S.  I wish more people could walk in my shoes, or the shoes of my Jewish
brothers, or the shoes of anyone who has been persecuted for something they
could not help, be it skin color (the most obvious, man we're a limited
species), or a belief system (the least obvious, man we're a limited
species), or gender (man/woman, we're a limited species).  I think if
people did, this world would not only be a better place, but we would
probably have less intellectualization of the harmful things perpetrated in
society.  The only thing I can hope for is as the world becomes more brown
(most of the world *IS* brown, but I'm talkin' about America), the
supremacists of the planet will be relegated to history, where they belong.

Out.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 07:43:06 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 10:41:57 -0400 (EDT)
From: DJ Hardware <hardware@gate.net>
Reply-To: DJ Hardware <hardware@gate.net>
To: se-raves@american.edu
cc: ne-raves@world.std.com, txraves@io.com, pb-cle-raves@hyperreal.com,
        DCRaves@Americanm.edu, NW-Raves@hyperreal.com, SFraves@hyperreal.com,
        MTN-Raves@hyperreal.com, MW-Raves@hyperreal.com, FL-Raves@cate.net
Subject: Adrenalin signing new material
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		A D R E N A L I N      R E C O R D S 

	Is looking for new material to sign. We are intrested in
development of techno artist is the USA. We are looking for Hard House,
Progressive House, Trance, Acid Trance, Funkty Breaks, Trip-Hop, Ambient,
and Hardcore Gabber and Techno track to sighn to Adrenalin Records.

If you have a demo and would like to submit it to us for review for
sighning to the lable then send it to the following address. In the near
future we have many 12" vinyl releases coming out by Cotten Club from the
UK who is now signed to us, Stryke, The Tweakers and many more.....

38@send Demos to:
		Adrenalin Records
		Attn: DJ HARDWARE - Director of A&R
		13870 Oneida DR
		Suite C-2
		Delray Bch, FL 33446

our numbers are:

		PH: (407) 495 - 9954
		FAX: (407) 495 - 3919

	Hope to hear some new and intovative music real soon....


			Techno Music....... Fueling the Future.....


					Yours truely,


						DJ HARDWARE
					      ADRENALIN RECORDS
					       DIRECTOR OF A&R



    M   U   S   I    C       W   I  T  H      A         R   U    S  H  


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 07:43:08 1996
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Message-ID: <n1380062674.97193@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 14 May 1996 07:37:12 -0800
From: "Jason Green*" <Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: WHO SFRAVES
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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WHO SFRAVES


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 08:06:26 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 08:06:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: GITANE <Gitane@cris.com>
cc: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Gay Freedom Parade Story
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.93.960514001457.15745B-100000@galileo.cris.com>
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     When is the actual parade?





On Tue, 14 May 1996, GITANE wrote:

> unfortunately for the purposes of putting a float in the parade the
> application date just passed (was May 10), though I'm planning to 
> park my motorhome as close to the staging/celebration area the night
> before and have a super vantage point to party all day! 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>                                                 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 08:51:07 1996
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Subject: Re: WHO SFRAVES
To: Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com (Jason Green*)
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 08:51:05 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <n1380062674.97193@gateway.apple.com> from "Jason Green*" at May 14, 96 07:37:12 am
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> WHO SFRAVES

Remember, send messages like these to majordomo@hyperreal.com,
*not* the list itself.  I've made the same mistake myself a
few times...

	Sami

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 09:04:24 1996
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To: Superstah 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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Just about everything you mentioned happened the last time this thing came
to da list.  It was pretty aweful, and drew too much energy from too many
fine people.  I hope enough of us remember, and proceed as appropriate.

Peace,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 09:10:33 1996
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From: GITANE <Gitane@cris.com>
To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
Cc: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Gay Freedom Parade Story
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The Parade date is Sunday, June 30th, they have an information 
number which is 864-FREE or E-mail sfpride@aol.com


On Tue, 14 May 1996, Reagan Reid wrote:

>  
>      When is the actual parade?
> 



                                                


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 09:39:57 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 09:39:22 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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These guys were absolutely amazing! Those of you who have never heard
them play their ambient music should really try and check them out next
time they play at a party...I heard them for the first time at the 7th
Progress party. Unfortunately, I missed the 8th Progress party a few
weeks ago.

Combine beautiful music with delicious organic uncooked vegan food and
an incredibly positive vibe atmosphere and you have a perfect energizing
pre-raving lunch/dinner!

RAW is located at 1224 9th ave. at Lincoln in SF...I think they have
live performances a few nights a week but I can't remember which
nights?

Peace and Love,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 10:49:27 1996
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Date: 14 May 96 13:45:20 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Gay Freedom Parade date
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     Reagan Reid asked....   When is the actual parade?


It's on Sunday, June 30th....   Even if we don't have a marching musical parade
contingent, it would be so fun to have a presence of some sort, maybe a
gathering spot (there are usually a couple of dance areas, and the house music
area is  the most fun), or some sort of signs or banners (Ravers Love Everbody!
or whatever) or stickers we give out, whatever!  This is the street party of all
street parties, and we have a very special energy to bring to it!

No matter what, I'll be out there dancing!

Leslie  : )



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 11:06:36 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: Sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Hello everyone (again)
Date: 14 May 1996 18:55:34 GMT
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Hello to thoses that know and don't know me..
It is I, Adam (Aka Foustus)..
Been awhile since I've been gone.
But I'm Back...
This is my new account.


"Dance with me" (Spins,)

Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 599-5500
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 11:11:21 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 96 11:10:56 PDT
Subject: FW: Hard Copy RESPONDS!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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FYI-

---------------Original Message---------------
Hard Copy has turned their fax machine off due to the volume of calls.
There's no point in faxing to that number right now.  As soon as we get
other numbers, I will let you know when to start faxing again!

Because of your efforts, they have FINALLY decided that they need talk to
us and  discuss these issues.



Here's what they had to say...

Attorneys for Hard Copy say that the allegations in the letter and the
breach the Journalists' Code of Ethics are serious and will not go without
serious internal investigation.

Hard Copy attempts to adhere to those Codes of Ethics and are disturbed
that such a large number of them could have been breached in a single
report.

That the producer has been unable to clarify the situation in which the
report was brought to him but that he will meet with the Paramount
attorneys as soon as possible.

It is entirely possible that the "footage" was obtained from a 3rd party
but that it is still the producer's responsibility to substantiate the
relevance and accuracy of the footage.

*****Hard Copy will discuss covering the movement from another angle(see 
below).

They are distressed that I contacted the Society for Professional
Journalism regarding these allegations.

Hard Copy will contact us with a report regarding these issues.

AND LAST BUT DEFINATELY NOT LEAST....

The entire Hard Copy production goes on hiatus in 2 weeks which probably
means they won't be able to do anything for 8-10 weeks! (Can you say "wait
until this all blows over"?)


****** As far as Hard Copy doing another story from a different angle, I am
100% against.  I don't want ANY publicity about our movement anymore...
good or bad.  This will probably start an interesting thread again.  I'm
interested to hear everyone's comments.



Thanks for all of you who called in the 1-900 Hard Copy line.  (They said
that perhaps as much as 75% of the calls they received were defending the
desert-rave movement.)

And thanks to all of you who took the time and faxed in the Code of Ethics!


We've been heard... now let's see if we are listened to.

Please cross post this to all the other mail lists!




-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen




----------End of Original Message----------

-------------------------------------
05/14/96 - 11:10:56
Teena Jamieson
Sales Support Representative
Teena@compute.com

       N E T W O R K   I N T E N S I V E
        The Complete Internet Solution
                 800-273-5600
                   info@ni.net
               http://www.ni.net
-------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 11:12:57 1996
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To: geoffw@cybetribe.com (Geoff White)
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: NRR:Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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GWhite said to me:
>Do you really think most of the people
>in Nazi Germany were saying "Yeah! Kill ALL JEWS!!" "Yeah!! We'll rule the
>world!!". I bet not,

Be careful how you bet.  There is a raging debate going on right now about
the guilt of Germans in this regard.  A Jewish brother, Daniel J.
Goldhagen, (whose dad survived the Holocaust) wrote a book called "Hitler's
Willing Executioners".  In it he argues that anti-semitism was so ingrained
for the Germans, that to turn them into killing machine state was easy.  He
also counters the argument about people not having ill will toward jews,
and cites, in a most convincing fashion, that the Germans were willing and
eager to rid themselves of the Jews.  Anyway this debate goes on.  I
haven't decided where I stand on this.  Suffice that I do not quickly
beleive in the "I was only following orders" often spouted as a balm for
the marks left by history.

>but I bet most people just went along with the tide,
>they bought into the belief that only criminals, trators and terrorist were
>being
>placed in the "work camps", and it just happened to be that a lot of criminals
>and terrorist HAPPENED to be Jewish (sound familiar folks?). Most folks didn't
>want to know what was going on (this denial exist in the Nazi movement to this
>day), the ones that knew kept quiet least they wind up being branded as a
>dissitant and sent off to a "work camp" themselves, in the end, people
>looked out
>for themselves and their families, remember, Germany was in a state of war,
>the govenment had tremendous power over the population, most people didn't get
>it until they woke up one day and realized they were on a path to Hell. By
>this
>time there cities were being firebombed by the allies and it was too late to
>alter the course.
>

Like I said, there are other trains of thought that dispute the
aforementioned commonly held notion of "following orders".

>So I say folks this is a free country and if I want to talk about LSD or
>MDMA or
>NAZI orientated Rock I should be allowed to.

Oh, I am down with people talking about whatever, and publishing it in
print as well.  But since the Usenet is not part of the public sphere, and
since we can vote against or for it, I stand against them.  And, of course,
vote appropriately.  As for free speech, I have thought about this.  It
seems that the courts have traditionally ruled that free speech has few
limits.  However, taking a look at the medium of said speech, you will find
that free speech right vary depending on the publics capability to respond.
So with TV, you have certain things you can and cannot say, I as a ham
radio operator cannot curse on the air, some restrictions apply to radio
and CATV as well.  But printing is a whole other matter.  In any case,
depending on the medium FOS can be curtailed.  You can't say anything you
want to at work and expect to have a job for instance.  There are limits.

The Internet will be in big trouble in many regards.  And if you *think*
that if portions of CDA are defated they wont return, then I think one
might be mistaken.  The real problem on the net is self-policing.  Right
now it's a free for all, total anarchy in the truest sense.  It doesn't fit
the model of our society, and since it doesn't seem to want to be
self-policing, others wil step in to do the job.  It will happen, it's only
a matter of time, IMO.

>
>People need to first address the racism inside of their own hearts and then
>worry about the exterior manifestation in others.  If you handle the first part
>it makes you stronger when dealing witht the second.
>
>
>                                        G

I agree 100% here G!  Right on!




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 11:15:39 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 11:10:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605141112.E1825-0100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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I think this was meant for the whole list.  (Susan, I hope this is okay?)



---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 19:23:08 +0100
From: Susan Miller <sumiller@sirius.com>
To: KaySEE <kirstenc@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves

>
>What makes this list "look" like a social circle is that you get people
>who are less "shy" (for lack of a better word) or busy, or whatever, that
>post frequently.  So, you start to read stuff from the people who post
>all of the time.  The remedy for this is that more people should post.
>
>I'd like to see more people come forward and speak up
============================================================

Don't worry about looking too much like a social circle. This is my first
post, having only been introduced to the rave scene and you SFRavers a few
weeks ago. I have really enjoyed "listening in" to what you are saying and
really enjoy how friendly you are towards each other.

You don't come off as a social clique, more like a group of friends
enjoying a shared interest.

(And knowing what you are wearing to the next rave is cool ... I'll be sure
to introduce myself!)

ciao,
pandora


"enjoy life, you only get one."   *(;-,




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 11:30:51 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 11:30:26 -0800
To: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Harmony's Beach Party
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The irony in that would be the fact that there was a fucking nitrous tank
there and a naked guy with a hard-on!  How better to perpetuate the
bullshit that the Hard Copy report created about sex orgies and nitrous
binges.

Don't get me wrong, in the right setting both of those things are perfectly
acceptable, however the former is at the dentist's office and the latter,
well, not in a public setting where you think maybe at least half the
people around you might get slightly uncomfortable with your arousal.  And
that's coming from a nudist (but ONLY in the right setting).

The music was great, and finally we hear Wink's Higher State of
Consciousness after about a ten month respite from the underground charts.
It was a cool mix too!

Props to Harmony and Beautiful People everywhere.

Peace!

Tone

At 11:32 PM  -0700 5/13/96, Adam Luong wrote:
>Hey everybody, by the way. There was this guy who was taking ALOT of
>pictures at the beach party on Sunday. Make sure it doesn't get on HARD
>COPY. Hehe.
>
>         Adam
>
>
>                        R.Lunatic




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 11:54:02 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 13:23:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Hard Copy RESPONDS! (fwd)
Message-Id: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960514132228.23140A-100000@dfw.dfw.net>
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Score one for us. It beautifull what a group effort can acomplish.
Peace to all of you and keep the vibe going.

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 13:53:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kc <sarahtonen@earthlink.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: Hard Copy RESPONDS!

Hard Copy has turned their fax machine off due to the volume of calls.
There's no point in faxing to that number right now.  As soon as we get
other numbers, I will let you know when to start faxing again!

Because of your efforts, they have FINALLY decided that they need talk to
us and  discuss these issues.



Here's what they had to say...

Attorneys for Hard Copy say that the allegations in the letter and the
breach the Journalists' Code of Ethics are serious and will not go without
serious internal investigation.

Hard Copy attempts to adhere to those Codes of Ethics and are disturbed
that such a large number of them could have been breached in a single
report.

That the producer has been unable to clarify the situation in which the
report was brought to him but that he will meet with the Paramount
attorneys as soon as possible.

It is entirely possible that the "footage" was obtained from a 3rd party
but that it is still the producer's responsibility to substantiate the
relevance and accuracy of the footage.

*****Hard Copy will discuss covering the movement from another angle(see below).

They are distressed that I contacted the Society for Professional
Journalism regarding these allegations.

Hard Copy will contact us with a report regarding these issues.

AND LAST BUT DEFINATELY NOT LEAST....

The entire Hard Copy production goes on hiatus in 2 weeks which probably
means they won't be able to do anything for 8-10 weeks! (Can you say "wait
until this all blows over"?)


****** As far as Hard Copy doing another story from a different angle, I am
100% against.  I don't want ANY publicity about our movement anymore...
good or bad.  This will probably start an interesting thread again.  I'm
interested to hear everyone's comments.



Thanks for all of you who called in the 1-900 Hard Copy line.  (They said
that perhaps as much as 75% of the calls they received were defending the
desert-rave movement.)

And thanks to all of you who took the time and faxed in the Code of Ethics!


We've been heard... now let's see if we are listened to.

Please cross post this to all the other mail lists!




-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 12:23:44 1996
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To: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: Rick and Eric at RAW on Friday
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 09:39 AM 5/14/96 -0700, you wrote:
>These guys were absolutely amazing! Those of you who have never heard
>them play their ambient music should really try and check them out next
>time they play at a party...I heard them for the first time at the 7th
>Progress party. Unfortunately, I missed the 8th Progress party a few
>weeks ago.

Actually, Eric wasn't in on that one.  You are referring to Consciousness
Lab Ambient Sound Research.  We are included in the collective that is
C-Lab, but if it's just Erick and I we go by "RE:"

>Combine beautiful music with delicious organic uncooked vegan food and
>an incredibly positive vibe atmosphere and you have a perfect energizing
>pre-raving lunch/dinner!

The food there is reason alone to check this place out.

>RAW is located at 1224 9th ave. at Lincoln in SF...I think they have
>live performances a few nights a week but I can't remember which
>nights?
>
>Peace and Love,
>John


Thanks John, glad you liked it.  We were asked to play there three time per
week, but since we live in Sacramento, and have to provide sound as well as
our equipment, we had to compromise on once per week.  So..... RE: will be
playing at RAW every Friday from around 7:30 pm - 10:30.
        r
RE: = e i k        
        c

I'll do a BSP on Friday to remind anyone who may want to go.  It's free.

:)

Rick



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 12:56:43 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 12:56:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: FYI
Message-ID: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960514124919.120A-100000@value.net>
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Hi everyone.  I now have a brand new IP.  Much thanks to all of the 
information everyone gave to me!  My new address is:  scarab@value.net, I 
will now get all of my mail right here!

KaySEE

(scarab@value.net)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 13:05:34 1996
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From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: Review: Mad
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Forwarded at the request of Adam Luong aka R.Lunatic.  Please send replies
directly to Adam: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com

>You wrote: 
>>
>>Another Mad review (long):
>
>>Additional equipment:
>>        Grapes
>>        Lotion
>>        Tums
>>        Water
>>        Stickers
>>        Camera and several rolls of film
>>        etc.
>>
>
>I want to thank you for the TUMS!!! without it I probably would have 
>not been able to drive home by myself... uugghhh... 
>
>
>
>>COOL MOMENT: Adam (aka R.Lunatic) and I running around with our Dr. 
>Seuss 
>>hats.  Hey, it was just plain fun being such a goof.  I was skipping 
>and 
>>jumping and running and being a total kid.
>
>Like I said before, "WE'RE THE SUESS BROTHERS!!!" =)~
>Except mine is Black and White and it doesn't glow in the black light 
>like yours.. =(
>
>>NEXT TIME: The next time you're at a rave and you're having trouble 
>getting 
>>with the groove, come find me.  
>
>Yeah! He has all the toys!! If you're having trouble at all... come to 
>ME and I'll make ya laugh.. =)~
>
>
>
>Adam
>                        R.Lunatic
>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 13:27:50 1996
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Date: 14 May 96 16:26:31 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: socializing at raves
Message-ID: <960514202630_71165.755_GHL88-1@CompuServe.COM>
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Regarding the conversations about SFR seeming like a "social circle" or "clique"
... some interesting points were brought up ...  and ... surprise, surprise... I
have something to add!

I can see the point that the social aspect of the group can seem alienating if
you didn't go to a certain place, meet certain people, whatever -- There are
lots of people on this list who don't live in the Bay Area, or can't go out
often because of schedules, school, finances, etc.... 

But I for one am VERY THANKFUL for the opportunity to meet so many people with
whom I have one huge thing in common ... we love the music, we love the vibe.  

The SFR picnic for me was an example of that -- it was like going to a family
reunion where you don't really know all the people who are there, but you have
an undeniable common thread, so there's never a question of whether you belong
there or not.  If you're there, you belong.

When I post what I'm wearing, it's my sincere invitation for any SFRaver to come
up to me and introduce themselves, so we can meet face to face.  I love that.
When I post after a party and list the people I met, it's my way of saying
"thank you for being part of one of the most important nights of my week" to
those people (sometimes because I wasn't able to express that in person at the
party for whatever reason, mental incapacity/ sound too loud/ got lost,
whatever).

For those of you who feel like you're on the outside looking into a smaller
group, come on in!  There's no secret password, there's no attitude, everyone is
part of this family if they want to be .. and there's still plenty of room for
your own individuality in the group, too.
 
Don't want to post?  You don't have to, but it's a good idea, because then we
get to recognize your name and know a little about you when we meet in person.
Even if you're not ready to post, seek out someone you recognize as an SFRaver
when you're out, because you'll quickly discover the warm welcome you'll
receive!  

Leslie  : )




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 14:54:07 1996
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To: jsl@netcom.com
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Dear John,
        I just wanted to say thank you for making the points you did,
before I got a chance to. I hope that some of the people out there THINK
before forming an opinion. I would just like to add that this is an online
"community" that we are participating in. It is a privilege to be
participating in it, not a right. It is my hard-earned privilege! I
particularly don't want racists and other people filled with hate hogging
up my bandwidth and blabbering in our online community.
I would like to think that this is a community of intelligent people (with
open minds) open to discussing problems and ideas. It is our privilege to
exclude people who we don't think fit into our community, and might
possibly destroy the amazing thing we have going on here. Racism brings
nothing positive to a community.
     By letting them have their own news group we are telling them that it
is ok for them as human beings to be racist and hate. If we as a species
are to evolve and succeed than we must get past these idiotic issues of
race, color and creed.
It takes all of the colors in the rainbow to make a beautiful painting. :-)



Jon


At  7:37 AM 5/14/96 -0700, John S. Lee wrote:
>>>>>> I REALLY HOPE YOU VOTE NO!
>>it's a freedom of speech thing.
>
>No it is not.  It is a democratic process.  You do not have to consider
>freedom of speech issues in this regard if one doesn't want to.  Besides,
>they can put up a nice big nasty web page.  FOS is the red herring people
>love to use.  Sometimes, against all logic.
>
>>if you hated the cda, then you have no
>>choice but to vote yes.
>
>Wrong IMO.  They are two seperate issues.  One was decided by congress, the
>other BY THE PEOPLE.  This vote, is BY THE PEOPLE (at least those with
>computers).  Since there are other avenues for these nitwits to publish
>their hate, they need not be on the Usenet.  You want a race free society,
>then always vote no on hate.  You want to discuss race well into the 22nd
>century?  Provide as many avanues pas possible for racist thought.  They
>can put up a web page, keep the bastards off the Usenet.
>
>>better to not vote at all.
>
>People have died so that I can vote.  Even though this is a less democratic
>means (I mean the entire population isn't voting, just tech weenies), I see
>it as synonymous with voting rights in general.  If you're a person of
>color or a woman, you should ALWAYS vote.  People DIED to ensure that you
>have that right.
>
>Just the persepective of a person whose father and mother couldn't vote
>when he was born.
>
>>have you ever seen how someone posting large binaries uuencoded into
>>millions of parts can disrupt a newsgroup?
>
>Happens every day.  Spam is a way of life.  Especially since the internet
>flood gates have opened.  Spams becuase of limited speech?  What is this
>extortion...either vote yes or the whole USenet goes down?  Whatever, let
>it sink.  It damn near rock bottom anyway.
>
>>i seriously doubt that the group
>>will ever have any impact.
>
>Funny, people said the exact same thing about Hitler, Mussolini, and
>countless other fascist despots.
>
>>it will either A) escalate into a huge flame war
>>on every issue
>
>Very few newsgroups are civilized and without flamage.  I always thought
>Usenet == flame war.  Try asking a simple question and watch your ass catch
>on fire.
>
>>B) get censored by everyone
>
>Censorship CAN be a good thing.  I do not beleive in a free for all where
>EVERYTHING goes.  We have to have some standard by which to set a course.
>Just because there are pedophiles, does not mean there should be a group
>devoted to their eortic binaries.  Just as there are rapists and other
>miscreants, does not mean we need to provide a vehicle for their pursuits.
>What Americans have yet to understand or grapple with is the RESPONSIBILITY
>of free speech.  And responsibility often requires management.  And
>management often requires that some things NOT be done.
>
>>C) get spammed so badly that I) sysadmins have no choice but to drop the
>>group due to bandwidth concerns  II) it renders the group unreadable  III)
>>it gets flooded so badly that messages are lost, destroying the threads.
>
>The s/n ration on usenet is very, very low.  All the items you talked about
>are realites now.  Usenet willl not be any worse off by NOT having a bunch
>of spuremacists talking about thier music.  Let them put iup very expensive
>web pages.  Internet is NOT a democracy, there are millions of people who
>are not on the net, as a matter of fact, the majority of the population.
>There are plenty of other avenues for racists, and supremacists, to spout
>their garabe.  Keep the Usenet in it's presednt state of decay.  Vote NO
>for neo-nazi punk bitch mutherfuckers with a 4th grade education, trying to
>have thier ideas validated by society.  Skinheads and Nazis, the real
>reasons pepper spray was invented.
>
>>so, there really isn't anything to worry about.
>
>I think the survivors of the holocaust would tend to differ.  And I *do*
>agree with them in this regard.  Enough is enough.  Stop the hate.  Destroy
>it before it ever comes to the surface.  The Usenet will just not be a
>media they can exploit.  Vote no for a sane tomorrow.
>
>Peace,
>John
>
>P.S.  I wish more people could walk in my shoes, or the shoes of my Jewish
>brothers, or the shoes of anyone who has been persecuted for something they
>could not help, be it skin color (the most obvious, man we're a limited
>species), or a belief system (the least obvious, man we're a limited
>species), or gender (man/woman, we're a limited species).  I think if
>people did, this world would not only be a better place, but we would
>probably have less intellectualization of the harmful things perpetrated in
>society.  The only thing I can hope for is as the world becomes more brown
>(most of the world *IS* brown, but I'm talkin' about America), the
>supremacists of the planet will be relegated to history, where they belong.
>
>Out.

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 14:59:01 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 14:58:45 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Weekend decision, RE: Madness
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Well, it was very clear to me after this weekend, Madness being the one
thing that made up my mind for me. I had one of the best times in my life
at Madness. The love and energy I felt that night completely over whelmed
me. I'm not ashamed to admit that when I was heading home to Sunnyvale, all
I did was think about what an incredible time I had. I put in a mix tape
and just remembered the whole night. I actually got choked up and teary
eyed I was soooo happy and felt sooo good. I have decided that I'm going to
move to SF. Just thinking about it right now makes me so incredibly warm
inside I'm getting choked up now. I have never felt like this ever. I feel
I can move a mountain right now. Saturday night had such an impact on me. I
really don't know why. I have always had a good time at other events.
Madness wasn't even one of the best parties I have went to before. All I
can say is that it was the people and the love I shared with the ones I was
with at Madness that hit me hard. So, I'm moving up here. I want to be a
little closer to what and who I love. I just want to say thank you again to
those that put on Madness and all the people that made this event one for
me to remember and love for a long time. God, I FEEL so good right now. It
is still very overwhelming. I wish Everyone can feel what I'm feeling right
now.


Tim (knucklehead)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 15:11:35 1996
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From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: SFR T-Shirts
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Ok folx!  I've only received one image for the SFR T-shirt logo and one vote.
WAKE UP!!!!!  Help me out here!  Don't we have any creative, artistic types 
out there?  Give me your best shot!

To reiterate, we're trying to put together a run of T-shirts with some form 
of SFR logo.  I'm taking all logos and putting them on a web page so you 
folks can review them.  I'm taking logo entries in GIF, JPG, BMP, or PCX 
format.  Just attach it to an email and send it my way.

The page is at www.tgrigsby.com/sfraves.

There's no real deadline here, but come on: Show me whatcha got!

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 15:52:28 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Weekend decision, RE: Madness
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To everyone who attended Madness: please share the love and positive energy
with the rest of us.  It sounds like it was an incredibly meaningful,
moving experience; how I wish I'd gone :(

Please pass the PLUR,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 15:55:24 1996
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From: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
To: bigz@bigz.com, jsl@netcom.com
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>      By letting them have their own news group we are telling them that it
> is ok for them as human beings to be racist and hate.
>
> >Stop the hate.  Destroy
> >it before it ever comes to the surface.

	Um...  wouldn't it be more effective just to go over there and shoot 
them all?  Or, we could be humane, and lock them up in camps...  yeah, thats the 
ticket.

	Be very careful you don't end up playing the same game you started out 
to end...  And remember the tighter you hold the lid on, the faster the water 
boils.

	Let them have their damn newsgroup, then use it to tell them (and 
the rest of the world) what you think of them.

Andrew
-----------------------------------------
Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 16:10:37 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Hello socal-raves!
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Crew?  What say youse?  - E

>Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 15:47:25 -0700 (PDT)
>From: Lauren Fox <lfox@alnitak.usc.edu>
>To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@synopsys.com>
>Subject: Re: Hello socal-raves!
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>
>We love you too!!!
>:)
>Lauren
>
>ps, so when do you think Socal and SFRaves will decide to have a joint party
>somewhere mid-state??
>
>On Tue, 14 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:
>
>> sfraves loves you!!!
>>
>> :)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 16:20:33 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 16:20:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
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John Lee-

You made some excellent, well-articulated points.... after reading your 
posts, I *did* seriously reconsider my position on this issue--

But I did not change it.   I may be new to this list, but I'm not new to 
this sort of debate.   While I was in college getting my poli/sci degree 
in Iowa, I did hardcore battle with the (then blossoming) Christian 
Coalition.   In our student government (UI being a Big Ten school) 
there is a fund of over $1mil of student fees to be allocated to student 
groups by the student senate.  Of course, our rabid rightwinger friends 
had a large presence in this senate, and we did some very serious, 
emotionally-charged debating on the senate floor about this subject:  

should a group of people with a "hate-oriented" agenda be allowed to pull 
resources away from "positive-oriented" groups?  (Replace "resources" 
with the words "bandwidth" or "s/n ratio".)

This is a very healthy, very American debate.  One which should never 
stop being discussed.  Why, as a progressive/radical in the student 
senate, did I vote to allow student groups like the "Heterosexual Rights 
Coalition" or "Young Americans for Freedom" to receive student funds?  
Because as long as this is a free country, EVERYONE must be allowed to 
speak, whether hate-mongering murderers, pedophiles, etc.    

How else can the rest of us "know thy enemy"?   How else can we ensure 
that groups considered "dangerous" by cultural dominators like Newt or
Rush or even Senator Exon are allowed free speech in some future time 
when this country is (even more) dominated by right-wingers?  
(For instance, gays, "one-worlders", the cypherpunks, or the extropians, or 
even deadheads--!)  

Should Dole win, and Congress remain Republican, don't you want the 
ABSOLUTE RIGHT of EVERYONE to be allowed a forum on Usenet?   

Many of the descriptive language you use to villify the skinheads, etc 
(although I agree strongly with you), can and may also be used to 
villify legitimate, positive communities--- if the people doing the 
describing have the attitude of "well, there is a precedent for banning 
this kind of dangerous speech--- like when the Usenet community 
disallowed those disturbed young Aryans a forum".

or how bout this one:   "sure there's free speech, all you need is the 
money to put up a website".   Are you *really* saying that one must have 
money to speak one's mind?   IMHO, this is exactly what makes the net so 
much more empowering than major media outlets like TV stations and radio 
stations:   many-to-many, without the need for good-ol-boy networks of 
rich fatcats, whose asses need kissing for access to "public airspace".

While your points are well thought-out and beautifully articulated, I 
hope you will consider mine before continuing your passionate arguments.

peaceout
cubensis



On Tue, 14 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:

> >Here we go again!  If you must vote, the only good vote is a yes.  But only
> >if you believe in freedom of speech...  - E
> 
> To do the above requires a total suspension of reality.  As if there are
> not enough outlets for hate already.
> 
> Late,
> John
> 
> "god made me phunky, but I guess he blessed me that way!"
> 
> ..they have eyes, but they do not see...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 16:33:27 1996
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To: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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>>      By letting them have their own news group we are telling them that it
>> is ok for them as human beings to be racist and hate.
>>
>> >Stop the hate.  Destroy
>> >it before it ever comes to the surface.
>
>        Um...  wouldn't it be more effective just to go over there and shoot
>them all?  Or, we could be humane, and lock them up in camps...  yeah,
>thats the
>ticket.

It all depends on how you interpreted my words.  One can engage in battle
many ways, some peaceful some not.  The more non-peaceful methods can come
into play if all peaceful methods have been exhausted.

Hate, IMO, is not to be tolerated.  This is not an intellectual concept.
Hatred is sheer illogic.  To give it any merit, as if it serves some
function other than the destruction of others, would not allow any
civilization to progress but so far.  History has taught us this lesson all
to well.

I choose to fight racism via my words.  And through my actions I defy it.
But if *they* wish to deprive me the opportunity to live, through *action*,
then I'll have no other choice but to react in kind.  But I digress...

And as for locking people up in camps, so far, some of the victims of this
procedure in America to date have been Native Americans, African Americans,
Japanese Americans, and Chinese Americans, oh yeah Hatians, Cubans...I
think the last thing we have to worry about is a bunch of white
supremacists getting put into concentration camps.

>
>        Be very careful you don't end up playing the same game you started out
>to end...  And remember the tighter you hold the lid on, the faster the water
>boils.

I am very concious of the results of burying racism.  But I find lately too
many all to eager to allow racism a pulpit from which to speak.  I was not
implying keeping any lid on, I wished restraint in one medium.  I do not
believe that all concepts are absolute.  To say that one should be able to
say *ANYTHING* at *ANYTIME* is rubbish.  We KNOW there are boundaries.
What I suggest is that, since we pay to be online, and it is a privilege
not a right, and since things are done by consensus, that people act in a
way that solidifies the community, not destroy it.  It would be like
inviting the worst denizens of the night into a safe neighborhood all for
the sake of diversity.  Even the concept of diversity has limits.

I just say since we do have a choice, reject it.  Without fear that they
will not have a voice.  They can choose other avenues.  Just as mainstream
TV, or public TV rejects this drivel, so should we.  They have other ways
to communicate their message, it shouldn't be on my time, or subsidized
with my dime!

>
>        Let them have their damn newsgroup, then use it to tell them (and
>the rest of the world) what you think of them.
>
>Andrew
>-----------------------------------------
>Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
>Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

I prefer a pre-emptive method.  Your points are well taken, and I agree
with some of what you said.  I just think you characterized my words
incorrectly.

Peace out,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 16:39:09 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 16:38:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: Darrin Fossella <darrin@cea.edu>
Subject: SPAZ live on TV Wed. 5/15
To: SFraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
cc: interns@cea.edu, staff@cea.edu
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Members of SPAZ will be playing live on the NADA Public Access TV show
on Wed. 5/15 at 10pm - I believe the channel is 54 (somewhere in the 50's).
This is show is very chaotic, obsure, and deep - a perfect SPAZ environment.
TUne IN
TUrn ON
and
SPAZ OUT



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 16:59:46 1996
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To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I see valid arguments on both sides of this issue.  Since I can't fully
agree one way or the other, I will abstain in this.  If any are uncertain,
they might want to do the same.  I do it to make a point, though, not to go
with the flow, dig?

Go with your concience, my sisters and brothers!

- Eric P.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 17:06:07 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 17:05:45 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Benifit for 111 Minna St. Gallery
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This Friday there is going to be a benifit party for 111 minna st.

dj's will be.....Simon, Markie and Tracy...  This one is brought to you
by the same people who throw Outta Sight Friday Night...I'll have more 
info for y'all later today or tonght.  

       Peace, the Amebas

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 17:08:53 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 96 17:01:08 PDT
Subject: Re: Hello socal-raves! (fwd) 
To: Lauren Fox <lfox@alnitak.usc.edu>,
        Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Cc: socal-raves@UCSD.EDU, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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It would be cool to have a combined party!  I think that the party should 
be somewhere in the middle, though (between SF & LA).  Santa Barbara is 
still a pretty far distance to be travelling to from SF.  Somewhere in the 
middle would be more fair for all!

I'm on both lists & this would be a great way to meet people from both 
lists!!  Haven't met too many people yet from SFRaves, but I'll be moving 
to SF on June 15 & plan on meeting a lot of SFRavers!!

Teena

On Tue, 14 May 1996 16:53:17 -0700 (PDT)  Troy Sheets wrote:
>Obvious choice?  A future Horizon SB beach party.
>
>-troy
>

>> >Lauren
>> >
>> >ps, so when do you think Socal and SFRaves will decide to have a joint 
party
>> >somewhere mid-state??
>> >
>> That would be SO COOL!  I forwarded your ? to the list; let's see what 
kind
>> of response we get :)
>> 
>> Peace,
>> 
>> - E
>> 
>> 
>> 
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
>tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
>tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
>http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
>troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 17:14:45 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 20:14:15 -0400
Message-ID: <960514201413_113668549@emout16.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: SFR YOSEMITE TRIP! Need your help!
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**A CALL TO ACTION FOR ALL DUTIFULL SFRAVERS!**
Time to put those hours upon hours of useless web surfing experience to work!
 Next time your out, see what you can dig up on lodgings in the Yosemite
area.  Be creative in your search and may it yeild a place worthy to shake
our booties.  At this point I think we're open to cabins, campgrounds,
backwoods resorts, etc.  You'll know what will work when it finds you.
 Things to look for are "acreage", "secluded", "perfect for family reunions
or large groups",  "amenities", "rented by owner" etc.  Keywords that might
help are "Yosemite", "vacation properties", "rentals", "retreats", "group
camping" etc.  BTW: the national parks Yosemite web sight sucks up there with
the worst of em!
***Don't forget to get your avail. dates to Matt (correspondent in cheif)
Lanier [lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu]***
***Talk it up out there, if we decide to do it in an outdoor stylee well be
able to pack em in.***

Seconding the motion,
Steveo


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 17:16:40 1996
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Eric,

This sounds like a lot of FUN! I'll help out in every/any way
possible?!

John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 17:20:02 1996
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A suggestion from our socal counterparts... - E

>Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 17:12:00 -0700
>X-Sender: marcus@technologik.com
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>To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@synopsys.com>
>From: Marc Fathauer <marcus@technologik.com>
>Subject: Re: Hello socal-raves! (fwd)
>
>>>>ps, so when do you think Socal and SFRaves will decide to have a joint party
>>>>somewhere mid-state??
>>>>
>>How about the Santa Barbara Area? There are lots of x-Santa Barbara people
>now, living both up norh and down south. Those of us here would love to host
>all of you....
>>
>marcus@technologik.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 17:25:30 1996
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Return-Path: <owner-ff-planners@priscilla.ultima.org>
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hi.

some good friends of mine (and yours, too, perhaps) need a ride to
Tribal Future if anyone has space for two.  Tom and Monica can be
reached at 415.334-6788.  please call them directly, since i am
only posting this on their behalf, and they have no net connection
at the moment.

thanks.
-- 
=== Bryce Ryan ========= AMBIANCE ======== brycer@ultima.org ===
=== Internet Services, Education and ToasterNet Construction ===
===  Web Weather at http://priscilla.ultima.org/stats.html   ===



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 19:20:05 1996
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Subject: berkeley and stuff
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 21:20:03 -0500 (CDT)
From: "roger kumar" <rkumar@umr.edu>
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:)
i'm commin back to berkeley for the summer..

	if anyone needs an ambient/acid jazz dj, just ask :)

also, if someone in berkeley has a place for me to stay/sublet, please 
email me..

does anyone know if there are any dj's (moon earth ss?) at the chateau?

cya all soon

-- 
pJou_|        pgpfone encrypted calls and pgp encrypted mail accepted
    _l                            public keys on server or by request

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 20:15:27 1996
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To: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>, jsl@netcom.com
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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At  3:48 PM 5/14/96 -0700, Andrew Knutsen wrote:
>>      By letting them have their own news group we are telling them that it
>> is ok for them as human beings to be racist and hate.
>>
>> >Stop the hate.  Destroy
>> >it before it ever comes to the surface.
>
>        Um...  wouldn't it be more effective just to go over there and shoot
>them all?  Or, we could be humane, and lock them up in camps...  yeah, thats
>the
>ticket.

No, I don't believe in either of these methods. It frustrates me to no end
that people with the same descent as myself are currently doing these
things in the Middle East.


>
>        Be very careful you don't end up playing the same game you started out
>to end...  And remember the tighter you hold the lid on, the faster the water
>boils.

In other cases that might be true, but this is primarily a small group of
white males. I don't see many people of other denominations comming to pick
up their bick lighter.

>
>        Let them have their damn newsgroup, then use it to tell them (and
>the rest of the world) what you think of them.


Frankly I can't be bothered, I'd rather just not let them in to the party.

Jon

>
>Andrew
>-----------------------------------------
>Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
>Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 20:21:31 1996
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To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee), Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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Thanx once again John...


Jon


At  4:32 PM 5/14/96 -0700, John S. Lee wrote:
>>>      By letting them have their own news group we are telling them that it
>>> is ok for them as human beings to be racist and hate.
>>>
>>> >Stop the hate.  Destroy
>>> >it before it ever comes to the surface.
>>
>>        Um...  wouldn't it be more effective just to go over there and shoot
>>them all?  Or, we could be humane, and lock them up in camps...  yeah,
>>thats the
>>ticket.
>
>It all depends on how you interpreted my words.  One can engage in battle
>many ways, some peaceful some not.  The more non-peaceful methods can come
>into play if all peaceful methods have been exhausted.
>
>Hate, IMO, is not to be tolerated.  This is not an intellectual concept.
>Hatred is sheer illogic.  To give it any merit, as if it serves some
>function other than the destruction of others, would not allow any
>civilization to progress but so far.  History has taught us this lesson all
>to well.
>
>I choose to fight racism via my words.  And through my actions I defy it.
>But if *they* wish to deprive me the opportunity to live, through *action*,
>then I'll have no other choice but to react in kind.  But I digress...
>
>And as for locking people up in camps, so far, some of the victims of this
>procedure in America to date have been Native Americans, African Americans,
>Japanese Americans, and Chinese Americans, oh yeah Hatians, Cubans...I
>think the last thing we have to worry about is a bunch of white
>supremacists getting put into concentration camps.
>
>>
>>        Be very careful you don't end up playing the same game you started out
>>to end...  And remember the tighter you hold the lid on, the faster the water
>>boils.
>
>I am very concious of the results of burying racism.  But I find lately too
>many all to eager to allow racism a pulpit from which to speak.  I was not
>implying keeping any lid on, I wished restraint in one medium.  I do not
>believe that all concepts are absolute.  To say that one should be able to
>say *ANYTHING* at *ANYTIME* is rubbish.  We KNOW there are boundaries.
>What I suggest is that, since we pay to be online, and it is a privilege
>not a right, and since things are done by consensus, that people act in a
>way that solidifies the community, not destroy it.  It would be like
>inviting the worst denizens of the night into a safe neighborhood all for
>the sake of diversity.  Even the concept of diversity has limits.
>
>I just say since we do have a choice, reject it.  Without fear that they
>will not have a voice.  They can choose other avenues.  Just as mainstream
>TV, or public TV rejects this drivel, so should we.  They have other ways
>to communicate their message, it shouldn't be on my time, or subsidized
>with my dime!
>
>>
>>        Let them have their damn newsgroup, then use it to tell them (and
>>the rest of the world) what you think of them.
>>
>>Andrew
>>-----------------------------------------
>>Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
>>Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538
>
>I prefer a pre-emptive method.  Your points are well taken, and I agree
>with some of what you said.  I just think you characterized my words
>incorrectly.
>
>Peace out,
>John

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 20:32:59 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Jon Zimmerman <bigz@bigz.com>
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Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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Prohibiting these bastards of having their own opinions and places to 
discuss them implies that they actually have something important to say..

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 20:35:25 1996
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To: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
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>John Lee-
>
>You made some excellent, well-articulated points.... after reading your
>posts, I *did* seriously reconsider my position on this issue--
>
>But I did not change it.   I may be new to this list, but I'm not new to
>this sort of debate.   While I was in college getting my poli/sci degree
>in Iowa, I did hardcore battle with the (then blossoming) Christian
>Coalition.   In our student government (UI being a Big Ten school)
>there is a fund of over $1mil of student fees to be allocated to student
>groups by the student senate.  Of course, our rabid rightwinger friends
>had a large presence in this senate, and we did some very serious,
>emotionally-charged debating on the senate floor about this subject:
>
>should a group of people with a "hate-oriented" agenda be allowed to pull
>resources away from "positive-oriented" groups?  (Replace "resources"
>with the words "bandwidth" or "s/n ratio".)
>
>This is a very healthy, very American debate.  One which should never
>stop being discussed.  Why, as a progressive/radical in the student
>senate, did I vote to allow student groups like the "Heterosexual Rights
>Coalition" or "Young Americans for Freedom" to receive student funds?
>Because as long as this is a free country, EVERYONE must be allowed to
>speak, whether hate-mongering murderers, pedophiles, etc.
>

Depending upon, of course, who owns the medium.  That right is not
instantaneously transferrable.  And that is the real issue here.  By
consensus, everyone on the net owns it, and has a voice.  These people are
not representatives of the public, but a sector of the public.  The medium
is governed by these people, not the public.  The internet is NOT a public
resource, it requires money to maintain and participate in.  I do not think
such a vehicle, since it is not owned by public or public interests (really
just small and large companies), the same rules of free speech do not
apply.  The courts have ruled time and time again on these instances.  It
may be illegal to hand out pamphlets against your company on their lot.
The rules of free speech do not necessarily hold.  You might have to go off
of their property to excersize the right.  The right of freedom of speech
does have some domain limitations.  And *I* think the internet, in its
present form, should be ruled likewise.  At least by some consensus of
behavior by the participants.  This vote is a display of that ideal.

Since I have a say, since I pay for the medium, I vote to exclude, with the
consideration being that they have other means.  Even creating the group
itself, and letting people cancel it at their sites.  Whatever.  The vote
is a symbol of my belief about something that has torn the fabric of
humanity since we started.  And people, still want to talk about it.  Yes,
it needs a forum, but I do not think the notion of hate is legitimate.  It
is like the discussion of a flat earth.  A waste of time.

Hate has no useful purpose.  It is a destroyer.  It has other avenues, the
Use net for now should be spares any more rubbish.


>How else can the rest of us "know thy enemy"?  How else can we ensure
>that groups considered "dangerous" by cultural dominators like Newt or
>Rush or even Senator Ex on are allowed free speech in some future time
>when this country is (even more) dominated by right-winger s?
>(For instance, gays, "one-world-wide", the cypher punks, or the
>extroversion, or
>even deadheads--!)

Through their good use of CATV, Public Access, News Print, radio stations,
videos, training camps, etc.


>
>Should Dole win, and Congress remain Republican, don't you want the
>ABSOLUTE RIGHT of EVERYONE to be allowed a forum on Use net?
>
>Many of the descriptive language you use to villify the skinheads, etc
>(although I agree strongly with you), can and may also be used to
>villify legitimate, positive communities--- if the people doing the
>describing have the attitude of "well, there is a precedent for banning
>this kind of dangerous speech--- like when the Use net community
>disallowed those disturbed young Aryans a forum".

There are few words or phrases that are immune to distortion.  No matter
what is said.  I am not for censoring them, just deny them one medium, one
that I happen to own a small piece of.  I don't want to subsidize their
message or thoughts.  If you want to have the group fine, but excluding
them is an option also.  I think many providers will chose that route.
Remember, there are OTHER avenues and mediums to get their message out.

>
>or how bout this one:   "sure there's free speech, all you need is the
>money to put up a website".   Are you *really* saying that one must have
>money to speak one's mind?

Name the person who doesn't pay for Internet access.  Everyone pays,
somehow, somewhere.  Since it is subsidized by those who pay to use the
services, then they should have rights to exclude what they wish.
Especially if it violates a "community standard".  I think the net
qualifies as a community of sorts.  This is NOT unconstitutional per se.

As for the financial aspect, already answered.  The people in this country
who have a voice have money.  We are not heard due to the noise.
Unfortunately free speech has become bound by the dollar in most cases.
Sad but true.

this is not my ideal however, but it is a reality of the net.  You need
money to get & stay connected.  No money, no net voice.

>IMHO, this is exactly what makes the net so
>much more empowering than major media outlets like TV stations and radio
>stations:   many-to-many, without the need for good-ol-boy networks of
>rich fatcats, whose asses need kissing for access to "public airspace".

I hate that word, it's so overused, empowering that is.  The net is
empowering for those who have some mastery of the technology and have no
phobias.  The net is still too expensive for people on limited incomes, or
the poor.  Most of America is NOT wired.

The empowerment is of those who know the technology and are able to master
it to a degree.  Let's no forget the large number of people, not connected,
who have no voice.  Either on the net, or in real life.

>
>While your points are well thought-out and beautifully articulated, I
>hope you will consider mine before continuing your passionate arguments.
>

I also thought your points were good and valid.  The purpose is not to
necessarily sway your thinking, or change your mind.  Just want to discuss
other components of speech.  Things that make it tricky, at least to me.

Anyway, this thread is getting long.  I think the subject is quite relevant
to raves.  We engage in some provocative discussion here, and I think it is
proper to analyze the many sides of speech and how it might affect us.  For
instance, what happens a larger numbers of people join, and change the
demographic of the net.  What happens when there is a vote to not allow any
more drug discussion.

Lists are immune from this, so far.


>peaceout
>cubensis



Peace,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 20:46:36 1996
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From: Sami Khoury <khoury@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605150346.UAA21155@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
To: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 20:46:34 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605142152.OAA03557@cyberE.creative.net> from "Jon Zimmerman" at May 14, 96 02:52:48 pm
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Jon said:

> I would like to think that this is a community of intelligent people (with
> open minds) open to discussing problems and ideas. It is our privilege to
> exclude people who we don't think fit into our community, and might
> possibly destroy the amazing thing we have going on here.

This part is kind of funny.  You'd like to think this is a community of
open-minded people who are exercising their privelege to exclude those
who don't fit in?  uh...right :)

I am not saying they should or should not be allowed their newsgroup, but
don't claim that you'd like to prevent them from doing so in the name of
"open-mindedness".

> If we as a species are to evolve and succeed than we must get past these
> idiotic issues of race, color and creed.

Creed is an idiotic issue?

	Sami

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 21:14:45 1996
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From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: more on UCSC rave
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Ok fellow ravers here is where your raver abilities will be tested.  The 
UCSC gate is hard to get through w/out a UCSC parking permit and parking 
on campus is difficult.  However there is a bus stop right outside the 
front gate and if you get on that you can or the UCSC shuttles you can 
get right on the campus.  The shuttles stop running @ 12:00 and the buses 
stop @ 1:00.  Please keep this in mind but DONT LET IT INHIBIT you!


      ___                ___           ___     
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    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
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       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    











    







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 21:34:23 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 21:34:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: WHO SFRAVES
To: Jason Green* <Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
In-Reply-To: <n1380062674.97193@gateway.apple.com>
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On 14 May 1996, Jason Green* wrote:

> WHO SFRAVES
> 
> 
  i do...who doesn't?

      ___                ___           ___     
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    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
   /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
  /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
 /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
 \/__/~~/:/  /      \/__\:\/:/  / \:\  /\ \/__/
       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    











    







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 21:38:34 1996
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Message-Id: <31995FAC.4E3C@excite.com>
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 21:38:04 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Harmony Sunday and Venus
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Did anyone else who went to the Harmony beach party on Sunday notice 
that after the sun had just set beyond the horizon that Venus was 
shining brilliantly just above the ocean near the tip of cliff to the
left of the bay? It was an absolute singular beauty being the first
heavenly body to shine on Mothers Day! There we all were celebrating
loving each other with the Goddess of Love herself shining down on us
all! How perfect was that!?!?...it was true harmony.

Peace,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 21:48:45 1996
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From: Dimitri K Gortinsky <myself@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Harmony Sunday and Venus
To: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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i also heard that that day was 11/11 according to the mayan calendar 
(help me tara) and that venus and the moon were in alignment!
 
On Tue, 14 May 1996, John Kawamoto wrote:

> Did anyone else who went to the Harmony beach party on Sunday notice 
> that after the sun had just set beyond the horizon that Venus was 
> shining brilliantly just above the ocean near the tip of cliff to the
> left of the bay? It was an absolute singular beauty being the first
> heavenly body to shine on Mothers Day! There we all were celebrating
> loving each other with the Goddess of Love herself shining down on us
> all! How perfect was that!?!?...it was true harmony.
> 
> Peace,
> John
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 21:52:18 1996
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Message-ID: <3198BBAB.162E@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 09:58:19 -0700
From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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Organization: CT D-Zine
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFR T-Shirts
References: <199605142210.PAA27671@shellx.best.com>
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SDream wrote:
> 
> Ok folx!  I've only received one image for the SFR T-shirt logo and one vote.
> WAKE UP!!!!!  Help me out here!  Don't we have any creative, artistic types
> out there?  Give me your best shot!
> 
> To reiterate, we're trying to put together a run of T-shirts with some form
> of SFR logo.  I'm taking all logos and putting them on a web page so you
> folks can review them.  I'm taking logo entries in GIF, JPG, BMP, or PCX
> format.  Just attach it to an email and send it my way.
> 
> The page is at www.tgrigsby.com/sfraves.
> 
> There's no real deadline here, but come on: Show me whatcha got!
> 
> S

Well, I kinda let the shirt thang sit on the backburner until
everybody cooled off about Hard Copy. But, I'm back on the 
drawing board and open to any suggestions that you fellow sfravers
may have. Ask and you shall receive...

btw, the design I submitted was originally intended for laminates.
Anyone still down for the new laminate thang???
 
Hugs,

CT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 21:56:15 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Marc Fathauer <marcus@technologik.com>
Subject: MAPS MDMA test results (long)
Cc: socal-raves@UCSD.EDU
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Just thought I'd pass this on for yor information.Seems like DXM
(robotussin) is the main culprit in the fake e's that have been floating
around ( and not MDA, ketamine, speed, heroin, pcp or any other alleged
culprits).

MAPS MDMA Analysis Project

Rick Doblin

In February and March of 1996, people from around the United States and
England sent MDMA for analysis to a licensed testing facility. The purpose of
the study was to gather information about the quality of the MDMA being sold
on the underground market in the United States and England. Information about
the quality of MDMA is necessary in order to estimate the dangers faced by
users of illicitly manufactured and distributed MDMA and to place reports of
adverse effects in some context. 

A total of 33 samples were tested, 22 from the United States, 10 from England
and 1 from South Africa. Quantitative and qualitative analyses were conducted
on all the samples. The total cost of the study was $3,520. Nicholas
Saunders, author of E for Ecstasy, Ecstasy and the Dance Culture and the
forthcoming Dance,Trance and Transformation, donated $1,650 to MAPS for the
study. An additional $1,100 was donated to MAPS for the study from High Times
Magazine. A total of $660 came from MAPS' general fund and the remaining $110
was paid directly by a private individual. 

Technological Limitations
The testing was conducted with a gas chromatograph-mass spectrometer (GC/MS).
The gas chromatograph separates the different components of the sample. The
mass spectrometer identifies the atomic composition of each of the
components. This data is then compared by a computer to a data base of
hundreds of known drugs and other compounds to see if there are any matches.
In this way, many of the ingredients in the samples can be identified.

There are some limitations to the GC/MS technology. Certain inorganic and
some organic compounds may not volatilize and/or chromatograph and therefore
would not be detected. These compounds include baking soda, baby powder and
certain sugars that are sometimes used to dilute cocaine and other drugs in
powder form such as MDMA. There also may be many compounds that can be
detected by the GC/MS technology but are not contained in the computer data
base and therefore cannot be identified. 

United States Samples
We were fortunate to obtain a rather good geographic distribution of the 22
samples from the United States. Five samples came from New York State, of
those 3 came from New York City and 2 from other parts of the state. Three
samples came from near Chicago, Illinois. One sample was from Minneapolis, 1
from Eunice, Louisiana (near Baton Rouge), 1 from Charlotte, North Carolina
and 1 from Sarasota, Florida. Ten samples came from California, of those 3
were from San Francisco and 7 were from the Santa Barbara/Los Angeles area.
Despite the fact that the samples were from around the country, there is no
way to determine if they comprise a representative sample of the MDMA being
sold in the United States. Therefore, the results from this study can be used
only to draw inferences and not conclusions about the content of the pills
and capsules being sold as MDMA in the United States. Furthermore, according
to Nicholas Saunders, "you cannot be sure that any pill that looks similar to
the ones illustrated will have similar contents. When a pill earns a good
reputation, it is frequently exploited by dud lookalikes after a few weeks,
and the same press may be used for completely different ingredients."

Of the 22 samples from the United States, 17 were tablets and 5 were
capsules. Eight out of the 22 samples had no MDMA at all. Interestingly, all
the capsules contained MDMA while only about half of the tablets did so. Of
those samples that did contain MDMA, the highest dose was 119 mg. The lowest
was 45 mg. Of the 14 samples that contained MDMA, the average dose was 79 mg.
This average is significantly lower than the standard dose sold before the
criminalization of MDMA which was in the range of 100-125 mg. Doses lower
than 100 mg. are generally considered to be below the level at which many
people will feel the full effects of MDMA. 

Of the 14 samples that contained MDMA, only 1 also contained another
psychoactive compound identified by the GC/MS. That sample was a tablet from
New York State that contained MDMA and caffeine. In the remaining 13 samples,
MDMA was 100% of only three of those samples, all capsules from San
Francisco. The other samples contained a range of percentages of other
ingredients that were not measured by the GC/MS technology. For example, the
capsule of MDMA from Santa Barbara was only 59% MDMA, the capsule from
Sarasota was 85% MDMA and the tablet from New York City was 25% MDMA. While
these unidentified ingredients could have been another psychoactive
ingredient or a byproduct of manufacturing, they were not cocaine, heroin,
barbiturates, benzodiazapines, tranquilizers, hypnotics, ketamine,
methamphetamine, amphetamine or any of several hundred other compounds. Some
of these unidentified ingredients were fillers or binding agents used in the
manufacture of the tablets. Whether these unidentified ingredients are toxic
cannot be determined. The common rumor that MDMA is frequently cut with
heroin was not substantiated. 

Of the 8 samples that contained no MDMA, 2 contained the psychoactive drug
MDE (3,4-methylenedioxyethylamphetamine), a chemical cousin of MDMA that
generates an emotional reaction that is not quite as profound as that of
MDMA, and 1 contained an unidentified compound. The remaining 5 contained
various combinations of ingredients found in over-the-counter preparations
including dextromethorphan (an ingredient found in cough suppressants that
has an alcohol-like psychoactive effect especially in higher doses),
ephedrine/pseudoephedrine (a stimulant found in many plants, over-the-counter
medicines and Herbal Ecstacy and other similar pseudo-MDMA products),
phenylpropanolamine (a decongestant and mild stimulant found in cold
medicines), and glyceryl guaiacolate (a compound that dries sinuses and is an
expectorant). 
The ingredients in the samples that did not contain MDMA raise some degree of
concern since the interaction of genuine MDMA and ephedrine/pseudoephedrine
could provoke a significant elevation in blood pressure. Such interactions
could occur if someone were to take two different samples at a time, one
containing genuine MDMA and the other containing ephedrine/pseudoephedrine.
In one case, a person who had taken 20 mg. of pseudoephedrine in the morning
and MDMA later in the day reported having transitory severe anginal chest
pain.

England and South Africa Samples

Just like the samples from the United States, the 10 samples from England and
the 1 sample from South Africa are not necessarily representative of the MDMA
being sold in those countries.
Of the 10 samples from England, five contained MDMA. Three of these 5 samples
contained only MDMA, 1 contained a small amount of caffeine in addition to
the MDMA and 1 contained some MDE in addition to the MDMA. The average dose
of MDMA in these five samples was 128 mg., substantially larger than the
average dose of the samples from the United States. The only psychoactive
compound detected in 3 samples was MDE. In 2 samples the only psychoactive
compound detected was caffeine. Thus, 8 out of 10 samples contained some MDMA
or MDE, two drugs with a somewhat similar subjective effect. The 1 sample
from South Africa contained only one psychoactive ingredient, MDMA, and a
very substantial dose of 138 mg.

Conclusion
All the capsules from the United States contained MDMA while only about half
the tablets did so. The samples with MDMA were likely to be weak, averaging
only 79 mg., well below the standard dose generally considered to be in the
range of 100-125 mg. The one capsule from England contained caffeine and only
half the tablets contained MDMA, averaging 128 mg. per tablet. It seems that
the doses of MDMA in the United States are lower than those in England,
perhaps a contributing factor in the virtual absence of MDMA-related deaths
in the United States.

Four out of 10 samples from England contained MDE while only 2 samples out of
22 in the United States contained MDE. Perhaps there are differential
penalties between MDMA and MDE in some countries in Europe, in the United
States both MDMA and MDE carry the same penalty.
While there were no toxic additives found in any of the samples, there were
unidentified ingredients in virtually all the samples. It is possible that
all of these compounds were benign fillers or binders of some sort used in
the manufacturing of the tablets or benign "cuts" used to expand the amounts
of the powder. However, the safety of MDMA tablets and capsules cannot be
determined with certainty. Nevertheless, the claims that MDMA is frequently
mixed with crushed glass, rat poison, heroin and other dangerous substances
has not been substantiated.*

NOTE:  If any MAPS readers are interested in obtaining anonymous,
qualitative-only analyses of samples of illicitly manufactured drugs, Drug
Detection Laboratories will conduct such analyses for $100. Samples should be
sent in a crush-proof manner to DDL, 3117 Fite Circle, Suite 104, Sacramento,
CA 95827, (916) 366-3113. Include a note that indicates what you think the
drug is supposed to be and assign a six-digit code number to your sample so
that you can call  DDL about two weeks after your sample would have been
received to learn the results anonymously. Please indicate that you read
about DDL in MAPS.
marcus@technologik.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 22:45:02 1996
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From: Wurzle@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 01:44:32 -0400
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Wurzle's back ! :)
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    Well all, I'm back from my world travels and I can't wait to see you all
at the next party I go to.  I was just in Israel for a month and a half,
Ireland for a month, and then london for about a week.  Just thought i'd drop
a line to say hi, but maybe I'll write up a report on the party scenes there
:)
           Hugs, Wurz§

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 22:50:54 1996
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 14 May 1996 22:50:51 -0800 (PST)
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 22:50:51 -0800 (PST)
Date-warning: Date header was inserted by SONOMA.EDU
From: Jonas Hanning <hanning@SONOMA.EDU>
Subject: Last chance!!! =)
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Fellow ravers (yeah, I know I still have to show up at something
to become one...).

May 20th is approaching a lot faster than I want it to, and I
still have some equipment to sell. Here's the rundown on it...

* 1 Technics SL1200Mk2 turntable. It is about 2.5-3 yrs old,
according to the guy who sold it to me less than 3 months ago.
The condition is great (they ARE Technics, remember?), but it
could use some cleaning. =) The cart is a Technics w/ a Stanton
styli. And oh, it IS an original US version. I paid $700 for
the pair, and I'm asking something like half of that for this
beauty. However, it's negotiable. =)
* Harman Kardon 3250 Stereo Receiver. This baby rocks! =) Paid
$320(+tax)+60 (5 yr warranty that covers just about EVERYTHING) for
it when I bought it in February 1996. 
* a pair of DCM KX10 speakers. They have a 10" bass woofer, a 6"
midrange and a 3/4" tweeter. If I had anything to say in the matter,
I would _NOT_ sell these! But I have to. I paid $340(+tax) for the 
pair, and I'm asking about $300.
* Packard Bell 14" monitor. This was bought 4-5 months ago for 
$280(+tax) and it's going to whoever wants it....basically. =)

Like I said, I need to sell this ASAP, so give me a call at
707-795-2846. Thanks a bundle.

reeeeespect, jonas
...........................................................
..::DJ E(skimo!)::....:::Jonas Hanning:::....::dabalhed::..
.......:::http://www.sonoma.edu/students/hanning/:::.......
...........................................................


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 22:58:17 1996
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Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 22:58:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tinsau <amdice@puc.edu>
To: b e n c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
cc: "'sfraves'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: experience?
In-Reply-To: <01BB4002.F1B7FDE0@n145.solano.community.net>
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Four of us made the trek from Napa down to Experience. There were several 
downsides to the party, mainly fairly dark, minimal lighting, little 
decoration and visuals, and quite a bit of heat, although it was not that 
bad. These were only minor irritations compared to the awesome trance 
that flowed nonstop. The music was totally mental, just the way I love 
it. The real problem came from the water situation. What water they had 
was $2 a bottle and that supply ran out by three AM. After that people 
just had to start leaving or risk severe dehydration. It thinned out 
quickly and cooled down some but when they still had no water at just 
after 5 am my friends and I left. It really was too bad because the music 
was so phenomanal.  This is the second GK production with a solid goa 
room I have been to and because of this I will look for them in the future, 
but the water situation HAS to be better planned. 

Now before everyone thinks this was a terrible event, I have to say in 
the smaller goa room people were going crazy all night, letting the dj's 
know how good the music was, I met many happy people (including some guys 
who just moved here from Chicago, so we welcomed them as best we could, 
they were used to larger parties with more people sitting around i.e. not 
as much dancing), gave out a couple of bananas and a bunch of candy I 
brought. Sounds like madness was excellent but I wouldn't trade my 
"experience" as each event builds toward a collective experience and I 
can't say I have ever been to a terrible one yet.

Til next weekend at Space teddy and the BTB (in rave costume)
  Austin                             
  Tinsau                    

            S.F. Born and Raved!                          











From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 14 23:43:21 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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To: moonpup@hooked.net, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: mi planz: Fresh Start This Sat
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Erik: here's the scoop:
Square one presents "Fresh Start" Sat May 18th
These guys are great, they got the love & I expect to see ii show in their
party.
Virgin Location (I've heard it's pretty dern special)
Only $10
Line Up isn't anything phenomonal but I expect to hear some fresh sounds:
D.J.'s lego, pelican boy, karizma,rig a tony, Dr. Jimmy Zimms, ambient by rig
a tony
Map Point info 415 263 3987
Any other SFRers goin?? lemme know

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 00:29:54 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: UCSC FREE RAVE = for all (fwd)
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Well it is here. Dionysus Dreams will be performing live at Oracle. 
Please come by if you can and say hi!

Ran

                      ( oh yes )
                          /
                    -=*=-/
                      ~



---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:55:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: -=]madame mercury[=- <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: UCSC FREE RAVE = for all

All right...

Join us for "Oracle" @ the UCSC campus May 31st.
dance area and ambient chill zone
for more info. write to mhg@cats.ucsc.edu

don't forget...it's FREE

      ___                ___           ___     
     /\__\              /\__\         /\  \    
    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
   /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
  /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
 /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
 \/__/~~/:/  /      \/__\:\/:/  / \:\  /\ \/__/
       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    











    









From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 01:23:03 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 01:22:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Fred Heutte <phred@well.com>
cc: nw-raves@hyperreal.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: a couple of weekends worth (long). . .
In-Reply-To: <199605131044.DAA22088@well.com>
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Dear Fred:

My boyfriend who used to rave a few years ago but stopped was expressing 
some of the same sentiments as you were in the text.  In his opinion
there is no such thing as rave anymore becuase for him it has forgotten
its original purpose when it moved into the clubs and out of the
warehouses ( a movement which I fear will only be continued with the
introduction of the stadium in China Basin).  From what I understood the 
increase in the price of admission and the movemment into spaces where
the spectacle of the rave seems to become focused back onto the pony
show of a lot of clubs and not the music and the vibe it creates is
abhorrent.  I began to rave a lot later than him and though I am aware
of the times and the history of Mr. Floppy, Sharon, and so on I was not
ready at the time to be a part of it though I am only a year younger than
him. I understand the scene has changed and in some ways I agree with him
zzzzbut I also know that I have to find my own path as does the scene.  
Change, it should be stated is inevitable as eenergy of any time is not
static but in flux.

I guess what I am wondering from the older timers is why they think the
scene has changed and why they think the change has been ineffective if it
has been.  I was not part of the early rave scene but I still have what I
think have been some tremendously transcendentsl experiances.  I raved at
BI this weekend and though the vibe was at first hard for me to enter I
still tripped solely off the music and at times with the person I was with
:).  I suspect this is a transition time for the scene, maybe it won't
continue but that shouldn't be necessarily bemoaned.  I guess the
question should be if the values are being forgotten.  If the values are
being forgotten than we have a problem.

I was interested in finding out kore about "healing raves" like Mission
Vortex.  I have met people from England who have come to SF simply becuase
because they consider the scene in CA to be more spiritual.  Has anyone
been to one? Is it true?  Just some thoughts . . Maybe it is time to
reexamine what we are doing and try something new .v.vwhat would people
like to see?

Musing,

Cassandra

 On Mon, 13 May 1996, Fred Heutte wrote:

> 
> Sorta dropped the ball on saying anything about last weekend.
> 
> First I should mention Susie's most excellent birthday party, where
> the apple and pear cider were definitely better than my mixing :)
> I missed Harmony as a result but had a real good time anyway,
> especially my periodic geekfest with Laura, one of the chief geeks
> at Infogeek, I mean Infoseek :)
> 
> Last Saturday was the sfraves picnic, about which nuff said except
> the weather was awesome and so was the music and the company.  
> 
> I went to Down to Earth, the Pacific/Sunset party, on Saturday night,
> in a very interesting gallery/performance art place at 21st and Mission.
> There is another party there next week, I think (different organizers).
> I didn't have a chance to talk with Polliwog about it since she was
> spinning at the time :)  but I gather she is involved with this space
> on an ongoing basis.  John Howard was down in the basement playing
> really cool jazzy stuff, a real treat for me at 3 am instead of the
> usual bang-yer-noggin stuff.  I stuck around for some of Galen's set
> and then went to Wicked, but it just didn't do anything for me so
> I went home a bit early.
> 
> Sunday afternoon was my first Sunset of the year, and fine one, if a
> bit on the chilly side.  Alex really impressed me and managed to keep
> everything going despite the fact he was playing (techno) at sunset!
> 
> Sunday night was like a flashback to my raving past, circa 1992.  Three
> places, two and a half misses.  I got to 1190 Folsom (ok, 683 Clementina
> since you have to go in the back door) after midnight, after the Ameba
> crew had already cleared out.  This was for the Sci Fi Club, where
> Brenda and I had a memorable evening a few weeks back.  But this time,
> it was Not Happening -- about 20 people in the dance room listlessly
> shuffling to the usual hard trance stuff, and five people in the bar --
> two DJs, a bartender, another customer and me.  I drank a beer and split.
> I missed the Sub Base party down at 290 Howard by a short bit, by the
> time I got there it was already closed down.  They had a nice flyer,
> has anyone been since?  Finally, since I was nearby, I dropped into Spundae.
> I really don't care for the space or the crowd, but James Christian from
> NYC, whose records I like quite a bit, was playing so I had a chance to
> check him out.  Standard NY club/hard house, nothing spectacular.  I did
> have a chance to meet Peter, one of the co-promoters of Spundae.  They're
> quite busy now -- doing Nikita on Friday at 1015, Spundae on you-know-when,
> and out of town events on Saturday, the first of which was here in Portland
> last night.
> 
> Monday I shopped for records and found excellent jungle/drum + bass at
> Zebra in the lower Haight.  Definitely check them out.  Tweekin continues
> to please me with their broad and deep house selection, and they're adding
> more techno and jungle as well.  I heard (and passed) on both new albums
> by Underworld and Orbital.  Finally checked back in at Ameba and spun a
> bit before heading out of town.  Got my cool-as-you-like Tribal Future
> tickets, get yers soon!
> 
> This past weekend was a bit more restricted as I have a big work project
> I'm wrapping up.  But we did our first Portland outdoor event this year,
> organized by Jeremy.  This was at a beautiful spot right on the Columbia
> River, across from about NE 15th in Portland.  It drizzled but never got
> too wet.  Toonz by Cory West, Jeff (who brought out a fine speaker system),
> yrs trly and Jeremy, whose was unfortunately shut down due to the generator
> running out of gas :-)  I played both LTJ Bukem's "Rain Fall" and Hardkiss'
> "River and Rain" in honor of the humidity :)  About 40 people showed up,
> many from Seattle, and despite the weather it was a nice way to start up.
> Jeremy's got one a month scheduled at various Vancouver area locations
> through the summer.  
> 
> Last night, Spundae brought their road show to Portland.  Lots of
> production,
> lasers, big sound, two full rooms of stuff, at Roseland.  I mostly stayed
> in the main room where Carlos kicked off a big charge and led into a nearly
> three-hour set by the Deep Dish guys, Dubfire and Sharam, who traded off
> three-and-three for the entire set.  They spun very well though not like
> DJs do, more like record producers do (which they are).  Lots of test
> pressings, not much continuity from track to track but lots of excellent
> ones.  Vocals, hard house, tracky stuff all mixed together.  Carlos and
> Brenda and I had a good time funking out bigtime to some of the tunes
> early in the set.  
> 
> Very little vibe of any note, but the crowd was relatively relaxed.  I saw
> one of the local promoters breaking up a big circle early in the Deep Dish
> set.  A half a dozen guys with satin jacket emblazoned with their Breaks
> Crew name showed up, one even had a crash helmet on his head.  I guess
> they were determined to be the show.  The promoter had other ideas.  He
> told them off, they grumbled a bunch and then melted.  This thing about
> ravers and circle dancers is like the mods and rockers.  It's a culture
> clash that won't go away.  It'll be interesting to see how this progresses.
> 
> The Spundae party here is the wave (rave) of the future, I think.  Say
> goodbye to warehouse parties.  I haven't been to a one in Portland in
> years that really has had much going for it.  Occasional sets -- DRC
> a couple of weeks ago, Emma last fall, Derrick Carter's awesome three-deck
> mix, Garth a way long time ago -- stand out for me, but I've never had a
> *good* time at one of these.  Spundae had a bit more of an age mix and
> clearly these big-production affairs in club spaces are where things are
> going.  We are about to witness the Americanization of the UK club scene,
> and this is the precursor.  Spundae is starting down the path of the
> superclub model, where they build up a name, a local crowd, bring in
> the big name DJs, and then starting planting their operation all around
> the country.  I wish Spundae well but their concept and their crowd are
> not what I got into all this for, although I certainly enjoyed the music
> last night.  
> 
> For $16, everyone got a good deal at Spundae, but I still prefer to haul
> equipment across the sand and play outside . . .
> 
> phred
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 01:30:04 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 01:30:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: well, yosemite is coming along slowly
In-Reply-To: <199605140712.AAA21985@taz.hyperreal.com>
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Dear all:

I am pretty free in June so dates are not a problem but I would prefer a 
cabin to a tent just becuase then there would be a chill place to retire 
to if needed.  I would probably want to stay outside.

Cassandra

On Tue, 14 May 1996,
matthew d. p. k. lanier wrote:

> hello all-
> 
> just a report from the yosemite correspondent.
> 
> i think we have enough people to make the trip worthwile!  now, i pose the
> following questions:
> 
> 1) are we looking for cabin life or tent life?
> 
> 2) i got several requests to change the date, so i will run a poll:
> 
> could everybody remotely interested in this trip e-mail me with their
> prefered dates?  in about 3 days, i will tabulate the results and return
> them with the optimal dates.  make the subject "dates" and send it privately.
> 
> 
> till next time a decide to download my 500+ messages / day...
> 
> peace, love, and yosemite-
> 
> matt l.
> matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
> lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
>                                   /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
> home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
>                                 /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
>                                /   ++++   \
> "i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
> window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
> unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
> saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
> reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
> the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
> the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
> the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
> for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
> and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
> would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."
> 
>      -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 01:48:51 1996
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 15 May 1996 01:48:44 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 01:48:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: drenalin <drenalin@OREGON.UOREGON.EDU>
Subject: NRR Re: berkeley and stuff
In-reply-to: <199605150220.VAA29360@saucer.cc.umr.edu>
To: roger kumar <rkumar@umr.edu>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Tue, 14 May 1996, roger kumar wrote:

> 
> also, if someone in berkeley has a place for me to stay/sublet, please 
> email me..
> 
On that note, I just talked to a friend Sig today.  Some of you may know 
her.  She doesnt have net access right now but asked me to post that she 
has a vacant room in her two bedroom apartment.  Can be filled immediately.

Sig is raver friendly.  Rent is $277.50 permonth.  The place is in North 
Oakland very near Cal College of Arts and Crafts (where Sig goes to 
school).  Right between two BART stations by walking distance.
If you or someone is interested give here a call at (510) 655-4743 or 
email me and I'll get her the message.

love scott

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 02:12:13 1996
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 15 May 1996 01:51:02 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 01:51:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: drenalin <drenalin@OREGON.UOREGON.EDU>
Subject: A great story (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 21:10:07 -0700 (PDT) 
From: Ariel Meadow Stallings <ameadow@u.washington.edu>
Cc: nw-raves@hyperreal.com
Subject: A great story 


Listen I just have to share this one little bit of a much larger party
story (which, if you'd like the unabridged version, can be found at
http://weber.u.washington.edu/~ameadow/imri.html tomarrow)...

I went to a party in SF last weekend with this guy named Imri.  His deal
is that he travels for a living, selling a bizarre pink industrial cleaser
called "Magic."  His job is just an excuse to travel to as many cities as
possible and enjoy raves all over the country.  So, he and I were dancing
our asses off at this great little soiree called Madness, and he leans
over and says "Don't you feel right at home?"  There I was in S.E. San
Francisco, with 400 people I didn't know (including Imri himself, I met
him by asking a clerk in a store who I could hook a ride with) and yet
strangely, I had to say "Yeah..."  He continued on to say "This is what I
love about this community...no matter what city I'm in, or what the hell
else is going on, once the music starts, and it's me and all these people
dancing, I'm right at home."  It was true.  I was at home.

What a great feeling.

Ariel



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 09:00:03 1996
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To: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Vote NO on neo-nazi-newsgroup (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Prohibiting these bastards of having their own opinions and places to
>discuss them implies that they actually have something important to say..

It also lends them strength, by thinking that they're feared.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 10:32:27 1996
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From: teena@lioness.compute.com
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Date: Wed, 15 May 96 10:28:25 PDT
Subject: Re: Hello socal-raves! (fwd) 
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu, Chuen-Pei Ng <Teknosis@ucla.edu>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Oops...How can I forget our SD Groodies (Sorry Brian & Julian)!!!  :-(  I 
love the SD Groodies!!!  They always seem ready to have a great time & 
always seem to bring a positive vibe!!!

I'm not sure how far north SFRaves covers.  Probably Redding/Chico area, 
as I think the next raves group north is NWRaves (Oregon & Washington).

Does anyone know on SFRaves how far north it covers?

Teena

On Tue, 14 May 1996 13:16:30 -0700  Chuen-Pei Ng wrote:
>teena@lioness.compute.com wrote:
>> 
>> It would be cool to have a combined party!  I think that the party 
should
>> be somewhere in the middle, though (between SF & LA).  
>
>Correction!!!  It should be somewhere between SF & SD ... =)  Don't 
forget about the 
>SD groodies!!  btw, how far north does SF-raves cover?
>
>--Chuen
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 10:41:35 1996
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	id AA832180750 Wed, 15 May 96 10:19:10 PST
Date: Wed, 15 May 96 10:19:10 PST
From: "Waterstreet, Andrea" <awaters@mfi.com>
Encoding: 1377 Text
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re:  the something free story
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     The Something Free crews' experience last weekend really makes me 
     burn, because it reminds me of something very similar that happened to 
     me.  (A couple of gang kids--at least they were flying the colors and 
     tats--were trying to steal my poor Vespa when I came out of an event, 
     and then proceeded to pull a gun on me when I protested. I made a 
     bunch of noise, and they used the gun to put a big dent in the freshly 
     painted cowl. :(
     
     What is the freaking story????  It seems like if you go to an UG these 
     days, you see a bunch of kids hanging in the parking area with no 
     intention of going in, and ready to cause mayhem.  And they all throw 
     out those wonderful "I'm packing an arsenal--don't fuck with me" 
     vibes.
     
     I know that there surely are shining examples of kids who don't pull 
     this poop, and I remember all to well my trials and tribulations when 
     I wanted to get into over 21 clubs.  But it seems like there are more 
     fools with heavy weaponry than ever, and there's not a whole lot that 
     anyone can do about it.  (The rational approach just don't cut it!)
     
     Anyone have a good method of dealing with the kids, and not becoming 
     totally depressed at the state of society???
     
     
     Andrea
     awaters@mfi.com
     

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 10:56:21 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 96 10:55:51 -0700
From: swoosh@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (John Elias Darrow)
Message-Id: <9605151755.AA03488@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Wish (BSP)
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I just wanted to invite everyone who is itching for something to
do tonight to come out to Wish.

It's a small affair with good people and music...

Wish - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663 
[5.15 - Henrik] 
[5.22 - Grover (Las Vegas)] 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 11:17:01 1996
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From: Begroovy@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 14:16:27 -0400
Message-ID: <960515141625_301333505@emout15.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Please take neo-nazi discussions to another forum.
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

I am writing to request that people start thinking about the volume of e-mail
they are creating on sfraves. I have nothing against pertinent rave
information being posted to this address. Week long ranting on subjects as
disconnected as neo-nazis are to ravers is ridiculous. As well as the Tracy
Lords deal. I am sure there is a Tracy Lords fan newsgroup you could vent
your steam at. I am definately possitive that there is at least one neo-nazi
news group to vent your steam at. Before sending e-mail to sfraves, THINK.
Could this post be sent as a personal e-mail? Could this post be sent to a
news group where people would give a shit about popstars and neo-nazi's? I
believe issues such as upcoming events, organizing things like cabin trips,
finding rides and places to live, selling personal (not promoting retail
sales here) music and computer equioment, discussing rave technology,
discussing music ............is what this is about? Please think about these
things before posting. Have a great day, PEACE!!  Cid  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 11:17:10 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 11:16:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: the something free story
To: "Waterstreet, Andrea" <awaters@mfi.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9604158321.AA832180750@mfi.com>
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On Wed, 15 May 1996, Waterstreet, Andrea wrote:

> 
>      The Something Free crews' experience last weekend really makes me 
>      burn, because it reminds me of something very similar that happened to 
>      me.  (A couple of gang kids--at least they were flying the colors and 
>      tats--were trying to steal my poor Vespa when I came out of an event, 
>      and then proceeded to pull a gun on me when I protested. I made a 
>      bunch of noise, and they used the gun to put a big dent in the freshly 
>      painted cowl. :(
>      
>      What is the freaking story????  It seems like if you go to an UG these 
>      days, you see a bunch of kids hanging in the parking area with no 
>      intention of going in, and ready to cause mayhem.  And they all throw 
>      out those wonderful "I'm packing an arsenal--don't fuck with me" 
>      vibes.
>      
>      I know that there surely are shining examples of kids who don't pull 
>      this poop, and I remember all to well my trials and tribulations when 
>      I wanted to get into over 21 clubs.  But it seems like there are more 
>      fools with heavy weaponry than ever, and there's not a whole lot that 
>      anyone can do about it.  (The rational approach just don't cut it!)
>      
>      Anyone have a good method of dealing with the kids, and not becoming 
>      totally depressed at the state of society???
>      
>      
>      Andrea
>      awaters@mfi.com
>      


DMSO and LSD and a squirt gun. In about three seconds (so rumour has it) 
every cell in the body will be dosed when exposed to this blend. Oboy! A 
tripster with a gun! Just a thought (and a bad one at that ;) ).



Ran


                        -=*=-
                          ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 11:18:09 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Vote whatever on neo-nazi-newsgroup
Date: 15 May 1996 18:42:27 GMT
Message-Id: <2992921710.10479398@compattic.com>
Organization: Computer Attic
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Well, would I listen to what anyone of a neo-nazi newsgroup have to say???

Nooo.


So would I subscribe to such a news group???

Nooo.

Remember, Us ravers are feared by certian members of the public because were
misunderstood... Here (SFRaves) we can put fouth our issues to light,
Banishing the myths that we're "Drug crazed dancin' loonies till dawn"...

So maybe if the Neo Group had ther place to say we can totally deny (or
confirm) the myths associated to themselves...

I being hispanic should have a strong "just say No" additude but, I happen to
know a few of the less extreme Neo Nazis.  Do I hate them? No.  But I try to
understand them... And Befriend them...

That's what we're all about, Remember?  PLUR 'N' LOVE

"Dance With Me",

              Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 599-5500
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 11:31:10 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 11:34:23 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Totally Cool Rave Art Work For Hire
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Hiya;

        Need a totally awesome artist to do your flyers, I have a friend
coming here from Austin, Texaxs who works for Origin Systems & Electonic
Arts, need I say more. I'll have some of his stuff for ya's in a bit.

        The dudes shading alone blows me away, no to mention the rest of the
drawing all done by hand.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 11:40:34 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 11:43:53 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Re: Raves in SF, The NEGATIVE "Experience"
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hiya All;

        What did I tell you not one promoter responded to this post, greed,
greed, greed; makes me sick. This is the same greed however that drives our
country and it's corporations; know it & recognize it for it is the enemy of
all living things.

        The pursuit of a material world is the loss of everything.

Peace
THX1138

PS Anyone got a dollar they can spare



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 11:58:29 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 12:01:58 -0700
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From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: It's Wedesday Yeah!!!!!!!!
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Hiya;

        Just realized it's Wedesday good night to go out and PARTY!!!!!!!
Mite do the B & D thang tonight, haven't worn anything black in a couple of
days, see ya out there.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 12:11:23 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 12:14:50 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, Marc Fathauer <marcus@technologik.com>
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Re: MAPS MDMA test results (long)
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Hiya;

        So I would like the ask the ? why is it that we feel the need to
belief that x is cut with h? Now there's one for the couch.             

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 12:29:50 1996
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Message-ID: <n1379959091.20558@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 15 May 1996 12:24:14 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Apple Rave in San Jose!
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP-QM 4.0.0 b1
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Tonight Apple is throwing a 'Rave' in Downtown San Jose.  This is part of the WWWDC in support of the "rave" and "sprocket" Apple products.  Playing live is Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orchestra.  I'm not sure who the DJ's are.  Starts at 8 and goes till 2 and its only 5 bucks!

doors open this wed.(5/15/96) night at 8pm

call this number for all the latest info:

408-345-1415

Now here's how to get there:

>From the Convention Center:

Head south on market. Pass San Salvador Street. Pass William Street. Go under the freeway. Go through the First Light past the freeway (Virginia). Make the next left on Martha Street. Once on Martha, go through the stop sign. The warehouse is on Martha Street, on the right hand side, between 4th and 5th streets. The front door is located on the corner of Martha and 5th streets. The address is 190 Martha Street.
****park on 5th street.

>From 280 North (Cupertino) take the 7th street exit. The intersection exit
forks 3 ways. Go straight. You are now on 6th Street going south. Make a
right on Martha (at the first stop sign). One block west on Martha brings you to our front door.
****Park on 5th Street!!





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 12:32:36 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: moonpup@hooked.net, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: mi planz: Fresh Start This Sat
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> Any other SFRers goin?? lemme know

I'll be there!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 12:47:07 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 12:49:20 -0700
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From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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Anyone going to this? I might have to check it out.



At 12:24 PM 5/15/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Tonight Apple is throwing a 'Rave' in Downtown San Jose.  This is part of
the WWWDC in support of the "rave" and "sprocket" Apple products.  Playing
live is Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orchestra.  I'm not sure who the DJ's
are.  Starts at 8 and goes till 2 and its only 5 bucks!
>
>doors open this wed.(5/15/96) night at 8pm
>
>call this number for all the latest info:
>
>408-345-1415
>
>Now here's how to get there:
>
>>From the Convention Center:
>
>Head south on market. Pass San Salvador Street. Pass William Street. Go
under the freeway. Go through the First Light past the freeway (Virginia).
Make the next left on Martha Street. Once on Martha, go through the stop
sign. The warehouse is on Martha Street, on the right hand side, between 4th
and 5th streets. The front door is located on the corner of Martha and 5th
streets. The address is 190 Martha Street.
>****park on 5th street.
>
>>From 280 North (Cupertino) take the 7th street exit. The intersection exit
>forks 3 ways. Go straight. You are now on 6th Street going south. Make a
>right on Martha (at the first stop sign). One block west on Martha brings
you to our front door.
>****Park on 5th Street!!
>
>
>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 13:11:27 1996
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Message-ID: <n1379956580.19255@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 15 May 1996 12:23:07 -0800
From: "Jason Green*" <Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Please take neo-nazi dis
To: Begroovy@aol.com, "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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        Reply to:   RE>Please take neo-nazi discussions to another forum.

THANK YOU!
This something that not only needed to be said, but it also something that I
said about a month back.  This a RAVE bulletin board, not a random discussion
forum - now don't get me wrong: I am NOT saying that the issues that have been
discussed, or that are being discussed on SFRAVES aren't important, they are
just not SFRAVES related.
Thank you...
Peace, love, and infinite positive energy...
-Jason
--------------------------------------
Date: 5/15/96 11:33 AM
To: Jason Green*
From: Begroovy@aol.com
I am writing to request that people start thinking about the volume of e-mail
they are creating on sfraves. I have nothing against pertinent rave
information being posted to this address. Week long ranting on subjects as
disconnected as neo-nazis are to ravers is ridiculous. As well as the Tracy
Lords deal. I am sure there is a Tracy Lords fan newsgroup you could vent
your steam at. I am definately possitive that there is at least one neo-nazi
news group to vent your steam at. Before sending e-mail to sfraves, THINK.
Could this post be sent as a personal e-mail? Could this post be sent to a
news group where people would give a shit about popstars and neo-nazi's? I
believe issues such as upcoming events, organizing things like cabin trips,
finding rides and places to live, selling personal (not promoting retail
sales here) music and computer equioment, discussing rave technology,
discussing music ............is what this is about? Please think about these
things before posting. Have a great day, PEACE!!  Cid  

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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 13:15:22 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 13:15:31 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: a couple of weekends worth (long). . .
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> The Spundae party here is the wave (rave) of the future, I think.  Say
> goodbye to warehouse parties.  I haven't been to a one in Portland in
> years that really has had much going for it.  Occasional sets -- DRC
> a couple of weeks ago, Emma last fall, Derrick Carter's awesome three-deck
> mix, Garth a way long time ago -- stand out for me, but I've never had a
> *good* time at one of these.  Spundae had a bit more of an age mix and
> clearly these big-production affairs in club spaces are where things are
> going.  We are about to witness the Americanization of the UK club scene,
> and this is the precursor.  Spundae is starting down the path of the
> superclub model, where they build up a name, a local crowd, bring in
> the big name DJs, and then starting planting their operation all around
> the country.  I wish Spundae well but their concept and their crowd are
> not what I got into all this for, although I certainly enjoyed the music
> last night.  
> 
> For $16, everyone got a good deal at Spundae, but I still prefer to haul
> equipment across the sand and play outside . . .



You and a lot of others, rick!  Based on my limited observations/experiences
of the past few months, I do see a lot of what you noted above.  I hear a
lot about big production vibe-less clubby raves these days (altho i always
choose to stay away from them & attend our smaller community-oriented
gatherings).  However, at least in SF from what I've seen, there are still a
pretty big number of people who are really interested in preserving the
smaller underground-style warehouse parties that are also still occurring
today.  Assuming what I've been told is correct, folks like the FnF crew &
others got together in order to try and have more of these types of parties,
for reasons like yours above, because the massive clubby vibeless parties
were really becoming prevalent.  I know there are a lot of people here who
fully support that idea and will continue to, because that is what they
really value in our parties.  And as was mentioned in some earlier posts, as
the underground becomes more "mainstream", this will in turn generate a new
underground behind that.  As long as there are enough people who are really
interested in maintaining what we currently have in our
Gateway/FnF/Harmony/etc parties, we will continue to have a thriving
underground consisting of people who really appreciate it & support it.  I
know that these types of parties have fallen by the wayside in other areas
of the country, but because this topic keeps recurring on SFRaves, it leads
me to believe that (as described over & over again by people who visit other
areas & by people who have come from other areas to our scene) at least San
Francisco is different.  San Francisco appears to have a definite large
number of people who are aware of this potential trend and are concerned
about where things may be going in the future.  This puts us in a stronger
position!  We are in the position of knowing what may come down the pike &
being able to prevent it beforehand, rather than wondering "what happened to
our scene" and having to fix what is already wrong.  When I was in Montreal,
the people didn't really seem to care too terribly one way or another for
anything beyond just the music, they had already lost what (I've heard) was
once a wonderful vibe & loving people.  Simply being aware beforehand can
easily prevent our scene from becoming that way.  I guess, to me, it doesn't
seem too difficult to do, as long as we remain aware of what's really
important to us as individuals and to the scene as a whole, and consistently
work towards those goals in the here-now.

Looking forward to more parties where we gotta haul that equipment down to
the beach! :)

Love,
Shawna


"Deedle deedle dee, wubba wubba wubba..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 13:30:10 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 20:30:02 GMT
Message-Id: <199605152030.UAA23425@shgc.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

Come-on all you hip gen-x 'ers! 
oh ya, and don't forget your highly disposable incomes...
Last I checked a rave doen't usally end at 2am, but starts to takeoff
around then!
Tell the market research dept. to try harder next time.
It's sad to see what happens to a movment that started with the "dreggs of
society"(i.e. the most creative and forward looking people around) get's
used by the most powerfull and elite members of society  (CEO's and other
good'ole boys and girls)
The end is near kids, enjoy it while it lasts!! 

>Tonight Apple is throwing a 'Rave' in Downtown San Jose.  This is part of the
>WWWDC in support of the "rave" and "sprocket" Apple products.  Playing live is
>Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orchestra.  I'm not sure who the DJ's are. 
>Starts at 8 and goes til 2 and its only 5 bucks!




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 13:32:51 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 13:33:09 -0700
From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Organization: r e g e n e r a t i o n  X
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To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
CC: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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I/m not going to miss it for the world.
I love events i can walk to.

hugs, ionX

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 13:38:36 1996
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Message-Id: <199605152006.NAA32518@ns.mauswerks.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Date: Wed, 15 May 96 13:37:04 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>, <Sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>Anyone going to this? I might have to check it out.

We should all go because I'm sure no one else will understand how to
dance to the music. Hee hee.

-Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 13:43:21 1996
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From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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Knucklehead wrote:

>Anyone going to this? I might have to check it out.
>
>At 12:24 PM 5/15/96 -0700, you wrote:
>>Tonight Apple is throwing a 'Rave' in Downtown San Jose.  This is part of
>the WWWDC in support of the "rave" and "sprocket" Apple products.  Playing
>live is Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orchestra.  I'm not sure who the DJ's
>are.  Starts at 8 and goes till 2 and its only 5 bucks!

Apple?  As in the company, Apple?  Throwing a *rave*?  Hey JSL!  You know 
anything about this?  Heck, I'll check it out just to see what an Apple Rave 
looks like...

Apple Raves, Apple Raves
Cinnamon, toasty, Apple Raves!
You need to dance 
so do your body a fave
Shake your thang at an Apple Rave....

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 14:00:34 1996
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Date: 15 May 96 16:57:33 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: What belongs on SFR?
Message-ID: <960515205732_71165.755_GHL82-1@CompuServe.COM>
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responding to Cid who feels that neo-nazi discussions and Tracy Lords
discussion's don't belong on SFR....  

I don't agree that these threads are totally off-topic for us -- the neo-nazi
discussion has to do with issues of censorship and rights on the internet --
which affects us, we are a sometimes controversial group, are we not?  ---- and
Tracy Lords is in fact a DJ who spins techno music in addition to other
escapades -- so once again, there is a real connection here... even if some of
us are not personally interested in joining in the debates...  and in fact
couldn't care less...

What I like is when it's clear in the header of a message what it's about so I
can skip it -- e.g., when someone's selling some equipment, I don't read it,
because i'm not a dj and don't have a phat sound setup at home.

And, frankly, I don't want to have to go searching for other news groups to
express an opinion on something that has to do with SFR -- I'd rather hear the
ideas and opinions of the people on here, with whom I have something in
common...   I mean, who do you think is ON a Tracy Lords newsgroup?  I don't
even want to think!

(my 200 pesos)

Leslie  ; )

p.s.  What would be nice is a "dead horse" filter on outgoing and incoming
messages ... you know, "is this message just more of the same on a subject we've
beaten to death already?"  -- if so ......   self...... destr...
uc........t.......


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 14:08:59 1996
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From: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
To: marcus@technologik.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: MAPS MDMA test results (long)
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 14:01:25 -0700 (PDT)
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> Ten samples came from California, of those 3
> were from San Francisco
> [...]
> In the remaining 13 samples,
> MDMA was 100% of only three of those samples, all capsules from San
> Francisco.

	Yes!!!

Andrew
-----------------------------------------
Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 14:16:59 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 14:16:51 -0700
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From: Brian Benitez <benitez@hotwired.com>
Subject: MAPS MDMA Results
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I missed the original post, can someone forward me the text of the MAPS
results?

Thanks,

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Brian Benitez                    Audio Engineer, HotWired
benitez@hotwired.com             http://www.hotwired.com/
. . . . . . . . . . (415) 356-3702. . . . . . . . . . . .



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 14:36:42 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: Sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Date: 15 May 1996 22:26:12 GMT
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Organization: Computer Attic
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Yea, I can see the Apple CEO's now,

"Ok guys, we just laid off another 3000 employees, how can we boost company
morale???"


"THROW A RAVE!!!"



-"Dance with Me",
                              Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 599-5500
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 14:42:48 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 14:42:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Deborah Grace Nadel <deborahn@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: the something free story
To: "Waterstreet, Andrea" <awaters@mfi.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9604158321.AA832180750@mfi.com>
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On Wed, 15 May 1996, Waterstreet, Andrea wrote:

- I talked to one of the DJ's that was there, and although his car wasn't 
damaged, he was really really angry.  He told me that in order to get out 
of there, they almost had to run some of the kids over, and actually did 
run over one of the kid's feet because he wouldn't move out of the way.  
I'm really glad no one got hurt (even the evil drunken kids), and it was 
only cars that were damaged.  I spent a lot of time reflecting how I 
would react in that situation.  To answer your question, although I do 
see a bad element in our society with violence and guns as the solution, 
(I know this will sound hokey), I think we should fight this solution 
with loving each other the best we can, supporting these fears by setting 
an example ourselves by showing that we have the balls to not resort to 
the cowardly method of using arsenal to show our bravery.  
I say fight the world with love and a happy raver mentality.
Eventually we'll have the rest of the world with us.
Love and hugs, 
Deborah 
--------------      
The Something Free crews' experience last weekend really makes me 
>      burn, because it reminds me of something very similar that happened to 
>      me.  (A couple of gang kids--at least they were flying the colors and 
>      tats--were trying to steal my poor Vespa when I came out of an event, 
>      and then proceeded to pull a gun on me when I protested. I made a 
>      bunch of noise, and they used the gun to put a big dent in the freshly 
>      painted cowl. :(
>      
>      What is the freaking story????  It seems like if you go to an UG these 
>      days, you see a bunch of kids hanging in the parking area with no 
>      intention of going in, and ready to cause mayhem.  And they all throw 
>      out those wonderful "I'm packing an arsenal--don't fuck with me" 
>      vibes.
>      
>      I know that there surely are shining examples of kids who don't pull 
>      this poop, and I remember all to well my trials and tribulations when 
>      I wanted to get into over 21 clubs.  But it seems like there are more 
>      fools with heavy weaponry than ever, and there's not a whole lot that 
>      anyone can do about it.  (The rational approach just don't cut it!)
>      
>      Anyone have a good method of dealing with the kids, and not becoming 
>      totally depressed at the state of society???
>      
>      
>      Andrea
>      awaters@mfi.com
>      
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 14:54:16 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605152154.OAA05675@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Well, since I know folks who work at Apple or contract their labor to
Aplle, I'd like to go just to see if I meet anyone I know! And, of course
there are SFRavers at Apple - it'll be good to see them too!

 I'll be wearing my SFR laminate - maybe even some Apple logo trash!

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:03:45 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:06:46 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: (NON-Rave) Internet Software Soon To.......
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Hiya All;

        After extensive trial testing of numerous Internet packages
available on da market I've found that NetManage's Internet Chameleon is da
shit.

        Their Full Blown Windows 95 32 bit stack version(non-dos shell) that
allows multiple dial up adapters to be run simultaneously will be available
in about a week. I like this package because it does everything FTP, Archie,
Handles Multiple POP Mail Accounts(Eudora Doesn't do this), Net Browser,
News Reader, Telnet, Gopher, Ping, Whois, Talk, Finger, and it has is own
text tag that allows you to highlight text within most application and mail
that to whomever. They are also a local company, right there in Cupertino.
The company also tells me the package is going to cost $30.00, how can you
go wrong.

        Sorry to take up bandwidth with this but e-mail, the internet, and
it's software are part of every group and person who access the net, and if
you had to do this yourself it would take you months as it did me.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:12:09 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:15:11 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Foustus/Adam Got A New Job
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Hiya All;

        Make sure you congradulate Adam/Foustus@aol on his new job,
congradats Adam.

peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:16:17 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:15:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: dumb jokes 
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Here are some dumb jokes for a slow, rainy day!!

Q. How do you catch a unique rabbit?
	A. U-NEEK up on it

Q. How do you catch a tame rabbit?
	A. The TAME way.

Q. What can you catch from kissing a bird?
	A. CHIRPIES, it's an untweetable disease!!


I'll stop now before I do any more damage!!!

XXOO,
kaysee	

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:29:27 1996
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Message-Id: <199605152157.OAA32741@ns.mauswerks.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Date: Wed, 15 May 96 15:28:42 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: "Mark Piercy" <piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU>, <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>Come-on all you hip gen-x 'ers! 
>oh ya, and don't forget your highly disposable incomes...
>Last I checked a rave doen't usally end at 2am, but starts to takeoff
>around then!
>Tell the market research dept. to try harder next time.
>It's sad to see what happens to a movment that started with the "dreggs of
>society"(i.e. the most creative and forward looking people around) get's
>used by the most powerfull and elite members of society  (CEO's and other
>good'ole boys and girls)
>The end is near kids, enjoy it while it lasts!! 

My, my, my. Before you start getting all pissy, you should know that 
Apple throws a bunch of parties every year for its' developers. It
just so happens that this one will have a rave theme, so what? I don't
think anyone is expecting it will be like a real rave!! It is sort
of cheesy, but what the heck. Maybe someone will actually have fun.

I wonder how many ravers are now Apple Employees or used to work there,
I know of a bunch myself. I really doubt the CEO's have anything to do
with it, nor do they care. Find something else to gripe about, please.

Amy Felix

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:34:23 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 22:34:18 GMT
Message-Id: <199605152234.WAA27319@shgc.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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>Um, I really don't think of nerdy Apple programmers to be the elite members
>of soicety.  They are just 'heads who know how to use computers.
>
>-troy
Apples' nerdy programers have nothing to do with this- it's the marketing
people-the programmers and other people who actually do the CREATIVE work
and make the products happen, they  never have any say in the actual
DIRECTION the company takes-those  decisions are made by CEO's, MBA's  ect,
people who know business and how it works.  Programmers are simply human
capital that makes investment returns possible.  An idea, no matter how
smart or novel has to make money and its not up to a programmer or
desingner to decide what will make $ and what wont.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:42:20 1996
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To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: nathan_moser@manual3.com (Nathan Moser)
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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>Anyone going to this? I might have to check it out.
>
I'll prolly go since I work in downtown SJ and I'm here late tonight
anyway. If nothing else, I'd like to meet the person is in SJ who's open to
renting out a warehouse for this sort of thing (maybe that's why it ends at
2am? or is it just that Apple doesn't want their employees and developers
having _too_ much fun? ;)

I'll wear my yellowish t-shirt with the graphic of a bumbleball toy (some
think it looks like a bomb) on the back, so say hi if you're feeling
social!

-nate



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:46:34 1996
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Ms. Phink wrote:

>>Anyone going to this? I might have to check it out.
>
>We should all go because I'm sure no one else will understand how to
>dance to the music. Hee hee.
>
>-Amy

In your case, wouldn't that be the blonde leading the blind?

<hehe!>

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:46:54 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: What belongs on SFR?
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>I don't agree that these threads are totally off-topic for us 

Bingo.  Leslie hit on the head.  My addition: There are the absolutely rave 
topics and then there are grey area topics.  I would imagine that just about 
any topic besides "where the raves are going to be" and then "how they 
turned out" would qualify as grey area.  

I think the pursuit of truth, fairness, equality, peace, love, acceptance, 
all these belong on this list and these are some of the issues that revolve 
around the neo-nazi topic (BTW: For the most part I agree with what John S. 
Lee had to say about that).  

As for Tracy Lords, whatever.  It was of very limited interest to me, it 
went on a bit too long, and it devolved into a battle over different 
people's sense of what's proper and moral.  Definitely a paler shade of grey 
there.  That she was attempting to break into DJing was the most interesting 
thing to me.

>And, frankly, I don't want to have to go searching for other news groups to
>express an opinion on something that has to do with SFR -- I'd rather hear the
>ideas and opinions of the people on here, with whom I have something in
>common...   

BIG Bingo.  I've made some mighty good friends on this list.  They 
constitute my rave family, and I want to discuss the topics with them.  Nuff 
said.

>I mean, who do you think is ON a Tracy Lords newsgroup?  I don't
>even want to think!

Pat Buchanan?  Oh, sorry, that's the neo-nazi group...

>p.s.  What would be nice is a "dead horse" filter on outgoing and incoming
>messages ... you know, "is this message just more of the same on a subject 
we've
>beaten to death already?"  -- if so ......   self...... destr...
>uc........t.......

<hehe!>  I like that one!

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:47:31 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 22:47:29 GMT
Message-Id: <199605152247.WAA27591@shgc.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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>I really doubt the CEO's have anything to do
>with it, nor do they care. Find something else to gripe about, please.
>
>Amy Felix
Excuse me???
So you think this is just for fun-Apple is spending a few thousand $
because they like to throw parties and they just love house music? I really
DO think the company is doing anything it can to increase market share and
be at the fore front of any trend they see as profitible .  I thought a
rave meant a little more than a 5 hour commercial at a night club.  Maybee
it's time to be realistic.

Mark


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:48:17 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605152248.PAA24759@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:48:12 -0700 (PDT)
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Forwarded message:
From owner-socal-raves@UCSD.EDU  Wed May 15 15:45:31 1996
From: Andy Kumeda <kumeda@intelenet.net>
Message-Id: <199605152207.PAA17660@natasha.intelenet.net>
Subject: Goa e-mail list
To: socal-raves@UCSD.EDU
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:07:01 -0700 (PDT)
Reply-To: andy@intelenet.net (Andy Kumeda)
Organization: InteleNet Communications, Inc.
X-URL:        http://www.intelenet.net
X-Phone:      714.583.3135
X-FAX:        714.851.1088
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Hello all you Goa lovers,

I have created an e-mail list dedicated to the discussion of Goa trance,
and anything else related to the Goa scene in general -- ie track
reviews, event listings, your favorite ingredient for Chai, etc.

This will be unmoderated, but irrelevant subjects (ie drugs, other types
of music, employment announcements, spams, etc) will NOT BE TOLERATED --
keep that stuff on Usenet.  The list is intended to be very low in volume, 
yet high in content. 

For those that are interested, subscribe by sending e-mail to the
following:
	majordomo@party.net
In the subject of the message enter the following:
	subscribe goa
To post to the list, send e-mail to the following:
	goa@party.net

Hope to see some of you there!

Andy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:48:19 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 17:46:14 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
Message-Id: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960515174548.24002B-100000@dfw.dfw.net>
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Anyone else joining me on this one?

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:07:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andy Kumeda <kumeda@intelenet.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: Goa e-mail list

Hello all you Goa lovers,

I have created an e-mail list dedicated to the discussion of Goa trance,
and anything else related to the Goa scene in general -- ie track
reviews, event listings, your favorite ingredient for Chai, etc.

This will be unmoderated, but irrelevant subjects (ie drugs, other types
of music, employment announcements, spams, etc) will NOT BE TOLERATED --
keep that stuff on Usenet.  The list is intended to be very low in volume, 
yet high in content. 

For those that are interested, subscribe by sending e-mail to the
following:
	majordomo@party.net
In the subject of the message enter the following:
	subscribe goa
To post to the list, send e-mail to the following:
	goa@party.net

Hope to see some of you there!

Andy


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:50:31 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:50:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tony Rose <trose@violet.berkeley.edu>
To: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: dumb jokes 
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960515150841.18209A-100000@value.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.ULT.3.91.960515154723.8686A-100000@violet.berkeley.edu>
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here is a funny joke to play on someone, almost guaranteed to work!
look around yourself...find all of the white colored things you can, then 
one at a time, ask yourself what color is that, after about four or five 
successful attempts to identify white as the color of white objects,
answer this question " what do cows drink?"



* * ** *** ***** ******** ************* ****************** 
Paul Anthony Rose
UC Berkeley Computer Science/ Mathematics
http://violet.berkeley.edu/~trose
_HARDER--DEEPER--FASTER
****************** ************* ******** ***** *** ** * *

On Wed, 15 May 1996, KaySEE wrote:

> Here are some dumb jokes for a slow, rainy day!!
> 
> Q. How do you catch a unique rabbit?
> 	A. U-NEEK up on it
> 
> Q. How do you catch a tame rabbit?
> 	A. The TAME way.
> 
> Q. What can you catch from kissing a bird?
> 	A. CHIRPIES, it's an untweetable disease!!


I remember this one kirsten very bad!!:)


> 
> 
> I'll stop now before I do any more damage!!!
> 
> XXOO,
> kaysee	
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:58:48 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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I seriously doubt that the "Apple rave" will have any impact on the true
rave community whatsoever.  It's as much a non-issue as the McDonald's
thing, and will have much less publicity.

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 15:59:52 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:54:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
To: THX1138 <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: (NON-Rave) Internet Software Soon To.......
In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960515220646.006e9fac@sanfrancisco01.pop.internex.net>
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Hey there ...

Does THX1138 = Brian Darkness ?

This message is very much in his writing style.

When do we get 'Stories of the California Highway Patrol' part 3/3 ?

-Dan


On Wed, 15 May 1996, THX1138 wrote:

> Hiya All;
> 
>         After extensive trial testing of numerous Internet packages
> available on da market I've found that NetManage's Internet Chameleon is da
> shit.
> 
>         Their Full Blown Windows 95 32 bit stack version(non-dos shell) that
> allows multiple dial up adapters to be run simultaneously will be available
> in about a week. I like this package because it does everything FTP, Archie,
> Handles Multiple POP Mail Accounts(Eudora Doesn't do this), Net Browser,
> News Reader, Telnet, Gopher, Ping, Whois, Talk, Finger, and it has is own
> text tag that allows you to highlight text within most application and mail
> that to whomever. They are also a local company, right there in Cupertino.
> The company also tells me the package is going to cost $30.00, how can you
> go wrong.
> 
>         Sorry to take up bandwidth with this but e-mail, the internet, and
> it's software are part of every group and person who access the net, and if
> you had to do this yourself it would take you months as it did me.
> 
> Peace
> THX1138
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 16:10:16 1996
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Message-ID: <n1379945864.16822@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 15 May 1996 16:07:02 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        "Mark Piercy" <Mark_Piercy@quickmail.apple.com>
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         Reply to:   RE>>Apple Rave in San Jose!

I think you guys are digging a little to deep into this.  Jeez, its just a party for the Word Wide Developers Confrence.  I work for Apple, but have nothing to do with this party.  However, the people that are in charge of this party have been in the Rave scene since the beginning and they DO know what they are doing.  There probably wont be much of a vibe there, but shit, Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orch.  are playing for 5 bucks!  What more do you guys want?  Just because its beeing sponsered by a Major Corportation does not mean its gonna suck.  There will probably be some cool internet and multimedia exhibits there to check out, and there will deffinatly be great music.  How much 'Market Share' do you think Apple plans to increase by throwing a party that *maybe* 200 people will show up at??  Trust me, Apple still has a few bucks in the bank to do bigger and better things to improve sales than throwing a rave in down town SJ.  Has any one seen the Apple "Mission Imposs!
 ibe" Powerbook commercial yet??

-M

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/15/96 3:54 PM
To: Mark Camp*
From: Mark Piercy
>I really doubt the CEO's have anything to do
>with it, nor do they care. Find something else to gripe about, please.
>
>Amy Felix
Excuse me???
So you think this is just for fun-Apple is spending a few thousand $
because they like to throw parties and they just love house music? I really
DO think the company is doing anything it can to increase market share and
be at the fore front of any trend they see as profitible .  I thought a
rave meant a little more than a 5 hour commercial at a night club.  Maybee
it's time to be realistic.

Mark


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From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 16:23:01 1996
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Date: 15 May 1996 16:17:17 -0800
From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
To: "Mark Piercy" <piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU>,
        "Ms Phink" <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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        Reply to:   RE>>Apple Rave in San Jose!

THANK YOU!  You said something that needed to be said!  (Iwould have said it
sooner, but I haven't had any time)
I work at Apple, and my partner Greg and myself throw the Harmony parties. 
THERE ARE LOTS OF RAVERS THAT WORK HERE.  The people that are organizing the
party have been in the scene for a LONG time - they're not a bunch of stuffy
business guys "trying to increase market share."  Why would Apple throw a
300-400 person party in a warehouse in downtown San Jose on a Wed. night to
better their public image?  I mean, PUH-LEEZ.  I think some people tend to be
a little quick on casting judgment /and or finding something to bash.  OPEN
MINDS ONLY, PLEASE
Thank you...
Peace, love and infinite positive energy...
-Jason
--------------------------------------
Date: 5/15/96 3:37 PM
To: Jason Green*
From: Ms Phink
>Come-on all you hip gen-x 'ers! 
>oh ya, and don't forget your highly disposable incomes...
>Last I checked a rave doen't usally end at 2am, but starts to takeoff
>around then!
>Tell the market research dept. to try harder next time.
>It's sad to see what happens to a movment that started with the "dreggs of
>society"(i.e. the most creative and forward looking people around) get's
>used by the most powerfull and elite members of society  (CEO's and other
>good'ole boys and girls)
>The end is near kids, enjoy it while it lasts!! 

My, my, my. Before you start getting all pissy, you should know that 
Apple throws a bunch of parties every year for its' developers. It
just so happens that this one will have a rave theme, so what? I don't
think anyone is expecting it will be like a real rave!! It is sort
of cheesy, but what the heck. Maybe someone will actually have fun.

I wonder how many ravers are now Apple Employees or used to work there,
I know of a bunch myself. I really doubt the CEO's have anything to do
with it, nor do they care. Find something else to gripe about, please.

Amy Felix

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Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Date: Wed, 15 May 96 15:28:42 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 16:23:44 1996
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From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
cc: THX1138 <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: (NON-Rave) Internet Software Soon To.......
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960515155227.23520C-100000@crl13.crl.com>
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On Wed, 15 May 1996, Daniel J. MacMillan wrote:

> Hey there ...
> 
> Does THX1138 = Brian Darkness ?

You hadn't figured that out YET?  Pretty slow, I must say!!! hahahah :)

-k

> 
> This message is very much in his writing style.
> 
> When do we get 'Stories of the California Highway Patrol' part 3/3 ?
> 
> -Dan
> 
> 
> On Wed, 15 May 1996, THX1138 wrote:
> 
> > Hiya All;
> > 
> >         After extensive trial testing of numerous Internet packages
> > available on da market I've found that NetManage's Internet Chameleon is da
> > shit.
> > 
> >         Their Full Blown Windows 95 32 bit stack version(non-dos shell) that
> > allows multiple dial up adapters to be run simultaneously will be available
> > in about a week. I like this package because it does everything FTP, Archie,
> > Handles Multiple POP Mail Accounts(Eudora Doesn't do this), Net Browser,
> > News Reader, Telnet, Gopher, Ping, Whois, Talk, Finger, and it has is own
> > text tag that allows you to highlight text within most application and mail
> > that to whomever. They are also a local company, right there in Cupertino.
> > The company also tells me the package is going to cost $30.00, how can you
> > go wrong.
> > 
> >         Sorry to take up bandwidth with this but e-mail, the internet, and
> > it's software are part of every group and person who access the net, and if
> > you had to do this yourself it would take you months as it did me.
> > 
> > Peace
> > THX1138
> > 
> > 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 16:45:42 1996
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Message-Id: <199605152314.QAA00201@ns.mauswerks.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Date: Wed, 15 May 96 16:44:59 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: "Mark Piercy" <piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU>, <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>Excuse me???
>So you think this is just for fun-Apple is spending a few thousand $
>because they like to throw parties and they just love house music? I really
>DO think the company is doing anything it can to increase market share and
>be at the fore front of any trend they see as profitible .  I thought a
>rave meant a little more than a 5 hour commercial at a night club.  Maybee
>it's time to be realistic.
>
>Mark


I think there are better ways of increasing your market share than 
throwing a small party somewhere in San Jose with house music. 
Yes, it is for fun.I don't know why that is so hard to believe.

Well, people will believe what ever they want. I am already sick of
discussing this, so I will be bowing out of the conversation now.


-Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 16:48:47 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 16:48:19 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Apple Rave: Freaky Chakra vs Single Cell
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say, before everyone knocks the Apple rave you all should know that 
Freaky Chrakra Vs Single Cell will be playing live along with DJ Liqiud 
and some others. That in itself is enough to spark my interest:)
-- 
salutations,
andrew
_____________________________________
ameba  1732 haight street sf ca 94117
mailto:ameba@netcom.com
http://www.ameba.com        |      \
415.750.9368                |       \
=====================================
                            |       /
                            |      /

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 16:59:19 1996
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To: Sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
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Anyone going to this? I might have to check it out.



At 12:24 PM 5/15/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Tonight Apple is throwing a 'Rave' in Downtown San Jose.  This is part of
the WWWDC in support of the "rave" and "sprocket" Apple products.  Playing
live is Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orchestra.  I'm not sure who the DJ's
are.  Starts at 8 and goes till 2 and its only 5 bucks!
>
>doors open this wed.(5/15/96) night at 8pm
>
>call this number for all the latest info:
>
>408-345-1415
>
>Now here's how to get there:
>
>>From the Convention Center:
>
>Head south on market. Pass San Salvador Street. Pass William Street. Go
under the freeway. Go through the First Light past the freeway (Virginia).
Make the next left on Martha Street. Once on Martha, go through the stop
sign. The warehouse is on Martha Street, on the right hand side, between 4th
and 5th streets. The front door is located on the corner of Martha and 5th
streets. The address is 190 Martha Street.
>****park on 5th street.
>
>>From 280 North (Cupertino) take the 7th street exit. The intersection exit
>forks 3 ways. Go straight. You are now on 6th Street going south. Make a
>right on Martha (at the first stop sign). One block west on Martha brings
you to our front door.
>****Park on 5th Street!!
>
>
>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 17:15:20 1996
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From: teena@lioness.compute.com
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Subject: FW: PLEASE CROSS-POST THIS!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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FYI-
---------------Original Message---------------

THIS IS A CALL TO ARMS!

On Wednesday 5/8, the tabloid TV show "Hard Copy" nationally
broadcast a slanderous report regarding the current California
desert-rave movement.  The sensationalized report opened up calling
desert raves "deadly teen orgies of sex and booze."  They aired many
images of ravers inhaling nitrous oxide and drinking.  They never
substantiated the claims that raves are deadly and orgiastic in
nature.

The report went on to make bold face lies about matters of safety
and responsibility at raves and falsely claimed that raves have been
forced out into the desert because of a "plague of deadly fires and
gang shootings."



Defaming comments such as these turn public opinion against us which
in turn makes it more difficult for us to obtain locations, permits
and insurance to continue to throw raves.

This was an obvious attempt at sensationalizing our movement for
their profit.  Although we cannot keep the media from profiteering
off of our efforts, we can do two things:

1) Educate ourselves a little better about these situations.  DON'T
start blabbing away to video cameras even if they say it's just for
personal use (This is what we were told at DUNE by the Hard Copy
"undercover team").  Be discrete, be smart, be safe and be
responsible.  Point out safety/medical concerns to promoters and
security personnel at raves. All of this is easy to do even while
you're having fun.

AND

2) Let the media know that we won't allow ourselve to be raped
anymore.  We aren't stupid.  We aren't unorganized. And even through
their efforts to discredit us, we're not going to stop raving!


I encourage you to do a few things

...to cross post this to techno/rave/DJ culture mail lists, newsgroups,
magazines and www sites to make others more aware of this problem.

...to disallow video cameras at ALL rave events.  This will ensure
privacy and tighten leaks to the media.

...to discuss this media relations problem in your locale and come
up with ways to keep this from happening in your scene.

and last

...to call the Hard Copy viewer comments phone # and let them know
that you are outraged by their irresponsible, inaccurate and
unethical report on desert raves. Make them understand that they
MUST be held accountable for the claims presented in their reports.
Remind them that they should be more committed to standards and
ethics of profesional journalism.

The Hard Copy # is 900/268-6868.  The call will be .50¢ but will be
a worthwhile investment for our movement.


This is OUR future in THEIR hands.  Do not let others who don't
understand our movement dictate to the public what we are about...
who we are.

TAKE CONTROL!

-Kc of DUNE




-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen




----------End of Original Message----------

-------------------------------------
05/15/96 - 17:14:12
Teena Jamieson
Sales Support Representative
Teena@compute.com

       N E T W O R K   I N T E N S I V E
        The Complete Internet Solution
                 800-273-5600
                   info@ni.net
               http://www.ni.net
-------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 17:23:14 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 17:23:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140b03adbfaf5fbeef@[146.225.72.168]>
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Not exactly what I expected to be my first party, now that I'm back in 
the Bay area...  but my roommate Ed and I are gonna go check it out!  
Being web developers (with Apple as a client), it sounds like a great 
opportunity to meet some fellow geek-freeks, as well as groove to some 
fine beats.   =)

I have a Mountain-Raves laminate, not an sfraves one, so I'll skip that 
whole thing and be wearing my white PLUR teeshirt!   Please come over and 
introduce yurself if you spot me!

peace
john

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 17:24:15 1996
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Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Date: Wed, 15 May 96 17:22:14 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Mark Piercy, piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU wrote:
>Come-on all you hip gen-x 'ers! 
>oh ya, and don't forget your highly disposable incomes...
>Last I checked a rave doen't usally end at 2am, but starts to takeoff
>around then!
>Tell the market research dept. to try harder next time.
>It's sad to see what happens to a movment that started with the "dreggs of
>society"(i.e. the most creative and forward looking people around) get's
>used by the most powerfull and elite members of society  (CEO's and other
>good'ole boys and girls)
>The end is near kids, enjoy it while it lasts!! 

Now, now, don't get all bitchy.  Sad to see?  See what?  This show hasn't 
even happened yet.  And I don't think there are going to be many CEOs 
there.  It's not a product introduction, it's not a media event, it's 
just a celebration for the Apple developer community.  And if you think 
that community doesn't include anyone as cool as you, you can piss right 
off.  This mailing list is home to plenty of Apple and ex-Apple people 
(me, for example) and more, I'm sure, who are connected to the 
third-party community.  There are all kinds of people everywhere.

And it's not like Freaky Chakra is suddenly going to suck because a 
corporation is signing the check.  What would be *genuinely* lame is if 
Apple (or anyone, corporate or not) were to decide to put on a party and 
hired a bunch of shitty DJs in the mistaken belief that they were tapping 
into the real house (or whatever) current.  And if the event were a 
success, *that* would be a genuine sign of the dying, co-opted scene you 
seem to be worried about.  (And of course, this does happen, 
unfortunately).
  
and then he said:
>So you think this is just for fun-Apple is spending a few thousand $
>because they like to throw parties and they just love house music? I really
>DO think the company is doing anything it can to increase market share and
>be at the fore front of any trend they see as profitible .  I thought a
>rave meant a little more than a 5 hour commercial at a night club.  Maybee
>it's time to be realistic.

Maybe it's time for you to relax.  Look, it's A PARTY.  For FUN.  A 
chance for people in the Apple development community to get together and 
enjoy themselves.  Things like this happen at every conference--I didn't 
hear anyone complaining about the Digital Queers bash at MacWorld in 
January.

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 17:31:22 1996
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Subject: Apple Rave
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Well, Market shares or not, I'm going! I just want to hear some good music. I
know Freaky Chakra and Single Cell will deliver that...Plus it's not to far
from me. So I'll see ya there whoever goes. I'm not sure what I'm wearing,
but I'll have on an SFR laminate..
 
Tim (knucklehead)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 17:32:29 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 17:32:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Subject: Apple Rave: It's Apple Co.!
In-Reply-To: <319A6D43.2FB4@netcom.com>
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Yeah, be thankful it won't be a Microsoft Rave!
I could imagine all kinds of horrible things at one of those:

	-The voicemail says the party starts at 10pm, but it gets
postponed about twelve times until it finally starts at 11 am the next day
	-They make you buy their own Microsoft Brand water, claiming
that 'all other waters are incompatible with this venue'
	-The sound system inexplicably shuts down every 30 minutes 
	-The visuals consist of slides of Bill Gates superimposed over
Windows wallpaper.bmps
	-After you get into the party and realize it sucks, you find
ticket vendors selling pricey 'ticket-supplements' that grant access to
another, hidden room where the better DJs and better vibe are
	-The promoters run around the party trying to buyout all the
small-scale smoothie vendors

So, support our Apple friends.  They're the last line of defense against
the mediocre hegemony that is Microsoft!

	-jon



On Wed, 15 May 1996, ameba wrote:

> say, before everyone knocks the Apple rave you all should know that 
> Freaky Chrakra Vs Single Cell will be playing live along with DJ Liqiud 
> and some others. That in itself is enough to spark my interest:)
> -- 
> salutations,
> andrew
> _____________________________________
> ameba  1732 haight street sf ca 94117
> mailto:ameba@netcom.com
> http://www.ameba.com        |      \
> 415.750.9368                |       \
> =====================================
>                             |       /
>                             |      /
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 17:43:37 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 16:28:25 -0700 (PDT)
From: TALILLA SCHUSTER <tas12@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: tas12@pluto
To: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: dumb jokes 
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960515150841.18209A-100000@value.net>
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Were these off popsicle sticks or what...:) my boyfriend and I keep the 
ones we find particularly nauseating (does anybody else eat popsicles and 
know what I'm talking about?) For instance, "What is a baby whale who 
cries?" -- "A little blubber" Anyway, all this is just a little too punny 
for me...Talilla:)

On Wed, 15 May 1996, KaySEE wrote:

> Here are some dumb jokes for a slow, rainy day!!
> 
> Q. How do you catch a unique rabbit?
> 	A. U-NEEK up on it
> 
> Q. How do you catch a tame rabbit?
> 	A. The TAME way.
> 
> Q. What can you catch from kissing a bird?
> 	A. CHIRPIES, it's an untweetable disease!!
> 
> 
> I'll stop now before I do any more damage!!!
> 
> XXOO,
> kaysee	
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 18:05:54 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 18:08:47 -0700
To: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Re: (NON-Rave) Internet Software Soon To.......
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Hiya,

        No who is Brian Darkness, and why are you taking up public bandwidth
with this.

Lat
THX1138


At 03:54 PM 5/15/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Hey there ...
>
>Does THX1138 = Brian Darkness ?
>
>This message is very much in his writing style.
>
>When do we get 'Stories of the California Highway Patrol' part 3/3 ?
>
>-Dan
>
>
>On Wed, 15 May 1996, THX1138 wrote:
>
>> Hiya All;
>> 
>>         After extensive trial testing of numerous Internet packages
>> available on da market I've found that NetManage's Internet Chameleon is da
>> shit.
>> 
>>         Their Full Blown Windows 95 32 bit stack version(non-dos shell) that
>> allows multiple dial up adapters to be run simultaneously will be available
>> in about a week. I like this package because it does everything FTP, Archie,
>> Handles Multiple POP Mail Accounts(Eudora Doesn't do this), Net Browser,
>> News Reader, Telnet, Gopher, Ping, Whois, Talk, Finger, and it has is own
>> text tag that allows you to highlight text within most application and mail
>> that to whomever. They are also a local company, right there in Cupertino.
>> The company also tells me the package is going to cost $30.00, how can you
>> go wrong.
>> 
>>         Sorry to take up bandwidth with this but e-mail, the internet, and
>> it's software are part of every group and person who access the net, and if
>> you had to do this yourself it would take you months as it did me.
>> 
>> Peace
>> THX1138
>> 
>> 
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 18:06:44 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 18:06:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
cc: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave: It's Apple Co.!
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.93.960515171802.25245A-100000@elaine46.Stanford.EDU>
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That was too funny <lol>

> 	-The voicemail says the party starts at 10pm, but it gets
> postponed about twelve times until it finally starts at 11 am the next day
> 	-They make you buy their own Microsoft Brand water, claiming
> that 'all other waters are incompatible with this venue'
> 	-The sound system inexplicably shuts down every 30 minutes 
> 	-The visuals consist of slides of Bill Gates superimposed over
> Windows wallpaper.bmps
> 	-After you get into the party and realize it sucks, you find
> ticket vendors selling pricey 'ticket-supplements' that grant access to
> another, hidden room where the better DJs and better vibe are
> 	-The promoters run around the party trying to buyout all the
> small-scale smoothie vendors

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 18:31:29 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 18:31:34 -0700
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Apple Rave in San Jose!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hmm.. I live pretty close.. I'll have to check this out myself!!

Look out for the black and white Dr.Suess hat and the Alien Necklace!
                            =)~



Adam
                        R.Lunatic




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 18:56:52 1996
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From: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Subject: SCHWA
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Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?

Gotta go...

-SUNNY
(SOLLE CLOTHING CO.)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 19:02:07 1996
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Date: 15 May 96 22:00:01 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Message-ID: <960516020001_71165.755_GHL181-1@CompuServe.COM>
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Why oh why does it have to be such a big suspicious deal whenever a corporation
does something?  

People, stop and think about this "corporate is always bad" mentality that is
spouted off so often ... guess what?  lots of corporations are filled with very
cool people!  And lots of SFRavers are included in that list!  

I mean, get real.... successful businesses mean jobs for people, probably
including you and including myself...  (Apple used to be a major client of my
company, and is very responsible for the beginning of our success -- we named
the PowerBook, Quadra, QuickTake, and more for them) ...   

I bet everyone on this list is dependent in some way on the success of a company
-- whether you're an employee or have your own business, if corporations aren't
profitable, we all lose...  hey, if you wait tables, your customers need jobs to
come to your restaurant.. if you work for a florist, your customers won't buy
your flowers if they're not working ... WE ARE ALL INTERCONNECTED!

...and I'd make some kind of bet here that the event planners took the tastes
and interests of the people they invited into account -- so instead of a "square
dance" theme (which I'm sure all the REAL square dancers would poo-poo as being
insincere and inauthentic) -- they're having a rave-oriented party....  

And look, they have the real thing performing, don't they?  I wish I could go
and see them!  Ooooh, it's not a REAL rave because it starts at 8 and ends at 2?
Hello?  I don't know about you guys, but most people who work corporate jobs go
to work in the morning on the weekdays.  A company-sponsored party on a
weeknight can only be expected to go until 2, that seems pretty generous -- Many
of our own events end then as well on weeknights due the venues.... 

And I hope the CEO is there -- yes, sometimes senior execs are buttheads, but
sometimes they're not.  

And maybe we can be a little less defensive about our music and scene.  Of
course, it's not going to be like an underground party -- but just think, there
will be people there exposed to this great music for the first time!  I was
listening to Freaky Chakra in my car today, and I'm psyched that others will be
hearing it for the first time!  

I hope all you South Bay people have fun there tonight!

Leslie 

...done spouting off for the day .... whew!  that feels better!  ; )



_________________________


>Come-on all you hip gen-x 'ers! 
>oh ya, and don't forget your highly disposable incomes...
>Last I checked a rave doen't usally end at 2am, but starts to takeoff
>around then!
>Tell the market research dept. to try harder next time.
>It's sad to see what happens to a movment that started with the "dreggs of
>society"(i.e. the most creative and forward looking people around) get's
>used by the most powerfull and elite members of society  (CEO's and other
>good'ole boys and girls)
>The end is near kids, enjoy it while it lasts!! 

My, my, my. Before you start getting all pissy, you should know that 
Apple throws a bunch of parties every year for its' developers. It
just so happens that this one will have a rave theme, so what? I don't
think anyone is expecting it will be like a real rave!! It is sort
of cheesy, but what the heck. Maybe someone will actually have fun.

I wonder how many ravers are now Apple Employees or used to work there,
I know of a bunch myself. I really doubt the CEO's have anything to do
with it, nor do they care. Find something else to gripe about, please.

Amy Felix


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 19:02:19 1996
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Subject: Apple Rave Directions!!
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Dang it...  I left the directions to the Apple rave at work.  Could someone 
forward that message to me?

Much Thanks!!

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 19:07:29 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 19:05:55 -0800
To: ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: laminates, was: Re: SFR T-Shirts
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, tgrigsby@best.com
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>btw, the design I submitted was originally intended for laminates.
>Anyone still down for the new laminate thang???

I think I'd be more *down* for new laminates than t-shirts... I'm not too
fond of shirts with logos on them and stuff (most of the time...
meaningless logos are cool  =).

I too am working on something, todd, so don't get yer panties in a bunch. =)

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 19:15:11 1996
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From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
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>Anyone else joining me on this one?

I'll be there...

...who else?

I don't know much, but I can learn...

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 19:33:28 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 19:34:43 -0700
From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Organization: r e g e n e r a t i o n  X
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Subject: **apple** Ravein San jose
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let us not rant but *rave*, young jedi.

For it is not the empire that  a *Microsuck* rave.

Well I love the chaos apple has caused with the rave and will make my
journey to the rave by foot as to not lose my spiritual connection with
gaia.(it helps when u have no car and live in downtown san jose). I have
meet a few sfr ravers and hope to meet a ton more tonight.

I'll just follow the PLUR.

peace,
ionX

I'll be wearing a skate like a man t-shirt, and probably dancing.
come say hi.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 19:34:39 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 19:29:18 -0700
Message-Id: <199605160229.TAA27819@dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: SCHWA
To: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
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You wrote: 
>
>
>Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?
>
>Gotta go...
>
>-SUNNY
>(SOLLE CLOTHING CO.)
>
>
>

They're everywhere, up in the sky, stuck on cars (Ahem, LOWUFO), on 
necklaces, even on Skateboards.. oh wait.. that's alien workshop.. =)~


Adam
    
                    R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 20:13:41 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 20:13:37 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: NRR! hey macintosh people!
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I'm looking for a copy of "Graphics Converter" for Macintosh. The one on
Hyperreal doesn't work (it's corrupted or something) and the one this
computer lab has some kind of copy protection on it... even though it's
shareware. =P

can anyone help me out? e-mail it to me or something?

thanks a bazillion...

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 20:29:05 1996
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From: Jondabomb@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 23:28:33 -0400
Message-ID: <960515232833_295215169@emout18.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: FINALS
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Pass me a huge helping of positive energy.....I HAVE FINALS!
UNGGGGHHHHHHH
jonathan

See you all at ORigin!!! It is on my Birthday...Im turning 19(but im still an
immature little boy!:P

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 20:48:49 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Re: What belongs on SFR?
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On Wed, May 15, 1996 4:57:33 PM  at Leslie Ayres wrote: 
 
>What I like is when it's clear in the header of a message what it's about
so I 
>can skip it -- e.g., when someone's selling some equipment, I don't read
it, 
 
Leslie, you hit it right on the nose!  It would make my 100+ messages a
HELL of a lot easier to get through if I would know what I'm about to read
by the header.  So please lets make the headers as clear as they can
be...save the creativity for the body.  Then I'll have more time to get out
and have FUN! rather than sit at the computer. 
 
--erik 
 
Ps.  I looked all over every pull down menu in this lame Mac program
(Hooked internet services may have something to do with this) and I can't
find how to change the thing that says <Milton Cecil> instead of <Erik>. 
Please help if you have an idea or if your familiar with this program. 
That's why I have to say this... 
 
**IMPORTANT!  READ DISCLAIMER** 
These words were NOT written by moonpup 
He's in London until late August 
 
...and I'm ERIK.  I'll be using his address until then 
Please address all comments, rebuttals, love or hate letters to me, ERIK 
or drop me a line... 415-337-6666

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 20:49:00 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 20:47:19 -0800
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From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Missing Madness
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>To everyone who attended Madness: please share the love and positive energy
>with the rest of us.  It sounds like it was an incredibly meaningful,
>moving experience; how I wish I'd gone :(


Don't encourage them, Eric!  There's already at least 20 reviews making me
terribly jealous!  I was at the library - can anyone top THAT for a bad
Saturday night??

Hey, Madness, any chance of making it a MONTHLY??!

Nancy



>
>Please pass the PLUR,
>
>- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 21:21:51 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Address help, non-rave
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hi!
 This person sent me e-mail and I tried to reply but my mail was bounced 
back. Can anyone help? Is Alissa out there? Please write if you are 
Alissa I would love to talk to you, especially about an upcoming and 
future shows.

Thanx in advance

 Ran @ Dionysus Dreams

                                    ( reach out... )
                                           /
                                     -=*=-/
                                       ~





From: Alissa Feinberg <AFEINBER@sybex.com>
To: randream@cats.ucsc.edu
Subject: Re: Greetings =)


Hi there!

I'm an artist, mostly a non-electronic, non-photographic multi-media
sculptor. I do (and have done) "installation art" as well as the
regular old object-making endeavors. Many ideas in recent years for
collaborating with other artists, specifically with interest and
experience in musical and lyrical performance.

I look forward to bumping into you on the dancefloor soon!

Take care,
Alissa



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 21:36:16 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Harmony's Beach Party
To: Adam Luong <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605140632.XAA19363@dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com>
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On Mon, 13 May 1996, Adam Luong wrote:

> Hey everybody, by the way. There was this guy who was taking ALOT of 
> pictures at the beach party on Sunday. Make sure it doesn't get on HARD 
> COPY. Hehe.
> 
>          Adam
>                         
> 
>                         R.Lunatic
> 
> 

Hi all!
 It's okay about the photographer. I have some extreme closeups of him on 
video :)


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams

                               ( see you, see me )
                                   /
                             -=*=-/
                               ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 22:19:32 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 22:19:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: FW: PLEASE CROSS-POST THIS! (long response)
To: teena@lioness.compute.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Chameleon.960515171442.teena@lioness.compute.com>
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On Wed, 15 May 1996 teena@lioness.compute.com wrote:

> 
> ...to disallow video cameras at ALL rave events.  This will ensure
> privacy and tighten leaks to the media.
> -Kc of DUNE

                        FUCK CENSORSHIP!!!
 
 I'm a multi-media artist who works with video occasionally. I'm also 
a performance ambient artist, again multi-media focused.
 
 I have two perspectives on video-taping raves.

 1) Free raves in public on public land: No one has the legal or ethical 
   right to prevent ANY video-taping here! Some may regard the video-taping 
   intrusive yet it is no more intrusive than a bunch of noisy, partying 
   ravers in a public venue. Share and share alike.

 2) Public events in rented venues: A more gray area. Legally the 
    producer has the right to forbid video-taping ( or any other recording 
    process ). I actually have been invited by one rave promoter to come 
    early and set up non-intrusive lighing in order to get some good shots 
    (lights would only be on for minutes). And realistically you will 
    not prevent all video-taping. Just look at all the bootlegs of bands 
    (audio and video). I do feel that if video-taping is occuring at an event
    that the promoter should inform folks at the door with a BIG sign 
    stating such.

 The bottom line is that you cannot prevent video-taping entirely. We 
might as well put out our own material in order to present a balanced 
perspective to the TV audience. Universes video-tape "The Global Dance 
Party" (1993) does a real good job. Besides, the public knows something 
about us already. 
 
 As a video-taper I try to show respect for the situation I'm in. Of course 
not all folks are this way. I do feel it is important that some sort of 
record is created for future generations. And of course, a video can never 
really capture what a rave really is. That is inside each of us Not to 
mention that most of my footage is going to be projected at future raves. 
 
 Censorship is for nazi's. If you want a private party, throw it! Do not 
expect sympathy if you throw a public event affecting large groups of 
people and someome wants to document the event. Saying no is just stupid 
thinking. Sorry if my strong opinion is offensive to some. It is mearly 
my $0.02


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
            ( your rights are our rights )       
                       /
                 -=*=-/
                   ~

Remember; legally a release needs to signed by any individual whose voice 
or likeness is used for profit (like a "news" broadcast).


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 22:27:36 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605160527.WAA00125@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: SCHWA
To: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 22:27:14 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605160153.SAA08729@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com> from "Sunny" at May 15, 96 06:53:24 pm
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> 
> 
> Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?
> 

Thanks for calling the Schwa Customer Feedback Service.  The Schwa
Corperation, and it's Wholly Owned Subsiderary, $ubvert, Inc., welcomes
customer feedback so we can better serve you.

Trust the Schwa Corpertion that these so-called "bald big eyes alien things"
are an exagerated Urban Myth.  A figment of over-active imaginations.

Rest assured that the Schwa Corperation is always looking after your best
interest, and undermining our efforts might result in reduced cutomer service.

Please don't become alarmed.  Everything is working perfectly.  And remember,
the Schwa Corperation is your friend.

-The Schwa Corperation.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 15 23:49:02 1996
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Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 23:52:11 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: So YA Say You Want To Make A CD (BP)
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Hiya All;

        You now know  someone who can make you a CD. CD-R will be available
to our scene's artist's sometime by the end of next week. If your interested
please send e-mail to "Harry Tuttle" <htuttle@planet-jubip.com>. 

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 01:10:52 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Apple's Rave in San Jose!!!!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I just got back from that little party that APPLE threw... you know it 
was actually fun! Seeing people in suits dancing.. hehe.. the drinks 
and foods were FREE!!! Cool deal! 5 bux, free music, free softdrinks, 
free food.. What a party... Too bad I had to leave early, I have school 
in the morning.. =(  The only thing that sucked was there was no A/C. 
It was HOOOOT! APPLE should throw more of these parties.. YEAH!

Btw.. while I was leaving, a bunch of cops were coming up the stairs... 
Did the party get busted?!? Lemme know!!
There were six cop cars lined up outside the warehouse. heh.


See ya all soon!


Adam
                            R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 01:47:04 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 01:49:05 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
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Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
Uunderground enough?  Other than that, a pretty good time--nice space, good
music, free food and drink (and t-shirts, even), absolutely zero in the way
of marketing/pitching and so on.  The only thing directly related to the
WWDC was a pair of Macs in the back showing off a variety of games and some
things built with Sprockets and RAVE.  Only drawback was low turnout.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 02:29:42 1996
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Message-Id: <199605160858.BAA00844@ns.mauswerks.com>
Subject: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
Date: Thu, 16 May 96 02:29:02 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
>Uunderground enough?

Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops 
were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If 
that's
true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh. 

I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the
fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure
they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....

It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party.
Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally 
meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are 
obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink
somewhere!

Love-
Amy :-)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 06:17:42 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 06:18:14 -0700
To: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: Apple's Rave in San Jose!!!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 01:06 AM 5/16/96 -0700, you wrote:

>Btw.. while I was leaving, a bunch of cops were coming up the stairs... 
>Did the party get busted?!? Lemme know!!
>There were six cop cars lined up outside the warehouse. heh.
>
>
>See ya all soon!
>
>
>Adam
>                            R.Lunatic
>
Can you say BUSTED..the Cops shut it donw around 12:30...Freaky Chakra and
Single Cell were getting off too. That kinda sucked. It wasn't a bad party
either. Once Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orch started the place got
moving. I'd have to give them a thumbs up for tring to put on a good party.
It was going good until the cops came. They were kinda being jerks about it
to. Anyway I had fun.


Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 07:00:15 1996
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To: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Raves in SF, The NEGATIVE "Experience"
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Hiya All;
>
>        What did I tell you not one promoter responded to this post, greed,
>greed, greed; makes me sick. This is the same greed however that drives our
>country and it's corporations; know it & recognize it for it is the enemy of
>all living things.
>
>        The pursuit of a material world is the loss of everything.
>
>Peace
>THX1138
>
>PS Anyone got a dollar they can spare

It is little wonder no promoter would respond.  This place is well known to
be very inhospitable to anyone who dares make a $ from any party.  Be it
promoter, DJ, etc.

Just FYI.

Peace,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 07:00:20 1996
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To: "Jason Green*" <Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Please take neo-nazi dis
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>        Reply to:   RE>Please take neo-nazi discussions to another forum.
>
>THANK YOU!
>This something that not only needed to be said, but it also something that I
>said about a month back.  This a RAVE bulletin board, not a random discussion
>forum - now don't get me wrong: I am NOT saying that the issues that have been
>discussed, or that are being discussed on SFRAVES aren't important, they are
>just not SFRAVES related.
>Thank you...
>Peace, love, and infinite positive energy...
>-Jason

Suffice it to say I am in complete disagreement.  I see plenty of relevance
to raves/parties (since I do not like the word raves...BTW when was the
last rave?).

With that said.  Peace.

Out,
John

P.S.  I am glad we have so many people who decide what is good for the list
and what is bad.  The list would probably die without such stalwart
citizens. ;)




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 07:28:11 1996
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From: ccat@netcom.com (Chris Beaumont)
Message-Id: <199605161428.HAA26246@netcom7.netcom.com>
Subject: Origins of Apple
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 07:28:07 -0700 (PDT)
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Hey, you guys should ask Captain Crunch about Apple,


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 08:22:08 1996
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Message-ID: <n1379887540.43039@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 16 May 1996 08:18:05 -0800
From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        "Troy Sheets" <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
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        Reply to:   RE>Goa e-mail list (fwd)

THANK YOU!   
THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!
BEAUTIFUL IDEA!
GOA LOVERS UNITE!
I have been looking-for/dreaming-of something like this for some time now.  I
have been a goa ever since I was introduced to it, but it seems hard to find
others that are into goa, and records for that matter - before the
introduction of F8, that is.  The only problem for me with F8 is that I live
in San Jose.  Anyhow, I will be posting my subscription post shortly...
Thank you again, and job well done...
Peace, love, and infinite positive energy...
-Jason
P.S. We should share all kinds of goa-related info (wait a minute, isn't this
pretty much the purpose of this list?  Sorry.  I guess the reason I say this
is that I have some cool web sites I will post on there for everybody to
cruise around on.... 
See ya!
--------------------------------------
Date: 5/15/96 3:57 PM
To: Jason Green*
From: Troy Sheets
Forwarded message:
From owner-socal-raves@UCSD.EDU  Wed May 15 15:45:31 1996
From: Andy Kumeda <kumeda@intelenet.net>
Message-Id: <199605152207.PAA17660@natasha.intelenet.net>
Subject: Goa e-mail list
To: socal-raves@UCSD.EDU
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:07:01 -0700 (PDT)
Reply-To: andy@intelenet.net (Andy Kumeda)
Organization: InteleNet Communications, Inc.
X-URL:        http://www.intelenet.net
X-Phone:      714.583.3135
X-FAX:        714.851.1088
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hello all you Goa lovers,

I have created an e-mail list dedicated to the discussion of Goa trance,
and anything else related to the Goa scene in general -- ie track
reviews, event listings, your favorite ingredient for Chai, etc.

This will be unmoderated, but irrelevant subjects (ie drugs, other types
of music, employment announcements, spams, etc) will NOT BE TOLERATED --
keep that stuff on Usenet.  The list is intended to be very low in volume, 
yet high in content. 

For those that are interested, subscribe by sending e-mail to the
following:
	majordomo@party.net
In the subject of the message enter the following:
	subscribe goa
To post to the list, send e-mail to the following:
	goa@party.net

Hope to see some of you there!

Andy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 08:25:03 1996
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Date: 16 May 1996 08:19:15 -0800
From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
To: "Aleph One" <aleph1@dfw.net>, "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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        Reply to:   RE>Goa e-mail list (fwd)

I AM JOINING YOU!  This is a really cool idea!  Hope to talk to you soon...
-Jason

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/15/96 3:57 PM
To: Jason Green*
From: Aleph One
Anyone else joining me on this one?

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 15:07:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andy Kumeda <kumeda@intelenet.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: Goa e-mail list

Hello all you Goa lovers,

I have created an e-mail list dedicated to the discussion of Goa trance,
and anything else related to the Goa scene in general -- ie track
reviews, event listings, your favorite ingredient for Chai, etc.

This will be unmoderated, but irrelevant subjects (ie drugs, other types
of music, employment announcements, spams, etc) will NOT BE TOLERATED --
keep that stuff on Usenet.  The list is intended to be very low in volume, 
yet high in content. 

For those that are interested, subscribe by sending e-mail to the
following:
	majordomo@party.net
In the subject of the message enter the following:
	subscribe goa
To post to the list, send e-mail to the following:
	goa@party.net

Hope to see some of you there!

Andy


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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 08:41:19 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 08:28:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
To: THX1138 <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: (NON-Rave) Internet Software Soon To.......
In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960516010847.00ac16dc@sanfrancisco01.pop.internex.net>
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OK, whatever.
If I had known this was a big secret, I wouldn't have 
mentioned it. However, please do not question my use of 'public 
bandwidth' ... 

peace,
Dan


On Wed, 15 May 1996, THX1138 wrote:

> Hiya,
> 
>         No who is Brian Darkness, and why are you taking up public bandwidth
> with this.
> 
> Lat
> THX1138
> 
> 
> At 03:54 PM 5/15/96 -0700, you wrote:
> >Hey there ...
> >
> >Does THX1138 = Brian Darkness ?
> >
> >This message is very much in his writing style.
> >
> >When do we get 'Stories of the California Highway Patrol' part 3/3 ?
> >
> >-Dan
> >
> >
> >On Wed, 15 May 1996, THX1138 wrote:
> >
> >> Hiya All;
> >> 
> >>         After extensive trial testing of numerous Internet packages
> >> available on da market I've found that NetManage's Internet Chameleon is da
> >> shit.
> >> 
> >>         Their Full Blown Windows 95 32 bit stack version(non-dos shell) that
> >> allows multiple dial up adapters to be run simultaneously will be available
> >> in about a week. I like this package because it does everything FTP, Archie,
> >> Handles Multiple POP Mail Accounts(Eudora Doesn't do this), Net Browser,
> >> News Reader, Telnet, Gopher, Ping, Whois, Talk, Finger, and it has is own
> >> text tag that allows you to highlight text within most application and mail
> >> that to whomever. They are also a local company, right there in Cupertino.
> >> The company also tells me the package is going to cost $30.00, how can you
> >> go wrong.
> >> 
> >>         Sorry to take up bandwidth with this but e-mail, the internet, and
> >> it's software are part of every group and person who access the net, and if
> >> you had to do this yourself it would take you months as it did me.
> >> 
> >> Peace
> >> THX1138
> >> 
> >> 
> >
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 09:05:36 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 09:05:27 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: Origins of Apple
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Hey, you guys should ask Captain Crunch about Apple,

John Draper, whaddya say to this???




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 09:20:30 1996
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Date: 16 May 1996 08:43:27 -0800
From: "Scott Nozawa" <scott_nozawa@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: ?Apples' nerdy programers?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Cc: "Mark Piercy" <piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU>
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                      Subject:                              Time:  9:05
  OFFICE MEMO         ?Apples' nerdy programers?            Date:  5/16/96


Hey gang,

     Speaking of Apples' nerdy programers, come see this one close at Quench
this Sunday  8*)   Quench is held at The Usual (F/X) 400 S. 1st St. S.J. 
Please all you Southbay raver types come up and say high!  Hopefully I will
have little flyers to hand out about a cool music thang in a park in June. 
It's gonna be summer time real soon and we gotta get SJ dancin' together!  

Peace to all...

                            Tamotsu
     


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 09:39:08 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 09:38:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605160858.BAA00844@ns.mauswerks.com>
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It was fun, after all!   Freaky Chakra was great--- I'd never heard them 
before...  the place was about 1/2 full, but some good vibes were 
generated by the sfravers, for sure!  It was great meeting all the 
wonderful people who came up to me and introduced themselves!  (Boy, 
wearing a recognizable tee-shirt comes in handy!)

I second Amy's idea for those sfravers in the South Bay to get together 
for a drink, or somethin'...!

;-p

love
john


On Thu, 16 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
> >Uunderground enough?
> 
> Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops 
> were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If 
> that's true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh. 
> 
> I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the
> fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure
> they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....
> 
> It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party.
> Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally 
> meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are 
> obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink
> somewhere!
> 
> Love-
> Amy :-)
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:03:52 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:00:23 -0700
Message-Id: <199605161700.KAA12392@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

You wrote: 
>
>

>I second Amy's idea for those sfravers in the South Bay to get 
together 
>for a drink, or somethin'...!
>
>;-p
>
>love
>john
>
>
>On Thu, 16 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

 Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to 
finally 
>> meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are 
>> obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a 
drink
>> somewhere!
>> 
>> Love-
>> Amy :-)
>> 
>


Yes! I THIRD this Idea!!! =)~


Adam
                    R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:13:32 1996
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From: Sami Khoury <khoury@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605161713.KAA23325@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Raves in SF, The NEGATIVE "Experience"
To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:13:29 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: THX1138@planet-jubip.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02130505adc0804f60f7@DialupEudora> from "John S. Lee" at May 16, 96 06:59:59 am
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THX1138 said:

> What did I tell you not one promoter responded to this post, greed,
> greed, greed; makes me sick.

Is it the responsibilty of the promoters to employ your friend?  How are
the promoters being greedy by not responding?  Perhaps they already have
designers with which they are comfortable.

And then THX1138 said:

> This is the same greed however that drives our country and it's
> corporations; know it & recognize it for it is the enemy of all
> living things.
>
> The pursuit of a material world is the loss of everything.

I love these kind of random, poorly thought-out attempts at social
conscientiousness espoused in an adolescent "the whole world hates me"
sort of way :)

I spent six months at a major corporation.  It was not so bad.  I met
some very intelligent people and made some friends I hope to know for
a long time to come.  It's ironic how there can be this non-discerning
contempt for all things corporate within a scene which prides itself
on being 'open-minded'.

	Sami

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:22:04 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:21:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Jondabomb@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: FINAL
In-Reply-To: <960515232833_295215169@emout18.mail.aol.com>
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   You first;). I have finals next Monday and Wednesday!
                         HuGS-
                     Reagan




On Wed, 15 May 1996 Jondabomb@aol.com wrote:

> Pass me a huge helping of positive energy.....I HAVE FINALS!
> UNGGGGHHHHHHH
> jonathan
> 
> See you all at ORigin!!! It is on my Birthday...Im turning 19(but im still an
> immature little boy!:P
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:42:20 1996
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To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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What I find most interesting is the fact that even Apple (Apple!) can't
throw a party without it being busted.  You would think an event sponsored
by a corporate giant would not be as prone to busting as say a small
collective of relative insignificance.  (One making a substantial
contribution to the local economy, the other making a huge racket all
night.)

We shall win the war one battle (and one hug) at a time.  :^)

Anyone know if any official Apple representatives were there to defend the
party?  Or were they long gone, home in bed with their wives and
mistresses, husbands and misters.  :^)

Tony


At 2:29 AM  -0700 5/16/96, Ms Phink wrote:
>>Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
>>Uunderground enough?
>
>Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops
>were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If
>that's
>true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh.
>
>I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the
>fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure
>they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....
>
>It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party.
>Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally
>meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are
>obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink
>somewhere!
>
>Love-
>Amy :-)




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:44:07 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:33:19 -0800
To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee), "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Raves in SF, The NEGATIVE "Experience"
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Wait, what was the question?

TR

At 6:59 AM  -0700 5/16/96, John S. Lee wrote:
>>Hiya All;
>>
>>        What did I tell you not one promoter responded to this post, greed,
>>greed, greed; makes me sick. This is the same greed however that drives our
>>country and it's corporations; know it & recognize it for it is the enemy of
>>all living things.
>>
>>        The pursuit of a material world is the loss of everything.
>>
>>Peace
>>THX1138
>>
>>PS Anyone got a dollar they can spare
>
>It is little wonder no promoter would respond.  This place is well known to
>be very inhospitable to anyone who dares make a $ from any party.  Be it
>promoter, DJ, etc.
>
>Just FYI.
>
>Peace,
>John




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:49:27 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:49:07 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Shakes the Clown <wayne@club.net>
Subject: Re: Origins of Apple
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If you want to know about Apple just read the many books written about it.
They will be much less biased and slef-promoting than personal accounts
from people only tangentially involved with the company.

Here are ones I found when I searched for "Apple Computer history" on
<www.amazon.com>

-----------
The Mac Bathroom Reader; Owen W. Linzmayer; Paperback; $11.69

The MacIntosh Way; Guy Kawasaki; Paperback; $11.25

Steve Wozniak : A Wizard Called Woz (Achievers); Rebecca Gold; Library
Binding; $18.95

Accidental Millionaire : The Rise and Fall of Steve Jobs at Apple Computer;
Lee Butcher; Hardcover; $19.95 (Special
Order)

The MacIntosh Way; Guy Kawasaki; Hardcover; $21.55 (Special Order)

Odyssey : Pepsi to Apple : A Journey of Adventure, Ideas, and the Future;
John Sculley; Hardcover (Publisher Out Of
Stock)

West of Eden : The End of Innocence at Apple Computer; Frank Rose;
Hardcover (Publisher Out Of Stock)




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:49:39 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 13:49:12 -0400
Message-ID: <960516134911_114930980@emout12.mail.aol.com>
To: 71165.755@compuserve.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Corp Prejud/Steveo Quit His Job!-was apple rave
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"Beware of all enterprises which require new clothes"
-Henry David Thoreau

Hmm, good point Leslie[71165.755@CIS], I've never thought that I might be
corporation prejudice. :o  But that's still not stopping me from vamoosing
the corporate world after three dragging years!!  Starting today I will be
fully responsible for my (miniscule) economic part in the world.  My business
is small but growing, and god help me if it ever gets to a point where my
ideals flex to meet my marketing plan.  As far as dependency on coprorations,
yes I suppose I still am, I'm not saying burn down the factories, I'm just
hoping and dreaming for a world where personal responsibility and
accomplishment has greater value than convenience.
Love & Resignation Papers : )
Steveo
Independent Graphics
(Ignore the above commercial)

P.S.  Unfortunately leaving work also means I wont have an extra hour or two
a day to participate in sfraves actively, I'll probably be on and off so dont
forget about me!  Maybe corps are good for something. :`}

"What a beautiful world this could be... what a wonderful time to be free"
-Some  cheezy 70's band?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:49:46 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 13:49:16 -0400
Message-ID: <960516134915_114931004@emout15.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Laminates Survey
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How does anyone feel about having to fork out about a buck for their
laminate.  I really like the free idea, but I've got this really neat design
which involves a small electronic device. (Hee hee, I'm not telling)  Might
be able to keep production costs under a buck. 
-P.S. I was just thinking what a strange concept sfraves is, kinda like a
positve version of The Borg gone haywire.  "You too will be assimilated!"
Love,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:51:32 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:51:19 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
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What I find most interesting is the fact that even Apple (Apple!) can't
throw a party without it being busted.  You would think an event sponsored
by a corporate giant would not be as prone to busting as say a small
collective of relative insignificance.  (One making a substantial
contribution to the local economy, the other making a huge racket all
night.)

We shall win the war one battle (and one hug) at a time.  :^)

Anyone know if any official Apple representatives were there to defend the
party?  Or were they long gone, home in bed with their wives and
mistresses, husbands and misters.  :^)

Tony


At 2:29 AM  -0700 5/16/96, Ms Phink wrote:
>>Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
>>Uunderground enough?
>
>Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops
>were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If
>that's
>true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh.
>
>I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the
>fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure
>they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....
>
>It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party.
>Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally
>meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are
>obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink
>somewhere!
>
>Love-
>Amy :-)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:52:03 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
cc: brian@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
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Thanks to aleph1@dfw.net  for posting this and giving people a place to
discuss goa trance. This is what I was discussing yesterday. This will allow
people who enjoy goa trance a forum to discuss this genre of music. Thus
respecting the sfravers who are not particularly fond of this genre of music.
There mail boxes will not be filled with specific goa type messages.
I think this is a wonderful idea and i would like to see many more of these
types of specific lists. Sub-catagories of the sfraves e-mail list! Getting
bored, Brian???? Need something to keep you busy????? = )    Have a great
day,PEACE!! Cid  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 10:57:57 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605161757.KAA05638@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Raves in SF, The NEGATIVE "Experience"
To: khoury@hyperreal.com (Sami Khoury)
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:57:53 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605161713.KAA23325@taz.hyperreal.com> from "Sami Khoury" at May 16, 96 10:13:29 am
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> 
> THX1138 said:
> 
> > What did I tell you not one promoter responded to this post, greed,
> > greed, greed; makes me sick.
> 
> Is it the responsibilty of the promoters to employ your friend?  How are
> the promoters being greedy by not responding?  Perhaps they already have
> designers with which they are comfortable.
> 
> And then THX1138 said:
> 
> > This is the same greed however that drives our country and it's
> > corporations; know it & recognize it for it is the enemy of all
> > living things.
> >
> > The pursuit of a material world is the loss of everything.
> 
> I love these kind of random, poorly thought-out attempts at social
> conscientiousness espoused in an adolescent "the whole world hates me"
> sort of way :)
> 
> I spent six months at a major corporation.  It was not so bad.  I met
> some very intelligent people and made some friends I hope to know for
> a long time to come.  It's ironic how there can be this non-discerning
> contempt for all things corporate within a scene which prides itself
> on being 'open-minded'.
> 
> 	Sami
> 

100% Sami !

Peace out,
John


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 11:30:28 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 11:24:25 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Minuk <davidmin@crl.com>
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
In-Reply-To: <v03006657adc125a1f701@DialupEudora>
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An amusing situation was when Matthew Fox's Creation Spirituality group 
threw a "rave mass" at Jerry Brown's We the People warehouse in  
Oakland.  Everytime the cops came by the Ex-Gov would go talk to them, 
and they would be gone.

David

On Thu, 16 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:

> What I find most interesting is the fact that even Apple (Apple!) can't
> throw a party without it being busted.  You would think an event sponsored
> by a corporate giant would not be as prone to busting as say a small
> collective of relative insignificance.  (One making a substantial
> contribution to the local economy, the other making a huge racket all
> night.)
> 
> We shall win the war one battle (and one hug) at a time.  :^)
> 
> Anyone know if any official Apple representatives were there to defend the
> party?  Or were they long gone, home in bed with their wives and
> mistresses, husbands and misters.  :^)
> 
> Tony
> 
> 
> At 2:29 AM  -0700 5/16/96, Ms Phink wrote:
> >>Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
> >>Uunderground enough?
> >
> >Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops
> >were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If
> >that's
> >true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh.
> >
> >I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the
> >fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure
> >they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....
> >
> >It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party.
> >Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally
> >meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are
> >obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink
> >somewhere!
> >
> >Love-
> >Amy :-)
> 
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 11:40:50 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605161840.LAA12300@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Fwd: |NER| Fwd: NYC club owner in 'ecstasy' bust (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 11:40:53 -0700 (PDT)
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>From what I have heard about the Tunnel in NYC, it is a less than PLURRY place.
This is still extremely bad news....

-troy

---------------------------------

	NEW YORK, May 15 (UPI) -- A New York City nightclub impresario was  
arrested Wednesday and charged with turning two of his popular hot spots 
into drug dens by distributing the hallucinogen ``ecstasy'' to his young 
patrons. 
	Brooklyn U.S. Attorney Zachary Carter said Peter Gatien transformed  
Tunnel and the Limelight into ``virtual ecstasy supermarkets,'' selling 
up to 2,000 pills per month at $35 to $40 a pop. 
	``What's really remarkable was we determined that dealing drugs was  
not just a lucrative sideline, but was the centerpiece of the operation, 
'' Carter said. ``It could be said that these clubs existed to 
distribute these drugs.'' 
	Carter said an eight-month investigation into the distribution of the  
designer drug in New York led them directly to Gatien. He said Gatien 
hired a director and ``party promoters'' whose duties included guarding 
the door to let ``house dealers'' of the drug inside and then warn them 
when New York City police officers came around. 
	The club also took a cut of the dealers' profits, officials said.  
	The multicolored ecstasy pills -- sold under names like ``fruitloops,''  
``cat's eye,'' ``playboys'' and ``doves'' -- were apparently smuggled 
into the country from Amsterdam, the Netherlands, Montreal, Canada and 
Miami, said Drug Enforcement Administration Special Agent Carlo Boccia. 
	The drug is known to produce a combination of effects, including a  
euphoric high, relaxation and mild hallucinations, Boccia said. High 
doses have been linked to psychosis, brain damage and even death. 
	``The public needs to realize that the high visibility of clubs such  
as these glamorize the use and distribution of these illegal substances, 
'' Boccia said. 
	``Those who sell these drugs, albeit surrounded by the splendor and  
glitz of 'fashionable' nightclubs, are no less the scourge than those 
who hide in the back alleys of the inner city to dispense their poison. 
These people are just as bad, if not worse.'' 
	Gatien and 21 others were arrested in pre-dawn raids and 6,000 pills  
were confiscated. The defendants were charged with conspiracy to 
distribute ecstasy. They face maximum prison terms of 20 years if 
convicted. 
	Carter has also filed a motion to seize any of Gatien's ill-gotten  
assets and other physical property related to the alleged drug 
operation. 
	The clubs can remain open until a judge's ruling on the matter, he  
said. 
  	   	



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 11:51:14 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 11:51:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andy Thomas <andy@hyperreal.com>
Reply-To: Andy Thomas <andy@hyperreal.com>
To: Begroovy@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
In-Reply-To: <960516135134_302264137@emout13.mail.aol.com>
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There are several electronic music releated lists served by hyperreal: 

idm (intelligent dance music)  
ambient 
313 (detroit)  
analogue heaven (analogue equipment) 

For info on any of these lists, send mail to majordomo@hyperreal.com with
"info <listname>" in the body of the message, where <listname> is one of
the lists above.  Or for a listing of all lists served off of hyperreal,
send the command "lists". 

I've also heard there's a trance list somewhere, and a "breaks" (jungle) 
list over at xmission.com.  I'm sure there's others too... Anyone know of
a "house music" mailing list?

Andy

On Thu, 16 May 1996 Begroovy@aol.com wrote:

> Thanks to aleph1@dfw.net  for posting this and giving people a place to
> discuss goa trance. This is what I was discussing yesterday. This will allow
> people who enjoy goa trance a forum to discuss this genre of music. Thus
> respecting the sfravers who are not particularly fond of this genre of music.
> There mail boxes will not be filled with specific goa type messages.
> I think this is a wonderful idea and i would like to see many more of these
> types of specific lists. Sub-catagories of the sfraves e-mail list! Getting
> bored, Brian???? Need something to keep you busy????? = )    Have a great
> day,PEACE!! Cid  




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 11:58:27 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 11:57:56 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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To: SteveOSac@aol.com
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Laminates Survey
References: <960516134915_114931004@emout15.mail.aol.com>
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SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:
> 
> How does anyone feel about having to fork out about a buck for their
> laminate.  I really like the free idea, but I've got this really neat design
> which involves a small electronic device. (Hee hee, I'm not telling)  Might
> be able to keep production costs under a buck.

That sounds like a deal to me!

Peace,
John

PS: To all my old and new SFRave brothers and sisters I met last night
at the Apple Rave, can't wait to see all your smilin happy faces again!
at Origin possibly? Till then take care of yourselves!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:32:10 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.stanford.edu>
cc: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave: It's Apple Co.!
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That was too funny <lol>

> 	-The voicemail says the party starts at 10pm, but it gets
> postponed about twelve times until it finally starts at 11 am the next day
> 	-They make you buy their own Microsoft Brand water, claiming
> that 'all other waters are incompatible with this venue'
> 	-The sound system inexplicably shuts down every 30 minutes 
> 	-The visuals consist of slides of Bill Gates superimposed over
> Windows wallpaper.bmps
> 	-After you get into the party and realize it sucks, you find
> ticket vendors selling pricey 'ticket-supplements' that grant access to
> another, hidden room where the better DJs and better vibe are
> 	-The promoters run around the party trying to buyout all the
> small-scale smoothie vendors

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:32:11 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: What belongs on SFR?
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>I don't agree that these threads are totally off-topic for us 

Bingo.  Leslie hit on the head.  My addition: There are the absolutely rave 
topics and then there are grey area topics.  I would imagine that just about 
any topic besides "where the raves are going to be" and then "how they 
turned out" would qualify as grey area.  

I think the pursuit of truth, fairness, equality, peace, love, acceptance, 
all these belong on this list and these are some of the issues that revolve 
around the neo-nazi topic (BTW: For the most part I agree with what John S. 
Lee had to say about that).  

As for Tracy Lords, whatever.  It was of very limited interest to me, it 
went on a bit too long, and it devolved into a battle over different 
people's sense of what's proper and moral.  Definitely a paler shade of grey 
there.  That she was attempting to break into DJing was the most interesting 
thing to me.

>And, frankly, I don't want to have to go searching for other news groups to
>express an opinion on something that has to do with SFR -- I'd rather hear the
>ideas and opinions of the people on here, with whom I have something in
>common...   

BIG Bingo.  I've made some mighty good friends on this list.  They 
constitute my rave family, and I want to discuss the topics with them.  Nuff 
said.

>I mean, who do you think is ON a Tracy Lords newsgroup?  I don't
>even want to think!

Pat Buchanan?  Oh, sorry, that's the neo-nazi group...

>p.s.  What would be nice is a "dead horse" filter on outgoing and incoming
>messages ... you know, "is this message just more of the same on a subject 
we've
>beaten to death already?"  -- if so ......   self...... destr...
>uc........t.......

<hehe!>  I like that one!

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:35:02 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Apple Rave in San Jose!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-Id: <96May16.123334pdt.4424@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:50:32 PDT
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Hmm.. I live pretty close.. I'll have to check this out myself!!

Look out for the black and white Dr.Suess hat and the Alien Necklace!
                            =)~



Adam
                        R.Lunatic




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:37:08 1996
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From: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Subject: SCHWA
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:51:54 PDT
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Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?

Gotta go...

-SUNNY
(SOLLE CLOTHING CO.)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:38:19 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Apple Rave Directions!!
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Dang it...  I left the directions to the Apple rave at work.  Could someone 
forward that message to me?

Much Thanks!!

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:39:00 1996
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From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Rave in San Jose!
Message-Id: <96May16.123734pdt.4501@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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Why oh why does it have to be such a big suspicious deal whenever a corporation
does something?  

People, stop and think about this "corporate is always bad" mentality that is
spouted off so often ... guess what?  lots of corporations are filled with very
cool people!  And lots of SFRavers are included in that list!  

I mean, get real.... successful businesses mean jobs for people, probably
including you and including myself...  (Apple used to be a major client of my
company, and is very responsible for the beginning of our success -- we named
the PowerBook, Quadra, QuickTake, and more for them) ...   

I bet everyone on this list is dependent in some way on the success of a company
-- whether you're an employee or have your own business, if corporations aren't
profitable, we all lose...  hey, if you wait tables, your customers need jobs to
come to your restaurant.. if you work for a florist, your customers won't buy
your flowers if they're not working ... WE ARE ALL INTERCONNECTED!

...and I'd make some kind of bet here that the event planners took the tastes
and interests of the people they invited into account -- so instead of a "square
dance" theme (which I'm sure all the REAL square dancers would poo-poo as being
insincere and inauthentic) -- they're having a rave-oriented party....  

And look, they have the real thing performing, don't they?  I wish I could go
and see them!  Ooooh, it's not a REAL rave because it starts at 8 and ends at 2?
Hello?  I don't know about you guys, but most people who work corporate jobs go
to work in the morning on the weekdays.  A company-sponsored party on a
weeknight can only be expected to go until 2, that seems pretty generous -- Many
of our own events end then as well on weeknights due the venues.... 

And I hope the CEO is there -- yes, sometimes senior execs are buttheads, but
sometimes they're not.  

And maybe we can be a little less defensive about our music and scene.  Of
course, it's not going to be like an underground party -- but just think, there
will be people there exposed to this great music for the first time!  I was
listening to Freaky Chakra in my car today, and I'm psyched that others will be
hearing it for the first time!  

I hope all you South Bay people have fun there tonight!

Leslie 

...done spouting off for the day .... whew!  that feels better!  ; )



_________________________


>Come-on all you hip gen-x 'ers! 
>oh ya, and don't forget your highly disposable incomes...
>Last I checked a rave doen't usally end at 2am, but starts to takeoff
>around then!
>Tell the market research dept. to try harder next time.
>It's sad to see what happens to a movment that started with the "dreggs of
>society"(i.e. the most creative and forward looking people around) get's
>used by the most powerfull and elite members of society  (CEO's and other
>good'ole boys and girls)
>The end is near kids, enjoy it while it lasts!! 

My, my, my. Before you start getting all pissy, you should know that 
Apple throws a bunch of parties every year for its' developers. It
just so happens that this one will have a rave theme, so what? I don't
think anyone is expecting it will be like a real rave!! It is sort
of cheesy, but what the heck. Maybe someone will actually have fun.

I wonder how many ravers are now Apple Employees or used to work there,
I know of a bunch myself. I really doubt the CEO's have anything to do
with it, nor do they care. Find something else to gripe about, please.

Amy Felix


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:39:01 1996
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To: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Anyone else joining me on this one?

I'll be there...

...who else?

I don't know much, but I can learn...

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:39:03 1996
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To: ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: laminates, was: Re: SFR T-Shirts
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, tgrigsby@best.com
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>btw, the design I submitted was originally intended for laminates.
>Anyone still down for the new laminate thang???

I think I'd be more *down* for new laminates than t-shirts... I'm not too
fond of shirts with logos on them and stuff (most of the time...
meaningless logos are cool  =).

I too am working on something, todd, so don't get yer panties in a bunch. =)

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:50:31 1996
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Date: 16 May 96 15:47:23 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Laminates Survey
Message-ID: <960516194723_71165.755_GHL131-3@CompuServe.COM>
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Steveo asked if we'd be willing to cough up a dollar for a laminate with a
"small electronic device"!  .........


Hell, yes, I'd cough up a buck for my laminate ---

I'd like to thank Vince for giving me mine at Madness last week -- I was flagged
down a couple of times at the Harmony beach party because of it, so it works ...

of course, mine has to be attached to my backpack, so it doesn't interfere with
my very very carefully coordinated fashion princess persona that I like to
create for parties ; )  f... 

hmmm,  electronic device attached?  might be willing to pay more than a buck for
that!!  

Leslie


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:50:42 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Address help, non-rave
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hi!
 This person sent me e-mail and I tried to reply but my mail was bounced 
back. Can anyone help? Is Alissa out there? Please write if you are 
Alissa I would love to talk to you, especially about an upcoming and 
future shows.

Thanx in advance

 Ran @ Dionysus Dreams

                                    ( reach out... )
                                           /
                                     -=*=-/
                                       ~





From: Alissa Feinberg <AFEINBER@sybex.com>
To: randream@cats.ucsc.edu
Subject: Re: Greetings =)


Hi there!

I'm an artist, mostly a non-electronic, non-photographic multi-media
sculptor. I do (and have done) "installation art" as well as the
regular old object-making endeavors. Many ideas in recent years for
collaborating with other artists, specifically with interest and
experience in musical and lyrical performance.

I look forward to bumping into you on the dancefloor soon!

Take care,
Alissa



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:51:22 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: SCHWA
To: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605160153.SAA08729@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com> from "Sunny" at May 15, 96 06:53:24 pm
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> 
> 
> Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?
> 

Thanks for calling the Schwa Customer Feedback Service.  The Schwa
Corperation, and it's Wholly Owned Subsiderary, $ubvert, Inc., welcomes
customer feedback so we can better serve you.

Trust the Schwa Corpertion that these so-called "bald big eyes alien things"
are an exagerated Urban Myth.  A figment of over-active imaginations.

Rest assured that the Schwa Corperation is always looking after your best
interest, and undermining our efforts might result in reduced cutomer service.

Please don't become alarmed.  Everything is working perfectly.  And remember,
the Schwa Corperation is your friend.

-The Schwa Corperation.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:51:23 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: FW: PLEASE CROSS-POST THIS! (long response)
To: teena@lioness.compute.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Chameleon.960515171442.teena@lioness.compute.com>
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On Wed, 15 May 1996 teena@lioness.compute.com wrote:

> 
> ...to disallow video cameras at ALL rave events.  This will ensure
> privacy and tighten leaks to the media.
> -Kc of DUNE

                        FUCK CENSORSHIP!!!
 
 I'm a multi-media artist who works with video occasionally. I'm also 
a performance ambient artist, again multi-media focused.
 
 I have two perspectives on video-taping raves.

 1) Free raves in public on public land: No one has the legal or ethical 
   right to prevent ANY video-taping here! Some may regard the video-taping 
   intrusive yet it is no more intrusive than a bunch of noisy, partying 
   ravers in a public venue. Share and share alike.

 2) Public events in rented venues: A more gray area. Legally the 
    producer has the right to forbid video-taping ( or any other recording 
    process ). I actually have been invited by one rave promoter to come 
    early and set up non-intrusive lighing in order to get some good shots 
    (lights would only be on for minutes). And realistically you will 
    not prevent all video-taping. Just look at all the bootlegs of bands 
    (audio and video). I do feel that if video-taping is occuring at an event
    that the promoter should inform folks at the door with a BIG sign 
    stating such.

 The bottom line is that you cannot prevent video-taping entirely. We 
might as well put out our own material in order to present a balanced 
perspective to the TV audience. Universes video-tape "The Global Dance 
Party" (1993) does a real good job. Besides, the public knows something 
about us already. 
 
 As a video-taper I try to show respect for the situation I'm in. Of course 
not all folks are this way. I do feel it is important that some sort of 
record is created for future generations. And of course, a video can never 
really capture what a rave really is. That is inside each of us Not to 
mention that most of my footage is going to be projected at future raves. 
 
 Censorship is for nazi's. If you want a private party, throw it! Do not 
expect sympathy if you throw a public event affecting large groups of 
people and someome wants to document the event. Saying no is just stupid 
thinking. Sorry if my strong opinion is offensive to some. It is mearly 
my $0.02


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
            ( your rights are our rights )       
                       /
                 -=*=-/
                   ~

Remember; legally a release needs to signed by any individual whose voice 
or likeness is used for profit (like a "news" broadcast).


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:51:26 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Harmony's Beach Party
To: Adam Luong <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605140632.XAA19363@dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com>
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On Mon, 13 May 1996, Adam Luong wrote:

> Hey everybody, by the way. There was this guy who was taking ALOT of 
> pictures at the beach party on Sunday. Make sure it doesn't get on HARD 
> COPY. Hehe.
> 
>          Adam
>                         
> 
>                         R.Lunatic
> 
> 

Hi all!
 It's okay about the photographer. I have some extreme closeups of him on 
video :)


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams

                               ( see you, see me )
                                   /
                             -=*=-/
                               ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 12:53:50 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 14:52:08 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Flash Back
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I'am either getting flash backs or hyperreal is resending old message 
from the last couple of days.

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:00:18 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605162000.NAA12219@netcom22.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 13:00:10 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <v0300665aadc129a0e776@DialupEudora> from "Tony Rotundo" at May 16, 96 10:51:19 am
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Being that I'm writing this during my work hours at a merciless greedy
corporate giant , I'll try to keep it short -

Some Stuff RE: Apple "Sprockets" "Rave"

1. Looked just like a rave when I showed up at the announced opening
time of 8PM - ie nothing ready quite yet, guys running around trying to 
get stuff set up. I must say that they had a DJ working at the turntables at 
least! Although he would be cut off every once and awhile as they tweaked
the system for Freaky Chakra. I think the DJ's name was Alex ( not MAD
Alex ).

2. Nobody that I noticed in suits or nametags. On the whole , the dress
was either California yuppy casual with the occasional individualistic
touch ( unique tie or pin or hairdo ) or what you'd see at a rave ( no
naked people or "costumes" , tho ).

3. Free non-alcoholic drinks and snack food included in the $5 admin.

4. I left 15 minutes before the cops showed up - must have been some
personal 6th sense. Maybe it was the speaker stack placed in front of 
the open window that gave me a hint .... Nobody from Apple that was
arranging this was in suits, so there was no one to impress the police
with, much less Jerry Brown.

5. By the way , thanks to the folks who arranged for the event! I understand
they had to rent the space for over $1000 last night. If I remember, at
least one of them subscribes to SFRaves - so "hello!".

6. South Bay SFRavers - getting together sounds good to me! As Mr.
Knucklehead knows, it's the organizing that's the tough part.

 Gotta get back to looking like I'm working!!!!

Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com ( No , I don't work for NETCOM )

PS - HI! to all the folks I met last night , even if I don't remember
your name(s)! It was great to meet new folks and match faces to email
names.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:02:36 1996
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From: ccat@netcom.com (Chris Beaumont)
Subject: Origins of Apple
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey, you guys should ask Captain Crunch about Apple,


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:02:36 1996
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From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
To: "Aleph One" <aleph1@dfw.net>, "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP-QM 3.0.3 b1 d5
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        Reply to:   RE>Goa e-mail list (fwd)

I AM JOINING YOU!  This is a really cool idea!  Hope to talk to you soon...
-Jason

--------------------------------------
To: Jason Green*
From: Aleph One
Anyone else joining me on this one?

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Andy Kumeda <kumeda@intelenet.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: Goa e-mail list

Hello all you Goa lovers,

I have created an e-mail list dedicated to the discussion of Goa trance,
and anything else related to the Goa scene in general -- ie track
reviews, event listings, your favorite ingredient for Chai, etc.

This will be unmoderated, but irrelevant subjects (ie drugs, other types
of music, employment announcements, spams, etc) will NOT BE TOLERATED --
keep that stuff on Usenet.  The list is intended to be very low in volume, 
yet high in content. 

For those that are interested, subscribe by sending e-mail to the
following:
	majordomo@party.net
In the subject of the message enter the following:
	subscribe goa
To post to the list, send e-mail to the following:
	goa@party.net

Hope to see some of you there!

Andy


------------------ RFC822 Header Follows ------------------
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15:48:19 -0700
PAA11533; Wed, 15 May 1996 15:48:12 -0700
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
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Precedence: bulk




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:02:39 1996
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From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        "Troy Sheets" <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP-QM 3.0.3 b1 d5
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        Reply to:   RE>Goa e-mail list (fwd)

THANK YOU!   
THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!
BEAUTIFUL IDEA!
GOA LOVERS UNITE!
I have been looking-for/dreaming-of something like this for some time now.  I
have been a goa ever since I was introduced to it, but it seems hard to find
others that are into goa, and records for that matter - before the
introduction of F8, that is.  The only problem for me with F8 is that I live
in San Jose.  Anyhow, I will be posting my subscription post shortly...
Thank you again, and job well done...
Peace, love, and infinite positive energy...
-Jason
P.S. We should share all kinds of goa-related info (wait a minute, isn't this
pretty much the purpose of this list?  Sorry.  I guess the reason I say this
is that I have some cool web sites I will post on there for everybody to
cruise around on.... 
See ya!
--------------------------------------
To: Jason Green*
From: Troy Sheets
Forwarded message:
From owner-socal-raves@UCSD.EDU  Wed May 15 15:45:31 1996
From: Andy Kumeda <kumeda@intelenet.net>
Subject: Goa e-mail list
To: socal-raves@UCSD.EDU
Reply-To: andy@intelenet.net (Andy Kumeda)
Organization: InteleNet Communications, Inc.
X-URL:        http://www.intelenet.net
X-Phone:      714.583.3135
X-FAX:        714.851.1088
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hello all you Goa lovers,

I have created an e-mail list dedicated to the discussion of Goa trance,
and anything else related to the Goa scene in general -- ie track
reviews, event listings, your favorite ingredient for Chai, etc.

This will be unmoderated, but irrelevant subjects (ie drugs, other types
of music, employment announcements, spams, etc) will NOT BE TOLERATED --
keep that stuff on Usenet.  The list is intended to be very low in volume, 
yet high in content. 

For those that are interested, subscribe by sending e-mail to the
following:
	majordomo@party.net
In the subject of the message enter the following:
	subscribe goa
To post to the list, send e-mail to the following:
	goa@party.net

Hope to see some of you there!

Andy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:05:11 1996
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To: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Raves in SF, The NEGATIVE "Experience"
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Hiya All;
>
>        What did I tell you not one promoter responded to this post, greed,
>greed, greed; makes me sick. This is the same greed however that drives our
>country and it's corporations; know it & recognize it for it is the enemy of
>all living things.
>
>        The pursuit of a material world is the loss of everything.
>
>Peace
>THX1138
>
>PS Anyone got a dollar they can spare

It is little wonder no promoter would respond.  This place is well known to
be very inhospitable to anyone who dares make a $ from any party.  Be it
promoter, DJ, etc.

Just FYI.

Peace,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:05:16 1996
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To: "Jason Green*" <Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Please take neo-nazi dis
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>        Reply to:   RE>Please take neo-nazi discussions to another forum.
>
>THANK YOU!
>This something that not only needed to be said, but it also something that I
>said about a month back.  This a RAVE bulletin board, not a random discussion
>forum - now don't get me wrong: I am NOT saying that the issues that have been
>discussed, or that are being discussed on SFRAVES aren't important, they are
>just not SFRAVES related.
>Thank you...
>Peace, love, and infinite positive energy...
>-Jason

Suffice it to say I am in complete disagreement.  I see plenty of relevance
to raves/parties (since I do not like the word raves...BTW when was the
last rave?).

With that said.  Peace.

Out,
John

P.S.  I am glad we have so many people who decide what is good for the list
and what is bad.  The list would probably die without such stalwart
citizens. ;)




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:10:53 1996
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From: "Scott Nozawa" <scott_nozawa@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: ?Apples' nerdy programers?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Cc: "Mark Piercy" <piercy@toolik.stanford.edu>
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                      Subject:                              Time:  9:05


Hey gang,

     Speaking of Apples' nerdy programers, come see this one close at Quench
this Sunday  8*)   Quench is held at The Usual (F/X) 400 S. 1st St. S.J. 
Please all you Southbay raver types come up and say high!  Hopefully I will
have little flyers to hand out about a cool music thang in a park in June. 
It's gonna be summer time real soon and we gotta get SJ dancin' together!  

Peace to all...

                            Tamotsu
     


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:10:54 1996
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From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605160858.BAA00844@ns.mauswerks.com>
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It was fun, after all!   Freaky Chakra was great--- I'd never heard them 
before...  the place was about 1/2 full, but some good vibes were 
generated by the sfravers, for sure!  It was great meeting all the 
wonderful people who came up to me and introduced themselves!  (Boy, 
wearing a recognizable tee-shirt comes in handy!)

I second Amy's idea for those sfravers in the South Bay to get together 
for a drink, or somethin'...!

;-p

love
john


On Thu, 16 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
> >Uunderground enough?
> 
> Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops 
> were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If 
> that's true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh. 
> 
> I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the
> fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure
> they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....
> 
> It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party.
> Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally 
> meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are 
> obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink
> somewhere!
> 
> Love-
> Amy :-)
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:13:55 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 13:05:57 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Anyone else catch that Spaz thing on Public Access?
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Weird!

Cool visuals, but weird spoken word over live music/synths.  Live drummer.
Trippy dancers.  Images of the band layed over and under funky art work,
all swirling and melding and twirling.  Things like putting the drummers
head inside the bass drum, looking like a really old Led Zepplin video or
something.

Considering I was prepared to hear techno it ca.  The word "call" and a
phone number would speratically appear.  I didn't.

Question is, "was this SPAZ the party./rave promoters?"



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:15:18 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave/Media Essay (Super Long)
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Dear Friends & Family,

	I hope many of you took the time to read this.  It's not in fact 
specifically about the rave scene, but I definitely found it relevant.

My computer tells me that on Fri, 10 May 1996, Kyung Rok shared (in part):

> Though perhaps better sent on a Tuesday instead of a Friday afternoon, 
> this is about 1/4 of a cultural studies piece titled "Moral Panic, the 
> Media and British Rave Culture."  Written by Sarah Thornton, the rest of 
> this essay can be found in "Microphone fiends : Youth Music & Youth 
> Culture / edited by Andrew Ross & Tricia Rose. Routledge, 1994.

A few of the observations I found most interesting, and some comments of 
my own:

> ___
> The idea that authentic culture is somehow outside media and commerce is a 
> resilient one. In its full-blown romantic form, the belief imagines that 
> grass-roots cultures resist and struggle with a colonizing mass-mediated 
> corporate world

Although the problems with media and commercial interests are many, I am 
forced to agree with the author's indictment of our anti-media and 
anti-commercial outlook, as if our culture is somehow pure and real, and 
immune from the greed, mediocrity, and tastelessness we see in media and 
commerce.  The indictment of commerce may be due to the "temporary 
respite" many of us who are young possess from "adult commitments of 
accumulation of economic capital" (see below), but this doesn't make it 
correct.  

> In exploring this case, this article finds no opposition between 
> subcultures and the media, except for a dogged ideological one. It 
> uncovers no pure origins or organic homologies of sound, style and 
> ritual, nor does it vilify a vague monolith called "The media." Instead, 
> it examines how various media are integral to youth's social and 
> ideological formations. Micromedia like flyers and listings are means by 
> which club organizers bring the crowd together; niche media like the 
> music press construct as much as they document subcultures; while mass 
> media like the tabloids develop as much as do youth movements. Contrary 
> to youth discourses, then, subcultures do not germinate from
> seed and grow by force of their own energy into mysterious movements to 
> be belatedly ingested by the media. Rather, media are there and effective 
> right from the start. 

Again, this seems true.  SFRaves is part of the media, although it has 
the advantage of being a better-informed, more personal, and less 
restricted than large mass media outlets, plus the crucial point of being 
truly interactive.  Damning "the media" indiscriminately doesn't reflect 
well on our ability to comprehend that media are an important part of 
any culture, including ours.  Nor do they fit well into neat boxes of 
"mainstream" and "underground" media based on audience size or by whether 
they call themselves underground or alternative.

> The term "underground" is the expression by which clubbers refer to 
> things subcultural. More than fashionable or trendy, underground sounds 
> and styles are "authentic," and pitted against the mass-produced and 
> mass-consumed. Underqrounds denote exclusive worlds whose main point is 
> not elitism. but whose parameters often relate to particular crowds. They 
> delight in parental incomprehension, negative newspaper coverage and that 
> best blessing in disguise, the BBC ban. More than anything else, then, 
> undergrounds define themselves against the mass media.

Fortunately I don't think ravers delight much in "parental 
incomprehension."  From what I've seen, many of us have actually tried to 
bring our parents into the scene, and share the joy with them.  We do 
however, it seems to me, take an unseemly delight in negative media 
coverage:  Ridiculing them for lack of knowledge of our scene, taking the 
attitude "they just don't get it" as if they are incapable of getting it, 
reveling in our perceived superiority -- these attitudes don't reflect 
well on our community.  Which is not to say that we should go along with 
negative coverage -- we should seek to inform and correct it, and to 
fight it when it refuses to be informed and corrected.

> That's what I mean by underground."Undergrounds define themselves most 
> clearly by what they're not, that is "main stream." Although there is 
> variation, the oft-repeated expression by which they refer to mainstream 
> clubs is that these are places where "Sharon and Tracy dance around their 
> handbags." This mainstream is decried as passive, indiscriminate and 
> uncommitted to dance culture; it is ridiculed for its " herd instinct" 
> and " bandwagon mentality. " 

When I find myself dissing mainstream culture, I try to check myself.  I 
do not think it is a good habit, although it is an easy one to fall 
into.  What we are really doing when we dis mainstream culture, 
after all, is dissing humanity at large, saying most people are stupid, 
base, and lack taste and culture.  Now if we hold out the hope of 
reforming mainstream culture by making the underground the mainstream, 
that is different, for that is saying that there is hope for humanity, 
that humanity at large is not to blame, only current social attitudes.
	Note in the paragraph below where the author says that 
popularization is seen as a problem by the underground.  I think 
her observation is correct, and it's unfortunate, because while certainly 
it can have problematic *aspects*, to say that popularization *itself* 
is the problem is truly cynical and elitist.  

> ...subcultures romanticize "the street" 
> and the crowd, not artists' studios and individual genius. Moreover, 
> rather than the dreaded "trickle down," the problem for underground 
> subculture is popularization by a gushing up to the mainstream. 

I have myself noticed this tendency to romanticize "the street."  I think 
this can take several forms, one being the old argument that "If you 
aren't (X) yourself, or haven't done (X) yourself, or haven't been to (X) 
yourself, you aren't qualified to have an opinion on (X)."  Personally I 
have always thought this an extremely weak way of invalidating someone 
else's point of view.  Another way "the street" gets romanticized is by 
dissing "book smarts" in favor of an ill-defined "you've got to go out 
there and experience it, man" approach.
	I once occurred to me after a trip to L.A. that when people there are 
stuck up it seems to be more about how much money they have, who they 
know that's famous, whereas when people in S.F. are stuck up it's more 
often about how much a part of some "underground elite" they are.

> ...youth. whatever their 
> class enjoy a momentary reprieve from "necessity."'! In other words, 
> youth are exempt from adult commitments to the accumulation of economic 
> capital. They temporarily enjoy what Bourdieu argues is normally reserved 
> for the bourgeoisie; that is, a "taste of liberty or luxury. "

	This is troubling to me, because it reminds me that so few 
people, as they grow older, manage to live outside these "adult 
commitments to the accumulation of economic capital."  Just look at our 
cultural forebears, the hippies.  For the most part, the '60s generation 
has blended into the workforce without fulfilling the dreams of their 
youth of social change toward a world of peace, love, harmony, and fun.
	It troubles me that many ravers do not even seem to have such 
noble dreams.  Many of us have no hope of changing the world.  We do 
not think beyond the next party, beyond how great our favorite dance 
music is.  When the music is old, and a new generation seeking its own 
values finds something else to turn to besides raves, with different 
music and perhaps different values, what will we have changed?  If we're not 
even idealistic now, how crassly cynical and materialist may we become in 
thirty years?  I know this is a downer, but I say it not out of cynicism, 
but out of hope that we will make a difference, ravers young and old.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:20:04 1996
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To: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: Apple's Rave in San Jose!!!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-Id: <96May16.125928pdt.4808@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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At 01:06 AM 5/16/96 -0700, you wrote:

>Btw.. while I was leaving, a bunch of cops were coming up the stairs... 
>Did the party get busted?!? Lemme know!!
>There were six cop cars lined up outside the warehouse. heh.
>
>
>See ya all soon!
>
>
>Adam
>                            R.Lunatic
>
Can you say BUSTED..the Cops shut it donw around 12:30...Freaky Chakra and
Single Cell were getting off too. That kinda sucked. It wasn't a bad party
either. Once Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orch started the place got
moving. I'd have to give them a thumbs up for tring to put on a good party.
It was going good until the cops came. They were kinda being jerks about it
to. Anyway I had fun.


Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 13:35:44 1996
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Date: 16 May 96 13:28:24 -0700
From: "Aaron_Edsinger" <AEDSINGE@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: |NER| Fwd: NYC club owner in 'ecstasy' bust (fwd)
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yeah too bad...I sure will miss those 25$ Vitamin C tablets being sold at the 
LimeLight........


--Boundary-4901633-0-0
Content-Type: message/rfc822

Date: 16 May 96 11:40:53
From:"Troy Sheets " <owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Fwd: |NER| Fwd: NYC club owner in 'ecstasy' bust (fwd)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24]
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>From what I have heard about the Tunnel in NYC, it is a less than PLURRY place.
This is still extremely bad news....

-troy

---------------------------------

	NEW YORK, May 15 (UPI) -- A New York City nightclub impresario was  
arrested Wednesday and charged with turning two of his popular hot spots 
into drug dens by distributing the hallucinogen ``ecstasy'' to his young 
patrons. 
	Brooklyn U.S. Attorney Zachary Carter said Peter Gatien transformed  
Tunnel and the Limelight into ``virtual ecstasy supermarkets,'' selling 
up to 2,000 pills per month at $35 to $40 a pop. 
	``What's really remarkable was we determined that dealing drugs was  
not just a lucrative sideline, but was the centerpiece of the operation, 
'' Carter said. ``It could be said that these clubs existed to 
distribute these drugs.'' 
	Carter said an eight-month investigation into the distribution of the  
designer drug in New York led them directly to Gatien. He said Gatien 
hired a director and ``party promoters'' whose duties included guarding 
the door to let ``house dealers'' of the drug inside and then warn them 
when New York City police officers came around. 
	The club also took a cut of the dealers' profits, officials said.  
	The multicolored ecstasy pills -- sold under names like ``fruitloops,''  
``cat's eye,'' ``playboys'' and ``doves'' -- were apparently smuggled 
into the country from Amsterdam, the Netherlands, Montreal, Canada and 
Miami, said Drug Enforcement Administration Special Agent Carlo Boccia. 
	The drug is known to produce a combination of effects, including a  
euphoric high, relaxation and mild hallucinations, Boccia said. High 
doses have been linked to psychosis, brain damage and even death. 
	``The public needs to realize that the high visibility of clubs such  
as these glamorize the use and distribution of these illegal substances, 
'' Boccia said. 
	``Those who sell these drugs, albeit surrounded by the splendor and  
glitz of 'fashionable' nightclubs, are no less the scourge than those 
who hide in the back alleys of the inner city to dispense their poison. 
These people are just as bad, if not worse.'' 
	Gatien and 21 others were arrested in pre-dawn raids and 6,000 pills  
were confiscated. The defendants were charged with conspiracy to 
distribute ecstasy. They face maximum prison terms of 20 years if 
convicted. 
	Carter has also filed a motion to seize any of Gatien's ill-gotten  
assets and other physical property related to the alleged drug 
operation. 
	The clubs can remain open until a judge's ruling on the matter, he  
said. 
  	   	



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:10:28 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 15:10:46 -0600 (MDT)
From: Maren Ault <rault@holly.ColoState.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: dj 343
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anyone heard of dj343 from colorado?

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:10:53 1996
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To: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Raves in SF, The NEGATIVE "Experience"
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-Id: <96May16.125943pdt.4846@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 11:53:55 PDT
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>Hiya All;
>
>        What did I tell you not one promoter responded to this post, greed,
>greed, greed; makes me sick. This is the same greed however that drives our
>country and it's corporations; know it & recognize it for it is the enemy of
>all living things.
>
>        The pursuit of a material world is the loss of everything.
>
>Peace
>THX1138
>
>PS Anyone got a dollar they can spare

It is little wonder no promoter would respond.  This place is well known to
be very inhospitable to anyone who dares make a $ from any party.  Be it
promoter, DJ, etc.

Just FYI.

Peace,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:13:51 1996
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To: "Jason Green*" <Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Please take neo-nazi dis
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-Id: <96May16.125936pdt.4827@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 11:53:24 PDT
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>        Reply to:   RE>Please take neo-nazi discussions to another forum.
>
>THANK YOU!
>This something that not only needed to be said, but it also something that I
>said about a month back.  This a RAVE bulletin board, not a random discussion
>forum - now don't get me wrong: I am NOT saying that the issues that have been
>discussed, or that are being discussed on SFRAVES aren't important, they are
>just not SFRAVES related.
>Thank you...
>Peace, love, and infinite positive energy...
>-Jason

Suffice it to say I am in complete disagreement.  I see plenty of relevance
to raves/parties (since I do not like the word raves...BTW when was the
last rave?).

With that said.  Peace.

Out,
John

P.S.  I am glad we have so many people who decide what is good for the list
and what is bad.  The list would probably die without such stalwart
citizens. ;)




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:13:58 1996
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yeah too bad...I sure will miss those 25$ Vitamin C tablets being sold at the 
LimeLight........


--Boundary-4901633-0-0
Content-Type: message/rfc822

Date: 16 May 96 11:40:53
From:"Troy Sheets " <owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Fwd: |NER| Fwd: NYC club owner in 'ecstasy' bust (fwd)
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>From what I have heard about the Tunnel in NYC, it is a less than PLURRY place.
This is still extremely bad news....

-troy

---------------------------------

	NEW YORK, May 15 (UPI) -- A New York City nightclub impresario was  
arrested Wednesday and charged with turning two of his popular hot spots 
into drug dens by distributing the hallucinogen ``ecstasy'' to his young 
patrons. 
	Brooklyn U.S. Attorney Zachary Carter said Peter Gatien transformed  
Tunnel and the Limelight into ``virtual ecstasy supermarkets,'' selling 
up to 2,000 pills per month at $35 to $40 a pop. 
	``What's really remarkable was we determined that dealing drugs was  
not just a lucrative sideline, but was the centerpiece of the operation, 
'' Carter said. ``It could be said that these clubs existed to 
distribute these drugs.'' 
	Carter said an eight-month investigation into the distribution of the  
designer drug in New York led them directly to Gatien. He said Gatien 
hired a director and ``party promoters'' whose duties included guarding 
the door to let ``house dealers'' of the drug inside and then warn them 
when New York City police officers came around. 
	The club also took a cut of the dealers' profits, officials said.  
	The multicolored ecstasy pills -- sold under names like ``fruitloops,''  
``cat's eye,'' ``playboys'' and ``doves'' -- were apparently smuggled 
into the country from Amsterdam, the Netherlands, Montreal, Canada and 
Miami, said Drug Enforcement Administration Special Agent Carlo Boccia. 
	The drug is known to produce a combination of effects, including a  
euphoric high, relaxation and mild hallucinations, Boccia said. High 
doses have been linked to psychosis, brain damage and even death. 
	``The public needs to realize that the high visibility of clubs such  
as these glamorize the use and distribution of these illegal substances, 
'' Boccia said. 
	``Those who sell these drugs, albeit surrounded by the splendor and  
glitz of 'fashionable' nightclubs, are no less the scourge than those 
who hide in the back alleys of the inner city to dispense their poison. 
These people are just as bad, if not worse.'' 
	Gatien and 21 others were arrested in pre-dawn raids and 6,000 pills  
were confiscated. The defendants were charged with conspiracy to 
distribute ecstasy. They face maximum prison terms of 20 years if 
convicted. 
	Carter has also filed a motion to seize any of Gatien's ill-gotten  
assets and other physical property related to the alleged drug 
operation. 
	The clubs can remain open until a judge's ruling on the matter, he  
said. 
  	   	



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
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troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within


--Boundary-4901633-0-0--

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:14:23 1996
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It's just you :|  

Rick

At 10:51 AM 5/16/96 PDT, you wrote:
>
>Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?
>
>Gotta go...
>
>-SUNNY
>(SOLLE CLOTHING CO.)
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:18:33 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 13:53:48 -0700
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From: Klaxon 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: lets do the time warp again
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erk.
not again.
didn't we just finish with this?

anyone know which server is reposting old mail to the list? :(


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:18:56 1996
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Date: 16 May 1996 21:45:58 -0800
From: "Doug Hill" <doug_hill@powertalk.apple.com>
Subject: Re(2): Apple Sprockets/RAVE
Cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Well, I for one had a good time there. Hi to all I saw (Larry, Knucklehead,
Andy). As an Apple employee, I was afraid this was going to be a much more
techno-nerd, geek-fest. But, ravers came through and showed a good vibe. It
probably would have been 10X better if more people had showed up and the 
packed the place. The Single Cell/Freaky Chakra duo rocked the house and so
did the first DJ. There were definately some misses, but there were plenty of
good moments. This is actually the kind of events that could be going on more
if not for the the excessive police force.

And speaking of that: I couldn't believe the scene outside the event after the
cops showed up. I actually counted at least *8* squad cars parked down the
preceding two blocks to the warehouse. This is a major flashback to the
mid/late 80's punk scene in SJ when the cops would bust every show. Why did
they need this show of police force? Is it that the half-empty warehouse of
curious engineers and mellow ravers were such a threat? No! It's because
nobody can do any kind of after-hours event in SJ without paying off the
police to do security for you. It is a major fraud! This is precisely why
nothing happens here in SJ and why it will continue to be a completely boring,
uninteresting place. The cops have driven off everyone who isn't into
corporate greed and political scams. Thank god us south bay ravers have the
city to go to at least. 

BTW, as much as people might think that this was a major corporate event, you
should have seen the place and know you were completely wrong. Tiny warehouse
in one of the lousiest parts of town, very cool computer graphics/obscure
videos, groovy music, *no marketing slogans anywhere*, bizarre chill room.
This was a case where the promoters knew how to work the marketing process at
Apple and get funding to create their own thing. Very big thanks for putting
this on. I'm also glad that those who showed up had a good time and I got to
meet a bunch of cool individuals.

And, in true Apple fashion, they gave out shirts for the event, so, even if
you didn't like getting shut down, it wasn't a complete loss. BTW, I would be
curious to hear the story from the promoters to find out why the cops showed
up in the first place and then decided to shut it down.

doug

 ------ From: John Bagby, Thu, May 16, 1996 ------ 


It was fun, after all!   Freaky Chakra was great--- I'd never heard them 
before...  the place was about 1/2 full, but some good vibes were 
generated by the sfravers, for sure!  It was great meeting all the 
wonderful people who came up to me and introduced themselves!  (Boy, 
wearing a recognizable tee-shirt comes in handy!)

I second Amy's idea for those sfravers in the South Bay to get together 
for a drink, or somethin'...!

;-p

love
john


On Thu, 16 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
> >Uunderground enough?
> 
> Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops 
> were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If 
> that's true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh. 
> 
> I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the
> fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure
> they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....
> 
> It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party.
> Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally 
> meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are 
> obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink
> somewhere!
> 
> Love-
> Amy :-)
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:22:20 1996
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This was a very small (150 people, maybe?) rave.  It was a nice space -- one 
we South Bay Ravers should look into using again sometime soon.  The main 
dance room had nice visuals, free non-alcoholic drinks.  Chill space had a 
black light, some home movies playing, and a couple of Macs with video 
games.  We figured the ambient consisted of a couple of guys who had found a 
synth and a book, "Ambient for Dummys".  I really wonder if someone switched 
the colored stickers on the keyboard so the poor guy was hitting the wrong 
notes.  Interesting, if rather weird, and the guys doing the ambient did 
have their good moments.  The sound system in the main room was not the best 
but adequate for that size room.  The first guy I heard spinning, Alex, was 
*good*.  There were various people throwing vinyl down after that, ranging 
from ok to fairly flat.

I had a pretty good time dancing and chatting with fellow SFRavers.  It's so 
nice to go to something and know that you'll meet up with people you know 
that have a similar drive to party and dance!

I pooped out around 12:30.  There were cops there at that point, but the 
reason I left was because I had to work the next day, and I just couldn't 
really relax knowing that.

MISCONCEPTION #1:  It was NOT put on by Apple.  It was put on by some ravers 
that work for Apple.

MISCONCEPTION #2:  The cops did not originally intend to bust the party.  
Apparently city ordinance in San Jose requires that the promoter for a party 
have a business license if they charge an entrance fee.  I guess the guy 
that put it on thought he'd get around it by putting a bowl at the front 
door labeled "Donations".  Nope.  So the cops cited him.  When I left he was 
arguing with the cops and getting pretty pissed off.  I suspect that shortly 
after I passed them, the cops got fed up and decided to show the guy what 
they *could* do as opposed to what they had intended to do.

FOR FUTURE REFERENCE: This was a good space and the idea of providing a 
cheap party was excellent.  Two things: First, have a map point where you 
can charge the fee or get a business license.  Second, bring in a HUGE fan 
to push/pull air out of the main room.  It gets hot and humid in a hurry and 
the air just doesn't move, but it wouldn't be difficult to remedy this.

And one more thing: do NOT argue with the cops.  They're doing their jobs.  
Just grin and bear it.  You can bet there are about 10 cops that now have a 
less positive view of our scene due to last night's events.  Personally, I'd 
rather work *with* the authorities than against them...

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:22:38 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 14:23:29 -0700
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Subject: here we go again
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aaaargh! the sony server is acting up again!
can someone please remove jkolarik@ssi.sony.com from the list?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:33:23 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 14:33:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Laminates Survey
In-Reply-To: <960516134915_114931004@emout15.mail.aol.com>
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cool...I think that a laminate for a buck is fair if it allows the
artist to express creativity . . 

Cassandra

On Thu, 16 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com
wrote:

> How does anyone feel about having to fork out about a buck for their
> laminate.  I really like the free idea, but I've got this really neat design
> which involves a small electronic device. (Hee hee, I'm not telling)  Might
> be able to keep production costs under a buck. 
> -P.S. I was just thinking what a strange concept sfraves is, kinda like a
> positve version of The Borg gone haywire.  "You too will be assimilated!"
> Love,
> Steveo
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:41:30 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 14:41:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Adam Luong <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
In-Reply-To: <199605161700.KAA12392@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
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Fourth????

On Thu, 16 May 1996, Adam Luong wrote:

> You wrote: 
> >
> >
> 
> >I second Amy's idea for those sfravers in the South Bay to get 
> together 
> >for a drink, or somethin'...!
> >
> >;-p
> >
> >love
> >john
> >
> >
> >On Thu, 16 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:
> 
>  Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to 
> finally 
> >> meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are 
> >> obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a 
> drink
> >> somewhere!
> >> 
> >> Love-
> >> Amy :-)
> >> 
> >
> 
> 
> Yes! I THIRD this Idea!!! =)~
> 
> 
> Adam
>                     R.Lunatic
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:41:49 1996
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Subject: Re: SCHWA
Date: Thu, 16 May 96 15:45:49 -0600
From: Andy Hawks <andy@cmac20.colorado.edu>
To: "Sanfrandisco Raves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?

I've never met you, so I dunno if you're one of 'em or not.

<shrug>

If you are, we should hang out sometime, I'll take you to a 
party....people there will all dig you.  =)

Have an Evolved Day

=)




       __                                              __
   ___/  )           andy@andy.colorado.edu           (  \___
  (___) (_____   peace<->love<->unity<->respect   _____) (___)
  (___)> _____    believe in the power of love    _____ <(___)
  (___)_/                                              \_(___)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 14:48:28 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 14:49:55 -0700
From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Organization: r e g e n e r a t i o n  X
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Hey everybody. I was glad that I actually drove the five minutes to get
to the Apple Rave. It was a good party. I was a little skeptical at
first but as usual I was proven wrong. The atmosphere was very good. Me
and my friend (whose account this is, coincidentally enough) met a
couple of people from sfraves. We met John Bagby (PLUR), Adam ( Dr.
Seuss hat) and another John from sf who told us about BAY TO BREAKERS. I
saw several people who were at Madness. It was funny watching the cops
come in and try their best to find out what was going on. One of the
cops was watching us dance and he he had a very self assured "thank god
I'm not one of you degenerates" look on his face. The cops proceeded to
walk through the place and try to figure this one out. They even went
behind the Non-alcoholic bar to look for alcohol and any other
paraphernalia that they could. Unfortunately for them, none was to be
found. I saw one of the cops writing a citation of some sort to a young
lady. Me and my friends were wondering what the reason for it was
because she did not seem to be doing anything noticably wrong. I wonder
if it has something to do with the teenage curfew laws in San Jose (?)
Overall I would like to applaud Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orchestra
for their outstanding effort. The music was really flowing when the cops
busted the party. I was pleasantly surprised when all of us who stayed
until the very end received a free commerative T-shirt. It is obvious to
me why there are no raves in san jose. The law enforcement establishment
was unable to see this party for the peaceful communal gathering that it
wwas. Me and ionX are eager to meet all those sfravers who reside in the
south bay. We would be more than happy to join all of you for a drink
soon.(as suggested by Amy :).


Dhiren, ionX

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 15:16:04 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 15:17:22 -0700
From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
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Hi everybody! Does anybody know what kind of sound equipment was being
used by the djs playing at around 11 at the apple rave. We were sitting
across the room and it looked like the dj was scratching a turntable
with his maglite. Upon closer inspection, we found out that he was
actually waving his maglite like Merlin's wand over what looked like a
circuit board of some sort. It obviously had sensors built in to read
the movements of the light and synthesize a sound similar to that
movement. It was a real trip watching him weave his magic by moving a
torchlight. If anyone knows what instrument that is would they please
post some info about it or send us mail. Thank you


Peace 
Dhiren and ion x

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 15:21:47 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 15:16:28 -0700
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: apple maglite dj rig?
To: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
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You know, that instrument looked like one of those "build it yourself" 
electronic boards that you can buy at Radio Shack. I swear it looked 
just like the one I bought when I was 11 years old... Hehehehe... 
yeah.. It made some type of trippy whiny noise while he was tapping the 
button down... wierd... but, whatever works!!

Adam


You wrote: 
>
>Hi everybody! Does anybody know what kind of sound equipment was being
>used by the djs playing at around 11 at the apple rave. We were 
sitting
>across the room and it looked like the dj was scratching a turntable
>with his maglite. Upon closer inspection, we found out that he was
>actually waving his maglite like Merlin's wand over what looked like a
>circuit board of some sort. It obviously had sensors built in to read
>the movements of the light and synthesize a sound similar to that
>movement. It was a real trip watching him weave his magic by moving a
>torchlight. If anyone knows what instrument that is would they please
>post some info about it or send us mail. Thank you
>
>
>Peace 
>Dhiren and ion x
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 15:32:21 1996
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Subject: Re: SBay folks (was apple rave: )
Date: Thu, 16 May 96 15:32:03 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
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>We would be more than happy to join all of you for a drink
>soon.(as suggested by Amy :).

Well, I would be more than happy to play cruise director so we
can actually get this thing together.

Next weekend would be a good time for me, so perhaps on Friday
night early on? I don't know what kind of place we want to go
to, so if anyone has suggestions please let me know. Ideally it
would be someplace big, and someplace where our under-21 friends
could hang out, but not drink alcohol. I'm not expecting anything
in the way of good music, just somewhere we can chill.

-Amy :-)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 16:11:58 1996
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>...It is obvious to
>me why there are no raves in san jose. The law enforcement establishment
>was unable to see this party for the peaceful communal gathering that it
>was.

What makes everyone think San Fran is any different?  An experienced 
promoter will take care of the various requirements for having an event in 
whatever city they decide to throw the party in.  I was standing outside 
listening to the police officer trying to explain to the promoter that 
*nothing at all* would have happened if he hadn't had the donations bowl 
sitting there.  The promoter came back whining about how the cop had the 
badge so there was nothing he could do.  What the heck is that supposed to 
mean?  It tells me the guy wearing the badge has a job to do, regardless of 
whether or not he enjoys doing it.  What turned it into a bust was a cop 
that got tired of getting badgered for trying to go easy and decided to just 
shut it all down.

Put it this way: I've partied in various venues with various themes and 
music for a long time.  When people follow the rules and respect the 
authorities, it's a good night.  When they don't, it's a bad night.  Simple.

>One of the
>cops was watching us dance and he he had a very self assured "thank god
>I'm not one of you degenerates" look on his face.

I was dancing right in front of that guy wearing my Dr. Seuss hat.  I'm sure 
he was actually thinking, "Geez, where can *I* get a hat like that?"  Ok, 
maybe not...

S



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 16:16:04 1996
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Date: 16 May 1996 16:12:56 -0800
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Subject: FWD>Apple Rave- It's Apple 
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Mail*Link¨ SMTP               FWD>Apple Rave: It's Apple Co.!

Hey Joel,  

sorry if you got this twice.  This came in on SFRaves.  I thought it was funny
-M

Yeah, be thankful it won't be a Microsoft Rave!
I could imagine all kinds of horrible things at one of those:

	-The voicemail says the party starts at 10pm, but it gets
postponed about twelve times until it finally starts at 11 am the next day
	-They make you buy their own Microsoft Brand water, claiming
that 'all other waters are incompatible with this venue'
	-The sound system inexplicably shuts down every 30 minutes 
	-The visuals consist of slides of Bill Gates superimposed over
Windows wallpaper.bmps
	-After you get into the party and realize it sucks, you find
ticket vendors selling pricey 'ticket-supplements' that grant access to
another, hidden room where the better DJs and better vibe are
	-The promoters run around the party trying to buyout all the
small-scale smoothie vendors

So, support our Apple friends.  They're the last line of defense against
the mediocre hegemony that is Microsoft!

	-jon



On Wed, 15 May 1996, ameba wrote:

> say, before everyone knocks the Apple rave you all should know that 
> Freaky Chrakra Vs Single Cell will be playing live along with DJ Liqiud 
> and some others. That in itself is enough to spark my interest:)
> -- 
> salutations,
> andrew
> _____________________________________
> ameba  1732 haight street sf ca 94117
> mailto:ameba@netcom.com
> http://www.ameba.com        |      \
> 415.750.9368                |       \
> =====================================
>                             |       /
>                             |      /
> 


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From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Subject: Apple Rave: It's Apple Co.!
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 16:40:33 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 16:40:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Begroovy@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
In-Reply-To: <960516135134_302264137@emout13.mail.aol.com>
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I have one thing to say about what belongs on sfraves.  Raving is, to a 
certain extent, a limited topic.  If you start subdividing the whole 
thing into different  music genres/ different spiritualities/ etc. etc., 
the result will be  VERY watered down.  I would hate to see that.  I am 
not knocking the Goa list at all, but why not talk a little about that 
stuff here?  Raving is  about music and I would  certainly enjoy picking the 
brains of people who know a hell of a lot more than I do.  If you dislike 
something, DELETE it!  It's not hard.

-kaySEE

On Thu, 16 May 1996 Begroovy@aol.com wrote:

> Thanks to aleph1@dfw.net  for posting this and giving people a place to
> discuss goa trance. This is what I was discussing yesterday. This will allow
> people who enjoy goa trance a forum to discuss this genre of music. Thus
> respecting the sfravers who are not particularly fond of this genre of music.
> There mail boxes will not be filled with specific goa type messages.
> I think this is a wonderful idea and i would like to see many more of these
> types of specific lists. Sub-catagories of the sfraves e-mail list! Getting
> bored, Brian???? Need something to keep you busy????? = )    Have a great
> day,PEACE!! Cid  
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 17:05:59 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 17:06:31 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Graphic Converter (thanks everyone!)
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Thanks everyone who responded to my Graphic Converter inquiry... I got
about 20 messages with download info, etc. Even the program itself in an
attachment... =)

thank you all, I got what I needed.

(I LOVE this list!)

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 17:09:22 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 17:09:54 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Apple's Rave in San Jose!!!
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Sounds like Apple really managed to recreate a true rave... =)

-m.


>At 01:06 AM 5/16/96 -0700, you wrote:
>
>>Btw.. while I was leaving, a bunch of cops were coming up the stairs...
>>Did the party get busted?!? Lemme know!!
>>There were six cop cars lined up outside the warehouse. heh.
>>
>>
>>See ya all soon!
>>
>>
>>Adam
>>                            R.Lunatic
>>
>Can you say BUSTED..the Cops shut it donw around 12:30...Freaky Chakra and
>Single Cell were getting off too. That kinda sucked. It wasn't a bad party
>either. Once Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orch started the place got
>moving. I'd have to give them a thumbs up for tring to put on a good party.
>It was going good until the cops came. They were kinda being jerks about it
>to. Anyway I had fun.
>
>
>Tim (knucklehead)


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 17:16:34 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 17:17:26 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: sddpw@sirius.com (Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works)
Subject: NRR: YEAAAH!
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I just handled in my final, final project and I am DONE WITH SCHOOL!
Graduation is this Sunday.  Boy am I psyched, but I have no one else to
share it with at the moment, so I thought I'd share it with my virtual
summer.

Top it all off, just got a one sentence "review" in XLR8R.  Can't wipe the
smile off my face.  Looks like things are definitely looking up.

Good luck to everyone else who is still struggling through the end of their
semesters.  And to everyone, positive vibes for an awesome summer.

arkay



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 17:19:23 1996
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From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
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>I am 
>not knocking the Goa list at all, but why not talk a little about that 
>stuff here?

I agree totally.  Why put the Goa messages on a separate list?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 17:32:15 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605170032.RAA16860@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 17:32:46 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605170019.RAA19039@shellx.best.com> from "SDream" at May 16, 96 05:19:32 pm
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> 
> >I am 
> >not knocking the Goa list at all, but why not talk a little about that 
> >stuff here?
> 
> I agree totally.  Why put the Goa messages on a separate list?

Becuase sfraves is a list dedicated to a specific geographical location.
The Goa list is global.

Additionally, have you considered that the creater of the Goa list
would like to just discuss music, without the major distractions that
appear on sfraves?

The list creater, Andy Kumeda, is not even subscribed to sfraves.  He
is a socal-raver.

I don't see whats the big deal.  If you want to get the the goa info, just
subscribe.

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 17:39:27 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 14:06:42 PDT
From: Diane_Tabellija@adoc.xerox.com
Message-Id: <9604168322.AA832277240@beluga.adoc.xerox.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re[2]: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
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Oops, I meant to send this to the list...verification on local laws would be 
appreciated.

   From my failing memory, I seem to recall that San Jose has a caberet law 
   where _legal_ clubs & parties need to close at 2pm.  I also know that there 
   was a big write-up in the local rag (Metro) sometime ago indicating that 
   promoters/club owners were required to utilize particular security guard 
   firms that actually hire off-duty police.  The article addressed it as a 
   scam.  Perhaps SJ's finest got a bit grumpy 'cause they weren't involved or 
   they wanted to make more of it...wonders never cease, do they?
   
   Having a delicious low-key day,
   Diane
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
Author:  	Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.com> at beluga-mail 
Date:    5/16/96 11:06 AM
   
   
What I find most interesting is the fact that even Apple (Apple!) can't 
throw a party without it being busted.  You would think an event sponsored 
by a corporate giant would not be as prone to busting as say a small 
collective of relative insignificance.  (One making a substantial 
contribution to the local economy, the other making a huge racket all 
night.)
   
We shall win the war one battle (and one hug) at a time.  :^)
   
Anyone know if any official Apple representatives were there to defend the 
party?  Or were they long gone, home in bed with their wives and 
mistresses, husbands and misters.  :^)
   
Tony
   
   
At 2:29 AM  -0700 5/16/96, Ms Phink wrote:
>>Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago. 
>>Uunderground enough?
>
>Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops 
>were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If 
>that's
>true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh. 
>
>I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the 
>fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure 
>they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....
>
>It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party. 
>Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally 
>meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are 
>obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink 
>somewhere!
>
>Love-
>Amy :-)
   
   


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 18:03:14 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 18:03:02 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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To: Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works <sddpw@sirius.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: NRR: YEAAAH!
References: <v01520d01adc1756790aa@[205.134.228.135]>
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Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works wrote:
> 
> I just handled in my final, final project and I am DONE WITH SCHOOL!
> Graduation is this Sunday.  Boy am I psyched, but I have no one else to
> share it with at the moment, so I thought I'd share it with my virtual
> summer.
> 
> Top it all off, just got a one sentence "review" in XLR8R.  Can't wipe the
> smile off my face.  Looks like things are definitely looking up.
> 
> Good luck to everyone else who is still struggling through the end of their
> semesters.  And to everyone, positive vibes for an awesome summer.
> 
> arkay

Congratulations on your graduation!! You mentioned that you got a 
one sentence review in XLR8R but review of what? Do you dj or ...? If so
I hope to be able to check ya out sometime this summer here in the
bay area? If you're not gonna be around this summer I wish you happiness
and love in your life! 

Also, please DON'T wipe that smile off your face!! All that positive 
energy is highly contagious...YEAH!!!

Peace,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 19:50:28 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 19:51:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Thanks from Harmony!
To: Gregory Sandler <ascend@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Mon, 13 May 1996, Gregory Sandler wrote:

> Matt, Cloud and Trent, thanks for the tunes! (And no 
> Randy, Dj Dan didn't spin first.) 
> 

Hi!
 My apologies to Matt and Cloud. I wish I had more time to learn who the 
DJ's are but damn I have a full life. You guys played some awesome beats. 
Made carrying the sound system and cleaning up VERY worthwhile. AND I 
thought Greg and Trent were serving up some  tasty mixs ;) !!!!!!!

Ran

                        ( taking it higher )
                              /
                        -=*=-/
                          ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 20:04:17 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 20:00:45 -0700
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: apple rave: 
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
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You wrote: 

>I was dancing right in front of that guy wearing my Dr. Seuss hat.  
I'm sure 
>he was actually thinking, "Geez, where can *I* get a hat like that?"  
Ok, 
>maybe not...
>
>S
>
>


On Haight Street.. =)~

Adam



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 20:06:47 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 20:07:22 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: signing off tommorrow...
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Hey all!

The school year is ALMOST over (I got one final coming up saturday) and I'm
having e-mail yanked out from under my feet after 10pm tommorrow. So, I'm
signing off of SFRaves friday. However, once I get home (San Jose) on
Sunday, I'm going to try to hook up some kind of modem access to my campus
account, so *hopefully* I'll be back within a week...

Anyway, I've met a bunch of you and you're all wonderful people. I'll keep
going to parties and such over summer, so I'll see you around. It'll just
be a lot harder getting rides and BARTing and stuff. =) I guess now I'll
have to meet some south bay SFRavers?

Thanks for the good times,
-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 20:38:09 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 20:38:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Pack-a-bowl
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I am out the door, headed to PackABowl.  If anyone else goes, look for 
me.  I'll have on a pink T-shirt and dark baggy pants.  I'll also be with 
Jess and I'll be the person who REALLY sucks at bowling (you should 
notice me from that!!!)

chau,
kaysee

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 20:44:21 1996
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From: Derek Chung <dhchung@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605170344.UAA10011@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: This Week's SFR Calendar!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (SF Raves)
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 20:44:16 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves-calendar@hyperreal.com (SFR Calendar)
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The big fun was at Madness last weekend with bumpy techno in a cool
indoor/outdoor space in the city - just the way I like it.  This weekend
features a bunch of out-of-town guests - Pierre, Miss Thing, Reese and
Keoki; Nikita probably also has a big guest DJ but I don't have the list
handy - call the number I guess.  I think there's also a party at 
111 Minna on Friday that I forgot the info for.

Thanks for everyone who sent in updates this week (and past weeks)!


                                THE SFR CALENDAR
                                       
    http://www.hyperreal.com/raves/sf/calendar/gencal.cgi
    
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Upcoming Parties in the San Francisco Bay Area

   Friday, May 17th - King St Garage
   Anita, Patrick, David Harness.
   10pm-, 21+, $4. King St Garage, 174 King St @ 3rd., SF. 415.522.6887
   
   Friday, May 17th - Ultra 5 presents _Smarties _
   Pierre (NYC), Eric Davenport, Barry Weaver, DJ Dan, Jeno, Kimo.
   9pm-7am, . 800.204.3986 415.437.5503 408.345.2399 916.484.4006
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Origin presents _Liquid Sky Music west coast tour_
   Teri Bristol (Miss Thing), Reese (NYC), Markie, Simon, Garth, Rob
   Doten.
   Virgin location, free water and organic food.
   415.675.5605 408.236.3398 415.541.5646 916.484.4213
   
   Saturday, May 18th - SqUAreOne presents _Fresh Start_
   Karizma, Rig-A-Tony, Lego, Pelican Boy, Dr. Jimmy Zimms, special
   guest.
   discount for May Babies w/i.d.
   $10. SF. 415.263.3987
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Spundae presents _Space Teddy_
   Keoki, DJ Dan, Mystr-E, Mars, Jon Santos, David Michael.
   415.764.2922
   
   Saturday, May 18th - _Outer Limits_
   Chach, Naz, Danny, SOL.
   18+, $5. central california. 209.488.5332
   
   Friday, May 24th - Space Children & In-Touch presents _Open Space_
   A1 (Texas), DJ Dan, Donald Glaude, Graeme, Cesar, Radley.
   415.267.3916 510.433.7216 408.327.9277 916.554.7177
   
   Friday, May 24th - Bee.Jones & OM records presents urban jam IV
   Jungle Biskit, Telefunken, Los Angelitos, New Dealers, Mo'Fessionals,
   Mark Farina, Felix the Dogge, Corey Black, Buck.
   advance tix thru family dog - 415.974.0634
   8pm-. Maritime Hall, 450 Harrison St, SF.
   
   Friday, May 24th - _Sm:)e_
   Stevie (Dimensional), Vibes (Dimensional), Xpress (Davis), Spin Clair
   (Colorado), more TBA.
   Free Smarties and other goodies.
   7pm- $10. Stockton. 209.547.3285
   
   Saturday, May 25th - Funky Tekno Tribe 
   Graeme, DJ Dan, Simon, Tony, Galen, Jon Williams, Chris Flores,
   Darkhorse, Jonah Sharp, Professor Smith.
   limited pre-sale tix $20 at Housewares & In Tha Mix.
   415.266.8215 415.266.9215 408.236.2205 916.484.3727
   
   Saturday, May 25th - _a higher state of freedom_
   andre lucero, taj, galen, sean murray, goura candra.
   Free. 415.303.5336
   
   Sunday, May 26th - _Spundae_
   John Aquaviva, Jon Williams, Simon, Henrik, Tony, Felix, David
   Michael, Kimball Collins, Mark Lewis, DJ Dan, Carlos, Miquel, Pete
   Avila, David Harness.
   Visuals by Dimension Se7en.
   9pm-8am, 21+. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.974.9389
   
   Wednesday, May 29th - Up n'Atom
   Laron, Chris, Gavin, Felix the Dogge, Soulstice (live).
   111 Minna St, SF. 415.789.8044
   
   Friday, May 31st - _Needles_
   Barry Weaver, Donald Glaude, Chris Flores, Karizma, Dutch, Matthew,
   Miah, Stevie, Vibes, Flash, Dennis, Rockit, Filip, Scot, Carlos
   Campos.
   runs all weekend (thru 6/2)
   415.313.7107 916.440.2707
   
   Friday, May 31st - Out-A-Sight
   Graeme, Jeno, Simon, Sotero (SD).
   Visuals by Hyperdelic, Donovan.
   SF. 415.437.4462
   
   Friday, May 31st - Beyond Space-Time/Kundalini presents 100% Spiritual
   Rays of Love
   DJ Shakra, Michael Manahan, Dervish, DJ Daeman, Ernie Munson, Phil
   Salter, Jon Williams.
   415.337.4928 510.895.3550
   
   Saturday, June 1st - _Tribal Future Big Mountain Boogie_
   Tony, Carlos, Josh, John Howard, Tracy, Galen, Solar, Alex Windsor,
   Alika, Abstract, Pollywog, Dan Barnes, Allen, Andrew, Nathan, DJ
   Crack.
   runs from noon Saturday until midnight or later Sunday.
   tix at Ameba and Primal.
   $20. Willits. 415.750.9368
   
   Saturday, June 8th - choice... presents Basics 
   Tony, Josh, Garth, Doc Martin, Doran, Brownie, Astral Matrix (live).
   E.S.W.H/H.O.B.M./C.C.C./H.B.T.U.K.
   415.905.9629
   
   Wednesday, August 28th - Burning Man 1996
   includes Wicked Sound System.
   save $10 by registering by June 1st.
   runs entire weekend, through September 2nd.
   All ages, $35. Black Rock Desert, Nevada. 415.985.7471
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
W E E K L I E S

   House/techno/acid jazz/ambient/etc reg'lar happenins Some of them may
   have ended - let me know when that happens...
   
  Thursday
  
   Lift - House, Funk w/DJs David Harness, Ruben Mancias, Jay-J, Black,
   guests. 12mid-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma, SF. 415.267.5984
   
   Velvet Shop - House, Techno. call for location
   21+, $5. 4th St Bowl, , SJ. 408.235.1556
   
   _Azul_ - House, Soul w/DJs Alfie, James. 21+, Free. Casanova, 527
   Valencia, SF.
   
   Full House - Acid Jazz, House w/DJs Finn, Matt Bernsen, Andrew
   Rawnsley, Bruno Ybarra, guests, live musicians. 10pm-2am, 21+, $3.
   Miss Pearl's Jam House, Eddy & Larkin, SF.
   
   Pack-a-Bowl - "We'll be droppin the wax while you're droppin the
   balls" w/DJs Mars, Tracy, guests. 8:30pm-2am, $6. Park Bowl, Haight @
   Stanyan, SF. 415.541.5019
   
   .blitz - foxyboysfancygirlsfreshmademixes begins April 4th
   21+. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   _Le Jazz Hot!_ - future sounds for jazz heads w/DJs Andrew Jervis,
   guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, $3. Nickies BBQ, 460 Haight, SF. 415.621.6508
   
   _Real_ - house, techno. every first Thursday of the month
   9pm-2am, 18+, $7. Pantages Theater, 1225 K St Mall, Sacramento.
   916.565.9588
   
   _Revolutionary Wax_ - coax your evolutionary ass w/DJs Consuelo Kevin,
   John John (Open Mind), James (Tweekin). 21+, Free. Dalva, 3121 16th
   St, SF. 415.252.7740
   
   _Green_ - house, techno w/DJs guests weekly. 10pm-2am, 18+. the top of
   the Wharf Cafe, the end of the Santa Cruz Wharf, Santa Cruz.
   
  Friday
  
   _ Sound Factory _- House w/DJs Pete Avila, David Harness, guets.
   9:30pm-7am, 21+, $10. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF.
   415.543.1300
   
   _Soul'd Out_ - House w/DJs Julius Papp, Rick Preston, guests. free
   before 10:30
   9pm-, 21+, $5. The Usual, 400 S.1st St., San Jose.
   
   _Nocturnal Transmission_ - House w/DJs David Harness, Tim Martinez,
   Saint John, guests. $5 before midnight.
   11pm-5am, 21+, $10. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Go Fast_ - Techno. Energy Music...for Women by Women (boys can come
   too).
   10pm-. 8th & Minna, SF.
   
   _Liquid Fridays_ - House w/DJs various DJs. 10pm-2am, 18+, Free. 2721
   Broadway, Sacramento., Sacramento. 916.484.4285
   
   the green door - "where circles meet squares" w/DJs andrew, thomas,
   caspar, paul, felix the dog, guests. 10pm-3am, 21+, $7. 880 Stevenson
   @ 10th, SF.
   
   _Nikita_ - house, techno w/DJs Jeno, Simon, Henrik. 10pm-7am, 21+,
   $10. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.267.0568
   [5.31 - Juan Atkins]
   [6.7 - DJ Duke]
   [6.14 - Westbam, Hardsequencer]
   [6.21 - CJ Mackintosh]
   [6.28 - Derrick May]
   
   _The Scene_ - 21+. the EndUp, 401 6th @ Harrison, SF. 415.393.9067
   
   _Beats_ - house, breakbeat, trance w/DJs Carlos Campos, Karizma,
   weekly guests. 7042 Folsom Blvd between Howe and 65th, Sacramento.
   415.273.1345 916.558.0850
   
   _This Side Up_ - house, techno w/DJs guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight,
   SF.
   
  Saturday
  
   _Other Whirled_ - House, Techno w/DJs Warren, Nobel, Jason Cassady,
   Nikki Rivera, guests. saturday morning
   6am-, 21+. 201 9th @ Howard, SF.
   
   _Sound Factory _- big club sounds
   9:30pm-4am, 21+. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF. 415.543.1300
   
   _Release _- Acid Jazz, Funk, Reggae, House w/DJs Jerry Ross, Josh, Mr.
   Sulu, Randy Wong. 21+. 1015 Folsom, , SF. 415.337.7457
   
   55 - House, Euro w/DJs Jorge Martinez, Tim Martinez, guests. 21+. 55
   Natoma St., SF. 415.267.1858
   
   _Vanilla Fudge _- House w/DJs Corey Black, Sunshine, Moonbeam, Jason,
   Big Lee, Darren. occasional saturday nights.
   10pm-2am, Free. Cafe Bastille, 55 Belden Alley, SF. 415.764.2903
   
   Vertigo - Psycho, Techno, Disco, Funk w/DJs Nikki Rivera, Ellen
   Ferrato, Dave Peterson, Lewis. 10pm-, 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison,
   SF. 415.703.7172
   
   _Liquid Vinyl_ - House w/DJs Jay-J, Suiki, John Howard, guests.
   2am-6am, 21+, $8. DV8, 540 Howard, SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Nuff Respect _- Jungle w/DJs StarEyes, Thad. 5pm-9pm, Free. Your
   Mama's Cafe, 5239 College Ave @ Broadway, Oakland, Oakland.
   510.601.YOUR
   
   phunkatech - Jungle w/DJs UFO, Noel, guests. 21+, $2. The Top, 424
   Haight, SF. 415.995.4699
   
   _Metro Jazz _- Acid Jazz w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Mauricio Avilas, Tom
   Thump, Franky, guests. 10pm-, 21+, $7. 111 Minna St, SF.
   [5.18 - Kevin]
   [5.25 - Harry Who?]
   [6.1 - Markie]
   [6.8 - Two Year Anniversary]
   
  Sunday
  
   the Sci-fi Club - hypersentientpsychedelictribalacidcybertrance w/DJs
   Dutch, DRC, Mars, Theta Blip, Solar, guests. Free food and Funky vibes
   in The Juicy Milk Bar (Ameba DJ team + guests)
   18+. 683 Clementina @ 8th & Folsom, SF. 415.331.1500x888
   
   _Spundae _- House, Techno w/DJs Henrik, Carlos, Miquel, weekly guests.
   free b4 10:30p
   For Technotica, call 415.764.2922
   10pm-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.974.9389
   
   _Leopard Lounge_ - Acid Jazz, Funk & Live Bands. w/DJs Suiki, Jay-J,
   Anthony, Julius Papp, Mark Farina, guests. 2125 Lombard @ Fillmore,
   SF. 415.771.2583
   
   _Pleasuredome_ - House w/DJs Neil Lewis, David Harness, Phil B,
   guests. 21+. 177 Townsend, SF. 415.985.5256
   
   Quench - House, Ambient w/DJs Rick Preston, Ryan Tapia, guests.
   Ambient-Space explorations by DJ Leath and guests in the front room.
   21+. The Usual, 400 South First St., San Jose. 408.535.0330
   
   _Techsture_ - deep layers of sound w/DJs tomas, markus, guests.
   8pm-12mid, All ages, Free. cafe abir, 1300 Fulton @ Divisadero, SF.
   415.974.4358
   
   subbass - jungle, drum'n'bass, trip hop w/DJs noel, abstract, jawbone.
   10pm-2am, 21+, $3. 270 Brannan @ 2nd, SF. 415.905.8865
   
  Monday
  
    Mushroom Jazz - acid jazz, trip hop w/DJs Mark Farina, Miquel, Julius
   Papp, guests. 9pm-3am, 21+, $5. 330 Ritch St, SF. 415.905.8811
   
   _Noc Noc_ - techno/ambient/jungle w/DJs Mohsen. 21+, Free. 557 Haight
   St., SF.
   
   _Tongue n' Groove _- trip hop, jungle, acid jazz w/DJs tomas, seth,
   m.mark, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+, $5. Cat's Grill & Alley, 1190 Folsom @
   8th, SF. 415.431.3332
   
   _rotation_ - jazz, hiphop, soul, acid jazz, funk w/DJs racer x, yamu,
   stef, rasta cue-tip, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+. up & down club, 1151
   Folsom St, SF.
   
   _21st sensory _- abstractbeatz-hiphop-dub-drum n'bass-electro w/DJs
   Tomas, Abstract, guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight, SF. 415.974.4358
   
   _Movement_ - trance, breakbeat, jungle w/DJs Julio, Kimo. 10pm-2am,
   18+, $3. Bahia Cabana, 1600 Market @ Franklin, SF. 415.263.5797
   
  Tuesday
  
    Butterfly - Hip Hop, Acid Jazz, House, Funk w/DJs Charlotte, Dani,
   guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, $2. Casanova, 527 Valencia, SF.
   
   Breathe Deep - House w/DJs Jay-J, Ruben, Miquel, guests. 10pm-4am,
   21+, $5. 1015 Folsom., SF. 415.998.9515
   
   _Begin..._ - house, trip hop, trance w/DJs Darrel, Cisco, Radley,
   Ollie, Seanee, Xpress, Grey, Anna. 9pm-2am, All ages. The Inn of the
   Beginning, 8201 Old Redwood Highway, Cotati, Cotati. 707.524.4443
   
   _Kinetic_ - Phil Salter, guests. 21+, $5. 2325 clayton road, concord.
   510.946.5005
   
   _Shoam_ - Trip-Hop & Drum n Bass Your Mama's Cafe, 5239 College,
   Oakland.
   
   _Succotash!_ - tasty jazz - funk - beats - space w/DJs tom thump,
   rasta q-tip. 21+, Free. up & down club, 1151 folsom st., SF.
   
   _supper_ - funk, acid jazz w/DJs Caspar, guests. 21+, Free. Julie's
   Supper Club, 1123 Folsom @ 7th, SF. 415.861.0707
   
   _Light-n-Up Lounge_ - house w/DJs Preston, guests. 21+. 111 Minna St,
   SF.
   
   _L-Tryptophan_ - ambient, techno w/DJs guest DJs weekly. 21+, Free.
   1624 California @ Van Ness, SF.
   
   _Lost in Space_ - house, hip-hop w/DJs Pause, Dark Money, Winnie B,
   Eric Lacy. 21+, Free. Cafe Mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th, SF.
   
  Wednesday
  
   _ Come/Unity _- House, Techno, Ambient w/DJs Simon, Jeno, Garth. first
   Wednesday of the month.
   10pm-4am, 21+, $7. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.241.8815
   
   _Boost_ - old school uplifting house w/DJs Jamie J, Hector the
   ejector. 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison, SF. 415.703.7105
   
   _Roots_ - House, Trip Hop w/DJs Garth, Jeno, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+,
   $6. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.512.5713
   
   _cosmic lounge _- space jazz, galactic grooves, jungle w/DJs Caspar,
   Paul, Seth, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, Free. cafe mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th,
   SF.
   
   _Reunion_ - Danny, Naz Cafe, guests. 9pm-, 21+, Free. The Fulton Bar,
   1243 Fulton Mall, Fresno. 209.488.5332
   
   _Thirsty_ - tasty house tunes and even better company w/DJs Jellybear,
   Jay-J, top notch guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, Free. The Top, 424 Haight St,
   SF.
   
   _The Lounge_ - 9pm-3am, 21+. 1401 Arden Way, Sacramento.
   916.922.8041x4240
   
   _Bubbles_ - deep funky techno house music w/DJs Don Crisp (Crisp
   Records), guests. starts May 1.
   9pm-2am, 21+. Babylon, 2260 Van Ness @ Vallejo, SF. 415.567.1222
   
   _Wish_ - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
   18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663
   [5.22 - Grover]
   
   _Belief_ - house w/DJs Julius Papp, Harry Who?, Rick Preston. begins
   5.22.
   10pm-, 21+. Agenda basement, 1st & San Salvador, San Jose.
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Info Lines

     * Be-At Info Line - 415-626-4087. Usually has 5-10 listings, updated
       daily.
     * Clubline - 415.979.8686
     * Fatline - 415.207.3668
     * Frequency 8 Trance/Techno infoline - 415.541.5019
     * the Global Party Network Buzzline - 415.568.1338
     * The Groove Line - (415) 331.1500 ext.4788
     * Housewares Rave Line - 415.281.0125
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Radio/TV Shows

     * Sunday night 11pm-2am - "The Dreaming/Innermind Show" w/DJ Miracle
       & Mr. Monchichi. House, Jungle, Trip-Hop, Ambient, Dub,
       Break-Beats & guest DJs. KSCU 103.3 (Santa Clara)
     * Monday afternoon 12:30-3:00 pm - DJ Jerecho presents the best of
       the urban polyrhythmic experience jungle, acid jazz, techno,
       electro, breakbeat KDVS, 90.3 FM (Davis)
     * Wednesday night/Thursday morning 3am-6am - "Aural Fixation"
       experimental sounds of ambient and trip hop with a splash of hi
       nrg, from trance to jungle. KZSC 88.1 fm (Santa Cruz)
     * Thursdays 9:30pm-midnight - "Aurora Borealis" Beats and
       atmospherics w/DJ Seth. KALX 90.7 (Berkeley)
     * Fridays 9pm-midnight - Andrew from Groove Merchant spins on KUSF
       90.3 (SF)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - midnight-noon. House/techno mix
       with Johnny K, Ozone & guests - KCSS 91.9 Central Valley (Turlock)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - "Just Desserts" w/Mr.Goodwrench -
       10pm-2am Jungle, Detroit, Techno, Acid House, whacked-out Dub, and
       noise KFJC 89.7 - Los Altos Hills
     * Friday night - nocturnal transmissions - featuring house DJs from
       SF and around the world. mid-2am, 107.7 FM (SF)
     * Friday night - Your Mama's House w/Pete Avila - 3am-5am, 106.1
       KMEL.
     * Friday night - Moondance. Ambient; 3am-7:30am, KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday afternoon - "Bus Stop" - music and talk w/guest DJs from
       SF and beyond. 2pm-3pm. KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday night 11pm - Flux Television, Viacom Channel 53 -
       Ambient, acid jazz and house music videos & interviews. (415)
       281-3377. flux@flux.net
     * Saturday night 9pm-mid - "An Epiphany of Sound" hosted by J.C. and
       Monkeywrench KZSU 90.1 (Stanford)
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
   For a _search_ interface to the calendar, see the Late Train club
   section.
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Administrative Notes

   If anyone has info on any other events, send it to me! I can't
   possibly hope to get all the info every week.
   
   This info gets sent via email every Thursday. To subscribe or
   unsubscribe to the calendar mailing list, send e-mail to
   majordomo@hyperreal.com with either the line
   
   subscribe sfraves-calendar or
   unsubscribe sfraves-calendar
   
   There is also an sfraves discussion mailing list for issues related to
   clubs, parties, house and techno music, etc. To subscribe, send e-mail
   to majordomo@hyperreal.com with the line
   
   subscribe sfraves
   
   in the body of the message.
   
   
   
   
    Derek Chung - dhchung@hyperreal.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 21:04:03 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 21:08:03 -0700
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From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: HVAC @ Parties; A Joke
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hiya All;

        A Rave with HVAC is an environmental engineers wet dream. 

Peace
THX1138

PS Soooo Bad


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 21:09:18 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 21:13:19 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: HVAC @ Parties Another Joke
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Hiya All;

        What do ya call an environmental engineer's nightmare?

        A rave at King Street Garage on  Summer Night

ROFL(rolling on the floor laighing)

Peace
THX1138

PS He's sooo sick


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 21:09:48 1996
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Priority: urgent
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 22:08:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: Apple RAVE
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Anyone know who the promoters were?  I'd like to send some appreciative   
email to encourage more of this sort of thing.  I'm sure they are bummed   
about the bust, and I'd love to let them know how many people on this   
list enjoyed the generous effort.  Positive feedback to re-enforce   
desired behavior & all that sort of thing...
 -Roy  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 21:37:07 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 21:41:12 -0700
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From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Rumor Mill >Mars
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Hiya All;

        I heard a rumor on the Space Teddy voice mil that our very own DJ
Mars has been booked at the Love Parade in Berlin, go Mars go. Hey need some
traveling companions, if so I'm there cause I got a place to stay in Berlin.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 22:47:40 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 22:50:23 -0800
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From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: Review: Cinnamon Toasty Apple Raves
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SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream) wrote:
>The first guy I heard spinning, Alex, was
>*good*.  There were various people throwing vinyl down after that, ranging
>from ok to fairly flat.

Anyone know who was last before SCO?  I liked it.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 22:48:31 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 22:49:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tinsau <amdice@puc.edu>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Laminates Survey
In-Reply-To: <960516134915_114931004@emout15.mail.aol.com>
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On Thu, 16 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:

> How does anyone feel about having to fork out about a buck for their
> laminate.  I really like the free idea, but I've got this really neat design
> which involves a small electronic device. (Hee hee, I'm not telling)  Might
> be able to keep production costs under a buck. 
A buck? no problem as far as I am concerned.

  Austin                             
  Tinsau                    

            S.F. Born and Raved!                          










From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 23:01:39 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 23:05:46 -0700
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From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Laminates
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Hiya All;

        If were going to go electronic, I think we should all have a
LOJAK'ed telemetry package installed in them. This way we can track each
other on a big board somewhere. Hey maybe the defense departments would let
us use there MICOM Defense board for this. = >

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 23:08:53 1996
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Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 23:09:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: Apple etc.
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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It was fun seeing people at the Apple thing.  I also had a chance to meet 
some people I haven't met previously :).  The only bad thing was that I 
just can't deal with San Jose streets :(.  I managed to get lost by car, 
and then walking from 5th to the actual warehouse...  Needless to say it 
was raining and I was soaking wet. 

I would like to thank SDream for letting me ware his bandana (I forgot 
all my hair bands because I came straight from work and my hair was just 
out of control while I was dancing).  Also thanks CT for helping me 
find my car afterwards.  It would have taken me forever to find it...

I am still at work :( - beta software realise tomorrow morning, so send 
me e-mail if you get bored.  Also I would love to join South Bay crowd in 
getting together (it would be great during the week, because I work in 
Mt. View and live in SF).

Hugz,
Branka

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 23:24:05 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: South Bay Gathering
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Well, I dunno if everybody got my response about a gathering, but I was 
suggesting a coffee shop!! how about The Pruneyard in Campbell?! It's 
right off of 880/17 and 85. It's nice and open.. indoors and outdoor... 


Adam


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 23:51:57 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: Congratulations/Good Luck!
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[ to sfraves ]

 Good luck to all those going through the strains of late semester academics.
And congatulations to those who've survived!

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 16 23:57:19 1996
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Subject: SBay get-together
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[ to sfraves ]

 Thanks to Amy(Ms Phink) for volunteering as the coordinator for a South Bay
meet!

 Next weekend is Memorial Day weekend. I could meet with folks early Friday 
night, but others may have weekend out-of-town plans.

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 00:00:26 1996
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Subject: Re: South Bay Gathering
Date: Thu, 16 May 96 23:59:50 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
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>Well, I dunno if everybody got my response about a gathering, but I was 
>suggesting a coffee shop!! how about The Pruneyard in Campbell?! It's 
>right off of 880/17 and 85. It's nice and open.. indoors and outdoor... 
>
>
>Adam


I was waiting to see if we got any other responses... personally I feel 
that 
drinking coffee on a Friday night is not a great way to relax. I am kind 
of 
partial to beer myself. But I will go wherever people want to go, so 
there!
Let's wait a few more days and make a decision.

Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 00:09:50 1996
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Subject: Re: South Bay Gathering
Date: Thu, 16 May 96 23:59:50 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
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>Well, I dunno if everybody got my response about a gathering, but I was 
>suggesting a coffee shop!! how about The Pruneyard in Campbell?! It's 
>right off of 880/17 and 85. It's nice and open.. indoors and outdoor... 
>
>
>Adam


I was waiting to see if we got any other responses... personally I feel 
that 
drinking coffee on a Friday night is not a great way to relax. I am kind 
of 
partial to beer myself. But I will go wherever people want to go, so 
there!
Let's wait a few more days and make a decision.

Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 00:12:51 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605170713.AAA01428@netcom16.netcom.com>
Subject: Santa Cruz hints for June?
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[ to sfraves list ]

 I was thinking ( ohoh ), about an idea I had some months ago but never 
followed up on. My idea was , if it was known that an event was going to
be happening in the evening in Santa Cruz or the South Bay , that folks
could get together for a daytime picnic before heading off to the rave!

 Those who remember the SFRaves get together I organized called RadioRadio
a few years ago might remember the park it was held in - Sunnyvale Baylands
Park. That's a nice site - there are some other parks I was thinking of 
as well. 

 Not so much like a Sunset , with a sound system and DJs. Mostly just 
chilling and grilling and kite flying and chatting.

 So - anybody involved with doing Santa Cruz/South Bay events can give
hints about any June events? ( I guess Tribal Future makes the first
weekend in June out of consideration ).

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 00:36:06 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 00:38:48 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: Rave/Media Essay (Super Long)
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Starchild <star@sfsu.edu> wrote:
>My computer tells me that on Fri, 10 May 1996, Kyung Rok shared (in part):
>> Though perhaps better sent on a Tuesday instead of a Friday afternoon,
>> this is about 1/4 of a cultural studies piece titled "Moral Panic, the
>> Media and British Rave Culture."  Written by Sarah Thornton...
>
>> The term "underground" is the expression by which clubbers refer to
>> things subcultural. More than fashionable or trendy, underground sounds
>> and styles are "authentic," and pitted against the mass-produced and
>> mass-consumed....
>
>Fortunately I don't think ravers delight much in "parental
>incomprehension."...

I think a valid distinction can be made between underground and
non-underground on the basis of the amount of effort (knowledge, cost,
inconvenience, time, etc.) required for an individual to engage oneself in
"the scene."  Of course, a clear line cannot be drawn across the
spectrum...as Chesterton, or whoever it was, had it, though no one may be
able to discern the exact point at which day becomes night, one can
tolerably distinguish the two nonetheless.

>> That's what I mean by underground."Undergrounds define themselves most
>> clearly by what they're not, that is "main stream."...
>
>What we are really doing when we dis mainstream culture,
>after all, is dissing humanity at large, saying most people are stupid,
>base, and lack[ing in] taste and culture.

They are.  Amazingly enough, it's possible to like them all the same.

>I think
>her observation is correct, and it's unfortunate, because while certainly
>it can have problematic *aspects*, to say that popularization *itself*
>is the problem is truly cynical and elitist.

Yes.

>> ...youth. whatever their
>> class enjoy a momentary reprieve from "necessity."'! In other words,
>> youth are exempt from adult commitments to the accumulation of economic
>> capital. They temporarily enjoy what Bourdieu argues is normally reserved
>> for the bourgeoisie; that is, a "taste of liberty or luxury. "
>
>	This is troubling to me, because it reminds me that so few
>people, as they grow older, manage to live outside these "adult
>commitments to the accumulation of economic capital."

The issues here are deeper than acknowledged by Thornton.  *By definition*,
youth is relieved from the responsibilities of adulthood.  In our
contemporary culture, this equates to a relief from the accumulation of
capital and a taste of liberty and luxury, because we live in a capitalist
society that makes accumulation of capital a primary responsibility and
which rewards success along those lines with luxury and liberty.  Youth,
freed of responsibility by the effort of adulthood, can reap adulthood's
rewards without effort.

>Just look at our
>cultural forebears, the hippies.  For the most part, the '60s generation
>has blended into the workforce without fulfilling the dreams of their
>youth of social change toward a world of peace, love, harmony, and fun.

Personally, though I have no factual experience on which to base these
judgements, I think that the popular view of "our cultural forebears" is a
mistaken one, that the prominence of these figures owes more to their
extremity than to their prevalence, and that their apparent lack of effect
on the course of history results simply because they are moving against the
tide, not because their tide has ebbed.  I don't know any sometime
"hippies" who have become their own antitheses by trading the ideals that
motivated them in the past for those they strove against.  I do know some,
however, whose extemity has faded as they have aged and the cultural
spotlight has shifted, who yet continue to work for their old ideals in
subtler, less strident ways: through their children, through their friends,
through their communities.

Of course, I live in Santa Cruz.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 01:35:05 1996
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From: Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress <mswietzke@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Joy Funk Club
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I'm DJing a party in S.F. on Friday the 18th called Joy Funk Club.  It is an
AIDS benefit and should be a lot of fun and at the same time raise some
money for a good cause.  It's on the corner of 11th and Folsom at a club
called Transmissions and starts at 9pm.  If you're interested, stop on by.
I will be playing mainly house music, so it should be a great place to go
dancing!

Peace, Matt


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 01:50:42 1996
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From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
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Well, through some stroke of luck, one of the new trainees bailed out of 
his show and I am not back on the air at KDVS.  The show airs from 3-5am 
on Saturday (That's Friday night continued for those of you keeping track 
in that manner :P) on KDVS 90.3fm.  The station can be heard through the 
contral valley, but best in Davis/Sacramento.  
Be sure to also listen to DJ Jericho on KDVS mondays 12-2pm  :)

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 01:56:16 1996
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From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
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Subject: James Brown
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Okay, I found out about the show from this list, so I figure it's okay to 
post about going. 
I went to the Thursday night show and I can sum the experience up in two 
words:  James Brown.
An _amazing_ show -- wonderful location, really cool visuals (really!), 
great lighting, awesome sound and a wonderful happy vibe (despite the 
couple of little tiffs).  At one point the Godfather of Soul told us all 
to turn to the person on our right and tell them that we love them and 
then turn to the person on our left and tell them that we love them too.  
How much more could you ask for?!  A great great great show.  And such a 
wonderful diversity of people!  Every kind of person from biker to 
suit-and-tie to 70's retro folks, old, young, fat, skinny, dark, light 
and everything else.  Everyone was there and for the most part just happy 
and out-of-their mind.  If you ever get a chance to go see James Brown, 
don't hesitate.  Just go.  You have appreciated his records, you have 
appreciated manipulation of his samples, but nothing _nothing_ can 
compare to seeing it live.  63 years old and he still stances like a maniac!
Jee wiz.  What a show!
Did any other SFRAVErs go to the Thursday night show?

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 02:20:34 1996
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Message-ID: <319B9DD3.4382@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 14:27:47 -0700
From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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Organization: CT D-Zine
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Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
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Tony Rotundo wrote:
> 
> What I find most interesting is the fact that even Apple (Apple!) can't
> throw a party without it being busted.  You would think an event sponsored
> by a corporate giant would not be as prone to busting as say a small
> collective of relative insignificance.  (One making a substantial
> contribution to the local economy, the other making a huge racket all
> night.)
> 
> We shall win the war one battle (and one hug) at a time.  :^)
> 
> Anyone know if any official Apple representatives were there to defend the
> party?  Or were they long gone, home in bed with their wives and
> mistresses, husbands and misters.  :^)
> 
> Tony

AAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!

What the cops told the guy throwing the party was that they had to
shut it down because he did not have a business license and he was
accepting cash at the door. What a crock of shit! Come on, there
a sign on the table which specifically said "Donations". Apparently
the cops didn't buy this, and were determined to shut the party down
right from the start. 

First of all, that party was completely clean. There were no dealers
hanging out at the entrance, no blatant pot smoking, NO ALCOHOL!
Everybody was just having a good time. I personally was really stoked
to see all the Apple people goin' off!. 

What really pissed me off was when I was outside witnessing the cop
harassing the Apple guy, the cop said, "96% of what you were trying to
do tonight was good. We're not going to haul you off the San Quentin,
but you're at least going to receive a citation.". This cop was really
a dick!

[taking a deep breath]

Well, on a positive note, I was glad to see all of you again, as
briefly as it was. I second the motion that us south bay sfraves
should get together sometime. Till then, take care and PLUR.

Hugs,

CT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 03:08:15 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 03:10:35 +1000
To: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Origins of Apple
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>Hey, you guys should ask Captain Crunch about Apple,
>
>John Draper, whaddya say to this???

After I met Woz,  he wanted me to design the telephone interface board.
So I designed a board with an ADC/DAC that controlled the audio,
switch-hook,  and it could send and decode any kind of tones,
as well as differentiate speech from tones,  but would not recognize
speech.   Remember,  this was 1977 (July to be exact).   I have some
of these stores on my WEB site.

http://www.well.com/user/crunch
  Play --> Stories --> Early days

Back then Apple wasn't corperate...  Only Mike Scott (CEO at the time)
and Mike Markula wore suits.   Boy,  have things changed.  This doesn't
have much to so with raving,   but getting back to the subject,  it
appears that Apple didn't pay the San Jose police enough money...  Thats
strange that it got busted...  I bet it was funny,  watching people dance
in suits.... But at the MacWorld Expo,   a few years ago,  they had
a rave,  actually,  it was my 2nd rave (where I danced) and it was
actually the "NextWorld Expo" for Next hackers.   The rave was the
Stone rave,  and was at 1015 Folsom... It was really good,   I get there
about 7 pm  (No rave music playing),  then about 9 pm or so,   the
thumpin beats are gradually mixed in,   and a half hour later,  the
dance floor was filled.  It was really good.

My next rave after that was WICKED at the Sound Factory the following
Saturday...  Then,  I was hooked...   But didn't do ANY drugs then,
but dug it BIG TIME,  so I can contribute my raving very closly with
computers in this sense.    About 3 weeks later....   Let Freedom Rave,
3rd of July,  Livermore racetrack...  Candyflipped....  Went beserk,
Remember the hill fire?

Oh,  one more thing... Forbes ASAP has a piece on me....   June issue,
check it out....Haven't read it yet though

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 03:08:23 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 03:10:42 +1000
To: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: apple maglite dj rig?
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>You know, that instrument looked like one of those "build it yourself"
>electronic boards that you can buy at Radio Shack. I swear it looked
>just like the one I bought when I was 11 years old... Hehehehe...
>yeah.. It made some type of trippy whiny noise while he was tapping the
>button down... wierd... but, whatever works!!
>
Sounds like a therimen...(scuse spelling)

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 03:08:31 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 03:10:53 +1000
To: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>
>> >I am
>> >not knocking the Goa list at all, but why not talk a little about that
>> >stuff here?
>>
>> I agree totally.  Why put the Goa messages on a separate list?
>
>Becuase sfraves is a list dedicated to a specific geographical location.
>The Goa list is global.
>
>Additionally, have you considered that the creater of the Goa list
>would like to just discuss music, without the major distractions that
>appear on sfraves?

Also,  Goa parties up here in SF don't happen that often.   The ones
that do,  are so underground that unless you are friends of the person(s)
putting it on,  you don't know about it,  or get in.   The certainly
don't get announced in SFRaves,  other than Freq-8 and a few of them.

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 03:19:58 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 03:20:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: michal migurski <lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com, tgrigsby@best.com
Subject: SFR Laminates, t-shirts
In-Reply-To: <96May16.123735pdt.4506@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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I'm with Michael here... there's entirely too many t-shirts floating 
around out there already.  Why can't we have a different article of 
clothing, something nobody puts logos on, like socks?  Or underwear?
What about a take-off on those boxer shorts with the big yellow and black 
smiley face?  8)
	
Much love,
				<<< Starchild >>>

P.S. - A laminate with an electronic device?  I'll buy that for a dollar!


My computer tells me that on Thu, 16 May 1996, michal migurski shared:

> >btw, the design I submitted was originally intended for laminates.
> >Anyone still down for the new laminate thang???
> 
> I think I'd be more *down* for new laminates than t-shirts... I'm not too
> fond of shirts with logos on them and stuff (most of the time...
> meaningless logos are cool  =).
> 
> I too am working on something, todd, so don't get yer panties in a bunch. =)
> 
> -m.
> 
> 
> 0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
> |    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
> |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
> |                                               |
> |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
> |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
> |                                               |
> |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
> |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
> |                                               |
> |              Michal Migurski                  |
> |              (510) 664-1026                   |
> 0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 05:03:21 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 05:02:46 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
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This sounds like a ton of fun, but I unfortunately will not be able 
to make it since I'm goin to ncsa Wednesday thru Friday of next week...
I'll be back in time for the weekend though, so hopefully I'll get to
see my family at a party then?!?!

Everyone have a cup o' smiles for me though!

Peace and Love,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 05:44:16 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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To: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
cc: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.EDU>,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: well, yosemite might work! (please read me!)
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I'm up for a trip to Yosemete an' all so write to me about it.
TRISTAN.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 06:36:46 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 06:40:10 -0700
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Subject: Re: Rumor Mill >Mars
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Hiya All;

        It's a NOT, just a rumor.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 08:25:34 1996
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signoff sfraves

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 08:49:53 1996
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Greetings Friends!

Sorry this is a bit late in coming, but that's just the way it goes
sometimes...

In any event, on behalf of everyone that helped pull madness off -- the mad
crew, gateway systems, and our many other dear friends that busted their
asses for this one -- we offer our sincerest thanks for once again bringing
your energy, your hope, your optimism, your peace, and your love, with you
when you came, it makes all the difference.

It was indeed a very mad night; let's do it again sometime =)

take it easy
madness



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 08:59:54 1996
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>AND I thought Greg and Trent were serving up some  tasty mixs ;) !!!!!!!
>
>Ran
>
Yeah, who'd have thunk that Greg would turn out to be a phat dj?!  (j/k,
Greg ;))
"Please, Sir, may I have some more?"

Peace,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 09:29:44 1996
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>``Those who sell these drugs, albeit surrounded by the splendor and  
>glitz of 'fashionable' nightclubs, are no less the scourge than those 
>who hide in the back alleys of the inner city to dispense their poison. 
>These people are just as bad, if not worse.'' 

Can you say ouch!!!!!!!!!
I think someone has been wearing there underware to tight?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 09:38:36 1996
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Message-ID: <n1379796549.17846@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 17 May 1996 09:33:34 -0800
From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: I HATE DUPLICATE POSTS!
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!

Just had to get that out, sorry...
-Jason


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 09:40:46 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:40:31 -0700 (PDT)
To: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
In-Reply-To: <319B9DD3.4382@ix.netcom.com>
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On Thu, 16 May 1996, CT wrote:

> Tony Rotundo wrote:
> > 
> > What I find most interesting is the fact that even Apple (Apple!) can't
> > throw a party without it being busted.  You would think an event sponsored
> > by a corporate giant would not be as prone to busting as say a small
> > collective of relative insignificance.  (One making a substantial
> > contribution to the local economy, the other making a huge racket all
> > night.)
> > 
> > We shall win the war one battle (and one hug) at a time.  :^)
> > 
> > Anyone know if any official Apple representatives were there to defend the
> > party?  Or were they long gone, home in bed with their wives and
> > mistresses, husbands and misters.  :^)
> > 
> > Tony
> 
> AAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!
> 
> What the cops told the guy throwing the party was that they had to
> shut it down because he did not have a business license and he was
> accepting cash at the door. What a crock of shit! Come on, there
> a sign on the table which specifically said "Donations". Apparently
> the cops didn't buy this, and were determined to shut the party down
> right from the start. 
> 
> First of all, that party was completely clean. There were no dealers
> hanging out at the entrance, no blatant pot smoking, NO ALCOHOL!
> Everybody was just having a good time. I personally was really stoked
> to see all the Apple people goin' off!. 
> 
> What really pissed me off was when I was outside witnessing the cop
> harassing the Apple guy, the cop said, "96% of what you were trying to
> do tonight was good. We're not going to haul you off the San Quentin,
> but you're at least going to receive a citation.". This cop was really
> a dick!
> 

Well then, as this was a totally legitimate event you should file a 
formal complaint. You want to talk to the San Jose Police department's 
Office of Internal Affairs. The number is (408) 277-4094. I wasn't there 
so I really have no ability to file a complaint. But bitching to the 
right people would seem to be much more effective than just bitching to us.

                                      
                                            Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 09:53:30 1996
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Date: 17 May 96 12:50:04 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: SFR Laminates, t-shirts
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Idea instead of laminates (I'm not sure about production costs here ...)

Make embroidered patches that people can put where they want -- on their
backpack, on a hat, on a sweatshirt, on a jacket ... whatever!  We can show our
connection and still stay indivdiduals!  

Leslie


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 09:55:56 1996
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Date: 17 May 96 12:50:01 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Pack-a-bowl
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kaysee said..

I am out the door, headed to PackABowl.  If anyone else goes, look for 
me.  I'll have on a pink T-shirt and dark baggy pants.  I'll also be with 
Jess and I'll be the person who REALLY sucks at bowling (you should 
notice me from that!!!)

_________________________________

>From my Packabowl experiences -- sucking at bowling is the LAST thing that would
distinguish you from the crowd!  

That's part of the fun at Packabowl -- everybody sucks!  No performance pressure
here!

I watched one night, and everyone was SOOOOO bad it was hysterical!  That was
the best part, watching people actually having so much fun doing something that
they sucked at, but they were having a ball anyway!!!  

One lane I was watching must have thrown 15 gutter balls in a row ... I loved
it, they were laughing so hard, having a ball!

Leslie   ; )





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 10:01:27 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:01:07 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: James Brown
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I must have been at the other James Brown show.  I felt you were right-on
in all of your description except for the parts about JB.  The crowd was
cool, the space excellent, the lights (colored oil under an overhead, old
technique I hear) were good.  The sound was at times very piercing, but not
bad.

He never really played a full song.  It was more presented as a
compilation.  I was never really able to bust a move because just as a song
started, it would end about 30-45 seconds later.  The cues were horrible.
He never busted a move as far as I saw.  I was watching too.

Yes, he's extremely charismatic, especially for his age, but I would not go
so far as to tell everyone I know to drop their computers immediately and
go see James Brown.  I saw frustration, more than anything, in the crowd.
It *was* great when he said,  "Turn to the person to your left and tell
them that James Brown loves them."  Pause.  "Now turn to the right and tell
them that James Brown loves them."  I honestly can't remember any moment
where he had a grooving fat, funky JB energy flowing for more than a minute
and a half.  One thing I really found frustrating was that JB never sang
even a smidgen of a song alone, but rather the back-up singers, et al,
would chime in following every line he belted out.  As a non-exact example
he would sing, "This is a man's world..." and the others would be like,
"Man's world; man's world!"  And while that's nice every once in a while,
it would happen with nearly every line he sang.

It was a unique experience, and I'm glad I went, and more glad that some
people had a fantastic time.  Please don't let me discourage you from
checking him out, but again, I honestly can't recommend with as much zeal
as Uncle Noah that you go see the "the man working the hardest at making it
look like he's the hardest working man in show business."

I met SFRer Melissa Woodrow, and that was excellent, though it was hard to
communicate.

Sorry to do this to you Noah, but your malapropism only sums up how I felt
about it:  >compare to seeing it live.  63 years old and he still stances
like a maniac!
                                              ^^^^^^^

Peace and flame retardent suit set at "roast".

Tone

P.S.  The opening band (Sy Klops ?!) was too contrived.

At 1:56 AM  -0700 5/17/96, Uncle Noah wrote:
>Okay, I found out about the show from this list, so I figure it's okay to
>post about going.
>I went to the Thursday night show and I can sum the experience up in two
>words:  James Brown.
>An _amazing_ show -- wonderful location, really cool visuals (really!),
>great lighting, awesome sound and a wonderful happy vibe (despite the
>couple of little tiffs).  At one point the Godfather of Soul told us all
>to turn to the person on our right and tell them that we love them and
>then turn to the person on our left and tell them that we love them too.
>How much more could you ask for?!  A great great great show.  And such a
>wonderful diversity of people!  Every kind of person from biker to
>suit-and-tie to 70's retro folks, old, young, fat, skinny, dark, light
>and everything else.  Everyone was there and for the most part just happy
>and out-of-their mind.  If you ever get a chance to go see James Brown,
>don't hesitate.  Just go.  You have appreciated his records, you have
>appreciated manipulation of his samples, but nothing _nothing_ can
>compare to seeing it live.  63 years old and he still stances like a maniac!
>Jee wiz.  What a show!
>Did any other SFRAVErs go to the Thursday night show?
>
>--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
>                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
>                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 10:37:10 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:36:34 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
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Leslie Ayres wrote:
> 
> kaysee said..
> 
> I am out the door, headed to PackABowl.  If anyone else goes, look for
> me.  I'll have on a pink T-shirt and dark baggy pants.  I'll also be with
> Jess and I'll be the person who REALLY sucks at bowling (you should
> notice me from that!!!)
> 
> _________________________________
> 
> >From my Packabowl experiences -- sucking at bowling is the LAST thing that would
> distinguish you from the crowd!
> 
> That's part of the fun at Packabowl -- everybody sucks!  No performance pressure
> here!
> 
> I watched one night, and everyone was SOOOOO bad it was hysterical!  That was
> the best part, watching people actually having so much fun doing something that
> they sucked at, but they were having a ball anyway!!!
> 
> One lane I was watching must have thrown 15 gutter balls in a row ... I loved
> it, they were laughing so hard, having a ball!
> 
> Leslie   ; )

Gosh, I'm sorry I missed Pack-a-Bowl, I would've fit in perfectly! Has 
anyone ever bowled only to have the bowling ball jump into the OTHER
guy's lane on the right and knock some of his pins down?!?! ...boy was
that embarassing.

John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 10:37:21 1996
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Date: 17 May 96 13:31:11 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: SFR PICNIC HORROR STORY - HELP
Message-ID: <960517173110_71165.755_GHL84-1@CompuServe.COM>
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I've debated whether to post this to the group ... but I just have to ....

I brought my best girlfriend to the SFR picnic with me.  Sara, who had just
returned from 3 months in India, was very mellow and transitioning back into
this world...

She met someone there to whom she gave her phone number to, and now she has
subsequently been the victim on some of the most disgusting and horrifying
obscene phone calls ... (which have been recorded fyi)

Last night, she was able to determine, using call return, that it does appear
this was the person she met at the picnic, and now some roommate or something
has also called.  The phone company and police have been notified.

My request:  I don't know if this person is a SFR member, but if you do read
this, PLEASE KNOCK IT OFF!  It is so inhuman and so sick to terrorize someone
with these unwelcome incidents, and Sara is not interested in you.  Please LEAVE
HER ALONE!  She is a kindhearted person and in no way deserves this treatment.

We know who you are, and we will do whatever is necessary to stop this
harrassment, but prefer that it stops because you choose to do so.

Thank you.

Leslie  


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 10:39:04 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:38:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Pack-a-bowl
In-Reply-To: <960517165001_71165.755_GHL99-2@CompuServe.COM>
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Pack-a-bowl was really fun.  I highly reccomend it to anyone who can go.  
We had a small, but spirited, group of sfravers.  I guess Leslie is 
right, most ppl are pretty bad bowlers, but I still think I own the crown 
on that one.  I couldn't even hold the ball and kept dropping it (I just 
hope too many ppl weren't watching:)

The music was wonderful.  And quite a crowd showed up.  It was a really 
mellow, fun thing to do on a Thursday night.  My only gripe was the group 
of people who decided to set up a NO2 tank in the girls' bathroom.  

Have a fun weekend, everyone.  I may go out on Saturday night (possibly 
to Fresh Start), so I hope to see some of you around.  I'm headed to the 
JB show tonight......

chau,
kaysee



On 17 May 1996, Leslie Ayres wrote:

> kaysee said..
> 
> I am out the door, headed to PackABowl.  If anyone else goes, look for 
> me.  I'll have on a pink T-shirt and dark baggy pants.  I'll also be with 
> Jess and I'll be the person who REALLY sucks at bowling (you should 
> notice me from that!!!)
> 
> _________________________________
> 
> >From my Packabowl experiences -- sucking at bowling is the LAST thing that would
> distinguish you from the crowd!  
> 
> That's part of the fun at Packabowl -- everybody sucks!  No performance pressure
> here!
> 
> I watched one night, and everyone was SOOOOO bad it was hysterical!  That was
> the best part, watching people actually having so much fun doing something that
> they sucked at, but they were having a ball anyway!!!  
> 
> One lane I was watching must have thrown 15 gutter balls in a row ... I loved
> it, they were laughing so hard, having a ball!
> 
> Leslie   ; )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 11:08:07 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:07:49 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: James Brown
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hey noah

oh man, there we a BUNCH of us there! and it was some amazing experience!
from the youthful hippies (of all ages) to the hell's angels, to the Solid
Gold dancers on stage, to the woman who tried to pick my pocket ("oh! i'm
so sorry i bumped into you!" right), to the beautiful italian-aria
interlude.....

and it was over so fast....someone said to me it was the best half-hour of
music they'd ever travlled an hour and a half to see...well, maybe it was a
little more than that :>

the Man still has it, even after time in the joint. more power to him.

mmm hmm!!!

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 11:09:47 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: SFraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: So, who's where this weekend???
Date: 17 May 1996 18:51:27 GMT
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So Who's doing what where and when this weekend????



"Dance with me"
 -Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 599-5500
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 11:10:07 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:09:37 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: I HATE DUPLICATE POSTS!
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hey folks

anybody dealing with this? do we have to talk to the xerox people again?

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 11:18:21 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:17:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: South Bay Gathering
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: Adam Luong <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605170628.XAA02170@ns.mauswerks.com>
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mmmmmmmmm   beer.


On Thu, 16 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >Well, I dunno if everybody got my response about a gathering, but I was 
> >suggesting a coffee shop!! how about The Pruneyard in Campbell?! It's 
> >right off of 880/17 and 85. It's nice and open.. indoors and outdoor... 
> >
> >
> >Adam
> 
> 
> I was waiting to see if we got any other responses... personally I feel 
> that 
> drinking coffee on a Friday night is not a great way to relax. I am kind 
> of 
> partial to beer myself. But I will go wherever people want to go, so 
> there!
> Let's wait a few more days and make a decision.
> 
> Amy
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 11:22:55 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605171822.LAA27672@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: SFR PICNIC HORROR STORY - HELP
To: 71165.755@CompuServe.COM (Leslie Ayres)
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:22:46 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <960517173110_71165.755_GHL84-1@CompuServe.COM> from "Leslie Ayres" at May 17, 96 01:31:11 pm
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[ to sfraves list ]
Leslie had some very sad and disgusting news for us ...
>... 
> I brought my best girlfriend to the SFR picnic with me.  Sara, who had just
> returned from 3 months in India, was very mellow and transitioning back into
> this world...
> 
> She met someone there to whom she gave her phone number to, and now she has
> subsequently been the victim on some of the most disgusting and horrifying
> obscene phone calls ... (which have been recorded fyi)
> 
> Last night, she was able to determine, using call return, that it does appear
> this was the person she met at the picnic, and now some roommate or something
> has also called.  The phone company and police have been notified.
> 
> My request:  I don't know if this person is a SFR member, but if you do read
> this, PLEASE KNOCK IT OFF!  It is so inhuman and so sick to terrorize someone
> with these unwelcome incidents, and Sara is not interested in you.  Please LEAVE
> HER ALONE!  She is a kindhearted person and in no way deserves this treatment.
> 
 I am very upset , angry , and sad that someone at our picnic would have
done this! Leslie - I hope that your friend Sara gets through this OK. 
The folks who run this mailist might be able to come up with the perp's
email address if you have his name - you might try that. Also , a recent
post mentioned that the full SFRaves list of email addresses can be
obtained with some simple UNIX command .

 As an SFRaves member , I want to apologize to Leslie's friend on behalf
of SFRaves. 

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

PS - I don't remember if the SFR picnic was on the SFRaves calendar
or not -that has a seperate distribution from sfraves@hyperreal.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 11:39:38 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:39:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Packabowl
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I sure had a lot of fun at packabowl last night.  Met up with a bunch of
sfravers (Kirsten, Renaud, Erik (aka moonpup's housesitter), SDream) and
friends.  Man, you guys are so damn cool!  You warm the cockles of my
heart whenever I have the pleasure of your company :) :) :)

I bowled a whopping 107 (close to my personal best!) and the best
part is that I beat Renaud - ha! :)  Man you should see that guy bowl.  We
went to packabowl a couple of weeks ago, Renaud having _never_ bowled
before (apparently bowling and raves aren't a good mix in FRANCE) and he
managed to kick my ass. (What me? competitive?  not a chance)  I succeded
in demonstrating my sublime grace by slipping on my ass and sliding down
the lane.  ha, ha, ha!

Tooonz were way happening, as usual

There were tons of people there and the place was rippling with activity.
I heard there was a fight though.  What's up with that?

	your ebbalubbin looney

		jess


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 11:48:09 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:48:35 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Klaxon 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: SFR Laminates, t-shirts
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>Make embroidered patches that people can put where they want -- on their
>backpack, on a hat, on a sweatshirt, on a jacket ... whatever!  We can show our
>connection and still stay indivdiduals!  

how about having the laminate pinned onto an article of clothing instead of
hanging around your neck with a string?
i personally hate stuff dangling around my neck.. a leftover from playing
tennis, where pendants, etc.. had a tendancy to swing up and crack me in the
face or teeth. =(


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 11:56:18 1996
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Message-Id: <199605171813.LAA02665@ns.mauswerks.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
Date: Fri, 17 May 96 11:44:21 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: <blkadder@value.net>, "CT" <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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>Well then, as this was a totally legitimate event you should file a 
>formal complaint. You want to talk to the San Jose Police department's 
>Office of Internal Affairs. The number is (408) 277-4094. I wasn't there 
>so I really have no ability to file a complaint. But bitching to the 
>right people would seem to be much more effective than just bitching to us.
>
>                                      
>                                            Black Adder


I hope we aren't all boring Black Adder with our tedious 'bitching'. ;-)

Anyway, I think filing a complaint is a bit premature, since none of us
know what the facts are, so far we have just rumors and heresay. I think
some people were waiting to hear from those responsible for the party. 

It seems like they did have a legitimate reason to shut the party down, if
the law states that you must have a business license in order to take 
money
from people, donations or not. If that is the case, then we really have
nothing to complain about except the fact that they were being total 
pricks;
gee, how unusual for a police officer! 

Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 12:22:34 1996
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To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
In-Reply-To: <199605171813.LAA02665@ns.mauswerks.com>
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On Fri, 17 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >Well then, as this was a totally legitimate event you should file a 
> >formal complaint. You want to talk to the San Jose Police department's 
> >Office of Internal Affairs. The number is (408) 277-4094. I wasn't there 
> >so I really have no ability to file a complaint. But bitching to the 
> >right people would seem to be much more effective than just bitching to us.
> >
> >                                      
> >                                            Black Adder
> 
> 
> I hope we aren't all boring Black Adder with our tedious 'bitching'. ;-)

Not at all. I am just making the suggestion that people actually 
*DO SOMETHING ABOUT THINGS THEY FEEL THAT ARE WRONG*  It took me all of 
two minutes to call San Jose PD and find out who to talk with. 


> Anyway, I think filing a complaint is a bit premature, since none of us
> know what the facts are, so far we have just rumors and heresay. I think
> some people were waiting to hear from those responsible for the party. 

Great, then call the PD. Find out what they say, compare that with your 
experience and go from there. 

> It seems like they did have a legitimate reason to shut the party down, if
> the law states that you must have a business license in order to take 
> money

Does it? The promoters didn't seem to feel that way based on the reports 
here. 

> from people, donations or not. If that is the case, then we really have
> nothing to complain about except the fact that they were being total 
> pricks;

How bout the fact that they felt it necessary to divert 8(or however 
many) squad cars to deal with a peacful gathering of law-abiding 
citizens, instead of patrolling the streets like they should be, keeping 
an eye out for real criminals? That isn't worth a complaint?

> gee, how unusual for a police officer! 

My father is a cop, and a pretty nice guy, and I get really sick of all 
the bashing of law enforcement that goes on here by a people that 
have no respect for anyone, although they claim to. If you want to say "This 
particular officer was a prick," fine. But sterotyping people and saying 
"All cops are pricks" is just as bad as sterotyping black people, or 
gays, or any other group of people. In other words it makes you little 
different than a racist or a bigot. 

                                       Black Adder


                                         
                                           

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 13:20:13 1996
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Date: 17 May 96 16:18:27 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: PICNIC HORROR STORY RESPONSES
Message-ID: <960517201826_71165.755_GHL96-2@CompuServe.COM>
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Wow, I want to express my thanks and appreciation for the huge volume of
responses I got about this horrible episode of obscene calls to my friend.
Reading all of these very quick and loving responses reaffirms my respect for
our group.

Several people asked who specifically this is -- I don't know this person
personally, although I would recognize him if I saw him, and we know his first
name.  However, I don't want to share that because 1) there is a very remote
possibility it is not that person, and 2) there would really be no useful
purpose in it.  However if it continues, we do have a photo of him at the
picnic.

Several people, including Larry Ching, offered personal apologies about this
nastiness.  Thank you all so much for your support. 

Please be assured that in no way do Sara or I think there is any responsibility
or connection to the SFR group at all -- even if this jerk is actively on SFR,
which I'm not sure he is, this is one person with one twisted part of his
personality, and that's not the responsiblity of the organizers of either SFR or
the picnic -- so please don't take this on your shoulders with any guilt or
responsibility -- only the caller is responsible (and apparently his roommate,
another scummy creep obviously) .. and he carries all of that on himself.  

Sara has been a raver for many years, and she knows that this is not about this
group, and it's not about ravers in general ..... it's about one mixed-up creepy
person.  

My hope is that he IS on this list and he'll understand that this behavior has
repercussions, including the worst of karma, not to mention potential legal
penalties, and will simply stop.  If not, we now have LOTS OF PEOPLE in the
posse to stand up for Sara's (and every person's) right not to be harrassed!  

Thanks you all, I'm printing all these messages for Sara!

Much love to everyone,   Leslie  : )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 13:44:09 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: BSP Free Live Ambient/IDM by "RE:"
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Once again, RE: will be playing live ambient/idm electronic listening music
to make your ears happy at:

RAW Living Foods
1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln
San Francisco

We will play from about 7:30 to 10:30 p.m.  It's FREE, and the food at RAW
is incredible.  Hope to see some of you there.

Rick

ps:  We finally finished our demo tape, and will have a few copies on hand.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 13:49:36 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Re: Pack-a-bowl
Date: 17 May 1996 21:37:55 GMT
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With all these bad bowlers, we should have a Paka-a-bowl-off bad bowler
tourney...


Just a thought,


"Dance with me."

-Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 599-5500
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:09:46 1996
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From: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
To: solle@ix.netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: SCHWA
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> 
> Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?
> 

	You mean the ones with FNORD tatoo'd on their foreheads, who keep 
sending mail just like the mail thats been sent before?

Andrew
-----------------------------------------
Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:20:09 1996
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From: Renaud Waldura <rw@softway.com>
Message-Id: <199605172116.OAA12831@softway95.softway.com>
Subject: Re: Packabowl
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (Friends & Family)
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 14:16:03 -0700 (PDT)
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(please ignore if you look for information)

> I bowled a whopping 107 (close to my personal best!) and the best
> part is that I beat Renaud - ha! :)  

	Of course, as everybody had guessed without this post, I actually 
	let Jess won the game...
	As Leslie pointed out clearly enough, Pack-A-Bowlers are so
	lame that you don't want to distinguish yourself with perfect
	bowling, and then beat natives at their own game.
	This is said to be polite!
	;-))

> There were tons of people there and the place was rippling with activity.

	Yah, it was very fun...  Who said ``wacky''?
	Bowling on Trance is quite original, I never heard of anything
	like that before. Maybe is it unique, or am I still new?

	Many thanks to F8 for this funny event, it makes a good break
	in the week, and a cool foreword to the long-awaited... *WEEK-END*!

	BTW, what you fine guys&girls are doing tonight?
	Give an advice to the lonesome foreigner :-)

Renaud

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:21:03 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 14:20:45 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Interesting SFR Picnic/Party thought
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Hello!

The timing of this idea may be coming at a bad time, considering the sad
news Leslie has shared with us, but we can't let the actions of one or two
children inhibit our desire to get together on a regular basis.

Last night in the effort to communicate coherently with Melissa at JB, our
conversation got on to how cool the picnic was.  (Lots of nods, two thumbs
up and smiles.)  I said something like, "hell, we should do that once a
month."  I immediately ammended that and though once every other month
would be nice, and a lot less pressure.

Here's the idea.  We (SFR) set-up a spot, organize logistics, do promotion,
and handle as much as possible the leg work of having picnic party, and ask
a different production group to come, with their sound system and DJs.

What's in it for us is that we get a different "feel" of each party, and a
great cross section of the different styles of music in the Bay Area.
What's in it for them?  They get a hassle free, organized event that all
they have to do is show up (I guess and bring a system :) and bring friends.

Any ideas?

Tone

P.S.  I wasn't envisioning the massive BBQ that Knucklehead has, but maybe
a couple Webbers would do.  I have a massive Webber (Big Bertha) that loves
to be used.  ;^)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:24:06 1996
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To: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
cc: solle@ix.netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SCHWA
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On Fri, 17 May 1996, Andrew Knutsen wrote:

> > 
> > Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?
> > 
> 
> 	You mean the ones with FNORD tatoo'd on their foreheads, who keep 
> sending mail just like the mail thats been sent before?

There are no aliens citizen. You saw nothing of the sort.

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Rick Riffle wrote:
>
> Once again, RE: will be playing live ambient/idm electronic listening music
> to make your ears happy at:
>
> RAW Living Foods
> 1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln
> San Francisco
>
> We will play from about 7:30 to 10:30 p.m.  It's FREE, and the food at RAW
> is incredible.  Hope to see some of you there.
>
> Rick
>
> ps:  We finally finished our demo tape, and will have a few copies on hand.

I'm gonna try and make it there again tonight to fuel up on all that
positive energy for either Origin or Space Teddy tommarow night and Bay
to Breakers Sunday morning. Definitely gotta get one of their demo
tapes too! Hope to see anyone / everyone there!

Take care,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:34:51 1996
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From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Organization: r e g e n e r a t i o n  X
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (X11; I; Linux 1.99.4 i586)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: **apple** Ravein San jose
References: <199605152041.NAA18368@shellx.best.com>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Message-Id: <96May17.143352pdt.4518@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:59:05 PDT
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let us not rant but *rave*, young jedi.

For it is not the empire that  a *Microsuck* rave.

Well I love the chaos apple has caused with the rave and will make my
journey to the rave by foot as to not lose my spiritual connection with
gaia.(it helps when u have no car and live in downtown san jose). I have
meet a few sfr ravers and hope to meet a ton more tonight.

I'll just follow the PLUR.

peace,
ionX

I'll be wearing a skate like a man t-shirt, and probably dancing.
come say hi.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:34:53 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: SCHWA
To: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-Id: <96May17.143352pdt.4519@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:59:08 PDT
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You wrote: 
>
>
>Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?
>
>Gotta go...
>
>-SUNNY
>(SOLLE CLOTHING CO.)
>
>
>

They're everywhere, up in the sky, stuck on cars (Ahem, LOWUFO), on 
necklaces, even on Skateboards.. oh wait.. that's alien workshop.. =)~


Adam
    
                    R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:35:38 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: NRR! hey macintosh people!
Message-Id: <96May17.143419pdt.4531@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:59:49 PDT
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I'm looking for a copy of "Graphics Converter" for Macintosh. The one on
Hyperreal doesn't work (it's corrupted or something) and the one this
computer lab has some kind of copy protection on it... even though it's
shareware. =P

can anyone help me out? e-mail it to me or something?

thanks a bazillion...

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:35:38 1996
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From: Jondabomb@aol.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: FINALS
Message-Id: <96May17.143419pdt.4534@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 10:59:59 PDT
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Pass me a huge helping of positive energy.....I HAVE FINALS!
UNGGGGHHHHHHH
jonathan

See you all at ORigin!!! It is on my Birthday...Im turning 19(but im still an
immature little boy!:P

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:35:42 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Re: What belongs on SFR?
Message-Id: <96May17.143421pdt.4540@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 11:00:20 PDT
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On Wed, May 15, 1996 4:57:33 PM  at Leslie Ayres wrote: 
 
>What I like is when it's clear in the header of a message what it's about
so I 
>can skip it -- e.g., when someone's selling some equipment, I don't read
it, 
 
Leslie, you hit it right on the nose!  It would make my 100+ messages a
HELL of a lot easier to get through if I would know what I'm about to read
by the header.  So please lets make the headers as clear as they can
be...save the creativity for the body.  Then I'll have more time to get out
and have FUN! rather than sit at the computer. 
 
--erik 
 
Ps.  I looked all over every pull down menu in this lame Mac program
(Hooked internet services may have something to do with this) and I can't
find how to change the thing that says <Milton Cecil> instead of <Erik>. 
Please help if you have an idea or if your familiar with this program. 
That's why I have to say this... 
 
**IMPORTANT!  READ DISCLAIMER** 
These words were NOT written by moonpup 
He's in London until late August 
 
...and I'm ERIK.  I'll be using his address until then 
Please address all comments, rebuttals, love or hate letters to me, ERIK 
or drop me a line... 415-337-6666

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:35:42 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Missing Madness
Message-Id: <96May17.143421pdt.4541@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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>To everyone who attended Madness: please share the love and positive energy
>with the rest of us.  It sounds like it was an incredibly meaningful,
>moving experience; how I wish I'd gone :(


Don't encourage them, Eric!  There's already at least 20 reviews making me
terribly jealous!  I was at the library - can anyone top THAT for a bad
Saturday night??

Hey, Madness, any chance of making it a MONTHLY??!

Nancy



>
>Please pass the PLUR,
>
>- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:36:13 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: apple rave: 
X-Mailer: <PC Eudora Version 1.4>
Message-Id: <96May17.143510pdt.4685@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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>...It is obvious to
>me why there are no raves in san jose. The law enforcement establishment
>was unable to see this party for the peaceful communal gathering that it
>was.

What makes everyone think San Fran is any different?  An experienced 
promoter will take care of the various requirements for having an event in 
whatever city they decide to throw the party in.  I was standing outside 
listening to the police officer trying to explain to the promoter that 
*nothing at all* would have happened if he hadn't had the donations bowl 
sitting there.  The promoter came back whining about how the cop had the 
badge so there was nothing he could do.  What the heck is that supposed to 
mean?  It tells me the guy wearing the badge has a job to do, regardless of 
whether or not he enjoys doing it.  What turned it into a bust was a cop 
that got tired of getting badgered for trying to go easy and decided to just 
shut it all down.

Put it this way: I've partied in various venues with various themes and 
music for a long time.  When people follow the rules and respect the 
authorities, it's a good night.  When they don't, it's a bad night.  Simple.

>One of the
>cops was watching us dance and he he had a very self assured "thank god
>I'm not one of you degenerates" look on his face.

I was dancing right in front of that guy wearing my Dr. Seuss hat.  I'm sure 
he was actually thinking, "Geez, where can *I* get a hat like that?"  Ok, 
maybe not...

S



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:36:14 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
X-Mailer: <PC Eudora Version 1.4>
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>I am 
>not knocking the Goa list at all, but why not talk a little about that 
>stuff here?

I agree totally.  Why put the Goa messages on a separate list?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:38:31 1996
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From: "Aaron_Edsinger" <AEDSINGE@us.oracle.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: |NER| Fwd: NYC club owner in 'ecstasy' bust (fwd)
X-Orcl-Application: In-Reply-To: UNX02.US.ORACLE.COM:owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com's message of 16-May-96 01:36
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--Boundary-4901633-0-0

yeah too bad...I sure will miss those 25$ Vitamin C tablets being sold at the 
LimeLight........


--Boundary-4901633-0-0

From:"Troy Sheets " <owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Fwd: |NER| Fwd: NYC club owner in 'ecstasy' bust (fwd)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24]
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X-Orcl-Application: Precedence:  bulk


>From what I have heard about the Tunnel in NYC, it is a less than PLURRY place.
This is still extremely bad news....

-troy

---------------------------------

	NEW YORK, May 15 (UPI) -- A New York City nightclub impresario was  
arrested Wednesday and charged with turning two of his popular hot spots 
into drug dens by distributing the hallucinogen ``ecstasy'' to his young 
patrons. 
	Brooklyn U.S. Attorney Zachary Carter said Peter Gatien transformed  
Tunnel and the Limelight into ``virtual ecstasy supermarkets,'' selling 
up to 2,000 pills per month at $35 to $40 a pop. 
	``What's really remarkable was we determined that dealing drugs was  
not just a lucrative sideline, but was the centerpiece of the operation, 
'' Carter said. ``It could be said that these clubs existed to 
distribute these drugs.'' 
	Carter said an eight-month investigation into the distribution of the  
designer drug in New York led them directly to Gatien. He said Gatien 
hired a director and ``party promoters'' whose duties included guarding 
the door to let ``house dealers'' of the drug inside and then warn them 
when New York City police officers came around. 
	The club also took a cut of the dealers' profits, officials said.  
	The multicolored ecstasy pills -- sold under names like ``fruitloops,''  
``cat's eye,'' ``playboys'' and ``doves'' -- were apparently smuggled 
into the country from Amsterdam, the Netherlands, Montreal, Canada and 
Miami, said Drug Enforcement Administration Special Agent Carlo Boccia. 
	The drug is known to produce a combination of effects, including a  
euphoric high, relaxation and mild hallucinations, Boccia said. High 
doses have been linked to psychosis, brain damage and even death. 
	``The public needs to realize that the high visibility of clubs such  
as these glamorize the use and distribution of these illegal substances, 
'' Boccia said. 
	``Those who sell these drugs, albeit surrounded by the splendor and  
glitz of 'fashionable' nightclubs, are no less the scourge than those 
who hide in the back alleys of the inner city to dispense their poison. 
These people are just as bad, if not worse.'' 
	Gatien and 21 others were arrested in pre-dawn raids and 6,000 pills  
were confiscated. The defendants were charged with conspiracy to 
distribute ecstasy. They face maximum prison terms of 20 years if 
convicted. 
	Carter has also filed a motion to seize any of Gatien's ill-gotten  
assets and other physical property related to the alleged drug 
operation. 
	The clubs can remain open until a judge's ruling on the matter, he  
said. 
  	   	



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within


--Boundary-4901633-0-0--

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:39:17 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Klaxon 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: here we go again
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aaaargh! the sony server is acting up again!
can someone please remove jkolarik@ssi.sony.com from the list?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:39:17 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Apple's Rave in San Jose!!!
Message-Id: <96May17.143728pdt.4782@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:10:53 PDT
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Sounds like Apple really managed to recreate a true rave... =)

-m.


>At 01:06 AM 5/16/96 -0700, you wrote:
>
>>Btw.. while I was leaving, a bunch of cops were coming up the stairs...
>>Did the party get busted?!? Lemme know!!
>>There were six cop cars lined up outside the warehouse. heh.
>>
>>
>>See ya all soon!
>>
>>
>>Adam
>>                            R.Lunatic
>>
>Can you say BUSTED..the Cops shut it donw around 12:30...Freaky Chakra and
>Single Cell were getting off too. That kinda sucked. It wasn't a bad party
>either. Once Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orch started the place got
>moving. I'd have to give them a thumbs up for tring to put on a good party.
>It was going good until the cops came. They were kinda being jerks about it
>to. Anyway I had fun.
>
>
>Tim (knucklehead)


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:39:27 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Thanks from Harmony!
To: Gregory Sandler <ascend@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605131855.LAA26306@dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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On Mon, 13 May 1996, Gregory Sandler wrote:

> Matt, Cloud and Trent, thanks for the tunes! (And no 
> Randy, Dj Dan didn't spin first.) 
> 

Hi!
 My apologies to Matt and Cloud. I wish I had more time to learn who the 
DJ's are but damn I have a full life. You guys played some awesome beats. 
Made carrying the sound system and cleaning up VERY worthwhile. AND I 
thought Greg and Trent were serving up some  tasty mixs ;) !!!!!!!

Ran

                        ( taking it higher )
                              /
                        -=*=-/
                          ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:40:42 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
To: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave/Media Essay (Super Long)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605101643.A10733-0100000@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
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Dear Friends & Family,

	I hope many of you took the time to read this.  It's not in fact 
specifically about the rave scene, but I definitely found it relevant.

My computer tells me that on Fri, 10 May 1996, Kyung Rok shared (in part):

> Though perhaps better sent on a Tuesday instead of a Friday afternoon, 
> this is about 1/4 of a cultural studies piece titled "Moral Panic, the 
> Media and British Rave Culture."  Written by Sarah Thornton, the rest of 
> this essay can be found in "Microphone fiends : Youth Music & Youth 
> Culture / edited by Andrew Ross & Tricia Rose. Routledge, 1994.

A few of the observations I found most interesting, and some comments of 
my own:

> ___
> The idea that authentic culture is somehow outside media and commerce is a 
> resilient one. In its full-blown romantic form, the belief imagines that 
> grass-roots cultures resist and struggle with a colonizing mass-mediated 
> corporate world

Although the problems with media and commercial interests are many, I am 
forced to agree with the author's indictment of our anti-media and 
anti-commercial outlook, as if our culture is somehow pure and real, and 
immune from the greed, mediocrity, and tastelessness we see in media and 
commerce.  The indictment of commerce may be due to the "temporary 
respite" many of us who are young possess from "adult commitments of 
accumulation of economic capital" (see below), but this doesn't make it 
correct.  

> In exploring this case, this article finds no opposition between 
> subcultures and the media, except for a dogged ideological one. It 
> uncovers no pure origins or organic homologies of sound, style and 
> ritual, nor does it vilify a vague monolith called "The media." Instead, 
> it examines how various media are integral to youth's social and 
> ideological formations. Micromedia like flyers and listings are means by 
> which club organizers bring the crowd together; niche media like the 
> music press construct as much as they document subcultures; while mass 
> media like the tabloids develop as much as do youth movements. Contrary 
> to youth discourses, then, subcultures do not germinate from
> seed and grow by force of their own energy into mysterious movements to 
> be belatedly ingested by the media. Rather, media are there and effective 
> right from the start. 

Again, this seems true.  SFRaves is part of the media, although it has 
the advantage of being a better-informed, more personal, and less 
restricted than large mass media outlets, plus the crucial point of being 
truly interactive.  Damning "the media" indiscriminately doesn't reflect 
well on our ability to comprehend that media are an important part of 
any culture, including ours.  Nor do they fit well into neat boxes of 
"mainstream" and "underground" media based on audience size or by whether 
they call themselves underground or alternative.

> The term "underground" is the expression by which clubbers refer to 
> things subcultural. More than fashionable or trendy, underground sounds 
> and styles are "authentic," and pitted against the mass-produced and 
> mass-consumed. Underqrounds denote exclusive worlds whose main point is 
> not elitism. but whose parameters often relate to particular crowds. They 
> delight in parental incomprehension, negative newspaper coverage and that 
> best blessing in disguise, the BBC ban. More than anything else, then, 
> undergrounds define themselves against the mass media.

Fortunately I don't think ravers delight much in "parental 
incomprehension."  From what I've seen, many of us have actually tried to 
bring our parents into the scene, and share the joy with them.  We do 
however, it seems to me, take an unseemly delight in negative media 
coverage:  Ridiculing them for lack of knowledge of our scene, taking the 
attitude "they just don't get it" as if they are incapable of getting it, 
reveling in our perceived superiority -- these attitudes don't reflect 
well on our community.  Which is not to say that we should go along with 
negative coverage -- we should seek to inform and correct it, and to 
fight it when it refuses to be informed and corrected.

> That's what I mean by underground."Undergrounds define themselves most 
> clearly by what they're not, that is "main stream." Although there is 
> variation, the oft-repeated expression by which they refer to mainstream 
> clubs is that these are places where "Sharon and Tracy dance around their 
> handbags." This mainstream is decried as passive, indiscriminate and 
> uncommitted to dance culture; it is ridiculed for its " herd instinct" 
> and " bandwagon mentality. " 

When I find myself dissing mainstream culture, I try to check myself.  I 
do not think it is a good habit, although it is an easy one to fall 
into.  What we are really doing when we dis mainstream culture, 
after all, is dissing humanity at large, saying most people are stupid, 
base, and lack taste and culture.  Now if we hold out the hope of 
reforming mainstream culture by making the underground the mainstream, 
that is different, for that is saying that there is hope for humanity, 
that humanity at large is not to blame, only current social attitudes.
	Note in the paragraph below where the author says that 
popularization is seen as a problem by the underground.  I think 
her observation is correct, and it's unfortunate, because while certainly 
it can have problematic *aspects*, to say that popularization *itself* 
is the problem is truly cynical and elitist.  

> ...subcultures romanticize "the street" 
> and the crowd, not artists' studios and individual genius. Moreover, 
> rather than the dreaded "trickle down," the problem for underground 
> subculture is popularization by a gushing up to the mainstream. 

I have myself noticed this tendency to romanticize "the street."  I think 
this can take several forms, one being the old argument that "If you 
aren't (X) yourself, or haven't done (X) yourself, or haven't been to (X) 
yourself, you aren't qualified to have an opinion on (X)."  Personally I 
have always thought this an extremely weak way of invalidating someone 
else's point of view.  Another way "the street" gets romanticized is by 
dissing "book smarts" in favor of an ill-defined "you've got to go out 
there and experience it, man" approach.
	I once occurred to me after a trip to L.A. that when people there are 
stuck up it seems to be more about how much money they have, who they 
know that's famous, whereas when people in S.F. are stuck up it's more 
often about how much a part of some "underground elite" they are.

> ...youth. whatever their 
> class enjoy a momentary reprieve from "necessity."'! In other words, 
> youth are exempt from adult commitments to the accumulation of economic 
> capital. They temporarily enjoy what Bourdieu argues is normally reserved 
> for the bourgeoisie; that is, a "taste of liberty or luxury. "

	This is troubling to me, because it reminds me that so few 
people, as they grow older, manage to live outside these "adult 
commitments to the accumulation of economic capital."  Just look at our 
cultural forebears, the hippies.  For the most part, the '60s generation 
has blended into the workforce without fulfilling the dreams of their 
youth of social change toward a world of peace, love, harmony, and fun.
	It troubles me that many ravers do not even seem to have such 
noble dreams.  Many of us have no hope of changing the world.  We do 
not think beyond the next party, beyond how great our favorite dance 
music is.  When the music is old, and a new generation seeking its own 
values finds something else to turn to besides raves, with different 
music and perhaps different values, what will we have changed?  If we're not 
even idealistic now, how crassly cynical and materialist may we become in 
thirty years?  I know this is a downer, but I say it not out of cynicism, 
but out of hope that we will make a difference, ravers young and old.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:40:44 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v0300665aadc129a0e776@DialupEudora> from "Tony Rotundo" at May 16, 96 10:51:19 am
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Being that I'm writing this during my work hours at a merciless greedy
corporate giant , I'll try to keep it short -

Some Stuff RE: Apple "Sprockets" "Rave"

1. Looked just like a rave when I showed up at the announced opening
time of 8PM - ie nothing ready quite yet, guys running around trying to 
get stuff set up. I must say that they had a DJ working at the turntables at 
least! Although he would be cut off every once and awhile as they tweaked
the system for Freaky Chakra. I think the DJ's name was Alex ( not MAD
Alex ).

2. Nobody that I noticed in suits or nametags. On the whole , the dress
was either California yuppy casual with the occasional individualistic
touch ( unique tie or pin or hairdo ) or what you'd see at a rave ( no
naked people or "costumes" , tho ).

3. Free non-alcoholic drinks and snack food included in the $5 admin.

4. I left 15 minutes before the cops showed up - must have been some
personal 6th sense. Maybe it was the speaker stack placed in front of 
the open window that gave me a hint .... Nobody from Apple that was
arranging this was in suits, so there was no one to impress the police
with, much less Jerry Brown.

5. By the way , thanks to the folks who arranged for the event! I understand
they had to rent the space for over $1000 last night. If I remember, at
least one of them subscribes to SFRaves - so "hello!".

6. South Bay SFRavers - getting together sounds good to me! As Mr.
Knucklehead knows, it's the organizing that's the tough part.

 Gotta get back to looking like I'm working!!!!

Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com ( No , I don't work for NETCOM )

PS - HI! to all the folks I met last night , even if I don't remember
your name(s)! It was great to meet new folks and match faces to email
names.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:40:49 1996
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From: ccat@netcom.com (Chris Beaumont)
Subject: Origins of Apple
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Hey, you guys should ask Captain Crunch about Apple,


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:44:51 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Graphic Converter (thanks everyone!)
Message-Id: <96May17.144111pdt.4804@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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Thanks everyone who responded to my Graphic Converter inquiry... I got
about 20 messages with download info, etc. Even the program itself in an
attachment... =)

thank you all, I got what I needed.

(I LOVE this list!)

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:47:52 1996
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From: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Subject: SCHWA
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Is it just me or are these bald big eyed alien things everywhere?

Gotta go...

-SUNNY
(SOLLE CLOTHING CO.)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:47:54 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605170019.RAA19039@shellx.best.com> from "SDream" at May 16, 96 05:19:32 pm
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> 
> >I am 
> >not knocking the Goa list at all, but why not talk a little about that 
> >stuff here?
> 
> I agree totally.  Why put the Goa messages on a separate list?

Becuase sfraves is a list dedicated to a specific geographical location.
The Goa list is global.

Additionally, have you considered that the creater of the Goa list
would like to just discuss music, without the major distractions that
appear on sfraves?

The list creater, Andy Kumeda, is not even subscribed to sfraves.  He
is a socal-raver.

I don't see whats the big deal.  If you want to get the the goa info, just
subscribe.

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:48:03 1996
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From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Begroovy@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
In-Reply-To: <960516135134_302264137@emout13.mail.aol.com>
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I have one thing to say about what belongs on sfraves.  Raving is, to a 
certain extent, a limited topic.  If you start subdividing the whole 
thing into different  music genres/ different spiritualities/ etc. etc., 
the result will be  VERY watered down.  I would hate to see that.  I am 
not knocking the Goa list at all, but why not talk a little about that 
stuff here?  Raving is  about music and I would  certainly enjoy picking the 
brains of people who know a hell of a lot more than I do.  If you dislike 
something, DELETE it!  It's not hard.

-kaySEE

On Thu, 16 May 1996 Begroovy@aol.com wrote:

> Thanks to aleph1@dfw.net  for posting this and giving people a place to
> discuss goa trance. This is what I was discussing yesterday. This will allow
> people who enjoy goa trance a forum to discuss this genre of music. Thus
> respecting the sfravers who are not particularly fond of this genre of music.
> There mail boxes will not be filled with specific goa type messages.
> I think this is a wonderful idea and i would like to see many more of these
> types of specific lists. Sub-catagories of the sfraves e-mail list! Getting
> bored, Brian???? Need something to keep you busy????? = )    Have a great
> day,PEACE!! Cid  
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:49:09 1996
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Subject: Re: South Bay Gathering
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: "Adam Luong" <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>, <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>Well, I dunno if everybody got my response about a gathering, but I was 
>suggesting a coffee shop!! how about The Pruneyard in Campbell?! It's 
>right off of 880/17 and 85. It's nice and open.. indoors and outdoor... 
>
>
>Adam


I was waiting to see if we got any other responses... personally I feel 
that 
drinking coffee on a Friday night is not a great way to relax. I am kind 
of 
partial to beer myself. But I will go wherever people want to go, so 
there!
Let's wait a few more days and make a decision.

Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:49:12 1996
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From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.stanford.edu>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Laminates Survey
In-Reply-To: <960516134915_114931004@emout15.mail.aol.com>
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cool...I think that a laminate for a buck is fair if it allows the
artist to express creativity . . 

Cassandra

On Thu, 16 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com
wrote:

> How does anyone feel about having to fork out about a buck for their
> laminate.  I really like the free idea, but I've got this really neat design
> which involves a small electronic device. (Hee hee, I'm not telling)  Might
> be able to keep production costs under a buck. 
> -P.S. I was just thinking what a strange concept sfraves is, kinda like a
> positve version of The Borg gone haywire.  "You too will be assimilated!"
> Love,
> Steveo
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:49:24 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Subject: Congratulations/Good Luck!
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[ to sfraves ]

 Good luck to all those going through the strains of late semester academics.
And congatulations to those who've survived!

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:49:33 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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>Last night in the effort to communicate coherently with Melissa at JB, our
>conversation got on to how cool the picnic was.  (Lots of nods, two thumbs
>up and smiles.)  I said something like, "hell, we should do that once a
>month."  I immediately ammended that and though once every other month
>would be nice, and a lot less pressure.
>
*snip*
>Tone
>
Excellent idea!  I'm in like phlegm (Flynn?).  Every other or every three
months would be good, as someone mentioned before that every month might be
a burden, and not everyone's schedule is sufficiently friendly.  My
presence and contributions to ongoing picnics will be high (so to speak...
;)).  Who's with us?

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:49:42 1996
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From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: Apple RAVE
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Anyone know who the promoters were?  I'd like to send some appreciative   
email to encourage more of this sort of thing.  I'm sure they are bummed   
about the bust, and I'd love to let them know how many people on this   
list enjoyed the generous effort.  Positive feedback to re-enforce   
desired behavior & all that sort of thing...
 -Roy  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:50:09 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 14:52:23 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: Interesting SFR Picnic/Party thought
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At 02:20 PM 5/17/96 -0800, you wrote:

>Last night in the effort to communicate coherently with Melissa at JB, our
>conversation got on to how cool the picnic was.  (Lots of nods, two thumbs
>up and smiles.)  I said something like, "hell, we should do that once a
>month."  I immediately ammended that and though once every other month
>would be nice, and a lot less pressure.

I was liking that idea as well. I had a great time doing the Picnic. I'd be
up for a monthly thing.
>
>Here's the idea.  We (SFR) set-up a spot, organize logistics, do promotion,
>and handle as much as possible the leg work of having picnic party, and ask
>a different production group to come, with their sound system and DJs.

This is a good idea. I started doing that in the begining, but found few
people that wanted or could show up for a meeting to organize it. I found
myself doing most of it, which I didn't mind doing, and had a few people
help out at the end. It was very scary not knowing for sure if people would
actually do what they said they would. I think if we were to pull off a
monthly BBQ, it would have to be well organized.

>
>What's in it for us is that we get a different "feel" of each party, and a
>great cross section of the different styles of music in the Bay Area.
>What's in it for them?  They get a hassle free, organized event that all
>they have to do is show up (I guess and bring a system :) and bring friends.


Plus, I think everyone would have a Great time and give us a chance to meet
more people on a different level unlike an actual night time party. There is
more time to just kick back in the sun and get to know people.

>Any ideas?
>
>Tone
>
>P.S.  I wasn't envisioning the massive BBQ that Knucklehead has, but maybe
>a couple Webbers would do.  I have a massive Webber (Big Bertha) that loves
>to be used.  ;^)
>

Hey, I'm putting a new grill on it here soon. I highly suggest if we plan on
having more then 100 people, we should use may BBQ. I had alot of people
come up to me and say the loved my big BBQ. I think it gives off a good
little feeling seeing a big old BBQ there, kinda cool, but a bunch of webers
would do it to. I just wanted to add that if anyone want to use it for a
party or whatever just let me know a week or so before hand and you got it.


I'm all up for a monthly BBQ, let make it work!! Throwin in my Buck 2.59

Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:51:23 1996
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From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: Apple etc.
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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It was fun seeing people at the Apple thing.  I also had a chance to meet 
some people I haven't met previously :).  The only bad thing was that I 
just can't deal with San Jose streets :(.  I managed to get lost by car, 
and then walking from 5th to the actual warehouse...  Needless to say it 
was raining and I was soaking wet. 

I would like to thank SDream for letting me ware his bandana (I forgot 
all my hair bands because I came straight from work and my hair was just 
out of control while I was dancing).  Also thanks CT for helping me 
find my car afterwards.  It would have taken me forever to find it...

I am still at work :( - beta software realise tomorrow morning, so send 
me e-mail if you get bored.  Also I would love to join South Bay crowd in 
getting together (it would be great during the week, because I work in 
Mt. View and live in SF).

Hugz,
Branka

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:51:34 1996
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From: Maren Ault <rault@holly.colostate.edu>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: dj 343
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anyone heard of dj343 from colorado?

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:52:08 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Subject: SBay get-together
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[ to sfraves ]

 Thanks to Amy(Ms Phink) for volunteering as the coordinator for a South Bay
meet!

 Next weekend is Memorial Day weekend. I could meet with folks early Friday 
night, but others may have weekend out-of-town plans.

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:52:08 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: Review: Cinnamon Toasty Apple Raves
Message-Id: <96May17.144246pdt.4842@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream) wrote:
>The first guy I heard spinning, Alex, was
>*good*.  There were various people throwing vinyl down after that, ranging
>from ok to fairly flat.

Anyone know who was last before SCO?  I liked it.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:52:09 1996
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From: Tinsau <amdice@puc.edu>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Laminates Survey
In-Reply-To: <960516134915_114931004@emout15.mail.aol.com>
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On Thu, 16 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:

> How does anyone feel about having to fork out about a buck for their
> laminate.  I really like the free idea, but I've got this really neat design
> which involves a small electronic device. (Hee hee, I'm not telling)  Might
> be able to keep production costs under a buck. 
A buck? no problem as far as I am concerned.

  Austin                             
  Tinsau                    

            S.F. Born and Raved!                          










From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:52:13 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Harmony's Beach Party
To: Adam Luong <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Mon, 13 May 1996, Adam Luong wrote:

> Hey everybody, by the way. There was this guy who was taking ALOT of 
> pictures at the beach party on Sunday. Make sure it doesn't get on HARD 
> COPY. Hehe.
> 
>          Adam
>                         
> 
>                         R.Lunatic
> 
> 

Hi all!
 It's okay about the photographer. I have some extreme closeups of him on 
video :)


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams

                               ( see you, see me )
                                   /
                             -=*=-/
                               ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:52:27 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: South Bay Gathering
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Well, I dunno if everybody got my response about a gathering, but I was 
suggesting a coffee shop!! how about The Pruneyard in Campbell?! It's 
right off of 880/17 and 85. It's nice and open.. indoors and outdoor... 


Adam


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:52:29 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Subject: Santa Cruz hints for June?
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[ to sfraves list ]

 I was thinking ( ohoh ), about an idea I had some months ago but never 
followed up on. My idea was , if it was known that an event was going to
be happening in the evening in Santa Cruz or the South Bay , that folks
could get together for a daytime picnic before heading off to the rave!

 Those who remember the SFRaves get together I organized called RadioRadio
a few years ago might remember the park it was held in - Sunnyvale Baylands
Park. That's a nice site - there are some other parks I was thinking of 
as well. 

 Not so much like a Sunset , with a sound system and DJs. Mostly just 
chilling and grilling and kite flying and chatting.

 So - anybody involved with doing Santa Cruz/South Bay events can give
hints about any June events? ( I guess Tribal Future makes the first
weekend in June out of consideration ).

 Larry Ching / larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 14:55:51 1996
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From: Begroovy@aol.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Damn?
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 13:31:44 PDT
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>``Those who sell these drugs, albeit surrounded by the splendor and  
>glitz of 'fashionable' nightclubs, are no less the scourge than those 
>who hide in the back alleys of the inner city to dispense their poison. 
>These people are just as bad, if not worse.'' 

Can you say ouch!!!!!!!!!
I think someone has been wearing there underware to tight?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:04:17 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: madness....
Message-Id: <96May17.145316pdt.5216@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 13:29:25 PDT
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Greetings Friends!

Sorry this is a bit late in coming, but that's just the way it goes
sometimes...

In any event, on behalf of everyone that helped pull madness off -- the mad
crew, gateway systems, and our many other dear friends that busted their
asses for this one -- we offer our sincerest thanks for once again bringing
your energy, your hope, your optimism, your peace, and your love, with you
when you came, it makes all the difference.

It was indeed a very mad night; let's do it again sometime =)

take it easy
madness



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:09:08 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 15:09:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andy Thomas <andy@hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: BSP Free Live Ambient/IDM by "RE:"
In-Reply-To: <199605172042.NAA25341@franc.ucdavis.edu>
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I highly reccomend this to anyone who's looking for a good place to chill
and get some eats before going out.  Cami and I went last friday and it
was great.  The food and the music was perfect! 

Andy

On Fri, 17 May 1996, Rick Riffle wrote:

> Once again, RE: will be playing live ambient/idm electronic listening music
> to make your ears happy at:
> 
> RAW Living Foods
> 1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln
> San Francisco
> 
> We will play from about 7:30 to 10:30 p.m.  It's FREE, and the food at RAW
> is incredible.  Hope to see some of you there.
> 
> Rick
> 
> ps:  We finally finished our demo tape, and will have a few copies on hand.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:11:00 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 17:09:14 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Cc: postmaster@godzilla.adoc.xerox.com, postmaster@adoc.xerox.com
Subject: Duplicate Messages
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Could the owner of godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com STOP sending old messages of 
the maling list to sfraves!

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:14:36 1996
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From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Pack-a-bowl
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:19:40 PDT
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I am out the door, headed to PackABowl.  If anyone else goes, look for 
me.  I'll have on a pink T-shirt and dark baggy pants.  I'll also be with 
Jess and I'll be the person who REALLY sucks at bowling (you should 
notice me from that!!!)

chau,
kaysee

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:15:58 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: apple rave: 
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 

>I was dancing right in front of that guy wearing my Dr. Seuss hat.  
I'm sure 
>he was actually thinking, "Geez, where can *I* get a hat like that?"  
Ok, 
>maybe not...
>
>S
>
>


On Haight Street.. =)~

Adam



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:17:23 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
To: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
cc: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: well, yosemite might work! (please read me!)
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I'm up for a trip to Yosemete an' all so write to me about it.
TRISTAN.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:17:26 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 15:17:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Pack-a-bowl
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On 17 May 1996, Leslie Ayres wrote:

> 
> That's part of the fun at Packabowl -- everybody sucks!  No performance pressure
> here!
> 
> I watched one night, and everyone was SOOOOO bad it was hysterical!  That was
> the best part, watching people actually having so much fun doing something that
> they sucked at, but they were having a ball anyway!!!  
> 
> One lane I was watching must have thrown 15 gutter balls in a row ... I loved
> it, they were laughing so hard, having a ball!
> 
> Leslie   ; )
> 
       Yeap I have to agree with you Leslie, it doesn't matter how good, 
or how bad you are at the game, as long as you have a grand time. When I 
went, my friend Denise and I knew that we sucked, so we just had some fun 
with it: we bowled 2 people at a time down a lane and bowled backwards 
throwing the ball between our legs and we actually knocked some pins down 
too:).
                          Reagan
         


> 
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:17:26 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 15:17:11 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: branka! where are you?
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branka

i've lost your email! if you want to get together tonite, give me a call or
email....

omar, nancy and i are prob'ly going to hit this event
        Friday is Shunyata (Solar, Andre, Taj, Polywog, Shiloh, in SF)
if you're interested.


catch you later

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:18:56 1996
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To: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: apple maglite dj rig?
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-Id: <96May17.144540pdt.4972@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:07:52 PDT
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>You know, that instrument looked like one of those "build it yourself"
>electronic boards that you can buy at Radio Shack. I swear it looked
>just like the one I bought when I was 11 years old... Hehehehe...
>yeah.. It made some type of trippy whiny noise while he was tapping the
>button down... wierd... but, whatever works!!
>
Sounds like a therimen...(scuse spelling)

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:19:38 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress <mswietzke@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Joy Funk Club
Message-Id: <96May17.144533pdt.4950@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:06:19 PDT
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I'm DJing a party in S.F. on Friday the 18th called Joy Funk Club.  It is an
AIDS benefit and should be a lot of fun and at the same time raise some
money for a good cause.  It's on the corner of 11th and Folsom at a club
called Transmissions and starts at 9pm.  If you're interested, stop on by.
I will be playing mainly house music, so it should be a great place to go
dancing!

Peace, Matt


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:19:45 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.com>
Subject: Anyone else catch that Spaz thing on Public Access?
Message-Id: <96May17.143850pdt.4762@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:19:35 PDT
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Weird!

Cool visuals, but weird spoken word over live music/synths.  Live drummer.
Trippy dancers.  Images of the band layed over and under funky art work,
all swirling and melding and twirling.  Things like putting the drummers
head inside the bass drum, looking like a really old Led Zepplin video or
something.

Considering I was prepared to hear techno it ca.  The word "call" and a
phone number would speratically appear.  I didn't.

Question is, "was this SPAZ the party./rave promoters?"



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:19:52 1996
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Subject: Re: South Bay Gathering
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: "Adam Luong" <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>, <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <96May17.144522pdt.4927@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:05:58 PDT
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>Well, I dunno if everybody got my response about a gathering, but I was 
>suggesting a coffee shop!! how about The Pruneyard in Campbell?! It's 
>right off of 880/17 and 85. It's nice and open.. indoors and outdoor... 
>
>
>Adam


I was waiting to see if we got any other responses... personally I feel 
that 
drinking coffee on a Friday night is not a great way to relax. I am kind 
of 
partial to beer myself. But I will go wherever people want to go, so 
there!
Let's wait a few more days and make a decision.

Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:20:00 1996
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From: "Scott Nozawa" <scott_nozawa@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: ?Apples' nerdy programers?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Cc: "Mark Piercy" <piercy@toolik.stanford.edu>
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                      Subject:                              Time:  9:05


Hey gang,

     Speaking of Apples' nerdy programers, come see this one close at Quench
this Sunday  8*)   Quench is held at The Usual (F/X) 400 S. 1st St. S.J. 
Please all you Southbay raver types come up and say high!  Hopefully I will
have little flyers to hand out about a cool music thang in a park in June. 
It's gonna be summer time real soon and we gotta get SJ dancin' together!  

Peace to all...

                            Tamotsu
     


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:20:08 1996
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From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: BSP The Uncle Noah TV Show
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Well, through some stroke of luck, one of the new trainees bailed out of 
his show and I am not back on the air at KDVS.  The show airs from 3-5am 
on Saturday (That's Friday night continued for those of you keeping track 
in that manner :P) on KDVS 90.3fm.  The station can be heard through the 
contral valley, but best in Davis/Sacramento.  
Be sure to also listen to DJ Jericho on KDVS mondays 12-2pm  :)

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:20:20 1996
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To: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list and the what belongs on sfraves.
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>
>> >I am
>> >not knocking the Goa list at all, but why not talk a little about that
>> >stuff here?
>>
>> I agree totally.  Why put the Goa messages on a separate list?
>
>Becuase sfraves is a list dedicated to a specific geographical location.
>The Goa list is global.
>
>Additionally, have you considered that the creater of the Goa list
>would like to just discuss music, without the major distractions that
>appear on sfraves?

Also,  Goa parties up here in SF don't happen that often.   The ones
that do,  are so underground that unless you are friends of the person(s)
putting it on,  you don't know about it,  or get in.   The certainly
don't get announced in SFRaves,  other than Freq-8 and a few of them.

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:20:26 1996
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To: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: Apple's Rave in San Jose!!!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 01:06 AM 5/16/96 -0700, you wrote:

>Btw.. while I was leaving, a bunch of cops were coming up the stairs... 
>Did the party get busted?!? Lemme know!!
>There were six cop cars lined up outside the warehouse. heh.
>
>
>See ya all soon!
>
>
>Adam
>                            R.Lunatic
>
Can you say BUSTED..the Cops shut it donw around 12:30...Freaky Chakra and
Single Cell were getting off too. That kinda sucked. It wasn't a bad party
either. Once Freaky Chakra and Single Cell Orch started the place got
moving. I'd have to give them a thumbs up for tring to put on a good party.
It was going good until the cops came. They were kinda being jerks about it
to. Anyway I had fun.


Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:20:31 1996
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From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: James Brown
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Okay, I found out about the show from this list, so I figure it's okay to 
post about going. 
I went to the Thursday night show and I can sum the experience up in two 
words:  James Brown.
An _amazing_ show -- wonderful location, really cool visuals (really!), 
great lighting, awesome sound and a wonderful happy vibe (despite the 
couple of little tiffs).  At one point the Godfather of Soul told us all 
to turn to the person on our right and tell them that we love them and 
then turn to the person on our left and tell them that we love them too.  
How much more could you ask for?!  A great great great show.  And such a 
wonderful diversity of people!  Every kind of person from biker to 
suit-and-tie to 70's retro folks, old, young, fat, skinny, dark, light 
and everything else.  Everyone was there and for the most part just happy 
and out-of-their mind.  If you ever get a chance to go see James Brown, 
don't hesitate.  Just go.  You have appreciated his records, you have 
appreciated manipulation of his samples, but nothing _nothing_ can 
compare to seeing it live.  63 years old and he still stances like a maniac!
Jee wiz.  What a show!
Did any other SFRAVErs go to the Thursday night show?

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:20:38 1996
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From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605160858.BAA00844@ns.mauswerks.com>
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It was fun, after all!   Freaky Chakra was great--- I'd never heard them 
before...  the place was about 1/2 full, but some good vibes were 
generated by the sfravers, for sure!  It was great meeting all the 
wonderful people who came up to me and introduced themselves!  (Boy, 
wearing a recognizable tee-shirt comes in handy!)

I second Amy's idea for those sfravers in the South Bay to get together 
for a drink, or somethin'...!

;-p

love
john


On Thu, 16 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >Half a dozen squad cars showed up and busted the place about an hour ago.
> >Uunderground enough?
> 
> Now we all know why there aren't any raves in San Jose! I heard the cops 
> were searching this girl whose only crime was passing out flyers. If 
> that's true, it's totally ridiculous, they had no probable cause. Ugh. 
> 
> I think the reason it got shut down finally had something to do with the
> fact that they weren't allowed to be collecting donations. But I'm sure
> they would have found a reason to shut it down anyway....
> 
> It was cool that a lot of sfravers showed up! I think we made the party.
> Esp. Todd and Adam wearing their krazy hats. Well it was good to finally 
> meet some of you & to hang out with others of you. Since there are 
> obviously a few of us in the S. Bay, we should get together for a drink
> somewhere!
> 
> Love-
> Amy :-)
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:20:52 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
To: michal migurski <lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com, tgrigsby@best.com
Subject: SFR Laminates, t-shirts
In-Reply-To: <96May16.123735pdt.4506@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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I'm with Michael here... there's entirely too many t-shirts floating 
around out there already.  Why can't we have a different article of 
clothing, something nobody puts logos on, like socks?  Or underwear?
What about a take-off on those boxer shorts with the big yellow and black 
smiley face?  8)
	
Much love,
				<<< Starchild >>>

P.S. - A laminate with an electronic device?  I'll buy that for a dollar!


My computer tells me that on Thu, 16 May 1996, michal migurski shared:

> >btw, the design I submitted was originally intended for laminates.
> >Anyone still down for the new laminate thang???
> 
> I think I'd be more *down* for new laminates than t-shirts... I'm not too
> fond of shirts with logos on them and stuff (most of the time...
> meaningless logos are cool  =).
> 
> I too am working on something, todd, so don't get yer panties in a bunch. =)
> 
> -m.
> 
> 
> 0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
> |    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
> |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
> |                                               |
> |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
> |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
> |                                               |
> |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
> |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
> |                                               |
> |              Michal Migurski                  |
> |              (510) 664-1026                   |
> 0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:20:58 1996
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To: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Origins of Apple
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:07:49 PDT
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>>Hey, you guys should ask Captain Crunch about Apple,
>
>John Draper, whaddya say to this???

After I met Woz,  he wanted me to design the telephone interface board.
So I designed a board with an ADC/DAC that controlled the audio,
switch-hook,  and it could send and decode any kind of tones,
as well as differentiate speech from tones,  but would not recognize
speech.   Remember,  this was 1977 (July to be exact).   I have some
of these stores on my WEB site.

http://www.well.com/user/crunch
  Play --> Stories --> Early days

Back then Apple wasn't corperate...  Only Mike Scott (CEO at the time)
and Mike Markula wore suits.   Boy,  have things changed.  This doesn't
have much to so with raving,   but getting back to the subject,  it
appears that Apple didn't pay the San Jose police enough money...  Thats
strange that it got busted...  I bet it was funny,  watching people dance
in suits.... But at the MacWorld Expo,   a few years ago,  they had
a rave,  actually,  it was my 2nd rave (where I danced) and it was
actually the "NextWorld Expo" for Next hackers.   The rave was the
Stone rave,  and was at 1015 Folsom... It was really good,   I get there
about 7 pm  (No rave music playing),  then about 9 pm or so,   the
thumpin beats are gradually mixed in,   and a half hour later,  the
dance floor was filled.  It was really good.

My next rave after that was WICKED at the Sound Factory the following
Saturday...  Then,  I was hooked...   But didn't do ANY drugs then,
but dug it BIG TIME,  so I can contribute my raving very closly with
computers in this sense.    About 3 weeks later....   Let Freedom Rave,
3rd of July,  Livermore racetrack...  Candyflipped....  Went beserk,
Remember the hill fire?

Oh,  one more thing... Forbes ASAP has a piece on me....   June issue,
check it out....Haven't read it yet though

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:21:19 1996
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From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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Organization: CT D-Zine
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Subject: Re: Apple Sprockets/RAVE
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Tony Rotundo wrote:
> 
> What I find most interesting is the fact that even Apple (Apple!) can't
> throw a party without it being busted.  You would think an event sponsored
> by a corporate giant would not be as prone to busting as say a small
> collective of relative insignificance.  (One making a substantial
> contribution to the local economy, the other making a huge racket all
> night.)
> 
> We shall win the war one battle (and one hug) at a time.  :^)
> 
> Anyone know if any official Apple representatives were there to defend the
> party?  Or were they long gone, home in bed with their wives and
> mistresses, husbands and misters.  :^)
> 
> Tony

AAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!

What the cops told the guy throwing the party was that they had to
shut it down because he did not have a business license and he was
accepting cash at the door. What a crock of shit! Come on, there
a sign on the table which specifically said "Donations". Apparently
the cops didn't buy this, and were determined to shut the party down
right from the start. 

First of all, that party was completely clean. There were no dealers
hanging out at the entrance, no blatant pot smoking, NO ALCOHOL!
Everybody was just having a good time. I personally was really stoked
to see all the Apple people goin' off!. 

What really pissed me off was when I was outside witnessing the cop
harassing the Apple guy, the cop said, "96% of what you were trying to
do tonight was good. We're not going to haul you off the San Quentin,
but you're at least going to receive a citation.". This cop was really
a dick!

[taking a deep breath]

Well, on a positive note, I was glad to see all of you again, as
briefly as it was. I second the motion that us south bay sfraves
should get together sometime. Till then, take care and PLUR.

Hugs,

CT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:21:27 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: FW: PLEASE CROSS-POST THIS! (long response)
To: teena@lioness.compute.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Chameleon.960515171442.teena@lioness.compute.com>
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On Wed, 15 May 1996 teena@lioness.compute.com wrote:

> 
> ...to disallow video cameras at ALL rave events.  This will ensure
> privacy and tighten leaks to the media.
> -Kc of DUNE

                        FUCK CENSORSHIP!!!
 
 I'm a multi-media artist who works with video occasionally. I'm also 
a performance ambient artist, again multi-media focused.
 
 I have two perspectives on video-taping raves.

 1) Free raves in public on public land: No one has the legal or ethical 
   right to prevent ANY video-taping here! Some may regard the video-taping 
   intrusive yet it is no more intrusive than a bunch of noisy, partying 
   ravers in a public venue. Share and share alike.

 2) Public events in rented venues: A more gray area. Legally the 
    producer has the right to forbid video-taping ( or any other recording 
    process ). I actually have been invited by one rave promoter to come 
    early and set up non-intrusive lighing in order to get some good shots 
    (lights would only be on for minutes). And realistically you will 
    not prevent all video-taping. Just look at all the bootlegs of bands 
    (audio and video). I do feel that if video-taping is occuring at an event
    that the promoter should inform folks at the door with a BIG sign 
    stating such.

 The bottom line is that you cannot prevent video-taping entirely. We 
might as well put out our own material in order to present a balanced 
perspective to the TV audience. Universes video-tape "The Global Dance 
Party" (1993) does a real good job. Besides, the public knows something 
about us already. 
 
 As a video-taper I try to show respect for the situation I'm in. Of course 
not all folks are this way. I do feel it is important that some sort of 
record is created for future generations. And of course, a video can never 
really capture what a rave really is. That is inside each of us Not to 
mention that most of my footage is going to be projected at future raves. 
 
 Censorship is for nazi's. If you want a private party, throw it! Do not 
expect sympathy if you throw a public event affecting large groups of 
people and someome wants to document the event. Saying no is just stupid 
thinking. Sorry if my strong opinion is offensive to some. It is mearly 
my $0.02


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
            ( your rights are our rights )       
                       /
                 -=*=-/
                   ~

Remember; legally a release needs to signed by any individual whose voice 
or likeness is used for profit (like a "news" broadcast).


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:21:33 1996
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From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Goa e-mail list (fwd)
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        "Troy Sheets" <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP-QM 3.0.3 b1 d5
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        Reply to:   RE>Goa e-mail list (fwd)

THANK YOU!   
THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!  THANK YOU!
BEAUTIFUL IDEA!
GOA LOVERS UNITE!
I have been looking-for/dreaming-of something like this for some time now.  I
have been a goa ever since I was introduced to it, but it seems hard to find
others that are into goa, and records for that matter - before the
introduction of F8, that is.  The only problem for me with F8 is that I live
in San Jose.  Anyhow, I will be posting my subscription post shortly...
Thank you again, and job well done...
Peace, love, and infinite positive energy...
-Jason
P.S. We should share all kinds of goa-related info (wait a minute, isn't this
pretty much the purpose of this list?  Sorry.  I guess the reason I say this
is that I have some cool web sites I will post on there for everybody to
cruise around on.... 
See ya!
--------------------------------------
To: Jason Green*
From: Troy Sheets
Forwarded message:
From owner-socal-raves@UCSD.EDU  Wed May 15 15:45:31 1996
From: Andy Kumeda <kumeda@intelenet.net>
Subject: Goa e-mail list
To: socal-raves@UCSD.EDU
Reply-To: andy@intelenet.net (Andy Kumeda)
Organization: InteleNet Communications, Inc.
X-URL:        http://www.intelenet.net
X-Phone:      714.583.3135
X-FAX:        714.851.1088
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hello all you Goa lovers,

I have created an e-mail list dedicated to the discussion of Goa trance,
and anything else related to the Goa scene in general -- ie track
reviews, event listings, your favorite ingredient for Chai, etc.

This will be unmoderated, but irrelevant subjects (ie drugs, other types
of music, employment announcements, spams, etc) will NOT BE TOLERATED --
keep that stuff on Usenet.  The list is intended to be very low in volume, 
yet high in content. 

For those that are interested, subscribe by sending e-mail to the
following:
	majordomo@party.net
In the subject of the message enter the following:
	subscribe goa
To post to the list, send e-mail to the following:
	goa@party.net

Hope to see some of you there!

Andy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:21:48 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: Rave/Media Essay (Super Long)
Message-Id: <96May17.144304pdt.4885@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
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Starchild <star@sfsu.edu> wrote:
>My computer tells me that on Fri, 10 May 1996, Kyung Rok shared (in part):
>> Though perhaps better sent on a Tuesday instead of a Friday afternoon,
>> this is about 1/4 of a cultural studies piece titled "Moral Panic, the
>> Media and British Rave Culture."  Written by Sarah Thornton...
>
>> The term "underground" is the expression by which clubbers refer to
>> things subcultural. More than fashionable or trendy, underground sounds
>> and styles are "authentic," and pitted against the mass-produced and
>> mass-consumed....
>
>Fortunately I don't think ravers delight much in "parental
>incomprehension."...

I think a valid distinction can be made between underground and
non-underground on the basis of the amount of effort (knowledge, cost,
inconvenience, time, etc.) required for an individual to engage oneself in
"the scene."  Of course, a clear line cannot be drawn across the
spectrum...as Chesterton, or whoever it was, had it, though no one may be
able to discern the exact point at which day becomes night, one can
tolerably distinguish the two nonetheless.

>> That's what I mean by underground."Undergrounds define themselves most
>> clearly by what they're not, that is "main stream."...
>
>What we are really doing when we dis mainstream culture,
>after all, is dissing humanity at large, saying most people are stupid,
>base, and lack[ing in] taste and culture.

They are.  Amazingly enough, it's possible to like them all the same.

>I think
>her observation is correct, and it's unfortunate, because while certainly
>it can have problematic *aspects*, to say that popularization *itself*
>is the problem is truly cynical and elitist.

Yes.

>> ...youth. whatever their
>> class enjoy a momentary reprieve from "necessity."'! In other words,
>> youth are exempt from adult commitments to the accumulation of economic
>> capital. They temporarily enjoy what Bourdieu argues is normally reserved
>> for the bourgeoisie; that is, a "taste of liberty or luxury. "
>
>	This is troubling to me, because it reminds me that so few
>people, as they grow older, manage to live outside these "adult
>commitments to the accumulation of economic capital."

The issues here are deeper than acknowledged by Thornton.  *By definition*,
youth is relieved from the responsibilities of adulthood.  In our
contemporary culture, this equates to a relief from the accumulation of
capital and a taste of liberty and luxury, because we live in a capitalist
society that makes accumulation of capital a primary responsibility and
which rewards success along those lines with luxury and liberty.  Youth,
freed of responsibility by the effort of adulthood, can reap adulthood's
rewards without effort.

>Just look at our
>cultural forebears, the hippies.  For the most part, the '60s generation
>has blended into the workforce without fulfilling the dreams of their
>youth of social change toward a world of peace, love, harmony, and fun.

Personally, though I have no factual experience on which to base these
judgements, I think that the popular view of "our cultural forebears" is a
mistaken one, that the prominence of these figures owes more to their
extremity than to their prevalence, and that their apparent lack of effect
on the course of history results simply because they are moving against the
tide, not because their tide has ebbed.  I don't know any sometime
"hippies" who have become their own antitheses by trading the ideals that
motivated them in the past for those they strove against.  I do know some,
however, whose extemity has faded as they have aged and the cultural
spotlight has shifted, who yet continue to work for their old ideals in
subtler, less strident ways: through their children, through their friends,
through their communities.

Of course, I live in Santa Cruz.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:21:55 1996
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From: Derek Chung <dhchung@hyperreal.com>
Subject: This Week's SFR Calendar!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (SF Raves)
Cc: sfraves-calendar@hyperreal.com (SFR Calendar)
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The big fun was at Madness last weekend with bumpy techno in a cool
indoor/outdoor space in the city - just the way I like it.  This weekend
features a bunch of out-of-town guests - Pierre, Miss Thing, Reese and
Keoki; Nikita probably also has a big guest DJ but I don't have the list
handy - call the number I guess.  I think there's also a party at 
111 Minna on Friday that I forgot the info for.

Thanks for everyone who sent in updates this week (and past weeks)!


                                THE SFR CALENDAR
                                       
    http://www.hyperreal.com/raves/sf/calendar/gencal.cgi
    
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Upcoming Parties in the San Francisco Bay Area

   Friday, May 17th - King St Garage
   Anita, Patrick, David Harness.
   10pm-, 21+, $4. King St Garage, 174 King St @ 3rd., SF. 415.522.6887
   
   Friday, May 17th - Ultra 5 presents _Smarties _
   Pierre (NYC), Eric Davenport, Barry Weaver, DJ Dan, Jeno, Kimo.
   9pm-7am, . 800.204.3986 415.437.5503 408.345.2399 916.484.4006
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Origin presents _Liquid Sky Music west coast tour_
   Teri Bristol (Miss Thing), Reese (NYC), Markie, Simon, Garth, Rob
   Doten.
   Virgin location, free water and organic food.
   415.675.5605 408.236.3398 415.541.5646 916.484.4213
   
   Saturday, May 18th - SqUAreOne presents _Fresh Start_
   Karizma, Rig-A-Tony, Lego, Pelican Boy, Dr. Jimmy Zimms, special
   guest.
   discount for May Babies w/i.d.
   $10. SF. 415.263.3987
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Spundae presents _Space Teddy_
   Keoki, DJ Dan, Mystr-E, Mars, Jon Santos, David Michael.
   415.764.2922
   
   Saturday, May 18th - _Outer Limits_
   Chach, Naz, Danny, SOL.
   18+, $5. central california. 209.488.5332
   
   Friday, May 24th - Space Children & In-Touch presents _Open Space_
   A1 (Texas), DJ Dan, Donald Glaude, Graeme, Cesar, Radley.
   415.267.3916 510.433.7216 408.327.9277 916.554.7177
   
   Friday, May 24th - Bee.Jones & OM records presents urban jam IV
   Jungle Biskit, Telefunken, Los Angelitos, New Dealers, Mo'Fessionals,
   Mark Farina, Felix the Dogge, Corey Black, Buck.
   advance tix thru family dog - 415.974.0634
   8pm-. Maritime Hall, 450 Harrison St, SF.
   
   Friday, May 24th - _Sm:)e_
   Stevie (Dimensional), Vibes (Dimensional), Xpress (Davis), Spin Clair
   (Colorado), more TBA.
   Free Smarties and other goodies.
   7pm- $10. Stockton. 209.547.3285
   
   Saturday, May 25th - Funky Tekno Tribe 
   Graeme, DJ Dan, Simon, Tony, Galen, Jon Williams, Chris Flores,
   Darkhorse, Jonah Sharp, Professor Smith.
   limited pre-sale tix $20 at Housewares & In Tha Mix.
   415.266.8215 415.266.9215 408.236.2205 916.484.3727
   
   Saturday, May 25th - _a higher state of freedom_
   andre lucero, taj, galen, sean murray, goura candra.
   Free. 415.303.5336
   
   Sunday, May 26th - _Spundae_
   John Aquaviva, Jon Williams, Simon, Henrik, Tony, Felix, David
   Michael, Kimball Collins, Mark Lewis, DJ Dan, Carlos, Miquel, Pete
   Avila, David Harness.
   Visuals by Dimension Se7en.
   9pm-8am, 21+. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.974.9389
   
   Wednesday, May 29th - Up n'Atom
   Laron, Chris, Gavin, Felix the Dogge, Soulstice (live).
   111 Minna St, SF. 415.789.8044
   
   Friday, May 31st - _Needles_
   Barry Weaver, Donald Glaude, Chris Flores, Karizma, Dutch, Matthew,
   Miah, Stevie, Vibes, Flash, Dennis, Rockit, Filip, Scot, Carlos
   Campos.
   runs all weekend (thru 6/2)
   415.313.7107 916.440.2707
   
   Friday, May 31st - Out-A-Sight
   Graeme, Jeno, Simon, Sotero (SD).
   Visuals by Hyperdelic, Donovan.
   SF. 415.437.4462
   
   Friday, May 31st - Beyond Space-Time/Kundalini presents 100% Spiritual
   Rays of Love
   DJ Shakra, Michael Manahan, Dervish, DJ Daeman, Ernie Munson, Phil
   Salter, Jon Williams.
   415.337.4928 510.895.3550
   
   Saturday, June 1st - _Tribal Future Big Mountain Boogie_
   Tony, Carlos, Josh, John Howard, Tracy, Galen, Solar, Alex Windsor,
   Alika, Abstract, Pollywog, Dan Barnes, Allen, Andrew, Nathan, DJ
   Crack.
   runs from noon Saturday until midnight or later Sunday.
   tix at Ameba and Primal.
   $20. Willits. 415.750.9368
   
   Saturday, June 8th - choice... presents Basics 
   Tony, Josh, Garth, Doc Martin, Doran, Brownie, Astral Matrix (live).
   E.S.W.H/H.O.B.M./C.C.C./H.B.T.U.K.
   415.905.9629
   
   Wednesday, August 28th - Burning Man 1996
   includes Wicked Sound System.
   save $10 by registering by June 1st.
   runs entire weekend, through September 2nd.
   All ages, $35. Black Rock Desert, Nevada. 415.985.7471
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
W E E K L I E S

   House/techno/acid jazz/ambient/etc reg'lar happenins Some of them may
   have ended - let me know when that happens...
   
  Thursday
  
   Lift - House, Funk w/DJs David Harness, Ruben Mancias, Jay-J, Black,
   guests. 12mid-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma, SF. 415.267.5984
   
   Velvet Shop - House, Techno. call for location
   21+, $5. 4th St Bowl, , SJ. 408.235.1556
   
   _Azul_ - House, Soul w/DJs Alfie, James. 21+, Free. Casanova, 527
   Valencia, SF.
   
   Full House - Acid Jazz, House w/DJs Finn, Matt Bernsen, Andrew
   Rawnsley, Bruno Ybarra, guests, live musicians. 10pm-2am, 21+, $3.
   Miss Pearl's Jam House, Eddy & Larkin, SF.
   
   Pack-a-Bowl - "We'll be droppin the wax while you're droppin the
   balls" w/DJs Mars, Tracy, guests. 8:30pm-2am, $6. Park Bowl, Haight @
   Stanyan, SF. 415.541.5019
   
   .blitz - foxyboysfancygirlsfreshmademixes begins April 4th
   21+. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   _Le Jazz Hot!_ - future sounds for jazz heads w/DJs Andrew Jervis,
   guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, $3. Nickies BBQ, 460 Haight, SF. 415.621.6508
   
   _Real_ - house, techno. every first Thursday of the month
   9pm-2am, 18+, $7. Pantages Theater, 1225 K St Mall, Sacramento.
   916.565.9588
   
   _Revolutionary Wax_ - coax your evolutionary ass w/DJs Consuelo Kevin,
   John John (Open Mind), James (Tweekin). 21+, Free. Dalva, 3121 16th
   St, SF. 415.252.7740
   
   _Green_ - house, techno w/DJs guests weekly. 10pm-2am, 18+. the top of
   the Wharf Cafe, the end of the Santa Cruz Wharf, Santa Cruz.
   
  Friday
  
   _ Sound Factory _- House w/DJs Pete Avila, David Harness, guets.
   9:30pm-7am, 21+, $10. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF.
   415.543.1300
   
   _Soul'd Out_ - House w/DJs Julius Papp, Rick Preston, guests. free
   before 10:30
   9pm-, 21+, $5. The Usual, 400 S.1st St., San Jose.
   
   _Nocturnal Transmission_ - House w/DJs David Harness, Tim Martinez,
   Saint John, guests. $5 before midnight.
   11pm-5am, 21+, $10. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Go Fast_ - Techno. Energy Music...for Women by Women (boys can come
   too).
   10pm-. 8th & Minna, SF.
   
   _Liquid Fridays_ - House w/DJs various DJs. 10pm-2am, 18+, Free. 2721
   Broadway, Sacramento., Sacramento. 916.484.4285
   
   the green door - "where circles meet squares" w/DJs andrew, thomas,
   caspar, paul, felix the dog, guests. 10pm-3am, 21+, $7. 880 Stevenson
   @ 10th, SF.
   
   _Nikita_ - house, techno w/DJs Jeno, Simon, Henrik. 10pm-7am, 21+,
   $10. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.267.0568
   [5.31 - Juan Atkins]
   [6.7 - DJ Duke]
   [6.14 - Westbam, Hardsequencer]
   [6.21 - CJ Mackintosh]
   [6.28 - Derrick May]
   
   _The Scene_ - 21+. the EndUp, 401 6th @ Harrison, SF. 415.393.9067
   
   _Beats_ - house, breakbeat, trance w/DJs Carlos Campos, Karizma,
   weekly guests. 7042 Folsom Blvd between Howe and 65th, Sacramento.
   415.273.1345 916.558.0850
   
   _This Side Up_ - house, techno w/DJs guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight,
   SF.
   
  Saturday
  
   _Other Whirled_ - House, Techno w/DJs Warren, Nobel, Jason Cassady,
   Nikki Rivera, guests. saturday morning
   6am-, 21+. 201 9th @ Howard, SF.
   
   _Sound Factory _- big club sounds
   9:30pm-4am, 21+. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF. 415.543.1300
   
   _Release _- Acid Jazz, Funk, Reggae, House w/DJs Jerry Ross, Josh, Mr.
   Sulu, Randy Wong. 21+. 1015 Folsom, , SF. 415.337.7457
   
   55 - House, Euro w/DJs Jorge Martinez, Tim Martinez, guests. 21+. 55
   Natoma St., SF. 415.267.1858
   
   _Vanilla Fudge _- House w/DJs Corey Black, Sunshine, Moonbeam, Jason,
   Big Lee, Darren. occasional saturday nights.
   10pm-2am, Free. Cafe Bastille, 55 Belden Alley, SF. 415.764.2903
   
   Vertigo - Psycho, Techno, Disco, Funk w/DJs Nikki Rivera, Ellen
   Ferrato, Dave Peterson, Lewis. 10pm-, 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison,
   SF. 415.703.7172
   
   _Liquid Vinyl_ - House w/DJs Jay-J, Suiki, John Howard, guests.
   2am-6am, 21+, $8. DV8, 540 Howard, SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Nuff Respect _- Jungle w/DJs StarEyes, Thad. 5pm-9pm, Free. Your
   Mama's Cafe, 5239 College Ave @ Broadway, Oakland, Oakland.
   510.601.YOUR
   
   phunkatech - Jungle w/DJs UFO, Noel, guests. 21+, $2. The Top, 424
   Haight, SF. 415.995.4699
   
   _Metro Jazz _- Acid Jazz w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Mauricio Avilas, Tom
   Thump, Franky, guests. 10pm-, 21+, $7. 111 Minna St, SF.
   [5.18 - Kevin]
   [5.25 - Harry Who?]
   [6.1 - Markie]
   [6.8 - Two Year Anniversary]
   
  Sunday
  
   the Sci-fi Club - hypersentientpsychedelictribalacidcybertrance w/DJs
   Dutch, DRC, Mars, Theta Blip, Solar, guests. Free food and Funky vibes
   in The Juicy Milk Bar (Ameba DJ team + guests)
   18+. 683 Clementina @ 8th & Folsom, SF. 415.331.1500x888
   
   _Spundae _- House, Techno w/DJs Henrik, Carlos, Miquel, weekly guests.
   free b4 10:30p
   For Technotica, call 415.764.2922
   10pm-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.974.9389
   
   _Leopard Lounge_ - Acid Jazz, Funk & Live Bands. w/DJs Suiki, Jay-J,
   Anthony, Julius Papp, Mark Farina, guests. 2125 Lombard @ Fillmore,
   SF. 415.771.2583
   
   _Pleasuredome_ - House w/DJs Neil Lewis, David Harness, Phil B,
   guests. 21+. 177 Townsend, SF. 415.985.5256
   
   Quench - House, Ambient w/DJs Rick Preston, Ryan Tapia, guests.
   Ambient-Space explorations by DJ Leath and guests in the front room.
   21+. The Usual, 400 South First St., San Jose. 408.535.0330
   
   _Techsture_ - deep layers of sound w/DJs tomas, markus, guests.
   8pm-12mid, All ages, Free. cafe abir, 1300 Fulton @ Divisadero, SF.
   415.974.4358
   
   subbass - jungle, drum'n'bass, trip hop w/DJs noel, abstract, jawbone.
   10pm-2am, 21+, $3. 270 Brannan @ 2nd, SF. 415.905.8865
   
  Monday
  
    Mushroom Jazz - acid jazz, trip hop w/DJs Mark Farina, Miquel, Julius
   Papp, guests. 9pm-3am, 21+, $5. 330 Ritch St, SF. 415.905.8811
   
   _Noc Noc_ - techno/ambient/jungle w/DJs Mohsen. 21+, Free. 557 Haight
   St., SF.
   
   _Tongue n' Groove _- trip hop, jungle, acid jazz w/DJs tomas, seth,
   m.mark, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+, $5. Cat's Grill & Alley, 1190 Folsom @
   8th, SF. 415.431.3332
   
   _rotation_ - jazz, hiphop, soul, acid jazz, funk w/DJs racer x, yamu,
   stef, rasta cue-tip, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+. up & down club, 1151
   Folsom St, SF.
   
   _21st sensory _- abstractbeatz-hiphop-dub-drum n'bass-electro w/DJs
   Tomas, Abstract, guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight, SF. 415.974.4358
   
   _Movement_ - trance, breakbeat, jungle w/DJs Julio, Kimo. 10pm-2am,
   18+, $3. Bahia Cabana, 1600 Market @ Franklin, SF. 415.263.5797
   
  Tuesday
  
    Butterfly - Hip Hop, Acid Jazz, House, Funk w/DJs Charlotte, Dani,
   guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, $2. Casanova, 527 Valencia, SF.
   
   Breathe Deep - House w/DJs Jay-J, Ruben, Miquel, guests. 10pm-4am,
   21+, $5. 1015 Folsom., SF. 415.998.9515
   
   _Begin..._ - house, trip hop, trance w/DJs Darrel, Cisco, Radley,
   Ollie, Seanee, Xpress, Grey, Anna. 9pm-2am, All ages. The Inn of the
   Beginning, 8201 Old Redwood Highway, Cotati, Cotati. 707.524.4443
   
   _Kinetic_ - Phil Salter, guests. 21+, $5. 2325 clayton road, concord.
   510.946.5005
   
   _Shoam_ - Trip-Hop & Drum n Bass Your Mama's Cafe, 5239 College,
   Oakland.
   
   _Succotash!_ - tasty jazz - funk - beats - space w/DJs tom thump,
   rasta q-tip. 21+, Free. up & down club, 1151 folsom st., SF.
   
   _supper_ - funk, acid jazz w/DJs Caspar, guests. 21+, Free. Julie's
   Supper Club, 1123 Folsom @ 7th, SF. 415.861.0707
   
   _Light-n-Up Lounge_ - house w/DJs Preston, guests. 21+. 111 Minna St,
   SF.
   
   _L-Tryptophan_ - ambient, techno w/DJs guest DJs weekly. 21+, Free.
   1624 California @ Van Ness, SF.
   
   _Lost in Space_ - house, hip-hop w/DJs Pause, Dark Money, Winnie B,
   Eric Lacy. 21+, Free. Cafe Mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th, SF.
   
  Wednesday
  
   _ Come/Unity _- House, Techno, Ambient w/DJs Simon, Jeno, Garth. first
   Wednesday of the month.
   10pm-4am, 21+, $7. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.241.8815
   
   _Boost_ - old school uplifting house w/DJs Jamie J, Hector the
   ejector. 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison, SF. 415.703.7105
   
   _Roots_ - House, Trip Hop w/DJs Garth, Jeno, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+,
   $6. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.512.5713
   
   _cosmic lounge _- space jazz, galactic grooves, jungle w/DJs Caspar,
   Paul, Seth, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, Free. cafe mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th,
   SF.
   
   _Reunion_ - Danny, Naz Cafe, guests. 9pm-, 21+, Free. The Fulton Bar,
   1243 Fulton Mall, Fresno. 209.488.5332
   
   _Thirsty_ - tasty house tunes and even better company w/DJs Jellybear,
   Jay-J, top notch guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, Free. The Top, 424 Haight St,
   SF.
   
   _The Lounge_ - 9pm-3am, 21+. 1401 Arden Way, Sacramento.
   916.922.8041x4240
   
   _Bubbles_ - deep funky techno house music w/DJs Don Crisp (Crisp
   Records), guests. starts May 1.
   9pm-2am, 21+. Babylon, 2260 Van Ness @ Vallejo, SF. 415.567.1222
   
   _Wish_ - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
   18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663
   [5.22 - Grover]
   
   _Belief_ - house w/DJs Julius Papp, Harry Who?, Rick Preston. begins
   5.22.
   10pm-, 21+. Agenda basement, 1st & San Salvador, San Jose.
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Info Lines

     * Be-At Info Line - 415-626-4087. Usually has 5-10 listings, updated
       daily.
     * Clubline - 415.979.8686
     * Fatline - 415.207.3668
     * Frequency 8 Trance/Techno infoline - 415.541.5019
     * the Global Party Network Buzzline - 415.568.1338
     * The Groove Line - (415) 331.1500 ext.4788
     * Housewares Rave Line - 415.281.0125
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Radio/TV Shows

     * Sunday night 11pm-2am - "The Dreaming/Innermind Show" w/DJ Miracle
       & Mr. Monchichi. House, Jungle, Trip-Hop, Ambient, Dub,
       Break-Beats & guest DJs. KSCU 103.3 (Santa Clara)
     * Monday afternoon 12:30-3:00 pm - DJ Jerecho presents the best of
       the urban polyrhythmic experience jungle, acid jazz, techno,
       electro, breakbeat KDVS, 90.3 FM (Davis)
     * Wednesday night/Thursday morning 3am-6am - "Aural Fixation"
       experimental sounds of ambient and trip hop with a splash of hi
       nrg, from trance to jungle. KZSC 88.1 fm (Santa Cruz)
     * Thursdays 9:30pm-midnight - "Aurora Borealis" Beats and
       atmospherics w/DJ Seth. KALX 90.7 (Berkeley)
     * Fridays 9pm-midnight - Andrew from Groove Merchant spins on KUSF
       90.3 (SF)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - midnight-noon. House/techno mix
       with Johnny K, Ozone & guests - KCSS 91.9 Central Valley (Turlock)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - "Just Desserts" w/Mr.Goodwrench -
       10pm-2am Jungle, Detroit, Techno, Acid House, whacked-out Dub, and
       noise KFJC 89.7 - Los Altos Hills
     * Friday night - nocturnal transmissions - featuring house DJs from
       SF and around the world. mid-2am, 107.7 FM (SF)
     * Friday night - Your Mama's House w/Pete Avila - 3am-5am, 106.1
       KMEL.
     * Friday night - Moondance. Ambient; 3am-7:30am, KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday afternoon - "Bus Stop" - music and talk w/guest DJs from
       SF and beyond. 2pm-3pm. KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday night 11pm - Flux Television, Viacom Channel 53 -
       Ambient, acid jazz and house music videos & interviews. (415)
       281-3377. flux@flux.net
     * Saturday night 9pm-mid - "An Epiphany of Sound" hosted by J.C. and
       Monkeywrench KZSU 90.1 (Stanford)
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
   For a _search_ interface to the calendar, see the Late Train club
   section.
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Administrative Notes

   If anyone has info on any other events, send it to me! I can't
   possibly hope to get all the info every week.
   
   This info gets sent via email every Thursday. To subscribe or
   unsubscribe to the calendar mailing list, send e-mail to
   majordomo@hyperreal.com with either the line
   
   subscribe sfraves-calendar or
   unsubscribe sfraves-calendar
   
   There is also an sfraves discussion mailing list for issues related to
   clubs, parties, house and techno music, etc. To subscribe, send e-mail
   to majordomo@hyperreal.com with the line
   
   subscribe sfraves
   
   in the body of the message.
   
   
   
   
    Derek Chung - dhchung@hyperreal.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:22:49 1996
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The big fun was at Madness last weekend with bumpy techno in a cool
indoor/outdoor space in the city - just the way I like it.  This weekend
features a bunch of out-of-town guests - Pierre, Miss Thing, Reese and
Keoki; Nikita probably also has a big guest DJ but I don't have the list
handy - call the number I guess.  I think there's also a party at 
111 Minna on Friday that I forgot the info for.

Thanks for everyone who sent in updates this week (and past weeks)!


                                THE SFR CALENDAR
                                       
    http://www.hyperreal.com/raves/sf/calendar/gencal.cgi
    
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Upcoming Parties in the San Francisco Bay Area

   Friday, May 17th - King St Garage
   Anita, Patrick, David Harness.
   10pm-, 21+, $4. King St Garage, 174 King St @ 3rd., SF. 415.522.6887
   
   Friday, May 17th - Ultra 5 presents _Smarties _
   Pierre (NYC), Eric Davenport, Barry Weaver, DJ Dan, Jeno, Kimo.
   9pm-7am, . 800.204.3986 415.437.5503 408.345.2399 916.484.4006
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Origin presents _Liquid Sky Music west coast tour_
   Teri Bristol (Miss Thing), Reese (NYC), Markie, Simon, Garth, Rob
   Doten.
   Virgin location, free water and organic food.
   415.675.5605 408.236.3398 415.541.5646 916.484.4213
   
   Saturday, May 18th - SqUAreOne presents _Fresh Start_
   Karizma, Rig-A-Tony, Lego, Pelican Boy, Dr. Jimmy Zimms, special
   guest.
   discount for May Babies w/i.d.
   $10. SF. 415.263.3987
   
   Saturday, May 18th - Spundae presents _Space Teddy_
   Keoki, DJ Dan, Mystr-E, Mars, Jon Santos, David Michael.
   415.764.2922
   
   Saturday, May 18th - _Outer Limits_
   Chach, Naz, Danny, SOL.
   18+, $5. central california. 209.488.5332
   
   Friday, May 24th - Space Children & In-Touch presents _Open Space_
   A1 (Texas), DJ Dan, Donald Glaude, Graeme, Cesar, Radley.
   415.267.3916 510.433.7216 408.327.9277 916.554.7177
   
   Friday, May 24th - Bee.Jones & OM records presents urban jam IV
   Jungle Biskit, Telefunken, Los Angelitos, New Dealers, Mo'Fessionals,
   Mark Farina, Felix the Dogge, Corey Black, Buck.
   advance tix thru family dog - 415.974.0634
   8pm-. Maritime Hall, 450 Harrison St, SF.
   
   Friday, May 24th - _Sm:)e_
   Stevie (Dimensional), Vibes (Dimensional), Xpress (Davis), Spin Clair
   (Colorado), more TBA.
   Free Smarties and other goodies.
   7pm- $10. Stockton. 209.547.3285
   
   Saturday, May 25th - Funky Tekno Tribe 
   Graeme, DJ Dan, Simon, Tony, Galen, Jon Williams, Chris Flores,
   Darkhorse, Jonah Sharp, Professor Smith.
   limited pre-sale tix $20 at Housewares & In Tha Mix.
   415.266.8215 415.266.9215 408.236.2205 916.484.3727
   
   Saturday, May 25th - _a higher state of freedom_
   andre lucero, taj, galen, sean murray, goura candra.
   Free. 415.303.5336
   
   Sunday, May 26th - _Spundae_
   John Aquaviva, Jon Williams, Simon, Henrik, Tony, Felix, David
   Michael, Kimball Collins, Mark Lewis, DJ Dan, Carlos, Miquel, Pete
   Avila, David Harness.
   Visuals by Dimension Se7en.
   9pm-8am, 21+. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.974.9389
   
   Wednesday, May 29th - Up n'Atom
   Laron, Chris, Gavin, Felix the Dogge, Soulstice (live).
   111 Minna St, SF. 415.789.8044
   
   Friday, May 31st - _Needles_
   Barry Weaver, Donald Glaude, Chris Flores, Karizma, Dutch, Matthew,
   Miah, Stevie, Vibes, Flash, Dennis, Rockit, Filip, Scot, Carlos
   Campos.
   runs all weekend (thru 6/2)
   415.313.7107 916.440.2707
   
   Friday, May 31st - Out-A-Sight
   Graeme, Jeno, Simon, Sotero (SD).
   Visuals by Hyperdelic, Donovan.
   SF. 415.437.4462
   
   Friday, May 31st - Beyond Space-Time/Kundalini presents 100% Spiritual
   Rays of Love
   DJ Shakra, Michael Manahan, Dervish, DJ Daeman, Ernie Munson, Phil
   Salter, Jon Williams.
   415.337.4928 510.895.3550
   
   Saturday, June 1st - _Tribal Future Big Mountain Boogie_
   Tony, Carlos, Josh, John Howard, Tracy, Galen, Solar, Alex Windsor,
   Alika, Abstract, Pollywog, Dan Barnes, Allen, Andrew, Nathan, DJ
   Crack.
   runs from noon Saturday until midnight or later Sunday.
   tix at Ameba and Primal.
   $20. Willits. 415.750.9368
   
   Saturday, June 8th - choice... presents Basics 
   Tony, Josh, Garth, Doc Martin, Doran, Brownie, Astral Matrix (live).
   E.S.W.H/H.O.B.M./C.C.C./H.B.T.U.K.
   415.905.9629
   
   Wednesday, August 28th - Burning Man 1996
   includes Wicked Sound System.
   save $10 by registering by June 1st.
   runs entire weekend, through September 2nd.
   All ages, $35. Black Rock Desert, Nevada. 415.985.7471
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
W E E K L I E S

   House/techno/acid jazz/ambient/etc reg'lar happenins Some of them may
   have ended - let me know when that happens...
   
  Thursday
  
   Lift - House, Funk w/DJs David Harness, Ruben Mancias, Jay-J, Black,
   guests. 12mid-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma, SF. 415.267.5984
   
   Velvet Shop - House, Techno. call for location
   21+, $5. 4th St Bowl, , SJ. 408.235.1556
   
   _Azul_ - House, Soul w/DJs Alfie, James. 21+, Free. Casanova, 527
   Valencia, SF.
   
   Full House - Acid Jazz, House w/DJs Finn, Matt Bernsen, Andrew
   Rawnsley, Bruno Ybarra, guests, live musicians. 10pm-2am, 21+, $3.
   Miss Pearl's Jam House, Eddy & Larkin, SF.
   
   Pack-a-Bowl - "We'll be droppin the wax while you're droppin the
   balls" w/DJs Mars, Tracy, guests. 8:30pm-2am, $6. Park Bowl, Haight @
   Stanyan, SF. 415.541.5019
   
   .blitz - foxyboysfancygirlsfreshmademixes begins April 4th
   21+. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   _Le Jazz Hot!_ - future sounds for jazz heads w/DJs Andrew Jervis,
   guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, $3. Nickies BBQ, 460 Haight, SF. 415.621.6508
   
   _Real_ - house, techno. every first Thursday of the month
   9pm-2am, 18+, $7. Pantages Theater, 1225 K St Mall, Sacramento.
   916.565.9588
   
   _Revolutionary Wax_ - coax your evolutionary ass w/DJs Consuelo Kevin,
   John John (Open Mind), James (Tweekin). 21+, Free. Dalva, 3121 16th
   St, SF. 415.252.7740
   
   _Green_ - house, techno w/DJs guests weekly. 10pm-2am, 18+. the top of
   the Wharf Cafe, the end of the Santa Cruz Wharf, Santa Cruz.
   
  Friday
  
   _ Sound Factory _- House w/DJs Pete Avila, David Harness, guets.
   9:30pm-7am, 21+, $10. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF.
   415.543.1300
   
   _Soul'd Out_ - House w/DJs Julius Papp, Rick Preston, guests. free
   before 10:30
   9pm-, 21+, $5. The Usual, 400 S.1st St., San Jose.
   
   _Nocturnal Transmission_ - House w/DJs David Harness, Tim Martinez,
   Saint John, guests. $5 before midnight.
   11pm-5am, 21+, $10. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Go Fast_ - Techno. Energy Music...for Women by Women (boys can come
   too).
   10pm-. 8th & Minna, SF.
   
   _Liquid Fridays_ - House w/DJs various DJs. 10pm-2am, 18+, Free. 2721
   Broadway, Sacramento., Sacramento. 916.484.4285
   
   the green door - "where circles meet squares" w/DJs andrew, thomas,
   caspar, paul, felix the dog, guests. 10pm-3am, 21+, $7. 880 Stevenson
   @ 10th, SF.
   
   _Nikita_ - house, techno w/DJs Jeno, Simon, Henrik. 10pm-7am, 21+,
   $10. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.267.0568
   [5.31 - Juan Atkins]
   [6.7 - DJ Duke]
   [6.14 - Westbam, Hardsequencer]
   [6.21 - CJ Mackintosh]
   [6.28 - Derrick May]
   
   _The Scene_ - 21+. the EndUp, 401 6th @ Harrison, SF. 415.393.9067
   
   _Beats_ - house, breakbeat, trance w/DJs Carlos Campos, Karizma,
   weekly guests. 7042 Folsom Blvd between Howe and 65th, Sacramento.
   415.273.1345 916.558.0850
   
   _This Side Up_ - house, techno w/DJs guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight,
   SF.
   
  Saturday
  
   _Other Whirled_ - House, Techno w/DJs Warren, Nobel, Jason Cassady,
   Nikki Rivera, guests. saturday morning
   6am-, 21+. 201 9th @ Howard, SF.
   
   _Sound Factory _- big club sounds
   9:30pm-4am, 21+. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF. 415.543.1300
   
   _Release _- Acid Jazz, Funk, Reggae, House w/DJs Jerry Ross, Josh, Mr.
   Sulu, Randy Wong. 21+. 1015 Folsom, , SF. 415.337.7457
   
   55 - House, Euro w/DJs Jorge Martinez, Tim Martinez, guests. 21+. 55
   Natoma St., SF. 415.267.1858
   
   _Vanilla Fudge _- House w/DJs Corey Black, Sunshine, Moonbeam, Jason,
   Big Lee, Darren. occasional saturday nights.
   10pm-2am, Free. Cafe Bastille, 55 Belden Alley, SF. 415.764.2903
   
   Vertigo - Psycho, Techno, Disco, Funk w/DJs Nikki Rivera, Ellen
   Ferrato, Dave Peterson, Lewis. 10pm-, 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison,
   SF. 415.703.7172
   
   _Liquid Vinyl_ - House w/DJs Jay-J, Suiki, John Howard, guests.
   2am-6am, 21+, $8. DV8, 540 Howard, SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Nuff Respect _- Jungle w/DJs StarEyes, Thad. 5pm-9pm, Free. Your
   Mama's Cafe, 5239 College Ave @ Broadway, Oakland, Oakland.
   510.601.YOUR
   
   phunkatech - Jungle w/DJs UFO, Noel, guests. 21+, $2. The Top, 424
   Haight, SF. 415.995.4699
   
   _Metro Jazz _- Acid Jazz w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Mauricio Avilas, Tom
   Thump, Franky, guests. 10pm-, 21+, $7. 111 Minna St, SF.
   [5.18 - Kevin]
   [5.25 - Harry Who?]
   [6.1 - Markie]
   [6.8 - Two Year Anniversary]
   
  Sunday
  
   the Sci-fi Club - hypersentientpsychedelictribalacidcybertrance w/DJs
   Dutch, DRC, Mars, Theta Blip, Solar, guests. Free food and Funky vibes
   in The Juicy Milk Bar (Ameba DJ team + guests)
   18+. 683 Clementina @ 8th & Folsom, SF. 415.331.1500x888
   
   _Spundae _- House, Techno w/DJs Henrik, Carlos, Miquel, weekly guests.
   free b4 10:30p
   For Technotica, call 415.764.2922
   10pm-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.974.9389
   
   _Leopard Lounge_ - Acid Jazz, Funk & Live Bands. w/DJs Suiki, Jay-J,
   Anthony, Julius Papp, Mark Farina, guests. 2125 Lombard @ Fillmore,
   SF. 415.771.2583
   
   _Pleasuredome_ - House w/DJs Neil Lewis, David Harness, Phil B,
   guests. 21+. 177 Townsend, SF. 415.985.5256
   
   Quench - House, Ambient w/DJs Rick Preston, Ryan Tapia, guests.
   Ambient-Space explorations by DJ Leath and guests in the front room.
   21+. The Usual, 400 South First St., San Jose. 408.535.0330
   
   _Techsture_ - deep layers of sound w/DJs tomas, markus, guests.
   8pm-12mid, All ages, Free. cafe abir, 1300 Fulton @ Divisadero, SF.
   415.974.4358
   
   subbass - jungle, drum'n'bass, trip hop w/DJs noel, abstract, jawbone.
   10pm-2am, 21+, $3. 270 Brannan @ 2nd, SF. 415.905.8865
   
  Monday
  
    Mushroom Jazz - acid jazz, trip hop w/DJs Mark Farina, Miquel, Julius
   Papp, guests. 9pm-3am, 21+, $5. 330 Ritch St, SF. 415.905.8811
   
   _Noc Noc_ - techno/ambient/jungle w/DJs Mohsen. 21+, Free. 557 Haight
   St., SF.
   
   _Tongue n' Groove _- trip hop, jungle, acid jazz w/DJs tomas, seth,
   m.mark, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+, $5. Cat's Grill & Alley, 1190 Folsom @
   8th, SF. 415.431.3332
   
   _rotation_ - jazz, hiphop, soul, acid jazz, funk w/DJs racer x, yamu,
   stef, rasta cue-tip, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+. up & down club, 1151
   Folsom St, SF.
   
   _21st sensory _- abstractbeatz-hiphop-dub-drum n'bass-electro w/DJs
   Tomas, Abstract, guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight, SF. 415.974.4358
   
   _Movement_ - trance, breakbeat, jungle w/DJs Julio, Kimo. 10pm-2am,
   18+, $3. Bahia Cabana, 1600 Market @ Franklin, SF. 415.263.5797
   
  Tuesday
  
    Butterfly - Hip Hop, Acid Jazz, House, Funk w/DJs Charlotte, Dani,
   guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, $2. Casanova, 527 Valencia, SF.
   
   Breathe Deep - House w/DJs Jay-J, Ruben, Miquel, guests. 10pm-4am,
   21+, $5. 1015 Folsom., SF. 415.998.9515
   
   _Begin..._ - house, trip hop, trance w/DJs Darrel, Cisco, Radley,
   Ollie, Seanee, Xpress, Grey, Anna. 9pm-2am, All ages. The Inn of the
   Beginning, 8201 Old Redwood Highway, Cotati, Cotati. 707.524.4443
   
   _Kinetic_ - Phil Salter, guests. 21+, $5. 2325 clayton road, concord.
   510.946.5005
   
   _Shoam_ - Trip-Hop & Drum n Bass Your Mama's Cafe, 5239 College,
   Oakland.
   
   _Succotash!_ - tasty jazz - funk - beats - space w/DJs tom thump,
   rasta q-tip. 21+, Free. up & down club, 1151 folsom st., SF.
   
   _supper_ - funk, acid jazz w/DJs Caspar, guests. 21+, Free. Julie's
   Supper Club, 1123 Folsom @ 7th, SF. 415.861.0707
   
   _Light-n-Up Lounge_ - house w/DJs Preston, guests. 21+. 111 Minna St,
   SF.
   
   _L-Tryptophan_ - ambient, techno w/DJs guest DJs weekly. 21+, Free.
   1624 California @ Van Ness, SF.
   
   _Lost in Space_ - house, hip-hop w/DJs Pause, Dark Money, Winnie B,
   Eric Lacy. 21+, Free. Cafe Mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th, SF.
   
  Wednesday
  
   _ Come/Unity _- House, Techno, Ambient w/DJs Simon, Jeno, Garth. first
   Wednesday of the month.
   10pm-4am, 21+, $7. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.241.8815
   
   _Boost_ - old school uplifting house w/DJs Jamie J, Hector the
   ejector. 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison, SF. 415.703.7105
   
   _Roots_ - House, Trip Hop w/DJs Garth, Jeno, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+,
   $6. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.512.5713
   
   _cosmic lounge _- space jazz, galactic grooves, jungle w/DJs Caspar,
   Paul, Seth, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, Free. cafe mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th,
   SF.
   
   _Reunion_ - Danny, Naz Cafe, guests. 9pm-, 21+, Free. The Fulton Bar,
   1243 Fulton Mall, Fresno. 209.488.5332
   
   _Thirsty_ - tasty house tunes and even better company w/DJs Jellybear,
   Jay-J, top notch guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, Free. The Top, 424 Haight St,
   SF.
   
   _The Lounge_ - 9pm-3am, 21+. 1401 Arden Way, Sacramento.
   916.922.8041x4240
   
   _Bubbles_ - deep funky techno house music w/DJs Don Crisp (Crisp
   Records), guests. starts May 1.
   9pm-2am, 21+. Babylon, 2260 Van Ness @ Vallejo, SF. 415.567.1222
   
   _Wish_ - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
   18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663
   [5.22 - Grover]
   
   _Belief_ - house w/DJs Julius Papp, Harry Who?, Rick Preston. begins
   5.22.
   10pm-, 21+. Agenda basement, 1st & San Salvador, San Jose.
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Info Lines

     * Be-At Info Line - 415-626-4087. Usually has 5-10 listings, updated
       daily.
     * Clubline - 415.979.8686
     * Fatline - 415.207.3668
     * Frequency 8 Trance/Techno infoline - 415.541.5019
     * the Global Party Network Buzzline - 415.568.1338
     * The Groove Line - (415) 331.1500 ext.4788
     * Housewares Rave Line - 415.281.0125
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Radio/TV Shows

     * Sunday night 11pm-2am - "The Dreaming/Innermind Show" w/DJ Miracle
       & Mr. Monchichi. House, Jungle, Trip-Hop, Ambient, Dub,
       Break-Beats & guest DJs. KSCU 103.3 (Santa Clara)
     * Monday afternoon 12:30-3:00 pm - DJ Jerecho presents the best of
       the urban polyrhythmic experience jungle, acid jazz, techno,
       electro, breakbeat KDVS, 90.3 FM (Davis)
     * Wednesday night/Thursday morning 3am-6am - "Aural Fixation"
       experimental sounds of ambient and trip hop with a splash of hi
       nrg, from trance to jungle. KZSC 88.1 fm (Santa Cruz)
     * Thursdays 9:30pm-midnight - "Aurora Borealis" Beats and
       atmospherics w/DJ Seth. KALX 90.7 (Berkeley)
     * Fridays 9pm-midnight - Andrew from Groove Merchant spins on KUSF
       90.3 (SF)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - midnight-noon. House/techno mix
       with Johnny K, Ozone & guests - KCSS 91.9 Central Valley (Turlock)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - "Just Desserts" w/Mr.Goodwrench -
       10pm-2am Jungle, Detroit, Techno, Acid House, whacked-out Dub, and
       noise KFJC 89.7 - Los Altos Hills
     * Friday night - nocturnal transmissions - featuring house DJs from
       SF and around the world. mid-2am, 107.7 FM (SF)
     * Friday night - Your Mama's House w/Pete Avila - 3am-5am, 106.1
       KMEL.
     * Friday night - Moondance. Ambient; 3am-7:30am, KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday afternoon - "Bus Stop" - music and talk w/guest DJs from
       SF and beyond. 2pm-3pm. KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday night 11pm - Flux Television, Viacom Channel 53 -
       Ambient, acid jazz and house music videos & interviews. (415)
       281-3377. flux@flux.net
     * Saturday night 9pm-mid - "An Epiphany of Sound" hosted by J.C. and
       Monkeywrench KZSU 90.1 (Stanford)
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
   For a _search_ interface to the calendar, see the Late Train club
   section.
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Administrative Notes

   If anyone has info on any other events, send it to me! I can't
   possibly hope to get all the info every week.
   
   This info gets sent via email every Thursday. To subscribe or
   unsubscribe to the calendar mailing list, send e-mail to
   majordomo@hyperreal.com with either the line
   
   subscribe sfraves-calendar or
   unsubscribe sfraves-calendar
   
   There is also an sfraves discussion mailing list for issues related to
   clubs, parties, house and techno music, etc. To subscribe, send e-mail
   to majordomo@hyperreal.com with the line
   
   subscribe sfraves
   
   in the body of the message.
   
   
   
   
    Derek Chung - dhchung@hyperreal.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:24:47 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 15:23:03 -0700
Message-Id: <199605172223.PAA16717@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Smarties 1 year Anniversery
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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So, Anybody going to Smarties tonight?! It's their one year 
Anniversery... Dj Lineup:

Pierre
Eric Davenport
Barry Weaver
DJ Dan
Jeno
Kimo

Anybody going?    I am!!!!  Look for me, once again... Black and White 
Suess Hat with and Alien Necklace!! =)~


Adam
                        R.Lunatic

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:32:25 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Message from a party
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Everyone, I don't recall at which party I found this (Gathering?), but it
wanted to be shared:

(Neon pink sheet of paper, folded down: front says "Open with and open
mind, read with an open heart, understand and believe)
Inside reads:

To the wonder in your eyes and the amazement in your sigh take the gifts I
give and pass them down with love.  Receive into yourself all that you
deserve and be sure to deserve all that you receive.  Be selfish in nothing
you do for when you live only for yourself you lose yourself - your soul
and heart - and happiness will never find you rather an emptiness you just
can't seem to fulfill.  Lead yourself into the right mind state that is
true for you.  Believe in yourself and others will believe in you.  Be
confident in all that you do yet do not live in a state of conceit.  That
only turns others away from you and from believing in you.  Don't live on
expectations, instead build your hopes and dreams into reality and focus
your energy in the right direction.  Always remember what you learn so you
can find a way to teach others.  Be positive, think positive, feel positive
and positive things will happen.  Love and respect all who come in contact
with you and all that you come in contact with.  Never lose faith in fate
for everything happens for a reason and there is a reason for everything,
including you.  Find your place here and fulfill it.  Never be afraid and
always be ready to learn and evolve.  Open your hearts, open your minds -
together we _can_ make a change.  Always carry a smile and spread 'd vibe
in any way possible.
>From someone who sometimes forgets.
(TRIPS 'R' US Productions, copyright)

Enjoy, my friends!
Love,
Eric



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:35:47 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Message duplicates
Message-ID: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960517153403.16735A-100000@value.net>
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I left a voice message for the admin @ xerox to try to get them to stop 
sending all the duplicates....

 echo.....

    echo......
     
      echo.......


                                      Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:37:24 1996
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From: Andy Thomas <andy@hyperreal.com>
To: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Duplicate Messages
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960517170804.19424A-100000@dfw.dfw.net>
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Since Brian is away on business I've taken the liberty of removing the
address that seems to be causing the problem from the subscriber list. 
There might be some backlog in the dejavu queue but hopefully it will end
soon... 

Andy

On Fri, 17 May 1996, Aleph One wrote:

> Could the owner of godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com STOP sending old messages of 
> the maling list to sfraves!
> 
> Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
> http://underground.org/
> KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
> Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 15:44:28 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: mi planz: Fresh Start This Sat
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It turns out that "RE:" will be playing live at this one as well.

At 02:42 AM 5/15/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Erik: here's the scoop:
>Square one presents "Fresh Start" Sat May 18th
>These guys are great, they got the love & I expect to see ii show in their
>party.
>Virgin Location (I've heard it's pretty dern special)
>Only $10
>Line Up isn't anything phenomonal but I expect to hear some fresh sounds:
>D.J.'s lego, pelican boy, karizma,rig a tony, Dr. Jimmy Zimms, ambient by rig
>a tony
>Map Point info 415 263 3987
>Any other SFRers goin?? lemme know
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:00:09 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 15:50:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Adam Luong <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Smarties 1 year Anniversery
In-Reply-To: <199605172223.PAA16717@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com>
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> So, Anybody going to Smarties tonight?! It's their one year 
> Anniversery... Dj Lineup:

I'll be there!  I'm going to be wearing my new silver jacket 'cause it's 
all shiny and raved out :P


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:12:26 1996
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To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: SFR PICNIC HORROR STORY - HELP
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>I've debated whether to post this to the group ... but I just have to ....
>
>I brought my best girlfriend to the SFR picnic with me.  Sara, who had just
>returned from 3 months in India, was very mellow and transitioning back into
>this world...
>
>She met someone there to whom she gave her phone number to, and now she has
>subsequently been the victim on some of the most disgusting and horrifying
>obscene phone calls ... (which have been recorded fyi)
>
>Last night, she was able to determine, using call return, that it does appear
>this was the person she met at the picnic, and now some roommate or something
>has also called.  The phone company and police have been notified.

This is really saddening,

Is this what the great SFRAVES has sunk to?

Come On people, please have some (self)respect and let's try to police ourselves
(so that the other police don't have too)
Yhis is rule #1 of any type of underground/TAZ, whatever

So if anyone out there knows what's going on, please tell this person to
STOP RIGHT NOW.

Shit, there was a time where a woman felt perfectly safe giving her number
to anyone at an SFR event, what is going on here?


        Action! Not Words!


                                        G
 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:22:46 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 16:22:32 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Interesting SFR Picnic/Party thought
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I mentioned some of these things to Tim, maybe other want to share in the fun:

At 2:52 PM  -0700 5/17/96, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:

>I was liking that idea as well. I had a great time doing the Picnic. I'd be
>up for a monthly thing.

I was thinking that if it's just a couple people, each time, every month
might be too much.  BUT!  What about this idea:

We set a schedule up wherein we have a different couple people set-up the
party each month.  For example, Tim/Tony set-up (coordinate logistics, get
food, BBQ, generator, gas, secure site, ect) June, [Example only here]
Leslie/Jess/Renaud set-up July, SDream/Eric P. set-up August, etc.  That
way, each party will be slightly different, and the work load will be
spread out.

Cash might be a problem, but maybe we could have a tip jar, or something of
that nature.  I think the parties could be done pretty inexpensively.

>This is a good idea. I started doing that in the begining, but found few
>people that wanted or could show up for a meeting to organize it. I found
>myself doing most of it, which I didn't mind doing, and had a few people
>help out at the end. It was very scary not knowing for sure if people would
>actually do what they said they would. I think if we were to pull off a
>monthly BBQ, it would have to be well organized.

As I told Tim, I think people tend to be skeptical at first, but seeing how
the first one went so well, I feel people might be more willing to help
with the next.


>Plus, I think everyone would have a Great time and give us a chance to meet
>more people on a different level unlike an actual night time party. There is
>more time to just kick back in the sun and get to know people.

Exactly!  Variety is key!  :^)

Anyway, it's something to ponder about this weekend while you're all dancing...

Have fun!

Tone



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:32:38 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked.
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My apologies in advance to those of you that don't want to hear this. I
don't get this pissed very often, but I am now, and feel compelled to
publicly state the following:

Tom and Stacy: Fuck you and the horse you rode in on. You have, and show,
no respect for this scene, it's history, or the people and precious
resources that comprise it and are so essential to its continued, healthy
existence.

I sincerely hope you and your commercial, money grubbing, shit-ass parties
burn in eternal hell.

ethan

-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:35:19 1996
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Date: 17 May 96 19:32:49 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
Message-ID: <960517233248_71165.755_GHL52-4@CompuServe.COM>
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Black Adder said....

My father is a cop, and a pretty nice guy, and I get really sick of all 
the bashing of law enforcement that goes on here by a people that 
have no respect for anyone, although they claim to. If you want to say "This 
particular officer was a prick," fine. But sterotyping people and saying 
"All cops are pricks" is just as bad as sterotyping black people, or 
gays, or any other group of people. In other words it makes you little 
different than a racist or a bigot. 

                                       Black Adder
________________________________________

Once again, folks, a reminder that we are all interconnected, and if we want to
be given the benefit of the doubt, we should give it to others as well.  I'm
pretty thankful to a few cops that have helped me out in my life, just as I'm
pretty disappointed in a few that created havoc unnecessarily for me -- 

But remember ..... (this is what I try to do when I'm driving behind someone
who's reeeeaallly slow and refuses to politely get the heck out of my way) ....
we are all someone's father, mother, daughter, son, sister, brother .... so if
we try to treat that cop like they are our OWN father, or that bad driver like
they're our OWN sister or whatever, we'll probably be a little happier all
around!

Yikes, I need a weekend, don't you!  Much love and positive thoughts to everyone
whose thoughts, ideas and support have helped me make it through another week!

Leslie   : )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:37:33 1996
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Date: 17 May 96 19:34:49 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: YES another picnic!
Message-ID: <960517233449_71165.755_GHL52-6@CompuServe.COM>
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Tone and Melissa...

GREAT IDEA to get right on another picnic planning (please don't let this thing
with the mystery caller color our happy picnic times!)...

I will do whatever to help organize this .... or if you prefer, I will simply be
in charge of mass quantities of potato salad!

Leslie  : )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:43:24 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 16:43:21 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: forgot something... =)
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To any of you south bay folks who want to keep in touch this summer if I
don't get back on the list (I probably will), here's my phone # in San
Jose:

408.264.6604

thanks everyone, g'bye!

-m.


0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
|    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
|     for that whole body thirst situation      |
|                                               |
|             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
|     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
|                                               |
|  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
|          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
|                                               |
|              Michal Migurski                  |
|              (510) 664-1026                   |
0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:45:21 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605172345.QAA05625@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked.
To: ethan@bass-station.com (Ethan Miller)
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 16:45:16 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v03006c01adc258abf3c7@[207.76.139.151]> from "Ethan Miller" at May 17, 96 04:33:15 pm
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Wow!  maybe a rant like this should include a detailed description as to
what Origin did to solicit such an angry response.

-troy


> 
> My apologies in advance to those of you that don't want to hear this. I
> don't get this pissed very often, but I am now, and feel compelled to
> publicly state the following:
> 
> Tom and Stacy: Fuck you and the horse you rode in on. You have, and show,
> no respect for this scene, it's history, or the people and precious
> resources that comprise it and are so essential to its continued, healthy
> existence.
> 
> I sincerely hope you and your commercial, money grubbing, shit-ass parties
> burn in eternal hell.
> 
> ethan
> 
> -----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
> -------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
> -------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:53:43 1996
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To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>
cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc. 
In-reply-to: Your message of "17 May 1996 19:32:49 EDT."
             <960517233248_71165.755_GHL52-4@CompuServe.COM> 
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 16:53:18 -0700
From: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
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>Black Adder said....
>
>My father is a cop, and a pretty nice guy, and I get really sick of all 
>the bashing of law enforcement that goes on here by a people that 
>have no respect for anyone, although they claim to. If you want to say "This 
>particular officer was a prick," fine. But sterotyping people and saying 
>"All cops are pricks" is just as bad as sterotyping black people, or 
>gays, or any other group of people. In other words it makes you little 
>different than a racist or a bigot. 

Are you "trolling" Black Adder? If so, I would appreciate it if you would
not do that on this list.

Peace,
Jim

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 16:57:17 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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In all my life, my experiences with police have been negative (and not
always for what I did!), except for having officers sign off fix-it
tickets, but I don't let that color my judgment of all of law enforcement.
Some of them out there are protecting and serving US, not just
special-interest groups.  "Officer Bill is your friend."  :)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:01:09 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 16:58:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: BSP Free Live Ambient/IDM by "RE:"
In-Reply-To: <199605172042.NAA25341@franc.ucdavis.edu>
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When?

Cassandra

On Fri, 17 May 1996, Rick Riffle wrote:

> Once again, RE: will be playing live ambient/idm electronic listening music
> to make your ears happy at:
> 
> RAW Living Foods
> 1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln
> San Francisco
> 
> We will play from about 7:30 to 10:30 p.m.  It's FREE, and the food at RAW
> is incredible.  Hope to see some of you there.
> 
> Rick
> 
> ps:  We finally finished our demo tape, and will have a few copies on hand.
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:10:08 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: geoffw@cybertribe.com
Cc: 71165.755@compuserve.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Re: SFR PICNIC HORROR STORY - HELP
Date: 18 May 1996 00:55:12 GMT
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Organization: Computer Attic
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Hell I remember when it was safe to post our own ph# over the list....


Tsk,


"Dance with me."
-Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 599-5500
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:15:47 1996
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From: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199605180014.RAA13101@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: SFR PICNIC HORROR STORY - HELP
To: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 17:14:52 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605172310.QAA07421@precipice.v-site.net> from "Geoff White" at May 17, 96 04:10:38 pm
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Being something of a militant where this kind of bad behavior is 
involved...I suggest that your friend should make public the name of this 
creep, or the creep's room-mates.

Just a weird little story to share:

Several years ago there was an undergraduate female student who was 
working in an immunology lab at Berkeley.  There was another 
undergraduate student- a guy- who was working in the same lab who kept 
bugging this young woman.  He even threatened her a few times.  I think 
he wanted her to go out on a date or something.  

Anyway, she complained to the PI (principle investigator- the guy that 
ran the lab), but he did nothing.  The misery continued until, finally...

A group of graduate students and post-docs took the guy to the stairwell 
and threatened to throw him down the stairs if he did not (a) quit the 
lab and (b) stop harassing their friend.

I took this incident as a lesson that if such a situation ever happened 
to me or to one of my friends that the offending person would get the 
same treatment.  I believe this is called vigilantism and is very 
illegal.  

Such bad behavior is not limited to just men, however.  Once a female 
aquaintance of mine kept harassing one of my housemates, a guy, who could 
NOT get her to leave him alone.  I took her to one side one day and told 
her that I thought she had a problem and that if she came by our 
house anymore there would be hell to pay.  She was pretty pissed, but 
she quit coming around for a few months, until she got involved with a 
wonderful guy and that was the end of her obsession.

It sucks that your friend Sara had to put up with this crap.  The guy 
that was doing it obviously has some kind of a problem and I hope your 
friend hasn't been blaming herself for what happened.  I've had many 
friends who experienced similar things and ended up feeling like dirt 
because of it.  

-Ann



> 
> >I've debated whether to post this to the group ... but I just have to ....
> >
> >I brought my best girlfriend to the SFR picnic with me.  Sara, who had just
> >returned from 3 months in India, was very mellow and transitioning back into
> >this world...
> >
> >She met someone there to whom she gave her phone number to, and now she has
> >subsequently been the victim on some of the most disgusting and horrifying
> >obscene phone calls ... (which have been recorded fyi)
> >
> >Last night, she was able to determine, using call return, that it does appear
> >this was the person she met at the picnic, and now some roommate or something
> >has also called.  The phone company and police have been notified.
> 
> This is really saddening,
> 
> Is this what the great SFRAVES has sunk to?
> 
> Come On people, please have some (self)respect and let's try to police ourselves
> (so that the other police don't have too)
> Yhis is rule #1 of any type of underground/TAZ, whatever
> 
> So if anyone out there knows what's going on, please tell this person to
> STOP RIGHT NOW.
> 
> Shit, there was a time where a woman felt perfectly safe giving her number
> to anyone at an SFR event, what is going on here?
> 
> 
>         Action! Not Words!
> 
> 
>                                         G
>  
> 
> 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:16:54 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 17:16:29 -0800
To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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At 7:32 PM  -0400 5/17/96, Leslie Ayres wrote:

>But remember ..... (this is what I try to do when I'm driving behind someone
>who's reeeeaallly slow and refuses to politely get the heck out of my way)
>....
>we are all someone's father, mother, daughter, son, sister, brother .... so if
>we try to treat that cop like they are our OWN father, or that bad driver like
>they're our OWN sister or whatever, we'll probably be a little happier all
>around!

But maybe that's part of the problem.  People in positions of power, have
the opportunity to weild it as they wish, and it's that inconsistency you
see with cops that bothers people.  If cops treated everyone like a
relative, no one would be in jail.  Knowwhatimean?  (With the exception of
when Marge gave Homer a citation for taking her police hat.  :^)

Power is an interesting drug, and I think what a lot of people resent about
cops is their ostentatious display of power.  Then, on the flip-side,
respect, especially immediate, unquestioned respect, is necessary to
control people, and thus cops need to "cop" an attitude in order to garner
that immediate respect.  Some do it well, some do it like utter assholes.
Unfortunately, it seems as if most fall into the later group, but not *I'm
sure* Mr. Black Adder, senior.  ;^)

Interesting paradigm.  When people start treating someone with intense awe,
say a cop, politician, or DJ, that person, trained or not, will be affected
by that fame/power, and will react to it. Again, some do it well, as if
it's natural to them, and some do it not so well.

Whatever...

TR



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:31:18 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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>Interesting paradigm.  When people start treating someone with intense awe,
>say a cop, politician, or DJ, that person, trained or not, will be affected
>by that fame/power, and will react to it. Again, some do it well, as if
>it's natural to them, and some do it not so well.
>
>Whatever...
>
>TR

Well, when people adore and worship me for my extraordinary bass-playing,
I'm usually quite humble and gracious about it...usually... ;)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:32:15 1996
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Message-Id: <319D1A6D.56AA@excite.com>
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 17:31:41 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (X11; I; SunOS 5.4 sun4m)
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To: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.stanford.edu>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: BSP Free Live Ambient/IDM by "RE:"
References: <Pine.SUN.3.93.960517165811.22565B-100000@elaine40.Stanford.EDU>
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Cassandra Ann Thomas wrote:
> 
> When?
> 
> Cassandra
> 
> On Fri, 17 May 1996, Rick Riffle wrote:
> 
> > Once again, RE: will be playing live ambient/idm electronic listening music
> > to make your ears happy at:
> >
> > RAW Living Foods
> > 1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln
> > San Francisco
> >
> > We will play from about 7:30 to 10:30 p.m.  It's FREE, and the food at RAW
> > is incredible.  Hope to see some of you there.
> >
> > Rick
> >
> > ps:  We finally finished our demo tape, and will have a few copies on hand.
> >
> >
> >

Hi Cassandra!

They will be playing tonight 17 May Friday...try to make it there if you
can...the vibe is definitely magical!

Peace and Love,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:46:43 1996
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Message-Id: <199605180046.AAA26736@shgc.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: 111 Minna Party
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I think yesterday ameba posted some info about a party for 111 minna by By
The People-anyone know any details? they throw pretty good parties!
Thanks
Mark


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:51:12 1996
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From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: 111 Minna Party
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I think yesterday ameba posted some info about a party for 111 minna by By
The People-anyone know any details? they throw pretty good parties!
Thanks
Mark




***********************************************************

Mark's primitive page-http://shgc-www.stanford.edu/~piercy/
____________________________________________________ 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 17:56:07 1996
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The following mail messages are bouncing back  whoever manages the
SFRave list might want to take note..

Crunchman

>Date: Fri, 17 May 96 15:21:59 PST
>From: Administrator@ssi.sony.com (ccMail SMTPLINK)
>To: crunch@well.com
>Subject: ccMail SMTPLINK Undeliverable Message
>
>User jkolarik is not defined
>
> Original text follows
> ----------------------------------------------
>Received: from mail1.bc.in.sel.sony.com by ccgate.ssi.sony.com (SMTPLINK V2.11
>PreRelease 4)
>        ; Fri, 17 May 96 15:21:57 PST
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>To: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
>From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
>Subject: Re: Origins of Apple
>Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
>Message-Id: <96May17.144538pdt.4971@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
>Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:07:49 PDT
>Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
>Precedence: bulk
>
>>>Hey, you guys should ask Captain Crunch about Apple,
>>
>>John Draper, whaddya say to this???
>
>After I met Woz,  he wanted me to design the telephone interface board.
>So I designed a board with an ADC/DAC that controlled the audio,
>switch-hook,  and it could send and decode any kind of tones,
>as well as differentiate speech from tones,  but would not recognize
>speech.   Remember,  this was 1977 (July to be exact).   I have some
>of these stores on my WEB site.
>
>http://www.well.com/user/crunch
>  Play --> Stories --> Early days
>
>Back then Apple wasn't corperate...  Only Mike Scott (CEO at the time)
>and Mike Markula wore suits.   Boy,  have things changed.  This doesn't
>have much to so with raving,   but getting back to the subject,  it
>appears that Apple didn't pay the San Jose police enough money...  Thats
>strange that it got busted...  I bet it was funny,  watching people dance
>in suits.... But at the MacWorld Expo,   a few years ago,  they had
>a rave,  actually,  it was my 2nd rave (where I danced) and it was
>actually the "NextWorld Expo" for Next hackers.   The rave was the
>Stone rave,  and was at 1015 Folsom... It was really good,   I get there
>about 7 pm  (No rave music playing),  then about 9 pm or so,   the
>thumpin beats are gradually mixed in,   and a half hour later,  the
>dance floor was filled.  It was really good.
>
>My next rave after that was WICKED at the Sound Factory the following
>Saturday...  Then,  I was hooked...   But didn't do ANY drugs then,
>but dug it BIG TIME,  so I can contribute my raving very closly with
>computers in this sense.    About 3 weeks later....   Let Freedom Rave,
>3rd of July,  Livermore racetrack...  Candyflipped....  Went beserk,
>Remember the hill fire?
>
>Oh,  one more thing... Forbes ASAP has a piece on me....   June issue,
>check it out....Haven't read it yet though
>
>Crunchman
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 18:09:47 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 18:08:32 -0700 (PDT)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: HELP!!! I need to get to a RAVE!
In-Reply-To: <199605180046.AAA26736@shgc.Stanford.EDU>
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Well folks it's a sad story.  One many of you might of heard or even lived
through before.  Yes I am a Virgin Raver.  While I have been listening to
techno, ambiant (sp?), house, and everything in between, I have never yet
gotten to a rave.  Maybe it's because I am in the working world, or maybe
I just don't have the type of friends that want to get out to raves on a
regular basis, but one thing is for sure, I really want to go to one soon!

Here is the plea!  Is there anyone out there willing to take me under
their shoulder and open the door to the rave scean for a new comer?  I
have a car and can get to the city or I can drive people to the city from
Santa Cruz or other places along the way.  I would like  to go to a really
visual intense rave to dance and smile :-) I'm not against any mind
altering subastance unless I am driving!  I'm not gay and not Straight,
but somewhere inbetween.  23 years under my belt and a Molecular biologist
(actually I'm just a lab tech)  So yes I will laugh at anything biological
in humor.  Tall, lanky, glasses, goatee, long brown hair and ready to
dance into the morning.

So if there are any cool people out there that wouldn't mind letting me in
to their circle and taking me to an experience that could very well change
me for the rest of my life (hopfuly for the better), I would be overjoyed
to hear from you.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 18:20:10 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 18:15:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Matthew James Plunkett <plunkett@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
In-Reply-To: <v0300660cadc2d2f4eb7f@DialupEudora>
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Most people realize that it's only a small percentage of cops that
are bad.

The problem I have with cops in general is their "code of silence"
that keeps them from turning in unethical/illegal actions by their
own ilk.  IMO that destroys the credibility of the whole group.

-Matt

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 18:31:14 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 18:31:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Anyone else catch that Spaz thing on Public Access?
In-Reply-To: <v03006660adc14793f0d0@DialupEudora>
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Did anyone tape the show?  I would like to get a copy for personal use.

Cassandra

On
Thu, 16 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:

> Weird!
> 
> Cool visuals, but weird spoken word over live music/synths.  Live drummer.
> Trippy dancers.  Images of the band layed over and under funky art work,
> all swirling and melding and twirling.  Things like putting the drummers
> head inside the bass drum, looking like a really old Led Zepplin video or
> something.
> 
> Considering I was prepared to hear techno it ca.  The word "call" and a
> phone number would speratically appear.  I didn't.
> 
> Question is, "was this SPAZ the party./rave promoters?"
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 18:37:23 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 18:37:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
To: Melissa Woodrow <melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: I HATE DUPLICATE POSTS!
In-Reply-To: <199605171812.LAA11587@sugen1.sugen.sf.ca.us>
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On Fri, 17 May 1996, Melissa Woodrow wrote:
> anybody dealing with this? do we have to talk to the xerox people again?

Kinda ironic it's a machine at Xerox which is sending COPIES to the
mailing list, huh?  :)

Thanks to Andy for removing that email address...

	Brian



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 18:49:15 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 18:49:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
To: John Draper <crunch@well.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: ccMail SMTPLINK Undeliverable Message
In-Reply-To: <199605180055.RAA04923@mh1.well.com>
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Check, they've been removed.

Please send list-maintenance-related questions to me personally, not the
list.

	Brian

On Fri, 17 May 1996, John Draper wrote:
> The following mail messages are bouncing back  whoever manages the
> SFRave list might want to take note..
> 
> Crunchman
> 
> >Date: Fri, 17 May 96 15:21:59 PST
> >From: Administrator@ssi.sony.com (ccMail SMTPLINK)
> >To: crunch@well.com
> >Subject: ccMail SMTPLINK Undeliverable Message
> >
> >User jkolarik is not defined
> >
> > Original text follows
> > ----------------------------------------------
> >Received: from mail1.bc.in.sel.sony.com by ccgate.ssi.sony.com (SMTPLINK V2.11
> >PreRelease 4)
> >        ; Fri, 17 May 96 15:21:57 PST
> >Return-Path: <sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com>
> >Received: by mail1.bc.in.sel.sony.com id AA16902; Fri, 17 May 96 18:21:31 -0400
> >Received: by mail2.fw-sj.sony.com id PAA08542; Fri, 17 May 1996 15:21:30 -0700
> >(PDT)
> >Received: by taz.hyperreal.com (8.6.12/8.6.5) id PAA26635; Fri, 17 May 1996
> >15:21:18 -0700
> >Received: by taz.hyperreal.com (8.6.12/8.6.5) id OAA23019; Fri, 17 May 1996
> >14:52:55 -0700
> >Received: from alpha.xerox.com by taz.hyperreal.com (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP
> >id OAA22931; Fri, 17 May 1996 14:52:23 -0700
> >Received: from godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com ([13.242.128.10]) by alpha.xerox.com
> >with SMTP id <16818(4)>; Fri, 17 May 1996 14:45:58 PDT
> >Received: by godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com id <4971>; Fri, 17 May 1996 14:45:38 -0700
> >To: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
> >From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
> >Subject: Re: Origins of Apple
> >Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
> >Message-Id: <96May17.144538pdt.4971@godzilla.ADOC.xerox.com>
> >Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:07:49 PDT
> >Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
> >Precedence: bulk
> >
> >>>Hey, you guys should ask Captain Crunch about Apple,
> >>
> >>John Draper, whaddya say to this???
> >
> >After I met Woz,  he wanted me to design the telephone interface board.
> >So I designed a board with an ADC/DAC that controlled the audio,
> >switch-hook,  and it could send and decode any kind of tones,
> >as well as differentiate speech from tones,  but would not recognize
> >speech.   Remember,  this was 1977 (July to be exact).   I have some
> >of these stores on my WEB site.
> >
> >http://www.well.com/user/crunch
> >  Play --> Stories --> Early days
> >
> >Back then Apple wasn't corperate...  Only Mike Scott (CEO at the time)
> >and Mike Markula wore suits.   Boy,  have things changed.  This doesn't
> >have much to so with raving,   but getting back to the subject,  it
> >appears that Apple didn't pay the San Jose police enough money...  Thats
> >strange that it got busted...  I bet it was funny,  watching people dance
> >in suits.... But at the MacWorld Expo,   a few years ago,  they had
> >a rave,  actually,  it was my 2nd rave (where I danced) and it was
> >actually the "NextWorld Expo" for Next hackers.   The rave was the
> >Stone rave,  and was at 1015 Folsom... It was really good,   I get there
> >about 7 pm  (No rave music playing),  then about 9 pm or so,   the
> >thumpin beats are gradually mixed in,   and a half hour later,  the
> >dance floor was filled.  It was really good.
> >
> >My next rave after that was WICKED at the Sound Factory the following
> >Saturday...  Then,  I was hooked...   But didn't do ANY drugs then,
> >but dug it BIG TIME,  so I can contribute my raving very closly with
> >computers in this sense.    About 3 weeks later....   Let Freedom Rave,
> >3rd of July,  Livermore racetrack...  Candyflipped....  Went beserk,
> >Remember the hill fire?
> >
> >Oh,  one more thing... Forbes ASAP has a piece on me....   June issue,
> >check it out....Haven't read it yet though
> >
> >Crunchman
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 18:56:19 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 18:54:17 -0700
Message-Id: <199605180154.SAA03609@dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com>
From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked.
To: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

You wrote: 
>
>My apologies in advance to those of you that don't want to hear this. 
I
>don't get this pissed very often, but I am now, and feel compelled to
>publicly state the following:
>
>Tom and Stacy: Fuck you and the horse you rode in on. You have, and 
show,
>no respect for this scene, it's history, or the people and precious
>resources that comprise it and are so essential to its continued, 
healthy
>existence.
>
>I sincerely hope you and your commercial, money grubbing, shit-ass 
parties
>burn in eternal hell.
>
>ethan
>
Whoa...?





>-----------------------------( ethan miller 
)-----------------------------
>-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ 
)-------------------
>-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you 
)--------
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
---
>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 19:20:35 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 19:23:40 -0600
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From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Nomad Interactive
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I'm sure Ethan will clarify his post, which was obviously highly emotional.

There's been quite a bit of conjecture about NI, which I'm loathe to become
a part of, but I do find their tactics in obtaining a space for their party
tomorrow a bit questionable and disrespectful of other promoters as well as
the neighbors of the space they intend on using. Maybe they're just being
naive, maybe they're just being selfish. Personally, I don't particularly
care and I'm not going to let it bother me too much. Hopefull it won't
destroy the future potential of a promising location.

Joe






(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 19:22:53 1996
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From: Low UFO <lowufo@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Smarties 1 year Anniversery
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I'll be there.  I'll be the tall guy with blue jeans and a 
white shirt that says "DUH!" with a stupid face on it.
Come say "Hi" if you get a chance.

Ian                     
              /--^--\
LowUFO     <<< o o o >>>   
                /|\
               / * \


At 03:23 PM 5/17/96 -0700, you wrote:
>So, Anybody going to Smarties tonight?! It's their one year 
>Anniversery... Dj Lineup:
>
>Pierre
>Eric Davenport
>Barry Weaver
>DJ Dan
>Jeno
>Kimo
>
>Anybody going?    I am!!!!  Look for me, once again... Black and White 
>Suess Hat with and Alien Necklace!! =)~
>
>
>Adam
>                        R.Lunatic
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 19:37:48 1996
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References: <v03006c01adc258abf3c7@[207.76.139.151]> from "Ethan Miller"
 at May 17, 96 04:33:15 pm
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From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
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At 11:45 PM  -0000 5/17/96, Troy Sheets wrote:

>Wow!  maybe a rant like this should include a detailed description as to
>what Origin did to solicit such an angry response.

Well enough of you asked. Here's my beef:

Those of us that recently put on madness invested a lot of time, energy,
care and respect in developing a relationship with: the space owner, the
space itself, and it's surrounding environs, ie the community, neighbors,
police, etc.

It was and is our opinion that the space and environs could safely and
harmoniously handle 500 - 600 people *once a month* without damaging the
long term viability of the space.

We let these opinions, themselves the result of almost 3 years of
experience throwing parties here in the bay area, guide our behaviour and
planning in regard to our use of the space.

Indeed, my guiding philosophy on "How Not To Get Busted" is:

  --> make sure you are no one's problem

Even applying this philosophy last saturday, we still had two complaints
from the neighbors, which thankfully did not get the party busted.

It was thus our intention to: bring less sound next time, aim the sound
strategically, add sound damping material, and, most importantly, NOT DO
ANOTHER PARTY there for at least a month, once again the intent being to
preserve an amazing space for future, *responsible* use.

All of the above goes right in the trash tomorrow when when mr. and mrs.
fuckhead put 1000 people at $20 a head into the same space only one week
later.

The space can't take it, and the neighborhood can't and *won't* take it,
never mind that the cops seem to be conveniently in Nomad's pocket.

This kind of slash and burn attitude, this total disrepect for the hard won
and carefully laid groundwork that other people have put in place is
bullshit. End of story.

And that's just the beginning of what's really wrong with it. What's really
wrong with it is that it totally betrays the energy that really makes this
*whole thing* -- raving -- work. This scene means so much to so many people
and at the deepest, deepest, levels. And at the end of the day it's about
one thing: building repect, love, and trust between and for each other,
building real community for ourselves and for each other. It's about giving
of yourself to your community.

This has always been the magic of Freinds & Family: the opportunity to come
together, with your friends, with your family, in your community, to give
of yourself, to the group, to help create a safe, magic and sacred space
where we we can let go of our fear and our doubt, all be exactly who we are
with each other.

So I'm sick to my stomach, I'm mad, and I'm deeply saddened that this
*magic* is once again being cashed in for a quick buck and a cheap thrill,
at all of our expense, and in this case, especially mine.

yours always
ethan

-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 20:13:12 1996
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Oh yeah, I'm out of town and without email till tuesday. So if I don't
respond on this subject that's how come.

see ya
ethan

-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 20:13:31 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 20:12:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked.
In-Reply-To: <v03006c03adc26db8e68e@[207.76.139.151]>
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Wow, after reading your message Ethan, I understand the situation a lot 
better - thanks for the followup.  This type of tedious work is not put 
into too many parties, and if more people went along these lines, less 
parties would get busted and the rave scene would look much better in the 
public eye.  If promoters work together, stuff like this won't happen as 
much.

> So I'm sick to my stomach, I'm mad, and I'm deeply saddened that this
> *magic* is once again being cashed in for a quick buck and a cheap thrill,
> at all of our expense, and in this case, especially mine.

My heart goes out to you bud...   The only thing I can say is that if we 
all don't want this to happen again, we're going to have to let them know 
what they're doing wrong.  If they're not cool with that, then we REALLY 
have a problem...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 20:31:21 1996
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From: davidmin@crl.com (David Minuk)
To: aguevara@compattic.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFR PICNIC HORROR STORY - HELP
Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 03:24:50 GMT
Message-Id: <319d42b2.95178332@mail.crl.com>
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Whoa people, don't assume it was someone from this list.  The party
was flyered.

David

On 18 May 1996 00:55:12 GMT, you wrote:

>Hell I remember when it was safe to post our own ph# over the list....
>
>
>Tsk,
>
>
>"Dance with me."
>-Adam
>____________________________
>Transmitted from Computer Attic
>SuperCenter:  (415) 599-5500
>Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
>____________________________
>

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Minuk(davidmin@crl.com)
WWW:  My URL is http://www.crl.com/~davidmin/
This website is not yet rated.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 21:03:03 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: Smarties 1 year Anniversery
To: Low UFO <lowufo@ix.netcom.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Ian will be hangin with me!!!  =)~

Adam

You wrote: 
>
>I'll be there.  I'll be the tall guy with blue jeans and a 
>white shirt that says "DUH!" with a stupid face on it.
>Come say "Hi" if you get a chance.
>
>Ian                     
>              /--^--\
>LowUFO     <<< o o o >>>   
>                /|\
>               / * \
>
>
>At 03:23 PM 5/17/96 -0700, you wrote:
>>So, Anybody going to Smarties tonight?! It's their one year 
>>Anniversery... Dj Lineup:
>>
>>Pierre
>>Eric Davenport
>>Barry Weaver
>>DJ Dan
>>Jeno
>>Kimo
>>
>>Anybody going?    I am!!!!  Look for me, once again... Black and 
White 
>>Suess Hat with and Alien Necklace!! =)~
>>
>>
>>Adam
>>                        R.Lunatic
>>
>>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 21:39:59 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 21:39:46 -0700 (PDT)
To: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
cc: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc. 
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On Fri, 17 May 1996, James Ausman wrote:

> >Black Adder said....
> >
> >My father is a cop, and a pretty nice guy, and I get really sick of all 
> >the bashing of law enforcement that goes on here by a people that 
> >have no respect for anyone, although they claim to. If you want to say "This 
> >particular officer was a prick," fine. But sterotyping people and saying 
> >"All cops are pricks" is just as bad as sterotyping black people, or 
> >gays, or any other group of people. In other words it makes you little 
> >different than a racist or a bigot. 
> 
> Are you "trolling" Black Adder? If so, I would appreciate it if you would
> not do that on this list.
> 

No, I was not "trolling." I honestly meant what I said. I see no 
difference between sterotyping people based on their legitimate 
occupation, and sterotyping people based on race, religion, etc. The 
difference on S.F. Raves however is that it seems acceptable to call cops 
"pigs"(as has been done in the past) and to say that they are all pricks. 
I do not feel this is right, and displays an utter lack of respect for 
people as individuals.  

At any rate, the original poster and I have had a private discussion and 
the matter is cleared as far as I am concerned.

                                            Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 21:42:30 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 21:42:26 -0700 (PDT)
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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On Fri, 17 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> In all my life, my experiences with police have been negative (and not
> always for what I did!), except for having officers sign off fix-it
> tickets, but I don't let that color my judgment of all of law enforcement.
> Some of them out there are protecting and serving US, not just
> special-interest groups.  "Officer Bill is your friend."  :)  - E

Here's a couple of thougts to ponder:

What public servant do you call when something *GOOD* is happening?

Is there a 911 for positive occurances?

                                    Black Adder

 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 21:48:33 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 21:48:30 -0700 (PDT)
To: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
cc: Melissa Woodrow <melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: I HATE DUPLICATE POSTS!
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On Fri, 17 May 1996, Brian Behlendorf wrote:

> On Fri, 17 May 1996, Melissa Woodrow wrote:
> > anybody dealing with this? do we have to talk to the xerox people again?
> 
> Kinda ironic it's a machine at Xerox which is sending COPIES to the
> mailing list, huh?  :)

ROTFL!!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 21:52:35 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605180452.VAA14080@netcom14.netcom.com>
Subject: SFRave gardener is back ...
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 21:52:33 -0700 (PDT)
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Forwarded message:
> Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 18:49:11 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
> To: John Draper <crunch@well.com>
> cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
> Subject: Re: ccMail SMTPLINK Undeliverable Message
> Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
> 
>..... 
> Please send list-maintenance-related questions to me personally, not the
> list.
> 
> 	Brian
> 
 Hi Brian ! I for one wasn't sure when you were coming back - welcome home!
( Now get cracking on cleaning up sfraves !!!! )

 ->  :-)


 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com
 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 22:13:34 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 22:13:29 -0700 (PDT)
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
cc: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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On Fri, 17 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:

> At 7:32 PM  -0400 5/17/96, Leslie Ayres wrote:
> 
> >But remember ..... (this is what I try to do when I'm driving behind someone
> >who's reeeeaallly slow and refuses to politely get the heck out of my way)
> >....
> >we are all someone's father, mother, daughter, son, sister, brother .... so if
> >we try to treat that cop like they are our OWN father, or that bad driver like
> >they're our OWN sister or whatever, we'll probably be a little happier all
> >around!
> 
> But maybe that's part of the problem.  People in positions of power, have
> the opportunity to weild it as they wish, and it's that inconsistency you
> see with cops that bothers people.  If cops treated everyone like a
> relative, no one would be in jail.  Knowwhatimean?  (With the exception of
> when Marge gave Homer a citation for taking her police hat.  :^)
> 
> Power is an interesting drug, and I think what a lot of people resent about
> cops is their ostentatious display of power.  Then, on the flip-side,
> respect, especially immediate, unquestioned respect, is necessary to
> control people, and thus cops need to "cop" an attitude in order to garner
> that immediate respect.  Some do it well, some do it like utter assholes.
> Unfortunately, it seems as if most fall into the later group, but not *I'm
> sure* Mr. Black Adder, senior.  ;^)

As an aside I would like to relate a small personal experience:

A few years back I had the opportunity to work as a "role-player" in the 
final examination of a class of graduating law enforcement students (CHP 
and Dept. of Fish & Game officials.) Well, we got several cadets sent 
back to the academy that day. And the simple reason was that they could 
not take adequate control of a given situation(which resulted in their 
mock shooting.) It is essential that in any unknow situation that the 
officer gain control of the situation. 

There are some power-hungry, little people out there that are employed 
as law enforcement. It would be silly to deny that. My point is that you 
have to look at each person individually, and weigh them on their own 
merits. To do any less is to fall into the trap of sterotyping people. If 
you go into a situation expecting someone to be an utter prick, and treat 
them as such, you are more than likely going to get an utter prick.  


> Interesting paradigm.  When people start treating someone with intense awe,
> say a cop, politician, or DJ, that person, trained or not, will be affected
> by that fame/power, and will react to it. Again, some do it well, as if
> it's natural to them, and some do it not so well.

100% right on. 

                                         Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 22:26:01 1996
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From: Greg2write@aol.com
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 01:25:29 -0400
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Ethan
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Re: Ethans' Pitifull Tirade

I've been part of the "scene" Ethan recently discovered, since its' inception
in the gritty warehouses of Chicago's infamous southside and have quite
literally seen 'em come and seen 'em go. Ethan dear boy, I definately think
its time for you to go. Three years won't get you through college let alone
enable you to pretentiously assume to inherit the mantle of "high priest" of
raves that you attempt to project. Your comments reek of at least four of the
seven deadly sins. Sloth in allowing the "new kids on the block" to beat you
at your own game. Greed in your reluctance at sharing the "scene" with new
comers. Envy at their successes. Wraith in your obvious and thinly veiled
threat to put the proverbial kabosh on their party plans (and you have the
unmitigated gall to complain about "tactics). 
My allegiance is, and always has been to the music, and yet music and magic
don't pay bills do they. You insult all of our intelligence by pretending
that your events are anything more than commercial endeavors, and
simultaneously implying that only you and not your competitors can possibly
understand the "Art of Rave". Do us all a favor  grow up and move on, the
scene you lay claim to obviosly alreadly has. 
In closing I' d like to remind you of two things. first, spirituality is not
chemically synthesized and dispensed for profit, it comes from the heart,
unfortunately yours seems  noticeably absent. Secondly, profanity makes
ignorance audible, surely you own a thesaurus.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 17 23:01:13 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc. 
To: blkadder@value.net
cc: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>,
        Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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On Fri, 17 May 1996 blkadder@value.net wrote:

> > 
> > Are you "trolling" Black Adder? If so, I would appreciate it if you would
> > not do that on this list.
> > 
> 
> No, I was not "trolling." I honestly meant what I said. I see no 
> difference between sterotyping people based on their legitimate 
> occupation, and sterotyping people based on race, religion, etc. The 
> difference on S.F. Raves however is that it seems acceptable to call cops 
> "pigs"(as has been done in the past) and to say that they are all pricks. 
> I do not feel this is right, and displays an utter lack of respect for 
> people as individuals.  
> 
> At any rate, the original poster and I have had a private discussion and 
> the matter is cleared as far as I am concerned.
> 
>                                             Black Adder
> 

Hi!
 I'm in full support for BA on this issue (sorry to keep this going but 
this is an important issue). Police Officers do one of the most 
difficult jobs around. Helping to keep our communities and society safe 
from destructive chaos. It is a fucked job which many of us would never 
dare do ourselves. Due to the stresses of the job, many subcumb to less 
ethical influences. This does not mean they are inhuman! Officers are 
like any other group of people; some good, some bad, most pretty middle 
of the road. They have good days and bad days like most of us.

  My view is that Officers are like an AC power line; potentially useful 
and needed, potentially lethal if not approached with respect. The best 
thing to do when dealing with an Officer IS to respect them. If you lie 
to them (admittedly sometimes neccesary) and they know it it burns them 
as it is a sign of lack of respect. Most are mearly doing the best job 
they can to help keep us safe so we CAN party and have a good time.

 Granted some Police organizations have nazi-like people in charge which 
lends that department a particularly nauseating flavor. Given the power 
these people wield it is our responsibility to expose this corruption and 
eliminate it. However if we indiscrimanetly go around saying all cops are 
fucked than no one (except other non-discriminate thinkers) will listen 
to us. Remember PLUR; we need to share that vibe with EVERYONE or else we 
are no better than the goons we decry.


Ran @ Dionysus Dreams


                                  (all together now)
                                          /
                                    -=*=-/
                                      ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 00:10:55 1996
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To: Greg2write@aol.com
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: Ethan
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Re: Ethans' Pitifull Tirade
>
>I've been part of the "scene" Ethan recently discovered, since its' inception
>in the gritty warehouses of Chicago's infamous southside and have quite
>literally seen 'em come and seen 'em go. Ethan dear boy, I definately think
>its time for you to go. Three years won't get you through college let alone
>enable you to pretentiously assume to inherit the mantle of "high priest" of
>raves that you attempt to project. Your comments reek of at least four of the
>seven deadly sins. Sloth in allowing the "new kids on the block" to beat you
>at your own game. Greed in your reluctance at sharing the "scene" with new
>comers. Envy at their successes. Wraith in your obvious and thinly veiled
>threat to put the proverbial kabosh on their party plans (and you have the
>unmitigated gall to complain about "tactics). 
>My allegiance is, and always has been to the music, and yet music and magic
>don't pay bills do they. You insult all of our intelligence by pretending
>that your events are anything more than commercial endeavors, and
>simultaneously implying that only you and not your competitors can possibly
>understand the "Art of Rave". Do us all a favor  grow up and move on, the
>scene you lay claim to obviosly alreadly has. 
>In closing I' d like to remind you of two things. first, spirituality is not
>chemically synthesized and dispensed for profit, it comes from the heart,
>unfortunately yours seems  noticeably absent. Secondly, profanity makes
>ignorance audible, surely you own a thesaurus.


Dude,
        I don't know where you come from but you are truely WAY out of line
here.
Once again people getting on the list not knowing what the fuck they are talking
about.  Perhapse you need to move on, I have worked side by side with Ethan both
throwing parties and in strictly professional situations. They don't come any 
better than him, I can honestly say that I could trust Ethan with my life and
that is no idle comment from me.  For me THAT is what Raving is about, Ethan is
a good friend to me, this Scene, and to many other people here in the Bay
Area.  He has sacrificed a major part of his life to bring other people
happiness and
Joy.  As far as spirituality is concerned, maybe you need to go back to studying
the books you have on it because you obviously haven't got a clue when the real 
deal is staring you right in the face.


        (much) Later,

                        G


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 00:19:40 1996
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Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 00:19:29 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: John Carel <john@bass-station.com>
Subject: Re: Ethan
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Whoa, hold on there a second, buddy. I don't post very often, but your
comments about Ethan Miller have kind of gotten my hackles up. I've known
and worked with Ethan for over a year now, and the fact that you can say
the words "Ethan" and "commercial" in the same sentence shows that you
obviously don't know who he is or what he has done for this scene. I have
yet to see Ethan turn a profit at a party, excluding Madness, where he
pocketed a grand total of 80 dollars - for about 24 hours of straight work.
He is one of the only DJs that I have ever seen moving speakers and
sweeping up, with no regaurd to whose party it is.  He is one of the main
organizers behind Friends and Family, a party which has never charged more
than five dollars. And it's _not_ a five dollar party. I've been to many
$20 and $25 parties that had half the production of FnF. He also throws
Mad, a _three_ dollar party. Now, if you think that he's getting rich off
of that, then think again. I suggest you do more research next time before
posting about shit that you know nothing about.

-john



>Re: Ethans' Pitifull Tirade
>
>I've been part of the "scene" Ethan recently discovered, since its' inception
>in the gritty warehouses of Chicago's infamous southside and have quite
>literally seen 'em come and seen 'em go. Ethan dear boy, I definately think
>its time for you to go. Three years won't get you through college let alone
>enable you to pretentiously assume to inherit the mantle of "high priest" of
>raves that you attempt to project. Your comments reek of at least four of the
>seven deadly sins. Sloth in allowing the "new kids on the block" to beat you
>at your own game. Greed in your reluctance at sharing the "scene" with new
>comers. Envy at their successes. Wraith in your obvious and thinly veiled
>threat to put the proverbial kabosh on their party plans (and you have the
>unmitigated gall to complain about "tactics).
>My allegiance is, and always has been to the music, and yet music and magic
>don't pay bills do they. You insult all of our intelligence by pretending
>that your events are anything more than commercial endeavors, and
>simultaneously implying that only you and not your competitors can possibly
>understand the "Art of Rave". Do us all a favor  grow up and move on, the
>scene you lay claim to obviosly alreadly has.
>In closing I' d like to remind you of two things. first, spirituality is not
>chemically synthesized and dispensed for profit, it comes from the heart,
>unfortunately yours seems  noticeably absent. Secondly, profanity makes
>ignorance audible, surely you own a thesaurus.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 01:05:57 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 01:09:37 -0800
To: Greg2write@aol.com
From: tim@redshift.com (Tim Gotch)
Subject: Re: Ethan
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Man, have you ever been to a Friends and Family? Having been involved in
most of the Fnf events in the last year and a half on the planning and
production end, I can tell you that not one dime is being made off any of
the Fnf parties. Fnf consists of near 60 people (most of whom are on this
list) who plan and work their asses off for free, just for the music and
the vibe, and personally, I feel that your post is attacking myself, the
entire Fnf crew and everyone involved with MAD (another non-money making
venture), as well as Ethan. Maybe you should redefine your viewpoint of
just what this is about, namely, togetherness and music. Sfraves is a
community, a community that Ethan has contributed a great deal to. You
should get a little background before posting inflammatory rhetoric about
something you obviosly know so little about.
Enough for now,
Tim

>Re: Ethans' Pitifull Tirade
>
>I've been part of the "scene" Ethan recently discovered, since its' inception
>in the gritty warehouses of Chicago's infamous southside and have quite
>literally seen 'em come and seen 'em go. Ethan dear boy, I definately think
>its time for you to go. Three years won't get you through college let alone
>enable you to pretentiously assume to inherit the mantle of "high priest" of
>raves that you attempt to project. Your comments reek of at least four of the
>seven deadly sins. Sloth in allowing the "new kids on the block" to beat you
>at your own game. Greed in your reluctance at sharing the "scene" with new
>comers. Envy at their successes. Wraith in your obvious and thinly veiled
>threat to put the proverbial kabosh on their party plans (and you have the
>unmitigated gall to complain about "tactics).
>My allegiance is, and always has been to the music, and yet music and magic
>don't pay bills do they. You insult all of our intelligence by pretending
>that your events are anything more than commercial endeavors, and
>simultaneously implying that only you and not your competitors can possibly
>understand the "Art of Rave". Do us all a favor  grow up and move on, the
>scene you lay claim to obviosly alreadly has.
>In closing I' d like to remind you of two things. first, spirituality is not
>chemically synthesized and dispensed for profit, it comes from the heart,
>unfortunately yours seems  noticeably absent. Secondly, profanity makes
>ignorance audible, surely you own a thesaurus.

------------------------------------------------------------
                   Tim Gotch
                tim@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~tim
            Hyper Design Technologies
                hdt@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~hdt
             395 Del Monte Ctr. #128
                Monterey, CA 93940
      Nothing is true, everything is permitted
------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 03:45:33 1996
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From: Greg2write@aol.com
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To: geoffw@cybertribe.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Ethan
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Funny, I didn't see his face in any of the books I read, perhaps I was
distracted by their texts, which hopefully someday you'll learn to decipher.
A proper response to my observations should, at minimum, include some
rebuttal of its content, not the all to pathetically near pagan idolatry
you've offered up. 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 03:53:47 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: SDream <SDream@tgrigsby.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Apple rave bust -- ethical?
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Dear Friends & Family,

Okay, I'm kind of steamed at this ...

My computer tells me that on Fri, 17 May 1996, SDream shared:

> An experienced
> promoter will take care of the various requirements for having an event in 
> whatever city they decide to throw the party in.  

A few years ago when apartheid was still the law in South Africa, some 
rappers did a song called Sun City.  It was meant to protest the notion that 
it's okay to just follow the rules in whatever city you want to play, 
even if those rules are hurting people.  We'd do well to remember it.

> I was standing outside 
> listening to the police officer trying to explain to the promoter that 
> *nothing at all* would have happened if he hadn't had the donations bowl 
> sitting there.  

Spare us the officer's attempt at justifying himself.  If he'd been cool, 
he would've just advised the promoter to be more discrete and then gone away.

> The promoter came back whining about how the cop had the 
> badge so there was nothing he could do.  What the heck is that supposed to 
> mean?  It tells me the guy wearing the badge has a job to do, regardless of 
> whether or not he enjoys doing it. 

If he doesn't enjoy doing it, and honestly I don't see how anyone with 
compassion can, either he needs to think about doing it differently or 
turning in his badge and finding some honest employment.

> What turned it into a bust was a cop 
> that got tired of getting badgered for trying to go easy and decided to just 
> shut it all down.

The *cop* was getting badgered?  Who came trying to disrupt whose event?
Since when is it illegal to ask for money?  That's fucking freedom of 
speech, and the Apple guy was right to whine, if that's what you want to 
call the sad tale of a citizen who just had his Constitutional rights 
violated.

> Put it this way: I've partied in various venues with various themes and 
> music for a long time.  When people follow the rules and respect the 
> authorities, it's a good night.  When they don't, it's a bad night.  Simple.

I've also partied in various venues with various themes and music, and my 
take on this is rather different.  It is that underground, illegal 
parties, or parties where the promoters don't enforce age laws with 
respect to drinking, don't hassle people for doing illegal drugs at their 
parties, and don't collaborate with the cops in any way are often some of 
the very best events I've been to.  

"Follow the rules" -- which rules, precisely?  Smoke a joint, lose your 
license?  Getting an entertainment license before you can have a poetry 
reading in a cafe?  Not being able to talk about certain subjects on the 
Internet?  No jaywalking?  No skateboard riding in downtown S.F.? No one 
under 18 allowed to dance in S.F. after 2 a.m.? (that last one's no 
longer in effect because a lot of us stood up against it back in '93, but 
you can bet some cops would love to enforce it if it were the law.)

No offense SDream, but "Respect the authorities" is only valid in a 
situation where the authorities are acting in a manner such as deserves 
respect, otherwise it's like licking the boot that's pressing your head 
against the floor.  When they respect the Bill of Rights and stop 
violating our freedoms, I'll respect them plenty.  Until then, no.  I'll 
be nice and polite when it's expedient to do so, i.e. when they threaten 
to arbitrarily exercise their power at my expense, but that's it.  The 
farther away the cops are from our parties, the better.

> >One of the
> >cops was watching us dance and he he had a very self assured "thank god
> >I'm not one of you degenerates" look on his face.

Should I be laughing, or crying, or both?  These are the people we pay 
to be fair and objective in enforcing the law.
> 
> I was dancing right in front of that guy wearing my Dr. Seuss hat.  I'm sure 
> he was actually thinking, "Geez, where can *I* get a hat like that?"  Ok, 
> maybe not...
> 
> S

I do not like blue suits and ham*,  

					<<< Starchild >>>


*Not the ones that deserve the name pigs, anyway, the ones who like to 
bust parties just because they can or because they don't like ravers.  Some 
cops are cool and treat you with respect -- as long as you don't exercise 
certain of your rights in their presence.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 04:00:23 1996
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From: Greg2write@aol.com
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To: john@bass-station.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Ethan
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First let me apologize for not knowing that you were the delphi oracle of
knowledge and  thus enables you to so easily tell the rest of us we "don't
know shit about something" Well GOD thanks for illuminating the path of true
wisdom, personal sacrifice, and selflessness. Do you think it premature to
cast his name into the Nobel prize candidates pool. 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 04:31:16 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
cc: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc., NRR
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Dear Friends & Family,

	After firing off my message responding to SDream's comments on 
the cop at the Apple rave bust, I saw this post from Tony, which I 
felt contained some valuable insights:

My computer tells me that on Fri, 17 May 1996, Tony shared:

> Power is an interesting drug, and I think what a lot of people resent about
> cops is their ostentatious display of power.  Then, on the flip-side,
> respect, especially immediate, unquestioned respect, is necessary to
> control people, and thus cops need to "cop" an attitude in order to garner
> that immediate respect.  Some do it well, some do it like utter assholes.
> Unfortunately, it seems as if most fall into the later group, but not *I'm
> sure* Mr. Black Adder, senior.  ;^)

I grant that in some situations cops need to control people, and when 
they do, they need to command respect in order to get swift cooperation.  
However the only time I can think of where cops have a legitimate need to 
control people is where a crime is being committed and someone or 
something is in physical danger, i.e. a mugging, burglary, riot, etc.

The remainder of the time, they should act humble.  After all, they work 
for us.  The awesome power to arrest, detain, and search that they have 
needs to be counterbalanced by a very healthy respect for the citizen.  
Unless it would put themselves or others in physical jeopardy, cops 
should treat everyone they come into contact with, including those they 
arrest, like they would the mayor of the city.  Because that person is 
legally 100% innocent of wrongdoing until proven otherwise in a court of law.

> Interesting paradigm.  When people start treating someone with intense awe,
> say a cop, politician, or DJ, that person, trained or not, will be affected
> by that fame/power, and will react to it. Again, some do it well, as if
> it's natural to them, and some do it not so well.

Agreed, and this is one good reason to limit the power of cops.

Yours in liberty,
				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 04:39:20 1996
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Subject: Re: Ethan
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Firstly, for the record my gripe is not an indictment of Fnf in any way. I
have enjoyed some of your promotions in the past and then again some of them
have sucked. Don't expect me, or anyone else for that matter, to apologize
for criticizing the  vehement rantings of a cry baby. If the Fnf truly wants
its membership to mean something it had better do a better job of policing
its "loose cannons" instead of supporting their feeble egos rank and file
like the nazis at Nuremburg. Secondly, the "inflammatory rhetoric" of which
you speak was, and I think this is the most important distinction, an
objective response from an outsider whose been to a  Rave or two. A response
to verbage that was downright hostile and threatening at best, divisive at
worst, and consistent only in its sophmoric whining. Everyone likes a winner,
until they feel, whether real or imagined, that they are the one on the
losing end. Perhaps our subject took his own moniker to heart, mistakenly
confusing Paranoia with the natural progression and refinement of the skills
so many have watched Ethan and other members of Fnf exhibit beautifully,
unencumbered by the need to control it.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 04:49:02 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: blkadder@value.net
cc: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: 911 for positive occurrences
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My computer tells me that on Fri, 17 May 1996, Black Adder asked:

> Is there a 911 for positive occurances?

    Yes, it's called SFRaves. Haven't you read many party reviews lately? ;)

Much love,
				<<< Starchild >>>

P.S. - Consider yourselves hugged!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 07:23:27 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: sandoz@pluto
To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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Remember: any person who is a cop has decided that he is a). better then 
other people; b). can go around and and take away ALL of an individuals 
rights (and shoot them as well) for no other reason then because he feels 
like it and c). has nothing but contempt for their fellow man which is 
why they are cops in the first place.  This is not an opniniated 
statement it is a cold hard fact.  All cops are like this, white, black 
or asian; it's attitude we are interestested in here not the colour of 
their skin.  Black Adder, you say your dad is a nice guy but he can't be: 
he's a cop and because he is a cop he thinks he is better then other 
people and has the right to tell his peers what to do and how to think 
(or else!).  Now do you honestly think that these are traits of a nice 
person?


On 17 May 1996, Leslie Ayres wrote:

> Black Adder said....
> 
> My father is a cop, and a pretty nice guy, and I get really sick of all 
> the bashing of law enforcement that goes on here by a people that 
> have no respect for anyone, although they claim to. If you want to say "This 
> particular officer was a prick," fine. But sterotyping people and saying 
> "All cops are pricks" is just as bad as sterotyping black people, or 
> gays, or any other group of people. In other words it makes you little 
> different than a racist or a bigot. 
> 
>                                        Black Adder
> ________________________________________
> 
> Once again, folks, a reminder that we are all interconnected, and if we want to
> be given the benefit of the doubt, we should give it to others as well.  I'm
> pretty thankful to a few cops that have helped me out in my life, just as I'm
> pretty disappointed in a few that created havoc unnecessarily for me -- 
> 
> But remember ..... (this is what I try to do when I'm driving behind someone
> who's reeeeaallly slow and refuses to politely get the heck out of my way) ....
> we are all someone's father, mother, daughter, son, sister, brother .... so if
> we try to treat that cop like they are our OWN father, or that bad driver like
> they're our OWN sister or whatever, we'll probably be a little happier all
> around!
> 
> Yikes, I need a weekend, don't you!  Much love and positive thoughts to everyone
> whose thoughts, ideas and support have helped me make it through another week!
> 
> Leslie   : )
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 07:25:35 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
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Yeah, this picinic idea is a good one.  Let mew know when it is and I'll 
bake a cake for it.  What about having it Sutro Baths?  Let me know when 
it is too.

On 17 May 1996, Leslie Ayres wrote:

> Tone and Melissa...
> 
> GREAT IDEA to get right on another picnic planning (please don't let this thing
> with the mystery caller color our happy picnic times!)...
> 
> I will do whatever to help organize this .... or if you prefer, I will simply be
> in charge of mass quantities of potato salad!
> 
> Leslie  : )
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 07:37:16 1996
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You won't find anybody, and I mean anybody, with more integrety, 
positivness, total lack of the need to gain money, and cleverness on the 
Sf rave scene then Ethen.  Anybody who says otherwise has clearly never 
met him and is talking complete crap and should either put up or shut up.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 08:25:50 1996
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From: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
To: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
cc: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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 Only cop's a BAD cop..... to paraphrase....


 can you say TROLLING, TROLLING over the hill we go  ;-)

 
 Don't EVEN give this the dignity of a direct answer - it isn't worth it...

 Mike


 meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic 
 Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 09:36:58 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: what party tonight? (3)
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Hmmm...  my friends are throwing Fresh Start, and I'll know most of the 
people there, but DJ Dan and Keoki are at Space Teddy...  Any one else 
here going to Fresh Start?  Oh well, if one gets busted or winds up in a 
bad location I can change my mind...

(I've REALLY wanted to post replies to some of these pseudo-intellectual 
AOL users trying to use big words and failing miserably, but I've kept my 
mouth shut.  Everyone here that matters knows what's up :P  Take it to 
MAIL!)

John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 10:43:14 1996
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To: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked.
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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"Ahhhh...I love the smell of Napalm=81 in the morning." - Capt. Kilgore

>At 11:45 PM  -0000 5/17/96, Troy Sheets wrote:
>
>>Wow!  maybe a rant like this should include a detailed description as to
>>what Origin did to solicit such an angry response.
>
>Well enough of you asked. Here's my beef:
>
>Those of us that recently put on madness invested a lot of time, energy,
>care and respect in developing a relationship with: the space owner, the
>space itself, and it's surrounding environs, ie the community, neighbors,
>police, etc.
>
>It was and is our opinion that the space and environs could safely and
>harmoniously handle 500 - 600 people *once a month* without damaging the
>long term viability of the space.
>
>We let these opinions, themselves the result of almost 3 years of
>experience throwing parties here in the bay area, guide our behaviour and
>planning in regard to our use of the space.
>
>Indeed, my guiding philosophy on "How Not To Get Busted" is:
>
>  --> make sure you are no one's problem
>
>Even applying this philosophy last saturday, we still had two complaints
>from the neighbors, which thankfully did not get the party busted.
>
>It was thus our intention to: bring less sound next time, aim the sound
>strategically, add sound damping material, and, most importantly, NOT DO
>ANOTHER PARTY there for at least a month, once again the intent being to
>preserve an amazing space for future, *responsible* use.

In other words Ethan & crew had and have built something called respect, in
and around thier party.


>
>All of the above goes right in the trash tomorrow when when mr. and mrs.
>fuckhead put 1000 people at $20 a head into the same space only one week
>later.
>

In other words, someone else has a different idea of what makes a good
party.  Even the person who Ethan was working with (owner of the space
perhaps), had different ideas of success as well.

Just a thought.


>The space can't take it, and the neighborhood can't and *won't* take it,
>never mind that the cops seem to be conveniently in Nomad's pocket.

In other words, someone knows how to work the SF system of graft.  For
those with the time, money and resources, graft is the BEST and ONLY way to
ENSURE your party isn't busted in SF.  I hear it works well in other
cities, like NY, as well.  Is there any suprise about the "big" bust of a
NY party most recently (The Tunnel).  Now, does anyone here think that the
reaon THAT party got busted was due to crowds or drugs.  Nope, it was due
to cops not getting cut in on the action.  In big cities, you gotta pay to
play, or so it seems.


>
>This kind of slash and burn attitude, this total disrepect for the hard won
>and carefully laid groundwork that other people have put in place is
>bullshit. End of story.

Or is it.  I think what the real problem is you are dealing with one set of
ideals, and others are not playing by the same game plan.  Difficult to say
the least.  I have learned to lower my expectations of people in the SF
party scene.  I have found many friends, but find few loyalists.  People,
especially those who decide to make a living by raves/parties, will do
whatever it takes to survive and eat.  Sometimes people have in mind
McDonalds, others want a banquet.  Depending on what the person has in
mind, will determine the extent and type of capitalism.

There has , ALWAYS been a system of construction/destruction in the SF
scene.  One promoter is very careful, dots the i's and crosses the t's.
Others see a spot or an idea and run with it.  Mowing over any and all who
are in their path.  People get upset, then they move onto other venues,
ideas, ideals, etc.  The one thing I have found the most hardcore to have
adopted, is a willingness to move onto the next project, and quickly.

Ethan, despite your vitriol (understandable), I *know* you will get over
this, and move onto bigger and better places and spaces suitable to what
you're trying to do.  This is just a blip.  You've been around long enough
to expect these things to happen from time to time, I know.


>
>And that's just the beginning of what's really wrong with it. What's really
>wrong with it is that it totally betrays the energy that really makes this
>*whole thing* -- raving -- work. This scene means so much to so many people
>and at the deepest, deepest, levels. And at the end of the day it's about
>one thing: building repect, love, and trust between and for each other,
>building real community for ourselves and for each other. It's about giving
>of yourself to your community.

Really?  I respectfully disagree.  You have a set of ideals that someone
else doesn't have.  And when they end up violating your rules, you get
upset.  Oh, there's plenty of historical precendence, the Native American
Genocide by the Europeans being a brief example in time.  B.K.A. what
happens when two worlds collide.

=46or some people it is as you say it is, respect, love, and trust.  For
others, it is all about $$$'s, $$$'s, and MORE $$$'s.  IMO, we need both.
People who chose the, for lack of a better term "Ethan's Way" (ala Guy
Kawasaki :) ) keep the continuum going.  The "other" way ensures that
people get paid enough to do some free or lower cost things.  Not everyone
can work for Apple, and not everyone can survive throwing free parties or
doing low cost events.  It's all a give and take, yin-yang.  It is truly
unfortunate when someone is coming from a a place of generosity and another
from a place of greed.  In our system, on the whole, greed wins.
Unfortunate for many, but true.

Just keep the spirit, and "Keep, keep, keep, pressin' on!" (ala That Kid
Chris - Ernie Munsen works that song like no other!)

>
>This has always been the magic of Freinds & Family: the opportunity to come
>together, with your friends, with your family, in your community, to give
>of yourself, to the group, to help create a safe, magic and sacred space
>where we we can let go of our fear and our doubt, all be exactly who we are
>with each other.
>
>So I'm sick to my stomach, I'm mad, and I'm deeply saddened that this
>*magic* is once again being cashed in for a quick buck and a cheap thrill,
>at all of our expense, and in this case, especially mine.
>
>yours always
>ethan
>
>-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
>-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
>-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Often times, those of good intentions are crushed by the almighty $$$.  Sf
is about $$$, and these club owners are ALL about $$$.  Trust few, get
papers signed where possible, and throw your gig!

Stay positive, despite feelings to the contrary, and throw your next gig
like it will be your last!  I wish the best for all your efforts, and don't
let the greed of others get you down. Rise above it!

Peace out,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 10:43:29 1996
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To: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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>On Fri, 17 May 1996 blkadder@value.net wrote:
>
>> >
>> > Are you "trolling" Black Adder? If so, I would appreciate it if you would
>> > not do that on this list.
>> >
>>
>> No, I was not "trolling." I honestly meant what I said. I see no
>> difference between sterotyping people based on their legitimate
>> occupation, and sterotyping people based on race, religion, etc. The
>> difference on S.F. Raves however is that it seems acceptable to call cops
>> "pigs"(as has been done in the past) and to say that they are all pricks.
>> I do not feel this is right, and displays an utter lack of respect for
>> people as individuals.
>>
>> At any rate, the original poster and I have had a private discussion and
>> the matter is cleared as far as I am concerned.
>>
>>                                             Black Adder
>>
>
>Hi!
> I'm in full support for BA on this issue (sorry to keep this going but
>this is an important issue). Police Officers do one of the most
>difficult jobs around. Helping to keep our communities and society safe
>from destructive chaos. It is a fucked job which many of us would never
>dare do ourselves. Due to the stresses of the job, many subcumb to less
>ethical influences. This does not mean they are inhuman! Officers are
>like any other group of people; some good, some bad, most pretty middle
>of the road. They have good days and bad days like most of us.
>
>  My view is that Officers are like an AC power line; potentially useful
>and needed, potentially lethal if not approached with respect. The best
>thing to do when dealing with an Officer IS to respect them. If you lie
>to them (admittedly sometimes neccesary) and they know it it burns them
>as it is a sign of lack of respect. Most are mearly doing the best job
>they can to help keep us safe so we CAN party and have a good time.
>
> Granted some Police organizations have nazi-like people in charge which
>lends that department a particularly nauseating flavor. Given the power
>these people wield it is our responsibility to expose this corruption and
>eliminate it. However if we indiscrimanetly go around saying all cops are
>fucked than no one (except other non-discriminate thinkers) will listen
>to us. Remember PLUR; we need to share that vibe with EVERYONE or else we
>are no better than the goons we decry.
>
>
>Ran @ Dionysus Dreams
>
>
>                                  (all together now)
>                                          /
>                                    -=*=-/
>                                      ~


I can't believe it.  I actually AGREE with BOTH BA & RC Cone?  Do *I* need
an enema or what ;).

Peace out & propers,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 10:43:40 1996
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Oh well, here we go again.  Before this list sinks into the Internet's Hall
Of Flame, I just wanted to chime in, briefly.

The concept of greed is not just about money, it can be applied to many
things.  Is it greed to say "This is MY space?  You can't use it
unless...", is it greed to say, "This is my scene I built up.  You can't
join unless...", is it greed to say "Hey, I bought this records, it's the
bomb, but I can't let you see the label...".

I am not saying that anyone in particular said any of these things.  These
are just some of the things I have heard people say over the years in the
SF Dance Culture Scene, while at the same time aspousing some ethos of
respect, unity, love, and sometimes peace.  I have heard many a promoter
say, "I am all about the good time whne it all boils down to it.  That's
why I do this!"  while at the same time charging $$$'s for an unsafe
unpermitted totallybustablecuzyoudidn'tgreasethefive-oh space?

I see greed in many forms and fashions.  Often dressed to disguise.

And greed pops up in the strangest of places.

Anway, on with the battle.

"Mr. Phelps, this list will self-destruct any minute now.  Your mission,
should you decide to accept it, is to high tail it out of here.  There is
no hope, the natives are restless.  There has been a perceived character
assassination attempt on one of the tribesmen.  In other words Mr.
Phelps....GET THE FUCK OUTTA DODGE WHILE YOU STILL CAN!  This message will
self destruct in 10 seconds...good luck!"

Damn, it's gettin' hot in here.

Keep :),
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 11:58:25 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 11:58:39 -0700
Message-Id: <199605181858.LAA10580@dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Smarties Review
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Well, Smarties went off. The crowd was, ok. This crowd was not my type 
of crowd, but there was still some cool people. The Vibe was -ok-. The 
music was GREAT!!! The place was PACKED FULL!! There must have been 
twice as many people there compared to Harmony's Beautiful people. It 
was located at the Jerrold's Deli, once again. 

Good Moment:Dancing all night on the floor where the A/C was actually 
cranked up.

Bad moment:Roaming around feeling sick because it was TOOOOOO HOT!!! 
The only place to be where it was actually COOL was on the the dance 
floor right underneath that a/c.

Good moment:Meeting alot of people that noticed me because of my hat 
and necklace.

Very bad moment: When I finally left to go to back to my car, I found 
out that it was broken into. SHIT. Like I said, not my type of crowd so 
my car had no respect. Or something... Shit happens....

Other than that... It was OK. Yeah... I'm kinda depressed and 
pissed....

Adam
                        R.Lunatic

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 12:07:08 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 12:10:46 -0800
To: Greg2write@aol.com
From: tim@redshift.com (Tim Gotch)
Subject: Re: Ethan
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Firstly, do you have any idea how difficult it is to aquire a location that
can be used more than once? Ethan and the Madness crew put weeks of work
into setting up this particular space so that it could be used again and
again, not only by themselves, but by others who would (hopefully) respect
the space, the owner of the space, the neighborhood around it, and the
continued viability of the space for others to use. Nomad Interactive have
taken advantage of that work, the opening of the door for future use, and
will probably destroy it. The owner of the space in question has only had
experience with Madness, a group of people who respect first and don't try
to abuse a space just to make a buck. Unfortunatly, he is about to see a
wholly different slice of the pie that will probably result in this space
never being available again, to anyone.

         While I realize that $ is the name of the game for some, Nomad
bills itself as an underground party, where money is supposed to be a
secondary issue. I see nothing wrong with making money in this scene, as
long as it is not at the expense of other people. For a lot of us, money
isn't what raving is about, and that's why parties like Fnf happen, and,
frankly, Fnf would not exist in the form that it does without the presence
of Ethan Miller. If you need more evidence, check out the archives to get a
feel for who you are attacking.
Tim




>Firstly, for the record my gripe is not an indictment of Fnf in any way. I
>have enjoyed some of your promotions in the past and then again some of them
>have sucked. Don't expect me, or anyone else for that matter, to apologize
>for criticizing the  vehement rantings of a cry baby. If the Fnf truly wants
>its membership to mean something it had better do a better job of policing
>its "loose cannons" instead of supporting their feeble egos rank and file
>like the nazis at Nuremburg. Secondly, the "inflammatory rhetoric" of which
>you speak was, and I think this is the most important distinction, an
>objective response from an outsider whose been to a  Rave or two. A response
>to verbage that was downright hostile and threatening at best, divisive at
>worst, and consistent only in its sophmoric whining. Everyone likes a winner,
>until they feel, whether real or imagined, that they are the one on the
>losing end. Perhaps our subject took his own moniker to heart, mistakenly
>confusing Paranoia with the natural progression and refinement of the skills
>so many have watched Ethan and other members of Fnf exhibit beautifully,
>unencumbered by the need to control it.

------------------------------------------------------------
                   Tim Gotch
                tim@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~tim
            Hyper Design Technologies
                hdt@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~hdt
             395 Del Monte Ctr. #128
                Monterey, CA 93940
      Nothing is true, everything is permitted
------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 12:26:08 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 12:25:48 -0700 (PDT)
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
In-Reply-To: <v02130505adc354338480@DialupEudora>
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On Sat, 18 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:

> I can't believe it.  I actually AGREE with BOTH BA & RC Cone?  Do *I* need
> an enema or what ;).
> 
> Peace out & propers,
> John

Wow, what strange and wonderful days... ;-)

                                          Black Adder

                                   

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 12:31:40 1996
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 18 May 1996 12:31:32 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 12:31:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: drenalin <drenalin@OREGON.UOREGON.EDU>
Subject: Re: Ethan
In-reply-to: <960518073844_296908716@emout14.mail.aol.com>
To: Greg2write@aol.com
Cc: tim@redshift.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Sat, 18 May 1996 Greg2write@aol.com wrote:

> Firstly, for the record my gripe is not an indictment of Fnf in any way. I

No but I think some of us take it as a personal attack on a very good 
friend of ours.

> have enjoyed some of your promotions in the past and then again some of them
> have sucked. Don't expect me, or anyone else for that matter, to apologize
> for criticizing the  vehement rantings of a cry baby. If the Fnf truly wants

Have you ever heard the term "constructive criticism".  Try reading 
John's post for a good example of how to question but not condemn.

> its membership to mean something it had better do a better job of policing
> its "loose cannons" instead of supporting their feeble egos rank and file
> like the nazis at Nuremburg. Secondly, the "inflammatory rhetoric" of which

If you understood the concept of FnF, you'd understand FnF isnt about 
"policing" our collective energy...how is this different than what you 
wrongly accuse in the latter part of the sentence?  So we should censor 
Ethan and that would keep us from being like nazi's?  You need to take a 
look at you logic.

> you speak was, and I think this is the most important distinction, an
> objective response from an outsider whose been to a  Rave or two. A response
> to verbage that was downright hostile and threatening at best, divisive at
> worst, and consistent only in its sophmoric whining. Everyone likes a winner,

Objective?  Please point out the objectivity of any of the posts you have 
sent out in the last tow days?

> until they feel, whether real or imagined, that they are the one on the
> losing end. Perhaps our subject took his own moniker to heart, mistakenly
> confusing Paranoia with the natural progression and refinement of the skills
> so many have watched Ethan and other members of Fnf exhibit beautifully,
> unencumbered by the need to control it.

I don't know how long you've been on this list but I've been on for over 
two years now, and I've seen a lot of bullshit go thru my inbox.  You've 
got to understand that if you are going to post such condemning remarks 
about someone who is an integral part of this community, this energy, 
this vibe, this friendship that you are going to get flamed.  Ethan has 
touched a lot of people in a lot of places and is a dear and true friend 
to many.  

In regards to your first post...does it really matter if you were in 
Chicago when the scene there was young?  what does that have to do with 
SF scene?  not a whole lot directly, maybe lots indirectly...Ethan doesnt 
label himself "high priest" (just pope ;) and he doesnt just attempt to 
"project" these parties along with several others he *does* what he set 
out to do.  As for the sloth, grred, wraith, and envy part you need to do 
some more research. 
For your info Ethan is perfectly financially stable without throwing 
parties as are many of us who do now help to organize events.  Do you 
realize how much damage you can do to someone by attacking their 
principles?  Earlier this year I was accused on nw-raves of using a 
charity event to further "business" motives...it was low, very low and It 
cuts deeply to have such things labled on you.  You need to think about 
how you go about accusing people of things you have no idea about.

>spirituality is not
>chemically synthesized and dispensed for profit, it comes from the heart,
>unfortunately yours seems  noticeably absent

maybe you need to look for your head?  I think its somewhere we dont want 
to look for it. 

all due respect...live and learn

love drenalin

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 13:47:28 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 13:45:46 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Farewell, SFR Family
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Graduation.  Everyone keeps saying, "Congratulations!" but all I see is my
beloved life being ripped from me.  Thrust from the idyllic education
experience straight into some meaningless 9-to-5 that's going to suck the
life right out of me.  No more student life dedicated to the pursuit of
knowledge; no more wondrous group discussions in classes, exploring the
dynamics of politics, culture, society; no more learning from the minds of
brilliant professors; no more tight-knit community of coffeehouses and
co-ops.  Good-bye to drunken parties every week-end; gone for me, lazy
afternoons reading books in the sun; good-bye to so many friends I'll
probably never see again.  Good-bye to the life I adored.  I've been in the
"real" world before - for too many years.  I know what it is to see all my
energy drained in the constant struggle just to make ends meet.  I know
enough to cherish the opportunity to get an education at a  place like
Berkeley.

Of the many things I'm losing, my privileges as a student add another blow.
No more entrance to the sophisticated gym, no more access to the
unbelievable resources of the libraries, no more chance to see so many
performances, world-class lectures and symposiums, art and music.  But most
of all, dear SFR family, I am losing you.  Barred from the computer labs,
free e-mail cut off, I have no way to maintain this connection.  I don't
own a computer, nor will I in the foreseeable future.   E-mail right now is
a luxury that I can't afford.

So, against my will, I am tearfully bidding you farewell.  This list has
meant a lot to me in the short time I have been a part of it.  I have
learned so much from all of you.  It's an amazing thing to share
conversations with hundreds of people; it redefines community.  Thank you
for being such a vibrant, intelligent, aware, loving community.  I am sorry
to leave it.

I'll look forward to seeing you at parties - dancing, smiling, massaging!
I intend to dance my summer - and hopefully some of my sadness - away.  But
I will miss the level of conversation possible in this forum, the clarity
that can get muddled in the psychedelic whirl of a rave; the valuable input
of so many more than one chill room can hold.

I wish you all happiness, continued stimulating conversation, and to always
treat each other and each other's ideas with love and respect.

Much Love, Plur Always,
Nancy

P.S. I have access to the computers for the next week, until May 24.  I'd
love to hear from you!



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 13:56:48 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 13:56:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02130505adc354338480@DialupEudora>
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On Sat, 18 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:

> 
> I can't believe it.  I actually AGREE with BOTH BA & RC Cone?  Do *I* need
> an enema or what ;).
> 
> Peace out & propers,
> John


Don't worry John. I'm sure we can find SOMEthing to wrestle over ;) 
Besides, we all need an enema from time to time =)
Peace

Ran @ Dionysus Dreams

                             ( will miracles never cease ;) )
                                     /              
                               -=*=-/
                                 ~



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 14:04:59 1996
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From: Justin Cooper <datura@best.com>
Message-Id: <199605182104.OAA17280@shellx.best.com>
Subject: morning bay bridge traffic
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 14:04:43 -0700 (PDT)
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hey all,
 i live in berkeley and the last time i came home from sf in the wee hours,
i got stuck in the 5 lanes-to-1 lane traffic jam... so i was wondering if
anybody knows what's up with the current traffic situation, is there a 
good time ti cross the bridge in the morning?  a bad time?

be seeing you,
 justin

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 15:13:43 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 15:13:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kati Renee Fleming <thebear@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
X-Sender: thebear@gladstone
To: Greg2write@aol.com
cc: john@bass-station.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Ethan
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i don't think it would be premature at all. i cast my vote. 

On Sat, 18 May 1996 Greg2write@aol.com wrote:

> First let me apologize for not knowing that you were the delphi oracle of
> knowledge and  thus enables you to so easily tell the rest of us we "don't
> know shit about something" Well GOD thanks for illuminating the path of true
> wisdom, personal sacrifice, and selflessness. Do you think it premature to
> cast his name into the Nobel prize candidates pool. 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 16:13:32 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 16:16:43 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>,
        Greg2write@aol.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: SFRavers Love Ethan
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Hiya All;

        Just thought I'd add my voice & NRG in support of Ethan, what I
belief him to be about, and what I know him to be about. Actions always
speak louder than words, and Ethan has always acted for & with our scene in
mine first and his pocket last.

        I have nothing positive to say about Nomad so I would say anything
at all, other than get a clue, and there are certain things you just can't
buy in our world.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 16:45:25 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 16:43:43 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: See All Y'All Ravin' Muthas on the DanceFloor!
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Okay, family members, my internet incarnation may be at an end, but raving
will never die!!

I intend to dance my ass off this summer.  And I intend to keep up contact
with as many of you as possible.  So, come up and say hi if you recognize
me, and I'll do the same!

The Description:
Female.  5'5".  Dark brown hair.  Favorite raving tees: "I Take Candy From
Strangers" and Mickey Mouse from Fantasia.  Usually wear jeans and
backpack.  Hair may be in braids or otherwise pinned up for dancing.
Cookie Monster will probably be in tow.  I adorn myself with blinking
lights, and sometimes a really bright lavendar beanie.  Whenever possible,
I will be the Strawberry Girl, with fresh berries for the family (which is
everyone at the party!).

The Parties:
I'll be at anything thrown by Gateway, Harmony, or F& F (sending those
vibes for spaces!!).  I'll be at Sunsets.  And I might even show up at a
couple of massives.

In the immediate future: next weekend, Chrysalis on Saturday and Spundae on
Sunday.  There are also a few Nikitas in my future (thanks to my clubber
friends).

Much love to all of you!!
Keep Dancin' and Smilin'!
Positivity Always!!
Nancy



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 19:16:29 1996
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Message-ID: <960518221557_116484589@emout08.mail.aol.com>
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Subject: Re: Ethan
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I started to respond to ,Greg2write@aol.com, message but figured that I don't
need to waste my breathe on someone like this, Have a great night, PEACE!!
Cid



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 19:30:38 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 96 19:30:03 -0700
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>If that is the case, then we really have nothing to complain about 
>except the fact that they were being total pricks; gee, how unusual 
>for a police officer! 

>Amy

Everyone-
This was part of the original message I posted and evidently what has 
caused the major controversy. 

It never ceases to amaze me that something so stupid which I put about
10 seconds thought into is enough to create a thread which will go on
for days. Then 20 other people have to chime in to say "Oh, I agree."

I'm glad there are so many people on this list who are obviously much
more open minded than me and much better people. Sometimes I get
afraid to post *anything* because I'm not in the mood (ever) to start
a major controversy. I almost got fed up and unsubscribed from this
list (again) due to the major amount of verbiage involved. Not to 
mention the "you are not open-minded and full of PLUR statements"
which are obviously designed to make someone else feel like shit.

I got to feeling sorry for Mark the other day about that Apple Rave
thing; I mean, we all make mistakes. How about treating each other
with a little PLUR in our e-mail, that would go a long way in showing
me that SF ravers really do have PLUR and are not just full of shit.
There are gentle ways of telling someone something w/out getting
all emotional or resorting to name-calling. 

I know there are people on this list who are afraid to post because
they don't want to feel stupid after 20 other folks shoot them down...
let's start by treating each other with respect, OK? I don't know why
I even bother saying these things... but sometimes reading sf raves
just seriously disturbs me. Instead of bringing us together as a family
it just makes me less inclined to want to bother meeting anyone. What
purpose does that serve?

Amy 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 19:30:50 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 19:30:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
To: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
cc: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>,
        Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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bad cop
no donut.

good cop
extra icing.

=)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 21:23:47 1996
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From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Vintage turntable info
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I have this 1973 RCA record player, part of an old-fashioned integrated
stereo system (with 8-track!), that doesn't work too well but which I'd
love to have fixed.  I'm not sure what the problem is, but at the very
least it needs a new stylus--I managed to break the one I had in trying to
diagnose the other trouble.  Unfortunately, the cartridge (and the rest of
it, I suspect) is totally non-standard in today's market.  Anyone know of
any parts suppliers or repair shops that cater to the old-style stereo
owner?  Any help is much appreciated.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 21:31:40 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 21:31:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Adam Guevara <aguevara@compattic.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Re: Pack-a-bowl
In-Reply-To: <1023999.21522320@compattic.com>
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Hands down, I will beat everyone in this endeavor!!

-KaySEE 


On 17 May 1996, Adam Guevara wrote:

> With all these bad bowlers, we should have a Paka-a-bowl-off bad bowler
> tourney...
> 
> 
> Just a thought,
> 
> 
> "Dance with me."
> 
> -Adam
> ____________________________
> Transmitted from Computer Attic
> SuperCenter:  (415) 599-5500
> Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
> ____________________________
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 22:16:00 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 22:15:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Justin Cooper <datura@best.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: morning bay bridge traffic
In-Reply-To: <199605182104.OAA17280@shellx.best.com>
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The Bay Bridge will be under construction for about 3 years, if not 
more.  I think the worst times are really late at night.  There is a 
phone number you can call to see what they are doing each day.  I don't 
have the number, but it is posted near the toll booths.  I will definetly 
be taking it down next time I go out.



On Sat, 18 May 1996, Justin Cooper wrote:

> hey all,
>  i live in berkeley and the last time i came home from sf in the wee hours,
> i got stuck in the 5 lanes-to-1 lane traffic jam... so i was wondering if
> anybody knows what's up with the current traffic situation, is there a 
> good time ti cross the bridge in the morning?  a bad time?
> 
> be seeing you,
>  justin
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 18 22:17:19 1996
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Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 22:17:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: Ethan
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Sat, 18 May 1996 Greg2write@aol.com wrote:

> Re: Ethans' Pitifull Tirade

> Greed in your reluctance at sharing the "scene" with new
> comers. Envy at their successes. 

i rarely get involved with flamefests, but i thought i could share 
something from personal experience. 
my friends and i have begun throwing parties in december of 95, so i'd 
call us new to the scene. from witnessing the positive energy catalized 
by the efforts of gateway and friends and family, ive come to realize 
that i too would want to contribute to our scene in this way. since our 
first party, weve rescieved much support from said groups, and in no way 
was ethan or anyone else unwilling to share the "scene" with newcomers, 
as stated above. with continuing support, i'd call ethan anything but 
envious - he's always been respectful and willing to help out if he can.

i hope this can shed some lite on your perspective.

peace, love, and positive energy,
tom 

 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 03:04:26 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 06:03:55 -0400
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Preach On!
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Check it out......Don't talk shit...about anyone......no matter who. Im only
18, and Im exreamly childish, but, to talk shit about people is pretty
pathetic. I can't say I know Ethan to well...but since I have talked to him I
can say that he is extreamly friendly, helpful.and, sorry, I'm just really
angry, I think Ethan is a great guy, and I don't think anyone should have to
defend him....This post seems a little pointless but, this shit just got to
me....It sucks when people try and ruin something you love and care for...and
Ethan just doesn't deserve this shit!
Raveing 101
PLUR
PLUR
PLUR                     CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG????
         
Depressed,
Jonathan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 03:34:28 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 03:29:21 -0700
To: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
From: "Rusty H. Hodge" <rusty@hodge.com>
Subject: Re: Is discussing sexuality offensive/NRR?
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Keep it up, you're adding some cool insight and interesting directions to
this list (which has a tendency to be a bit childish).

Besides- there is so much sex happening in the rave community - but
everyone is afraid to talk about it. It gets weird when you can't talk
about things.

Nice to smart being so open about sex. It shouldn't be a mystery.

I think it's all very rave related.

And I enjoy your posts (and forward some to my friends).

See ya-

Rusty

PS- I'm a semi-lurker, I only post about 1 or 2 times a month it seems.

--
Rusty Hodge <rusty@hodge.com>
Hodge [Interactive] Productions            801 Minnesota Ave. Studio 9
San Francisco CA 94107    tel +1.415.826.9500      fax +1.415.641.7773



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 05:15:42 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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On Fri, May 17, 1996 12:50:01 PM  at Leslie Ayres wrote: 
 
>kaysee said.. 
> 
>I am out the door, headed to PackABowl.   
 
Leslie,  
 
    I was there with Jess but I didn't see you.  Where were you? 
 
--erik 
 
**IMPORTANT!  READ DISCLAIMER** 
These words were NOT written by moonpup 
He's in London until late August 
 
...and I'm ERIK.  I'll be using his address until then 
Please address all comments, rebuttals, love or hate letters to me, ERIK 
or drop me a line... 415-337-6666

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 05:21:18 1996
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Leslie, 
 
Oops.  I read  your post again and noticed that you quoted some of it from
Kaysee. I need to pay attention a bit more.  Evenso, because I did meet
Kaysee. 
 
--erik

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 05:35:36 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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Kaysee, 
 
I went to fresh start with Renaud.  I didn't see you. 
 
--erik

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 07:48:40 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 07:48:33 -0700 (PDT)
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Our community
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On Sat, 18 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >If that is the case, then we really have nothing to complain about 
> >except the fact that they were being total pricks; gee, how unusual 
> >for a police officer! 
> 
> >Amy
> 
> Everyone-
> This was part of the original message I posted and evidently what has 
> caused the major controversy. 
> 
> It never ceases to amaze me that something so stupid which I put about
> 10 seconds thought into is enough to create a thread which will go on
> for days. Then 20 other people have to chime in to say "Oh, I agree."

Perhaps it would be a good idea to think before you post. I think almost 
all of us(myself *definitely* included) have at some time, said something or 
posted something without putting enough thought into it.... and been 
called on it.  Quite frankly it seems that you are upset because you got 
called on something, and a majority of people agreed. Was the call harsh? 
Yes, however so was the original statement. 

> I'm glad there are so many people on this list who are obviously much
> more open minded than me and much better people. Sometimes I get
> afraid to post *anything* because I'm not in the mood (ever) to start
> a major controversy. I almost got fed up and unsubscribed from this
> list (again) due to the major amount of verbiage involved. Not to 
> mention the "you are not open-minded and full of PLUR statements"
> which are obviously designed to make someone else feel like shit.

Sour grapes. 

I am with JSL(god twice in one week) on this one. PLUR is a tired, 
over-used acronym. People are batted around by others with it. I do 
believe that there are some that really carry these ideals with them, but 
the majority just use it as a weapon to put others down. I did like what 
someone posted a few months back from one of the originators(I think) of 
the term. It went something like:

Peace, *when peace is given*
Love, *when love is given*
Unity, *when unity is desired*
Respect, *when respect is given*
(Apologies for the possible paraphrasing)

This stuff doesn't exist in a vacuum. If the concept of PLUR is included 
in the paradigm of your existance, cool. But you have to give to get. 

> I got to feeling sorry for Mark the other day about that Apple Rave
> thing; I mean, we all make mistakes. How about treating each other
> with a little PLUR in our e-mail, that would go a long way in showing
> me that SF ravers really do have PLUR and are not just full of shit.

It sounds like what happened was indeed unfortunate, and that 
*particular* group of cops may have indeed been pricks. However, that 
does not make it the modus operandi for all police everywhere.  

I also find it ironic that you complain about people using PLUR to make 
you feel like shit in one paragraph, and in the next, use it yourself. 

> There are gentle ways of telling someone something w/out getting
> all emotional or resorting to name-calling. 

You call people names, and then expect people to be gentle?

> I know there are people on this list who are afraid to post because
> they don't want to feel stupid after 20 other folks shoot them down...
> let's start by treating each other with respect, OK? I don't know why
> I even bother saying these things... but sometimes reading sf raves
> just seriously disturbs me. Instead of bringing us together as a family
> it just makes me less inclined to want to bother meeting anyone. What
> purpose does that serve?

Yes, let's start treating people with respect. Make sure your giving it 
when you ask for it.

                                          Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 07:51:15 1996
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To: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
cc: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>,
        TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>,
        Leslie Ayres <71165.755@compuserve.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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On Sat, 18 May 1996, John Bagby wrote:

> 
> bad cop
> no donut.
> 
> good cop
> extra icing.
> 
> =)

really good cop
sprinkles

                                 Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 09:28:10 1996
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To: "Rusty H. Hodge" <rusty@hodge.com>
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: Is discussing sexuality offensive/NRR?
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Keep it up, you're adding some cool insight and interesting directions to
>this list (which has a tendency to be a bit childish).
>
>Besides- there is so much sex happening in the rave community - but
>everyone is afraid to talk about it. It gets weird when you can't talk
>about things.

Tell me about it, the last free organic in golden gate park, I looked
around and saw several little "ravelets" toddling around, some in strollers,
some in the kangapouch carrying things, and about 2 or 3 women with big
round bellies, I thought to myself, well I guess we've gone to the next
level of community which is spawning offspring. Obviously people are having
(lots) of sex, after you've known some people for years, seen them out, know
their friends and and their reps for treating other people, it's a lot
easier to get together with them, even on a casual basis, you pretty much
know what to expect.

>
>Nice to smart being so open about sex. It shouldn't be a mystery.

I'm sure for most it's not, it seems to be "an american thing", when
I was staying in France and Germany folks were rather matter of fact
about sex, they were not perverted (like some americans believe) just
open, and pragmatic about their desires.



                                        G


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 09:31:53 1996
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To: "Rusty H. Hodge" <rusty@hodge.com>
From: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Is discussing sexuality offensive/NRR?
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 03:29 AM 5/19/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Keep it up, you're adding some cool insight and interesting directions to
>this list (which has a tendency to be a bit childish).
>
>Besides- there is so much sex happening in the rave community - but
>everyone is afraid to talk about it. It gets weird when you can't talk
>about things.
>
>Nice to smart being so open about sex. It shouldn't be a mystery.
>
>I think it's all very rave related.
>

Just a thought: If sexuality was banned fgrom the house music scene, then
there would be no house music.

Courtney 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 10:06:14 1996
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Subject: Re: Our community
Date: Sun, 19 May 96 10:05:31 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: <blkadder@value.net>
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>Yes, let's start treating people with respect. Make sure your giving it 
>when you ask for it.
>
>                                          Black Adder

As a matter of fact, I am not asking for your respect and I don't care if
I get it. I am not feeling any 'sour grapes', just because something I 
said
was completley blown out of proportion and used as a folly for another
high-school level debate. What you think of me is of no concern, so please
don't worry.

I am not going to engage in any more arguments with you or anyone else. 
If 
there was nothing valid in what I was trying to say, just leave it the 
hell
alone. Don't nit pick it to death, please!! I will ultimately try to 
ascribe to
the level of perfection which you have attained, I will humbly crawl back
to the Lord Black Adder when I am worthy.

Can you say FED UP?!?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 10:32:31 1996
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To: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Music & Sexuality Was:Is discussing sexuality offensive/NRR?
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>Just a thought: If sexuality was banned from the house music scene, then
>there would be no house music.
>
>Courtney 



Right On! So true.

In fact, your statement made me realize something that I was struggling with.
I've tried to get into the Goa-Trance thing, the people seem really nice and
their definitely seems to be some sort of vibe, but try as i may, I can't seem
to catch a groove to the music. Finally, I realize that it is all upper chakras
there isn't anything for my first and second.  House music tends to operate on
your 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th and some times 6th. Goa starts at the 5th and 6th,
with some activity at the 3rd.

Just my 2 cents not ment to be dogma or anything.

Disclaimer: I've never been to a ccc party and I'm still open to the experience
but it's hard for me to get into the music if their isn't some sexual exergy
present.


                                                G


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 11:43:07 1996
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To: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Vintage turntable info
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Try Jack's Record Cellar in San Francisco, they specialize in  78 speed
records, and will probably know someone with the info..

Jon


At  9:25 PM 5/18/96 -0800, Anarch wrote:
>I have this 1973 RCA record player, part of an old-fashioned integrated
>stereo system (with 8-track!), that doesn't work too well but which I'd
>love to have fixed.  I'm not sure what the problem is, but at the very
>least it needs a new stylus--I managed to break the one I had in trying to
>diagnose the other trouble.  Unfortunately, the cartridge (and the rest of
>it, I suspect) is totally non-standard in today's market.  Anyone know of
>any parts suppliers or repair shops that cater to the old-style stereo
>owner?  Any help is much appreciated.
>
>anarch@scruznet.com

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 12:57:18 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 12:56:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked.
In-Reply-To: <v02130502adc346d05f5c@DialupEudora>
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Dear Friends & Family,

My computer tells me that on Sat, 18 May 1996, John S. Lee shared (in part):

> In other words, someone knows how to work the SF system of graft...

> ...People
> especially those who decide to make a living by raves/parties, will do
> whatever it takes to survive and eat.  Sometimes people have in mind
> McDonalds, others want a banquet.  Depending on what the person has in
> mind, will determine the extent and type of capitalism.

	Just a brief point: Graft and greed are not what capitalism is 
about.  There are plenty of businesspeople who are out to make a profit, 
but will not stoop to the use of bribery, nor would they put ethical 
concerns about negating the hard work of others to the wind, as 
apparantly happened here.  I am saddened that so many people seem to have so 
little respect for the system of free enterprise that allows our scene to 
exist in the first place.

> For some people it is as you say it is, respect, love, and trust.  For
> others, it is all about $$$'s, $$$'s, and MORE $$$'s.  IMO, we need both.
> People who chose the, for lack of a better term "Ethan's Way" (ala Guy
> Kawasaki :) ) keep the continuum going.  The "other" way ensures that
> people get paid enough to do some free or lower cost things.  Not everyone
> can work for Apple, and not everyone can survive throwing free parties or
> doing low cost events.  It's all a give and take, yin-yang.  It is truly
> unfortunate when someone is coming from a a place of generosity and another
> from a place of greed.  In our system, on the whole, greed wins.
> Unfortunate for many, but true.

	I agree with John that it is good to have some higher priced 
events, although I see it as more of a necessary evil that need only 
occur because we in society have our standard of living artificially 
lowered by the government to the point where we cannot all afford to 
throw free parties even if we might want to.
	But I don't think that we should assume that anyone charging a 
significant amount of money for an event is greedy and only out for 
money, and anyone throwing a free event is doing it strictly out of 
generosity.  Better to assume the latter than the former though.
	I don't think "greed wins" in our system.  People who "succeed" 
based on greed are not going to be very happy, even if they may produce 
envy and hatred in others who similarly fail to see that the real path to 
happiness and success is not based on the rapacious acquisition of money.

Much love,
				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 13:22:12 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 13:22:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: Nancy <nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: See All Y'All Ravin' Muthas on the DanceFloor!
In-Reply-To: <v0213050fadc41ce4db5f@[128.32.91.91]>
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Dear Nancy,

	Goodbye! (sniff)  You've been such a good girl, I'm sure you will 
spread wonderful vibes this summer wherever you go... dress warmly, don't 
forget to write (via friends)!  If you go swimming, don't eat for half an 
hour beforehand... just kidding. 8)
	I hope you'll be back with us electronically, ASAP... I've sent 
you private email with more details on a possible way to do it.

May the force be with you,
				<<< Starchild >>>

My computer tells me that on Sat, 18 May 1996, Nancy shared:

> Okay, family members, my internet incarnation may be at an end, but raving
> will never die!!
> 
> I intend to dance my ass off this summer.  And I intend to keep up contact
> with as many of you as possible.  So, come up and say hi if you recognize
> me, and I'll do the same!
> 
> The Description:
> Female.  5'5".  Dark brown hair.  Favorite raving tees: "I Take Candy From
> Strangers" and Mickey Mouse from Fantasia.  Usually wear jeans and
> backpack.  Hair may be in braids or otherwise pinned up for dancing.
> Cookie Monster will probably be in tow.  I adorn myself with blinking
> lights, and sometimes a really bright lavendar beanie.  Whenever possible,
> I will be the Strawberry Girl, with fresh berries for the family (which is
> everyone at the party!).
> 
> The Parties:
> I'll be at anything thrown by Gateway, Harmony, or F& F (sending those
> vibes for spaces!!).  I'll be at Sunsets.  And I might even show up at a
> couple of massives.
> 
> In the immediate future: next weekend, Chrysalis on Saturday and Spundae on
> Sunday.  There are also a few Nikitas in my future (thanks to my clubber
> friends).
> 
> Much love to all of you!!
> Keep Dancin' and Smilin'!
> Positivity Always!!
> Nancy
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 13:32:20 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 13:32:04 -0700 (PDT)
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Our community
In-Reply-To: <199605191634.JAA04560@ns.mauswerks.com>
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On Sun, 19 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >Yes, let's start treating people with respect. Make sure your giving it 
> >when you ask for it.
> >
> >                                          Black Adder
> 
> As a matter of fact, I am not asking for your respect and I don't care if
> I get it. I am not feeling any 'sour grapes', just because something I 
> said
> was completley blown out of proportion and used as a folly for another
> high-school level debate. What you think of me is of no concern, so please
> don't worry.

Doesn't that directly contradict what you said in your last message about 
how we all should respect one another?   

I feel that the debate was sufficiently mature. If everyone agreed with 
you, would you still feel the debate was 'high-school?' 

At any rate, I(and I think most everyone else) am not on this earth to 
tear you apart. You said something I consider off-base, and I called you 
on it. Others happened to agree. Big deal.  Sorry that you feel so bad 
about it, but I do not apologize for anything I said. 


> I am not going to engage in any more arguments with you or anyone else. 
> If 
> there was nothing valid in what I was trying to say, just leave it the 
> hell
> alone. Don't nit pick it to death, please!! I will ultimately try to 
> ascribe to
> the level of perfection which you have attained, I will humbly crawl back
> to the Lord Black Adder when I am worthy.

If you don't wish to engage in any more "arguments" then why do you feel 
the need to make a snide remark like the one above?

If you are going to make a public remark you should be willing to 
discuss your statements, publicly or privately. If you are not willing to 
do this, why make a public statement in the first place?
 
> Can you say FED UP?!?

Then why did you decide to make a public statement about this subject, 
after we both agreed in private e-mail that the issue was resolved?

                                            Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 14:01:15 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 14:00:54 -0700 (PDT)
To: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
cc: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>, Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked.
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On Sun, 19 May 1996, Starchild wrote:

> Dear Friends & Family,
> 
> My computer tells me that on Sat, 18 May 1996, John S. Lee shared (in part):
> 
> > In other words, someone knows how to work the SF system of graft...
> 
> > ...People
> > especially those who decide to make a living by raves/parties, will do
> > whatever it takes to survive and eat.  Sometimes people have in mind
> > McDonalds, others want a banquet.  Depending on what the person has in
> > mind, will determine the extent and type of capitalism.
> 
> 	Just a brief point: Graft and greed are not what capitalism is 
> about.  There are plenty of businesspeople who are out to make a profit, 
> but will not stoop to the use of bribery, nor would they put ethical 
> concerns about negating the hard work of others to the wind, as 
> apparantly happened here.  I am saddened that so many people seem to have so 
> little respect for the system of free enterprise that allows our scene to 
> exist in the first place.

Capitalism *can* be greed. There are 'rape the earth, take whatever you 
can get' capitalists, just as there are capitalists that work in synergy 
with their communities, enviroments, etc. In it's truest sense capitalism   
would seem to be purely economic Darwinism. If this were not the case 
we wouldn't have the sometimes heavy-handed government regulation of industry. 

I don't think JSL was being disrespectful of capitialism at 
all. Notice he did say it depends on what the person has in mind, which 
determines the type of capitalism they engage in. 

> 	I agree with John that it is good to have some higher priced 
> events, although I see it as more of a necessary evil that need only 
> occur because we in society have our standard of living artificially 
> lowered by the government to the point where we cannot all afford to 
> throw free parties even if we might want to.

Of course without gov't regulation, except for the upper class, we would all
be working 14 hour days, and making .50 a day. We could always live in 
Sweden, where income tax is roughly 50% I am no great fan of the way the 
current gov't is run or the direction it is headed, but we do need some 
gov't regulation, and some taxation in order to survive as a nation.


> 	But I don't think that we should assume that anyone charging a 
> significant amount of money for an event is greedy and only out for 
> money, and anyone throwing a free event is doing it strictly out of 
> generosity.  Better to assume the latter than the former though.
> 	I don't think "greed wins" in our system.  People who "succeed" 
> based on greed are not going to be very happy, even if they may produce 
> envy and hatred in others who similarly fail to see that the real path to 
> happiness and success is not based on the rapacious acquisition of money.

I think there are a lot of CEO's that would argue this point with you. 
While this may not be your or my "real path to happiness to sucess" it 
could well be theirs. 

                                           Black Adder 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 14:16:10 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 16:14:28 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Sunset
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Can some kind sould point me to where Sunset will be today.

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 14:47:42 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 14:47:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Our community
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605190159.SAA03167@ns.mauswerks.com>
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On Sat, 18 May 1996, Ms Phink wrote:

> >If that is the case, then we really have nothing to complain about 
> >except the fact that they were being total pricks; gee, how unusual 
> >for a police officer! 
> 
> let's start by treating each other with respect, OK? I don't know why
> I even bother saying these things... but sometimes reading sf raves
> just seriously disturbs me. Instead of bringing us together as a family
> it just makes me less inclined to want to bother meeting anyone. What
> purpose does that serve?
> 
> Amy 


Hi!
 Just because people are on sfraves does not automatically make them 
"cool", "fresh" or whatever. Yes ,lets treat each others on sfraves with 
respect. Lets also treat others (like officers) with respect also. 
Otherwise we are just as elitist and snobbish as any power-abusing cop.
 If a group of people who are as open-minded and fun-loving as ravers are 
have troubles communicating and getting along, can you imagine how tough 
it is for most officers (with their sometimes life-threatening stress's) 
to show PLUR?

Peace

Ran
 
*(best not to judge an individual until you have walked a mile in their shoes)
                                    /
                              -=*=-/
                                ~                        

* badly paraphrased native-american saying

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 15:03:17 1996
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From: Rudy Villafane <rudy@quiknet.com>
To: "'Jason Green*'" <Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Cc: "SFraves@hyperreal.com" <SFraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: WHO SFRAVES
Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 14:17:01 -0700
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Right here bud!  Went to Smarties Last Friday! RAD RAVE!!!!! Did Anyone els go? Whatz yer opinionz? I thought It was AWSOME!

----------
From: 	Jason Green*[SMTP:Jason_Green*@quickmail.apple.com]
Sent: 	Tuesday, May 14, 1996 8:37 AM
To: 	sfraves
Subject: 	WHO SFRAVES

WHO SFRAVES




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 15:03:19 1996
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From: Rudy Villafane <rudy@quiknet.com>
To: "'Adam Luong'" <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>,
        "sfraves@hyperreal.com"
	 <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: Smarties Review
Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 15:01:02 -0700
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	I thought I was Awsome...The Only thing I'de say that wasn't too good =
about it was that is WAS TOO HOT...Especially on the upper =
level...However..As packed as it was...I spent most of my tyme on the =
air conditioned dance floor!  Other than that I put everthing aside and =
had a bitchin tyme...I thought the vibez were awsome...I liked the kool =
stuff they were selling near the entrance of the dance floor!  My friend =
and I stayed until 7am...
	As dawn aproached around 6am and since there were windows on the =
ceiling there was too much light on the dance floor which kinda spoiled =
that underground, elite, feeling of the rave. But it was 1 hour to =
closing anyways...

-RuDy-
----------
From: 	Adam Luong[SMTP:rlunatic@ix.netcom.com]
Sent: 	Saturday, May 18, 1996 11:58 AM
To: 	sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: 	Smarties Review

Well, Smarties went off. The crowd was, ok. This crowd was not my type=20
of crowd, but there was still some cool people. The Vibe was -ok-. The=20
music was GREAT!!! The place was PACKED FULL!! There must have been=20
twice as many people there compared to Harmony's Beautiful people. It=20
was located at the Jerrold's Deli, once again.=20

Good Moment:Dancing all night on the floor where the A/C was actually=20
cranked up.

Bad moment:Roaming around feeling sick because it was TOOOOOO HOT!!!=20
The only place to be where it was actually COOL was on the the dance=20
floor right underneath that a/c.

Good moment:Meeting alot of people that noticed me because of my hat=20
and necklace.

Very bad moment: When I finally left to go to back to my car, I found=20
out that it was broken into. SHIT. Like I said, not my type of crowd so=20
my car had no respect. Or something... Shit happens....

Other than that... It was OK. Yeah... I'm kinda depressed and=20
pissed....

Adam
                        R.Lunatic



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 15:39:16 1996
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Begroovy@aol.com wrote:

>I started to respond to ,Greg2write@aol.com, message but figured that I don't
>need to waste my breathe on someone like this, Have a great night, PEACE!!
>Cid

Bingo.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 18:08:42 1996
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To: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked.
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>Dear Friends & Family,
>
>My computer tells me that on Sat, 18 May 1996, John S. Lee shared (in part):
>
>> In other words, someone knows how to work the SF system of graft...
>
>> ...People
>> especially those who decide to make a living by raves/parties, will do
>> whatever it takes to survive and eat.  Sometimes people have in mind
>> McDonalds, others want a banquet.  Depending on what the person has in
>> mind, will determine the extent and type of capitalism.
>
>	Just a brief point: Graft and greed are not what capitalism is 
>about.  There are plenty of businesspeople who are out to make a profit, 
>but will not stoop to the use of bribery, nor would they put ethical 
>concerns about negating the hard work of others to the wind, as 
>apparantly happened here.  I am saddened that so many people seem to have so 
>little respect for the system of free enterprise that allows our scene to 
>exist in the first place.
>

Nor are graft, greed, dominance and totaliarian control what communism is
about, in it's pure sense, the bottom line here is human nature in both
systems and to the extent that a group will be ruthless enough to push
their agenda at the expense of everyone else. Our scene happens to exist in
a system that alledgedly practices some form of "free enterprise", it doesn't
exist because of free enterprise, is exist regardless of free enterprise,
one could set up sound systems, charge admission, evade and even be busted
by the police inside of a communist or socialist company.  Also the concept
of free enterprise or rather open markets is not new, nor was it even
invented by Adam Smith (though he may have codified it for westerners in
his "the wealth of Nations" which was little more than a manual for the
proper operations of plantations), there were large market economies through
out Africa and Asia for at least 2000, but we digress...

>> For some people it is as you say it is, respect, love, and trust.  For
>> others, it is all about $$$'s, $$$'s, and MORE $$$'s.  IMO, we need both.
>> People who chose the, for lack of a better term "Ethan's Way" (ala Guy
>> Kawasaki :) ) keep the continuum going.  The "other" way ensures that
>> people get paid enough to do some free or lower cost things.  Not everyone
>> can work for Apple, and not everyone can survive throwing free parties or
>> doing low cost events.  It's all a give and take, yin-yang.  It is truly
>> unfortunate when someone is coming from a a place of generosity and another
>> from a place of greed.  In our system, on the whole, greed wins.
>> Unfortunate for many, but true.
>
>	I agree with John that it is good to have some higher priced 
>events, although I see it as more of a necessary evil that need only 
>occur because we in society have our standard of living artificially 
>lowered by the government to the point where we cannot all afford to 
>throw free parties even if we might want to.

I assert that even if we were not taxed and if there was "unbridled
capitalism" there would still be greedy people (if not greedy for money
then greedy for power). In a totally free market system, price is always
set by supply and demand, thus, if you can corner the market, and the demand
is high, you can charge whatever price you want. If the governement weren't
there, rest assured that some "greedy bastard" would perceive that if they could
keep free parties from happening then more people will pay to come to their
parties.  We need to first change human nature (which is a very difficult
thing, that no one has be successful at yet)

>	But I don't think that we should assume that anyone charging a 
>significant amount of money for an event is greedy and only out for 
>money, and anyone throwing a free event is doing it strictly out of 
>generosity.  Better to assume the latter than the former though.

No many promoters use the "free party" as a form of promotion or
advertising.  It seems to work.

>	I don't think "greed wins" in our system.  People who "succeed" 
>based on greed are not going to be very happy, even if they may produce 
>envy and hatred in others who similarly fail to see that the real path to 
>happiness and success is not based on the rapacious acquisition of money.

Dude, tell that to Bill (Gates) I'm sure he is quite happy and will be even
happier when he gets a nanocent for ever bit that traverses ever conduit
on the planet :)


                                                geoffw



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 18:29:36 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 18:26:54 -0700
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From: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
Subject: B2B
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So who else did the Bay to Breakers this AM ???

I had a BLAST !! Went dressed up as the giant raver boy. BIG silver shiny
sparkley pants with matching BIG silver shiny sparkley hat, my Brazil world
cup soccer jersey and an SFRaves laminate !!  My knees are killing me now,
but it was TOTALLY worth it. I'm going over to my friends now to see the TV
coverage.

How bout the Gay Freedom Day parade ?? Do we know any other groups that are
already signed up (since we are too late for this year) that we could join
in with and dance our way down the street ???





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 21:27:44 1996
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From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
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You wrote: 
>
>So who else did the Bay to Breakers this AM ???
>
I did it for the first time and also had a great time.  It was great 
seeing all the creative outfits people were wearing, and hearing all 
the music along the way.
I got to hear techno in 2 spots along the way which gave me an extra 
boost. 
I found this to be much more fun than the sf marathon.  Very nice wacky 
vibe throughout the race.

:)
peter


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 23:44:01 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 00:42:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: Can we get a grip?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Holy cow, Tristan, I hope you're joking.  _ALL_ cops are evil?  Oh come   
on!  The world is NEVER, NEVER this black-and-white.  Surely you can't be   
serious?  How can you cast out your opinion and call it a fact?  You have   
perhaps some proof of this to offer?  It's an opinion, and a quite   
extreme one at that.  And holy shit, man, going off on a guy's Dad like   
that?  Even if you were right, surely our Mr. Adder is going to be very   
offended by your indictment of a man you don't know, a man who raised   
him.

Easy, man!
 -Roy

 ----------
From:  TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG[SMTP:sandoz@sfsu.edu]
Sent:  Saturday, May 18, 1996 7:40 AM
To:  Leslie Ayres
Cc:  sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject:  Re: dissing cops, etc.

Remember: any person who is a cop has decided that he is a). better then
other people; b). can go around and and take away ALL of an individuals
rights (and shoot them as well) for no other reason then because he feels   

like it and c). has nothing but contempt for their fellow man which is
why they are cops in the first place.  This is not an opniniated
statement it is a cold hard fact.  All cops are like this, white, black
or asian; it's attitude we are interestested in here not the colour of
their skin.  Black Adder, you say your dad is a nice guy but he can't be:   

he's a cop and because he is a cop he thinks he is better then other
people and has the right to tell his peers what to do and how to think
(or else!).  Now do you honestly think that these are traits of a nice
person?


On 17 May 1996, Leslie Ayres wrote:

> Black Adder said....
>
> My father is a cop, and a pretty nice guy, and I get really sick of all   

> the bashing of law enforcement that goes on here by a people that
> have no respect for anyone, although they claim to. If you want to say
"This
> particular officer was a prick," fine. But sterotyping people and   
saying
> "All cops are pricks" is just as bad as sterotyping black people, or
> gays, or any other group of people. In other words it makes you little
> different than a racist or a bigot.
>
>                                        Black Adder
> ________________________________________
>
> Once again, folks, a reminder that we are all interconnected, and if we
want to
> be given the benefit of the doubt, we should give it to others as well.   
 I'm
> pretty thankful to a few cops that have helped me out in my life, just   
as
I'm
> pretty disappointed in a few that created havoc unnecessarily for me --   

>
> But remember ..... (this is what I try to do when I'm driving behind   
someone
> who's reeeeaallly slow and refuses to politely get the heck out of my   
way)
....
> we are all someone's father, mother, daughter, son, sister, brother   
.... so
if
> we try to treat that cop like they are our OWN father, or that bad   
driver
like
> they're our OWN sister or whatever, we'll probably be a little happier   
all
> around!
>
> Yikes, I need a weekend, don't you!  Much love and positive thoughts to
everyone
> whose thoughts, ideas and support have helped me make it through   
another
week!
>
> Leslie   : )
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 23:55:12 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 06:53:42 GMT
From: sfraves <sfraves@spinback.demon.co.uk>
Reply-To: sfraves@spinback.demon.co.uk
Message-Id: <86@spinback.demon.co.uk>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Our community
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In your message dated Sunday 19, May 1996 you wrote :

> Hi!
>  Just because people are on sfraves does not automatically make them 
> "cool", "fresh" or whatever. Yes ,lets treat each others on sfraves with 
> respect. Lets also treat others (like officers) with respect also. 
> Otherwise we are just as elitist and snobbish as any power-abusing cop.
>  If a group of people who are as open-minded and fun-loving as ravers are 
> have troubles communicating and getting along, can you imagine how tough 
> it is for most officers (with their sometimes life-threatening stress's) 
> to show PLUR?
> 
> Peace
> 
> Ran
>  
> *(best not to judge an individual until you have walked a mile in their shoes)
>                                     /
>                               -=*=-/
>                                 ~                        
> 
> * badly paraphrased native-american saying
> 

hi!!

I am new to SFRaves, but from reading the messages posted here, it is apparent 
to me that you are a very close community.

I have been raving / clubbing for the past 5 years now, and I live in London, 
England.  It would be nice if many of our ravers had the sort of mentality that 
you are all showing.

Unfortunately, our summers of love died out by 1993, and most of the raves are 
now big business, pulling in the corporate sharks.  Of course, there are still 
plenty of underground parties and raves (I know cause I have been to them, and 
even organised a few myself!) but with changes in legislation, it is becoming a 
lot harder to throw a decent all nighter- count yourselves lucky you do not have 
the criminal justice act!

Hopefully, I will be over to party in June, and I hope that a good time will be 
had by all- I would appreciate it if someone could tell me a little about what 
to expect from Tribal Future- I will be going to it as soon as my plane lands.  
The police in England have stopped our Tribal Future from taking place, even 
though 20,000 tickets have been sold!

regards

Daryll
XXXXXX



        	********************************
		*  daryll@spinback.demon.co.uk *
		********************************
		* 197 The Avenue London E4 9SD *		
		********************************
		* 			       *
		*  "Living is a Life Sentence" *
		*			       *
		********************************



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 19 23:59:08 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 23:59:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Can we get a grip?
To: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605200643.AA22115@mail.ico.net>
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On Mon, 20 May 1996, Roy Feague wrote:

> 
> Holy cow, Tristan, I hope you're joking.  _ALL_ cops are evil?  Oh come   
> on!  The world is NEVER, NEVER this black-and-white.  Surely you can't be   
> serious?  How can you cast out your opinion and call it a fact?  You have   
> perhaps some proof of this to offer?  It's an opinion, and a quite   
> extreme one at that.  And holy shit, man, going off on a guy's Dad like   
> that?  Even if you were right, surely our Mr. Adder is going to be very   
> offended by your indictment of a man you don't know, a man who raised   
> him.
> 
> Easy, man!
>  -Roy
> 
>  ----------
> From:  TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG[SMTP:sandoz@sfsu.edu]
> Sent:  Saturday, May 18, 1996 7:40 AM
> To:  Leslie Ayres
> Cc:  sfraves@hyperreal.com
> Subject:  Re: dissing cops, etc.
> 
> Remember: any person who is a cop has decided that he is a). better then
> other people; b). can go around and and take away ALL of an individuals
> rights (and shoot them as well) for no other reason then because he feels   
> 
> like it and c). has nothing but contempt for their fellow man which is
> why they are cops in the first place.  This is not an opniniated
> statement it is a cold hard fact.  All cops are like this, white, black
> or asian; it's attitude we are interestested in here not the colour of
> their skin.  Black Adder, you say your dad is a nice guy but he can't be:   
> 
> he's a cop and because he is a cop he thinks he is better then other
> people and has the right to tell his peers what to do and how to think
> (or else!).  Now do you honestly think that these are traits of a nice
> person?
> 
> 

Tristan doesn't even deserve a response for such an arrogant, stupid 
piece of shit as this post. I think he is just baiting.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 00:08:52 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 00:12:09 -0700
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From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: Re: Our community
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Hiya All;

        What is PLUR without tolerance, and I speak of  a tolerance that
approaches acceptance of each other for our differences. We are all human
here, with the exception of a few aliens & holograms like myself. When I
think human; I associate that word with diversity. This is so apparent to me
my simply looking around and noticing that no two of  you are a like, duh.
Yet WE EXPECT each other to be the same, when were elementally not. We are
very much like original works of art, priceless by virtue of our uniqueness,
and a eventual expiration date.

        Yet we get soo pissy when we discover another human, or many humans
that happen to disagree with us. When instead of accepting this as the norm,
our egos freak and go on this character assassinating rampage in order that
we can feel good about ourselves by making the offending humans less the
human. When chances are that the offending humans don't even agree with each
other.

        So what is it that we really want or need when the reality of life
slaps us in the face and said's that hey YOUR UNIQUE IN YOUR VIEWS &
BELIEFS? Only you can answer this question for yourselves.    

        I personally think it's much more productive instead of doing the
knee jerk character assassination thing to privately communicate our
feelings to the offending person/s.  I personally don't care what you thing
about me, or anyone else, because in the end it only matters what you or I
personally think about our respective selves.

        A funny thing happens when I catch myself and do the above
mentioned. I experience a wonderful overwhelming feeling that hey, I won, I
didn't add to the planets negativity, I didn't go down the character
assassination road to hell, I didn't add to the hurt of an already hurtful
situation, and I feel great about myself despite the situation and/or the
person for doing it and not going there. That today I got a little closer to
my own divinity, and approached a truer love. 

        So why waist your time telling someone just what you think of them,
when you know it's just being hurtful, dehumanizing, mean and adding to our
planets negativity all for the benefit of our ego.

        The fact being that any belief system, even personal ones that make
another human less than human are by definition & the root of hatred and
oppression.

Peace
THX1138

At 07:48 AM 5/19/96 -0700, you wrote:

>Peace, *when peace is given*
>Love, *when love is given*
>Unity, *when unity is desired*
>Respect, *when respect is given*
>(Apologies for the possible paraphrasing)
>
>This stuff doesn't exist in a vacuum. If the concept of PLUR is included 
>in the paradigm of your existance, cool. But you have to give to get. 

>I also find it ironic that you complain about people using PLUR to make 
>you feel like shit in one paragraph, and in the next, use it yourself. 

>> There are gentle ways of telling someone something w/out getting
>> all emotional or resorting to name-calling. 
>
>You call people names, and then expect people to be gentle?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 00:40:52 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 00:40:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: socializing at raves
In-Reply-To: <199605102143.OAA22727@ns.mauswerks.com>
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Dear Friends & Family,

	Regarding contributing to the vibe, I really sometimes feel I am 
doing this just as intensely when I'm "exploring" as when I'm dancing.  I 
almost always take the time to do this at a party:
	Walk around, and notice things, mostly people who look like they 
have the vibe.  Whoever looks particularly friendly or interesting 
(creatively dressed, neat toys, etc.) I will usually find an excuse to 
talk to.  I also like to pay attention to and appreciate whatever has 
been done to decorate the space and make it beautiful.  Aesthetics are 
very important to me; not just the "visuals" per se, but the whole visual 
environment at a party makes a huge difference to me, nearly as much as 
the "audio environment", i.e. the quality of the music/sound system.
	I love dancing, and those of you who know me know I definitely 
get into it(!), but I don't think not dancing all the time makes you 
"lame".  Sometimes I would simply rather be doing something else.  If the 
DJ is going off, plenty of others will be dancing and showing their 
appreciation of that fact.  I don't think anyone should feel they "owe it 
to the DJ" to dance -- if I were a DJ, I would want to believe that 
people were dancing because they wanted to, not for any other reason.
	When I'm walking around, or just chilling in the ambient area or 
wherever, I feel I am still contributing to the energy of a party, because 
it's then that I will take the time to smile at people, offer water, food, 
or whatever, and generally try to interact with people, which won't always 
happen when I'm dancing.
	Also, some of the most intense moments I've had at raves have 
been talking to people and getting each other totally excited by the 
exchange of energy, thoughts, and information.  You can have connections 
with people without ever saying a word, but the other kind are good too.  
Language is a beautiful thing, and I enjoy using it!  8)  And it's hard 
to have a conversation while you're moving at 120 BPM, especially if you 
have your eyes closed and can't see the other person to read their lips...

Much love, & may the bass be with us,

				<<< Starchild >>>


My computer tells me that on Fri, 10 May 1996, Ms Phink shared:

> >Hi all!
> > kaySEE, the collective conciousness you are refering to has been 
> >experienced in many different enviroments and is a area of (part time) 
> >study for me. I first came across it at Grateful Dead concerts (before 
> >they were REALLY big colisium affairs). Bob Weir refered to this 
> >phenomenon as "Gestalt Linkage".
> >
> Here is my whole take on this dancefloor/socializing thing. 
> 
> Unless you are out dancing, you are being a total lame ass.
> Yes, meeting new people is great fun and I try to spend some
> time talking to people too.
> 
> But I feel that if the DJ is doing a really good job, you
> almost owe it to that person to be out dancing! If I was a 
> DJ, nothing would be worse than playing to a room full of
> boring people. Conversely, if someone really sucks the first
> thing I do is go sit down. (yes, I do sit down when I'm tired too!)
> 
> I feel like unless i am moving, I'm just sitting there being
> entertained. But if I am dancing, I am helping to create the 
> energy that ultimately makes the party happen or not. It is 
> so great to feel that your energy is helping the party to go off!!
> It makes the whole experience really worth it to me. 
> 
> Luv-
> Ms Phunk
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 01:55:08 1996
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From: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199605200854.BAA16952@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Our community
To: sfraves@spinback.demon.co.uk
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 01:54:55 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <86@spinback.demon.co.uk> from "sfraves" at May 20, 96 06:53:42 am
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Ow wow...

did you say there's a tribal future in england, too!

hey, amebas, was that where you got the name, or is this just one of 
those amazing synchronicities.  cool.

i can't wait!!!

-ann

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 02:30:06 1996
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From: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199605200925.CAA19500@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: no mad, nomad, not mad DAMN!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 02:25:47 -0700 (PDT)
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Dear all,

I can't believe it...Tom and Stacy ruined the much-hoped for Mad space?  
I'm not involved at all with Mad, and I didn't go to the recent Mad 
party, but I used to go to the weekly when it was still at Bahia.  It was 
an awesome party, and the music was to-die-for.

In support of Ethan and the Friends and Family crew:  for a lot of 
people, they are what is keeping the underground scene going.  And a lot 
of the Friends and Family crew have helped put on other underground 
parties, like the New Moon and the Full Moon.  They've been generous with 
their time and resources, and they do it for the fun of it, not because 
they want to make any money.

Nomad Interactive- the name of Tom and Stacy's party.  Nomad- is someone 
who travels around.  Are Tom and Stacy nomads?  Where did they come 
from?  And does nomad also mean No Mad?  It kind of looks that way.

I hope the Nomads will pick up and go somewhere else soon.

-Ann



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 02:36:42 1996
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From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: Geoff White <geoffw@cybertribe.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Greed, taxes, etc., only semi-rave related
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Dear Friends & Family,

My computer tells me that on Sun, 19 May 1996, Geoff shared:

(what I previously said):
> >	Just a brief point: Graft and greed are not what capitalism is 
> >about.  There are plenty of businesspeople who are out to make a profit, 
> >but will not stoop to the use of bribery, nor would they put ethical 
> >concerns about negating the hard work of others to the wind, as 
> >apparantly happened here.  I am saddened that so many people seem to have so 
> >little respect for the system of free enterprise that allows our scene to 
> >exist in the first place.
> 
> Nor are graft, greed, dominance and totaliarian control what communism is
> about, in it's pure sense, the bottom line here is human nature in both
> systems and to the extent that a group will be ruthless enough to push
> their agenda at the expense of everyone else. 

Whoa there, Geoff!  Who said anything about communism?

> Our scene happens to exist in
> a system that alledgedly*                          
> practices some form of "free enterprise", it doesn't
> exist because of free enterprise, is exist regardless of free enterprise,
> one could set up sound systems, charge admission, evade and even be busted
> by the police inside of a communist or socialist company.

(*I'm with you there)

Theoretically you could, but I think the odds against this kind of scene 
happening inside a nation with a highly socialist system are high.  
Recall that back in the '60s when they were having protests and be-ins in 
the U.S. and Western Europe, you didn't exactly hear much about the 
hippies behind the Iron Curtain.

> Also the concept
> of free enterprise or rather open markets is not new, nor was it even
> invented by Adam Smith (though he may have codified it for westerners in
> his "the wealth of Nations" which was little more than a manual for the
> proper operations of plantations), there were large market economies through
> out Africa and Asia for at least 2000, but we digress...
 
Geoff, I don't know where you get your info about "The Wealth Of 
Nations," but your slander of Adam Smith is way off.  No, he didn't 
invent free enterprise, far from it, but his classic treatise on free 
markets had nothing to do with slavery.

> >> For some people it is as you say it is, respect, love, and trust.  For
> >> others, it is all about $$$'s, $$$'s, and MORE $$$'s.  IMO, we need both.
> >> People who chose the, for lack of a better term "Ethan's Way" (ala Guy
> >> Kawasaki :) ) keep the continuum going.  The "other" way ensures that
> >> people get paid enough to do some free or lower cost things.  Not everyone
> >> can work for Apple, and not everyone can survive throwing free parties or
> >> doing low cost events.  It's all a give and take, yin-yang.  It is truly
> >> unfortunate when someone is coming from a a place of generosity and another
> >> from a place of greed.  In our system, on the whole, greed wins.
> >> Unfortunate for many, but true.
> >
> >	I agree with John that it is good to have some higher priced 
> >events, although I see it as more of a necessary evil that need only 
> >occur because we in society have our standard of living artificially 
> >lowered by the government to the point where we cannot all afford to 
> >throw free parties even if we might want to.
> 
> I assert that even if we were not taxed and if there was "unbridled
> capitalism" there would still be greedy people (if not greedy for money
> then greedy for power).

I admit that on reading my above sentence over again, my meaning was 
less than clear.  I wasn't saying that greed wouldn't exist in a 
laissez-faire system.  What I meant was, if government wasn't taking so 
much of our money, both directly and indirectly, many more people would 
be able to afford to throw free parties.

> In a totally free market system, price is always
> set by supply and demand, thus, if you can corner the market, and the demand
> is high, you can charge whatever price you want. If the governement weren't
> there, rest assured that some "greedy bastard" would perceive that if they could
> keep free parties from happening then more people will pay to come to their
> parties.  We need to first change human nature (which is a very difficult
> thing, that no one has be successful at yet)

In a true free market, you can't corner the market.  Any time you raise 
prices significantly above cost, someone will come along to compete with you.
 
> >	But I don't think that we should assume that anyone charging a 
> >significant amount of money for an event is greedy and only out for 
> >money, and anyone throwing a free event is doing it strictly out of 
> >generosity.  Better to assume the latter than the former though.
> 
> No many promoters use the "free party" as a form of promotion or
> advertising.  It seems to work.

That was my point -- free doesn't *necessarily* indicate generosity on the 
promoter's part.  But I prefer to give them the benefit of the doubt.  
Many promoters do throw free parties because they like to see people have 
fun, and more power to them.
 
> >	I don't think "greed wins" in our system.  People who "succeed" 
> >based on greed are not going to be very happy, even if they may produce 
> >envy and hatred in others who similarly fail to see that the real path to 
> >happiness and success is not based on the rapacious acquisition of money.
> 
> Dude, tell that to Bill (Gates) I'm sure he is quite happy and will be even
> happier when he gets a nanocent for ever bit that traverses ever conduit
> on the planet :)

	Bill Gates may be wealthy, I don't know if he's happy or not.  
Certainly we have examples of people who were exceedingly wealthy and not 
very happy, like Howard Hughes.

May the bass be with you,   8)

				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 08:04:44 1996
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From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Areas in SF, (NRR)
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Hey, is Noe Valley a good or bad area? Also what about Bayview district. The
street is Quesada. While I'm asking, what about Bernal Heights. I'm just
checking on places to move to and found some in the above areas. I'm not
sure what kind of areas these are and was hoping someone can tell me. Are
they worth checking out?  I just don't know the good and bad areas to live,
except the places I can obviously see. Any help would be greatful.

Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 08:17:22 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605201517.IAA03690@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: So, how was Nomad's party anyway?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Does anyone here who went to Nomad Interactive's event Saturday (?) night
feel like giving us a review of it? I'm curious !

 ( Include in your review text whether you're an Ethan fan or not :-} )

 ( PS - I am , but I won't hate you if you aren't ... )

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.coom


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 08:45:27 1996
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Subject: Fresh Start Review
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I had a pretty limited perspective on this one, but I'll do my best.  RE:
was asked to play at Fresh Start this Saturday.  It was pretty last minute,
but we were into it.  We got there around 11.  The space was on Embarcadero
right on the water.  A huge warehouse on a pier.  The ambient room (where we
were to play) was seperated off from the main space by huge cotton bails.
They had built a 15 foot wall to seperate the spaces.  There was massive
amounts of sound bleed, so the only way to hear the music in the ambient
space was to play it really loud, or play stuff with beats.  We set up, and
proceeded to peruse the space which was really nice.  Room for a thousand
easy and comfortable, too bad only a few hundred showed up.  The sound
system was really nice, and the visuals were great as well.  Good
projections.  We met the promoter Todd, and he was very nice and
appreciative of us coming down.  I didn't really dance the whole night, so I
can't comment on the vibe in the dance space.  We ended up going on earlier
than scheduled and played for about 3 1/2 hours.  We had to turn up the bass
and drums on alot of our songs to make them audible over the bleed from the
main room, which made the ambient space not very ambient, but hey, we play
the cards we are delt right?  We had a blast playing.  In the morning, dj
Rig-a-Tony (the man who taught me about records) completely warped my mind
by mixing a couple of songs together that I really love.  He just let them
play together through the entire record.  Soon after, someone opened up the
huge door out to the water, and everyone left at the party went outside to
watch the sunrise...all 30 of us.  I got to hear Orbital's "Belfast" for the
first time at a rave.  The bay was beauitful as well as the sky and the
lights on the bridge and accross the bay.  I felt like I was with family
during that time, even though I only acually knew a few of the people there.
All in all I had a great time, and would definately recommend parties thrown
by these guys again.  It was nice being able to drive right into the space
to load up our equipment as well.  :)

Rick



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 09:29:41 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 09:31:36 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: no mad, nomad, not mad DAMN!
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Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
>I can't believe it...Tom and Stacy ruined the much-hoped for Mad space?

Well...did they?  What happened on Saturday?  Were there complaints?  Is
the owner pissed?

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 09:59:25 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605201659.JAA17992@netcom22.netcom.com>
Subject: Monday on Geraldo
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 09:59:16 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 In the SF Bay area TV land , the topic on today's Geraldo will be:

 "Youths in the club scene" : Channel 5 , 3 PM

 I guess he tapes in NYC , but it will probably not be totally irrelevant
to the SF club scene. 

 I predict you could probably design a drinking contest on today's show:

 Take a sip from your glass whenever the following topics are mentioned:
* MDMA/X/ecstacy
* GHB ( or however you spell that stuff that killed River Phoenix )
* River Phoenix
* Speed/crystal/meth
* Keoki
* House music
* Techno
* Gabber
* Industrial
* Goth
* Gays/lesbians
* Club fires
* Drive by shootings & violence in general
* "The way you/those kids dress!"

 Take a swallow when these get mentioned:
* Any US DJ from not of the West Coast.

 Drain your glass if these get mentioned:
* Any West Coast DJ
* Any foreign DJ


 Feel free to add to my list ! 

Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 10:05:38 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 10:09:01 -0600
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From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Nomad/Ethan
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Ok, I just called the Origin voicemail and I'm getting a bit peeved. Not
only do they swipe the location we worked so hard at securing, but they use
the same map point and have the gall to announce it as a virgin warehouse
location. What utter bullshit. I'd like to know what happened to the
"virgin location" they had printed on their flyers for the past few weeks.
I've not had problems with them in the past, and don't know them well
enough personally to make character judgements but the way they've gone
about this really rubs me the wrong way.

Are Tom & Stacy on the list? I know they've posted before - I'd really like
to hear their side of this.

I do hope their party went without problems, anybody know? Luckily we
(Madness & Gateway) were able to instill in the space owner an awareness of
our concerns and I have hope for future responsible use of this space.

---

Ok, on this whole Ethan name-calling issue. I began to write a fairly
strong worded personal response to whomever this Greg2write person is, but
realized there's nothing I'm going to be able to say to combat his
ignorance of the facts and of who Ethan is since it's obvious he's never
met the man. I've been throwing parties for several years both here and in
LA (where promoter wars are so bad people get shot at) and I've never met
anyone with as much love, positive energy, and respect for the scene and
its members, hands down. I'm honored to have been involved in as many
parties as I have with Ethan and to have become such close friends with
him. Yeah, I think his initial post was overly inflammatory for a public
list, but I, and the rest of the Madness crew, share in his frustration
with this situation and agree with his assessment of what's happening.
Ethan is a man of the highest ideals and purest intentions and I urge
anyone who would doubt that to sit down and have a conversation with him
and actually take the time to get to know him rather than base vitriolic
rants on a solitary post by him.

Joe




(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 10:09:55 1996
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To: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked. 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 17 May 1996 16:33:15 PDT."
             <v03006c01adc258abf3c7@[207.76.139.151]> 
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 09:53:58 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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Ethan,

I feel compelled to speak up and object about your message. This
doesn't represent PLUR in any way, and is, in my opinion, quite
inappropriate to our scene, much less this list.

If you have a personal beef about an individual, take it off the list,
and send personal mail. I think I can safely say for everyone on the
list that we don't subscribe here to read such trash writing as this.

Additionally, if you have something constructive to say, by all means,
speak up!

[I won't even quote the original message here.]

-G-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 10:10:01 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked. 
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 10:09:11 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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This is a good lesson about establishing a good scene. It's also a
good lesson about that tendency to post and react in an excessively
volitile manner -- myself especially included.

Humbly returning to my cell,
-G

------- Forwarded Message

To: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive: fucked, fucked, fucked. 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 17 May 1996 19:36:56 PDT."
             <v03006c03adc26db8e68e@[207.76.139.151]> 
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 10:05:26 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>

Ethan,

I saw your follow-up. Thanks for posting it. You had some good points
to make on scene-building, and I understand your upset now.

It's one of those Monday morinigs when my sensitivity level is set way
high...

Peace,
George

------- End of Forwarded Message


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 10:30:18 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 10:30:01 -0800
To: knucklehead@email.org, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: Areas in SF, (NRR)
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tim

noe valley is often thought of as the center of the civilized universe that
is san francisco.....most of the time. good weather, ~cool~ community, and
hamano's (wicked good sushi). what more could you ask for?

however, for those of us who aren't quite ready to live in nirvana, there's
bernal heights. now, don't think i'm partial to this area just because i
live there, but it has be-yoootiful views of the city, good weather, and is
very convenient to downtown. not to say that it doesn't have it's
drawbacks, but you wouldn't be able to get me out of my apartment with a
crow bar....

hope this helps!

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 10:58:06 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Car break-ins
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Hey, y'all!  RLunatic's story got me to thinkin': car vandals may be hip to
some of the events at which we gather, finding ripe fields of cars waiting
for them to reap a bountiful harvest.  There may be no way to prevent this
from happening, but we may be able to decrease the chances of a car being
broken into.  I suggest driving a vehicle that doesn't look to spiffy,
sporty, shiny, or otherwise suggests the owner's affluence; if you have a
"nice" car, get a ride with someone whose wheels don't look as nice.  Also,
when you park, HIDE Y'ALL'S GOODIES!  If someone can't see anything
attractive inside da ride, he/she may be less likely to have in.  Any other
ideas?  We need to help each other, if we care about each other :)

Peace,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 11:24:45 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 11:23:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
Subject: Re: B2B
To: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02130502adc5796b1a6b@[157.22.240.191]>
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I didn't get to go, but I saw it "live" on the internet courtesy of 
KPIX's web page.  There were 4 cameras set up at various points on the 
course and the pictures were updated every 3 minutes.  It was pretty cool 
to see it from my bedroom!  Next year, I would love to participate, this 
time as a *local* San Franciscan! :)

love,
Amy

---------------
|   _  ,/|    |
|  '\`o O'    |
|   =(_^_)=   |         Amy Starkey
|     |U|     |         sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu
|     | |     |      
---------------


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 11:27:03 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605201826.LAA12638@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 11:26:56 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140b0badc5ff69b30e@[146.225.72.168]> from "Eric P. Peterson" at May 20, 96 10:57:59 am
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> 
> Hey, y'all!  RLunatic's story got me to thinkin': car vandals may be hip to
> some of the events at which we gather, finding ripe fields of cars waiting
> for them to reap a bountiful harvest.  There may be no way to prevent this
> from happening, but we may be able to decrease the chances of a car being
> broken into.  I suggest driving a vehicle that doesn't look to spiffy,
> sporty, shiny, or otherwise suggests the owner's affluence; if you have a
> "nice" car, get a ride with someone whose wheels don't look as nice.  Also,
> when you park, HIDE Y'ALL'S GOODIES!  If someone can't see anything
> attractive inside da ride, he/she may be less likely to have in.  Any other
> ideas?  We need to help each other, if we care about each other :)

Put a blinking red light in your car.  Alarms are just deterrents anyway,
right?  If they are going to break into your car, they probably won't care
about the alarm anyway.  But, if they have a choice between a car
that may have an alarm, and one that does not... well, you know.

Blinking red LEDS are available at Radio Shack for about 1.90.  You can
install them yourself (they might work at 12 volts?), and your won't
piss off your neighbors with false alarms!

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 11:27:07 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: SFR Logo/T-shirts
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Ok, since many people have said they don't necessarily want t-shirts, let's 
make this a general logo contest.  Or not: Perhaps this will simply be a 
collection of logos from which people can choose what logo they prefer, copy 
it, and use it to create their own t-shirt/laminate/bumper sticker/ etc....

Well, we now have TWO -- count'em, two -- designs!  I'm just going to leave 
the page up and add any and all designs to it that come my way, cool?  Get 
creative, and don't worry anymore about people voting on them.  I know I'm 
not gonna worry: I'm going to do a little dabbling in graphic design and 
throw some of my own artwork on there, and I do *not* expect people to vote 
for them...  Just a way to show off...

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 11:31:14 1996
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Subject: I'm Outta here!
Date: Mon, 20 May 96 11:30:22 -0700
From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Everyone-
Well, I unsubscribed from the list the other day, but I just wanted to 
sign back on
to say good-bye and try to explain my sorry ass self. This is not a plea 
for sympathy,
I just didn't want to disappear w/out saying anything.

This has less to do with one individual or a set of individuals than the 
tone of this
mailing list in general. Those of you who know me in real life will know 
that I have a
pretty sarcastic and flippant way of dealing with life. Perhaps my 
personality does 
not translate too well into e-mail. I seriously do not have the time, 
energy or inclination
to spend hours of my day thinking about or composing messages to sf 
raves. This 
includes the hours of deep thought involved in censoring yourself  so 
that anything you 
say does not get taken the wrong way, made fun of, or thrown back in your 
face to make 
you look like a hypocrite. For me personally, arguing over the Internet 
is not a valid way 
of spending my time when there are other aspects of my life that are in 
need of attention.

I would like to apologize to you all for my little outburst on Black 
Adder the other day
regarding my "Our Community" post. I meant what I said sincerley and I 
meant the
comments that I made about "us" to include myself, obviously. This is 
what happens
when my frustration level reaches an all time-high and I find this list 
to be a major
source of depression instead of positivity in my life. Maybe this is my 
problem, I
don't know. I wish you all luck and positive energy in your lives, and I 
hope you find
a way of dealing with these issues better than I.

I would still like to get together a group of SBay people this Friday. If 
anyone is interested,
we will be at the Gordon Biersh Brewery in San Jose starting around 7pm. 
I was there
the other day and they didn't card anyone at the door, but if this 
becomes a problem we
can always move somewhere else. The address is: 33 San Fernando between 
1st & 2nd
Streets and the phone # is: 408.294.6785. If anyone else has had a bad 
experience at
this place, please let me know and we will adjust the plans accordingly.

Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 11:38:12 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 11:36:48 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
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that's one of THE reasons i got an old tank of a car - an '84 brown volvo
with ripped up vinyl seats (honestly, a car only a mom could love  ;>
)....so far, no one's even given it a second look......

with fingers crossed
peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 11:53:20 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 11:53:55 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Metered 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Greed, taxes, etc., only semi-rave related
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i probably put my foot in my mouth or something here... oh well. =)

>Theoretically you could, but I think the odds against this kind of scene 
>happening inside a nation with a highly socialist system are high.  
>Recall that back in the '60s when they were having protests and be-ins in 
>the U.S. and Western Europe, you didn't exactly hear much about the 
>hippies behind the Iron Curtain.

err? i thought communism existed behind the iron curtain, not socialism...
besides, canada, and most of the western european countries _are_ socialist
countries. socialism isn't an economic system, it's a social system.
socialism is about people as a group over people as individuals, which seems
fairly similar to PLUR to me.

>> >	I agree with John that it is good to have some higher priced 
>> >events, although I see it as more of a necessary evil that need only 
>> >occur because we in society have our standard of living artificially 
>> >lowered by the government to the point where we cannot all afford to 
>> >throw free parties even if we might want to.
>I admit that on reading my above sentence over again, my meaning was 
>less than clear.  I wasn't saying that greed wouldn't exist in a 
>laissez-faire system.  What I meant was, if government wasn't taking so 
>much of our money, both directly and indirectly, many more people would 
>be able to afford to throw free parties.

anyway, it seems that your argument is based on the dislike of socialist
policies that restrict the individual's monetary freedom.
personally, i would rather devote my money to the good of society as a whole
and hope to bring about change on a great scale for many people rather than
for those few who by genetics, chance, or whatever have been given the
oppurtunity to make oodles of cash.
besides which, aren't free parties socialistic in nature? you throw a free
party because you want to share with others, just like in socialism.
capatalism, as an economic pricipal, does not support the sharing of wealth,
unless it will lead to personal gain. so you could ask a free party
promoter, "do you throw a party so that you will feel good about yourself or
do you throw a party so that others can have a good time?". i suspect most
promoters would say the latter.

>In a true free market, you can't corner the market.  Any time you raise 
>prices significantly above cost, someone will come along to compete with you.
doesn't government control restricting monopolies help keep prices low? as
well as laws against price-fixing? again, capatalism isn't a moral system,
so there are no scruples against something like price-fixing and screwing
other people because you control something they want.

>> Dude, tell that to Bill (Gates) I'm sure he is quite happy and will be even
>> happier when he gets a nanocent for ever bit that traverses ever conduit
>> on the planet :)
>	Bill Gates may be wealthy, I don't know if he's happy or not.  
>Certainly we have examples of people who were exceedingly wealthy and not 
>very happy, like Howard Hughes.
even if he isn't happy, he's laughing at us. =(



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 11:58:09 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 11:58:43 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Metered 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Monday on Geraldo
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> Take a sip from your glass whenever the following topics are mentioned:
>* MDMA/X/ecstacy
>* GHB ( or however you spell that stuff that killed River Phoenix )
>* River Phoenix

GHB did not kill River Phoenix. He hadn't even taken GHB the night he died.
It was just a rumour that got started because there was GHB going around
where he was, and someone mentioned that maybe he had taken some. The
coroner's report showed that he had no GHB in his system, but the media
didn't decide to widely publicize it and instead rode the frenzy about GHB.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:02:50 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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I have not got the time to write the hundred pages I would need to go 
into all the negative experiences I've had with cops.  Lets just say that 
I am bassing my opinions on personal experience.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:20:36 1996
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From: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199605201917.MAA01770@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: no mad, nomad, not mad DAMN!
To: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:17:23 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v01530505adc65cae0350@[165.227.109.23]> from "Anarch" at May 20, 96 09:31:36 am
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I don't know what happened.  I'm hoping that nothing bad went down..such 
as tagging of the neighborhood, noise complaints, etc.  Because maybe the 
space is still usable?  I hope so!!!

-Ann

> 
> Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
> >I can't believe it...Tom and Stacy ruined the much-hoped for Mad space?
> 
> Well...did they?  What happened on Saturday?  Were there complaints?  Is
> the owner pissed?
> 
> anarch@scruznet.com
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:20:43 1996
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From: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199605201918.MAA02048@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: no mad, nomad, not mad DAMN!
To: blkadder@value.net
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:18:42 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960520091105.7467B-100000@value.net> from "blkadder@value.net" at May 20, 96 09:13:58 am
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Obviously, I have no clue at all!

-Ann

> 
> On Mon, 20 May 1996, Ann Elizabeth Loraine wrote:
> 
> > Dear all,
> > 
> > I can't believe it...Tom and Stacy ruined the much-hoped for Mad space?  
> > I'm not involved at all with Mad, and I didn't go to the recent Mad 
> > party, but I used to go to the weekly when it was still at Bahia.  It was 
> > an awesome party, and the music was to-die-for.
> 
> This was not the Mad space, it was the *MADNESS* space.
> 
> > 
> > In support of Ethan and the Friends and Family crew:  for a lot of 
> > people, they are what is keeping the underground scene going.  And a lot 
> > of the Friends and Family crew have helped put on other underground 
> > parties, like the New Moon and the Full Moon.  They've been generous with 
> > their time and resources, and they do it for the fun of it, not because 
> > they want to make any money.
> 
> This is *NOT* about Friends and Family, it's about Ethan. All this stuff was 
> done without any info on the F&F planners list.
> 
> > 
> > Nomad Interactive- the name of Tom and Stacy's party.  Nomad- is someone 
> > who travels around.  Are Tom and Stacy nomads?  Where did they come 
> > from?  And does nomad also mean No Mad?  It kind of looks that way.
> 
> Where do you get this stuff from? Nomad has been around here for a couple 
> of years, predating the use of "MAD" as the name of a production.
> 
> 
> > I hope the Nomads will pick up and go somewhere else soon.
> 
> You don't know the whole story. I wish you would reserve judgement until 
> you do.
> 
>                                           Black Adder
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:20:58 1996
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From: "Rocky Mullin" <caliban@organic.com>
Message-Id: <9605201224.ZM2538@tempest.organic.com>
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:24:14 -0700
In-Reply-To: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
        "Re: Car break-ins" (May 20, 11:26am)
References: <199605201826.LAA12638@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
MiscInfo: your chaotic-good formatting slave
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On May 20, 11:26am, Troy Sheets wrote:
>
> Blinking red LEDS are available at Radio Shack for about 1.90.  You can
> install them yourself (they might work at 12 volts?), and your won't
> piss off your neighbors with false alarms!

	good call.  i routinely have chronic false-alarm cars towed
	the hell off my street.


-- 
\  c   /\  a   /\  l   /\  i   /\  b   /\  a   /\  n   /\     rocky mullin
_\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\   san francisco
  \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /organic online, inc. 
   \/      \/      \/      \/      \/ http://www.organic.com/Staff/caliban
ninja250 -- analog synthesis -- chaotic good -- the internet is my ashtray

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:28:16 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:27:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: Metered 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
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Subject: Re: Greed, taxes, etc., only semi-rave related
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Dear Friends & Family,

My computer tells me that on Mon, 20 May 1996, Metered 99 shared:

> err? i thought communism existed behind the iron curtain, not socialism...
> besides, canada, and most of the western european countries _are_ socialist
> countries. socialism isn't an economic system, it's a social system.
> socialism is about people as a group over people as individuals, which seems
> fairly similar to PLUR to me.

	Well, there are as I see it two basic types of socialism.  
Top-down coercive socialism, and bottom-up voluntary socialism.  The 
former type is the type practiced by governments.  There are varying 
degrees of coercive socialism:  The U.S. is partly socialist, Western 
European countries perhaps a little more so overall, and the former 
Soviet bloc "communist" countries were highly so.  Communism is merely an 
extreme form of socialism, which in theory would be voluntary.

> anyway, it seems that your argument is based on the dislike of socialist
> policies that restrict the individual's monetary freedom.

Guilty.

> personally, i would rather devote my money to the good of society as a whole
> and hope to bring about change on a great scale for many people rather than
> for those few who by genetics, chance, or whatever have been given the
> oppurtunity to make oodles of cash.

And in a system where individuals have monetary freedom, you are free to 
do so, in whatever way you personally deem most effective.

> besides which, aren't free parties socialistic in nature? you throw a free
> party because you want to share with others, just like in socialism.
> capatalism, as an economic pricipal, does not support the sharing of wealth,
> unless it will lead to personal gain. so you could ask a free party
> promoter, "do you throw a party so that you will feel good about yourself or
> do you throw a party so that others can have a good time?". i suspect most
> promoters would say the latter.
 
Free parties are voluntary -- if you don't want to devote time or money 
to them, you don't have to.  This is an excellent example of bottom-up 
socialism, which I'm all for.

> doesn't government control restricting monopolies help keep prices low? as
> well as laws against price-fixing? again, capatalism isn't a moral system,
> so there are no scruples against something like price-fixing and screwing
> other people because you control something they want.

Government typically protects monopolies, or runs them itself.  As far as 
price-fixing and screwing people, Uncle Sam is doing a fine job of that 
right now.  Some people will probably continue to act immorally no matter what 
economic system is in place; as Geoff White noted in an earlier message 
to me, we haven't been too successful at changing human nature.

> >	Bill Gates may be wealthy, I don't know if he's happy or not.  

> even if he isn't happy, he's laughing at us. =(

He's not laughing at us, he's laughing with us.  ;)

May the bass be with you,

				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:30:41 1996
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From: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199605201929.MAA04529@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: no mad, nomad, not mad DAMN!
To: raygun@value.net (Reagan Reid)
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:29:34 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960520072409.3026D-100000@value.net> from "Reagan Reid" at May 20, 96 07:30:21 am
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Yeah, you're right.  I've been out of it for months and have no clue as 
to what is really going on.  I just hope that this space can be used 
again!  

I've only met Tom and Stacy a couple of times, and they seemed like nice 
folks to me.  I know the Friends and Family folks a lot better, and have 
been impressed beyond telling at the careful planning they do.  Yes, you 
are right...half-fast judgements are weak.  And I do not know the whole 
story!  And probably never will.  So I will make no more 
judgements...just this..if I do see them again- Tom and Stacy- I plan to 
ask them what their opinion on all of this is.  And I'd also like to know 
how they got involved with throwing parties, and what their motivation 
is.  

-Ann

> 
> 
>  Ann, wait a minute, you * do not * know the whole story!! Tom and Stacy 
> have not ruined that space at all. This has nothing to do with Freinds 
> and Family. Alot of people are thinking about leaving F&F over this. I 
> can't really say what is going on at this time but please wait until 
> things come to a head before making these half-fast judgements.
>                                              Reagan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, 20 May 1996, Ann Elizabeth Loraine wrote:
> 
> > Dear all,
> > 
> > I can't believe it...Tom and Stacy ruined the much-hoped for Mad space?  
> > I'm not involved at all with Mad, and I didn't go to the recent Mad 
> > party, but I used to go to the weekly when it was still at Bahia.  It was 
> > an awesome party, and the music was to-die-for.
> > 
> > In support of Ethan and the Friends and Family crew:  for a lot of 
> > people, they are what is keeping the underground scene going.  And a lot 
> > of the Friends and Family crew have helped put on other underground 
> > parties, like the New Moon and the Full Moon.  They've been generous with 
> > their time and resources, and they do it for the fun of it, not because 
> > they want to make any money.
> > 
> > Nomad Interactive- the name of Tom and Stacy's party.  Nomad- is someone 
> > who travels around.  Are Tom and Stacy nomads?  Where did they come 
> > from?  And does nomad also mean No Mad?  It kind of looks that way.
> > 
> > I hope the Nomads will pick up and go somewhere else soon.
> > 
> > -Ann
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:31:35 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605201931.MAA18458@netcom7.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Monday on Geraldo
To: erase99@sirius.com (Metered 99)
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:31:28 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960520185843.0088e124@140.174.229.14> from "Metered 99" at May 20, 96 11:58:43 am
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[ to sfraves list ]
> 
> GHB did not kill River Phoenix. He hadn't even taken GHB the night he died.
> It was just a rumour that got started because there was GHB going around
> where he was, and someone mentioned that maybe he had taken some. The
> coroner's report showed that he had no GHB in his system, but the media
> didn't decide to widely publicize it and instead rode the frenzy about GHB.

 Even more probability then of it coming up during today's Geraldo ...

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:31:58 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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I don't want to start any blasphemous rumors, but I think that God's got a
sick sense of humor, and when I die I expect to find Him laughing...

'nuff said.  Peace out :)

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:45:48 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Posting
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Just a general note to everyone:

One of the *RUDEST* possible thing you can do to someone on the Internet 
is to post their private mail to you publicly. I know that some people 
may not have known this but please, don't do it....

                                       Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 12:55:05 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:51:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: Albert Chan <adchan@ucdavis.edu>
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To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Areas in SF, (NRR)
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Noe Valley: good.  Must be alternative-lifestyle friendly, but is 
definitely a rad place to be, if you can afford the rent.

Bayview: bad.  Rent's cheap for a reason- crime, violence.

Bernal Heights: somewhere in between NV and Bayview.

Course this is only my limited experience.  I'm a Richmond/Sunset boy myself.

happy hunting.

-berT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 13:25:39 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 13:29:08 -0600
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Origin
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Just an FYI, apparantly the Origin party didn't get shut down, although
there were noise complaints and the police did show up more than once.

Points of clarification:

1. When I referred to the Madness crew in my last message, I meant the core
members: Ethan, Alex, Jon Santos, and myself.

2. I have no personal animosity towards Tom & Stacy, only a strong
disagreement with their actions as I've spelled out in previous messages.
Frankly, they're going to keep doing parties, and we're going to keep doing
parties, and the scene's going to survive. It'd be nice if everyone were in
this for the same reasons and liked and respected one another, but as
others have pointed out, that may not always be the case, and that's fine.

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 13:37:55 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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>Just a general note to everyone:
>
>One of the *RUDEST* possible thing you can do to someone on the Internet
>is to post their private mail to you publicly. I know that some people
>may not have known this but please, don't do it....
>
>                                       Black Adder

That's right!  Asking permission first is the thing to do, especially if
the content is of a highly personal nature, if ya wanna quote something to
illustrate a point.  Once again, we've been here before, so let's move on
:)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 13:39:35 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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I'm curious to know what the appeal is to living in SF anyway.  What are
the pros, and how do they stack up against the cons?  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 13:40:12 1996
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From: synapsisoverload <amdice@puc.edu>
To: peter fogel <peterbf@ix.netcom.com>
cc: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: B2B/SpaceTeddy Review
In-Reply-To: <199605200425.VAA07842@dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com>
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> You wrote: 
> >
> >So who else did the Bay to Breakers this AM ???
> >
> I did it for the first time and also had a great time.  It was great 
> seeing all the creative outfits people were wearing, and hearing all 
> the music along the way.
> I got to hear techno in 2 spots along the way which gave me an extra 
> boost. 
> I found this to be much more fun than the sf marathon.  Very nice wacky 
> vibe throughout the race.
> 
> :)
> peter
> 
There were at one point eight of us at the R during Footstock. Julie, 
Paul, John, two Sarahs, Cruchman, myself and someone else I didn't get 
the name of. We were there til at least noon. Very nice weather for the 
run and yes a wacky conglomeration of people all around. Now I need to go 
check the paper to see if I just barely made it in. Not a bad finish 
to an evening with Space Teddy--very very good music by the way. Keoki 
didn't have any outbursts (he even gave Mars a backrub when he first came 
in) but his set was definately the most average of the night, almost 
everything else was at a higher notch. It never got too hot at the 
Jerrold deli but water was the $2/bottle variety. I liked the lighting 
quite abit and they were playing scrambled movies on the walls upstairs. 
Ended at just after six giving me plenty of time to get over to the 
starting line for the race. Saw Cruchman, the two Sarahs (overflowing 
with vibe) and Paul, as well as a couple that recognized me from Circa 
'96 which was a pleasant surprise, and a group on vacation from Spain 
that thought I was crazy to be going to the race afterwards but wished me 
luck all the same. Now I just need alittle more sleep. : )

have an excellent day everyone

  Austin                             
  Tinsau                    

            S.F. Born and Raved!                          










From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 14:08:07 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Yosemite info Website
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Attention Yosimite trippers: check out the following URL if you have
Netscape; maybe our illustrious coordinator will find the info of use:
http://www.cdiguide.com/209/a_age/redwoods.html

Later!  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 14:09:02 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu (Jake Reichert)
Subject: Re: dissing cops, etc.
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>I have not got the time to write the hundred pages I would need to go 
>into all the negative experiences I've had with cops.  Lets just say that 
>I am bassing my opinions on personal experience.

I understand how having negative experiences with police officers could
color your view of the profession, but let's face it.  Your experiences with
them do not embody the whole of what they do every day.  I know people that
would not be alive today if it hadn't been for police officers.  Does that
make them all bad?  

I just get scared when I see people extrapolating their personal experiences
into a judgement of a whole group.  What if you had had a lot of negative
personal experiences with african-americans?  Does that then prove that all
of them are inherently evil?  Please, people, remember that personal
experience can only tell you so much.  You are only 1/4.5 billionth of the
population of the earth, and have only had 1/4.5 billionth of those experiences.

And, by the way, without having ever even met Black Adder's father, it seems
VERY closeminded to judge him like that.  If you were to sit down and have a
talk with him, I'm sure your feelings would be different.

Just a thought, 

Jake


Jake Reichert			|  I used to be indecisive/
reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu	|  But now I'm not so sure...		
				|                    -The The
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                     "LONELY IS AS LONELY DOES"
B.C. Gilbert/G. Lewis ------------------------    The Happy Family
A=====================================V  Bulgarian Voices | Pixies 
|          |              |   ____    |  Bauhaus |  Frazier Chorus
|     /|   |      /\      |  |    \   |  Michael Brook |  Spirea X
|    / |   |     /  \     |  |     \  |  The Breeders |  Colourbox
|   /  |   |    /    \    |  |      | |  Dead Can Dance |  Dif Juz
|  /___|   |   /______\   |  |      | |  Throwing Muses |  The The
|      |   |  /        \  |  |     /  |  Clan of Xymox | Rema-Rema
|      |   | /          \ |  |___ /   |  Cocteau Twins | Liquorice  
A=====================================M  Lisa Germano  | M|A|R|R|S
X Mal Deutschland | Dance Chapter | Insides |   The Birthday Party
A.R. Kane | Rowland S. Howard & Lydia Lunch  | C.V.O  |  Air Miami
Ultra Vivid Scene | Unrest | Pieter Nooten/Michael Brook | Swallow
That Dog. | Psychotic Tanks  |  Lisa Gerrard  | Last Dance |  Lush
Modern English |  Budd/Fraser/Guthrie/Raymonde |  This Mortal Coil   
The Wolfgang Press |  Richenel |  His Name Is Alive  | Pale Saints
The Glee Club    ---------------------------------    Colin Newman
                       "LONELY IS AN EYESORE"      


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 14:23:18 1996
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Subject: New Newsgroup
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OK I guess Im just the most perfect person in the whole world and everyone
else is a complete Moron. Especially all you sf ravers! I mean, you are all
greedy, drug dealers, addicts etc.... 
Now before I get a ton of flames....please post all replies to:
sfraves@hyperreal.com/idiotic.posts/flames  I can't afford to sort through
all of these shit posts anymore folks. Lets just love one another, and if we
have a gripe lets make them through personal e-mail. Everything posted here,
just becomes a personal attack on someone else, and it is really just
pointless!

Please post flames//replies to Sfraves@hyperreal.com/idiotic.posts/flames

Jonathan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 14:31:08 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 20:53:18 GMT
From: sfraves <sfraves@spinback.demon.co.uk>
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In your message dated Monday 20, May 1996 you wrote :
> Ow wow...
> 
> did you say there's a tribal future in england, too!
> 
> hey, amebas, was that where you got the name, or is this just one of 
> those amazing synchronicities.  cool.
> 
> i can't wait!!!
> 
> -ann
> 

For your info ann there is!

Only problem being that although the tickets have been sold, the police managed 
to get an injunction to have it stopped.

Another piece of justice from the criminal justice act :(

regards,

Daryll

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 14:37:48 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 14:35:12 -0700
Message-Id: <199605202135.OAA08625@dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
To: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>

>> when you park, HIDE Y'ALL'S GOODIES!  If someone can't see anything
>> attractive inside da ride, he/she may be less likely to have in.  
Any other
>> ideas?  We need to help each other, if we care about each other :)

I did HIDE all my goodies! They found my goodies and took them! I 
suggest now that if you have a nice car, go out and purchase a car 
cover with a CABLE LOCK! It may take about 5 minutes of your time but 
it WILL be worth it!


>
>Put a blinking red light in your car.  Alarms are just deterrents 
anyway,
>right?  If they are going to break into your car, they probably won't 
care

That's true! I had an alarm on my car and they opened up my hood and 
cut the wires to my siren and unhooked my positive battery cable. 

I found out that during that night, my car wasn't the only one that got 
hit.

ADam
                R.Lunatic

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 15:47:34 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 15:47:14 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Two words:  Keoki, Sunset
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Yup!  Keoki spun Sunset.  Suprised no one's mentioend anything about it, I
guess people are just too damn busy trying to find out who the fuck
Greg2write@aol.com is.  ;^)

The reviews seemed mixed.  Personally I though it was pretty good music,
definitely better towards the end, but not necessarily mixed that well.  It
ranmged from deep house to rather fast/technoey stuff.  Sort of all over,
which I heard he does.  It looked like he was having fun, joking around
behind the decks, banging records on his head, spinning in his socks on the
grass.  I was rather happy to have him come to a Sunset, because I'd
probably not go see him at an exspensive club.

Sunset got a late start (read: 4pm the message went up).  It filled up
late.  There were a lot of clubbers, it looked like, but that's fine.

Peace!

Tone



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 15:52:20 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 15:52:01 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Fight at Pack-a-Bowl (gun?!)
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So, I found it rather interesting that there were so many positive posts
(appropriately so) about Pack-A-Bowl last Thursday, and then heard that a
fight broke out around midnight and someone (word has it) pulled a gun and
the place cleared.  I guess those posting Friday must have split right
before that incident, or surely they would have mentioned it.

Weird huh?  What a weekend!?

Tone



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 15:53:25 1996
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Message-ID: <01BB4664.43282940@n143.solano.community.net>
From: b e n   c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
To: "'Metered 99'" <erase99@sirius.com>
Cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.org'" <sfraves@hyperreal.org>
Subject: RE: Greed, taxes, etc., only semi-rave related
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 15:51:47 -0700
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Metered99 wrote:

>err? i thought communism existed behind the iron curtain, not =
socialism...
>besides, canada, and most of the western european countries _are_ =
socialist
>countries. socialism isn't an economic system, it's a social system.
>socialism is about people as a group over people as individuals, which =
seems
>fairly similar to PLUR to me.

"socialism: an economic system in which the government owns the basic =
means of production, determines the use of resources, distributes =
products and wages, and provides social services such as education, =
health care and welfare."=20

>anyway, it seems that your argument is based on the dislike of =
socialist
>policies that restrict the individual's monetary freedom.
>personally, i would rather devote my money to the good of society as a =
whole
>and hope to bring about change on a great scale for many people rather =
than
>for those few who by genetics, chance, or whatever have been given the
>oppurtunity to make oodles of cash.

I would like to do the same, but I disagree that it is the governments =
job to do so. I believe it is the responsibility of each individual to =
make this decision and take the necessary action.

>again, capatalism isn't a moral system,
>so there are no scruples against something like price-fixing and =
screwing
>other people because you control something they want.

and niether is socialism a moral system. trying to use an economic =
system to provide moral guidance won't get us far; our social problems =
are much too complex. it is possible to be a responsible capitalist, to =
recognize that in order to make profits and benefit in the long term, =
you can't take advantage of the people buying your product, or the =
people making it.

b e n   c h u n

ben_chun@community.net
http://community.net/~ben_chun/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:02:04 1996
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To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
From: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 10:57 AM 5/20/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Hey, y'all!  RLunatic's story got me to thinkin': car vandals may be hip to
>some of the events at which we gather, finding ripe fields of cars waiting
>for them to reap a bountiful harvest.  There may be no way to prevent this
>from happening, but we may be able to decrease the chances of a car being
>broken into.  I suggest driving a vehicle that doesn't look to spiffy,
>sporty, shiny, or otherwise suggests the owner's affluence; if you have a
>"nice" car, get a ride with someone whose wheels don't look as nice.  Also,
>when you park, HIDE Y'ALL'S GOODIES!  If someone can't see anything
>attractive inside da ride, he/she may be less likely to have in.  Any other
>ideas?  We need to help each other, if we care about each other :)
>
>Peace,
>
>- E
>
>
>
>
Ever went to one of the parties that were held at the old One Step Beyond in
Santa Clara a few years back? 
I remember seeing ripe fields of cars at the beginning on the night and
seeing sparkling fields of broken glass in the morning. Oooooh, it was bad.
I was pissed once, cause I lost an illuminating frisbee. A car stereo (even
a car) can be replaced, but not an illuminating frisbee from 1978. Nope,
they got glow-in-the-dark ones available, bot not one with L.E.D.'s around
the rim. 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:06:18 1996
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To: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
From: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 11:36 AM 5/20/96 -0800, you wrote:
>that's one of THE reasons i got an old tank of a car - an '84 brown volvo
>with ripped up vinyl seats (honestly, a car only a mom could love  ;>
>)....so far, no one's even given it a second look......
>
>with fingers crossed
>peace
>melis
>
>
>
>
Right on!! I gots me a 1989 sky blue Ford Taurus ("L" model) with key
scratches and no hubcaps. But, old blue might be ugly and totally
unappealing on the outside, but it's really comfy (and roomy) on the inside.
Except that it is awfully blue inside -- I think it makes people tired.
Maybe if I put old T-shirts over the seats as seat covers (ha ha).

Courtney   


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:08:24 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 16:07:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Fight at Pack-a-Bowl (gun?!)
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I was there 'til 1:15 and didn't notice anyone clearing out nor a gun 
being pulled.  But, I was also in the bar area away from all of the main 
action.  The only thing vaguely interesting that I noticed was teenaged 
angst!

-kaysee

On Mon, 20 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:

> So, I found it rather interesting that there were so many positive posts
> (appropriately so) about Pack-A-Bowl last Thursday, and then heard that a
> fight broke out around midnight and someone (word has it) pulled a gun and
> the place cleared.  I guess those posting Friday must have split right
> before that incident, or surely they would have mentioned it.
> 
> Weird huh?  What a weekend!?
> 
> Tone
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:18:05 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Two words:  Keoki, Sunset
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Heard Keoki was on H, or some such thing.  Heard he was "doin' his thing."
Heard he was taken away from the dex...??  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:20:26 1996
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From: Mohan Veloo <mveloo@cisco.com>
To: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: CONCERT June 21-23
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 16:14:35 -0700
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Hi,
I got this information from a friend. Can anyone confirm this. Is Big Bear Mountain somewhere near LA?

>
>
>Subject:  JUNE 21-23 (somewhere at Big Bear Mntn)
>
>
>Show should be announced this weekend or thereabouts....
>
>
>
>Friday Night:   Zion Train
>                Underworld
>                The Orb
>                Leftfield (as yet unconfirmed)
>
>Saturday Night: Meat Beat Manifesto
>                Orbital
>                Ministry (a special retro set from 'With Sympathy' ;)
>                Chemical Brothers
>                Massive Attack (invited, not confirmed)
>
>
>that's all the news for now





________________________________________________________________
Mohan Veloo [mveloo@cisco.com]
Cisco Systems, Inc.  Sales Information Systems
Direct :		408-526-6814
Fax :		408-526-8811
Pager :		1-800-365-4578 
Pager Email :	mveloo@airnote.net
________________________________________________________________



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:27:55 1996
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To: Mohan Veloo <mveloo@cisco.com>
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: CONCERT June 21-23
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Where is Big Bear Mountain?  What state?  What area of said state?  Thank you.

Rick

At 04:14 PM 5/20/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Hi,
>I got this information from a friend. Can anyone confirm this. Is Big Bear
Mountain somewhere near LA?
>
>>
>>
>>Subject:  JUNE 21-23 (somewhere at Big Bear Mntn)
>>
>>
>>Show should be announced this weekend or thereabouts....
>>
>>
>>
>>Friday Night:   Zion Train
>>                Underworld
>>                The Orb
>>                Leftfield (as yet unconfirmed)
>>
>>Saturday Night: Meat Beat Manifesto
>>                Orbital
>>                Ministry (a special retro set from 'With Sympathy' ;)
>>                Chemical Brothers
>>                Massive Attack (invited, not confirmed)
>>
>>
>>that's all the news for now
>
>
>
>
>
>________________________________________________________________
>Mohan Veloo [mveloo@cisco.com]
>Cisco Systems, Inc.  Sales Information Systems
>Direct :		408-526-6814
>Fax :		408-526-8811
>Pager :		1-800-365-4578 
>Pager Email :	mveloo@airnote.net
>________________________________________________________________
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:35:20 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605202334.QAA17655@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: CONCERT June 21-23
To: rdriffle@ucdavis.edu (Rick Riffle)
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 16:34:24 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: mveloo@cisco.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605202327.QAA28677@franc.ucdavis.edu> from "Rick Riffle" at May 20, 96 04:27:04 pm
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Big Bear is just out of Los Angeles.  Although this party may be happening,
the bands listed to be performing is a joke... I think.

-troy

> 
> Where is Big Bear Mountain?  What state?  What area of said state?  Thank you.
> 
> Rick
> 
> At 04:14 PM 5/20/96 -0700, you wrote:
> >Hi,
> >I got this information from a friend. Can anyone confirm this. Is Big Bear
> Mountain somewhere near LA?
> >
> >>
> >>
> >>Subject:  JUNE 21-23 (somewhere at Big Bear Mntn)
> >>
> >>
> >>Show should be announced this weekend or thereabouts....
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Friday Night:   Zion Train
> >>                Underworld
> >>                The Orb
> >>                Leftfield (as yet unconfirmed)
> >>
> >>Saturday Night: Meat Beat Manifesto
> >>                Orbital
> >>                Ministry (a special retro set from 'With Sympathy' ;)
> >>                Chemical Brothers
> >>                Massive Attack (invited, not confirmed)
> >>
> >>
> >>that's all the news for now
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >________________________________________________________________
> >Mohan Veloo [mveloo@cisco.com]
> >Cisco Systems, Inc.  Sales Information Systems
> >Direct :		408-526-6814
> >Fax :		408-526-8811
> >Pager :		1-800-365-4578 
> >Pager Email :	mveloo@airnote.net
> >________________________________________________________________
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:42:48 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: CONCERT June 21-23
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It's in the (909) area, according to some real estate Website.  - E

>Big Bear is just out of Los Angeles.  Although this party may be happening,
>the bands listed to be performing is a joke... I think.
>
>-troy
>
>>
>> Where is Big Bear Mountain?  What state?  What area of said state?
>>Thank you.
>>
>> Rick
>>
>> At 04:14 PM 5/20/96 -0700, you wrote:
>> >Hi,
>> >I got this information from a friend. Can anyone confirm this. Is Big Bear
>> Mountain somewhere near LA?
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Subject:  JUNE 21-23 (somewhere at Big Bear Mntn)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Show should be announced this weekend or thereabouts....
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Friday Night:   Zion Train
>> >>                Underworld
>> >>                The Orb
>> >>                Leftfield (as yet unconfirmed)
>> >>
>> >>Saturday Night: Meat Beat Manifesto
>> >>                Orbital
>> >>                Ministry (a special retro set from 'With Sympathy' ;)
>> >>                Chemical Brothers
>> >>                Massive Attack (invited, not confirmed)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>that's all the news for now
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >________________________________________________________________
>> >Mohan Veloo [mveloo@cisco.com]
>> >Cisco Systems, Inc.  Sales Information Systems
>> >Direct :             408-526-6814
>> >Fax :                408-526-8811
>> >Pager :              1-800-365-4578
>> >Pager Email :        mveloo@airnote.net
>> >________________________________________________________________
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me
>tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
>http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
>troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:48:15 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 16:47:49 -0800
To: epaul@synopsys.com (Eric P. Peterson), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Two words:  Keoki, Sunset
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

At 4:18 PM  -0700 5/20/96, Eric P. Peterson wrote:
>Heard Keoki was on H, or some such thing.

1) He didn't display any telling signs as such.  2)  So what if he was, right?

>Heard he was "doin' his thing."
 I have absolutely no idea what that would be, besides the fact that he's a
DJ and he was in fact spinning records.  :^)

>Heard he was taken away from the dex...??  - E
The party ended probably a little after nine, usual Sunset ending time, and
unless someone came on "the dex" after I split, he ended the night.

TR



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 16:48:25 1996
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From: Julie Mills <julie@catapent.com>
To: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Bay to Breakers!
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 16:49:29 -0700
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This is to announce that our very own Austin (after partying all =
Saturday night) did indeed finish the Bay To Breakers in the top 7% of =
all racers!!!!  Amazing!

Congratulations Austin!!!!!!

Julie

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 17:04:07 1996
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word on the street is that those aren't the only dates and that you may 
not have to worry about commuting out of SF for the show... but I think 
that's still suppose to be a secret for now. we'll see...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 17:12:10 1996
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From: Mohan Veloo <mveloo@cisco.com>
To: Mohan Veloo <mveloo@cisco.com>, "'MIKE BOLGER'" <dislex@sfsu.edu>
Cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: CONCERT June 21-23
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 17:05:40 -0700
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WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!
if this is true, then it'll be the MOST MEGA show/rave this year??
I mean, Orbital, Underworld, Chemical Bros, Leftfield, Orb and Massive Attack in the same show??
Sounds a little too good to be true... but i'll check it up with my friend who's with a record company in LA and get back to you guys...

peace
Mohan


----------
From: 	MIKE BOLGER[SMTP:dislex@sfsu.edu]
Sent: 	Monday, May 20, 1996 10:04 AM
To: 	Mohan Veloo
Cc: 	'sfraves@hyperreal.com'
Subject: 	Re: CONCERT June 21-23


word on the street is that those aren't the only dates and that you may 
not have to worry about commuting out of SF for the show... but I think 
that's still suppose to be a secret for now. we'll see...




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 17:22:12 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 17:25:40 -0600
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: CONCERT June 21-23
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 5:14 PM  -0600 5/20/96, Mohan Veloo wrote:
>Hi,
>I got this information from a friend. Can anyone confirm this. Is Big Bear
>Mountain somewhere near LA?
>
>>
>>
>>Subject:  JUNE 21-23 (somewhere at Big Bear Mntn)
>>
>>
>>Show should be announced this weekend or thereabouts....
>>
>>
>>
>>Friday Night:   Zion Train
>>                Underworld
>>                The Orb
>>                Leftfield (as yet unconfirmed)
>>
>>Saturday Night: Meat Beat Manifesto
>>                Orbital
>>                Ministry (a special retro set from 'With Sympathy' ;)
>>                Chemical Brothers
>>                Massive Attack (invited, not confirmed)
>>
>>
>>that's all the news for now
>

Yeah, it appears to be happening. Philip Blaine's putting it on and he
usually delivers what he promises. He's also more of a concert promoter
than rave promoter, but with that kind of lineup so what?

213 960-5077 for info. Big Bear is about 2 hours out of LA. (East I think)

Joe

(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 18:39:19 1996
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From: Mohan Veloo <mveloo@cisco.com>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: CONCERT June 21-23
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 18:33:22 -0700
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Yeah,
Just called the number provided by Joe ... it IS HAPPENING!!! June 21-22!!! A 2 day festival!!!
Looks like I'll need to book those cheap 21 day advance tickets soon from Southwest!!!

mohan...
----------
From: 	Joe Rice[SMTP:ambient@netcom.com]
Sent: 	Monday, May 20, 1996 4:25 PM
To: 	sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: 	Re: CONCERT June 21-23

Yeah, it appears to be happening. Philip Blaine's putting it on and he
usually delivers what he promises. He's also more of a concert promoter
than rave promoter, but with that kind of lineup so what?

213 960-5077 for info. Big Bear is about 2 hours out of LA. (East I think)

Joe

(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 






From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 19:02:30 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 19:02:19 -0700
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: Wayne Correia <wayne@club.net>
Subject: RE: CONCERT June 21-23
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That party will be happening up here, too. We're (domain.net/club.net)
hosting their web site.... more details to follow :-)

-w



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 20:32:40 1996
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 20 May 1996 20:32:35 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 20:32:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: drenalin <drenalin@OREGON.UOREGON.EDU>
Subject: RE: CONCERT June 21-23
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Well I just did some web snooping and I found that Underworld are 
scheduled to play in Portugal on June 21 and then Leftfield (to be conf) 
for June 22.  This is for a big festival in Lisbon, the Super Bock Super 
Rock Festival.

So that would contradict the fact that Underworld is in/near LA on the 21st.

scott

couldnt find concert info for orb or orbital.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 20:46:22 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, hgmeier@hooked.net
Subject: A Fresh Start Indeed!
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Before I go off on my personal fulfillment, may I first say that these square
one fellas are the shit!  I've worked with them through Groove Trip, &
they're nothin but good.  We arrived @1:30 & Rigatony was ending his set with
"I feel love" (this ties into the story later on), anyway great vibe setting
song.  Because of the smaller crowd (shoulda had me do your flyers boys!) in
a rather large & awesome new space, the energy level remained moderate, but
positive.  The people were the frosting on this cake though, each and
everyone of the peoples I got a chance to interact with were just lovely.
  ......but none,  none  as lovely as the one I had the opportunity of being
there with.  A mystical goddess created somewhere amongst the realm of Tom
Robbin's "Another Road Side Attraction" and Eden.  Let me just say I am in
fear of the intense attraction I have toward this creature of divinity!
WhoaH!  Done with that..
Where was I?, Oh yes, decorations, yeah they were great! Nutralight set the
mood just right and Rick and Eric (Re) were just goin nuts, 5 hours
straight!! of the most beautiful sounds, (minus the bleed through from the
main area)  If any SFRavers want a good taste of quality Digereedooing
(<sp?), check these guys out at RAW foods next Friday. 
So to top it all off, there I stood, warm and loopy, looking out the window
of my new aquantance's 30th floor vacant office window at 6:30AM looking down
unto the bayside warehouse we had just bonded so tightly in.  I could see the
pier upon which all the happy ravers were standing, awaiting the rising sun.
 I thought to myself

A really blissed up Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 20:50:37 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 20:50:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: drenalin <drenalin@OREGON.UOREGON.EDU>
cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: CONCERT June 21-23
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> Well I just did some web snooping and I found that Underworld are 
> scheduled to play in Portugal on June 21 and then Leftfield (to be conf) 
> for June 22.  This is for a big festival in Lisbon, the Super Bock Super 
> Rock Festival.
> 
> So that would contradict the fact that Underworld is in/near LA on the 21st.

Whenever there's a message that says:

"Underworld, Orbital, The Prodigy, 808 State, The Shamen, The Orb, Sabres 
of Paridise, The Grid, etc. etc. are all playing at blah blah...."

I ignore, cuz it's BS...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 21:01:45 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 21:01:10 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Bay to Breakers and the BetaRavers!
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Wow, what a weekend! After going to Space Teddy and dancing to some 
incredible music with other SFRavers and meeting some more new brothers
and sisters I left at about 5:30 or so to go and get ready for Bay to
Breakers. I thought nothing could equal all that fun and excellent music
at Space Teddy but that was before I reached the one mile marker or so
along the race route...where some promoters who call themselves the
BetaRavers had opened up the door to their warehouse and had setup
their sound system with a dj spinning some outstanding techno right
there along the race route on Howard!! The tunes were too good to pass
up so I just stopped right there and danced with the promoters for 
about an hour or so until all the runners/walkers had passed and a
cop came and broke it up :( I wish I would've caught the djs name so I
could check him out at a party sometime, oh well, maybe someone knows
who it was? They were also handing out some really cool neon flyers
which said:

Like electricity
coursing thru wire,
you are a pulse of energy
(Em)POWERING us all

Charge On!

With Love and Light from the BETARAVERS

Some great moments were when one of the Hot Dog on a stick centipede
girls got down with us...boy she must've been to a few raves herself.
One of the Salmon who apparently got separated from his school of fish
swimming upstream against the tide of runners and walkers started 
floundering around with us! (pun intended sorry about that). Most of 
all it was wonderful to see the biggest smile on a handicapped girl 
being pushed by her mother, both of them laughing at us dancing up
a storm! 

After the cop broke that up, I ran and caught up with the rest of the
pack and if an hour+ of great music wasn't enough I stopped again at a
house near the beginning of Golden Gate where a dj from Spundae was
playing more superb music! I talked to one person who was sitting on
the steps of the house and he said they had been at Space Teddy too,
unfortunately, my memory is pretty bad and I forgot his and the djs
name, sorry about that.

I finally made it to the letter "R" at the polo fields a couple hours or
so later where our family members Austin (top 7% finisher!), Julie,
Sarah, Sarah, Paul, and Crunch were hanging out...Thanks for the Jolly
Ranchers, they gave me enough fuel to walk the two miles to Geary to 
catch a bus home!

Thank you to the BetaRavers and the people at the house near Golden Gate
for making Bay to Breakers absolutely the best of the four I've done so
far!

Peace and Love,
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 21:05:18 1996
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To: Mohan Veloo <mveloo@cisco.com>
cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: CONCERT June 21-23
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On Mon, 20 May 1996, Mohan Veloo wrote:

> Yeah,
> Just called the number provided by Joe ... it IS HAPPENING!!! June 21-22!!! A 2 day festival!!!
> Looks like I'll need to book those cheap 21 day advance tickets soon from Southwest!!!

Southwest has a deal where you book one person at full price($151 to LAX) 
and then it's only $53 for each additional person. And that's round trip...

                                           Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 21:30:09 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 21:26:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Matthew James Plunkett <plunkett@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: RE: CONCERT June 21-23
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Fly to Ontario, it's an hour closer to Big Bear.

On Mon, 20 May 1996 blkadder@value.net wrote:

> Southwest has a deal where you book one person at full price($151 to LAX) 
> and then it's only $53 for each additional person. And that's round trip...
> 
>                                            Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 22:28:12 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 22:28:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
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To: Julie Mills <julie@catapent.com>
cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Bay to Breakers!
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On Mon, 20 May 1996, Julie Mills wrote:

> This is to announce that our very own Austin (after partying all 
>Saturday night) did indeed finish the Bay To Breakers in the top 7% of 
>all racers!!!!  Amazing! > Congratulations Austin!!!!!!
> Julie

Right on austin!!!! i'm not quite sure how you did it. staying up all 
night and then running a 7 mile race is pretty impressive if you ask me. are 
you super man??!!:)
horray for john(fellow scorpio) too- dancin all night long and then 
running and dancing your way through the race!!
space teddy was a blast and bay to breakers was a great (and wacked out) 
way to finish off the weekend.
thanx to paul, other sarah, julie and all the rest of you crazy kiddos!!

*hugs* sarah 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 23:41:42 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 23:43:44 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: True People
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I picked up a copy of "True People: the Detroit Techno Album" at
yesterday's KFJC record swap.  It's a compilation of twenty Detroit
classics, and it's definitely recommended.  I've only got through the first
dozen or so, and I love it.  I hadn't realized it 'til now, but back in 90
or 91 when I was first getting into the scene, before I knew what to call
it, probably before I'd heard of "rave" at all, it was the old-school
Detroit sound that was drawing me into the whole thing (with a little
cross-pollination from neo-industrial and New Wave).  This album is full of
reminiscences, and it still rocks, and no doubt will keep on rocking for
years to come.  It's available as 5 12" discs or 2 CDs.

I also got a Japanese double CD of Derrick May, "Innovator."  I haven't
listened to it yet, but it looks mighty cool.  Don't know if there's a US
version.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 20 23:44:06 1996
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Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 23:43:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Re: CONCERT June 21-23
To: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
cc: Mohan Veloo <mveloo@cisco.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605202327.QAA28677@franc.ucdavis.edu>
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Big Bear is located in San Bernadino County, although I have always known 
it as Big Bear Lake...  San Bernadino is located about 45 miles east of 
Down Town Los Angeles, another 20 takes you up the mountain...

on the line up...  
I seriously doubt Ministry 
would be caught dead playing anything from 'With Sympathy' unless they 
are compltely desperate for Heroin $. ;-)  BESIDES THEY ARE PLAYING AT THE 
WARFIELD IN SAN FRANCISCO THIS SATURDAY NIGHT.!!!..(I have a ticket)...

Sounds like a scam to me.....  --Mau  

On Mon, 20 May 1996, Rick Riffle wrote:

> Where is Big Bear Mountain?  What state?  What area of said state?  Thank you.
> 
> Rick
> 
> At 04:14 PM 5/20/96 -0700, you wrote:
> >Hi,
> >I got this information from a friend. Can anyone confirm this. Is Big Bear
> Mountain somewhere near LA?
> >
> >>
> >>
> >>Subject:  JUNE 21-23 (somewhere at Big Bear Mntn)
> >>
> >>
> >>Show should be announced this weekend or thereabouts....
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Friday Night:   Zion Train
> >>                Underworld
> >>                The Orb
> >>                Leftfield (as yet unconfirmed)
> >>
> >>Saturday Night: Meat Beat Manifesto
> >>                Orbital
> >>                Ministry (a special retro set from 'With Sympathy' ;)
> >>                Chemical Brothers
> >>                Massive Attack (invited, not confirmed)
> >>
> >>
> >>that's all the news for now
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >________________________________________________________________
> >Mohan Veloo [mveloo@cisco.com]
> >Cisco Systems, Inc.  Sales Information Systems
> >Direct :		408-526-6814
> >Fax :		408-526-8811
> >Pager :		1-800-365-4578 
> >Pager Email :	mveloo@airnote.net
> >________________________________________________________________
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 08:22:51 1996
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The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 09:01:50 1996
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Message-Id: <199605211601.JAA27378@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: Geraldo's Club Kids (NYC)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 09:01:14 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Just a short report of yesterday afternoon's show. It seems he does this
theme every few years since 1990. He invites some of the more flamboyant
young club folks in New York City to come on his show and talk about going
out to clubs every night , getting stoned, and dressing strange.

 Some differentiation was made between club kids and ravers (..."baggy
pants...","....club scene..is more gay and lesbian...).

 Geraldo always made sure to mention the topic of drugs and "the dark
side" of being a club kid about every 8 minutes or so.

 The folks on stage were what I'd expected. The audience I wasn't quite
prepared for ... a mix of multicolor hair/tattooed/pierced folks and 
"regular" people in various stages of "look at the freaks!" facial
expressions. I guess I don't watch these shows often enough.

 If anyone's interested, I could look at the videotape again to get the
names of some of the folks onstage. What I remember is Walt Paper and
Richie Rich . There was also a guy who was a NYC DJ/promoter/manager ,
a bunch of former-ravers who had formed a "cyberpunk" band, and a gal
who does photography with the NYC club scene as her main theme.

 Drugs - lots of talk about "K" and exstacy and LSD. Some folks onstage
related their stupidest drug usage story.

 That's it for now!

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

PS - The costumes were cool! I don't go "clubbing" in San Francisco , 
 so I can't do a left coast / right coast comparison, but some of it
did look familiar.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 09:30:07 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: hello again
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Greetings Friends...

In my view this list is a campfire around which our tribe gathers to
discuss events and issues of import to this community. This is obviously
not the only way to view this list, but it is mine.

The public airing of grievances -- around the campfire -- and censure for
behaviour that threatens the well being of the tribe are both time honored
traditions for regulating behaviour, which I chose, carefully, to invoke.

For those of you that are curious, I did call Tom and Stacy and let them
know how I felt before I took the step of thashing them publicly. I felt
and I stil feel that they earned this thrashing. I view our scene as a
community and I feel that promoters hould be held accountable to and before
the community. I think Tom and Stacy will think twice before they pull this
kind of stunt again, as well they should. I don't prseume to ask that they
throw parties as I would, but I do presume to ask, to demand even, that
they repsect precious and extremely scarce resources.

I could, and perhaps should have, left out the rage and the profanity. But
then perhaps not. Amongst friends and in community it is a blessing to be
able to share yourelf, truly -- however you find yourself -- with your
friends, with your family, if not with them, then who else?. I'm glad that
over the years I've had a lot more joy to share with you than rage, but in
this case that's what I had. My apologies to those of you that it offended,
and my thanks to those of you that offered your kind support, I truly
appreciate it.

love ya
ethan

-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 10:01:49 1996
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Date: 21 May 96 12:59:18 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Fight at Pack-a-Bowl (gun?!)
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Tone said....

So, I found it rather interesting that there were so many positive posts
(appropriately so) about Pack-A-Bowl last Thursday, and then heard that a
fight broke out around midnight and someone (word has it) pulled a gun and
the place cleared.  I guess those posting Friday must have split right
before that incident, or surely they would have mentioned it.

Weird huh?  What a weekend!?

Tone


_________________________

Interesting, because my friend Sara said last night that she didn't want to go
there because she had heard there had been a bad fight or something --- and I
told her I hadn't heard about that on SFR so wondered it it was true!  It
appears even with our cybercommunication, we don't get all the news posted ....

Leslie

p.s.  Astrologically, just about every planet is retrograde (which means it
appears from our earthbound perspective to be moving backwards in the sky)
EXCEPT Mars, the planet of yang, masculine, aggressive energy ....  very
interesting.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 10:02:15 1996
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From: Renaud Waldura <rw@softway.com>
Message-Id: <199605211657.JAA29456@softway95.softway.com>
Subject: Re: Two words: Keoki, Sunset
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 09:57:43 -0700 (PDT)
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In a previous post, Tony Rotundo wrote:
> 
> The reviews seemed mixed.  Personally I though it was pretty good music,
> definitely better towards the end, but not necessarily mixed that well.  It

	I definitely agree. Real good House/Deep House stuff, mixed the
	House way... Precisely what one could have expected, right?
	I'm not surprised at all.

        The place (Point Molate) was cool as usual, and many people
	showed up, maybe 200?
	The crowd was nicely mixed: many "regulars ravers" and also more
	"club" people, which were there mainly for Keoki I guess. This
	guy seems to have some good fans.
	I looked at him for a moment, and didn't see anything peculiar
	being used except records ;-) And I can definitely assert that
	he didn't finish his set being removed from the "dex" by anybody.

	Trippy moment: after the sunset, everybody got lost in the dark, 
	calling after her/his friends. :-)

        Cheers to all the fine people I met during this cool afternoon,
	<names list omitted>,

Renaud

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 10:03:14 1996
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Date: 21 May 96 12:58:51 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Fight at Pack-a-Bowl (gun?!)
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Tone said....

So, I found it rather interesting that there were so many positive posts
(appropriately so) about Pack-A-Bowl last Thursday, and then heard that a
fight broke out around midnight and someone (word has it) pulled a gun and
the place cleared.  I guess those posting Friday must have split right
before that incident, or surely they would have mentioned it.

Weird huh?  What a weekend!?

Tone


_________________________

Interesting, because my friend Sara said last night that she didn't want to go
there because she had heard there had been a bad fight or something --- and I
told her I hadn't heard about that on SFR so wondered it it was true!  It
appears even with our cybercommunication, we don't get all the news posted ....

Leslie

p.s.  Astrologically, just about every planet is retrograde (which means it
appears from our earthbound perspective to be moving backwards in the sky)
EXCEPT Mars, the planet of yang, masculine, aggressive energy ....  very
interesting.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 10:09:36 1996
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To: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: hello again
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At  9:30 AM 5/21/96 -0700, Ethan Miller wrote:
>Greetings Friends...
>
>In my view this list is a campfire around which our tribe gathers to
>discuss events and issues of import to this community.

Well said!

Jon Zimmerman

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 10:27:38 1996
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Date: Tue, 23 Jan 1996 08:33:12
From: ravebabe@gnn.com (Carol  Saldana)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Missed all of you!
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Hi sfravers!!

I've been off the list for about 3 weeks and just got a new account....I was 
trying to use my old address <csaldan@mckinley.com> but "csaldana" is 
aparently taken- bummer, anyways for those of you who may recognize my name 
and those of you who know me, it's nice to be back and looking forward to 
talking to you all very soon:)

XX
OO
Carol


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 11:22:35 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 11:22:17 -0800
To: Greg2write@aol.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Who is: Greg2write@aol.com
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I know I'm not alone on this one...

And excuse me if I seem rude, but I feel it's a tad rude to make the type
of posts you made and not include your name.  You seem to be bold and
upfront in every other manner, and thus I am curious as to why you take a
"great and powerful Oz" like stance, by hiding behind a curtain.

It's actually kind of fun trying to figure out who you are.  If I had to
guess (which I don't, but I will anyway) I would say...Stacey.  But again,
that's just pure speculation.

Anyway, I think you owe it to those you attacked (for it is impossible to
know if you were defending yourself) to reveal your identity and maybe
start the process of open, constructive dialogue.

Tony Rotundo



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 11:53:28 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 11:53:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jessica Robin Berkson <berky@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: the essentials... 
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I was flipping through a book the other day and I found something that I 
thought was totally true and beautiful-and all though its not exactly 
rave related- I think it after all the negativity being 
posted as of late, I thought we could all use a good dose of something 
positive...  

The guide to what is essential..

1.  Right knowledge:  to supply you with the tools necessary for your voyage

2.  Wisdom:  to assure that you are using the accumulated knowledge of 
the past in a manner that will best serve the dicovery of your presence, 
your "now."

3.  Compassion:  to help you accept others whose ways may be different 
from yours, with gentleness and understanding, as you move with them or 
through them or around them on your own way.

4.  Harmony:  to be able to accept the natural flow of life

5.  creativity:  to help you to realize and recognize new alternatives 
and unchartered paths along the way

6.  Strength:  to stand up against fear and move forward in spite of 
uncertainty, without guarantee or payment.

7.  Peace, to keep you centered

8.  Joy:  to keep you songful and laughing and dancing all along the way.

9.  Love:  to be your continual guide towards the highest level of 
consciousness of which man is capable.

			AND FINALLY, MY FAVORITE...

10.  Unity:  which brings us back to where we started- the place where we 
are at one with ourselves and with all things....


smiles and love,
-jessica


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 12:07:23 1996
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From: Sabin Cloud Macphee <cloud@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Robert Miles and...
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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KDON?!?!?!?!?!?!  It's 12:00...and I turned on my radio...and the DJ says
"And here's one from a new artist...his name is robert miles...the song
is called 'Children'.  Check it out"
	And So I Listened...and so it was...the harder trance, full side
version.  Is nothing sacred!
=)
Sabin!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 12:19:27 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 12:23:00 -0600
To: Sabin Cloud Macphee <cloud@cats.ucsc.edu>
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Robert Miles and...
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At 1:07 PM  -0600 5/21/96, Sabin Cloud Macphee wrote:
>KDON?!?!?!?!?!?!  It's 12:00...and I turned on my radio...and the DJ says
>"And here's one from a new artist...his name is robert miles...the song
>is called 'Children'.  Check it out"
>	And So I Listened...and so it was...the harder trance, full side
>version.  Is nothing sacred!
>=)
>Sabin!


You think that's bad...

Driving down to Santa Barbara on Saturday "Children" was used to intro some
conservative talk show host on a Monterey AM station.

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 12:21:56 1996
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From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
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To: Jessica Robin Berkson <berky@cats.ucsc.edu>
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Jessica Robin Berkson wrote:
> 
> I was flipping through a book the other day and I found something that I
> thought was totally true and beautiful-and all though its not exactly
> rave related- I think it after all the negativity being
> posted as of late, I thought we could all use a good dose of something
> positive...
> 
> The guide to what is essential..
> 
> 1.  Right knowledge:  to supply you with the tools necessary for your voyage
> 
> 2.  Wisdom:  to assure that you are using the accumulated knowledge of
> the past in a manner that will best serve the dicovery of your presence,
> your "now."
> 
> 3.  Compassion:  to help you accept others whose ways may be different
> from yours, with gentleness and understanding, as you move with them or
> through them or around them on your own way.
> 
> 4.  Harmony:  to be able to accept the natural flow of life
> 
> 5.  creativity:  to help you to realize and recognize new alternatives
> and unchartered paths along the way
> 
> 6.  Strength:  to stand up against fear and move forward in spite of
> uncertainty, without guarantee or payment.
> 
> 7.  Peace, to keep you centered
> 
> 8.  Joy:  to keep you songful and laughing and dancing all along the way.
> 
> 9.  Love:  to be your continual guide towards the highest level of
> consciousness of which man is capable.
> 
>                         AND FINALLY, MY FAVORITE...
> 
> 10.  Unity:  which brings us back to where we started- the place where we
> are at one with ourselves and with all things....
> 
> smiles and love,
> -jessica

Two words for this:

Absolutely Beautiful!

John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 12:23:10 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605211922.MAA04342@netcom7.netcom.com>
Subject: Let Ethan Do It (Greg2write@aol.com)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 I for one am willing to let the hubbub begun with Ethan's original
Nomad Interactive posts and Greg2write's posts concerning Ethan's 
post to fade away. Since Ethan is back in town, he can defend himself,
I'm sure.

 I still wouldn't mind seeing a review of the Nomad Interactive event!
One person sent me private email about it, but was afraid to post
due in case of ostracism ! I understand that person met other 
SFRavers there too, and they didn't want to let the general list
know they went either!

 WE STILL LUV U !!!!  

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 12:34:07 1996
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From: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9605211933.AA28836@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Funky Techno Tribe
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Tue, 21 May 96 12:33:29 PDT
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(5) Reasons why I might be going to Funky Techno Tribe:

1. It's been a long time since I've been to a commercial massive
so I've forgotten why I usually don't have too great a time at them.

2. The DJs: specifically the Darkhorse/Jonah Sharpe/Professor Smith 
Gardening Club contingent.

3. It's going to be in the City at the roomy Concourse Pavillion,
very convenient for me to get to.  It's been said that we can thank
Mayor Jordan's departure for making this local big site available again.

4. FTT's current reputation for excellent production values, or so I
hear.  I don't think I've ever actually been to a FTT party.

5. If I'm not having a good time I can easily leave knowing that Tribal
Future the following week will make up for it.

Disclaimer: It seems that whenever I post to sfraves that I'm
going to be at a particular party, I usually end up not going for some
reason.  

Also, isn't it true that Darkhorse == Graeme?  Both are listed to spin
at FTT, so I guess he gets paid twice.  I suppose it makes sense for a 
DJ to have different names to cover different styles.  Perhaps there's
a really diverse DJ out there (Markie?) who could play an *entire* party
under a bunch of different pseudynoms.  Of course this might be difficult
if there were 2 separate rooms of music.

ObFlame: Ethan's analogy of sfraves to a campfire gathering brings
to mind the famous campfire scene from Blazing Saddles.  Pass me
some of them beans.

Lee
_________________________________________________________________________
lxfogel@pacbell.com  (    (   (  ( ((0)) )  )   )    )  lee@hyperreal.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 12:40:26 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: the essentials... 
Date: 21 May 1996 20:26:57 GMT
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What Happend to Flintstone kids daily vitamins????



"Dance with me"


              -Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 12:47:29 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 12:47:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: the essentials... 
To: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
cc: Jessica Robin Berkson <berky@cats.ucsc.edu>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <31A217AE.293E@excite.com>
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this is wondeful!

On Tue, 21 May 1996, John Kawamoto wrote:

> Jessica Robin Berkson wrote:
> > 
> > I was flipping through a book the other day and I found something that I
> > thought was totally true and beautiful-and all though its not exactly
> > rave related- I think it after all the negativity being
> > posted as of late, I thought we could all use a good dose of something
> > positive...
> > 
> > The guide to what is essential..
> > 
> > 1.  Right knowledge:  to supply you with the tools necessary for your voyage
> > 
> > 2.  Wisdom:  to assure that you are using the accumulated knowledge of
> > the past in a manner that will best serve the dicovery of your presence,
> > your "now."
> > 
> > 3.  Compassion:  to help you accept others whose ways may be different
> > from yours, with gentleness and understanding, as you move with them or
> > through them or around them on your own way.
> > 
> > 4.  Harmony:  to be able to accept the natural flow of life
> > 
> > 5.  creativity:  to help you to realize and recognize new alternatives
> > and unchartered paths along the way
> > 
> > 6.  Strength:  to stand up against fear and move forward in spite of
> > uncertainty, without guarantee or payment.
> > 
> > 7.  Peace, to keep you centered
> > 
> > 8.  Joy:  to keep you songful and laughing and dancing all along the way.
> > 
> > 9.  Love:  to be your continual guide towards the highest level of
> > consciousness of which man is capable.
> > 
> >                         AND FINALLY, MY FAVORITE...
> > 
> > 10.  Unity:  which brings us back to where we started- the place where we
> > are at one with ourselves and with all things....
> > 
> > smiles and love,
> > -jessica
> 
> Two words for this:
> 
> Absolutely Beautiful!
> 
> John
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 12:57:32 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 12:56:47 -0700
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From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: Re: Who is: Greg2write@aol.com
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>
>I know I'm not alone on this one...
>
>And excuse me if I seem rude, but I feel it's a tad rude to make the 
type
>of posts you made and not include your name.  You seem to be bold and
>upfront in every other manner, and thus I am curious as to why you 
take a
>"great and powerful Oz" like stance, by hiding behind a curtain.
>
>It's actually kind of fun trying to figure out who you are.  If I had 
to
>guess (which I don't, but I will anyway) I would say...Stacey.  But 
again,
>that's just pure speculation.

Tony,

    I have to step in here! Greg2write is NOT Stacy from Nomad!!! I 
feel this needed to be cleared up right away!!!! Please, if you have 
any questions call or write to me, or you could even talk to Stacy 
herself. 

Peace,

Greg :)

>
>Anyway, I think you owe it to those you attacked (for it is impossible 
to
>know if you were defending yourself) to reveal your identity and maybe
>start the process of open, constructive dialogue.
>
>Tony Rotundo
>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:04:44 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Lee Fogel <lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Funky Techno Tribe
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Don't forget 6, 7, and 8: DJ Dan, Tony, and Graeme :)  F2T DJs always 
seem to play out for their own party...


> (5) Reasons why I might be going to Funky Techno Tribe:
> 
> 1. It's been a long time since I've been to a commercial massive
> so I've forgotten why I usually don't have too great a time at them.
> 
> 2. The DJs: specifically the Darkhorse/Jonah Sharpe/Professor Smith 
> Gardening Club contingent.
> 
> 3. It's going to be in the City at the roomy Concourse Pavillion,
> very convenient for me to get to.  It's been said that we can thank
> Mayor Jordan's departure for making this local big site available again.
> 
> 4. FTT's current reputation for excellent production values, or so I
> hear.  I don't think I've ever actually been to a FTT party.
> 
> 5. If I'm not having a good time I can easily leave knowing that Tribal
> Future the following week will make up for it.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:10:40 1996
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To: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: hello again 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 21 May 1996 09:30:31 PDT."
             <v03006c14adc738aec8cb@[207.76.139.151]> 
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 13:06:29 -0700
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Thanks, Ethan, for your apology.

It is very refreshing to see that this list can maintain a signal /
noise ratio that is considerably higher than your average mailing list
or USENET group. The "campfire" metaphor that Ethan suggested is a
very good one to describe what we have here.

Although I have already responded privately to several people already,
I would like to clarify to the list at large where I was coming from
in my objection to y'all, since I feel well connected to you and this
list.

My objections were not aimed at the accusations, judgements, and
opinions that Ethan had toward Tom and Stacy. They weren't even aimed
at the anger and profanity itself. They were aimed at the wonton rage
without anything to qualify or explain it. 

Imagine that campfire scene for a moment, with someone around the
campfire shouting out, "<so and so> is a fucking asshole!" How would
you feel about that? How would you respond? Now, suppose that same
person around the campfire says, "<so and so> is a fucking asshole!
They just exploited of all the work I created for their own personal
gain." Your reaction may be different in that case.

I don't intend, nor do I want, to require anyone to suppress their
emotions here. I only ask that we, as a community, take responsibility
for the listening of the folks around us when we speak. Our words are
very powerful -- the world, and the people around it, are created
every day by our speaking. The very existence of each of us is
made up of the conversations we speak.

And, finally, to follow up on Ethan's point:

> For those of you that are curious, I did call Tom and Stacy and let them
> know how I felt before I took the step of thashing them publicly. I felt
> and I stil feel that they earned this thrashing. I view our scene as a
> community and I feel that promoters hould be held accountable to and before
> the community. I think Tom and Stacy will think twice before they pull this
> kind of stunt again, as well they should. I don't prseume to ask that they
> throw parties as I would, but I do presume to ask, to demand even, that
> they repsect precious and extremely scarce resources.

I wholeheartedly agree!

P&L,
-G-


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:10:52 1996
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Ok, ok, I'm burning with curiosity, was the space ruined for future use, or
can we still use it??


curiously,

shawna


"What you are suggesting could destroy his mind..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:12:02 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 13:11:41 -0800
To: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Who is: Greg2write@aol.com
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Thanks for the clarification!  And let me say publically, I am not gossip
hunting on this issue, nor am I trying to defend Ethan (he can do that fine
himself).  I am part of a group that I feel was attacked, and thus I feel I
have an interest in the issues at hand, and I think it's crap for someone
to post what they did and not sign it.

I do not intend to beat the issue or stir-up more controversy.

Tony

At 12:56 PM  -0700 5/21/96, Gregory Sandler wrote:
>You wrote:
>>
>>I know I'm not alone on this one...
>>
>>And excuse me if I seem rude, but I feel it's a tad rude to make the
>type
>>of posts you made and not include your name.  You seem to be bold and
>>upfront in every other manner, and thus I am curious as to why you
>take a
>>"great and powerful Oz" like stance, by hiding behind a curtain.
>>
>>It's actually kind of fun trying to figure out who you are.  If I had
>to
>>guess (which I don't, but I will anyway) I would say...Stacey.  But
>again,
>>that's just pure speculation.
>
>Tony,
>
>    I have to step in here! Greg2write is NOT Stacy from Nomad!!! I
>feel this needed to be cleared up right away!!!! Please, if you have
>any questions call or write to me, or you could even talk to Stacy
>herself.
>
>Peace,
>
>Greg :)
>
>>
>>Anyway, I think you owe it to those you attacked (for it is impossible
>to
>>know if you were defending yourself) to reveal your identity and maybe
>>start the process of open, constructive dialogue.
>>
>>Tony Rotundo
>>
>>
>>




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:14:46 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 13:14:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: drenalin <drenalin@OREGON.UOREGON.EDU>
Subject: Re: Funky Techno Tribe
In-reply-to: <9605211933.AA28836@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, Lee Fogel wrote:

> Also, isn't it true that Darkhorse == Graeme?  Both are listed to spin

No Darkhorse is a Graham but not Graeme.  Confusing huh? 

love scott

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:30:58 1996
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From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: hello again 
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At 01:06 PM 5/21/96 -0700, you wrote:

>The very existence of each of us is made up of the conversations we speak.

...and the music we make :)

Rick




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:35:15 1996
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To: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: Re: Funky Techno Tribe
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At 7:33 PM  -0000 5/21/96, Lee Fogel wrote:

>Also, isn't it true that Darkhorse == Graeme?  Both are listed to spin
>at FTT, so I guess he gets paid twice.  I suppose it makes sense for a
>DJ to have different names to cover different styles.  Perhaps there's
>a really diverse DJ out there (Markie?) who could play an *entire* party
>under a bunch of different pseudynoms.  Of course this might be difficult
>if there were 2 separate rooms of music.


Darkhorse *does not equal* Graeme (LaPaix)...

see ya
ethan

-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:35:47 1996
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Date: 21 May 96 16:33:44 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: the essentials...
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RIGHT ON JESSICA! -- I think I'll typeset this and post it at my desk and on my
bulletin board at home.... and if I get it really together, make some up to
bring to Chrysalis to share ...  thank you!

Leslie

_____________________________________________________
Jessica said:

Yes, I'll be there!  That will perhaps give me an opportunity for:
receiving my chart, introducing Sara and Cheyenne, giving you a massage,
talking about my difficulty with homosexuality, and sharing more love and
positive vibes (and maybe a puff or two ;))!

I was flipping through a book the other day and I found something that I 
thought was totally true and beautiful-and all though its not exactly 
rave related- I think it after all the negativity being 
posted as of late, I thought we could all use a good dose of something 
positive...  

The guide to what is essential..

1.  Right knowledge:  to supply you with the tools necessary for your voyage

2.  Wisdom:  to assure that you are using the accumulated knowledge of 
the past in a manner that will best serve the dicovery of your presence, 
your "now."

3.  Compassion:  to help you accept others whose ways may be different 
from yours, with gentleness and understanding, as you move with them or 
through them or around them on your own way.

4.  Harmony:  to be able to accept the natural flow of life

5.  creativity:  to help you to realize and recognize new alternatives 
and unchartered paths along the way

6.  Strength:  to stand up against fear and move forward in spite of 
uncertainty, without guarantee or payment.

7.  Peace, to keep you centered

8.  Joy:  to keep you songful and laughing and dancing all along the way.

9.  Love:  to be your continual guide towards the highest level of 
consciousness of which man is capable.

                        AND FINALLY, MY FAVORITE...

10.  Unity:  which brings us back to where we started- the place where we 
are at one with ourselves and with all things....


smiles and love,
-jessica



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:41:06 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: ambient@netcom.com
Cc: cloud@cats.ucsc.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Re: Robert Miles and...
Date: 21 May 1996 21:30:27 GMT
Message-Id: <617730045.5014874@compattic.com>
Organization: Computer Attic
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Childeren apperently is hitting really hard in England.  I believe that the
Arsenal is using the song to when they score goals during thier home games.


And....


It seems that Children Has been "domesticated" by Akrista Records. 
So Far I've heard it at:

Kohl (Community college radio station that play's top 40 tunes)

Kmel (Yup, that's right Kmel) On Low rotation.

Musak Station @ CompUSA.....


The Revoultion is at hand.....


"Dance with me"

Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:53:02 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 13:54:59 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Earth's a shakin
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Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!


Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 13:54:32 1996
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To: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Funky Techno Tribe
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At 1:33 PM  -0600 5/21/96, Lee Fogel wrote:

>Also, isn't it true that Darkhorse == Graeme?  Both are listed to spin
>at FTT, so I guess he gets paid twice.  I suppose it makes sense for a
>DJ to have different names to cover different styles.  Perhaps there's
>a really diverse DJ out there (Markie?) who could play an *entire* party
>under a bunch of different pseudynoms.  Of course this might be difficult
>if there were 2 separate rooms of music.
>

Graeme = La Paix
Darkhorse = Graham

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:01:09 1996
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To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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Yea, felt that pretty good up here in SF as well. I just happened to be
listening to Point of Intensity by DJ Massive during the shaking...
Personally I really like quakes... Like to feel the mother shaking her stuff!

Jon

At  1:54 PM 5/21/96 -0700, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:
>Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
>
>
>Tim (knucklehead)

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:03:38 1996
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From: Metered 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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>Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!

i felt it here in san mateo.
my first earthquake ever!!!

wasn't much of anything though. my cd rack shook a bit and i think i felt it
through my chair, but hardly.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:11:21 1996
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Date: 21 May 1996 14:05:34 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        "Tim (Knucklehead)" <Tim_#l#Knucklehead#r#@quickmail.apple.com>
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         Reply to:   RE>Earth's a shakin

I felt it.  I'm in Cupertino and I was talking to a friend in Santa Cruz when it hit.  He felt it a few seconds after I did.  kinda strange. 

The news says it was centered about 10 miles east of San Jose.  4.7 Magnitude

-M

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/21/96 2:02 PM
To: Mark Camp*
From: Tim (Knucklehead)
Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!


Tim (knucklehead)


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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:14:49 1996
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From: Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS
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just found out that it registered 4.8!!!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:19:32 1996
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From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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I felt it here in the East Bay, but it wasn't too bad in my building.  It 
was like a quiet rocking.  The most noticeable thing was all of the lab
equipment vibrating.  

The uncontrollable is very scary to the human race!!

--kaySEE


On Tue, 21 May 1996, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:

> Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
> 
> 
> Tim (knucklehead)
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:21:42 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 14:22:14 -0700
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From: Metered 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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>just found out that it registered 4.8!!!

hmm. i heard 4.7, epicenter just east of san jose... secondhand of course.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:22:08 1996
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Date: 21 May 96 17:19:26 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: OK, ALREADY! ORIGIN REVIEW!!
Message-ID: <960521211926_71165.755_GHL20-6@CompuServe.COM>
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Well, Larry has shamed me into posting my review..   ; )

My hesitation was NOT that I didn't want people to know I went -- for crying out
loud, my greatest pleasure in life is TO GO WHERE I WANT!  And I've paid dearly
for that right!  No fear and no shame!

And where I like to go is to listen to house music!  (yep, when you see me at
trance parties, it's mostly because I love all of you tranceheads enough that I
want to see you, more than the music drawing me there!)

So off I went, hearing first that I was heading to a map point and then a virgin
space.  When I got to the map point and realized where the party was, which was
where Madness was the previous week, I was quite disappointed -- that's not
virgin space, and shouldn't be called that.  Bad start.

Then I was duly frisked by the off-duty cops, had my unopened water bottle
confiscated ...(wouldn't it be nice if THAT was put on the voicemail, no bottles
allowed, or bring a bottle to refill, whatever?)... and went in to find a large
crowd of the sportswear set, the very young kids, gangbangers and dealers.  Not
my favorite beginning, I must say.

In no way did the vibe of this group of people compare to the Madness party,and
the space was not as welcoming in its setup either.  

The music, however, was great -- Rob Doten was finishing up a very good hard
house set, followed by Simon, then Reese from NY, very cool to me -- and Garth
was last -- somewhere in there was supposed to be Ms. Thing, Terry Bristol, but
maybe I was chilling at the time, cuz I never was aware of her spinning.

Big complaint:  Free water promised repeatedly, but there was none (Tom did make
one round giving out bottles, but that's not the same) -- and the one indoor
toilet bit the dust way early, creating a big mess!)  There was however, fresh
fruit cups passed out later.  Nice touch (though those hard crunchy cups ended
up being unusual sound effects as people tried to walk through the chill space
later ... maybe soft plastic or paper ones would have been better?)

Have to say my friend hated the vibe and left at 2:30 -- but I saw a number of
my friends there (most also grumbling about the crowd) -- and so I hung out
until 6am, meeting lots of (very young) nice people (esp the two sweetest
teenage girls, Stephanie and Amber) -- with a crowd this young, I got to be more
of the "rave mom" than ever, a role I don't mind when it's needed.

I did have a chance to talk to Stacey who was upset that she felt they had been
blasted for doing what they had to do to put their party together - I think this
is fundamentally a difference of motivation -- Stacey and Tom want to put on
parties that are fun enough for people to pay the money to come in, and that
way, everyone wins.  Tom asked me what I thought of the party, and I told him I
loved the music, but thought that it was promoted in the wrong places to bring
in the crowd that it did.  They seem to me to be sincere in their efforts.

Stacey promised a post to SFR yesterday, but it hasn't appeared yet (Stacey?
where are you?) -- (It's hard for me to think Greg2write is Stacey, since her
previous response to accusations was so professional and direct and his was so
incendiary and obnoxious)....

The bottom line here, for me, is that I believe we ALL have to stand strong that
PLUR is a real way to live, not just words, and sometimes it isn't easy in the
face of those who seem to stand in our way -- that maybe a quick checklist of
"is what I am about to do in the spirit of peace? love? unity? respect?" would
stop some of the actions that lead to these blowups ---  We can't change other
people, we can only change ourselves ... I just hope we can all get back to
peaceful coexistence soon....

The only side I'm on is the side of all of us who feel that raving brings us
depth, love, connection, happiness and a feeling of family -- and hope that
nothing ever stands in the way of that!

Much love to ALL ...  


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:22:54 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 14:22:12 +0200
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Got FINALS but went 2 ORIGINS (review)
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Hello friends and family,

I havn't posted for a while cuz I've been neck deep in studies for my
finals which are this week.  Been work 2 so I haven't checked my mail since
Wednesday.  Which means I didn't even know about all this MADDNESS going on
on the list latly.  I was down and stressed out so I wanted to get out
Saurday and to ORIGINS I went.  Mostly because I forgot the fresh start #
and I didn't feel like going to the deli AGAIN for another party.
   I didn't go to Madness last weekend (regretfully) and so as far I knew
on saturday the warehouse was virgin.  Paid 15 and they were charging 2$
for h2o but provided free cups of ice that you could munch on or fill up in
the bathroom.  Nice space - chill area inside and out, not too hot but you
could feel sweat dripping from the ceiling in the late evening.  Speaker
stacks at the 4 corners which made for good sound in the middle of the
building.  I arived at 1.30 am because I had to work a senior ball (nice
guys at 5 minute walk records).  I don't remember who was up at the time -
I belive it was Teri Bristol - "miss thing" was good but REESE was just
amazing.  He came on around 3 and rocked the house with some great acid
house and hard trance.  I was groovin' all night.  After Reese came Garth
to finish off the night with another great set.
   At first the people were rather straight faced, not smiling much and
there were a lot o' circles ( 3-4 at one time).  I spoke with a friend of
mine visiting from the east coast and he compared the party to an east
coast vibe.  I don't know about that but after 3.30 or so everyone seemed
to be getting into REESE and the vibe picked up.  I had a great time.  Cops
(2 uniformed officers) did show up twice (at least) First time was around
3.30 and everyone paniced and rushed inside.  I thought it helped the party
as everyone came together in the main room for awhile when the cops walked
around.  Then again around 7am.  I spoke with Andy doing security and he
said they show up because of a noise complant, they didn't see a reason to
bust the party as long as the noise didn't get louder and left.  They came
back in the morning to see that the party was ending (same officers) I left
right around this time cuz I was really tired and I need rest to do more
studing on Sunday.
   I had a great time.  I am sorry to hear that there is this hatred for
Tom and Stacy's tatics on throwing a party.  I say no disrespect at the
party by any of the patrons or Stacy her self.  There was little to
complain about and i am sure the space will be avaliable again.  I hope so
I love the location.  I hope everything gets worked out.  Bye bye for now -
back to the books.

See ya at crystalis?

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:48:34 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 02:54:55 -0700
From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:
> 
> Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
> 
> Tim (knucklehead)

Oh is that what it was?? Whew!!

I thought "they" were coming for me again... ;^)

CT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:49:02 1996
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From: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:

> Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
> 
> 
> Tim (knucklehead)
> 
> 
felt it here at sfsu, right in the middle of my economics final!!!! what 
a way to end the semester!!
sarah

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:52:42 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 14:52:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: The Tribe was Re: the essentials
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> 
> 10.  Unity:  which brings us back to where we started- the place where we 
> are at one with ourselves and with all things....

I was reading about the Suya Indians and the anthropologist who has 
studied them since the 1970's.  When the author of the story asked the 
anthropologist what *most* threatened the existence of this Brazilian tribe 
of only 158 people, he expected to hear something like "infringement on 
their land" or "destruction of their water".  But, the anthropologist 
said that the thing most threatening the Suya Indians is "individualism." 
There is an increasing tendancy to ignore to greater good of the entire 
tribe, and this threatens their community.  

I find this incredibly thought-provoking, especially since we can relate 
it to ourselves as a community.  So, I just thought I'd throw this out to 
all of you to draw your own conclusions.  

chau,
kaySEE

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 14:54:40 1996
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From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Metered 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960521210412.00896a88@140.174.229.14>
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 Well, I'm over here in Concord and I didn't feel a thing, Shawna did you 
feel anything?. BAck to studying! ah, one more &%$*@! day and I'll be a 
free Reagan;).




On Tue, 21 May 1996, Metered 99 wrote:

> >Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
> 
> i felt it here in san mateo.
> my first earthquake ever!!!
> 
> wasn't much of anything though. my cd rack shook a bit and i think i felt it
> through my chair, but hardly.
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 15:13:44 1996
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But it is possible to be individualistic, while keeping the good of the
entire tribe as key.  IMHO:)

Rick

At 02:52 PM 5/21/96 -0700, you wrote:
>
>
>
>> 
>> 10.  Unity:  which brings us back to where we started- the place where we 
>> are at one with ourselves and with all things....
>
>I was reading about the Suya Indians and the anthropologist who has 
>studied them since the 1970's.  When the author of the story asked the 
>anthropologist what *most* threatened the existence of this Brazilian tribe 
>of only 158 people, he expected to hear something like "infringement on 
>their land" or "destruction of their water".  But, the anthropologist 
>said that the thing most threatening the Suya Indians is "individualism." 
>There is an increasing tendancy to ignore to greater good of the entire 
>tribe, and this threatens their community.  
>
>I find this incredibly thought-provoking, especially since we can relate 
>it to ourselves as a community.  So, I just thought I'd throw this out to 
>all of you to draw your own conclusions.  
>
>chau,
>kaySEE
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 15:15:33 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 96 15:20:24 -0800
From: Marco_A._Mancia@sfbayguardian.com (Marco A. Mancia)
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Subject: ?
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hey, what has been going on my system was down for almost two
weeks.........................can someone mail me the latest Calendar?


--

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sent via the Guardian Online.  415.437.3600 N81 or bbs.sfbayguardian.com, 3004
================================================================================

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 15:20:16 1996
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From: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
To: Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS <Todd_Manley@notes.hds.eds.com>
Cc: Jon Zimmerman <bigz@bigz.com>, "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>,
        sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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This is the only thing that scares me to death about living in San 
Francisco.  But there is no place else I'd rather die if I was gonna...

love,
Amy


---------------
|   _  ,/|    |
|  '\`o O'    |
|   =(_^_)=   |         Amy Starkey
|     |U|     |         sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu
|     | |     |      
---------------

On 21 May 1996, Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS wrote:

> just found out that it registered 4.8!!!
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 15:32:06 1996
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From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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You wrote: 
>
>Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
>
>
>Tim (knucklehead)
>
>
I sure did!!! That was fun!!! I hope they don't get any bigger!

Greg :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 15:37:00 1996
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From: Thomas Schwarz <tschwarz@scudc.scu.edu>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
To: knucklehead@email.org (Tim)
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 15:33:56 -0700 (PDT)
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In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19960521205459.00687fc8@email.org> from "Tim" at May 21, 96 01:54:59 pm
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> 
> Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
> 
> 
> Tim (knucklehead)
> 
> 
It was my first earthquake. I was in the computer lab at SCU.
Must have been a bigger one. The people around me were quite surprised.


Thomas


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 15:40:37 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: Re: OK, ALREADY! ORIGIN REVIEW!!
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Leslie wrote:

> I was quite disappointed -- that's not
>virgin space, and shouldn't be called that.  Bad start.
>
>Then I was duly frisked by the off-duty cops, had my unopened water bottle
>confiscated ...(wouldn't it be nice if THAT was put on the voicemail, no
>bottles
>allowed, or bring a bottle to refill, whatever?)... 

Maybee I can see why Ethan was pissed, being frisked and having your
property confiscated and of course laying that it was a virgin
space....well that type of shit has never happened at a friends and family
or Chrysalis or many other UG parties.
Having spaces jepodized by commercial parties is not a good thing for
trully good parties
(i.e. those mostly done for fun and maybee a little profit)...lying and
security guards? I thought thats why we go to raves, to get away from that,
 that is what the clubs are all about.  Yes, I know alot of raves have had
these elements since '92-but from my experience this aint what FandF is
about and thats why they're so important.

Mark


***********************************************************

Mark's primitive page-http://shgc-www.stanford.edu/~piercy/
____________________________________________________ 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 15:42:34 1996
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Larry Ching wrote:

> I still wouldn't mind seeing a review of the Nomad Interactive event!
>One person sent me private email about it, but was afraid to post
>due in case of ostracism ! I understand that person met other 
>SFRavers there too, and they didn't want to let the general list
>know they went either!

YOU'RE KIDDING?!  Come on people!  This is not a clique, no one's going to 
think less of you for partying wherever you want, whenever you want.  Look, 
I for one would love to hear some honest reviews.  If you want, send them to 
me and I'll remove identifying text and repost it myself.  Or not, it's up 
to you.  No one's going to shun you for going to a party.  They may think 
your money would be better spent on other events, but that's a matter of 
personal opinion, knowhatahmean?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 15:49:37 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Funky Tekno Tribe
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Enough about the Dj's names already!

Now, who's going?!


Adam


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 16:08:00 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 16:09:35 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Space Teddy Review / Bay to Breakers
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Space Teddy/ Bay to Breakers review
=================================

Well,  here's my first review in a while,  as this has been the first
time I've had a chance to breath and come up for air.

Been going through some very hard times these last few months,
primarily because I thought that it would be possible to sell Web
sites for small businesses.   But business has been so bad that I
haven't had any work in over 45 days.    Then,  in first week of may,
one client I did Mac programming for,  had to leave to Taiwan on an
emergency and didn't pay me before he left.   So,   my landlord
evicted me for being only 3 days late in paying rent.  What a greedy
fuck head.

To make matters worse,  last Tuesday it started to rain and I had no
way to clear out my place,  then injured my lower back...  Ruptured a
disc in my lower back,  trying to move some heavy boxes.   Yukk!!
and double Yukk!!   I really had my heart set on running B to B,
because last year I was in Australia and missed it.   I was even
training for it,  by running the Dipsea trail to Stinson Beach.

Thanx to John (A super great fellow SFRaver) for helping steer me
into good positive thinking and paying my way into Madness and
this weeks Space Teddy,   I was able to rave and be with wonderful
REAL PEOPLE.

Anyway,   back to the review...   Space Teddy was incredible!!   Mars
was spinning some of the sickest hard trance I heard since I left the
land of Oz....   His set was brilliant...   Fast!!   Probably topped the 150
BPM range...   Oh!  how I love the fast beats....

When Keoki finally went on (I was looking forward for his set,  by
the way),   he slowed the BPMs way down (Much too slow for my
taste)...   He smoothly worked into a more housy sound,   but frankly
I wasn't that impressed.   He did spin a lot of variety though,   but
after Mar's set,   which was a tough act to follow,   it seemed to
reduce the energy level.

Of course,  due to lower back problems,  I wasn't my usual hi-nrg
self,  so sorta waddled around the dance floor and couldn't dance that
much,  but I did manage to run into Austin (Tinsau).

After Keoki's set,  Mystr-E took the controls,  but his set got off to a
slow start,  with a few interruptions to the beats,  which I used to
take the opportunity to go off and hide to deal with my lower back
and do some yoga and stretching for a while.    Then,   after his set
started to get more consistent,   he played "Paraglider" and I literally
WENT OFF!!   Such a GREAT track....

I think Jon Santos went on after that,  but I chilled for quite a while,
trying to find some water....  I had no money and couldn't afford to
buy any water,   but eventually,  I was able to sneak my water bottle
past the water-nazi and re-fill it,  after I pulled a distraction
technique and waited for the right moment to sneak in and fill it.

I also got a chance to talk to the Spundae promoter for the first
time... Really nice guy,  he even bought me some water....  Thanx
man!

After chilling,   I went back to hear David Michael's set...  Not bad,
really consistent,  kinda housey...   then just after 6 am,  the music
faded,  I found Tinsau who was kind enough to give me a ride to the
Haight...   After wondering around,  looking for any restaurant that
was open,   failing to find one,   I caught bus to the Castro to eat at
Orphan Annies...   Then back to the GG park pan handle to catch the
first Bay to Breakers runners and watched the race from there,  and
walking to the finish line.    I certainly could NOT do any running,
and even if I could,  I had no place to stash my stuff....   I eventually
made it to the finish line,  looking for any SFRavers running in.
Didn't see anyone,  so headed to the polo fields to the "R" section,
and ran into Tinsau.    The FootStock festivities were GREAT,  I sorta
wandered around,  listening to Greg Allmond concert...   Somehow
Tinsau ditched me after I asked him to wait while I took a pee,   but
when I got back,  he left.    I got stuck in SF with no money for bus
back,  and eventually hooked up with a fellow Raver who loaned me
the bus fare to return home.    I never made it back home until 6 PM,
only to find all my possessions removed from the room (I was
supposed to hook up with a friend at 3 PM to help me move,  but
wasn't lucky enough to make connections.

So,  if anyone out there has any storage space for about 5 apple fruit
boxes,   PLEASE contact me.    Right now,  all my stuff is outside
getting soaking wet in the rain,  and I have no place to sleep.   Last
night,  I had to sleep under someone's porch.   I'm still trying to get
into a homeless shelter,  but as luck would have it,   they closed them
down a few weeks ago.   Now there's a 5 week waiting list...   If only
it would stop raining...

I'm still able to get on the net,  but only if I can find some kind soul
who is willing to let me use their phone to make local calls to my ISP
so I can check my Mail.

Right now,  I'm spending most of my time on coffee shops in Mill
Valley and sometimes if the right person is working,  they let me
plug in to upload and download my Email.    I've managed to keep
my laptop dry,  but have no safe place to stash it,  so it remains as a
piece of my body.

Crunchman




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 16:12:58 1996
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Date: 21 May 96 19:09:30 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Big oops,
Message-ID: <960521230930_71165.755_GHL113-3@CompuServe.COM>
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Jessica did not say .....

>>"Yes, I'll be there!  That will perhaps give me an opportunity for:
>> ......................sharing more love and
>>positive vibes (and maybe a puff or two ;))!"

That was actually said by an invisible friend of mine who snuck in, put her
hands on my keyboard, and began typing while I was answering the phone......  


sorry....


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 16:20:01 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 16:19:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19960521205459.00687fc8@email.org>
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:

> Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
> 
> 
> Tim (knucklehead)
> 
> 


Hi!
 Yikes!! I felt that here at UCSC (Santa Cruz) at about 1:52pm on tuesday.
I was laying in bed and it shook the bed for anbout 30 secs. Not to hard.
I love earth surfing =)


Ran
                       ( rock and roll! )
                                 /
                           -=*=-/
                             ~


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 16:23:53 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 16:23:24 -0700
From: "w. p. risenhoover" <pauly@mobius.net>
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To: Thomas Schwarz <tschwarz@scudc.scu.edu>
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Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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Hi All

> > Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!

I'm in s.f. and I didn't feel it, although another guy in our office 
said his windows rattled.

I felt the last quake, though -- I think it was 1994.  It was on 
Saturday night at 2:00am and I was having sex.  When it was all over, 
we had to ask each other -- "Did the earth move for you, too?"

Gotcha!


pauly
p.s. it REALLY happened that way!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 16:30:10 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 16:29:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tony Rose <trose@violet.berkeley.edu>
To: "w. p. risenhoover" <pauly@mobius.net>
cc: Thomas Schwarz <tschwarz@scudc.scu.edu>, Tim <knucklehead@email.org>,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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I was in my friends room in berkeley for this one and I thought that she 
was kicking the bed with her foot, but then I noticed that the lamp on 
the other side of the room was shaking too! scary stuff!!

p.s. WOW I was in berkeley for the last shake and I too was with my 
signifigant other! Definately an earth shaking experience! :)

* * ** *** ***** ******** ************* ****************** 
Paul Anthony Rose
UC Berkeley Computer Science/ Mathematics
http://violet.berkeley.edu/~trose
TRANCE_HARDER--DEEPER--FASTER
****************** ************* ******** ***** *** ** * *

On Tue, 21 May 1996, w. p. risenhoover wrote:

> Hi All
> 
> > > Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
> 
> I'm in s.f. and I didn't feel it, although another guy in our office 
> said his windows rattled.
> 
> I felt the last quake, though -- I think it was 1994.  It was on 
> Saturday night at 2:00am and I was having sex.  When it was all over, 
> we had to ask each other -- "Did the earth move for you, too?"
> 
> Gotcha!
> 
> 
> pauly
> p.s. it REALLY happened that way!
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 16:47:15 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 16:50:55 -0700
From: NOMADS <tahsina@ix.netcom.com>
Organization: Nomad Interactive Productions
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
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First and foremost, we do not believe that the SFR list belongs to ethan
miller, it belongs to a group of different people from different 
backgrounds who share a sense of community which we feel part of.

Secondly, we do expect a public apology from ethan miller for the 
profanity and personal slander he administered against us!

The following is a summary of the events which took place last week 
before the ORIGIN party. We initially planned our event around another 
space but several factors, namely the fact that construction of a 
partition was not completed in the space, did not allow us to use that 
space. Consequently, we were left without a space and many commitments.

We were introduced to the owner of the space that madness used by a 
friend who told the owner that we also put together these types of 
events. The owner was very interested but also indicated that he had six 
other promoters approach him for the space. He said he was being 
selective and felt very excited about working with us. We do have 
excellent references from other people we have worked with.

After the owner gave the commitment to us, we recieved a call from ethan 
miller telling us it was disrespectful to use that space. He never 
bothered to ask why we needed that space. We know he cares alot about 
what he is doing and we respect that. Yet, several months back when F&F
needed a space, we took ethan and several members of the planning 
comittee to see a beautiful space with three musical areas that was well 
within F&F's budget. He loved the space and yet when it came down to it, 
he refused the space and even scared the manager into thinking that this 
was going to be some out of control party. We even asked ethan if we 
could donate one musical area to include sound, dj's, decorations, but he  
refused the space from the start and did not want anything to do with us.

We feel that we should all help each other if we can and we have never 
kept a space for ourselves. We found three new spaces in the last four 
months and they have been shared by many people. You cannot control a 
space unless you own it or lease it long term. Regarding the use of the 
map point that joe rice says we stole from madness: the people at that 
location are good people. The city has not allowed them to hold any 
events there for the past year and a half. They welcome the use of their 
location as a map point and would like others to use it as well.
The place has become a financial burden to them and if we and others can
help them supplement their financial obligations by using their location 
as a map point so be it. We have not stepped on anybody's toes or tried 
to take anything away from the madness people. as a matter of fact, we've 
made several map points available for people when we were asked for help.

Here are the facts regarding what happened last week:

Tuesday we spoke to the owner of the space who said yes lets do the 
party. 
Wednesday, we recieved a call from ethan miller saying it was 
disrespectful to use that space, even though his name is not on the lease 
for that space. He did not even ask why we needed the space. An hour 
later we recieved a call from the owner of the space saying he recieved a 
call from the police telling him "We understand you are having a rave 
party this Saturday. You can't do it and don't let us come down there".
The owner said that the caller never left his name. The owner told us he 
believed this to be a prank call from the madness people. He said lets 
still go ahead with the party. He did not want these people to bully him.

In the meantime there is a guy named billy who lives at this location 
free of charge. According to the owner billy introduced the madness 
people to him. The next morning, the owner called us and said that he 
recieved three calls from the madness people yelling at him not to do the 
party. He said the callers were alex, jon santos, and a third "person".
They told him don't do this party, these people are "this" and "that",
etc, etc. The owner also said that billy told him that the madness people 
had a meeting the night before and decided to cause problems for the 
party. If anyone wants to verify these facts they can ask the owner 
directly.

At this point the owner became hesitant and nervous about everything. He 
decided to call off the party. He also felt blackmaled by the madness 
people. A few hours later we met with him and he decided to honor his 
word and go through with the party. We addressed all the concerns of the 
owner to include sound levels, capacity issues, and adequate security.

Two hours after our meeting with the owner, ethan miller posted his 
malicious remarks on the internet.

During the party, around midnight, noise complaints started pouring in 
from far away locations. HOW STRANGE!!!

The sound levels were maintained so the party went on.

Overall, people were happy to have us in the neighborhood because we 
respected everything around us and that comes from doing events in that 
area for a while now and for keeping good relationships with the people 
we have worked with. 

On a final note, we do not feel that the SFR mailing list should be a 
forum to slander people. We have been victims of some very malicious 
rumors and we would not post these facts unless we know them to be 
correct. We have been very nice so far. We are good people. We have not 
caused harm to anyone and have nothing to hide. But we will never allow 
anyone again to use us as escapegoats. So please be warned and be 
careful about what you say. The power of the pen can destroy people.

The reason you do not see us posting alot is because there is so much 
negativity, slander, and critisism that frankly it does not make it fun 
to participate. We are very open minded about alot of the different 
events that take place in this community and we respect each of them for 
what they are. It is a shame that some people do not share the same view
point!

Tom & Stacey

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 16:55:14 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu (Jake Reichert)
Subject: God I love finals
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Today has quite possible been the most fucked-up day of my life.  First of
all, I couldn't sleep all last night because I was stressed out about
finals.  So I got up and went to the store to get some food for breakfast.
And locked myself out of the house.  Not only could I not get inside, but
everything I needed for my finals was in there.  Along with my car keys.  So
I had to walk to school.  And just when I thought things couldn't get any
worse, it started to rain.  Luckily I got ahold of my roommate, who had a
spare set of keys, so I got my stuff, but that only left me about thirty
minutes before my final.  And then, on top of everything else, the final
that I thought I had today was not, in fact, the final I had today.  The one
that I actually had (and because I didn't know about it hadn't studied for
yet) is for my hardest class this semester.  So I'm sure I did terrible on
it (no, this isn't a value judgement, I really did).  Which puts me in
danger of losing a $10,000 a year scholarship.

Life Sucks.


Jake Reichert			|  I used to be indecisive/
reicja00@dons.ac.usfca.edu	|  But now I'm not so sure...		
				|                    -The The
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                     "LONELY IS AS LONELY DOES"
B.C. Gilbert/G. Lewis ------------------------    The Happy Family
A=====================================V  Bulgarian Voices | Pixies 
|          |              |   ____    |  Bauhaus |  Frazier Chorus
|     /|   |      /\      |  |    \   |  Michael Brook |  Spirea X
|    / |   |     /  \     |  |     \  |  The Breeders |  Colourbox
|   /  |   |    /    \    |  |      | |  Dead Can Dance |  Dif Juz
|  /___|   |   /______\   |  |      | |  Throwing Muses |  The The
|      |   |  /        \  |  |     /  |  Clan of Xymox | Rema-Rema
|      |   | /          \ |  |___ /   |  Cocteau Twins | Liquorice  
A=====================================M  Lisa Germano  | M|A|R|R|S
X Mal Deutschland | Dance Chapter | Insides |   The Birthday Party
A.R. Kane | Rowland S. Howard & Lydia Lunch  | C.V.O  |  Air Miami
Ultra Vivid Scene | Unrest | Pieter Nooten/Michael Brook | Swallow
That Dog. | Psychotic Tanks  |  Lisa Gerrard  | Last Dance |  Lush
Modern English |  Budd/Fraser/Guthrie/Raymonde |  This Mortal Coil   
The Wolfgang Press |  Richenel |  His Name Is Alive  | Pale Saints
The Glee Club    ---------------------------------    Colin Newman
                       "LONELY IS AN EYESORE"      


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 17:16:28 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 19:14:39 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Blown Off by Hard Copy (fwd)
Message-Id: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960521191333.4804C-100000@dfw.dfw.net>
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Sad news. But alas look for a message from me later today.

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 15:51:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kc <sarahtonen@earthlink.net>
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Subject: Blown Off by Hard Copy

It's official...

we have officially been blown off by Hard Copy.  They will not have to
substantiate their claims or take action to prevent something like this
from happening again.

Thanks to anyone who might have called/faxed into Hard Copy.  They claim
that there really wasn't much of a negative response to the story.... I
have no way of knowing.


Anyway, I guess we should just let them win.... let them speak for all of us.


Do I sound bitter?




-Kc


Memories of DUNE at
http://home.earthlink.net/~sarahtonen



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 17:28:04 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 17:27:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jessica Robin Berkson <berky@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shak
To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19960521205459.00687fc8@email.org>
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It rattled my windows here in Santa Cruz!!!

-jessica

On Tue, 21 May 1996, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:

> Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
> 
> 
> Tim (knucklehead)
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 17:44:36 1996
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To: NOMADS <tahsina@ix.netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
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At 11:50 PM  -0000 5/21/96, NOMADS wrote:

>Secondly, we do expect a public apology from ethan miller for the
>profanity and personal slander he administered against us!

You, are dreaming.

Your insinuation that someone from madness called the cops is a laughable.
The inverse is more likely true.

The rest of your post is you saying, "the owner said...." I have no way of
knowing what the owner told you. None of which matters to me. I'm not
talking about the owner, your deal with him, or his willingness to break
previous agreements in favor of your cash.

Everyone gives in to cash.

You seem to feel that buying your way into that space was ethical behaviour
and I disagree.  You seem to feel that putting 1000 people in that space is
responsible behaviour and I disagree. You think that noise complaints came
from berkeley instead of around the corner and I disagree. You call a space
used a week ago a virgin warehouse and I disagree. You suggest that
lathering the neighbohood with cash, just "helps the neighborhood" and I
disagree.

You have permanently changed the climate for that space and that
neighborhood. Now the owner expects fat wads of cash and the cops think fat
wads of cash are being made. To mention just a few of the changes you have
effected.

We didn't leave the space in that condition, you did. And I think it's jsut
as fucked now as I did on friday.

ethan

-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 18:07:25 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Adam Luong <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Funky Tekno Tribe
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> Now, who's going?!

I'll be there...  like I said, the Organic/F2T DJs usually play out for 
their own parties.  I'll be wearing my silver jacket, and I would have my 
SFR laminate if I had one...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 18:11:38 1996
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Date: 21 May 96 21:04:54 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Thank you Nomads
Message-ID: <960522010453_71165.755_GHL109-4@CompuServe.COM>
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Stacey and Tom,

Thank you for posting such a calm, detailed and straightforward account of your
version of the events of last week.

I, for one, have let out a long sigh, releasing some of the tension of the past
days, feeling caught in the middle of something I never would have chosen to be
part of, and relieved that both sides have now spoken.  SFR is a forum for  us
to communicate, good and bad.  Using Ethan's tribal campfire metaphor, the
talking stick was passed to you and you used it eloquently.

It pains me to think that some of the actions you have outlined (such as either
reporting competitive promoters to authorities based on personal grudges, or
impersonating police) could even be implied to have been done by people who are
active in our community.

Again, the only side I take is of those who want to keep raving as an important
part of their life, and who depend on the party planners and organizers to
create the environment for us to come together.

May each and every person involved in this entire scenario deal personally with
whatever actions they took that created or contributed to the problems... as
well as whatever action they did *not* take that could have averted these
problems....  

We are each responsible for ourselves, and responsible for the consequences of
our actions .... even if nobody knows what we have done, what counts is who you
see when you look in the mirror.

I hope to see EVERYONE out partying in the future.

Love, peace and honesty.             Leslie  (yep, the raver mom)







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 18:21:17 1996
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Yikes.



>Childeren apperently is hitting really hard in England.  I believe that the
>Arsenal is using the song to when they score goals during thier home games.
>
>
>And....
>
>
>It seems that Children Has been "domesticated" by Akrista Records. 
>So Far I've heard it at:
>
>Kohl (Community college radio station that play's top 40 tunes)
>
>Kmel (Yup, that's right Kmel) On Low rotation.
>
>Musak Station @ CompUSA.....
>
>
>The Revoultion is at hand.....


"What you are suggesting could destroy his mind..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 18:33:12 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 18:33:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Reply-To: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
To: NOMADS <tahsina@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <31A256DF.738C@ix.netcom.com>
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, NOMADS wrote:

> First and foremost, we do not believe that the SFR list belongs to ethan
> miller, it belongs to a group of different people from different 
> backgrounds who share a sense of community which we feel part of.

Well, he never claimed it did. As I remember he always presented his 
views as his own.


> 
> Secondly, we do expect a public apology from ethan miller for the 
> profanity and personal slander he administered against us!
> 

???????

> The following is a summary of the events which took place last week 
> before the ORIGIN party. We initially planned our event around another 
> space but several factors, namely the fact that construction of a 
> partition was not completed in the space, did not allow us to use that 
> space. Consequently, we were left without a space and many commitments.
> 
> We were introduced to the owner of the space that madness used by a 
> friend who told the owner that we also put together these types of 
> events. The owner was very interested but also indicated that he had six 
> other promoters approach him for the space. He said he was being 
> selective and felt very excited about working with us. We do have 
> excellent references from other people we have worked with.
> 
> After the owner gave the commitment to us, we recieved a call from ethan 
> miller telling us it was disrespectful to use that space. He never 
> bothered to ask why we needed that space. We know he cares alot about 
> what he is doing and we respect that. Yet, several months back when F&F
> needed a space, we took ethan and several members of the planning 
> comittee to see a beautiful space with three musical areas that was well 
> within F&F's budget. He loved the space and yet when it came down to it, 
> he refused the space and even scared the manager into thinking that this 
> was going to be some out of control party. We even asked ethan if we 
> could donate one musical area to include sound, dj's, decorations, but he  
> refused the space from the start and did not want anything to do with us.

So this is your perspective which I'm sure others have different views 
on. I tend to wonder why ethan did not want to work with you.


> 
> We feel that we should all help each other if we can and we have never 
> kept a space for ourselves. We found three new spaces in the last four 
> months and they have been shared by many people. You cannot control a 
> space unless you own it or lease it long term. Regarding the use of the 
> map point that joe rice says we stole from madness: the people at that 
> location are good people. The city has not allowed them to hold any 
> events there for the past year and a half. They welcome the use of their 
> location as a map point and would like others to use it as well.
> The place has become a financial burden to them and if we and others can
> help them supplement their financial obligations by using their location 
> as a map point so be it. We have not stepped on anybody's toes or tried 
> to take anything away from the madness people. as a matter of fact, we've 
> made several map points available for people when we were asked for help.
> 

Yet what about the advertisments saying "Virgin Space"? That issue is not 
addressed in this post directly.



> Here are the facts regarding what happened last week:
> 

You claim.

> Tuesday we spoke to the owner of the space who said yes lets do the 
> party. 
> Wednesday, we recieved a call from ethan miller saying it was 
> disrespectful to use that space, even though his name is not on the lease 
> for that space. He did not even ask why we needed the space. An hour 
> later we recieved a call from the owner of the space saying he recieved a 
> call from the police telling him "We understand you are having a rave 
> party this Saturday. You can't do it and don't let us come down there".
> The owner said that the caller never left his name. The owner told us he 
> believed this to be a prank call from the madness people. He said lets 
> still go ahead with the party. He did not want these people to bully him.
> 
> In the meantime there is a guy named billy who lives at this location 
> free of charge. According to the owner billy introduced the madness 
> people to him. The next morning, the owner called us and said that he 
> recieved three calls from the madness people yelling at him not to do the 
> party. He said the callers were alex, jon santos, and a third "person".
> They told him don't do this party, these people are "this" and "that",
> etc, etc. The owner also said that billy told him that the madness people 
> had a meeting the night before and decided to cause problems for the 
> party. If anyone wants to verify these facts they can ask the owner 
> directly.
> 

This sounds a little suspicious to me. If billy is introducing the 
madness crew to the owner why would billy squeal on madness? Verification 
from the owner mearly would present his perspective which may or may not 
be fact.


> At this point the owner became hesitant and nervous about everything. He 
> decided to call off the party. He also felt blackmaled by the madness 
> people. A few hours later we met with him and he decided to honor his 
> word and go through with the party. We addressed all the concerns of the 
> owner to include sound levels, capacity issues, and adequate security.
> 
> Two hours after our meeting with the owner, ethan miller posted his 
> malicious remarks on the internet.
> 
> During the party, around midnight, noise complaints started pouring in 
> from far away locations. HOW STRANGE!!!
> 

Not necessarily. Shoreline amphitheatre used to get noise complaints from 
the east side of the bay. As a sound engineer I know that atmospheric 
accoustics can play strange tricks with the propagation of sound. I have 
had noise complaints come from a half mile away yet neighbors 50 to 100 
yards away never heard a thing ( or so it seemed ).


> The sound levels were maintained so the party went on.
> 
> Overall, people were happy to have us in the neighborhood because we 
> respected everything around us and that comes from doing events in that 
> area for a while now and for keeping good relationships with the people 
> we have worked with. 
> 

Cool! Keep that up.


> On a final note, we do not feel that the SFR mailing list should be a 
> forum to slander people.

I agree.

> We have been victims of some very malicious 
> rumors and we would not post these facts unless we know them to be 
> correct.

The only 'rumors' I believe I heard were those from ethan (please correct 
me if I'm wrong!).


> We have been very nice so far. We are good people. We have not 
> caused harm to anyone and have nothing to hide. But we will never allow 
> anyone again to use us as escapegoats. So please be warned and be 
> careful about what you say. The power of the pen can destroy people.
> 

And that sword cuts both ways.


> The reason you do not see us posting alot is because there is so much 
> negativity, slander, and critisism that frankly it does not make it fun 
> to participate.


Yet you want to use this forum to further your aims. hmmm


> We are very open minded about alot of the different 
> events that take place in this community and we respect each of them for 
> what they are. It is a shame that some people do not share the same view
> point!
> 
> Tom & Stacey
> 

Okay here is my 2 cents.
 
 I'm a very neutral observer in this situation. I do not know any of the 
people involved, yet I feel a right to respond as this is a public forum. 
 
 On the surface, ethan's original post is very harsh and (from my 
experience) much more violent than 99.99999% of the posts made here. 
However his anger MAY have been justified. I don't think I'll ever know 
the answer to that. However I have seen an immense outpouring of support 
and love for him here.

 I feel that Tom and Stacey have shown much respect by waiting until 
ethan was back online before posting their response. Whether this was 
deliberate or not? However their viewpoints above sound just as one-sided 
as ethans, despite how reasonable everything sounds. And as I have 
learned, reasonableness is not neccesarily fact.

 I also feel that perhaps ethan went overboard in his use of profanity 
and imflammitory (sp?) writing style. This in and of itself makes me 
suspicious of his motivations.

 While I feel that spot checking each other on shortcomings is good, 
stirring up feelings of anger and hatred is not good nor respected (by me).

Peace all

Ran


     ( if ravers can not get along, how can we expect the world to )
                                /
                          -=*=-/
                            ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 18:40:22 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Re: Earth's a shakin
Date: 22 May 1996 02:15:17 GMT
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Wow, and I thought all this time I was having a cool Flashback....


"Dance with me...."


Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 18:45:37 1996
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>Big complaint:  Free water promised repeatedly, but there was none (Tom did
make
>one round giving out bottles, but that's not the same) -- and the one indoor
>toilet bit the dust way early, creating a big mess!)  There was however, fresh
>fruit cups passed out later.  Nice touch (though those hard crunchy cups ended
>up being unusual sound effects as people tried to walk through the chill space
>later ... maybe soft plastic or paper ones would have been better?)


Or maybe possibly entertaining the notion of perhaps throwing them away to
begin with??



>Have to say my friend hated the vibe and left at 2:30 -- but I saw a number of
>my friends there (most also grumbling about the crowd) -- and so I hung out
>until 6am, meeting lots of (very young) nice people (esp the two sweetest
>teenage girls, Stephanie and Amber) -- with a crowd this young, I got to be
more
>of the "rave mom" than ever, a role I don't mind when it's needed.


Right on Leslie, you make the best rave mom! :)  Especially when you dressed
up at the Rave Earth Mother a cuppla parties ago!


"What you are suggesting could destroy his mind..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 18:53:54 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 18:50:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Reply-To: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: non-rave! this weekend (sigh)
To: "-=] madame mercury [=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: "D. Steve White" <stevew@orion.oriontel.com>,
        Jamie Pauline Smith <spunk@cats.ucsc.edu>,
        sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        Gregory Sandler <ascend@ix.netcom.com>, me <stacey@sirius.com>,
        Andrew Knudson <andrewk@sco.com>,
        James E Kaspar <James_E_Kaspar@notes.seagate.com>,
        Kam K <kamk@sgi.com>, shevaun gallant <she@xaostools.com>,
        nick farwell <nick_farwell@macmail.ucsc.edu>,
        brandon estuesta <brandone@sco.com>
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Hi folks!
 Just an FYI post. I will be offline and out of state from Wed. until 
Sunday of this week. Have fun folks and please be good to one another.

Smiles

Ran
                             *( "There is only us." )
                                      /
                                -=*=-/
                                  ~



* Peter Gabriel






From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 19:05:01 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 19:08:36 -0600
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
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I've saved most of my comments for personal email to Tom & Stacey as I feel
this  doesn't need to continue on the list or else it's just going to turn
into a flame war. If anyone wants to hear my response they can mail me. I
do wish to say publicly that insinuations that we made calls to the owner
and police trying to bust their party are disenheartening and utterly
groundless.

Joe

(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 19:15:07 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 19:14:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: Tue night fun???
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hey!

I was wondering if anything fun was going on tonight either in SF or 
South Bay.  My work is totally driving me crazy and I have to go out.  I 
was supposed to go out with a friend, but it looks like that will not 
happen.  

Thanks for the info.

Hugz,
Branka

P.S.  Keoki was good Sunday - my calves are still sore from dancing :) 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 19:26:28 1996
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	id AA13793; Tue, 21 May 96 21:22:22 CDT
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:22:21 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Cc: socal-raves@ucsd.edu, ausrave@student.adelaide.edu.au,
        boston-raves@alderaan.ccs.neu.edu, dcraves@american.edu,
        france-techno@la-douche.fr, fl-raves@cybernet.cse.fau.edu,
        lowlands@xs4all.nl, mtn-raves@hyperreal.com, mw-raves@hyperreal.com,
        ne-raves@umdd.umd.edu, nyc-raves@hyprereal.com, nw-raves@hyprereal.com,
        pb-cle-raves@hyperreal.com, run@hyperreal.com, seraves@american.edu,
        txraves@io.com, uk-dance@tqmcomms.co.uk,
        wnyso-raves@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu, zappo@iijnet.or.jp,
        lysloff@vms.cis.pitt.edu, tribe@lists.colorado.edu
Subject: Rave Film Treatment - 96
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        'Hard Copy's recent piece regarding the dangers of  rave culture
is yet another rehash of the sensationalist tactics used by the media to
demonise those operating outside established legal/social constraints.  By
presenting the rave scene in a derogatory light public opinion grants the
power to shut down gatherings and arrest whomever they wish with no public
outcry or intervention.

        The draconian English Criminal Justice Bill  (which outlaws any
gathering of over ten people without a permit, as well as the right to
silence) is a prime example of direct action taken by government to stop
young people from gathering, expressing ideas, and having a good time.
The English government told the public that the 'Suss' laws were designed
to stop ravers from gathering in England, yet they are much further reaching.
Could this happen in the US - well the Exxon Bill passed didn't it?

        Raves provide a safe environment for young and old people to dance,
enjoy, express and explore themselves. The Rave Culture stands for Peace,
Love, Unity and Respect. Many lives have been touched and changed by this
movement.

        We propose a documentary project to show the positive facets of Rave
Culture.  We want to turn this project into a group endeavor, collaboration
is essential.  Since we will be operating on a 'no budget' we plan to 
film for
the most part in California and will be compiling footage over the summer.
If you would like to participate in the project and you are outside of
California you can send a video (high-8, super 8, vhs, etc.) to us.  We plan
to edit the material at the end of the summer.

        We will not film at any rave without the permission of the promoters
and participants.  We do not want to be confused with another "Hard Copy"
undercover agent.  Any assistance from promoters would be very welcome.  If
you are throwing a rave and would like to participate in the project, please
let us know.

	To subscribe to the online discussion mailing list send an email
message to majordomo@underground.org with a body of:

		subscribe rave-film

        If you wish to contribute footage please mail it to:

                Annaliza Savage
                1803 Mission St.
                Santa Cruz, CA 95060 USA

        Peace, and spread the word.

                Aleph One
                Sir Dystic
                Annaliza Savage


Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 20:29:34 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 08:36:13 -0700
From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
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Organization: CT D-Zine
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: FINALS!!!
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Hello brothers and sisters!

Will someone pleez say a prayer for me so that my head doesn't 
explode in the middle of finals week???

I'll do the same for you.

No pressure, no pressure, no pressure...

CT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 20:56:48 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 20:53:58 -0700
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
From: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
Subject: Re: SFR Logo/T-shirts
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>let's make this a general logo contest.  Or not: Perhaps this will simply be a
>collection of logos from which people can choose what logo they prefer, copy
>it, and use it to create their own t-shirt/laminate/bumper sticker/ etc....

YEAH, NO CONTEST !

 I've butted heads with different galleries and art events over the issue
of art as a competition. I think is SUCKS, art is way to subjective to have
in a competitive situation. When I want to compete, I race. You get to the
finish line first, you WIN, period. So I think that everyone should use
whatever they want to identify themselves as an SFRaver.

Onward and upward Senor Dream, I like what you are doing.

Art is not a contest, it is an expression. It is all beautiful and comes
from inside the artist, they are giving us a piece of their heart and soul.

vince

PS: I have actually had some success in art competitions, BUT the work I
built for them was not built from my gut, it was built to impress the
judges. If you know that it is a contest, you are constantly thinking about
winning, instead of just expressing yourself, and letting it flow.

nuf said



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 21:04:35 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 20:51:12 -0700
From: wilton paul risenhoover <pauly@mobius.net>
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Greetings,

For those of you who are interested, x-radio is back online after a long 
series of troubles.  We hope to keep it up.  Thanks to those of you who 
sent letters of encouragement.

Best,
pauly

http://www.x-radio.com/x-radio/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 21:06:12 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:05:54 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Rusty H. Hodge" <rusty@hodge.com>
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
Cc: NOMADS <tahsina@ix.netcom.com>
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>Overall, people were happy to have us in the neighborhood because we
>respected everything around us and that comes from doing events in that
>area for a while now and for keeping good relationships with the people
>we have worked with.

Uh.... which people were *happy* to have you in the neighborhood?

I live in the neighborhood - on the other side of the park - and I wasn't
happy. I was home sick and unable to sleep because my windows and roof were
rattling from all the 140bpm bass. Not to mention the influx of gang-types
that always appear at over-commercialized raves.

And I know a lot of my neighbors weren't happy either, but we tolerated it.

Mixed industrial/residential neighborhoods are not good places to have huge
events.

It would have been different if there wasn't a party there the week before-
but there was.

-Rusty

 	(Who admits to preferring smaller and more underground parties.)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 21:30:01 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:29:44 -0700 (PDT)
To: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
In-Reply-To: <v03006602adc8184a4bde@[198.97.35.13]>
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, Joe Rice wrote:

> I've saved most of my comments for personal email to Tom & Stacey as I feel
> this  doesn't need to continue on the list or else it's just going to turn
> into a flame war. If anyone wants to hear my response they can mail me. I
> do wish to say publicly that insinuations that we made calls to the owner
> and police trying to bust their party are disenheartening and utterly
> groundless.

If we cannot have a *RATIONAL*, *ADULT* discussion *IN PUBLIC* what hope do 
you think there is for this scene that we all care about so much?  

Ethan, you wanted your grievances aired publicly, and they have been. Tom & 
Stacy, you have answered some of these allegations, and made some of your 
own. 

This situation has been made public, and in the most inflammatory manner 
I have ever seen on this list. I for one hope it stays public until some 
of these allegations are answered, or until both parties involved agree to 
make it private, and *TALK ABOUT IT* 

                                            Patrick

                                     



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 21:44:53 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Chat?, non-rave
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hi everyone!
 Once again in the computer lab trying to finish some work. It's about 
9:45 pm and I'll be here for a time. Any private discusions would be COOL.

So write me!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ran

                   -=*=-
                     ~  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 21:55:05 1996
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From: Sharif Torpis <storpis@crl.com>
Message-Id: <199605220450.AA19009@crl.crl.com>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
To: pauly@mobius.net (w. p. risenhoover)
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:50:40 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <31A2506C.10F4@mobius.net> from "w. p. risenhoover" at May 21, 96 04:23:24 pm
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> I felt the last quake, though -- I think it was 1994.  It was on 
> Saturday night at 2:00am and I was having sex.  When it was all over, 
> we had to ask each other -- "Did the earth move for you, too?"

Absolutely fabulous. Really.

Now, can we keep to the subject of this mailing list?

I've put up with 'save the whales', 'save <insert latest political
hero>', even 'hale's comet' ... but this takes the cake.

And don't send email or post asking me to relax. I'm totally relaxed. This
is just out of hand and ridiculous. Try the sexquake mailing list. They have
a mailing list and newsgroup for everybody, no matter how kinky. There's no
need to pollute others.

Perhaps non-raves@hyperreal.com is in order.

Thank you for your support.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 22:10:15 1996
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Priority: urgent
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 23:08:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: A call to arms
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Well, if THAT'S not a call to arms for this community, I don't know what   
is.
 I mailed John back directly to see if I could help, but I am hindered by   
being in Santa Cruz.  Are there local SF folk who can jump in here and   
help a friend in need?  This seems to me to be the perfect time to show   
what community can do!
 -Roy

 ----------
From:  John Draper[SMTP:crunch@well.com]
Sent:  Tuesday, May 21, 1996 4:38 PM
To:  sfraves
Subject:  Space Teddy Review / Bay to Breakers

...
Been going through some very hard times these last few months,
primarily because I thought that it would be possible to sell Web
sites for small businesses.   But business has been so bad that I
haven't had any work in over 45 days.    Then,  in first week of may,
one client I did Mac programming for,  had to leave to Taiwan on an
emergency and didn't pay me before he left.   So,   my landlord
evicted me for being only 3 days late in paying rent.  What a greedy
fuck head.

To make matters worse,  last Tuesday it started to rain and I had no
way to clear out my place,  then injured my lower back...  Ruptured a
disc in my lower back,  trying to move some heavy boxes.   Yukk!!
and double Yukk!!   I really had my heart set on running B to B,
because last year I was in Australia and missed it.   I was even
training for it,  by running the Dipsea trail to Stinson Beach.
...
I got stuck in SF with no money for bus
back,  and eventually hooked up with a fellow Raver who loaned me
the bus fare to return home.    I never made it back home until 6 PM,
only to find all my possessions removed from the room (I was
supposed to hook up with a friend at 3 PM to help me move,  but
wasn't lucky enough to make connections.

So,  if anyone out there has any storage space for about 5 apple fruit
boxes,   PLEASE contact me.    Right now,  all my stuff is outside
getting soaking wet in the rain,  and I have no place to sleep.   Last
night,  I had to sleep under someone's porch.   I'm still trying to get
into a homeless shelter,  but as luck would have it,   they closed them
down a few weeks ago.   Now there's a 5 week waiting list...   If only
it would stop raining
...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 22:13:34 1996
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Sharif Torpis <storpis@crl.com> wrote:
>
>Perhaps non-raves@hyperreal.com is in order.
>

Id subscribe. I like listening to the randomstuff :)

(and when a thread gets irritating, i just killfilter it)




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 22:19:09 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
To: Sharif Torpis <storpis@crl.com>
cc: "w. p. risenhoover" <pauly@mobius.net>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605220450.AA19009@crl.crl.com>
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, Sharif Torpis wrote:

> > I felt the last quake, though -- I think it was 1994.  It was on 
> > Saturday night at 2:00am and I was having sex.  When it was all over, 
> > we had to ask each other -- "Did the earth move for you, too?"
> 
> Absolutely fabulous. Really.
> 
> Now, can we keep to the subject of this mailing list?
> 
> I've put up with 'save the whales', 'save <insert latest political
> hero>', even 'hale's comet' ... but this takes the cake.
> 
> And don't send email or post asking me to relax. I'm totally relaxed. This
> is just out of hand and ridiculous. Try the sexquake mailing list. They have
> a mailing list and newsgroup for everybody, no matter how kinky. There's no
> need to pollute others.
> 
> Perhaps non-raves@hyperreal.com is in order.
> 
> Thank you for your support.
> 
> 


You know, tolerence goes a long ways. If I had your attitude I say KEEP 
IT FUCKIN PRIVATE (the suggestion).

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 22:20:17 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 22:20:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cami Edwards <cami@netcom.com>
Subject: Late Review of 111 Minna
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Well, we did not get out much this weekend (music-wise), but we did make 
it to 111 Minna.  Friday nites never find me with too much energy, after 
a long week of work, but I like to dance off some steam for a bit.

When we arrived(10:30) at the gallery (very beautiful space, I might add), 
there were only about ten or so peeps there, but nice ones.  A couple of 
people dancing, music was sort of mellow (think it was a tape).  Then 
Markie came on.  He is amazing.  His mixing is so flawless and his music 
is so diverse (comparable only to M. Farina in both respects, IMHO).  
Very nice and funky house music.  It was a great way to unwind from the 
stress of the week.  Had a good time dancing with very few people.  One 
person in particular was just a barrel of energy, kept trying to get the 
wallflowers to dance, with a little success, but he was determined! Fun 
to watch, too. After Markie was Simon, also spinning good funky shit.  Tracy 
was set to go on next, but after nearly 2 hours of straight dancing I was 
pooped (must've been to miss Tracy:)  

I really hope more people showed later (we left around one), because 
the people throwing the party seemed really cool, and it was only $5.  
Bargain Friday nite.  Definitely check this space out sometime, 
though.  I have always heard of it, but never been.        

See you on the floor.

Cheers***
Cami


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 22:48:36 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 22:48:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: hi kids :)
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i just wanted to share with you all down SF way what an AMAZING party we 
had up here in darn rainy Vancouver :)

It was called XL.  12 djs, 3 rooms.  The headliner was John Aquaviva, 
with plenty of home-grown talent thrown in.  Kind of a piddly laser 
system than was promised, but nice anyways.  It was in an old Armoury in 
the middle of town.  The main room had 40 or 50 foot ceilings, so it 
stayed nice and cool.  

the VISUALS were astonishingly well done ... for a while a huge YOU ARE 
HERE was projected over the Army crest on the wall :) lovely fractal 
animations too.  And also, there was a professional acting/dance troupe 
of FIRE BREATHERS! there :) one of them was this guy on stilts wearing a 
gas mask, strobe light breasts, a jockstrap and garters while juggling 
flaming torches.

The second room was the house room which sadly was way too echoey ... 

The third room was the ambient room ... to reach it you went up four 
flights of stairs .... but when you got there it was like stepping into 
heaven.  It was also a strictly non-smoking environment, which was 
appreciated :)

it went pumping and bouncing until four-thirty until KABOOM!  they shut 
it down, the bastids!  oh well.  it was worth it, every minute!!!

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 23:59:06 1996
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Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:21:52 GMT
From: sfraves <sfraves@spinback.demon.co.uk>
Reply-To: sfraves@spinback.demon.co.uk
Message-Id: <97@spinback.demon.co.uk>
To: aguevara@compattic.com, ambient@netcom.com
Cc: cloud@cats.ucsc.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Robert Miles and...
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In your message dated Tuesday 21, May 1996 you wrote :
> Childeren apperently is hitting really hard in England.  I believe that the
> Arsenal is using the song to when they score goals during thier home games.
> 
> 
> And....
> 
> 
> It seems that Children Has been "domesticated" by Akrista Records. 
> So Far I've heard it at:
> 
> Kohl (Community college radio station that play's top 40 tunes)
> 
> Kmel (Yup, that's right Kmel) On Low rotation.
> 
> Musak Station @ CompUSA.....
> 
> 
> The Revoultion is at hand.....
> 
> 
> "Dance with me"
> 
> Adam


Are you refering to the Robert Miles tune?  That has been over here in England 
for months, and has been in the pop charts top 10- It now suffers from what a 
lot of half decent tunes end up with here- commerical overplay.

Daryll

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 21 23:59:40 1996
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Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 22:48:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Bryce Ryan" <brycer@ultima.org>
In-Reply-To: <31A256DF.738C@ix.netcom.com> from "NOMADS" at May 21, 96 04:50:55 pm
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My mailer says that NOMADS said:
> 
> Yet, several months back when F&F
> needed a space, we took ethan and several members of the planning 
> comittee to see a beautiful space with three musical areas that was well 
> within F&F's budget. He loved the space and yet when it came down to it, 
> he refused the space and even scared the manager into thinking that this 
> was going to be some out of control party. 
> 

just a point of fact about the space in question here, and what 
members from the collective  brought to the attention of the manager:
that the party was going to be all night and that it was going to be loud.
the all night, loud part was news to the manager.  my sense, and his
conversation, indicated that this was new news to him, and got him to 
thinking on his own.

we also became aware, on inspecting the space and talking with the manager,
that there was a rest home 100 feet from the space, as well as residences
just across the street.  the residences we may have been able to deal with
by a door to door canvas;  the rest home, with many older and infirm
people, couldn't be  dealt with in any sensible manner except to recommend
against doing events there. going into a neighborhood and disturbing
all the neighbors, especially folks who aren't well and can't get away
from the disturbance, was the only responsible action under those 
circumstances, IMO.  i'm sure the manager's thoughts also turned in
that direction, since the space is maintained in the public interest
(i seem to recall that the building is owned by the city or county),
and he has to consider the impact on the community he serves.  we may
be there for one night...he has to live with the aftermath for the
remainder of his term of care, AND answer to the city or county.

i suspect, but don't know for sure, that the manager of the space also
took into consideration the fact that he was not informed until a very
late date, of just what that party would entail.  i recall him being
very surprised that we expect to go beyond 1 or 2 AM.  For a legal
event in a legal space, popping surprises like that on the management
is not a good thing. 

if there was anyone scaring anybody, it was responsible people considering
the long term consequences of their actions.

as it was, F&F had a fine event outdoors that disturbed no one and
was well attended, instead of a chancy event indoors that could have
resulted in noise complaints, an early shutdown, and unhappiness on all
sides.  Given that the event was an anniversary party, and F&F's previous
anniversary party got shut down very early because of a variety of
problems, ethan, i, and other members of the collective recommended against
doing an event in a space that was even modestly chancy.  Knowing the
potential draw of an F&F in a legal space, good promotion, and all
that, we decided NOT to risk another debacle of large proportions.  We
saw no reason to risk the happiness of our attendees with a potential
bust, nor risk the happiness, well-being and good will of the neighbors.

ethan did not, on his own, refuse the space.  he consulted with the planners
group and made a recommendation on our behalf. 
-- 
=== Bryce Ryan ===== AMBIANCE ========= e-dress: brycer@ultima.org =========
=== Internet services, education, and Toaster Net construction :-) =========
===  Web Weather report at http://priscilla.ultima.org/stats.html  =========

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 00:12:59 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: beddy bye, non-rave
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Thanks folks for talking with me. I have to go to Oregon tommorrow so I 
need to get some zzzzzzz

I'm beat


Ran
                             ( ooof )
                                /
                          -=*=-/
                            ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 01:25:03 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 01:24:41 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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Hi everybody . Tickets are moving fast for our campout , so I'll 
repeat 'get them early' once they are gone ,that's it. We should have 
tickets through the weekend but I expect it to sell out before the 
party. Our store will be closed ,we'll be at the mountain.
   So bring a sleeping bag or maybe a tent,some food to share,a 
telescope for the stars,something for the alter, something for your 
head,be creative.
   Friday night: settle in with early campers, slower beats with Corbin, 
Everett and others,warm up the hot tubs, Rather chill but every ones 
welcome.
   Saturday: inaugurate the mud baths, add on the rest of the sound(4 
corners, 8x by JK), Large spagetti feast for as many as we can(BRING 
STUFF TO ADD), then prepare to freak out all night with Spun(just 
confirmed!) Tony, Tracy, Carlos, Galen, Solar, Alex etc. 
   Sunday: relax and enjoy blue berry pancakes with Pollywog, Allen, 
Andrew and more,  but don't split yet because the full moon will soon 
rise in time for sunday night sets from Garth, Markie Mark, and John 
Howard.(and maybe an encore set from Tracy!)
   Monday: Sleep in, clean up, adios !!!
  So bring the whole family,(kids are welcome,dogs are not.)Please 
carpool to the limit of your vehicle( we have space for lots of 
people,not lots of cars. There's bus service to Willits(Greyhound or 
Green Tortoise} get yourself there and we'll shuttle you up to the 
party. Directions to the map point in Willits will be posted on the VM 
263-3915 where you will show your ticket and recieve final instructions.
Please try to arrive during the daylight hours on Fri, Sat, or Sunday, 
this will greatly help you in camping and locating the site which can be 
tricky at night. 
  
       Thanks everyone  ,  See ya there  , Mark Ameba

 p.s. The vision of a festival called Tribal Future popped into my head 
while visiting my daughter in New Zealand in October 1993. The first 
party by that name was on the Russian River in late summer '94 . The 
next Tribal Future was near Willits in October '95 and was subtitled 
"Mendocino Mountain Jam". 
 "Big Mountain Boogie" is the third in the Tribal Future series, but 
it's the fifth campout we've done up north since '92.                   
  Inspired by an impromptu after-party after "CREATION" we did on the 
river by Hacienda bridge near Guerneville we put together the "Russian 
River RE-UNION" on June 27-8 1992 followed by our collaboration with 
Preston known as "ACME ACRES" on August 15-16 '92 . This was the party 
that landed us in Sonoma County Court the day before the event , slapped 
with a restraining order from a local supervisor hysterical about "the 
rave" We won, first amendment in hand, to throw the party, shaken, but 
not stopped.
  We've got more events planned for this year, look for our workshop on 
Techno-Primitive Awareness at Harbin Hot Springs July 26-28, possibly a 
LARGE Tribal campout in Aug. or Sep. and another Tribal Future In 
Mendocino on October 19-20.      
  
-- 
salutations,  Mark Ameba 
_____________________________________
ameba  1732 haight street sf ca 94117
mailto:ameba@netcom.com
http://www.ameba.com        |      \
415.750.9368                |       \
=====================================
                            |       /
                            |      /

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 01:28:10 1996
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From: Rudy Villafane <rudy@quiknet.com>
To: "'SDream'" <SDream@tgrigsby.com>,
        "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'"
	 <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: SFR Logo/T-shirts
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 00:25:15 -0700
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I think the SFR T-shirt is a kool idea...It's been a while since I've =
done any type of art but I'll see if I can whip someting up this weekend =
and run it by ya.. :)

----------
From: 	SDream[SMTP:SDream@tgrigsby.com]
Sent: 	Monday, May 20, 1996 11:26 AM
To: 	sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: 	SFR Logo/T-shirts

Ok, since many people have said they don't necessarily want t-shirts, =
let's=20
make this a general logo contest.  Or not: Perhaps this will simply be a =

collection of logos from which people can choose what logo they prefer, =
copy=20
it, and use it to create their own t-shirt/laminate/bumper sticker/ =
etc....

Well, we now have TWO -- count'em, two -- designs!  I'm just going to =
leave=20
the page up and add any and all designs to it that come my way, cool?  =
Get=20
creative, and don't worry anymore about people voting on them.  I know =
I'm=20
not gonna worry: I'm going to do a little dabbling in graphic design and =

throw some of my own artwork on there, and I do *not* expect people to =
vote=20
for them...  Just a way to show off...

S




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 01:28:19 1996
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From: Rudy Villafane <rudy@quiknet.com>
To: "'John Draper'" <crunch@well.com>, "'Adam Luong'" <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
Cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: Funky Tekno Tribe
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 01:19:28 -0700
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Adam Luong: Hell Ya' I am! I should be wearing a black t-shirt with an =
alien in the front with the words "Alienated" underneath the back side =
has the same alien but with a court jester hat on. I'll also probably be =
wearing a black Adidas wind-breaker type pants that have a couple of =
white stripes down the side...If you also plan to attend this event let =
me know what you'll be wearing...Maybe we'll all meet up!...I'm kinda =
hyped about it....I hope it turns out kool!...

John Draper: Hey bud whassup?  We met at Madness (which by the way was a =
RAD event!).  Sorry to hear about your back man...  Hope things get =
better 4 U DoOd!  I've been meaning to reply to you last e-mail =
but...life for me iz so hektik...I don't always have the liberty to be =
online everyday...But Hope to see ya again bud!  I'll be at Funky Techno =
Tribe, let me know if you plan to attend!

                                         E
                                         /\
The Rest of the People in X-mail Land:  Whassup peoplez!  This looks =
like a RAD event! Whoever else is going give a holler!  I would actually =
like to see the people behind all these E-mailz!  Peace out people!  :)=20


-Rudy (  _BaNiSh_  ) -

----------
From: 	Adam Luong[SMTP:rlunatic@ix.netcom.com]
Sent: 	Tuesday, May 21, 1996 3:48 PM
To: 	sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: 	Funky Tekno Tribe

Enough about the Dj's names already!

Now, who's going?!


Adam




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 02:28:19 1996
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To: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: Funky Tekno Tribe
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>Enough about the Dj's names already!
>
>Now, who's going?!
>

I'm going!
 
The last party that Jerry,Kevin and Hectot (aka Funky Techno Tribe)
Totally ROCKED!!
I must say that their parties tend to help define the term Massive. I have 
known these guys through the years and they don't scrimp on production and
you will get your money's worth, the music will be good and in general they
care about the people who go to their parties, which is why they have lasted
the test of time.  Theese fellas are old skool and they hook it up right.


                                                G


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 02:50:09 1996
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To: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
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>You wrote: 
>>
>>Who felt that shake, I'm in Santa Clara and boy was that big!!
>>
>>
>>Tim (knucklehead)
>>
>>
>I sure did!!! That was fun!!! I hope they don't get any bigger!
>

That was about a 4.5 - 4.9 (my guess) yes they do get bigger
and if you live here long enough you will have a chance to
experience one :).  The quake of 89 was 7.1 about 100 times more energy.
When the inevitable "Big One" hits, it will be 8.0 or more.

Sometimes ya gotta pay to play :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 06:20:14 1996
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From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: FINALS!!!
In-Reply-To: <31A1E2ED.18C5@ix.netcom.com>
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  It's 6 a.m. and I have 2 finals left-I'm praying- I'm praying!!!!
                  *good luck*
                              hugs-
                               Reagan





On Tue, 21 May 1996, CT wrote:

> Hello brothers and sisters!
> 
> Will someone pleez say a prayer for me so that my head doesn't 
> explode in the middle of finals week???
> 
> I'll do the same for you.
> 
> No pressure, no pressure, no pressure...
> 
> CT
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 08:12:12 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605221512.IAA07552@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: Sci-fi Club
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello SFRaves -

 I had a flyer for the Sci-Fi Club, but I lost it! Is it still happening
for this Sunday evening? Also - is this Sunday's the last one at the
Clementina location?

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 08:25:58 1996
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To: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: hi kids :)
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, Karen Hardie wrote:

> the VISUALS were astonishingly well done ... for a while a huge YOU ARE 
> HERE was projected over the Army crest on the wall :) lovely fractal 
> animations too.  And also, there was a professional acting/dance troupe 
> of FIRE BREATHERS! there :) one of them was this guy on stilts wearing a 
> gas mask, strobe light breasts, a jockstrap and garters while juggling 
> flaming torches.
> 
How do you follow THAT act? ;-)

                                              Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 08:34:29 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 08:33:21 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Free Party This Saturday!
Cc: dhchung@hyperreal.com
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It's my friend's birthday this Saturday (May 25) and he's having a free party!


Higher State of Freedom

DJ's Gouracandra
         Andre Lucero
         Galen
         Taj
         Sean Murray

Gonna be at the beach!

Call (415) 303-5336 for more info

See ya there!

-Sean
John Mac
Renegade SoundSys.
'HOUSE MUSIC AIN'T NO CRIME"


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 09:44:25 1996
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To: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: Re: Sci-fi Club
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>Hello SFRaves -
>
> I had a flyer for the Sci-Fi Club, but I lost it! Is it still happening
>for this Sunday evening? Also - is this Sunday's the last one at the
>Clementina location?
>
> Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

I think that last sunday was the last, but that there will be a new thing
in the beginning of june.

take care
kcroy



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 09:56:52 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605221656.JAA23611@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Revenge of the Mag Spam.
To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 09:56:46 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24]
Content-Type: text
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First and formost:  Please do not "group reply" to this message.  It will
only futher the magazine spam/virtual virus.  

But, for all of those who got really irked by the magazine subscription
spammer, here is the info you have been looking for:

-troy

> Sent from: asif@well.com ()
> 
> [ mod's note: this guy Kevin Lipsitz did a lot of damage
>   around our site, and we're elated...
> ]
> 
> This is for all of those list managers who have been barraged recently
> by the magazine subscription posts emanating from temporary accounts
> on AOL.  Some fellow IICS members have finally succeeded in locating
> the offending party.  I seriously urge all who have been victimized by
> this scum to respond EN MASSE, via all means mentioned below.
> 
> LVX
> TF
> 
> > >-------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > >Date: Wed, 15 May 96 00:51:30 PDT
> > > >From: stan@tomlinson.com (Stan Tomlinson)
> > > >To: sdlp@lumina.ucsd.edu
> > > >Subject: SPAMMER's addresses
> > > >Cc: stan@tomlinson.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I sent in a fax and got the SPAMMER's 
> > > >(Fantastic Offer I Found...) catalog.
> > > >
> > > >The SPAMMER's name is Kevin Jay Lipsitz, who is president of
> > > >KRAZY KEVIN MAGAZINE CLUB and 
> > > >COLLEGETOWN MAGAZINE SUBSCRIPTION SERVICES, both at
> > > >POB 120990 Staten Island, New York, 10312-0990
> > > >
> > > >The SPAMMER's email addresses are "krazykev@kjl.com",
> > > >"krazykev@escape.com", "kjl@peakaccess.net".
> > > >
> > > >His phone numbers are
> > > >  voice mail: 800-644-0682 x 1234
> > > >  voice: 718-967-1234      [ <-- NO LONGER HERE. SEE BELOW. -TF ]
> > > >  fax: 718-967-1144
> > > >
> > > >The SPAMMER's ISP's are Kazan Corp (administrative
> > > >contact is "roman@escape.com") and Island Computer
> > > >Products (peakaccess.com, administrative contact
> > > >kberry@HLC.NET).
> > > >
> > > >Hope this helps those who hate getting spammed.
> > > >
> > > >Stan
> > > >
> > >-----------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > >From: TSEditor@aol.com
> > > >Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 04:31:56 -0400
> > > >To: sdlp@lumina.ucsd.edu
> > > >Subject: Stop spammer
> > > >
> > > >Feel free to emulate:
> > > >
> > > >11 May 1996
> > > >
> > > >Postmaster
> > > >United States Postal Service
> > > >11251 Rancho Carmel Dr.
> > > >San Diego, CA  92128
> > > >
> > > >cc:
> > > >Americal Online customer service
> > > >CompuServe customer service
> > > >Magazine Club Inquiry Center
> > > >PO Box 990
> > > >Staten Island, NY  10312-0990
> > > >
> > > >Dear Postmaster:
> > > >
> > > >Repeated attempts to have my direct and indirect email addresses
> > > >TSEditor@aol.com, 72010,3003 and sdlp@lumina.ucsd.edu) removed 
> > > >from the email list of Magazine Club Inquiry Center, PO Box 990,
> > > >Staten Island, NY  10312-0990 have failed, because they cancel
> > > >their free email account immediately after sending a promotional
> > > >message.  All "Please remove me from your list" messages are
> > > >consequently rejected as the sender is "Not a known user" (i.e.
> > > >Moved, no longer at this address.  Return to sender.)
> > > >
> > > >I consider this abuse of the Internet to be harassment.
> > > >Each message takes time to process, open and read.  Each message
> > > >takes time away from my basic rate account.  If the base time is
> > > >exceeded, it costs me money.
> > > >I will happily ad my name to the list of plaintiffs in any
> > > >legal action against Magazine Club Inquiry Center and their
> > > >agents if that's what it takes to stop this practice.
> > > >
> > > >An example of a typical message is attached.
> > > >
> > > >Sincerely,
> > > >
> > > >William T. Holmes
> > > >P.O. Box 1257
> > > >Escondido, California 92033
> > > >619-972-8569 (mobile), 619-432-0613 (fax/voice)
> > > >TSEditor@AOL.com or 72010,3003
> > > >
> > > >Subject: Interesting place I found in a remote corner of the net
> > > >Sent:        5/10/96 1:06 AM
> > > >Received:    5/11/96 1:28 AM
> > > >From:        Conroy675@aol.com
> > > >
> > > >---------------------
> > > >Forwarded message:
> > > >Subj:    Interesting place I found in a remote corner of the net
> > > >Date:    96-05-09 17:54:05 EDT
> > > >From:    Conroy675
> > > >
> > > >-----> NOTE:   Please first read my note which appears below the
> > > > "Request for more info Form."  Then, to get more info, just fill
> > > > out the "Request for More Info" form completely and *FAX* or
> > > >*SMAIL* it back to the company. 
> > > > 
> > > [remainder of offensive spam cut]
> > > 
> > >
> > >-- Terje <Norderhaug.CHI@Xerox.com>
> > >   http://www.ifi.uio.no/~terjen/
> > >   Chat: http://terje.cerfnet.com/interaction$/chat/terje
> > >
> > --
> > Elizabeth Forbes                | Pres., International Interactive
> > President, IntraAction          | Communications Society, San Diego 
> > MultiMedia that Moves Minds(TM) | iicshq@aol.com,
> www.learncd.com/sdiics.htm
> > ** zow@cyberdoor.com ** http://www.cyberdoor.com/ ** 619.271.6592 **
> 
> 
> ====== AND MORE LATE-BREAKING INFO... ====== 
> 
> 
> > Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 20:56:30 -0700
> > To: Elizabeth Forbes <zow@thegroup.net>, iics-list@netcom.com
> > From: shmerls@earthlink.net (Steven Shmerler)
> > Subject: Re: AOL Spammer found! - MORE INFO
> >  
> > Elizabeth and IICS;
> >  
> > Many apologies for this, but...
> >  
> > I called the voice #, but got AAA towing.  They've had the # only 5
> > months. The 800#, however, IS for KRAZY KEVIN.  The voice message
> > there, mentions the numbers below including the, now, AAA number,
> > which is in Staten Island consistant with the address in the SPAM.
> >  
> > I will try the 800 # again during business hours Monday.
> > Perhaps we ALL should!  I'm also sending this info to AOL as well.
> >  
> > Good Luck,
> >  
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >    ___  ___  ___  | Steven Shmerler
> >   /__  /__/ /__   | Internet Consultation, Design, Webmaster
> >  ___/ /  / ___/   | 213-874-4973  * shmerls@earthlink.net
> >  Entertainment    | http://home.earthlink.net/~shmerls
> >                   | IICS - LA Chapter Webmaster: http://la.iics.org
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >                       Resist Internet Censorship!
> 
> 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 10:29:23 1996
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   Wed, 22 May 96 10:25:48 PDT
Date: Wed, 22 May 96 10:25:48 PDT
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com
Subject: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

FROM: Robert Brown

SUBJECT: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)


 I had sent an email about this yesterday morning but it never showed up
 on SFR that I could see, so I'll resend it...

 After seeing a few posts about car break ins at raves I felt I just HAD
 to chime in on it given what happened to me over the weekend.

 On Saturday night/Sunday morning my car was stolen while I was in SF
 dancing.  Not an expenisive car, but not a heap either.  Coming out
 at 3:30am to discover your car is no more is not a pleasant experience,
 especially when you're alone, stranded 45 miles from home!

 According to the police (who was reasonably nice, btw) Hondas seem to
 be the current favorite flavor of car thieves in SF.  I had a "locktronics"
 ignition lock, but obviously it didn't prevent the car from being stolen.
 Seemed to be a pro job.  Also, again according to the police, auto theives
 do cruise around various party/club spots in SF looking for cars - so
 be careful as well as you can.  I think they were definitely after the car
 itself because I hid everything out of site so there'd be no obvious
 motivation for breaking into the car.  To no avail...

 Ironically I was looking at car alarms just a couple of weeks ago, but
 couldn't afford to get one at the time.  Argh!  :(

 Aside from the car my uninsured, personal, and expensive cellular phone
 was taken, and my planner/address book.  So, if any of you have given
 my your addy/phone # I no longer have them and would like them again,
 if possible.

 If anyone sees a black Honda Prelude with CA license plate EZP 233, please
 call the police!  Though I'm sure it's been hacked to bits and the
 parts sent all over the place by now.  :(

 And just to make things completely miserable, my s.o. decided to break up
 with me last night.  Paradise lost...(that phrase just came to mind)
 Life seems a swirl of negativity currently...

 Sorry, but had to spill to whomever was listening.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 10:56:40 1996
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To: TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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We hear ya, man!  Yeah, there definitely is a lot of negative energy and a
spirit of ill will about.  We all need to spread positive vibes, however
down we may feel, to counteract this.  The only thing we can be sure of in
life is that we can't be sure of anything.

May the Force (of PLUR) be with you!

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 10:58:40 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605221758.KAA24452@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Hard Copy Copy URL (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 10:58:34 -0700 (PDT)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24]
Content-Type: text
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Check out the HTMLized Hard Copy story at:

http://hyperreal.com/raves/socal/HardCopy

-troy





> 
> For those who want to look at the Hard Copy report again, 
> or if you haven't seen it, i have it available in 4 formats:
> 
> Quicktime -- 25 MEG!
> 
> ftp://hyperreal.com/incoming/socal/hard.copy.bin
> 
> MPEG  -- 4.8 meg (just video, no audio :( if someone can tell me how to fix
> this, it would be much appreciated :)
> 
> ftp://hyperreal.com/incoming/socal/hard.copy.mpg
> 
> HTML 
> 
> http://hyperreal.com/raves/socal/HardCopy
> 
> TEXT
> 
> http://hyperreal.com/raves/socal/HardCopy/HardCopy.txt
> 
> 
>  ,
> dana
> 
> "You're married to someone for six years and you think
> you know a person and all of a sudden they say, 'I'm not gay.'"
> 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 11:21:32 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 11:25:07 -0600
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk


>If we cannot have a *RATIONAL*, *ADULT* discussion *IN PUBLIC* what hope do
>you think there is for this scene that we all care about so much?
>
>Ethan, you wanted your grievances aired publicly, and they have been. Tom &
>Stacy, you have answered some of these allegations, and made some of your
>own.
>
>This situation has been made public, and in the most inflammatory manner
>I have ever seen on this list. I for one hope it stays public until some
>of these allegations are answered, or until both parties involved agree to
>make it private, and *TALK ABOUT IT*
>
>                                            Patrick
>
>

Ok, there's been a fair amount of insterest so I'll post it:

(btw I've also verified that at last one noise complaint came from 1 block
away from the party by personal contact with the person who made the call)

---

Insinuation will get us nowhere. I'm just going to respond directly to
items that I can shed some light on.

At 5:50 PM  -0600 5/21/96, NOMADS wrote:


>Tuesday we spoke to the owner of the space who said yes lets do the
>party.
>Wednesday, we recieved a call from ethan miller saying it was
>disrespectful to use that space, even though his name is not on the lease
>for that space. He did not even ask why we needed the space. An hour
>later we recieved a call from the owner of the space saying he recieved a
>call from the police telling him "We understand you are having a rave
>party this Saturday. You can't do it and don't let us come down there".
>The owner said that the caller never left his name. The owner told us he
>believed this to be a prank call from the madness people. He said lets
>still go ahead with the party. He did not want these people to bully him.
>

The respect issue isn't about being on the lease for the space. It's about
nurturing a location for longterm use. The owner today told me he barely
scraped by on Saturday and wants to take a long time off before another
event. I find the police call story very odd as the owner has a good
relationship with his local station and knows enough of them to check that
kind of threat out. It should also be obvious that we (madness) are
straight up about our feelings and wouldn't resort to underhanded tactics
to stop a party. The owner has the utmost respect for us and I've had
several discussions with him both before and after your party and he's in
no way led me to believe he has any doubts about us nor did he mention any
phone calls or any police contact until he approached them on Saturday
before the party.

>In the meantime there is a guy named billy who lives at this location
>free of charge. According to the owner billy introduced the madness
>people to him. The next morning, the owner called us and said that he
>recieved three calls from the madness people yelling at him not to do the
>party. He said the callers were alex, jon santos, and a third "person".
>They told him don't do this party, these people are "this" and "that",
>etc, etc. The owner also said that billy told him that the madness people
>had a meeting the night before and decided to cause problems for the
>party. If anyone wants to verify these facts they can ask the owner
>directly.
>

I'm not sure what day your refering to. The only time we had a meeting last
week was on Monday night when we took down lights at the space and did a
post party analysis. We never at any time had any discussions about causing
problems for your party. I did ask the owner to be extra sensitive to sound
levels based on the two complaints we generated, but that's about it.

>At this point the owner became hesitant and nervous about everything. He
>decided to call off the party. He also felt blackmaled by the madness
>people. A few hours later we met with him and he decided to honor his
>word and go through with the party. We addressed all the concerns of the
>owner to include sound levels, capacity issues, and adequate security.

Blackmailed? We have nothing to blackmail him with. I for one only
expressed my concern for the continued usability of his space and the
avoidance of problems with his neighbors. That's what I'm concerned about.
It wouldn't have mattered who did the party.

>
>Two hours after our meeting with the owner, ethan miller posted his
>malicious remarks on the internet.
>
>During the party, around midnight, noise complaints started pouring in
>from far away locations. HOW STRANGE!!!
>

If you're insinuating we were calling trying to get your party busted I
find that completely disgusting. We had two complaints from neighbors at
our party, I don't find it  unreasonable at all to think that the same
people complained again. You may not have been aware that there's a
convalescent home right on the other side of 280.

>The sound levels were maintained so the party went on.
>
>Overall, people were happy to have us in the neighborhood because we
>respected everything around us and that comes from doing events in that
>area for a while now and for keeping good relationships with the people
>we have worked with.

So you spoke to neighbors before and after the party?

Look, I don't want to slander you, and as I've said on SFR I don't have
anything against you personally and I don't care about the rumors floating
around. Unless someone does something to me personally I'm not going judge
them. I feel you had little respect for the work we'd done getting that
space and made a selfish snap decision because your "virgin" space didn't
work out. And hearing you refer to the location on your voicemail as virgin
merely added insult to injury. I don't think you have as much respect for
the location as we do. Life goes on.

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 11:26:24 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 11:26:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: Car break-ins
To: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605221114.A27060-0100000@netcom20>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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My friend also had his rental car broken into and all his traveling stuff 
(as well as my friends' jacket and sweater) stolen during Gaia.  When we 
drove to the party we had no idea that the neighborhood was as bad.

In the morning there were other people who had their cars broken into 
waiting for the cop to finish talking to us :(.  

Maybe one way to try to prevent it (or cut down on it) is to have 
promoters say something about the area on VM.  If there has been a 
history of car break-ins to let people know that the area is not the best 
and maybe offer other alternatives (BART, safe near by area + cab....).
Also to send the cops who come to visit the party to drive around and 
check the cars every once in a while.

Sometimes cops are nice enough to do it - I live in OK part of SF (border-line
of Pacific heights and Western Addition) and whenever I have 
problem with the bums (when they get agressive and try to follow us to 
the house or threaten to beat us up for some money - happened to me once 
during the party we had and I was brave/stupid/drunk enough to talk back 
to this lady who was twice my size) police comes and scares them away.  
Or just checks the neighborhood is safe.

Just a thought...

Hugz,
Branka

P.S.  Funky Tekno Tribe - I will be there - look for me - glow sticks, 
gray/purple back-pack, glow in the dark koosh balls etc.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 11:36:36 1996
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	id AA05547; Wed, 22 May 96 13:34:48 CDT
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 13:34:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: More Herbal Ecstacy News (fwd)
Message-Id: <Pine.SUN.3.91.960522133419.1147B-100000@dfw.dfw.net>
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More goverment control. 

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 09:52:22 -0700
From: Sean Songalia <ideas@i-d-e-a-s.com>
To: 'SoCal-Raves Mailing List' <socal-raves@ucsd.edu>
Subject: More Herbal Ecstacy News

>From the HP Starlink Messaging Pager:

=======================================================
--TOP STORY --
Comgress announced this morning that it will be taking up
legislation to try to stop firms from marketing herbal drugs as
legal alternatives to illegal street drugs such as "ecstacy"
and "speed."  Sen. Alfonse D'Amato (R-NY) was joined by Sens.
Christopher Dodd (D-CT) and Bill Frist (R-TN) in New York City
today to unviel the bill. At least 15 people have died in the
US from use of the herb-based drugs.
=======================================================


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 12:28:22 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 15:27:44 -0400
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To: aleph1@dfw.net, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Blown Off? Phuk That! Who's got the #'s
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>>>It's official...
...we have officially been blown off by Hard Copy.  ...They claim that there
really wasn't much of a negative response to the story....<<<
Apparently there is a bit of a miscommunication.  I know we may not be
experts on negativity, but I'm sure we can improvise.  Let's see that fax #
again,  who's got the their address.  Load the catapult.  I'm not saying that
we'll spend the rest of our lives screaming injustice, but that was a little
to easy for them.  I at least want to see a public apology issued to all
interested forums.  Someone mentioned the staff is reccessing soon.  Let's
act fast.  And if we've missed them, then let's remeber to be at their door
when they get back.  I'm obviously with the "This is straight up fucking
wrong" party on this issue, and I would really like to see something done.
 I've never been a big dignity monger, and I'm always cautious of those
acting in the name of pride, but I see this as a matter of respect and I feel
it's important to the unity of our comunnity that something more be done.
Sit BooBoo, Sit!
Steveo


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 13:08:04 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 13:07:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
To: TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605221725.AA13725@nsc.nsc.com>
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First off, I am sorry to learn of your loss.  My 'cherry' 1984 Toyota SR5 
was stolen last July 28, two weeks before a one week off road vision 
quest, and of course I had to take a piece of shit rental car to my 
second Burning Man...  After completely giving my truck away in my heart, 
it came back to me two days after returning from Burning Man...Sept. 5.
it was missing the camper shell, a brand new battery, the power antennae, 
and many valuable belongings (as I was going out that night), etc.

Knowing what I know now, I would have paid $1000 for an alarm!  The theft 
cost me dearly, like yours.  Like you I had thought about getting an 
alarm for years... You would think that the insurance companies would 
tell us which are the hottest vehicles stolen, well my truck and all 
Toyota trucks, 4 runners, etc. are the number one stolen vehicle in 
California, especially in Southern Ca. and yours is very popular...
These are actual statistics...  So my advice is if you get your baby 
back, put an alarm in it and a club (why make it easy for them) even if 
you have to go in debt to do it.  If you have to purchase a new vehicle, 
put an alarm in that as well.... You can also have a mechanic put in an 
additional kill switch...    Good luck...  --Maureen

P.S.  If you had insurance, don't let them screw you by quoting blue 
book...insist on replacement value, do some research in auto trader 
magazines....  

On Wed, 22 May 1996 TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com wrote:

> FROM: Robert Brown
> 
> SUBJECT: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
> 
> 
>  I had sent an email about this yesterday morning but it never showed up
>  on SFR that I could see, so I'll resend it...
> 
>  After seeing a few posts about car break ins at raves I felt I just HAD
>  to chime in on it given what happened to me over the weekend.
> 
>  On Saturday night/Sunday morning my car was stolen while I was in SF
>  dancing.  Not an expenisive car, but not a heap either.  Coming out
>  at 3:30am to discover your car is no more is not a pleasant experience,
>  especially when you're alone, stranded 45 miles from home!
> 
>  According to the police (who was reasonably nice, btw) Hondas seem to
>  be the current favorite flavor of car thieves in SF.  I had a "locktronics"
>  ignition lock, but obviously it didn't prevent the car from being stolen.
>  Seemed to be a pro job.  Also, again according to the police, auto theives
>  do cruise around various party/club spots in SF looking for cars - so
>  be careful as well as you can.  I think they were definitely after the car
>  itself because I hid everything out of site so there'd be no obvious
>  motivation for breaking into the car.  To no avail...
> 
>  Ironically I was looking at car alarms just a couple of weeks ago, but
>  couldn't afford to get one at the time.  Argh!  :(
> 
>  Aside from the car my uninsured, personal, and expensive cellular phone
>  was taken, and my planner/address book.  So, if any of you have given
>  my your addy/phone # I no longer have them and would like them again,
>  if possible.
> 
>  If anyone sees a black Honda Prelude with CA license plate EZP 233, please
>  call the police!  Though I'm sure it's been hacked to bits and the
>  parts sent all over the place by now.  :(
> 
>  And just to make things completely miserable, my s.o. decided to break up
>  with me last night.  Paradise lost...(that phrase just came to mind)
>  Life seems a swirl of negativity currently...
> 
>  Sorry, but had to spill to whomever was listening.
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 13:16:29 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 13:15:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
To: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
cc: SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605221114.A27060-0100000@netcom20>
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Another thought would be for the promoters to have security folks 
patrolling the area...  The Funky Techno guys have done this when their 
parti4es are at Caesar's ...in the past...  The other thing is to listen 
to you gut feelings...when you park your auto and something doesn't feel 
right, you are probably being watches... listen to your instincts....Your 
instincts are not paranoia....they are ancient and quite real....  your 
inner wolf...  

At this point I simply refuse to party in bad, really bad neighborhoods...
for not only do we risk losing our vehicles or belongings, but the odds 
increase for being personally assaulted...So I either go with friends or 
not at all... and I usually arrive hideously early to insure a close 
space near the door....  --Maureen
  

On Wed, 22 May 1996, Branka Cehic wrote:

> My friend also had his rental car broken into and all his traveling stuff 
> (as well as my friends' jacket and sweater) stolen during Gaia.  When we 
> drove to the party we had no idea that the neighborhood was as bad.
> 
> In the morning there were other people who had their cars broken into 
> waiting for the cop to finish talking to us :(.  
> 
> Maybe one way to try to prevent it (or cut down on it) is to have 
> promoters say something about the area on VM.  If there has been a 
> history of car break-ins to let people know that the area is not the best 
> and maybe offer other alternatives (BART, safe near by area + cab....).
> Also to send the cops who come to visit the party to drive around and 
> check the cars every once in a while.
> 
> Sometimes cops are nice enough to do it - I live in OK part of SF (border-line
> of Pacific heights and Western Addition) and whenever I have 
> problem with the bums (when they get agressive and try to follow us to 
> the house or threaten to beat us up for some money - happened to me once 
> during the party we had and I was brave/stupid/drunk enough to talk back 
> to this lady who was twice my size) police comes and scares them away.  
> Or just checks the neighborhood is safe.
> 
> Just a thought...
> 
> Hugz,
> Branka
> 
> P.S.  Funky Tekno Tribe - I will be there - look for me - glow sticks, 
> gray/purple back-pack, glow in the dark koosh balls etc.
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 13:25:52 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 13:25:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Re: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
To: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v0300660fadc8fcaef492@[198.97.35.13]>
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> (btw I've also verified that at last one noise complaint came from 1 block
> away from the party by personal contact with the person who made the call)


I wish promoters would remember that many SOMA areas once considered 
abandoned warehouse areas, now house people in live in artist spaces...not 
all of them are ravers...the base does carry, we know this..  Promoters 
need to check out local buildings thoroughly before renting new spaces...
I have mentioned this before...  It was probably the reason the F8 party 
was made to shut the music off  on New Years..or was it March 
1..anyway...remember..  

And also, the only way this entire matter will be settled is for each 
party to meet mano to mano and have a discussion/healing 
session...I suggest they use a talking stick, and in the tradition I 
learned, you can only speak from the heart while holding this stick and 
no one can interrupt you...

Way too much human 
information is lost arguing back and forth on the net...   --Maureen


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 13:33:33 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 13:32:19 -0700 (PDT)
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To: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>, TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com
From: bigz@bigz.com (Jon Zimmerman)
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Before you buy an alarm, try the $35 alternative, "The Club". I've had one
in every car I've ever owned, and use it often particularly in bad
neighborhoods.

Jon



At  1:07 PM 5/22/96 -0700, Maureen Garrett wrote:
>First off, I am sorry to learn of your loss.  My 'cherry' 1984 Toyota SR5
>was stolen last July 28, two weeks before a one week off road vision
>quest, and of course I had to take a piece of shit rental car to my
>second Burning Man...  After completely giving my truck away in my heart,
>it came back to me two days after returning from Burning Man...Sept. 5.
>it was missing the camper shell, a brand new battery, the power antennae,
>and many valuable belongings (as I was going out that night), etc.
>
>Knowing what I know now, I would have paid $1000 for an alarm!  The theft
>cost me dearly, like yours.  Like you I had thought about getting an
>alarm for years... You would think that the insurance companies would
>tell us which are the hottest vehicles stolen, well my truck and all
>Toyota trucks, 4 runners, etc. are the number one stolen vehicle in
>California, especially in Southern Ca. and yours is very popular...
>These are actual statistics...  So my advice is if you get your baby
>back, put an alarm in it and a club (why make it easy for them) even if
>you have to go in debt to do it.  If you have to purchase a new vehicle,
>put an alarm in that as well.... You can also have a mechanic put in an
>additional kill switch...    Good luck...  --Maureen
>
>P.S.  If you had insurance, don't let them screw you by quoting blue
>book...insist on replacement value, do some research in auto trader
>magazines....
>
>On Wed, 22 May 1996 TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com wrote:
>
>> FROM: Robert Brown
>>
>> SUBJECT: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
>>
>>
>>  I had sent an email about this yesterday morning but it never showed up
>>  on SFR that I could see, so I'll resend it...
>>
>>  After seeing a few posts about car break ins at raves I felt I just HAD
>>  to chime in on it given what happened to me over the weekend.
>>
>>  On Saturday night/Sunday morning my car was stolen while I was in SF
>>  dancing.  Not an expenisive car, but not a heap either.  Coming out
>>  at 3:30am to discover your car is no more is not a pleasant experience,
>>  especially when you're alone, stranded 45 miles from home!
>>
>>  According to the police (who was reasonably nice, btw) Hondas seem to
>>  be the current favorite flavor of car thieves in SF.  I had a "locktronics"
>>  ignition lock, but obviously it didn't prevent the car from being stolen.
>>  Seemed to be a pro job.  Also, again according to the police, auto theives
>>  do cruise around various party/club spots in SF looking for cars - so
>>  be careful as well as you can.  I think they were definitely after the car
>>  itself because I hid everything out of site so there'd be no obvious
>>  motivation for breaking into the car.  To no avail...
>>
>>  Ironically I was looking at car alarms just a couple of weeks ago, but
>>  couldn't afford to get one at the time.  Argh!  :(
>>
>>  Aside from the car my uninsured, personal, and expensive cellular phone
>>  was taken, and my planner/address book.  So, if any of you have given
>>  my your addy/phone # I no longer have them and would like them again,
>>  if possible.
>>
>>  If anyone sees a black Honda Prelude with CA license plate EZP 233, please
>>  call the police!  Though I'm sure it's been hacked to bits and the
>>  parts sent all over the place by now.  :(
>>
>>  And just to make things completely miserable, my s.o. decided to break up
>>  with me last night.  Paradise lost...(that phrase just came to mind)
>>  Life seems a swirl of negativity currently...
>>
>>  Sorry, but had to spill to whomever was listening.
>>
>>

Jon Zimmerman
(415)664-6645
bigz@bigz.com
http://www.bigz.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 13:49:40 1996
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From: blkadder@value.net
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 13:49:19 -0700 (PDT)
To: Jon Zimmerman <bigz@bigz.com>
cc: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>, TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com, sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
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On Wed, 22 May 1996, Jon Zimmerman wrote:

> Before you buy an alarm, try the $35 alternative, "The Club". I've had one
> in every car I've ever owned, and use it often particularly in bad
> neighborhoods.
> 
> Jon
> 
All these suggestions are great if the theives are amateurs. If they are 
pro's the Club is a minor inconvience. However, it does do one important 
thing, slow them down. You are not going to stop a determined theif, but 
you can slow them down to the point that your vehicle becomes 
unattractive. Alarms also help in this, especially if you have a 
secondary battery located somewhere besides the engine compartment.

                                     Black Adder



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 14:25:57 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 15:26:03 -0500
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: cduwe@wesleyan.edu (Colin Duwe)
Subject: Graduating and leaving SFR
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Hi all,
        On Sunday I'm graduating from Wesleyan with a BA in English and a
plane ticket home. I'll finally be in SF for good, so I can stop trying to
throw Tribal Funks by remote control. My partner Flash has also graduated
so you can expect to see a lot of us in the coming months. I'll be off the
list for a little while getting settled. Hopefully I will bump into a bunch
of you up in Mendacino for my first boogie session back in town (out of
town?) And we're trying to put together a Tribal Funk for June 29th. See
you soon.
        Keep Smiling
        Colin



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 14:34:32 1996
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From: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
Message-Id: <199605222132.OAA27210@alumnae.caltech.edu>
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
To: blkadder@value.net
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 14:32:40 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960522134343.18603B-100000@value.net> from "blkadder@value.net" at May 22, 96 01:49:19 pm
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> All these suggestions are great if the theives are amateurs. If they are 
> pro's the Club is a minor inconvience. However, it does do one important 
> thing, slow them down. You are not going to stop a determined theif, but 
> you can slow them down to the point that your vehicle becomes 
> unattractive. Alarms also help in this, especially if you have a 
> secondary battery located somewhere besides the engine compartment.
> 
>                                      Black Adder
> 

Unfortunately, it sounds like these thieves are organized
and really know what they're doing :(  Ack.

I guess I'll go buy the Club tonight, since as you point out,
it sure can't hurt.  

My sympathies to all who have had their cars %$#$ed with,
I can't imagine a worse way to come down from a good party.

Sometimes bad things happen to good people...

			Smiles,
				Chin

P.S. Was there going to Ackpfthouth Bay SFR gathering this Friday,
or did I already miss it?

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 14:44:49 1996
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From: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Cc: sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
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 Like any other device, The Club can be defeated, but for $39 you really 
can't do better. Most theives will put their feet on the steering wheel, 
while pulling on the club in an effort to 'flex' the wheel enough to get 
it off. It helps to attach the Club's 'hooks' near the spokes on your 
steering wheel where it is a bit more rigid.
 Also, you can add an ignition kill switch for the price of a simple SPST 
toggle switch from Radio Shack (~$1.50), and some wire. Just intercept 
the hot wire, and mount the switch somewhere that isn't obvious.

peace,
Dan


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 14:51:27 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: i'm back...
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OK, I got e-mail working down here so I'm back on the list...

did anything ever come of that "south bay get together" thing? Because if
it did, let me know. I'm totally up for it.

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, t-shirts and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (510) 664-1026                   |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:00:40 1996
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From: "Rocky Mullin" <caliban@organic.com>
Message-Id: <9605221504.ZM8703@tempest.organic.com>
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 15:04:13 -0700
In-Reply-To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
        "Car break-ins" (May 20, 10:57am)
References: <v02140b0badc5ff69b30e@[146.225.72.168]>
MiscInfo: your chaotic-good formatting slave
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To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson), sfraves@hyperreal.com
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	and don't drive up to the party booming hardfloor on your
	$2k stereo system.

On May 20, 10:57am, Eric P. Peterson wrote:
> Subject: Car break-ins
> Hey, y'all!  RLunatic's story got me to thinkin': car vandals may be hip to
> some of the events at which we gather, finding ripe fields of cars waiting
> for them to reap a bountiful harvest.  There may be no way to prevent this
> from happening, but we may be able to decrease the chances of a car being
> broken into.  I suggest driving a vehicle that doesn't look to spiffy,
> sporty, shiny, or otherwise suggests the owner's affluence; if you have a
> "nice" car, get a ride with someone whose wheels don't look as nice.  Also,
> when you park, HIDE Y'ALL'S GOODIES!  If someone can't see anything
> attractive inside da ride, he/she may be less likely to have in.  Any other
> ideas?  We need to help each other, if we care about each other :)
>
> Peace,
>
> - E
>
>-- End of excerpt from Eric P. Peterson



-- 
\  c   /\  a   /\  l   /\  i   /\  b   /\  a   /\  n   /\     rocky mullin
_\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\   san francisco
  \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /organic online, inc. 
   \/      \/      \/      \/      \/ http://www.organic.com/Staff/caliban
ninja250 -- analog synthesis -- chaotic good -- the internet is my ashtray

"i hate anything that ends with .exe" - patrick sean farley

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:07:17 1996
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From: "Rocky Mullin" <caliban@organic.com>
Message-Id: <9605221510.ZM8747@tempest.organic.com>
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 15:10:50 -0700
In-Reply-To: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
        "Re: Car break-ins" (May 20,  4:01pm)
References: <199605202301.QAA10538@iceland.it.earthlink.net>
MiscInfo: your chaotic-good formatting slave
X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.2 10apr95 MediaMail)
To: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>,
        epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
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On May 20,  4:01pm, Courtney Nielsen wrote:
>
> Ever went to one of the parties that were held at the old One Step Beyond in
> Santa Clara a few years back?
> I remember seeing ripe fields of cars at the beginning on the night and
> seeing sparkling fields of broken glass in the morning. Oooooh, it was bad.
> I was pissed once, cause I lost an illuminating frisbee. A car stereo (even
> a car) can be replaced, but not an illuminating frisbee from 1978. Nope,
> they got glow-in-the-dark ones available, bot not one with L.E.D.'s around
> the rim.
>
>-- End of excerpt from Courtney Nielsen

	your geek-fu is weak!  build your own!  wbl forever...
	;)



-- 
\  c   /\  a   /\  l   /\  i   /\  b   /\  a   /\  n   /\     rocky mullin
_\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\   san francisco
  \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /organic online, inc. 
   \/      \/      \/      \/      \/ http://www.organic.com/Staff/caliban
ninja250 -- analog synthesis -- chaotic good -- the internet is my ashtray

"i hate anything that ends with .exe" - patrick sean farley

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:07:53 1996
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To: Rocky Mullin <caliban@organic.com>
cc: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
In-Reply-To: <9605221504.ZM8703@tempest.organic.com>
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On Wed, 22 May 1996, Rocky Mullin wrote:

> 
> 	and don't drive up to the party booming hardfloor on your
> 	$2k stereo system.
> 
Guilty.... ;-)

                                      Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:15:15 1996
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From: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
Message-Id: <199605222207.PAA28433@alumnae.caltech.edu>
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
To: lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu (Chinley L. Chang)
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 15:07:15 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605222132.OAA27210@alumnae.caltech.edu> from "Chinley L. Chang" at May 22, 96 02:32:40 pm
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> P.S. Was there going to Ackpfthouth Bay SFR gathering this Friday,
> or did I already miss it?
> 

Whoops, that's supposed to read:

"P.S. Was there going to be a South Bay SFR gathering this Friday,
 or did I already miss it?"

...  Although if there is going to be an Ackpfthouth Bay SFR gathering,
I guess I'd like to hear about that too :)

                        Smiles,
                                Chin


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:24:15 1996
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From: "Rocky Mullin" <caliban@organic.com>
Message-Id: <9605221527.ZM8797@tempest.organic.com>
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 15:27:15 -0700
In-Reply-To: NOMADS <tahsina@ix.netcom.com>
        "Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long" (May 21,  4:50pm)
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	water and toilets?
	nice work.

On May 21,  4:50pm, NOMADS wrote:
> Subject: Nomad Interactive response to ethan!!!!!!-long
> First and foremost, we do not believe that the SFR list belongs to ethan
> miller, it belongs to a group of different people from different
> backgrounds who share a sense of community which we feel part of.
>
> Secondly, we do expect a public apology from ethan miller for the
> profanity and personal slander he administered against us!
>
> The following is a summary of the events which took place last week
> before the ORIGIN party. We initially planned our event around another
> space but several factors, namely the fact that construction of a
> partition was not completed in the space, did not allow us to use that
> space. Consequently, we were left without a space and many commitments.
>
> We were introduced to the owner of the space that madness used by a
> friend who told the owner that we also put together these types of
> events. The owner was very interested but also indicated that he had six
> other promoters approach him for the space. He said he was being
> selective and felt very excited about working with us. We do have
> excellent references from other people we have worked with.
>
> After the owner gave the commitment to us, we recieved a call from ethan
> miller telling us it was disrespectful to use that space. He never
> bothered to ask why we needed that space. We know he cares alot about
> what he is doing and we respect that. Yet, several months back when F&F
> needed a space, we took ethan and several members of the planning
> comittee to see a beautiful space with three musical areas that was well
> within F&F's budget. He loved the space and yet when it came down to it,
> he refused the space and even scared the manager into thinking that this
> was going to be some out of control party. We even asked ethan if we
> could donate one musical area to include sound, dj's, decorations, but he
> refused the space from the start and did not want anything to do with us.
>
> We feel that we should all help each other if we can and we have never
> kept a space for ourselves. We found three new spaces in the last four
> months and they have been shared by many people. You cannot control a
> space unless you own it or lease it long term. Regarding the use of the
> map point that joe rice says we stole from madness: the people at that
> location are good people. The city has not allowed them to hold any
> events there for the past year and a half. They welcome the use of their
> location as a map point and would like others to use it as well.
> The place has become a financial burden to them and if we and others can
> help them supplement their financial obligations by using their location
> as a map point so be it. We have not stepped on anybody's toes or tried
> to take anything away from the madness people. as a matter of fact, we've
> made several map points available for people when we were asked for help.
>
> Here are the facts regarding what happened last week:
>
> Tuesday we spoke to the owner of the space who said yes lets do the
> party.
> Wednesday, we recieved a call from ethan miller saying it was
> disrespectful to use that space, even though his name is not on the lease
> for that space. He did not even ask why we needed the space. An hour
> later we recieved a call from the owner of the space saying he recieved a
> call from the police telling him "We understand you are having a rave
> party this Saturday. You can't do it and don't let us come down there".
> The owner said that the caller never left his name. The owner told us he
> believed this to be a prank call from the madness people. He said lets
> still go ahead with the party. He did not want these people to bully him.
>
> In the meantime there is a guy named billy who lives at this location
> free of charge. According to the owner billy introduced the madness
> people to him. The next morning, the owner called us and said that he
> recieved three calls from the madness people yelling at him not to do the
> party. He said the callers were alex, jon santos, and a third "person".
> They told him don't do this party, these people are "this" and "that",
> etc, etc. The owner also said that billy told him that the madness people
> had a meeting the night before and decided to cause problems for the
> party. If anyone wants to verify these facts they can ask the owner
> directly.
>
> At this point the owner became hesitant and nervous about everything. He
> decided to call off the party. He also felt blackmaled by the madness
> people. A few hours later we met with him and he decided to honor his
> word and go through with the party. We addressed all the concerns of the
> owner to include sound levels, capacity issues, and adequate security.
>
> Two hours after our meeting with the owner, ethan miller posted his
> malicious remarks on the internet.
>
> During the party, around midnight, noise complaints started pouring in
> from far away locations. HOW STRANGE!!!
>
> The sound levels were maintained so the party went on.
>
> Overall, people were happy to have us in the neighborhood because we
> respected everything around us and that comes from doing events in that
> area for a while now and for keeping good relationships with the people
> we have worked with.
>
> On a final note, we do not feel that the SFR mailing list should be a
> forum to slander people. We have been victims of some very malicious
> rumors and we would not post these facts unless we know them to be
> correct. We have been very nice so far. We are good people. We have not
> caused harm to anyone and have nothing to hide. But we will never allow
> anyone again to use us as escapegoats. So please be warned and be
> careful about what you say. The power of the pen can destroy people.
>
> The reason you do not see us posting alot is because there is so much
> negativity, slander, and critisism that frankly it does not make it fun
> to participate. We are very open minded about alot of the different
> events that take place in this community and we respect each of them for
> what they are. It is a shame that some people do not share the same view
> point!
>
> Tom & Stacey
>
>-- End of excerpt from NOMADS



-- 
\  c   /\  a   /\  l   /\  i   /\  b   /\  a   /\  n   /\     rocky mullin
_\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\____/__\   san francisco
  \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /    \  /organic online, inc. 
   \/      \/      \/      \/      \/ http://www.organic.com/Staff/caliban
ninja250 -- analog synthesis -- chaotic good -- the internet is my ashtray

"i hate anything that ends with .exe" - patrick sean farley

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:28:56 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 18:28:24 -0400
Message-ID: <960522182823_202080513@emout12.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Need Burnin Man Registration Form. Pleeeeez
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

Can someone bit spit me a burning man reg. form?
I thank you, my fish thanks you, & the man thanks you.
Sincerely,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:29:07 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 18:28:36 -0400
Message-ID: <960522182835_202080686@emout13.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: SFaRt & Design "Contest"?
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If I understand correctly the design "contest" is off?  This is kind of a
bummer.  It's not so much the competition I would enjoy as it would be the
chance to see the variety of input, and seeing the best, no matter whose it
is.  I can't say that I would agree with an art contest, but this is where
design differs.  Design in the sense we're using it has a specific purpose, a
mission, before it is even created.  Art is free to be whatever it wants to
whoever wants it.  (<This was top of the head rhetoric and if it goes up for
debate, I reserve the right to contradict myself)
  Besides, I believe that the best design for either T-Shirts or Laminates,
is going to be several designs, all with some unifying theme.  Kinda like us!
: )  
Love, Art & Design,
Steveo

If I spent half the time designing as I did emailing, I'd probably be famous.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:33:35 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605222233.PAA01716@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: South Bay Friday Evening
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 15:33:25 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves mailist ]

 Here's the original location information , from Ms. Phink's post:

Forwarded message:
> Date: Mon, 20 May 96 11:30:22 -0700
> From: Ms Phink <msphink@ns.mauswerks.com>
> To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
> 
> ...I would ... like to get together a group of SBay people this Friday. 
> If anyone is interested, we will be at the Gordon Biersh Brewery in 
> San Jose starting around 7pm. I was there the other day and they didn't 
> card anyone at the door, but if this becomes a problem we
> can always move somewhere else.
>  The address is: 33 San Fernando between 1st & 2nd Streets 
>  and the phone # is: 408.294.6785. 
> If anyone else has had a bad experience at this place, please let me 
> know and we will adjust the plans accordingly.
> 
> Amy
> 
 I'll be in San Jose Friday afternoon and part of the early evening, so 
it'll be easy for me and my wife Mary to meet up. See you folks then!

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 15:39:59 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 17:38:03 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: Jon Zimmerman <bigz@bigz.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
In-Reply-To: <199605222032.NAA02792@cyberE.creative.net>
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On Wed, 22 May 1996, Jon Zimmerman wrote:

> Before you buy an alarm, try the $35 alternative, "The Club". I've had one
> in every car I've ever owned, and use it often particularly in bad
> neighborhoods.

The Club is a joke. Thiefs can remove then in seconds. I seen cars that
had been broken into and the only thing stolen had been "The Club". Now
there is a thief with a sence of humor. ;)

> Jon

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 16:07:47 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 16:07:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Need Burnin Man Registration Form. Pleeeeez
In-Reply-To: <960522182823_202080513@emout12.mail.aol.com>
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Oooh,  could you CC me one too?


	much thanks,


			jon



On Wed, 22 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:

> Can someone bit spit me a burning man reg. form?
> I thank you, my fish thanks you, & the man thanks you.
> Sincerely,
> Steveo
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 16:25:12 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 16:24:31 -0700 (PDT)
To: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
cc: SteveOSac@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Need Burnin Man Registration Form. Pleeeeez
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.93.960522160715.24682A-100000@elaine38.Stanford.EDU>
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On Wed, 22 May 1996, Jonathan Mark Logan wrote:

> Oooh,  could you CC me one too?
> 
> 
> 	much thanks,
> 			jon
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, 22 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:
> 
> > Can someone bit spit me a burning man reg. form?
> > I thank you, my fish thanks you, & the man thanks you.
> > Sincerely,
> > Steveo
> > 

>From their home page: 

To Register send $35 per person ($25 per person if mailed before June 1) to:
Burning Man 
PO Box 420572
San Francisco, CA 94142
USA

Include your name, address and phone number and the number of people you wish 
to register. For the latest information you may call the Burning Man 
Information Line: (415) 985-7471   


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 16:38:07 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
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>Before you buy an alarm, try the $35 alternative, "The Club". I've had one
>in every car I've ever owned, and use it often particularly in bad
>neighborhoods.

A pair of bolt cutters will cut throught the steering wheel and pop that 
sucker off in 10 seconds flat.  If they're out to steal a car, as opposed to 
just stealing the contents, they will come equipped to deal with "The Club", 
and if they want your particular car they *will* take it.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 16:39:12 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
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About the car thefts:

In college I was a security guard at a large apartment complex in San Jose.  
13 buildings, 250 units, something like that.  Lot's of good stories came 
out of that job, but the pertinent one was the time I almost caught some 
guys trying to steal a truck.  He ran just a tad quicker than I did, and his 
buddy had their getaway vehicle already rolling with the door open.

Anyway, the way they got in was to pop the back on the camper and bust the 
latch on the window between the bed and the cab.  A tire iron will get them 
in with little or no noise and no obvious sign of entry once they're in.  
With that kind of entry, they have more time to work on getting the car 
started with little damage.  Once in the cab, the guy was busy popping the 
case on the steering column to get to the ignition wires.  Another couple of 
minutes and he'd have been long gone.

Point is, an alarm would have had me over there in a heartbeat and they 
probably never would have even gotten in the cab, or better for the owner, 
they would have picked a different vehicle.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 16:49:50 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 16:49:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Robert Miles and...
To: sfraves <sfraves@spinback.demon.co.uk>
cc: aguevara@compattic.com, ambient@netcom.com, cloud@cats.ucsc.edu,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <97@spinback.demon.co.uk>
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, sfraves wrote:

> In your message dated Tuesday 21, May 1996 you wrote :
> > Childeren apperently is hitting really hard in England.  I believe that the
> > Arsenal is using the song to when they score goals during thier home games.
> > 
> > 
> > And....
> > 
> > 
> > It seems that Children Has been "domesticated" by Akrista Records. 
> > So Far I've heard it at:
> > 
> > Kohl (Community college radio station that play's top 40 tunes)
> > 
> > Kmel (Yup, that's right Kmel) On Low rotation.
> > 
> > Musak Station @ CompUSA.....
> > 
> > 
> > The Revoultion is at hand.....
> > 
> > 
> > "Dance with me"
> > 
> > Adam
> 
> 
> Are you refering to the Robert Miles tune?  That has been over here in England 
> for months, and has been in the pop charts top 10- It now suffers from what a 
> lot of half decent tunes end up with here- commerical overplay.

ouch! that hurts. its one of my *favorite* records to slap down in the 
middle of a trance set. i hope we dont get another "mighty dub cats" type 
overplay. it sucks when hella good records decompose into cheeze with 
comercial overplay - not that "magic carpet ride" was a hella good record 
to begin with, it was ok, but anyway this is just IMHO.

maybe we could all call the commercial stations one day and tell em it 
*sucks* and to never play it cuz everytime we hear it, we turn the 
station and maybe they'll stop;)

enjoy the sun!
tom 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 16:50:18 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 16:54:09 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: tim@redshift.com (Tim Gotch)
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>Before you buy an alarm, try the $35 alternative, "The Club". I've had one
>>in every car I've ever owned, and use it often particularly in bad
>>neighborhoods.
>
>A pair of bolt cutters will cut throught the steering wheel and pop that
>sucker off in 10 seconds flat.  If they're out to steal a car, as opposed to
>just stealing the contents, they will come equipped to deal with "The Club",
>and if they want your particular car they *will* take it.
>
>S
I know that a couple of years ago people were breaking into cars around the
upper McAllister area and just stealing the "Club" to piss people off, so I
definitly wouldn't put my trust in one of them.
Tim

------------------------------------------------------------
                   Tim Gotch
                tim@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~tim
            Hyper Design Technologies
                hdt@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~hdt
             395 Del Monte Ctr. #128
                Monterey, CA 93940
      Nothing is true, everything is permitted
------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 16:50:52 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 16:50:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: wilton paul risenhoover <pauly@mobius.net>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: x-radio
In-Reply-To: <31A28F30.662E@mobius.net>
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Where can you receive it?  What is the channel?

-k

On Tue, 21 May 1996, wilton paul risenhoover wrote:

> Greetings,
> 
> For those of you who are interested, x-radio is back online after a long 
> series of troubles.  We hope to keep it up.  Thanks to those of you who 
> sent letters of encouragement.
> 
> Best,
> pauly
> 
> http://www.x-radio.com/x-radio/
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 17:00:27 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 17:00:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Sharif Torpis <storpis@crl.com>
cc: "w. p. risenhoover" <pauly@mobius.net>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
In-Reply-To: <199605220450.AA19009@crl.crl.com>
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I am tired of people telling others (or the whole) list what can and 
can't be posted.  I understand what it's like to have 100's of messages, 
but there is this magic little delete key which can alleviate your 
problems.  I know there is much difference of opinion about rave 
relevance on this list, but there is also the fact that we are a 
community, and sometimes off-topic posts help with a little bit of 
community bonding.  If you don't like something, don't read it.  I do 
that all of the time.  I just don't feel it is right that everyone seems 
to think they can tell everyone else what is right and wrong.

I apologize for adding any negativity to a list that is having enough 
intense things going on, but I just couldn't sit idly by anymore.  I am 
perfectly ready to be flamed, if that's what is going to happen.  I just 
got tired of everyone telling everyone else what to do.  Diversity comes in 
many forms, and part of diversity is a diversity of opinions.  

Dismounting,
--kaySEE

On Tue, 21 May 1996, Sharif Torpis wrote:

> > I felt the last quake, though -- I think it was 1994.  It was on 
> > Saturday night at 2:00am and I was having sex.  When it was all over, 
> > we had to ask each other -- "Did the earth move for you, too?"
> 
> Absolutely fabulous. Really.
> 
> Now, can we keep to the subject of this mailing list?
> 
> I've put up with 'save the whales', 'save <insert latest political
> hero>', even 'hale's comet' ... but this takes the cake.
> 
> And don't send email or post asking me to relax. I'm totally relaxed. This
> is just out of hand and ridiculous. Try the sexquake mailing list. They have
> a mailing list and newsgroup for everybody, no matter how kinky. There's no
> need to pollute others.
> 
> Perhaps non-raves@hyperreal.com is in order.
> 
> Thank you for your support.
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 17:08:36 1996
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From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Need Burnin Man Registration Form. Pleeeeez
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 If I'm not mistaken, Ameba has them?.....Ameba.....




On Wed, 22 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:

> Can someone bit spit me a burning man reg. form?
> I thank you, my fish thanks you, & the man thanks you.
> Sincerely,
> Steveo
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 17:10:56 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Wish (BSP)
Date: 23 May 1996 00:59:25 GMT
Message-Id: <323582.10969462@compattic.com>
Organization: Computer Attic
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Im in NOOO way a promoter or anything but.....


Wish - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663 

[5.22 - Grover (Las Vegas)] 

In case anyone's bored out there...



"Dance with me"


Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 17:36:38 1996
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From: "w. p. risenhoover" <pauly@mobius.net>
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To: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
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Subject: Re: x-radio
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KaySEE,

KaySEE wrote:
> Where can you receive it?  What is the channel?

> On Tue, 21 May 1996, wilton paul risenhoover wrote:
> 
> > Greetings,
> >
> > For those of you who are interested, x-radio is back online after a long
> > series of troubles.  We hope to keep it up.  Thanks to those of you who
> > sent letters of encouragement.

It's a RealAudio web site.  Go to http://www.realaudio.com and download the 
RealAudio player (version 2), then go to http://www.x-radio.com/x-radio/.  
There are about a disks online that you can listen to across the 'net.  The 
catch: you need a 28.8 modem.

Meaning: you can receive it ANYWHERE!

Enjoy,
pauly

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 17:49:58 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: SFaRt & Design "Contest"?
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SteveO wrote:

>If I understand correctly the design "contest" is off?

Well, yeah, but the page remains and I'll put any and all logo art on there 
that's sent my way.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 18:28:24 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 18:28:00 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Burning Man Order Form
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Well, since enough people seem to be interested in the order form, just
print this puppy up!

Love,
Shawna


>Ok, for those of you who wish to register and don't have the form, just 
>print this out (or write it the part that follows the:


>*************************************************
>
>BURNING MAN 1996 ADVANCE REGISTRATION/ORDER FORM
><Copy and distribute freely>
>
>on a piece of paper and send it to the address specified...  so here it is:
>
>Whats follows is another advance release from the Spring 96 "Building Burning
>Man" newsletter. '96 Registration form included at end'o'file; get a $10
>discount if you send it in before June 1st!
>
>*************************************************
>
>SURVIVAL
>
>Visitors to the playa should not come as spectators to a show. Instead, they
>will encounter an interactive experience; a spontaneous outpouring of energy
>that is created by our community itself. Burning Man is a phenomenon which
>springs from your immediate involvement. We are not funded by grants or
>product endorsements. We depend upon direct contributions. Hundreds of people
>are now engaged in creating this year's event. Here is how you can help:
>
>CONTRIBUTE
>Send in your registration fee today!  By purchasing your ticket now for $25
>you can save $10. Beginning in June tickets to the event will cost $35. 
>Buy a
>t-shirt or a video. If you can, make an extra contribution (see the check box
>on order form). Many new projects- Mudhenge, the Inferno, a new public
>transit project, and an elaborated Man-are being readied for 1996. None of
>this will happen without your early support. If you are among those people
>who already know they are coming to Burning Man, help us now. 
>
>VOLUNTEER
>There is only one way to become a member of the Project.  You must do
>something. Burning Man is a society of activists. Later this year we will
>solicit volunteers to help us run the infrastructure of our camp. We are now
>recruiting experienced builders, people to do data entry and distribute
>flyers, help with clerical tasks, and individuals who can assist with
>transport of materials to Nevada throughout the year. If you have any skill
>or resource which you think might help us in our preparations, please call
>our Hotline.        
>
>ARTISTS
>In addition to the "Inferno," Burning Man is planning many new art
>initiatives in 1996.  Our burning pageant in the desert on Sunday, September
>1, will feature large-scale portable effigies that can be raised overhead.
> Puppeteers, model makers, stilt walkers, fire performers, etc.-please
>contact us.  We also need folks to assist us in casting a large number of
>plaster brains (yes, brains ) that will be featured at our premier show on
>March 23 at the Minna Street Gallery in San Francisco.      
>
>MUDHENGE
>In 1995 our camp was inundated by a rainstorm and mudpeople sprang from the
>playa (you know who you are). In 1996 we will construct a temple and public
>shower in which to house these rites. We invite all persons of mud to
>worship, wallow, and bathe between the legs of "Water Woman" (Showers are
>restricted to initiates. You must first get down in the mud). If you would
>like to help construct and tend the temple, or wish to organize and schedule
>an event here (i.e. mud wrestling, a mud procession, etc.) please contact our
>Hotline.
>
>PUBLIC TRANSIT
>The playa of the Black Rock Desert is a fundamentally safe environment.
> Apart from the very real, dire, and life-threatening hazard of becoming lost
>[please read the Survival Guide that is mailed to all registered
>participants] the playa is as flat and as forgiving as the mattress of a
>playpen. The greatest hazard that we face is self-created. Nearly every one
>of the few serious accidents and injuries that we have witnessed during
>Burning Man has involved automobiles. This year we encourage everyone to
>bring bicycles. They are perfectly adapted to the hard-packed surface of the
>playa.  We plan also to organize a pool of specially marked bicycles for
>public use. If you can help us with this effort please call our Hotline.
>
>FILM FEST
>We are now accepting entries for the 2nd Annual Burning Man Film and Video
>Festival. The deadline for submissions is July 4th. Please contact Coffee
>Achievers at 415.826-3277. Ask for Hernan. 
>
>SETTLEMENT
>This year, the city of Black Rock will sport a newly renovated downtown area
>and a number of exurban hubs, or "meta-theme camps." If you want to create
>your own city within a city, call the Hotline. 
> 
>*************************************************
>
>1996 REGISTRATION/ORDER FORM
>
>Burning Man Festival
>Wednesday, August 28 through Monday, September 2, 1996
>
>The annual celebration of BURNING MAN will take place over Labor Day weekend
>in the Black Rock Desert of Northern Nevada. All attendees need to register
>for the event, and must bring their own shelter, food and water. 
>
>This form can be used to register and/or order Burning Man merchandise. Feel
>free to make copies. If you are purchasing tickets you will receive your
>registration packet (including 1996 map, survival guide, and schedule of
>events) approximately one month before the festival.
>
>Tickets: Purchase advance tickets now for Burning Man, August 28 - September
>2, 1996.  We will mail you a ticket, your survival guide, map, and a detailed
>schedule of events approximately one month before the event. Order now and
>save! After June 1st, the price goes up to $35 per person.
>
>Burning Man Video: Only the finest photons, hand-selected and lovingly
>preserved on durable magnetic tape for your viewing pleasure. Relive past
>glories or see what you missed in this 48-minute documentary by WeirdTV's
>Chuck Cirino. A substantial portion of the proceeds benefit Burning Man.
> $19.95
>
>T-shirts: Buy a Burning Man t-shirt, lovingly crafted from 100% cloth for
>cool desert comfort. Screen printed on black in sizes L and XL. Always
>fashionable; makes a great gift! Proceeds benefit the Burning Man Project.
> $15.00 
>
>
>*************************************************
>
>BURNING MAN 1996 ADVANCE REGISTRATION/ORDER FORM
><Copy and distribute freely>
>
>
>Name: __________________________________ Phone: (______)_______________
>
>Address: ____________________________________________________________
>
>City: _____________________________ State: _______ Zip: _______________
>
>
>-Registration tickets 
> number in party: ________  x $35.00* = $______
>
>  *For a limited time only, you can register for Burning Man 96 for just $25
>per person. This special advance price is valid ONLY through June 1, 1996.
> Orders postmarked after June 1, 1996 must register at the $35.00 rate.
>
>
>-Burning man videos
> QTY: ________  x $19.95 = $______
>
>
>-Burning man t-shirts 
>  QTY: ____ LARGE ____ EXTRA LARGE ____
> total shirts - QTY: ________  x $15.00 = $______
>
>
>-Optional extra contribution  = $______
>
>
>-Total amount enclosed:     = $______
>
>Please make checks payable to BURNING MAN. 
>Mail this form with payment to:
>
>The Burning Man Project
>P.O. Box 420572
>San Francisco, CA  94142-0572
>
>Burning Man is a 100% participant-funded event, entirely dependent on your
>support. Thanks!!
>
>###          
>
>
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 18:30:22 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 18:30:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: robert miles children
To: happy people <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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On Tue, 21 May 1996, sfraves wrote:

> In your message dated Tuesday 21, May 1996 you wrote :
> > Childeren apperently is hitting really hard in England.  I believe that the
> > Arsenal is using the song to when they score goals during thier home games.
> > 
> > 
> > And....
> > 
> > 
> > It seems that Children Has been "domesticated" by Akrista Records. 
> > So Far I've heard it at:
> > 
> > Kohl (Community college radio station that play's top 40 tunes)
> > 
> > Kmel (Yup, that's right Kmel) On Low rotation.
> > 
> > Musak Station @ CompUSA.....
> > 
> > 
> > The Revoultion is at hand.....
> > 
> > 
> > "Dance with me"
> > 
> > Adam
> 
> 
> Are you refering to the Robert Miles tune?  That has been over here in
England 
> for months, and has been in the pop charts top 10- It now suffers from what a 
> lot of half decent tunes end up with here- commerical overplay.

ouch! that hurts. its one of my *favorite* records to slap down in the 
middle of a trance set. i hope we dont get another "mighty dub cats" type 
overplay. it sucks when hella good records decompose into cheeze with 
comercial overplay - not that "magic carpet ride" was a hella good record 
to begin with, it was ok, but anyway this is just MHO.

maybe we could all call the commercial stations one day and tell em it 
*sucks* and to never play it cuz everytime we hear it, we turn the 
station and maybe they'll stop;)

enjoy the sun!
tom 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 19:02:04 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 19:02:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Shawna's 6 month anniversary
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    Hey all you kiddies! As many of you know Chrysalis is this weekend. 
As many of you don't know,  this weekend will also be the 6 month 
anniversary for Shawna who, you guessed it, had been raving for 6 months. 
Unfortunately, I'll be out of town and won't be able to celebrate with her.
So, I want everyone to give her an anniversary hug for me;):):):).
                  Take care and have a good one!
                              Love-
                                    Reagan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 21:07:42 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 21:06:07 -0700
To: blkadder@value.net
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
Cc: Jon Zimmerman <bigz@bigz.com>, Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>,
        TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com,
        sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com
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>> Before you buy an alarm, try the $35 alternative, "The Club". I've had one
>> in every car I've ever owned, and use it often particularly in bad
>> neighborhoods.
>> 
>> Jon
>> 
>All these suggestions are great if the theives are amateurs. If they are 
>pro's the Club is a minor inconvience. However, it does do one important 
>thing, slow them down. You are not going to stop a determined theif, but 
>you can slow them down to the point that your vehicle becomes 
>unattractive. Alarms also help in this, especially if you have a 
>secondary battery located somewhere besides the engine compartment.
>


Take the distrubitor rotor out. 

-Sean


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 21:10:40 1996
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Priority: urgent
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:08:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: Bring back the Phone Numbers!
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Ok, I admit it, I didn't call or fax or anything on that Hard Copy story,   
because I didn't see it.
Thanks to the URL:
 http://hyperreal.com/raves/socal/HardCopy
Now I've seen it.  If you haven't, check it out.  And let's get a re-post   
of those phone numbers if someone still has them, because Steveo is   
absolutely right.  That story is really a disgrace, and it's a damaging   
and direct afront to the rave community.

Call them.  Fax them.  Mail them.  It can't be just a few; they need lots   
of messages from lots of people.  I'm going to get on their asses.  Who's   
got those phone numbers?
 -Roy


 ----------
From:  SteveOSac[SMTP:SteveOSac@aol.com]
Sent:  Wednesday, May 22, 1996 1:46 PM
To:  aleph1; sfraves
Subject:  Blown Off? Phuk That! Who's got the #'s

>>>It's official...
...we have officially been blown off by Hard Copy.  ...They claim that   
there
really wasn't much of a negative response to the story....<<<
Apparently there is a bit of a miscommunication.  I know we may not be
experts on negativity, but I'm sure we can improvise.  Let's see that fax   
#
again,  who's got the their address.  Load the catapult.  I'm not saying   
that
we'll spend the rest of our lives screaming injustice, but that was a   
little
to easy for them.  I at least want to see a public apology issued to all
interested forums.  Someone mentioned the staff is reccessing soon.   
 Let's
act fast.  And if we've missed them, then let's remeber to be at their   
door
when they get back.  I'm obviously with the "This is straight up fucking
wrong" party on this issue, and I would really like to see something   
done.
 I've never been a big dignity monger, and I'm always cautious of those
acting in the name of pride, but I see this as a matter of respect and I   
feel
it's important to the unity of our comunnity that something more be done.
Sit BooBoo, Sit!
Steveo



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 21:38:36 1996
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From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
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>Take the distrubitor rotor out. 



Yeah, for those of you who don't have fuel injection!  For me, I just pop
the engine out & bring it into the party with me, works every time!  When I
don't have time for that, I just hire Evil Henchmen to hang out & guard it.

;)


Love,
Shawna


"For what shall it profit a man to gain the world but lose his lunch..."
  
  
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%%%%%%%%   %%%% o %%%%%%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%%
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 21:41:48 1996
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From: tim@redshift.com (Tim Gotch)
Subject: test
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------------------------------------------------------------
                   Tim Gotch
                tim@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~tim
            Hyper Design Technologies
                hdt@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~hdt
             395 Del Monte Ctr. #128
                Monterey, CA 93940
      Nothing is true, everything is permitted
------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 21:52:08 1996
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From: blkadder@value.net
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 21:51:44 -0700 (PDT)
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.16.19960522031122.36df7730@popd.ix.netcom.com>
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On Wed, 22 May 1996, hey, where am I? wrote:

> >Take the distrubitor rotor out. 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, for those of you who don't have fuel injection!  For me, I just pop
> the engine out & bring it into the party with me, works every time!  When I
> don't have time for that, I just hire Evil Henchmen to hang out & guard it.

Err, your car is going to have a dist. rotor, FI or no FI. But I get the 
joke.... :)

                                          Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 22:23:16 1996
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Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:28:03 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Andrew Nourse" <andy@pythagoras.org>
Subject: Re: Car break-ins
Message-ID: <19960523052311.AAA28180@[204.119.89.82]>
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For those of us coming into the City from the south,  Caltrain can be an option
The terminal is at 4th & Townsend, right in the middle of SOMA.
the last 2 trains arrive at about 9:30 and 11:30,
and the first train out in the morning is at 5 on weekdays, 7 Satuday, and 8
Sunday.
Not so good for clubs that close at 2, but if you're really sure it will go
all night...


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 22:36:46 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605230536.WAA20441@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Wish (BSP)
To: aguevara@compattic.com
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:36:44 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <323582.10969462@compattic.com> from "Adam Guevara" at May 23, 96 00:59:25 am
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Recently, Adam let us know about something going on at Bahia -
> 
> Im in NOOO way a promoter or anything but.....
> 
> Wish - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
> 18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663 
> 
> [5.22 - Grover (Las Vegas)] 
> 
 Ummm - which day of the week ? 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 22:43:32 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605230543.WAA21008@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Wish (BSP) (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:43:32 -0700 (PDT)
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Recently, I betrayed my ignorance of the numbering of the days of the 
month -
> Recently, Adam let us know about something going on at Bahia -
> > 
> > Im in NOOO way a promoter or anything but.....
> > 
> > Wish - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
> > 18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663 
> > 
> > [5.22 - Grover (Las Vegas)] 
> > 
>  Ummm - which day of the week ? 
> 
 Gee , 5.22 is/was a Wednesday , so this thing must happen TADA! every
Wednesday ...

 I think I'm posting too much ... Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com
 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 22:55:30 1996
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From: Sharif Torpis <storpis@crl.com>
Message-Id: <199605230547.AA16330@crl.crl.com>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
To: randream@cats.ucsc.edu (Randy C Cone)
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:47:25 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605212224.A12729-0100000@ese.UCSC.EDU> from "Randy C Cone" at May 21, 96 10:18:57 pm
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> You know, tolerence goes a long ways. If I had your attitude I say KEEP 
> IT FUCKIN PRIVATE (the suggestion).

...hmm, where's that ravin' community spirit?...

...my tolerance was evident in not saying anything until now...think...

...here's another thought: if u have sense enough to mark your message w/
"non-rave" in the subject line then perhaps it doesn't belong in a rave
mailing list?...maybe, just maybe?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 22:55:45 1996
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Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
To: scarab@value.net (KaySEE)
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:41:38 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960522165207.12405B-100000@value.net> from "KaySEE" at May 22, 96 05:00:20 pm
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> can't be posted.  I understand what it's like to have 100's of messages, 
> but there is this magic little delete key which can alleviate your 

...that is not a cure for the problem...the problem needs to be fixed...

> community, and sometimes off-topic posts help with a little bit of 
                 ^^^^^^^^^

...this list has been experiencing an ever decreasing signal to noise
ratio for quite some time now...it is definitely not "sometimes"...

> that all of the time.  I just don't feel it is right that everyone seems 
> to think they can tell everyone else what is right and wrong.

...when u subscribe to a list called sfraves, do u expect to read messages
about sex during earthquakes?...thank you...don't make this into a morality
play about right and wrong...

> intense things going on, but I just couldn't sit idly by anymore.  I am 
                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

...neither could I...you should know how i feel...

> got tired of everyone telling everyone else what to do.  Diversity comes in 
> many forms, and part of diversity is a diversity of opinions.  

...diversity comes in the forms of many different mailing lists...


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 23:02:28 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605230602.XAA23362@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: SFR Picnic
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 23:02:28 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Well, maybe one more post before bedtime ...

 I personally would have I problem with a June 15th picnic , because I'm
going to the Free Tibet outdoor concert at the Polo Field at Golden Gate
Park ( and , I think some other folks are also going on the 15th and next
day Sunday the 16th ).

 What's folks' classwork/finals situation? 

 I would go for June 8th/9th or June 22/23rd. 

 Or , another idea entirely - instead of having our own picnic , how about
meeting at one of the grill pits at a park were an upcoming Sunset is
going to be? Music for those who want it , or just chilling , or tastes
of both as the whim moves ya ... We could even show up early to get our
little SFR thingy going and some pre-music chatting & grilling.

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 22 23:02:58 1996
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To: freakz@ultima.org, sfraves@hyperreal.com
cc: dhchung@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Free Party This Saturday! - Taj Rules
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In a message dated 96-05-22 11:43:11 EDT, freakz@ultima.org writes:

>Higher State of Freedom
>
>DJ's Gouracandra
>         Andre Lucero
>         Galen
>         Taj
>         Sean Murray
>
>Gonna be at the beach!
>
>Call (415) 303-5336 for more info

I LOVE Taj!!!!!!!!  (The others are probably good, too, but I don't know
them.)

-rg.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 00:34:55 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 00:34:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tony Rose <trose@violet.berkeley.edu>
To: Sharif Torpis <storpis@crl.com>
cc: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
In-Reply-To: <199605230541.AA16181@crl.crl.com>
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Just my two sense here...are we forgetting what a community is about? it 
is very natural and healthy to diverge from "approved behavior" thats 
what chaos is all about, and that is what meaning in life is about, I am 
not going to join alt.sex.earthquake or whatever whenever I have 
soomething that I want to share with another human being, I prefer to 
have some sort of connection there to share with. Just smile and hit the 
delete key now! :)

* * ** *** ***** ******** ************* ****************** 
Paul Anthony Rose
UC Berkeley Computer Science/ Mathematics
http://violet.berkeley.edu/~trose
TRANCE_HARDER--DEEPER--FASTER
****************** ************* ******** ***** *** ** * *

On Wed, 22 May 1996, Sharif Torpis wrote:

> > can't be posted.  I understand what it's like to have 100's of messages, 
> > but there is this magic little delete key which can alleviate your 
> 
> ...that is not a cure for the problem...the problem needs to be fixed...
> 
> > community, and sometimes off-topic posts help with a little bit of 
>                  ^^^^^^^^^
> 
> ...this list has been experiencing an ever decreasing signal to noise
> ratio for quite some time now...it is definitely not "sometimes"...
> 
> > that all of the time.  I just don't feel it is right that everyone seems 
> > to think they can tell everyone else what is right and wrong.
> 
> ...when u subscribe to a list called sfraves, do u expect to read messages
> about sex during earthquakes?...thank you...don't make this into a morality
> play about right and wrong...
> 
> > intense things going on, but I just couldn't sit idly by anymore.  I am 
>                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 
> ...neither could I...you should know how i feel...
> 
> > got tired of everyone telling everyone else what to do.  Diversity comes in 
> > many forms, and part of diversity is a diversity of opinions.  
> 
> ...diversity comes in the forms of many different mailing lists...
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 03:04:31 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 03:04:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Car break-ins & celtic lore
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Dear Friends & Family,

My computer tells me that on Mon, 20 May 1996, Eric shared:

> Hey, y'all!  RLunatic's story got me to thinkin': car vandals may be hip to
> some of the events at which we gather, finding ripe fields of cars waiting
> for them to reap a bountiful harvest.  There may be no way to prevent this
> from happening, but we may be able to decrease the chances of a car being
> broken into.  I suggest driving a vehicle that doesn't look to spiffy,
> sporty, shiny, or otherwise suggests the owner's affluence; if you have a
> "nice" car, get a ride with someone whose wheels don't look as nice.  Also,
> when you park, HIDE Y'ALL'S GOODIES!  If someone can't see anything
> attractive inside da ride, he/she may be less likely to have in.  Any other
> ideas?  We need to help each other, if we care about each other :)

	This may not be practical at every parking site, and it might 
damage some cars, but with a little work and a good heavy crane, we 
could do something that would probably astound these pesky thieves so 
much they would kiss our hubcaps in appreciation and awe.
	I'm thinking that what we do is arrange our cars in groups of 
three, specifically two cars stood vertically on end, with one car across 
them on top.  (We would need to have some way of matching up vehicles by 
length to really make this work).
	Then, we make concentric circles of these groups of three, 
radiating outward.  Can you imagine a would-be vandal arriving at a 
quiet, moonlit lot near a party and being confronted with this vision of 
Stonehenge?  I'll bet car stereos would be the last thing on his mind.
	Tell me, do I have great ideas or what?   ;)  Do we have any 
other problems that need solving?

Invoking the vibe,

				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 03:15:03 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 03:15:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: request for advice, assistance (NRR)
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I've got a question for you seasoned Bay Areans:

I recently received an offer for a summer position in the city, starting
in mid June.  However, I'm looking for a place to live in Palo Alto, which
is where I go to school.  

Am I insane to consider commuting to SF everyday from Palo Alto?  If so,
could someone refer me to a possible summer sublet or 3 month lease in or
near SF?  

thanks.  I'm getting quite nervous having only three weeks to find a place
to live...


				jon

		(the guy who wears a Burger King crown at parties)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 06:34:53 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: This VS That - VERY LONG!
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I really didn't want to say anything about the two promoters going verbal
fisticuffs at each other, but since both seem to have a need to air their
laundry in public, I now feel a need to respond in kind.

This discussion is no longer fun.

Promoter VS Promoter
-----------------------
I really only have one question, what is the VALUE of having this
tit-for-tat on-line?  Ethan had a problem with some promoters.  He then, in
a very public way, called them to task.  What is the point, other than
venting, of doing it?  The way in which Ethan did it, was at best unethical
for one reason;  He said a big FU without ANY explanation.  Sorry, this is
just straight poor judgment.  If you're going call someone out, at least
give the background in it's totality (i.e. the whole story from your point
of view), otherwise it is just venting for the sake of venting, and that
does nobody any good.  Ethan did give background, after several posts from
people asking him why he went off the way he did.  However, the damage had
already been done; the hornets nest had been disturbed.

I understand his beef, but I also understand Tom & Stacy's perspective.
Despite what people want to believe, there ARE two sides to this story, and
depending on YOUR perspective you will find the truth that fits your
reality.  From a non-participatory view, they both have agendas, and both
will be right in their respective views.

What aggravates me is the airing of dirty promoter BS laundry in public.
This stuff is best left behind closed doors where the participants (the
direct participants) can hash it out.  If it doesn't work out, fine, agree
to disagree and move on.  What is the point of all of this "he said, she
said", when in fact it's all a done deal?  Will it change the result or
expected outcome?  I doubt it.  Will it stop whatever from happening again?
I doubt it.  So really what is the point?  To let everyone know what
really happened?  Who cares?  As far as I am concerned, there is an FnF
planners list, THAT is the place this discussion belongs.  There, the party
promoters, planners, whatever, can go round and round with this thing ad
infinitum.  It would have more value to the people DIRECTLY involved with
the throwing of parties, than the general partying public.  But here for
all to see?, what value is any of this.

Not everyone is equal, nor has access to the same information.  My days as
Mr. Party Man started changing, when I was brought in to do parties with
various people.  It changed more when I got to know the lowdown on each and
every party, it changed more when I found out about the personalities
behind the parties, and it changed more as I got to know more and more
about some of the ugly underbelly of parties.  And yes, it does exists.
This discussion, if I may stretch to call the present arguments that, is
just that.  Part of the ugliness that is part of this scene.  Of course
that is my perspective, but what else would you call the present round of,
er discussion?  Constructive dialog?  People working stuff out?  Is that
what is going on?  No, it is two camps at odds, trying to explain how right
each view is.  And to WHOSE benefit?  Does it benefit the list or people
going to parties? , or does it illuminate that which would be better left
unsaid?( i.e. "Is EVERYTHING an issue open for discussion?") Was there a
need for a big loud "fuck you"?  Did this benefit the community?  Was there
a need for a reply?  And what need?  Do you REALLY want to know all the
dirty deeds some people might do to run parties at times?  Do you really
want to know who has been fucked over in this scene, whether justified or
not?  Do you want to know all of the dirt on everyone and everything in our
dance community?  Is this really all THAT?  Or do you want to hear good
music, in a good place, with people you enjoy being with?  Which and what
is more important to you?

I'll always remember Harry Who telling me, during a bad time between me and
another person doing parties: "Hey!, You guys are friends.  Shit happens.
Make-up."  after a blip in the radar.  That's what this is supposed to be
about.  Being friends & catchin' a groove.

Maybe I'm strange, I've always liked the music and the people, not how
something was put together.

When it comes to parties I don't know everything.  But then I've decided I
don't want to know everything.  Ignorance can be a good thing, when
executed properly, it can result in sheer bliss.  The LA scene was so cool
at one time.  Then the promoters started taking themselves very seriously.
The result is evident.  That house is STILL being reconstructed.  The same
thing IS happening here.

All of this talk about his space, my space...c'mon, sounds like some
pre-school argument over whose tree house it is.  The scale has changed,
the conversation is very much the same.

The harsh reality of parties:

-If you find a space, do not become attached to it in the slightest.  The
second you open the doors to said space, there will have already been
several promoters who will have talked to the person in charge of the
space.  You just lucked out, this time.
-You own no space, other than the one you have FOR THAT NIGHT.
-There will ALWAYS be a someone with more money and guile.  You do not
operate in a vacuum.
-The most hardcore care little about what you think.  It's what you do that
counts.
-If another promoter  beats you to the punch, outbids you, steals your
DJ's, remember it's just a party.  Hash it out with all people involved,
take it on the chin, learn from it, and move on.
-You're really hardcore if you let the person who fucked you over, into
your gig for free.
-The ideal is to have no expectations of anyone external to your group.
Expect and plan for the worse, you'll never be disappointed.  Having this
psyche makes even the slightest good thing be a grand bonus point.
-You got a problem with a someone?  Take it to them.  If you must, you
might want to talk to friends.  But be sure, most people could really care
less.  They are looking for the next party, or the next place to spin, or
the next place to be spun.  Your problems are for the moment, and there is
a weekend coming up...
-Got fucked over?, get over.  It's for the moment, you live and learn.  You
build a book of trust and a book of people to watch out for.  You get to
know who'll need a contract, and who's word is as good as gold.

There are more, but I follow these general rules, and have not been
surprised at the results.  I am happier, and have had great interactions
with people in dance culture.

I just think the bulk of this could've been handled off-line between the
respective parties.  Maybe the end result could've been the movement of MAD
or the other party.  Maybe the end result would've been the same minus the
back-and-forth.  I think that any other result, short of breaking out the
guns, is probably more desirable than what we have witnessed here over the
past few days.

Cool off & settle it between yourselves please.  A nice long weekend approaches.

Gang of many
--------------
Then comes the troops.  I have always found mob mentality interesting.
Especially when it develops around , so-called, peaceful movements.  People
create allegiances for all sorts of reasons.  I found it amusing how easy
it was for many to quickly forgive Ethan his minor trespass.  These same
individuals however would've roasted anyone else for doing the same thing.
Maybe it's a matter of familiarity with the person that determines the
level of forgiveness one will receive. I dunno.  I *DO* know that most of
the people, either agreeing or disagreeing with what was going on had
NOTHING TO DO WITH THE INTERACTION BETWEEN ETHAN & TOM&STACY.  With that in
mind, why chime in at all?  There are probably only a few who really know
what's going on depending on who was where when.  I know Ethan knows, Tom &
Stacy, & the club owner.  So, there will be three stories, three views.
Which is right?  Probably all of them.  Which is wrong?  Same answer, all
of them.  We are seeing the collision of expectations.  When they cannot be
reconciled we witness anger, on all sides.

Many of you jumped on Ethan's shit...I can only wonder how many of these
folks ever read the SFRaves archive?  Many of you chimed in agreement...I
can only wonder how many of you were there for the series of events leading
up to Ethan's frustration.  I know Ethan and respect him, I also was not
there for the interaction between he, tom & stacy.  My stance is neutral.
I empathize with Ethan because similar has happened to me and my friends
over the years.  I understand Tom & Stacy's view, sometimes the party MUST
go on.

There are two views.  And that is the only conclusion I can draw from the
information given.

What do *I* have to do with this?  Very, very little.  I am involved
because this has been made public.  Other than that, I am more than happy
to sit on the sidelines and watch these people duke it out, much like I
used to watch kids fight growing up.  Laugh at the loser, cheer the winner.
But the thing I have learned is that there are very few definitive winners
and losers when it comes to this party dance scene.  Either you'll stick it
out, or bow out, or bow out and come back (the choice of champions ;)).
really though, if one party goes away, there will be others to take it's
place.  My allegiance is to the music and my friends, not an entity called
a club or scene or particular party.  Where there is good music to my ears,
I'll be there, period.

Lessons
--------
What is going on now is weak bubble gum compared to what has gone on in
this city in the past IMO.  Feel very fortunate, those of you doing the do,
that there are many less snakes in the grass these days.  What happened to
Ethan & crew, used to happen ALL THE TIME.  What is worse is when you have
reserved a space, printed flyers, then have the space sold from under you.
Yikes!  Even worse is when you get outbid in one way or another....Yikes!
How about having a space, then the person who owns it blows it out before
your party, the venue busted by the cops, then expects you still have your
party there the next night, even though the space is red fucking hot!
YIKES!!!!  These things used to happen ALL THE TIME.  Some have happened to
me, some to others.  I feel fortunate though, because I can still catch a
groove and haven't let any of the bad things outweigh the enormous good
I've enjoyed.  As a matter of fact, I will work with some of the very
people who got on my nerves in the past.  Why?  Why not?  I'd rather
forgive, and try to forge a truce, than to waste energy maintaining
hostilities.  If others can do likewise, then we have a basis to work with
each other.  I'd rather move forward and test the waters with new projects,
using history to guide my present.  Besides, there are other more important
things to worry about...like, where's the next party?

The Power of The Phone
-------------------------
There  was a brief moment in dance culture history when promoters called
each other to determine when they could throw a party and not have it
defeat another person's gig.  It was brief, but it was good.  You actually
talked to the person throwing the gig, and created a cooperative model.
Alas, it was fragile; people became disconnected.

And then there were none
------------------------
"Peace, live in it or rest in it!  Come together!" - DJ Pierre;  This man
is the fucking mac.  I am so saddened at his departure from house music.
There is no other like Pierre, and there is no equal to his magic.  I hope
homey comes back to the fold one day.  My man feels house music hasn't been
as good to him as he's been to it.  No matter what, that man is by far, one
of the greats of our dance culture.  He IS one of the originators.  His
music will be missed.  He's the fucking mind bomb!  Everyone else is just
visiting!

Props to Jeno for working the DJ Pierre "Generate Power" @ Toon Town back
in the day (man, he would have motherfuckers grabbing @ straws - Jeno can
WORK this track!).  Extra special thanks to Wicked posse for bringing DJ
Pierre to SF to rock some fucking heads!!!  Now THAT was wicked!!!  (I am
talking in particular about an event held in the "front" of Townsend.  This
was one for the record books.  If you weren't there, you missed out on what
can truly be called a stellar event.  Even Markie & Jeno got affected!)

I'm done now,
John

Peace.




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 07:36:09 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 07:36:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: Thnkblnd@aol.com
cc: freakz@ultima.org, sfraves@hyperreal.com, dhchung@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Free Party This Saturday! - Taj Rules
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On Thu, 23 May 1996 Thnkblnd@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 96-05-22 11:43:11 EDT, freakz@ultima.org writes:
> 
> >Higher State of Freedom
> >
> >DJ's Gouracandra
> >         Andre Lucero
> >         Galen
> >         Taj
> >         Sean Murray
> >
> >Gonna be at the beach!
> >
> >Call (415) 303-5336 for more info
> 
> I LOVE Taj!!!!!!!!  (The others are probably good, too, but I don't know
> them.)

    *** Galen plays at Sunsets alot and Andre Lucero has played there 
also as well as MAD before. Both are *great* !!!!


> 
> -rg.
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 08:00:15 1996
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From: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: S.F. Library
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  (non-rave)
  Hey I was wondering if anyone out there knows the street address of the 
new library in S.F.? I'll be heading into the city about 1, so any 
responses before then would be really appreciated!
                      HUgs-
                        Reagan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 08:11:05 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 08:10:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Reply-To: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Nomad response !!!- VERY long
To: NOMADS <tahsina@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
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This started out as a message to Tom & Stacey - but I'm posting it to
everyone who might have an interest in the "T&S affair" and more importantly
an interest in raving... With out getting into the who's and why's of
detailed actions AND I guarentee that  UNFAIR & devious actions HAVE been
taken against Tom & Stacey including BUT not limited to an unfair narc
rumor... but then T&S have either knowingly or PERHAPS unknowingly done
things to upset certain people in the underground (UG) Particularly the
low cost UG... so actions have been taken by BOTH sides ... so perhaps
thinking about what is going on is in order... I know my mind has been 
buzzing the past week...  As a suggestion: The next time you deal with a
commercial or $20 party whether as a promoter charging it OR as a "guest"
or consumer ask yourself WHY?  If you don't think about it you might not
even care as long as the music and dancing is good.... if you think about
what is going on more deeply you might find as I have that you do care
after all......

Tom & Stacey,

  Basically good response - but after really thinking about it which I admit
I had NOT really done before this I don't think this addresses the root
cause of the problem......

  The real problem after some thought seems to be your desire to be 
COMMERCIAL more than a part of the UG.... to as one person said " tap the
house MARKET " - you know: make money at it and market the music & vibe...
While it's fine to be commercial - it does NOT mix well with the low cost
UG as we have just found out....


At one point, I thought jee if I sell my visuals for say $500-600 per show
and do 2 shows per month I can pull in $15-20K per year ( tax free if cash 
only ) Wow that would push my income up into 6 figures of tax equivalent
income and for about 2 hours that was attractive.... then I thought about
the alternative of working with the low cost high vibe UG and making $500
every 6 months and I chose that route.... I'll get to that later...
 
 By my figuring if you had a good turn out last weekend you guys pulled in
$4000 for yourselves.... but how many friends ( that you didn't already know)
did you meet at your party ? Are the people who come to your $20 house music
party people you really want to hang out with ?  At the end of the day when
all is said and done are you counting new friends made or money ? Which is
more important in your life ?  These I think are the fundemental questions
you have to answer for yourself.... about what you are doing.... but what
are you doing and what makes it different ?

  At first I thought like you do : Why can't we all SHARE spaces? I wouldn't
have introduced you to Dru if I hadn't thought this way.... I'm so used to
being open and sharing everything I have in the UG that I just naively wanted
to share the space with you and everyone else... so what's wrong with that ?
The way you use a space DOES ruin it for the UG and here's why :

  1) You hire thugs to be your guards ( actually off duty police but BIG 
     ones - sorry Pat ) to buy off
     busts.... At Jerrald I "bought" your explaination that the OWNER made
     you do it - but he's a $$$$ grubbing BASTARD.... so it made sense to 
     me.. then I hear at Dru's space you did the same and the guards removed
     water bottles during their searches.... SEARCHES WHAT SEARCHES ? Did
     you notice at MADDNESS NOBODY was searched at all ! NOBODY !  Try that
     at one of your parties - with the crowd you invite is it safe ? OK so
     now there's another space that when the police come by they EXPECT to
     see other police working the security - if not likely bust... Can you
     understand that creating the policy of "greasing the police" this way
     is something the UG does NOT want to do....

  2) The people you invite will ruin the space. If the people you invite or
     attract NEED to be searched then are they the type of crowd you really
     want to hang with or do you just want their $20?  I noticed at the
     Jerrald deli Tom spent most of his time hanging with the employees
     behind the counter or at the door... this is what I'm talking about
     when I talk about VIBE... Anyone can fill a room full of drug taking
     dancing, even shouting people but what is this thing called "vibe". To
     me it's NOT about how many people are shouting on the floor - hell it's
     easy to make people shout - just let them have their drugs and a good
     DJ... But when I go to a F&F I meet ( in a way that is significant )
     20-30 new people EVERY time in addition to 50-150 people I already
     know.... Talking with people is difficult because there are so many
     people to meet and talk with... at your parties I meet 3-5 MAX... How
     many new people do you meet each time ? And when I say meet I mean
     people that you would "hang with" at other times & places... Are these
     the people you search at the door ?  If so why ?

       So the VIBE I talk about is one of COMMUNITY... that is a dynamic
     community of friends... that TALK to each other... That share with each
     other... that do NOT need to be searched... that are all worthy of being
     friends - that are NOT charged top dollar for the party . Parties like 
     that are AMAZING... NO amount of $$$ could make
     me want to give that up... that's what I'm in the scene to nurture.
     AND btw I seldom go to Martin's commercial parties or wicked because
     from my definition they are vibeless... little groups of people who
     know their small group of friends and it STAYS that way.... the only
     community that is built is one of small but independent groups of
     friends taking drugs and dancing together... BUT there is NOT really
     an overall merging of the group... The outcome when I go to a wicked
     I meet 3-5 people just like at your parties.... community - WHAT
     COMMUNITY ?  Just a bunce of people paying top dollar to dance together.


  3) The 3rd reason you ruin a space is you pay top dollar for it... Instead
     of nurturing low cost spaces and passing the savings on - you pay $4000
     and pass that on in the form of $20 entry... anyone can do that but the
     UG chooses NOT to because these are our FRIENDS or people who will be...
     If we filled a space full of people we didn't care about and weren't
     meeting as friends then we could say :  $20 bucks is cheap for a whole
     night  BUT is $20 cheap for your FRIENDS ?.... See Stacey there's the
     difference... FRIENDS  vs CUSTOMERS and don't minimize that difference
     it's a BIG one...

      When I met you and Tom and you told me about being from Cypress I 
     thought - How nice! I bet you know about freinds and family drinking
     and dancing together in Greek bars and resturants... late into the
     night... now there's a culture that knows how to party AND more 
     importantly celebrate with friends... I really thought THAT was the
     experience you wanted to nuture here.... but that means taking another
     route than making money on the scene.... this can be a business or it
     can be about bring friends together.... you have to decide which you
     really want MOST... 

     Paying more and more for spaces and then passing the high cost on goes
     against the UG movement of giving more for less to the community... 
     helping to build a community... as you pay more for spaces you make it
     impossible for the LOW cost UG to use them... Will Dru after getting
     $4000 for his space go back to letting people rent it for $800-$1000 ?

 
  4) UNEQUAL treatment of the people who work for you... another problem
     with commercial intent - everyone has a price and gets it... but there
     is an UNEQUAL distribution of funds... the more I think about it the
     more it troubles me... When I got into doing visuals I bought a $1000
     mixer and a second $3K projector as a donation to the scene... I go
     out with about $12K- $15K of equipment... and all I ask is a donation
     if possible so I'm definitely NOT going to get my money back much less
     make money at it... ( As I admitted before one day I daydreamed about
     making $20K per year doing it but immediately gave it up ) I do free
     parties like Wayne's house party or when you didn't make budget I didn't
     get paid by you... and that's ok by me... I NEVER turn down any party
     because of money or lack thereof... it's about time and my friends!
     So where does the UNEQUAL treatment come in ?  When I did your NYE show
     and I got paid $100 + another $60 later I felt good about it UNTIL I
     found out all the DJ's were getting $1000... Another show I did not many
     people showed... everyone else made money and I took nothing... I felt
     ok with that because this is NOT about money for me... BUT then I 
     thought about it... ok if this is about FRIENDSHIP and you guys are my
     friends: How come you guys feel comfortable about paying everyone but
     me $1000 ? Is this the way you treat a good friend ?  What I do is 
     special I think - I work ALL NIGHT long and I put loving energy into 
     it.. Admittedly I didn't ASK for higher pay so I didn't get it ... 
     but I naively thought everyone was sharing equally... That happens in
     F&F and because of DONATIONS the "guests" pay $5 or less... but when
     things get commercial things change... everyone gets what they charge..
     If I naively say I work for a donation then that's what I get - EXACTLY
     a small donation and nothing more... but if a DJ who works 1/5 the time
     I do asks for $500 that's what they get... and it's passed on to the
     CONSUMER at the door - NOT the friends coming ... If you take in $20K
     at the door it's NOT divided with any equity among friends... everyone
     gets what the "market will bear".... and anyone like myself who assumes
     if profits are made they will be gladly "profit shared EQUALLY" among
     those who contributed is NOT facing the fact of what profit motivated
     party throwing is all about.... prices will be bargined out and talent
     and work will be "bought and sold"....

     As a final comment, I'm not saying this is totally wrong... Hey it's 
     the American way... NO as I write this I AM SAYING that buying and
     selling at a negotiated price leads to a fucked up system EXACTLY like
     the US... where some people play the system and get rich while others
     who don't play (drop outs) , can't play ( mentally ill ), or are
     forbidden to play ( minorities )  - are left out in the cold with very
     little of the wealth expressly because wealth is NOT distributed equally
     for equal contributions.... 


 So these are the problems I have with trying to mix commercial raving with
the UG rave scene... The more I think about it the more I want to stay in
the LOW cost UG - where things are about community and sharing... I see
nothing totally wrong about being commercial ( although I have some problems
with it see above ) BUT NOT mixing commercial with UG... I've noticed that
Martin & wicked do NOT mix with the UG... They seldom sho up at UG parties
and they don't use the same spaces....

  So my suggestion to anyone such as yourself who wants to commercialize the
scene is to stay clear of low cost UG spaces and do like wicked and go into
clubs... Of course, you don't HAVE to but it would keep things MUCH 
friendlier....  Especially since you have said to me numerous times that you
want to support the UG and you like the UG... Then why would you be willing
to do the things outlined above ?  Why are you willing to search your 
friends ?  Why are you willing to charge them $20 ?  Why are you willing to
pay friends who work with you UNEQUALLY ?  Could it be that this isn't about
friends ? It's about making $$$, perhaps ? THAT difference IMHO is the
REAL reason we have just had the problems that have come up... 

  I hadn't REALLY thought this all out before - so I want to thank you and
Tom for being the catalyst that brought this all into focus for me... you
have been my teachers... You have once again reminded me - why I rave -
why I donate my visuals to the scene... You've shown me that years from
now long after any $$$ made from the scene is spent and forgotten, What I
will have is the memories of Milton and the E-bee, Ethan running around
in boxer shorts, Gateway zooming the crowd with lasers, Claire and New
Moon putting up loving alters, DJ's from all over NOT getting paid and
still loving it, dancing on Fort ORd with the Cloud Factory,people 
passing my table and telling me "great visuals"... and so many other people
all sharing a wealth of experiences with me... commercialize this?  my
answer is NO WAY !!!!! I might suggest that you and Tom really think about
what you want from the scene... Do you want to SELL music events to the
house "market" ?  OR  Do you want to create community and events that will
form friendships that you will remember for the rest of your life? .....


  Once you've decided that answer.... your actions will become clear....
I know mine have been....

Saying all of this as someone who wants to befriend all fairminded people,

Mike


 meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic 
 Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 08:16:50 1996
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Message-ID: <n1379283086.63520@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 23 May 1996 08:14:05 -0700
From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: WHERE IS FUNKY TEKNO TRIBE?
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hello all...
I was wondering - does anybody know where Funky Tekno Tribe is going to be this weekend?  I have heard that they *HAD* the Concourse, but no longer do.  As of 2 days ago, they were calling around for locations.  I would really like to go, but do they have a location?
If anybody has any info...
Thanks!
-Jason


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 08:25:57 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 08:11:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
In-Reply-To: <v01540b03adc9672321a0@[165.227.94.158]>
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 What makes all the difference in the effectiveness of The Club is the 
constructions of the car's steering wheel. A lot of newer cars have 
wheels made mostly of hard rubber, to protect the driver in a crash, and 
these are the ones that flex enough to get The Club off. If you have a 
sturdy, rigid wheel, it can work quite well.

Dan


On Wed, 22 May 1996, Tim Gotch wrote:

> >>Before you buy an alarm, try the $35 alternative, "The Club". I've had one
> >>in every car I've ever owned, and use it often particularly in bad
> >>neighborhoods.
> >
> >A pair of bolt cutters will cut throught the steering wheel and pop that
> >sucker off in 10 seconds flat.  If they're out to steal a car, as opposed to
> >just stealing the contents, they will come equipped to deal with "The Club",
> >and if they want your particular car they *will* take it.
> >
> >S
> I know that a couple of years ago people were breaking into cars around the
> upper McAllister area and just stealing the "Club" to piss people off, so I
> definitly wouldn't put my trust in one of them.
> Tim
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>                    Tim Gotch
>                 tim@redshift.com
>            http://www.redshift.com/~tim
>             Hyper Design Technologies
>                 hdt@redshift.com
>            http://www.redshift.com/~hdt
>              395 Del Monte Ctr. #128
>                 Monterey, CA 93940
>       Nothing is true, everything is permitted
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 08:27:34 1996
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Message-ID: <n1379282449.97869@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 23 May 1996 08:21:35 -0700
From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: CONCERT UP HERE TOO!
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Regarding the concert from the heavens, or whatever it may be called - you know, that L.A. Big Bear Mountain June 21st-23rd thing:

Underworld, Chemical Brothers, Leftfield, The Orb, Orbital, Meat Beat Manifesto, Ministry, Masssive Attack, Zion Train

Need I say more?
Anyway, I have heard that the show will be happening up here THE SAME WEEKEND.  Since it is two days, the acts that will be playing down there on Friday, will be playing up here on Saturday, and vice versa.  CRAZY, huh?  Anyway, where in San Francisco could we house an event of such magnatude?  Does anybody have any further info?
If this actually happens, it will go down in history!!!
-Jason
P.S. UNDERWORLD IN THE U.S.!!!!!  WOO HOO!  I have waited so long!! :)  = )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 08:47:23 1996
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To: Reagan Reid <raygun@value.net>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: Shawna's 6 month anniversary
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>    Hey all you kiddies! As many of you know Chrysalis is this weekend.
>As many of you don't know,  this weekend will also be the 6 month
>anniversary for Shawna who, you guessed it, had been raving for 6 months.
>Unfortunately, I'll be out of town and won't be able to celebrate with her.
>So, I want everyone to give her an anniversary hug for me;):):):).
>                  Take care and have a good one!
>                              Love-
>                                    Reagan

That will be one of the *many* hugs from me!  Everybody get in line...
:)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 08:55:27 1996
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Here's to Carhenge!  Hehehe :)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 08:57:15 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 08:56:22 -0700 (PDT)
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
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On Thu, 23 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:

> I really didn't want to say anything about the two promoters going verbal
> fisticuffs at each other, but since both seem to have a need to air their
> laundry in public, I now feel a need to respond in kind.

*SNIP*

I would like to take a moment to say, oddly enough I find myself again 
agreeing with you again John :) 

There is one notable exception:

> really happened?  Who cares?  As far as I am concerned, there is an FnF
> planners list, THAT is the place this discussion belongs.  There, the party
> promoters, planners, whatever, can go round and round with this thing ad
> infinitum.  It would have more value to the people DIRECTLY involved with
> the throwing of parties, than the general partying public.  But here for
> all to see?, what value is any of this.

This is not about Friends and Family. 

Other than that, thank you for your very thoughtful post.


                                        Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:07:15 1996
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To: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Bring back the Phone Numbers!
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>Ok, I admit it, I didn't call or fax or anything on that Hard Copy story,
>because I didn't see it.
>Thanks to the URL:
> http://hyperreal.com/raves/socal/HardCopy
>Now I've seen it.  If you haven't, check it out.  And let's get a re-post
>of those phone numbers if someone still has them, because Steveo is
>absolutely right.  That story is really a disgrace, and it's a damaging
>and direct afront to the rave community.

I read the HardCopy interview...  It was almost all lies and so heavily
biased,  I almost threw up.   I was AT that Dune party.    I couldn't
believe the lies and all the false statements made...    Where is that
FAX NUMBER,  I want to tell them what assholes they are for spreading
all those lies about our scene....

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:07:20 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
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Subject: ORGANIC '96-THE  CONFIRMATION (fwd)
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Forwarded message:
From owner-socal-raves@UCSD.EDU  Wed May 22 20:31:02 1996
From: KingFishPB@aol.com
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 23:10:40 -0400
Message-ID: <960522231039_540938670@emout09.mail.aol.com>
To: Socal-Raves@UCSD.EDU
Subject: ORGANIC '96-THE  CONFIRMATION

connect ;)
o__o__o
      |
      |
     \/
     \/



Philip Blaine, Chaotica and Insomniac present . . .
_________________________________________
>...>_>_..._..._..._...>>>  ORGANIC '96  <<<._..._..._..._<_<...<
_________________________________________
        a festival celebrating the electronic dance 
         culture growing here on our mother earth
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
'''''''''''''''''''''''''................ Main Stage
................'''''''''''''''''''''''''
(((((((((((((((((TEMPLE OF IMAGINATION)))))))))))))))))))
'''''''''''''''''''''''''................
                    ................system No.1
liveperformancesliveperformancesliveperformances
by...
.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@*.@
                                underworld
                                   the Orb
                        the Chemical Brothers
                                   Orbital
                          Meat Beat Manifesto
                                 Zion Train

 0-0   Main Stage DJ's    0-0   Hitting the Decks   0-0
__..Michael Dog//Jason Bentley//Daniel//Trance..__
_________________________________________
four.sound.systems.............................................system No.2
.^, * .^, * .^, * EXPERIMENTAL LOVE BOWL * .^, * .^, * .^,
  Eli Star/Brian/John Kelley/Alien Tom/Steve Pagan
lots o' smiles.ripe oranges.postive vibes.happy beats
_________________________________________
four.sound.systems.............................................system No.3
101010101010101SPACE PORT ZONE010101010101
               Ron D. Core/R.A.W./Fester/Thee-O
Japanimation computer grafx+3D Transformer props
_________________________________________
four.sound.systems.............................................system No.4
}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}Planet of the Drumz{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{
    Josh Swissman/Heretic/Curious/Raymond Roker
Tribal Beats.Drum Circles.Jungle & Breakbeat choons.
_________________________________________


Grow the future . . .
o__o__o
      |
      |
     \/
     \/


<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< THE DETAILS >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

FEATURES:
* FOUR sound systems surrounded by beautiful trees
   and rock formations.
* 360o of the event surrounded by Hi-Tech effects: 
   lasers, intelligent lighting, computer projections,
   and beyond...
* Wide variety of food, beverage, and merchandise vendors
* Orbotrons, Spaceballs, and other cool rides
* Multiple Beer+Wine stands available for
   those over 21 with I.D.
* Friendly and Helpful Security Staff
* First Aid Stations
* Daytime (pre-event, 8am-4pm) Activities: Horseback
   riding and mountain biking around the mountain and event
   site.  You must call 1 week in advance to make a reservation
   because space is limited.  Please call 800-680-SNOW.
* Secured parking
* Information about accomodations will be given at time of
   ticket purchase or on voice mail.
* Maps and information guidelines will be provided at
   ticketmaster at time of purchase.

LOCATED at Snow Valley Resort in *YOUR* San Bernardino
  National Forest.  (This is your forest, come check it out,
  utilize it, have fun in it and respect it.)
  In the town of Running Springs, CA (twenty-five minutes
  before Big Bear).

*** Highly Recommended things to do: ***
* Bring layers of warm clothing, blankets(if desired),
   durable shoes, and smiles.
* Please CARPOOL--save gas, have a designated drive
   and help cleaner air.
* Please drive safe--be aware of mountain roads.  Roads
   are curvy and dark.
* Please travel during Daylight hours--Come early, and
   Stay late!
*** Cautions: ***
* Please No cans, bottles, liquids, food, weapons, etc.
* Please No Fires anywhere
* Please No roadside parking or camping
* Please No on-site camping
* Please Be aware of fire hazards--this event is in the
   forest on dry clearings--be   cautious.
* No Ins and Outs--please be sure you have everything
   you need before entering.
* No tailgating or loitering in the parking areas.

*** Hours: ***
Saturday, June 22, 1996
Show/Bands from 7pm till 6am.
Site open from 4pm till 8am. 
First band on stage at 7pm sharp.  Again Come Early.

Tickets on sale June 1 at 10am at all aTicketmaster locations.
To charge by phone call
213.480.3232.   714.740.2000    805.583.8700.   619.220.TIXS. 
For Tickets with NO SERVICE CHARGE go to
the Ticketmaster outlets at 6243 Hollywood Blvd.
Mon-Sat 10am-5pm.

>...>_>_..._..._..._...>>>  ORGANIC '96  <<<._..._..._..._<_<...<
        Confirmation is complete (and a reality)
     A musical voyage that you will never forget.
           Come in peace or do not come at all.
                          Seeeeee ya there! 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:18:08 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605231618.JAA03781@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: MikeClay/JohnSLee : 2 Good Posts
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 09:18:05 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Since I'm at work , I haven't had the time to deeply read either Mike Clay's
post ( "Re: Nomad response !!!- VERY long" ) or John S. Lee's post
( This VS That - VERY LONG! ), but from what I could see , they are almost
mirror image descriptions of the whys and how-tos of raves here in the
SF Bay area. Mike's coming from the low-cost ideological underground
aspect, John more the nuts-and-bolts hassles and human interaction BS
of commercial and semi-commercial parties. 

 I will have to print out both and read them with my highlighter pen 
nearby to make sure I get the value out of both posts.

 Peace and Love and a Reasonable Profit 
 ( Hippie Ferengi Rule Of Living #42 )

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:27:59 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 09:28:35 -0800
To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
From: nathan_moser@manual3.com (Nathan Moser)
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>I really didn't want to say anything about the two promoters going verbal
>fisticuffs at each other, but since both seem to have a need to air their
>laundry in public, I now feel a need to respond in kind....

>I'm done now,
>John
>
>Peace.

Can't say i agree with all of your perspective (you'd have to throw me in
with the 'Ethan troops'), but this is _far and away_ the most constructive
thing posted on this subject thus far.

Now get back to stirring shit up - we're going to start thinking you're a
nice guy or something! ;-)

take care!
-nate



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:37:00 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Promoters: cooperation/competition
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(Chiming in like it's my business)  This may have been mentioned before,
but my unqualified opinion is that it is in promoters' best interest to
cooperate in securing and nurturing business relationships with those from
whom spaces are rented/leased for parties, since a good relationship will
encourage not only repeat business for one promotion crew, but also
business from other crews.  We share the SF Bay Area, we share the City and
the East Bay, etc., so why not work in the spirit of sharing locations?
Owners/lessors of the locations might even put in a good word on behalf of
promoters with other owners/lessors who are considering letting their space
be used for parties.  Does this make any sense at all?  What would be the
point of childish, undermining stunts against any one promotion crew, other
than to discredit them and cause them problems.  I hope all promoters will
strive to keep the business end of the scene from turning into a model of
corporate America, where cut-throat tactics are sometimes employed to help
one company get ahead at the expense of others.  It ain't healthy, it ain't
appreciated, and it ain't respectful.

OK, enough change from me.  Peace out,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:39:36 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 09:39:27 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: CHRYSALIS????!!!
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dear people

i don't want to bust anyone's bubble (mine own included), but i have heard
that chrysalis will NOT be happening this saturday, due to the loss of the
space. 

can anyone confirm/deny (oh pleeeease?) this horrible thought? gateway folks?

in a terrible state
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:40:53 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 09:40:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Subject: GRADE TIME Not exactly Rave Related
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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  How to learn to give a "sucker" an even break - be a prof ;-)

  Just finsihed my first spreadsheet - Intro to Comp Sci class....

  Let's see class avarage 77 %
  Let's look for curve breakpoints or seperation between adjacent students


  break between 89% - 87% of 17pts A cutoff goes there.....
  break between 81% - 77% of 30pts B cutoff goes there....
  break between 72% - 66% of 48pts C ..... maybe not

  here comes the even break.....

  IF I go down to 61% with the C's there's another separation point
  of 50 pts between the 61% student and a 55%....

  OK now which one to use ?  I'm feeling generous... so I'm going with
the lower one..... C's down to 61%...

  And who says teacher's aren't inflating grades ;-)

  Mike OUT

OB RAVE :  Next time you're judging someone in the rave scene - lower your
           cutoff point....



 meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic 
 Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:45:10 1996
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Date: 23 May 96 12:39:28 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: SFR Picnic
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Larry said.....


 Or , another idea entirely - instead of having our own picnic , how about
meeting at one of the grill pits at a park were an upcoming Sunset is
going to be? Music for those who want it , or just chilling , or tastes
of both as the whim moves ya ... We could even show up early to get our
little SFR thingy going and some pre-music chatting & grilling.
______________

That's a great idea -- we can go early, hang out, help the Sunset people set up
if they want .... and have the best of all worlds!

Leslie  : )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:48:42 1996
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Priority: urgent
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 10:46:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: RE: Bring back the Phone Numbers!
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Good luck with those finals!!
 As far as HardCopy goes, well, you could be right.  Then again, you   
could be wrong.  Maybe there's someone there who cares.  It's possible,   
right?  It's also possible that we could make enough stink that they   
might think twice next time they want to cover a rave... just being a   
PAIN IN THEIR ASS is enough to accomplish that.  Squeaky wheel gets the   
grease 'n' all.  You never know unless you try, and it's always been my   
experience that persistence gets you a lot farther than you might guess   
at the outset.

Anyway, I want to make some stink over there.  If nothing else, I'll run   
their damn fax machine out of paper and fill up the voicemail.
;)
 -Roy

 ----------
From:  Gioni D. Pasquinelli[SMTP:g1pasqui@isc.SJSU.EDU]
Sent:  Thursday, May 23, 1996 9:14 AM
To:  Roy Feague
Cc:  sfraves
Subject:  Re: Bring back the Phone Numbers!



On Wed, 22 May 1996, Roy Feague wrote:

>
> Call them.  Fax them.  Mail them.  It can't be just a few; they need   
lots
> of messages from lots of people.  I'm going to get on their asses.   
 Who's
> got those phone numbers?
>  -Roy

Not that I disagree but this is not going to accomplish anything...How
many other stories do you think they distorted?  I am sure its close to
100% of all the stories (yeah stories not news or facts) that they do and   

they air a couple everytime the show airs.

This isn't going to stop them from doing future stories nor from
distorting the truth like they do so its kind of a waste of time unless
you have some kind of legal case which might get their attention but
probably no then either.

I wonder how many times they have been sued???  Sorry to have such a
defeatist attitude but just tryin to be realistic here...

Peace and good waves,  finals are almost over...one more to go in 1/2   
hour.

Yeah!!!
G


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 09:48:48 1996
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Date: 23 May 96 12:47:20 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Earth's a shakin
Message-ID: <960523164720_71165.755_GHL45-4@CompuServe.COM>
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Regarding what people think does and does not belong on this list...

Sharif Torpis said...  

...here's another thought: if u have sense enough to mark your message w/
"non-rave" in the subject line then perhaps it doesn't belong in a rave
mailing list?...maybe, just maybe?

--------------------------
(Sorry, Sharif, I don't know how long you've been on SFR, so this may be
redundant to you, but ...)

This group has had many conversations about this, and one of them is that we'd
try to put some clue in the header so people could skip a message they didn't
want to read ... and NRR is your clue -- feel free to skip it ... or to skip
followup messages on topics that don't interest you....  We do pretty well on
this, I think...

but this is one big ongoing conversation with a group of people that has a
common connection, and it's an open forum... 

I personally (as many people know) think the main things that don't belong on
here are out-of-control personal attacks on other people ... intelligent
articulate disagreements are fine, it's personal nastiness that pushes my
buttons... pretty much anything else I can deal with (especially short messages
telling funny stories, jokes, etc., I love that stuff! It usually arrives when I
most need it!)

and frankly, earthquakes are WAY BIGGER than this little newsgroup, and are
pretty worth talkin' about no matter what ...

I mean, if the *mother ship* was hovering over San Francisco, would you think we
shouldn't talk about it here because it was NRR??  Please.

(actually, next time people see me, ask me about my theory about aliens
influencing our rave culture genetically) 

To me, diversity comes in the form of the many different people on SFR, and I
don't want to subscribe to "many different mailing lists" to talk about the
important things that affect our lives. We on SFR are a community, and we don't
have a review panel censoring people's posts ... "oh, I'm sorry, that's only 72%
rave-related, doesn't meet the standards, try again!"

When I subscribed to SFRaves, I expected to get messages, thoughts, ideas and
interchanges from the lives and perspectives of ravers, both about raving and
the more important bigger picture, and that's just what I got.  Except now, it's
not just from other ravers, it's from friends.  Thanks everyone!  

Leslie  : )



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 10:55:10 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 96 10:51:03 PDT
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: finals are over!  finally!
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hello all-

just wanted to great you all, now that i'm out of my scholastic shell.
finals are done, and i am back to raving again.



YEAH!!!!!!


who shall i see at chrysalis saturday, and how shall i identify you?  i'll
be wearing a homemade shirt that says  HI, I'M MATT!

peace, love, and chrysalis-

matt l
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 11:42:01 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 11:42:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: finals are over!  finally!
In-Reply-To: <199605231755.KAA00379@taz.hyperreal.com>
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On Thu, 23 May 1996, matthew d. p. k. lanier wrote:
> who shall i see at chrysalis saturday, and how shall i identify you?  i'll
> be wearing a homemade shirt that says  HI, I'M MATT!

If it's happening, then I'll probably be there.  And definitely at
Spundae!  And chances are, I'll be wearing something with a prominent
smiley face on it.  

I was going to post a review of last weekend (space teddy and BTB), but
it's kinda late and I had a rather crummy time at space teddy, so I won't
bother.  Life is definitely on the upswing! 

Smiles and hugs, 
) paul (



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 11:47:28 1996
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From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: SFaRt & Design "Contest"?
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steve,

>If I understand correctly the design "contest" is off?  This is kind of a

I totally agree... I'm still working on stuff though, just being a little
lazy about it =) I hope to get some ideas posted to SDream's page soon.

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 11:47:32 1996
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Subject: Tibet Concert was: Re: SFR Picnic
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>[ to sfraves list ]
>
> Well, maybe one more post before bedtime ...
>
> I personally would have I problem with a June 15th picnic , because I'm
>going to the Free Tibet outdoor concert at the Polo Field at Golden Gate
>Park ( and , I think some other folks are also going on the 15th and next
>day Sunday the 16th ).

I'm going to on the 15th... would've liked to go both days but $50 is a
little steep for me.

maybe we should set up a meeting time/spot for SFR people? Is anyone
familiar with the Golden Gate Polo Fields?

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (510) 664-1026                   |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 12:13:14 1996
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From: Pseudo 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
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>Can't say i agree with all of your perspective (you'd have to throw me in
>with the 'Ethan troops'), but this is _far and away_ the most constructive
>thing posted on this subject thus far.

one of the things that i read out of john's post was a reminder to all that
no matter who's camp you are in, you are basing your alligence/views on
subjective truths. remember that the 'other side' believes in their truths
as well. try and persuade them of your POV if neccessary, but more important
is to respect their views and find a workaround that fits into both your
agendas.
PLUR


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 12:16:33 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
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Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
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Really all I can say is that Ethan was just REALLY PISSED, and I think 
any one in his situation would have done the same thing.  There have been 
a ton of times where I've done the same thing and regretted it later.

As far as having this discussion online, it NEEDS to be here.  This is 
called a SCENE for a reason.  In any community, matters that affect 
everyone need to be discussed in a public forum.



> I really only have one question, what is the VALUE of having this
> tit-for-tat on-line?  Ethan had a problem with some promoters.  He then, in
> a very public way, called them to task.  What is the point, other than
> venting, of doing it?  The way in which Ethan did it, was at best unethical
> for one reason;  He said a big FU without ANY explanation.  Sorry, this is
> just straight poor judgment.  If you're going call someone out, at least
> give the background in it's totality (i.e. the whole story from your point
> of view), otherwise it is just venting for the sake of venting, and that
> does nobody any good.  Ethan did give background, after several posts from
> people asking him why he went off the way he did.  However, the damage had
> already been done; the hornets nest had been disturbed.
> 
> I understand his beef, but I also understand Tom & Stacy's perspective.
> Despite what people want to believe, there ARE two sides to this story, and
> depending on YOUR perspective you will find the truth that fits your
> reality.  From a non-participatory view, they both have agendas, and both
> will be right in their respective views.
> 
> What aggravates me is the airing of dirty promoter BS laundry in public.
> This stuff is best left behind closed doors where the participants (the
> direct participants) can hash it out.  If it doesn't work out, fine, agree
> to disagree and move on.  What is the point of all of this "he said, she
> said", when in fact it's all a done deal?  Will it change the result or
> expected outcome?  I doubt it.  Will it stop whatever from happening again?
> I doubt it.  So really what is the point?  To let everyone know what
> really happened?  Who cares?  As far as I am concerned, there is an FnF
> planners list, THAT is the place this discussion belongs.  There, the party
> promoters, planners, whatever, can go round and round with this thing ad
> infinitum.  It would have more value to the people DIRECTLY involved with
> the throwing of parties, than the general partying public.  But here for
> all to see?, what value is any of this.
> 
> Not everyone is equal, nor has access to the same information.  My days as
> Mr. Party Man started changing, when I was brought in to do parties with
> various people.  It changed more when I got to know the lowdown on each and
> every party, it changed more when I found out about the personalities
> behind the parties, and it changed more as I got to know more and more
> about some of the ugly underbelly of parties.  And yes, it does exists.
> This discussion, if I may stretch to call the present arguments that, is
> just that.  Part of the ugliness that is part of this scene.  Of course
> that is my perspective, but what else would you call the present round of,
> er discussion?  Constructive dialog?  People working stuff out?  Is that
> what is going on?  No, it is two camps at odds, trying to explain how right
> each view is.  And to WHOSE benefit?  Does it benefit the list or people
> going to parties? , or does it illuminate that which would be better left
> unsaid?( i.e. "Is EVERYTHING an issue open for discussion?") Was there a
> need for a big loud "fuck you"?  Did this benefit the community?  Was there
> a need for a reply?  And what need?  Do you REALLY want to know all the
> dirty deeds some people might do to run parties at times?  Do you really
> want to know who has been fucked over in this scene, whether justified or
> not?  Do you want to know all of the dirt on everyone and everything in our
> dance community?  Is this really all THAT?  Or do you want to hear good
> music, in a good place, with people you enjoy being with?  Which and what
> is more important to you?
> 
> I'll always remember Harry Who telling me, during a bad time between me and
> another person doing parties: "Hey!, You guys are friends.  Shit happens.
> Make-up."  after a blip in the radar.  That's what this is supposed to be
> about.  Being friends & catchin' a groove.
> 
> Maybe I'm strange, I've always liked the music and the people, not how
> something was put together.
> 
> When it comes to parties I don't know everything.  But then I've decided I
> don't want to know everything.  Ignorance can be a good thing, when
> executed properly, it can result in sheer bliss.  The LA scene was so cool
> at one time.  Then the promoters started taking themselves very seriously.
> The result is evident.  That house is STILL being reconstructed.  The same
> thing IS happening here.
> 
> All of this talk about his space, my space...c'mon, sounds like some
> pre-school argument over whose tree house it is.  The scale has changed,
> the conversation is very much the same.
> 
> The harsh reality of parties:
> 
> -If you find a space, do not become attached to it in the slightest.  The
> second you open the doors to said space, there will have already been
> several promoters who will have talked to the person in charge of the
> space.  You just lucked out, this time.
> -You own no space, other than the one you have FOR THAT NIGHT.
> -There will ALWAYS be a someone with more money and guile.  You do not
> operate in a vacuum.
> -The most hardcore care little about what you think.  It's what you do that
> counts.
> -If another promoter  beats you to the punch, outbids you, steals your
> DJ's, remember it's just a party.  Hash it out with all people involved,
> take it on the chin, learn from it, and move on.
> -You're really hardcore if you let the person who fucked you over, into
> your gig for free.
> -The ideal is to have no expectations of anyone external to your group.
> Expect and plan for the worse, you'll never be disappointed.  Having this
> psyche makes even the slightest good thing be a grand bonus point.
> -You got a problem with a someone?  Take it to them.  If you must, you
> might want to talk to friends.  But be sure, most people could really care
> less.  They are looking for the next party, or the next place to spin, or
> the next place to be spun.  Your problems are for the moment, and there is
> a weekend coming up...
> -Got fucked over?, get over.  It's for the moment, you live and learn.  You
> build a book of trust and a book of people to watch out for.  You get to
> know who'll need a contract, and who's word is as good as gold.
> 
> There are more, but I follow these general rules, and have not been
> surprised at the results.  I am happier, and have had great interactions
> with people in dance culture.
> 
> I just think the bulk of this could've been handled off-line between the
> respective parties.  Maybe the end result could've been the movement of MAD
> or the other party.  Maybe the end result would've been the same minus the
> back-and-forth.  I think that any other result, short of breaking out the
> guns, is probably more desirable than what we have witnessed here over the
> past few days.
> 
> Cool off & settle it between yourselves please.  A nice long weekend approaches.
> 
> Gang of many
> --------------
> Then comes the troops.  I have always found mob mentality interesting.
> Especially when it develops around , so-called, peaceful movements.  People
> create allegiances for all sorts of reasons.  I found it amusing how easy
> it was for many to quickly forgive Ethan his minor trespass.  These same
> individuals however would've roasted anyone else for doing the same thing.
> Maybe it's a matter of familiarity with the person that determines the
> level of forgiveness one will receive. I dunno.  I *DO* know that most of
> the people, either agreeing or disagreeing with what was going on had
> NOTHING TO DO WITH THE INTERACTION BETWEEN ETHAN & TOM&STACY.  With that in
> mind, why chime in at all?  There are probably only a few who really know
> what's going on depending on who was where when.  I know Ethan knows, Tom &
> Stacy, & the club owner.  So, there will be three stories, three views.
> Which is right?  Probably all of them.  Which is wrong?  Same answer, all
> of them.  We are seeing the collision of expectations.  When they cannot be
> reconciled we witness anger, on all sides.
> 
> Many of you jumped on Ethan's shit...I can only wonder how many of these
> folks ever read the SFRaves archive?  Many of you chimed in agreement...I
> can only wonder how many of you were there for the series of events leading
> up to Ethan's frustration.  I know Ethan and respect him, I also was not
> there for the interaction between he, tom & stacy.  My stance is neutral.
> I empathize with Ethan because similar has happened to me and my friends
> over the years.  I understand Tom & Stacy's view, sometimes the party MUST
> go on.
> 
> There are two views.  And that is the only conclusion I can draw from the
> information given.
> 
> What do *I* have to do with this?  Very, very little.  I am involved
> because this has been made public.  Other than that, I am more than happy
> to sit on the sidelines and watch these people duke it out, much like I
> used to watch kids fight growing up.  Laugh at the loser, cheer the winner.
> But the thing I have learned is that there are very few definitive winners
> and losers when it comes to this party dance scene.  Either you'll stick it
> out, or bow out, or bow out and come back (the choice of champions ;)).
> really though, if one party goes away, there will be others to take it's
> place.  My allegiance is to the music and my friends, not an entity called
> a club or scene or particular party.  Where there is good music to my ears,
> I'll be there, period.
> 
> Lessons
> --------
> What is going on now is weak bubble gum compared to what has gone on in
> this city in the past IMO.  Feel very fortunate, those of you doing the do,
> that there are many less snakes in the grass these days.  What happened to
> Ethan & crew, used to happen ALL THE TIME.  What is worse is when you have
> reserved a space, printed flyers, then have the space sold from under you.
> Yikes!  Even worse is when you get outbid in one way or another....Yikes!
> How about having a space, then the person who owns it blows it out before
> your party, the venue busted by the cops, then expects you still have your
> party there the next night, even though the space is red fucking hot!
> YIKES!!!!  These things used to happen ALL THE TIME.  Some have happened to
> me, some to others.  I feel fortunate though, because I can still catch a
> groove and haven't let any of the bad things outweigh the enormous good
> I've enjoyed.  As a matter of fact, I will work with some of the very
> people who got on my nerves in the past.  Why?  Why not?  I'd rather
> forgive, and try to forge a truce, than to waste energy maintaining
> hostilities.  If others can do likewise, then we have a basis to work with
> each other.  I'd rather move forward and test the waters with new projects,
> using history to guide my present.  Besides, there are other more important
> things to worry about...like, where's the next party?
> 
> The Power of The Phone
> -------------------------
> There  was a brief moment in dance culture history when promoters called
> each other to determine when they could throw a party and not have it
> defeat another person's gig.  It was brief, but it was good.  You actually
> talked to the person throwing the gig, and created a cooperative model.
> Alas, it was fragile; people became disconnected.
> 
> And then there were none
> ------------------------
> "Peace, live in it or rest in it!  Come together!" - DJ Pierre;  This man
> is the fucking mac.  I am so saddened at his departure from house music.
> There is no other like Pierre, and there is no equal to his magic.  I hope
> homey comes back to the fold one day.  My man feels house music hasn't been
> as good to him as he's been to it.  No matter what, that man is by far, one
> of the greats of our dance culture.  He IS one of the originators.  His
> music will be missed.  He's the fucking mind bomb!  Everyone else is just
> visiting!
> 
> Props to Jeno for working the DJ Pierre "Generate Power" @ Toon Town back
> in the day (man, he would have motherfuckers grabbing @ straws - Jeno can
> WORK this track!).  Extra special thanks to Wicked posse for bringing DJ
> Pierre to SF to rock some fucking heads!!!  Now THAT was wicked!!!  (I am
> talking in particular about an event held in the "front" of Townsend.  This
> was one for the record books.  If you weren't there, you missed out on what
> can truly be called a stellar event.  Even Markie & Jeno got affected!)
> 
> I'm done now,
> John
> 
> Peace.
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 12:47:09 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 12:46:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: $20 parties
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605230612.A26222-0100000@netcom14>
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I'm going to change the subject here a little...

There are really too many $20 parties in Northern California.  Some are 
worth the money, but 90% of them are the same exact 5 all-SF DJ lineup.
If a promoter is going to charge $20, some out of town DJs, killer 
visuals, and a decent location.  Am I the only person sick of hearing the 
same pool of about 20 DJs OVER AND OVER AGAIN?  Most SF DJs are notorious 
for having a small playlist, and it all gets old really fast.  Even the 
out of town DJs people bring in are usually the same ones (ie Donald 
Glaude, Barry Weaver, DJ Trance, etc).  If I was threw another party I 
would bring in *TERRY MULLAN*.... He's been around a few times in the 
past 6 months, but he's INCREDIBLE!  I guess the main reason why is these 
out of town guys cost so much money to bring in, but don't draw enough to 
justify the money they cost to fly out.  One party to check out is Open 
Space this Friday - A-1 from Dallas will be there, and I know that Space 
Children and In-Touch will put a lot of work into that party..


> thinking about what is going on is in order... I know my mind has been 
> buzzing the past week...  As a suggestion: The next time you deal with a
> commercial or $20 party whether as a promoter charging it OR as a "guest"
> or consumer ask yourself WHY?  If you don't think about it you might not
> even care as long as the music and dancing is good.... if you think about
> what is going on more deeply you might find as I have that you do care
> after all......

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 12:54:33 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
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Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
To: dwarzau@ns.net (John Deatherage)
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 12:54:31 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Action: C
In-Reply-To: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960523120736.24510H-100000@hornet.ns.net> from "John Deatherage" at May 23, 96 12:16:22 pm
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> 
> 
> 
> Really all I can say is that Ethan was just REALLY PISSED, and I think 
> any one in his situation would have done the same thing.  There have been 
> a ton of times where I've done the same thing and regretted it later.
> 

I have been in Ethan's situation on more than several occasions.  You 
will not find any post anywhere of my gripes with any promoters, period.  
I take it to them, hash it out, throw my party, then move on.

Like I said, I am strange.


> As far as having this discussion online, it NEEDS to be here.  This is 
> called a SCENE for a reason.  In any community, matters that affect 
> everyone need to be discussed in a public forum.
> 


I have to disagree, let you have the last word after this.  I do not care 
if president clinton wipes his ass.  In the same vein, I really don't 
care what it takes to have a party.  Either you're going to do it or 
not.  As a promoter and now partygoer/promoter-redux, all I am concerned 
about is catching a groove.  If Wicked or Preston has problems with the 
venue, I feel for them, becuase I was there.  But then the final question 
is always "Well, what are you gonna do about your party?"  Looking at it 
in this manner, you have taken your head out of what caused the problem, 
into a mode fo resolving to do something about it.  Sometimes talking 
FACE-TO-FACE helps, sometimes not.  Those who have been doing this for a 
while have learned not to dwell on the same issues for any more than a 
second.  The same could be a reason why the ranks have thinned, people 
concentrating on everything else but the dance/party.

I know the personal sacrifice it takes to find a space, get plyers done, 
etc.  I also know that not all of my travails are open for public 
scrutiny or discourse.  I would rather resolve problems between all 
parties, do my gig, make sure the people attending are having a good 
time.  Do the people entering the venue or space need to know I had to 
kiss so and so's ass, that I had to push one DJ out of a slot for 
previous obligations to another, that I had a flat tire on the way to 
distributing flyers, that I sacrificed my personal time to make sure they 
had a good time?  Do people come to parties to hear all of this?  I 
seriously doubt it.

For those who are curious fine.  Maybe there should (there once was), a 
place where everyone could dish their dirt, trials, and travails.  But 
for the general public, that which makes up the bulk of our dance 
community, they really could care less.  Most of them don't even know 
Jeno from Ethan anyway, and that is my point.  People come ot hear the 
music, people are a part of this because of the music, not becuase of 
politics or internal fighting.

I thought it was of great foresight to ask people interested in this 
debacle to get private e-mail correspondence.  As far as I am concerned, 
that is great.  As for everyone else who doesn't want to make the effort 
to be cc'ed on this, please do not assume that they are not certain of 
thier intentions.  Kepp that argument, debate, tit-for-tat promoter vs 
promoter stuff private.  I for one do not care to know.

I know others feel the same (well at least one other).  Anyway I hope 
things work out for all parties involved.  SInce I know Ethan, I *DO* 
hope he gets what he wants and hope he does well in all his future 
endeavors.  We need not overanalyze and be informed of the obvious.

As for everyone in the community being involved, they already are, 
whether they like it or not.  So much for choice.  ANyway I do think it 
holds intrigue for those who are not familiar with how parties are done, 
the mechanics and logistics of the party, etc.  So while I am all for 
such opportunities for learning (It ain't black magic), I am not down 
with the other aspects.  The pettiness, the bickering, the "my 
space"/"Your space" (a DJ once told me a certain venue was his, I laughed 
in his face...get real), the nonsense, the back-stabbing.  Hell, it's 
better to write a book:

"The Benefits and Risks of Being a Rave Promoter"

This book is a tell all!  Get it now!  In it you'll learn...

-How to outbid a promoter who has the DJ you want for your gig.
-How to make more money by busting a competitiors party.
-How to put off paying DJ's so that you alone can reap the benfit of your 
hard work.
-How to get work done for free.
-Throwing benefits for profit.
-Selling the concept of a virgin space.
-Safe circledancing.
-How to make money via the roving party scam.
-Lining up your troops, how to create a loyal posse that would do 
ANYTHING to ensure your party's survival.
-Waxing cops asses, or how to have an unbustable party.
-How to fuck someone over who did you a bad 5 years ago.
-Guerilla party tactics.
-The art of party subtrefuge.
-How to promise, but never deliver.

And this is just the tip of the iceberg.

Yeah, everyone really wants to know all these things, and for $19.95 you can!

Peace, live in it, or rest in it,
John

P.S.  I would rather go to a party where the people throwing it are people 
I trust.  The rest is icing or bollocks.  But then again, I am a very 
strange person.

Out & Peace.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 12:57:43 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: CHRYSALIS????!!!
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>i don't want to bust anyone's bubble (mine own included), but i have heard
>that chrysalis will NOT be happening this saturday, due to the loss of the
>space. 
>
>can anyone confirm/deny (oh pleeeease?) this horrible thought? gateway folks?


*SOB!*

Yes, it is so.  They lost their space, & were unable to find another one. :(
Hopefully we'll see a Chrysalis soon!  But y'alls might wanna mark down on
your calendars, they're gonna do a Light on Friday June 21st for the Summer
Solstice in the east bay.  Last Light I went to was totally amazing! :)  So
I might even hafta take the day off to do it! :)

Love,
Shawna


"For what shall it profit a man to gain the world but lose his lunch..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 13:24:05 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 13:23:57 -0700 (PDT)
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
In-Reply-To: <199605231954.MAA11435@netcom20.netcom.com>
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On Thu, 23 May 1996, John S. Lee wrote:

> 
> For those who are curious fine.  Maybe there should (there once was), a 
> place where everyone could dish their dirt, trials, and travails.  But 
> for the general public, that which makes up the bulk of our dance 
> community, they really could care less.  Most of them don't even know 
> Jeno from Ethan anyway, and that is my point.  People come ot hear the 
> music, people are a part of this because of the music, not becuase of 
> politics or internal fighting.

There are also people that come for the people. And as with any group of 
people you inevitably end up with politics and internal fighting. The other 
side of that coin is some smiles, a few laughs, and hopefully some 
lasting friendships. Not a "better" reason to go parties, just a 
different perspective. 

                                         Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 13:37:50 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 13:37:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Sharif Torpis <storpis@crl.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: The Community was Re: Earth's a shakin
In-Reply-To: <199605230541.AA16181@crl.crl.com>
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I'm not replying to this in order to make a "I'm right, you're wrong" kind 
of statement.  I respect where you are coming from, Sharif, but I kindly 
disagree.  

To me raving is about community.  I've been able to learn more about 
human beings and myself through raving.  This list (to me) is more than 
just a place to discuss the dance/music/party aspect of raving.  It is a 
community, one in which people care for each other.  Reaching out to 
someone comes in many forms, and if it takes topics which aren't 
"rave-related", whatever that means, so be it.  I think the interactions 
between people, like when we are commenting about earthquakes, are 
infectious and for the most part enjoyed.  It is all a part of good-will.

I understand that I am but one person with one voice, and I do not hope 
or try to impose my view on you.  Rather, I'd like to share with you how I 
see this list.  (which I think I've done)

Another thing that I find odd when ppl complain about "such-and-such" 
topic, is that in order to complain, they *had* to have read the posts in 
question.  If it angers someone so much, why do they read the posts in 
the first place?  I think it's because everyone is so afraid they are 
going to miss something.  Well, if this is true, maybe one should ask 
themselves why they feel this way.  Maybe because it is fun to be here, 
and to relate to people, which is my whole point!!

Finally, if you are not seeing topics that you would like to see, why 
don't you begin to post about them?  This is another thing that I don't 
get.  If there is something you'd like to talk about, then why don't 
you?  I do agree that I have seen little about music recently, and , 
unfortunately, I don't know enough to start talking about it, but maybe 
you do?  There are so many people on this list, that someone will most 
likely reply to any request that you make.

I hope you don't take this as a personal affront, because I am addressing 
my thoughts to everyone.

Sincerely, 

KaySEE


On Wed, 22 May 1996, Sharif Torpis wrote:

> > can't be posted.  I understand what it's like to have 100's of messages, 
> > but there is this magic little delete key which can alleviate your 
> 
> ...that is not a cure for the problem...the problem needs to be fixed...
> 
> > community, and sometimes off-topic posts help with a little bit of 
>                  ^^^^^^^^^
> 
> ...this list has been experiencing an ever decreasing signal to noise
> ratio for quite some time now...it is definitely not "sometimes"...
> 
> > that all of the time.  I just don't feel it is right that everyone seems 
> > to think they can tell everyone else what is right and wrong.
> 
> ...when u subscribe to a list called sfraves, do u expect to read messages
> about sex during earthquakes?...thank you...don't make this into a morality
> play about right and wrong...
> 
> > intense things going on, but I just couldn't sit idly by anymore.  I am 
>                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 
> ...neither could I...you should know how i feel...
> 
> > got tired of everyone telling everyone else what to do.  Diversity comes in 
> > many forms, and part of diversity is a diversity of opinions.  
> 
> ...diversity comes in the forms of many different mailing lists...
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 13:44:32 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 13:44:21 -0700 (PDT)
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: BSP for RE: (Sac Thurs Night Market)
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For those of you living in the Sacramento area, tonight is the first night
of Thursday Night Market.  Lots-o-vendors of various kinds of stuff on K
Street Mall in Sacramento from 5:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m.  I think tonight is
the first night of the Jazz Festival as well(but don't quote me cuz I'm not
sure).

Anyway, RE: will be providing FREE live ambient/idm music for your listing
pleasure infront of "Records" between 7th and 8th Streets on K.  We will
play from about 6:00pm - 9:00pm.  Hope to see some of you there.  

Rick

ps: this is going to be wierd playing for the general public.  fun though:)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 13:49:54 1996
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To: blkadder@value.net
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
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>There are also people that come for the people. And as with any group of
>people you inevitably end up with politics and internal fighting. The other
>side of that coin is some smiles, a few laughs, and hopefully some
>lasting friendships. Not a "better" reason to go parties, just a
>different perspective.
>
>                                         Black Adder

So, howzabout some smiles, laughs, friendships, and healing after all
that's happened of late?  I, for one, am sending out light, love, positive
energy, and a hope for reconciliation to Ethan, Stacy, Tom, and all their
posses.  Let love rule, y'all!

- Eric P.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 14:02:35 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 14:04:47 -0700
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From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Spinnin some Rekkids
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Just thought I'd ask for all you out there to throw alittle good vibe my way
this weekend. I'm going to make my first real mix tape this weekend. I've
made some just to listen to find out what the heck I was doing wrong and to
help improve myself, but this weekend I'm going to get serious and make a
tape. This may not seem like a big deal to some people and other DJ's, but I
just get off when I'm mixing a record and everything is flowing so good. I
feel enough happiness and energy and have such a great time doing it I can
live forever and pass that energy to others. I love the music and love the
people I've met in this great scene of ours. So if you don't see me out this
weekend, I'll be in SF, but I'll be in front of some turntables having a
blast. I'm going to make 1 House and 1 Trance tape. So if everything goes
good, I'm going to make a bunch of copies and just give them out for
everyone to check out and give me feed back on how or what to do to improve.
Anyway, hope everyone has a great day and remember, tomorrow is FRIDAY...3
day weekend!!!!!


Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 14:03:09 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 13:41:41 -0700
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From: Corey_Johnson@krinfo.com (Corey Johnson)
Subject: Friends, and the Nomad voicemail.
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     Although I'm still basically just a chippy in this scene, I would 
     suggest that no argument between event organizers could possibly be as 
     persuasive as an evaluation of the parties they promote (on a purely 
     subjective basis, of course) --it says a lot about people and their 
     integrity.
     
     After attending Madness --which was splendid-- I was prepared to check 
     out the Nomad party the following weekend (unaware that they were 
     planning to use the same space).  I didn't get very far.
     
     Perhaps I'm overly sensitive where selling is concerned, but as soon 
     as I rang their number I knew Nomad wasn't getting a dime out of me.
     Furthermore, it came as little surprise to learn how they conduct 
     their business, nor how their event came off.  I'm only sorry that my 
     gut reaction *wasn't* wrong.
     
     
     Corey
     
     ps - If anyone is wondering what I mean about the voicemail, just call 
          them at 415-675-5605.  I haven't heard the message lately, but    
          I'll wager the recording says "beautiful", "great", or "really    
          exciting", about 15 times.  Why not "More Absorbent!", "Longer    
          Lasting!" or "Phat Free!"  Business must be good.
     
      

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 14:26:53 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: blkadder@value.net, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
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I don't like the fact that they said VIRGIN WAREHOUSE the night of the 
party on the voicemail.  That's NOT cool...

> So, howzabout some smiles, laughs, friendships, and healing after all
> that's happened of late?  I, for one, am sending out light, love, positive
> energy, and a hope for reconciliation to Ethan, Stacy, Tom, and all their
> posses.  Let love rule, y'all!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 14:59:02 1996
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To: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
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>I don't like the fact that they said VIRGIN WAREHOUSE the night of the
>party on the voicemail.  That's NOT cool...
>
I agree: a lie is NEVER cool.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:04:53 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 15:04:52 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
Subject: PLASTIK JUNE 1ST/VELVET SHOP TONIGHT
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Ok, who works at SUN MICRO SYSTEMS?

The shippers at SUN are inserting flyers for this party with the pallets of
"Sun Sparc Stations" I've received today 5/23/96.  I must say it was a
surprise to see the flyer.  I guess that is one way to get people to go to
your party.

Anyways, I'm going to Velvet Shop tonight.  Anybody else from the list
going.  If so, I'll be wearing a black cap that says "HIC" in red.  Come up
and say hello.


___________________________________________________________________________

 Noah J. Ruiz
 SR SHIP/REC LEAD
 408-944-8050
 email: noah@cadence.com
 Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
___________________________________________________________________________



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:28:19 1996
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Message-Id: <199605232228.PAA20140@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: PLASTIK JUNE 1ST/VELVET SHOP TONIGHT
To: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 15:28:18 -0700 (PDT)
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In-Reply-To: <v02170503adca9b26603d@[158.140.4.129]> from "Noah Ruiz" at May 23, 96 03:04:52 pm
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> 
> Ok, who works at SUN MICRO SYSTEMS?
> 
> The shippers at SUN are inserting flyers for this party with the pallets of
> "Sun Sparc Stations" I've received today 5/23/96.  I must say it was a
> surprise to see the flyer.  I guess that is one way to get people to go to
> your party.

Actually, the filers for the really cool parties are tucked in with the 
Ultras.  Something about a daytime party called "Solaris?"

-troy

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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:31:40 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605232231.PAA13929@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
To: dwarzau@ns.net (John Deatherage)
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 15:31:39 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960523142435.28320B-100000@hornet.ns.net> from "John Deatherage" at May 23, 96 02:26:28 pm
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> 
> 
> I don't like the fact that they said VIRGIN WAREHOUSE the night of the 
> party on the voicemail.  That's NOT cool...
> 
> > So, howzabout some smiles, laughs, friendships, and healing after all
> > that's happened of late?  I, for one, am sending out light, love, positive
> > energy, and a hope for reconciliation to Ethan, Stacy, Tom, and all their
> > posses.  Let love rule, y'all!
> 

Virgin Warehouse?  In San Francisco?  You're kidding, right? 

I just want to lend a bit of perspective...there has not been a virgin 
warehouse in SF since the last huge quake of 1912.

People, this is the friggin barbary coast.  A place of gambling, brothels 
(yeah!), home of the shang-hai (soory to all my Asian bro's & sistahs), 
gold rush, sardine canneries, etc.

There has been undergrounds and secret societies and subcultures since we 
first started walking upright.

There is NO SUCH THING as a VIRGIN WAREHOUSE in SF.  If someone used it 
for anything, it is no longer virgin, by strict definition.  Please 
remember, this place has long been the focal point for gay culture & 
people.  The UG gay scene here, with it's dance parties and sex clubs 
were world renown, second only to maybe New York.  You can best believe 
that if there was an empty space, that at some time within the past 85 
years, it was used for something other than what is was designed for.

People have been partying in this city forever.  We are not the first, 
nor will we be the last.

To some Virgin Space menas one that has never been used for anything, 
never been used for a party, never been used for a massive.  It all 
depends on your view.  If you have a very strict sense of things, so be 
it.  You'll find plenty of people who are wrong, with such rigid standards.

I have always referred to spaces as new, where appropriate.  Now this can 
mean that my party 
had never used it before, or it could mean that, to my knowledge, it 
hadn't been used before by any other party.

Everyone's knowledge starts somewhere.  Those who are new to doing 
parties here in the city may just mistake a place THEY have never used 
before as being virgin.  It's common, especially with promoters from 
outside the area.  It happens all the time.

Also remeber, there are alot of people who are still first timers.  First 
timers are usually attracted to the larger events, so to alot of people, 
who might be used to going to Townsend, this space might seem new.  To the 
uninitiated it could be BRAND new.  I just try to remeber that 
some things are relative.

I do think that if *I* were to throw a party at this particular space, I 
would see no problem in calling it new or a newer space.  It hadn't been 
used that much, and since it can still be worked (unlike Townsend), I 
think the term new would be appropriate.

Virgin?  I dunno, it all depends.  Now I think it is a far cry from 
calling Townsend a new or virgin space.  That place is more reamed out 
than a soap-on-a-rope convict.  Oh well...

Ok now...let's all take a deep breath.  relax.  While taking your next 
deep breath, tighten your buttocks, as you exhale, relax them. 
Mmmmmm...doesn't that feel better.

Anyway, we can find 1000 ways to be pissed at someone or something.  I am 
not defending the actions of unscrupulous promoters who use the term 
"Virgin Warehouse" as a selling point to pack in heads. But sometimes it 
CAN be a matter of perspective.  

Maybe we all might do better if we broaden ours.

Peace, livin' it,
John

P.S.  This weekend will be the mac daddy bomb.  Why?  Becuase I am going 
out drinking then partying my ass off with some friends.  It is DJ 
Loren's bday on Sunday.  I was told he will be playing @ Sunset, so Im 
going to catch some grooves with the guy who got me into playing records.  Right 
on!  On Saturday?  Hangin' wit' da homeys!  Gonna drink, cook some food, and of 
course, partay!  Fukin-el!  Just a primer for Sunday.  Will I 
crackerjack?  My friends are jackin', but I probably will not.  That 
doesn't mean I won't have a good time.  Crackerjackin' was all good at 
one time, nowadays, I can catch a groove with my mind and hills of green.

This will be a good weekend.  Not for amatuers, not for the weak @ 
heart.  If you're not going to tribal "crackerjack" Future (which I also 
hear will be the mega bomb), I guess I'll see you @ Sunset.  Otherwise, 
have a good one.

That party on Tuesday @ 111 Minna is called Light N' Up Lounge.

I'm out!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:36:44 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 15:36:36 -0800
To: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
Subject: Re: PLASTIK JUNE 1ST/VELVET SHOP TONIGHT
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I haven't seen any with the Ultras.  Are you kidding? Or are you serious?
Just wondering!  =)

Noah


At 3:28 PM 5/23/96, Troy Sheets wrote:
>>
>> Ok, who works at SUN MICRO SYSTEMS?
>>
>> The shippers at SUN are inserting flyers for this party with the pallets of
>> "Sun Sparc Stations" I've received today 5/23/96.  I must say it was a
>> surprise to see the flyer.  I guess that is one way to get people to go to
>> your party.
>
>Actually, the filers for the really cool parties are tucked in with the
>Ultras.  Something about a daytime party called "Solaris?"
>
>-troy
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:43:28 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress <mswietzke@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: New virus (NRR)
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My dad mailed me this and I thought that it might help you all out....


______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________
Subject: New Virus
Author:  Walt Campbell at FWENJ2
Date:    5/23/96 1:58 PM
     
     
     There is a computer virus that is being sent across the Internet. If 
     you receive an email message with the subject line "Good  Times", DO 
     NOT read the message, DELETE it immediately.  Please read the messages 
     below. Some miscreant is sending  email under the title "Good Times" 
     nationwide, if you get anything like this, DON'T DOWN LOAD THE FILE! 
     >It has a virus that rewrites your hard drive, obliterating anything 
     on it.
     Please be careful and forward this mail to anyone you care about.
     
     WARNING!!!!!!!  INTERNET VIRUS
     
     
     The FCC released a warning last Wednesday concerning a matter of major 
     importance to any regular user  of the Internet. Apparently a new 
     computer virus has been engineered by a user of AMERICA ON LINE that  
     is unparalleled in its destructive capability. Other more well-known 
     viruses such as "Stoned", "Airwolf" and "Michaelangelo" pale in 
     comparison to the prospects of this newest creation by a warped 
     mentality. What makes this virus so terrifying, said the FCC, is the 
     fact that no program needs to be exchanged for a new computer to be 
     infected. It can be spread through the existing email systems of the 
     Internet.
     
     Once a Computer is infected, one of  several things can  happen. If 
     the computer contains a hard drive, that will most likely be 
     destroyed.  If the  program is not stopped, the computer's processor 
     will be placed in an nth-complexity infinite binary loop -which can 
     severely damage the processor if left running that way too long.
     
     Unfortunately, most novice computer users will not realize what is 
     happening until it is far too late. Luckily, there is one sure means of 
     detecting what is now known as the "Good Times" virus. It always travels 
     to new computers the same way in a text email message with the subject 
     line reading "Good Times". Avoiding infection is easy once the file has 
     been received simply by NOT READING IT! The act of loading the file into 
     the mail server's ASCII buffer causes the "Good Times" mainline program 
     to initialize and execute. The program is highly intelligent- it will  
     send copies of itself to everyone whose email address is contained in a 
     receive-mail file or a sent-mail file, if it can find one. It will then 
     proceed to trash the computer it is running on.
     
     The bottom line is:  - if you receive a file with the subject line "Good 
     Times", delete it  immediately! Do not read it"  Rest assured that 
     whoever's name was on the  "From" line was surely struck by the virus. 
     Warn your friends and  local system users of this newest threat to the 
     Internet! It could save them a lot of time and money.
     
     
     DO NOT DOWNLOAD ANY FILE NAMED PKZIP300 REGARDLESS OF THE 
     EXTENSION!!
     
     A NEW Trojan Horse Virus has emerged on the internet with the name 
     PKZIP300.ZIP, so named as to give the impression that this file is a 
     new version of the PKZIP software used to "ZIP" (compress) files.
     
     DO NOT DOWNLOAD this file under any circumstances!!! If you install or 
     expand this file, the virus WILL wipe your hard disk clean and affect 
     modems at 14.4 and higher. This is an extremely destructive virus and 
     there is NOT yet a way of cleaning up this one.
     
     REPEAT: DO NOT DOWNLOAD ANY FILE NAMED PKZIP300 REGARDLESS OF 
     THE  EXTENSION.
     
     
     
     
     
     

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matthew S. Wietzke                                            U.C. Davis


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:54:39 1996
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From: Pseudo 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
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ohhhh man. this virus alert is SO old.
and such a hoax.

please do NOT forward this to anyone else! let it die a dignified death!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:57:25 1996
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Subject: Re: New virus (NRR)
To: mswietzke@ucdavis.edu (Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress)
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 15:56:28 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605232243.PAA27391@franc.ucdavis.edu> from "Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress" at May 23, 96 03:43:00 pm
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> 
> My dad mailed me this and I thought that it might help you all out....
> 
> 
> ______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________
> Subject: New Virus

sorry for the duplicate posts, but
heres the URL for the old goodtimes memetic virus

http://www.hok.no/marius/memetics/communique.on.net.viruses.html

kcroy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:57:31 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Ethan Miller <ethan@bass-station.com>
Subject: posses etc.
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Amidst all the recent talk of "posses", "ethan's troops", etc., I really
need to make sure that the following is absolutely clear:

Everything I've said is my personal view and mine alone.

Nothing I have said IN ANY WAY reflects or represents the views of
Friends and Family the group, or any of its members.

This is also true in regard to madness. It was very difficlut to try and
describe the history of the ruccus without using some pronoun. I chose "we"
as it seemed more accurate than "I" in representing that history. But, as
noted, the emotions are mine not "ours", whoever that might be.

So please don't hold my views against anyone other than myself...  8)

thanks!

ethan


-----------------------------( ethan miller )-----------------------------
-------------------( http://www.bass-station.com/FnF/ )-------------------
-------( you're only paranoid if they're not really watching you )--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 15:57:39 1996
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From: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Subject: Re: Friends, and the Nomad voicemail.
To: Corey_Johnson@krinfo.com (Corey Johnson)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>     ps - If anyone is wondering what I mean about the voicemail, just call 
>          them at 415-675-5605.  I haven't heard the message lately, but    
>          I'll wager the recording says "beautiful", "great", or "really    
>          exciting", about 15 times.  Why not "More Absorbent!", "Longer    
>          Lasting!" or "Phat Free!"  Business must be good.

I've never had the pleasure of meeting the person who leaves the message but 
listening to it sure soothes me. I think she has a sexy voice. I keep calling it 
over and over and over and...

uh-oh gotta go,
-SUNNY

SOLLE CLOTHING CO.
"Yum Yum Gimme Some!"
solle@solle.com 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:06:40 1996
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From: tim@redshift.com (Tim Gotch)
Subject: Re: New virus (NRR)
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Not this again. The "good times" virus is bullshit, I think this is about
the third or fourth time I've seen it on this list in the last year.
Tim

------------------------------------------------------------
                   Tim Gotch
                tim@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~tim
            Hyper Design Technologies
                hdt@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~hdt
             395 Del Monte Ctr. #128
                Monterey, CA 93940
      Nothing is true, everything is permitted
------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:11:37 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Noah Ruiz <noah@cadence.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: PLASTIK JUNE 1ST/VELVET SHOP TONIGHT
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I don't think too many people with Suns are going to be going to raves, 
especially a over-commercialized gangsta party like that (damn I'm a shit 
talker :P ).  Those flyers are just disgusting...  I'm surprised there 
isn't a row of those tacky dingle balls hanging off the bottom of the flyer..


> The shippers at SUN are inserting flyers for this party with the pallets of
> "Sun Sparc Stations" I've received today 5/23/96.  I must say it was a
> surprise to see the flyer.  I guess that is one way to get people to go to
> your party.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:13:37 1996
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From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress <mswietzke@ucdavis.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: New virus (NRR)
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Umm, psyche?

Just read the wording, stuff like "warped mentality", and you'll know it's 
not real!

Besides, isn't it impossible to get a computer virus by just reading 
email?  You actually have to run the program, I think, but then, alas, 
what do I know!!

-kaySEE

              ****Shit, goddamn, get off your ass and jam****


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:14:40 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 16:14:01 -0700
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: $20 parties
To: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>
>
>I'm going to change the subject here a little...
>
>There are really too many $20 parties in Northern California.  Some 
are 
>worth the money, but 90% of them are the same exact 5 all-SF DJ 
lineup.
>If a promoter is going to charge $20, some out of town DJs, killer 
>visuals, and a decent location.  Am I the only person sick of hearing 
the 
>same pool of about 20 DJs OVER AND OVER AGAIN?

yeah, especially when you pay $20 to get into a small place like 
Jerrold's Deli over and over again. It's NOT worth it..

Oh, But Harmony's party $15 was DEFINATELY worth it. hehe



Adam


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:16:28 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 16:15:25 -0700
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: CHRYSALIS????!!!
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 

>*SOB!*
>
>Yes, it is so.  They lost their space, & were unable to find another 
one. :(
>

So does that mean more people are going to show up to FUnky Tekno 
Tribe? =)~


Adam


                        R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:17:51 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
In-Reply-To: <199605232231.PAA13929@netcom20.netcom.com>
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The fact of the matter is that they KNEW that it had been used for a rave 
before but they probably figured that most of the gangsta kiddies going 
wouldn't have been to any REAL parties today.

> Everyone's knowledge starts somewhere.  Those who are new to doing 
> parties here in the city may just mistake a place THEY have never used 
> before as being virgin.  It's common, especially with promoters from 
> outside the area.  It happens all the time.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:34:28 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
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Let it go, y'all...please!  Let's move forward, armed with knowledge, shall
we?  :)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:39:50 1996
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From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: "RE:" Cancelled at Thurs Night market
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Turns out we can't do it tonight because Eric has to watch his daughter.
Sorry.  We will be there next week though :)

Rick RE:



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:46:32 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 16:47:13 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Pseudo 99 <erase99@sirius.com>
Subject: Re: New virus (NRR)
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>Just read the wording, stuff like "warped mentality", and you'll know it's 
>not real!
how about the part about an AOLer writing it? (no offence to AOLers on the list)

>Besides, isn't it impossible to get a computer virus by just reading 
>email?  You actually have to run the program, I think, but then, alas, 
>what do I know!!
wellll.... you can get hit with an ansi-bomb, but since email programs don't
seem to use ansi colours, you'd have to export it and view it with another
program.. but you can get burned by an ansi-bomb without running it. if you
view it, it can remap keys on your keyboard to do different things (see:
reformat your harddrive), but you'd have to have an old ansi driver in order
for it to let that happen. nothing to worry about, anyway.

is anyone else getting bounced mail from POSTMASTER@support.com?


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:47:34 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 16:45:56 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Subject: Capitalist Mentality and the Death of Alternative Community
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Folks, it's all about spaces.   Property for sale to the highest bidder,
and what that tells us about our society.    This is not "Ethan vs. Tom &
Stacy", but what this argument represents -- the vitality of underground
parties vs. the dominance of commercial raves.  Some of us love the coming
together of friends in an UG; some of us love the world-class dj's and
production of a CR.   Babies or massives, it's all good!!  But
unfortunately, the fact is that commercialism has the nasty effect of
crushing the underground. Since no UG promoters own a fabulous space, they
must locate one from a third party, who's most interested in PROFIT.  When
a higher-end promoter comes along and offers a king's ransom for a space,
that space is forever priced out of UG range.  Another space lost.

Commercial parties are fine, but not when their method of business
eliminates the possibility of any OTHER kind of party.  Why did Chrysalis
fall through for this weekend - leaving us with only FTT?  Why hasn't there
been a Friends & Family in almost a year? Why are there so few
undergrounds, but a plethora of massives on any given week-end?? Spaces,
SPACES - it's all about the AFFORDABILITY of spaces.  So when a space is
finally located and much energy and time is devoted to it, only to have it
also disintegrate because of folks who claim to support the underground, a
reaction such as Ethan's is understandable, IMO.

This is, however, the mechanics of capitalism.  Charging what the market
will bear, pricing everyone's services - as Mike pointed out, "consumers"
not friends.  The ideal values of the UG -- donation of time and effort,
respect and trust of friends, collectives working together selflessly to
create something better for the whole -- cannot survive in an environment
dominated by an economic mentality.   The only way an alternative community
such as this CAN flourish is if it has its own protected space, apart from
the dominant values of the mainstream.   In a society where greatest price
wins, the value of community will always lose, at least as far as the owner
of a potential space is concerned.   Since UG's are forced to compete with
richer contenders for spaces -- the fundamental necessity for even HAVING a
party -- well, we can see the result.  Which value will prevail in a
society BASED on economic values?  Just count the number of undergrounds
compared to the money-making raves.

So our experiment of creating community apart from capitalist values may be
doomed.  I guess the UG has to move even further out of commercialized
arenas, back to beaches (Sunsets) and the forest (Tribal Future) and the
Desert (Dune) - though even there we are still within reach of permit
hassles, police, and vagaries of the weather.  Just think about it, people
-- the dominance of economic rationality (evaluating everything by its
monetary value) is SO pervasive that it is almost impossible for us to
create a community that celebrates something different.  Something more
human, life-affirming.  More loving.  The mainstream capitalist society
forces us to play by their rules, and either become like them (commercial
raves), or lose.

I think raves are three things - the music, the people, and the feeling.
That incredible feeling springs, for me, from the emancipation of finding a
public place NOT based on an economic mentality.  How amazing that is for
us all!  How unusual!  But the music and the physical exterior of the rave
were marketable - so, naturally (following capitalist logic) these were
elevated to become the characteristics of  commercial "raves."  The
unmarketable aspects are what were left behind in the UG.  You can't sell
it, but precisely because it is not sellable means its extinction.  Under
mainstream economic rationality, those things without a price are useless.
If it can't be traded for money, what good is it?  Because money is the
ultimate value.

The loss of this particular space is merely a symptom of a much-larger
socio-political phenomenon, bigger than Ethan or T/S.  I fully support and
love the concept behind the undergrounds.   It's just that with every lost
space, I grow increasingly pessimistic of its possibility.
Capitalism/Modernity/Industrialization has been an unbelievably powerful
force, trampling over other cultures and ideas all over the globe.  Today
we see a global hierarchy with the West firmly on top, and most of the
world suffering - cultures which were thriving before the imperialism of
the West.  Can alternative values grow right here in the heart of
Capitalist Mentality?  When even to question our national dogma is to be
labeled a commie, or backward, or a hippie (or a raver? :) ?  Or will the
might of economic rationality crush our experiment?

No Chrysalis this week-end - hmm, you decide.

Love, Nancy

P.S.  I'm unsubbing tomorrow <SOB!>, so I probably won't get to your
responses, if any.  But I do think it's something for us as a society to
consider, whether manifested as a "rave promoter squabble" or as global
politics.  Because they do share the same, fundamental basis.







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:53:16 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605232340.QAA05093@netcom22.netcom.com>
Subject: Good Intentions This Time
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 16:40:28 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Anytime someone posts a message warning about a virus , it is meant to
help others. All the more reason to be kind in your rebuttal to a
person who posts a warning about a virus , when the warning itself 
was designed by the original prankster as the virulent agent. 

 So, Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress , thanks for the warning! Now you know the
truth about the "Good Times" virus too! 

 Maybe more usefull - is there a newgroup that a person could read that
would have the latest info on viruses making the rounds? That way , if 
someone reads a warning about a computer virus , they could have a reference
newsgroup to verify the information.

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:58:34 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: Spinnin some Rekkids
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>Anyway, hope everyone has a great day and remember, tomorrow is FRIDAY...3
>day weekend!!!!!


weekends don't seem to mean quite so much when you're unemployed...

(or out of school or whatever =)

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 16:58:41 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 16:58:38 -0700 (PDT)
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: $20 parties
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>yeah, especially when you pay $20 to get into a small place like
>Jerrold's Deli over and over again. It's NOT worth it..
>
>Oh, But Harmony's party $15 was DEFINATELY worth it. hehe

$15 seems about right for a big event... I'd only pay $20 if there was
something super-special, like a big out-of-town dj (a _good_ one), or a
really good crowd, or a killer space or whatever (fancy lighting, free big
pants at the door, plenty of chocolate to go around)... A lot of the $20
house parties thrown around here just aren't worth the money IMHO.

why are the best Bay Area parties always $10 and under? =)

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:05:19 1996
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From: Jondabomb@aol.com
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 20:04:51 -0400
Message-ID: <960523200450_119854875@emout15.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: $20 parties
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Everyone says that $20.00 parties arren't worth the money yet everyone always
seems to go. Oh and why didn't anyone critcize parties like Area 51 or
Plastik..... As soon as people say Fuck it im not going to pay $20.00 bucks,
you will soon see that most parties will charge 10-15 bucks maybe lower...You
just have to decide what is worth it, a party or 20 bucks in your pocket....

Just my $20.00 dollars worth,
Jonathan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:27:07 1996
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Message-ID: <31A502B2.7CAB8D1F@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 17:28:34 -0700
From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Organization: r e g e n e r a t i o n  X
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Subject: finals over it time to dance
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hi all u beautiful people,
	
	finals are over, and it time to rave, hope to see some of u people
before i leave to singapore and Ko Phangang. Well, i be raving non stop
till tribal future.(i hope that there are still tickets.)

I have been swarmed with mail (256 unread)

got to go read all the post.

ionX

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:31:03 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 17:31:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: wow!  thanks.  (NRR)
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This is just a short note to thank everyone who's 
helping me find a place to live this summer. 

I can't believe how many people responded!  It's great to know that we've
got such a strong, supportive network here... even in times of strife.
That, to me, is what makes a healthy community.

BTW, I'll sort through the responses and reply individually as soon as I
can.  thanks again!


		jon


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:41:06 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 17:41:01 -0700
From: benedict pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Organization: r e g e n e r a t i o n  X
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To: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
CC: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: New virus (NRR)
References: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960523160916.29144B-100000@value.net>
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You actually have to run the program, I think, but then, alas,
> what do I know!!
> 
> -kaySEE
> 

u are absolutely right but we are dealing with a memetic virus( similar
to air dropping propoganda leaflets on vietnam). No alarm about anyone
hard drive crashing losing all those *.xm* files. 

unity and respect,
ionX

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:50:22 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Chrysalis on the Beach?
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Oops... sent this just to Nancy, meant to send it to everyone...

>So our experiment of creating community apart from capitalist values may be
>doomed.  I guess the UG has to move even further out of commercialized
>arenas, back to beaches (Sunsets) and the forest (Tribal Future) and the
>Desert (Dune) ...

Wait a minute!  Aside from all the politics and rumors, this may be an 
excellent idea.  HEY!  Is there any chance of seeing Chrysalis move to an 
outdoor location?  pleezohpleezohpleezohpleezohpleez?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:50:37 1996
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From: Justin Cooper <datura@best.com>
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Subject: Re: Capitalist Mentality and the Death of Alternative Community
To: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 17:50:17 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02130501adcaaa7886ae@[128.32.160.58]> from "Nancy" at May 23, 96 04:45:56 pm
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Nancy once said

> Can alternative values grow right here in the heart of
> Capitalist Mentality?  When even to question our national dogma is to be
> labeled a commie, or backward, or a hippie (or a raver? :) ?  Or will the
> might of economic rationality crush our experiment?
> 
>

Yes!  there will *always* be a Fringe where the freaks who don't fit the norm
gather and do things their own way.  

see you there,
 justin 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:51:57 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 17:51:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: (no subject) (fwd)
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  This message is in MIME format.  The first part should be readable text,
  while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.
  Send mail to mime@docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info.

---------------------------------280142780116151
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I asked if I could post this to sfraves and he said yes so here goes.  I
don't know him so I'm not recommending anything, but it sounds worthwhile
and cool.

	Brian


######

Additional info:

Chateau de Boom 
July 4th Day Rave 
San Mateo Area 
8 Killer DJ's 
bizzare carnival attractions 
12:01pm----8or9pm 
$5 We are not in this for the money
all money raised will go to Ellipse! 
INFO LINES (415)572-3250 and (415) 286-3495


---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Sun, 05 May 96 09:28:54 -0700
From: Gary Blythe <Freddie@PBINET.com>
To: brian@hyperreal.com
Subject: (no subject)

Hey we are gearing up for a huge day rave in the hills of san mateo at a 
96 room chatue "of course we are only allowed to use the 2 1/2 acers of 
outdoor land. We are looking for sponsers for sound and D.J's seince this 
is a benifit for San Mateo A.I.D.S. srevices nobody is profiting. We are 
just trying to stary july 4th partys off right. If you know annyone who 
chould help us please fowward them this message and Flyer
THANK YOU
MIKE

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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:55:42 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 17:57:29 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Top Candidate... please wich me luck
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hi...

Today,  I'm a lot more optimistic than I was last week.   I went to a killer
interview for a really good high paying job today.   So far,  I'm the top
candidate...  but they plan to interview just one more person this coming
Tuesday...   Because of the unexpected rains,  My belongings needed at
least two more days to dry out in the sun.   So I told off Rico (Landlord)
today,   saying that his "move out" time was unreasonable and unfair,  and
got him to back off and bought till the end of the month before I have
to vacate.

Thanx so very much to all those generious people who came forward to help
me find a temporary place for my boxes.   I might still need to store then
there,  until I can find my own place,  and have privately arranged that
already.

So,  I ask all of you great people to please send me all the positive vibes
and energy my way....  :-)

Then,  just today,  I got call from yet another great company who wants
to fly me out to Raliegh, NC next week for an interview and (brain picking)
session,  and will send me home with some $ and possibly an offer if this
Sausalito job doesn't work out....

This weekend,  will be in SoCal to...

Heliotropic, Sat. May 25, 1996.  Next Step brings you:

Mike Dearborne from Chicago (Djax Records) <--Wo!!
Micro from N.Y. (Caffeine Records)
Alien Happy Life Force from S.F. <-- GOA ALERT!!! GOA ALERT!!!
KODE IV w/ CEIBA performing live <-- GOA ALERT!!! GOA ALERT!!!
Daniel <-- MORE GOA TREAT!!!
Eric Daveport, Jun, Tang, Mike Hiatus.
310-726-4438, 213-960-5016, http://www.netvoyage/~nxt/

So,   see you all when I get back....

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 17:58:52 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Rave candy
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Survey time, kidz!  Who likes what kind(s) of candy the best at parties?
Also, I'd like to know if there is a certain time during a party when
people are more receptive to offers of candy.  All sugar-coated responses
are welcome :)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 18:02:50 1996
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From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Positive vibes... zzzzzzzz.....
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Ok, everyone had enough of swinging at each other?  Good!

Vince and Michal Migurski have made some contributions to the art page I set 
up.  Anyone interested in checking it out or making contributions of their 
own, please feel free to visit:

        http://www.tgrigsby.com/sfraves

And have a *really* cool weekend!

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 18:12:43 1996
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Subject: Re: This VS That - VERY LONG!
Date: Thu, 23 May 96 18:10:49 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
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John S. Lee, jsl@netcom.com wrote:
>
>> As far as having this discussion online, it NEEDS to be here.  This is 
>> called a SCENE for a reason.  In any community, matters that affect 
>> everyone need to be discussed in a public forum.
>
>I have to disagree, let you have the last word after this.  I do not care 
>if president clinton wipes his ass.  In the same vein, I really don't 
>care what it takes to have a party.
>...

If President Clinton's ass-wiping had an impact on his public policy, you 
might care to know more about it.  Similarly, promoter behavior that has 
a public impact on the raving community (e.g. affects space availibility, 
relations with police, etc.) may deserve public attention.  Whether this 
particular recent issue qualifies on these grounds is, of course, a 
matter of opinion.

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 18:25:35 1996
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*** Reply to note of 05/23/96 17:58
FROM: Robert Brown

SUBJECT: Rave candy

 I don't know about any one particulur favorite, but
 Jolly Ranchers and tootsie pops would be high on the list, as well as
 most lollipops.  Life Savers (butterscotch!) are good, too.
 I absolutely adore chocolate, but that's usually not too practical
 since it typically melts at hot raves.

 That's my vote


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 18:28:15 1996
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Subject: Thanks & Wow are right
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FROM: Robert Brown

SUBJECT: Thanks & Wow are right

 JMLogan beat me to it, but I must wholeheartedly agree with what he
 said.  I was pleasantly surprised by the numerous positive posts
 to me about my loss of car and love.  There are more caring people
 than I thought - which is always a nice discovery.

 Thanks again


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 18:34:50 1996
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>is anyone else getting bounced mail from POSTMASTER@support.com?



Yeah, I guess that means that sfraves still has an email address subscribed
that doesn't actually exist anymore?  I sent email to hyperreal asking about
that, but I'm not sure I sent it to the right address.

Brian B?



Shawna


"For what shall it profit a man to gain the world but lose his lunch..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 18:34:57 1996
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From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave candy
In-Reply-To: <v02140b12adca56caa841@[146.225.72.168]>
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Well, my personal preferences are:

Jolly Rancher Watermelon
Grape Hubba Bubba
Wildberry Bubblicious
Gummi Bears/Worms (with REAL JUICE!)
Frisk Peppermint (you can't get em in the states :P)
Blitz Cinnamon/Clove
Tootsie Pops
Starburst Fruit Chews

yeah all right i have a sweet tooth.  but if i could figure out how to 
keep green grapes cold and un-mashed by jove, i'd eat them instead!

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 19:18:20 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: SDream <SDream@tgrigsby.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Positive vibes... zzzzzzzz.....
In-Reply-To: <199605240101.SAA03579@shellx.best.com>
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> Ok, everyone had enough of swinging at each other?  Good!
> 
> Vince and Michal Migurski have made some contributions to the art page I set 
> up.  Anyone interested in checking it out or making contributions of their 
> own, please feel free to visit:
> 
>         http://www.tgrigsby.com/sfraves

I'll submit one soon!  If you ever run out of space, I've got about 9 
gigs free on our server here, and I can store just about anything.  If 
anyone on the list (record labels... hint hint) wants some free space let 
me know...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 19:23:25 1996
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From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
cc: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: wow! thanks. (NRR)
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Hmmm... I'm getting a job at SF State this summer and I'm going to need 
to find a place to stay soon too.  Anything in SF or South SF is cool, 
just not anywhere in the East Bay :) 

> This is just a short note to thank everyone who's 
> helping me find a place to live this summer. 
> 
> I can't believe how many people responded!  It's great to know that we've
> got such a strong, supportive network here... even in times of strife.
> That, to me, is what makes a healthy community.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 19:28:48 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 19:28:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave candy
In-Reply-To: <v02140b12adca56caa841@[146.225.72.168]>
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> Survey time, kidz!  Who likes what kind(s) of candy the best at parties?
> Also, I'd like to know if there is a certain time during a party when
> people are more receptive to offers of candy.  All sugar-coated responses
> are welcome :)  - E

Blow Pops!  Nice for teeth clenching, if you ever have that problem.  
Actually, if you have cotton mouth all that sugar makes your mouth pretty 
raw and weird feeling.  It's still fun to suck on it all night - sorta 
like Maggie from the Simpson's :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 20:12:22 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 20:12:13 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: Rave candy
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i almost forgot! 

ORANGES - maybe messy, but they are like liquid sunshine after 5 or 6 hours
of boogieboogieboogie.

peace
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 20:12:46 1996
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Subject: Re: Rave candy
Date: Thu, 23 May 96 20:10:54 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Mega Warheads (lemon).  Sour Patch Kids.  Atomic Fireballs.  Candy with 
an edge.

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 20:17:23 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 20:17:08 +0200
To: TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Re: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR) ME TOO
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This exact same thing happened to me last year on May 31st.  I still
remember the worrible day.  I too have a Honda; a civic though.  Well it
used to have nice rims and and a great sterio but now it's pretty much
stock.  It was stollen in front of Club X on Harrison.  It had a Clifford
alarm too but these pros got by that.  I had to take a taxi to sf state to
stay with friends untill the next day when I could get picked up.  Good
news though- I got it back 3 days later when the police called and found it
on blocks behind a house in OAKLAND.  Only positve thing=3D the theives
filled my gas tank up and didn't break any windows or dent any fenders.
Let me tell you the feeling sucks when you come out of a club of have a
great time and it is all shatters by the theft of something presious.  Lock
you valuables up!, park in lit areas, get a great alarm and just hope the
theives will pass your car up.

That night a cop told me.. If a theif wants your car bad enough there is
almost nothing you can do to stop him...

Peace
Austin

PS.  FINALS ARE OVER!!!!!!!!!!!! YEAH TIME TO DANCE AND PARTY

>FROM: Robert Brown
>
>SUBJECT: Car Break-ins & Theft (mostly NRR)
>
>
> I had sent an email about this yesterday morning but it never showed up
> on SFR that I could see, so I'll resend it...
>
> After seeing a few posts about car break ins at raves I felt I just HAD
> to chime in on it given what happened to me over the weekend.
>
> On Saturday night/Sunday morning my car was stolen while I was in SF
> dancing.  Not an expenisive car, but not a heap either.  Coming out
> at 3:30am to discover your car is no more is not a pleasant experience,
> especially when you're alone, stranded 45 miles from home!
>
> According to the police (who was reasonably nice, btw) Hondas seem to
> be the current favorite flavor of car thieves in SF.  I had a "locktronics=
"
> ignition lock, but obviously it didn't prevent the car from being stolen.
> Seemed to be a pro job.  Also, again according to the police, auto theives
> do cruise around various party/club spots in SF looking for cars - so
> be careful as well as you can.  I think they were definitely after the car
> itself because I hid everything out of site so there'd be no obvious
> motivation for breaking into the car.  To no avail...
>
> Ironically I was looking at car alarms just a couple of weeks ago, but
> couldn't afford to get one at the time.  Argh!  :(
>
> Aside from the car my uninsured, personal, and expensive cellular phone
> was taken, and my planner/address book.  So, if any of you have given
> my your addy/phone # I no longer have them and would like them again,
> if possible.
>
> If anyone sees a black Honda Prelude with CA license plate EZP 233, please
> call the police!  Though I'm sure it's been hacked to bits and the
> parts sent all over the place by now.  :(
>
> And just to make things completely miserable, my s.o. decided to break up
> with me last night.  Paradise lost...(that phrase just came to mind)
> Life seems a swirl of negativity currently...
>
> Sorry, but had to spill to whomever was listening.

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 20:48:19 1996
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From: Rudy Villafane <rudy@quiknet.com>
To: "'Adam Luong'" <rlunatic@ix.netcom.com>
Cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: CHRYSALIS????!!!
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 20:39:49 -0700
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I hope not!!!!  They are selling their tickets in advanced!!! & just today my friend is supposed to be picking up the tickets!!!!!!  >:(


----------
From: 	Adam Luong[SMTP:rlunatic@ix.netcom.com]
Sent: 	Thursday, May 23, 1996 4:15 PM
To: 	hey, where am I?
Cc: 	sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: 	Re: CHRYSALIS????!!!

You wrote: 

>*SOB!*
>
>Yes, it is so.  They lost their space, & were unable to find another 
one. :(
>

So does that mean more people are going to show up to FUnky Tekno 
Tribe? =)~


Adam


                        R.Lunatic




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 20:50:51 1996
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From: Rudy Villafane <rudy@quiknet.com>
To: "'TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com'" <TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com>
Cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: Rave candy
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I usually like to bring StarBurst and Blow Pops...We wind up giving them all away by the end of the rave though! :)

- Rudy ( _BaNiSh_ ) -

----------
From: 	TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com[SMTP:TBOBSC@tevm2.nsc.com]
Sent: 	Thursday, May 23, 1996 6:25 PM
To: 	sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: 	Rave candy

*** Reply to note of 05/23/96 17:58
FROM: Robert Brown

SUBJECT: Rave candy

 I don't know about any one particulur favorite, but
 Jolly Ranchers and tootsie pops would be high on the list, as well as
 most lollipops.  Life Savers (butterscotch!) are good, too.
 I absolutely adore chocolate, but that's usually not too practical
 since it typically melts at hot raves.

 That's my vote




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 20:57:21 1996
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Message-ID: <01BB48EA.DA2AB640@rudyvill>
From: Rudy Villafane <rudy@quiknet.com>
To: "'John Draper'" <crunch@well.com>
Cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: Top Candidate... please wich me luck
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 20:59:51 -0700
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Good to hear, good things are happening 4 U bud!  Things WILL get better =
dude!  BEST of luck 2 U man!  Is your back doing better also? L8R =
DoOd....

- Rudy ( _BaNiSh_  ) -

----------
From: 	John Draper[SMTP:crunch@well.com]
Sent: 	Thursday, May 23, 1996 12:57 AM
To: 	sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: 	Top Candidate... please wich me luck

Hi...

Today,  I'm a lot more optimistic than I was last week.   I went to a =
killer
interview for a really good high paying job today.   So far,  I'm the =
top
candidate...  but they plan to interview just one more person this =
coming
Tuesday...   Because of the unexpected rains,  My belongings needed at
least two more days to dry out in the sun.   So I told off Rico =
(Landlord)
today,   saying that his "move out" time was unreasonable and unfair,  =
and
got him to back off and bought till the end of the month before I have
to vacate.

Thanx so very much to all those generious people who came forward to =
help
me find a temporary place for my boxes.   I might still need to store =
then
there,  until I can find my own place,  and have privately arranged that
already.

So,  I ask all of you great people to please send me all the positive =
vibes
and energy my way....  :-)

Then,  just today,  I got call from yet another great company who wants
to fly me out to Raliegh, NC next week for an interview and (brain =
picking)
session,  and will send me home with some $ and possibly an offer if =
this
Sausalito job doesn't work out....

This weekend,  will be in SoCal to...

Heliotropic, Sat. May 25, 1996.  Next Step brings you:

Mike Dearborne from Chicago (Djax Records) <--Wo!!
Micro from N.Y. (Caffeine Records)
Alien Happy Life Force from S.F. <-- GOA ALERT!!! GOA ALERT!!!
KODE IV w/ CEIBA performing live <-- GOA ALERT!!! GOA ALERT!!!
Daniel <-- MORE GOA TREAT!!!
Eric Daveport, Jun, Tang, Mike Hiatus.
310-726-4438, 213-960-5016, http://www.netvoyage/~nxt/

So,   see you all when I get back....

Crunchman





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 20:59:00 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605240359.UAA23806@netcom7.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Rave candy
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 20:59:01 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 I like to bring peppermints for everyone. Energizing mint , sugar boost,
and trippy swirly pattern.

 And I keep a roll of multi-flavored LifeSavers for myself ...

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 21:22:09 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 21:21:35 -0700 (PDT)
To: Larry Ching <larryc@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave candy
In-Reply-To: <199605240359.UAA23806@netcom7.netcom.com>
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On Thu, 23 May 1996, Larry Ching wrote:

> 
> [ to sfraves list ]
> 
>  I like to bring peppermints for everyone. Energizing mint , sugar boost,
> and trippy swirly pattern.
> 
>  And I keep a roll of multi-flavored LifeSavers for myself ...

Ah HA! Holding out on the good stuff, eh?

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 21:27:05 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 21:27:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave candy
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSD/.3.91.960523212116.16410A-100000@value.net>
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I'm partial to pixie stix, myself.  
;)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 21:45:16 1996
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Message-Id: <9605240445.AA09545@mail.ico.net>
Priority: urgent
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 22:43:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: NO New virus (NRR)
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
X-Mailer: Worldtalk (NetConnex V4.00a)/MIME
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Blow it off, folks... this has been going around for over a year now.  It   
doesn't exist.  It's a hoax.

Thanks for the thought, though, Matt!
;)
 -Roy

 ----------
From:  Matt Wietzke/DJ Xpress[SMTP:mswietzke@ucdavis.edu]
Sent:  Thursday, May 23, 1996 3:53 PM
To:  sfraves
Subject:  New virus (NRR)

My dad mailed me this and I thought that it might help you all out....


______________________________ Forward Header
__________________________________
Subject: New Virus
Author:  Walt Campbell at FWENJ2
Date:    5/23/96 1:58 PM
       

       

     There is a computer virus that is being sent across the Internet. If   

     you receive an email message with the subject line "Good  Times", DO   

     NOT read the message, DELETE it immediately.  Please read the   
messages
     below. Some miscreant is sending  email under the title "Good Times"   

     nationwide, if you get anything like this, DON'T DOWN LOAD THE FILE!   

     >It has a virus that rewrites your hard drive, obliterating anything   

     on it.
     Please be careful and forward this mail to anyone you care about.
       

     WARNING!!!!!!!  INTERNET VIRUS
       

       

     The FCC released a warning last Wednesday concerning a matter of   
major
     importance to any regular user  of the Internet. Apparently a new
     computer virus has been engineered by a user of AMERICA ON LINE that   
   

     is unparalleled in its destructive capability. Other more well-known   

     viruses such as "Stoned", "Airwolf" and "Michaelangelo" pale in
     comparison to the prospects of this newest creation by a warped
     mentality. What makes this virus so terrifying, said the FCC, is the   

     fact that no program needs to be exchanged for a new computer to be
     infected. It can be spread through the existing email systems of the   

     Internet.
       

     Once a Computer is infected, one of  several things can  happen. If
     the computer contains a hard drive, that will most likely be
     destroyed.  If the  program is not stopped, the computer's processor   

     will be placed in an nth-complexity infinite binary loop -which can
     severely damage the processor if left running that way too long.
       

     Unfortunately, most novice computer users will not realize what is
     happening until it is far too late. Luckily, there is one sure means   
of
     detecting what is now known as the "Good Times" virus. It always   
travels
     to new computers the same way in a text email message with the   
subject
     line reading "Good Times". Avoiding infection is easy once the file   
has
     been received simply by NOT READING IT! The act of loading the file   
into
     the mail server's ASCII buffer causes the "Good Times" mainline   
program
     to initialize and execute. The program is highly intelligent- it   
will
     send copies of itself to everyone whose email address is contained   
in a
     receive-mail file or a sent-mail file, if it can find one. It will   
then
     proceed to trash the computer it is running on.
       

     The bottom line is:  - if you receive a file with the subject line   
"Good
     Times", delete it  immediately! Do not read it"  Rest assured that
     whoever's name was on the  "From" line was surely struck by the   
virus.
     Warn your friends and  local system users of this newest threat to   
the
     Internet! It could save them a lot of time and money.
       

       

     DO NOT DOWNLOAD ANY FILE NAMED PKZIP300 REGARDLESS OF THE
     EXTENSION!!
       

     A NEW Trojan Horse Virus has emerged on the internet with the name
     PKZIP300.ZIP, so named as to give the impression that this file is a   

     new version of the PKZIP software used to "ZIP" (compress) files.
       

     DO NOT DOWNLOAD this file under any circumstances!!! If you install   
or
     expand this file, the virus WILL wipe your hard disk clean and   
affect
     modems at 14.4 and higher. This is an extremely destructive virus   
and
     there is NOT yet a way of cleaning up this one.
       

     REPEAT: DO NOT DOWNLOAD ANY FILE NAMED PKZIP300 REGARDLESS OF
     THE  EXTENSION.
       

       

       

       

       

       


 -------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matthew S. Wietzke                                            U.C. Davis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 22:07:56 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 22:07:26 -0700
Message-Id: <199605240507.WAA05434@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: $20 parties 
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Howdy,

       This is not Greg, this is his roommate Matt. All words in this 
post are not Greg's, they are mine and mine alone. I do not understand 
why people complain about spending $20 on a party and then go and spend 
$20-$60 on EEEEE!!! If someone is so concerned about the cost of the 
party, then don't go. If you go and then spend more money on EEE and 
then complain about the expensive evening, then you need a lesson in 
money management. I go knowing how much my evening is going to cost me 
and if the party doesn't seem worth the entrance fee, then I won't go. 
It's just as simple as that.

    Sorry in advance to those of you who boycott $20 parties. This is 
not directed at you, but at those individuals who are constantly 
complaining.

        bye,bye,
                
                Matt :) :) :)


    

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 22:14:44 1996
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Priority: urgent
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 23:12:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: Candy
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Check out gummi LifeSavers... outstanding!
 -Roy  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 22:42:34 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 22:42:19 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Yes, my 6 month anniversary! :)  (long!)
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>  Hey all you kiddies! As many of you know Chrysalis is this weekend. 
>As many of you don't know,  this weekend will also be the 6 month 
>anniversary for Shawna who, you guessed it, had been raving for 6 months. 
>Unfortunately, I'll be out of town and won't be able to celebrate with her.
>So, I want everyone to give her an anniversary hug for me;):):):).



Ok, now that Reagan has sufficiently embarrassed me in front of the whole
class, might as well make a 
speech! ;)

*warning! possible spiritual subject matter ahead! Read at your own risk!*
(seriously, if you are bothered by this kind of thing, then stop here! :)


This weekend it will be, as Reagan said, my six month raving anniversary.  I
know that's not very long, I know some of you Crusty Grumpy Old Ravers out
there have been doin it since the Famed Toon Towns & before, but when I look
at the absolutely amazing changes my life has gone thru since having begun
raving, I really can't believe I've been doing it for as short a time as I
have! :)  I've met up with the most wonderful people, made the most
wonderful friends, and have had some mind-blowing experiences that I
wouldn't change for the world (yes, sober too! ;)  This, more than anything,
has really taught me something about so-called "life (my own anyway),
liberty & the pursuit of happiness".  I've experienced more of those three
in the last three months I think, than in the rest of my life put together
just about.  

Life:  never in my life have I been so excited to just merely exist!  I was
realizing that the other day.  I suddenly became aware that I was all hyper
& excited, and I began to wonder why, because there wasn't anything in
particular going on.  Then I realized, I was just happy & excited because I
was alive, and also realized how much I was looking forward to seeing what
happens in my life next!  Kinda like a book where you can't wait to turn the
page?  This really surprised me.  Once upon a time, I dreaded what would
happen in my life, I despaired of ever being able to change the situation I
was stuck in, and thought "god. is that what the rest of my life is going to
be like?"  This was only last September, folks!  And then last Saturday
(before Madness), I find myself lying there with my best friend listening to
a beautiful song, and I realize (alert, corny moment ahead) that I am about
as happy as I've ever been and to top it off I also realize I'm crying! :)
This totally blew me away needless to say.  And there wasn't anything
fabulous going on, I hadn't won the lottery, I hadn't found an incredible
new love or anything, I was just happy to exist.  And that was what *really*
blew me away. Not only was I happy enough to be crying out of the blue, but
there wasn't any greater reason than simple existence that was making me
feel that way.  This was probably one of the most intense experiences I've
ever had in my life, and yes it was stone sober for those enquiring minds
that want to know!  Y'alls can now understand why I feel such affection for
the rave scene & everything it entails!  

Liberty:  Woo-wee! :)  I have experienced the most amazing sense of freedom
since having joined up with my raving clan, in a number of ways.  One rather
obvious way is thru the breakup with my boyfriend.  This occurred right
before I began raving, and boy was it the best thing I've ever done in my
life just about!  Jealous, drunk & abusive, no way in hell I could have done
any raving at all with him still in the picture.  This was a situation I
thought I was stuck in, hence my above statement about wondering how the
hell I was going to get myself out of this, wondering if this was how my
life was going to be for the rest of my life.  We'd go to a party, & if I
took too long in the bathroom he'd come pounding on the door demanding to
know why I was there so long & who was in there with me.  I remember having
to steel myself ahead of time when I knew I was going to have to deal with
him drunk again.  So!  You can imagine the amazing sense of lightness &
freedom I experienced attending beautiful experiences like my first
Chrysalis after having broken up with him! :):)  And it's just been going on
like that since.  Total night & day.  I've savored every bit of freedom I
could experience in these past few months, and you guys really wouldn't
believe how like a completely different person I feel now! Anyway, that
freedom is pretty obvious when you look at the before-and-after picture.
Another freedom I've experienced I think I described in my review of Basics
a couple of months ago.  This was a freedom from all that bizarre crap that
parents & society instill in you at a young age & onwards.  I definitely
still feel that we were all born a certain way, in awe & wonder about the
world around us, full of unconditional love.  And I believe that along the
way, society decides for us what proper behavior is, proper ways of thinking
are, proper ways to feel are, and teaches us to fear the very way we were
born feeling & behaving.  I described in that review how at that party I
somehow felt like I had completely come full circle back to how I was when I
was born, and it seemed that everyone around me was feeling the same way.
You can imagine how beautiful that group experience was!  Everybody acting &
feeling & thinking the way it seemed we were meant to do from the start.  No
negative reinforcement to be found.  It was a very simple & clear way to
exist.  I will always remember that party (and also the amazing group of
people I was with) for making me feel that way (again!).  Not every party
does that, and it taught me yet another valuable lesson.  So yes, in many
respects, I really feel like I now know what it is to be free.

The Pursuit of Happiness:   It is also important for me to point out that
while I directly attribute much of my recent changes of being to the rave
scene, it has very much taught me to look internally for this happiness I
described above.  Much like how Jesus taught Peter (it was peter, right?)
how to fish for himself, rather than simply handing him with the fish.
Raving has been this incredible force in my life that while providing me all
these amazing things & experiences, still managed to teach me how to seek
these things out & find them for/within myself.  I don't know about all of
you, but this has actually been one of the most important things I've been
learning lately, and this change of perspective on my part has literally
changed my life in a very short amount of time.  The pursuit of happiness
has led me to myself, all the while finding a thousand ravers holding my
hand! :)


I just wanted to write this & let you all know how much the rave scene, &
thus all of you who make up the scene, has done for me.  You are all
important to me, dj/promoter/party-goer/etc, you all make up what feels like
a close community for me.  Without one of those components, it just wouldn't
be the same, in fact it wouldn't even exist.  You have all played a part
somehow in those things I described above, you have all helped teach me the
real meaning of Life, Liberty, & the Pursuit of Happiness (The Inalienable
Rights of Raving!)  And you have all helped teach me to find these things in
myself as well.  

And to top it all off, I just had the best mango I've ever had in my life!
Life just doesn't get any better than this! :)


Well, since I *was* gonna celebrate my anniversary at Chrysalis, looks like
I'll hafta put it off for one week and do it at Tribal Future instead.  I
hope to see everybody who's made a difference to me there, to help me "ring
in" the next six months! :):)


Thanks for your patience if you've read this far! :)

Love,
Shawna

1996 has been a great year so far!


"For what shall it profit a man to gain the world but lose his lunch..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 23:03:05 1996
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Message-ID: <31A4A9EC.3A70@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 11:09:48 -0700
From: CT <ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com>
Reply-To: ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com
Organization: CT D-Zine
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Hey All!

In lieu the recent happenings with the SF logo thang, I
decided to take the initiative to print up SFR laminates
with the design I submitted.

They went to the printer today, so I will have them for
you kiddies on Sat. night.

Just look for me (big yellow happy face necklace) or R.Lunatic
(Dr. Seuss hat). We will probably be at FTT.(Does anyone know
what's up with their space???)

Also, if you want to donate a buck to cover production costs, that
would be great. However, a hug and a smile are absolutely Mandatory!

Special thanks to SDream for his efforts in this project.

Well, back to the books................PLUR

CT

---------------------------------------
     ______   ________               
    /  ___/  /__   __/            
   /  /__      /  /              
  /_____/     /__/   D-Zine Labs  
  graphics-flyers-dream manifestations  
  
            Terry Estioko
            (408)955-8638
----------------------------------------

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 23:19:18 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 23:18:46 -0700
Message-Id: <199605240618.XAA26980@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: Rave candy
To: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>
>Survey time, kidz!  Who likes what kind(s) of candy the best at 
parties?
>Also, I'd like to know if there is a certain time during a party when
>people are more receptive to offers of candy.  All sugar-coated 
responses
>are welcome :)  - E
>
>
>


SSSTTTTAAAARRRBBBBBBUUUUURRRSSSSSSTTTTTTTT!!!!!!!!

And Jolly Ranchers too! =)~

Yum Yum Yum!

That's All I carry with me! So if you ever see me at a rave, come ask 
for some candy! 

R.Lunatic


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 23:20:54 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605240620.XAA01603@netcom8.netcom.com>
Subject: Who Are The "Progressive House"/Breakbeat DJs?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 23:20:55 -0700 (PDT)
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[ to sfraves list ]

 Hi - an actual San Francisco Bay Area Rave Scene question here !!!

 Which DJs and musicians in the SF Bay Area do music that is considered :

1. Progressive House
2. Breakbeat
3. Jungle/Drum & Bass

 Just email your suggestions to me, and I'll compile your suggestions
and post them to SFRaves -

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 23 23:24:01 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 23:23:25 -0700
Message-Id: <199605240623.XAA27234@dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Re: Rave candy
To: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>
>i almost forgot! 
>
>ORANGES - maybe messy, but they are like liquid sunshine after 5 or 6 
hours
>of boogieboogieboogie.
>
>peace
>melis
>
>
>

Oh Btw! Orange POP ROCKS!!! those are a trip!! Hehe... and Cotton 
Candy!!!! YUM! You can litteraly feel them melt in your mouth!

Adam


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 00:12:54 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 00:17:49 -0700
To: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Andrew Nourse" <andy@pythagoras.org>
Subject: Re: Capitalist Mentality and the Death of Alternative Community
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At 04:45 PM 5/23/96 -0800, Nancy wrote:
>Folks, it's all about spaces....
> Since no UG promoters own a fabulous space

I think we COULD!

>The only way an alternative community such as this CAN flourish is if it has
>its own protected space, apart from the dominant values of the mainstream.

When people are exposed to the real thing, they lose patience with the hyped-up
imitations.  We need no protection from the system.  The system feels the need
to be protected from us.

>In a society where greatest price wins, the value of community will always
lose,
>at least as far as the owner of a potential space is concerned.

If the current owners all act like automata, as you suggest, then the
solution to
the problem is obvious---   We become the owners...

>Just count the number of undergrounds compared to the money-making raves.

That is hard to do.  The money-making ones advertise, and the undergrounds
are, well, underground, so most of us don't always hear about them.

>I guess the UG has to move even further out of commercialized
>arenas, back to beaches (Sunsets) and the forest (Tribal Future) and the
>Desert (Dune)

I have always preferred places like this anyway.  Often the best places are
ones that are protected from the ravages you speak of by the sheer difficulty
of building anything there.  It is often possible to purchase land in such
places for surprising little money.

>I think raves are three things - the music, the people, and the feeling.
>That incredible feeling springs, for me, from the emancipation of finding a
>public place NOT based on an economic mentality. ...  The
>unmarketable aspects are what were left behind in the UG. ...

> precisely because it is not sellable means its extinction.

No, it just means that capitalists will not attempt to sell it.  They  can
attempt to stamp it out, but since they don't really understand what it is,
eliminating it will always be very difficult for them to do.

>If it can't be traded for money, what good is it?  Because money is the
>ultimate value.

And raves are one of the places that people learn that this isn't true.
(which, no doubt, is a source of great concern to some people).


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 00:40:56 1996
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From: Derek Chung <dhchung@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605240740.AAA09885@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: This Week's SFR Calendar!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (SF Raves)
Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 00:40:50 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves-calendar@hyperreal.com (SFR Calendar)
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Lots of stuff this Memorial Day weekend, all around the bay area and
Northern CA - in SF, in Santa Cruz, in the East Bay, in Stockton, and even
on the Bay!  Funky Tekno Tribe and Spundae will probably be the biggest,
and there are also free afternoon parties on Saturday and maybe Sunday.


                           THE SFR CALENDAR
                                       
    http://www.hyperreal.com/raves/sf/calendar/gencal.cgi
    
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Upcoming Parties in the San Francisco Bay Area

   Friday, May 24th - Space Children & In-Touch presents _Open Space_
   A1 (Texas), DJ Dan, Donald Glaude, Graeme, Cesar, Radley.
   415.267.3916 510.433.7216 408.327.9277 916.554.7177
   
   Friday, May 24th - Bee.Jones & OM records presents urban jam IV
   Jungle Biskit, Telefunken, Los Angelitos, New Dealers, Mo'Fessionals,
   Mark Farina, Felix the Dogge, Corey Black, Buck.
   advance tix thru family dog - 415.974.0634
   8pm-. Maritime Hall, 450 Harrison St, SF.
   
   Friday, May 24th - Sm:)e
   Stevie (Dimensional), Vibes (Dimensional), Xpress (Davis), Spin Clair
   (Colorado), more TBA.
   Free Smarties and other goodies.
   7pm- $10. Stockton. 209.547.3285
   
   Saturday, May 25th - Funky Tekno Tribe 
   Graeme, DJ Dan, Simon, Tony, Galen, Jon Williams, Chris Flores,
   Darkhorse, Jonah Sharp, Professor Smith.
   limited pre-sale tix $20 at Housewares & In Tha Mix.
   415.266.8215 415.266.9215 408.236.2205 916.484.3727
   
   Saturday, May 25th - _a higher state of freedom_
   andre lucero, taj, galen, sean murray, goura candra.
   Free. 415.303.5336
   
   Saturday, May 25th - Fluffy Feather Chill Zone and 2nd Chakra presents
   _Nexus_
   Tony, Donald Glaude, Dreamer, Carlos.
   please bring donations of food and clothing.
   noon-All ages, Free. Peoples Park, , Berkeley. 415.337.4263
   510.667.3492
   
   Saturday, May 25th - _Free Tribal Beach Party_
   Carlos, Tracy, Harry Who?, Mei-Lwun, Eric, Spire, Chris, Rob.
   noon-9pm, All ages, Free. santa cruz?. 408.427.5688
   
   Sunday, May 26th - Bulletproof presents _The Boat Party_
   Pete Avila, Jay-J, Big Lee, Aural B, Kevin, Jerry Ross.
   departs 7pm from the Ferry Building.
   advance tix at Bulletproof, 629 Haight.
   afterparty at Mission Rock, Monday May 27th.
   7pm-midnight, $25. SF. 415.255.7168
   
   Sunday, May 26th - _Spundae_
   John Aquaviva, Jon Williams, Simon, Henrik, Tony, Felix, David
   Michael, Kimball Collins, Mark Lewis, DJ Dan, Carlos, Miquel, Pete
   Avila, David Harness.
   Visuals by Dimension Se7en.
   9pm-8am, 21+. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.974.9389
   
   Wednesday, May 29th - Up n'Atom
   Laron, Chris, Gavin, Felix the Dogge, Soulstice (live).
   111 Minna St, SF. 415.789.8044
   
   Friday, May 31st - _Needles_
   Barry Weaver, Donald Glaude, Chris Flores, Karizma, Dutch, Matthew,
   Miah, Stevie, Vibes, Flash, Dennis, Rockit, Filip, Scot, Carlos
   Campos.
   runs all weekend (thru 6/2)
   415.313.7107 916.440.2707
   
   Friday, May 31st - Out-A-Sight
   Graeme, Jeno, Simon, Sotero (SD).
   Visuals by Hyperdelic, Donovan.
   SF. 415.437.4462
   
   Friday, May 31st - Beyond Space-Time/Kundalini presents 100% Spiritual
   Rays of Love
   DJ Shakra, Michael Manahan, Dervish, DJ Daeman, Ernie Munson, Phil
   Salter, Jon Williams.
   415.337.4928 510.895.3550
   
   Saturday, June 1st - Wicked 
   Markie, Garth, Jeno, Thomas.
   11pm-8am, 21+, $15. SF. 415.512.5713
   
   Saturday, June 1st - _Tribal Future Big Mountain Boogie_
   Tony, Carlos, Josh, John Howard, Tracy, Galen, Solar, Alex Windsor,
   Alika, Abstract, Pollywog, Dan Barnes, Allen, Andrew, Nathan, DJ Crack.
   runs from noon Saturday until midnight or later Sunday.
   tix at Ameba and Primal.
   $20. Willits. 415.750.9368
   
   Saturday, June 8th - choice... presents Basics 
   Tony, Josh, Garth, Doc Martin, Doran, Brownie, Astral Matrix (live).
   E.S.W.H/H.O.B.M./C.C.C./H.B.T.U.K.
   415.905.9629
   
   Friday, June 14th - _Orion_
   916.392.9105
   
   Saturday, June 15th - Nexus presents _Second Chakra_
   Dale Charles (Boston), Pete Moss (Boston), Jeno, Donald Glaude, DJ
   Quest, Carlos, Dreamer, Kwashi, Essence.
   510.667.3492 415.337.4263
   
   Saturday, June 22nd - Full Circle Productions presents _Sankofa_
   Mark Gage (Vapour Space), Rabbit in the Moon, DJ Monk, Vicious Vic,
   Wade Hampton, Terry Mullan, Justin, Ernie Munson, DJ Dan, Simon,
   Garth, Jeno.
   415.675.9956 510.986.9089
   
   Tuesday, June 25th - _Crash Worship_
   live tribal/industrial band
   $10. Trocadero, 520 4th St @ Bryant, SF. 415.995.4600
   
   Saturday, June 29th - _Tribal Funk_
   Tony, Josh, Galen, guests.
   
   Thursday, July 4th - _Chateau de Boom_
   fundraiser for San Mateo AIDS Services
   noon-8pm, $3. 565 Remillard, Hillsboro "classic spelling".
   
   Wednesday, August 28th - Burning Man 1996
   includes Wicked Sound System.
   save $10 by registering by June 1st.
   runs entire weekend, through September 2nd.
   All ages, $35. Black Rock Desert, Nevada. 415.985.7471
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
W E E K L I E S

   House/techno/acid jazz/ambient/etc reg'lar happenins Some of them may
   have ended - let me know when that happens...
   
  Friday
  
   _ Sound Factory _- House w/DJs Pete Avila, David Harness, guets.
   9:30pm-7am, 21+, $10. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF.
   415.543.1300
   
   _Soul'd Out_ - House w/DJs Julius Papp, Rick Preston, guests. free
   before 10:30
   9pm-, 21+, $5. The Usual, 400 S.1st St., San Jose.
   
   _Nocturnal Transmission_ - House w/DJs David Harness, Tim Martinez,
   Saint John, guests. $5 before midnight.
   11pm-5am, 21+, $10. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Go Fast_ - Techno. Energy Music...for Women by Women (boys can come
   too).
   10pm-. 8th & Minna, SF.
   
   _Liquid Fridays_ - House w/DJs various DJs. 10pm-2am, 18+, Free. 2721
   Broadway, Sacramento., Sacramento. 916.484.4285
   
   the green door - "where circles meet squares" w/DJs andrew, thomas,
   caspar, paul, felix the dog, guests. 10pm-3am, 21+, $7. 880 Stevenson
   @ 10th, SF.
   
   _Nikita_ - house, techno w/DJs Jeno, Simon, Henrik. 10pm-7am, 21+,
   $10. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.267.0568
   [5.31 - Juan Atkins]
   [6.7 - DJ Duke]
   [6.14 - Westbam, Hardsequencer]
   [6.21 - CJ Mackintosh]
   [6.28 - Derrick May]
   
   _The Scene_ - 21+. the EndUp, 401 6th @ Harrison, SF. 415.393.9067
   
   _Beats_ - house, breakbeat, trance w/DJs Carlos Campos, Karizma,
   weekly guests. 7042 Folsom Blvd between Howe and 65th, Sacramento.
   415.273.1345 916.558.0850
   
   _This Side Up_ - house, techno w/DJs guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight,
   SF.
   
  Saturday
  
   _Other Whirled_ - House, Techno w/DJs Warren, Nobel, Jason Cassady,
   Nikki Rivera, guests. saturday morning
   6am-, 21+. 201 9th @ Howard, SF.
   
   _Sound Factory _- big club sounds
   9:30pm-4am, 21+. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF. 415.543.1300
   
   _Release _- Acid Jazz, Funk, Reggae, House w/DJs Jerry Ross, Josh, Mr.
   Sulu, Randy Wong. 21+. 1015 Folsom, , SF. 415.337.7457
   
   55 - House, Euro w/DJs Jorge Martinez, Tim Martinez, guests. 21+. 55
   Natoma St., SF. 415.267.1858
   
   _Vanilla Fudge _- House w/DJs Corey Black, Sunshine, Moonbeam, Jason,
   Big Lee, Darren. occasional saturday nights.
   10pm-2am, Free. Cafe Bastille, 55 Belden Alley, SF. 415.764.2903
   
   Vertigo - Psycho, Techno, Disco, Funk w/DJs Nikki Rivera, Ellen
   Ferrato, Dave Peterson, Lewis. 10pm-, 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison,
   SF. 415.703.7172
   
   _Liquid Vinyl_ - House w/DJs Jay-J, Suiki, John Howard, guests.
   2am-6am, 21+, $8. DV8, 540 Howard, SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Nuff Respect _- Jungle w/DJs StarEyes, Thad. 5pm-9pm, Free. Your
   Mama's Cafe, 5239 College Ave @ Broadway, Oakland, Oakland.
   510.601.YOUR
   
   phunkatech - Jungle w/DJs UFO, Noel, guests. 21+, $2. The Top, 424
   Haight, SF. 415.995.4699
   
   _Metro Jazz _- Acid Jazz w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Mauricio Avilas, Tom
   Thump, Franky, guests. 10pm-, 21+, $7. 111 Minna St, SF. 415.974.1719
   [5.25 - Harry Who?]
   [6.1 - Markie]
   [6.8 - Two Year Anniversary block party w/Josh Jones, Hueman Flavor,
   Andrew Jervis]
   
  Sunday
  
   _ Spundae _- House, Techno w/DJs Henrik, Carlos, Miquel, weekly
   guests. free b4 10:30p
   For Technotica, call 415.764.2922
   10pm-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.974.9389
   
   _Leopard Lounge_ - Acid Jazz, Funk & Live Bands. w/DJs Suiki, Jay-J,
   Anthony, Julius Papp, Mark Farina, guests. 2125 Lombard @ Fillmore,
   SF. 415.771.2583
   
   _Pleasuredome_ - House w/DJs Neil Lewis, David Harness, Phil B,
   guests. 21+. 177 Townsend, SF. 415.985.5256
   
   Quench - House, Ambient w/DJs Rick Preston, Ryan Tapia, guests.
   Ambient-Space explorations by DJ Leath and guests in the front room.
   21+. The Usual, 400 South First St., San Jose. 408.535.0330
   
   _Techsture_ - deep layers of sound w/DJs tomas, markus, guests.
   8pm-12mid, All ages, Free. cafe abir, 1300 Fulton @ Divisadero, SF.
   415.974.4358
   
   subbass - jungle, drum'n'bass, trip hop w/DJs noel, abstract, jawbone.
   10pm-2am, 21+, $3. 270 Brannan @ 2nd, SF. 415.905.8865
   
   Strawberry Sundays - techno, house w/DJs Dutch, Jazz-E, Corey, Oscure,
   Jesse. $5 for under 21;.
   6am-, 18+, $3. Bahia, 1600 Market St., SF. 415.635.9183
   
   Mantra - techno, ambient, trance w/DJs Dutch, Surge, Theta Blip,
   guests. Lounge around the cul-de-sac of psychedelic exotica w/the
   ameba crew - allen, andrew & mark.
   10pm-3am, 18+, $5. 683 Clementina Alley, SF. 415.331.1500x888
   
  Monday
  
    Mushroom Jazz - acid jazz, trip hop w/DJs Mark Farina, Miquel, Julius
   Papp, guests. 9pm-3am, 21+, $5. 330 Ritch St, SF. 415.905.8811
   
   _Noc Noc_ - techno/ambient/jungle w/DJs Mohsen. 21+, Free. 557 Haight
   St., SF.
   
   _Tongue n' Groove _- trip hop, jungle, acid jazz w/DJs tomas, seth,
   m.mark, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+, $5. Cat's Grill & Alley, 1190 Folsom @
   8th, SF. 415.431.3332
   
   _rotation_ - jazz, hiphop, soul, acid jazz, funk w/DJs racer x, yamu,
   stef, rasta cue-tip, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+. up & down club, 1151
   Folsom St, SF.
   
   _21st sensory _- abstractbeatz-hiphop-dub-drum n'bass-electro w/DJs
   Tomas, Abstract, guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight, SF. 415.974.4358
   
   _Movement_ - trance, breakbeat, jungle w/DJs Julio, Kimo. 10pm-2am,
   18+, $3. Bahia Cabana, 1600 Market @ Franklin, SF. 415.263.5797
   
  Tuesday
  
    Butterfly - Hip Hop, Acid Jazz, House, Funk w/DJs Charlotte, Dani,
   guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, $2. Casanova, 527 Valencia, SF.
   
   Breathe Deep - House w/DJs Jay-J, Ruben, Miquel, guests. 10pm-4am,
   21+, $5. 1015 Folsom., SF. 415.998.9515
   
   _Begin..._ - house, trip hop, trance w/DJs Darrel, Cisco, Radley,
   Ollie, Seanee, Xpress, Grey, Anna. 9pm-2am, All ages. The Inn of the
   Beginning, 8201 Old Redwood Highway, Cotati, Cotati. 707.524.4443
   
   _Shoam_ - Trip-Hop & Drum n Bass Your Mama's Cafe, 5239 College,
   Oakland.
   
   _Succotash!_ - tasty jazz - funk - beats - space w/DJs tom thump,
   rasta q-tip. 21+, Free. up & down club, 1151 folsom st., SF.
   
   _supper_ - funk, acid jazz w/DJs Caspar, guests. 21+, Free. Julie's
   Supper Club, 1123 Folsom @ 7th, SF. 415.861.0707
   
   _Light-n-Up Lounge_ - house w/DJs Preston, guests. 21+. 111 Minna St,
   SF.
   
   _L-Tryptophan_ - ambient, techno w/DJs guest DJs weekly. 21+, Free.
   1624 California @ Van Ness, SF.
   
   _Lost in Space_ - house, hip-hop w/DJs Pause, Dark Money, Winnie B,
   Eric Lacy. 21+, Free. Cafe Mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th, SF.
   
  Wednesday
  
   _ Come/Unity _- House, Techno, Ambient w/DJs Simon, Jeno, Garth. first
   Wednesday of the month.
   10pm-4am, 21+, $7. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.241.8815
   
   _Boost_ - old school uplifting house w/DJs Jamie J, Hector the
   ejector. 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison, SF. 415.703.7105
   
   _Roots_ - House, Trip Hop w/DJs Garth, Jeno, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+,
   $6. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.512.5713
   
   _cosmic lounge _- space jazz, galactic grooves, jungle w/DJs Caspar,
   Paul, Seth, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, Free. cafe mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th,
   SF.
   
   _Reunion_ - Danny, Naz Cafe, guests. 9pm-, 21+, Free. The Fulton Bar,
   1243 Fulton Mall, Fresno. 209.488.5332
   
   _Thirsty_ - tasty house tunes and even better company w/DJs Jellybear,
   Jay-J, top notch guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, Free. The Top, 424 Haight St,
   SF.
   
   _The Lounge_ - 9pm-3am, 21+. 1401 Arden Way, Sacramento.
   916.922.8041x4240
   
   _Bubbles_ - deep funky techno house music w/DJs Don Crisp (Crisp
   Records), guests. starts May 1.
   9pm-2am, 21+. Babylon, 2260 Van Ness @ Vallejo, SF. 415.567.1222
   
   _Wish_ - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
   18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663
   
   _Belief_ - house w/DJs Julius Papp, Harry Who?, Rick Preston. begins
   5.22.
   10pm-, 21+. Agenda basement, 1st & San Salvador, San Jose.
   
   _Jackin' the Box_ - weeklytechnohousejammyinnadetroitchicagostylee
   w/DJs jon santos, samuel, guests. 10pm-2am, 18+, $5. 375 1st St @
   Harrison, SF.
   [5.29 - cesar]
   [6.5 - sho]
   [6.12 - john howard]
   [6.19 - dial8]
   
   Boogie Bowl - house, techno w/DJs John Howard, Tracy, Dave, Virg,
   guests. admission includes bowling and pool.
   10pmm-3am, $8. Country Club Bowl, 88 Vivian Way @ E.Francisco, San
   Rafael. 415.456.6440
   
  Thursday
  
   Lift - House, Funk w/DJs David Harness, Ruben Mancias, Jay-J, Black,
   guests. 12mid-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma, SF. 415.267.5984
   
   Velvet Shop - House, Techno. call for location
   21+, $5. 4th St Bowl, , SJ. 408.235.1556
   
   _Azul_ - House, Soul w/DJs Alfie, James. 21+, Free. Casanova, 527
   Valencia, SF.
   
   Full House - Acid Jazz, House w/DJs Finn, Matt Bernsen, Andrew
   Rawnsley, Bruno Ybarra, guests, live musicians. 10pm-2am, 21+, $3.
   Miss Pearl's Jam House, Eddy & Larkin, SF.
   
   Pack-a-Bowl - "We'll be droppin the wax while you're droppin the
   balls" w/DJs Mars, Tracy, guests. 8:30pm-2am, $6. Park Bowl, Haight @
   Stanyan, SF. 415.541.5019
   
   .blitz - foxyboysfancygirlsfreshmademixes - 21+. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   _Le Jazz Hot!_ - future sounds for jazz heads w/DJs Andrew Jervis,
   guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, $3. Nickies BBQ, 460 Haight, SF. 415.621.6508
   
   _Real_ - house, techno. every first Thursday of the month
   9pm-2am, 18+, $7. Pantages Theater, 1225 K St Mall, Sacramento.
   916.565.9588
   
   _Revolutionary Wax_ - coax your evolutionary ass w/DJs Consuelo Kevin,
   John John (Open Mind), James (Tweekin). 21+, Free. Dalva, 3121 16th
   St, SF. 415.252.7740
   
   _Green_ - house, techno w/DJs guests weekly. 10pm-2am, 18+. the top of
   the Wharf Cafe, the end of the Santa Cruz Wharf, Santa Cruz.
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Info Lines

     * Be-At Info Line - 415-626-4087. Usually has 5-10 listings, updated
       daily.
     * Clubline - 415.979.8686
     * Fatline - 415.207.3668
     * Frequency 8 Trance/Techno infoline - 415.541.5019
     * the Global Party Network Buzzline - 415.568.1338
     * The Groove Line - (415) 331.1500 ext.4788
     * Housewares Rave Line - 415.281.0125
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Radio/TV Shows

     * Sunday night 11pm-2am - "The Dreaming/Innermind Show" w/DJ Miracle
       & Mr. Monchichi. House, Jungle, Trip-Hop, Ambient, Dub,
       Break-Beats & guest DJs. KSCU 103.3 (Santa Clara)
     * Monday afternoon 12:30-3:00 pm - DJ Jerecho presents the best of
       the urban polyrhythmic experience jungle, acid jazz, techno,
       electro, breakbeat KDVS, 90.3 FM (Davis)
     * Wednesday night/Thursday morning 3am-6am - "Aural Fixation"
       experimental sounds of ambient and trip hop with a splash of hi
       nrg, from trance to jungle. KZSC 88.1 fm (Santa Cruz)
     * Thursdays 9:30pm-midnight - "Aurora Borealis" Beats and
       atmospherics w/DJ Seth. KALX 90.7 (Berkeley)
     * Fridays 9pm-midnight - Andrew from Groove Merchant spins on KUSF
       90.3 (SF)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - midnight-noon. House/techno mix
       with Johnny K, Ozone & guests - KCSS 91.9 Central Valley (Turlock)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - "Just Desserts" w/Mr.Goodwrench -
       10pm-2am Jungle, Detroit, Techno, Acid House, whacked-out Dub, and
       noise KFJC 89.7 - Los Altos Hills
     * Friday night - nocturnal transmissions - featuring house DJs from
       SF and around the world. mid-2am, 107.7 FM (SF)
     * Friday night - Your Mama's House w/Pete Avila - 3am-5am, 106.1
       KMEL.
     * Friday night - Moondance. Ambient; 3am-7:30am, KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday afternoon - "Bus Stop" - music and talk w/guest DJs from
       SF and beyond. 2pm-3pm. KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday night 11pm - Flux Television, Viacom Channel 53 -
       Ambient, acid jazz and house music videos & interviews. (415)
       281-3377. flux@flux.net
     * Saturday night 9pm-mid - "An Epiphany of Sound" hosted by J.C. and
       Monkeywrench KZSU 90.1 (Stanford)
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
   For a _search_ interface to the calendar, see the Late Train club
   section (http://www.hyperreal.com/zines/late/clubs/).
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Administrative Notes

   If anyone has info on any other events, send it to me! I can't
   possibly hope to get all the info every week.
   
   This info gets sent via email every Thursday. To subscribe or
   unsubscribe to the calendar mailing list, send e-mail to
   majordomo@hyperreal.com with either the line
   
   subscribe sfraves-calendar or
   unsubscribe sfraves-calendar
   
   There is also an sfraves discussion mailing list for issues related to
   clubs, parties, house and techno music, etc. To subscribe, send e-mail
   to majordomo@hyperreal.com with the line
   
   subscribe sfraves
   
   in the body of the message.
   
   
   
   
    Derek Chung - dhchung@hyperreal.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 00:56:04 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 00:56:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: michal migurski <lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: $20 parties
In-Reply-To: <v02130507adca3c80c758@[136.152.95.73]>
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In my experiance they concentrated on the music and, hence, attracted
people who understand the vibe music can make.  The more expensive 
massives - while good-attract a different vibe IMO because they are
inherently spectacles and maybe inherently alienating because of their
size. That doesn't mean they are bad but maybe massives then become
something different than a rave or maybe they to become a series of
small raves with people moving into cliques to find that bonding and
shared experiance that I have always enjoyed at smaller raves.  

Cassandra

P.S. Is anyone going to anything else other than FTT?:)

On Thu,
23 May 1996, michal migurski wrote:

> >yeah, especially when you pay $20 to get into a small place like
> >Jerrold's Deli over and over again. It's NOT worth it..
> >
> >Oh, But Harmony's party $15 was DEFINATELY worth it. hehe
> 
> $15 seems about right for a big event... I'd only pay $20 if there was
> something super-special, like a big out-of-town dj (a _good_ one), or a
> really good crowd, or a killer space or whatever (fancy lighting, free big
> pants at the door, plenty of chocolate to go around)... A lot of the $20
> house parties thrown around here just aren't worth the money IMHO.
> 
> why are the best Bay Area parties always $10 and under? =)
> 
> -m.
> 
> 
>         0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
>         |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
>         |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
>         |                                               |
>         |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
>         |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
>         |                                               |
>         |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
>         |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
>         |                                               |
>         |              Michal Migurski                  |
>         |              (408) 264-6604                   |
>         0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 00:59:54 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 00:59:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave candy
In-Reply-To: <v02140b12adca56caa841@[146.225.72.168]>
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Sour worms, sour grapefruit, sour anythind. chocolate covered espresso
beans,

and a favorite of mine-

flavored ice (usually some kind of punch freezed before)
when I am in a place I have access to keep it cold.

Cassandra

On Thu, 23 May
1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> Survey time, kidz!  Who likes what kind(s) of candy the best at parties?
> Also, I'd like to know if there is a certain time during a party when
> people are more receptive to offers of candy.  All sugar-coated responses
> are welcome :)  - E
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 01:02:14 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 01:02:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave candy
In-Reply-To: <Pine.A32.3.93.960523212640.45289A-100000@itsa.ucsf.edu>
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> I'm partial to pixie stix, myself.  

Party Trick You Never Want To Try #4820

Snorting Pixie sticks to be funny.  It HURTS :)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 01:22:15 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 01:22:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Yes, my 6 month anniversary! :)  (long!)
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I didn't include Shawna's original message becuase it is very long;
however, I think everyone should skim it becuse I think there is an
important lesson in Shawna's lovely post.  I, also, consider myself a
*new* raver though I was aware of a lot of the things like Toon Town and
Mr. Floppy's when they were going on. Other friends of mine, however, did
including my current boyfriend who at one time helped throw a rave called
Peace (by the way, did anyone ever go to it? I am just curious to see what
people's were of it ;).  He and these other friends of mind do not rave
anymor but consider that period in their lives to have been crucial in
their growth.  They are also among a group of people who give the current
scene a lot of crap for being too commercial, too plastic, etc.  And to a
certain extent those criticisms are vaild.  Those problems do exist in the
scene.  But that does not mean the scene does not have something to offer
or can not offer the same experiance to us now who will never know what it
eas like in the olden days.  I do want to venture that maybe what people
lik me and Shawna will experiance at our peaks in the scene won't be rave,

Maybe the
scene needs to change and look into different directions but the lessons
and values at the foundation are the same.  I have known many ravers from
the Bay Area scene and no matter what generation they have been from the
vast majority have been looking for the same things (whether thay knew it
or not) - Peace, Love, Unity,
Respect- many things may have changed over the years but not that cliche
(which should not be considered overused)!     
We need to remember that and respect that each of us has our own path and
our own time to experiment and find what we need.

Cassandra :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 06:26:04 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 15:20:29 +0200 (MESZ)
From: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
Subject: Re: Robert Miles and... II (fwd)
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 13:16:23 +0200 (MESZ)
From: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@bp.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
To: Sabin Cloud Macphee <cloud@cats.ucsc.edu>,
    SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Robert Miles and... II

************
this post apparently got lost on its way, so i'm sending it again.
************


 
> children is something like number 4 of the charts in germany and is played
> c o n s t a n t l y  all over the place... not that i mind...
> the video is neat, too.

after i sent this i figured that you guys over there would maybe 
appreciate some additional information on the subject 
(**don't you**???!), so here it comes.
techno or better some special branch of easily consumable techno is big in 
the german charts since about one year. 
especially something that is known as kindergarten techno never fails to 
make it at least into the top 10. it has either little underage girls 
with squeaky voices repeating some entirely stupid sentences, or  
features the voices of characters of wellknown children tv shows (to make 
it more complicated, mostly former east german ones that are 
cancelled now), like a freaky fox, a magpie and a female duck, uttering 
something that is meant all innocently but might be understood in an obscene 
way. 
yes. kindergarten techno. strange enough. this is an all german 
phenomenon, i believe.
i don't know who's responsible for the chart success of that stuff. kids 
probably.
apart from that, much pretty trancey (sp?) stuff, mostly german originated,
is around and successful. i can't say much about the music to help your 
imagination up because i'm not so first-class-beknowned in music styles, 
i mainly care wether the music is right to jump around to if i go out... 
it mostly has vocals that are drug related in some way or generally like: 
ravers of the nation, see your hands in the air, give me your hand, let's 
go to wonderful land, bla bla bla.  my impression is, that, especially 
if it comes to the aesthetics of the videos, the reality escaping aspect of 
techno and techno drugs (which is kinda strong in germany i believe) is 
particularly emphasized, not critical, but often apparently with some 
consciousness of its ambivalent quality.

so, you see, techno is quite mainstream over here. of course, our 
very own and beloved ** s c e n e ** always attempts to dissolve 
itself from the mainstream,which is pathetic on the one hand, but the source 
of innovation and development on the other. 
but, generally and alltogether, everybody is quite at ease with that fact.
however it wouldn't help much to complain.
ok. i hope, you don't find this too perverted and your world view feels 
broadened now.
i understand that the experience of techno becoming bigtime mainstream is 
new and maybe somewhat scary for you, but yuck and yikes don't help much. 
you gotta arrange with it.
have a nice day everybody. 
ulrike
 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 08:06:39 1996
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To: nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Nancy)
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: Capitalist Mentality and the Death of Alternative Community
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Folks, it's all about spaces.   Property for sale to the highest bidder,
>and what that tells us about our society.    This is not "Ethan vs. Tom &
>Stacy", but what this argument represents -- the vitality of underground
>parties vs. the dominance of commercial raves.  

Once again I don't see this as a US vs. Them but a question of personal
preference and human nature.  MOST of what you would call commercial
raves started as undergrounds, Wicked, Funky Techno, The Gathering, etc.
The promoters of these well known parties used various devices in the
past to obtain venues. The DRIVING factor in all of these parties is that
all of these groups are doing this as a primary means of revenue for the
individuals involved, i.e. they are not students, don't have compuer industry
jobs, or trust funds.  Many of them have been doing this for 4 or 5 years,
after a while, guess what? Life is pretty different at 25 then it was at 20!
(even more different at 30 then it is at 25!).  Where as before if your party
got busted, you might not make the rent on your flat and have to move in with
your mate, now if your party gets busted, your 3 year-old's play-school may
not get paid, people who were just partiers or Djs or promoters before are
parents now, they are starting families (or have some in full bloom :) Many of
them are not willing to take the risk when it comes to the little-ones future.
Remember, many of these parties are still going on because there is a market
for what is being offered and the promoters more or less deliver consistantly.
For this type of rock solid consistancy you need a reliable venue(s).


>Some of us love the coming
>together of friends in an UG; some of us love the world-class dj's and
>production of a CR.   Babies or massives, it's all good!!  But
>unfortunately, the fact is that commercialism has the nasty effect of
>crushing the underground. Since no UG promoters own a fabulous space, they
>must locate one from a third party, who's most interested in PROFIT.  When
>a higher-end promoter comes along and offers a king's ransom for a space,
>that space is forever priced out of UG range.  Another space lost.

I have to disagree here, 5 years ago when ALL raves were pretty much
underground,
a space was as good as the unbusted party that was just held there.  Most
promoters considered it a success if the party went unbusted and they were
able to get their equipment out and at least break even.  Props were given
to the promoter for being the "first" (see jsl's definition of first)
to use the space, part of the thrill (that is totally absent now) is knowing
that
a party was about to happen and not knowing where it was going to be, not
knowing _anything_ but a mappoint when you call the voice-mail, packing you
backpack and being ready to party _anyplace_ from an abandonded warehouse,
to a beach, to a deserted ice cream factory, the rush was more like "shit
this is a
deserted Nike missle base! This is an absolutely _sick_ venue!".  What has 
happened is not commercialism but the UG's loss of daring.  Not to many people
(or party goers willing to risk getting arrested just to catch a groove anymore)


>
>Commercial parties are fine, but not when their method of business
>eliminates the possibility of any OTHER kind of party.  Why did Chrysalis
>fall through for this weekend - leaving us with only FTT?  Why hasn't there
>been a Friends & Family in almost a year? Why are there so few
>undergrounds, but a plethora of massives on any given week-end?? Spaces,
>SPACES - it's all about the AFFORDABILITY of spaces. 

No, It'a all about the avialbility of Space and how much your willing to
risk in using one that you found. If you have a set of bolt-cutters, you'll
be amazed at how much space is available :) But consider, all venues have
their price, the promoter has to ask him/her-self, is s/he willing to pay?
If you have a break in and your party goes unmolested (some of you may remember
the ledgendary Equinox parties) then you get the venue for free, if you get
busted, well you may have to pay for bail, lawyers and a new sound system :)

Just how dedicated to the UG are you? :)


>This is, however, the mechanics of capitalism.  Charging what the market
>will bear, pricing everyone's services - as Mike pointed out, "consumers"
>not friends.  The ideal values of the UG -- donation of time and effort,
>respect and trust of friends, collectives working together selflessly to
>create something better for the whole -- cannot survive in an environment
>dominated by an economic mentality.   The only way an alternative community
>such as this CAN flourish is if it has its own protected space, apart from
>the dominant values of the mainstream.


As Hakim Bey has pointed out in TAZ, protected space is more or less impossible.
You may have a utopia for a period of time but sooner or later "external or
internal forces" will form to implode on it. One strategy is to realize this
and to plan for ultimate demise, i.e. constantly look for new venues, spaces,
area where your ideals can florish, this takes time, agility and commitment.

  
> In a society where greatest price
>wins, the value of community will always lose, at least as far as the owner
>of a potential space is concerned.   Since UG's are forced to compete with
>richer contenders for spaces -- the fundamental necessity for even HAVING a
>party -- well, we can see the result.  Which value will prevail in a
>society BASED on economic values?  Just count the number of undergrounds
>compared to the money-making raves.

As far as i know ther are at least two Underground parties scheduled for this
weekend (I'm sure there are other that i don't know about yet).  Rest assured
that id indeed the party is underground, it will most-likely not be listed
on SFRAVEs (wich is pretty much above ground these days )

>
>So our experiment of creating community apart from capitalist values may be
>doomed.  I guess the UG has to move even further out of commercialized
>arenas, back to beaches (Sunsets) and the forest (Tribal Future) and the
>Desert (Dune) - though even there we are still within reach of permit
>hassles, police, and vagaries of the weather.  Just think about it, people
>-- the dominance of economic rationality (evaluating everything by its
>monetary value) is SO pervasive that it is almost impossible for us to
>create a community that celebrates something different.  Something more
>human, life-affirming.  More loving.  The mainstream capitalist society
>forces us to play by their rules, and either become like them (commercial
>raves), or lose.

There is a third alternative but it take courage, you can make them irrelevant.
Throwing a successful underground party is about rising ABOVE all of these
things, that's what makes them, the people who throw them and the people who
go to them special.  You dance differently when the cops are putting on riot
gear and bringing out Dogs. You spin differently when your in an abandon
warehouse and the crowd is "going off" and the police are at the door and your
an illegal alien.  Maybe these times are gone for good, maybe it's a good thing
that they are, I don't know, but I do know that when you share events like these
with people over the years, it bonds you in a very different way then a hit
of e, or liking the same type of music, or even the same DJ's. In order to
have these kinds of parties it takes trust, the crowd has to trust the promoter
that they are dedicated to delivering the Music NO MATTER WHAT! The promoter
has to trust that the party goers will stick by them and not desert at the
first flash of a blue light (ther is safety and power in numbers :). How much is
charged at the door is totally irrelevant when you have this level of trust.
The party goers trust that the promoter will use the money wisely to throw
more killer parties and not to just pocket it and live fat), the promoter
trust the party goers to attend, police themselves and the general area and
not to bring about problems or have the maturity t realize that the goal is
to not draw any unnecessary attention.


>
>I think raves are three things - the music, the people, and the feeling.
>That incredible feeling springs, for me, from the emancipation of finding a
>public place NOT based on an economic mentality.  How amazing that is for
>us all!  How unusual!  But the music and the physical exterior of the rave
>were marketable - so, naturally (following capitalist logic) these were
>elevated to become the characteristics of  commercial "raves."  The
>unmarketable aspects are what were left behind in the UG.  You can't sell
>it, but precisely because it is not sellable means its extinction.  Under
>mainstream economic rationality, those things without a price are useless.
>If it can't be traded for money, what good is it?  Because money is the
>ultimate value.

No they are not useless, and in-fact they still exist ( but the Underground
today is smaller and deeper and less accessible then 4 years ago).  You may
have to look deeper than the parties that you know about (i.e. mentioned)

>
>The loss of this particular space is merely a symptom of a much-larger
>socio-political phenomenon, bigger than Ethan or T/S.  I fully support and
>love the concept behind the undergrounds.   It's just that with every lost
>space, I grow increasingly pessimistic of its possibility.
>Capitalism/Modernity/Industrialization has been an unbelievably powerful
>force, trampling over other cultures and ideas all over the globe.  Today
>we see a global hierarchy with the West firmly on top, and most of the
>world suffering - cultures which were thriving before the imperialism of
>the West.  Can alternative values grow right here in the heart of
>Capitalist Mentality?  When even to question our national dogma is to be
>labeled a commie, or backward, or a hippie (or a raver? :) ?  Or will the
>might of economic rationality crush our experiment?

Or will our experiment just be incorporated into the machinery (more likely)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 08:34:30 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 08:34:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
cc: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave candy
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heh i know someone who snorted lemonade powder ..... oops. :)

k

On Fri, 24 May 1996, John Deatherage wrote:

> > I'm partial to pixie stix, myself.  
> 
> Party Trick You Never Want To Try #4820
> 
> Snorting Pixie sticks to be funny.  It HURTS :)
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 08:37:00 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: BSP RE: at RAW Foods (Free)
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RE: will be providing free live ambient/idm music for your pre-rave
listening pleasure at RAW Living Foods tonight from about 7:30 - 10:30 pm.
Location:

RAW Living Foods
1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln
San Francisco

We will have about 12-15 copies of our demo for anyone wanting one.  They're
free, but we never refuse a donation :)

Rick



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 09:05:49 1996
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From: The.Finn@bbs.urbanite.com
Message-Id: <199605241605.JAA27395@taz.hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: 24 May 1996 09:06:54 PST
Subject: ORGANIC '96-THE  QUESTIONS
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After looking through the post about organic there seem to be a couple
of funny things.

1: Someone said that underworld were booked in Lisbon that weekend, can anyone
confirm this.

2: Is it really going to be up here as well, if so is there any info around
for it, and will all the groups be playing up here. And where can we
get tix.

3: I didn't see Leftfield mentioned, have they flaked?

Can anyone answer these?

I'd love to go, and would prefer not to have to go all the way down
south for it, but I will if it has to be. In which case we should sort
out something about car pooling, it would make the journey less boring
and cheaper!!!

Later

Stephen

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 09:15:10 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 09:14:52 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us (Melissa Woodrow)
Subject: Re: NO New virus (NRR)
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>Blow it off, folks... this has been going around for over a year now.  It   
>doesn't exist.  It's a hoax.

yes, i too have seen this message before on a couple of occasions.
BUT....as our network manager said to me, 'yeah, probably not a real thing,
on the off chance that it IS, keep your eyes peeled....'  hey, if i have to
waste some small part of my brain devoting some time to looking for this
(which is probably the intent of this thing anyway), small price to pay if
it does (some day) turn out to be true.

>
>Thanks for the thought, though, Matt!

second that!

peace 
melis



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 09:43:19 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 12:42:42 -0400
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Open Space Tonight
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Any space children out there going?

Donald Glaude 
DJ Dan
A-1 (Dallas)
Radley
Graeme
Cesar
415-273-1622

See you....... :)
-Rebecca

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 10:17:52 1996
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From: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
Message-Id: <199605241714.KAA13652@alumnae.caltech.edu>
Subject: Re: Yes, my 6 month anniversary! :)  (long!)
To: shawna-@ix.netcom.com (hey, where am I?)
Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 10:14:40 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.16.19960523041504.388f73d4@popd.ix.netcom.com> from "hey, where am I?" at May 23, 96 10:42:19 pm
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> Ok, now that Reagan has sufficiently embarrassed me in front of the whole
> class, might as well make a 
> speech! ;)
> 
> *warning! possible spiritual subject matter ahead! Read at your own risk!*
> (seriously, if you are bothered by this kind of thing, then stop here! :)

Wow.  What can I add to that?  As many of us do, I read my e-mail
first thing upon coming to work, and I can't tell you how amazing
a difference it makes to begin a day by reading something like
that!

I think this really clarifies to me what I, personally, get out
of this SFR community of ours.

First of all, there's the reason I signed up: to get info on parties, when
they are, what's good, etc.

But increasingly, the reason why I stay subscribed to this
monstrous beast of an e-mail generator is the existence of
posts like this one, which give me much needed boosts of inspiration
randomly interspersed throughout the week.  Despite all of the
complaints of negativity that have popped up recently, I personally
still feel that the positivity and love that exists on this list
is overwhelming!

So promoter flamewars, earthquake reports, I love it all, but if we
ever ban posts like this I'm LEAVIN!  :)

Props to Shawna, BEAUTIFUL!  My only complaint is that it came on
a Friday instead of a Monday ;)


                Smiles,
                        Chin

P.S. Happy 6-month anniversary, it's my 6-month too!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 10:20:32 1996
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From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: nrr, but help me anyway!
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hello all-

i'm in a moral dillema.  i work at st. ignatius church as a musician.  i'm
good friends with the music director and with the assistant music director,
as both of them have educated me in the ways of music and liturgy.  the
assistant director, though, is more of a personal friend.

the music director has decided to fire the assistant music director and has
asked me to replace him.  i can't decide if i should take the job and try to
work out things between be and my friend (the assistant music director) or
refuse the jub on moral grounds.

i'm caught in the middle of 2 factors: a good friend, and a job as choir
director that i have wanted for years.

HELP!!!!!  I NEED INPUT!  I'M LOST!!!!!

peace, love, and thanks-

matt l
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 10:43:05 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 96 10:43 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: nrr, but help me anyway!
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> hello all-
> 
> i'm in a moral dillema.  i work at st. ignatius church as a musician.  i'm
> good friends with the music director and with the assistant music director,
> as both of them have educated me in the ways of music and liturgy.  the
> assistant director, though, is more of a personal friend.
> 
> the music director has decided to fire the assistant music director and has
> asked me to replace him.  i can't decide if i should take the job and try to
> work out things between be and my friend (the assistant music director) or
> refuse the jub on moral grounds.

Well....did the director fire the assistant just so you could replace him?
OR did he get fired and you just happen to be next inline for the job?

If its the first...well...then I might question it.
If its the latter...well...what moral problems are there?
You didnt get him fired.  (or did you?   ;)
Take the job.












                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 10:50:23 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 10:48:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Some CD Reviews (NRR)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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V/A, "WALL OF PUSSY," (Wall of Sound/Pussyfoot):  9/10
_Quality_ downtempo grooves.  Lush, funky, and occasionally 
quite beautiful.  Twelve artists featured on this 70+ 
minute cd.  Import, twenty dollars.    

JEDI KNIGHTS (aka Global Communications) "New School Science" 
(Evolution):  7/10.  Star Wars meets Breakdancin'.  A little 
inconsistent.  Import, 70+ minutes, $18.  

V/A, "EARTHRISE 2" (Ninja Tune):  7/10
Another vehicle for promoting the entire Ninja stable and their 
mother.  2-CD's, $15.    

V/A, "FLEXISTENTIALISM -- The Joy of Dex" (Ninja Tune):  7/10
Read previous.  10 of the tracks on this double-cd overlap with those 
found on Earthrise 2.  No need to get both.  Get Earthrise if you'd like 
a few more spacey experimental tracks, Flexistentialism if you'd like a 
little jungle thrown in.  $15+.    

I think I may need a break from Ninja Tune.  Keep your eye 
out for releases on Wall of Sound -- they got it goin' on.     

Share Music.  Rok.     


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 11:18:35 1996
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From: Begroovy@aol.com
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 14:18:03 -0400
Message-ID: <960524141801_120353202@emout16.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Respect, capitalism, and where are we going?
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I am going to relay my own personal views and explanations to the events and
discussions of the past week or so? The first thing is respect. We try to
worship it, but we get carried away and loose grasp of it. There are alot of
people in this world out to make a buck. These people are also idolized in
the western culture, that we happen to be stuck in the middle of. Bill Gates,
Magic Johnson, Mick Jagger, Donald Trump......There are also alot of people
in our world that are not out to make a buck.These people are also idiolized
in western culture. Martin Luther King, Ghandi, Yogananda, Christ,
Mohammed.......(If someone could explain to me why I chose live examples of
one and dead examples for the other ???) Now the point I am trying to get at
is that PLUR does not just pertain to like minded individuals (ravers,
nazi's, christians, deadheads, hindi's.........). We have to understand that
we are spinning on this not so round ball through the universe. On this ball
are billions of not like minded individuals. We have two choices: a) fight
everyone; b) respect everyone's individuality.Maybe three all of the above?
Now the point at hand is repect. And the question at hand is support. Now if
Nomad's individual choice is to make lots o' cash and you personally don't
believe in this type of endeaver, then your peaceful choice is to  respect
there goal and support someone who's endeavers are less monitarilly inclined.
Fighting them is not going to change there economic goals, it is more likely
to cause them to retaliate and try to put down SFR. Now as far as Ethan goes,
I think his energy would be better used to start work on the next F&F, MAD...
and put down the arms. Ethan will gain more support from me as a party
organizer and DJ than a warrior. But that is his choice and what I can do is
respect that choice. Now to elaborate on Geoff's point about the status of
the underground. The rave situation has definately evolved out of the
underground. Look at the party listed yesterday "Organic '96" (I see trouble
brewing just in the name for starters). The performance lineup is incredible,
and a high price to fly all of these cats out here is justifiable. Now the
promoter has pulled a major boner in my opinion by stating: a) no liquids!!!,
b) no ins and outs, c) bring every thing you'll need for 12+ hours of
partying at once?? This is a very contradictory thing to me. In 12 hours
especially outside in the sun, I assume I will need approximately a gallon of
water?? I can't bring it in? Then I will have to purchase it there at $$$$
per half liter?? What is this promoters motive? He is concerned about high
quality performers but the question of high quality comforts for party goers
is up in the air? Back to Geoff and the Wicked thang. Wicked definately
started in the underground. The biggest vibe of concern I feel from Wicked is
the music. These cats want to rip it up with that mind blowing sound system.
They are also top ass DJ's they know the tunes and they know how to melt you
down with the music. All support for the wicked crew (soundcrew, DJ's etc.).
Now as far as venues go. I respect King Street's right to run there club and
treat there patrons and choose who they want in their club, any way they
want. But I do not support that venue in any way shape or form. I actually
recently went back to King Street out of respect for a great friend. He had
personally expressed a great interest in supporting an old friend that was
playing that particular Wicked. I went and repected King Street's dress code,
drug code and other various technicalities that are a part of their trip. Now
as far as Wicked and others, economic stability and state of the underground.
Economic stability and the state of status quo tends to not support change. I
came into this scene because I had outgrown the status quo in the dead scene
that was a great part of my life prior to this. It had become crusty and old
and was rehashing the past. The dead have a much larger family than wicked
and they were touring and playing to keep their economic ship of fools
afloat. The economic stability issue started to show in their performance and
choices of venues. In my opinion and from qoutes from the band, it became
apparent that they were not playing for the love of music but for the need of
economic support. This is what brought me into this scene. The love of music,
dance, and last but not least unbridled hedonism. I hope Wicked doesn't fall
into this need for economic support, but from Geoff's opinion which I respect
because he is close to the source this same thing seems to be happening. I am
curious where it'll all go from here?? Have a great day, PEACE! Cid         

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 11:30:26 1996
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From: Thomas Schwarz <tschwarz@scudc.scu.edu>
Subject: I'm new in the Bay Area
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 11:27:28 -0700 (PDT)
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I moved from Germany to San Jose about 3 months ago..
I'm 26 and go frequently to raves since 3 years.
Most of the people I met here till now are not into our music & parties.
However, I don't like to go alone to parties. 
There's lots of stuff going on this weekend, would be a good chance
to meet some sfravers from the mailing list..
If anybody would like to go with me and introduce me to other sfravers,
send email (I'll check my emails till 6pm today) or call me at home
and leave a message. It's (408) 246-2968 and I should be at home after 9pm.


Love&Peace,

Thomas

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thomas Schwarz                           email: tschwarz@sunrise.scu.edu

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 11:51:40 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Sunset this Sunday?
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Does anyone know if there's a Sunset planned for this Sunday?  I lost the
info# AGAIN, so I, too, am lost.  Please help!  Thanks :)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 12:12:42 1996
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Subject: Got the Sunset info
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Thanks all, I got the info.  Sunset is scheduled to go off!  They say to
spread the word that they don't want any "balloon action" out there, and
will shut down if they see it happening.  Sounds good to me!  See y'all
there :)

Love,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 12:13:45 1996
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To: epaul@synopsys.com (Eric P. Peterson)
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave candy 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 23 May 1996 17:58:48 PDT."
             <v02140b12adca56caa841@[146.225.72.168]> 
Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 11:45:25 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
> Survey time, kidz!  Who likes what kind(s) of candy the best at parties?
> Also, I'd like to know if there is a certain time during a party when
> people are more receptive to offers of candy.  All sugar-coated responses
> are welcome :)  - E

Apple Jolly Ranchers -- exquisite mix of citric acid and sugar.
Altoids -- "curiously strong"
Chocolate peppermints -- I especially like that the coat checker at
	the King Street Garage sells them, so you don't get that
	melted glop in your bag.
Gum of various sorts -- I brought some Stimerol (minty and licorice
	flavored) to a rave once, and it created quite a sensation.
	I also love clove gum as well, but it's hard to find!

As far as times are concerned, I'd say around 2-4am is the time I'm
most into having something in my mouth whilest I rave. It does depend
on my time of arrival, of course.

-G-

P.S. Spundae it is! I'll be wearing a laminate, and a multicolored
maroon, gold, and blue shirt that has a batik look to it. See you
there!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 12:13:57 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 12:13:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Idleness on Saturday?
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Anyone up for some aimless wandering around the city during the day on
Saturday?

) paul (


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 12:37:03 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 12:36:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Open Space Tonight
To: Thnkblnd@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <960524120939_541950003@emout14.mail.aol.com>
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On Fri, 24 May 1996 Thnkblnd@aol.com wrote:

> Any space children out there going?
> 
> Donald Glaude 
> DJ Dan
> A-1 (Dallas)
> Radley
> Graeme
> Cesar
> 415-273-1622
> 
> See you....... :)
> -Rebecca
> 
  YEssssss!  Madame Mercury and Liquid are going (both will be in black 
and white and Liquid will have shorts on with refelctive stripes and I 
will have jeans on w/ my long brown hair tied up) come say hi.

RaVe On!

      ___                ___           ___     
     /\__\              /\__\         /\  \    
    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
   /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
  /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
 /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
 \/__/~~/:/  /      \/__\:\/:/  / \:\  /\ \/__/
       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    











    







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 13:02:12 1996
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From: Jondabomb@aol.com
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 16:01:32 -0400
Message-ID: <960524160131_120422660@emout19.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Nexus(free Party)
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All right folks, let's end this $20.00 debate stuff. First of all I am kinda
promoting but only because this party isn't about money. Jeff, who does
Nexus/second Chakra is throwing a free outdoor party tommorow in Peoples Park
in Berkeley. Dj's Carlos, Tony, Donald Glaude and Dreamer. I just got off the
phone with Jeff and all he kept saying was, he is tired of this,People paying
all their cash to get into some party at the same location with $2.00 water,
no bringing in your own water bottles and all that other BS. I wish everyone
could talk to him( Tommorow you can) he puts so much energy and love into his
parties, and he isn't doing it for the money. Alright, I can be talking
bullshit and everyone is going to flame me, or you can go to the party
tommorow and talk to Jeff yourself...and see what really is up!:)

5/25/96 Peoples Park Berkeley
Dj's Carlos, Dreamer, Tony, and Donald Glaude
Free, Noon, all ages
Please bring food for barbecue, clothes for the needy and canned food
Water guns, baloons, and anything else to beat the heat. 
And CANDY!!!!!!
Feel the love
Jonathan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 13:09:40 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 13:09:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: BSP free outdoor party sunday nite:)
To: Happy Ravers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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sunday nite looks like a good nite to get together and have some fun!
with djs jon carel, le le, dan barnes, and tom. hopefully we can 
gather some of our positive energy, as a lot of unfortunate things have 
been happening lately that have made it hard to do so. also this 
is le le's second to last weekend in the bay area, so we'll be saying a 
friendly good bie to him as well.

keep your heads up,
tom


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 13:11:05 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: X-CYT-ment!
Date: 24 May 1996 20:57:09 GMT
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Organization: Computer Attic
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Well well well... 

It looks like fun and eXXXcitement this weekend!!!

Two Beach Parties.  Three nights of event (and thats not to mention the
undergrounds and renegades)... 

Soooo wherever you and your's may take you....

Have a GREAT memorial day weekend.

(For thoses that know me, See you in The Void....)



"Dance with Me...."

  -Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 13:15:37 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 13:15:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: forgot Vmail # - sunday nite free party
To: Happy Ravers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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our number is 415.525.5o52 - sorry 'bout that.

energy,
tom

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 13:21:26 1996
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Date: 24 May 96 16:18:17 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Love to ALL the SFRavers
Message-ID: <960524201817_71165.755_GHL111-1@CompuServe.COM>
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Chin responded to Shawna's wonderful post with ....

.... increasingly, the reason why I stay subscribed to this
monstrous beast of an e-mail generator is the existence of
posts like this one, which give me much needed boosts of inspiration
randomly interspersed throughout the week.  Despite all of the
complaints of negativity that have popped up recently, I personally
still feel that the positivity and love that exists on this list
is overwhelming!.....

======================

I totally agree -- I often save the most inspirational of messages, like when
Tim (knucklehead) had a transformational experience at Madness, or Jess was on
the ceiling after Beaufiful People... and sometimes I print them out to share
with my friends who aren't on SFR ... so they can understand why I get so much
out of it....

Share that happiness! It changes people's lives ... 

yep, I know cuz I used to be a psychopathic bitch!  hehe  ; )  ...

Much love to everyone on this beautiful weekend and   :::hugs::::  (and wishes
that we get to experience Chin's fuzzy white glove again soon!)


Leslie   : )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 13:59:43 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 13:59:22 -0800
To: Jondabomb@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: Nexus(free Party)
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At 4:01 PM  -0400 5/24/96, Jondabomb@aol.com wrote:

>5/25/96 Peoples Park Berkeley
>Dj's Carlos, Dreamer, Tony, and Donald Glaude
      ^^^^^^

Seems that Carlos is booked in two places at once:

Saturday, May 25th - Free Triball Beach Party
Carlos, Tracy, Harry Who?, Mei-Lwun, Eric, Spire, Chris, Rob.
^^^^^^
noon-9pm, All ages, Free. santa cruz?. 408.427.5688

Different Carlos'?  Maybe he'll shoot from one to the other, which is
entirely possible.

Tone



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 14:03:47 1996
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From: jen@hotwired.com
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 14:08:31 -0800
To: Begroovy@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Respect, capitalism, and where are we going?
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The performance lineup is incredible,
>and a high price to fly all of these cats out here is justifiable. Now the
>promoter has pulled a major boner in my opinion by stating: a) no liquids!!!,
>b) no ins and outs, c) bring every thing you'll need for 12+ hours of
>partying at once?? This is a very contradictory thing to me. In 12 hours
>especially outside in the sun, I assume I will need approximately a gallon of
>water?? I can't bring it in? Then I will have to purchase it there at $$$$
>per half liter?? What is this promoters motive? He is concerned about high
>quality performers but the question of high quality comforts for party goers
>is up in the air?

Well now, it's not completely fair to blame the promoter for this.  It
could very well be that the owner/keeper of the space is insisting on no
liquids brought to the event.  This could be for a variety of reasons but
the most common ones I have encountered are 1. they want to run their own
water concession (read: money) (they can even make this a requirement to
renting the space, he who has the space makes the rules), 2. for security
reasons (read: drugs in bottles) and 3. garbage - if they provide the
drinks they can ensure no broken glass is going to end up lying on the
ground for someone to step on.  When you go to a movie or concert usually
bringing your own food and drink is not allowed.  An event this size is no
underground party so the rules will be different but placing the blame
solely on the promoter is wrong.  Yes, I'm sure there is more that can be
done to fix this common problem and I'd rather see free water everywhere
but until the rest of the world catches up we have to make do.  One thing I
would commend this promoter for is making the situation known in advance
rather than surprising us the day of.

thrivin' lika weed...... jen




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 14:11:47 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 14:11:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: way to go Pacific!
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I'm pleased and proud that Pacific is making an effort to suppress the
presence of nitrous at parties.  

It's that kind of crap that the woefully misinformed media can
easily use to discredit our scene (and that the police can use to bust
otherwise decent parties). 

Respect and discretion are two very important components for the continued
health of this scene, and nitrous (IMO) does not jive with either of them. 


		happy friday!


		jon


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 14:30:46 1996
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Message-ID: <01BB497D.827891E0@n155.solano.community.net>
From: b e n   c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
To: "'Melissa Woodrow'" <melissaw@sugen.sf.ca.us>
Cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: the real virus (was RE: NO New virus (NRR) )
Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 14:30:07 -0700
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On Friday, May 24, 1996 10:14 AM, Melissa Woodrow wrote:
>>Blow it off, folks... this has been going around for over a year now.  =
It  =20
>>doesn't exist.  It's a hoax.
>
>yes, i too have seen this message before on a couple of occasions.
>BUT....as our network manager said to me, 'yeah, probably not a real =
thing,
>on the off chance that it IS, keep your eyes peeled....'  hey, if i =
have to
>waste some small part of my brain devoting some time to looking for =
this
>(which is probably the intent of this thing anyway), small price to pay =
if
>it does (some day) turn out to be true.

I think you're getting closer... ;)  the Good Times Virus does exist, =
it's just, instead of infecting computers, it infects our collective =
conciousnesses.


b e n   c h u n

ben_chun@community.net
http://community.net/~ben_chun/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 14:32:26 1996
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From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Thnkblnd@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Open Space Tonight
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I'll be there to see DJ Dan and A-1 :)  I'll be wearing a shiny silver 
jacket, looking like a penny raver :)


> Any space children out there going?
> 
> A-1 (Dallas)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 15:24:53 1996
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Subject: TONITE!! - Robert Rich Sleep Concert on KUCI 88.9fm
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, ambient@hyperreal.com, socal-raves@ucsd.edu
Date: Fri, 24 May 96 15:24:46 PDT
From: DWATANAB@UCI.EDU (Dana Watanabe)
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LOG IN.  HOOK UP.  GO TO SLEEP.

Just a reminder:

Robert Rich live on KUCI 88.9 FM in Irvine  11 PM PDT to 8 AM PDT TONITE!

If you aren't in the broadcast area.  There will be RealAudio
and CUSeeMe connections.  For more info on that, check out:

http://www.kuci.uci.edu/

Dan Bremmer said:
> 
> Here is some more specific information regarding The upcoming Robert Rich 
> Sleep Concert this friday, May 24th from 11pm until Saturday, May 25th at 
> 8am on kuci 88.9fm.
> 
> Kuci is a student and 
> volunteer run non-profit public radio station broadcasting at 200 watts 
> out of the University of California, Irvine. We reach the greater Orange 
> County area.
> 
> We should have a RealAudio broadcast as well. Check out KUCI's web site 
> at HTTP://www.kuci.uci.edu later in the week for details. We suggest you 
> set everything up previous to the broadcast at HTTP://www.RealAudio.com.
> 
> If you have any questions Email me at 9-5Superspy@kuci.org.
> 
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> 
> The idea behind a sleep concert is to immerse yourself into the world of
> pure sound, a continually shifting slow-motion acoustic environment, to
> remove the perceptual walls of a room and transport you into a deep
> surreal landscape. 
> 
> Robert Rich's original sleep concerts took place with a live audience, so
> the acoustics of the room could be carefully controlled. Since Robert will
> perform this concert on the radio, each listener will  control his or her
> own sound environment.  To best experience the sleep concert, you should
> pay attention to the setup of your radio. First, make sure your tuner is
> picking up the station in stereo. If you have four speakers, try putting
> one in each corner of the room, with your head in the middle. Set the
> volume lower than usual, so the sound blends in with the background.
> Headphones might work for you as well, but it may be harder to sleep with
> them, and they may fall off during the night.
> 
> The first hour or two will be slightly more active than the rest, but soon
> the music will drop away into slow foggy textures and strange ambient
> sounds. At low volumes, these textures can blend into your acoustic
> environment, creating a sort of sonic dislocation, a re-focusing of your
> perceptions. 
> 
> You can use the sound texture as a way to focus your attention onto images
> that arise out of your half-sleeping mind. In the transitions between
> sleep and wake, hypnogogic images may become intensified and more vivid.
> You may also become more aware of dreams, and you can observe the
> different layers of perception as you teeter on the edge of consciousness.
> 
> The sleep concert will last from 11:00 PM Friday night until 8:00 AM
> Saturday morning, then we will resume our normal broadcast schedule.
> 


 ,
dana

"They are more like actors on the movie screen.  They play roles.
And their leaders... They are not chosen for virtue, but for their 
skill at playing roles.  They do not trust their leaders, 
and yet they follow them."

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 15:37:12 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 96 15:41:03 PST
From: "Renzo Saunders" <saunderr@NGC.COM>
Encoding: 29 Text
Message-Id: <9604248329.AA832977835@smtplink.NGC.Com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Smarties on Gerrold Ave. last weekend.
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     Hello everybody,
        Hope you all are doing great. I have followed this mailing list off 
     and on for a while but have never actually posted anyting. The reason 
     I have decided to speak up is because last friday I had my car 
     vandalized and burglarized while I was at Smarties. This location has 
     been used frequently in the past two months and I have never had any 
     problems with anybody there. But last friday when I went out to my car 
     it was fucking thrashed! My car was the only car that I saw that had 
     been broken in to. Has anybody else had any problems at this location? 
     
        I would hope that this was just a random break-in but if someone 
     was looking to steal stereos I would think that other cars would have 
     been burglarized as well. Not only did they take about $1000. worth of 
     stereo equipment, they destroyed my back seats and trunk, which they 
     didn't have to do to get to the stereo and speakers. 
     
        I'm sorry if this is off topic for this mailing list. I am just 
     wondering if anybody else has had similar problems. I am beginning to 
     think that maybe someone was plotting on me in particular. I would 
     like to be able to go out and not have to worry about being robbed. I 
     can go to City Night or DV8's for that. Thanks for your time and\or 
     comments. Peace......
     
     P.S. Know anybody trying to sell an Alpine deck or Rockford Fosgate 
     Amp? There MINE! :)
     
     'Ol BiZZO
     
     renzo@ngc.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 16:08:12 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 16:07:48 +0200
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: Re: $20 parties
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John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>wrote:
>for having a small playlist, and it all gets old really fast.  Even the
>out of town DJs people bring in are usually the same ones (ie Donald
>Glaude, Barry Weaver, DJ Trance, etc).  If I was threw another party I
>would bring in *TERRY MULLAN*.... He's been around a few times in the
>past 6 months, but he's INCREDIBLE!  I guess the main reason why is these

YESSSSSS!!!!!!  I second this.  I herd him in LA the last time I was there
and he IS increadable.  His brother is great too - Christopher Lawerence.
Some one please book these guys.....


  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 16:42:57 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 16:42:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Yes, my 6 month anniversary! :)  (long!)
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Congratulations on your anniversary Shawna!

What you wrote was very powerful and moving and I wholeheartedly concur!

The most amazing thing about life for me is that it just KEEPS GETTING
BETTER :)  Hard to believe maybe, but if you think it doesn't get any
better than this, JUST WAIT!

	Love, jess


On Thu, 23 May 1996, hey, where am I? wrote:

> Ok, now that Reagan has sufficiently embarrassed me in front of the whole
> class, might as well make a 
> speech! ;)
> 
> *warning! possible spiritual subject matter ahead! Read at your own risk!*
> (seriously, if you are bothered by this kind of thing, then stop here! :)
> 
snip snip etc...
> 
> And to top it all off, I just had the best mango I've ever had in my life!
> Life just doesn't get any better than this! :)

snip snip
> 
> Love,
> Shawna
> 
> 1996 has been a great year so far!
> 
> 
> "For what shall it profit a man to gain the world but lose his lunch..."
>   
>   
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%\|/%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%      %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%  %%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%
> %%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%%  %%%%%%
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> %%%%%%%%   %%%% o %%%%%%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%%
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> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
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> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 17:01:18 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 96 16:57:17 PDT
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From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: just another day
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hello today-

just wanted to say hello.  nothing much happening.  just enjoying summer.
loving it.  hope to see you all soon.

peace, love, and raving-

matt l
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 17:08:16 1996
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To: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: $20 parties
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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cassandra,

I totally agree.

In my (limited) experience wityh massives, they just seem like big
techno-concerts. Plus they bug because the huge sound systems don't let ya
talk... maybe a BLOCKED OFF chill area would make it better? hmmm...

Small parties seem to attract a better crowd because no one expects a
little tiny party to be a "rave," so they just look out for the big flyers
with the fractals and E references on them because they fit better into
peoples' preconception of what a "rave" should be. probably fed by years of
media portrayal of bad raves... grumble grumble... fuckin' media... black
helicopters... grumble grumble... =)

-m.

>In my experiance they concentrated on the music and, hence, attracted
>people who understand the vibe music can make.  The more expensive
>massives - while good-attract a different vibe IMO because they are
>inherently spectacles and maybe inherently alienating because of their
>size. That doesn't mean they are bad but maybe massives then become
>something different than a rave or maybe they to become a series of
>small raves with people moving into cliques to find that bonding and
>shared experiance that I have always enjoyed at smaller raves.
>
>Cassandra
>
>P.S. Is anyone going to anything else other than FTT?:)


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 17:36:24 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 17:36:08 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: SFR Haiku Contest -- JBRR
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(JBRR = Just Barely Rave Related  :^)

It's that magic time.  Five o'clock, Friday, long weekend ahead.  Hard not
to be giddy.  Nice company supplied Liberty Ale in one hand, key board in
the other.  Why not devise a contest?  Hell, I got the prizes today.
(Can't tell ya what they are yet, maybe soon...:^)

Thus is born...

THE FIRST ANNUAL SFR HAIKU CONTEST!

You see, I love haiku.  So wonderfully compact and delicate, yet sturdy and
stable.  A cross between a poem and a limrick?  You all remember them
right?  Grade school english class.  Five-seven-five.  Here's an example:

"There once was a man from Nantucket..."

Oh shit!  Wait, *that's* a limrick.  ;^)

Here's a haiku:

House music is dope.
But then, so is acid trance?
Guess I love it all!

Get the idea?

Well, here's the assignment:  Please send me your top three haikus,
relating to raving, rave music, the rave scene, rave experiences, etc...
*I* will pick the winner ('Cause I got the prize ;^) and will announce the
results at our first SFR awards banquet!  Or sometime real soon.

Have a great (belated) weekend folks and be careful out there!!

Love ya!

Tone

P.S.  I have a funny yet macabre list of haikus relating to the Una bomber
(I didn't generate it).  Email if you'd like to see them.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 17:40:56 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: See ya out somewhere!
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If you're gonna party at Sunset or Santa Cruz, mebbe I'll see you there!  I
plan to go to at least one of these, and I'll have candy (thanks to all who
shared their faves), water, hugz, and other treats to share ;)
Have a blast this weekend, y'all!!!

Don't ya know there'll be dancin'...

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 18:33:19 1996
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Subject: Re: SFR Haiku Contest -- JBRR
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>THE FIRST ANNUAL SFR HAIKU CONTEST!

An empty warehouse
Silent but for the murmurs
of happy ravers.

I turn to the crowd
place the needle on the wax
and crank up the bass.

Explosion of sound
Lasers ripping the chill night;
the Dance has begun.

Circle dancers spin.
Glo-sticks flash sick green lightening;
music warping minds.

Music pounds their souls,
ripping frenzied screams from them,
releasing, freeing.

I slow the fever
I pull the music down now
to touch their faces

Fade in faster beats
Machine gun fire snare drum
Bursting with a BOOM

Pounding again now,
the people freak to my beats...
the trance rewards them.

Your skin is prickling
I'm prying open your mind
scooping up your thoughts

Machines without souls,
the turntables play the souls
cut into vinyl.

Years of poetry
become a single moment
of hedonism.

People come to me
Hugs, sweet acceptance and joy,
Smiles, stickers, candy.

I pour it all back,
weaving tunes for my family,
my beloved friends.

Time blows soft away
Sweat, water, wet vibrations
Blasting ocean beats...

The music flows on
A stream carrying the sun
Light flowing upward

The light returning
Ravers, like stars, disappear
Just a few remain.

Finally, no more
the music fades to grey dust
Clapping my payment

An empty warehouse
Silent but for the murmurs
of happy ravers.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 21:24:28 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 21:21:36 -0700
To: ctd-zine@ix.netcom.com
From: Vince <Vince@vmar.com>
Subject: Re: SFR laminates
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Hey All!
>
>In lieu the recent happenings with the SF logo thang, I
>decided to take the initiative to print up SFR laminates
>with the design I submitted.

That's the spirit !!!!!!!

That's how it should be ! I want 400 laminates, one from each person on the
list, each one sharing the beauty and individuality of each one of us !!
Now get to work everyone.

hugs

Vince




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 22:04:26 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 22:04:24 PDT
Subject: helloooooooo
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Where is everyone tonight?? Is anybody out there?
 
Tim (knucklehead)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 22:22:17 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 22:22:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Darrin Fossella <darrin@cea.edu>
To: Alan Parry <fluid@hyperreal.com>
cc: Ambient <ambient@hyperreal.com>, SEOFON <Seofon@aol.com>,
        terbo ted <shag@sirius.com>, SFraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        Ron Sansone <ronps@aol.com>, Reflective Records <reflect@sirius.com>,
        Nathan Jantz <obliq@csd.net>, ming <bluewaters@aol.com>,
        Tamara Palmer <trance@netcom.com>, Nathan Montesa <natmon@aol.com>,
        Mixmaster Morris <morris@space.demon.co.uk>,
        Matt <mbreider@bigbtu.resdata.com>,
        Astral Matrix <astral@bass-station.com>,
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Yo! Here it is - now everyone could be a star :)
the review comes from the new issue of future mag

A couple of years ago, our very own Dave Robinson asked the head of Roland
a certain Mr Kakehashi - why the hell Roland wasn't reproducing the classic=
=20
TR-808, TR-909 and TB-303 machines that were (and still are) fetching such
extortionate prices on the secondhand market. "There's surely money to be=
=20
made there," is something he tried to say before being ejected from the
building by large Japanese security guards for his impertinence.

The answer has always been that Roland would never do it due to
manufacturing costs and the lack of the original circuitry. But Dave,
bless him,must have made some kind of impression because here's the=20
Roland MC-303 Groovebox - seemingly a TB-303, TR-808 and TR-909 in a
box,with loads of other features for less than 600 quid. A Roland
climb down? The end of high prices. The answer to techno musicians'dream?

An about-face? Roland has not backed down completely. The MC-303
may have rather stunning retro looksand sounds, but it is very much a 90s'
machine with digital technology at its core and features to match, such as
an 8-track sequencer and a wealth of patterns. Analogue purists will
doubtless kick it into touch without even auditioning it. Ah, the fools -
they will miss out on one of the most creative performance tools yet
released...

The Groovebox is essentially a pattern-based instrument: press Play
and 8-part complete arrangements will kick into action. If your only
experience of patterns is the kind of Bossonova stuff found on keyboards
with speakers, you may need to unscrew your brain and flip it over because
these are patterns you will not have heard before - except down at your=20
local nose-bleed techno house.=20

There is everything from house to jungle, acid jazz to hip-hop:
120 patterns in all and 300 variations on each. Using them could not
be simpler: Press Play and use the eight buttons above the screen to
mute parts for those classic drop-outs or ecstasy-inducing builds. And,
if you so wish, you can use the black-and-white keys below to play
melodies over the top.

It is, of course, easy to drop in variations of the patterns or swap
to completely different patterns during real-time performances, but this
is using the MC-303 at its very simplest level. The really neat stuff
starts when you select parts of the accompaniments for some real-time
manipulation. For example, you all know those piercing, resonating
basslines found in so much techno music. Well, on the MC-303, it's=20
simply a matter of selecting the bass part and twirling the resonance
control. Press Record and all that twiddling of knobs will be recorded=20
to a user pattern. And it's not just the bass parts that you can apply
it to: chucking the rhythms or leads through the resonance and cutoff=20
will achieve some bizarre effects. Great results - it can be tempting to
apply this to everything and end up with all sorts of fighting squeals.
Use care: sometimes less is more.

So what of these patterns? They are all genuine reproductions of what=20
is moving and shaking the floors of clubland in many areas of techno
music (although leaning heavily to the house end of the spectrum) with
only one or two acid jazz exceptions. It's not surprising that they are
so good, though, as many of the leading DJs from around the world were
called in for their input. And you needn't worry too much about dance=20
fashions because as they change you can emulate them yourself by
creating new patterns from scratch: rhythms, leads, basslines,=20
everything in fact...

Recording the patterns together is easy, but if you want to switch
between them in real time, go to PTN Set and assign the ones you want
to each of the 16 keys. This saves you from having to dial through all
the patterns to find the ones you want next by giving you instant access
to them across the black-and-white keys.

Kickin' The MC-303 is not just an accompaniment module or sound module.
You can link it up to a sequencer in a 'normal' sound module situation,=20
but the real benefits lie in its performance capabilities. As well as
the knob-twiddling stuff described above, the black-and-white keys can=20
be used for complete 'on the fly' performances. If you enter the RPS mode
you can assign each of these 16 keys to rhythms, fills, drop ins,
effects, basslines and leads. Press one button for the rhythm, add the
bass, build those fills and stab in some effects for instant tracks.=20

The obvious use is for the DJ mixing between tracks or composing on the
move while judging crowd reaction, although with 16 sets of these sounds=20
(all user definable), careful timing and variation between patterns, it
would probably be possible to play a whole set with just the MC-303 and=20
without a single record. Another great feature is that these riffs are
also programmable, so your own compositions can be broken down and
played in real time.

The sounds that make up the patterns are excellent dance classics.
Alongside the faithful reproductions of the 909, 303 and 808, the other
sounds that make up the 448 on-board tones consist of various pads and
variations on the basslines. There are other Roland favourites like
Junos and Jupiter, as well as noises and hits. All the sounds can be
fattened up with the on-board effects processors - a surprising but
welcome feature. Most of what you get is high in quality and there is
plenty to inspire you to create your own accompaniments -an essential=20
future operation since you'll be hearing these preset on-board patterns
everywhere!

Let's get one thing straight before the inevitable concluding remarks:=20
the MC-303 is not really intended to be a straight TR-808, TR-909 and
TB-303. The controls on those machines have not all been reproduced,=20
and analogue listeners will be able to detect some differences -
digital can be too perfect, after all. Having said that, 99% of us=20
wouldn't be able to notice much of a difference if it was put up=20
against the originals in a comparison test.=20

For anyone who is fed up with sampling and wants more control but
doesn't want to pay over the odds, the MC-303 is essential. At the=20
very least you could use it as a high-quality vintage tone module,
but you'd be missing most of the point, because the MC-303 is really
an instant techno machine, and the key word is performance. One button
press will turn you into a DJ monster from resonance hell. Producing
original dance classics is also a doddle - almost too easy.=20

Rest assured, the next time Dave Robinson runs into Mr Kakehashi he has
been primed to ask about completely reworking the Jupiter 8, the SH-101,
the Juno 60...=20

Number of tones 448=20
     Drums12 sets=20
     Multitimbrality 16 parts (8 main, 8 RPS)=20
     Polyphony 28 voices=20
     Effects Reverb, delay, chorus and flange=20
     Sequencer 8 tracks, 10 songs=20
     Patterns 120 standard, 200 RPS, 50 user
     (14,000 notes), 300 variations=20
     RPS sets 30=20
     Pattern sets 20

     Cost =A3565=20
     From Roland UK, Atlantic Close,
     Swansea Enterprise Park, Swansea,=20
     West Glamorgan SA7 9FJ.=20
     Tel: 01792 702701=20

Features 100%
      Ease of Use / Setting up 90%
      Quality of results 90%
      Value for money 90%=20

      Overall rating 93%

                                       VERDICT:
                                       A dance essential.
                                       That's it!=20



     =A31,499 from Roland UK, Atlantic Close,=20
     Swansea Enterprise Park,
     Swansea,=20
     West Glamorgan SA7 9FJ. Tel: 01792 702701

     =20

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 22:26:08 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 22:25:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Darrin Fossella <darrin@cea.edu>
Subject: MC303 Review from Future Magazine
To: Alan Parry <fluid@hyperreal.com>, Ambient <ambient@hyperreal.com>,
        SEOFON <Seofon@aol.com>, terbo ted <shag@sirius.com>,
        SFraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, Ron Sansone <ronps@aol.com>,
        Reflective Records <reflect@sirius.com>, Nathan Jantz <obliq@csd.net>,
        ming <bluewaters@aol.com>, Tamara Palmer <trance@netcom.com>,
        Nathan Montesa <natmon@aol.com>,
        Mixmaster Morris <morris@space.demon.co.uk>,
        Matt <mbreider@bigbtu.resdata.com>,
        Astral Matrix <astral@bass-station.com>,
        Julian Bradley <julian@ares.csd.net>, IDM <idm@hyperreal.com>,
        Darrel Etter <darrele@netcom.com>, Dave Alex <davealex@csd.net>,
        Analogue Heaven <analogue@hyperreal.com>, AMEBA <ameba@netcom.com>
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On Fri, 24 May 1996, Darrin Fossella wrote:

> Yo! Here it is - now everyone could be a star :)
> the review comes from the new issue of future mag
>=20
> A couple of years ago, our very own Dave Robinson asked the head of Rolan=
d
> a certain Mr Kakehashi - why the hell Roland wasn't reproducing the class=
ic=20
> TR-808, TR-909 and TB-303 machines that were (and still are) fetching suc=
h
> extortionate prices on the secondhand market. "There's surely money to be=
=20
> made there," is something he tried to say before being ejected from the
> building by large Japanese security guards for his impertinence.
>=20
> The answer has always been that Roland would never do it due to
> manufacturing costs and the lack of the original circuitry. But Dave,
> bless him,must have made some kind of impression because here's the=20
> Roland MC-303 Groovebox - seemingly a TB-303, TR-808 and TR-909 in a
> box,with loads of other features for less than 600 quid. A Roland
> climb down? The end of high prices. The answer to techno musicians'dream?
>=20
> An about-face? Roland has not backed down completely. The MC-303
> may have rather stunning retro looksand sounds, but it is very much a 90s=
'
> machine with digital technology at its core and features to match, such a=
s
> an 8-track sequencer and a wealth of patterns. Analogue purists will
> doubtless kick it into touch without even auditioning it. Ah, the fools -
> they will miss out on one of the most creative performance tools yet
> released...
>=20
> The Groovebox is essentially a pattern-based instrument: press Play
> and 8-part complete arrangements will kick into action. If your only
> experience of patterns is the kind of Bossonova stuff found on keyboards
> with speakers, you may need to unscrew your brain and flip it over becaus=
e
> these are patterns you will not have heard before - except down at your=
=20
> local nose-bleed techno house.=20
>=20
> There is everything from house to jungle, acid jazz to hip-hop:
> 120 patterns in all and 300 variations on each. Using them could not
> be simpler: Press Play and use the eight buttons above the screen to
> mute parts for those classic drop-outs or ecstasy-inducing builds. And,
> if you so wish, you can use the black-and-white keys below to play
> melodies over the top.
>=20
> It is, of course, easy to drop in variations of the patterns or swap
> to completely different patterns during real-time performances, but this
> is using the MC-303 at its very simplest level. The really neat stuff
> starts when you select parts of the accompaniments for some real-time
> manipulation. For example, you all know those piercing, resonating
> basslines found in so much techno music. Well, on the MC-303, it's=20
> simply a matter of selecting the bass part and twirling the resonance
> control. Press Record and all that twiddling of knobs will be recorded=20
> to a user pattern. And it's not just the bass parts that you can apply
> it to: chucking the rhythms or leads through the resonance and cutoff=20
> will achieve some bizarre effects. Great results - it can be tempting to
> apply this to everything and end up with all sorts of fighting squeals.
> Use care: sometimes less is more.
>=20
> So what of these patterns? They are all genuine reproductions of what=20
> is moving and shaking the floors of clubland in many areas of techno
> music (although leaning heavily to the house end of the spectrum) with
> only one or two acid jazz exceptions. It's not surprising that they are
> so good, though, as many of the leading DJs from around the world were
> called in for their input. And you needn't worry too much about dance=20
> fashions because as they change you can emulate them yourself by
> creating new patterns from scratch: rhythms, leads, basslines,=20
> everything in fact...
>=20
> Recording the patterns together is easy, but if you want to switch
> between them in real time, go to PTN Set and assign the ones you want
> to each of the 16 keys. This saves you from having to dial through all
> the patterns to find the ones you want next by giving you instant access
> to them across the black-and-white keys.
>=20
> Kickin' The MC-303 is not just an accompaniment module or sound module.
> You can link it up to a sequencer in a 'normal' sound module situation,=
=20
> but the real benefits lie in its performance capabilities. As well as
> the knob-twiddling stuff described above, the black-and-white keys can=20
> be used for complete 'on the fly' performances. If you enter the RPS mode
> you can assign each of these 16 keys to rhythms, fills, drop ins,
> effects, basslines and leads. Press one button for the rhythm, add the
> bass, build those fills and stab in some effects for instant tracks.=20
>=20
> The obvious use is for the DJ mixing between tracks or composing on the
> move while judging crowd reaction, although with 16 sets of these sounds=
=20
> (all user definable), careful timing and variation between patterns, it
> would probably be possible to play a whole set with just the MC-303 and=
=20
> without a single record. Another great feature is that these riffs are
> also programmable, so your own compositions can be broken down and
> played in real time.
>=20
> The sounds that make up the patterns are excellent dance classics.
> Alongside the faithful reproductions of the 909, 303 and 808, the other
> sounds that make up the 448 on-board tones consist of various pads and
> variations on the basslines. There are other Roland favourites like
> Junos and Jupiter, as well as noises and hits. All the sounds can be
> fattened up with the on-board effects processors - a surprising but
> welcome feature. Most of what you get is high in quality and there is
> plenty to inspire you to create your own accompaniments -an essential=20
> future operation since you'll be hearing these preset on-board patterns
> everywhere!
>=20
> Let's get one thing straight before the inevitable concluding remarks:=20
> the MC-303 is not really intended to be a straight TR-808, TR-909 and
> TB-303. The controls on those machines have not all been reproduced,=20
> and analogue listeners will be able to detect some differences -
> digital can be too perfect, after all. Having said that, 99% of us=20
> wouldn't be able to notice much of a difference if it was put up=20
> against the originals in a comparison test.=20
>=20
> For anyone who is fed up with sampling and wants more control but
> doesn't want to pay over the odds, the MC-303 is essential. At the=20
> very least you could use it as a high-quality vintage tone module,
> but you'd be missing most of the point, because the MC-303 is really
> an instant techno machine, and the key word is performance. One button
> press will turn you into a DJ monster from resonance hell. Producing
> original dance classics is also a doddle - almost too easy.=20
>=20
> Rest assured, the next time Dave Robinson runs into Mr Kakehashi he has
> been primed to ask about completely reworking the Jupiter 8, the SH-101,
> the Juno 60...=20
>=20
> Number of tones 448=20
>      Drums12 sets=20
>      Multitimbrality 16 parts (8 main, 8 RPS)=20
>      Polyphony 28 voices=20
>      Effects Reverb, delay, chorus and flange=20
>      Sequencer 8 tracks, 10 songs=20
>      Patterns 120 standard, 200 RPS, 50 user
>      (14,000 notes), 300 variations=20
>      RPS sets 30=20
>      Pattern sets 20
>=20
>      Cost =A3565=20
>      From Roland UK, Atlantic Close,
>      Swansea Enterprise Park, Swansea,=20
>      West Glamorgan SA7 9FJ.=20
>      Tel: 01792 702701=20
>=20
> Features 100%
>       Ease of Use / Setting up 90%
>       Quality of results 90%
>       Value for money 90%=20
>=20
>       Overall rating 93%
>=20
>                                        VERDICT:
>                                        A dance essential.
>                                        That's it!=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>      =A31,499 from Roland UK, Atlantic Close,=20
>      Swansea Enterprise Park,
>      Swansea,=20
>      West Glamorgan SA7 9FJ. Tel: 01792 702701
>=20
>      =20
>=20

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 22:54:10 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 22:56:15 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Y'all ready for this?
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Finally!  CRASH WORSHIP have set their dates.  Below are those of likely
interest to sfraves subscribers:

June 15 World Beat Center San Diego, CA
June 19 TBA Hollywood, CA
June 20 TBA Hollywood, CA
June 25 The Trocadero San Fransisco, CA 415-995-4600 #2356
June 27 John Henry's Eugene, OR 541-342-3358

I'll be at the SF show for sure and possibly LA as well.  I don't know
what's up with these weeknight dates...more may be added.  Just in case
this rings no bells, I'll reprise my remarks from the last time the topic
arose here:

>...leaving all this, and indeed *everything*,
>behind--beyond rave, rock, rap, the Dead, Burning Man, sex, drugs,
>bungee-jumping naked from collapsing bridges, or whatever other paltry
>thrills you may turn to for your occasional tot of ecstasy, that little
>electric taste of The Edge--there is CRASH WORSHIP.  You want to talk about
>temporary autonomous zones?  A Crash Worship show is, without exception or
>reservation, the farthest remove from everyday reality, from normality,
>from life itself as we know it, I've ever found.  A Crash Worship show is
>not a place, not an event--it's an entity, a single seething fusion of
>audience and performers that can grow to be invested with an awesome, even
>terrifying, elemental force.  I've felt myself dissolved, become a single
>swarming cell within the greater being, catalyzed by the power and
>intensity of the performance.  Really, there are no words.  It's just WAY
>OUT.

Yeah...so if you want to get crazy, come on down.  Disposable clothing a must.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 22:54:14 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 22:56:17 -0800
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From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: Re: helloooooooo
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tim744@silicon.email.net wrote:
>Where is everyone tonight?? Is anybody out there?

Everyone's off raving, of course (except us--but I'm going soon, I
promise).  There's a precipitous drop in the volume of this list over every
weekend--you haven't noticed?

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 23:03:42 1996
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Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 23:01:26 -0700
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>Where is everyone tonight?? Is anybody out there?
> 
>Tim (knucklehead)



Just hangin out at home, watchin a cuppla movies I rented!  Probably gonna
be a busy weekend.  Whatchoo up to this weekend mr knucklehead?

Shawna


"For what shall it profit a man to gain the world but lose his lunch..."
  
  
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 23:14:27 1996
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>Finally!  CRASH WORSHIP have set their dates.  Below are those of likely
>interest to sfraves subscribers:
>
>June 15 World Beat Center San Diego, CA
>June 19 TBA Hollywood, CA
>June 20 TBA Hollywood, CA
>June 25 The Trocadero San Fransisco, CA 415-995-4600 #2356
>June 27 John Henry's Eugene, OR 541-342-3358



"DOH!"

Well jeez.  They just happened to pick the one SF night I'll have class on,
with work to immediately follow the next day! :(  Guess I'll just hafta call
in sick the next day or something.  I do hope they add on more do-able
dates, I've been waiting a while to check this out!

Shawna


  *smurp*
     
      
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 24 23:59:43 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 02:59:05 -0400
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Sunset info # please!!??
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hey-lo all

ive been lurking on this wonderful list for about 4 months now and i thought
it may be time for me to say hello! well, i was wondering if anyone could
please email me with this sunday's info on Sunset and the info #? thanx in
advance..=)

-Mananya-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 02:39:51 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 02:39:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: Jason Green* <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Who is Underworld?
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My computer tells me that on 23 May 1996, Jason shared (in part):

> P.S. UNDERWORLD IN THE U.S.!!!!!  WOO HOO!  I have waited so long!! :)  = )

	Now I know there is no such thing as a dumb question, but if 
there were, this one would probably qualify.  8)
	Is this Underworld everyone is raving (pun intended) about the 
same band that had an album out a few years ago called "Change The 
Weather", with the singles "Underneath The Radar" and "Stand Up"?
	If they are, when did they change their sound and become the 
darlings of the dance world?

Curious,
				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 04:07:50 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 04:07:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
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To: Nancy <nancys@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Capitalist Mentality and the Death of Alternative Community
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Dear Friends & Family,

	While I share Nancy's concern expressed in the post below that 
commercial bookings may price some spaces out of the range of promoters of 
underground events, let us never forget that in reality there is *no shortage 
of spaces*, in San Francisco or anywhere else, suitable for a party.
	On any given night, most of the locations at which parties have 
been thrown in this town at one time or another will be empty!
	It strains credibility to suggest that all the owners of 
those empty spaces are holding out for the big fees of the commercial 
promoters rather than booking the smaller parties when they face a choice 
between a small fee or nothing. 
	May I suggest that the real cause of the lack of available spaces 
lies elsewhere?
	One, many owners don't want raves happening on their property, not 
because they dislike ravers, but because they are worried about 
liability.  The fact that they have this worry is because we have a legal 
system which allows people to avoid responsibility for their own actions.
	If someone suffers an overdose at a space, or a problem similarly 
outside the control of the owner arises, our wonderful laws allow the 
victim or the victom's relatives to sue the owner for lack of oversight!  No 
wonder people with a lot to lose would rather err on the side of caution and 
just not allow events to happen in the first place.	
	The other main reason spaces are scarce is of course the 
police.  It isn't only outdoor parties that get hassled about permits, as 
we all well know.  How many spaces are virtually bust-free?  Not many, from 
what I can tell.  Since we give promoters flack when their parties are 
busted -- rather than directing our anger where IMHO it rightfully ought to 
go -- naturally many of them seek to use only secure spaces. 
	Promoters may compete with each other for these spaces, but what 
they're fighting over is the 10% left over after the law has made the other 90% 
risky propositions at best.  What we see at work here is not the mechanics 
of capitalism, but an artificial scarcity caused by a restriction of 
supply.  
	Anyone who feels cramped for space should first and foremost be 
pissed about the unavailability of that 90%.  

Rave on,
				<<< Starchild >>>


My computer tells me that on Thu, 23 May 1996, Nancy shared:

> Folks, it's all about spaces.   Property for sale to the highest bidder,
> and what that tells us about our society.    This is not "Ethan vs. Tom &
> Stacy", but what this argument represents -- the vitality of underground
> parties vs. the dominance of commercial raves.  Some of us love the coming
> together of friends in an UG; some of us love the world-class dj's and
> production of a CR.   Babies or massives, it's all good!!  But
> unfortunately, the fact is that commercialism has the nasty effect of
> crushing the underground. Since no UG promoters own a fabulous space, they
> must locate one from a third party, who's most interested in PROFIT.  When
> a higher-end promoter comes along and offers a king's ransom for a space,
> that space is forever priced out of UG range.  Another space lost.
> 
> Commercial parties are fine, but not when their method of business
> eliminates the possibility of any OTHER kind of party.  Why did Chrysalis
> fall through for this weekend - leaving us with only FTT?  Why hasn't there
> been a Friends & Family in almost a year? Why are there so few
> undergrounds, but a plethora of massives on any given week-end?? Spaces,
> SPACES - it's all about the AFFORDABILITY of spaces.  So when a space is
> finally located and much energy and time is devoted to it, only to have it
> also disintegrate because of folks who claim to support the underground, a
> reaction such as Ethan's is understandable, IMO.
> 
> This is, however, the mechanics of capitalism.  Charging what the market
> will bear, pricing everyone's services - as Mike pointed out, "consumers"
> not friends.  The ideal values of the UG -- donation of time and effort,
> respect and trust of friends, collectives working together selflessly to
> create something better for the whole -- cannot survive in an environment
> dominated by an economic mentality.   The only way an alternative community
> such as this CAN flourish is if it has its own protected space, apart from
> the dominant values of the mainstream.   In a society where greatest price
> wins, the value of community will always lose, at least as far as the owner
> of a potential space is concerned.   Since UG's are forced to compete with
> richer contenders for spaces -- the fundamental necessity for even HAVING a
> party -- well, we can see the result.  Which value will prevail in a
> society BASED on economic values?  Just count the number of undergrounds
> compared to the money-making raves.
> 
> So our experiment of creating community apart from capitalist values may be
> doomed.  I guess the UG has to move even further out of commercialized
> arenas, back to beaches (Sunsets) and the forest (Tribal Future) and the
> Desert (Dune) - though even there we are still within reach of permit
> hassles, police, and vagaries of the weather.  Just think about it, people
> -- the dominance of economic rationality (evaluating everything by its
> monetary value) is SO pervasive that it is almost impossible for us to
> create a community that celebrates something different.  Something more
> human, life-affirming.  More loving.  The mainstream capitalist society
> forces us to play by their rules, and either become like them (commercial
> raves), or lose.
> 
> I think raves are three things - the music, the people, and the feeling.
> That incredible feeling springs, for me, from the emancipation of finding a
> public place NOT based on an economic mentality.  How amazing that is for
> us all!  How unusual!  But the music and the physical exterior of the rave
> were marketable - so, naturally (following capitalist logic) these were
> elevated to become the characteristics of  commercial "raves."  The
> unmarketable aspects are what were left behind in the UG.  You can't sell
> it, but precisely because it is not sellable means its extinction.  Under
> mainstream economic rationality, those things without a price are useless.
> If it can't be traded for money, what good is it?  Because money is the
> ultimate value.
> 
> The loss of this particular space is merely a symptom of a much-larger
> socio-political phenomenon, bigger than Ethan or T/S.  I fully support and
> love the concept behind the undergrounds.   It's just that with every lost
> space, I grow increasingly pessimistic of its possibility.
> Capitalism/Modernity/Industrialization has been an unbelievably powerful
> force, trampling over other cultures and ideas all over the globe.  Today
> we see a global hierarchy with the West firmly on top, and most of the
> world suffering - cultures which were thriving before the imperialism of
> the West.  Can alternative values grow right here in the heart of
> Capitalist Mentality?  When even to question our national dogma is to be
> labeled a commie, or backward, or a hippie (or a raver? :) ?  Or will the
> might of economic rationality crush our experiment?
> 
> No Chrysalis this week-end - hmm, you decide.
> 
> Love, Nancy
> 
> P.S.  I'm unsubbing tomorrow <SOB!>, so I probably won't get to your
> responses, if any.  But I do think it's something for us as a society to
> consider, whether manifested as a "rave promoter squabble" or as global
> politics.  Because they do share the same, fundamental basis.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 07:45:16 1996
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From: b e n   c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
To: "'Dana Watanabe'" <DWATANAB@UCI.EDU>
Cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: TONITE!! - Robert Rich Sleep Concert on KUCI 88.9fm
Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 07:44:48 -0700
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On Friday, May 24, 1996 3:24 PM, Dana Watanabe wrote:
>LOG IN.  HOOK UP.  GO TO SLEEP.
>
>Just a reminder:
>
>Robert Rich live on KUCI 88.9 FM in Irvine  11 PM PDT to 8 AM PDT =
TONITE!

listening to this was incredible. I tuned in via realaudio at 11 and =
they were a running a little bit behind, so I got to hear Rob Rich and =
the station DJ talk for a while about his music. I was listening with my =
window open, and the sounds of the crickets and frogs outside seemed to =
enter the room and become a part of the sound environment, while it =
seemed that other sounds from the program were located far beyond the =
walls of my room... closing my eyes, the walls fell away...

unfortunately, I have to march in a marching band in a parade this =
morning, so I had to get up at 7:30 and turn this off, but the Sleep =
Concert was GREAT! this was the first time I had ever used realaudio to =
listen to a live broadcast stream, and it worked extremely well. it was =
great to be able to listen to Irvine's college radio station from up =
here in northern california.

b e n   c h u n

ben_chun@community.net
http://community.net/~ben_chun/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 09:28:13 1996
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To: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Cc: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, ses@sunsite.unc.edu,
        jack@twaxx.com
Subject: "Solaris" party review
In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 23 May 96 15:28:18 PDT."
             <199605232228.PAA20140@xanadu.cyborganic.net> 
Date: Sat, 25 May 96 09:27:53 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>
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>> Ok, who works at SUN MICRO SYSTEMS?
>> 
>> The shippers at SUN are inserting flyers for this party with the pallets of
>> "Sun Sparc Stations" I've received today 5/23/96.  I must say it was a
>> surprise to see the flyer.  I guess that is one way to get people to go to
>> your party.

>Actually, the filers for the really cool parties are tucked in with the 
>Ultras.  Something about a daytime party called "Solaris?"

Yeah, I went to  this party. THey said there will be no waiting lines
getting in because they were multithreaded (i guess this means people
wearing cool clothes). But then all the sudden, reality just freezes,
and all the bag/ticket checkers and packet filters just stop dead in
their tracks and the line backs up for miles. Then this gang of paunchy
hirsute wizards and monks  suddenly appeared chanting "the network is
the computer, the computer is down" while smacking themselves over the
head with a Sparc IPX .... finally they managed to find the circuit
breakers to reboot the party. 

The voicemail said it was a huge abandoned wherehouse with lots of room
to grow -- but when we got in, the space, even though it only contained
a few users, was completely packed. We went to the concession counter
and they said you need to buy our herbal perfomance enhancing RAM -- at
least 32Megabytes more -- because we have lots of important features
that you the customer need and want! After all, Solaris is the result
of years and years of trying to be 100%-buzzword compatible, and that
kind of PLUR doesn't come cheap. But at $1600.00 for their herbal
boost, we found that a bit steep so we just huddled in the corner
eating our "vi" pops and "rogue" candybars while this huge pulsating
kernel bloated in the center of wherehouse sucking up all the free
resources.

I also heard they had cappucino machines all around that said "come get
your java -- it's free, it's secure, it's safe, and everybody's doin'
it". People seemed awestruck by the little dancing bitmap figurines and
the fact that the letters on the flyers would change fonts and bounce
around illegibly, even though that's considered mundane
kindergarten-level computer graphics and has also been proven to be
useless in promoting a good vibe at a party.

Afterwards, I heard that the people that drank Java got very sick from
a stomach virus, and that it wasn't even very good coffee. It's all in
the beans you see -- and you just can't make good coffee from C++
beans, no matter what James Gosling says.

I had much more fun at this underground party called "Linux" and I only
had to bring food donations, instead of wasting $20.00 on some
overhyped piece of commercial crap...

-- NPM.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 09:46:25 1996
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Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 13:16:23 +0200 (MESZ)
From: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@bp.biologie.hu-berlin.de>
Subject: Re: Robert Miles and... II
To: Sabin Cloud Macphee <cloud@cats.ucsc.edu>, SFRaves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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> children is something like number 4 of the charts in germany and is played
> c o n s t a n t l y  all over the place... not that i mind...
> the video is neat, too.

after i sent this i figured that you guys over there would maybe 
appreciate some additional information on the subject 
(**don't you**???!), so here it comes.
techno or better some special branch of easily consumable techno is big in 
the german charts since about one year. 
especially something that is known as kindergarten techno never fails to 
make it at least into the top 10. it has either little underage girls 
with squeaky voices repeating some entirely stupid sentences, or  
features the voices of characters of wellknown children tv shows (to make 
it more complicated, mostly former east german ones that are 
cancelled now), like a freaky fox, a magpie and a female duck, uttering 
something that is meant all innocently but might be understood in an obscene 
way. 
yes. kindergarten techno. this is an all german phenomenon, i believe.
i don't know who's responsible for the chart success of that stuff. kids 
probably.
apart from that, much pretty trancey (sp?) stuff, mostly german originated,
is around and successful. i can't say much about the music to help your 
imagination up because i'm not so first-class-beknowned in music styles, 
i mainly care wether the music is right to jump around to if i go out... 
it mostly has vocals that are drug related in some way or generally like: 
ravers of the nation, see your hands in the air, give me your hand, let's 
go to wonderful land, bla bla bla.  my impression is, that, especially 
if it comes to the aesthetics of the videos, the reality escaping aspect of 
techno and techno drugs (which is kinda strong in germany i believe) is 
particularly emphasized, not critical, but often apparently with some 
consciousness of its ambivalent quality.

so, you see, techno is quite mainstream over here. of course, our 
very own and beloved ** s c e n e ** always attempts to dissolve 
itself from the mainstream,which is pathetic on the one hand, but the source 
of innovation and development on the other. 
but, generally and alltogether, everybody is quite at ease with that fact.
however it wouldn't help much to complain.
ok. i hope, you don't find this too perverted and your world view feels 
broadened now.
have a nice day everybody.
ulrike
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 10:05:22 1996
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In-Reply-To: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>
        ""Solaris" party review" (May 25,  9:27am)
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ROTFL .  . .!

phred

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 10:09:55 1996
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At 10:56 PM 5/24/96 -0800, you wrote:
>tim744@silicon.email.net wrote:
>>Where is everyone tonight?? Is anybody out there?
>
>Everyone's off raving, of course (except us--but I'm going soon, I
>promise).  There's a precipitous drop in the volume of this list over every
>weekend--you haven't noticed?
>
>anarch@scruznet.com
>
>
>
>
That's cause everyone is using their computers at work.
Me, I have to wait till after work when everyone's signed off and gone home. 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 10:18:30 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 10:18:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: New virus (NRR)
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On Thu, 23 May 1996, hey, where am I? wrote:
> >is anyone else getting bounced mail from POSTMASTER@support.com?
> 
> Yeah, I guess that means that sfraves still has an email address subscribed
> that doesn't actually exist anymore?  I sent email to hyperreal asking about
> that, but I'm not sure I sent it to the right address.

Yup, I tracked it down and removed it on Thursday.  I have the list set up
such that bounce messages *should* go directly to me and not the person
posting to the list, but not all mailers out thee conform to the protocol
specs...

	Brian



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 10:28:04 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 10:27:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
To: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
cc: Jason Green* <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>,
        sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Who is Underworld?
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SOL.3.91.960525023326.26011E-100000@orion>
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On Sat, 25 May 1996, Starchild wrote:
> My computer tells me that on 23 May 1996, Jason shared (in part):
> 
> > P.S. UNDERWORLD IN THE U.S.!!!!!  WOO HOO!  I have waited so long!! :)  = )
> 
> 	Now I know there is no such thing as a dumb question, but if 
> there were, this one would probably qualify.  8)
> 	Is this Underworld everyone is raving (pun intended) about the 
> same band that had an album out a few years ago called "Change The 
> Weather", with the singles "Underneath The Radar" and "Stand Up"?

Yes.

> 	If they are, when did they change their sound and become the 
> darlings of the dance world?

About three (?) years ago they released a track called "Skyscraper, I Love
You", a very dubby, bass-heavy song with vocals tha some people didn't
like but I did.  After that came the album Dubnobasswithmyheadman, which
was extremely good, and critics and DJ's liked it a lot.  I think they had
some personnel changes between their older sound and this newer sound -
I'm not sure if their lead guy Darren Emerson was a part of the band back
then or not.  But yes, they are the same band, in lineage at least.

	Brian



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 10:45:19 1996
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From: Sami Khoury <khoury@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605251745.KAA24251@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: sunset again
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 10:45:15 -0700 (PDT)
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Could someone who has the Sunset info number please forward it to
me or mail it to the list?

Thanks,

	Sami

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 11:46:34 1996
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From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Subject: raving on the bridge
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After I got off work last night at 11:30pm, I popped a techno tape in 
and headed home toward the bay bridge to SF. In a short while I was 
dancing in my car while I was driving by bopping my head and moving my 
arms.

When I got to the toll booth I forgot to lower my music which is 
something I usually do, so I don't blast the toll booth worker.  
Another car must have either heard my music or seen me dancing because 
a little ways up the bridge I see this car filled with people with one 
guy hanging out the window with his fist in the air waving at me and 
shouting WOOOHOOO!

This brought a bigger smile than I already had, as I felt that 
increased special rave connection as I watched the car most likely 
filled with ravers heading off to a rave with the beautiful SF skyline 
all lit up in the backround.
By any chance was that anybody on this list?
If so thanks.

See you all at tribal future,
:)
peter

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 11:52:06 1996
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From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
cc: Jason Green* <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>,
        sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Who is Underworld?
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heh yea i do believe it's te same underworld :) i like Rez (their BIG 
single) but other than that eeeehhh .... they're ok. :)

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 12:26:49 1996
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Sami Khoury wrote:
> 
> Could someone who has the Sunset info number please forward it to
> me or mail it to the list?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
>         Sami985-5264  
!!!^%&%*$%#@$%@!$%^&^#&%%&()(*_)&*)&UO&(*)&()*+_+(&_*%*&#$%^%#^$#&%$^&$&^*%*&^)*(_)*&)_^&(T)(*_)_&*(^&(_)+)_+*)*&%*&$$^#$^#$&#%&%*&$^&*$^*(%&*(^&R*&(^&*%^**$&^($#^*#@$%&#%^*&$^(^&*P)(_(^O*_&*)(_*&()*&%(^$*&%^$#&#%$^%$#%*&$^&(%*)&*()_+*(+()+_)_&*(&_&_*)()&^)%^*&G$^&F&(HB(PH(*^)^^%(%^&#*%^

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 13:11:39 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 13:11:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Pac-a-bowl Review
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Last Thursday night some friends and I finally had to check out this party..
I had heard so many 'interesting' things about it over the past several 
months..

Walking in the front door, my friends in their mid to late twenties 
commented what a young crowd... Avg. age 15-19.. This leads to a moment 
from a conv. in the woman's john.. a 17 year old asked,"I don't mean to 
be rude or anything, I have been coming here since the beginning and I 
have never seen you before, and you seem old for this."  I responded, 
with a big smile, "What do you invision yourself doing at my age?"  We 
had an 'interesting' conversation...She liked my taste in 
lipstick...called Lust..lilac and shinny..  ;-)...

We tried to bowl...but the lane where we chose to hang was 
malfunctioning...!no doubt!..Later on we went back to the same spot since 
there was room to sit, and watched the bowlers...we laughed and laughed as
two people assaulted the pins together in the same lane, as one young man 
threw the ball with such velocity that I was certain something would break,
as pins somehow found themselves six feet in front of the reset 
mechanism, as ravers were using many balls to knock other balls back into the
end of the wall thing ( I really don't know what the hell you call bowling
devices  ;-) )  it was just pure madness...  I mean, I guess the owner 
must 'know' his place is being pretty trashed...The balls were in bad 
shape, etc....  my guess is that it won't be long before it is closed 
down and becomes something else...And as many have pointed out, the 
sounds of bowling didn't interfere with the music...

Next, we also tried to play pool but after entering the pool room for 
one minute and smoking 2 packs of cigarettes, I just had to leave... 
Los Angeles smog on a bad day...

The alley has a nice bar, beautiful ambient music (didnt' recognize the 
DJ)..free water..

**Music....excellent!!!!!!!!!!!  Tracy was great and when Carlos came 
on...I realized how much I had missed him for I have not heard him spin 
for over 1.5 years...just don't seem to frequent the parties where he 
spins...  ghod I love what he does....his energy, his always present smile...


At the time we were leaving the cops were arriving...  

I also noticed lots of heavy security throughout the night...would I 
return to this party in the Haight...  nope, glad I went...yup..regrets, 
that I didn't have a video camera for the bowling.....   --Mau


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 13:34:28 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 13:34:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
X-Sender: ez031733@elroy.ucdavis.edu
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: :)
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I just wanted to send a happy vibe out to everyone on this long weekend!  
:)


--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor
  		      Listen to the Uncle Noah TV Show 
  		    The best in Techno and House music
   	        Saturdays, 3-5am only on KDVS 90.3fm in Davis


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 13:46:32 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 13:46:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Starchild <star@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: star@orion
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Wanna go to Panther/Bonny Doon today?
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.960525134400.24405B-100000@orion>
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	Chikako and I were thinking of driving down to check out these 
daytime beach parties near Santa Cruz.  We have room for two more (three 
if we squeeze) and could also use help paying for gas :)  so if anyone 
wants a ride, give me a call at 626-3036 or 270-7887 or send email.  If 
the 626 number is busy, I'm online. 

Much love, 
				<<< Starchild >>>

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 15:45:37 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 15:48:31 -0700
From: trippen <trippen@aol.com>
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To: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
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Subject: (non rave) turntables wanted
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looking for used 1200's please e-mail with price thanks....

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 19:30:22 1996
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 19:29:42 -0700
Message-Id: <199605260229.TAA15862@dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com>
From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: FUNKY TEKNO TRIBE TONIGHT!!!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Anybody Going?!?!!?
I'LL BE THERE!!! LOOK FOR ME!

I'll have my Black and White Dr. Suess hat with my alien head necklace!

I'll also have a backpack on with TOYS and GOODIES for all ya'll 
people! 

Make sure you come and say hi with a big hug!

See ya all there!!!


Love,
Adam

Btw, it's going to be in Oakland where Gaia was held. I just called.. 
50,000 square feet. something like that..



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sat May 25 23:09:22 1996
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Subject: test
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test...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 10:29:12 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 10:29:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Funky Tekno Tribe mini-blurred-review
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zzzzzz.  It's 10:30am.  Do you know where your car stereo is?  ACK!!!
Sure enough, my car got broken into and Shawna lost her purse.  Sigh.
Luckily no cash but quite a pain in the ass nonetheless.  

FTT was pretty good for a massive massive, once we got inside.  Of course,
it took us over an hour in line to get in.  Still, hanging out in line
with a bunch of sfravers was pretty fun.  :) :)

The music was great -- it really kept me hopping all night!  The crowd was
even pretty good, all things considered.  People seemed to be having a
great time and grooving a lot.  :)  yay!!

Well, that's all I can squeeze out now.  Time to face plant.  See y'all at
Sunset and Spundae!!  

Love,
) Paul ( and Shawna

:) ;) ;-P


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 10:31:36 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 10:31:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
Subject: I'm venturing to Sunset
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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I'm gonna come out for a little while, so if any of you who read this 
before Sunset happens haven't met me yet - I'll be wearing an "Acid 
Raindrop" tee  shirt.  My hair will be wavy today (thanks to a braid!)
If its not too windy, I'll wear my sfraves laminate - otherwise it gets 
twisted around my neck all the time and I hate getting choked.  At least 
by a laminate chain anyway...;)

love,
Amy 

---------------
|   _  ,/|    |
|  '\`o O'    |
|   =(_^_)=   |         Amy Starkey
|     |U|     |         sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu
|     | |     |      
---------------


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 14:42:25 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 14:42:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: IMPORTANT: IN TOUCH STUFF THAT CONCERNS YOU!
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Since Karl and Mikey of In Touch Productions don't have access to SFR 
yet, I'm sending out this message is from the three of us:

On Friday night, as most of you may know, the Pier location for Open 
Space got busted.  In Touch's last party got busted and if you remember, 
the DELI was where the party was moved to.  Because of lame rave rumors, 
Tom and Stacey were suspected to have been the people that busted the 
first one that time.  Now we KNOW it was the people at the DELI *BOTH 
TIMES*, since they're on some kind of trip and want to make as much as 
possible off the rave scene.  If you don't throw your party there, they 
will bust it if they can...  Our apologies go out to Tom and Stacey for 
this...

The people at the DELI *WILL* be taken care of, in whatever way possible, 
but if for any reason any of them are still around to run the place in 
the next couple of weeks, I suggest BOYCOTTING it (like I had to tell you 
that).  I don't think they'll be able to have parties much longer, 
because they've just pissed the WRONG people off.  If you have any 
questions for me, Mikey, or Karl, please send them to this email and I'll 
let them know they have a message.  I'm getting them both set up with 
emails soon, so they'll be on here in a while...

John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 14:52:04 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 14:52:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: UNDERWORLD/MEAT BEAT/CHEMICAL BROS./ORB in SF
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It's happening here too!  Not just in LA!

June 21st
Space Children

Underworld
Meat Beat Manifesto
Chemical Brothers
The Orb

+ more live acts + DJs

This looks like the best party yet ALL YEAR!  Call 415-273-1622...  more 
acts will be confirmed soon!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 16:47:59 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 16:47:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Clearing it up! (fwd)
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
cc: "D. Steve White" <stevew@orion.oriontel.com>,
        James E Kaspar <James_E_Kaspar@notes.seagate.com>,
        infocat <infocat@cats.ucsc.edu>, brandon estuesta <brandone@sco.COM>
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Hi folks!
 I'm back and beat (better than black `n blue?). Recieved this post and 
in case it is on the up `n up, I thought it might be good to foward.
Replies on posting this should be made to me in private please. Thanks.

Ran 

                          ( where is that?!? )
                                /
                          -=*=-/
                            ~





---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 09:30:14 +0200
From: Paul Ferrise <tiny@village.it>
To: she@xaostools.com
Cc: kellyb@sonic.net, kymlb@ix.netcom.com, drweeks@aol.com,
    cary@earthlink.net, inface@aol.com, schip@netcom.com,
    JRyan74059@aol.com, dmouse@earthlink.net, 76223.443@compuserve.com,
    cpicnic@aol.com, randream@cats.ucsc.edu, mz.demnr@ix.netcom.com,
    spp@earthlink.net
Subject: Re: Clearing it up!

Hello, everyone, the children are out playing again without mom present.
Please read carefully!!!!!!!



>WARNING!!!!!!!  INTERNET VIRUS  The FCC released a warning last Wednesday 
>concerning a matter of major importance to any regular user of the Internet.  
>Apparently a new computer virus has been engineered by a user of AMERICA ON 
>LINE that is unparalleled in its destructive capability.  Other more 
>well-known viruses such as "Stoned", "Airwolf" and "Michaelangelo" are pale in 
>comparison to the prospectus of this newest creation by a warped mentality.  
>What makes this virus so terrifying, said the FCC, is the fact that no program 
>needs to be exchanged for a new computer to be infected. It can be spread 
>through the existing e-mail systems of the Internet. Once a Computer is 
>infected, one of several things can happen.  If the computer contains a hard 
>drive, it will most likely be destroyed.  If the program is not stopped, the 
>computer's processor will be placed in an nth-complexity infinite binary loop 
>- which can severly damage the processor if left running that way too long.  
>Unfortunately, most novice computer users will not realize what is happening 
>until it is far too late.  Luckily, there is one sure means of detecting what 
>is now known as the "Good Times": virus.  It always travels to new computers 
>the same way in a text e-mail message with the subject line reading "Good 
>Times". Avoiding infection is easy once the file has been received simply by 
>NOT READING IT!  The act of loading the file into the mail server's ASCII 
>buffer causes the "Good Times" mainline program to initialize and execute.  
>The program is higly intelligent -- it will send copies of itself to everyone 
>whose e-mail address is contained in a receive-mail file or a sent-mail file, 
>if it can find one.  It will then proceed to trash the computer it is running 
>on.  The bottom line there is:  if you receive a file with the subject line 
>"Good Times", delete it immediately!  Do not read it"  Rest assured that 
>whoever's name was on the "Form" line was surely struck by the virus.  Warn 
>your friends and local system users of this newest threat to the Internet!  It 
>could save a lot of time and money.  Could you pass this along to your global 
>mailing list as well?
>
>George H. Bowers
>Vice President for information Systems
>University of Maryland Medical System
>410-328-2579  (fax) 410-328-0572
>gbowers@umms_itg.ab.umd.edu
>
>
>--- Internet Message Header Follows ---
>Received: from nemesis.cybergate.net (nemesis.cybergate.net
[204.248.180.25]) by altmail.holonet.net with ESMTP
>	id LAA06208; Tue, 21 May 1996 11:54:43 -0700
>Received: (from bin@localhost) by nemesis.cybergate.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id
OAA10116 for foolish_fish@sfbayguardian.com; Tue, 21 May 1996 14:51:23 GMT
>Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 14:51:23 GMT
>Message-Id: <199605211451.OAA10116@nemesis.cybergate.net>
>From: sandra10@msn.com
>To: festival@cybergate.net
>Subject: Uh-oh,  Mercury continues to retch...  almost over,  gang.
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 16:58:44 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 16:58:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: New virus (NRR)
To: Tim Gotch <tim@redshift.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v01540b00adcaaea40990@[165.227.94.205]>
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605261615.A13968-0100000@ese.UCSC.EDU>
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On Thu, 23 May 1996, Tim Gotch wrote:

> Not this again. The "good times" virus is bullshit, I think this is about
> the third or fourth time I've seen it on this list in the last year.
> Tim
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>                    Tim Gotch
>                 tim@redshift.com
>            http://www.redshift.com/~tim
>             Hyper Design Technologies
>                 hdt@redshift.com
>            http://www.redshift.com/~hdt
>              395 Del Monte Ctr. #128
>                 Monterey, CA 93940
>       Nothing is true, everything is permitted
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
> 


Sorry!!!!!

Ran


                     -=*=-
                       ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 17:53:51 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 17:53:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: panther beach party
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605261715.A25008-0100000@well>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Well hey!  There's one more day of weekend!

So I just wanted to share my first brush with the awesome energy in this 
bay area scene since moving here two weeks ago--

I had heard great things about the Chrysalis party, so I was bummed when 
it was cancelled, and I would not get to meet Shawna this weekend 
afterall!   =)  Plus, my crazy Friday kept me from meeting up with the 
South Bay sfravers Friday night (oops)!!

So it was with great pleasure that several friends and I spent the 
afternoon yesterday basking in some really nice vibes at the party on 
Panther Beach near Santa Cruz, and churned out some energy of our own as 
we dug little dance patterns into the sand at our feet.  There were some 
wonderful house beats, a very diverse and down-to-earth crowd (geez- it 
felt like a Dead show!), and most of all the ocean which added such a 
rich, wonderful undertone-- harmonious mother nature padding out the 
crisp sounds of the music!   Now I know what's missing from those 
beautiful Rocky Mountain parties I just left!   So, there was this sweet 
spot where the sound was caught by the overhanging rock that makes that 
cool natural arch, and the hyper little birds that live in holes in the 
rock were groovin' in sets of four to the speakers!   If the promoters 
are on this list, THANK YOU for a wonderful chillspace yesterday!

In fact, we had so much fun, we ended up being shamefully late getting 
back north, and thus didn't use our tickets to Wigstock!  The money 
went to AIDS charities, so not using the tix was no biggie except for 
missing all the fun dancing with the drag queens!  If anybody went, 
please tell us how it was!

Anyway, time to send out happybeams to everyone on this list--
PLUR
John

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 19:25:29 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 19:16:08 -0700
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Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
From: kcroy@best.com (kcroy)
Subject: Re: Clearing it up! (fwd)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

hey randy.
your email _is_ the virus. A mimetic one. Like chain letters, and pyramid
scheme letters, _you_ are the host, and are convinced to reproduce the
virus (the warning) and send it out.
It is cool of you to try and let people know that there might be a problem,
but in this case you have actually spread it :)
a cathcy phrase or a pop tune is also a mimetic virus. you whisle it, and
it sinks into someone elses brain.
I used to have a better URL for info about it, but its someplace to start...
http://www.lucifer.com/virus/alt.memetics/what.is.html



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 20:13:27 1996
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 20:13:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Clearing it up! (fwd)
To: kcroy <kcroy@best.com>
cc: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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"Memetics is to media as genetics is to biology."  -FringeWare Review

As a student of memetic engineering, I've assembled a collection of usefull 
links regarding memes and memetics, from tutorials to examples, etc.

Point Netscape (2.0 if ya got it) to:  http://myhouse.com/pronoia/
and choose the "ways and memes" button.  The word "memes" is hot, and 
takes you to the resources I'm ranting about!   Have fun..

-John


On Sun, 26 May 1996, kcroy wrote:

> hey randy.
> your email _is_ the virus. A mimetic one. Like chain letters, and pyramid
> scheme letters, _you_ are the host, and are convinced to reproduce the
> virus (the warning) and send it out.
> It is cool of you to try and let people know that there might be a problem,
> but in this case you have actually spread it :)
> a cathcy phrase or a pop tune is also a mimetic virus. you whisle it, and
> it sinks into someone elses brain.
> I used to have a better URL for info about it, but its someplace to start...
> http://www.lucifer.com/virus/alt.memetics/what.is.html
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 21:19:00 1996
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From: phred@well.com
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Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 21:18:36 -0700
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To: dcraves@american.edu, ne-raves@world.std.com, nw-raves@hyperreal.com,
        sfraves@hyperreal.com, uhn-l@teleport.com
Subject: on the road . . .
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I'm logging in from my mom's house in Washington, DC, where I grew up.
Rather than the usual heat'n'humid smogfest of early summer, the weather
is unexplainably Oregon-like.  Cold and drizzly today, very nice and sunny
yesterday.

I went to Buzz on Friday night for a while, Scott Henry was playing
old-skool
hahdcoah techno a la 1992, a guy named Ed Bailey was doing housier stuff
in the smaller room.  Buzz is two or three garages stitched together into
a fairly large but, I am afraid, vibeless club with tons of bored-looking
kids milling around.  I didn't think it was bad or good, more or less the
same as the big parties in Portland actually.

It's down by the Navy Yard Metro stop, where I had never been before despite
living in DC for years and years.  There are several other clubs in a two
or three block area, and they divide neatly into straight and gay, white
and non-white.  Very weird to see such self-segregation in such a small
area.  It was all pretty relaxed and lots of booming bass as I walked
around the neighborhood checking the scene :)

Yesterday I went record shopping and spent a good long while at 12" Dance
Records off Dupont Circle -- they have definitely improved their buying
for house (still no jungle though) and I found quite a few good tracks.

Last night, Wicked played in a tent behind Tracks, one of the other clubs
near the Capital Ballroom.  I actually had a pretty good time and stayed
until about 5:30.  I caught just the end of a local DJ's set (didn't hear
his name), then the order was Jeno-Garth-Markie and I think Thomas was
being rounded up to go on after I left, with Scott Henry and Lieven 
following into the morning inside the club.

A pretty good crowd, not too packed, but the dancefloor never really got
going and there was a more or less constant set of circles happening
through most of the proceedings.  Jeno had one of the better sets I've
heard him play recently, a nice jazzy overtone but still straight down
the chute.  Garth pulled the short straw, unfortunately, after starting
a very nice jazzy-housey set the sound crapped out on one side and it
took the techs more than an hour to get it working properly.  Markie
did his usual eclectic walk through things, and then it was time for me
to go.  Hadn't been to a Wicked since the Doc one in January at King St
in SF (I dropped in very briefly last month but didn't stay), so this turned
out rather nicely and the guys seemed very relaxed.  They played St. Louis
Friday night and the (S)Limelight in NYC tonight.

I'm off to New York City early Tuesday morning.  Have a couple of meetings
and I'll also be doing some record shopping.  

I ran into Dan the Love Man at Wicked last night, but not too many others.

see y'all!

phred

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Sun May 26 23:59:14 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Bradley Graham <bradleyg@netcom.com>
Subject: No Mo Techsture
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Hey everyone!
Just got back from Cafe Abir.  I was disappointed to find there isn't gonna
be no more
Techsture.  When asked why they said something about the noise and Joe Rice.
:>)  Ok,
I'm kiddin about Joe (he played a very kewl set a few weeks back) but the
noise part is 
apparently true.  Maybe that's what killed the Kennel Club.  Anyway, looks like
Techsture can be removed from the weeklies list.

Hope everyone is having a wild weekend!

Bradley  


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 02:14:00 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 02:14:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: ambient album rec...
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woah, I thought Richie Hawtin was cool enough... then I got From Within I,
a collab. with Pete Namlook on the FAX label.  

this album is sweet!  I can't stop listening to it.  best album I've
gotten in weeks (I buy so damn many...)


	jon


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 08:28:08 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 08:28:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: nw-raves@hyperreal.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: someone stole my music!
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that's right folks ... eight of my favorite CDs were swiped OUT OF MY 
ROOM this weekend & i don't know by who .... :( or if i'll ever see em again.

man, i HATE the human race sometimes.

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 10:16:21 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 10:16:15 -0700
From: "John O'Brien" <cti@earthlink.net>
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Wow, its quite, not only outside (I'm at work!) but on this list. Hope 
everyone had a good extended weekend 'cause I hate ya (I had to work 
allllll weekend LONG!). 

Looking forward to Tribal Future, it should be killer!

So, whos all going? Hope to see yous there!

-- 
   Me: John O'Brien                   Email: cti@earthlink.net
    @: Clockwork Tortoise Inc.        Voice: 415-399-1429
Where: 211 Sutter Street, Suite 401     Fax: 415-399-0158
  Why: San Francisco, CA 94108

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 10:19:20 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 10:18:48 -0700
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From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Subject: party today?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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It's a nice day today.  Anybody know of a party today?

Unfortunately I had to work this weekend so I missed out on sat and sun 
parties :(
I love to hear some reviews.
 
:)
peter

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 10:59:29 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 10:59:42 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: sddpw@sirius.com (Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works)
Subject: Spundaes w/Candy on Top
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I know all you hardcore underground ravers might cringe, but I have to say
that last night's Spundaes was an awesome party.  Even at 1015 Folsom!

I did not see any laminates :-(  Where were you all hiding?  I had extra
tickets that I wanted to share with some of y'all, but noone answered my
calls, "Anyone here from the SFRaves listserv?"  Damn near made a fool of
myself.

Thought the set by John Aquaviva was really good.  Danced hard to whoever
was in the basement.

Was leary about the crowd b4 coming, because of all the general circulation
ads, but the crowd was 98% smiles & hugs.  Thanks to my knowing compatriots
on this very list, I was having an absolute ball giving away spearmint gum
and apple Jolly Ranchers.  They didn't sell Charms Blow-Pops at Safeway.

So, if you are one of the girlfriends who let me hug your boyfriend, if
your one of the boyfriends that didn't mind I gave your girlfriend a
backrub, if your one of the MANY people who threw me a humungous smile
back, thanks for making it an awesome night out for me.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 10:59:45 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 10:59:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cami Edwards <cami@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: party today?
To: peter fogel <peterbf@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I second that.  I would love to go to an outdoor party today.  What a 
bummer it was so cold yesterday, I was freezing at Sunset.   The wind 
coming in off the bay was crazy.  Panther beach was really nice on 
Saturday, though.  Kinda weird that there were two soundsystems on the 
same little beach, though (not quite sure why one or the other didn't 
just move down a beach?)  The music was nice and funky house (at the 
system I was sitting at).  

It got shut down for about an hour or so by some rent-a-cops :(  
Supposedly, they are security guards hired to patrol the beaches in that 
area.  The thing is, Troy overheard them talking to the party organizers 
and they said there wasn't anything they could see wrong with what we 
were doing, but we should stop it anyways.  No complaints, it wasn't 
bothering anyone, we should just stop.  So it stopped for an hour, 
then they were gone and the music started again.:)  

Did anyone go to Spudae last night (you prob. aren't up yet:), how was it?

Cheers***
Cami

On Mon, 27 May 1996, peter fogel wrote:

> It's a nice day today.  Anybody know of a party today?
> 
> Unfortunately I had to work this weekend so I missed out on sat and sun 
> parties :(
> I love to hear some reviews.
>  
> :)
> peter
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 11:07:08 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 11:07:19 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: sddpw@sirius.com (Shimako-Dominguez Department of Public Works)
Subject: Looking for John(?)
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Hoping, on the odd chance, that someone would know who this guy was I was
talking to last night at Spundaes.  I think his name was John, but not 100%
sure.  He was wearing a brown and tan shirt, with a brown baseball cap and
was standing next to a woman in a new "Stoopid" mini-T.  He had an this
awesome necklace of an person that I wanted to ask him about, because he
said his friend made it.  If anyone knows the person who fits this
description, could you please pass along my e-mail address or give out my
phone number - (415) 864-8234.

THANKS....

arkay



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 11:29:56 1996
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To: <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
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Subject: Re: someone stole my music!
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On Mon, May 27, 1996 8:28:04 AM  at Karen Hardie wrote: 
 
 ... eight of my favorite CDs were swiped OUT OF MY  
>ROOM this weekend & i don't know by who .... man, i HATE the human race
sometimes. 
> 
That really sucks!  I'm sorry that happened.  Were these "friends" of
strangers that were in your room?  You cannot deny that some people can be
or are assholes.  So sometimes it's necessary to take precausions such as
putting away your cd's when you have many people at your place or making
sure there is nothing visible in your car when you park in the city or even
locking your car doors. 
 
Doesn't it suck that we have to do these things?  Why can't people respect
others and what they own?  If someone is not satisfied with what they own,
maybe they should do something about it such as get a better job or
sacrifice other things to attain what they want.  Or better yet, make an
effort to change their values to center less around materialistic things. 
 
I'm sure glad nobody can steal my Love from me!  If everything I own is
taken from me... 
             it will always remain. 
 
--erik 
  
*IMPORTANT!  READ DISCLAIMER** 
These words were NOT written by moonpup 
He's in London until late August 
 
...and I'm ERIK.  I'll be using his address until then 
Please address all comments, rebuttals, love or hate letters to me, ERIK 
or drop me a line... 415-337-6666

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 14:17:44 1996
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To: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: UNDERWORLD/MEAT BEAT/CHEMICAL BROS./ORB in SF
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John...

thanks for the info.

all you sfravers can be SURE to catch me at this *event*

>It's happening here too!  Not just in LA!
>
>June 21st
>Space Children
>
>Underworld
>Meat Beat Manifesto
>Chemical Brothers
>The Orb
>
>+ more live acts + DJs
>
>This looks like the best party yet ALL YEAR!  Call 415-273-1622...  more
>acts will be confirmed soon!

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 14:20:02 1996
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To: cami@netcom.com, peterbf@ix.netcom.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: party today? - Spundae last night
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In a message dated 96-05-27 14:06:21 EDT, cami@netcom.com (Cami Edwards)
writes:

>Did anyone go to Spudae last night (you prob. aren't up yet:), how was it?

I agree with the "review" someone posted earlier about Spundae!  I thought it
was great!!!  Ran into some nice people I'd met at Space Teddy last week (was
it just a week ago?)... Heard  some great music (mostly in the basement)....
saw some grrrroooy lights.... met a few new interesting people.... all around
good time, even if it WAS at 1015.


See you.
-Rebecca  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 14:37:30 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: Re: IMPORTANT: IN TOUCH STUFF THAT CONCERNS YOU!
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>Now we KNOW it was the people at the DELI *BOTH 
>TIMES*, since they're on some kind of trip and want to make as much as 
>possible off the rave scene.

How do you know?  Please don't start any unsupportable rumors.  What are the 
facts here?

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 14:41:56 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 14:52:40 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: andrewba@sonic.net (Andrew Barry)
Subject: Anyone with the 411...
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Its now 2:45 in the PM and I am trying to figure out where the Bulletproof
party is today at Mission Rock? It is the follow up to last nights boat
party?  If anyone gets this soon please post me a message...thanks

Drew....



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 16:05:55 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 19:05:24 -0400
Message-ID: <960527190524_311412499@emout10.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: SFR APB: Rachel (from Ohio)
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Calling all ravers,
This is an unofficial APB for a one Rachel Channing of Columbus Ohio.  Last
spotted at a Harmony Party a few months back.  First sighted at Burning Man
95.  Apparently moved out to SF earlier this year and currently living
somewhere therein with significant other.  If you have seen or heard from
this individual (short/dark hair, short-med height, med build, socio major,
age 24 or so) please advise.
Over,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 16:06:04 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 19:05:33 -0400
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: ?FMR info?
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For those of us poor few who can't make it out to Mendocino next weekend,
does anyone have any FMR info?  Even wild guesses would be appreciated.
Really wanted to make it to Tribal Future, but I'll be working the Envision
Design Conference Fri & Sat, (<Anyone going to this?)
Yanks,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 16:28:16 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 16:28:01 +0200
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: exodus@earthlink.net (Austin)
Subject: BIG OOPS! was Re: 20$ parties
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I said --

>John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>wrote:
>>for having a small playlist, and it all gets old really fast.  Even the
>>out of town DJs people bring in are usually the same ones (ie Donald
>>Glaude, Barry Weaver, DJ Trance, etc).  If I was threw another party I
>>would bring in *TERRY MULLAN*.... He's been around a few times in the
>>past 6 months, but he's INCREDIBLE!  I guess the main reason why is these
>
>YESSSSSS!!!!!!  I second this.  I herd him in LA the last time I was there
>and >he IS increadable.  His brother is great too - Christopher Lawerence.
>Some one >please book these guys.....

My mistake I miss took TERRY MULLEN for the name THOMAS MICHEAL....aaaahhhhh=
h
I'm not with it today...I'm trying to get over Strep throat,  been in bed
for a few days sick as I've ever been.  Sorry.  Terry Mullen is INCREDABLE
as well heard him too here in sf.
Sorry my mistake,
Seeya guys next weekend if I get better.

Austin

  .                .         __/-^-\__      .      .         .             .
       .                  <<<<Austin>>>>               .         .  .
           @        .        `'\-*-/`'        .     .       .   .      .    =
 .
             .                  /|\    .           .          .         .
  .                   .        / | \          .                        .
           .                  /  |  \                .                .
     .           .       .   / / | \ \.   .            .
             .              / /  |  \ \      .          .          .        =
   .
                     .     / / / | \ \ \            .             .     .
 .          .             / / /  |  \ \ \                   .   .           =
  .
       .                 / / / / | \ \ \ \.      .            .        .
                 .      / / / /  |  \ \ \ \          .    .
  _@_/`   ~\_e_/~    _G/        O      ~\_Q_   ~\_8_|   _9_     .         .
~/ }}       (*)     < =99        /|\       (.)\,   [#]  ,/ }}\,
   \\       /|     ~\/ \   _=3D=3D=3D___=3D=3D=3D_   //      / \     /\/    =
    .
   //       \\         /  [___________]  \\      \ /     \
   ~~       ~~         ~   ^         ^   ~~      ~ ~     ~     .          .




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 16:48:58 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 16:46:26 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Funky Tekno Review (long) (yeah yeah I know!)
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Hey all!

Well it's been a very interesting weekend.  Went to Funky Tekno Tribe on
Saturday, being one of the Chrysalis ousted. :(  This party definitely had
some real up points and some *real* down points.  

We all met up ahead of time to go there together, so at least we had a group
of mostly sfravers to go with.  So we all drive over to the warehouse, and
when we get there, we see this enormous line of people stretching down the
block.  Very daunting, pretty usual with massives I guess, cuz they searched
each person (not very well I might add!)  So we wait there in line for an
hour, entertaining ourselves, to get in.  There are lots of youngsters &
gangster types along for the ride, lots of people swishing down bottles of
Jack Daniels as fast as they can and them throwing them to the side onto the
ground.  One particularly charming gentleman kinda stumbled around in
between the line of people & the building itself, and naturally eventually
fell face & hands forward into one of the glass windows of the warehouse.
He seemed fine, but of course now there's this enormous broken window and
glass all over the place.  One of the policemen occupying one of 5-6 cop
cars sitting there outside the event hauls him away.  Boy I tell you folks,
at this point, I realize I really am experiencing pangs of homesickness for
you guys, all the friendly folk that woulda showed to the Chrysalis party!
(which was one saving grace for this party, many ousted Chrysalis folk made
it to this one instead, thereby raising the vibe-factor by quite a bit!)
And I'm also thinking that if I had come by myself in my own car, I would
have left then & there.  But I came with other people in someone else's car
so oh well.  And then, after the aforementioned hour, we *finally* make it
up to the front of the line, and I am *completely* dismayed to see that
while the pre-sale tickets were $20, the at-the-door tickets were jacked up
to $25!!  There of course was no mention of this on the recording, or
mention at the stores where the tickets were being pre-sold. You didn't
learn this until after waiting a whole hour in line, so that by the time you
get in, you feel you *have* to go to this party just to justify having
waited that long.  My friends are going in, I have no way home on my own, so
I say "shit. fine. here's my money, now leave me alone" and go on in.  

The warehouse setup is kind of weird.  It's huge and long, so that one side
is completely lit, while the other side is darkened like a normal rave.
There's a big alcove also that is decorated only with a blacklight on the
ceiling and a white parachute hanging from the ceiling directly under it.  I
liked the way that looked, but if possible I would have at least covered the
ceiling in these blacklight parachutes so you'd have this entire eerily
glowing fluffy ceiling above, that woulda looked cool!  The only real effort
in decor that ws made was the dj setup and the lasers.  The laser show was
pretty damn cool, saw some nifty effects.  There was a scaffold platform in
the middle of the floor, in between the laser (which was set up on one side
of the dance area) and the dj setup (on the other side of the dance area).
People often climbed up on this and danced, and looking at the people
dancing against the laser design background looked pretty darned cool too,
especially since a number of these were totally decked out in these enormous
glow-sticks that were a little longer than the length of one's forearm.
These people had one glow-stick tied to each leg & one tied to each arm, and
against the laser show that in & of itself made a pretty cool show!  But of
course, still not worth $25.  The warehouse was nice because you could go
outside, they had a whole outdoor area you could go sit and cool off at,
which was very nice.  The warehouse was also *very* large, so in spite of
the large numbers of people there was always lots of open space (with the
possible exception of in the thick of the dance area of course). 

Upon first getting into the party, I was needless to say in a rather surly &
bitter mood.  And then I promptly lost most of the people I had come with.
So I do my usual thing and wander around scoping out the set-up seeing where
everything sits.  As I wander thru the dance area, I am completely surprised
when somebody looks at me and offers me candy with a big smile!  This was so
completely not what I was expecting at a party like this, anybody who would
actually run around with candy offering it to random people.  This actually
did a considerable amount towards raising my spirits quite a bit.  Like I
said, there were probably a lot of people there who originally had intended
to go to Chrysalis, so it probably isn't as much of a surprise as it
normally would have been.  But still, even tho my spirits had lifted quite a
bit, a lot of the people were composed of what I had already seen outside in
line.  However, the music rocked! :)  I've learned that when I go to a party
like this, and the music does rock, I pretty much have to put away my "soft
& fluffy" expectations (like expecting people & vibe from parties like
Chrysalis), and kind of get a little more hardcore about it, and just really
enjoy the great music & dance my ass off the whole time.  I love the soft &
fluffy stuff, it's a large part of what I seek out, but at a party like
this, putting that away is really the best way I can assure that I will have
the best time possible, and for $25 I definitely want to have the best time
possible!  This also meant not indulging, cuz (for me) that would be a total
distraction from just dancing all night & would make me want to find heaps
of happy people to hang out with, & that just wasn't to be found here.  So I
had an immensely good time dancing!  It's that same type of energy that I
experienced in Montreal, just the energy of a huge number of people all
really enjoying dancing their asses off with excellent music.  And I also
discovered something new, which is that I now contend (for me) that if I am
gonna *just* dig on the groovy music & dance real hard all night, a massive
is the way to go!  The music just sounds so much fuller with a good system
in a huge area, WHOOM WHOOM WHOOM WHOOM, jeez!  That alone just keeps ya
going (I like lotsa bass, ya definitely get that effect in a large space!).
Not quite sure why yet, but I keep hearing the music I really enjoy more at
larger parties, rather than the smaller ones (with the exception of a couple
of dj's at the last Beautiful People).  Or maybe the large space is just
providing for better effects.  Anyway, this music I really enjoyed, and I
regret not having made note of which dj was spinning when with the exception
of Dj Dan. Oh yeah, the infamous fire dancers came out for an appearance or
two, which i saw a bit of.  And the most notable item I must make mention of
here is Our Own SDream!  Yes folks, SDream like you've never seen him
before!  I'm dancing out in the middle of the floor, and I look up to
realize that there, upon the small scaffold built up right next to the dj
setup, is the Good Ol' Boy from Tallahassee wearing one of his cat-in the
hat style hats (this one red with white polka dots), his pants, & nothing
else!  Dancing around up there, along with several other people, one of
which had a big hat like his.  I couldn't believe it!  And the best part?
We got PICTURES! :):)  Good blackmail material if I ever saw! ;)  & if not
that, a good source of merciless teasing!  So all in all, having danced the
whole time, I had a really great time.  My bare minimum requirement for
having fun is great music, and that was taken care of.  As long as i didn't
expect much chill-room fun, I was set, so at the end of the party I still
found myself feeling great.  I do need to just do simple dancing at parties
more often I think, I don't feel that particular type of energy as much as
I'd like to.  

And then for the fabulous ending.  We leave the building the following
morning, and walk the couple of blocks to our car.  We see that the car is
still in the lot and Paul says "oh cool!  my car wasn't broken into!"  And
for some reason, I just say "let's just wait & see if my purse is still
there or not before we say that!"  And sure enough, we pop the trunk, & the
purse is gone.  The car didn't look vandalized because they hadn't broken
any windows or anything, they simply jimmied the lock.  Strange thieves too,
they took my purse and ripped out the little change box in his car that
contained 45 cents or so, but left my tape collection *and* Paul's portable
cd player!  Go figure.  So we look around the parking lot to make sure that
maybe the thieves hadn't simply dumped my purse into a dumpster or something
after taking what they want.  Nothing of mine was found, altho we did find
someone else's purse that had been dumped along with her wallet, which we
took & called her to let her know we'd found her stuff.  But nothing of
mine.  So I had to go thru the usual rigamarole of calling the credit card
people & such, turns out these thieves had made charges to my card already,
they had gone to a gas station and made three $1 charges on it!  Hmm.  But
luckily I got it blocked before any more charges were made.  Anyway, for
some reason I was not overly disturbed by this.  I did realize that it could
have been much worse, the car & the rest of the contents were still there,
the biggest pain I had to go thru was having poor Paul drive me all the way
from Oakland to Pleasant Hill so I could get my spare house & car keys (my
originals were in my purse, so there was no way for me to get my car which I
had left in SF), and make those phone calls to the credit card folk.  Yeah
it sucks that people would do that in the first place, but I just know it
could have been way worse.  & it still didn't ruin the rest of my day which
was real nice & laid back.  And ya know what?  I get a call at Paul's house
later that afternoon from my roommate.  My roommate says that a lady called
the house to let me know she'd found my purse, and that it was almost
entirely still intact! :)  I figure I musta had some good karma stored up or
something, cuz I consider that real lucky to have happened.  She leaves it
hidden at her house for me, I pick it up, and she's right, it is almost
entirely intact.  A few papers were missing, but my wallet was there, my
passport was there, and my drivers license was there.  Even my checkbook was
still there!  (altho the fuckers went & stole my stamps!)  Only the couple
of credit cards I had already had blocked were really missing from my
checkbook.  That was really nice to make that recovery, the credit cards
were really something that would be easier to replace than a lot of personal
things I had in that purse, in addition to having to spend more money to get
a another one of similar quality to the first.  

Oh yeah, a big public embarrassing thank you to Paul Abramson who really
helped out a lot with this situation. Like I said, he drove me all the way
to Pleasant Hill from Oakland, and then back to San Francisco again, and
lent me money to be able to eat, which I really needed to do but hadn't yet
(& coffee, which I *really* needed to get!), and was just generally a great
& helpful friend! :)  The next time you see him at a party, he'll probably
have brilliant tangerine colored hair, so go up & say hi to him!


Ok, I'm done now!

Love,
Shawna


  *smurp*
     
      
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 18:25:21 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 18:25:09 -0700 (PDT)
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: cnielsen@earthlink.net (Courtney Nielsen)
Subject: any TR-727's lying around?
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Hello,
Does anyone have (or know who has, or know where there is) a Roland TR 727
fo' sale?
It's the latin compliment to the TR 707 Drum machine that came out around
'87 or so.
I'm lookin' to buy one...

Thanks for any help.

Courtney



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 18:51:34 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 18:51:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: (non rave) turntables wanted
To: trippen <trippen@aol.com>
cc: socal-raves@ucsd.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <31A78E3F.20B@aol.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605271820.A24184-0100000@ese.UCSC.EDU>
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On Sat, 25 May 1996, trippen wrote:

> looking for used 1200's please e-mail with price thanks....
> 
  I TOO AM INTERESTED IN SOME EQUIPMENT:
  2 TURN TABLES
  1 CROSSFADER/MIXER

  so let me know what is out there....THANX

      ___                ___           ___     
     /\__\              /\__\         /\  \    
    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
   /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
  /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
 /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
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       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/    











    







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 18:54:51 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 18:54:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tony Rose <trose@violet.berkeley.edu>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: kawai manual (RR?)
Message-ID: <Pine.ULT.3.93.960527185252.19185C-100000@violet.berkeley.edu>
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I Just borrowed a Kawai KI-ii  from a friend for the summer, but there
isnt a manual...do any of you know where I could look to find sa manual as
to how to progrqm this thing? Thanks :)

* * ** *** ***** ******** ************* ****************** 
Paul Anthony Rose
UC Berkeley Computer Science/ Mathematics
http://violet.berkeley.edu/~trose
TRANCE_HARDER--DEEPER--FASTER
****************** ************* ******** ***** *** ** * *


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 19:26:19 1996
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To: Tony Rose <trose@violet.berkeley.edu>
From: cnielsen@earthlink.net (Courtney Nielsen)
Subject: Re: kawai manual (RR?)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>I Just borrowed a Kawai KI-ii  from a friend for the summer, but there
>isnt a manual...do any of you know where I could look to find sa manual as
>to how to progrqm this thing? Thanks :)
>
>* * ** *** ***** ******** ************* ******************
>Paul Anthony Rose
>UC Berkeley Computer Science/ Mathematics
>http://violet.berkeley.edu/~trose
>TRANCE_HARDER--DEEPER--FASTER
>****************** ************* ******** ***** *** ** * *

I dont have a manual, but there is a place in Emeryville, shit, I cant
remember the name, but they usually have an ad in keyboard magazine, anyway
they sell manuals for virtually every synth. And they do mail order. (I'll
CC this message to SFraves, someone should know what the store's name is)

As far as the Kawai K-series, they are really easy to program. I have a K4
and I have played around on a Kawai K1 and they seem to be virtually the
same. Do you have any experience with synth programming? If you do, you
should have no problem. Let me know. If you don't I'll give you a primer.
All synths, no matter how fancy they are, have the same format as far as
fundamentals. It's just a matter of finding where the parameters are, and I
believe the layout of the K1 and the K4 are the same.

Hope this helps,
Courtney






From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 19:55:38 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 22:54:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: DJ Hardware <hardware@gate.net>
To: South East Rave List <SERAVES@american.edu>
cc: txraves@io.com, pb-cle-raves@hyperreal.com, ne-raves@world.std.com,
        DCRaves@american.edu, NW-Raves@hyperreal.com, MTN-Raves@hyperreal.com,
        MW-Raves@hyperreal.com, SFraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Adrenalin signing new material 
Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.93.960527224828.49308B-100000@hopi.gate.net>
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		A D R E N A L I N      R E C O R D S 

	Is looking for new material to sign. We are interested in
development of techno artist is the USA. We are looking for Hard House,
Progressive House, Trance, Acid Trance, Funky Breaks, Trip-Hop, Ambient,
and Hardcore Gabber and Techno track to sign to Adrenalin Records.

If you have a demo and would like to submit it to us for review for
signing to the label then send it to the following address. In the near
future we have many 12" vinyl releases coming out by Cotten Club from the
UK who is now signed to us, Stryke, The Tweakers and many more.....

38@send Demos to:
		Adrenalin Records
		Attn: DJ HARDWARE - Director of A&R
		13870 Oneida DR
		Suite C-2
		Delray Bch, FL 33446

our numbers are:

		PH: (407) 495 - 9954
		FAX: (407) 495 - 3919

	Hope to hear some new and innovative music real soon....


			Techno Music....... Fueling the Future.....


					Yours truly,


						DJ HARDWARE
					      ADRENALIN RECORDS
					       DIRECTOR OF A&R



    M   U   S   I    C       W   I  T  H      A         R   U    S  H  



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 20:06:37 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 23:06:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: DJ Hardware <hardware@gate.net>
To: South East Rave List <SERAVES@american.edu>
cc: txraves@io.com, pb-cle-raves@hyperreal.com, DCRaves@american.edu,
        Ne-Raves@world.std.com, MW-raves@hyperreal.com,
        MTN-raves@hyperreal.com, SFRaves@hyperreal.com, NW-Raves@hyperreal.com,
        jhouse@gate.net
Subject: Re: Bookings for July/ August / September 
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> > Hello all Rave lists Subscribers. My name is DJ Hardware and I'm the 
> > > > director of A&R at Adrenalin Records in New York. I currently live in 
> > > > South Florida where I base the A&R office for Adrenalin Records. I'm 
> > > > looking for DJ Gigs north of South Florida and across the USA where 
> > > > I have not played yet. Currently I have 8 mixed CD's out on Adrenalin 
> > > > Records in stores throught the world. They are:
> > > > 		- Trip - Hop Acid Phunk vol 1
> > > > 		- Trip - Hop Acid Phunk vol 2  
> > > > 		- Acid warfare vol 1
> > > > 		- House Stompin'
> > > > 		- Adrenalin Hardcore Rush
> > > > 	        - Trip-Hop Acid Phunk vol 3: The Hard Edition
> > > > 		- Electro Phunk 
> > > > 		- Beat Generator
> > > > 
	And Out in 2 Weeks:
> > > > 	  a 12" single BY : The Tweakers called "All Tweaked Out"
> > > > 		With remixes by DJ Voodoo & DJ DONAVAN
> > > > 			     and Stryke Vs. Hardware

> > > > If anyone is intrested in booking me at a club or event please contact me 
> > > > at the Adrenalin Records Offices in Florida for more information at (407) 
> > > > 495 - 9954 or the Fax number at (407) 495 - 3919 or Email me at 
> > > > hardware@gate.net.
>  
> > > > 						Thanks for your time......
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 							DJ HARDWARE
> > > > 						      ADRENALIN RECORDS
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Mon May 27 22:01:35 1996
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Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 22:01:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: JEFFREY PHILLIP MORGAN <jpmorgan@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: writers group
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hello all! I was just wondering if anyone knows if there are in existence 
any writers groups in the bay area for people who write rave fiction and 
rave poetry...if there is such a thing! I sure hope so! If not, lets 
aspiring writers get together and form one....its long overdue! Fiction 
and poetry these days, with a few exceptions, seems stale and recycled. 
Its time for us to step up and bring this new genre to publishers' attention!
well, thanks for your time....hugs and kisses to all the party going 
people out there.......:)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 00:50:18 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 00:52:12 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: socal-raves@ucsd.edu
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Heliotrope Review - A SoCal adventure..

Well,   surprisingly things have actually turned out as planned.    I
finally got my boxes of stuff together in time before Greg arrives to
pick me up.   We head over to Justin's place to store my stuff,  then
with Jeremy, Greg, and myself,  head south towards LA and got
underway.

We wasted no time getting down to LA and arrived about noon,
where I was to meet an old friend I haven't seen in 45 years.   Yes,
that's 45 years.   I tracked him down via the Internet,  amazingly
enough.    After that,  we head to Venice Beach to hang out and take
in the SoCal scene.

Late in the afternoon,  I tried many times to find a place to plug in
my laptop to post something to SoCal raves,  but none of the Kinko's
places we checked allowed us to plug in to check my mail,   but I was
able to find Kevin who had included his phone numbers in his mail
sig.   I cannot believe how BACKWARDS this country is in it's
telecommunications infra-structure.   Just about any other place in
the world,  they provide data jacks on the pay phones,  but NOT
HERE...

We hooked up with Kevin at the Santa Monica pier and made our
way to Heliotropic.    The info number said it was in Downtown LA at
some art studio.

The venue had NO free water,  but $2 a bottle,  with no running
water to refill the bottles.   I was constantly going around,  begging
for money so I can get some water.   As usual,  the place was stuffy
and very hot,  but the music more than made up for it.

Things started off with some jungle,   then moved into full goa
trance.    Excellent performance by Code IV performing live.   Our
very own Alien Life force tore the place to shreds,  playing some
amazing hard trance (The really fast kind).   WOW!!   Incredible.

I wish I could say I went ballistic,  but due to recent back injury,
my dancing was no way what I would call "up to par" but I did spend
a lot of time dancing this time..

Following Alien Life force was LA's Eric Daveport,  who played a little
slower stuff.    I managed to run into a few SoCal ravers,  and thanks
to Eric who bought me some water and saved me from certain
dehydration.

The rave ended at 6 am,  so we head out somewhere to get some
sleep before driving back.    We left in late afternoon and got back at
10 am.

Anyway...  Mike,  the promoter got us on his guest list,  Thanx Mike...
but next time,  please don't use that venue...  the owner is far too
greedy and has no concern for people's health...  not allowing access
to running water and charging $2 for it,  really SUX...   Is it THIS way
for all LA venues....   I'm so sorry that you SoCal ravers have to put
up with such greed.   So,  why not fight back and force those greedy
venue owners to provide at least some running water.    I've got
some ideas,   Email me....

Hello to all you SoCal ravers I met....   I really had a great time down
there,   but I sure wish that we had good trance parties up here,
instead of having them be so secret and underground,  and closed to
only those special people.

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 01:36:02 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 96 01:41:37 -0800
From: Marco_A._Mancia@sfbayguardian.com (Marco A. Mancia)
Organization: The San Francisco Bay Guardian
Subject: Tripping to ..............>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-ID: <1989656.ensmtp@sfbayguardian.com>
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Hey,      I am leaving for Eastern Europe in a few days,,,,,,,,,,,,,does
anyone have any info. for ,me,,,,messages to send,,,,,,,,,,,,cool places to go
and see, cool lists, squats,,,,,,people anything.  I will mostly be in Prague.
 Nightlife, cool hang outs, parties, anything.  Any newsgroups or
websites..................let me know....................


--

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sent via the Guardian Online.  415.437.3600 N81 or bbs.sfbayguardian.com, 3004
================================================================================

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 02:49:47 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 02:51:54 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Subject: FTT DJs
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Funky Tekno Tribe: nice production, lousy logistics--typically massive.
What I want to know is where were the DJs?  There were nine or ten billed,
if I recall correctly.  Now, I admit I wasn't paying very close attention,
but I sure didn't notice that many.  I got in around 12:30-1:00 and thought
I caught one til about 1:30, a second from then til 3:30, another to 5 or
so, and then one more to close.  Was there another room or something that I
completely missed?

Few or many, whoever they were got OFF.  Pity about SRL, though...now that
would have made for an event to remember.

anarch@scruznet.com



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 03:29:57 1996
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From: Benedict Simeon Pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
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To: John Draper <crunch@well.com>
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whoa!,
	that sounded like a cool party except about the water and such.
I that's why I didn't get to see u at either dune kings or spundae. I too 
have been kicked out of my dorm and taking the way of the wanderer.(hugs 
to all my loving friends whom have put up with me.)

Hope your back's okay and might see u on the mountain.

peace,
ionX

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 07:55:57 1996
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From: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9605281454.AA13738@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: FTT DJs
To: anarch@scruznet.com (Anarch)
Date: Tue, 28 May 96 7:54:43 PDT
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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> Funky Tekno Tribe: nice production, lousy logistics--typically massive.
> What I want to know is where were the DJs?  There were nine or ten billed,
> if I recall correctly.  Now, I admit I wasn't paying very close attention,
> but I sure didn't notice that many.  I got in around 12:30-1:00 and thought
> I caught one til about 1:30, a second from then til 3:30, another to 5 or
> so, and then one more to close.  Was there another room or something that I
> completely missed?

According to one of the DJs who was supposed to spin that nite, FTT got
off to a late start and he got bumped to the 2nd ("Gardening Club DJs")
sound system, which never got set up.  I wasn't there, so I won't offer
an opinion, but he felt that it was a big ripoff to charge $25 for that
party.  Supposedly, FTT is planning to throw a free one in the Park in
the near future.

Lee
_________________________________________________________________________
lxfogel@pacbell.com  (    (   (  ( ((0)) )  )   )    )  lee@hyperreal.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 09:06:54 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Re: someone stole my music!
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To everyone who receives this message:  I promise never to take anything
from you unless you offer it.  I promise to give you all my love, and ask
for or expect nothing in return.  It's in my nature to give and not to
take, but I'll gladly accept any kindness anyone cares to show.

Much love,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 09:15:40 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: Saturday night's Belano party
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It was at the beach near Belano State Park (or something like that), about
25mi north of Santa Cruz.  Don't know which crew it was.  "Formally" met
Wonka (I've seen him before, last year), and helped carry some gear down to
the beach.  Carried a speaker with the legendary John Carel, though we
didn't officially meet (Hi, John!).  Saw my bud Joey (of the Harmony Crew)
there, and helped gather some firewood.
The wind was fierce and bone-chilling, and blew lots of sand around.  All I
had on was a tee-shirt and an overshirt (yes, pants too :)), and couldn't
take the cold, so I bailed.  Hope the party went off BIG; I left just as
others were arriving.
Questions: what was this party called?  Which crew was it?

Peace,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 10:53:18 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Weekend....
Date: 28 May 1996 18:16:20 GMT
Message-Id: <2805725.25644620@compattic.com>
Organization: Computer Attic
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Howdy ho all!

Hope the weekend was good to ya'll as for me....

Friday nite I was chillin @ the F-8 mappoint socalising with Mars'n'Mystr-E.
(Mars new tape has a gobs and gobs of uplifting trance.. Worth a
Checkout...).  Ending up at a lil underground saturday morning...

Saturday was reserved for the Panther beach partie(s)-  Nice to have a scene
kind enuff to house two soundsystems on the same beach without any
disputes... Too bad the sheriffs dropped by to shut them down @ round'
6ish...

Saturday nite was reserved for a few friends , no dancing here. Contuing with
Sunday at a B-day partie and onto "Something Free".  Got there @ midnite. The
setup wasn't up... Stayed till 2 in the cold ( Cold, COLD) wind.  Still no
Music, so time to jet....

Monday was the traditional Labor day BBQ and stuff... 

Smile O Meter ratings....

Friday nite:  8 smiles (nice to be with friends...)

Saturday @ Panther Beach:  8 smiles  (Ditto Friday nite, big plus on the 1hr.
stall time before the sheriffs shut the system down).

Well that's it for now... 
Spaz get together up in Seattle this weekend from what I hear, as well as A
F-8 event Saturday night.  Decisions, decisions.....


"Dance with me.."

-Adam

____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 11:28:40 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 11:32:24 -0700
From: Diana Greer <inanna@ccnet.com>
Organization: The Lab
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To: sfraves@hyperrreal.com
CC: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Party Today??
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SF Ravers,

Does anyone know some good clubs that have rave parties during the week?

Time to play,
Diana

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 11:42:33 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 11:16:33 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: tactile@igc.apc.org (Derek Chung)
Subject: Win95 version of the Tactile1200
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Greetings,

Some of you may remember the interactive DJ turntable application I put up
on the web
for download last year - that was Macintosh-only.  The Windows 95 version
is finally
done for your PC's - it requires both QuickTime and DirectX, so it'll take
a while to download
if you don't already have those installed.

The Zip file is downloadable from http://www.tactilepix.com/demos.html;
please read the
instructions carefully, since having the right system extensions is
critical.  It's only been
up there a short time, so let me know if there are any problems.  In
particular, you may
have problems with the FTP server timing out because the file is so large.

There's a little info about the Tactile1200 in this month's i-D Magazine
and Mixmaster Morris mentioned
it in last month's Mixmag :-).

-Derek



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 11:47:05 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 11:46:34 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
Subject: NUMARK DM2160
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello,

I'm thinking about buying this mixer.  Any comments good or bad?

I can get one for $889 not including tax.  Is this a good price?

Thanks for your time.


Noah

___________________________________________________________________________

 Noah J. Ruiz
 SR SHIP/REC CLERK
 408-944-8050
 email: noah@cadence.com
 Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
___________________________________________________________________________



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 12:36:42 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 12:36:22 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Rave Article in the NYT
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Here we go again.  He actually calls former Deadheads who rave "Deadbeats."

Here's news to you all:  "The rave scene, like the Deadhead scene, is
turning into an autonomous, self-referential and self-perpetuating culture
with little desire to effect change in the outside world -- just to escape
it for a little while."

Yeah, escape *this* pal, we're just trying to get away from crap journalism
and bad music.

Anyway, enjoy....


>http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/news/arts/rave-festival-650.html
>
>front page of today's Living Arts Section.

Peace!

Tone

P.S.  Please pass it on to SoCal and NW



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 13:26:23 1996
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From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: The SFRaves homepage
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hey there,

Is it just me, or does the SFR homepage on hyperreal look a little dated to you?

I checked it out a few weeks ago, and I was thinking maybe it should get a
slick graphic facelift... I would gladly volunteer my time to improve it.
What do y'all think?

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 13:33:21 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 13:33:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tony Rose <trose@violet.berkeley.edu>
To: michal migurski <lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: The SFRaves homepage
In-Reply-To: <v02130505add0a2d4c264@[136.152.95.73]>
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I HIghly agree!...it also needs a software update...you know, more goodies
like simsynth for all of us to play with!

* * ** *** ***** ******** ************* ****************** 
Paul Anthony Rose
UC Berkeley Computer Science/ Mathematics
http://violet.berkeley.edu/~trose
TRANCE_HARDER--DEEPER--FASTER
****************** ************* ******** ***** *** ** * *

On Tue, 28 May 1996, michal migurski wrote:

> hey there,
> 
> Is it just me, or does the SFR homepage on hyperreal look a little dated to you?
> 
> I checked it out a few weeks ago, and I was thinking maybe it should get a
> slick graphic facelift... I would gladly volunteer my time to improve it.
> What do y'all think?
> 
> -m.
> 
> 
>         0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
>         |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
>         |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
>         |                                               |
>         |             (- My Portfolio! -)               |
>         |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
>         |                                               |
>         |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
>         |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
>         |                                               |
>         |              Michal Migurski                  |
>         |              (408) 264-6604                   |
>         0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 13:40:40 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 13:40:04 -0700
From: John Kawamoto <jkawamoto@excite.com>
Organization: Excite, Inc.
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Subject: My Dinner with Andre (long excerpt)
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Here's an excerpt from the video "My Dinner with Andre". The setting is
a restaurant and a famous playwrite, Andre Gregory, is having dinner 
with his friend Wallace Shawn. Their conversation is about Andre's
experiences at Finhorn (SP?) where people are able to grow plants in
soil that has no nutrients in it all among other scientifically
unexplainable phenomena and also about his experience at leading an
improvisational play with beatiful music in a Polish forrest with people
who could not speak any of his own languages. His interpretation of his
experiences seems to closely parallel our "underground"?

Peace and Love,
John

----

Andre:

"Finhorn people see it a little differently, they're feeling that there
will be these pockets of light springing up in different parts of the
world and that these will be in a way invisible planets on this planet,
and it as we or the world grow colder we can take invisible space
journeys to these different planets, refuel for what it is what we need
to do on the planet itself and come back. It's their feeling that there
have to be centers now where people can come and re-construct a new
future for the world and when I was talking to Gustav Bjornstron, he was
saying that actually these centers were growing up everwhere now and
what they're trying to do, which is what Finhorn was trying to do, and
in a way which was what I was trying to do...I mean these things can't
be given names but in a way these are all attempts at creating a new
kind of school or a new kind of monastery and Bjornstron talks about the
concept of reserves - islands of safety where history can be remembered
and the human being can continue to function in order to maintain the
species thru a dark age. In otherwords we're talking about an
underground, which did exist in a different way during the dark ages
among the mystical orders of the church ... and the purpose of this
underground is find out how to preserve the LIGHT ... LIFE! The culture!
How to keep things living! You see, I keep thinking that what we need is
a new language ... a language of the HEART, a language as in the Polish
forrests where language wasn't needed, some kind of language between
people that is a new kind of poetry, thats the poetry of the dancing bee
that tells us where the HONEY is! And I think that in order to create
that language you're going to have to learn how you can go thru a
looking glass into another kind of perception where you have that sense
of being UNITED to all things ... and suddenly ... you understand
everything!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 13:41:15 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 13:41:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
In-Reply-To: <v03006609add11294be2a@DialupEudora>
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As far as media portrayal of the rave scene goes, I thought this was
fairly positive and well-written. 

Do check it out, decide for yourselves.

Remember, all mass-media depictions of the scene are going to
suffer from a sort of pervasive ignorance despite any bad or good
intentions.  Media love to generalize on a subject, in order to cater to
the lowest common denominator.  Hence, some rather blatantly dumb
statements... :P

Regardless, it's nice to see the media focusing on the *cultural* aspect 
of raves for once!  


		jon


On Tue, 28 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:

> Here we go again.  He actually calls former Deadheads who rave "Deadbeats."
> 
> Here's news to you all:  "The rave scene, like the Deadhead scene, is
> turning into an autonomous, self-referential and self-perpetuating culture
> with little desire to effect change in the outside world -- just to escape
> it for a little while."
> 
> Yeah, escape *this* pal, we're just trying to get away from crap journalism
> and bad music.
> 
> Anyway, enjoy....
> 
> 
> >http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/news/arts/rave-festival-650.html
> >
> >front page of today's Living Arts Section.
> 
> Peace!
> 
> Tone
> 
> P.S.  Please pass it on to SoCal and NW
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 13:41:26 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 13:38:21 -0700 (PDT)
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To: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: NUMARK DM2160
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I got the exact same mixer for just under $600.  Don't pay that much for it.

Rick

At 11:46 AM 5/28/96 -0800, you wrote:
>Hello,
>
>I'm thinking about buying this mixer.  Any comments good or bad?
>
>I can get one for $889 not including tax.  Is this a good price?
>
>Thanks for your time.
>
>
>Noah
>
>___________________________________________________________________________
>
> Noah J. Ruiz
> SR SHIP/REC CLERK
> 408-944-8050
> email: noah@cadence.com
> Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
>___________________________________________________________________________
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 14:03:59 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 14:03:37 -0700 (PDT)
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To: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: OOPS: NUMARK DM2160
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I'm sorry, I made a mistake.  I thought you wrote 2060.  I got the 2060 for
that price.  Sorry again.

Rick

At 01:38 PM 5/28/96 -0700, you wrote:
>I got the exact same mixer for just under $600.  Don't pay that much for it.
>
>Rick
>
>At 11:46 AM 5/28/96 -0800, you wrote:
>>Hello,
>>
>>I'm thinking about buying this mixer.  Any comments good or bad?
>>
>>I can get one for $889 not including tax.  Is this a good price?
>>
>>Thanks for your time.
>>
>>
>>Noah
>>
>>___________________________________________________________________________
>>
>> Noah J. Ruiz
>> SR SHIP/REC CLERK
>> 408-944-8050
>> email: noah@cadence.com
>> Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
>>___________________________________________________________________________
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 14:07:19 1996
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To: noah@cadence.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: OOPS: NUMARK DM2160
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I'm sorry, I made a mistake.  I thought you wrote 2060.  I got the 2060 for
that price.  Sorry again.

Rick

At 01:38 PM 5/28/96 -0700, you wrote:
>I got the exact same mixer for just under $600.  Don't pay that much for it.
>
>Rick
>
>At 11:46 AM 5/28/96 -0800, you wrote:
>>Hello,
>>
>>I'm thinking about buying this mixer.  Any comments good or bad?
>>
>>I can get one for $889 not including tax.  Is this a good price?
>>
>>Thanks for your time.
>>
>>
>>Noah
>>
>>___________________________________________________________________________
>>
>> Noah J. Ruiz
>> SR SHIP/REC CLERK
>> 408-944-8050
>> email: noah@cadence.com
>> Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
>>___________________________________________________________________________
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 14:14:30 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 14:14:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v03006609add11294be2a@DialupEudora>
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On Tue, 28 May 1996, Tony Rotundo wrote:

> Here we go again.  He actually calls former Deadheads who rave "Deadbeats."

sheeee-yah!    beat THIS, buttmunch!

I forwarded this to Mountain-Raves, as well.

-John, the Proud "Deadbeat"

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 14:14:53 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 96 14:14 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Scott Hardkiss
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Help...I need either Scott's numba..or where he can be reached...
Hope someone can help...or point me in the right direction.
Thankyou in advance :)












                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 15:27:52 1996
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From: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
Message-Id: <199605281833.LAA21765@soda>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: New York Times article
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There is an article in todays New York Times about Raves. It is on the front
of B1, the Living Arts section. It focuses on weekend outdoor parties and
has the expected "Teenage Wasteland" NYT angle. It is perceptive on some
fronts, saying "the rave scene has grown and evolved on its own energy,
becoming an entrenched subculture that exists in a near-vacuum, similar
not only to the cults that gather around punk-rock or Gothic-rock music
but also to the Deadheads that followed the Grateful Dead." It carries
the Deadhead angle a bit far, describing in detail how the Dead and Rave
scenes are alike and claiming that many Deadheads are becoming ravers.
Does Neil Strauss (the writer of the article) read this list?

It ends with a discussion of the possibility that raves will become the
youth subculture of the baby boomlet generation. Anybody got a better
name for that cohort?

Peace,
Jim

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 16:01:08 1996
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Date: 28 May 96 18:58:33 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: SPUNDAE Review!  Whew!
Message-ID: <960528225833_71165.755_GHL94-1@CompuServe.COM>
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For all of those of you hardcore ravers who looked at me as if I were totally
out of my mind to be planning to go to Spundae after Sunset on Sunday....

WOOOOO HAAA!  IT ROCKED!!

I think this was the best club experience I've ever had out -- the energy at 11
pm was incredible already, and the place was only half open at that point ....
and it stayed high all night long!

There were four totally awesome dance areas -- we started in the smaller front
room (the main room was already too packed), danced some, went up to the roof,
hung out, went back downstairs to the big room which was ON FIRE -- THUMPING AND
POUNDING! then upstairs to the trip-hop rooms, with new comfy leather couches
(and the great company of Tom and Stacey and friends) .... then back all the way
down to the basement where Carlos and DJ Dan were so hot, I swear the
temperature was 100 degrees (oh, yeah, I think it WAS 100 degrees, way too hot,
but the music was too god to leave it)... back upstairs to chill and dance to
trip hop, back to the roof... back to the basement to dance more ... ending the
night in the front room on comfy couches after the music stopped, the best of
chill spaces....

All night long, every single space was totally perfect in its own way... I was
thankful that I got there early at 11, which meant I got a full 8-1/2 hours in
by the time I left at 7:30 .... every minute was great!

The crowd?  Lots of real ravers (met a new SFRaver who has a sheepdog and is
actually going to learn how to herd sheep -- what's your name again? I'm sorry,
I forgot!), plus lots of high-energy club people of all sorts from all kinds of
places -- these people were ALL having a great time, and the mix was totally
amazing.  I saw people from all over, even friends from Seattle who'd come down
for the weekend!

Weirdest moment? on the roof when all the security guys came running through,
climbing on the roof frame and edges looking for someone who must have snuck in
over the wall 3 floors up!  Like Lethal Weapon III!

So, now that I'm switching to a 3-day schedule at my job soon, I think you'll
see me at Spundae again, seeing if it's that fun on normal nights!

Here's to diversity in parties!  Leslie  : )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 16:19:59 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 16:19:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Benedict Simeon Pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
X-Sender: pere0103@mcs01
To: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: New York Times article
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I call it   r e g e n e r a t i o n   X
and a rave being the celebration of the continuity of incredible change.

love,
ionX

PS. I felt the vibe in a smile at FTT (i'm still glowing in it's warth)

On Tue, 28 May 1996, James Ausman wrote:

> There is an article in todays New York Times about Raves. It is on the front
> of B1, the Living Arts section. It focuses on weekend outdoor parties and
> has the expected "Teenage Wasteland" NYT angle. It is perceptive on some
> fronts, saying "the rave scene has grown and evolved on its own energy,
> becoming an entrenched subculture that exists in a near-vacuum, similar
> not only to the cults that gather around punk-rock or Gothic-rock music
> but also to the Deadheads that followed the Grateful Dead." It carries
> the Deadhead angle a bit far, describing in detail how the Dead and Rave
> scenes are alike and claiming that many Deadheads are becoming ravers.
> Does Neil Strauss (the writer of the article) read this list?
> 
> It ends with a discussion of the possibility that raves will become the
> youth subculture of the baby boomlet generation. Anybody got a better
> name for that cohort?
> 
> Peace,
> Jim
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 16:44:24 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 23:44:15 GMT
Message-Id: <199605282344.XAA00318@shgc.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: bulletproof@mission rock
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Well sounds like it was an ok weekend..for me pretty quiet, but on Monday
Bulletproof had a great afterparty at one of my favorites-Mission Rock.
Anyone know when the next one is? Some great House was in full effect and
the party was free no-less!.  That old-skool-recycle-krew was there,
basically a fine party and havent been to that space in awhile. To any
promoters on the list-get that space if ya can! I remember there were alot
of parties there awhile back-the view is amazing although it's kinda small.


About that New York Times article-sounds just like the ramblings of a
grumpy,jealous,old man who can't DANCE. I could be wrong.
Seeya
Mark


***********************************************************

Mark's primitive page-http://shgc-www.stanford.edu/~piercy/
____________________________________________________ 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 17:11:12 1996
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From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: James Ausman <ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: New York Times article
In-Reply-To: <199605281833.LAA21765@soda>
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> youth subculture of the baby boomlet generation. Anybody got a better
>name for that cohort?
			
			Hmmm.... Generation X is everyone's fave nowadays.

--kaysee


              ****Shit, goddamn, get off your ass and jam****


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 17:13:00 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: ausman@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: New York Times article
Date: 29 May 1996 00:59:48 GMT
Message-Id: <1297149950.27088945@compattic.com>
Organization: Computer Attic
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Funny thing is.. Raves always have and will always be here, Just under
different guises and names....
Be it beatnik gatherings,love fests of the 60's, speakeasies,underground
discos, Illegal ghetto parties (Remember Beat Street?) or any other
collection of persons for sub/counterculture activities  (If you also count
dancing as subcultureish...). 
 
Times change but the vibe is the same...

We are the future..

"Dance with me."


Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 17:18:45 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 17:18:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Uncle Noah <napodaca@ucdavis.edu>
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Subject: media representations of rave culture
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all these comments have made me think about how the media views us and 
our music.  I started noticing recently the big trend with stand-up 
comics to rip on techno music.  Anyone else notice this?  I went to see 
three commedians the toehr night and every one of them did a bit on how 
terrible techno music is.  Then, last night I happened to watch 
Politically Incorrect with Bill Mahr (sp?) and Bill and the panel (which 
included the top dude from Spin magazine) were discussing Tim Leary.  The 
discussion got to drugs (how did that happen?) and a comment went out 
that as soon as the government realizes that people have fun with a 
particular drug, the make it illegal, even if there aren't bad aeffects 
from the drug; as was the case with marijuana, 
LSD, ecstacy... and at that point, one of the comics on the panel said, 
"Yeah, but ecstacy makes you listen to really bad music!" and the crowd 
erupted into laughter.  
I don't know, maybe I'm just hyper-sensitized, but there is a lot of 
resistance out there.  And I just don't see why!  They don't make jokes 
about how rotten Nirvana is or how bad punk rock is or how sad it is that 
Aerosmith came back from the dead to milk a few more bucks out of the 
industry.  But if people enjoy a form of music that is too alternative, 
the American mainstream slams down upon them.  
I didn't mean to sound too bummed out and I hope I'm not sending out a 
bad vibe, it's just amazing to me.

Peace! :)

--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+----+--+---
                 "Uncle" Noah Apodaca - napodaca@ucdavis.edu
                    Student, Disc Jockey, Resident Advisor
  		      Listen to the Uncle Noah TV Show 
  		    The best in Techno and House music
   	        Saturdays, 3-5am only on KDVS 90.3fm in Davis


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 17:42:33 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: NRR - Female Boa for mating
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Hello!  If anyone out there has a male snake that can breed with a female
Columbian red-tail boa, please e-mail me privately.  My sister's boyfriend
has one that's very ready to mate.

Thanks,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 17:43:40 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 17:43:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Poor Me (not going to TF)
In-Reply-To: <960527190532_311412604@emout17.mail.aol.com>
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I am another sorry soul who is not going to Tribal Future.  You see, I
have been given the supreme honor of taking final exams in order to
complete my first year of medical school :P

So if you don't see me around for a couple of weeks just picture me
buried in my textbooks and there I'll be.

Last exam-June 15 and boy I'll be celebrating with a fury.  My plans for
the summer are simple: Rave, rave, rave, sleep a little, and spend three
weeks in Europe (raving) 

I'll miss you guys terribly at TF but I'll be sending my very extra
special jess-vibes in your direction so if you suddenly feel overwhelmed
with love and have an uncontrollable urge to boogie,  you'll know we are
connected through time and space.....:)

Don't feel sorry for me though - I plan on being naughty and spending next
Saturday night trancing in the forest at the Frequency 8 party....Who's
coming with me?


		crazy about you all, or maybe just crazy

			jess
		

On Mon, 27 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:

> For those of us poor few who can't make it out to Mendocino next weekend,
> does anyone have any FMR info?  Even wild guesses would be appreciated.
> Really wanted to make it to Tribal Future, but I'll be working the Envision
> Design Conference Fri & Sat, (<Anyone going to this?)
> Yanks,
> Steveo
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 18:28:26 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 18:28:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Matthew Boshko Abrams <marbs@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Full Moon Rave #
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605281850.A5873-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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I know that this number has been posted a hundred times, but can someone 
post the phone # for the full moon raves.  Thanx.

Matt
   Da
    Loaf

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 18:30:32 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 18:24:11 -0700
To: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: fritz@hooked.net (Greg-n-Cindy)
Subject: Re: Tribal Future info
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At 1:24 AM 5/22/96, ameba wrote:

>party. Directions to the map point in Willits will be posted on the VM
>263-3915 where you will show your ticket and recieve final instructions.
>Please try to arrive during the daylight hours on Fri, Sat, or Sunday,
>this will greatly help you in camping and locating the site which can be
>tricky at night.

just wondering if the map point will be open late friday and how early
saturday?  we may drive up after traffic friday which would put us at the
map point around 11 or 12 after stopping in santa rosa to get mark evju.

Peace & positivity,
GnC



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 18:31:59 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 18:25:52 -0700
To: SteveOSac@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: fritz@hooked.net (Greg-n-Cindy)
Subject: Re: SFR APB: Rachel (from Ohio)
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At 4:05 PM 5/27/96, SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:

>This is an unofficial APB for a one Rachel Channing of Columbus Ohio.  Last


this is my best friend.  gotta number she can call?  going to Tribal Future
- you'll see her there?

Peace & positivity,
GnC



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 18:50:02 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 18:51:41 +1000
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Need ride to Mt Jam this weekend,  PLEASE HELP
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hi...  My ride fell through for Mt Jam,  so if anyone is going up,   My friend
Justin and myself would really like a ride.    If anyone is going from SF,
or points south,   please let me or Justin know....  We already got tickets
and are really looking forward to going.    What say Starchild,  are you
taking your car up there?

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 19:07:07 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 19:06:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Deatherage <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: SDream <SDream@tgrigsby.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: IMPORTANT: IN TOUCH STUFF THAT CONCERNS YOU!
In-Reply-To: <199605272137.OAA19044@shellx.best.com>
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> >Now we KNOW it was the people at the DELI *BOTH 
> >TIMES*, since they're on some kind of trip and want to make as much as 
> >possible off the rave scene.
> 
> How do you know?  Please don't start any unsupportable rumors.  What are the 
> facts here?

Well, when the second time they ask us if we want to have it there BEFORE 
the cops have even arrived at the first location, it's a pretty good 
indicator...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 19:34:38 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
Subject: web pages 
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Hey: I plan to be building my own web page real soon for my studio -
primarily a house music studio - but I don't know where to begin. I would
like to include sound bytes of new records as well as previous ones, which I
plan to re-release. I have noticed a few software titles that let you
"build" a web page, does anyone know if those are any good? 
        I have a PowerMac 7200/90 w/ 16 megs RAM, a fair amount of graphics
software, lots of gear, not a lot of money. 
        Can anyone point me in the right direction? 

Thanks! 

Courtney 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 19:37:54 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
Subject: NYT article
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newspapers = 6th grade reading level.  They have to edit so the average
idiot can understand. Get a bad editor and you are screwed. 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 19:39:38 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 19:39:12 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Shuffle *this*...
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I'm off to a wedding in Buffalo tomorrow.  I'm rather psyched, actually,
because it doesn't appear as if there's anything really happening this
weekend that
*I'd* want to go to.  I mean, without a massive, the alternative is, like,
totally gross camping and dirty fetid hot tubs with crappy music and bugs.
Yuck!

Now a wedding in Buffalo, that's something special, something free;
something like "butt-ah."  Also, I just got off the phone with my dad
(always a treat).  Turns out my sister's grades sucked, and since she came
out here to visit it's all my fault. I was told that I should find lodging
elsewhere.  Thus, I'm looking for a cheap room in Buffalo, and fortunately,
there's nothing but.  I'm not bitter, really, but I am rather pissed at you
all for showing my sister such a good time her brain collapsed and she got
a D in Chemistry.  I also should let you all know that I'm selfish, have no
concept or respect for family values (he actually said that), and that I
better get in with the Republican's because they own the banks.  Ahhh,
yeah!?  Okay....

I'm not bitter.  As I said, there's nothing for me here this weekend.  I
won't even be thinking about you guys.

My father is sure that all I do is smoke dope, and thus if I start bawling
in the middle of the reception, say, when they put on the Chicken Dance,
his fears will surely be confirmed.  (I kind of wish I did smoke.  ;^)

Have a shitty time...:^)

Tone

P.S.  I wish I could have Jon Lee give me some pointers on the apporpriate
moves to bust for the Chicken Dance.  I think my move will be straight to
the bar for another martini.

P.P.S.  Keep me in your thoughts, I'm going to need all the support I can get.

Love



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 19:42:10 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 96 19:41 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: web pages
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> Hey: I plan to be building my own web page real soon for my studio -
> primarily a house music studio - but I don't know where to begin. I would
> like to include sound bytes of new records as well as previous ones, which I
> plan to re-release. I have noticed a few software titles that let you
> "build" a web page, does anyone know if those are any good? 
>         I have a PowerMac 7200/90 w/ 16 megs RAM, a fair amount of graphics
> software, lots of gear, not a lot of money. 
>         Can anyone point me in the right direction? 
> 
> Thanks! 
> 
> Courtney 

Well...Courtney...you shood just go and learn some html yerself ;)
But i know how annoying that is...you jus want the stuff up...right?
Adobe Pagemill
Pretty much the newest flashiest hippest web page authoring software 
Drag and Drop..web page creation
We can get it here for about $149cdn
Then theres the step up Sitemill...$420 (with Pagemill)

Goto the Adobe site..and they give all the info there...












                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 20:14:52 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 20:14:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: NRR - Female Boa for mating
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140b09add0eb17b906@[146.225.72.168]>
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LOL!


On Tue, 28 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> Hello!  If anyone out there has a male snake that can breed with a female
> Columbian red-tail boa, please e-mail me privately.  My sister's boyfriend
> has one that's very ready to mate.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> - E
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 20:15:31 1996
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From: b e n   c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
To: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: theron's tape...
Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 20:14:52 -0700
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hey there mr. tkagnoff at AOL, got your tape in the mail today... BAM! =
if ya haven't heard it, y'all need ta get the mutherfucka because the =
shit is on hit!

I agree, definately a HOT TRIP 2 GOA...

b e n   c h u n

ben_chun@community.net
http://community.net/~ben_chun/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 20:15:40 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 20:15:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: NYT article
In-Reply-To: <199605290235.WAA04543@norway.it.earthlink.net>
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> newspapers = 6th grade reading level.  They have to edit so the average
> idiot can understand. Get a bad editor and you are screwed. 

Actually, I think it's 4th grade :)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 20:43:14 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 20:47:15 -0800
To: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
From: tim@redshift.com (Tim Gotch)
Subject: Re: web pages
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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WWW stuff (among other things) is what I do for a living, and You don't
want to use one of those web generating programs like pagemill. While they
are really easy to use, you'll find that they really won't do what you want
them to do. My advice is to go out to a bookstore, and pick up a book on
html. It's really easy to learn, and you'll be much happier that you only
spent $20 instead of $200.
Good Luck
Tim

>Hey: I plan to be building my own web page real soon for my studio -
>primarily a house music studio - but I don't know where to begin. I would
>like to include sound bytes of new records as well as previous ones, which I
>plan to re-release. I have noticed a few software titles that let you
>"build" a web page, does anyone know if those are any good?
>        I have a PowerMac 7200/90 w/ 16 megs RAM, a fair amount of graphics
>software, lots of gear, not a lot of money.
>        Can anyone point me in the right direction?
>
>Thanks!
>
>Courtney

------------------------------------------------------------
                   Tim Gotch
                tim@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~tim
            Hyper Design Technologies
                hdt@redshift.com
           http://www.redshift.com/~hdt
             395 Del Monte Ctr. #128
                Monterey, CA 93940
      Nothing is true, everything is permitted
------------------------------------------------------------



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 20:50:26 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 20:50:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Full Moon Rave #
To: Matthew Boshko Abrams <marbs@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605281850.A5873-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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On Tue, 28 May 1996, Matthew Boshko Abrams wrote:

> I know that this number has been posted a hundred times, but can someone 
> post the phone # for the full moon raves.  Thanx.
> 
> Matt
>    Da
>     Loaf
> 
  If you could also take the time to enlighten me with the # as well, it  
  would be much appreciated.

      ___                ___           ___     
     /\__\              /\__\         /\  \    
    /::|  |            /:/  /        /::\  \   
   /:|:|  |           /:/__/        /:/\:\  \  
  /:/|:|__|__        /::\  \ ___   /:/  \:\  \ 
 /:/ |::::\__\  ~   /:/\:\  /\__\ /:/__/_\:\__\
 \/__/~~/:/  /      \/__\:\/:/  / \:\  /\ \/__/
       /:/  /            \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\  
      /:/  /             /:/  /     \:\/:/  /  
     /:/  /             /:/  /       \::/  /   
     \/__/ADAME         \/__/         \/__/ @cats.ucsc.edu   











    







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 21:03:38 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 20:57:32 -0700
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: fritz@hooked.net (Greg-n-Cindy)
Subject: Re: Shuffle *this*...
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>P.S.  I wish I could have Jon Lee give me some pointers on the apporpriate
>moves to bust for the Chicken Dance.  I think my move will be straight to
>the bar for another martini.

throwing things on the ice is the latest rage in hockey these
days...perhaps a live or dressed bird launched from a secreted place would
be appropriatly childish


>P.P.S.  Keep me in your thoughts, I'm going to need all the support I can get.


we will.


>Love


Peace & positivity,
GnC



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 21:14:28 1996
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From: Arthur Chandler <arthurc@sfsu.edu>
X-Sender: arthurc@pluto
To: "Eric P. Peterson" <epaul@Synopsys.COM>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: NRR - Female Boa for mating
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  Is this a great list, or what!   :<) 
  Bring 'em to a GG Park Rave and let them lead the dancing!

On Tue, 28 May 1996, Eric P. Peterson wrote:

> Hello!  If anyone out there has a male snake that can breed with a female
> Columbian red-tail boa, please e-mail me privately.  My sister's boyfriend
> has one that's very ready to mate.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> - E
> 
> 
> 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 21:38:53 1996
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From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: oraclE
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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free     free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free
     \*/     \*/      \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
	~	O	R	A	C	L	E	~
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-

GREETINGS FELLOW RAVERS...
	on may 31st, this friday, at UC SantaCruz,  crown college...
	come groove to the rhythms and beats of (((techno & house))) djs:
        
	s w o o p s -=*=- c l o u d s -=*=- b r i a n F l i p -=*=- mc2

	also relax and chill to the ambient grooves of live performace by:

			-=*=- dionysus dreams -=*=-

	this is a FREE event, sponsored by crown college, music spinning 
	starting at dusk, ending = ?

		for more directions: email liquid7@cats OR mhg@cats
	       >>408-471-5420<<		      >>408-471-7450<<

	-=>])} Please use public transportation from the base of campus  {([<=- 
		-for parking/entrance by car is restricted to students-
		-there is a bus/shuttle stop at the south gate, bay st.-

\___...Oh yeah, were just students throwing this party... a free party...
		...put on by sf-ravers  ...for sf-ravers
					\____...hope to see you there ;)

_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
 __    ____  _____  __  __  ____  ____  ___
(  )  (_  _)(  _  )(  )(  )(_  _)(  _ \(__ )
 )(__  _)(_  )(_)(  )(__)(  _)(_  )(_) )/ /
(____)(____)(___/\\(______)(____)(____/(_/@cats.ucsc.edu


  \  |           |                     \  |
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 22:06:27 1996
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To: Benedict Simeon Pereira <pere0103@sundance.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: New York Times article
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I will examine the article closely -- it is important for coverage to be
concise - if they do cover the "teenage wasteland" angle and nothing else,
they are being slack journalists. Sure, there is negativity that desrves
fair coverage, as does the positive . . . .

also - I gotta step up and say that I'm a deadhead (and hardly "former"!)
who has discovered the rave scene has a similarly enormous "good mojo"
about it, just as the dead's traveling road show did. I miss them so much,
you can't comprehend. but there's no end to the gladness I feel when
witnessing and participating in what the rave scene has to offer. the
scenes are cut from the same cloth. aside from the asthetic details of the
music, the rave scene and the dead scene spring from the same
dance-of-life. yes. the scraggly-ass drummers, for example, are common
elements between the dead and the rave thang. we are of one family.  From a
historical perspective, the rave scene is a direct descendent on Ken
Kesey's Acid Tests. But I'm sure that is old news to you-all.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 22:17:30 1996
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To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Here we go again.  He actually calls former Deadheads who rave "Deadbeats."
>
>Here's news to you all:  "The rave scene, like the Deadhead scene, is
>turning into an autonomous, self-referential and self-perpetuating culture
>with little desire to effect change in the outside world -- just to escape
>it for a little while."
>
>Yeah, escape *this* pal, we're just trying to get away from crap journalism
>and bad music.
>
>Anyway, enjoy....
>
>
>>http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/news/arts/rave-festival-650.html
>>
>>front page of today's Living Arts Section.
>
>Peace!
>
>Tone
>
>P.S.  Please pass it on to SoCal and NW

I read it this morning.  Some truth, some fiction, some new words, some old
reporter, whatever.  It won't be the first or last time someone tries to
pigeonhole something.

"Deadbeats"?  I dunno.  Here in the city of trust funds, and people
pretending to be poor, who the fuck knows. (BTW, I lived in LA for a while.
SF IS quite different.  Where else do you find people NOT grabbing for
BMW's, but bumming it by choice or worse, hiding the fact that they have
much $$$'s for the sake of fitting in...strange place indeed!)

Seriously though, some important issues were brought up.  Like really, what
HAS been the influence of rave OUTSIDE the rave sphere?  Please spare the
"techno in commercials". I am talking impact, not pablum.

Rave has been very autonomous from the onset, existing outside most other
common frameworks, save capitalism (which works well within our little
subculture).

As for deadheads, I see it a bit more these days.  The scene has changed
from my view, and now it definitely has the feel of a more hippie-crunchy
kinda flavor at times(it was more soulful when I started going out).  Just
my view.

The rest of that article was just that, another just-say-no to drugs
article very late on the fact that this scene as it may be, has taken a
life of its own, and operates outside of most common constructs.  People
really hate it when you do or think for yourslef.  That is all that article
said to me.

As I have always said, the media exists for one reason...its own existence.

Peace,
John

P.S.  You can blame many promoters for making things worse.  Many are all
too willing to talk to the press, about thier gig.  I remember I was
approached by a media type to talk about, er, stuff.  I told her I had
little to say, and that maybe she might want to go to a few events, instead
of dropping in and taking notes.  She then asked me when the next
underground is, I then asked , "When isn't there one?"  and walked away.

You want UG, don't talk to the press.  Live with snakes, die by them.

Shit used to be way more silent than now.  Soemtimes I long for the old
days, when the TELEPHONE and a VOICE on the other end was the ONLY WAY you
knew where a party was.  No call, no party.  Now *THAT'S* UG!

Out & Peace.



Side of mouth shit:

"Ruthless gangstah definition villian, keep your shit unlocked and I'm
stealin'!" - Eazy-E

Speaking of LA, when I used to rave/party there, I ALWAYS used to listen to
the most hardcore ass thumpin' rap before catchin some rave/dance/love
tunes @ a party.  That shit would have me pumped up to dance, keep me bold
enough to brave some of the roughest LA neighborhoods, and have me hyped
for anything, good or bad.  I love hardcore ganstah roughneck shit before I
bust love grooves.  Straight jackin' baby!

"I got a bone to pick cuz' I'm sick, of you muthafucka's talkin' shit, you
pick us up, you put us down, now I'm mad, time to talk about your dog
ass!..." - Geto Boys

"Word to your mother." - Vanilla Ice <- THE hardcore rapper bar nun! ;)







From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 22:38:09 1996
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From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Forwarded mail....
To: michael clay <meclay@netcom.com>
cc: Todd Yerman <tjyerman@cats.ucsc.edu>,
        "D. Steve White" <stevew@orion.oriontel.com>,
        sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>,
        Gregory Sandler <ascend@ix.netcom.com>, me <stacy@sirius.com>,
        Andrew Knudson <andrewk@sco.com>,
        James E Kaspar <James_E_Kaspar@notes.seagate.com>,
        Farouz Gipson <Farouz@cats.ucsc.edu>,
        shevaun gallant <she@xaostools.com>,
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        brandon estuesta <brandone@sco.com>,
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 20:51:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: -=]liquid[=- <liquid7@cats.ucsc.edu>
To: theList <asbc@cats.ucsc.edu>, bobduffy@cats.ucsc.edu, cag@cats.ucsc.edu,
    dania@cats.ucsc.edu, jcanio@cats.ucsc.edu, kdarnell@cats.ucsc.edu,
    lambchop@cats.ucsc.edu, maitai@cats.ucsc.edu, mhg@cats.ucsc.edu,
    mhope@cats.ucsc.edu, rheakerr@cats.ucsc.edu, rjeremy@cats.ucsc.edu,
    velocity@cats.ucsc.edu
Cc: mudbone@cats.ucsc.edu, gmo@cats.ucsc.edu, nike@cats.ucsc.edu,
    howard@cats.ucsc.edu, tara@cats.ucsc.edu, spin@cats.ucsc.edu,
    randream@cats.ucsc.edu, tiffer@cats.ucsc.edu, fooyoung@cats.ucsc.edu,
    mhg@cats.ucsc.edu, dave wills <jholmes@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: 

free     free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free
     \*/     \*/      \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
	~	O	R	A	C	L	E	~
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-

GREETINGS FELLOW RAVERS...
	on may 31st, this friday, at crown college...
	come groove to the rhythms and beats of (((techno & house))) djs:
        
	s w o o p s -=*=- c l o u d s -=*=- b r i a n F l i p -=*=- mc2

	also relax and chill to the ambient grooves of live performace by:

			-=*=- dionysus dreams -=*=-

	this is a FREE event, sponsored by crown college, music spinning 
	starting at dusk, ending = ?

		for more inFo email liquid7@cats OR mhg@cats
	       >>408-471-5420<<		      >>408-471-7450<<

	-=>])} PLEASE FORWARD THIS TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW, THANK YOU {([<=- 
			WERE LOOKING FOR A PHAT TURNOUT
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
 __    ____  _____  __  __  ____  ____  ___
(  )  (_  _)(  _  )(  )(  )(_  _)(  _ \(__ )
 )(__  _)(_  )(_)(  )(__)(  _)(_  )(_) )/ /
(____)(____)(___/\\(______)(____)(____/(_/@cats.ucsc.edu



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 23:22:27 1996
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From: b e n   c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
To: "'sfraves@hyperreal.org'" <sfraves@hyperreal.org>
Subject: singing/dancing around the campfire
Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 23:21:59 -0700
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I'm going camping with some friends, and I was wondering if you all have =
some suggestions of ways to sing and dance around a campfire... it seems =
like an awful lot of fun but without music playing I wouldn't even know =
where to begin. well, anyone?


b e n   c h u n

ben_chun@community.net
http://community.net/~ben_chun/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Tue May 28 23:52:56 1996
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Subject: Re: New York Times article
Date: Wed, 29 May 96 01:56:17 -0500
From: Alex Rosenberg <alexr@bungie.com>
To: <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>There is an article in todays New York Times about Raves.
..
>It carries
>the Deadhead angle a bit far, describing in detail how the Dead and Rave
>scenes are alike and claiming that many Deadheads are becoming ravers.

The event in question was "Even Further." There was even a picture of the 
bus on the flyer.

I'm glad I didn't go to it. It was hours away, raining and muddy, and 
filled with Chicago attitude. Burning Man it was not, I'm sure.

------------------------------------------------------
|  Alexander M. Rosenberg   <mailto:alexr@bungie.com>|
|  Bungie Software          <http://www.bungie.com>  |
|  Nobody cares what I say.                          |



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 00:13:04 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 00:12:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: tinsau <amdice@puc.edu>
To: b e n c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
cc: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: theron's tape...
In-Reply-To: <01BB4CD2.550BCB20@n161.solano.community.net>
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> hey there mr. tkagnoff at AOL, got your tape in the mail today... BAM! if ya haven't heard it, y'all need ta get the mutherfucka because the shit is on hit!
> 
> I agree, definately a HOT TRIP 2 GOA...
> 
> b e n   c h u n
> 
> ben_chun@community.net
> http://community.net/~ben_chun/
> 
Yes, I got mine in the mail recently and it is VERY well done. Excellent 
mixing and track selection. Thanks for the price break as 
well, especially on a 90 min. tape. If you like goa at all this one has 
something for you.

  Austin                             
  Tinsau                    

            S.F. Born and Raved!                          










From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 00:42:04 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 00:41:23 -0700
Message-Id: <199605290741.AAA13277@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Subject: adolescent rave perspective
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I've been working mostly on the adolescent unit at the hospitol where I 
work.  Today I overheard one kid telling the other about how she missed 
out on going to a rave this past weekend.  I decided to ask her more 
about her rave perspective.
I asked her if she likes techno, because I only hear her listening to 
rap music.  She says she likes techno, but added "you have to be on 
drugs to like that music". 
I asked her why she goes to raves.  "For fun" she says.  I told her "I 
hear alot of people who go to raves find it to be a spiritual 
experience."  Both of these 16 year olds just looked at me with a blank 
expression.
They asked me if I ever been to one, and if so what did i wear.  They 
said if I wore what i was wearing (green slightly baggy pants, nice 
button down shirt) I'd probably get jumped.  "You have to wear tye-dye 
type clothing"
I told them the rave I went to was more of an anything goes, all 
excepting type crowd.  When I told them it was on the beach they said  
"oh that's different, thats not what its like in the warehouse raves."

I asked them if they ever heard of plur which stands for peace love 
unity and respect and some ravers I hear use it as a set of ideals to 
live by.  Again blank expressions.

After talking with these two 16 year olds I felt kinda sad, thinking 
that there may be a major lack of spirituality to alot of the younger 
people going to raves.  

I am thankfull this isn't true for many, and as long as I can hear good 
music and can still enjoy dancing, I think there will always be some 
element of spirituality.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 01:49:40 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: kcroy@best.com (kcroy)
Subject: tribal future ride <grin>
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hello SFurry-creatures.
lost my ride up to the big mountain boogie, and wondering if anyone has
room for one or two voyagers. really really want to get out of the city and
do some dancin'. can offer gas, some food, backrubs, maybe some energy
therapy, and anything else i can dredge up along the way.

reach by email (quickest) kcroy@best.com
or voice (surest) 415.864.3647

take care,
kcroy



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 02:04:15 1996
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To: Courtney Nielsen <cnielsen@earthlink.net>
From: kcroy@best.com (kcroy)
Subject: Re: web pages
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Hey: I plan to be building my own web page real soon for my studio -
>primarily a house music studio - but I don't know where to begin. I would
>like to include sound bytes of new records as well as previous ones, which I
>plan to re-release. I have noticed a few software titles that let you
>"build" a web page, does anyone know if those are any good?
>        I have a PowerMac 7200/90 w/ 16 megs RAM, a fair amount of graphics
>software, lots of gear, not a lot of money.
>        Can anyone point me in the right direction?
>
>Thanks!
>
>Courtney
depends on what you are looking for. if its something really simple, and
you have a place to host it (i dont know how earthlink works) I could help
you througha lot of it. i personally think that most of the helping
software is bunk ('xcept BBedit, which is a nice editor). Really, it isnt
more than a few hours worth of work (i used to teach an intro compArt class
that icncluded web design) noone ever managed to _not_ make a page.)

http://www.ncsa.uiuc.edu/General/Internet/WWW/HTMLPrimer.html
Between this and looking at the source to otheres peoples pages should give
you a good start. Something that works really well when you are starting is
finding something you like, "view source", copy that source, and use it in
your page.

seriously though, feel free to drop me a line if you get stuck on
something. (yeah, yeah bored netSaint and all that)

hmmm.. will swap html for ride to TribalFuture this weekend :)

take care
kcroy



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 05:05:06 1996
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Message-Id: <199605291204.FAA02361@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: media representations of rave culture
To: napodaca@ucdavis.edu (Uncle Noah)
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 05:04:53 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SOL.3.91.960528171219.21784A-100000@elroy.ucdavis.edu> from "Uncle Noah" at May 28, 96 05:18:24 pm
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People are so funny.

I played house music to my mom and she said:  It sounds just like disco!

My mom is so right on.

My standard answer to the techno diss is to say:  Hey!  There's a zillion 
types of techno music, and each has its place and time to shine.  At four 
in the morning, you need something fast and weird to keep you going.  
At 8 in the morning, you need something smooth and funky to keep you 
happy.  And at midnight you need some house music to get you started off 
just right.

And then I start to rave on and on about trip hop and how it blows your 
mind.  That music is complex, man!  It's what our grandchildren will play 
on the way to the stars.

-Ann

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 05:15:05 1996
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From: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Message-Id: <199605291211.FAA02610@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Subject: I saw the shuttle tonite!!!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 05:11:33 -0700 (PDT)
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Tonite my boyfriend Gregg and I saw the space shuttle streak across the sky!!

It was an omen.  A man-made omen!

It was astonishing- a magenta star sailing proud as an angel across the 
sky.  It moved so fast!  And left behind it a thin, white track.  

Here's to you, beautiful traveler! Land safe and sound in Florida.

-Ann

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 05:26:53 1996
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From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: I saw the shuttle tonite!!!
In-Reply-To: <199605291211.FAA02610@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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> Tonite my boyfriend Gregg and I saw the space shuttle streak across the sky!!
> 
> It was an omen.  A man-made omen!
> 
> It was astonishing- a magenta star sailing proud as an angel across the 
> sky.  It moved so fast!  And left behind it a thin, white track.  
> 
> Here's to you, beautiful traveler! Land safe and sound in Florida.

Oh my god!  That's what I saw!  We thought it was just a plane with the 
moon lighting up the jet stream! :)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 06:18:26 1996
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To: Alex Rosenberg <alexr@bungie.com>
From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Subject: Re: New York Times article
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>>There is an article in todays New York Times about Raves.
>..
>>It carries
>>the Deadhead angle a bit far, describing in detail how the Dead and Rave
>>scenes are alike and claiming that many Deadheads are becoming ravers.
>
>The event in question was "Even Further." There was even a picture of the
>bus on the flyer.
>
>I'm glad I didn't go to it. It was hours away, raining and muddy, and
>filled with Chicago attitude. Burning Man it was not, I'm sure.
>
>------------------------------------------------------
>|  Alexander M. Rosenberg   <mailto:alexr@bungie.com>|
>|  Bungie Software          <http://www.bungie.com>  |
>|  Nobody cares what I say.                          |


Everyone probablly had a good time nonetheless. :)

Why do we have to go immediately to comparisons of who's was better?  Why
not just look at it as another type of celebration.  Which from the
article, it seemed it was.

As far as I am concerened, if there was no incident of violence, with all
that humanity (not to mention the Million Man March), it was ALL good!
Scott Hardkiss was there (at least one SFciscan representing), they said
nothing about violence or arrests, just a couple of freak-outs.  It
could've been written better.  But worse hack jobs have been done by our
local papers.

The author had some funny quips, but presented it as a brief look from the
outside of the culture.  We should be able to have others interpretation of
what they see, but they should get the whole picture, not just a late
edition snapshot.

It would be nice to know what the participants of the party/event, thought
about their event.

About this deadhead and rave connection, there is one, and there always has
been one.  In one way or the other.  There is little doubt though that
there is an active migration, heavier now than before.  Predictable.

Out,
John




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 06:29:50 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 06:29:44 PDT
Subject: Space shuttle???
Message-Id: <9605290629.S378767873@silicon.email.net>
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Are you sure it was the space shuttle??...and not the Mother ship? 
 
Just a thought, I didn't see it myself or anything on the News so I really am
not sure.
 
Tim (knucklehead)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 07:14:12 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 07:13:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
To: peter fogel <peterbf@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605290741.AAA13277@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
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As to the adolescent perspective - this is what we get when we thoughtlessly
dump 100's (1000's) of kids into large warehouses and mix in drugs
without any sort of initiation or connection with an experienced culture.
I'm very thankful I met raving through FnF where there are dozens of
connected people... makes for a whole different picture....

 Also, related are news stories about raving.... they can write things that
are TRUE and piss off people in the scene depending on who they inteview.
If they interview someone like you, Ethan or Bryce they get one story if
they were to interview those girls they would get another... so who's
telling the truth?  

  When you are blind about something you become a blind man grabbing the
elephant and truth becomes relative.... 

Mike


 meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic 
 Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 08:17:12 1996
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To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: OOPS: NUMARK DM2160 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 28 May 96 14:04:15 PDT."
             <199605282104.OAA03051@franc.ucdavis.edu> 
Date: Wed, 29 May 96 08:17:06 -0700
From: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>
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uhhh, doesn't all numark equipment suck??

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
==      Niels Mayer -- http://www.eit.com/~mayer -- mayer@netcom.com       ==
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 08:18:19 1996
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From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: I saw the shuttle tonite!!!
In-Reply-To: <199605291211.FAA02610@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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hahaaa!  i'm glad you recognized it ... when i saw the Shuttle a couple 
of months ago i had NO IDEA what it was :)  I looked up and there was 
this thing sailing serenely along ....

Get out there and stare at the skies whenever possible - you see 
interesting stuff if yer patient!

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 08:22:27 1996
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To: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: OOPS: NUMARK DM2160 
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Nope!  I'm quite happy with my numark equipment thank you.

Rick

At 08:17 AM 5/29/96 -0700, you wrote:
>
>uhhh, doesn't all numark equipment suck??
>
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>==      Niels Mayer -- http://www.eit.com/~mayer -- mayer@netcom.com       ==
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 08:24:50 1996
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From: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9605291521.AA24711@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Date: Wed, 29 May 96 8:21:53 PDT
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02130506add11fa21251@DialupEudora>; from "John S. Lee" at May 28, 96 10:17 pm
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John S. Lee:
>Seriously though, some important issues were brought up.  Like really, what
>HAS been the influence of rave OUTSIDE the rave sphere?  Please spare the
>"techno in commercials". I am talking impact, not pablum.

Well, in the SF Bay Area, a pretty exciting network of creative and
technical professionals has evolved, partially fueled by their
(mostly former) involvement with the rave scene.  Geoff White gave
a good listing a while back that included many of these startups.
I myself was heavily recruited at the Sunset Boat party by the head
of a multimedia/internet company who preferred working with "a
similar mindset".  Raving has always (but not exclusively) attracted 
people who look to the future with an appreciation of sensory
stimulation, mind expansion and open communication.  Raving 
together *has* had an impact.  And the eventual impact that such
people will have on the evolution of the internet/web/multimedia
and our overall culture could be very large. 

>Shit used to be way more silent than now.  Soemtimes I long for the old
>days, when the TELEPHONE and a VOICE on the other end was the ONLY WAY you
>knew where a party was.  No call, no party.  Now *THAT'S* UG!

This still happens.  Perhaps there's an underground that even you
don't know about. :)  But let's face it, most people don't want to
go to parties that are so far underground that only the same exclusive
clique goes to them.   Such parties only go off (IMO) when
there aren't many other good choices.  Not that there's anything
wrong with a bunch of friends getting together,  but there's nothing
like the fresh energy exchange and unity that happens when it's with
people who *don't* know each other.

Lee
_________________________________________________________________________
lxfogel@pacbell.com  (    (   (  ( ((0)) )  )   )    )  lee@hyperreal.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 08:52:57 1996
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To: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>,
        "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
Subject: Re:NUMARK DM2160
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Then what are your suggestions??  You can strike out MTX and Gemini I have
no interest in these brands.  How about some input folks!

Goodday,

Noah

At 8:17 AM 5/29/96, Niels P. Mayer wrote:
>uhhh, doesn't all numark equipment suck??
>
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>==      Niels Mayer -- http://www.eit.com/~mayer -- mayer@netcom.com       ==
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 08:57:52 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605291556.IAA29567@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 08:56:40 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: tony@xinet.COM, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02130506add11fa21251@DialupEudora> from "John S. Lee" at May 28, 96 10:17:20 pm
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> Seriously though, some important issues were brought up.  Like really, what
> HAS been the influence of rave OUTSIDE the rave sphere?  Please spare the
> "techno in commercials". I am talking impact, not pablum.

I think this is a moot point.   The whole idea of an underground rave scene
is that it is seperate from trying to impact the rest of society.  I think
if we look back to the sixties, where there was a huge push to have the
subculture clash directly with mainstream culture, mainstream culture always
won out.  I don't really expect the rave culture to change our existsing, sick
culture.  Instead, I see 2 different cultures... one rising up and one
fading away.  I mean, the only way rave spreads is from one person to another.
Try as we will, but a positive view of raves will never be seen in the mass
media.  All we can do is try our best to make sure they are not outright 
lying (as in the Hard Copy story), and present our views as articulately as
possible in other information channels not owned by transnational corperations.

> As I have always said, the media exists for one reason...its own existence.

Brainwashing the masses.  Defining a reality within narrow materialistic
parameters.  Supressing thought.  Distracting people from the true
reality.  ect, ect, ect.  

Rave mailing lists are one of the most valuable tools we have to spread the
rave culture.

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 09:31:29 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 09:31:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFR APB: Rachel (from Ohio)
In-Reply-To: <v02120d01add157f5ff96@[206.80.9.167]>
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On Tue, 28 May 1996, Greg-n-Cindy wrote:

> At 4:05 PM 5/27/96, SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:
> 
> >This is an unofficial APB for a one Rachel Channing of Columbus Ohio.  Last
> 
> 
> this is my best friend.  gotta number she can call?  going to Tribal Future
> - you'll see her there?
> 

See, everyone, look at our marvelous community where we are actually just 
one extended family.  Where everyone knows everyone else.  It is really a 
special treat.

--KaySEE

              ****Shit, goddamn, get off your ass and jam****



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 09:50:38 1996
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Date: 29 May 1996 09:49:07 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <mark_camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: TEST!!!!!ERASE!!!!NO RAVE C
To: "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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There's Nothing Here!!!!!?????


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 09:55:44 1996
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From: Jim Cyr <surfpunk@well.com>
Subject: Frequency 8 (BSP)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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For those who prefer small, outdoor parties with
GOA, Hard Trance and other auditory explorations  . . .
Saturday June 1st - A Full Moon Party In The Woods
45 minutes north of San Francisco and only $5.00
(we do this because we love the music we play)

Frequency 8 with Ivo, MARS, Myster-E and Cyr (in that order)
from 11pm to 6am
Because the space is small, we are limiting this to only 150
prepurchased tickets at F-8, the store, please call (415) 221-4142
for ticket information.

As always we strongly suggest that you bring a flashlight and wear
sensible shoes :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 10:05:37 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 09:58:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: Lee Fogel <lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM>
cc: "John S. Lee" <jsl@netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, Lee Fogel wrote:

> Well, in the SF Bay Area, a pretty exciting network of creative and
> technical professionals has evolved, partially fueled by their
> (mostly former) involvement with the rave scene.  Geoff White gave
> a good listing a while back that included many of these startups.
> I myself was heavily recruited at the Sunset Boat party by the head
> of a multimedia/internet company who preferred working with "a
> similar mindset".  Raving has always (but not exclusively) attracted 
> people who look to the future with an appreciation of sensory
> stimulation, mind expansion and open communication.  Raving 
> together *has* had an impact.  And the eventual impact that such
> people will have on the evolution of the internet/web/multimedia
> and our overall culture could be very large. 

Yeah boyeeeeeeeeee!   THIS is how "rave values" will make it to the 
mainstream media without the filter of the old skool media 
conglomerates.  Memetic expression of PLUR is and will continue to 
subvert the "spectacle" of the mediasphere, IMHO.  

> don't know about. :) But let's face it, most people don't want to 
> go to parties that are so far underground that only the same 

I've personally tried to subvert the mainstream by confronting this 
alienation, and bringing the "rave vibe" to reporters by process of 
partying and (outright seduction) with them. (Some of you may remember 
the Zippy Pronoia spectacle from a few years back).   We had some very 
great success in getting the media to steer away from the anti-drug 
paranoia, and the villification-for-ratings phenomenon.   Lots of people 
read about "zippies" talking about raving and using technology for the 
first time, within a positive light.  Ironically, it was this exposure
which ultimately allowed the megalomania which many times accompanies an 
eruption of "underground" counterculture to the mainstream culture... and 
brought the whole "zippy vibe" crashing to the same floor Mondo 2000 and 
others currently sleep on.  IMHO, of course.   =)

This argument was very well defined and heated (even within this list) 
back then, and included many people from the international rave scenes.  
One of the recurring themes was that overground exposure brings dilution 
of "the vibe", and beer-soaked frat boys at raves when Hootie concerts 
sell out, etc.  The counter to that is this:  Nature Abhors A Vacuum.  In 
other words, new undergrounds will ALWAYS evolve from the disillusionment 
of the old.  Beatniks--> Hippsters --> Hippies --> Punks/Goths --> Ravers 
and on and on and on...

Just my two cents... have a groovy day!

-john

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 10:11:09 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 10:10:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: peter fogel <peterbf@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, peter fogel wrote:

> I've been working mostly on the adolescent unit at the hospitol where I 
> work.  Today I overheard one kid telling the other about how she missed 
> out on going to a rave this past weekend.  I decided to ask her more 
> about her rave perspective.
> I asked her if she likes techno, because I only hear her listening to 
> rap music.  She says she likes techno, but added "you have to be on 
> drugs to like that music". 
> I asked her why she goes to raves.  "For fun" she says.  I told her "I 
> hear alot of people who go to raves find it to be a spiritual 
> experience."  Both of these 16 year olds just looked at me with a blank 
> expression.
> They asked me if I ever been to one, and if so what did i wear.  They 
> said if I wore what i was wearing (green slightly baggy pants, nice 
> button down shirt) I'd probably get jumped.  "You have to wear tye-dye 
> type clothing"
> I told them the rave I went to was more of an anything goes, all 
> excepting type crowd.  When I told them it was on the beach they said  
> "oh that's different, thats not what its like in the warehouse raves."
> 
> I asked them if they ever heard of plur which stands for peace love 
> unity and respect and some ravers I hear use it as a set of ideals to 
> live by.  Again blank expressions.
> 
> After talking with these two 16 year olds I felt kinda sad, thinking 
> that there may be a major lack of spirituality to alot of the younger 
> people going to raves.  

Thanks for the perspective.  I've often wondered how some of the many 
adolescents I see feel about raving.  Unfortunately, my encounters have 
been similar to yours.  

Being a teenager is very difficult.  It is your 
first glimpse of being an independant human being, but at the same time 
you really are not.  Speaking from my experiences as a teenager, that 
time was a period of my life you couldn't pay me millions of dollars to 
re-live.  There is no tolerance for individuality; everyone tries their 
best to fit in, to be cool.  I actually refer to this phenomenon as the 
"cool-factor."

Being cool, unfortunately, means there is one standard way to do it, and 
all other ways are only worthy of disdain.  Hence, the occurance of a 
hierarchy of "cliques" and labeling such as "jocks", "nerds", and now 
"ravers"?  I can imagine what raving is to many teenagers.  It has become 
to a certain extent mainstream, and has now entered the "cool-factor."

Raving is the perfect activity to enter the cool-factor because in it are 
three things essential to establishing your place in the teenaged hierarchy: 
1) clothes 2)music 3) drugs.  I remember when I was a teenager, and 
partying (not raves-didn't have them) was cool.  HOnestly, to be a part 
of the IN-crowd you had to drink and do drugs and have the right clothes, 
and listen to the right music.  In that way, you could earn respect 
(however misdirected) from your peers.  When you are an adolescent and 
you desperately want to fit in, peer pressure almost always works it magic.

So, I can understand how the kids that Peter talked about replied the way 
they did.  It is probably not  a way of spirituality for many, but rather 
a way to fit in.  I want to qualify my comments by stating that they are 
wholely MY observations and MY experiences (especially my experiences as 
a pained teenager).  I am not that far from my teenaged years, and I 
sympathize greatly with many of the experiences.  And, not every teenager 
is the same.  Many people do different things with their lives, and many 
don't succumb to the pressures of being a teenager.  But, by all means, 
just like the rest of life, it is difficult and has pressures unique to it.

Hopefully many, just by being exposed to the spiritual side of raves, 
will eventually incorporate some of it into their lives.  I'm sure we 
have teenagers on this list that can elaborate and tell us what raving 
means to them. :)

Much respect,
KaySEE


              ****Shit, goddamn, get off your ass and jam****


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 10:32:48 1996
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From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Zippies?  was Re: Rave Article in the NYT
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, John Bagby wrote:

> 
> partying and (outright seduction) with them. (Some of you may remember 
> the Zippy Pronoia spectacle from a few years back).   We had some very 
> great success in getting the media to steer away from the anti-drug 
> paranoia, and the villification-for-ratings phenomenon.   Lots of people 
> read about "zippies" talking about raving and using technology for the 
> first time, within a positive light.  Ironically, it was this exposure


Could someone educate this ignorant lil' raver and tell me what the whole 
Zippy thing was?  I've heard about this over and over, but have yet to 
learn what it/they is/are.  

Mucho thanks,
kaysee

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 10:34:15 1996
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Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
Date: Wed, 29 May 96 11:37:42 -0600
From: Andy Hawks <andy@cmac20.colorado.edu>
To: "Sanfrandisco Raves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>After talking with these two 16 year olds I felt kinda sad, thinking 
>that there may be a major lack of spirituality to alot of the younger 
>people going to raves.  

I'm 22, I've been going to parties for about 4-5 years in Colorado, but I 
can honestly say I didn't see raves as anything "spiritual" until the 
last couple years.....I don't really know if I saw *anything* as truly 
spiritual until the last couple years....

A certain amount of that lack of spirituality comes from, simply and 
stereotypically, youth.  Most 16 year-olds don't know themselves well 
enough, don't know their world well enough, haven't really experienced 
enough to *gnow* a spiritual experience. Those that do are the exception 
rather than the rule by far, I'd say.  

Also, what you get out of rave culture, your opinions on what it's really 
all about, are largely shaped by your environment....If you come from a 
circle of friends that's young and not very spiritual-minded you're 
probably less likely to look at parties from that perspective....But if 
you're on SF-Raves or have read Hyperreal, read a lot of philosophy, do a 
fair amount of x or acid and little else, go to parties all the time, 
etc., etc., you're probably more likely to identify with the spiritual 
spect of rave culture.

All anyone can do in this regard is break down barriers that prevent 
people from seeing things in a different light.  So props for hinting at 
the spiritual possibility of rave culture for these kids.  Undoubtedly, 
the next time they go to a party, that's gonna cross their head.  And 
then it's up to them to do something with the seed you planted.  

   


       __                                              __
   ___/  )           andy@andy.colorado.edu           (  \___
  (___) (_____   peace<->love<->unity<->respect   _____) (___)
  (___)> _____    believe in the power of love    _____ <(___)
  (___)_/                                              \_(___)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 10:38:26 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 10:35:57 -0800
To: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
Subject: Re:NUMARK DM2160
Cc: bpm@dhp.com
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Ok! I think I have made a choice for the RANE MP-22 ($724.32).  The only
question I have is for the Numark DM2160: it gives the option to assign the
left ear to the left table and the right ear to the right table.  Rane
doesn't give that option.  So is this option that big of an advantage or is
it hardly used?  Comments?

Noah




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 10:44:36 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 96 10:44 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re:NUMARK DM2160
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IMO...huge advantage...
BUT it all depends what YOU like.
The Rane is a nice board...Im a sucker for Numarks...but I heard their
quality and workmanship has been going down the tubes ever since they just
about bit the dust a few years back.
Anyway...back to the topic at hand...I WISH I could assign 'ears' on my
mixer...i only have a small one now ;) But its a nice treat.

> Ok! I think I have made a choice for the RANE MP-22 ($724.32).  The only
> question I have is for the Numark DM2160: it gives the option to assign the
> left ear to the left table and the right ear to the right table.  Rane
> doesn't give that option.  So is this option that big of an advantage or is
> it hardly used?  Comments?
> 
> Noah
> 
> 
> 
> 












                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 10:48:26 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605291748.KAA21294@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net (Troy Sheets)
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 10:48:15 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605291556.IAA29567@xanadu.cyborganic.net> from "Troy Sheets" at May 29, 96 08:56:40 am
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> 
> 
> > Seriously though, some important issues were brought up.  Like really, what
> > HAS been the influence of rave OUTSIDE the rave sphere?  Please spare the
> > "techno in commercials". I am talking impact, not pablum.
> 
> I think this is a moot point.   The whole idea of an underground rave scene
> is that it is seperate from trying to impact the rest of society.  I think
> if we look back to the sixties, where there was a huge push to have the
> subculture clash directly with mainstream culture, mainstream culture always
> won out.

On a macro scale, perhaps.  But you had alot of kids from different 
backgrounds, in the 60's, getting introduced to each other.  Music was 
part of the unification glue.  These people, from that point on unlike 
thier parents, met and even talked to, on a human-to-human basis with 
people far different than they.  This had an impact, no doubt.  The 60's 
weren't ALL wasteful.


> I don't really expect the rave culture to change our existsing, sick
> culture.  Instead, I see 2 different cultures... one rising up and one
> fading away.  I mean, the only way rave spreads is from one person to another.
> Try as we will, but a positive view of raves will never be seen in the mass
> media.  All we can do is try our best to make sure they are not outright 
> lying (as in the Hard Copy story), and present our views as articulately as
> possible in other information channels not owned by transnational corperations.
> 

Agreed.

> > As I have always said, the media exists for one reason...its own existence.
> 
> Brainwashing the masses.  Defining a reality within narrow materialistic
> parameters.  Supressing thought.  Distracting people from the true
> reality.  ect, ect, ect.  
> 

Agreed, etc. etc. :)

> Rave mailing lists are one of the most valuable tools we have to spread the
> rave culture.
> 
> -troy
> 

Whoaaa doctor!  I don't necessarily beleive this at all, and think this 
is more technology as lifestyle hype.  The people who have access to this 
have a computer.  This tends to be the minority of the people involved in 
dance culture.  This also tends to limit the exposure to the point where 
exclusivity is damn near unavoidable.  Yeah, people find out about things 
through others via the list, but you gotta know someone on the list. I 
think this is harder to access for most than a simple telephone call.

I think one of the most valuable tools we have to spread the rave culture 
is our voice, our hands in peace, and a good solid telephone connection, 
7 digits and a voice on the other end asking "So, where is it?"  and the 
reply is "A warehouse on xxxxxxx and yyyyyy.  Bring some friends, it 
oughta be good!".

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
> tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
> http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
> troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within
> 

Peace,
John



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 10:50:09 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 10:49:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Bagby <cubensis@well.com>
Subject: Re: Zippies? was Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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http://myhouse.com/pronoia/tour/FAQ/FAQ_zippies.html


On Wed, 29 May 1996, KaySEE wrote:

> Could someone educate this ignorant lil' raver and tell me what the whole 
> Zippy thing was?  I've heard about this over and over, but have yet to 
> learn what it/they is/are.  
> 
> Mucho thanks,
> kaysee
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 11:08:13 1996
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To: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re:NUMARK DM2160
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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My Numark 2060 has a cross fader for the headphones, which I find to be an
incredible advantage over the assignable left/right in the headphones kinda
thing, or the either on/off buttons that the Rane's have.  I find I can beat
mix much more precisely with the crossfader feature....but then again, I may
just need more practice.  

Rick

At 10:44 AM 5/29/96 PDT, you wrote:
>IMO...huge advantage...
>BUT it all depends what YOU like.
>The Rane is a nice board...Im a sucker for Numarks...but I heard their
>quality and workmanship has been going down the tubes ever since they just
>about bit the dust a few years back.
>Anyway...back to the topic at hand...I WISH I could assign 'ears' on my
>mixer...i only have a small one now ;) But its a nice treat.
>
>> Ok! I think I have made a choice for the RANE MP-22 ($724.32).  The only
>> question I have is for the Numark DM2160: it gives the option to assign the
>> left ear to the left table and the right ear to the right table.  Rane
>> doesn't give that option.  So is this option that big of an advantage or is
>> it hardly used?  Comments?
>> 
>> Noah
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>                          peace
>                         bill.e
>            .com communications
>http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/
>
>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 11:12:46 1996
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From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Subject: Re: Zippies?  was Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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You wrote: 
>Could someone educate this ignorant lil' raver and tell me what the 
whole 
>Zippy thing was?  I've heard about this over and over, but have yet to 

>learn what it/they is/are.  
>
>Mucho thanks,
>kaysee
>
>From what I remember, the zippys which were pretty much led by this guy 
named Frazier (who I'd rather forget :)), wanted to revolutionalize the 
world with rave culture.
Frazier didn't go over very well with most of us sfravers as he had 
specific ideas about what raving is and thought we should follow his 
way of raving, thinking that his way is the best way.
This is a brief description of the zippy thing from my perspective, 
though there is more to it which you can most likely get from the 
archives.

:)
peter

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 11:16:21 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 11:15:41 -0700 (PDT)
To: Andy Hawks <andy@cmac20.colorado.edu>
cc: Sanfrandisco Raves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
In-Reply-To: <1378752630-306661@cmac20.Colorado.EDU>
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, Andy Hawks wrote:

> >After talking with these two 16 year olds I felt kinda sad, thinking 
> >that there may be a major lack of spirituality to alot of the younger 
> >people going to raves.  
> 
> I'm 22, I've been going to parties for about 4-5 years in Colorado, but I 
> can honestly say I didn't see raves as anything "spiritual" until the 
> last couple years.....I don't really know if I saw *anything* as truly 
> spiritual until the last couple years....

It also may well be that the viewing of raves as "spiritual" events is 
San Franciscocentric. I get the impression from talking to people from 
areas other than the Bay Area, and from reading posts from people that 
have gone to parties elsewhere that the "spiritual" aspect is not present(I 
won't say lacking,) or least as not as much an issue. Does this make any 
sense?

                                                      
                                             Black Adder
 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 11:31:18 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: anyone have the old tahoe phone list?
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hello all tahoe people-

anone still have on their computer the old tahoe list?  i got a message
asking for a copy and i can't find mine.  any takers?


thanks!

peace, love, and phones-

matt l
matthew d. p. k. lanier             /\    "peace within us, peace over us,
lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu         /  \     peace under our feet.
                                  /    \     peace behind us, peace around us,
home 415-752-3218                / ++++ \     let all around us be peace."
                                /  ++++  \        -david haas, prayer for peace
                               /   ++++   \
"i looked out my       ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   "deep within,      
window, saw the cross  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    i will plant my law.
unaccesable,           ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++    not on stone,
saw the empty seats        /       ++++       \      but on your heart
reserved for the wealthy, /        ++++        \      follow me,
the bread reserved for   /         ++++         \      i will bring you back
the full, the wine for  /          ++++          \      you will be my own,
the drunk, the roof    /           ++++           \      and i will be your god.
for those with homes, /____________++++____________\      return to me, 
and wondered,                      ++++                    with all your heart
would jesus have been catholic?"   ++++      and i will bring you back."

     -me, 1996                                    -david haas, deep within



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 11:41:33 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: surfpunk@well.com
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Frequency 8 (BSP)
Date: 29 May 1996 19:29:43 GMT
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>>As always we strongly suggest that you bring a flashlight and wear
sensible shoes :)

Heh, the words sensible and F-8 in the same context... That's pretty
funny....


"Dance with me"


Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 11:43:39 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605291843.LAA02078@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
To: blkadder@value.net
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 11:43:23 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: andy@cmac20.colorado.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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> > I'm 22, I've been going to parties for about 4-5 years in Colorado, but I 
> > can honestly say I didn't see raves as anything "spiritual" until the 
> > last couple years.....I don't really know if I saw *anything* as truly 
> > spiritual until the last couple years....
> 
> It also may well be that the viewing of raves as "spiritual" events is 
> San Franciscocentric. I get the impression from talking to people from 
> areas other than the Bay Area, and from reading posts from people that 
> have gone to parties elsewhere that the "spiritual" aspect is not present(I 
> won't say lacking,) or least as not as much an issue. Does this make any 
> sense?
> 
>                                                       

It makes sense, but I don't think it is just a sfcentric thing.  Talk
to anyone who has been to a Moontribe in LA... serious spirituality there.
But even if people don't call it spiriutality per se, I think there can
still be good vibe.   Over the Christmas break I went to Seattle and checked
out a great little party.  People had lots of energy and were really into the
music and everyone was nice.  Dancing is generally a spiritual experience.
But you don't tend to label it as such if you are in a nightclub or a
warehouse.  Sometimes, it takes dancing to the sunrise in the middle of a 
vast desert with panoramic 200 mile views to make you label an experience
as "Spiritual"

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 11:56:38 1996
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From: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9605291854.AA01611@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Date: Wed, 29 May 96 11:54:15 PDT
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605291737.KAA19984@netcom20.netcom.com>; from "John S. Lee" at May 29, 96 10:37 am
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John S. Lee sez: 
> I have never looked at UG as some unique clique.  I think SFR is more of 
> a clique than the overall culture.

Really?  Except for a few of us diehards, the personnel on this list
keeps changing.  Don't post for a couple of months and  hardly anyone
know who you are.  Perhaps the list is exclusive to those with
internet access, but it's hardly a clique.

> [...]  UG, IMO, is all about communication between people who trust one 
> another.  It certainly is not about making a general announcement on a 
> list of over 400+ people, I tend to think of them as more personal.

I think it's pretty cool when you can trust that a non-UG party will
have enough great music and enough of a vibe that people will come 
together with unity and respect.  With an underground, where fully
trusted people are carefully preselected, sure, you get good results,
but the accomplishment just doesn't seem as special.  You brought
together people who already are together.  Not much *new* trust is
created.  But everyone has a blast, and maybe that's the main goal.

> alot of spoiled brats complaining about what isn't at a party (there is 
> always a list opf what wasn't there).  Hell, if they would've gone to the 
> first equinox, held in a very sweaty e-filled warehouse in Hunters Point, 
> they would appreciate the bean bag and 1.25 water.  It's all a matter of 
> historical perspective.  To me, many of these "kids" (i.e. new skollers) 
> are soft.  But that's just me.

Well, count me as an old skooler who has gone soft.  I get more out
of (and can give more to) a party when I'm not hot, dehydrated and 
pressed up against someone's back.  I used to put up with
that kind of punishment when it was the only way to get near
the music I love.  I understand the bonding-through-shared-pain
thing, but I prefer to bond through shared pleasure.  YMMV.

> No, UG has it's place, and I think it keeps the scene very real.  It's 
> nice to go to a party that had no flyers, and is only avaialbe by vox 
> contact.  I guess it requires some networking, but to me, it is well 
> worth the effort.  

> > Such parties only go off (IMO) when
> > there aren't many other good choices. 
> 
> This is not so.  UG's are held even when there are other popular massives 
> or better known parties.  They still manage to go off.  Wassup?

Yes, true.  I retract my original statement.

> > Not that there's anything
> > wrong with a bunch of friends getting together,  but there's nothing
> > like the fresh energy exchange and unity that happens when it's with
> > people who *don't* know each other.
> 
> There is also nothing like being with people you trust.  People you can 
> hang out with, people who know how to handle their substances w/o use of 
> an ambulance, people who will take care of each other.  There is 
> something to say about both kinds fo energy, I just like it when there 
> are more expereienced folks to help direct such energies.

This does happen (sometimes) at parties that you would not consider to be
trictly undergound.  I guess it's all matter of degree.

>   I know plenty of old 
> skoolers who hang out at UG's and have a really good time.  No biitchin' 
> about water or a place to chill out.  People are talking chatting 
> laughing, and goofing on each other and the newbies.  New people get 
> introduced to some of the skoolers, and the tradition lives on.

Yeah, the whole *scene* thing can be fun.  And the scenes within the
scene; that sense of belonging, of being cool 'cause of who you know.
It can all be very superficial as well, the "I'm cool, you're cool"
mindset.  What ever happenned to getting down on the dance floor
and connecting to complete strangers through the music?

> It's all good.

Agreed!

> (Unity cannot happen without familiarity.  Introductions go alot farther 
> than a chance meeting at a party.)

Well, there's the Unity of the moment, which I've seen happen purely
through music and dance, and then there's the unity of the scene, which
I think you are focusing more on, and is needed to sustain a sense of
community.  Both are important.

> P.S.  And yes, I do go out alot more now that I'm spinning, and planning 
> on doing some events this year.  Time to get back and catch the groove.

Looking forward to seeing you!

Lee
_________________________________________________________________________
lxfogel@pacbell.com  (    (   (  ( ((0)) )  )   )    )  lee@hyperreal.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:02:50 1996
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Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 12:02:34 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: John Carel <john@bass-station.com>
Subject: Re:NUMARK DM2160
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>My Numark 2060 has a cross fader for the headphones, which I find to be an
>incredible advantage over the assignable left/right in the headphones kinda
>thing, or the either on/off buttons that the Rane's have.  I find I can beat
>mix much more precisely with the crossfader feature....but then again, I may
>just need more practice.
>
>Rick

Both Ranes (the MP-22 & MP-24) have cross-fading for the headphones,
although it's not a crossfader, it's a knob. I know with the 24 it's
possible to assign a turntable to each ear, and I think you can with the
22, too. The sound quality on either of them will blow away any Numark
(IMO).

-john

>At 10:44 AM 5/29/96 PDT, you wrote:
>>IMO...huge advantage...
>>BUT it all depends what YOU like.
>>The Rane is a nice board...Im a sucker for Numarks...but I heard their
>>quality and workmanship has been going down the tubes ever since they just
>>about bit the dust a few years back.
>>Anyway...back to the topic at hand...I WISH I could assign 'ears' on my
>>mixer...i only have a small one now ;) But its a nice treat.
>>
>>> Ok! I think I have made a choice for the RANE MP-22 ($724.32).  The only
>>> question I have is for the Numark DM2160: it gives the option to assign the
>>> left ear to the left table and the right ear to the right table.  Rane
>>> doesn't give that option.  So is this option that big of an advantage or is
>>> it hardly used?  Comments?
>>>
>>> Noah
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                          peace
>>                         bill.e
>>            .com communications
>>http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/
>>
>>



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:14:36 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 12:14:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>
cc: San FranDisco Ravers List <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: OOPS: NUMARK DM2160 
In-Reply-To: <199605291517.IAA26004@netcom23.netcom.com>
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> uhhh, doesn't all numark equipment suck??

Not the old Numark stuff... just the new Gemini/Numark stuff...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:16:10 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 12:15:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Noah Ruiz <noah@cadence.com>
cc: San FranDisco Ravers List <sfraves@hyperreal.com>, bpm@dhp.com
Subject: Re:NUMARK DM2160
In-Reply-To: <v02170507add2413a4430@[158.140.4.128]>
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> Ok! I think I have made a choice for the RANE MP-22 ($724.32).  The only
> question I have is for the Numark DM2160: it gives the option to assign the
> left ear to the left table and the right ear to the right table.  Rane
> doesn't give that option.  So is this option that big of an advantage or is
> it hardly used?  Comments?

I would agree, except for I kinda like to have a crossfader :)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:18:58 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: media representations of rave culture
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>"Yeah, but ecstacy makes you listen to really bad music!" and the crowd
>erupted into laughter.
>I don't know, maybe I'm just hyper-sensitized, but there is a lot of
>resistance out there.  And I just don't see why!  They don't make jokes
>about how rotten Nirvana is or how bad punk rock is or how sad it is that
>Aerosmith came back from the dead to milk a few more bucks out of the

I think it's because techno is such a completely different *form* of music
than rock... for one thing no one respects it because it's "fake" (it is).
People who don't listen to techno are accustomed to the usual "musician ->
star" progression, and they get confused because making techno music
doesn't take much  practice, so how can anyone be a fan and how can anyone
be accorded respect for making such a simplistic form of music? However,
unlike rock music, the typical techno musician doesn't really expect any
kind of star-type recognition... for the most part, they remain pretty much
anonymous (with some exceptions like orbital or the prodigy). The musicians
are basically in the business to provide DJs with music... listening to a
typical trance single is pretty boring; it doesn't _really_ become music
until it's mixed with other songs playng at the same time... it's like the
DJ is the musician, and the records are just instruments. No one wants to
listen to a single tambourine being hit over and over, but when it's
"mixed" with a bunch of other instruments it becomes "music," just like a
boring trance single becomes music when a DJ takes control and actually
uses it to provide a changing mood.

Then there's gabber...

boomboomboomboomboomboomboomboomweeweeweeweeboomboomboomboom

Gabber just flat out confuses me.

I think my point escaped me somewhere in here...

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |               (- Portfolio! -)                |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        |                                               |
        |"The skies are gray, but today they seem blue."|
        |                                               |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:31:35 1996
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References: Your message of "Tue, 28 May 96 14:04:15 PDT."            
 <199605282104.OAA03051@franc.ucdavis.edu>
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 12:35:17 -0600
To: "Niels P. Mayer" <mayer@netcom.com>
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: OOPS: NUMARK DM2160
Cc: "San FranDisco Ravers List" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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At 9:17 AM -0600 5/29/96, Niels P. Mayer wrote:
>uhhh, doesn't all numark equipment suck??
>
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>==      Niels Mayer -- http://www.eit.com/~mayer -- mayer@netcom.com       ==
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Nope. New Numark equipment is mode by a different manufacturer than the
older mixers that everybody has (1750, 1800, 1950, etc.) The original
Numark went bankrupt awhile back and somone else bought the name. I don't
know much about the quality of newer mixers, but I haven't heard anything
bad. The older Numark stuff is fine, but certainly not in the same class as
Biamp, Urei, or Rane.

MTX supposedly is designed and/or made by some of the original Numark
engineers and has a decent reputation for mid-priced equipment.

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:39:59 1996
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From: rlunatic@ix.netcom.com (Adam Luong)
Subject: Tribal Future and Plastik
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Uhhhmmm..

Is it me or is Carlos spinning at Tribal Future and at Plastik on the 
same night?


=)~


Adam (R.Lunatic)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:40:52 1996
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From: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Message-Id: <199605291939.MAA05292@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 12:39:29 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605291854.AA01611@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM> from "Lee Fogel" at May 29, 96 11:54:15 am
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Before we get into flame wasr about newbies, old-skool, new-skool etc.  
Let me preface by saying this was private e-mail.  It was not meant to be 
read by everyone.  I still stand by what I say though.

> 
> John S. Lee sez: 
> > I have never looked at UG as some unique clique.  I think SFR is more of 
> > a clique than the overall culture.
> 
> Really?  Except for a few of us diehards, the personnel on this list
> keeps changing.  Don't post for a couple of months and  hardly anyone
> know who you are.  Perhaps the list is exclusive to those with
> internet access, but it's hardly a clique.

I was applying your definition, from my view, of what a clique was.  The 
list is a cliquey as any arty that has any exclusivity.  The fact that 
you need internet access is enough of a limiting factor, IMO.


> 
> > [...]  UG, IMO, is all about communication between people who trust one 
> > another.  It certainly is not about making a general announcement on a 
> > list of over 400+ people, I tend to think of them as more personal.
> 
> I think it's pretty cool when you can trust that a non-UG party will
> have enough great music and enough of a vibe that people will come 
> together with unity and respect.  With an underground, where fully
> trusted people are carefully preselected, sure, you get good results,
> but the accomplishment just doesn't seem as special.  You brought
> together people who already are together.  Not much *new* trust is
> created.  But everyone has a blast, and maybe that's the main goal.
> 

Did you read the post Lee (or should I say private e-mail).  I said that 
new people are brought in.  It's not all that.  New people are what has 
kept this thing going as long as it has.  I do argue about how things are 
done.  But there is no argument that new people are the fuel of dance 
culture.  And it is that aspect, new people, trusted new people, getting 
involved, then going off and doing their own thing.  It's all about 
netoworking, gaining trust & respect, and sharing it with others.  NOT 
holding it to one's self.

As for new trust?  It is created all the time in UG.  Trust that.
It wouldn't be happening if it weren't for new people gettin' involved.

> > alot of spoiled brats complaining about what isn't at a party (there is 
> > always a list opf what wasn't there).  Hell, if they would've gone to the 
> > first equinox, held in a very sweaty e-filled warehouse in Hunters Point, 
> > they would appreciate the bean bag and 1.25 water.  It's all a matter of 
> > historical perspective.  To me, many of these "kids" (i.e. new skollers) 
> > are soft.  But that's just me.
> 
> Well, count me as an old skooler who has gone soft.  I get more out
> of (and can give more to) a party when I'm not hot, dehydrated and 
> pressed up against someone's back.  I used to put up with
> that kind of punishment when it was the only way to get near
> the music I love.  I understand the bonding-through-shared-pain
> thing, but I prefer to bond through shared pleasure.  YMMV.
> 

To each his own.

> > No, UG has it's place, and I think it keeps the scene very real.  It's 
> > nice to go to a party that had no flyers, and is only avaialbe by vox 
> > contact.  I guess it requires some networking, but to me, it is well 
> > worth the effort.  
> 
> > > Such parties only go off (IMO) when
> > > there aren't many other good choices. 
> > 
> > This is not so.  UG's are held even when there are other popular massives 
> > or better known parties.  They still manage to go off.  Wassup?
> 
> Yes, true.  I retract my original statement.
> 
> > > Not that there's anything
> > > wrong with a bunch of friends getting together,  but there's nothing
> > > like the fresh energy exchange and unity that happens when it's with
> > > people who *don't* know each other.
> > 
> > There is also nothing like being with people you trust.  People you can 
> > hang out with, people who know how to handle their substances w/o use of 
> > an ambulance, people who will take care of each other.  There is 
> > something to say about both kinds fo energy, I just like it when there 
> > are more expereienced folks to help direct such energies.
> 
> This does happen (sometimes) at parties that you would not consider to be
> trictly undergound.  I guess it's all matter of degree.
> 

All depends on if I and others trust the person who is doing the show.  
But I agree, it's all a matter of degree.


> >   I know plenty of old 
> > skoolers who hang out at UG's and have a really good time.  No biitchin' 
> > about water or a place to chill out.  People are talking chatting 
> > laughing, and goofing on each other and the newbies.  New people get 
> > introduced to some of the skoolers, and the tradition lives on.
> 
> Yeah, the whole *scene* thing can be fun  And the scenes within the
> scene; that sense of belonging, of being cool 'cause of who you know.
> It can all be very superficial as well, the "I'm cool, you're cool"
> mindset.  What ever happenned to getting down on the dance floor
> and connecting to complete strangers through the music?
> 

I ask myself this everythgime I hear someone complain about a chill space 
(a relatively new invention).  As for connections, from what I see and 
hear, they are still being made.

I do not think this is all about being cool or whatever characterization 
you continue to allude to.  I think it is a matter of direct 
communication, building trust, nad hanging out with friends you've 
connected with or been introduced to.  If there is any "cool" part, it is 
the direct communication and trsut that is built.  The rest of that "seen 
and be seen" ain't what I'm talking about.

As far as I am concerned, everyone is in a scene.  Admitted or not.  As 
you gravitate from one place to another, you get to know the parties 
people associate themselves with.  As a result you start to see the same 
faces you've seen at the last event.  If familairity is a scene, then 
we're all in scene's one way or another.  

When I use scene, I mean dance culture.

> > It's all good.
> 
> Agreed!
> 
> > (Unity cannot happen without familiarity.  Introductions go alot farther 
> > than a chance meeting at a party.)
> 
> Well, there's the Unity of the moment, which I've seen happen purely
> through music and dance, and then there's the unity of the scene, which
> I think you are focusing more on, and is needed to sustain a sense of
> community.  Both are important.
> 

I have seen both.  My focus?  Is on dance culture, and how it can be 
nurtured for further growth.

Unity of the scene?  I have never said that, I have talked about unity of 
people, communication, trust, hangin' out with those you trust, etc.  
Goals, I think are common to all of us in one way or another.  I think 
you mistook some of what I said, but it happens.

And the ouside world looks onto us as a scene so....it's all a matter of 
perspective.

Unity of the moment?  It happens!  Although I find it a rare commodity 
these days.

> > P.S.  And yes, I do go out alot more now that I'm spinning, and planning 
> > on doing some events this year.  Time to get back and catch the groove.
> 
> Looking forward to seeing you!
> 
> Lee
> _________________________________________________________________________
> lxfogel@pacbell.com  (    (   (  ( ((0)) )  )   )    )  lee@hyperreal.com
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 

I hate it when e-mail is broadcast.  Other than that, peace.

Out,
John


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:47:45 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 12:47:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: WISH tonight?
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Anyone up for a little visit to Wish at Bahia tonight?  I *was* going to
stay in this week, but.....  :) :) :)

) Paul (


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:48:51 1996
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From: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9605291947.AA03222@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: Rave Article in the NYT
To: jsl@netcom.com (John S. Lee)
Date: Wed, 29 May 96 12:46:59 PDT
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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John S. Lee:
> Before we get into flame wasr about newbies, old-skool, new-skool etc.  
> Let me preface by saying this was private e-mail.  It was not meant to be 
> read by everyone.  I still stand by what I say though.

Yikes!  Didn't realize that was private. Apologies for my carelessness.
I'll leave John with the last word on this.

Lee

> I hate it when e-mail is broadcast. 

Me too.  oy.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 12:59:53 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 12:59:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: SFcentric - LONG
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It _is_ true that california in general and SF in particular are some of
the new-age capitals of the world and as such, discussions of spirituality
are much more commonplace and acceptable here than many other places.

However, having spent last summer in the UK, where I grew up, I must say
that I was surprised at the number of discussions relating to PLUR and
spiritual things - topics which are often scorned and laughed at outside
of the rave scene.

Young people in England are pretty harsh with each other - "bitch" is your
favorite word for your best friend and groups of young adults will spend a
lot of time "slagging each other off" (teasing each other in a sort of
pointed and painful way) - you have to really toughen up to be able to
take it.  I used to get my feelings hurt a lot.

Also, young people in England and most other European countries have
pretty negative feelings about the US and turn their noses up at things
that smack of americanism - such as discussions of PLUR and spirituality
at raves for example - which they consider to be frank proof of how
shallow and superficial americans are - all touchy feely with no
substance, no honestly and no sense of reality 

HOWEVER, I almost fell over backwards at a rave in England last year when
some bloke told me that the scene in SF was reported to be "really
beautiful with lots of people loving each other".  And, if you read
UK-dance (which I highly recommend if you want to get out of your american
imperialist, self-centered attitude that thinks that this country is the
center of the universe), you will find references to PLUR and things
spiritual....so it isn't just SF afterall.

I personally think that the English have a lot to thank for raves and for
E because it's softened a rather harsh social scene.  So, this
spirituality that we talk of _is_ the reason other people in other parts
of the world are so hooked on raving - even if they don't talk about it in
those terms or as often.

But I also think we have something to learn from those people who aren't
so committed to the spiritual side of things as well as people who
criticize this aspect as being phoney and shallow.  I think we often use
PLUR as a way to avoid conflict and sometimes as a way to avoid the
realities of our relationships with each other - there are beautiful
things at raves, and there are some very ugly things.  Life isn't about
just looking at the beautiful things, it's about seeing reality, in all
its forms and about coming to some inner peace about that reality - it
_must_ be ok the way it is just because it _is_ that way - that doesn't
mean
that it has to be all nice and fuzzy and palatable all the time.  The
English prefer a harsh look at reality and, I would suggest, tend to err
on
the side of emphasizing the negative - we USers, especially in SF tend to
try and focus only on the positive things (peace man) - I think some
merger of the two is where the real power lies.  You wanna get really
high?  then let go of the PLUR crap and really LOOK at what life is all
about - then you will find beauty even in the ugliness and that's when
you'll be set free


	ranting and raving,
		jess


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 13:22:29 1996
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To: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.edu>
From: "Matthew D. Lanier" <lanima00@dons.ac.usfca.edu>
Subject: Re: WISH tonight?
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hey paul- (and anyone else that might be going)

keep an eye out for me, i might be there!  i'm 5'9", a little pudgy, red
haired goatee-ed yuppie looking raver type with a big black bag.  i look
foreward to meeting you!


peace, love, and raving-


matt l


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 13:37:42 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 16:37:06 -0400
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: FM# & Tard Copy #  Pl,Pl,Pleease
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Did someone ever re-post the Hard Copy ph/fax#?  I'm still needing it. I
suggest we use it as our very own frustration release hotline.  Just keep it
on your speed dialer and use it as often as neccessary to relieve
frustrations of the day.  Also NEED FM# TOO (A direct post on this one would
be sufficient)
Thankses,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 13:38:12 1996
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Damn I just love this shit!
You meet someone from across the country in the middle of the desert.  You
part ways forever. A year later you type a little letter send it down a phone
 line.. and bammo! 15 brothers and sisters bangin on your door just to tell
you where that person is on this very night!  Thanks all!
Steveo

"Mmmm mmm, I love technolog-g-g-g-g..."
-Sigue Sigue Sputnik

Thanks John, I'll try calling tommorow!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 13:46:37 1996
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Subject: keeping plur in check (Re: SFcentric - LONG)
Date: Wed, 29 May 96 14:50:20 -0600
From: Andy Hawks <andy@cmac20.colorado.edu>
To: "Sanfrandisco Raves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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>But I also think we have something to learn from those people who aren't
>so committed to the spiritual side of things as well as people who
>criticize this aspect as being phoney and shallow.  I think we often use
>PLUR as a way to avoid conflict and sometimes as a way to avoid the
>realities of our relationships with each other 

i agree wholeheartedly...

there's no question in my mind that the hedonistic positive atmosphere 
created at parties -- comprised of a plur ethic that fades havily when 
the party's over, use of x and other drugs, indulgent ritualistic dance, 
and the very nature of walking around the space sharing smiles/candy/toys 
with strangers and people you abrely know -- has so much potential to 
create within a person an almost lobotomized bliss, and if that outlook 
becomes your dominant approach to the world, then you're in 
trouble...that's when plur becomes shallow, phony, and an escape....

a lot of "party people" live in this state of mind...i think it's vital 
to get beyond that, and, as you say later, look at all of life -- don't 
be blinded by plur, that's not a Good Thing.  when you find yourself 
surrounded by numerous acquaintances and shallow friendships and lacking 
in a comfortable amount of long-term and substantive connections, when 
you find yourself reading flyers instead of the New York Times, when 
everyone close to you is someone you'll see at the next FMR, if you're 
all plur on the outside and all wrecked up on the inside, those are all 
signs that it's time to re-broaden your perspective of the world.

the plur attitude, like any other mindset comprised of powerful feelings 
and a desire to affect other people with it, can be dangerous if not kept 
in check...people don't think that there can be anything negative about 
peace, love, unity, and respect, but there definitely can, especially in 
a culture as innately self-indulgent as rave.  i mean, every war is 
fought in the name of furthering peace.  

when a community is in the building process there's always that stage 
where things are "fake" and on the surface for the purpose of creating 
ties that bind tht allow the community to be built further and extended.  
i think global rave culture on the whole is still pretty much in that 
stage, even after 10 years.  after that -- and after the falling out and 
the hard times that always follow -- there's the opportunity for real 
community to be established.  that means that there is potential within 
rave culture for true peace, true love, true unity, true respect.  but we 
should never lose site of the fact that just because we talk about it and 
practice it in small ways doesn't mean we've truly achieved it -- it just 
means we're on the path. i think it's a journey worth taking.

> Life isn't about
>just looking at the beautiful things, it's about seeing reality, in all
>its forms and about coming to some inner peace about that reality - it
>_must_ be ok the way it is just because it _is_ that way - that doesn't
>mean that it has to be all nice and fuzzy and palatable all the time. 

props.

> You wanna get really
>high?  then let go of the PLUR crap and really LOOK at what life is all
>about - then you will find beauty even in the ugliness and that's when
>you'll be set free

it's just all about acceptance of things as they are -- letting go of 
desires to change things in your own vision, letting go of fear of things 
you don't understand or don't gnow about....the more you're able to 
accept yourself and your world, the more it instills within you a sense 
of true well-being and, yeah, freedom. ugly things lose their ugliness, 
power/greed/selfishness fade to nothingness, fear is replaced by love.  

but i think it's wrong to say "let go of the plur crap"....  the plur 
ethic is a tool and as long as it's kept in check like i said above i 
think it's a very valuable tool that for some is a guide along parts of 
the path to freedom. there's no one path to personal freedom -- it's an 
infinite sky.          




       __                                              __
   ___/  )           andy@andy.colorado.edu           (  \___
  (___) (_____   peace<->love<->unity<->respect   _____) (___)
  (___)> _____    believe in the power of love    _____ <(___)
  (___)_/                                              \_(___)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 13:56:15 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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>About this deadhead and rave connection, there is one, and there always has
>been one.  In one way or the other.  There is little doubt though that
>there is an active migration, heavier now than before.  Predictable.
>
>Out,
>John

Predictable, and a natural shift-of-medium/style, like learning to paint
impressionist after having spent time painting abstractionist (note: these
were chosen at random).  The collective known as ravers is composed of many
different kinds of people, all very individual and with varied beliefs and
tastes, but we're unified through music/dance, and some of us are unified
through spirituality.  Know what?  That's exactly what many of the
Deadheads were/are all about, too!  It doesn't take a label, a clothing
style, a drug, or a particular taste in music to make me the kind of person
that I am, but people like us are drawn together in different ways, by
similar forces, and it's very natural that we join together at times.  It's
an intersection of circles, which hopefully will expand to become a union,
IMHO.  Where else would we be?  What else could draw us together?  We're
family!

You all rule, and you know it :)  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 14:03:22 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 14:05:15 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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At 12:59 PM 5/29/96 -0700, you wrote:

>Young people in England are pretty harsh with each other - "bitch" is your
>favorite word for your best friend and groups of young adults will spend a
>lot of time "slagging each other off" (teasing each other in a sort of
>pointed and painful way) - you have to really toughen up to be able to
>take it.  I used to get my feelings hurt a lot.

I was in the UK for about 2 years and noticed (IMO, and personal observation)
that the young people are alot more harsh because there is alot more
drinking there as well as other things. Mostly by males. I remember a few
friends and I had to pull off a guy hitting his girlfriend because she went
and hugged some other guy. This wasn't at a "RAVE" but a place were they had
Techno music playing, so it was a similar environment as maybe 1015 Folsom,
kinda clubby but not real clubby. If drinking wasn't has heavy out there, I
think the scene out there could be alot like it is out here. For what I have
seen there, most of the males act to macho because the are drinking and in
turn that's were all the harshness comes from. Remember this is just what
I've notice when I was there.

>Also, young people in England and most other European countries have
>pretty negative feelings about the US and turn their noses up at things
>that smack of americanism - such as discussions of PLUR and spirituality
>at raves for example - which they consider to be frank proof of how
>shallow and superficial americans are - all touchy feely with no
>substance, no honestly and no sense of reality 
>
>HOWEVER, I almost fell over backwards at a rave in England last year when
>some bloke told me that the scene in SF was reported to be "really
>beautiful with lots of people loving each other".  And, if you read
>UK-dance (which I highly recommend if you want to get out of your american
>imperialist, self-centered attitude that thinks that this country is the
>center of the universe), you will find references to PLUR and things
>spiritual....so it isn't just SF afterall.
>
>I personally think that the English have a lot to thank for raves and for
>E because it's softened a rather harsh social scene.  So, this
>spirituality that we talk of _is_ the reason other people in other parts
>of the world are so hooked on raving - even if they don't talk about it in
>those terms or as often.

I would agree here. Drinking played a roll it this too. There has actually
been a little decline on the drinking by the people in the age group that
usually attend "Raves". So "I" think this also softened up some of that
harshness in the scene over there.
>


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 14:23:26 1996
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From: Killing Time <adchan@ucdavis.edu>
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To: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
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Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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cut text...
> merger of the two is where the real power lies.  You wanna get really
> high?  then let go of the PLUR crap and really LOOK at what life is all
> about - then you will find beauty even in the ugliness and that's when
> you'll be set free
> 
> 
> 	ranting and raving,
> 		jess

As an old chinese proverb goes, "A gem is not polished without friction, 
nor man (woman) perfected without trials.  I personally have come to 
appreciate anti-PLUR for its ability to let me appreciate PLUR that much 
more.  Human beings come equipped with a full range of emotions, negative 
and positive, and there are appropriate times and places for _all_ of them.

PLUR, for the most part,
-alberT

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 14:40:59 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 14:34:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
To: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
Cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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Jess - you've (almost) brought up some interesting points, but what's with 
your attitude?

>>UK-dance (which I highly recommend if you want to get out of your american
>>imperialist, self-centered attitude that thinks that this country is the
>>center of the universe), you will find references to PLUR and things
>>spiritual....so it isn't just SF afterall.

 Exactly who are you accusing of having this "imperialist, self-centered 
attitude"? I hope it's not me (or anyone else on this list you don't know 
intimately). You are in no position to make such a judgement en masse.

>>Also, young people in England and most other European countries have
>>pretty negative feelings about the US and turn their noses up at things
>>that smack of americanism - such as discussions of PLUR and spirituality
>>at raves for example - which they consider to be frank proof of how
>>shallow and superficial americans are - all touchy feely with no
>>substance, no honestly and no sense of reality

 Interesting how you capitalize "England" and "European" but repeatedly 
fail to capitalize any word having "america" as it's prefix.
 Who's really got the problem here, Jess?

>>lot of time "slagging each other off" (teasing each other in a sort of
>>pointed and painful way) - you have to really toughen up to be able to
>>take it.  I used to get my feelings hurt a lot.

 No you don't. You just need to make some new friends who aren't so insecure.
I work for a UK-based company, have delt with British and European people 
for years, and have plenty of British friends here in the US. This 
"slagging off" isn't a regional issue. Weak people anywhere will treat you 
badly if you allow it.
 
 It isn't my intention to just slam you for sport, but what are you 
_really_ angry about?



Dan


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 14:48:39 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 96 14:48 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: OOPS: NUMARK DM2160
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> At 9:17 AM -0600 5/29/96, Niels P. Mayer wrote:
> >uhhh, doesn't all numark equipment suck??
> >
> Nope. New Numark equipment is mode by a different manufacturer than the
> older mixers that everybody has (1750, 1800, 1950, etc.) The original
> Numark went bankrupt awhile back and somone else bought the name. I don't
> know much about the quality of newer mixers, but I haven't heard anything
> bad. The older Numark stuff is fine, but certainly not in the same class as
> Biamp, Urei, or Rane.

The new Numark stuff...is not very nice.
Ive played on several of the 'new' mixers and they just dont compare.
Ive found them about as good as any other 'entry level mixer.
Ive played on decade old Numarks...that are still better than any new
mixer Ive seen. Personally I dont like the BiAmp's...and Ive seen the
Rane's...I know theres one I like...its got tons of dials on it.

> MTX supposedly is designed and/or made by some of the original Numark
> engineers and has a decent reputation for mid-priced equipment.

designed and made by...put an old Numark and a new MTX beside each other.
Its scary. Nice but scary ;)
 
> Joe













                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 14:53:27 1996
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From: b e n   c h u n <ben_chun@community.net>
To: "'sfraves@hyperreal.com'" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: dissemination network
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 14:52:55 -0700
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have any of you people out there heard of dissemination network?

I just picked up a CD called "transmissions 1991 - 1993" by them... I =
have to admit that I bought it because the name was cool, but this is =
some good shit! they seem to deal with the issues of technology and =
future culture, backed up with some nice beats and cool samples... =
anyone know anything more about them?

b e n   c h u n

ben_chun@community.net
http://community.net/~ben_chun/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 14:55:24 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 14:55:02 -0800
To: SteveOSac@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
Subject: Re: FM# 
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What Full Moon number are people clamoring for?  There used to be a FM done
by Wicked, and maybe it still happens, but most likely the number won't be
posted on SFR.  You'd need to speak with a Wicked person for it.  (Or
someone who has it, I guess.)

There is a group trying to put on consistent FM parties, called Community
Full Moon, but it's not yet definitely happening every month, and I'm not
certain any number previously used will be used again.  I'll ask and get
back to you.

I'm not aware of any other FM parties that happen monthly.

TR


At 4:37 PM  -0400 5/29/96, SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:
 Also NEED FM# TOO (A direct post on this one would
>be sufficient)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 15:27:17 1996
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From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
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Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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Wow,  you're a perceptive motherf***er aren't you :)
You're right on many points about my anger and my shitty attitude but I
think I also have a pretty strong experience on which to base some of my
opinions..

>  Exactly who are you accusing of having this "imperialist, self-centered 
> attitude"? I hope it's not me (or anyone else on this list you don't know 
> intimately). You are in no position to make such a judgement en masse.

Yes I am since I have seen in almost every American I meet here and
abroad, whether or not they see it in themselves - ask any out of towner.

When I first moved to this country, at the age of 17, I couldn't believe
how ignorant USers were about the rest of the world.  At first I thought
people were just lazy but now I realize how brainwashed we all are by the
crappy mainstream media over here that thinks a kitten getting stuck in a
cardboard box is headline new and spends no more than 4.5 minutes of an
hour on international news.  

Not all USers are so ignorant but you gotta
be pretty damn industrious and committed to keep alert to the important
goings on in other parts of the world.  If you are one of those people,
then more power to you, but I'm not and I find myself becoming more and
more unaware, the more I live here.  So I don't blame us as individuals,
but I do think we have a certain tendancy to be obsessed with
our own culture whether we realize it or not.  If you have ever travelled
you will quickly realize how
much more every one in the world knows about our culture than we know
about theirs.  Not our fault, but true, and worth rectifying if we ever
intend to do something about the US cultural domination that is sweeping
the planet and destroying many indigenous and beautiful cultures. 

> 
>  Interesting how you capitalize "England" and "European" but repeatedly 
> fail to capitalize any word having "america" as it's prefix.
>  Who's really got the problem here, Jess?

You're right - I'm mad about it.
> 

> >>lot of time "slagging each other off" (teasing each other in a sort of
> >>pointed and painful way) - you have to really toughen up to be able to
> >>take it.  I used to get my feelings hurt a lot.
> 
>  No you don't. You just need to make some new friends who aren't so insecure.
> I work for a UK-based company, have delt with British and European people 
> for years, and have plenty of British friends here in the US. This 
> "slagging off" isn't a regional issue. Weak people anywhere will treat you 
> badly if you allow it.

I disagree.  UK adults are pretty polite and friendly on the whole, but if
you are a teenager or young adult - IN ENGLAND - I think you'll find it
pretty different.  Also, if you meet English people here in the States,
outside of their home base, don't you think you'll be experiencing a
unique interaction with them?  They, then are the minority, trying to make
their way in a social scene dictated by us. 

If you want to get a taste of how young English people are with each other
then watch "Eastenders" - it's a UK soap about a working class group of
neighbours (spelling intended :) ) and it's on KTEH (channel 54 or cable)
and
you'll see how harsh they are with each other - OK, its drama but it's
really not so different - the aesthetic is correct even if the level of
harshness is upped for TV pleasure (?)

 > It isn't my intention
to just slam you for sport, but what are you > _really_ angry about?

> Dan

I really appreciate your comments

	jess



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 15:28:26 1996
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From: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
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To: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: re:WISH(how about jack in the box?)
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, Paul Abramson wrote:
> Anyone up for a little visit to Wish at Bahia tonight?  I *was* going to
> stay in this week, but.....  :) :) :)

HEY PAUL(and others)-

me and some friends are going to 'Jack in the box' tonight. its a 
weekly that starts tonight. dj's are jon santos(mad), samuel and cesar. 

it is 18+!!!!!

starts at 10pm, goes till 2am and it is free before 11pm.
Flyer says "weeklytechnohousejammyinnadetroitchicagostylee"

should be fun, hope to see you kids there.
luv,
sarah

oh yeah- it is at 375 1st street(@harrison). 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 15:33:19 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 15:31:38 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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Subject: Mantra up date
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This is the up date to the current Mantra club listing.

Mantra

A hypnotic trance-inducing affermation

Trance DJs: Dutch, Surge, Theta-blip

Jungle DJs: Abstract, Noel, UFO

Every Sunday night 10-3am

18+, $5. 683 clementina alley @ 8th/folsom

Info: 415.331.1500ext 888/415.332.5800ext 24-7

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 15:44:54 1996
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From: Czefir@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 18:44:15 -0400
Message-ID: <960529184414_545080390@emout17.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: The 1200 Hobos
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Hey!

Anybody ever heard of these guys (the 1200 hobos)?


Later,
             Megan             Czefir

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 16:11:06 1996
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To: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
From: piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU (Mark Piercy)
Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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 > I couldn't believe
>how ignorant USers were about the rest of the world.  At first I thought
>people were just lazy but now I realize how brainwashed we all are by the
>crappy mainstream media over here that thinks a kitten getting stuck in a
>cardboard box is headline new and spends no more than 4.5 minutes of an
>hour on international news.  

I could not agree more about how horribly ingnorant many Americans are
about the outside world!! especially about countries we are supposed to
hate ie, Iran , Iraq, and the entire middle east, people here dont know the
first thing about the history of these places(more importantly, the history
of US involvement there), but it's ok to bomb the fuck out of them, or
cause them economic havoc and starvation.  Europeans seem cynical to many
naive and ignorant Americans, but I think they just know more of what is
hidden and overlooked by us.  btw-my dad is English so I've had a chance to
experiece both worlds and places..btw2: I'm not really trying to say one
place is better than the other, just very different.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 16:20:03 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 16:23:46 -0600
To: Tony Rotundo <tony@xinet.COM>
From: Joe Rice <ambient@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: FM#
Cc: SteveOSac@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 4:55 PM -0600 5/29/96, Tony Rotundo wrote:
>What Full Moon number are people clamoring for?  There used to be a FM done
>by Wicked, and maybe it still happens, but most likely the number won't be
>posted on SFR.  You'd need to speak with a Wicked person for it.  (Or
>someone who has it, I guess.)
>

According to their VM they'll be doing a full moon in Mendocino on 6/2.
Coincidental with Tribal Future? Hmm....

>There is a group trying to put on consistent FM parties, called Community
>Full Moon, but it's not yet definitely happening every month, and I'm not
>certain any number previously used will be used again.  I'll ask and get
>back to you.

Yah - the number changes from month to month and is only spread word of
mouth. I don't know if a CFM is happening or not this month.

Joe


(:Joe Rice:____________:joe@psychoactive.com:____________:ambient@netcom.com:)
(:"Oh, the turntables are his instruments!"                                 :)
(:"But I can't tell what sound that record is making!"                      :)
(:"I know! He puts them on and off and you never know! I've never seen      :)
(: anything like it!"                                                       :)
 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 16:31:07 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
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Someone wrote:

>After talking with these two 16 year olds I felt kinda sad, thinking 
>that there may be a major lack of spirituality to alot of the younger 
>people going to raves.  

Now granted I don't go to many raves but I am 17.  I have never thought of
raves as anything more than a totally spiritual experience where you get in
touch with the music and yourself and those around you.  I have many friends
that think raves are places you go to to get laid and do drugs.  I have taken
a few to raves and shown them what they area really about but some are too
stubborn and immature to realize there is more to it than sex and drugs.  I
pity all those people who are evidently too close-minded to experience the
real meaning of rave, but (sigh) I guess I got to leave them alone.

Peace Ya'll,
      
         Megan                        Czefir



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 16:39:14 1996
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Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG [NOT Rave Related]
To: jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU (jess)
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 16:38:03 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: djm@crl.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.A32.3.93.960529150608.30904N-100000@itsa.ucsf.edu> from "jess" at May 29, 96 03:26:53 pm
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> 
> 
> Wow,  you're a perceptive motherf***er aren't you :)
> You're right on many points about my anger and my shitty attitude but I
> think I also have a pretty strong experience on which to base some of my
> opinions..
> 
> >  Exactly who are you accusing of having this "imperialist, self-centered 
> > attitude"? I hope it's not me (or anyone else on this list you don't know 
> > intimately). You are in no position to make such a judgement en masse.
> 
> Yes I am since I have seen in almost every American I meet here and
> abroad, whether or not they see it in themselves - ask any out of towner.
> 
> When I first moved to this country, at the age of 17, I couldn't believe
> how ignorant USers were about the rest of the world.  At first I thought
> people were just lazy but now I realize how brainwashed we all are by the
> crappy mainstream media over here that thinks a kitten getting stuck in a
> cardboard box is headline new and spends no more than 4.5 minutes of an
> hour on international news.  
> 


couldn't agree more...sometimes (especially, these days as I am awaiting
news on India's elections and the 3rd prime minister in 12 days) those
news bits on stuck cats( and other "Ohh, so cuute" newsbits) really
piss me off, as they appear on socalled *headline* news.

thank god for the web. it's the only place to get the real news.:)

regards,
-harsh

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 16:41:57 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 16:41:14 -0700
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From: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Subject: Plastik vs. Wicked??
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hey... can anybody tell me aything about PLASTIK?  I won't be attending 
Tribal Future but was sure to make it to WICKED on Saturday, that is 
until I saw the lineup for PLASTIK (Garth,Carlos,Dan,Jay-J,Mark Farina, 
John Howard, etc.).  Please help me so that I may make an informed 
decision. 

Respectfully Yours,
-Sunny   

(like I'd really bail on Wicked...)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 16:49:47 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 16:49:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
Reply-To: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: JOSHUA MICHAEL ABERANT <mist@sfsu.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, inanna@ccnet.com
Subject: re:WISH(how about jack in the box?)
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Super Sarah wrote.....
> HEY PAUL(and others)-
> me and some friends are going to 'Jack in the box' tonight. its a 
> weekly that starts tonight. dj's are jon santos(mad), samuel and cesar. 
> starts at 10pm, goes till 2am and it is free before 11pm.
> Flyer says "weeklytechnohousejammyinnadetroitchicagostylee"
> luv,
> sarah
>
------> oh yeah- it is at 375 1st street(@harrison).  <--------

Ok, I'm sold.  How about 'Jack in the Box' tonight (wednesday) instead of
Wish? 

See y'all there (I'm going early)... I'm thin, 5'10", and have short
almost-white hair.  Prolly smiling a lot too.  :) 

Love,
) paul (

p.s. I'm still assimilating Spundae... will post a review when I collect
my thoughts!  


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 17:00:48 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 18:58:59 -0500 (CDT)
From: Aleph One <aleph1@dfw.net>
To: Killing Time <adchan@ucdavis.edu>
Cc: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, Killing Time wrote:

> As an old chinese proverb goes, "A gem is not polished without friction, 
> nor man (woman) perfected without trials.  I personally have come to 
> appreciate anti-PLUR for its ability to let me appreciate PLUR that much 
> more.  Human beings come equipped with a full range of emotions, negative 
> and positive, and there are appropriate times and places for _all_ of them.

Ying. Yang. Enough said.

> PLUR, for the most part,
> -alberT
> 

Aleph One / aleph1@dfw.net
http://underground.org/
KeyID 1024/948FD6B5 
Fingerprint EE C9 E8 AA CB AF 09 61  8C 39 EA 47 A8 6A B8 01 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 17:40:44 1996
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From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Sunny <solle@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Plastik vs. Wicked??
In-Reply-To: <199605292341.QAA19474@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
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> Hey... can anybody tell me aything about PLASTIK?  I won't be attending 
> Tribal Future but was sure to make it to WICKED on Saturday, that is 
> until I saw the lineup for PLASTIK (Garth,Carlos,Dan,Jay-J,Mark Farina, 
> John Howard, etc.).  Please help me so that I may make an informed 
> decision. 

Plastik is an over-commercialized, gangsta party that will suck other 
than the fact that it has a good lineup, but I can't get into Wicked and 
I wanna party :)... so I might go...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 17:59:29 1996
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Yahoo! F-8 saves the day!

Who else?!

Love,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 17:59:44 1996
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To: jfogler@itsa.ucsf.edu, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: SFcentric/PLUR revisited
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Jfogler wrote:  >> we often use PLUR as a way to avoid conflict and sometimes
as a way to avoid the realities of our relationsh<< tiny part(read the whole
post, it's good)

Excellent post Jess, very fresh!  Although this may be a hard perspective to
jive with at first, I feel everyone should read that post with open heart and
mind.
We should also remember though, that positivity is the road that took us to
where we stand.  And from where I'm standing that's something to be proud and
appreciative of.  It has taken a concious act to evolve ourselves from into
living more positive lives.  One thing we have all learned is our ability to
make a positive change in our surroundings or our situation merely by
changing our view and attitude towards it.  So yes, we should be leary of
using plur as a sort visor to evil, but also beware of keeping it hidden in
it's case, exposing your soul face first to all the harsh truths and evil
realities of  existence is not the simple solution either.   Perhaps we
should also be cautious using "plur" as a multi-purpose "that covers it"
phrase as well.  We seem to have bundled up quite a surplus of meaning in one
little word.  Perhaps sometimes spelling it out we may be less likely to find
fault in it. Certainly I cant find apathy, ignorance or denial in: PEACE,
 LOVE,  UNITY  AND REPSECT.
PLUR,
Steveo



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 18:08:45 1996
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To: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
From: cnielsen@earthlink.net (Courtney Nielsen)
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
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>I've been working mostly on the adolescent unit at the hospitol where I
>work.  Today I overheard one kid telling the other about how she missed
>out on going to a rave this past weekend.  I decided to ask her more
>about her rave perspective.
>I asked her if she likes techno, because I only hear her listening to
>rap music.  She says she likes techno, but added "you have to be on
>drugs to like that music". ...

Unfortunately, these kids are probably going to end up in the hospital
again, only for other reasons.

You see so many people going to these parties strictly for getting wasted,
and they burn out before they can even legally drink.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 18:11:53 1996
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To: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
From: cnielsen@earthlink.net (Courtney Nielsen)
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
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>As to the adolescent perspective - this is what we get when we thoughtlessly
>dump 100's (1000's) of kids into large warehouses and mix in drugs
>without any sort of initiation or connection with an experienced culture.
>I'm very thankful I met raving through FnF where there are dozens of
>connected people... makes for a whole different picture....
>
> Also, related are news stories about raving.... they can write things that
>are TRUE and piss off people in the scene depending on who they inteview.
>If they interview someone like you, Ethan or Bryce they get one story if
>they were to interview those girls they would get another... so who's
>telling the truth?
>
>  When you are blind about something you become a blind man grabbing the
>elephant and truth becomes relative....
>
>Mike
>
>
> meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic
> Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.\


Journalists love to stir controversy. They know who they are interviewing.
They want to be the savior of the evil teenage life to the parent's eyes.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 18:12:33 1996
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Priority: urgent
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 19:09:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: ECommunication Pitfalls, NRR, kinda long
To: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
Cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hi Dan,
(Hi all,)
 Wow!   It's pretty clear that Jess got your hackles up.  That's   
certainly understandable, since no one likes to be on the receiving end   
of a generalization.  But your response inspired me to want to point out   
how careful we need to be about messages that smack of personal attack.   
 There are some shining examples in the past month of where this applies.
 As far as Jess' message, most people would probably agree that there are   
plenty of people in this country who really don't know anything about the   
rest of the world, and who think America is Number 1, not by rational   
thought and comparison, but by fiat.  So if the shoe fits, wear it.  If   
it doesn't, and it sounds like it doesn't in your case, Dan, don't.  I'm   
pretty sure there was no malicious intention to suggest that EVERYONE   
fits this bill.
 In your response, you publicly suggest "attitude", and then going on to   
suggest a hidden issue or agenda.  It seems like personal attack, and is   
going to arouse animosity and hurt feelings (correct me if I'm wrong   
here).  So what do ya do, pretend you're not angry?  Perhaps such things   
are best suited to a PERSONAL email, keeping the public response very   
consciously free of attack-tone.
 So why is THIS message a public post?  Because I want to suggest   
publicly that people take angry responses directly to the person in   
question, so there isn't the public attack element to exacerbate the   
situation (Isn't exacerbate a great word?), and keep the public responses   
as personal-attack-sound-free as possible.  I have had a couple of people   
contact me that way, and I think it works out much better, and keeps a   
friendlier community tone.  I'm not saying people should be falsely   
friendly, I'm saying taking grievance to the source FIRST will much more   
likely result in an amicable solution.  As far as the need for public   
rebuttal, that can be tone in a fairly neutral tone.
 Has anybody else noticed how pitfall-frought electronic communication   
is?  Without the aural and visual cues of observing the speaker, it's   
really easy to hear malice where there's none, or to have situations   
escalate beyond the intentions of either party, or to take half-serious   
and overly-general statements more seriously than they were intended.   
 That's why the use of smileys like :) in email isn't just cute, it's   
really essential to fill the missing element of intended tone!!  I have   
had SO many bad situations where I emailed something that was intended   
jokingly to a friend, and got back an ANGRY message because the intention   
wasn't clear.  I'm sure someone else has had similar experiences?

My $0.02, free to you guys during my special month-end pontification   
sale.
;)
 -Roy


 ----------
From:  Daniel J. MacMillan[SMTP:djm@crl.com]
Sent:  Wednesday, May 29, 1996 3:05 PM
To:  jess
Cc:  sfraves
Subject:  Re: SFcentric - LONG

Jess - you've (almost) brought up some interesting points, but what's   
with
your attitude?

>>UK-dance (which I highly recommend if you want to get out of your   
american
>>imperialist, self-centered attitude that thinks that this country is   
the
>>center of the universe), you will find references to PLUR and things
>>spiritual....so it isn't just SF afterall.

 Exactly who are you accusing of having this "imperialist, self-centered
attitude"? I hope it's not me (or anyone else on this list you don't know   

intimately). You are in no position to make such a judgement en masse.

>>Also, young people in England and most other European countries have
>>pretty negative feelings about the US and turn their noses up at things
>>that smack of americanism - such as discussions of PLUR and   
spirituality
>>at raves for example - which they consider to be frank proof of how
>>shallow and superficial americans are - all touchy feely with no
>>substance, no honestly and no sense of reality

 Interesting how you capitalize "England" and "European" but repeatedly
fail to capitalize any word having "america" as it's prefix.
 Who's really got the problem here, Jess?

>>lot of time "slagging each other off" (teasing each other in a sort of
>>pointed and painful way) - you have to really toughen up to be able to
>>take it.  I used to get my feelings hurt a lot.

 No you don't. You just need to make some new friends who aren't so   
insecure.
I work for a UK-based company, have delt with British and European people   

for years, and have plenty of British friends here in the US. This
"slagging off" isn't a regional issue. Weak people anywhere will treat   
you
badly if you allow it.
   

 It isn't my intention to just slam you for sport, but what are you
_really_ angry about?



Dan



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 18:18:23 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 96 18:17 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Re:NUMARK DM2160
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> Hi there!!!
> 
> Do any of you people out there uses vestax?  I find tht they are a lot easier to 
> use than numark, plus all of them have removealbe crossfaders.
> 
> Daryll 

Actually...I mentioned earlier I used a Stanton/Vestax...
I have a PMC005, and its better than ANY of the newer Numarks Ive played
on. And thats an entry level mixer!
The next mixer i buy will def-in-ate-ly be a Vestax.
 












                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 18:41:10 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 18:40:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: Branka Cehic <branka@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: ECommunication Pitfalls, NRR, kinda long
To: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
cc: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
In-Reply-To: <9605300112.AA22880@mail.ico.net>
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Wow!!

Roy, you ended up summing up (and adding more) of what I felt about this 
entire issue.  

My feelings on this - when you read e-mail please don't take everything 
personally and give people some slack.  Sometimes all of us say/write 
things that are not 100% thought through.  I do it a lot (more in RL 
conversations, but in e-mail as well).

I think Dan, you were a little bit too harsh on Jess, because she did 
bring up some interesting points. 

Maybe one day all of us will learn how to communicate better, because 
that's usually the souce of many problems.

Hugz,
Branka

P.S.  Hope to meet people I haven't met at TF and hope to see many ppl I 
already know.  

On Wed, 29 May 1996, Roy Feague wrote:

> 
> Hi Dan,
> (Hi all,)
>  Wow!   It's pretty clear that Jess got your hackles up.  That's   
> certainly understandable, since no one likes to be on the receiving end   
> of a generalization.  But your response inspired me to want to point out   
> how careful we need to be about messages that smack of personal attack.   
>  There are some shining examples in the past month of where this applies.
>  As far as Jess' message, most people would probably agree that there are   
> plenty of people in this country who really don't know anything about the   
> rest of the world, and who think America is Number 1, not by rational   
> thought and comparison, but by fiat.  So if the shoe fits, wear it.  If   
> it doesn't, and it sounds like it doesn't in your case, Dan, don't.  I'm   
> pretty sure there was no malicious intention to suggest that EVERYONE   
> fits this bill.
>  In your response, you publicly suggest "attitude", and then going on to   
> suggest a hidden issue or agenda.  It seems like personal attack, and is   
> going to arouse animosity and hurt feelings (correct me if I'm wrong   
> here).  So what do ya do, pretend you're not angry?  Perhaps such things   
> are best suited to a PERSONAL email, keeping the public response very   
> consciously free of attack-tone.
>  So why is THIS message a public post?  Because I want to suggest   
> publicly that people take angry responses directly to the person in   
> question, so there isn't the public attack element to exacerbate the   
> situation (Isn't exacerbate a great word?), and keep the public responses   
> as personal-attack-sound-free as possible.  I have had a couple of people   
> contact me that way, and I think it works out much better, and keeps a   
> friendlier community tone.  I'm not saying people should be falsely   
> friendly, I'm saying taking grievance to the source FIRST will much more   
> likely result in an amicable solution.  As far as the need for public   
> rebuttal, that can be tone in a fairly neutral tone.
>  Has anybody else noticed how pitfall-frought electronic communication   
> is?  Without the aural and visual cues of observing the speaker, it's   
> really easy to hear malice where there's none, or to have situations   
> escalate beyond the intentions of either party, or to take half-serious   
> and overly-general statements more seriously than they were intended.   
>  That's why the use of smileys like :) in email isn't just cute, it's   
> really essential to fill the missing element of intended tone!!  I have   
> had SO many bad situations where I emailed something that was intended   
> jokingly to a friend, and got back an ANGRY message because the intention   
> wasn't clear.  I'm sure someone else has had similar experiences?
> 
> My $0.02, free to you guys during my special month-end pontification   
> sale.
> ;)
>  -Roy
> 
> 
>  ----------
> From:  Daniel J. MacMillan[SMTP:djm@crl.com]
> Sent:  Wednesday, May 29, 1996 3:05 PM
> To:  jess
> Cc:  sfraves
> Subject:  Re: SFcentric - LONG
> 
> Jess - you've (almost) brought up some interesting points, but what's   
> with
> your attitude?
> 
> >>UK-dance (which I highly recommend if you want to get out of your   
> american
> >>imperialist, self-centered attitude that thinks that this country is   
> the
> >>center of the universe), you will find references to PLUR and things
> >>spiritual....so it isn't just SF afterall.
> 
>  Exactly who are you accusing of having this "imperialist, self-centered
> attitude"? I hope it's not me (or anyone else on this list you don't know   
> 
> intimately). You are in no position to make such a judgement en masse.
> 
> >>Also, young people in England and most other European countries have
> >>pretty negative feelings about the US and turn their noses up at things
> >>that smack of americanism - such as discussions of PLUR and   
> spirituality
> >>at raves for example - which they consider to be frank proof of how
> >>shallow and superficial americans are - all touchy feely with no
> >>substance, no honestly and no sense of reality
> 
>  Interesting how you capitalize "England" and "European" but repeatedly
> fail to capitalize any word having "america" as it's prefix.
>  Who's really got the problem here, Jess?
> 
> >>lot of time "slagging each other off" (teasing each other in a sort of
> >>pointed and painful way) - you have to really toughen up to be able to
> >>take it.  I used to get my feelings hurt a lot.
> 
>  No you don't. You just need to make some new friends who aren't so   
> insecure.
> I work for a UK-based company, have delt with British and European people   
> 
> for years, and have plenty of British friends here in the US. This
> "slagging off" isn't a regional issue. Weak people anywhere will treat   
> you
> badly if you allow it.
>    
> 
>  It isn't my intention to just slam you for sport, but what are you
> _really_ angry about?
> 
> 
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 18:50:54 1996
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Subject: Re: Plastik vs. Wicked??
Date: Wed, 29 May 96 18:47:24 -0800
From: Anarch <anarch@scruznet.com>
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>Plastik is an over-commercialized, gangsta party that will suck other 
>than the fact that it has a good lineup

The January Plastik in Santa Cruz was really fun, very friendly and not 
at all "gangsta" compared to, say, the Area 51 in the same spot a week or 
two later.  I had a great time.  Don't know how representative that event 
was, though.

anarch@scruznet.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 19:00:36 1996
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From: Bryan <dougie@sfsu.edu>
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Subject: Late weekend review
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Hey everyone quick notes on parties attended the past weekend:

Sat : Nexus in People's Park

  Beautiful day and fun music for most of the time there. i actually 
danced to carlos when he got deep for a bit ;)  it really helped my
suntan tho

Sun:  Sunset

  Arrived around 6 and heard DJ named michael from Seattle spin.  he
was good, and i really liked Lauren (sp?) who spun next. funky but 
hard set that really got me moving.  this was only my second sunset of 
this year and i was suprised by how many new faces i didnt recognize
but some old skoolers came towards the end.  I actually met a SFRaver
also (hey Sarah!) =)

Sun Night : Spundae's

  This was a lot of fun.  At the end of the night i was worn out cause i
had been taken on a house excursion by Tom Aquaviva (thats his name right?)
and when he played this one song i bought two years ago but never heard
out before, I was running around in ecstatic circles and jumping up
and down in front of the dj booth.  =)

well thats it for now.  peace and see ya around

doug ) ( dougie@sfsu.edu

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 19:26:55 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 19:24:18 -0700 (PDT)
Message-Id: <199605300224.TAA02984@webe.hooked.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: MONEY = HAPPINESS (non rave)
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I would like to sharewith SFRaves a letter I wrote back to my friend: 
 
On Tue, May 28, 1996 5:12:22 PM, 
 
  A FRIEND OF MINE wrote: 
 
 >Actually, one of the things keeping me here is the possibility of mucho
money...  = 
>I'm trying to be a millionaire by 28 yrs old.  I know I will do it.  But= 
>I am beginning to wonder if its worth the agony and not enjoying life in =

>the mean time. 
 
So you admitted that you're not enjoying life before you're a millionaire
(that is... right this minute and for the next 4 years until you're 28). 
Are you so sure that you will enjoy life when you are a millionare?  You're
saying that money will make you happy?  R U sure?  I hope so.  Because you
will have spent your precious youth getting to a place you believe is the
answer to happiness.  There's no turning back the clock. 
 
 >How did you do it...  How did you work and play at the same time... did
you just not >take work seriously?  
 
Well... my philosophy is that my youth is precious.  I have about 60 years
left if all goes well.  And if all doesn't go well and life ends
tomarrow... I will have lived a happy life up until the end.  I could die
right now and not regret much-- and I mean that.  I've been following my
heart for the past few years and that's what's most important.  If during
the next sixty years I believe that money is the answer, then I will go for
it.  It won't take but a few years to educate or train myself to the level
where I could start earning 100 K.  And I definately don't need a
helicopter to make me happy. 
 
But for right now... I'm trying to figure out exactly what it is that will
allow me to be happy so I don't go through life down the wrong path.  I
want to figure it out now so I don't wast time.  That's more important than
wasting money.  I've figured out the latter already.  It's as simple as
looking at my Mother and my Father: 
 
My Father has the Cadillac, large house and lawn edger...  
My mother has an old, small house, second-hand clothes and a Ford Tempo. 
 
But I know my Mother's happier.  Who would you rather be? 
 
Believe it or not,  right now I'm happy being poor.  I love living in the
precious present. 
 
Love, 
 
--erik 
 
PS.  I'm glad to hear that your quitting smoking.  I've decided not to
smoke even on ocasion, like I had been doing lately.  And like you and
Jenny, I've become mostly a vegetarian, too.  But I will have a big mac
from time to time.... like today! 
 
PSS  I took a motorcycle ride around the San Francisco Penninsula
Yesterday.  I stopped at the Golden Gate bridge and at several of the Parks
and beaches along the way.  It's so fucking gorgeous here!  I was about the
only one on the beach while I watched the waves crash on shore and the
Golden Gate bridge was off on the horizon and South of me the waves were
crashing along the cliffs and a cool breeze blew through my hair... 
 
I miss you Greg.  Please at least stop to smell the roses. 
 
**IMPORTANT!  READ DISCLAIMER** 
These words were NOT written by moonpup 
He's in London until late August 
 
...and I'm ERIK.  I'll be using his address until then 
Please address all comments, rebuttals, love or hate letters to me, ERIK 
or drop me a line... 415-337-6666

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 19:31:12 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 19:30:21 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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Mark Farina is djing at Roots tonight!!!!!!!

        Are ya Down??????
                           Roots is at 1015 Folsom at 6th....

      Hope we see you there,  The Amebas

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 19:50:32 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 19:47:27 -0700
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>>"Yeah, but ecstacy makes you listen to really bad music!" and the crowd
>>erupted into laughter.
>>I don't know, maybe I'm just hyper-sensitized, but there is a lot of
>>resistance out there.  And I just don't see why!  They don't make jokes
>>about how rotten Nirvana is or how bad punk rock is or how sad it is that
>>Aerosmith came back from the dead to milk a few more bucks out of the

>I think it's because techno is such a completely different *form* of music
>than rock... for one thing no one respects it because it's "fake" (it is).
>People who don't listen to techno are accustomed to the usual "musician ->
>star" progression, and they get confused because making techno music
>doesn't take much  practice, so how can anyone be a fan and how can anyone
>be accorded respect for making such a simplistic form of music? 


There may also be a couple of other factors, at least from what I've
experienced.  One is, as noted by that comedian, drug use (for me anyway,
I'm almost embarrased to admit).  I know that once a upon a time I totally
hated that music, and had no clue why people listened to it.  Then one day I
indulged for the first time, heard some of it, and said "Ooohhhh! *Now* I
get it!"  So I can see where that guy maybe got his opinion of how e makes
you like bad music, but for me it really was a simple adjustment of
perception on my part.  A lot of the time I listen to music, it is simply
background noise for me to do my work by, or surf the net by, etc.  I don't
usually take the time to really listen to what's going on musically.  This
is why I often like to listen to music stoned, it totally changes my
perspective and i really sit and listen to *everything* that is going on in
the song that's playing.  I have been totally blown away by music listened
to in this state that I had not previously taken note of.  This was also the
case the first time I did e, I really approached the music with a very
different perspective, and understood what there was to like about it.  Now
having experienced that different perspective, I now know it's there, and of
course don't require drugs to appreciate it, and now I listen to that kind
of music more than most other kinds.  But I hafta admit, drugs did work as a
catalyst in my situation.  
Another thing I've noticed is that probably a lot of people who make joke
about our "bad music" have probably not really heard some good quality
techno.  All I have to do is to to any "hip" store at the mall, or even the
steakhouse down the street, and bizarre cheezy housey kinda stuff (no i'm
not saying house is cheezy, just the stuff emanating from these mall
stores!) is playing, and imho sounds like shit!  If this is what people hear
on a regular basis, it's no wonder they think it sounds like shit.  It's
like hearing A-ha music (whoa 80's flashback!) and thinking that rock music
in general sucks.  They're not really hearing what's being made by people
who really love the music and put all their energy into it, imo.  
And really, I don't consider this music "fake" any more than any other kind
of music.  What makes music fake, to me, is when you get a band together
that uses only synthesizers to try and attempt to sound like live drums, a
guitarist, a bassist etc.  They are only attempting to imitate real
instruments.  With techno, I do not hear this.  Synthesizers are real
instruments in their own right, to me, and come up with some of the craziest
sounding noises! :)  They are not attempting to sound like anything but
themselves.  I've found an amazing amount of depth in this music that goes
way deeper than lots of "live" music created by "real" instruments I've heard.

Well enough rambling!

Love,
Shawna


  *smurp*
     
      
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 20:14:31 1996
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From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: O R A C L e (update)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.org
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times posted



free     free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free
     \*/     \*/      \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
	~	O	R	A	C	L	E	~
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-

GREETINGS FELLOW RAVERS...
	on may 31st, this friday, at UC SantaCruz,  crown college...
	come groove to the rhythms and beats of (((techno & house))) djs:
        
	s w o o p s -=*=- c l o u d s -=*=- b r i a n F l i p -=*=- mc2

	also relax and chill to the ambient grooves of live performace by:

			-=*=- dionysus dreams -=*=-

	this is a FREE event, sponsored by crown college, music spinning 
	starting at 9:00PM-1:30AM

		for more directions: email liquid7@cats OR mhg@cats
	       >>408-471-5420<<		      >>408-471-7450<<

	-=>])} Please use public transportation from the base of campus  {([<=- 
		-for parking/entrance by car is restricted to students-
		-there is a bus/shuttle stop at the south gate, bay st.-

\___...Oh yeah, were just students throwing this party... a free party...
		...put on by sf-ravers  ...for sf-ravers
					\____...hope to see you there ;)

_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
 __    ____  _____  __  __  ____  ____  ___
(  )  (_  _)(  _  )(  )(  )(_  _)(  _ \(__ )
 )(__  _)(_  )(_)(  )(__)(  _)(_  )(_) )/ /
(____)(____)(___/\\(______)(____)(____/(_/@cats.ucsc.edu


  \  |           |                     \  |
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 20:37:13 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 20:36:57 -0700 (PDT)
To: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
cc: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: ECommunication Pitfalls, NRR, kinda long
In-Reply-To: <9605300112.AA22880@mail.ico.net>
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, Roy Feague wrote:

>  In your response, you publicly suggest "attitude", and then going on to   
> suggest a hidden issue or agenda.  It seems like personal attack, and is   
> going to arouse animosity and hurt feelings (correct me if I'm wrong   
> here).  So what do ya do, pretend you're not angry?  Perhaps such things   
> are best suited to a PERSONAL email, keeping the public response very   
> consciously free of attack-tone.

Oh, I get it, we should all be duplicitous when we are upset by something 
someone says in public mail? We should be polite in public, and reserve 
our negative views to private mail? What a bunch of unnatural, lying,
hypocritical *CRAP*. The wonderful thing about this list is that anyone 
can post their views publicly. If someone makes a public statement, 
someone can make a public reply. When you start telling people that they 
should reserve their negative remarks, it strikes me as very *wrong*. Not 
wrong from the "you shouldn't do that" standpoint, but wrong because you 
are attempting to deny the negative. You can't have yin without yang.

                                             Black Adder 



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 21:14:38 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 21:14:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jessica Robin Berkson <berky@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: media representations of rave culture (fwd)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I hate to admit it too, but it did take e for me to enjoy techno- I had a 
total bias to it until the day I actually could *feel* what it was all 
about.... that first time I couldn't stop dancing, and I couldn't 
believe how incredible the music was- how much sould and life and 
spirit and joy was in it....now I love it no matter what state of 
mind I'm in...and I 'm still dancing...

xoxo
-jessica
V[

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 22:05:52 1996
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Priority: urgent
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 23:03:00 -0700
From: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Subject: RE: Communications EPitfalls, NRR, long
To: blkadder <blkadder@value.net>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hi Black Adder -
(Hi All) -

Wow, I feel like I just got my ass bitten off.  But I doubt our points of   
view are really _so_ far apart on this; I think you just misunderstand   
me.  I'm trying to make two points:
1.  It's important to be tactful and sensitive in public responses to   
posts, because someone's feelings are on the receiving end.
2.  If you are so steamed that #1 is impossible, it's probably a good   
idea to give the person a chance to respond to a private mail to clarify   
before you bake their ass in a public forum.

>Oh, I get it, we should all be duplicitous when we are upset by   
something
>someone says in public mail? We should be polite in public, and reserve
>our negative views to private mail?
Hmm.  Well, no, I think you DON'T get it.  I'm not suggesting you   
suppress your honest opinion.  I'm just saying that a little TACT and   
SENSITIVITY goes a long way, and I'm trying to point out that with this   
medium, it's particularly important.  Don't keep your negative views   
private.  Just express them in a fashion that doesn't attack and insult   
_unnecessarily_.  Not only is it more respectful, but it almost always   
elicits a more constructive response.

If you're sufficiently riled up that tact is impossible, wait ten minutes   
and try again.  If it's still impossible and you're going to get   
personal, then maybe the decent thing to do is take it direct first.   
 Otherwise it becomes public insult.  Insult is rough enough; public   
insult in a forum of nearly 1000 should really be reserved for the   
extreme case.  What if there is a misunderstanding?  You can't undo the   
damage of a public attack if it turns out you went off half-cocked or   
just read more into something than was intended.

>What a bunch of unnatural, lying,
>hypocritical *CRAP*.
Well, this really illustrates my point.  You could easily have disagreed   
with me without such inflamatory words as "lying, hypocritical CRAP",   
don't you think?  Feelings get hurt unnecessarily, and your words are   
needlessly harsh and extreme.

This exchange is a perfect example.  I got your message, and I was   
initially hurt and riled up.  It's taken me several minutes to chill to   
the point where I can reply in a civil fashion, but I think it's worth   
making the effort.  Posting one's thoughts publicly puts one in a   
somewhat vulenerable position.  So when someone else discards opinions as   
lying, hypocritical CRAP, that's just bound to hurt feelings.  Maybe   
you'd call that weak.  I think it's just human.  I don't think it's   
necessary to be coarse or rude to be genuine and true to one's self.

>The wonderful thing about this list is that anyone
>can post their views publicly. If someone makes a public statement,
>someone can make a public reply. When you start telling people that they   

>should reserve their negative remarks, it strikes me as very *wrong*.   
Not
>wrong from the "you shouldn't do that" standpoint, but wrong because you   

>are attempting to deny the negative. You can't have yin without yang. 
You're right, it's wonderful to see the honest exchanges that go on here.   
 Again, I'm definitely NOT advocating squelching your dissenting   
opinions.  You can speak your truth with humility, respect, sensitivity,   
and tact, and still speak your truth effectively and honestly.  Yin and   
Yang only coexist peacefully in a sphere of mutual acceptance.

I'm guessing that what was offensive to you in my original post was the   
suggestion that the public a private ought to be different.  Well, yeah,   
maybe that's a bit half-baked... you shouldn't post a nicey-nicey public   
response and a bite-your-ass private mail.  That WOULD suck for all the   
reasons you point out.  What I'm saying is, if you can't possibly be   
tactful in your response, respond privately first to allow for the   
possibility that you misunderstood.

And always remember that on the other end of your dissenting sword is a   
human being whose feelings and opinions should be treated with respect,   
even if you disagree.

 -Roy

P.S.  "Duplicitous" is an even better word than "exacerbate".
;)  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 22:36:05 1996
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From: Wurzle@aol.com
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Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
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In a message dated 96-05-29 13:15:11 EDT, you write:

> 

     Well, I agree with quite a few of the points in your posting, but you
really should acknowledge the endless exceptions.  My sister took me to my
first rave when I was all of 11, and since then it's been a very spiritual...
almost religous experience for me.  To say teenagers are in it for the cool
factor works for some, but I have to seperate myself from the group you're
speaking of.  *sigh* with the rap teenagers get, can I be judged on my mental
age instead of my chronological?
          Wurz§ (bday 5-13-81!)

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 23:05:13 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 23:05:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Maureen Garrett <mh2o@well.com>
Subject: Re: I saw the shuttle tonite!!!
To: Ann Elizabeth Loraine <anthrax@uclink.berkeley.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605291211.FAA02610@uclink.berkeley.edu>
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My roommate woke me at 3:00 am in San Rafael as I requested and we 
proceeded to head out to China Beach...I was completely blown away by 
this beautiful sight...it was higher on the Zenith then was originally  
planned..  pretty much directly overhead as it arched from the west to 
the east...Bright magenta white with yellow glowing object with a   
beautiful plasma trail...blending into a dimly visibly 
milky way...  once it passed it took about 4 minutes for the sonic boom 
to be heard...  it took my breath away...  (Note.. I experienced the 
first Shuttle landing at Edwards AFB a long time ago  :)  )  My prayer 
for the evening is that humans get back into space, the spin-off 
technology alone (remember Apollo) is worth the price to get there...

So I think it would be cool for those of us who are interested in such 
wondrous events to gather for the next one..?    --Maureen


On Wed, 29 May 1996, Ann Elizabeth Loraine wrote:

> Tonite my boyfriend Gregg and I saw the space shuttle streak across the sky!!
> 
> It was an omen.  A man-made omen!
> 
> It was astonishing- a magenta star sailing proud as an angel across the 
> sky.  It moved so fast!  And left behind it a thin, white track.  
> 
> Here's to you, beautiful traveler! Land safe and sound in Florida.
> 
> -Ann
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 23:16:36 1996
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On Wed, May 29, 1996 11:05:00 PM  at Maureen Garrett wrote: 
 
 
>So I think it would be cool for those of us who are interested in such  
>wondrous events to gather for the next one..?    --Maureen 
> 
Let me know when it's next passage is....  I'm there! 
 
--erik

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 23:24:14 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 23:22:30 -0700 (PDT)
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: E to enjoy Techno?
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On Wed, May 29, 1996 9:14:24 PM  at Jessica Robin Berkson wrote: 
 
> 
> 
> 
>I hate to admit it too, but it did take e for me to enjoy techno- I had a 

>total bias to it until the day I actually could *feel* what it was all  
>about.... that first time I couldn't stop dancing, and I couldn't  
>believe how incredible the music was- how much sould and life and  
>spirit and joy was in it....now I love it no matter what state of  
>mind I'm in...and I 'm still dancing... 
> 
>xoxo 
>-jessica 
>V[ 
> 
> 
Yes, it does seem that drugs may act as a "catalyst" to rave culture or
spirituality/ awareness for some people.  Terence McKenna is an advocate of
this belief.  I cannot deny that drugs have offered me an alternate
perception of things.  And at times this alternate perception has
enlightened me on certain issues concerning the "real world"...maybe even
helped clarify issues that I had been seemingly uable to resolve in an
unaltered state.  But I really can't confirm this (I was fucked up at the
time, right?) 
 
Terence McKenna seems to believe that drugs, particularly psychedelics, if
used in a responsible manner, are the catalysts or gateways to spirituality
and awareness.  Where if we pass through these gateways and educate
oursleves in this space, we can apply this knowledge to the "real world".  
 
The obstacle that I run into with this approach is that we're playing with
fire.  There is no question in my mind that drugs are to be feared.  I have
had some terribly BAD experiences on drugs, marijuana for example.  Why not
use meditation to reach an altered state?  It may be harder and will take
more discipline.  But it's a hell of a lot healthier, safer, less addictive
and cheaper! 
 
And as for enjoying Techno music...  I listened to it and loved it long
before I even heard of E or X (as it used to be called). 
 
But if E appears the only way to boost one's self into the spiritual
realm...  better than not at all! 
 
Just watch your ass for what comes next.   
 
--erik 
   
**IMPORTANT!  READ DISCLAIMER** 
These words were NOT written by moonpup 
He's in London until late August 
 
...and I'm ERIK.  I'll be using his address until then 
Please address all comments, rebuttals, love or hate letters to me, ERIK 
or drop me a line... 415-337-6666

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 23:45:34 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 23:47:20 +1000
To: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Tribal Future info
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Say Mark,

I got my car registered,  and we'll have room for two more people who
might want a ride with us.   Justin already picked up my ticket,  and
those people who want rides would have to take bus to Mill Valley
(Very easy to do) and meet at MY place.    I cannot drive yet until
I pay the $520 in fines,  then I'll get my license back again.

Justin has license and is the designated driver...   To get bus to
Mill Valley,   get on the #20 bus at 7th and Market,  transfer to
the #10 in Sausalito and get off in Downtown Mill Valley.    Call
ahead to tell me when you will be arriving.

We would like to know when things are due to start up there,  like
when is a good time to leave,  when the first DJ gets on,  and all
the details on the map point or directions to get there.   Although
I might still have the directions from last year,   but in case I can't
dig them up,   we would like to get up there kinda early,   perhaps
to help setup,  cook meals,  or whatever.    We'll be bringing up some
food to donate,  and want to know if we'll have access to the kitchen
again like last year.

Anyway,  get back to me soon,   so I can plan this trip....

Also,   you might want to have anyone who needs a ride in a non-smoking
car to contact me at 415-381-5847...

Cheers
Da Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Wed May 29 23:55:32 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 23:41:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Daniel J. MacMillan" <djm@crl.com>
To: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
Cc: blkadder <blkadder@value.net>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: Communications EPitfalls, NRR, long
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Roy -

I have to agree with the thoughts behind Black Adder's message. However, it 
obviously wasn't a delivery that was going to work for you, and I respect 
your right to question it. 
I can't think of any reason why my reply to Jess should have been sent 
through private email. When someone posts to a public forum, they are 
initiating conversation, and that's all that has happened here. My 
response wasn't designed to hurt her, and given the context of her reply, I
don't think it did. In my experience, this is how you get to know people 
through email ... After just a few messages, I already know so much more 
about Jess than I did yesterday, and that's the best part. For me, the 
net is a quick glimpse into the lives of people that I may have never 
had contact w/ otherwise, and may never, ever meet in person (although on 
this list it's quite likely!) ... Debate / conversation / whatever; it's all 
good.

I can't think of a better use for all this bandwidth.

Dan





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 00:47:35 1996
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From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: E to enjoy Techno?
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>On Wed, May 29, 1996 9:14:24 PM  at Jessica Robin Berkson wrote: 
> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>I hate to admit it too, but it did take e for me to enjoy techno- I had a 


I remember my first Toon-Town (I was working at Sun at the time and i remember
going to raves because it was one of the places where you could try out
Virtual Reality :).  I remember going into the "big room" where people were
dancing, It must have been around 3 am because people WERE GOING OFF!!
Totally and full on in trance, I remember not liking the music and thinking
these people were reeeallly wierd! (Little did I know that in a mere 6
months I would be going
off harder than most of em')  Anyway, It took me several months to really
take any chemicals at raves, don't know when exactly it hit but I remember
doing some
speaker worship with another guy next to me, it was some hard techno and
suddenly
it all made sense! :)



                                        geoffw


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 00:59:52 1996
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To: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: Tribal Future info
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>We would like to know when things are due to start up there,  like
>when is a good time to leave,  when the first DJ gets on,  and all
>the details on the map point or directions to get there.   Although
>I might still have the directions from last year,   but in case I can't
>dig them up,   we would like to get up there kinda early,   perhaps
>to help setup,  cook meals,  or whatever.    We'll be bringing up some
>food to donate,  and want to know if we'll have access to the kitchen
>again like last year.
>


Hey Crunch, you bringin any Butter? :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 02:43:57 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 02:43:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: BP Collapsing Silence Friday!!!
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For those of you who attended Burning Man last summer, you must remember
those crazily costumed performance artists dancing
around the Lingham as it burned phallically into the night... Collapsing
Silence!  They're performing this Friday at Stanford University.
 (no, we're not entirely stuffy and conservative... not yet, at least)

CS is performing at the dedication ceremony of Stanford's Papua New
Guinea sculpture garden; a wonderful little glade
with *extremely* cool authenically carved totems and stone sculptures...
As a bonus, the sculptors are going to be at the event!

So, if you're looking for something to kick off the weekend, I suggest
checking this out.  It should be a smallish affair (the sculpture garden
is pretty tiny), but worth it.  

Um, I don't have any phone #s on hand, sorry.  You could try the calling
Stanford Information.  I'm certain the event is on Friday.


		jon


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 02:46:53 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 02:46:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Mark Logan <gonzo@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: friends&family <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Collapsing Silence addendum!
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Here's the info # for the CS show/new Guinea Sculpture Garden:

	415/725-0153

		jon


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 06:56:15 1996
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For those of you who care - it's looking increasingly likely that I will
make the big leap across the pond in about a month and join you party people
in SF.

I'm in the process of trying to make sure if I end up in your part of the
world that I can get regular shipments of Goa on DAT, so I need to know how
much to budget for a couple of DAT players - something like the Sony "DAT
Walkmans" would be good. Any ideas or pointers?

Please cc any replies to me directly - at the moment I can only glance at
what's happening on sfraves. :-/

...j

--
dpp@peg.apc.org                       http://www.peg.apc.org/~dpp
D o m i n a n t      P i n e a p p l e      P r o d u c t i o n s
'Lead this life to the fullest, it may be the last life you have'


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 08:50:49 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 08:50:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, jess wrote:

> UK-dance (which I highly recommend if you want to get out of your american
> imperialist, self-centered attitude that thinks that this country is the
> center of the universe), you will find references to PLUR 

WHAT? You mean we *AREN'T* the center of the univers!!  You've got to be 
joking!!!  (insert heavy sarcasm here!!)

:)
KaySEE


              ****Shit, goddamn, get off your ass and jam****


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 09:05:44 1996
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Date: 30 May 96 12:01:32 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: ECommunication Pitfalls, NRR, kinda long
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Roy said (snip)

Has anybody else noticed how pitfall-frought electronic communication   
is?  Without the aural and visual cues of observing the speaker, it's   
really easy to hear malice where there's none, or to have situations   
escalate beyond the intentions of either party, or to take half-serious   
and overly-general statements more seriously than they were intended.   
 That's why the use of smileys like :) in email isn't just cute, it's   
really essential to fill the missing element of intended tone!!

_________________________________

Right on Roy, that is so true, and important to remember -- ESPECIALLY when
we're talking to someone we haven't met personally, which means when we read
their words, we are only imagining the tone and attitude behind them...

Example .... I used to read John S.(famous for his strong personal expression on
SFR, right John?)  Lee's posts and imagine him in one way .. then I had the
great pleasure of meeting him and realizing immediately, when I saw the big open
smile on his face, that I had misread/misunderstood some of his written
thoughts.

So, remember we're only seeing a partial vision of someone's ideas when we read
them on email, much of the spirit and soul is not translatable in this medium
.... so let's be careful out there!

Much love (can't misunderstand that, and I REALLY mean it!) it all, and I hope
to see all your smiling faces at Tribal Future!!

Leslie  : )



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 09:09:41 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 09:09:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: blkadder@value.net
cc: Andy Hawks <andy@cmac20.colorado.edu>,
        Sanfrandisco Raves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
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I am originally from New York City and the emphasis in my experiance
there was not on spirituality but intellectualism.. This difference in
emphasis hass led to a scene characterized by a lot of creative and
vibrant people mentally but also a lot of competition and snobbery
("where have you shown? what play did you work on? what is the concept
behind your clothes?) between people compelled to build very elaborate
personas. can lead to an empty and cold vibe sometimes but I am a New
Yorker so actually do miss "shade" sometimes

Cassandra

On Wed, 29 May 1996
blkadder@value.net wrote:

> On Wed, 29 May 1996, Andy Hawks wrote:
> 
> > >After talking with these two 16 year olds I felt kinda sad, thinking 
> > >that there may be a major lack of spirituality to alot of the younger 
> > >people going to raves.  
> > 
> > I'm 22, I've been going to parties for about 4-5 years in Colorado, but I 
> > can honestly say I didn't see raves as anything "spiritual" until the 
> > last couple years.....I don't really know if I saw *anything* as truly 
> > spiritual until the last couple years....
> 
> It also may well be that the viewing of raves as "spiritual" events is 
> San Franciscocentric. I get the impression from talking to people from 
> areas other than the Bay Area, and from reading posts from people that 
> have gone to parties elsewhere that the "spiritual" aspect is not present(I 
> won't say lacking,) or least as not as much an issue. Does this make any 
> sense?
> 
>                                                       
>                                              Black Adder
>  
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 09:21:48 1996
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Date: 30 May 1996 09:16:47 -0700
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 09:47:22 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 09:47:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Random Raver Experience
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Last night I went to this cool little bar on the Albany/El Cerrito border 
called Club Mallard.  It was the first time I had gone, and not usually 
liking any bar scene, I actually enjoyed this place.  I went with the 
intention of hanging out with a group of friends, some of which I hadn't 
seen in awhile.

So, my good raver friend shows up and has brought with her the map to 
Tribal Future (which is VERY cool btw).  She and I and my SO (the three 
of us are going!!) are commenting on how wonderful it will be, when this 
guy seated at the bar notices the flyer and that we are talking about 
dj's and starts talking to us.  Turns out he and his friend 
are long-time ravers.  We all started talking about TF, and, he, having 
gone before, described the place, and got us even more excited.  We were 
all filled with that "raver" excitement at having randomly met others of 
our kind.  Plus, we know some of the same people.  It was totally random, 
and totally sweet.  We all hung out for awhile, parting with the promise 
of hooking up in Mendocino.  

Now THAT  made my evening which turned out to be a barrel of fun!!

Connections,
KaySEE

              ****Shit, goddamn, get off your ass and jam****


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 10:07:16 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 10:07:07 -0700 (PDT)
To: Roy Feague <rfeague@starfishsoftware.com>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: RE: Communications EPitfalls, NRR, long
In-Reply-To: <9605300505.AA27128@mail.ico.net>
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, Roy Feague wrote:

> 
> Hi Black Adder -
> (Hi All) -
> 
> Wow, I feel like I just got my ass bitten off.  But I doubt our points of   
> view are really _so_ far apart on this; I think you just misunderstand   
> me.  I'm trying to make two points:
> 1.  It's important to be tactful and sensitive in public responses to   
> posts, because someone's feelings are on the receiving end.
> 2.  If you are so steamed that #1 is impossible, it's probably a good   
> idea to give the person a chance to respond to a private mail to clarify   
> before you bake their ass in a public forum.

The problem is that this goes *both* ways. This list can be very cyclic 
at time: 

Person A says something inflammatory, whether personally or in the form 
of a generalization.

Person B(the person that felt offended) responds back with something 
inflammatory.

Persons C,D,E,F, etc. get on persons *B* case about the means in which 
they chose to respond.  

And the circle continues....

> 
> >Oh, I get it, we should all be duplicitous when we are upset by   
> something
> >someone says in public mail? We should be polite in public, and reserve
> >our negative views to private mail?
> Hmm.  Well, no, I think you DON'T get it.  I'm not suggesting you   
> suppress your honest opinion.  I'm just saying that a little TACT and   
> SENSITIVITY goes a long way, and I'm trying to point out that with this   
> medium, it's particularly important.  Don't keep your negative views   
> private.  Just express them in a fashion that doesn't attack and insult   
> _unnecessarily_.  Not only is it more respectful, but it almost always   
> elicits a more constructive response.

That is not what you were asking in your original message on the subject. 
An excerpt:
 
>  In your response, you publicly suggest "attitude", and then going on to   
> suggest a hidden issue or agenda.  It seems like personal attack, and is   
> going to arouse animosity and hurt feelings (correct me if I'm wrong   
> here).  So what do ya do, pretend you're not angry?  Perhaps such things   
> are best suited to a PERSONAL email, keeping the public response very   
> consciously free of attack-tone.

I do appreciate your clarification of your position, but it is indeed 
different from your original suggestion.

> If you're sufficiently riled up that tact is impossible, wait ten minutes   
> and try again.  If it's still impossible and you're going to get   
> personal, then maybe the decent thing to do is take it direct first.   
>  Otherwise it becomes public insult.  Insult is rough enough; public   
> insult in a forum of nearly 1000 should really be reserved for the   
> extreme case.  What if there is a misunderstanding?  You can't undo the   
> damage of a public attack if it turns out you went off half-cocked or   
> just read more into something than was intended.

Given the above senario of person A,B etc., and your feelings on TACT and 
SENSITIVITY, don't you think it might be more appropriate and useful in your 
to suggest to person A that they not make potentially inflammatory 
generalizations that would illicit such responses?    

Personally, I fully support the right for Jess to say that Americans are 
all imperialistic, self-centered, egotistical bastards, or whatever, if 
that is how she truly feels on the subject.

However, I disagree with her, and I also fully support anybodies right to 
return words that are as equally inflammatory in a public forum. 

> >What a bunch of unnatural, lying,
> >hypocritical *CRAP*.
> Well, this really illustrates my point.  You could easily have disagreed   
> with me without such inflamatory words as "lying, hypocritical CRAP",   
> don't you think?  Feelings get hurt unnecessarily, and your words are   
> needlessly harsh and extreme.

Given the level of distate I had for your original suggestion, I feel 
that my words were quite appropriate. 

> This exchange is a perfect example.  I got your message, and I was   
> initially hurt and riled up.  It's taken me several minutes to chill to   
> the point where I can reply in a civil fashion, but I think it's worth   
> making the effort.  Posting one's thoughts publicly puts one in a   
> somewhat vulenerable position.  So when someone else discards opinions as   
> lying, hypocritical CRAP, that's just bound to hurt feelings.  Maybe   
> you'd call that weak.  I think it's just human.  I don't think it's   
> necessary to be coarse or rude to be genuine and true to one's self.

Perhaps you know have an idea of how I felt at the suggestion that I or any 
other member of this list be confined to only "thinking good thought and 
saying good things"(twilight zone reference) in public, and reserve their 
real feelings for private exchanges. You are not in any means the first,  or am 
I sure the last, person to suggest this, and wrapping it a cloak of civility 
does not make the thought any more appealing. I do not say things without 
the willingness to back up those statements. If you would like to 
continue this discussion in private, I will be happy to go on ad nauseum 
about why I feel this concept has no merit, is hypocritical, lying, and 
crap. I am not saying you are stupid, kick puppies for fun, or anything 
else, just that this idea is a very poor one.   

> You're right, it's wonderful to see the honest exchanges that go on here.   
>  Again, I'm definitely NOT advocating squelching your dissenting   
> opinions.  You can speak your truth with humility, respect, sensitivity,   
> and tact, and still speak your truth effectively and honestly.  Yin and   
> Yang only coexist peacefully in a sphere of mutual acceptance.

So again I ask, why only post when you saw Dan's reply? Why didn't you 
post immediately when you saw the post from Jess? Do you really feel that 
saying (paraphrasing)"you Americans are a bunch of imperialistic 
egotists," is speaking your truth with humility, respect, or sensitivity?

Believe it or not, I am agreeing with what you are saying in this regard, 
but question its validity when that respect and sensitivity is not shown 
in the first place.

> I'm guessing that what was offensive to you in my original post was the   
> suggestion that the public a private ought to be different.  Well, yeah,   
> maybe that's a bit half-baked... you shouldn't post a nicey-nicey public   
> response and a bite-your-ass private mail.  That WOULD suck for all the   
> reasons you point out.  What I'm saying is, if you can't possibly be   
> tactful in your response, respond privately first to allow for the   
> possibility that you misunderstood.

Well then, I guess we can agree to disagree.

                                      
                                      Black Adder



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 10:25:04 1996
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From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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On Wed, 29 May 1996, jess wrote:

> 
> 
> Not all USers are so ignorant but you gotta
> be pretty damn industrious and committed to keep alert to the important
> goings on in other parts of the world.  If you are one of those people,
> then more power to you, but I'm not and I find myself becoming more and
> more unaware, the more I live here.  So I don't blame us as individuals,
> but I do think we have a certain tendancy to be obsessed with
> our own culture whether we realize it or not.  If you have ever travelled
> you will quickly realize how
> much more every one in the world knows about our culture than we know
> about theirs.  Not our fault, but true, and worth rectifying if we ever
> intend to do something about the US cultural domination that is sweeping
> the planet and destroying many indigenous and beautiful cultures. 

I'd agree with Jess.  The average American knows very little about other 
cultures and current events outside of the States.  However, there are 
reasons for this.  After traveling and living in other countries (Latin 
America), I've come to some conclusions on why this is true.  First and 
foremost, is the basic fact that, YES, WE, the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 
are the world's biggest military and political power.  Admittedly, I am 
not an expert on foreign policy or relations, but we are still the 
most powerful country in the world, especially since the Cold War has 
ended.  We are definitely one of the richest too, and with wealth comes 
power.  The United States has always been an imperialistic country.  And 
with imperialism comes a hierarchy in which we seem to have our foot 
firmly planted on top.

Sitting where we do in the world's hierarchy, of course the average 
American is going to think the same and reflect that view.  There is 
also a subtler view I attribute to our ignorance.  This being the sheer 
size of our country.  I am under the opinion that since we are not 
surrounded by many other countries like in Europe, we do not get as wide 
a view of other cultures.  It is a simple geographic problem.  In both 
Europe and Latin America, you are bordered by more countries, and 
geography allows you to have more interactions with other countries and 
therefore have a larger world view.  I think in the more ethnically 
diverse states like California, the people are forced to know more than  
they otherwise would.

Americans are under a lot of scrutiny because o their place in the world, 
which is a hard thing to deal with sometimes when you are an individual.  
I've found ignorance goes both ways, and many times people in other 
countries stereotype us, which to me is also ignorance.

So, I'd have to agree with all the points that Jess has made, but I'd like to 
buffer it by pointing out that one has to see the history behind the 
interaction in order to fully understand how it came to be.

--Bye--
KaySEE



 > > > 
> >  Interesting how you capitalize "England" and "European" but repeatedly 
> > fail to capitalize any word having "america" as it's prefix.
> >  Who's really got the problem here, Jess?
> 
> You're right - I'm mad about it.
> > 
> 
> > >>lot of time "slagging each other off" (teasing each other in a sort of
> > >>pointed and painful way) - you have to really toughen up to be able to
> > >>take it.  I used to get my feelings hurt a lot.
> > 
> >  No you don't. You just need to make some new friends who aren't so insecure.
> > I work for a UK-based company, have delt with British and European people 
> > for years, and have plenty of British friends here in the US. This 
> > "slagging off" isn't a regional issue. Weak people anywhere will treat you 
> > badly if you allow it.
> 
> I disagree.  UK adults are pretty polite and friendly on the whole, but if
> you are a teenager or young adult - IN ENGLAND - I think you'll find it
> pretty different.  Also, if you meet English people here in the States,
> outside of their home base, don't you think you'll be experiencing a
> unique interaction with them?  They, then are the minority, trying to make
> their way in a social scene dictated by us. 
> 
> If you want to get a taste of how young English people are with each other
> then watch "Eastenders" - it's a UK soap about a working class group of
> neighbours (spelling intended :) ) and it's on KTEH (channel 54 or cable)
> and
> you'll see how harsh they are with each other - OK, its drama but it's
> really not so different - the aesthetic is correct even if the level of
> harshness is upped for TV pleasure (?)
> 
>  > It isn't my intention
> to just slam you for sport, but what are you > _really_ angry about?
> 
> > Dan
> 
> I really appreciate your comments
> 
> 	jess
> 
> 
> 

              ****Shit, goddamn, get off your ass and jam****


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 10:29:07 1996
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From: Killing Time <adchan@ucdavis.edu>
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To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFcentric/PLUR revisited
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On Wed, 29 May 1996 SteveOSac@aol.com wrote:
> changing our view and attitude towards it.  So yes, we should be leary of
> using plur as a sort visor to evil, but also beware of keeping it hidden in
> it's case, exposing your soul face first to all the harsh truths and evil
> realities of  existence is not the simple solution either.   Perhaps we
> should also be cautious using "plur" as a multi-purpose "that covers it"

I think we tend to overuse PLUR, inserting it where it doesn't need to 
go.  Sometimes it's painful but necessary for someone to tell us to shut 
the f__k up when we're mouthing off, or to tell us to just say so what 
when we see too people non-PLURing.  Example: this whole thing with 
apoligizing for our posts in advance (e.g. NRR, or LONG, as if you were 
afraid to violate our right to our 15 second attention span, or afraid 
that what you consider to be part of the rave culture isn't necessarily 
part of another's view of rave.  We're all on this newsgroup together: if 
you've got something to say, SAY IT TO ALL OF US!

Learn to deal (SIV- sarcasitic inflection of voice ;))
-alberT



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 10:50:31 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 96 10:50 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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> I'd agree with Jess.  The average American knows very little about other 
> cultures and current events outside of the States.  However, there are 
> reasons for this.  After traveling and living in other countries (Latin 
> America), I've come to some conclusions on why this is true.  First and 
> foremost, is the basic fact that, YES, WE, the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 
> are the world's biggest military and political power.  Admittedly, I am 
> not an expert on foreign policy or relations, but we are still the 
> most powerful country in the world, especially since the Cold War has 
> ended.  We are definitely one of the richest too, and with wealth comes 
> power.  The United States has always been an imperialistic country.  And 
> with imperialism comes a hierarchy in which we seem to have our foot 
> firmly planted on top.

So what.
Just because you are the biggest and strongest has nothing to do with why
the people in the US are ignorant (as in uneducated to  other parts of the
world). In fact...just imagine the attitude of some of the guys/girls who
work out a lot...weird analogy i know...when they have 'that'
attitude..what do we usually think of them?
Besides all the power and miltary in the world isnt going to do you guys a
bit of good...imagine all the breakaway republics in Europe right
now...starving for $$$$...well you know all those Nuclear missiles the
Russians had in all them little countries...guess where they are now?
And guess where they're still pointed. Theres no massive government with
the finger on the button either...one word...Khadafi. (sp?) 

> Sitting where we do in the world's hierarchy, of course the average 
> American is going to think the same and reflect that view.  There is 
> also a subtler view I attribute to our ignorance.  This being the sheer 
> size of our country.  I am under the opinion that since we are not 
> surrounded by many other countries like in Europe, we do not get as wide 
> a view of other cultures.  It is a simple geographic problem.  In both 
> Europe and Latin America, you are bordered by more countries, and 
> geography allows you to have more interactions with other countries and 
> therefore have a larger world view.  I think in the more ethnically 
> diverse states like California, the people are forced to know more than  
> they otherwise would.

Umm..hello?
No other cultures?
What do you call Canada? Mexico?
I wonder how many Americans still feel we'll be the 55th state one day ;|
If you think thats being sarcastic...
 
> Americans are under a lot of scrutiny because o their place in the world, 
> which is a hard thing to deal with sometimes when you are an individual.  
> I've found ignorance goes both ways, and many times people in other 
> countries stereotype us, which to me is also ignorance.

And so they should be...you _should_ be setting the example for EVERYone
else. No one is stereotyping anyone...but the facts you stated yourself.
Ignorance is absolutely no excuse.
The only reason anyone might stereotype americans is because it is soooo
easy to do.
 
> So, I'd have to agree with all the points that Jess has made, but I'd like to 
> buffer it by pointing out that one has to see the history behind the 
> interaction in order to fully understand how it came to be.

Dont get me wrong on this...I am not American bashing...
The US has done a lot of good things...and for the most part I loooove
coming down to the US even tho our dollar is only worth about .70 cents
down there. But thats the way it goes.
I especially love SF..I cant wait to come down :)

BUT the fact does remain...as you stated...that Americans are quite
ignorant to the ways of anything outside their country.
I am not trying to start any sort of arguement with this...but living in
Canada, trust me..many many people here...as well as many people in
Euro-Asian countries with which we have huge relationships with...unlike
what you stated for your country (meaning your geographic dis/advantage is
not an excuse either!) think or have at least heard of the taste we get in
our mouths when we think of the US.

Im not proud of it...but ive got more annoying stories about things Ive
heard from Americans mouths than I care ti bring up.
I mean Polar bears thru downtown? Come on.

Have a good day :)












                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 10:52:13 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605301752.KAA20216@netcom7.netcom.com>
Subject: Have Fun At TF/ORACLe
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 10:52:09 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: MaryP76944@aol.com
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[to sfraves list]
 I'm another one of those folks who won't be going to TF ( got other
priorities re: work this weekend ). You folks have fun! I know there
will be tons of reviews next week.
 
 I am planning to go to ORACLe in Santa Cruz this friday evening.
I was thinking of eating dinner at a restaurant called Dharma's in
Capitola - 4250 Capitola Rd. It was recommended to me - it's a
vegitarian restaurant.
 
 Being that I'll be driving from Santa Clara valley, I don't know what
the commute delay will be like, so I can't promise a time for when
I'll be in Capitola or Santa Cruz. Since ORACLe starts at 9PM,
my plan is to be at the Bay St. gate of Crown College by 8:30PM ,
and catch a bus into the campus . ( I've never been to Crown College ;
I wonder how difficult it is to walk from the Bay St. gate to the 
campus? ).
 
 As far as IDing me - can't decide on what clothes I'll be wearing - 
I will be wearing a little clay pendant and at least one SFR laminate 
around my neck.
 
 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 10:52:52 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 10:52:46 -0700 (PDT)
To: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
cc: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>, sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: SFcentric - LONG
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On Thu, 30 May 1996, KaySEE wrote:

> I'd agree with Jess.  The average American knows very little about other 
> cultures and current events outside of the States.  However, there are 
> reasons for this.  After traveling and living in other countries (Latin 
> America), I've come to some conclusions on why this is true.  First and 
> foremost, is the basic fact that, YES, WE, the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 
> are the world's biggest military and political power.  Admittedly, I am 
> not an expert on foreign policy or relations, but we are still the 
> most powerful country in the world, especially since the Cold War has 
> ended.  We are definitely one of the richest too, and with wealth comes 
> power.  The United States has always been an imperialistic country.  And 
> with imperialism comes a hierarchy in which we seem to have our foot 
> firmly planted on top.

Don't be too sure about this...

Do you think that China is getting most favored nation trading status 
because our govt. likes the way China pirates software, video, and 
everything else under the sun? Or how China treats it's dissidents? 
It ain't because of love or respect.....

                                        Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 10:55:39 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 10:54:49 -0700 (PDT)
To: Killing Time <adchan@ucdavis.edu>
cc: SteveOSac@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFcentric/PLUR revisited
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On Thu, 30 May 1996, Killing Time wrote:

> I think we tend to overuse PLUR, inserting it where it doesn't need to 
> go.  Sometimes it's painful but necessary for someone to tell us to shut 
> the f__k up when we're mouthing off, or to tell us to just say so what 
> when we see too people non-PLURing.  Example: this whole thing with 
> apoligizing for our posts in advance (e.g. NRR, or LONG, as if you were 
> afraid to violate our right to our 15 second attention span, or afraid 
> that what you consider to be part of the rave culture isn't necessarily 
> part of another's view of rave.  We're all on this newsgroup together: if 
> you've got something to say, SAY IT TO ALL OF US!

Jeez.... Putting NRR on a post isn't apologizing for a post in advance, 
it's just being polite...

                                        Black Adder

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 11:00:26 1996
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Message-ID: <n1378668472.96301@gateway.apple.com>
Date: 30 May 1996 11:00:19 -0700
From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: UNDERWORLD, ETC. UP HERE!
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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My e-mail has been down for almost a week now, and I lost all of my sfraves messages.  Usually when it goes down, after it comes back up, all the unread messages are there patiently waiting for me, but not this time. :-(
I was just wondering if there had been any posts/news regarding the big Organic '96 thing UP HERE.  I'm sure most of us have seen the color teasers were being passed out like crazy at funky tekno (the selfish, money-hungry assholes don't even deserve capitalization of thier name).  The flyers just read:  Orb, Orbital, Meat Beat Manifesto, Chemical Brothers, and Underworld (yeah!) San Francisco, June 1996.
THIS IS GOING TO THE BIGGEST AND BEST U.S. SHOW TO DATE!!!!!!!!  YEAH!!!
-Jason


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 11:09:53 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: E to enjoy Techno? 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 29 May 1996 23:22:30 PDT."
             <199605300622.XAA10937@bass.hooked.net> 
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 11:02:55 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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[Apologies in advance for the slight divergence from the subject of
raves...]

Eric, guest-subbing for Moonpup, writes:

> Terence McKenna seems to believe that drugs, particularly psychedelics, if
> used in a responsible manner, are the catalysts or gateways to spirituality
> and awareness.  Where if we pass through these gateways and educate
> oursleves in this space, we can apply this knowledge to the "real world".  

I've always felt that there is a conspiracy on the part of politicians
advocating the war on drugs. The idea is that if people got in touch
with their spirituality through hallucinogenic drugs, then many of the
ideals on the Conservative Republican agenda would be in danger of
being attacked by their constituency (such as favoring industry over
ecology, large millitary budgets, tax laws favoring the rich, reduced
spending on social improvement programs, etc). So long as they have
that mind-numbing drug alcohol around, and make those other drugs
relatively inaccessible, they can control that dissenting voice.

> The obstacle that I run into with this approach is that we're playing with
> fire.  There is no question in my mind that drugs are to be feared.  I have
> had some terribly BAD experiences on drugs, marijuana for example.  Why not
> use meditation to reach an altered state?  It may be harder and will take
> more discipline.  But it's a hell of a lot healthier, safer, less addictive
> and cheaper! 

We're already playing with fire -- that which lights up tobacco. ;-) 

But seriously, the conspiracy has nothing to do about the dangers of
drug use -- it's just a bunch of hype. After all, many thousands of
innocent people die at the hands (well, cars, really) of those under
the influence of alcohol. And more people die from tobacco-related
diseases than from most, if not all, other causes. I have yet to hear
of a single case of someone who died from overdosing on marijuana, for
instance. And the number of deaths from psychedelics is comparively
very small.

> And as for enjoying Techno music...  I listened to it and loved it long
> before I even heard of E or X (as it used to be called). 

Same here.

> But if E appears the only way to boost one's self into the spiritual
> realm...  better than not at all! 

Amen to that! :-) The use of drugs as the gateway to the spiritual
realm has a long history. Native Americans still do it with peyote, of
course. Many Muslims smoke marijuana to "get closer to Allah". They
also shun the use of alcohol, calling it the "drug of the Devil". Very
interesting indeed...

-G-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 11:14:51 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: All we really need to know...
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(From a poster, given to me by my longest-known friend)
All I really need to know I learned in kindergarten.
All I really need to know about how to live and what to do and how to be I
learned in kindergarten.  Wisdom was not at the top of the graduate-school
mountain, but there in the sandpile at Sunday School.  These are the things
I learned: Share everything.  Play fair.  Don't hit people.  Put things
back where you found them.  Clean up your own mess.  Don't take things that
aren't yours.  Say you're sorry when you hurt somebody.  Wash your hands
before you eat.  Flush.  Warm cookies and cold milk are good for you.  Live
a balanced life--learn some and think some and draw and paint and sing and
dance and play and work every day some.
Take a nap every afternoon.
When you go out into the world, watch out for traffic, hold hands, and
stick together.
Be aware of wonder.  Remember the little seed in the Styrofoam cup: The
roots go down and the plant goes up and nobody really knows how or why, but
we are all like that.
Goldfish and hamsters and white mice and even the little seed in the
Styrofoam cup--they all die.  So do we.
And then remember the Dick-and-Jane books and the first work you
learned--the biggest word of all--LOOK.
Everything you need to know is in there somewhere.  The Golden Rule and
love and basic sanitation.  Ecology and politics and equality and sane
living.
Take any one of those items and extrapolate it into sophisticated adult
terms and apply it to your family life or your work or your government or
your world and it holds true and clear and firm.  Think what a better world
it would be if we all--the whole world--had cookies and milk about three
o'clock every afternoon and then lay down with our blankies for a nap.  Or
if all governments had as a basic policy to always put things back where
they found them and to clean up their own mess.
And it is still ture, no matter how old you are--when you go out into the
world, it is best to hold hands and stick together.

By Robert Fulghum.

Think about these things.  Live and love.  - E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 11:26:50 1996
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From: swoosh@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (John Elias Darrow)
Message-Id: <9605301825.AA06293@ucscb.UCSC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Plastik vs. Wicked??
To: dwarzau@ns.net (John)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 11:25:20 -0700 (MDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.HPP.3.91.960529173628.28382A-100000@hornet.ns.net> from "John" at May 29, 96 05:37:28 pm
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> 
> > Hey... can anybody tell me aything about PLASTIK?  I won't be attending 
> > Tribal Future but was sure to make it to WICKED on Saturday, that is 
> > until I saw the lineup for PLASTIK (Garth,Carlos,Dan,Jay-J,Mark Farina, 
> > John Howard, etc.).  Please help me so that I may make an informed 
> > decision. 
> 
> Plastik is an over-commercialized, gangsta party that will suck other 
> than the fact that it has a good lineup, but I can't get into Wicked and 
> I wanna party :)... so I might go...
> 
I wouldn't say that.  I've heard some negative things about Plastik
but this last January I went to one and I had a pretty damn fine time.
It had nice visuals, a great laser show, and good sound.
and I didn't run into one person who wasn't having a great time.
It also had much more room to dance than Wicked usually does.

so it's all in the luck of the draw I guess.

-john.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 11:41:07 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 11:38:46 -0800
To: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: noah@cadence.com (Noah Ruiz)
Subject: Re: Mark Farina @ Roots Tonight!!!!
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Just to let you all know that Mark Farina kicked ass @ Quench on Sunday.
I just kept on moving till the end of his set.

Noah

At 7:30 PM 5/29/96, ameba wrote:
>Mark Farina is djing at Roots tonight!!!!!!!
>
>        Are ya Down??????
>                           Roots is at 1015 Folsom at 6th....
>
>      Hope we see you there,  The Amebas



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 11:58:32 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 11:55:06 -0700
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From: tigger@thestranger.com (Glenn)
Subject: Who went to Sunset?
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Hiya folks,

Just wanted to hear about Sunset last weekend.  My friend Michael and
Nathan (Dervish) were supposed to spin and I wanted to know what you
thought about it.

Peace!

Tigger


                          __,,,,_
      _   _ ___.--'''`--''// ,-o `-.
      \`)' O |  \  \ o\/ /.// / ,-  o,_
     /_`  \   |o )  | O|. /o// / -.,_o `-.
    /<0\    ) \  |  | ||/ //o| \/ O \`-.o`-._
   /  _.-.  .-\,O__|  _-| /o\ \/|_/  |    `-._)
   `-\  \/ |       /o__/ \__O / |o_//
        `-'       |  -| -|\__ \  |-'|
               __/ o /__,-o    ),'o |'
              ((__.-'((____..-' \__,'
______________________________________________________________



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 12:26:33 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 12:23:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: Timothy McIntyre <sidewalk@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: SFcentric
To: Mark Piercy <piercy@toolik.Stanford.EDU>
cc: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605292310.XAA00428@shgc.Stanford.EDU>
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Sure, Americans, generally speaking, are ignorant of the rest of the world.
But do you guys really think that any other country's citizens are not as 
equally focused on their home country?  I mean, how many Iranians or 
Welsh or any other nationality have any idea who Nathan Hale is?
I think it's multi-directional.
Pondering,
Timothy


On Wed, 29 May 1996, Mark Piercy wrote:

>  > I couldn't believe
> >how ignorant USers were about the rest of the world.  At first I thought
> >people were just lazy but now I realize how brainwashed we all are by the
> >crappy mainstream media over here that thinks a kitten getting stuck in a
> >cardboard box is headline new and spends no more than 4.5 minutes of an
> >hour on international news.  
> 
> I could not agree more about how horribly ingnorant many Americans are
> about the outside world!! especially about countries we are supposed to
> hate ie, Iran , Iraq, and the entire middle east, people here dont know the
> first thing about the history of these places(more importantly, the history
> of US involvement there), but it's ok to bomb the fuck out of them, or
> cause them economic havoc and starvation.  Europeans seem cynical to many
> naive and ignorant Americans, but I think they just know more of what is
> hidden and overlooked by us.  btw-my dad is English so I've had a chance to
> experiece both worlds and places..btw2: I'm not really trying to say one
> place is better than the other, just very different.
> 
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 12:34:42 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 96 12:34 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFcentric NRR
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> 
> 
> Sure, Americans, generally speaking, are ignorant of the rest of the world.
> But do you guys really think that any other country's citizens are not as 
> equally focused on their home country?  I mean, how many Iranians or 
> Welsh or any other nationality have any idea who Nathan Hale is?
> I think it's multi-directional.
> Pondering,
> Timothy

That was a baaaaad point yer tryin to make.
A little exagerrated...
How many of you Americans know who the PM of Canada is?
OR how many times the queen visits us?
Now thats sad.


OK....we're all waaaay off topic here I know..
I didnt start it ;)













                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
http://www.islandnet.com/~solo/

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 12:40:31 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 12:37:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: Timothy McIntyre <sidewalk@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: media representations of rave culture
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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I've been thinking about this a lot recently, about the idea that techno
music is sort of 'fake,' or unnatural, or whatever other problematic 
adjective you wish to use... I love techno and trance and all its related
forms, mind you, and I don't want to start a big flame war or anything 
silly like that, but the conclusion I keep arriving at is this one:
Dance music doesn't have any PERSONALITY!  Of course, ravers do, and DJ's 
do, and the parties do, but maybe all the personality that you see at a 
rave is to compensate for the music's lack thereof?  I think the music 
has a lot of things going for it: rhythm, funk, sensuality, power, emotional
persuasion, et al, but I keep having trouble when I look for the 
personality...then again, maybe that's the appeal.  Dunno... 
I'd love to see what other people have to say about this, though.  
high fives,
Timothy


On Wed, 29 May 1996, hey, where am I? wrote:

> >>"Yeah, but ecstacy makes you listen to really bad music!" and the crowd
> >>erupted into laughter.
> >>I don't know, maybe I'm just hyper-sensitized, but there is a lot of
> >>resistance out there.  And I just don't see why!  They don't make jokes
> >>about how rotten Nirvana is or how bad punk rock is or how sad it is that
> >>Aerosmith came back from the dead to milk a few more bucks out of the
> 
> >I think it's because techno is such a completely different *form* of music
> >than rock... for one thing no one respects it because it's "fake" (it is).
> >People who don't listen to techno are accustomed to the usual "musician ->
> >star" progression, and they get confused because making techno music
> >doesn't take much  practice, so how can anyone be a fan and how can anyone
> >be accorded respect for making such a simplistic form of music? 
> 
> 
> There may also be a couple of other factors, at least from what I've
> experienced.  One is, as noted by that comedian, drug use (for me anyway,
> I'm almost embarrased to admit).  I know that once a upon a time I totally
> hated that music, and had no clue why people listened to it.  Then one day I
> indulged for the first time, heard some of it, and said "Ooohhhh! *Now* I
> get it!"  So I can see where that guy maybe got his opinion of how e makes
> you like bad music, but for me it really was a simple adjustment of
> perception on my part.  A lot of the time I listen to music, it is simply
> background noise for me to do my work by, or surf the net by, etc.  I don't
> usually take the time to really listen to what's going on musically.  This
> is why I often like to listen to music stoned, it totally changes my
> perspective and i really sit and listen to *everything* that is going on in
> the song that's playing.  I have been totally blown away by music listened
> to in this state that I had not previously taken note of.  This was also the
> case the first time I did e, I really approached the music with a very
> different perspective, and understood what there was to like about it.  Now
> having experienced that different perspective, I now know it's there, and of
> course don't require drugs to appreciate it, and now I listen to that kind
> of music more than most other kinds.  But I hafta admit, drugs did work as a
> catalyst in my situation.  
> Another thing I've noticed is that probably a lot of people who make joke
> about our "bad music" have probably not really heard some good quality
> techno.  All I have to do is to to any "hip" store at the mall, or even the
> steakhouse down the street, and bizarre cheezy housey kinda stuff (no i'm
> not saying house is cheezy, just the stuff emanating from these mall
> stores!) is playing, and imho sounds like shit!  If this is what people hear
> on a regular basis, it's no wonder they think it sounds like shit.  It's
> like hearing A-ha music (whoa 80's flashback!) and thinking that rock music
> in general sucks.  They're not really hearing what's being made by people
> who really love the music and put all their energy into it, imo.  
> And really, I don't consider this music "fake" any more than any other kind
> of music.  What makes music fake, to me, is when you get a band together
> that uses only synthesizers to try and attempt to sound like live drums, a
> guitarist, a bassist etc.  They are only attempting to imitate real
> instruments.  With techno, I do not hear this.  Synthesizers are real
> instruments in their own right, to me, and come up with some of the craziest
> sounding noises! :)  They are not attempting to sound like anything but
> themselves.  I've found an amazing amount of depth in this music that goes
> way deeper than lots of "live" music created by "real" instruments I've heard.
> 
> Well enough rambling!
> 
> Love,
> Shawna
> 
> 
>   *smurp*
>      
>       
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
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> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 13:12:36 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: two things (kinda rave related)
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1)  Does anybody actually know if Galen did spin at Funky Tekno Tribe?  I
saw his name in the line up, but forgot to pay attention, and I know that
some of the dj's did not spin after all.  Just wonderin!

2)  Can somebody please explain this bizarre phenomenon:  I bought a mixed
music cd a while back, and then recorded it onto a tape for listening at
work.  The mixing of the songs on the cd is fine, but when I recorded it
onto the tape, the mixing disappeared!  When one song was about to end,
instead of it blending into the next one, it cuts short.  Then there's a few
seconds of silence like there would be on a normal non-mixed cd, and then
the next song abruptly starts.  The space where the two songs are combined
is cut out entirely.  And it has recorded this way onto my tape.  It sounds
real weird!  But I just can't figure out why the tape didn't recor exactly
what was playing on the cd, this doesn't make sense to me.  Any techy people
out there know the answer?


Love,
Shawna


  *It's not easy being cheezy...*
     
      
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 13:17:37 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605302011.NAA12945@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: media representations of rave culture
To: sidewalk@uclink2.berkeley.edu (Timothy McIntyre)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 13:11:17 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: shawna-@ix.netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605301225.B759-0100000@uclink2.berkeley.edu> from "Timothy McIntyre" at May 30, 96 12:37:28 pm
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> 
> 
> I've been thinking about this a lot recently, about the idea that techno
> music is sort of 'fake,' or unnatural, or whatever other problematic 
> adjective you wish to use... I love techno and trance and all its related
> forms, mind you, and I don't want to start a big flame war or anything 
> silly like that, but the conclusion I keep arriving at is this one:
> Dance music doesn't have any PERSONALITY!  Of course, ravers do, and DJ's 
> do, and the parties do, but maybe all the personality that you see at a 
> rave is to compensate for the music's lack thereof?  I think the music 
> has a lot of things going for it: rhythm, funk, sensuality, power, emotional
> persuasion, et al, but I keep having trouble when I look for the 
> personality...then again, maybe that's the appeal.  Dunno... 
> I'd love to see what other people have to say about this, though.  
> high fives,
> Timothy

What?  Personality?  What do you mean?  I don't see how music can have
personality.  Maybe you should define personality and tell us what music
has it and what music does not have it.

I think only persons can have personality.

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 13:20:22 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 13:19:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: Amy R Starkey <sac41673@saclink1.csus.edu>
Subject: Re: Who went to Sunset?
To: Glenn <tigger@thestranger.com>
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <v02140500add39eecb554@[199.238.224.10]>
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On Thu, 30 May 1996, Glenn wrote:

> Just wanted to hear about Sunset last weekend.  My friend Michael and
> Nathan (Dervish) were supposed to spin and I wanted to know what you
> thought about it.
> 
It was ****CCCOOOLLLLDDDD****!  Not to mention cloudy and windy.  
But the music was pretty good. :)

love,
Amy

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 13:22:50 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: BSP RE: free live ambient/idm
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We tried to do this last week, but had to cancel at the last minute...but
tonight for sure!!!!

RE: will be playing free live ambient/idm at Thursday Night Market in
Sacramento tonight.  TNM is on K Street Mall in Sacramento.  It's an annual
event that runs every thurs in downtown Sac all summer.  They have tons o
people, performers, vendors with various booths of stuff.  We will be
located in front of "Records" on K between 7th and 8th.  We will also have a
guest dj named Jonny who will be spinning ambient records and generally
helping us mix everything together.  Jonny is great.  You just have to hear
him sometime to understand.  He's pretty "out there"  

Hope to see some of you there.

Rick



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 13:39:08 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com, hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com
Subject: (NRR) Good Web News sources? Infobots?
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Okay, so all thisSFcentric talk has got me thinking I should probably be a
little more globally aware.  I refuse to watch TV though, and although
wonderful, NPR's "all things considered", can't be considered real news.  So
what's a good source on the web?  Is there any free or cheap "roboting"
service that gathers news daily or weekly under your specified parameters
from a large base of resources and sends it via email?  Let me know.
Thanks all,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 13:39:27 1996
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To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
Cc: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
From: Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS
 <Todd_Manley@notes.hds.eds.com>
Date: 30 May 96 13:35:19 
Subject: Re: two things (kinda rave related)
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Hi Shawna-

 Here's my take on your problem with the recording.  Depending on your stereo 
system, your CD player may automatically skip from the end of one track to the 
beginning of the next.  This may cause the mixing of track to no occur.
 Now I haven't had any direct experience with this, but I know of friends to 
which this same problem has happened.

-Todd








To: sfraves @ hyperreal.com @ SMTP
cc:  (bcc: Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS)
From: shawna- @ ix.netcom.com ("hey, where am I?") @ SMTP
Date: 05/30/96 01:13:08 PM
Subject: two things (kinda rave related)

2)  Can somebody please explain this bizarre phenomenon:  I bought a mixed
music cd a while back, and then recorded it onto a tape for listening at
work.  The mixing of the songs on the cd is fine, but when I recorded it
onto the tape, the mixing disappeared!  When one song was about to end,
instead of it blending into the next one, it cuts short.  Then there's a few
seconds of silence like there would be on a normal non-mixed cd, and then
the next song abruptly starts.  The space where the two songs are combined
is cut out entirely.  And it has recorded this way onto my tape.  It sounds
real weird!  But I just can't figure out why the tape didn't recor exactly
what was playing on the cd, this doesn't make sense to me.  Any techy people
out there know the answer?



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 13:56:51 1996
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From: lxfogel@srv.PacBell.COM (Lee Fogel)
Message-Id: <9605302056.AA16049@pbssi.srv.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: Who went to Sunset?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 13:56:04 PDT
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605301334.A20783-0100000@saclink1.csus.edu>; from "Amy R Starkey" at May 30, 96 1:19 pm
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> On Thu, 30 May 1996, Glenn wrote:
> > Just wanted to hear about Sunset last weekend.  My friend Michael and
> > Nathan (Dervish) were supposed to spin and I wanted to know what you
> > thought about it.
> > 
> It was ****CCCOOOLLLLDDDD****!  Not to mention cloudy and windy.  
> But the music was pretty good. :)
> love,
> Amy

Actually, I didn't think it was *that* cold.  The sun did peep out
for about 10 minutes to our cheers a couple of times.

I thought Dervish (guy with ponytail right after Solar?) and
Michael who followed him both were fine.  Nothing amazing, but
they kept us dancing, and warm.  

It may be my imagination, but the Sunset vibe always seems much
better at the Berkeley Marina compared to Pt. Molate in Richmond.
Less alchohol, less garbage, friendlier people.  Also less Nitrous
(Galen had threatened to shut the party down over it) was evident,
though I did see the telltale balloon litter down closer to the water.
I hope things remain manageable for the Pacific crew now that summer
is here with influx of folks off from school with nothing else to do.

Will see many of U at TF!

Lee
_________________________________________________________________________
lxfogel@pacbell.com  (    (   (  ( ((0)) )  )   )    )  lee@hyperreal.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 14:04:16 1996
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From: eric@nit.AirTouch.COM (Eric Pederson)
Message-Id: <9605302104.AA18831@nit.AirTouch.COM>
Subject: Re: Plastik vs. Wicked??
To: solle@ix.netcom.com (Sunny)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 14:04:09 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605292341.QAA19474@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com> from "Sunny" at May 29, 96 04:41:14 pm
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Sunny writes...
> 
> Hey... can anybody tell me aything about PLASTIK?  I won't be attending 
> Tribal Future but was sure to make it to WICKED on Saturday, that is 
> until I saw the lineup for PLASTIK (Garth,Carlos,Dan,Jay-J,Mark Farina, 
> John Howard, etc.).  Please help me so that I may make an informed 
> decision. 

yeah that lineup is great but it's going to be in santa cruz again...
for me it's king st (BARTable) versus a sick 2 hour drive to SC. hmm...

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 14:08:59 1996
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From: Justin Cooper <datura@best.com>
Message-Id: <199605302104.OAA25473@shellx.best.com>
Subject: Re: two things (kinda rave related)
To: shawna-@ix.netcom.com (hey, where am I?)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 14:04:02 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.16.19960529184344.35e7bc84@popd.ix.netcom.com> from "hey, where am I?" at May 30, 96 01:13:08 pm
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well, i don't know how to explain it in technical terms, and this is just
a guess at best anyway, but here goes :

when you set up the cd player to make the tape, you put it into program 
mode and selected it to play song 1, then song2, then song 3 etc...
now if you watch the little time display while your cd player is switching
from song 1 to song 2, you'll notice a little anomaly in there somewhere
where the display says -0:02 and counts backwards till 0:00, then it goes
up again... i suspect that if you set up the cd player in program mode,
it skips those little in-between negative-seconds and just starts at 0:00.

sooo, the way to fix the problem i gues would be to just play the cd normally
like you would if you were just listeening to it and record that way.

confused yet? :)

justin

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 14:21:56 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 14:21:08 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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We have the map and guide to Tribal Future at Ameba . If you already 
have tickets, please try to drop by to get the map . If its difficult to 
make it by Ameba I can fax the map to people. We'll be closed on Sat. 
and Sun. so I'll leave some maps for ticket holders at Cafe Cole just 
across the street. 
 There seems to be a real buzz about this one , tickets are going fast
THEY BUILT US A SWEAT LODGE!!    Yes you can bring food to cook or to 
donate to the group kitchen, help with stuff like trash bags, 
lightwieght plates, etc.
   Music will start Friday around dusk ,dub,trip-hop, reggae , large 
system kicks on saturday thru the night, then pace yourself cus Sunday 
night will be some serious LUNACY with guest slots from some of our 
favorite pioneeers in outdoor grooving who are all busy at their monthly 
club on saturday. We're welcome to party until Monday morning so get 
ready for a good long groove. 
  Late arrivals(ie.sunday) should be prepared to make a donation of at 
least $10 per car ,remember,this is a private retreat with limited space
(esp. for cars) so please carpool to the max!!
                  Thanx everybody
                                   Mark          see ya there!!!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 14:23:07 1996
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Date: 30 May 1996 14:10:42 -0700
From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: two things (kinda rave 
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>,
        "Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS" <Todd_Manley@notes.hds.eds.com>
Cc: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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        Reply to:   RE>>two things (kinda rave related)

Question 1: No, Galen, Simon, The Gardening Club, and the entire ambient area got cut from the line-up.
Question 2: The below mentioned is what happened - my CD player does the same thing.
--------------------------------------
Date: 5/30/96 1:45 PM
To: Jason Green*
From: Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS
Hi Shawna-

 Here's my take on your problem with the recording.  Depending on your stereo 
system, your CD player may automatically skip from the end of one track to the 
beginning of the next.  This may cause the mixing of track to no occur.
 Now I haven't had any direct experience with this, but I know of friends to 
which this same problem has happened.

-Todd








To: sfraves @ hyperreal.com @ SMTP
cc:  (bcc: Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS)
From: shawna- @ ix.netcom.com ("hey, where am I?") @ SMTP
Date: 05/30/96 01:13:08 PM
Subject: two things (kinda rave related)

2)  Can somebody please explain this bizarre phenomenon:  I bought a mixed
music cd a while back, and then recorded it onto a tape for listening at
work.  The mixing of the songs on the cd is fine, but when I recorded it
onto the tape, the mixing disappeared!  When one song was about to end,
instead of it blending into the next one, it cuts short.  Then there's a few
seconds of silence like there would be on a normal non-mixed cd, and then
the next song abruptly starts.  The space where the two songs are combined
is cut out entirely.  And it has recorded this way onto my tape.  It sounds
real weird!  But I just can't figure out why the tape didn't recor exactly
what was playing on the cd, this doesn't make sense to me.  Any techy people
out there know the answer?



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From: Todd Manley/Santa Clara/HDS
 <Todd_Manley@notes.hds.eds.com>
Date: 30 May 96 13:35:19 
Subject: Re: two things (kinda rave related)
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 14:32:30 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 14:30:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Andrew B. Lawson" <lawson@nature.berkeley.edu>
To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: two things (kinda rave related)
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On Thu, 30 May 1996, hey, where am I? wrote:

> 1)  Does anybody actually know if Galen did spin at Funky Tekno Tribe?  I
> saw his name in the line up, but forgot to pay attention, and I know that
> some of the dj's did not spin after all.  Just wonderin!
> 
> 2)  Can somebody please explain this bizarre phenomenon:  I bought a mixed
> music cd a while back, and then recorded it onto a tape for listening at
> work.  The mixing of the songs on the cd is fine, but when I recorded it
> onto the tape, the mixing disappeared!  When one song was about to end,
> instead of it blending into the next one, it cuts short.  Then there's a few
> seconds of silence like there would be on a normal non-mixed cd, and then
> the next song abruptly starts.  The space where the two songs are combined
> is cut out entirely.  And it has recorded this way onto my tape.  It sounds
> real weird!  But I just can't figure out why the tape didn't recor exactly
> what was playing on the cd, this doesn't make sense to me.  Any techy people
> out there know the answer?
> 
> 
> Love,
> Shawna

Hi Shawna... my JVC boombox does the same thing.  It automatically places
spaces in between the tracks.  Look in your manual if you have one, there
should be a way to turn off that option.  On mine I think I have to play
the disk and pause it, then turn the deck on to record.  Hope this helps.
smiles
Andrew




> 
> 
>   *It's not easy being cheezy...*
>      
>       
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%\|/%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%      %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%%%%%    %%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%   %%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%  %%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%
> %%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%  %%%%%%%%  %%%%%%
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> %%%%  %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%  %%%%%
> %%%%  %%%%%%%%%%%%%  %%%%%%%%%%%%%  %%%%%
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> %%%%%%  %%%%%   %%%%%%%%%  %%%%%  %%%%%%%
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> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%     %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 14:39:13 1996
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To: tigger@thestranger.com (Glenn)
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Who went to Sunset? 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 30 May 1996 11:55:06 PDT."
             <v02140500add39eecb554@[199.238.224.10]> 
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 14:31:36 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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I went. It was the first time I ever made it to Sunset, and what a
time to initiate myself! The weather was cold, cloudy, and
windy. Despite that, it rocked! I especially got down with Lorin's
set. The vibe was a great change from those of massives and clubs,
which I'm used to. Highlights of the event: the sun made two rare
appearances: one around 4-5pm, for about 20 minutes or so, and another
just as it was setting: a blazing red display. Everyone cheered at
those two moments.

Looking forward to the next one,
-G-

> Just wanted to hear about Sunset last weekend.  My friend Michael and
> Nathan (Dervish) were supposed to spin and I wanted to know what you
> thought about it.
> 
> Peace!
> 
> Tigger

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:04:24 1996
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testing 135792468




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:09:28 1996
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To: "hey, where am I?" <shawna-@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: two things (kinda rave related) 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 30 May 1996 13:13:08 PDT."
             <1.5.4.16.19960529184344.35e7bc84@popd.ix.netcom.com> 
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 14:47:31 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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Shawna asks:

> 2)  Can somebody please explain this bizarre phenomenon:  I bought a mixed
> music cd a while back, and then recorded it onto a tape for listening at
> work.  The mixing of the songs on the cd is fine, but when I recorded it
> onto the tape, the mixing disappeared!  When one song was about to end,
> instead of it blending into the next one, it cuts short.  Then there's a few
> seconds of silence like there would be on a normal non-mixed cd, and then
> the next song abruptly starts.  The space where the two songs are combined
> is cut out entirely.  And it has recorded this way onto my tape.  It sounds
> real weird!  But I just can't figure out why the tape didn't recor exactly
> what was playing on the cd, this doesn't make sense to me.  Any techy people
> out there know the answer?

This phenomenon occurs for me on my Yamaha X-90 mini system when I
record CD to tape under certain programmed modes. When I play a CD in
programmed mode, it intentionally puts several seconds of blank space
between the tracks. This happens even when the tracks are programmed
in sequence. The logic on the CD unit isn't smart enough to handle the
situation, and let the previous track play continuously into the
next. However, a good feature of this is that you do a music search on
the tape, the tape deck will correctly find the track breaks. My unit
will even pause the tape after several seconds if the CD unit needs to
change disks, or scan over many tracks, so that the spacing between
the tracks on the tape is constant.

It's all rather annoying when recording a mixed CD, but I've found a
workaround: play the CD manually (unprogrammed), and start and stop
the tape deck on my own at the appropriate times.

Of course, I'm only guessing this is what's happening for you, since
you didn't mention what you were recording the CD on.

-G-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:18:18 1996
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On Thu, May 30, 1996 10:24:52 AM  at KaySEE wrote: 
 
  There is  
>also a subtler view I attribute to our ignorance.  This being the sheer  
>size of our country.  I am under the opinion that since we are not  
>surrounded by many other countries like in Europe, we do not get as wide  
>a view of other cultures.  It is a simple geographic problem.  
> 
That's a good point that is often overlooked: 
 
If I had taken my 3,000 mile x-country trip in Europe instead of the United
States, I would have traveled through 13 Countries, not 13 states.  That's
a hell of a different experience all together!  It's obvious to me how much
easier it would be to educate myself interculturally in other less
"isolated" countries. 
 
--erik

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:18:29 1996
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From: "Renzo Saunders" <saunderr@NGC.COM>
Encoding: 46 Text
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Subject: Re[2]: Plastik vs. Wicked??
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Anybody know where Plastik is going to be? I went to the last one in Santa Cruz 
and it was a really good party. The outdoor Plastik last summer was also 
veeeeerry good!

BTW, what would you consider "gangster"? Is it the way people dress, attitude? 
Please explain. I am not at all involved with any gangs, yet when ever I come in
contact with police I am automatically classified as a gang member. I have also 
noticed at parties sometimes that people seem to be intimidated by my 
appearance. Little do they know, I am just as fun loving and open minded as the 
next guy\gal. I have been raving in SF for about 3 years now and have noticed 
that the number of "gangster type" people at parties has increased 
considerabely. Keep in mind that people cannot and should not be judged by their
appearance. Just because one dresses a certain way doesn't necessarily mean they
are affiliated with gangsters or a gangster attitude. That's just like me 
calling you a tweaker or a scrub because you wear Vans, cut-offs and ride a 
skateboard. Know what I'm sayin'? Just my two cents. Talk to y'all later. 
Peace.......

-R3N20
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: Plastik vs. Wicked??
Author:  swoosh@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (John Elias Darrow) at SMTPLINK
Date:    5/30/96 12:26 PM


> 
> > Hey... can anybody tell me aything about PLASTIK?  I won't be attending 
> > Tribal Future but was sure to make it to WICKED on Saturday, that is 
> > until I saw the lineup for PLASTIK (Garth,Carlos,Dan,Jay-J,Mark Farina, 
> > John Howard, etc.).  Please help me so that I may make an informed 
> > decision. 
> 
> Plastik is an over-commercialized, gangsta party that will suck other 
> than the fact that it has a good lineup, but I can't get into Wicked and 
> I wanna party :)... so I might go...
> 
I wouldn't say that.  I've heard some negative things about Plastik 
but this last January I went to one and I had a pretty damn fine time. 
It had nice visuals, a great laser show, and good sound.
and I didn't run into one person who wasn't having a great time. 
It also had much more room to dance than Wicked usually does.
     
so it's all in the luck of the draw I guess.
     
-john.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:26:15 1996
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From: "Jason Green*" <jason_green*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: testing...
To: "sfraves" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:37:55 1996
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From: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com, hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com
Subject: (NRR) Good Web News sources? Infobots?
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>  So
> what's a good source on the web?  Is there any free or cheap "roboting"
> service that gathers news daily or weekly under your specified parameters
> from a large base of resources and sends it via email?

	My favorite right now is <http://www.yahoo.com/headlines>.  Its from 
Reuters, so its less US-centric than it might be.  It has both general and world 
sections, plus tech, business and pap.  I like it because its continuously 
updated.

	Its been about 15 years since I've had news emailed to me, but I 
understand Individual runs a good service.  The SJ Mercury also does it (very 
inexpensive if you get the paper paper already).  Claris might... and doesn't 
AOL?

	Expect email services to charge; the web is usually free these days 
(because of the ads I assume).

Andrew
-----------------------------------------
Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:40:30 1996
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From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: SteveOSac@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, hdeshma@cadev6.intel.com
Subject: Re: (NRR) Good Web News sources? Infobots?
In-Reply-To: <960530163536_124131076@emout10.mail.aol.com>
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Try the PointCast Network... www.pointcast.com  It's a screensaver and 
plug-in for Netscape Navigator that you can set up to download updates 
several times a day.  It's okay... good for stocks... <plug plug>  They 
just started it, but it looks promising..


> Okay, so all thisSFcentric talk has got me thinking I should probably be a
> little more globally aware.  I refuse to watch TV though, and although
> wonderful, NPR's "all things considered", can't be considered real news.  So
> what's a good source on the web?  Is there any free or cheap "roboting"
> service that gathers news daily or weekly under your specified parameters
> from a large base of resources and sends it via email?  Let me know.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:51:54 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Ok, kids....(NRR)
Date: 30 May 1996 23:33:59 GMT
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Organization: Computer Attic
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OK, I have some people here who want to see some really REALLY neat
websites...

Anyone that knos please drop me a line...


"dance with me"


Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:53:49 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 15:53:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Techno music and E
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I used to run screaming from a room if I ever heard techno music.  It
seemed so grating and uninviting to me.

And yet, sometime last year I heard it again and I *got it* in a major way
- now I'm totally hooked.

Most of you already know that I haven't done any drugs for years so that
wasn't a factor in my initiation - however, I _used_ to be really into
psychedelics and I think those pathways are still open and available for
me to access.  I'm not sure if I'd never tranced out on drugs if I'd know
how to do it sober - On the other hand, cultures have been trancing out
for eons and not all of them had drugs so it must be an inate human
ability.

just my .02

	ranting and raving

		jess


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 15:55:19 1996
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From: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
To: larryc@netcom.com
Subject: Have Fun At TF/ORACLe
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 15:41:53 -0700 (PDT)
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> ( I've never been to Crown College ;
> I wonder how difficult it is to walk from the Bay St. gate to the 
> campus? ).

	Its a LONG way up from the gate to Crown.  Crown means "top of the 
hill". About 2 miles, with a five hundred foot climb.

	I may see you there...

Andrew
-----------------------------------------
Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 16:21:31 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 16:21:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
Reply-To: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: E-communications (was SFcentric)
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I have a couple of thoughts in response to Dan, Blackadder, Roy etc..about
personal attacks in public.

If there's one thing I've learned in my life it's that it is _extremely_
difficult to get someone to reconsider their position on something if you
direct your comments in the form of a personal attack.  Dan's initial
response to my post certainly stung for a few minutes but I can't say,
given the nature of this list, that I didn't expect an attack like that
from someone.  

I think that if you disagree with someone you have two paths you can take
	1. slam them - you'll feel better
	2. focus your response on the ideas while validating the person at 
	the same time - you might not feel better but you might actually
	get them to reconsider their position

I really believe that people rarely change their minds about things that
important to them unless they feel that you are on their side and
have their best interests at heart.  In other words that you are acting
as a friend rather than a foe. I mean, if you feel attacked then you get
defensive and that isn't very conducive to introspection and thoughtful
ruminations.

Dan's comments were largely directed at my person rather than my ideas and
as such constituted a personal attack. However, he wasn't completely wrong
either - Dan is obviously a very perceptive man and saw that my ideas were
colored by my emotions - he's right - but isn't that true for all
important issues.

I guess it would have affected me more if I didn't have such a
thick skin from hanging aroung those harsh UK young people (j/k).

I guess my point is that the private vs. public thing is not really the
issue here - the issue is whether you are interested in engaging someone
in a mutually respectful interchange where people feel safe enough to
actually risk changing their minds about long-held ideas, or whether you
are interested in starting a flame fest of the Ethan vs. Tom and Stacey
variety - I'm willing to bet that very few people really reconsidered
their positions on that one.

So I don't really think it matters whether it happens in full view of all
or behind closed doors - attacks are attacks - the advantage to public
airing of grievances is that you get support for both sides and so the
attackee may not feel so alone and that's a very good thing.

Last point - I don't think flame fests are such a bad thing really - I am
really glad that we are finally talking about the SFcentric issue and if I
hadn't written such a provocative post we never would have done it - like
I said in my original post, lets not get so blotto on PLUR that we forget
how to wrestle with each other - let's just do it respectfully -
challenging people on their ideas, not their personal atributes

	ranting and raving
	
		jess



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 16:24:44 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 16:20:59 -0700
To: aguevara@compattic.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: tigger@thestranger.com (Glenn)
Subject: Re: Ok, kids....(NRR)
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At 4:33 PM 5/30/96, Adam Guevara wrote:
>OK, I have some people here who want to see some really REALLY neat
>websites...
>
>Anyone that knos please drop me a line...
>

Really REALLY neat?  Ok! here...

http://www.speakeasy.org/~z2013/

Make sure ya check out Dans Psyberdellica at the Hardbarr!  =)

Enjoy!

w/ love at the speed of light,

Tigger


                          __,,,,_
      _   _ ___.--'''`--''// ,-o `-.
      \`)' O |  \  \ o\/ /.// / ,-  o,_
     /_`  \   |o )  | O|. /o// / -.,_o `-.
    /<0\    ) \  |  | ||/ //o| \/ O \`-.o`-._
   /  _.-.  .-\,O__|  _-| /o\ \/|_/  |    `-._)
   `-\  \/ |       /o__/ \__O / |o_//
        `-'       |  -| -|\__ \  |-'|
               __/ o /__,-o    ),'o |'
              ((__.-'((____..-' \__,'
______________________________________________________________



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 16:36:18 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
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It certainly would encourage goodwill and healthy exchange if people
wouldn't post in an insulting manner, I agree.  I've been on the receiving
end of this sort of thing myself, but when I choose to respond, I usually
do it privately, so the whole list doesn't have to endure yet another
bitching match.  IMO, we are here to lift each other up rather than put
each other down.  Elementary school's over, folks ;)  Let's try some
kindness, some r-e-s-p...you get the idea.

Thanks!

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 16:48:59 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 16:51:57 -0700
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From: Ciaran <cohara@berksys.com>
Subject: re : car-pooling for tribal future
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>
>Hello,
>                I've been hearing about the Tribal Future today and it
co-incides with two things i love :
>                the outdoors and dance music. Unfortunately, i don't own a
car yet as i've only lived  here                 (the US)   a short time.
>                Basically, i was wondering if anyone would mind giving me a
ride to the event on either 
>                Saturday or Sunday. Of course, i am willing to contribute
to the cost of gas for the trip.
>                Maybe you know me to see already, i've been to a few events
in San Francisco. I live in                    the Upper Haight area and am
a regular dude type- person (i think).
>
>                Any offers considered.
>
>                Kiron
>


Ciaran A. O' Hara, Pc Tech Support, Berkeley Systems,
2095 Rose Street, Berkeley, CA 94709
===========================================
Phone : 510-549-2300
Fax :510-849-9426
E-mail : PcTech@berksys.com
Online Online support is available at : www.berksys.com

"go n'eirigh on bothar leat"  "go nigh-ree on bow-her lat"
 "May the road rise up to meet up you".

                       		     \ | /                                   
                               	   @ @
        +-------------------oOO--(_)--OOo--------------------+
         





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 17:24:38 1996
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Date: 30 May 96 20:21:37 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Techno Music and Who Loves It (LONG!)
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A very long message, but hey I had to share it!!  ... food for thought... 

I think a lot about music and why certain people are triggered by certain styles
of music .... Sometimes I'm out dancing and thinking "what is it about this
music that is so important to me?" or sometimes "what am I missing here that so
many people obviously love this music but I don't?"

What I've come to believe is that each person has their own "vibrational" rate
(this is perhaps different from the purely spiritual vibrational rate theory,
maybe not, but I am in no way implying any sort of spiritual development level
here) -- 

That vibrational rate means that when Person A hears a certain type of music, it
reaches deep into their heart and soul, and triggers in them an emotion (happy,
sad, hopeful, whatever) -- the music talks to them and moves them.  

Now, Person B may hear that same music and say ... "I don't get it" ... but THEY
get that emotional response to something totally different, let's say country
music.   We call this "having different tastes in music" but I really think it's
much more than that.

These differences can be subtle ...  but we each know when we're hearing
something that "belongs" to us, because of how we respond.  When I'm dancing
like mad, loving the funky sexy house beat, and look over to my friend Jess, who
is hardly moving because it's too slow for her .... and then the music speeds up
to trance and she's going wild, but my feet have stopped moving ... I know that
there are truly differences in our individual "beats."

(....sometimes I wonder if there are physiological similarities between people
who love house, or people who love jazz, or whatever -- do their hearts beat at
the same rate?  blood pressure?  other measureable things?  ...anyone?  anyone?
...)

Some people would like to put a value judgment on having different musical
tastes ... "oh, you're just not SOPHISTICATED enough to like this music" or "you
listen to TRASH" ....  but I don't think that's valid at all.  Because the love
of music, whatever it is, isn't about thinking, it's about feeling.

Is techno music impersonal or without "soul"?  Not to me, I think it's TOTALLY
personal, because it talks to me deeply, and makes me move, and helps me to be
the person I want to be!  It's TOTALLY personal, because when I hear it, it
becomes part of me, and it brings out MY soul.  

Would that be as possible without the electronic, synthesized nature of it?
Maybe not, because maybe if there was too much of a personal stamp on it from
someone else, I couldn't own it as much when I hear it.  I often listen to music
with a strong personal voice (such as blues vocals or rap/hip-hop music) but
that doesn't affect me in quite the same way -- that's more like a person
singing to me, more like a conversation with another person, there's a
separation there like being an observer/listener.  

One of my favorite things is electronic music with scrambled or muffled vocals
that you can't quite make out (Jeno is a master at this), because then you have
to allow the words to absorb into your mind first, then let the message appear
from within -- almost like talking to yourself.  No other (identifiable) person
to come between you and how the music affects you.  (Again, classical has
similarities but because it is not made to dance to, it is a totally different
experience.)

Is music better when high?  Hell yes -- I feel that sometimes being stoned, or
an EmpathogEnic state creates a clear path to the vibe of the music -- like
walking through a door that was there all the time, only you didn't see it
before.  To me, that altered state lets me let go of my "mental" self and become
my "physical and emotional" self, and that is the part of me that responds best
to music and dancing.

So as part of this long testimonial (sorry!), I'd like to say a BIG THANK YOU to
the people who create techno music, the creators of the amazing equipment that
makes/mixes the music, and MOST of all to the DJs who use these tools to take us
on journeys where we get to BE ourselves, get to SEE ourselves, and get to have
MORE FUN than many people feel they deserve in a lifetime!

Leslie  ("I got the music in me")

p.s.  Separate topic but related?  Let's not be too hard on the 14-year-olds who
don't see the spiritual side of raving yet -- "when the student is ready, the
teacher will appear" -- we all develop at different rates, and sometimes it
takes time for someone to be ready for a leap in their personal development --
let's just try to be there with them to light the path when they are ready.





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 17:41:52 1996
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From: Derek Chung <dhchung@hyperreal.com>
Message-Id: <199605310041.RAA07429@taz.hyperreal.com>
Subject: This Week's SFR Calendar!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com (SF Raves)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 17:41:48 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves-calendar@hyperreal.com (SFR Calendar)
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In case anyone was wondering...

Due to crowding constraints and other reasons, some rave organizers don't
want their events listed in this calendar (since it goes to well over
a thousand recipients).  So sometimes I have to use discretion to decide
if an event should go in the calendar - if it sounds pretty underground
I might leave it out.  If the party is flyered on Haight and the clubs,
I'll assume it isn't underground and put it in.  Otherwise, if you're a
promoter and you definitely do or don't want your event in the calendar,
please send me mail at dhchung@hyperreal.com.  Occasionally I get behind
in my mail, or I'll get a lot at once and so I might miss something -
apologies if this occurs.


                             THE SFR CALENDAR
                                       
    http://www.hyperreal.com/raves/sf/calendar/gencal.cgi
    
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Upcoming Parties in the San Francisco Bay Area

   Friday, May 31st - _Needles_
   Barry Weaver, Donald Glaude, Chris Flores, Karizma, Dutch, Matthew,
   Miah, Stevie, Vibes, Flash, Dennis, Rockit, Filip, Scot, Carlos
   Campos.
   runs all weekend (thru 6/2)
   415.313.7107 916.440.2707
   
   Friday, May 31st - Out-A-Sight
   Graeme, Jeno, Simon, Sotero (SD).
   Visuals by Hyperdelic, Donovan.
   SF. 415.437.4462
   
   Friday, May 31st - Beyond Space-Time/Kundalini presents 100% Spiritual
   Rays of Love
   DJ Shakra, Michael Manahan, Dervish, DJ Daeman, Ernie Munson, Phil
   Salter, Jon Williams.
   415.337.4928 510.895.3550
   
   Friday, May 31st - GrooveKid and FunkyBeat presents _Experienced_
   Tony, Matthew, Essence, Max Factor, Kenneth Paul, Spinner, Jin.
   SF. 415.605.1915 408.814.5763 510.726.5947
   
   Saturday, June 1st - Wicked 
   Markie, Garth, Jeno, Thomas.
   11pm-7am, 21+, $15. 174 King St, SF. 415.512.5713
   
   Saturday, June 1st - _Tribal Future Big Mountain Boogie_
   Tony, Carlos, Josh, John Howard, Tracy, Galen, Solar, Alex Windsor,
   Alika, Abstract, Pollywog, Dan Barnes, Allen, Andrew, Nathan, DJ
   Crack.
   runs from noon Saturday until midnight or later Sunday.
   tix at Ameba and Primal.
   $20. Willits. 415.750.9368
   
   Saturday, June 1st - _Plastik 1 yr anniversary_
   Carlos, Garth, Ghost, DJ Dan, Jay-J, Mark Farina, John Howard, Simply
   Jeff, Trance, Hipp-E, Donald Glaude.
   tape giveaway to first 200.
   510.885.8178 408.469.5079 415.675.5980 707.551.7337
   
   Saturday, June 1st - Frequency-8 
   A Full Moon Party in the Woods
   Ivo, MARS, Myster-E, Cyr.
   Only 150 prepurchase tix available @ Freq-8 415.221.4142
   $5.
   
   Saturday, June 8th - choice... presents Basics 
   Tony, Josh, Garth, Doc Martin, Doran, Brownie, Astral Matrix (live).
   E.S.W.H/H.O.B.M./C.C.C./H.B.T.U.K.
   415.905.9629
   
   Saturday, June 8th - _Down to Earth_
   Galen, John Howard, Solar, Pete Moss, Little T, Laron.
   Visuals by Mark Johns.
   $7 before 11pm
   415.985.7109
   
   Friday, June 14th - AstralScapes Inc. presents _Orion_
   A Journey Through Sound
   Tyler, Wizard, Talizman, Jon Santos, Solar, Shoam, Candy Land Twinz,
   Myste, Minor Minor, Trent, Noel, UFO, Karizma, Thad, Hannibal Selecta,
   OM, Rig-A-Tony, OBSO, Consciousness Lab Ambient Sound Research.
   presale tix at Frequency-8, Getta Clue (Sac) and Garment Lounge (Oak)
   415.273.1190 916.392.9105
   
   Saturday, June 15th - Nexus presents _Second Chakra_
   Dale Charles (Boston), Pete Moss (Boston), Jeno, Donald Glaude, DJ
   Quest, Carlos, Dreamer, Kwashi, Essence.
   510.667.3492 415.337.4263
   
   Saturday, June 15th - Frank Nitty and the Brotherhood presents
   _Indonesia_
   Frank Nitty, DJ Ghost, E Flow (Sweden), Rick Preston, Kwashi, Essence,
   Dope Cat, J Mack.
   415.560.5324 415.340.5607 408.235.9344
   
   Saturday, June 22nd - Full Circle Productions presents _Sankofa_
   Mark Gage (Vapour Space), Rabbit in the Moon, DJ Monk, Vicious Vic,
   Wade Hampton, Terry Mullan, Justin, Ernie Munson, DJ Dan, Simon,
   Garth, Jeno.
   415.675.9956 510.986.9089
   
   Tuesday, June 25th - _Crash Worship_
   live tribal/industrial band
   $10. Trocadero, 520 4th St @ Bryant, SF. 415.995.4600
   
   Saturday, June 29th - _Tribal Funk_
   Tony, Josh, Galen, guests.
   
   
   Thursday, July 4th - _Chateau de Boom_
   fundraiser for San Mateo AIDS Services
   noon-8pm, $3. Hillsboro "classic spelling". 415.572.3250
   
   Wednesday, August 28th - Burning Man 1996
   includes Wicked Sound System.
   save $10 by registering by June 1st.
   runs entire weekend, through September 2nd.
   All ages, $35. Black Rock Desert, Nevada. 415.985.7471
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
W E E K L I E S

   House/techno/acid jazz/ambient/etc reg'lar happenins Some of them may
   have ended - let me know when that happens...
   
  Thursday
  
   Lift - House, Funk w/DJs David Harness, Ruben Mancias, Jay-J, Black,
   guests. 12mid-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma, SF. 415.267.5984
   
   Velvet Shop - House, Techno. call for location
   21+, $5. 4th St Bowl, , SJ. 408.235.1556
   
   _Azul_ - House, Soul w/DJs Alfie, James. 21+, Free. Casanova, 527
   Valencia, SF.
   
   Full House - Acid Jazz, House w/DJs Finn, Matt Bernsen, Andrew
   Rawnsley, Bruno Ybarra, guests, live musicians. 10pm-2am, 21+, $3.
   Miss Pearl's Jam House, Eddy & Larkin, SF.
   
   Pack-a-Bowl - "We'll be droppin the wax while you're droppin the
   balls" w/DJs Mars, Tracy, guests. 8:30pm-2am, $6. Park Bowl, Haight @
   Stanyan, SF. 415.541.5019
   
   .blitz - foxyboysfancygirlsfreshmademixes begins April 4th
   21+. 278 11th St @ Folsom, SF.
   
   _Le Jazz Hot!_ - future sounds for jazz heads w/DJs Andrew Jervis,
   guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, $3. Nickies BBQ, 460 Haight, SF. 415.621.6508
   
   _Real_ - house, techno. every first Thursday of the month
   9pm-2am, 18+, $7. Pantages Theater, 1225 K St Mall, Sacramento.
   916.565.9588
   
   _Revolutionary Wax_ - coax your evolutionary ass w/DJs Consuelo Kevin,
   John John (Open Mind), James (Tweekin). 21+, Free. Dalva, 3121 16th
   St, SF. 415.252.7740
   
   _Green_ - house, techno w/DJs guests weekly. 10pm-2am, 18+. the top of
   the Wharf Cafe, the end of the Santa Cruz Wharf, Santa Cruz.
   
   _Thirzdaze_ - bringing you the true frisco groove w/DJs DJ Dan, Donald
   Glaude, guests. details to follow.
   
   
  Friday
  
   _ Sound Factory _- House w/DJs Pete Avila, David Harness, guets.
   9:30pm-7am, 21+, $10. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF.
   415.543.1300
   
   _Soul'd Out_ - House w/DJs Julius Papp, Rick Preston, guests. free
   before 10:30
   9pm-, 21+, $5. The Usual, 400 S.1st St., San Jose.
   
   _Nocturnal Transmission_ - House w/DJs David Harness, Tim Martinez,
   Saint John, guests. $5 before midnight.
   11pm-5am, 21+, $10. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Go Fast_ - Techno. Energy Music...for Women by Women (boys can come
   too).
   10pm-. 8th & Minna, SF.
   
   _Liquid Fridays_ - House w/DJs various DJs. 10pm-2am, 18+, Free. 2721
   Broadway, Sacramento., Sacramento. 916.484.4285
   
   the green door - "where circles meet squares" w/DJs andrew, thomas,
   caspar, paul, felix the dog, guests. 10pm-3am, 21+, $7. 880 Stevenson
   @ 10th, SF.
   
   _Nikita_ - house, techno w/DJs Jeno, Simon, Henrik. 10pm-7am, 21+,
   $10. 1015 Folsom St, SF. 415.267.0568
   [5.31 - Juan Atkins]
   [6.7 - DJ Duke]
   [6.14 - Westbam, Hardsequencer]
   [6.21 - CJ Mackintosh]
   [6.28 - Derrick May]
   
   _The Scene_ - 21+. the EndUp, 401 6th @ Harrison, SF. 415.393.9067
   
   _Beats_ - house, breakbeat, trance w/DJs Carlos Campos, Karizma,
   weekly guests. 7042 Folsom Blvd between Howe and 65th, Sacramento.
   415.273.1345 916.558.0850
   
   _This Side Up_ - house, techno w/DJs guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight,
   SF.
   
  Saturday
  
   _Other Whirled_ - House, Techno w/DJs Warren, Nobel, Jason Cassady,
   Nikki Rivera, guests. saturday morning
   6am-, 21+. 201 9th @ Howard, SF.
   
   _Sound Factory _- big club sounds
   9:30pm-4am, 21+. Sound Factory, 525 Harrison @ 1st, SF. 415.543.1300
   
   _Release _- Acid Jazz, Funk, Reggae, House w/DJs Jerry Ross, Josh, Mr.
   Sulu, Randy Wong. 21+. 1015 Folsom, , SF. 415.337.7457
   
   55 - House, Euro w/DJs Jorge Martinez, Tim Martinez, guests. 21+. 55
   Natoma St., SF. 415.267.1858
   
   _Vanilla Fudge _- House w/DJs Corey Black, Sunshine, Moonbeam, Jason,
   Big Lee, Darren. occasional saturday nights.
   10pm-2am, Free. Cafe Bastille, 55 Belden Alley, SF. 415.764.2903
   
   Vertigo - Psycho, Techno, Disco, Funk w/DJs Nikki Rivera, Ellen
   Ferrato, Dave Peterson, Lewis. 10pm-, 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison,
   SF. 415.703.7172
   
   _Liquid Vinyl_ - House w/DJs Jay-J, Suiki, John Howard, guests.
   2am-6am, 21+, $8. DV8, 540 Howard, SF. 415.957.1730
   
   _Nuff Respect _- Jungle w/DJs StarEyes, Thad. 5pm-9pm, Free. Your
   Mama's Cafe, 5239 College Ave @ Broadway, Oakland, Oakland.
   510.601.YOUR
   
   phunkatech - Jungle w/DJs UFO, Noel, guests. 21+, $2. The Top, 424
   Haight, SF. 415.995.4699
   
   _Metro Jazz _- Acid Jazz w/DJs Ruben Mancias, Mauricio Avilas, Tom
   Thump, Franky, guests. 10pm-, 21+, $7. 111 Minna St, SF. 415.974.1719
   [6.1 - Markie]
   [6.8 - Two Year Anniversary block party w/Josh Jones, Hueman Flavor,
   Andrew Jervis]
   
  Sunday
  
   _ Spundae _- House, Techno w/DJs Henrik, Carlos, Miquel, weekly
   guests. free b4 10:30p
   For Technotica, call 415.764.2922
   10pm-5:30am, 21+, $5. 55 Natoma St., SF. 415.974.9389
   
   _Leopard Lounge_ - Acid Jazz, Funk & Live Bands. w/DJs Suiki, Jay-J,
   Anthony, Julius Papp, Mark Farina, guests. 2125 Lombard @ Fillmore,
   SF. 415.771.2583
   
   _Pleasuredome_ - House w/DJs Neil Lewis, David Harness, Phil B,
   guests. 21+, $8. 177 Townsend, SF. 415.985.5256
   
   Quench - House, Ambient w/DJs Rick Preston, Ryan Tapia, guests.
   Ambient-Space explorations by DJ Leath and guests in the front room.
   21+. The Usual, 400 South First St., San Jose. 408.535.0330
   
   _Techsture_ - deep layers of sound w/DJs tomas, markus, guests.
   8pm-12mid, All ages, Free. cafe abir, 1300 Fulton @ Divisadero, SF.
   415.974.4358
   
   subbass - jungle, drum'n'bass, trip hop w/DJs noel, abstract, jawbone.
   10pm-2am, 21+, $3. 270 Brannan @ 2nd, SF. 415.905.8865
   
   Strawberry Sundays - techno, house w/DJs Dutch, Jazz-E, Corey, Oscure,
   Jesse. $5 for under 21;.
   6am-, 18+, $3. Bahia, 1600 Market St., SF. 415.635.9183
   
   Mantra - A hypnotic trance-inducing affirmation. w/DJs Dutch, Surge,
   Theta Blip, Abstract, Noel, UFO, guests. 10pm-3am, 18+, $5. 683
   Clementina Alley, SF. 415.331.1500x888
   
  Monday
  
    Mushroom Jazz - acid jazz, trip hop w/DJs Mark Farina, Miquel, Julius
   Papp, guests. 9pm-3am, 21+, $5. 330 Ritch St, SF. 415.905.8811
   
   _Noc Noc_ - techno/ambient/jungle w/DJs Mohsen. 21+, Free. 557 Haight
   St., SF.
   
   _Tongue n' Groove _- trip hop, jungle, acid jazz w/DJs tomas, seth,
   m.mark, guests. 10pm-4am, 21+, $5. Cat's Grill & Alley, 1190 Folsom @
   8th, SF. 415.431.3332
   
   _rotation_ - jazz, hiphop, soul, acid jazz, funk w/DJs racer x, yamu,
   stef, rasta cue-tip, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+. up & down club, 1151
   Folsom St, SF.
   
   _21st sensory _- abstractbeatz-hiphop-dub-drum n'bass-electro w/DJs
   Tomas, Abstract, guests. 21+. the Top, 424 Haight, SF. 415.974.4358
   
   _Movement_ - trance, breakbeat, jungle w/DJs Julio, Kimo. 10pm-2am,
   18+, $3. Bahia Cabana, 1600 Market @ Franklin, SF. 415.263.5797
   
  Tuesday
  
    Butterfly - Hip Hop, Acid Jazz, House, Funk w/DJs Charlotte, Dani,
   guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, $2. Casanova, 527 Valencia, SF.
   
   Breathe Deep - House w/DJs Jay-J, Ruben, Miquel, guests. 10pm-4am,
   21+, $5. 1015 Folsom., SF. 415.998.9515
   
   _Begin..._ - house, trip hop, trance w/DJs Darrel, Cisco, Radley,
   Ollie, Seanee, Xpress, Grey, Anna. 9pm-2am, All ages. The Inn of the
   Beginning, 8201 Old Redwood Highway, Cotati, Cotati. 707.524.4443
   
   _Shoam_ - Trip-Hop & Drum n Bass Your Mama's Cafe, 5239 College,
   Oakland.
   
   _Succotash!_ - tasty jazz - funk - beats - space w/DJs tom thump,
   rasta q-tip. 21+, Free. up & down club, 1151 folsom st., SF.
   
   _supper_ - funk, acid jazz w/DJs Caspar, guests. 21+, Free. Julie's
   Supper Club, 1123 Folsom @ 7th, SF. 415.861.0707
   
   _Light-n-Up Lounge_ - house w/DJs Preston, guests. 21+. 111 Minna St,
   SF.
   
   _L-Tryptophan_ - ambient, techno w/DJs guest DJs weekly. 21+, Free.
   1624 California @ Van Ness, SF.
   
   _Lost in Space_ - house, hip-hop w/DJs Pause, Dark Money, Winnie B,
   Eric Lacy. 21+, Free. Cafe Mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th, SF.
   
  Wednesday
  
   _ Come/Unity _- House, Techno, Ambient w/DJs Simon, Jeno, Garth. first
   Wednesday of the month.
   10pm-4am, 21+, $7. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.241.8815
   
   _Boost_ - old school uplifting house w/DJs Jamie J, Hector the
   ejector. 21+. the EndUp, 6th & Harrison, SF. 415.703.7105
   
   _Roots_ - House, Dub, Reggae w/DJs Garth, Jeno, guests. Buna & guests
   in the dub reggae room
   10pm-4am, 21+, $6. 1015 Folsom, SF. 415.512.5713
   
   _cosmic lounge _- space jazz, galactic grooves, jungle w/DJs Caspar,
   Paul, Seth, guests. 10pm-2am, 21+, Free. cafe mars, 798 Brannan @ 7th,
   SF.
   
   _Reunion_ - Danny, Naz Cafe, guests. 9pm-, 21+, Free. The Fulton Bar,
   1243 Fulton Mall, Fresno. 209.488.5332
   
   _Thirsty_ - tasty house tunes and even better company w/DJs Jellybear,
   Jay-J, top notch guests. 9pm-2am, 21+, Free. The Top, 424 Haight St,
   SF.
   
   _The Lounge_ - 9pm-3am, 21+. 1401 Arden Way, Sacramento.
   916.922.8041x4240
   
   _Bubbles_ - deep funky techno house music w/DJs Don Crisp (Crisp
   Records), guests. starts May 1.
   9pm-2am, 21+. Babylon, 2260 Van Ness @ Vallejo, SF. 415.567.1222
   
   _Wish_ - techno, house w/DJs guests weekly. Lighting by EyeTribe
   18+. Bahia, 1600 Market St, SF. 415.436.0663
   
   _Belief_ - house w/DJs Julius Papp, Harry Who?, Rick Preston. begins
   5.22.
   10pm-, 21+. Agenda basement, 1st & San Salvador, San Jose.
   
   _Jackin' the Box_ - weeklytechnohousejammyinnadetroitchicagostylee
   w/DJs jon santos, samuel, guests. 10pm-2am, 18+, $5. 375 1st St @
   Harrison, SF.
   [6.5 - sho]
   [6.12 - john howard]
   [6.19 - dial8]
   
   Boogie Bowl - house, techno w/DJs John Howard, Tracy, Dave, Virg,
   guests. admission includes bowling and pool.
   10pmm-3am, $8. Country Club Bowl, 88 Vivian Way @ E.Francisco, San
   Rafael. 415.456.6440
   
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Info Lines

     * Be-At Info Line - 415-626-4087. Usually has 5-10 listings, updated
       daily.
     * Clubline - 415.979.8686
     * Fatline - 415.207.3668
     * Frequency 8 Trance/Techno infoline - 415.541.5019
     * the Global Party Network Buzzline - 415.568.1338
     * The Groove Line - (415) 331.1500 ext.4788
     * Housewares Rave Line - 415.281.0125
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Radio/TV Shows

     * Sunday night 11pm-2am - "The Dreaming/Innermind Show" w/DJ Miracle
       & Mr. Monchichi. House, Jungle, Trip-Hop, Ambient, Dub,
       Break-Beats & guest DJs. KSCU 103.3 (Santa Clara)
     * Monday afternoon 12:30-3:00 pm - DJ Jerecho presents the best of
       the urban polyrhythmic experience jungle, acid jazz, techno,
       electro, breakbeat KDVS, 90.3 FM (Davis)
     * Wednesday night/Thursday morning 3am-6am - "Aural Fixation"
       experimental sounds of ambient and trip hop with a splash of hi
       nrg, from trance to jungle. KZSC 88.1 fm (Santa Cruz)
     * Thursdays 9:30pm-midnight - "Aurora Borealis" Beats and
       atmospherics w/DJ Seth. KALX 90.7 (Berkeley)
     * Fridays 9pm-midnight - Andrew from Groove Merchant spins on KUSF
       90.3 (SF)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - midnight-noon. House/techno mix
       with Johnny K, Ozone & guests - KCSS 91.9 Central Valley (Turlock)
     * Friday night/Saturday morning - "Just Desserts" w/Mr.Goodwrench -
       10pm-2am Jungle, Detroit, Techno, Acid House, whacked-out Dub, and
       noise KFJC 89.7 - Los Altos Hills
     * Friday night - nocturnal transmissions - featuring house DJs from
       SF and around the world. mid-2am, 107.7 FM (SF)
     * Friday night - Your Mama's House w/Pete Avila - 3am-5am, 106.1
       KMEL.
     * Friday night - Moondance. Ambient; 3am-7:30am, KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday afternoon - "Bus Stop" - music and talk w/guest DJs from
       SF and beyond. 2pm-3pm. KUSF 90.3 SF.
     * Saturday night 11pm - Flux Television, Viacom Channel 53 -
       Ambient, acid jazz and house music videos & interviews. (415)
       281-3377. flux@flux.net
     * Saturday night 9pm-mid - "An Epiphany of Sound" hosted by J.C. and
       Monkeywrench KZSU 90.1 (Stanford)
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
   For a _search_ interface to the calendar, see the Late Train club
   section.
     _________________________________________________________________
   
Administrative Notes

   If anyone has info on any other events, send it to me! I can't
   possibly hope to get all the info every week.
   
   This info gets sent via email every Thursday. To subscribe or
   unsubscribe to the calendar mailing list, send e-mail to
   majordomo@hyperreal.com with either the line
   
   subscribe sfraves-calendar or
   unsubscribe sfraves-calendar
   
   There is also an sfraves discussion mailing list for issues related to
   clubs, parties, house and techno music, etc. To subscribe, send e-mail
   to majordomo@hyperreal.com with the line
   
   subscribe sfraves
   
   in the body of the message.
   
   
   
   
    Derek Chung - dhchung@hyperreal.com

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 18:07:26 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:07:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: O R A C L e (parking)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605301802.A27253-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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A parking alternative has been researched and brought to my attention 
(thank you swoosh!) :


From: swoosh@ucscb.UCSC.EDU (John Elias Darrow)
> ...
> If you get to the campus before 8pm, you can drive right through the gate
> without being stopped, and then just walk around until 9.  There are some
> great views of the town and bay, and paths around there.
> You can park almost anywhere on campus after 5pm and all weekend without
> fear of getting ticketed.
> ...

 And to double check on his information, I called The Crown College parking
office ( 459-4373 ). The gal who answered the phone told me that , after
5PM , general public parking is OK in the "A" lots. Also , to avoid the
guard at the gate , I should enter campus before 7:30PM.


free     free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free
     \*/     \*/      \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
	~	O	R	A	C	L	E	~
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-

GREETINGS FELLOW RAVERS...
	on may 31st, this friday, at UC SantaCruz,  crown college...
	come groove to the rhythms and beats of (((techno & house))) djs:
        
	s w o o p s -=*=- c l o u d s -=*=- b r i a n F l i p -=*=- mc2

	also relax and chill to the ambient grooves of live performace by:

			-=*=- dionysus dreams -=*=-

	this is a FREE event, sponsored by crown college, music spinning 
	starting at 9:00PM-1:30AM

		for more directions: email liquid7@cats OR mhg@cats
	       >>408-471-5420<<		      >>408-471-7450<<

	-=>])} Please use public transportation from the base of campus  {([<=- 
		-for parking/entrance by car is restricted to students-
		-there is a bus/shuttle stop at the south gate, bay st.-

\___...Oh yeah, were just students throwing this party... a free party...
		...put on by sf-ravers  ...for sf-ravers
					\____...hope to see you there ;)

_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
 __    ____  _____  __  __  ____  ____  ___
(  )  (_  _)(  _  )(  )(  )(_  _)(  _ \(__ )
 )(__  _)(_  )(_)(  )(__)(  _)(_  )(_) )/ /
(____)(____)(___/\\(______)(____)(____/(_/@cats.ucsc.edu


  \  |           |                     \  |
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 18:10:18 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:10:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: O R A C L e (who's coming?)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605301834.A27253-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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free     free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free    free
     \*/     \*/      \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/     \*/
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-
        ~       O       R       A       C       L       E       ~
_-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-___-=*=-

We are wondering if any of you SFravers are getting this message and plan 
to come to Oracle @ the UCSC campus on Friday, May 31 st.  If you plan to 
come could you drop a quick line to mhg@cats.ucsc.edu so we can estimate 
the # of people coming.

THANX

RaVe On!

_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
  \  |           |                     \  |                          
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/ 
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 18:19:39 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:19:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: ORACLe (parking w/ little walking)
To: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
cc: larryc@netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605301541.aa10940@andrewk.pdev.sco.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605301818.A27253-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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No need for serious walking!  

You can catch one of the night shuttles 
from the stop @ the base of the campus just outside of the front gate or you 
can catch the Santa Cruz Metro bus 1 (it says UCSC on it) from the Metro 
station downtown (on Pacific) which only costs $1.

See yall ravers on friday!  We are looking forward to your appearance.


On Thu, 30 May 1996, Andrew Knutsen wrote:

> > ( I've never been to Crown College ;
> > I wonder how difficult it is to walk from the Bay St. gate to the 
> > campus? ).
> 
> 	Its a LONG way up from the gate to Crown.  Crown means "top of the 
> hill". About 2 miles, with a five hundred foot climb.
> 
> 	I may see you there...
> 
> Andrew
> -----------------------------------------
> Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
> Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538
> 










_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
  \  |           |                     \  |                          
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/ 
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 18:26:36 1996
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	(Smail-3.1.29.1 #32) id m0uPIyq-0002DFC; Thu, 30 May 96 18:26 PDT
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:26:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: E to enjoy Techno?
In-Reply-To: <199605300622.XAA10937@bass.hooked.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.SCO.3.91.960530182217.22808A-100000@vanbc.wimsey.com>
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i'm being brave by responding to this post without reading anyone else's 
responses! :)

I didn't need e to appreciate techno .... as a matter of fact, i think
techno helped me appreciate e if anything.  my first rave was an accident. 
i didn't even know that such things existed and i had heard o ecstacy. but
only occasionally, as the group i hung with was more into acid at the time
... and since i was taking one of my "rests" from drugs at the time, my
earliest techno experiences were all DRUG FREE!!! and you know what?  I
LOVED IT ANYWAYS! :)

k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 18:28:44 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:28:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: where's DJ DAN?
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Since DJ Dan will not be spinning ANYWHERE on Friday night we recommend 
that you come to Oracle because it is a FREE rave and that way you can 
save your $$ for Saturday night's Plastik where DJ Dan will be spinning.

Praise to god of break beats...

_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
  \  |           |                     \  |                          
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_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/ 
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 18:38:29 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:38:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: ORACLe (parking w/ little walking)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605301849.A1847-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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No need for serious walking!  

You can catch one of the night shuttles 
from the stop @ the base of the campus just outside of the front gate or you 
can catch the Santa Cruz Metro bus 1 (it says UCSC on it) from the Metro 
station downtown (on Pacific) which only costs $1.

See yall ravers on friday!  We are looking forward to your appearance.


On Thu, 30 May 1996, Andrew Knutsen wrote:

> > ( I've never been to Crown College ;
> > I wonder how difficult it is to walk from the Bay St. gate to the 
> > campus? ).
> 
> 	Its a LONG way up from the gate to Crown.  Crown means "top of the 
> hill". About 2 miles, with a five hundred foot climb.
> 
> 	I may see you there...
> 
> Andrew
> -----------------------------------------
> Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
> Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538
> 










_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
  \  |           |                     \  |                          
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/ 
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 19:20:37 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream)
Subject: what the heck?
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Ok, my rave-ignorance is showing.  What the heck does the following stand 
for?  I pulled this off the SFRaves Calendar...


        E.S.W.H/H.O.B.M./C.C.C./H.B.T.U.K.

S


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 19:31:42 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 19:31:35 -0700
To: SDream@tgrigsby.com (SDream), sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Wayne Correia <wayne@club.net>
Subject: Re: what the heck?
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At 7:20 PM 5/30/96, SDream wrote:>Ok, my rave-ignorance is showing.  What
the heck does the following stand
>for?  I pulled this off the SFRaves Calendar...
>
>

E.S.W.H
something about Will Higgs

H.O.B.M.
something about Malachy

C.C.C.
Communion Consciousness Collective

H.B.T.U.K.
you got me.

____________________________________________________________________________
 Wayne D. Correia                                            wayne@club.net
 900 Tennessee Street              TEL: +1.415.826.6000        www.club.net
 San Francisco CA 94107-3014       FAX: +1.415.826.6100      www.domain.net



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 19:57:04 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 19:56:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>
To: nw-raves@hyperreal.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: only testing :)
Message-ID: <Pine.SCO.3.91.960530195532.27607A-100000@vanbc.wimsey.com>
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i sent a message to hyperreal today and i got about TEN copies of it back 
in my box, all addressed to me ... anyone else having odd email troubles?

confused,
k

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 20:04:45 1996
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Message-ID: <31AE7D87.4DD@netdoor.com>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 22:03:03 -0700
From: Bill or Brent Overstreet <billover@netdoor.com>
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
CC: billover@netdoor.com
Subject: JUST SAY YES!
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jess wrote:
>
> I used to run screaming from a room if I ever heard techno music.  It
> seemed so grating and uninviting to me.
>
> And yet, sometime last year I heard it again and I *got it* in a major way
> - now I'm totally hooked.
>
> Most of you already know that I haven't done any drugs for years so that
> wasn't a factor in my initiation - however, I _used_ to be really into
> psychedelics and I think those pathways are still open and available for
> me to access.  I'm not sure if I'd never tranced out on drugs if I'd know
> how to do it sober - On the other hand, cultures have been trancing out
> for eons and not all of them had drugs so it must be an inate human
> ability.
>
> just my .02
>
>         ranting and raving
>
>                 jess

     Jess, I know what you mean about the drugs. I have been in the
underground music scene for about seven years and the vibes are more
addictive than drugs. I love to make a tape and just jam out. I am in
treatment so I can't say I never done drugs I done them most of my life.
I knew that it wasn't the drugs that made me love the music I just love
the vibes I get from it. All I need is to do one more fix(mix) and then I
will get off of the shit(turntables). That's what they all say!!!
   JUST SAY YES TO A GOOD CLEAN MIX
      BIG"O"
          
      Some where in Jackson,Ms.  HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-- 
  Bill or Brent Overstreet
    Clinton, Mississippi
      Visit "Aa-aah-hh-h, Now You're Cooking" at...  
        http://www2.netdoor.com/~billover/index.html

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 20:10:30 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 20:10:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Leichardt <djtom@svpal.org>
Subject: what about sunset?
To: Happy Ravers <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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is there a sunset this weekend?

pleeeze tell me, i got to make some plans.

peace,
tom

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 20:13:32 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 22:12:00 -0700
From: Bill or Brent Overstreet <billover@netdoor.com>
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> A very long message, but hey I had to share it!!  ... food for thought...
>
> I think a lot about music and why certain people are triggered by certain styles
> of music .... Sometimes I'm out dancing and thinking "what is it about this
> music that is so important to me?" or sometimes "what am I missing here that so
> many people obviously love this music but I don't?"
>
> What I've come to believe is that each person has their own "vibrational" rate
> (this is perhaps different from the purely spiritual vibrational rate theory,
> maybe not, but I am in no way implying any sort of spiritual development level
> here) --
>
> That vibrational rate means that when Person A hears a certain type of music, it
> reaches deep into their heart and soul, and triggers in them an emotion (happy,
> sad, hopeful, whatever) -- the music talks to them and moves them.
>
> Now, Person B may hear that same music and say ... "I don't get it" ... but THEY
> get that emotional response to something totally different, let's say country
> music.   We call this "having different tastes in music" but I really think it's
> much more than that.
>
> These differences can be subtle ...  but we each know when we're hearing
> something that "belongs" to us, because of how we respond.  When I'm dancing
> like mad, loving the funky sexy house beat, and look over to my friend Jess, who
> is hardly moving because it's too slow for her .... and then the music speeds up
> to trance and she's going wild, but my feet have stopped moving ... I know that
> there are truly differences in our individual "beats."
>
> (....sometimes I wonder if there are physiological similarities between people
> who love house, or people who love jazz, or whatever -- do their hearts beat at
> the same rate?  blood pressure?  other measureable things?  ...anyone?  anyone?
> ...)
>
> Some people would like to put a value judgment on having different musical
> tastes ... "oh, you're just not SOPHISTICATED enough to like this music" or "you
> listen to TRASH" ....  but I don't think that's valid at all.  Because the love
> of music, whatever it is, isn't about thinking, it's about feeling.
>
> Is techno music impersonal or without "soul"?  Not to me, I think it's TOTALLY
> personal, because it talks to me deeply, and makes me move, and helps me to be
> the person I want to be!  It's TOTALLY personal, because when I hear it, it
> becomes part of me, and it brings out MY soul.
>
> Would that be as possible without the electronic, synthesized nature of it?
> Maybe not, because maybe if there was too much of a personal stamp on it from
> someone else, I couldn't own it as much when I hear it.  I often listen to music
> with a strong personal voice (such as blues vocals or rap/hip-hop music) but
> that doesn't affect me in quite the same way -- that's more like a person
> singing to me, more like a conversation with another person, there's a
> separation there like being an observer/listener.
>
> One of my favorite things is electronic music with scrambled or muffled vocals
> that you can't quite make out (Jeno is a master at this), because then you have
> to allow the words to absorb into your mind first, then let the message appear
> from within -- almost like talking to yourself.  No other (identifiable) person
> to come between you and how the music affects you.  (Again, classical has
> similarities but because it is not made to dance to, it is a totally different
> experience.)
>
> Is music better when high?  Hell yes -- I feel that sometimes being stoned, or
> an EmpathogEnic state creates a clear path to the vibe of the music -- like
> walking through a door that was there all the time, only you didn't see it
> before.  To me, that altered state lets me let go of my "mental" self and become
> my "physical and emotional" self, and that is the part of me that responds best
> to music and dancing.
>
> So as part of this long testimonial (sorry!), I'd like to say a BIG THANK YOU to
> the people who create techno music, the creators of the amazing equipment that
> makes/mixes the music, and MOST of all to the DJs who use these tools to take us
> on journeys where we get to BE ourselves, get to SEE ourselves, and get to have
> MORE FUN than many people feel they deserve in a lifetime!
>
> Leslie  ("I got the music in me")
>
> p.s.  Separate topic but related?  Let's not be too hard on the 14-year-olds who
> don't see the spiritual side of raving yet -- "when the student is ready, the
> teacher will appear" -- we all develop at different rates, and sometimes it
> takes time for someone to be ready for a leap in their personal development --
> let's just try to be there with them to light the path when they are ready.

-- You shouldn't limit yourself on music expecially in this type of
music. I love jazzy house to hard jungle. It's all in your mood at the
time. I make a tape just for the mood I'm in at that time. It would be a
bore if you had a one track mind.
  KEEP THE GOOD VIBS FLOWING
        BIG"O"

  

-- 
  Bill or Brent Overstreet
    Clinton, Mississippi
      Visit "Aa-aah-hh-h, Now You're Cooking" at...  
        http://www2.netdoor.com/~billover/index.html

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 20:52:34 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 20:52:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Have Fun At TF/ORACLe
To: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
cc: larryc@netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605301541.aa10940@andrewk.pdev.sco.com>
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On Thu, 30 May 1996, Andrew Knutsen wrote:

> > ( I've never been to Crown College ;
> > I wonder how difficult it is to walk from the Bay St. gate to the 
> > campus? ).
> 
> 	Its a LONG way up from the gate to Crown.  Crown means "top of the 
> hill". About 2 miles, with a five hundred foot climb.
> 
> 	I may see you there...
> 
> Andrew
> -----------------------------------------
> Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
> Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538
> 


Hi!
 If you are at the gate just wait at the bus stop for a campus shuttle. 
They are free and will take you straight there.



Ran



                               -=*=-
                                 ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 20:53:17 1996
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Well I guess last night was the first night of Jackin the box, so I decided
to go & check it out.  I did enjoy the music, but it really did make me miss
MAD! :(  When I first got there, we were the only ones in the entire place!
This was located at 375 1st street, and you had to go down a flight of
stairs from the street level entrance to get to it.  It felt very weird
somehow to be finally be literally underground rather than figuratively!  It
did feel strange being underground, tho.  And there wasn't a bit of
decoration in the space, there was just the bare wood floor, the dj's
turntables, the walls, and black plastic garbage bags taped to the windows
to keep out the light from other rooms.  For the longest time, there wasn't
anybody there except a couple of other people milling about the place.  Then
for about five minutes two circle dancers took turns watching each other, &
then they too sat down and did nothing.  It really took close to 1 1/2 hours
for anybody to really start dancing, & I don't think there were any more
than ten people at any given time dancing at once. That group energy you
experience when a whole group of people is just totally getting off on the
music & dancing their asses off was completely lacking here, it was just a
few individuals kinda dancing around.  I had fun, but it wasn't the
phenomenal dancing experience I've had at MAD.  But then again, this was
only this weekly's first night, so I will have to check it out further on
down the line & see if it's improved at all.  But the music was good!  Some
good trance & techno stuff.  It had an ambient bar too, which was kind of
nice, you could go somewhere quieter if you wanted a break & to talk to
people (assuming people do show!).  But it just wasn't the same.

Ethan & Joe R. & co, I hope you all find somewhere new soon for MAD, we miss
you! :)


Love,
Shawna


  *It's not easy being cheezy...*
     
      
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 20:56:19 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 20:56:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Matthew Boshko Abrams <marbs@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Have Fun At TF/ORACLe
To: Andrew Knutsen <andrewk@sco.COM>
cc: larryc@netcom.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <9605301541.aa10940@andrewk.pdev.sco.com>
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Don't worry about the walk up, there is a free UCSC shuttle that runs about 
every half hour.

Matt
   Da
    Loaf


> > ( I've never been to Crown College ;
> > I wonder how difficult it is to walk from the Bay St. gate to the 
> > campus? ).
> 
> 	Its a LONG way up from the gate to Crown.  Crown means "top of the 
> hill". About 2 miles, with a five hundred foot climb.
> 
> 	I may see you there...
> 
> Andrew
> -----------------------------------------
> Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
> Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 20:59:07 1996
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From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: **help**
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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any body know why every time i try to post a message, i get about 40 or 
so back to my account?  this is what it keeps sending me back....
**help!!**
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri May 31 02:32:02 GMT 1996
From:mhg@cats.ucsc.edu
To: mhg@cats.ucsc.edu
Subject: 

Received: from hyperreal.com by ultima.org; Thu, 30 May 96 19:32 PDT
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From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: ORACLe (parking w/ little walking)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9605301849.A1847-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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No need for serious walking!  

You can catch one of the night shuttles 
from the stop @ the base of the campus just outside of the front gate or you 
can catch the Santa Cruz Metro bus 1 (it says UCSC on it) from the Metro 
station downtown (on Pacific) which only costs $1.

See yall ravers on friday!  We are looking forward to your appearance.


On Thu, 30 May 1996, Andrew Knutsen wrote:

> > ( I've never been to Crown College ;
> > I wonder how difficult it is to walk from the Bay St. gate to the 
> > campus? ).
> 
> 	Its a LONG way up from the gate to Crown.  Crown means "top of the 
> hill". About 2 miles, with a five hundred foot climb.
> 
> 	I may see you there...
> 
> Andrew
> -----------------------------------------
> Andrew Knutsen            andrewk@sco.com
> Santa Cruz Operation      (408) 427-7538
> 










_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
  \  |           |                     \  |                          
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/ 
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_





From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 21:03:20 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 21:03:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: where's DJ DAN?
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605301812.A1117-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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YES!  WORSHIP DJ DAN!!!!!  YOU UNDERSTAND!!!!


> Since DJ Dan will not be spinning ANYWHERE on Friday night we recommend 
> that you come to Oracle because it is a FREE rave and that way you can 
> save your $$ for Saturday night's Plastik where DJ Dan will be spinning.
> 
> Praise to god of break beats...
> 
> _-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
>   \  |           |                     \  |                          
>  |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
> _|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
>                            mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/ 
> _-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
> 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 21:05:16 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 21:05:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: bouncing messages..
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we had a power outage here at NSNet... sorry for any bounced messages :)

___________________________________________________________________
John Deatherage - dwarzau@ns.net                    V: 916-856-1530
Sales/Tech Support - NSNet                          F: 916-856-1540
Sacramento's Premier Internet Service Provider


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 21:16:55 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 21:16:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
To: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: **help**
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605302021.A11768-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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On Thu, 30 May 1996, -=]madame mercury[=- wrote:
> any body know why every time i try to post a message, i get about 40 or 
> so back to my account?  this is what it keeps sending me back....

It was a mail problem at Ultima.org - it's now fixed.

	Brian



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 21:17:51 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 21:17:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Moving Junglist (fwd)
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 11:45:56 -0700
From: John Drefahl aka Johnsin Massive <johnsin@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Moving Junglist

hello everyone.. I am just shooting this sucka of a response up to the
SF-Raves list because I am moving from wisconsin (milwaukee) to the bay
area for school.. (transferring to the CCAC).  I get to SF on June 4th.

Just wanted to know if there is anyone out there doing the following:

1. in need of a roommate (san fran/oakland area)
2. Inta drum and bass, and want to hook up and shoot the shit on jungle
3. Willing to show me what the hell there is to do in the bay area.

Basically, I am blindly moving to SF, I know two people, and I am just
looking for some pathetic souls to get ta' know.. And help me get to know
SF and the bay area.

Cheers..

John Drefahl
Massive Magazine Milwaukee.



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 21:19:44 1996
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Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 20:35:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Josh Kneubuhl <joshk@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Hi from Nancy!
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Hi Everybody!  I'm BA-AACK! 

My good friend (and fellow raver!) Josh has kindly agreed to sub to the 
list for me on his account.  So, you ain't rid of me yet! ;) (And I bet 
you'll be hearing from Josh too - you may recognize him from parties as 
the Jester Hat Boy).

I'll be using his account to post, so to differentiate between Josh and 
me, look for (N) in front of the subject line.

I'm so happy I got all of you back!  So now we'll be seeing each other in 
cyperspace as well as on the dancefloor.

:) Nancy  



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 21:40:54 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 21:40:46 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jessica Robin Berkson <berky@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: I need some good thoughts...
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.ULT.3.91.960529202311.7212A-100000@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU>
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I start a brand new job tomorrow- I'm going to be a group home supervisor 
for teenage girls in San Jose...Unfortunately I'm going to be working 
weekends for a while- so I won't be able to make any parties for a 
bit..Anyways,I'm a little nervous- I want to be a really positive force 
in these girls' lives- they haven't been loved enough, and that's what 
I'll be there to do- 

I need all of your help- I figure if enough positive vibes are sent my 
way, then the girls will feel it too...

thanks!

-jess
"I wish you wouldn't keep appearing"
And vanishing so suddenly
You make one quite giddy!"
This time it vanished quite slowly,
beginning with the end of the tail,
and ending with the grin,
which remained for some time
after the rest of it had gone..

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 21:48:55 1996
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Message-ID: <31AE95FC.66FE@netdoor.com>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 23:47:24 -0700
From: Bill or Brent Overstreet <billover@netdoor.com>
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: where's DJ DAN?
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John wrote:
> 
> YES!  WORSHIP DJ DAN!!!!!  YOU UNDERSTAND!!!!
> 
> > Since DJ Dan will not be spinning ANYWHERE on Friday night we recommend
> > that you come to Oracle because it is a FREE rave and that way you can
> > save your $$ for Saturday night's Plastik where DJ Dan will be spinning.
> >
> > Praise to god of break beats...
> >
> > _-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
> >   \  |           |                     \  |
> >  |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
> > _|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
> >                            mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/
> > _-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
> >I've never listened to him. How can I get a tape that he has made? I'm 
not from the SF area. HELP!!!!!!! I live in Jackson,Ms so please don't 
get the wrong idea! I do not fit in here. Thanks
   
     SAY YES TO GOOD VIBES!
        BIG"O" 
    -- 
  Bill or Brent Overstreet
    Clinton, Mississippi
      Visit "Aa-aah-hh-h, Now You're Cooking" at...  
        http://www2.netdoor.com/~billover/index.html

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 22:21:15 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605310521.WAA17437@netcom10.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: what about sunset?
To: djtom@svpal.org (Tom Leichardt)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 22:21:06 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.88.9605302012.A7450-0100000@svpal> from "Tom Leichardt" at May 30, 96 08:10:17 pm
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To tom and SFRaves -
> 
> is there a sunset this weekend?
> 
> pleeeze tell me, i got to make some plans.
> 
> peace,
> tom
> 
 I called the Sunset number , and they say that they're not going to be
doing a local Sunset because they'll be at Tribal Future.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 22:21:37 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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To: john@bass-station.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: my APB: Rachel ; Thankses
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Damn I just love this shit!
You meet someone from across the country in the middle of the desert.  You
part ways forever. A year later you type a little letter send it down a phone
 line.. and bammo! 15 brothers and sisters bangin on your door just to tell
you where that person is on this very night!  Thanks all!
Steveo

"Mmmm mmm, I love technolog-g-g-g-g..."
-Sigue Sigue Sputnik

Thanks John, I'll try calling tommorow!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 22:21:47 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 01:21:11 -0400
Message-ID: <960531012110_404315108@emout15.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: FM# & Tard Copy #  Pl,Pl,Pleease
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Did someone ever re-post the Hard Copy ph/fax#?  I'm still needing it. I
suggest we use it as our very own frustration release hotline.  Just keep it
on your speed dialer and use it as often as neccessary to relieve
frustrations of the day.  Also NEED FM# TOO (A direct post on this one would
be sufficient)
Thankses,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 22:21:53 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: ?F-8 tickets available still?
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Goodness me, I hope so!  Leemme know, yah?

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 22:50:17 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
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Subject: Santa Cruz buses
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 23:06:55 1996
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From: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Message-Id: <199605310606.XAA06282@netcom20.netcom.com>
Subject: Bussing to ORACLe
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 23:06:46 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: MaryP76944@aol.com
In-Reply-To: <199605310531.WAA19293@netcom10.netcom.com> from "Larry Ching" at May 30, 96 10:31:21 pm
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[ to sfraves list ]

Getting to this Friday night's ORACLe on the bus -

 Sorry for my incomplete message asking about the #1 Santa Cruz Metro bus
to UCSC. Right at the end of my previous message , it occured to me to 
use my web browser to find the Santa Cruz Metro home page (if any). I was
trying to exit my mailer but accidentally sent the message anyway!

 Santa Cruz Metro does have a home page! It's a bit of a bother to get to a 
schedule ( unless I did it the hard way again ) - I had to download and
set up a special document reader to read on download their schedule.

 Anyway - from the downtown Metro Center there are buses leaving every
15 minutes that get to the Applied Sciences center about 18 minutes later.
That's until 10PM , then the buses leave every 1/2 hour. 

 The last buses from the Applied Sciences center leave at 11:48PM and 
12:28 AM. I suspect that the bus passes the ORACLe site before it gets
to this Applied Sciences building , so plan ahead if you're bus dependent.

 I may catch the bus just so I don't have to hustle early to the campus to
find parking. Also, after commuting from Santa Clara and driving around
to find a new/strange restaurant, I'll be in the mood to let some other
person drive me around!

 Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com

 PS - No mention of fare on the schedule , but other folks have said $1.
 I assume that's $2 for a round trip.
 

  

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Thu May 30 23:44:40 1996
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From: Wurzle@aol.com
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 02:44:05 -0400
Message-ID: <960531024404_314730683@emout16.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: ORACLE in Santa Cruz tomorrow!
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     Boy am I excited about finally getting to a party since i got back.  No
doubt i'll be at oracle, being that I live in Santa Cruz, and I was thinking
that if any of you sfravers needed a place to crash that night, too tired to
drive etc. I could offer some hospitality.  If not, I'll see you there
anyway!
   Hugs, Wurz§

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 00:08:15 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 00:07:39 -0700
Message-Id: <199605310707.AAA11291@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
From: ascend@ix.netcom.com (Gregory Sandler )
Subject: hello again!!!!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello everyone,

    I just finally got my computer working right. I got windows 95 and 
it screwed up my computer for a week. So if you wrote to me over the 
past weewk please write again and fogive me for not getting back to 
you!

Peace,

Greg :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 00:36:08 1996
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From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: Re: SFcentric
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>Sure, Americans, generally speaking, are ignorant of the rest of the world.
>But do you guys really think that any other country's citizens are not as
>equally focused on their home country?  I mean, how many Iranians or
>Welsh or any other nationality have any idea who Nathan Hale is?
>I think it's multi-directional.

Yeah, but we Americans are *particularly* ignorant... we live in this
little seperate area, while the rest of the world is across the ocean, so
why should Joe American give a damn about the rest of the world, unless it
has a direct impact on his life? People who live in Europe, Asia, etc., are
all right in the middle of a bunch of countries with long histories of
conflict and competition... in Europe, you'll be lucky to meet someone who
_isn't_ well informed about the state of world politics and who _doesn't_
know a foreign language or two.

Considering the state of this country, I don't think our economic/cultural
dominance of the world will last long.

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |               (- Portfolio! -)                |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        |                                               |
        |"The skies are gray, but today they seem blue."|
        |                                               |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 00:46:14 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 00:46:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: Cassandra Ann Thomas <senator@leland.Stanford.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: ride &play
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Dear all:

My boyfriend is coming down to Palo Alto tmw afternoon/evening to see a
play that I am working on and has a lot of stuff.  If anyone could give
him a ride from 16th and Church in the evening I would really appreciate
it.  It would be to the Stanford/Palo Alto area.  If so, please give me a
message back.  Also, everyone is invited to my play whch is a multimedia
performance of the glass Menagerie at MEmorial Audiotorium at 7:00 P>M. on
Friday and at 2:00 P.M. on Saturday.  STanford University.

Thanks,
Cassandra



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 02:45:53 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 02:45:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy C Cone <randream@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Bussing to ORACLe
To: Larry Ching <larryc@netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, MaryP76944@aol.com
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On Thu, 30 May 1996, Larry Ching wrote:

> Getting to this Friday night's ORACLe on the bus -
> 
> 
>  Anyway - from the downtown Metro Center there are buses leaving every
> 15 minutes that get to the Applied Sciences center about 18 minutes later.
> That's until 10PM , then the buses leave every 1/2 hour. 
> 
>  The last buses from the Applied Sciences center leave at 11:48PM and 
> 12:28 AM. I suspect that the bus passes the ORACLe site before it gets
> to this Applied Sciences building , so plan ahead if you're bus dependent.

This it does. When arriving mearly ask the driver for Crown College stop. 
That college is uphill from the stop. You should be able to hear the 
beats :)


> 
>  I may catch the bus just so I don't have to hustle early to the campus to
> find parking. Also, after commuting from Santa Clara and driving around
> to find a new/strange restaurant, I'll be in the mood to let some other
> person drive me around!
 
At the base of campus there is a theatre called the Barn Theatre. It is 
the first big building (on the left) when you drive into the main 
entrance (there are only two entrances), and is covered with large, 
painted marquees. They have lots of parking although there will be a play 
that night. The bus/shuttle stop is directly across from the theatre. 
There is another parking lot behind the bus/shuttle stop. The shuttle is 
free (they do not check ID) and the schedule is on a sign at the stop. 
Runs about every 15 minutes during the day.



>  Larry Ching/larryc@netcom.com
> 
>  PS - No mention of fare on the schedule , but other folks have said $1.
>  I assume that's $2 for a round trip.

Fee is $1 for one way, $3 for an all day pass, no transfers.

 I really recommend coming early and hiking the campus!! It has some 
spectacular views of Santa Cruz, the pier, the Boardwalk and the Montery 
Bay. On a clear day you can see across to Monterey.

 Remember!!! After about 8:00 pm the guards come on duty. They will not 
let you in unless someone has called the gate to clear you ahead of time 
or if you have any UC campus ID (must be current) Again the guards do not 
check the shuttles or buses. =)



Lookin' foward to lotsa hugs!!


Ran
                             ( boogie oogie woogie )
                                      /
                                -=*=-/
                                  ~

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 03:41:19 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 05:45:52 -0500
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Subject: Re: where's DJ DAN?
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John Commands:

>YES!  WORSHIP DJ DAN!!!!!  YOU UNDERSTAND!!!!

How about the weekend of 7 June to 10 June? I'll be visiting SF (from
Austin, TX) and would LOVE to catch Dan while I'm out there with y'all.
Will I be able to find him spinning somewhere that weekend?

Hugz,
-Chet

----
Drop 'till you dance...



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 03:41:44 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 05:46:20 -0500
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re:NUMARK DM2160
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>Ok! I think I have made a choice for the RANE MP-22 ($724.32).  The only
>question I have is for the Numark DM2160: it gives the option to assign the
>left ear to the left table and the right ear to the right table.  Rane
>doesn't give that option.  So is this option that big of an advantage or is
>it hardly used?  Comments?

Well, I must admit, that would be a VERY useful option for me personally. I
work third shift (11pm-8am) and on my days off (nights off, actually) I
like to spin but I don't want to wake up my whole apartment complex. So I
put on the headphones and go to it. If I could assign each headphone cup, I
could play the tunes as loud as I want (in the headphones only) and still
be able to beatmatch/cue/etc. without having to use my speakers.

Hugz,
-Chet

----
Drop 'till you dance...



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 03:41:51 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 05:46:26 -0500
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Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
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Black Adder offers:

>It also may well be that the viewing of raves as "spiritual" events is
>San Franciscocentric. I get the impression from talking to people from
>areas other than the Bay Area, and from reading posts from people that
>have gone to parties elsewhere that the "spiritual" aspect is not present(I
>won't say lacking,) or least as not as much an issue. Does this make any
>sense?

I think it has more to do with how deeply they are involved in the scene.
Here is Austin there's quite a few people who view raves as spiritual. They
usually have been going to parties for a while or are heavily involved in
DJing, promotion, etc. or hang out with those who do. It's often a process
of osmosis.

Hugz,
-Chet

----
Drop 'till you dance...



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 04:19:53 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 04:19:33 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "THX1138" <THX1138@planet-jubip.com>
Subject: My Memorial Day Weekend In Florida
Cc: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
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Hello All;

        Well I spent my holiday weekend on the scene in North Central
Florida, at the Firestone in Orlando Saturday night, and Sunday at Simion's
in Gainesville; listening to Sasha spin on both nights; utterly fantastic.

        North Central Florida stills kicks, sorry SF but that's just my
honest opinion. The venues, drugs, DJ's, and people just stand a step above
what we have out here. 

        In a nutshell I feel this way because of the following, first the
venues. Real estate is no where near as valuable there as it is here; so
people are a lot more willing to rent out a piece of property to a bunch of
ravers. Second, the drugs; at one event alone I was offered over 20
DIFFERENT kinds of pills from people claiming them to be MDMA; no powder was
to be found anywhere. DJ's, in one month Gainesville, the smaller of the two
towns sees more out of town DJ's from all over the world than we see here in
SF, in an entire year. Lastly but certainly not least; the people. The
people of the South East  live the scene and the vibe and are a lot more
interested in you, rather than what they can get from you, and I think they
dance better ta boot. In addition, it's much more a multi cultural scene
there than here despite the race hate.

        Just my opinion based on my experience, yours is no doubt different
but nonetheless just as accurate with reference to you, so save your flames
for the fireplace. 

        Don't get me wrong, I chose to live here in the Bay area for it's
energy, opportunities, beauty and vibe which our scene contributes to in
many ways. But I have never, ever, gotten teary eyed over 1015, DV8, Acme,
or the many other vibeless unsafe venues here in Cali. like I did when I
walked into Simion's before the show started.

Peace
THX1138


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 06:21:17 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 06:23:13 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Stolen Truck
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Well, I woke up this morning to find my truck GONE. Right out of my parking
stall at home. This F@#$ing sucks. I'd tell you to be on the lookout for a
red chevy-S10 ext cab 4x4 pickup that looks brand new, but How many do you
think there is on the street. I saw 6 after I talked to the Police on my way
to work. I just hope I can get it back. I'm in shock right now, and it
hasn't hit me I guess, that my truck is gone. I don't know what to do or
say. I didn't think my life could get any worse then what it is now. Guess I
was wrong.

Tim 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 06:31:50 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 15:36:18 +0200 (MESZ)
From: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
Reply-To: Ulrike Laitko <laitko@hpbio1.Biologie.HU-Berlin.de>
Subject: Re: Communication pitfalls/SF-centric
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Lately, Leslie Ayres wrote
 
> So, remember we're only seeing a partial vision of someone's ideas when we read
> them on email, much of the spirit and soul is not translatable in this medium
> .... so let's be careful out there!

well, this is quite right, but, hey, i wouldn't bother to post if i 
didn't have another fairly contrary point to share:

actually i think that through the cold  electronic medium of 
email the true self, the essence of a person often shines with extraordinary 
clarity.
i know this sounds paradoxical, but nowadays it apparently takes windy 
paradoxical roads to achieve authenticity .

there are some obvious points, like, no distraction by somebodies outer 
appearance (for example me, i'm, like, small and more on the cute 
side and everything, and people are normally pretty bummed if they hear 
me talking), but there's definitely way more than that about it, only i 
have trouble explaining it, especially in goddam english.

in the real world, every attitude, every pose, every feeling, every 
sentence is overly used by millions of people trying to find expression for 
their own, original self and sucking the meaning out of these 
attitudes, poses, feelings, sentences and emptying them, step by step, of 
their original content.  movies and commercials recycle and/or exploitthe 
already digested stuff again.
 (and you can't help it, this is just the way things go : 
everytime somebody managed to create a new, unique way to express a 
feeling or something it's a very happy moment, but it is also 
another step in that unwanted direction i been describing. the weird 
ways art goes illustrate that blatantly.) 

jess, in her very interesting post some days ago mentioned these young 
british people interacting with each other in a very rough way, bitch being 
the name for their best friend and so on. 
maybe they felt that it was the only fresh authentic way, the only 
way that really belonged to *them* and didn't have that taste of 
worn-out-ness = meaningless-ness that every normal, traditional way would 
maybe have. i know this explanation is kinda adventurous, and it 
definitely is not the whole story, bla bla bla, but i like it, and 
actually there are not too many explanations for phenomena like that
(or are there?).

in the internet, everything is fresh and shiny.
every word that appears on the screen after making it through all the 
wires and circuits seems to be gone through some sort of 
meaning-refreshing system (IMO of course).

another thing about the electronic medium:
somebody (sorry i couldn't find that post to quote it in original, 
hopefully i'm reporting it ok) in that E to enjoy techno? thread said that 
he appreciated techno exactly for its artificial quality, for it being 
emptied of any personal expression, because this enabled him to insert 
*his* feelings into the music without being disturbed by anything somebody 
else has left there.  i think the analogy to what i said above about 
language and other means of personal expression is, well, not perfect, but 
there seems to be some relation.  

boys and girls: if this doesn't make sense to you - lucky you, and 
don't bother, for heavens sake. anyway this whole authenticity thing 
seems to be  more of a european problem, no wonder, since europe was pretty 
old already when you guys over there just started the whole thing. 
but still there seem to be some people that feel it anyway. 
anybody heard of walker percy?

by the way: i'm no big friend of smiley faces and 
Insert-Heavy-Sarcasm-Here's.
so if you miss something - just insert smiley faces and whatever 
all over the place.

finally: i read that inspiring SF-Centric - and related topics - thread 
with the utmost interest. to add to the general oh-how-wonderful-this-list-is :
this list is really neat, most of the time.

thanks for making it through this dazed post, at least it helped me a 
bit to collect my thougts.

love and all kinds of authentic candy - 
ulrike


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 07:14:43 1996
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To: polo@eden.com
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: adolescent rave perspective
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Black Adder offers:
>
>>It also may well be that the viewing of raves as "spiritual" events is
>>San Franciscocentric. I get the impression from talking to people from
>>areas other than the Bay Area, and from reading posts from people that
>>have gone to parties elsewhere that the "spiritual" aspect is not present(I
>>won't say lacking,) or least as not as much an issue. Does this make any
>>sense?
>
>I think it has more to do with how deeply they are involved in the scene.
>Here is Austin there's quite a few people who view raves as spiritual. They
>usually have been going to parties for a while or are heavily involved in
>DJing, promotion, etc. or hang out with those who do. It's often a process
>of osmosis.

Once you discover how to ride the rythym, it completely changes your
perception in life.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 07:19:57 1996
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To: Wayne Correia <wayne@club.net>
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Re: what the heck?
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>At 7:20 PM 5/30/96, SDream wrote:>Ok, my rave-ignorance is showing.  What
>the heck does the following stand
>>for?  I pulled this off the SFRaves Calendar...
>>
>>
>
>E.S.W.H
>something about Will Higgs
Eternal Spirit, Will Hicks
>
>H.O.B.M.
>something about Malachy
Healing Out to Brother Malachy
>
>C.C.C.
>Communion Consciousness Collective
>
>H.B.T.U.K.
>you got me.
???


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 08:37:38 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 08:37:29 -0700 (PDT)
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Rick Riffle <rdriffle@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: BSP  RE: at Raw
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Tonight:  7:30 - 11:00 pm

RE: (live)
with guest dj Jonny

RAW Living Foods
1224 9th Avenue at Lincoln
San Francisco



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 08:40:31 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 08:29:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kathryn Ankrum <kathank@crl.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Source for news
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Hi Everyone,

This blurb appeared in a listing of new media sites.

"For English speakers seeking a non-US perspective on world affairs, 
Kensington Publications' World Statesman makes its Web debut, with 
weekly news and features covering the major political  and economic 
developments. It's incisive coverage in a format stateside newshounds 
rarely see."

World Statesman's URL is http://boss1.kenpubs.co.uk/worldstatesman/

Cheers,
Kathryn



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 09:25:06 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 09:24:49 -0700
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: kcroy@best.com (kcroy)
Subject: TF looking for a driver _back_ from TF
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we are looking for someone to drive our car back from TF (with us in it,
obviously) late sunday night. I need to work monday am, and need to get at
least a few hours of sleep sunday night. But sleeping in the car on the way
back would be fine, too- so you get it right. im rambling.
need driver from TF to SF leaving 3-4 am.

take care
kcroy
you can call me at work
till about 6 pm today or email me.
ask for kc or justin or jen

415-522-5542




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 09:41:55 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 09:41:19 -0700
Message-Id: <199605311641.JAA25472@dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com>
From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Subject: tribal future
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Yeeha!
one more day til tribal future.  I haven't been getting out much and am 
looking foward to sharing the vibe with you all this weekend.  I think 
the energy on this list has been beautiful this past week.
I love all the spiritual talk lately, and with a party up in a spot 
surrounded by nature, the excitement is mounting.  I'm already feeling 
a hieghtened sense of that beautiful innerconnectedness that runs 
through us all that raves help me get more in touch with.

see ya there,
:)
peter

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 09:42:45 1996
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Subject: NRR:  Tim Leary's obit. 
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 09:41:39 -0700 (PDT)
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http://www.cnn.com/US/9605/31/leary.obit/index.html
There's a link to hyperreals drug archives from there.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 09:50:56 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605311650.JAA01287@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Re: tribal future
To: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 09:50:44 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605311641.JAA25472@dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com> from "peter fogel" at May 31, 96 09:41:19 am
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> 
> Yeeha!
> one more day til tribal future.  I haven't been getting out much and am 
> looking foward to sharing the vibe with you all this weekend.  I think 
> the energy on this list has been beautiful this past week.
> I love all the spiritual talk lately, and with a party up in a spot 
> surrounded by nature, the excitement is mounting.  I'm already feeling 
> a hieghtened sense of that beautiful innerconnectedness that runs 
> through us all that raves help me get more in touch with.

The same sort of vibe has been happening on socal-raves this week with
the Moontribe party happening this weekend in the desert.  California rocks!

see you at tf,
-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 09:59:26 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 09:59:10 -0700 (PDT)
To: peter fogel <peterbf@ix.netcom.com>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: tribal future
In-Reply-To: <199605311641.JAA25472@dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com>
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On Fri, 31 May 1996, peter fogel wrote:

> Yeeha!
> one more day til tribal future.  I haven't been getting out much and am 
> looking foward to sharing the vibe with you all this weekend.  I think 
> the energy on this list has been beautiful this past week.
> I love all the spiritual talk lately, and with a party up in a spot 
> surrounded by nature, the excitement is mounting.  I'm already feeling 
> a hieghtened sense of that beautiful innerconnectedness that runs 
> through us all that raves help me get more in touch with.
> 
Can't wait.... The site is so pretty.....

                                      Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 10:24:14 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 10:20:17 -0700
To: Karen Hardie <eidrah@vanbc.wimsey.com>, nw-raves@hyperreal.com
From: tigger@thestranger.com (Glenn)
Subject: Re: only testing :)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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At 7:56 PM 5/30/96, Karen Hardie wrote:
>i sent a message to hyperreal today and i got about TEN copies of it back
>in my box, all addressed to me ... anyone else having odd email troubles?
>
>confused,
>k

Yeah, I got some mail bounced back when I posted sfraves. Pretty obnoxious
but, it seems to have gone away.

Have a great wonderful sunshiny day!

G


                          __,,,,_
      _   _ ___.--'''`--''// ,-o `-.
      \`)' O |  \  \ o\/ /.// / ,-  o,_
     /_`  \   |o )  | O|. /o// / -.,_o `-.
    /<0\    ) \  |  | ||/ //o| \/ O \`-.o`-._
   /  _.-.  .-\,O__|  _-| /o\ \/|_/  |    `-._)
   `-\  \/ |       /o__/ \__O / |o_//
        `-'       |  -| -|\__ \  |-'|
               __/ o /__,-o    ),'o |'
              ((__.-'((____..-' \__,'
______________________________________________________________



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 10:38:37 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 10:37:49 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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Cafe Cole will not have maps, only wheat grass juice...

Maps Should be picked up at ameba today until 7pm.
These maps have info and careful directions. If you have bought a ticket
please get one if possible.
People with tickets but unable to come to ameba should call the number 
printed on the invite(flyer) for rudamentary directions.
We can still fax maps if you call or email  early today 
-- 
salutations,al@ameba
_____________________________________
ameba  1732 haight street sf ca 94117
mailto:ameba@netcom.com
http://www.ameba.com        |      \
415.750.9368                |       \
=====================================
                            |       /
                            |      /

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 10:50:51 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
Subject: Timothy Leary's Dead
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        Tim Leary died this morning shortly after midnight.

        Make sure you do a drop for him this weekend.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 11:08:58 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: decisions, decisions...
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 11:04:44 -0700
From: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
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Well, it's Friday :). I'm not on my way to Tribal Future, unfortunately,
due to previous commitments on Sunday, so I'm hanging in the city. The
big question is: where to rave?

So, I'd like to poll the community at large...

Who has been to Out-A-Sight before? How are the producers? I really
like Graeme and Jeno, and it would be fun checking out Sotero from SD,
so this one appeals to me.

Experienced also sounds good, and the line-up is large! The price is
nice, too.

I am trying to recollect the previous conversations here regarding
Kundalini. Unfortunately, the lo-tech setup here at work doesn't
permit me access to the SFR archives (it's an e-mail only link), so I
can't check it now. Could someone refresh my memory?

Then there's this Needles thing. And Oracle down in SC (a long drive,
ugh).

I appreciate your steering this rave puppy towards the greener vibe...

-G-

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 11:20:53 1996
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From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: Josh Kneubuhl <joshk@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com, Brian Behlendorf <brian@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Hi from Nancy!
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Yipeeeee! Nancy's back!!!  :) :) :)


> Hi Everybody!  I'm BA-AACK! 
> 
> My good friend (and fellow raver!) Josh has kindly agreed to sub to the 
> list for me on his account.  So, you ain't rid of me yet! ;) (And I bet 
> you'll be hearing from Josh too - you may recognize him from parties as 
> the Jester Hat Boy).
> 
> I'll be using his account to post, so to differentiate between Josh and 
> me, look for (N) in front of the subject line.
> 
> I'm so happy I got all of you back!  So now we'll be seeing each other in 
> cyperspace as well as on the dancefloor.
> 
> :) Nancy  
> 
> 
> 
> 


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 11:31:29 1996
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From: "Chinley L. Chang" <lenchang@alumni.caltech.edu>
Message-Id: <199605311830.LAA26559@alumnae.caltech.edu>
Subject: Re: Have Fun At TF/ORACLe
To: larryc@netcom.com (Larry Ching)
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 11:30:02 -0700 (PDT)
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <199605301752.KAA20216@netcom7.netcom.com> from "Larry Ching" at May 30, 96 10:52:09 am
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> [to sfraves list]
>  I'm another one of those folks who won't be going to TF ( got other
> priorities re: work this weekend ). You folks have fun! I know there
> will be tons of reviews next week.

Yeah, sounds like TF will be a really good time, have fun all!

And I hope to see a lot of you non TF-ers at Oracle tonight, I'll
be wearing an SFR laminate and maybe a jester's cap!

		Smiles, and hooray for four day weeks,

			Chin  :)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 11:32:33 1996
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Subject: Plastik
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Is 27 bucks in Santa Cruz.... Have a great day:(

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 11:47:54 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 11:47:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Subject: Ride to tribal future
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HELP!!!
I need a ride to tribal future hopefully leaving today if possible.  I 
have gas money and lots of nice thing's to do and hear.  
Virgin ravers particually encouraged to apply but anybody will do.  I 
just looked At the weather report and it's going to be 96 degrees so come 
on kids, don't be shy.  Please page me Tristan on 415-220-4173 a.s.a.p 
please!!!

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 12:02:20 1996
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From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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IT WAS LOTS OF FUN!

That guy who started the fight was an arcehole.  If he is reading this 
mail (which I doubt since he probably can't read) you are a serious 
arsehole who should go back home to mother as soon as possible.
See yer this weekend!
tristan

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 12:10:27 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 12:09:46 -0700
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From: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel)
Subject: Tim Leary dead
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Just got the news and was wondering if this happened live in 
cyberspace, and did anyone tune in and see him tune out.

peter

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 12:38:51 1996
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Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 12:40:28 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: Yes!! Got my Truck Back
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YES!!!!!!  Got it back, I can't believe it..got to go see it right now. All
I know is that it's not damaged and there is no GAS in it. Apparently it ran
out of gas and ditched. Hopefully everything is in it still. They found it a
few hours ago and just now called. It took them long enough. I might be able
to goto TF still, and boy do I need this trip. Thanks for everyones
support!!! Now only if those people they had there cars taken get back to
there owners this fast. The police said they must of got it not to long
before I went to work. I'll let you know the details when I pick it up.

Tim (knucklehead)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 12:51:34 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 12:51:26 -0700 (PDT)
To: "Tim (Knucklehead)" <knucklehead@email.org>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Yes!! Got my Truck Back
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On Thu, 30 May 1996, Tim (Knucklehead) wrote:

> YES!!!!!!  Got it back, I can't believe it..got to go see it right now. All
> I know is that it's not damaged and there is no GAS in it. Apparently it ran
> out of gas and ditched. Hopefully everything is in it still. They found it a
> few hours ago and just now called. It took them long enough. I might be able
> to goto TF still, and boy do I need this trip. Thanks for everyones
> support!!! Now only if those people they had there cars taken get back to
> there owners this fast. The police said they must of got it not to long
> before I went to work. I'll let you know the details when I pick it up.
> 
Another reason to drive on empty.... ;-)

                                      Black Adder


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 12:52:49 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 12:52:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
Reply-To: jess <jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: SFRaves posse at F8
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OK, all you sorry mutherfuckers who can't make it out to Trivial Flutter
this weekend - THERE IS HOPE - 

We have a growing group of SFRavers going to the F8 outdoor, full-moon,
trance-trounce-flounce-bounce - wild-assed partee on Saturday

Why don't you quit feeling sorry for yourself and lets create a wicked
vibe together in the forest of luuuuuuv.

As of 1:00 today F8 had 40-50 tix left.
If you mail me today, I might even pick up a ticket for you from F8 (if
you're really nice and promise to give me a treat, that is :) )

	Ranting and Raving

		jess



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 13:07:46 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 13:12:06 -0800
To: peterbf@ix.netcom.com (peter fogel), sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Tim Leary dead
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At 12:09 PM 5/31/96, peter fogel wrote:
>Just got the news and was wondering if this happened live in
>cyberspace, and did anyone tune in and see him tune out.
>
>peter

it was a private affair.  check out leary.com for details.  or read this
lovely letter...

 ***Long Live Timothy Leary by John Perry Barlow

  A couple of hours ago, at 12:45 am Beverly Hills time, my old friend and
  the corrupter of my youth Timothy Leary made good on his promise to
  "give death a better name or die trying." Willingly, peacefully, and
  unafraid, he headed off on his last trip.

  He spoke his last words a few hours before. On the phone to the mordant
  William S. Burroughs he said, "I hope that someday I'm as funny as you
  are."

  He didn't, as threatened, commit suicide on the Net. Or have his head
  cut off and frozen. Or engage in any other the other spectacles of
  departure I had dreaded. In the end, he surrounded himself with the
  angelic band of twenty-somethings who have been uploading him into
  the Web these last few months and drifted peacefully out of here.

  I was headed his way when he died. When I was with him earlier this month
  he said, "When I leave here, Barlow, I want your face to be one of the
  last things I see." I think that was one of the sweetest things anyone
  ever said to me, and I was trying to make it possible, but death proved
  itself once again to be bigger and faster than either of us. The phone
  just rang in the middle of this rainy Wyoming night, and now I'm here
  naked in the dark trying to think of something to follow him out with.

  Two years ago, Cynthia and I spent our last day together with Timmy.
  When she died the next day and it became so shockingly clear to both of
  us how strange this culture has become on the subject of the second
  commonest event in the world, how weirdly shameful is dying in
  America, we both thought it time to bring death out of the closet. I did
  so by grieving her, and continuing to grieve her, more publicly than
  is polite in a culture that claims for itself the ability to conquer
  and control everything.

  But Timmy beat me to the barricades. He flat died. And he died, without
  pretending that he was "really going to get well any day now," without
  permitting himself to become a ghoulish and futile medical
  experiment, without contributing to the stupefying mass denial
  that causes almost 80% of America's health care dollars to be blown on
  the last six months of life.

  He died unashamed and having, as usual, a great time.

  A few weeks ago, the denizens of leary.com and I rented a phalanx of
  wheel chairs and rode them with him into the House of Blues on Sunset
  Strip, a place that likely had never seen fifteen people in wheel
  chairs before. After a truly merry time, we were headed back to his
  house and on the way came within a smile of Tim Leary's Last Bust.

  We cruised west on Sunset. And the sun was setting. The top was down on
  my metallic mauve rent-a-convertible. A couple of the web girls,
  Trudy and Camilla, were sitting on the trunk like psychedelic prom
  queens, shoop-de-booping to the funk station on the radio, volume at
  eleven. Both the girls were beautiful, Trudy like a character from
  Neuromancer, Camilla like a character from Botticelli. The air was
  sweet and soft as a negligee on our faces, and the light had that
  elegiac quality that makes people think LA might not be so bad after
  all.

  Timmy gave me a high five and grinned. "Life is good!" he shouted over
  the music. As I looked up to meet his raised hand, I saw in my rear view
  mirror, past the swaying torsos of the girls, the rotating reds of a
  real Beverly Hills cop.

  Of course we were in possession of several of those substances that we
  considered safe and effective but which this culture, in another of
  its dangerous madnesses, has declared lethal, probably to distract
  heat from its own deadly drugs of choice. Furthermore, I had only
  recently paid an astonishingly steep California fine for allowing a
  friend to stand up through the sunroof of a car I was driving.

  He pulled us over in front of the Beverly Hills Hotel. He looked like an
  Eagle Scout.

  "Officer," I said, nodding back at the still improperly seated
  girls, "I know what we were doing was wrong. But you see, my friend here
  is dying, and we're trying to show him a good time." Timmy, without
  saying anything, smiled sheepishly at the cop and nodded, caught in
  the act.

  He looked like hell but he sure looked happy.

  The officer gazed into Timmy's beatific skull-face and lost his
  starch. "Well," he said to the girls, "I'd be lying if I didn't say that
  looks like fun, but just because he's dying doesn't mean you should.
  Now get down in the seat and buckle up and I'll let you go." I felt like
  honest death had just made one of its first converts.

  In thirty years of following Tim Leary around, he's given me some
  wonderful and hair-raising moments. He has been father,
  anti-father, partner-in-crime, and devout fellow-worshipper of
  all that is female in this world. We loved each other, and shared more
  memories than I will ever relate. But I think the look he gave that cop
  is the memory I will cherish most.

  As usual he was "cocking snooks at authority," as Aldous Huxley once
  accused him. But he was doing it, also as usual, with wit. And with
  love.

  America managed to forgive Richard Nixon when he died. I hope they
  will extend the same amnesty to a real hero, Dr. Timothy Leary.

  Yrs,

  John Perry


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>jen@hotwired.com<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<jaws@hangten.com>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>










From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 13:22:15 1996
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From: epaul@Synopsys.COM (Eric P. Peterson)
Subject: See ya's at the F-8 Full Moon Full-out!
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Hope to see lots of friends and make new ones out in da woodz at the F-8
thang!  I'll have candy for the sweet-teeth out there, and Eric-hugs for
whoever gets in my path ;)  Hope to stay and help clean up, too, if Jess
doesn't poop out too early [sound of a gaunlet being thrown down].
Come on
Dance with me
Come on
Dance with me

Lunar love,

- E



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 13:33:24 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 13:33:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: KaySEE <scarab@value.net>
To: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
cc: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: Re: Techno Music and Who Loves It (LONG!)
In-Reply-To: <960531002136_71165.755_GHL83-1@CompuServe.COM>
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On 30 May 1996, Leslie Ayres wrote:

> 
> Now, Person B may hear that same music and say ... "I don't get it" ... but THEY
> get that emotional response to something totally different, let's say country
> music.   We call this "having different tastes in music" but I really think it's
> much more than that.

I also believe that to appreciate different kinds of music, one has to 
learn about them.  If someone has an open mind, that someone can learn to 
appreciate much more about life.  Love of music often reaches snobbery 
and elitism.  I'm talking about putting down another because they don't 
know something about certain types of music or the "you listen to THAT 
shit" kind of attitude.  I think I was once that type of person.  When I 
was an adolescent, alining yourself with a type of music was also alining 
yourself with a group of people.  So, when you put down another kind of 
music it was a way of indirectly putting down the type of life of another 
and thereby validating YOUR lifestyle.  

I'm glad to say that I'm not like that any more, and have opened my eyes 
to tons of music.  But, to do this, I had to get out of a very narrow 
mind-set (which is also part of growing up i.e. things cease to be black 
or white).  I now enjoy lots of different kinds of music, techno being on 
the top of my list right now along with a couple of other things.  I also 
try and check myself when I start thinking one type of music is 
inherently "better."  I do think some music is more "advanced" (maybe 
that's the word:) and requires more talent to perform, e.g. jazz, but I 
don't think anything is inherently "better."  

Like Leslie said, people like music for different reasons.  To name a 
few: feeling, alignment with a certain movement, association with the 
lyrics, etc.  To invalidate a type of music as inferior is, to me, to 
invalidate the aforementioned things.  

I have a big dark secret to tell that ALWAYS gets me lots of slack.  I 
use to totally love Heavy Metal.  AC/DC was my favorite band.  I can 
already hear some of your groans!!!  I used to listen to this music 
because it was high energy.  It made me feel energized and ready to 
conquer the world.  It was also a result of growing up in Middle 
America.  Although, with rare exception, do I listen to that kind of 
music any more, it holds a feeling for me.  That feeling has passed now, 
but very few people even attempt to understand the feeling behind the 
actions.  I think people should stop to appreciate what others enjoy 
and share with them a part of their life.  My result of this has led me 
to like jazz, choral music, hip hop, folk music, and, OF COURSE, 
techno; the love of which I share with all of you.

cheers, have a great weekend, and I'll see you in the mtns...

Kirsten


              ****Shit, goddamn, get off your ass and jam****


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 13:34:57 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 13:40:38 -0700
From: Diana Greer <inanna@ccnet.com>
Organization: The Lab
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To: sfraves@hyperrreal.com
CC: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Rental to Raver, Cool space!
References: <9605301525.aa10874@andrewk.pdev.sco.com>
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SF Ravers,

I have a 9'x13' room to rent to a fellow raver for short term live-in, 
or for daytime office space.  This space would be a great affordable 
space for an artist to "spread out." and be productive.  It is located 
on the ground floor of a small four-story loft, with a commercial 
lease in the lovely, growing-in-trendiness, Berkeley 4th street area. 
Parking, parking, parking.  Kitchen and bathroom use included, of 
course.  I plan to spend the summer studying at home and working outside 
of the home occasionally. Right now I have an evening teaching gig 
three nights a week. Raving a certainty.

I am not solid on price; it is more important for me to find a fellow 
artist(s) to share this space with than to turn a real profit. 

Diana Greer
510 528 1612

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 13:38:35 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605312038.NAA04907@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Friend in need of ride to TF
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 13:38:30 -0700 (PDT)
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Hello, I have a friend, Kevin (you might know him as the guy working the
doors at many Crysalis parties) needs a ride to tf.  He lives in SF,
in SOMA.  If you can help, email him at kevin@infoflow.com

thanks-troy


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 13:50:53 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 13:50:29 -0700
From: ameba <ameba@netcom.com>
Organization: ameba
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email for html map. send ticket#.
-- 
salutations, al@ameba
_____________________________________
ameba  1732 haight street sf ca 94117
mailto:ameba@netcom.com
http://www.ameba.com        |      \
415.750.9368                |       \
=====================================
                            |       /
                            |      /

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 13:52:58 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: f-8, Beasties concert
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Is anyone going to BOTH of these events?

I'm trying to figure out a way to fit both in one day, and I'm not driving
and I don't know if any of my SBay friends are up for F-8 so if anyone can
give me a ride from the Tibet concert (noon-6pm 6/15 ?) to F-8 later that
night, e-mail me or something... I'd appreciate it. My friend Mikey *might*
decide to go to both, in which case I wouldn't need your help, but I'm not
sure whether he wants to go or not.

-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |               (- Portfolio! -)                |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        |                                               |
        |"The skies are gray, but today they seem blue."|
        |                                               |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 13:55:09 1996
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
Subject: OOPS: f-8, Beasties concert
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OOPS! disregard my last post...

I was somehow under the impression that F-* was in two weeks, not
tommorrow... I'm getting my parties confused. =)

-m.


>
>To: sfrpost
>From: lachim@uclink4.berkeley.edu (michal migurski)
>Subject: f-8, Beasties concert
>Cc:
>Bcc:
>X-Attachments:
>
>Is anyone going to BOTH of these events?
>
>I'm trying to figure out a way to fit both in one day, and I'm not driving
>and I don't know if any of my SBay friends are up for F-8 so if anyone can
>give me a ride from the Tibet concert (noon-6pm 6/15 ?) to F-8 later that
>night, e-mail me or something... I'd appreciate it. My friend Mikey
>*might* decide to go to both, in which case I wouldn't need your help, but
>I'm not sure whether he wants to go or not.
>
>-m.


        0=-------B A R K O D E * A R T W O R K S-------=0
        |    -flyers, graphics and other diversions-    |
        |     for that whole body thirst situation      |
        |                                               |
        |               (- Portfolio! -)                |
        |     http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~lachim/      |
        |                                               |
        |  *monster netscape 2.0 update extravaganza*   |
        |          C O M I N '   A T C H A !            |
        |                                               |
        |              Michal Migurski                  |
        |              (408) 264-6604                   |
        |                                               |
        |"The skies are gray, but today they seem blue."|
        |                                               |
        0=---------------------=0=---------------------=0



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 14:10:27 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 14:06:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Reply-To: Kyung Rok <krok@uclink2.berkeley.edu>
Subject: I Was a Grade School Nitrous Fiend
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Just kidding ;)  

Actually, I was just thinking back to third grade when the 
hyperventilation fad swept my class.  You remember -- you'd deeply 
inhale and exhale five times each with your back against the wall.  Then, 
holding your breath as you took your last big inhale, the person you 
designated to activate the oxygen-deprivation trip would push against 
your chest, a hand over each breast region (with the girls, palms were 
tactfully placed above the nipples), until your eyes involuntarily closed 
shut and your body became lava lamp limp.  Coming to, you gazed upward 
from the ground at a bunch of smiling faces who, with glee, retell the 
history of your body during the ten post-Tysonian seconds your ass was 
knocked out.

Seriously, for about a week or two, whenever the teacher wasn't around in 
class, we'd be doin' this shit.  Everyone kinda chilled out, tho', after 
this one time Karen Amanse started trippin' like Helen Keller before the 
Miracle-worker kicked in the special ed..  Karen, ahead of her time, was 
anachronistically kickin' junglistic convulsions when she should 
have been mellowing out on a soft beatless ambient beanbag cloud.  

Currently suffering from sleep-deprivation, Rok.

See you in Mendocino!


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 14:17:19 1996
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   Fri, 31 May 96 14:09:49 PDT
Date: Fri, 31 May 96 14:09:49 PDT
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Subject: Yes!! Got my Truck Back
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*** Reply to note of 05/30/96 12:40
FROM: Robert Brown

SUBJECT: Yes!! Got my Truck Back

  Congrats, Tim on getting your truck back!  And undamaged even.

  To give you all a brief update on my stolen car saga...
  It was found (in Oakland no less) last weekend, but it was a "major
  strip."  Exactly what's left I'm not sure, but the tow yard seemed
  to indicate that it was pretty much a total strip with nothing left
  but the frame.  I'll check it out this weekend.

  TF would be more fun, of course...

  P.S., Even worse was that my gas tank was EXTREMELY FULL when it was
        stolen.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 14:17:50 1996
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Date: 31 May 96 17:15:15 EDT
From: Leslie Ayres <71165.755@CompuServe.COM>
To: "sfraves@hyperreal.com" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
Subject: LOOK FOR MY TENT!!....
Message-ID: <960531211515_71165.755_GHL54-2@CompuServe.COM>
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OK, instead of the "here's what I'm wearing" I'm going to post a short
description of MY TENT, which should be distinctive ... so that those of you who
know me (or wanna know me!) ... or maybe those who want to avoid me!  ; )  ....
know where I am (or at least my stuff!)

I've borrowed a small blue and white dome, standard kind of tent.... but on top
of it (hopefully if it's connectable, if not, then in front of it) ... will be a
multi-colored, garish, mylar contraption that looks like fireworks going off...
with a silver whirly-gig thing in the middle....

You know, sorta like A HAT FOR MY TENT!

(at least I'm consistent!  And I'm bringing a big ol' hat box too!)

I'm leaving in a little while, so see you there!!!

Leslie  : )


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 15:27:55 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 15:29:33 +1000
To: geoffw@cybertribe.com (Geoff White)
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: Timothy Leary's Dead
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>        Tim Leary died this morning shortly after midnight.
>
>        Make sure you do a drop for him this weekend.

I have one with his name on it.....    :-)

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 15:27:59 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 15:29:43 +1000
To: George Feil <george@unrrts.com>
From: crunch@well.com (John Draper)
Subject: Re: decisions, decisions...
Cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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>Well, it's Friday :). I'm not on my way to Tribal Future, unfortunately,
>due to previous commitments on Sunday, so I'm hanging in the city. The
>big question is: where to rave?
>

If you like Goa trance,  check out the F-8 party this weekend.  It will
be outdoors in the woods....  Stop by f-8 for tix...

It can't get any greener...

Crunchman



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 15:34:04 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 15:33:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Subject: Ride for 1 to TF (Sat)
To: sfraves <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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Hey gang,

  I have a space for 1 ( unless someone piles in the back of my truck )
to TF... Intend to leave on Sat morning from San Mateo... returning on
Monday ( whenever - school's out for the summer )....

Call me at number below if interested.....

Mike


 meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic 
 Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 16:07:01 1996
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Date: 31 May 1996 16:00:43 -0700
From: "Mark Camp*" <mark_camp*@quickmail.apple.com>
Subject: Re: Hard Copy and the Natur
To: "Mark Camp*" <Mark_Camp*@quickmail.apple.com>,
        "Nancy" <Nancy@quickmail.apple.com>, "sfr" <sfraves@hyperreal.com>
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         Reply to:   RE>>Hard Copy and the Nature

um, I really dont know why this message showed up again.  This was sent a couple of weeks ago.  wierd.

-M

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/31/96 3:03 PM
To: Mark Camp*
From: Mark Camp*
         Reply to:   RE>Hard Copy and the Nature of Mass Media

Rather than complaining to Hard Copy, maybe complaining directly to the
advertisers would be a better idea.  If the advertisers become aware of the
publics outrage over the programs that they buy time on, maybe the next time a
story like this comes around, they wont want to advertise.

just a thought......

-M

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/9/96 5:54 PM
To: Mark Camp*
From: Nancy

Michael wrote:

> Before wasting time in a reply to Hardcopy you might consider Do they
>even care ?  I suspect that a show like that would only care that you
>watched at all - NOT whether you agree/disagree.... merely that they are
>getting through . Their goal is not to inform with TRUTH as much as it is
>to inform with entertainment ( truth is not really their objective )...


I agree, but I think that their goal is not to inform at all, but to ensure
an audience FOR THE COMMERCIALS.  Size of audience share sets the price the
show can charge for commercial time - the PROFIT behind this show.
Therefore, they sensationalize and "entertain" and distort and vulgarize as
much as possible to appeal to the widest amount of people (oops, I mean
"consumers").

Most television shows are merely the padding around the true purpose of
commercial television - agressive advertisement for you to buy, buy, buy.
Their mind-numbing stupidity (i.e. sit-coms) and their ridiculous
sensationalizing (i.e. tabloid "news" shows) create a state of mind in the
viewer that ensure absolute receptivity, NOT conducive to analytical
thought -- the perfect mind-set to unthinkingly absorb the subliminal/overt
messages of the commercials.  Therefore, it would be counter-productive for
a medium intent on creating mindless consuming automatons to encourage
open-mindedness and thinking for our selves.

The job of the Hard Copy crew is to scour real life for any situation that
could possible be exploited.  And illegal, all-night parties with
teen-agers and drugs is PUUURRFECT for that.  It's "sexy!" (in advertising
lingo).

A public  retraction is totally impossible.  Any information would just be
for the benefit of the Hard Copy crew, who may or may not care - either
way, it doesn't change the nature of their job, which is to sensationalize,
which brings in the viewers, who are primed for a barrage of advertising.

The real issues are addressing why America eats up these shows, how to
resist excessive consumerism,  how to reform the mass media, and making
sure those in our own lives hear from us the real story.

But, it was good for a laugh.  :P

Back to studying!
Love, Nancy


>
>All this IMHO of course ;-)
>
>HARDCOPY the show that cares about THE TRUTH and shows it...
>Now there's a slogan for the masses....
>
>Mike
>
>
> meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic
> Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.



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Subject: Hard Copy and the Nature of Mass Media
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Date: 10 May 1996 08:57:18 -0700
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From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 16:09:32 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 16:09:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: TRISTAN BERNARD BLAUG <sandoz@sfsu.edu>
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Ride to tribal future
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I still need a ride to Tribal future.  I can leave from anywhere in the 
bay area from 8.00 p.m onwards.  Have gas money etc.; please help.
Please page Tristan at 415-220-4173.

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 16:10:51 1996
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From: Troy Sheets <tsheets@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Message-Id: <199605312310.QAA07193@xanadu.cyborganic.net>
Subject: Tribal Future Weather Forecast!
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 16:10:48 -0700 (PDT)
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Looks like it will be a great weekend!

FPUS5 KSFO 312148
ZFPCA
NORTHERN AND CENTRAL CALIFORNIA ZONE FORECAST
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE SAN FRANCISCO CA
3 PM PDT FRI MAY 31 1996  ...DO NOT USE AFTER 9.30 PM FRIDAY

CAZ001-010400-
NORTHWEST CALIFORNIA
3 PM PDT FRI MAY 31 1996  ...DO NOT USE AFTER 9.30 PM FRIDAY

.TONIGHT...AREAS OF LOW CLOUDS AND FOG NEAR THE OCEAN.  OTHERWISE
PARTLY CLOUDY NORTH...MOSTLY CLEAR SOUTH.  LOWS 40S AND LOWER 50S.
NORTHWEST EVENING WIND TO 15 MPH.
.SATURDAY...AREAS OF FOG AND LOW CLOUDS NEAR THE OCEAN...OTHERWISE
SUNNY. WARMER INLAND. HIGHS UPPER 50S AND 60S NORTH COAST TO AROUND
90 INLAND. NORTHWEST WIND TO 15 MPH.
.SATURDAY NIGHT...AREAS OF LOW CLOUDS AND FOG NEAR THE OCEAN.
OTHERWISE PARTLY CLOUDY NORTH...MOSTLY CLEAR SOUTH. LOWS 40S AND
LOWER 50S.
.SUNDAY...PATCHY FOG AND LOW CLOUDS NEAR THE OCEAN...OTHERWISE SUNNY.
WARMER INLAND. HIGHS UPPER 50S AND 60S NORTH COAST TO THE MID 90S
INLAND.

-troy

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tsheets@cyborganic.net                     <- You have found me   
tsheets@schwa.sun.com                      <- Official Use Only
http://www.cyborganic.com/People/tsheets   <- Instant Content
troys-list@schwa.sun.com                   <- Inquire Within

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:03:34 1996
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From: Czefir@aol.com
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 20:02:58 -0400
Message-ID: <960531200256_404809124@emout09.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: to all promoters
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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HEY YOU!!!

YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE!!

THE PEOPLE WHO PUT A WHOLE MINUTE OF MUSIC AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MESSAGE!!!

THOSE OF US WHO CALL LONG DISTANCE REALLY DON'T APPRECIATE IT!!

PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE LIMIT IT TO ONLY 30 SECONDS OR LESS!!!

thank you,

       Megan              Czefir

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:10:03 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 17:09:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: Czefir@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: to all promoters
In-Reply-To: <960531200256_404809124@emout09.mail.aol.com>
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> THE PEOPLE WHO PUT A WHOLE MINUTE OF MUSIC AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MESSAGE!!!
> 
> THOSE OF US WHO CALL LONG DISTANCE REALLY DON'T APPRECIATE IT!!
> 
> PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE LIMIT IT TO ONLY 30 SECONDS OR LESS!!!


Sometimes there's important info at the beginning of a message that 
promoters NEED people to know (ie - don't park on xxxxxx streets, don't 
bring pens).  If we put that stuff at the end, nobody would listen past 
the directions...  True though, music at the beginning isn't necessary..

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:10:17 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 17:10:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: to all promoters
In-Reply-To: <960531200256_404809124@emout09.mail.aol.com>
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On Fri, 31 May 1996 Czefir@aol.com wrote:
> THE PEOPLE WHO PUT A WHOLE MINUTE OF MUSIC AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MESSAGE!!!
> PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE LIMIT IT TO ONLY 30 SECONDS OR LESS!!!


Hee hee..... AMEN!  ;)  This goes for people's answering machines, too! 
And for that matter, can be extended to .signature files and 'quoting' in
e-mail replies. 

There needs to be a mandatory class on electronic etiquette in Jr. High to
go along with typing and gym.

:)


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:11:33 1996
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From: aguevara@compattic.com (Adam Guevara)
Reply-To: aguevara@compattic.com
To: SfRaVeS@HyPeRrEaL.CoM
Subject: See Ya Out There...
Date: 01 Jun 1996 00:44:03 GMT
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For all in the know how....


See you tonight @ O R C A L e

See you Tomorrow @ F-8

See You Sunday at (???)


See ya,


"Dance With Me"


Adam
____________________________
Transmitted from Computer Attic
SuperCenter:  (415) 363-8100
Corporate HQ: (415) 614-7500
____________________________

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:16:20 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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Subject: WOW! News of the weird!
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At the 1994 annual awards dinner given by the American Assoc. for  
Forensic Science, AAFS president Don Harper Mills astounded his  
audience in San Diego with the legal complications of a bizarre  
death.  
Here is the story: 
      
On 03/23/94, the medical examiner viewed the body of Ronald Opus  
and concluded that he died from a shotgun wound to the head.  The 
decedent had jumped from the top of a ten-story building intending to  
commit suicide (he left a note indicating his despondency).  As he  
fell 
past the ninth floor, his life was interrupted by a shotgun blast  
through a window, which killed him instantly.  Neither the shooter  
nor the decedent was aware that a safety net had been 
erected at the eighth floor level to protect some window washers  
and that Opus would not have been able to complete his 
suicide anyway because of this. 
Ordinarily, Dr. Mills continued, a person who sets out to commit  
suicide ultimately succeeds, even though the mechanism might not be  
what he intended. That Opus was shot on way to certain death nine  
stories below probably wouldn't have changed his mode of death 
from suicide to homicide.  But the fact that his suicidal intent  
would not 
have been successful caused the medical examiner to feel that he  
had a homicide on his hands.   
      
The ninth floor room whence the shotgun blast emanated was  
occupied by an elderly man and his wife.  They were arguing and he  
was threatening her with the shotgun.  He was so upset that, when  
he pulled the trigger, he completely missed his wife and pellets went  
through the window striking Opus.  When one intends to kill subject  
A, but kills subject B in the attempt, one is guilty of the murder of  
subject B. 
      
When confronted with the charge, the  man and his wife were both  
adamant that neither knew that the shotgun was loaded.  The old man  
said it was his long standing habit to threaten his wife with the  
unloaded shotgun.  He had no intention to murder her - therefore, the  
killing of Opus appeared to be an accident.  That is, the gun had been  
accidentally loaded. 
      
The continuing investigation turned up a witness who saw the old  
couple's son loading the shotgun approximately six weeks prior to the  
fatal incident.  It transpired that the old lady had cut off her son's  
financial support and the son, knowing the propensity of his father  
to 
use the shotgun threateningly, loaded the gun  expectatiing that  
his father would shoot his mother. The case now becomes  murder,  
on the part of the son for the death of Ronald Opus. 
      
There's a final exquisite twist.  Further investigation revealed that  
the 
son, one Ronald Opus, had become increasingly despondent over the  
failure of his attempt to engineer his mother's murder.  This led him  
to jump off the ten-story building on March 23, only to be killed by  
a 
shotgun blast through a ninth story window. 
      
The medical examiner closed the case as a suicide. 
      
    

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:18:01 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 17:24:21 -0700
From: s <scorrea@inreach.com>
Reply-To: scorrea@inreach.com
Organization: RaveCo
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: needless
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anyone going to needles?
-- 
drivin'

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:18:03 1996
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From: Milton Cecil <moonpup@hooked.net>
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To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: room for 2 to TF
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I've got space for two to TF.  I'm leaving around 6:30pm from SF.  
  
--erik  
 drop me a line... 415-337-6666 
 
- 
 

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:23:29 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 17:23:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Michael E. Clay" <meclay@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: to all promoters
To: Paul Abramson <pabrams@itsa.ucsf.EDU>
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <Pine.A32.3.93.960531170625.78902A-100000@itsa.ucsf.edu>
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On many ( but not all ) answering machines you can skip an annoyingly
long intro message by pressing the "star" key.....

This of course does NO GOOD if the annoyingly long message IS what you
called to hear....

>From someone who's stood at a noisy roadside phone listening to a painfully
long intro song a few too many times  ;-)

Mike


 meclay@netcom.com          |  Alone & ecstatic 
 Mike Clay   (415)572-8971  |  A young rainbow learns  to levitate.


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:30:04 1996
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Subject: hiphop dj's tonight
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 19:29:55 +1900 (CDT)
From: "roger kumar" <rkumar@umr.edu>
X-Www-Page: http://www.umr.edu/~rkumar/
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hello all. i'm going to try to go to this tonight, it looks really really 
cool. its free. so come! here's the info i got:

oh, i'll be at F8 tomorrow night (hopefully), so maybe i can meet some sf 
people before i leave..

 __
If you have never seen these DJs perform, this is your chance.  The
following turntable technicians will cut records the f**k up on Friday,
May 31st, 10pm-2.  Wilbur East Courtyard, Stanford University.

Q-Bert
Shortkut
Apollo
Babu
Rhettmatic
Symphony (the woman has skills!)
Icy-Ice
Derrick D.

"Da' Hype" (okay, I didn't pick the name) will be the dopest DJ showcase
since the DMCs.  It is a little-known but very-true fact that these
turntable samurai will take improvisational musicianship into the third
millenium.
        Four truly world-class serial wax killers and their West
Coast contemporaries will slice and dice any non-believers until they
become devout Deacons in the Cult of Turntablism.

This will be a free event.  No alcohol, no video cameras, no 9mms.  And if
someone asks Babu if he can play "Tootsie Roll" the event will
automatically end...

For info call the director Lan Phan at 415-497-6120.  Or call or email me,
497-0846.

Brought to you by Okada House as part of Asian Pacific Islander Heritage
Month.



                                                Joon-Mo Ok
                                                genghis@Leland.Stanford.EDU


    - Line of the Week for May 19 1996 -
       Courtesy LMNO of Black Forest

     "...Relevance is a key quality..."


-- 
pJou_|        pgpfone encrypted calls and pgp encrypted mail accepted
    _l                            public keys on server or by request

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 17:54:08 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 17:53:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Plastik
To: Jondabomb@aol.com
cc: sfraves@hyperreal.com
In-Reply-To: <960531143158_207772860@emout14.mail.aol.com>
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On Fri, 31 May 1996 Jondabomb@aol.com wrote:

> Is 27 bucks in Santa Cruz.... Have a great day:(
> 
 are you saying that Plastik is gonna be in Santa Cruz?
 where is it gonna be?




_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
  \  |           |                     \  |                          
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/ 
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 18:00:13 1996
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From: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: ORACLE 
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Hello all,

	Nice to see that quite a bit of you plan on comin' on down 
tonight.  Just a note, tonight is the night before the full moon so as to 
enjoy the silver light of the night Oracle will be held outside.  The 
weather is beautiful today but bring a jacket to wear after raving all night.


_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_
  \  |           |                     \  |                          
 |\/ |  _` |  _` |  _` |  ` \   -_)   |\/ |  -_)  _| _| |  |  _| |  |
_|  _|\__,_|\__,_|\__,_|_|_|_|\___|  _|  _|\___|_| \__|\_,_|_|  \_, |
                           mhg@cats.ucsc.edu                    ___/ 
_-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-__-=*=-_


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 18:20:53 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 18:17:42 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Vince <vince@vmar.com>
Subject: Tribal Future weather forecast
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Weather Conditions at 6 PM PDT on 31 MAY 96 for Ukiah, CA.
Temp(F)    Humidity(%)    Wind(mph)    Pressure(in)    Weather
========================================================================
   76          37%          NNW at 8       N/A      Clear

NORTHWEST CALIFORNIA
3 PM PDT FRI MAY 31 1996  ...DO NOT USE AFTER 9.30 PM FRIDAY

 TONIGHT...AREAS OF LOW CLOUDS AND FOG NEAR THE OCEAN.  OTHERWISE
PARTLY CLOUDY NORTH...MOSTLY CLEAR SOUTH.  LOWS 40S AND LOWER 50S.
NORTHWEST EVENING WIND TO 15 MPH.
 SATURDAY...AREAS OF FOG AND LOW CLOUDS NEAR THE OCEAN...OTHERWISE
SUNNY. WARMER INLAND. HIGHS UPPER 50S AND 60S NORTH COAST TO AROUND
90 INLAND. NORTHWEST WIND TO 15 MPH.
 SATURDAY NIGHT...AREAS OF LOW CLOUDS AND FOG NEAR THE OCEAN.
OTHERWISE PARTLY CLOUDY NORTH...MOSTLY CLEAR SOUTH. LOWS 40S AND
LOWER 50S.
 SUNDAY...PATCHY FOG AND LOW CLOUDS NEAR THE OCEAN...OTHERWISE SUNNY.
WARMER INLAND. HIGHS UPPER 50S AND 60S NORTH COAST TO THE MID 90S
INLAND.



Its gonna be a scorcher !!  Burn baby burn, raver inferno !!

See you all there,
I'll be wearing ?? uh, Something Wacky !!

hugs

Vince




From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 18:59:04 1996
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From: SteveOSac@aol.com
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 21:58:29 -0400
Message-ID: <960531215828_208069878@emout08.mail.aol.com>
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFR posse @ F8, yeah yeah yeah!
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F-8 Sat night:  I second the motion, this is gonna be sweeeeet!   Drop me or
Jess (jfogler@itsa.ucsf.EDU) a line if you're going!  I wont be getting mail
after 7am sat.   & HEY, all you tribal future folks rememeber to exude some
cosmic energy @ 3AM sun morn.  We'll do the same and perhaps together we get
Timmy's attention!  Of course he's probably busy convincing St. Stephen that
he really should drop some acid.
Love,
Steveo

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 19:40:57 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 19:40:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jessica Robin Berkson <berky@cats.ucsc.edu>
Subject: A little luck came my way...
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
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First of all, let me thank everybody who wished me luck with my new job 
(the group home job in SJ)-- I read all the messages right before I left 
and I drove the whole way there with a grin on my face ...:)

Second of all, when I got to work,my supervisor informed me that due to 
some miscommunication I don't have to work this weekend- so I get to go 
to Oracle which is right here!!  I'm so happy!! I can't wait to see all 
of you guys there!  I'm bringing treats...

-jessica


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 19:50:54 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 22:50:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: DJ Hardware <hardware@gate.net>
To: Mike W Sharpe <djsharpe@gate.net>
cc: South East Rave List <SERAVES@AMERICAN.EDU>, fl-raves@cat.net,
        MTn-raves@hyperreal.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com, ne-raves@world.std.com,
        mw-raves@hyperreal.com, pb-cle-raves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Electro Phunk (fwd)
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 14 Dec 95 11:11:04 PST
From: comeback@mcs.com
To: cnsrecords@aol.com, hardware@gate.net
Subject: Electro Phunk

Submitted to the Alternative Press (assigned by editor)

hope you like it and cross your fingers

                                  -critroc

                          Electro Phunk

You are getting sleepy, your eyes are getting heavy, your mind is
drifting back, back in time. When you awake you will remember
nothing of this encounter, only the ancient, pulsing beat shall
remain constant in your brain. The atom heart mother of this disc
is an Electro remix of Africa Bambataa & The Soulsonic Force's
Don't Stop The Planet Rock. Operating with this touchstone of
early techno and hip-hop, DJ Hardware and DJ SHARPe embrace the
royal roots of the turntable, seamlessly working UK artists like
Sem, Stem, RAC and OSC. While Electro/Techno-Bass is only a small
part of a much bigger picture, 1996 marks a triumphant return of
the deejay as resilient cultural phenomena. The raves are only
getting bigger and more numerous. Why, I can remember fifteen
years ago going to the Power Plant in Chicago, jacking to house
beats supplied by Frankie Knuckles himself and...oops, sorry. Now
where did THAT come from?

(Adrenaline Records, 166 5th Ave, New York, New York 10010)
                           
                                Mitch Myers
                             comeback@mcs.com


From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 20:09:13 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 20:09:06 -0700
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: Tim (knucklehead) <knucklehead@email.org>
Subject: The truck story
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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Well, they found my truck minus $48.  They found it on hwy 101 out of gas.
Anyway the cops found 34 generic GM keys in it. The key that was in the
ignition fits my friends door to his S-10 but not the ignition. I wonder
how many of those keys actually fit other trucks. The cops let me keep the
one. But everything is better. I still feel wierd, but hoping  TF fixes it
all up for me. See ya out there.

Tim (knucklehead)



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 20:24:05 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 20:23:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: John <dwarzau@ns.net>
To: "-=]madame mercury[=-" <mhg@cats.ucsc.edu>
cc: Jondabomb@aol.com, sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: Plastik
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9605311717.A14190-0100000@am.UCSC.EDU>
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> > Is 27 bucks in Santa Cruz.... Have a great day:(
> > 
>  are you saying that Plastik is gonna be in Santa Cruz?
>  where is it gonna be?

If it's anywhere other than the Civic (barf) Auditorium I'd be surprised..

From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 21:16:05 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 21:21:23 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: leftjab@well.com (leftjab)
Subject: room for 2 to TF -- Sat. am about 11
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it's been 3 weeks since I kicked it, been a heavy work week, just got paid,
bought a new tent, finished the laundry, very ready to rest tonight, get
Furthur tour tickets tomorrow morning at 10 at BASS (deadhead that I am),
and get on the road . . .

but since i only was sure on Thursday I could go, the two people who said
they needed rides had found others ...

so, I will be leaving the emeryville tower records at hopefully 10:30 or
so, and anyone on the general path through the east bay or sf is welcome to
share the ride . . . bring a smile, and tapes!

i'll be checking my e-mail until i leave tomorrow am


leftjab, feelin' the moon



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 21:40:12 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 21:45:33 -0800
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
From: leftjab@well.com (leftjab)
Subject: car is full now . . . weird why, tho
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
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just got a call from Ray, who was planning on leaving tonight --

and his friend's van unfortunately hit a pothole, and broke an axle :(

but, he knew I had room, and the car is now full.

So have to retract the ride offer, sorry.

see y'all there -- watch out for potholes . . .

leftjab



From sfraves-owner@hyperreal.com  Fri May 31 22:04:49 1996
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Date: Fri, 31 May 96 22:04 PDT
From: solo@islandnet.com (solo)
To: sfraves@hyperreal.com
Subject: Re: SFcentric
Sender: owner-sfraves@hyperreal.com
Precedence: bulk

> >Sure, Americans, generally speaking, are ignorant of the rest of the world.
> >But do you guys really think that any other country's citizens are not as
> >equally focused on their home country?  I mean, how many Iranians or
> >Welsh or any other nationality have any idea who Nathan Hale is?
> >I think it's multi-directional.
> 
> Yeah, but we Americans are *particularly* ignorant... we live in this
> little seperate area, while the rest of the world is across the ocean, so
> why should Joe American give a damn about the rest of the world, unless it
> has a direct impact on his life? People who live in Europe, Asia, etc., are
> all right in the middle of a bunch of countries with long histories of
> conflict and competition... in Europe, you'll be lucky to meet someone who
> _isn't_ well informed about the state of world politics and who _doesn't_
> know a foreign language or two.
> 
> Considering the state of this country, I don't think our economic/cultural
> dominance of the world will last long.
> 
> -m.

Its funny watching all of us discuss this...and every message that comes
up..supporting or not...proves you guys dont know whats up...waaaaay up
Hello...what about Canada?
You dont pay attention to anything overseas?  puuulease!













                          peace
                         bill.e
            .com communications
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